EPISODE 2 - Izzy Odinson: Rewriting Your Story

This episode's guest, Izzy Odinson, is a hypnotherapist, breathwork guide, and subconscious mind coach. Her work weaves compassion, curiosity, and powerful healing practices to create grounding, soulful, and transformative experiences for her clients. Izzy believes in walking beside people as they remember their own power, creating sacred spaces for real healing and self-fulfillment.

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/alchemywithizzy/

Transcript

Host Intro And Show Purpose

Katherine 0:00

Hello everyone and welcome to Hyp Talks. I'm your host, Katherine Hinchey. I'm a certified hypnotherapist, NLP practitioner, and chair of a senior certified professional in human resources. After spending a decade working in the music industry, my path led me into the world of the healing art, where science, energy, mindset, and transformation all meet. Each week, I sit down with a different healing practitioner to explore the many powerful modalities available to support our growth, well-being, and personal evolution. So come with me on this journey of discovery and learn about all the opportunities for healing and transformation that are available to all of us.

Meet Izzy: Path To Healing Work

Katherine 1:39

Her work weaves compassion, curiosity, and powerful healing practices to create grounding, soulful, and transformative experiences for her clients. Izzy believes in walking beside people as they remember to own their power, creating sacred spaces for real healing and self-fulfillment. I'm so glad you're here. Thank you. So happy to be here. We met doing the NLP course with Joe Tabanella at HMI and have just kind of stayed connected, stayed in touch. And you have your own podcast.

Izzy 2:16

I do, yeah. It's in a little bit of like a remission at the moment, but it's still gonna happen. We're still doing it. Me and my co-hosts are still talking about episodes. It's called It's Not Woo, which is true. Thinking about just renaming it to not Woo Just True, because what are all these words for? Where are you based, Izzy? I'm out of Portland, Oregon. Up here in the Pacific Northwest.

Katherine 2:40

Fabulous. Tell us about your practice, your healing corner of the world.

Izzy 2:47

Yeah, so I think I have my own blend of modalities that I have come with. My journey into my work started years ago in my 20s when I was doing a bunch of different jobs. And the only jobs I ever really enjoyed were ones that left people walking away feeling better. Healing became sort of the avenue that I was following, wanting to pursue medical school for a long time until I got a little bit of disenchanted with the Western medical system in general. And beyond just physical healing, I needed my own emotional healing. I had like an internal wake-up call in 2017, 2018 around there, that I knew that the path that I was on wasn't gonna go somewhere I wanted to go. I just knew that intuitively. It wasn't about just like being in a bad place, but it was about just knowing this path is not a good one. And I was, you know, in one of those like kind of listless stages, not really sure where I'm going, you know. So I started picking up different modalities to try to heal from my own past traumas, to escape this path that I had found myself on. You know, I think it's funny and I love it in a way. So many of the modalities that I've learned have testimonials from situations where it's like, oh, this one thing. And I was like, whoa, I have learned like 15 different healing modalities, and it took all of those to start making progress. So I'm sure if that's the case for me, it's the case for other people. We need sometimes a lot of different approaches and a lot of different angles to come at our problems, and that was certainly the case for me.

Many Modalities, One Foundation

Izzy 4:31

What was the first, like what modalities did you start with? I started with mindfulness, I started with gratitude practice, I started getting into my mind. That's where I began, is just trying to make my inner world a nicer place to be. And that was slow and it did some things, but it was really when I found breath work and especially when I started at HMI, where we met, of course, that started diving deeper into the work and really deep into the subconscious mind and into these old programs and really got to a place where I started to question my inner paradigm and really break it down before. I guess I would say like the mindfulness work and the gratitude was it helped a lot, but it was kind of like putting some fresh paint or some nice carpet down in a dilapidated house. You know, I still had to figure out how to like fix the foundation of this place, you know, get the rats out of the walls, you know.

Katherine 5:30

Did you come to breath work before HMI?

Izzy 5:33

I did. I actually completed a certification course, like a six-month certification course. In order to complete my certification, I was facilitating journeys and I would have my friends help me. They're not coming to breath work, they're not searching for healing, they're just helping me out.

Katherine 5:53

Yeah.

Izzy 5:54

And just with the breath,

Discovering Breathwork And Hypnosis

Izzy 5:57

they were having these intense visceral, emotional, purging experiences. And I knew that they were in an altered state. I mean, obviously, if somebody's rolling around crying or something, that is not the state that they were just in. So they're getting into these altered states, and I knew that it was something like a hypnotic state, but I didn't know really anything about hypnosis. For some reason, I guess I didn't really question at the time, but I just intuitively was like, yeah, hypnosis is the next step. Because then I'll know what to do with them. I'm leading them into this place with their breath, or their breath is leading them into this place, really, rather, that I could never just get them to, we couldn't even get them to necessarily, maybe with hypnosis, but the breath is just, it will just lead them where they need to go naturally. As many things do in this crazy universe. Right after I decided hypnosis was the way to go, I met someone new who was just graduating from HMI. They say it's praises, and I looked into nothing else. I just went for it. That's great. Yeah. Yeah. When you know the right way, you know, you just get on with it, I guess.

Katherine 7:07

So did that lead you to how you do your practice? You begin with breath work into hypnosis or talk a little bit about what you do?

How Breath Shapes The Nervous System

Izzy 7:17

My breath work is mostly just in group settings. I don't use it as much in my one-on-one sessions unless it's necessary. One thing with breath work, and everyone rolls their eyes when I tell them this, but it's the truest thing. All the journeys that you can do in the 15-minute, 20-minute, hour-long practices, whatever it is, they're amazing. They're deep, they're cathartic. But if you really, really, really, really want to bring breath work into your life in a big way, check it with your breath like a million times a day. Make it such a habit. Am I breathing right now? How am I breathing? Am I breathing up into my chest where we're activating fight or flight? We're only supposed to be breathing into our chest when we're scared. You see a lion, you hear the lion or you know, grumble or something, and then you up into the chest. You're starting to hyperventilate, you're taking on extra oxygen, it's getting pushed out to all of your muscles, you're preparing to run, do something, fight, flight. But in our day and age, as we know, we just live in an environment that's putting us into fight and flight, you know, by kind of default, because now our tax returns are the new lions. And it's like, well, that's not gonna kill you. It might suck a lot. It might kill like your joy or something, but ultimately you'll still be alive if you live in. Like it's survivable, and we know that, but our nervous systems don't know the difference because we've spent more of our being with that kind of being our biggest threat. Is something gonna hunt me right now? No, okay, I'm cool. It's like animals out in the wild, you know, you'll see them, a deer or something, like grazing on some grass, and then it stops and it perks its head up, it looks around, it listens. Either it hears something else and it's like gone, or it just goes back to eating the grass, right? It is immediately out of that fight or flight.

Katherine 9:13

So the breath work is to calm the nervous system and are somatic elements to it?

Izzy 9:21

It's both, absolutely. So when we're checking into our breath every part of the day, we're looking for downregulated breathing. And what does that mean? It's slow, it's into our belly. We actually breathe way more than we need to as people. We have a low tolerance for CO2 in our blood. You actually don't breathe because you don't take in a breath because you're trying to get oxygen generally. If you've ever worn one of those O2 monitors on your finger, if you were to hold your breath, you would notice it would be several minutes before your oxygen levels would actually start to drop. So if you don't need oxygen, why are we breathing? Well, we're trying to exhale. We're trying to offset CO2 because we have, especially when we're breathing like this, very shallow, whatever, we're used to the levels of our CO2 in our body being very low. But we can actually increase our tolerance for this, and this has a lot of positive therapeutic effects for our body. It makes our blood naturally more acidic, which helps to clear out our system. It actually helps us to more effectively

CO2 Tolerance And Better Breathing

Izzy 10:23

take on oxygen. So we're actually getting more oxygenated when we train ourselves to breathe less, which is why connecting to the breath throughout your day is so very important. But of course, nobody wants that new habit, right? Like, how am I breathing? How am I breathing? How am I breathing? I don't think it occurs to so many of us, you know. It really doesn't. Until you start thinking about it. I mean, I had no idea before I started studying breath work that our modern-day breathing habits are terrible. We're like, wow, we can't even breathe right. And like, yeah, unfortunately, we don't even know how to breathe. So, like, is that because it happens soon after birth, or you have a child, so you know, when they're really small and they have the little bellies because they're just breathing into their belly and they walk around, they don't care. I hope he never ever stops because that's what how we're supposed to be. But you know, we get older, we start getting insecure about our stomach, you know, the anxieties of the world start piling on us, we hold our breath way more, which is by the way, how we store the trauma to begin with. Oh, interesting. It's that pause moment a lot of when the breath is not flowing, we will literally just stop. Sometimes that's part of fight flight too. Yeah. And we stop. The freeze. That's when it we freeze, right? And that's well, that could be it. We could be freezing, but our breath is actually could be arrested, right? Either way, we're creating potential to start storing that trauma in our fascia. So when we're moving through these uncomfortable, this is a long way of saying that when I am doing hypnotic sessions, I will notice I'm always tuned into their breathing. And you I will tell immediately when someone is resisting whatever we're going into, because they will stop breathing. They'll just stop, you know, mid-breath, whatever, their chest to stop. I know they don't know it, they don't intend to be doing it. So that's how I incorporate breath work is to can make sure that their breath is continuing to flow. Not letting them stop. I'm kind of reminding them because out of all of the parts of our autonomic serv nervous system, we have control over exactly one. You can't make your heart beat any different, you know, you can't decide how much oxygen you're gonna absorb into your muscles, you know. We don't get to choose those things, but we can subconsciously take over control of our breath. And we can do that in any moment at any time, no matter what the stimulus is. And the more we practice gaining control back over our breath, the more we're gonna be able to pull ourselves out of that hypnotic state and back into what we want to be experiencing, feeling, perceiving, whatever it may be.

Katherine 13:02

But you touched on it

Trauma, Freeze, And Breath Awareness

Katherine 13:05

in your early 20s and these different modalities to feel better. What drove you f away from what you were doing to sort of pursue this life of being a healer?

Izzy 13:16

I guess I would say that it really began in my mid-20s, the start of me beginning to question why we do what we do. Is what we do actually helpful? Or are people feeling better? I worked in several ERs. I was a doctor scribe. I wrote their medical charts in an ER setting. I worked with many, many different doctors. I worked there for several years. In just a couple years, the amount of stories that I have are crazy. But you know, I've also always been looking. I've just been watching and observing and paying attention my whole life. And I was doing that there. And there were a lot of lessons that I took away about the state of things. And what I mean by that is like in our own human lives, we rely on some of these SIP systems because we're told that they actually will save us. Take CPR, right? I used to think CPR saved lives. I still do. So it might, but it's actually so unbelievably unlikely that it will save your life. It's sort of like the last chance. It might be the reason you die, or it might speed it up to something like maybe a 14% success rate. It can ultimately end up being trauma to the body when they're trying to like save it as opposed to like doing any good. It could be making it worse.

Katherine 14:50

I don't think that people shouldn't do CPR because I'm sorry to interrupt you, but did you take Lisa Mecklenburg's medical hypnosis class? And she talks about if you happen to be in a situation where somebody's having some kind of a serious situation and you're waiting for EMTs and they're bleeding as a hypnotherapist, you can actually just uh scream at them

Leaving Medicine And Trusting Subconscious

Katherine 15:17

and tell them to stop bleeding. And their subconscious mind will listen to that and stop bleeding, which to me I've never tested that out.

Izzy 15:26

I haven't either. I haven't had the situation to thank God. If doctors knew hypnosis, if nurses knew hypnosis, if paramedics knew hypnosis, yeah, and we're deeply trained because it's not just knowing, you know, to know obviously we know we're well trained in what to say and what not to say and when, which is very, very important when you're doing hypnosis. But yes, in that regard, I kind of like got deterred from what I was trying to say with the ER example because my ultimate point was that I sort of gotten disillusioned with things, and it occurred to me in my mid to late 20s, I was feeling a lot of frustration. I want to know where to go. No one has any useful advice, nobody's helpful in that regard. And I realized, oh my God, I'm asking people for directions to a place they've never been. So when I was looking around at my friends' lives and the people that I knew, it's like I don't want their life. Why would I ask them help me to get where I've covering? You know, they don't know. We only know how to go where we are and where we've been. And that really changed a lot for me. And I started to become disillusioned with the systems around me, and I started to ask myself questions about them, like how much does this help really? And it led into more of a metaphysical woo-ish type of world. The subconscious mind is so powerful that it can make you stop bleeding and suck your blood like up and back into your body. Like, holy shit. I know. I wonder. What are we bothering with these honestly kind of barbaric practices in some regard that may make the situation way worse? Yeah. But there is this possibility of working with somebody's subconscious, which is a million more times powerful than any. I mean, there's no device that would make a person stop bleeding and suck their blood back up, but you know, like we could cauterize a wound or something, but that doesn't exist. We don't have that. But the subconscious mind does like there are tools and powers and abilities in there that are far beyond rational comprehension, especially with our modern view of looking at things. And as I started to question and break down these systems, I just found oh, like it's not actually as lovely and helpful as we thought. What could be better? And that was a big proponent to me looking for alternative healing. I mean, it was necessary. It was

Rewriting Stories To Heal Relationships

Izzy 18:05

a deepening of my healing and learning how to retell my story, you know? And something that I realized. So I found so much more healing in my time at HMI because of the depth of what we learned, the encouragement to do the work, the support of the staff. Can't recommend it enough. Nothing's perfect, but I love HMI. And it started to really shift those things where I was like, oh, you know, so my house looks nicer, but to use the house analogy, like I can't really open this door because the floor is all hecked up. I trip over the crack in the floor all the time. If I truly want to push through, that became a whole other level of skills. So where I would have been learning to like be a carpenter, be a builder, instead of just mindfulness and gratitude in how I speak in my inner world, it actually became how. So I realized at HMI that we as humans, we exist entirely as a collection of stories. And we all do, which is why we all live in our own different worlds, because we all have a different collection of stories that make us up. And we try to like talk to each other about them, but you know, that's the subconscious that we're dealing with, right? We know we're dealing with like a deep, deep, deep well of experiences. Experiences, inter generation, intergenerational trauma, like who knows? Where it's not even our stories, it's not even just this is the life I've lived. We're born with stories, and we add on to them as we go, and it's all very complex and interwoven. At some point, something started to give where I realized this foundation is messed up, and I began to develop the ability to start rewriting old stories, which I believe is really powerful because it's really hard to do.

Katherine 20:01

Tell us more about that. How do you learn to rewrite your story?

Izzy 20:06

Is that through a modality that you learned or I would have to like think more about that to see if it actually specifically for you? Yeah, so I'll give an example. My relationship with my dad. It's always been really strange. He's never really showed up for me in the way that I need him to. You know, a lot of convoluted, complicated past there. Without like outright direct trauma, I guess. It was more my dad was very passive. Something just broke at some point where I was explaining to him a little bit of what my childhood experience was like. I just started to have this realization that, oh, my dad probably never wanted anything bad to happen to me and felt powerless to stop anything bad from happening to me because that's just the way of the world. But it was never that he like wished those things or anything.

Katherine 21:02

So you had this moment of recognition, like compassion, of seeing it.

Izzy 21:06

It let me like crack into his stories, right? So, and then accept that maybe there's more to it than that. I don't think anyone is the villain of their own story, which means that there is enough of their story that in theory, if you knew it, you would empathize or understand why they feel the way that they do, why they act the way that they do. The point is not that, it's about just understanding it.

Katherine 21:35

In my acting training, they always taught us that if you're playing a character who's evil or just a terrible person, that's not a quality that you play. You play from their perspective of how they are hurting or what they're looking to fulfill, what their desires are and all of that, is if you're on the other side of somebody's story and you don't necessarily understand it.

Izzy 21:59

But to say that. There is a way that you could. It wouldn't

Freedom From The Past Through Meaning

Izzy 22:02

necessarily like make them right. It's not about that, but it's just being like, oh, I get why you would feel that way, why you would think that way, why you would approach things that way. Not making good, but it makes it logical, it makes it understood. And that exists for all of us. We all have something on the other side of our stories. Sam Harris, I think it's in his book, Free Will. He says, you know, if I was exactly you, then I would do exactly what you would do. I wouldn't do anything different because I would be you for whatever reason. In that moment, it allowed the door to like crack open a little bit. There's more to his story than my side of his story. Doesn't invalidate mine at all, but it just made space for there to be another one. And I told him all of this, and he's never been like, Yeah, totally. That's how I feel. So this is just something that makes sense to me and resolves my conflict with him and in my subconscious, to where now when I speak to him, I just don't get triggered anymore. And it used to be like no matter what he said or did, I would just be like on fire, like instant rage, annoyance. Why do you talk to me like this? Why do you act like this? And I just that's just all kind of slipped away now. And I mean, it has all slipped away now. And so he hasn't changed, but our relationship has changed.

Katherine 23:24

Sounds like you fundamentally changed.

Izzy 23:26

Right. And so now our interactions are very different. So that's just an example of rewriting a story. And I always say that you can change the past by changing how it affects the present. Because it doesn't matter if something happened. What matters is how it affects this moment right here. If we can change what by default was happening because of the past, we've effectively changed the past.

Katherine 23:52

Wow.

Izzy 23:53

So you're getting on timelines. That's just how I've always looked at it. Like long before I got into I feel like I came up with that as a teenager or something, but I've always felt that way. That's how you change things, right? Because you know, people say, Oh, well, I'm like this because my mom kicked me every time I came home from school or whatever. And it's like, okay, well, can it be so if you're like, well, I, you know, shout at people because that happened. Okay, well, what if you were like nice to people because it happened? You know, what if that was a shift that you were able to make? You didn't change what happened, but you changed the effect, right? And that's that's power. Yeah, that's the story. Exactly. It is the story because it does get to be that. You know, we get to decide how much hate we hold in our body, how much anger or resentment we hold towards a person. I didn't do this for him, trying to manipulate my reality, which I think was a big part because I think in the past, maybe that's the place that I was coming from. I would just want you to be different, and I'll do anything to make you be different, even if it's making me different. And it just became like an acceptance. Oh, hey, my dad didn't want me to get hurt. You'd think something like that would be simple for him to have said in the last 30 years or whatever, but he hasn't said, but that became okay. Would I still be nice to hear it from him? Sure, but the need that it was holding on my mental state, on my emotional state, on my mental stability got to evaporate. So that's the power behind the story. That also greatly inspires my work because I think we should be able to be free from the past. Any restraints that we feel on our self-expression that's not hurting anybody, we should be free. There's just no reason for that oppression to exist, but it exists deeply and widely in all aspects of our society.

Neurodivergence And Practitioner Lens

Katherine 25:39

So you and I have talked a lot about neurodivergence, right? And we both shared stories about how we came to our understanding of our own neurodivergence and all of that. But can you talk to me about that and how that plays, if at all, into your practice?

Izzy 25:57

So I'm autistic, I have ADHD, and I think in some ways it's impossible to separate from my practice because it's the core of who I am. It's not a tree, it's not like a quirk, right? Like so autism, autistic people compared to neurotypicals when our dendrite, I guess, connections and our synapses are like expunging as we don't use them. So we develop so many as we're developing as a baby, as a child, and then we start to lose them. And autistic people don't lose as much as neurotypicals, and by that it's pretty significant. I'm just making up numbers. So 60, I think I was gonna say, like it's a higher-ish kind of number like that, which literally means more input from the environment is coming in. There's literally more sensors. There is a sensitivity to the world and surroundings as an autistic person that's inseparable from all things. And I think it just gives me more compassion and understanding.

Katherine 27:04

I'm picturing you as an ER scribe and just how intense that would be for anybody, but to have extra sensory perceptions around it, or am I just reading into it wrong? Totally, it could be. Absolutely, especially if somebody's more sensitive to people's energies. I think it might be a little bit of like the ADHD cut chaos in me that I thrive a little bit on the energy, I guess. So it was always fine for me. I never had problems staying in it when things were moving. I think it just gave me the ability to maybe just be better at it. Because I was paying attention to what people were doing when they're doing it, like in a code situation, CPRing, that kind of thing. Everything they do is supposed to be time. So when they push a medication, when they start compressions, when they stop compressions, when there's a breathing mask, if there's gonna be a breathing tube, like all of that is supposed to be really well documented and literally to describe like suppose I felt bad, I can't do anything. I'm not supposed to touch a single thing. I have my laptop, so I'd crawl up into a corner and just be typing away. Nurses are everywhere, doctors are going back and forth. Everybody, there's maybe like 10 people in

Mentors, Safety, And Holding Space

Izzy 28:16

the room trying to do a job, paramedics are trying to give their reports, it's all going on at once.

Katherine 28:21

You mentioned early on that before you kind of got into this work, you were looking around at the people around you, and those were the lives you wanted to lead. Like you didn't have anybody that you wanted to emulate. Have you found in doing this work a mentor, so to speak?

Izzy 28:38

Oh, yeah, so many. I worked with so many people, so many amazing souls that I have met on this journey, and especially in the past few years. And I think they're entirely necessary. Like, I cannot speak highly enough of working with people. I do not think that anyone ever, anywhere, that anyone that you've ever seen was success, they did not get their alone, period. They had support in some way, shape, or form. Someone who knew or at least had done something that they have done. And yeah, I have so many of those people in my life that I admire that I want to emulate that are such good examples of how I want to hold space and lead. Of course, we mentioned Joe Tabanel. We met in Joe Tabanella's class. Love Joe. I'm excited to later today. So you are you're gonna see him later? Yes, yeah. I'm so excited. I was thinking about I'm gonna message him soon. He's magical as far as masculine energy goes. I think he's probably one of the like safest feeling men I've ever encountered. He just feels so safe. His love, his care, his compassion comes through, and everything. And that's a great example of somebody who's doing something that I want to do. I think he's really good at what he does, and he just cares so much. And it makes a big difference. Absolutely.

Katherine 29:55

So we have a few minutes.

Izzy 29:57

Do you wanna Okay? So today I'm just gonna guide you through a gentle little

Guided Breath And Hypno Journey

Izzy 30:02

combination of techniques that are gonna help you out. You know, you said you weren't feeling too well today, maybe had some sinus stuff. It's always good to relax, get into that restorative, energetic, and nervous system state. Yeah, I'm ready. Right. So have you start by just shaking your hands or moving your shoulders or neck or just something that feels nice, getting into your body a little bit, seeing what would feel nice, easing a little tension. Anybody listening along is welcome to join, but don't close your eyes if you're driving or something like that. Of course. Be smart. So a little bit looser. Taking a couple of deep breaths. Whenever it feels comfortable, just letting your eyes close if that feels right. Inviting in a little bit of comfort with each breath. Easing some muscle tension with each exhale. The breath-sending, swirling energy through you, like you're inhaling bright shiny gold healing light. As it comes in through your nose, it swirls up through your head, and then down through your spine. Back up through the heart space. And then out through the nose or mouth. Just imagining this energy continuing to circle with each breath. If you can bite in a little bit more relaxation and comfort in this moment, can you go a little deeper? Letting your breath continue to flow. Looking for that deep, relaxing early breath. This light continuing to swirl. And you're seeing yourself go deeper into more relaxed state into a more at ease state. Just like you're gently walking down a hill, feeling that energy uh deepening. Just being in this moment. Nothing else to do. Nowhere else to be, just seeing how much of a feeling of ease we can invite into this moment. Seeing, imagining, pretending, however, is easiest for you as seeing yourself in a very comforting place on someone outside. Or the sunshine's warming your skin gently. And the fresh air is clearing your sinuses. Comforting your lungs. And that oxygen is moving to the muscles. Allowing them to relax even more. When your feet are on the ground. The energy of the earth. Sending that healing energy up. Up from the core, in through your feet. All the way up your body. Out the top of your head. But the sunshine continues to warm your skin. And the fresh air refreshes your lungs. And the energy within you is moving. Clearing. And all you have to do is rest. Getting out of the way, letting the body do what it knows how to do. Putting this restorative moment of nature cleanse and connect you. Just focusing on a few slow deep breaths here. As we imagine this bright sparkling light again in through the nose. Swirling into the head and deep down into the spine. And then back up into the belly.

Closing, Where To Find Izzy, Credits

Izzy 36:31

Making his way out again. Continuing the swirl and cleansing energy with each breath. Throughout the rest of your day. And as you sleep. Throughout your week to come. Nothing you consciously need to do, just every breath. Restoring you. Remembering to breathe just a little bit deeper now and then. Coming up out of this state here in a moment, maintaining this regenerative life-giving energy. Starting at one, closing the door to the subconscious mind, sealing in all positives. And two, becoming aware of your breath again. Three is the tendency for the corners of the mouth to want to curl upward. Four is becoming aware of the room around you. And five is eyes open, wide awake. One, two, three, four, five. Eyes open wide awake. Welcome back. I feel good. So good to hear it. Izzy, tell us how people can find you. I have a website at alchemywithizy.com. I'm also on Instagram and TikTok. You can also reach out to me via email, which is Izzy Odenson. That's I-Z-Z-Y-O-D-I-N-S-O-N at alchemywithizzy.com.

Katherine 38:30

And I will put links in the show notes for everyone. Thank you so much. This was really fun, and you were my first cast. I feel so honored to be the first. Appreciate it. You've been listening to Hip Talk Original Music by Tracy Moore and the Jazzy Fantasties. Podcast Editing and Sound Engineering by Zachary Trainer. If you like what you heard, please like and share and follow us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast. And if you leave a comment, I promise I will respond.