The Truth About Being a Great Teammate | Reed Low

Former NHL enforcer and St. Louis Blues fan favorite Reed Low joins the We Attitude Podcast to share the incredible journey from being cut repeatedly as a young player to carving out a career in the NHL.

In this conversation, Reed discusses the lessons that shaped his life both on and off the ice, including:

✔️ The importance of being a great teammate
✔️ Why coachability matters at every level
✔️ How leaders create winning cultures
✔️ The mindset required to overcome setbacks
✔️ Accepting your role while maximizing your potential
✔️ What businesses can learn from championship teams
✔️ The difference between individual success and team success

Whether you're a business owner, team leader, athlete, coach, or someone striving to grow personally, this episode is packed with practical wisdom on leadership, accountability, culture, and resilience.

Key Takeaway:
"Be a great teammate. Be coachable. Outwork the person across from you."

Chapters

00:00 Introduction & Meeting Reed Low
01:40 Growing Up in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan
03:40 Running Out of Speed & Finding a New Path
05:20 The Decision to Become an Enforcer
08:20 Getting Cut & Nearly Quitting Hockey
09:30 The Advice That Changed Everything
10:45 What It Means to Be a Great Teammate
13:00 Fighting for a Spot in the NHL
15:00 Leadership Lessons from Al MacInnis
18:00 Why Coachability Matters
21:00 Understanding Your Role on a Team
24:00 Team Culture & Accountability
28:00 Leadership, Following & Trust
32:00 Systems, Structure & Winning Teams
35:00 Applying Hockey Lessons to Business
37:00 Leadership Today & Final Thoughts

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Alright, welcome back to the Re Attitude Podcast. I'm excited today to have um our guest, who's an awesome uh human being, um, kind of a legend in St. Louis hockey world. Uh Re had the opposite play for the blues for a number of years. Uh Re Lowe is with me today. Um Re and I, uh Reed doesn't remember that because he was in the climb to his his uh his journey to the NHL, but we uh we played against each other in the minors, and uh I just remember how bass it of a human he wore that's like I just hope he's not on the ice bag. So, Rita, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself, who you are, where you're from, and then we'll just kind of dive into it.

SPEAKER_02 0:45

Yeah, so first off, thanks for having me on. Um it's funny because when I first got back, like I don't remember a lot of things, and and I didn't even really know that you had played in the minor leagues in Pro Hacking, and so um, but hopefully that was still nice. Um but then once I did find out, and obviously it didn't take me very long to listen to his French Canadian accent, one of the few French Canadians I like.

SPEAKER_01 1:10

I mean my favorite one is gonna hang on to that. If my boy Jesse Cannon's listening, who was my boss and Richard Brothers, you might have to play now again.

SPEAKER_02 1:18

Uh both of you two are right up there. Uh but no, it's been uh it's been fun getting to know you and and becoming good friends. So thanks for having me on for lack of uh anything else. Reblo. Uh born and raised in Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan. If Soupy Campbell is here, he'd say, Where's Moose Jaw Losie? And I'd say, six feet from Moose's ass. And uh laugh. Uh funny story about that, too. I'll get into that later if we get a chance. But uh actually, I'll just do it now. Um first prick uh training camp ever, just signed an HL ticket. Uh, three years, two-way, uh, nice signing bonus. I'm at training camp, I'm on the elevator and going down, and Joel Quindle and three scouts get on the elevator. And Joe, uh one of the guys like, uh you're from you're from Moosehou, Saskatchewan, right, Blosy? I'm like, yeah. And he's like, Where is that? And dude, the words came out of my mouth, and I was like, Oh, come on, come back in, come back in here. I'm like, I just birthday in camp, I've already cherred with the scouts. What are you doing, you know? And so uh, anyways, Joe Cribble's dying laughing, and they all laughed and had some fun with it. So uh, but yeah, uh, grew up with no of nothing else but just NHL. Um, didn't graduate high school until I was 40 years old. Uh, did not care about it at all. I had one mission, and and that was to make it NHL. And when I kind of, I would say, I didn't want sure I ran out of skill, but I certainly ran out of speed uh when I was about 17 years old. I was like, what else can I do here? And uh uh um got in a fight, a couple fights, uh in minor North Dakota, and then just kind of went from there. Um and was lucky enough to get drafted by the blues and then play here. And then what's better than all of them is the community and how they just surround their professional athletes, and kind of like once you give them the blood, sweat, and tears, they just give it back for the rest of your life. And so we're so blessed and so privileged to be here, be a part of this community. And then um, you know, I'm fortunate enough to work in the charity uh Severe as a as an event auctioneer and and even into some consulting, like I've just done so many of them. There's a lot of people that want to know what I like, you know what I see and why it doesn't work. So um, yeah, short little story there on the journey. There's there's a ton of rabbit holes on the way. Um, almost quit, did everything.

SPEAKER_00 3:44

So yeah, so that let's let's kind of unpack some of this, right? Because I I want to go back to when you said like you when you ran out of speed, right? So like the world now moves at such a fast pace that um you don't you don't get to plan everything, or or everything you plan doesn't necessarily pan out the way you want it, right? And uh the ability to pivot and and and find a different path or or adopt a different ways or whatever uh is somewhat of uh a gift because some people will resist it. No, no, I'll do it my way. I'm gonna stick to this, I'm gonna stick to this, this is what I've been doing, this is what I've been doing. And and I mean you would have had the same outcome have you had you stuck with the I've been working at the railway back in the shop. And you you you arguably went the hardest path. Yeah, I mean, like that the the living, especially back in those days. Uh big deaths of that, yes, and uh the the the the living you made and and the path you chose it besides courage, uh it takes uh yeah, I mean, it just takes a ton of guts to do it. So, so at what point do you like, like or how often should I say, like, right? Because I've seen it, I've seen guys like drop the gloves. I mean, I it happened to me not as often, but you're like, what is happening here? Like, what am I doing? Everybody's clapping, but you're like, that hurt? Yeah, no, like that, that's gonna leave a mark. And like, so at what point in your journey when you made the pivot and you said, all right, this is gonna be my path. If I'm gonna make it, this is the one thing I have to really get good at. Um, any times when you start second guessing yourself and every single game, yeah, like, oh my god, who does it this time?

SPEAKER_02 5:22

You know, it really I I I've got to give all the credit to my former coach. He's now a scout for the Toronto Maple East, Jim Rock. Uh, he was he coached some collegiate uh NCAA uh Division I and uh I came to training camp. I was a senior in high school back in Moosehaw, and I was planning on coming down and having a good training camp in the Saskatchewan Junior Hockey League, the SJHL tier two level. They had listed me that summer, and like you said, I packed a duffel bag. My sister, my buddy that was also listed with them, mom and dad drove four hours down to Mina, North Dakota, and I had a good training camp. I made the intersquad game. A coach put the two tough guys on the other side and told them to go after me, see what I had, and I fought them both and had really good fights, and um I ended up scoring four goals in that intersquad game, too. And so I'm like, I'm not even knowing what I'm thinking. I have been cut from every team I've ever played for. I signed an NHL contract when I was 21 years old, and I played three years of tier one hockey my entire life, two in the Western Hockey League, and then double A pee-wee uh when I was a second-year Pee-wee. That's it, that's the only tier one hockey I'd ever played, right? And uh, so I'm up into Jim's office and he's like, that's quite a game. Yeah, I did the day of moves. He's like, think you could do that again? And I was like, um score four goals. He's like, nah, beat the crap out of those guys. I'm like, first thing out of my mind is does it mean I'm gonna make the team? And he's like, absolutely. I'm like, literally, you point them out, I'll take them out. And the that story is is kind of funny and unique in its own setting, but you know, in my later years in life, I've had to kind of peel back some of the layers of that onion on why did I say yes? Why was I so willing to take that role on it? You know, I think I went through such a dark time in my adolescence where I didn't have a whole lot of friends. Um, I finally found a role, and I've never been in a street fighter bar fight ever in my life.

SPEAKER_00 7:13

Like I it's just not me. And that's funny because a lot of guys that did that role are like the quietest guy off this on the street, right? Like you sit down and you would and then you something happened, right? You put the skates on, you get there, and like, oh shit, who is this guy?

SPEAKER_02 7:27

But and and it's this, it's like I finally had a role in life where not only did they like me, but they respected me. Yeah, and um, so I was I really grew that off of that. I really loved that role. I did not like fighting, but I happened to be pretty good at it. And I I mopped up most of that leak that year. Um, towards the end of the year, they were holding on to my right arm, so I went home that summer, grabbed a tensor bandage around a heavy bag, and punched with my left until I couldn't feel my arm every single day. Went back. Now, people, if you ask people in the hockey world after it's all said and done, they'll tell you that I'm a lefty, but I'm not. I learned how to throw left hands that summer as an 18-year-old. And and then I was kind of getting playing actually some good hockey down there, and I was kind of getting scouted, but I didn't have my high school education. I dropped out of high school. So at that point in time, I knew that the Western Hockey League, if I was gonna do this, had to go. Called the Regina Pats. Um, they gave me a two-game tryout, sent me back, and then uh the following summer I went and talked to Al Tour and Mooshaw with the Warriors and said, Hey, listen, like I'll go back and play in the SJ, but I think that you know I need an opportunity at this level to see how I can taggle with these guys. And uh he's like, Yeah, sure, and made a bunch of promises and I quit hockey almost at the end of that training camp. So I got cut again, no intersquad gate, no nothing. Did everything that I was supposed to do, beat up the guys that were on the team. I was a 19-year-old rookie in the Western Hockey League, the head scouts like we can't have 19-year-old rookies. Um, so then I got cut and I went missing for three days on a little three-day bender in the jaw. My dad couldn't find me, he was so not happy. Right. Uh, and then he uh after that, he's like, What are you gonna do? And I actually my dad sold real estate since 1982. He's like, I'm like, Well, I thought I just come sell real estate with you. He's like, I didn't know I was hiring. And I'm like, What do you mean? I'm your son, you have to hire me, you know? Uh but he talked me into it. My dad was the best hockey dad ever, he never got in the way. Obviously, he didn't do anything to get me on any upper echelon teams. Three things that he had he told me to focus on, and that's be a great teammate, be coachable, and I'll work the person across from you. And those are really in life, in hockey, whatever we're doing, we don't have a whole lot more in our control than those three things. And so I said he's like, go back to my play hockey for a month. If you still hate it after 30 days, come back and I'll bring in. Yeah. He's like, do me a favor. If you can't do it for yourself, do it for me. So I went down and uh I was back in Mushan 30 days, but it wasn't to sell real estate. I'd run to the SJHL and I had 10 goals and seven assistants, seven games, and the Warriors were like, we might have made a mistake here. We need a national ring that's tough because they were getting their butts kicked back and back home too. And so they're like, all right, let's let's let's do this. And so I got called up, and at the end of that season, I got drafted by the St. Louis of Poo's in the seventh round, yeah, uh, the day after my my 20th birthday. So uh not only did he take me everywhere and drive everywhere, that moment when I was ready to quit, he was there to say, never think you're done yet, kid. Yeah, so great. Those those three digs are are are so true to anything, right?

SPEAKER_00 10:37

Anyway, I'm teaching it all I knew today. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So let's talk about this. Like what uh transition, yeah, go in and the pros spend some time in the minors, but I want to emphasize the part of being a good teammate. It's it's like you, it's something I value at a high level. I I try to shove that way every day. So so what did that look like for you at that time of your life with what you were chasing to be a good teammate? Because I I have an unfair advantage, like I know like the journey and the feeling and what comes with it. So, but I think a lot of times people forget, like misunderstand what a teammate is, right? Oftentimes the way I perceive it or I feel it, it's like, well, like it's really cool if I win too, kind of thing. Yeah, right, where it's actually like, hey, no, you got this, you know. And so what did I look like when you turn pro and start playing with guys that are significantly older and have a lot more experience?

SPEAKER_02 11:31

Yeah, there was challenges because I came with a little bit of a loud mouth too. I know that's hard to believe. Uh so and I was and I was confident in my skills as an enforcer. And so there were some guys that tried to knock me down a level, and for the most part, you know, you know, it worked. Um, and and just got me back into hey, listen, like the we is what's more important. Bobby Plagger and Chaser, and all the guys have said you play for the name on the front, not the name on the back. Yeah, and having a true understanding to that is what's gonna make a success. Like, there's probably nothing more important in anything than being a better, great teammate to each other and treating each other the way that you want to be treated, and all the cliches and slogans that kind of come along with that. You know, it's all out there, but are you truly willing to sacrifice something so that somebody else can have it? And for me, I did it in the most ridiculous form ever because I went out on the ice when something happened to my teammates, or we needed a spark, or uh, you know, we were just trying to jostle for who the toughest guys in the league were that at the beginning of the year, like you see fights for no reason, it's just like, well, we're gonna find out who is and who isn't the daughter and who's the sheriff, who's the sheriff, and who's the guys to look for and who's the guys to intimidate. And, you know, just my first year in St. Louis, I was a healthy scratcher the first four games, and we were one, two, and one on the road. We took an LA swing, and we came back and I got the lineup and I fought every night. Like I was just I was going out on the ice and I was hunting just to get that pressure away from me so that I could just prove to these guys that I would do anything to be here, right?

SPEAKER_00 13:01

Yeah, and uh and so I don't think I want to emphasize that you you were going out on the ice doing anything you can to get into a fight to show everybody you belong here, not to fix, not to elevate yourself and say, look at me. Yeah, like I want to stay here, and this is what it's gonna take, this is what I'm gonna do.

SPEAKER_02 13:21

I was so scared to get sent to the minors um that I got in a fight the first game against Matt Johnson, and then the next game, and the next game, and the next game, and I just kept doing it, and it was almost getting into like a little bit of a routine for me, like, and it made me feel like I had already accomplished everything that every other player had to do that night. I feel like that that moment I was good. Yeah, I had to get another shift rest game, which I was fortunate, Joel give me some decent ice time. Yeah, but like I felt like my main reason to be out there was done. I'd shown the other teams, I've taken on your toughest guy. You want to go? They give us three fights, boys. I'm not afraid to have it two or three times. So bring it on, let's go, you know. And and I think that my teammates felt uh they just felt the security inside of that. And Joe Quinville actually called me in after like the seventh, sixth or seventh game, and he's like, You gonna fight every night? I'm like, if that's what it takes. Yeah, I don't anticipate it being that, but right now that's what's going on, and we're winning, so why would I break it up?

SPEAKER_00 14:21

Right. That's awesome. But I think that emphasized the we thing, right? I could be the teammate. Uh, because anyone that is them at, and especially at your level, it I mean it's grueling and it hurts.

SPEAKER_02 14:32

We wanted people thinking it's great to see the cheering, but you sit in that box and slowly and your your hands, your face, everything kind of and I I have to the one other thing I think that's really important, and this is for what I would consider to be like the executive level people, like people that get to the highest level of whatever they're doing in their business, a boss, a CEO, a senior vice president, a vice president. Like, it's almost more important for those folks to be great teammates to focus on the we than it is the ones that are coming up. And the reason why I bring this up is because I always like to talk about Al McKinnon that stance. He was a consummate teammate. Uh Bryce Salvador would always joke around with me because I'd like to get around Al and I'd score. I'm like, see that? He's like, Yeah, you really think you got around Al? Come on, get really, you know. And and that was it. And and Al was there to help us in the summer. Um, Al's just like the best hockey dude ever. He's my favorite teammate. He's without question like Steve Eiserman. I grew up loving him, but having the opportunity to play with Al McInnes and learn from the person that Al was, and even though I probably didn't learn as good as I should have from Al, I might have a longer career uh if I would have done a few things differently. But didn't matter what you did. You know, Al would give you the business if you needed the business, but he was always there to support and love his teammates. And to this day, there's not a guy that I could shout from the mountains high enough about being the teammate of all teammates. And so I just try to be a little bit like that.

SPEAKER_00 16:03

I think I think it's that's a suit, that's a such a big observation because a lot of time, to use your word, when people get into executive roles or levels, yeah, you see a lot of leadership that is um like positionally driven, right? And and I would argue like a guy of his uh, you know, with his tenure and his pedigree and and Stanley Cops and Olympics and you know all this stuff had every reason to not talk to you. Yeah. I mean he would have had an argument not to. And and I think this is you're right, this is what creates an organization, um, what it is when a guy like that actually makes you part of it and makes you feel like hey, you're you're you belong to something that's bigger than all of us here, and and this is why we all play for the the the the name in the front, the name in the back.

SPEAKER_02 16:52

And and I knew it even more because I had teammates that weren't like that, that were selfish and that we're we're were out there for themselves. And uh I'm not gonna say enjoyed the limelight because who doesn't like a little spotlight here and there? I think we're all human, that's a natural thing, but you know, to to trip somebody in line so that you can get in front of them or to be at a level where you're a superstar and you treat somebody that's not lesser, especially when he's getting in fights for you every single night. Right. Like, really? That's how it is. So uh and but but I learned today, and I think I was fairly like this back in the day. There might have been a time or two that I got a little pissed off, but I don't like that's not my job to tell them or to like even today, like, hey, you know, if we have a conversation, I'm gonna let you know how I feel, but I'm I'm not gonna solicit information to you that's unnecessary. You just might not see me as much. Yeah, that's all.

SPEAKER_00 17:46

Yeah. So um I know the schedule is crazy. So so talk to me about so this is something sometimes I struggle with in business, right? Like any organization, most every field will have like conferences and and training and um uh ways for people to kind of buy into to enhance their own skills and things like that. And and you mentioned your dad said be coachable, right? Like be a good teammate, be coachable. And and a lot of times in in in in business, I find people that say they're coachable and I always say that they're coachable until they actually get coached. Yeah, and then all of a sudden it feels a lot different, right? So, so as considering the role you had, like tell me about being coached, like what does that mean to you, right? Because you have I always I always also believe like in you have to accept the role, right? It doesn't matter if you're at the top of the food chain, or I always say if you're at the table, at least you're not in the menu, right? So, so accepting your role, practice, all this stuff, what did that look like for you, and how much of your commitment to that part that's kind of you know stuff that nobody sees? Like how much of that played a role in in the longevity of your playing NHL?

SPEAKER_02 19:02

I think uh, you know, the biggest thing is is the research and the the student of the game that I had to become because I didn't just have a level of skill set that I could go out there and make up for the deficiencies that weren't there. And you know, typically in the NHL, the tough guys on the fourth line, um, if the ref needs to call an extra penalty, the chances are if I do the slightest little thing, he's gonna call me more than he's gonna call a pronger urban kennis, right? Um, and so just really being uh um listening to the voices around me on on uh how to make sure that I was the best defensively that I could possibly be, because that was probably almost as important as me fulfilling my tough guy role was to make sure that I wasn't a liability on the ice. Right. So I worked a lot with my kitchen after practice, before practice. Um, you know, just try to conditioning was always still is always uh always been a challenge for me. Like I tell people all the time, I drive by McDonald's and put on a couple pounds, I don't even need to stop. Just looking at it, you know. Uh and so I think that uh, and then again, just I think coachability, uh again, I'll say it is no different than being a great teammate from the highest level. If you're not willing, if you're the boss, you're the boss, if you're not willing to listen to somebody that is even new, or maybe has a couple years, or came from a different place, doesn't mean you have to take it and incorporate it into your business. But giving them the feeling like their opinion actually matters, I might not take it. But understanding that, and that's a form of leadership that I think gets lost a little bit in our world of right and wrong today. You're all going on, you know, like it's pathetic, it's a joke out there. I don't even it's like hate book and social hate or hatred is all it is, and and so for me, I think uh understanding that, you know, again, coming back to the we, uh, we're not gonna win at Stanley Cup unless all of us are on. That's why 20 names, 23 names get on it, and not just one. That's right, you know, and I think that it's important uh to understand that being coachable is all levels of where you're at, and then just making sure that that last name is doing everything it can to bolster that front name. You be a part of something, find your niche, leaders are and it's and there's still a leadership responsibility for those guys to make sure that everybody's pulling on it, right? I don't know if you watched the game last night, but Vegas looks unreal. They fired their coach a week and a half before the end of the season and brought shots, and then it's like they're a different hockey team now. What did he do?

SPEAKER_00 21:34

You know, I I watched part of it last night, but I'm I was really getting some rest for tonight. You work.

SPEAKER_01 21:41

Nobody's gonna no with no one's playing guilty tonight. That's right.

SPEAKER_00 21:49

So, um, all right, so like practice and all this. So so just for for um uh conceptually, right? So what what what is um what is the schedule look like? For a guy like you playing Derek for the blues, like do you practice a couple times a week? And we just traveled in these plane.

SPEAKER_02 22:08

We practice every single day. Especially at the beginning of the season, I would say practices are probably an hour, hour and 15 minutes. And I've got the extra duty after for the goaltenders, which I didn't have to be asked to stay out on the ice. I was the first one off to the last one off. Like those that two and a half hours a day that I got to spend on the ice in the NHL, like I was so blessed and so lucky. I tell people all the time, like I feel like I kind of won the lottery a little bit. You know what I mean? Like I almost didn't belong there. And uh and so I think that I really tried to make the most of that, even though I probably should have spent a few more hours in the gym after I was done, um, and maybe a few less hours in the bar. Um, but I think at the end of the day, it was uh um it it was an it was a daily thing. Um some of the guys would get an optional pregame skate, you know, towards the last latter part of the season, you know, prongs wouldn't practice, he would just have pregame skate. He's playing 33 minutes a night. He doesn't need to really practice at this point in time. He needs to rest the body, but he's not just in there eating bonbons, he's doing the physical activities with the therapist, he's washing the tapes, he's getting his treatment to make sure that his body's in peak form. And so I think everybody was a little bit different in that. You know, there were some guys like you know, Kelly Buckburgers of the world and the Mike Keynes of the world that were captains on teams, and they never took an optional skate just because when they were young, it wasn't allowed. And so they just adopted that mindset of how it was, and they wanted the young kids, you know, like I'm 34 years old, I'm the captain of this team, and I'm out doing pregame skate. What are you doing, right? It's your second year, yeah, you're second on the team in scoring, but that doesn't mean you can't get better, right? And I think that's a little bit more of an old school mentality than we see today. Um, but travel at the NHL level is ridiculous. You fly private planes and stay in five-star hotels, and I always tell people, other than the paycheck every other week, pregame meals on the road were literally the greatest thing that I ever was a part of. And and so it was uh it was fun, it was hectic, it was a lot. By the time the season got over, we were tired and beat up and broken.

SPEAKER_00 24:13

So, what would you say, right? Because I I uh I've used this as an example before in conversations where to an extent a professional locoon such as the blues has 25 independent contracts, right? You got guys making a half a million and you got guys making five million. They they they have a very different world that they live in, right? But yeah, when you go on the road and you get to those great pre-name reels and all this stuff, somehow like everybody's sitting down together and it's everybody's right, so besides leadership, or or I guess thinking including leadership, like what is it just that the team? Is it just a logo to bring people together? Is it a mindset like how? Because those are large discrepancies on a two-week basis when people get their check, and I'm not making this about the money, no, but I'm making this. There's a there's a there's different classes essentially in the locker room, right? So so how do you come together, you know, like this and have this level of camaraderie and this level of of teammates and all this stuff? Like what what creates that? How do you guys achieve that?

SPEAKER_02 25:21

I think the biggest thing is that everybody understands by the time you get to the NHL, you understand your role, you understand where you fit. Um, and you there's a there's a there's a training almost that comes in with some of the minor leagues and some of the hierarchy of veterans and and stuff like that. Um, you know, the money's just a part of it, and the money all will and always will go to people that produce. And so, you know, Keith could chuck. Funny story, I was walking through, and this is back when we actually had checks, and uh they'd give you a check. Yeah, and Ben Waltz is for like $400 something every two weeks after tax. I think mine was $40, it was no slob of call. Sure. I'm like, Walt, I'm like, just sign the back of checks. Yeah, you give me yours, I'll take mine. You're still getting something, you're not gonna miss this. I, you know, I'll protect it. I'll protect it, I'll get a few extra ones in for you. What do you say? He's like, Lucy, do you want to make more money? I said, absolutely. He says, play better. That's pretty much it. You want to make more money? Play better, right? And if you can't, shut the hell up and appreciate what you got, have a little gratitude and be a part of the team because there's 600 guys in the miners that are willing to take your job and do it if you don't. Yeah. What a great, what a great comeback.

SPEAKER_01 26:37

That's awesome. Oh, he's just he used to just make me yawn and stuff like that. Just play better. Okay, it's like, play better. Oh, see? It's not that hard. But like, you know, I go, I'd like to see you play as good as I do with six shifts a game, buddy.

SPEAKER_02 26:51

But in that in turn, in turnaround, if I had to play 22 shifts a game, I probably wouldn't have made it because that's a special conditioning in its own. And one night we only had like 10, 12 guys on the bench, everybody was sick. We were in New Jersey, and for some reason, I was only one that wasn't sick. I played like 16 and a half minutes that night. Joel looked at me after, he's like, How 16 and a half minutes, too? Yeah, I was like, man, I feel like I'm sick now, you know. But just to give an understanding that, you know, from my level up, we always wanted more. I always wanted more ice time. How do I get more ice time? How do I get more ice time, right? And the fact of the matter is, is there's only so much you go around for each of those hierarchy guys that are going around. So you just understand it and you accept it. And like I said, if you don't, you were gonna, right?

SPEAKER_00 27:36

Yeah, Lozie's not gonna do it. Ross, you're in it. Yeah. So so talk about this for a second, then, because I feel like this kind of reflects some of that, right? Like sometimes you hear uh great leaders at some point were probably great followers of other leaders, and then there's people that get triggered by the word follower. I I don't quite get that, but whatever. Um well, if you're not I think you're lost. If you don't have a follower, you're a liar. And you lost. How do you go? So I don't know. I I I'm I'm a I'm a huge believer in it, but whatever. So so think because you you like I heard this, like I heard performance matters, right? I've heard um I've heard uh being a teammate matters. Um now, how do you show up as a follower within the organization? Because some people like, well, I'm not a follower, and I guarantee, well, this is where we're going. Do you want to go or not, right? So how how how does that show up in an AHL locker room and and how did you live that?

SPEAKER_02 28:37

Yeah, I I think it just comes down to the team that you're playing on. In my case, they drafted me so I didn't have a whole lot of choice, and they like me because I played night of my uh 10 years in their organization. And so I think that it it just comes down to like you get drafted, you're so ecstatic, you get to the NHL training camp, and I think that's why it's so valuable for these kids, as younger kids that are still going back to junior, to go to training camp and see what it's like. Yeah, uh, because it not only is there like a oh whoa, that's Red Hole and Al McKedda saying Grant Fury, what's going on here? Yeah, like where am I really at? So it's my mom. Yeah, yeah. My mom, she was I didn't want her when I was trying out a junior, now I need her. Um, and so I think you just come in with that um from a young guy like I was, then you're just ecstatic to be there. Like, I just want to be here. What where do you need me? What do you need me to do? Yeah, I like and and just make sure I don't think I really had to worry about was making sure I was on time. Um, I think when you look at it from a different standpoint, maybe like uh a guy gets signed free agent somewhere and gets paid a lot of money, and now he's got to come in and tow that line per se, or follow the leadership. You know, I think that's where the management and the and the coaches and everybody that are sitting there before July 1st are sitting here saying, okay, well, let's talk to this guy, we're gonna talk to this guy, talk to this guy, but we've got our eye in this guy. NHL, especially in those scenarios, everybody kind of knows who you are. Word gets out on your phone quickly. Um, good, bad, and ugly. And so I think that uh you know it's the job of the general managers and then the coaches and the general managers making sure that they have an understanding and they've eliminated any of that guessing group or one saying no, I want to do this, and the other one saying no, and now it's like, well, you're on the line for this type of stuff. Like if those guys aren't together, it's really hard for everybody underneath you to be together. And I think that's probably you know where you see success here. Chemistry has to start at the top. Yeah, there's gotta be a strong chemistry of the thought's gotta be felt and seen at the top. Yes, and it's even more important for the players, uh, for the coaches behind the bench, because majority of those coaches are players, yeah. So they've already been where we're at, yeah, right? And they also can't hide. Yeah, you can't hide in the game of hockey. Like we do everything together. Yeah, you can't hide who you are. All you can do is uh take a real hard, honest look at it and try and make yourself better. Yeah, and at the end of the day, if you're making yourself better for the role that's been designated to you on the team, then that should be the part that 25, 23 to 25 guys all bring that together. That gets you a strong loop fist. And sometimes there's guys out there that are a little bit more selfish and do things in other ways and take uh and take other uh other avenues and and won't conform to the we that is the game of hockey and professional sports because you know there's there's some sports that are a little bit more individual independent, like baseball. If a pitcher goes out there and pitches, it doesn't matter how good the center fielder is. Yeah, right. Um, that is hockey's the most team game, I think, probably of all of them. Um, there is individual guys that are really, really good, but I think when you take a look at how the teams that are in the playoffs right now are there, they're all good, great goaltending, they are solid team defense, and they have great transition games. And you have to work on that stuff together. And if you don't, and you don't have a guy coming back and pulling his weight on backside pressure and back checking, back checking, it's no different than the Canadians losing in the Olympics. Yeah, a car was dogging it up the ice on three-on-three. Like he should never have been able to get that shot away. And McKinnon hesitated on the same thing. So a breakdown because you don't get your job done right, or you stayed out there too long, or made a mistake, doesn't mean you're a terrible teammate. No. It just means that you really have to be dialed in to playing the system that's been put in place for everybody. And hopefully, you've got a management, a coaching staff, and a set of captains and veteran players that are gonna lead that to the young guys.

SPEAKER_00 32:37

So you said a dirty warrior system. So how how as much chaos as it looked for the average trans from the sands, how systematic is an actual game on any given uh day? Uh very.

SPEAKER_02 32:52

Yeah. Um this the the real true winner of a systematic game is whoever breaks down the white least. Yeah. And and the biggest thing, and that people ask me all the time, what's the biggest difference between the American Hockey League and the NHL? And I've got about the same games in either, I think 250-some in the NHL and like three something in the in the American League. And the number one difference is uh the ability to get into a system and understand it and have some hockey IQ, the execution. The execution of the system and what your role is and making sure that you don't break your role to go help somebody else's. When I'm the weak side winger and that puck goes side to side, do not go down and throw it out to that defenseman that you're supposed to be on, right? Like have some commitment to what you buy into the system of accept your role in the system in the system and then implement it. And then implement it. And if everybody does that along, they should be fine. But the number one difference is passing. That's so different. Passing is passing is that helping your teammates out, and they always say you can't give a good player a bad pass, right? And and so passing in the International Hockey League is really what separates it from any other hockey in the world.

SPEAKER_00 34:06

Yeah. I just say that's funny. We talk, I mean, we're in the middle of reinventing a lot of systems. I always thought we need to nail the systems, and once we believe this is the right one, then it's just a matter of our simplating. And if the system is proven to be the right one and it's not happening, then you have a people issue. Yeah, not in the system, right?

SPEAKER_02 34:26

So uh a lot of time with the people issue comes uh though, well, it's not my fault. Yeah. Yeah, whose fault is it? It's somebody's, right? So let's let's let's get out of the victimhood and let's get into what do we got here? Yeah, let's just be honest. Yeah, because there's no sense in not being honest about it because you're just gonna keep losing. Yeah. You want to make more money? Yeah, play better, play better.

SPEAKER_00 34:50

So, all right, so let's just kind of kind of wrap this up. But I want to know, like, so how much of all of this knowledge and experience and learning you acquired through hockey gets translated into your day-to-day life and business after you're hockey?

SPEAKER_02 35:04

I would say it's uh it's everything. Um, especially with where I'm at today um and what I'm doing today, I think that there's a there's a there's a special flavor in some of the instances with all the hockey fans when I'm at these events. There's when they're looking at hiring their auctioneer, like you maybe get a little lean in. Yeah, I never am Reed Low hockey player. Like, yeah, if I walked into a room and not one person knew what I did, they'd just think I was not charity auctioneer, right? And I'll talk hockey all day long with you, but man, by the when I die, there better be something more to my life than four years of DNHL. You know what I mean? Like I got more to me than that, more substance. Yeah, but I take those lessons that I learned, and um, even the ones that I learned getting out. I've got a business that I got into with Ritchie Brothers right out of the gate when I got out of hockey as real estate for a hot second, and then found a little life at Ritchie Brothers, and I'm kind of getting into another mold with another business, and I'm gonna do some consulting for, and I'm taking a lot of what I did back then to make sure that this is as successful as that was. And and I think again, like I just it all comes back to the three things that I was taught as a kid growing up, yeah. And um, just like uh no take take no for an answer type of attitude. And last time I'll order you, yeah, yeah. You'll be the best teammate. Yep, right. And I gotta, and and that's a that's a that's a daily challenge because a lot of the charity stuff that I've been doing, I was on an island, I've built myself a little team now, which is a lot better for me because I found myself working in a space that I'd never been successful in before, and here I was trying to do this. I need people to help me, whether it's an auction coordinator or an assistant or a coach or whatever those things are. I have to be better in my mindset to make sure that I'm out there doing the best things that I can for my enterprise.

SPEAKER_00 36:52

Yeah. So so how do you how do you how would you say you show up to them as a leader? Like, are we are we trying to emulate McKenna's? Like, how do you try to show up as a leader for them?

SPEAKER_02 37:01

Yeah, so we don't like I don't really have name tags on who's the boss. Like, I think that natural board leaders are pushed into position, they're not elected into a position. People, everybody wants them there. That's why our political game is an absolute joke because nobody wants any of them, and everybody wants limited to everything else under the sun. And so our leader of the United States is not a representation of the entire country. You know, Al McInnes was our, even though Pronger was our captain, everybody knew that Al was to make it and Al didn't need to have a C on his jersey. He's like, give it the prawns. Yeah, he's a everybody hates him, he's just had a great season. Holly's gone. This is the next chapter for him. I'm fine doing what I'm doing, right? And that is the type of leadership that I think is important. Um, so I just try and do that. Um, I'm a little bit of a pain in the ass, but I have people that don't mind working with a pain in the butt because I'll always get it right before I try and be right. Yeah, and that's just a philosophy that I've walked with my whole life. Yeah, um, and I think it's important to not just talk it, you gotta live it. Um, but I I I got, like I said, I have two folks, uh two gals that are working with me right now, just help me hold the walls together. It's getting busier and busier and busier. And then I have another couple other gals that uh helped me and coach me in some other different ways to make sure that I'm staying on task because it's not easy living up here. Yeah, costs. Like this car is running 150 miles an hour, it's got a small bit of probably some post-concussion syndrome in there, you know, maybe too many beer lunch today, you know. Uh so uh I just but more than anything, if we're gonna do it, we gotta have fun. Yeah. And if there's a moment where we're not having fun, then we need to re-look at it and find out how to have fun again. Yeah. I mean, why do it otherwise? And sit.

SPEAKER_00 38:46

I love me too that was awesome. Thanks for having me. Thank you.