Jason: The Men Behind the Mask - The Crazy Ralph Podcast EP 5

While the iconic image of Jason Voorhees spans continents and generations, the unsung men who played Jason have largely been swallowed by film history. Over the years, putting on the mask to play Jason has been an honour to some, a burden to others, and for some, simply a job to pay the bills. Little did most of these men know that a large and passionate fan base would celebrate their contributions. For that reason alone, we feel it’s a great idea to unmask these men and break down their performances, looks, and impact on the world of Friday the 13th and the Jason universe.

3:15 Kane Hodder
14:40 Ken Kirzinger
17:54 Warrington Gillette and Steve Dash
24:27 Tom Morga and Dick Wieand
30:15 Ari Lehman
32:13 Dan Bradley / CJ Graham
38:16 Richard Brooker
43:24 Ted White
47:54 Derek Mears
50:22 Jason Actor Ages


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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:06

Welcome to the Crazy Ralph Podcast. I'm Jason, and I'm joined with your friendly neighborhood, Uncle Pete.

SPEAKER_00 0:13

Awesome.

SPEAKER_01 0:14

As usual, we will be talking all things Friday the 13th. Uh, make sure you follow us. Subscribe on YouTube. Follow us on wherever podcasts can be heard. We usually post, actually, we're pretty good for consistency. Every other Friday, you can hear us on YouTube. And like I said, wherever podcasts are heard. And then we also have a lot of shorter shows that we're throwing in there with some real fun content. We pride ourselves on doing fun stuff. We've we've seen the movies a billion times, just like you have, but you know, sometimes we gotta we gotta shake it up. And another cool thing about this show is that we really uh we really love to hear from people and their opinions. A lot of the content we throw up is is very opinionated based, and uh we don't pretend to be the end all and be all of Friday the 13th. We just uh we're two fans and we love to uh share our our perspectives or our ideas, and we hope that you kind of banter back, and that's what will make this show a lot of fun. Am I right, Uncle Pete?

SPEAKER_00 1:29

Why don't you pretend? We want because we're gonna you're gonna hear our opinions, our you know, how we feel about certain actors, or even across all these shows. We obviously we know each other's opinion. We want to hear you guys. What do you think is the best actor? Who do you think is the worst actor? Just whatever we're discussing, we want to hear feedback from you guys as far as what your topic is on how you your opinion on the topic. For sure.

SPEAKER_01 1:50

And the funny thing is, is Uncle Pete and I usually agree on quite a bit. Not that we want to, but we do. Uh, so definitely uh a different uh perspective is always welcome. Uh today is a it's a it's an essential show, I would say. We've talked about the many um looks of Jason in prior podcasts. However, this one we go deeper. We go, we go into the soul, we dig out the actors who have played Jason and we analyze them, or I don't know if we analyze them. We talk about them. We celebrate the men who put on the mask and uh and just you know, like I said before, sometimes it was a great film, sometimes it wasn't, but Jason was always a constant. We always love him, and for the most part, I think we love a lot of the actors that have played him. A lot of them have embraced it, uh, if not right away over the years. And uh yeah, so looking forward to uh to diving deep into the men who played Jason. So we're gonna, you know, usually we we start off in the past, like we've started off with in chronological order, but we're gonna I'm gonna shake it up. I'm gonna shake it up on you, Uncle Pete. We're gonna start off with the man who's played him the most. Kane Hawthorne let's let's talk about this. So Kane Hawthor first uh first got the role of Jason in Friday 13th, part 7, New Blood. That was 1988, and uh and then went on to play him in Jason Takes Manhattan, Jason goes to hell, Jason goes to space. He he really did the tour. He did the the the Jason tour. They marketed it that way. He was uh he was on tour. Um, and then a little bit of a heartbreak. We've talked about this before, where he was uh snubbed from playing Jason in the just anxiously awaited Freddie versus Jason. Uh uh a mistake, was it? I I mean I think it was. We could talk about that a little bit later. Um but overall, Kane Hodder uh embodied the role of Jason. Uh he came at the tail end of the 80s. Maybe the only knock on his, you know, his time was his timing for in this franchise. And I know Pete's you you've definitely commented on that before, and we'll talk about it. But Kane was uh was great in the sense that not only did he play Jason and got to play him multiple times, but man, he embraced the role, and in doing so, he made it okay for everybody else that was in a Friday the 13th fan to appreciate being in a Friday 13th fan or a film. Um it wasn't a guilty secret that they were in these things. He made it cool to you know to be Jason, to be in a Friday film. Um, I I I personally believe that, but um Yeah, I I've kind of started the ball rolling with Kane. I know you probably have some things to say, but uh I'll throw it in.

SPEAKER_00 5:11

Yeah, like some of my notes. I put like he's the most connected actor is you know to Harvey and like you know, you got Robert England is is Freddie, Nick Castle, Micah Mars, Doug Bradley, Pinhead, Brad Dorf, Chucky, Kane Hotter is Jason. You know, one thing I like about the way he portrayed it, this Jason is not playing games, he's angry, but he's also like the way Kane, like he's he's having fun, he's calculating with his kills. He's just not slashing with machete, he's drawing you in sludge, he's punching your head off, killing you with the guitar. He's having fun with these kills. He's like, Yep, I'm zombie now, I'm gonna have fun, and I'm just gonna go like and one thing I love that Kane Harder did was the head tilt. Wasn't excessive, he would just do a little head tilt. Yeah, and to me, it's like a wolf looking at prey trapped in a trap or something. It's like he got a wolf looking at a fox in a bear trap, and I'm also like, hmm. And that's the way he's like kind of studying, like he's he's patient, he's not as brutal as some of the other performances, but he's very calculated, like he'll just stand there and like watch a while, yeah. Okay, and then he'll go in for the kill. Like he added personality to Jason. That's one thing about Kane Hotter. He did, which is why they used him for that Friday the 13th video game. He did all the mocap because he is Jason. Yeah, but some films are a little misaligned, but what do you I he did great with what he was handed?

SPEAKER_01 6:39

Yeah, I and that's the thing. Like I you were talking about the head tilt. One thing I liked was the you know, the kind of like the deep breath, right? Like, you know, it was like here we go, you know. Um, so he adds he added some mannerisms, and this, you know, and those are the types of things that like you know, when you get the right person for the role, you you get that, right? Like, you know, in the past, you know, I I don't want to like rag on stuntman because ultimately Kane was a stunt man. Um, but like, you know, you get a stuntman to just do the job, and Kane was, you know, took his opportunity to really, really make it his own. Um, and and he did. Like, if you if you were to just ask if people who've watched the Friday the 13th to just say, do your best Jason imitation. I bet you they would do something that mimics the mannerisms of Kane Hodder versus any of the other Jasons, and that's a testament to um again, you know, where we talk about timing where the movies weren't the greatest, but maybe the timing where the pop culture was just like peaking for those types of films, and maybe it just kind of uh worked that way.

SPEAKER_00 7:53

Like he went on the Arsini, he was like probably other than like Robert England, one of the first horror villains to go on a talk show. Like he went on Arsini O'Hall as Jason and never said a word. Like he stayed in character. And one story I love about Kane is he was talking about in Crystal Lake Memories, they're talking about um Jason Takes Manhattan on Times Square, and he's like he just kind of stood there and took it in. He's like, We were certain now. This is the 90s, and it's like Tom Square was just packed with screaming fans. Yeah, knowing who they you don't need to have seen the movies, but you knew who that was. Yeah, you knew who that and that was because and just the the essence that he brought the character really speaks a lot, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

And and listen, he was on Arsenio Hall and he was just a uh uh mute Jason, but even on that, his his his timing and his mannerisms, timing sounds kind of weird, but like it they were bang on. If anybody has uh hasn't seen it, you gotta go back and see it. And the other thing about that, to keep in perspective, is the time that that was 1989, and uh stuff like that wasn't really done very often. Like you didn't see these types of gimmicky things on talk shows and stuff like that. Seeing Jason appear on a talk show was just it was mind-blowing. If you could honestly, like I know people say mind-blowing a lot, it was mind-blowing because it came out of nowhere. I was just like, what? This is amazing. It ended up being such a great moment, and I was happy for Kane on that. Um, the other thing with Kane Hodder is because of his posture, because of his stature and his height or whatever, his head shape. I don't, you you always will know when it's him. Like, that's one thing I'll say. Like, I I feel um maybe there's a you know, part in part nine, you know, we talked about it, he looked a little bloated and chunky.

SPEAKER_00 9:52

That was the one where I don't recognize him as much.

SPEAKER_01 9:55

Yeah, yeah. That was that was the one that was a little bit different, but you know, seven, eight, and then uh Jason X. Like you see Jason standing there, that wide stance, you know it's Kane.

SPEAKER_00 10:09

Yeah, like if you just showed a silhouette of a Jason from any movie, just like a black silhouette, just the movement, you can pick out which one is Kane hotter.

SPEAKER_02 10:18

Yeah, 100%.

SPEAKER_00 10:19

You just saw the silhouette movement, it just is distinct ways that Kane moved that was specific. He made it his own.

SPEAKER_01 10:27

Yeah, yeah. And like I said, I just love the fact that you know, Friday fans were listen, uh I was a little envious that there was always that, you know, one guy that played Freddie, you know? And and it was all it always kind of bugged me uh when I was a kid that there wasn't like a a Jason, like an actor that played Jason. So Kane came around, righted that wrong, and uh, and just you know, like I said, the fact that he just loved being Jason. Um was so cool, right? Like, you know, it wasn't yeah, I was in that movie, and uh, you know, whatever. You gotta get collect a paycheck and stuff like that, which you know, some have said in the past. But um so kudos to Kane on that. I will say this, I will say one thing. There's one quote of Kane Hodder's that really, really bugs me though. And I I you know I don't want to come on the show and like you know, piss off anybody, especially Kane Hodder. But there is one line where he said, uh, I think it was in one of the scripts, and I'm I'm I'm maybe paraphrasing, but like he said there was a a call to for him to kick a dog, and he refused to do it because Jason wouldn't kick a dog. And listen, I have no problem, I love animals, I'm not going that, but I just that one bugs me because I'm like, man, it seems like Michael Myers kills a dog in every single film.

SPEAKER_00 11:57

He's always eaten dogs.

SPEAKER_01 11:58

Yeah, and I'm like, okay, crap, man. If like, you know, if I'm defending Jason as being the baddest in the in the horror world and he won't touch a dog, and like I said, Mike, Mike, my Michael Myers goes out looking for dogs, man. It's like I think there's a one of the I forgot what movie. I think he killed two. Uh anyways, maybe I'm wrong on that, but I definitely know that Michael Myers has uh a canine body count. And uh so that's my that's my one thing. I'm like, no, no, no. I want Jason all in, man. He no mercy, but uh we'll uh let him have his opinion. I like that one.

SPEAKER_00 12:33

Sorry, remember that. I remember that too. Jason wouldn't kick a dog.

SPEAKER_01 12:39

Hey, he could uh that's his opinion, so he's he's entitled to it for sure. Um yeah, so I mean the movies, you know, a new blood is probably like what, like an average film. Like you you might want to like it a lot more because of the way he looks in it. Um you know, uh part eight, I think we've talked about it, is is very low out of the 12 films right at the bottom. Um, and uh only you know, beaten by the what came next, which was Jason Goes to Hell. Right. And then we have Jason X, which definitely has entertainment value, has Uber Jason, which is really cool, it's a different perspective. But at the end of the day, that four-pack is not what you would show uh someone who says, Hey, what's this Friday the 13th series about? You would not what's a good Friday the 13th film?

SPEAKER_00 13:41

Most people aren't gonna think that little section.

SPEAKER_01 13:43

It would take you a while to get to a cane film. Yeah, unfortunately, yeah. It would take you a while for the that for you to say, okay, and now this one. Um, and that's that's the unfortunate thing. He just never had the uh the the script or the the right movie for his performance, but at the end of the day, at least he was in those movies to make them something special and memorable. And he's still honored for them. For sure, for sure. So we'll jump to Freddie versus Jason, which this is it it was very unceremonious. It was I would have left field that Kane Hodder didn't play Jason in this film. Um, I think everybody just thought it was uh it was he was a shoe-in and it was just an automatic. And uh and Hollywood, baby, Hollywood says no. Yeah, and uh and in this case, the role went to Ken Kurtzinger, um, who by all accounts is uh seems like a great guy. I was just never big on his his stature. Uh I thought he was a little lanky and a little bit uh too tall.

SPEAKER_00 14:55

You yeah, for me, like my little notes here, like we all know Jason killed him in part eight. He's the the chef that gets thrown across the diner. But to me, look, he was a stun man. To me, I think he I put he moved clumsily and like he had like these platform boots on. He was too like much like Frankenstein. To me, he moved like Frankenstein in the film. Like when he's going through the cornfield, he's very slow and methodical. Kane, I'm gonna go back to him, he was like running, and other guys are bursting through doors and stuff. He moved so slow, like even the fight with Freddie. It's like yeah, yeah. To me, he was very clumsy and like Frankenstein. It's like can just sit watch Frankenstein Frankenstein, iconic villain. But I don't want my Jason to be Frankenstein, and that's kind of what I feel like we got.

SPEAKER_01 15:46

Yeah, well, and it he be he was the Frankenstein caricature. It's kind of the same thing with Frankenstein, like uh the 1931 Frankenstein with Boris Karloff, like Frankenstein moved frantically, you know, like he was like freaked out, and he was like, you know, and and then over the years he became this like clumsy, you know, very, very like slow oaf, right? That wasn't the original Frankenstein, and that's kind of sometimes the way Jason uh seems in that film, right? Like it's just like a a caricature of okay, well, Freddie's smaller, so he's faster, so we gotta make Jason taller and bigger and and slower. And it just like it kind of got a little uh comic book like, uh if I'm I don't know. And it just um didn't work. Didn't work for me. I mean he moved slow, it was just too slow. Yeah. Yeah, and and I don't envy him. He he he suffered, like you know, uh uh a backlash with that, um, with just getting a role. That's not nothing against him. He uh he's just trying to get a rolls in Hollywood and he got one. Uh, but it didn't go over well. I always wonder what the hell the backlash would be in the days of social media, like nowadays, if like if he would they say they replaced Jigsaw.

SPEAKER_00 17:08

Yeah, yeah. Like if they replaced Jigsaw with somebody like with Tom Cruise, you know, it's like Tobin Bell for Tom Cruise.

SPEAKER_01 17:15

Yeah, like you know what I mean. Like I wonder nowadays how how hard of a decision uh that would have been to stick by because uh Kane Scott is fans, you know, he's uh he's all over uh people's arms and chests and legs and and stuff like that for being uh for being the Jason. But um yeah, again, so not big on on the portrayal of Jason or the look of Jason and Freddie versus Jason. Uh we both kind of agree on that, which you know is uh time to move on. So we'll bring it back. Uh the one of the most fun uh stories in the world of Jason actors is part two. Um yeah, so I mean, so in part two, uh Warrington Gillette is credited as Jason. And uh as many Friday 13th fans know, Steve Dash played Jason in most of the film and isn't was not afraid to let everybody know this. And uh if you could see Steve Dash, I mean rest in peace. If you if you search Steve Dash at like you know, some of these festivals or doing some interviews, uh just a good storyteller and uh just a fun, fun guy to listen to. Uh, he does not pull punches, he you know, did not like Gillette uh getting credit for being Jason at all. Uh he basically, you know, as the story goes, by told by Steve was that he was, you know, seeing him go to all these festivals and cons, and and he's like, wait a second, I played him. And that's when the confusion started. Um, I've heard Steve Dash's story a lot. I have not heard a rebuttal from Warren and Gillette too much, whether it's just you know taking the high road or not having an argument. But let me just kind of break down the gist of what it is. So uh Warren Gillette, you know, it's his face when he busts through the the window and and and grabs Ginny. It's it's all him, and apparently that was very, very early into the shoot. And there was an injury in that scene. He was not um uh not he didn't very he didn't kind of roll with the punches too well, from what I heard, and uh and was let go. Um and then they brought in Steve Dash, who played Jason in all of the scenes with the sack on the head. So that's the way that's the most common, and I from what I could tell, uh the story that holds the most weight. And uh so two actors that played Jason in part two, not on purpose, but uh Warrington Gillette was more of an actor. I think he was up for the role of Paul, um, if I remember correctly, and didn't get it, got the role of Jason, and uh didn't last too long. He wasn't a stunt man, so um they brought in a stunt man to finish off Jason. That's the story of the actors as I know it. And uh what were your take? What was your take on part two, Jason?

SPEAKER_00 20:50

So just I'll first talk about Warranton, uh Warrington. You know, he does the final scene, he jumps through the window, you know, and you can see why he has the sack, it was a great scene, just done in slow motion, but there's not much else to go on as far as the performance. You know, he did a good he did a great jump scare. So, like him taking full credit, kind of a little wacky in my opinion. I mean, it was just like it was like your first look at his face, but there's just not much to go on as far as saying I like the way he portrayed Jason because it was one scene. Now, about Steve Dash, to me, and I put in my notes, I'm like he was nimble and clumsy at the same time. Well, and what I mean, like like I think it looked he looked great with the sack on, he was a stunt man. This Jason was the way he portrayed him was like young and inexperienced. But if you think about it, Jason really does learn fast because he's like inexperienced in part two. Yeah, then in 3 4, which is technically the same weekend, just yeah, expert. Yeah, but he played him like a young, like a young man, not like a seasoned killer. And I like that. It was like there was some not naivete, but like some I play he played him more like a man than a monster. Which in some ways can be more scary because you can actually that's somebody who can legit attack you. Yeah. Yeah, you got the big towering Kane Hotter Jason. Little comical in a way, because it's over-exaggerated, but Steve Dash, his Jason could be somebody walking down the street right now with the hood over their head. So he was he played it more like a man and a monster. That still, to me, can be kind of scary in a way. He was young, inexperienced. So I think he played him. Steve Dash really knew the character well. You know, you're getting revenge for your mom, you're angry, your adrenaline's pumping, so you're gonna be a little sloppy. You're gonna be a little clumsy because your adrenaline is pumping, not as methodical. You just wanted, you know, it's just like uh mayhem. That's the way you played him. So I gotta I I do love Steve Dash's performance.

SPEAKER_01 22:45

Yeah. Yeah, and and just uh uh like I said, just a colorful personality uh who's no longer with us, but um, you know, definitely reclaimed his uh his right to uh to to you know say he was Jason in part two. Um, but there was two, and you know, and one of the reasons was um, you know, uh again, we talk like I said, Hollywood baby. Um, you know, when Warrington was signed on for the film and given the credit, you know, there's a lot of legal stuff, especially if you've shot and you've had them in there and you've had face showing and stuff like that, it was not an easy thing to do. So Steve Dash doesn't even really get a credit. I think he is gets a buried credit in the film, um, maybe a stunt coordinator or something like that, because they couldn't completely replace Warren and Gillette at that particular point in time. Uh they were too deep into the production. So it's it's a legal thing too, right? It it becomes a little bit uh convoluted that way. But uh but at the same time, you know, you got you had two guys going out there talking about their experiences, Jason. No, like I never had an issue with Warranton Gillette. I think this face let looked perfect when it was all mutilated. And no, again, that's not a dig on him. I thought it was just a it was a great look for Jason. And uh, and yeah, I agree with you. Part two, like I love that, like, you know, growing pains kind of Jason. It was kind of uh it was fun. All right, my friend. Well, let's let's move on. Let's let's go to let's go to part five. Let's go to part five. Let's jump around to part five. So part five was uh was polarizing in so many ways. Uh, but we had two Jasons in this one as well, but that played into the storyline. We had uh uh of course we had Dick Wheeland as Roy Jason and uh and Tom Morga as Jason in uh the flashbacks, as well as the stunt was a lot of the stunt work as well. Um I don't know what's your comments on five.

SPEAKER_00 25:01

Like five I do, I still enjoy as a film, but if you've seen the first like if you watched all let's say you're gonna do in a marathon with somebody who's never seen these films before, get through the first four, they're getting a good feel for who Jason is now. Put on number five, just tell him, just accept the fact that Jason's back. Yeah, expend disbelief, he's back. You're gonna watch that film, like something's off, just the way he's moving is totally different. It's like more stiff, more unsure, like not that unkillable, like menace that he was. It's just kind of like more methodical in a way, like more cautious, a little awkward. So just something first time you're watching, like, that's that's not the guy. Because like, yeah, the size difference. He's definitely not as big. Yeah, you know, he was he was he was smaller, but I still like the way he played him. I think the kills were brutal, some really good kills. There was, you know, you can tell there was emotion in those kills because there was he was getting revenge for his son getting killed. Spoiler. So um there was emotion in those kills, it just it wasn't our Jason that we already had known to come in love by then. So not knocking him, but it was something different. But I'm not gonna poo-poo on it because it wasn't Jason Borges.

SPEAKER_01 26:19

For sure. Um, you know, and it's kind of like, yeah, it's kind of hard to even just delve into this one a little bit because of what we know. It's just it wasn't Jason, and um, you know, but the the the the shots, those visions that Tommy had were you know Jason's their stair with the axe all axe all bloody. Uh I mean they look great, and that's uh um Tom. And um, yeah, I think you know there's there's some brilliance brilliant shots in that film. Um and I think maybe a couple more flashbacks uh would have been really, really cool because he did look so cool and menacing. And um as far as uh Roy, you know, you know what I never thought of Uncle Pete until I was kind of like just thinking about this, and maybe like I'm completely out to lunch on this, but um you know it was called a new beginning, right? And a lot of that is to do with the fact that it's not Jason, then Jason died. This is a new beginning, self-explanatory. I was thinking about it, I was like, Roy and his son is literally like Pamela and her son. I I have thought about yeah, I was just like still a parent storyline, just a different uh sex in the parent, and um, you know, seen being there working kind of uh adjacent to you know where the murder happened and everything like that. And I I don't know if I'm just slow on the uptake, as the kids say, back in like 1977. Um I don't know if I was as slow to come to realize that, but I was just like, God, they could have they could have done a series after that with Roy.

SPEAKER_00 28:05

Like they could have launched Roy as a and if you think about it, the podcast namesake Crazy Ralph did say it's got a death curse. Yeah, so maybe there is something to that. Maybe there is some type of curse because um both kids were special needs, yeah. And you you it looked uh presumably two single parents.

SPEAKER_01 28:28

Yeah, yeah. So it just a bully, maybe crazy. Bully or bullies, they were making love while that like you know, but Jason, there was always the story that he was being bullied at camp and you know, just complete neglect. And it was it was the retelling of Friday the 13th, but in front of your face, and I didn't realize it until like three days ago when I'm prepping for this show.

SPEAKER_00 28:48

So if you let's say you took out the Tommy Jarvis, this is a totally off the cuff. Let's say you took out the Tommy Jarvis parts of a new beginning. Could you call it a remake?

SPEAKER_01 29:00

Yeah. I mean, a remake might be a little bit steep. Like a re-imaging, a reboot, re-imag. Yeah, uh definitely a reboot. I mean, you could go that way if that was even a round back. Okay, reboot, yeah, reboot mode and remake. I don't know if that phraseology was around back then. You could probably say it was a reboot. Yeah, you take Tommy out of there. We and we've talked about this on a different podcast. Like, as much as we want to love Tommy, he was really expendable in that film, uh, the way they kind of wrote him. But yeah, he's a forgettable Tommy.

SPEAKER_00 29:32

Yes, Tom Matthews and Corey Fellman. Yeah, I don't remember the middle guy's name.

SPEAKER_01 29:36

Yeah, no, I know. I hear I hear you. It was uh, but that's a great question. I don't know if I would call that a a remake. Um it would be a remake, but like a stretch, like you know, real let us know in the comments what you guys think about that theory. Yeah, and and let me know, be honest. Was like, did did you ever kind of draw the parallel that Roy and Pamela were kind of in the same boat and fighting the same battle? I don't know. Anyways, so we we kind of did really talk about the acting in that one, but there really wasn't a heck of a lot. Um, what about uh what about the the original Jason, Ari Lehman? So this guy, you know, God love him. He uh he's another one like Kane, really, you know, like uh not only embraces it, but like just you know dives in head first, no pun intended. Uh small, small, you know, uh sample size for him as Jason, but effective, and uh he was able to really parlay that into something special for himself and you know has his own band, first Jason, and he was. He was the first Jason. I mean, there's not a lot to talk about, but I'd be remiss if we didn't.

SPEAKER_00 30:54

Yeah, it's like again, Kid Jason, he looks scary. One of the greatest jump scares in horror. Like again, we've all seen it numerous times, but put yourself in 1980 in the theater watching this new horror movie called Friday the 13th. You're sitting there, okay, cool, the movie's over. We don't inundate you with jump like nowadays, you expect jump scares, you're waiting for it. But back then, beautiful Crystal Lake, she's got a finger in the water, and then you just get hit, bam. I can imagine people jumping out of their skin, not expecting that at all. You got this horrific looking kid pulling her into the lake right after you think she's safe. So that ending messes with your safety, and we have Ari to thank for it because he did a great job, looks scary, you know, doesn't really say much, just reaches an arm up and pulls her down, and that's it. And he's been able to make a career on it, and that's pretty awesome.

SPEAKER_01 31:46

Yeah, yeah, good for him. But again, there's not really a heck of a lot to talk about. Um, the uh we won't talk about the little boy in part eight that was supposed to be Jason, but was you know the kid in his underwear and the sewer, yeah, and then yeah, there's that, and then the flashback, yeah. We won't go into part eight. Uh for for for as much as we can, we'll stay away from part eight. But let's talk part six, which is uh oftentimes talked about as uh as uh your favorite. And um this is uh probably one of the biggest built Jasons, CJ Graham. Uh, but Dan Bradley was uh, I don't know, was he credited? But he he played Jason in uh in the cemetery scene. In the opening uh oh yeah in the opening cemetery scene, he was Jason, and um he was replaced by CJ based on uh stature. They didn't it's not that they didn't like him per se. There was nothing wrong with Dan, but they just they I guess saw CJ and uh they wanted that size, they wanted that frame, and uh and and CJ is the dawn of zombie Jason. It started in part six where he just uh he was resurrected like Frankenstein, um, and uh became a very, very brisk walking Jason. And I remember this is I remember okay, so when I was uh when I was a kid and uh we would we talk about Jason, it was always like Jason doesn't run. Jason doesn't run, even though he ran in the early ones. Uh you know, CJ Graham on, he kind of doesn't really run. And it was always a thing. He doesn't run, he doesn't have to because he's so fast, he tracks you down. And this is the kid's mentality in the schoolyard, right? Uh CJ Graham's strut was pretty, pretty powerful, man. That guy, that guy had a walk on him. He did it was like a walk run. And um, yeah, so he he kind of introduced that I'm not running, and that kind of took, right? That never he Jason really, until part of the remake, really never ran again. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 34:06

So, like you said, zombie Jason, this is the scariest version yet. That cemetery scene, his face is mangled, he comes back alive, like, oh shit, you know, like we just we just done effed up. Like I said, like you said, he moved differently. I love that scene with the paintball team, and you just hear and he's just good, you just the shot of his legs, like you like he's like just floating, just he's he's fast, but he's not running, you know, like previous ones that are running, like Richard Brooker, you see him running. Yeah, but DJ Graham's not running, like he was towering. This guy was his tank, he was like the juggernaut, just moving forward. You weren't gonna stop him. Now, with I think the way CJ Graham did the kills, they were more personal because he's pissed that he got killed, now he's back to life. So whether he's pissed he got resurrected, he got pissed that he was killed in the first place. Now these kills are personal. Because if you like the first four, they were kind of like in his area. It's like, okay, I'm just want to clean this out, but now it's like, no, you done pissed me off. You know, f FAFO is what CJ Graham Jason said. FAFO, and he's just into just like clear everything in his path, going straight back to Crystal Lake. So just he was just more his kills were more personal the way you perform. That's the interesting with all these Jasons. We all love these films, but everybody performed it just a little bit differently.

SPEAKER_01 35:30

Yeah. It's just weird if you think about it. Actually, it's funny because you were talking about the head tilt with Kane, but CJ did was, you know, when he kind of first gets to the camp, he kind of does that. He he he did the the head tilt as well. Um, and and this was like brute force, Jason, right? Like, you know, throwing a guy and ripping off his arm, crushing skulls with your head. Now he did that in part three, but yeah. So, you know, this is where you know, punching a hole through someone. Um this is this really upped the ante in uh in a Friday the 13th film. All of a sudden, as much as he was hard to kill before, there was still something man about him. All of a sudden, now you don't know what it is. And uh, and that was in the performance because again, like I said, he was he was like well, like we've talked about, extremely fast, but never ran. Seemed very cool.

SPEAKER_00 36:26

He didn't need to be careful anymore because he was unkillable, so it's not like he needed to be careful of injuries. Now you can just take a bullet.

SPEAKER_01 36:33

Exactly. And it was actually the first Friday the 13th, where almost from beginning to end, you see Jason. Um, like you know, part obviously one, we'll take that one out, but part two, until the end, you don't see him a lot. Same thing with part three until he gets the mask hammer kills or just here and there. Yeah, like part four, same thing. Part six, uh, Jason was almost the star of this film. Like, you know, he was they showed him walking, they showed him heading to camp. Like, you know, they showed him a lot.

SPEAKER_00 37:02

I just thought you see a lot of the kills in the daylight during part six. You don't see that a lot in other films. There was a lot of kills. Most horror movies, people only die at night. It was during the day, and he just mowed through that entire, like, you know, paintball team.

SPEAKER_01 37:18

Yeah, yeah. And I thought I thought C D CJ did a great, uh, great job. Um I again, I and we talked about the looks before, you know, how I feel. Like I felt he was just a little too neat and tucked in. I would have liked to have seen him more rugged. Um, you know, but uh he was definitely a tall son of a gun and it showed. Um but yeah, I I I I liked his performance. I like part six. I thought he was great for it. And um, you know, it's one of those uh like that's that's the type of movie that you you you kind of not in the not that you didn't want CJ in it, but that's the kind of movie you wish Kane had, right? You wish he had that one in his legacy.

SPEAKER_00 38:01

That is that is the one that I wish he had done. I would love to see what Kane could have done with part six.

SPEAKER_01 38:06

Yeah, and uh, but anyways, it's uh can't go back now, can we? However, we are gonna go back. We're gonna go back to part three. Dr. Richard Brooker. He's actually not a doctor. I apologize for that, but uh Richard Brooker had the physique I liked the most in Jason. There was something tall and lanky about him, but not too lanky where it looked awkward. He had the hunchback, but it wasn't like quasimodo or anything like that. Um I love them the the makeup design that they did on him and uh both makeup designs that they did on him. But ultimately, um you know this is this is where he gets the mask and um and and there's there's there's a couple of things. I'll let you go. I'll let you talk about uh Richard Brooker before I kind of just dive into a couple of things, but uh how about it?

SPEAKER_00 39:05

Yeah, so like I put in my notes like he was the first to wear the mask, and if you think about it, he's the I'm not too much about the look, but he started a look that lasted like eight to nine movies: the green shan, the green shirt, and the blue slash tan pants. Yeah, I think everybody kind of did a little bit with the way Richard Brooker carried, he was the first Jason Jason in the mask and everything. And he kind of did a little, he would do like the head tilt. He he also showed he was the first person that had to show emotion and anger without your face.

SPEAKER_02 39:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:36

With that, because even in um part two, they would focus on the eye. Over here, you really couldn't see his eyes. Yeah, so he had to do a he was the first one to try and show all that emotion, and he I think he did a good job. He like he did see he would like almost do like the cane hotter, like kind of shrug his shoulders and like do a little huff and like not like a huff and a puff but show that he's angry. Like when he's chasing, he's like almost like a like Mr. Hyde, he's like frantic and feverish, like yeah, he's gotta get the kills. And I put like um he's more confident now. I think after he survived number two, yes, now Jason, he's more confident. Like, oh, I just got you know, I survived this machete chopping through my shoulder and everything. He's like, Okay, maybe I got something here. So I think uh Richard gave Jason more confidence, big jump from number two to three, just in his confidence and maturity. Like you would think it was a year later the way he performed it.

SPEAKER_02 40:29

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:30

It was the same day, but you would think it was a year later the way Jason matured in a short amount of time. Yeah, and it's just that's how Richard Brooker interpreted the character.

SPEAKER_01 40:38

Yeah. And um, and you know, and all they had to do at the beginning of part three was put five years later and just like, and and that's it. Like they they didn't even have to really think too hard on this, or two years later, two years later. Sure.

SPEAKER_00 40:56

The body could have been missing by the time the paramedics got there. You just see the machete line in the sand and the hay, bam.

SPEAKER_01 41:03

Yeah, two years later, it gives you that uh that time for that flashback with Chris where she encounters him in the woods, gives you that time to have that. Um, man, yeah, anyways, just simple little decisions that would have made things better. I you know what I liked about Richard Brooker was that he kind of embodied a lot. Like, you know, in the beginning, he's stealth. He's trying, like, you know, where he gets his outfit, like you know, when the clothes line there. You know, then there's the point where there's a lot of people kind of laugh about this one where he's just kind of sauntering out with the crossbow there to uh to fire it into the he just got and then he just chucks it, just kind of like it's it's it's a very out of character thing. I don't know what the what the uh direction was on that one, but it was it's funny. But then, like I said, that that chase with Chris, like you know, where he's running down the hill, he looks like he's gonna lose his balance and stuff like that. Exactly, yeah. That's what I'm talking about. How he's kind of like yeah, like you know, but he's like determined, and even when he's limping and he's running down, and like you know, and you see him with the van and stuff like that. Just it was real and it was freaky. Like that was a real man, that was a real man coming for you, and that was like I I feel like he was like to me the freakiest in that regard because there was some relatability to a lot of that.

SPEAKER_00 42:24

And I think what you said freaky, like a like it seemed like you go, holy crap, is like when she hits him in the head with the axe, yeah, instinct would be let me get this out of my head. But no, he's going like that, like you son of a bitch. Yeah, that there's that does that little freak. So I see what you're saying. He added that, like, oh, like that unsettlingness, like instinct would be like take it out.

SPEAKER_01 42:43

But he's like, No, you no, he's he's dying at that time. I guess he's not thinking straight. But I love that, I love the like when he gets hit. Like, I love that. Like it was like that's that's what you miss in the later Jasons, I feel like you know, unfortunately, is that that human element that really makes it, you know. And then even when he's like at the window with he's unmasked and he's running out and stuff like that, there's just a lot of uh just realism to that. Like there's frantic, there's calm, there's like you know, out of control, there's you know, it I just I loved it. The great great performance by uh Richard Brooker and uh um and if we're gonna talk about great performances, we move on to Ted White, who Ted White at first did not love the fact that he was associated with Friday the 13th. Um he was an actor and he has been in a lot of stuff. You've seen him and stuff, um you just probably don't even realize it. But he was an actor who um was the oldest performer to play Jason. But in saying he is an actor and not a stunt man, man, it showed. Like I I thought the part for Jason um was a performance. Uh I thought like he he looked pissed, he looked angry, he looked vengeful. All came out. And it wasn't with head tilts or you know breathing. And all due respect, we said we love those things about Kane and stuff like that. But it was just all subtle and just violent. And and I absolutely love the performance of Ted White. It's my favorite Friday the 13th Jason performance. Um and uh yeah I I can't say enough good things about what he did for that that the that part and uh so I will say just like you said like I put down like you know more aggressive this time around.

SPEAKER_00 44:47

Like he played the role like they called it the final chapter. So he played that role this is my last stand. I'm gonna just when he burst through that door top five scene in the entire franchise top five segment in the entire franchise when he the door just explodes into toothpicks and he is so pissed off like you said he is just so angry and even in the kills are angry like when he kills my boy Jim the winner of Star Search. You know he puts that core screw in his hand and just that cleaver it's just angry.

SPEAKER_01 45:27

Yeah when he kills the twin just yanking her out he is like you said he is so pissed off it's the final chapter you knew this Jason was going to be their last in you don't know how they would kill him off but he played it like I'm going out with the bang and he damn he sure did even when even when he took that uh machete for uh shot from Trish in this in the chest he's just like you know he's just like get out of here like and then uh and then when he gets the machete in the head and he's just like ground and groan groaning and just like you know it's just it the performance was unbelievable.

SPEAKER_00 46:05

Um she throws something at him and hits the wall he looks like you stupid bitch just like he's like he's super pissed.

SPEAKER_01 46:13

Yeah no kudos to Ted White um he uh he did come around after and uh you know I guess realizing when you know all all the fans he had and and how meaningful as a lot of them do you know in the beginning they kind of want to make sure that they proceed with their careers especially a lot of the young actors but uh Ted White uh was just uh an unbelievable performer in the role of I think he said he really didn't care for Corey Feldman so like one of the interviews he's like yeah I didn't like that little shit so he's like so he's like sometimes a lot of that anger like he really didn't get along with the kids on set from my understanding because he was like always in character he's like I didn't want to get along with them because I don't want them like when I'm doing a scene I don't want them to think oh there's there's Ted who I was just at craft services having a cup of coffee.

SPEAKER_00 47:01

Yeah he's like no I wanted to I wanted him to like be afraid of me the entire time and there's that psychology actor in him that I that he really brought into that character.

SPEAKER_01 47:10

A form of method acting obviously and uh you know but um there is that famous story where he he came to the defense of Judy Aronson when she was in the water too long and he he you know so he and he's he was beloved like you know you see all the pictures after at all these cons and stuff and all everybody just loved him so like you know he he um yeah I I I loved uh Ted White I I think he was just fantastic as Jason and um I've I've said this many times he was my favorite uh performer as Jason my favorite look of Jason was part three what was your favorite performer as Jason I bring you on the spot okay think about it think about it think about it for a sec we're gonna talk about the remake and Derek Mears who I thought uh did a fantastic job I I I again I didn't love the remake too much but I loved his performance as Jason it was menacing it was big it was tall he looked like like kind of he had a resemblance to the former captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs Matt Sundine which uh you know speaks to me personally but um but I I thought he just had this awesome aggression um and stature it worked um yeah what are your thoughts on Derek well you asked that question and it might be controversial but Derek Mears is my favorite performance of Jason because to me he's the most frightening out of all of them because he's clever this guy's a hunter he sets up traps you know he's got like early warning systems in his little shack so like this is this is a clever Jason that's the way Derek performed because he was in Hatchet and he played a SWAT officer so he knows how to play like these methodical characters and like he was and he was menacing like in the uh thing was like a shot on the trailer he's running at that guy like and again you just hear dun dun dun dump fast and the screen cuts away yeah then when you watch the movie the guy's got the machete in his head puts his boot on it just yanks it out yeah this is another angry Jason but he kills somebody with the bow and arrow this is like Hunter backwoods survivalist Jason to me I think he's the most dangerous Jason because of the traps and the whatnot he's got the Derek Mears has got the size but I feel like if you just stood off his little weed farm he'd leave you alone like I think he just wants to be like a ret close he's not gonna go out looking for trouble because kids are having sex they're like no you're in my lake get the duck out of fodge and you know I'll leave you guys alone to me he was a combination of all the best parts of the previous actors big menacing fast nimble agile calculating clever scary fast just to me it was he was like the best of all the worlds so yeah Derek Mears as you could tell can you explain it a little bit better that was sorry boss tell me just use a few more adjectives do a little do us do with more passion there yeah exactly no no I love it I love it I'm glad that he got some love because like you know again I'm not biggest fan of that film but I thought he he was great in it um all right so thanks to uh slick and cabin six I got all the Jasons and their age when they portrayed the so the youngest was Ari Lehman at 15 number the second youngest was Warrington Gillette 21. So let's give the guys uh like a break Steve Dash like you know he was young and he was like you know uh trying to figure things out on set this was kind of surprising Richard Brooker 28 uh then cj graham was 30 years old and then Kane Hodder was 33 in part seven thirty four in part eight then 37 Derek Mears and Steve Dash both were 37 then Kane Hodder in Jason Goes to Hell was 38 uh Dick Wyland was 40 as Roy Ken Kurtzinger was 44 and then we have one two three all right the the oldest performers for Jason Tom Morga 44 in part five Kane Hodder 46 in 2001 and the oldest was Dr. Ted White I'm making every Jason that I like a doctor. Dr. Ted White was 58 and uh and lived a beautifully long life so he was able to enjoy all his uh praise and accolades from his fans and uh yeah so that's that's the Jasons my friend that's those are the guys that played them and the guys that we love and the stories that we can't get enough of and um yeah that's about all I got to say.

SPEAKER_00 52:05

Yeah let us know in in the comments down below what do you think who's your favorite who's your least favorite if you had to build your favorite like what are your favorite parts of Jason do you like the methodical do you like the clever do you like brute force do you like the hunter because we all like different Jasons for different reasons no one's right no one's wrong. Yeah yeah so I just I'd love to hear what you guys what do you love about Jason what do you not like about Jason just like you've heard Jason and I talk for the last 50 somewhat minutes.

SPEAKER_01 52:33

Yeah absolutely and uh you know it's it's it's always uh everybody's got a lot of opinions obviously Kane is a fan favorite but there's a lot of other opinions out there that uh are worth uh listening to and uh maybe someone that like Uncle Pete said maybe someone that you didn't really like as Jason that you know these felt just took it in a turn that you didn't want oh we'll see that being said I think that put that's a wrap on this show um once again thanks for joining us don't forget to uh love us and and praise us and you know we don't we don't get it in our home lives we need it in our uh youtube lives uh so no please subscribe share us comment engage uh on the instagram on the instagram oh my god i almost sounded like an old person it was just on that interest I got tongue tied on instagram uh the crazy rap podcast can be found under the whore slash umbrella so the whore slash just like the YouTube channel uh follow us there and engage in our posts we uh we want to hear what you have to say it's part of the fun for us I know we we say that a lot but it really is part of the fun for us so yeah 100% yeah so uncle Pete any part and words no thanks for checking us out just stay safe enjoy life and go watch some more Friday 13th movies and we'll see you here next time absolutely can't wait take care