Season 1 Finale: The Reckoning

It’s been a wild ride—from the "Age of Disclosure" to the heavy truths of grief and masculinity. In our Season 1 Finale, we’re stripping away the polish for a raw, no-filter recap of everything we’ve learned.
​We aren't doing this alone. We’ve invited two special guests to help us empty the vault and tackle the most provocative fan mail we’ve received all season. We’re debating the trends we’re killing off, the financial habits we’re resetting, and the real-world friction of navigating 2026.
​This is the ultimate reality check before we head into our summer break.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:20

Hey Brandon.

SPEAKER_04 0:21

Namdi, how are you?

SPEAKER_01 0:22

I'm doing well. Long time no talk.

SPEAKER_04 0:24

Yeah, it's been a little while. Have you missed the podcast? Of course, of course. This is what we do. Have the people missed us.

SPEAKER_01 0:32

Have the people missed us? They have. Tell me how I know.

SPEAKER_04 0:34

How do you know?

SPEAKER_01 0:36

I got almost 20 fan mails. 20. In the last two and a half weeks. Wow. We called for fan mails and the people's delivered. People's for me. I'm delivered.

SPEAKER_04 0:53

I am delivered.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Listen, talk black, talk back.

SPEAKER_04 0:59

It's the shoutout for me.

SPEAKER_01 1:01

It's the shout-outs for you, yeah. Um, and we're recording in a very different place today.

SPEAKER_04 1:05

Yeah, we switched the locations, usually it's like a bedroom in my apartment, but now we have some space and uh we needed some space.

SPEAKER_01 1:15

Why do we need some space?

SPEAKER_04 1:16

Because we have some extra people.

SPEAKER_01 1:20

I think the drum goes.

SPEAKER_04 1:24

We gotta add sound producer. Listen, where we have the sound.

SPEAKER_01 1:28

That's season two. I need a budget.

SPEAKER_04 1:32

You have it.

SPEAKER_01 1:33

I need a I need a budget, you understand? So people, if you send us some money, we'll send our post the cash. Cash and PayPal, whatever. If it's economy, we need a so yeah, that's good. So yeah, we do have guests, and uh, we like to introduce them.

SPEAKER_04 1:51

So they can introduce themselves, they are not shy at all.

SPEAKER_01 1:55

I mean, these are high flyers, we should like read the whole pro profile of them or something.

SPEAKER_04 2:00

You know what? We absolutely should use that.

SPEAKER_01 2:02

All the way from Brooklyn, give it up for the latest car police. Well, every time. All right, Dee, you want to go?

SPEAKER_02 2:11

Yeah, uh, thank you guys for having me. It happened us. Uh, my name is Devon. Um, happy to be here just to be on with you guys and discuss a little bit more. I'll I'll hand it over to the lovely lady to my left.

SPEAKER_00 2:23

Thank you. Hi, I'm Tara. I am happy to be here as well. Devon and I are also a married couple, so happy to be here with my my friend and my husband. Okay, good.

SPEAKER_01 2:34

And we wanted them here because this is our season finale.

SPEAKER_00 2:38

Make some noise!

SPEAKER_04 2:39

Yes, episode 10. So we're probably digits, yes.

SPEAKER_01 2:44

Big boy podcast, you know. So we have double-digit episodes, and um, I don't know if you guys know, we've been talking about a podcast. So I met all of you six years ago. So let's say four years ago, we've been talking about we should do a podcast, and we it just never happened. But then Brandon finished his master's, became a principal, and started making a lot of money, and now has time. Wow, okay, so it's not like oh, this is the time to do it, and you know, I I couldn't say no.

SPEAKER_04 3:11

And we still have to give a shout out to you. So she really pushed us this summer, she was here two years ago.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

Yeah, yeah, because she um kept hearing us argue all the time and argue all the time, and insisted that this should be podcast already. Yeah, so so we've been here. The reception has been good. I think um we've had listeners from all over the world, and uh it's just been humbling, crazy. Um I do in season one was to show our breadth and depth, so we picked on a number of different topics. But the format for today is a soft launch to how season two's format will be, which will be essentially reading questions, reading emails, and giving our point of view. We don't promise it's going to always be wise, but hopefully there will be enough wits and life lessons in other, very entertaining. So that's what it's going to be. Um, so again, very happy to have you guys here. Usually we start with our weekend roundup, and because there have been several weekends that have passed, so Brandon, do you want to kick us off with what have you been doing in the last couple of weekends?

SPEAKER_04 4:22

Um, my weekends have been relaxing, I will I will say. Not a ton going on. I have to think back now. What have I been doing? Uh last weekend my brother was in town, so was able to. A lot of family time. A lot of family time. Uh prior to that. Um, I think we talked about last time we talked was when I had gotten back from Atlanta from Memorial Day weekend. Um, and I think the weekend after that was just a relaxing weekend. I don't remember recall doing anything. Uh, and then sorry, I take that back. My godson was had his christening.

SPEAKER_01 5:02

You was gonna godfather of the air.

SPEAKER_04 5:05

I was about to lose it. We've been through so many of these. I now have 12 godchildren. He is the final window. I can absolutely not take capacity. Um and I'm old. I'm the grandpa, not the godfather. But uh, yes, so uh baby Ezra, his christening, so I was able to attend his christening through my back out. Lifted him and uh his little cousin up in there and playing with them, so forgot how old I really was uh and not in shape, so uh need to continue to work on that. So ended up throwing my back out, and so I was really down uh that first part of that week, but you know, uh God is good, so much better now.

SPEAKER_01 5:50

Yeah, have you been following the World Cup? Have you gone to watch any matches and any bars and anything? The Knicks won again. What did you do?

SPEAKER_04 5:59

Oh god, we had to bring that up. Um, no, I'm not a hater, so I actually uh did go to a couple of Knicks games uh at a bar so uh with some friends. Uh so I called a couple of them. I actually was rooting for them. I think it was good for the city. Uh I live here, so I'm definitely not a Knicks fan, still a Lakers fan. Uh but I called a couple of games actually the weekend my brother was in town, we went to see a game together. Um so um we were able to do that, and then World Cup definitely uh was definitely rooting for all the African countries as well. Except South Africa. I knew you were gonna say that, I'll just let it go. Um so for Ghana, I I do think they got cheated on a couple bad calls. Uh hopefully, you know, something may come in the review, but usually when these things are done, they're done. Uh so it's what it is. You move forward, but still rooting for them uh as well. And it was sad to see Haiti go. I actually went and watched that match. Not in the actual match, but at a bar. Local bush bar, as you all call it in Nigeria.

SPEAKER_01 7:08

And you give them bad luck.

SPEAKER_04 7:09

How?

SPEAKER_01 7:10

They lost.

SPEAKER_04 7:11

So if I wouldn't have watched it.

SPEAKER_01 7:13

Yeah, if you weren't there, they would have lost.

SPEAKER_04 7:14

No, they absolutely would have lost it. Okay, that's nothing much would have changed that.

SPEAKER_01 7:20

Yeah, okay. For me, um, I feel like I've been working doing a lot of manual labor. So I went all the way to Canada to get my brother's house ready for my family visiting over the summer, which was interesting. So very brotherly, yeah, very brotherly, right? Of me. Listen, they don't make them like me anymore, but you know, if I say so myself.

SPEAKER_04 7:43

So to whom much is given, much is required.

SPEAKER_01 7:46

So that itself be true. Um, so we you know went to Costco, bought a bunch of food, we did a lot of Amazon shopping, we did a lot of house cleaning and you know the getting things together. So I just got back from that, so it's really been relaxing. I've caught a couple of World Cup games. Um, track and field has been on fire, so I've been watching a lot of um the Jamaican national trials and Nigerian national trials, the USAs are coming up very soon. In two weeks' time, pre-fontaine classic in Eugene Oregon is happening. Shakari ran fast, Shamika ran fast, the Clayton twins ran fast. Um, the second fastest one in the world this year is a Nigerian. Shout out to Ajayi Kinsola.

SPEAKER_04 8:30

What about Melissa Jefferson?

SPEAKER_01 8:32

She's coming, she's boiling up slowly but surely. She's had a 1085 this year, so she she's she's where she needs to be. I don't think she needs to be blowing us out of the water. So that has been good. Um, I've been looking forward to a lot of that as well. And then my favorite show, The Traitors. I have been watching that on Peacock TV. Um, guys, let me put you on to the Canada franchise. That one is good. That is the that is a US Peacock? Yes, okay. It's on US Peacock, yeah. You should watch the Canadian version. I love the traitors, especially season two and three. My god. I thought the US brings the drama. Yeah, no, Canada brought the drama, Canada brought the drama, so that that has to be. The traders? Canada.

SPEAKER_00 9:17

Okay, I love the traders.

SPEAKER_04 9:18

Which one have you have you just seen US or have you seen other countries?

SPEAKER_00 9:21

I've only seen US, but but I've seen all seasons, so even watch the first one when there weren't like celebrities on it. Watch UK, UK with this.

SPEAKER_01 9:29

UK but see Canada, and you can skip season one. Okay, it's a bit boring.

SPEAKER_04 9:35

No, you have to appreciate, but you'll appreciate season two by watching.

SPEAKER_01 9:40

Season one, okay, fair, fair. But it's really, and then season three, they changed everything. Oh, yeah. In a very good way, you know. Give it away. Okay, okay, okay. I love how excited you are about it. Right. I have to watch.

SPEAKER_02 9:51

I've become a fan through Target.

SPEAKER_01 9:54

If we weren't recording tonight, we'll be watching the season three.

SPEAKER_00 9:59

We actually had Traders Game Night at our house. It was hosted by a friend of Devon's, his uh a team that he's a part of. And yeah, so we were we played the traitors.

SPEAKER_02 10:10

Came over to the house and we played the traitors game.

SPEAKER_01 10:12

The faithfuls are the traitors.

SPEAKER_00 10:13

The faithful, no, the traitor won.

SPEAKER_02 10:15

The traitors won. The traitor won.

SPEAKER_00 10:18

It kind of lost the decision to like let them win. Um, I was a trader.

SPEAKER_01 10:26

Did you mad?

SPEAKER_00 10:27

I heard it a lot. Yeah. I think I was a little, I mean, people kind of knew that one of us were a traitor because it was our house, like it felt very obvious. That like the hosts of the game would pick one of us. So they're trying to figure out which one it was, and it just became obvious it was me. You knew I was like came around you. I have a live. What am I doing live?

SPEAKER_04 10:53

This is a game that is hilarious.

SPEAKER_01 10:56

That's good. Um so yeah, that's that's been my weekend roundup.

SPEAKER_00 11:01

Yeah, um, gosh, time is flying this summer. Um, had a good couple weeks. We played the trader, we were at the traders' game night a few weekends ago. I actually we enjoyed the Knicks, so we had some friends in town, um, went, didn't do any bar stuff but watched, you know, watched around the house and celebrated during the day in the streets. Um last week I actually got to go to the World Cup. Okay. Um, which was Grand South Mexico versus I'm sorry, not Mexico versus I saw Colombia versus Uzbekistan in Mexico City. So I went to Mexico City to watch the game. It was amazing. One of the best experiences. Oh, you were in Mexico. Yeah, I went to Mexico City just for the day, just to go to the match. I got tickets.

SPEAKER_04 11:39

Excuse you.

SPEAKER_00 11:41

It was an opportunity I could not let pass me by.

SPEAKER_04 11:44

No, you should not let that pass if the opportunity to take a bucket listing. It was a bucket listing for me to go to a World Cup game.

SPEAKER_00 11:50

Yeah, to go to a World Cup game. And then I didn't know this, but the seats were like 10 rows back, 12 rows. So we were like on the field. They were great. Was with a bunch of people that were cheering for Columb Columbia. Columbia.

SPEAKER_04 12:02

Columbia. Columbia.

SPEAKER_00 12:04

Columbia. Yeah. So I'm a Columbia fan now. As long as they're in, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:09

I don't have a team yet, I'm open for recommendations.

SPEAKER_01 12:11

Can I give you a fun fact about Colombia football team? I think it was USA 94 when they played the World Cup in the USA in 1994. Someone in Colombia had an ongo. An ongo means you score on your side, which is wrong. No. And a few weeks later he was murdered in Colombia.

SPEAKER_00 12:34

I believe it. I believe it. I heard I heard they were saying that people sell their houses to come to the World Cup. Like people sell their houses. Like at an older age. I mean that stadium was 80,000 people. 75,000 of them were Colombian. Like it was it was really nice to see and be a part of, but wow. Yeah. Yeah. As an American, you don't see people walking around every day with like an a team USA jersey. I haven't seen any. In Mexico, every me every person's wearing a Mexico jersey.

SPEAKER_01 13:06

Soccer is big everywhere except the USA. Except the USA.

SPEAKER_04 13:09

Because we have basketball and football and baseball. Baseball was the hugest here first.

SPEAKER_02 13:14

I think we also just do things backwards in the US. A lot of times, like we're the on the wrong system of measuring, we're on the wrong side of the road. We are in our world. Yeah, we just decided, like, yeah, we're doing the right versus wrong. But I was having this conversation the other day, like, what happens if we put all of the LeBrons, if we put like a DK in that cast, we put them in football, like soccer? What does that look like? Like our US team would be crazy, but we just don't kind of put people in that space.

SPEAKER_04 13:42

Yeah, and a lot of times when those great players are here, they go back and play for their home country.

SPEAKER_02 13:49

In terms of like the weekend, I'll just say for the New York, I'm definitely happy for the city for the Knicks and the Black fans on the horse in the race, I'd say, but uh super happy to see a special game for to see the city just rejoice. Like there's not too much like the energy of New York, but everybody's on the game for it. Everybody's excited like that. And also uh June team had a big June team coming last weekend. Uh well part of the kickball team, so we've been here a few times here, I'm sorry. But uh we got our June team class, which was like our kickoff, and then like after the summer kickoff, so they just communicate around each other again. Season started, so my team ended up winning. A lot of people it was a tournament or just a season opener? Uh both. Both we ended up playing two games, so like the first team, the win with the biggest win differential, you get to play like a championship game. That makes sense. So it didn't count for too much, but we were excited.

SPEAKER_00 14:47

So we have a big old trophy in our house now. Oh nice.

SPEAKER_04 14:55

Are you like team captain?

SPEAKER_02 14:57

I'd say quasi. I'm more like team dad than team captain. I have like the bag of every team. Um I got a little to the meetings, but I just make sure I can't. DK no that old.

SPEAKER_01 15:06

I'm sorry. All right, but my meetings might disagree with you.

SPEAKER_00 15:09

Tell them that.

SPEAKER_01 15:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 15:10

Right. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

Okay. Yeah. He has that responsible aura. Yes.

SPEAKER_04 15:17

And so usually you get, you know, to be the dad of the group because I've been that my entire life. I can see that. Yeah, me too.

SPEAKER_01 15:26

No. Did you ever be out there?

SPEAKER_04 15:30

Nigerian haters.

SPEAKER_00 15:32

You've always looked out for me. As long as I've known you, Brandon.

SPEAKER_04 15:35

Thank you, Tom.

SPEAKER_00 15:35

Always felt very safe in your place.

SPEAKER_01 15:37

Don't cry for me, Argentina.

SPEAKER_00 15:38

We used to be out in the street. We found your house.

SPEAKER_01 15:45

Okay, so this is not a shade me, I shit you episode. This is a celebration episode. It's in one episode.

SPEAKER_04 15:53

So speaking of celebration, though, you left something out. Like you talked about going to your brother's house and your family coming. Yes, your family gets together as much as they can with uh your siblings living on four different in four different countries, five different countries. Yes, yeah. Yeah, yes. So you're welcoming a new niece or nephew to something.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

Yes, there's an addition to the family, which is also why we're preparing for all of that. But it's gonna be fun. The house is growing. More responsibilities, more money, but you know. That's how you look at it. Children are expensive. Have you seen the economy? Yeah, so but um, yeah, but we're very happy. Yeah, that's the reason. So you will the baby will be coming end of summer, so we're looking forward to that.

SPEAKER_04 16:44

Do you remember you are not a song?

SPEAKER_01 16:47

When we fell in love, September. Oh no, I'm young. Um okay, so like that, yeah. Like we said, we don't have one topic this today. Um, we got almost 30 different messages. I pruned it down to about 10 of them. Um, and so Brandon and I will take turns in reading and then we'll just open it up for conversations. Okay, all right. So, Brandon, do you want to take the first one?

SPEAKER_04 17:12

I have this one. Yeah. Alright, uh, I would like to remain anonymous. Uh, because the person I am referring to in this question is a listener. Thank you, listener. Uh, dating advice. I I am an African-American woman, late 40s, happily single with no kids. Over the last few years, I strictly dated men of the uh diaspora. I love their dedication to family, strong character, and integrity. Unfortunately, it doesn't work out due to the work-life balance. Last year I met a Liberian gentleman. I absolutely love everything about him. He's handsome, kind, thoughtful. He is all of the things. Yet I'm starting. Uh, yes, thank you for listening. Yet I'm starting to see he is more work than life. We definitely share an attraction, and I certainly believe this can grow into a beautiful bond. Um, do either one of you have any tips on how to help even the work-life balance when there are cultural norms at hand? Signed, I'm just a girl in heavy like.

SPEAKER_01 18:31

Wow. So there's a lot of um. I'm very curious about Tara and D's opinion because you guys are you work a lot and you're also a couple. But but but I found a lot of the language to be interesting. What does happily single, heavy like?

SPEAKER_04 18:48

They're like just catchphrases, I think. Right, yeah, but you you get caught on words, so whereas it's just um slang for African Americans, like that it doesn't yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:00

But I think it's gonna be like why qualify singleness with happy, and why not just say I like this person? Why say heavy and like at a moment?

SPEAKER_04 19:09

Because it means you're probably almost in love, but you're not ready to say it yet. And you're definitely not ready to say it where you've put yourself out here, like singing. Is that a 2020 six thing?

SPEAKER_01 19:20

Is that a post-pandemic thing?

SPEAKER_04 19:22

No, I think it had been it's been that way for a while. Like you always wait, like who said I love you first? Like, that's one of the questions for the couple, like especially if you don't know that type of thing where it's going or you haven't made a long-term commitment yet.

SPEAKER_00 19:34

I think it's safe to protect, guard your heart a little bit, especially if you're happily you've been happily single, right? Like you create a life that you want, it would be a choice to bring someone into that in a in a meaningful way. It has to be worth it.

SPEAKER_04 19:45

Why did you laugh at the happily single?

SPEAKER_01 19:47

Because I feel Danny, it almost makes you feel that when you say single, the assumption is that you're sad and lonely. No, so like why do we need to qualify opposite? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Why do we need to qualify it as happily?

SPEAKER_02 20:02

I'm just acknowledging that there is an alternative, right? Like, yeah, some people are not happily single. We're just calling that like I'm good where I'm at, but also this would be nice.

SPEAKER_00 20:11

And some people are relationship or relationship people, like they just have been in a relationship their whole life, they feel they feel happier, more content in relationships. But some people look for some people maybe need a little bit more to be in a relationship, right? Like it has to be the ideal situation. They would just be single if it weren't.

SPEAKER_04 20:32

Yeah, and sometimes it's not necessarily a choice, but if you're like choosing like to be single and work on yourself, you can say you're happily single because you're not actively looking for a relationship where there may have been times you were actively looking for a relationship.

SPEAKER_02 20:47

Yeah, but on the other angle you were going with was saying like the irony of being like happily single, but like it's about pursuing a person. Yeah, I think that is kind of interesting. Yeah, but I I mess with it. I do say like I always think it's kind of romantic to shoot your shot kind of like through radio, through a show. Um so I'm I mess with the the the writer in. Uh I like the call. Um and the listener listens.

SPEAKER_01 21:11

So hey listener, wink wink, like there we go. Do your thing. All right, but let's go to the um crux of the question walk-life balance on love. How does that work?

SPEAKER_00 21:24

It's effort. Devon and I, when we met, I was working, we both worked a lot, but I worked a lot. I had just gotten promoted, I I was learning a new role, and I'll say it meant a lot to me that Devon at that time really committed to tr making the effort dry, you know, to working around my schedule as we were getting to know each other. Throughout our marriage, we've had times where he's worked more and I've taken on more, you know, just to ensure that he's able to be successful. And the other way around where I'm working more and he does that. So it's been a balance, but very early on, I don't know if we would have made it if he hadn't. Been very empathetic and compassionate to my work situation and and been like humble enough to work around that. Didn't take it personally if I couldn't do something or if I was traveling or anything like that.

SPEAKER_02 22:10

I think clear communication and defining what's important to you are the two things that need to happen there. Like if you have your boundaries of like, look, I know you're gonna work a 60-hour work week or 80-hour work or whatever your life is like, but on this Saturday from 9 a.m. to 11 a.m., like I need your time here. We need to do this thing, we need to have data, like I'm not gonna give on that, we are gonna have data when someone's gonna be in this window. And whatever you have to do to make that work, if you care about me in the way you sit, and the way you say you do, I'm not making you choose. But if you if you care about I'm telling you this is important to me, please carve out this time and that person makes the effort, then you can work with them on anything else. But I think defining what's important to you, carving out that time and clearly communicating what you need, very, very important there. And I'll also say, like, depending on your person, like know your person, sometimes taking something off their plate can be like the most romantic thing you can do for them. Like a lot of I won't speak for black American women, but I'll say the ones that I know, love language is acts of service because they're holding everything together, they're super busy, they're doing a million things. So you're like, you know what? I know why you feel like you can't sit down to spend time. What's your list? Let me see that. Okay, here's where I can help and support. I'm gonna do these three, four things. Let's go ahead and have dinner on this night. Does that work for you? So, to the listener and writer, like if you see that his work-life balance is a lot of work and not a lot of like personal balance, if you can take two or three things off the list, he's gonna see that as super valuable. And know that you can't want to spend time on it.

SPEAKER_04 23:42

Yeah, I like that.

SPEAKER_01 23:44

And that's why we have them on the show today. Classic session. That was a great answer. Yeah, I really don't want to add anything to that. Okay, so do we do the next one? Yes. Okay, I'll read this one. Um, and he gave his name, Jamal, 32 Washington, DC, for context. Nanda and Brandon, peace to you both. And peace to you, I guess. I have been listening since the AI episode, but your recent age of disclosure conversation forced me to pull my car over. I am the exact demographic you were talking about. I make $115,000 working in consulting on Instagram. I look like I have it all together. The truth, with my student loans back in full effect, recent hikes and community inflation, I am secretly drowning. I literally use um Klana for my groceries two weeks ago. I don't know what that is.

SPEAKER_00 24:44

Klaner called Klaner, it's a apple.

SPEAKER_04 24:49

And then you pay make payments, I think.

SPEAKER_01 24:52

Okay, okay. For my groceries two weeks ago. Last month, my day one college friend started planning our annual July 4th trip this year to Tulum. The itinerary was going to cost me about $3,000 using the financial transparency advice you guys discussed. I swallowed my pride and I told the group chats the truth. I can't afford this trip right now. I'm drowning in debt and I need to sit this one out to get my money right. Fellas, the reaction broke my heart. Instead of grace, I got hit the wall of weaponized therapy speak. One friend told me I was projecting his scarcity mindset on the group's energy. Another said I need to evaluate my boundaries because my financial negativity was toxic to their vibe. They went ahead and booked the trip, and the chat group has been dead silent ever since. How do I navigate the friction when your financial reality doesn't match the aesthetics your peers expect? Is the age of disclosure just a quick way to end up in complete isolation? How do you rebuild a true cycle without faking it? Do you want to take this? If you have friends, I don't.

SPEAKER_04 26:07

You're gonna quit laughing at our listeners. Hey Jamal, uh we uh excuse our African brother because he does a vacation, so that becomes true.

SPEAKER_01 26:18

I'm just giving a cheerful vibe to the podcast. It's a that's what it is. Yeah, it's a happy, happy podcast, it's not a requirement.

SPEAKER_04 26:27

Got it. Okay, anyway. Um sometimes you go through these moments with friends, you can't go on a trip, you know, it's what it is. Um, stick to stick to your guns, save your money, figure out things for yourself. You definitely shouldn't be putting groceries on credit. You should be able to feed yourself, making that amount of money in DC. Um, so you're gonna have to figure out, continue to figure out where to cut back at, and then just plan for these things. Like if you don't have the cash saved, don't go on a vacation because you're not in a position to be charging anything. Uh, and if your friends can't understand that, I don't know how many, how much of a day one they really are. Like, because day ones would understand that, or if they really wanted you to go and they got it, they'd help you go. Like, hey, I get this for you, or something, just because sometimes those memories and things are important, and if that's what you enjoy doing, you figure it out as a as a friend group if they want to support you in that, or not, like you really say, like, I'm not going, I'm sitting in out this year.

SPEAKER_01 27:31

Okay. Um, Daddy, do you guys are you guys familiar with the whole age of disclosure conversation going on on the internet?

SPEAKER_00 27:38

Yeah, yes, I a little bit. I'm probably not as familiar as this gentleman. Um, anyone.

SPEAKER_01 27:44

So let me just for business. So there's a guy on TikTok called Casanova Brown. Yes, I started this whole movement around the age of disclosure, and he's been the front voice trying to actively get people to be transparent about their financial situation and how everyone is, or many people are struggling in this economy for many reasons. And it's been very heartbreaking to watch these videos online. People are going through a lot, yeah, and maybe it's my augment, but it's it almost seems like people who look like us are the ones disproportionately impacted, and so we had a whole episode dedicated to talking about just the financial stress and situation, not just in America but globally, if I'm being honest, and and the wars going on, the prices of oil and gas is not helping at all. So people are literally leaving paycheck to paycheck. In fact, one of Casanova's more recent TikTok videos on this, he was, I think it was like five days after the month, and he said he was walking down his hallway, and every single door had the pink slip. Wow, so it meant no one had paid rent, and it was day five, and I think after the five-year lead. So to like from beginning to the end of the hallway, he showed the video and it was like, what is going on? So, yeah. So, what do you have for this guy? Any of you?

SPEAKER_00 29:06

Yeah, I can I'll add briefly that one, I think it's very brave and commendable to lead with transparency in this way and vulnerability, and sometimes that can make people uncomfortable and they have surprising reactions, disproportionate reactions, which sounds like it's what happened in this case. Um, I would encourage Jamal to continue to feel good about the boundaries that you're setting and the stand that you're taking and the decisions you're making for your own life, and know that true friends, to your point, Brandon, will if that's your day one, will be your day one no matter what. You know, I I get it can feel isolating if someone feels like you change the dynamic. It's not true, right? Like we're all humans, we grow and evolve, and we have different moments in our lives. Keeping things PC just to make everyone comfortable is like it's over over that, right? Like we have to be a little bit more responsible about our future. Um so if there's some person, one person maybe you're closer to, maybe reach out to them. Um let the trip happen. You know, you'll you might be surprised if someone comes back to you later and says, you know, I was in the same situation, but I I put it on a credit card because I didn't want, I was embarrassed, you know, like everyone's going through this, you're not alone in it, and you're definitely not alone in your in your peer group. So I would I would maybe give it a little space, but then try to start to build those connections back if you feel comfortable.

SPEAKER_02 30:26

Yeah, I would I might go a little different direction here, but I would say that I'll echo your sentiments and brand sentiments and the fact that when I heard that I said these sound like new day ones. This sounds different, right? Like if it's your day one, they're gonna be there with you, they're support you, they're probably gonna know your situation already. You don't have to disclose it in the group chat, but um everybody's dynamic is different, so no judgment there. Like if I came and presented that information to my group chat, I know I'd get clowned originally, right? Like that's gonna come. But the next thing is how do we support how can we make sure that this happens? So um, I think take a step, like see this as a gift. Like take a step back, really focus on the issue, like sit in it to get better, like work on your financial literacy, work on your plan, be with the financial plan, make sure that this is a temporary struggle for long-term gain. And so then when you're when you're up, you know, you can choose who you surround yourself with. So typically, you know, you're gonna have the same kind of income bracket that people you spend the most time with and surround yourself with. So you're gonna be able to enjoy those vacations with people when you're in kind of the same situation financially or same status financially, and nobody has to feel guilty or anything like that. It's just gonna be more of a normal flow. Um so just look at you know, long-term future where you want to be and be okay, like working with the root. I know that's I don't want to sound insensitive, like I know it can be tough, but I would say like definitely focus on that piece so that long term you're gonna be in a better spot.

SPEAKER_01 31:52

Yeah, um, and plus one to everything you said, the I wanted to even hide a little on the financial literacy side of things. Um what's that superstar from the Philadelphia Eagles? The quarterback? Jalen Brown, no, Jalen Curry. Yeah. Um I watched a video of him today where he was talking about how he spent the first one million dollars he earned. I don't know if anyone saw that video.

SPEAKER_00 32:18

I know I've heard that he is very full.

SPEAKER_01 32:22

So um it was disclosed that for the very first million dollars he earned from playing professional in his year one, he saved $738,000 of it. And then the rest of it was you know doing things for himself, his parents, and helping, but it was very full spending, and most of it $700 was all saved. Contrast that to they showed um someone in the NBA, I think he belongs to uh Markuban's uh basketball team. What team does he do? That was my reason. And he earned I think a million dollars uh in his first year as well, and in that million dollars he saved 150. And so 50,000, I think, roughly went to getting his mom an Audi, 90,000 a Porsche Panorama, he paid 300,000 student loan for his sister, he did something for the house, 200. So so I'm um, and then what's his name? Mark Cooper was saying if you earned 850,000 in your first year as a professional basketball player, please don't go buy your mama a five million dollar house.

SPEAKER_00 33:31

It's like the first lesson they they're they're they're tough, but it's hard when you feel like everyone's invested in your dream, you want to give back, yeah. There has to be a balance.

SPEAKER_01 33:38

It has to be a balance. So I'm saying that it just made me realize that there's a lot of disparity when it comes to financial literacy, and I think as a community we need to do better to start to teach these financial literacy support each other through it, yeah, and have the uncomfortable conversations to be a leader in that way, yeah. Because to brand this point, 115,000 is not a lot of money, but it's also not small. I think I think if you're single definitely not small.

SPEAKER_04 34:03

I didn't say it wasn't a lot of money, I said that's enough money to be in DC.

SPEAKER_01 34:07

At 32 years old, I was exactly so he should be able to be able to figure it out, right? And and and and and all of that. The other thing is I feel even outside of the Jamal's situation, it's been very dire for other people. And I think when we had this conversation, I had spoken to Brandon about pooling communal resources, he wasn't very receptive to it, but like back up in Nigeria, it's like okay, maybe we have a multi-generational home so that we are paying one mortgage and multiple families with multiple streams of income. So remember the Hesus situation where there were like three families in the house, and it's different when you're not familiar.

SPEAKER_04 34:44

I'm trying to explain this to you, even off air. I'm not going to live with Tandis that we can say, man.

SPEAKER_00 34:49

Yeah, no. But we need our own space. If you haven't grown up with it, it's hard to take it on as an adult, you know.

SPEAKER_04 35:02

And if it's not like your family, like if it's your family, and like you come from a large family.

SPEAKER_01 35:09

I don't come from uh well, isn't it privileged speaking here? Yes, yeah. I'm speaking of the people making $30,000, $40,000 a year.

SPEAKER_04 35:18

And I'm like But how we've been living together in the PJs?

SPEAKER_01 35:21

What's PJs? Projects, yeah. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00 35:29

But what how is that different than having a roommate when you're in your 20s and 30s? You know, like I don't I'd love to have a roommates, but like having roommates is is similar, right?

SPEAKER_04 35:39

Because being able to save, yeah, being able to save.

SPEAKER_00 35:41

It's a good social environment.

SPEAKER_04 35:43

In New York, it's like you had to at that point, like at that age, because like what type of salary was you getting?

SPEAKER_01 35:48

Like you're gonna have to have maybe two of you, it's not the right example. So when I mean multi-generational, like I find that maybe it's also an immigrant thing, but kids are too eager to leave their parents' house because they graduated and are making 70,000. Like, say your parents' house, save that money, don't pay rent, you know, save enough to put a down payment on something that an investment property, like, because I feel like they are Nigeria is a very poor country, but there are some communal survival tact tactics that sort of protect our safety net from extreme poverty, and these are like simple things. So it's very common to see someone in his late 20s still living with his parents. It's very common for very old elderly parents to move in with the children, and then their grandkids are the ones who provide nursing care for them, so you don't have to pay for old and old people's homes. So, and then they in turn give provide child care for the children when they're really young. So, imagine all the money you're saving from daycare, from yeah, elderly care. So, I'm I'm I'm not sure why those things don't happen here, especially in communities.

SPEAKER_04 36:52

That's about space too. So, your homes are larger in Nigeria, so like if you have the space and you can be comfortable. But his clinics do that here.

SPEAKER_02 37:01

They don't necessarily have to use it. I'm open to it as a strategy in general, and I think we did used to do more of that. Like, I can speak to like going to see my grandparents in Tennessee, and like people being in the house. Like, if you have the you said what's the difference between like the rooming situation, and I think ownership one, right? Like, if you have your own house, your own space, once the mortgage is paid off, all right, how much money are we saving can be a lot, it can be substantial. So then you can invest in business, you can do other things. And I see other cultures doing this in a lot of our neighbors, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:30

Um, I think it's the uh Jews do.

SPEAKER_02 37:32

Yeah, I think it's a definitely do. I think it's a beneficial strategy for sure, and we should do more of it. But I think speaking to the mentality, it's like you are told I know you guys had a few conversations about this on other episodes, like the mentality of like the legacy of slavery and what that leaves in your mind sometimes. But the okay, I want to make sure that I have the biggest house, I have all of my stuff, my own space, I proved I can do it on my own as opposed to communally. What can we do together? How can we protect each other from things like that? Okay, how can we have businesses together and have cooperative economics, like those things? I think that the basis of that is that family unit and being able to share the house, share those resources. And you mentioned the money piece, but what about the wisdom you're getting from the grandparent that assists in the house that has now to the grandchild? What about those stories that you're sharing the history? Like the lessons, like all those things are super important. All of those are super important as well. So I think we should do more of it. Um I I understand the barriers there.

SPEAKER_00 38:31

But to your point, I think American capitalism relies on people feeling as if they need to have their own, their own car, their own house, their own, you know, looking a certain way, all of that. Like it the economy thrives on that seed that's being planted, like independence and ownership.

SPEAKER_04 38:49

Yeah, because you're viewed differently when you don't have like you know, people are looking like why you why y'all staying together? Why y'all like why don't you have your own, that type of thing, especially like uh let's say you're two uh older men or roommates or something, people would view that as very strange. Like, why don't you get your own why if that person gets their own? So that's social distractive. It's the age limit to that, yeah. Yeah, it's the age limit to that. Because once you hit 30, like it's like you're not supposed to have a roommate.

SPEAKER_01 39:16

No, no, forget the roommate. I've seen people be genuinely embarrassed about saying, My mom lives with me. Yeah, they may own the home, yeah. Their mom might be the vista, it may not even be their parents' house, but the idea that my mom lives with me is embarrassed.

SPEAKER_00 39:33

A single person dating in the past, the whole my mom lives with me was like 90% not true. Like it was you were living with your mom and you were making it seem like this is your house and she's living there. Like it's I see, but it shouldn't be a shameful thing, but because of how we're constructed, people don't want to admit to that, you know.

SPEAKER_02 39:52

Yeah, I'm curious. If let's say they didn't lie, right? Let's say they really do own the house and their mom lives with them. Yeah, if they could let's reverse that even. Let's say they did live with their mom, but they have the money to purchase two or three homes, like a home two or three times over, would you still date that person, or is that like construct just like I can't date a guy who lives with his mom?

SPEAKER_00 40:13

I just for me, I don't I wouldn't have a bias against it if they were being financially responsible and living at home. I think that's a responsible thing to do. Um, I don't I don't think there's anything wrong with that.

SPEAKER_01 40:25

I was just curious. I know you're one of one. Yeah, because I'm saying this because the stats don't lie. Black people as a demographic, we are the poorest in this country. We need to come up with coping strategies that help us. When um Brandon and I listened to a podcast called Free Conomics, and we're talking about taxation, and there's this big study in the P research where they showed it's the poorer people who have more spending habits. So the wealthier you become, the more frugal you are with money. So and which is the reason why we don't have a lot of consumption tax in America. Because if you only tax at the point of sale, more middle and poor people will pay more taxes. Because wealth people don't buy designers, they buy plain shirts at Target and keep it moving, right? And so it's the middle class, lower middle class that will want to buy the Gucci Prada and the wealth symbols and spend more money on those things. So I just feel like we need better habits as a community because the staff don't like Brandy always like to quote this other start around how many times the dollar stays in the community, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:31

Yeah, you want to speak to how many days in like four days?

SPEAKER_04 41:34

Um, not even just days, like how many yeah cycles I have, and it's it's like zero for the black community. We're in like seven to nine times for the Jewish community. Uh yeah, like five, six in the Asian community, like people who have built their own communities, like you go every large city you go to around the world, because now I've traveled, it's a Chinatown. Like it's a Chinatown in African countries. Like it's one everywhere. So they build their own community so their money stays in their community, and that's who they shop with. Um, I think what happens to us is this old uh story about um three people were selling bananas, uh Asian man, a black man, and a white man, the uh person is black, they go to the black man and all the bananas cost 35 cents in all three places. They ask the black man, can I get the banana for 25 cents? Black man says, No, like bananas are 35 cents. But they'll go to the white man and pay 35 cents for the banana because the black man didn't give them the discount.

SPEAKER_05 42:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 42:36

So it's like that mentality still exists. Like, and then sometimes the thought of, oh, the white man's bananas are better. Bananas then, where'd you get your bananas from? They could have gone to the same banana farm, if you will. Um, but that's the mentality we have about ourselves. If you're not giving me a deal, I'm not dealing with you.

SPEAKER_02 42:54

Why is this analogy with bananas? Can't we just use like apples or something? This is where your mentality is.

SPEAKER_04 43:02

Like the story that we use bananas, but you know what? Many of us are racist.

SPEAKER_01 43:14

I wanted to also point out there's also the emotional component, and what I mean by that is that I feel when other races do business with one another, people, there's a spectrum of people who are going to be honest, quasi-honest, and outright dishonest. But there is grace to say, Oh, okay, he cheated on me, he cheated me in this deal. That's fine, I'll get him next time. I think my observation is that in the black community, if you cheat me, brother, you cheated me. It's like it's you know it's a very personal, hurtful thing, and so I'm not gonna deal with you again, I'm not gonna refer you, I'm not gonna so it is. I think the emotions take over from the business side of um things.

SPEAKER_00 43:56

It's not just business, yeah. It's like you're hurt, you're personally hurt, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:00

So for example, Umar Johnson and this school he's been trying to build for me. I'm not laughing.

SPEAKER_00 44:08

Is that Dr. Umar?

SPEAKER_01 44:09

Dr. Umar, yeah. Dr. Johnson, yeah. And this we get his transfer. I think that's a good thing.

SPEAKER_00 44:13

But he he had a last name.

SPEAKER_01 44:15

Yeah. Yeah, Dr. Umar Johnson, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:17

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 44:17

And he's been trying to build this all black boys' girls' school and I think at this boys' school. And now people are beginning to get very personally hurt because they feel he's been taking them for a ride and scamming them. And I don't know that that is true. And even if it ends up being true, do you know how many times other groups of people have scammed themselves but still continue to do business to move forward? Like I can't imagine that in the Asian community nobody cheats. I'm sure it's within normal spectrum of behavior. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:45

It also is true that when you're starting a new venture, you're not experienced doing that thing. So he could be building the school and realize it costs four times as much as I thought it costs. Or I'm not, I'm not a contractor, so like I'm not getting the best deal on things. I think we also have to give people grace to like grow into a skill set and learn along the way if we're going to believe in them.

SPEAKER_04 45:05

And he named that. Like uh when he was on the Breakfast Club, he talked about that it had been some of those contractual things where people ran off with money, uh, the HVAC system costs so much money. Like it was all these roadblocks that happen, especially when you're building out something. Like if you go into a building and you know, it's already there and existing. Like, I think he's trying to build this in Delaware, and it's got to be a certain way because it's supposed to teach them all these horticulture skills and all this, all these different things. Like he has a clear vision of what he wants the school to be. But I think at some point you do reach that point where, like, I just gotta get it open, everything gonna be where it needs to be. But let me get it open and we'll start correcting things uh as we go and we'll learn from things as we go. Okay, I think I'll support him.

SPEAKER_02 45:52

So as I think it starts with a mindset shift as well. Like the point that you brought up of like, why don't we give the same grace or a second chance? And I'll agree that it does hurt more when you feel like you're coming from a scarcity mindset, you don't have as much. So the little that I have, I'm gonna entrust you with. And as my brother and my sister, I'm expecting you to do for me in the same way. It does hurt more. And I think it's more so that people also have a negative stereotype or view of the outcome of what it's gonna be when I deal with this person or this type of person. Not saying it should be like that, but sometimes it is, so it's like there is no grace because I expected this to happen with this person. Do I think it's gonna work? Do I believe in them? I'm gonna believe beyond belief, and I'm gonna make sure, I'm not saying to be taken advantage of, but like have faith in the person you're doing business with enough to say next time it'll go well, next time this will happen, as opposed to believing it won't. Yeah. So I think it's enough to get to you. Right.

SPEAKER_04 46:49

And I think the other side of that that um black business owners need to be transparent too. Like when something happens and you can't or whatever, like name that to the person so it doesn't turn into that instead of ghosting their mark. It's a trap. Do it.

SPEAKER_00 47:05

It's tough because you know you're not gonna get the benefit of the doubt. I think that's what's hard. It's like if I tell you that this happened, then it's like, oh, I knew it you've proven what I thought anyway. Yeah, and it's like we have to acknowledge that we're so we're growing up in America too, and unintentionally people hold biases about themselves, right? Because that's programmed into the television, into the curriculum, all of it. So it's like we have to really work hard to be objective and treat ourselves and others like our you know, our peers with care and love.

SPEAKER_02 47:37

That's what I'm saying. Like the global narrative is that we're the villains in the story, whatever the story is. And I don't know how we shift that, but I think making that shift in the mind is very important. We can be the heroes, we can be the heroines, like we we are.

SPEAKER_04 47:50

Yeah, yeah. And it would definitely take time, but I think it here because you have an option to work with somebody else, like you take Nigeria, everybody's black, so you know you're gonna get scared, you're gonna go back to this one. I hope you don't get scared. Like everybody you deal with is gonna be black. So it ain't like you can say I'm not dealing with somebody black in this situation, whereas in America, you can make that choice of like, okay, I'm giving out too many chances, like, I'm gonna deal with whoever I feel is the best.

SPEAKER_01 48:19

Yeah. Okay. Um, so Jamal, sorry this happened to you. Thank you for writing, thank you for being vulnerable. You need new friends. Expect that's not true.

SPEAKER_04 48:29

Keep your dick one.

SPEAKER_00 48:31

Give it like one one more child.

SPEAKER_01 48:34

Yeah, okay. That was a joke.

SPEAKER_04 48:36

Not in this age, because that's age of disclosure, age of get rid of your friends. Okay. All right, uh, I'm up next. This is a lithium. Uh I am a 48-year-old African-American man born and raised in on the south side of Chicago. I'm currently a regional director at a major logistics firm. Since the economy started contracting, uh contracting uh tech and AI layoffs uh hit our sector this spring, the corporate environment has become incredibly tense. Here's the uncomfortable truth. I am watching the immigrant shield, quotation marks. You guys talked about play out in real time uh to my detriment. Our VP of operations is a Nigerian man around Namdi's age. Uh, we get along well, but the white executives treat us completely differently. When he challenges an idea, they call his perspective global and innovative. They love his accent and his degrees. When I challenge the exact same data using my Chicago cadence, I am pulled aside and told my tone is aggressive or uncollaborative. Uh they view him as the exceptional safe black guy, and they view me through the lens of a 400-year-old stereotype. Uh Nandi, I appreciated you admitting uh that the immigrant hustle can blind you to the systemic racism. Right now, my Nigerian VP keeps telling me I just need to keep my head down and outwork the noise. He genuinely doesn't understand that the corporate machine gives him the benefit of the doubt while actively penalizing me. How do I explain this? Um how do I explain this Native Sun burden to him without sounding like a hater? How do African Americans and African immigrants stop letting corporate America press against each other for the last remaining diversity seat at the table?

SPEAKER_01 50:41

Wow, that's explosive. Where it came from here, do you what's his name or her name?

SPEAKER_04 50:46

His name. Is it a male? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 50:51

No name? Okay.

SPEAKER_04 50:52

Yeah, it's there, but I ain't gonna call him out.

SPEAKER_01 50:54

Okay. D. You incorporate. That's what I know you incorporate.

SPEAKER_02 51:06

Yeah, I mean, I don't think there's really a uh great answer for this one, if I'm I'm being honest. I think unless you can change the psyche of America in the last 400 years, it's not gonna be anything you can really excuse anything you're gonna shift. I'll say that probably the best strategy is to make sure you're doing what you're doing. Um, but doing it in community, are you risking like you bringing up the objection? Are you challenging the data by having kind of like a by-committee, not just you do it with others? Sorry, I was like almost dying on Sunday and Monday, so I'm out here. And you push to it. We appreciate it. Um but that's really always how to say in that scenario. I don't think there's too much you can do other than um bring up the conversation. If you want to have the conversation with your counterpart and try to get them to see the light in that way, you could, but I don't know how much is really gonna be invested there. It's gonna be valuable and change things for you.

SPEAKER_04 52:13

Because I I think um that person, uh like he's gonna want to protect himself too to a certain degree. So you know, y'all can have conversation. I don't know how close they are, uh, but depending on the nature of your relationship with this VP, like have that conversation uh and maybe think about how y'all can partner together uh in those moments as well.

unknown 52:38

You know.

SPEAKER_00 52:41

I don't know if I'm qualified to speak on this as a, you know, the dynamics are different for women. Um how so? I just and I've actually had, you know, as a as a black American woman, I've had an African woman boss before. Um and I've somewhat been the situation she was kind of like the chosen person, etc. But I've also been the situation I've had a French boss or a white American boss. So I've that I I didn't look at it any differently. I actually, if anything, I had empathy for her because I knew that she was probably still being penalized much more harshly than she would be as a white person. Um but what I did in that situation was I just empowered her to be my advocate. Like, I didn't look at it as a comparison between her and I. I looked at her as my manager. Like, you're my manager, like your my success is your responsibility. Here's what I need from you. Like, I need to ensure that in these situations I feel prepared. This is what I'm willing to do. Like, do you have any feedback for me? Do you have any guidance? Do you have any advice? And so she was actually able to really advocate for me. She got me like you know, elevation, some visibility to the best of her ability, and um, and it was helpful, you know, for the time being. Um, there were other outside factors that weren't ideal about the situation. But um ultimately I think that's what I would do, you know, as a woman, um, is make this their problem in a diplomatic way because they're still your manager, they're not you're not in competition with them, truly. Um so they should be looking for opportunities to elevate you.

SPEAKER_01 54:21

Yeah, I think there's a part of me that has a lot of empathy, but side-by-side irritation with this sort of diaspora and war. You know? Um, I think um and I mean me and Brandon have this conversation all the time around black immigrants, black professors, foundationally foundational black Americans, and I think even in this current administration there's been a lot of ordering of each group, which has been very sad to watch. And one of my only memories of um what was that thing? Clubhouse? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Clubhouse, yeah. Yeah, yeah, but I I will not forget one evening I went in there and it was African Americans and Africans shouting at each other and screaming at each other. I'm like, at the end of the day, I think we've been told lies. You know, someone woke up one day. So, guys, you have to remember history is written by conquerors, not losers. So whoever won in history gets to dictate how history is told. So if you, for example, start the story of America from Christopher Columbus losing his way, and you have a different story. Start the story of America from the Spanish Inquisition, and it's a completely different story, right? So who gets to tell? So, once upon a time, there were a group of Europeans from Spain who came with diseases and body order and all sorts of things, and killed Native Americans living in this country, and then from there committed all sorts of genocides, overtook the Mayan um dynasty and conquered the Americas, which is why the whole continent speaks Spanish. It's a very different story than starting it from oh, and then a white man was driving and stuff. What is this? America, but I think I'm in India, so those must be in there. So I think we have to understand that, and I'm I'm only saying that because somewhere along the lines, some people wrote a story that we sold people, and I think that there is no proof to a lot of that, and so it's easier to say I'm angry with you because you're people. So no, we're all one people, and at the end of the day, people were stolen, more people were stolen than actually people were sold. You know, these are like the things that people have to understand. Um, the other thing is I also think on the African side, it needs to be more humility to understand that you know, on one side I get that we are primarily economic migrants, so we came here primarily for economic prosperity, but that has come at a price built on the backs of descendants of slaves in this country. And if those people hadn't, you know, sat in the white side of the bus and refused to, you know, be separated in schools and and fought for voting rights and all of that, there will be no economic opportunity for us to come and fight for, or to come and even harvest for. So I really would like to see more collaboration. And a very intelligent person had once said until there is a predominantly first world, predominantly black first world nation, black people all over the world will never be respected. So there's a reason why Asians can go where they go, even with sopheal English, and still people will assume they know what they are saying. The same thing with Europeans, the same thing with you know every other place except black people. And the reason is because when you go to Asia, you can see the skyscrapers of Singapore, when you go to Europe, you can see the you know colonial and you know lovely towns of Paris and Milan and all of that. So of course there must have been intelligence here, there must have been you know some thinking here and some high IQ, you know, as it as it were. But then where is the Dubai of black people? And and and what is it about our inability, whether it's African Americans or Africans, to exist as a community and just develop in leaps and bounds, you know, and all of that. And so I you know, I'm encouraged by people like Bose, who is um a great marketing executive. Um, she did a lot of great work for Uber, Apple, and she's the one responsible for the whole great return to Ghana and bringing people and helping the Ghanaian government give free citizenship to any African American who wanted to come back to the year of return was all her marketing genius and idea. I think we need more of that. I think we need more pan-Africanism to understand that you know a fight for is a fight for everybody. Um, and you know, yeah, so I'm really sorry. I think you didn't give your name, but um I'm hoping the advice that everyone gives here will be helpful. Any last words on this?

SPEAKER_04 59:15

Um, I think these things just take time. Conversations need to continue uh to happen. People need to be open to those conversations because a lot of times what happens is uh Africans when they come to this country will stay in their own groups, they don't, you know, assimilate assimilate uh with us as much as it becomes more and it's not just because we're both black, it's a it's a classic thing too. It's like you want to assimilate with people who have what you're looking for.

SPEAKER_01 59:45

Aspire to aspire to whatever. Yeah, yeah, acquire.

SPEAKER_04 59:49

Because I don't think you could have like a broke friend. I think that would be a struggle for you, yeah, like a broke African-American friend.

SPEAKER_00 59:55

Um we should test it out. We should test it out. I gotta come back and give you my glasses.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:06

I just find anybody start glasses. I'm trying to understand the joke. Yes, you're glasses. I wonder I'll tell my story. I should write a book.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:20

That doesn't make you not your story, does not make you not class. We'll leave it for another day.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:25

Okay, um, any final one too.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:27

You came to Charlotte and you said, What is this? It seems like everybody drives raggedy cars here.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:31

Oh, I can explain what that is. So, growing up, if heaven was here and guys and pointing to the ceiling, America was just underneath it, and that was because of the solid propaganda machine that was exported from America to the rest of the world, for which a lot of it was black entertainment culture that we all aspired to. We all wanted to wear the Fubu, right? Yeah, the music video. So you you grew up thinking this this opulent and this yeah, and then everybody looks like Will Smith, you know. You can't remember you, so yeah, so a lot of that was just it's sometimes me reconciling all the lies I fed, I was fed growing up in Nigeria to the reality I'm seeing. Like sometimes I'm telling my friends back home about the subway system, and they can't fathom what I'm saying because in their mind it has to be pristine and like no.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:32

Can I ask the question on that? What has been the close, what experience has been closest to the ideal of America since you've been here? Like, have you ever gone anywhere or had experience?

SPEAKER_01 1:01:40

My first three years, Colorado.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:41

Interesting.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:42

I lived in Denver, Colorado. I lived in Aurora, Colorado. So very suburban, very picketed white fence, sanitized, sanitized. I'm careful with that word, but but but it's the suburban, the backyard, the frontier, the picket white fence. It's the what's what's that style of house? The one you grew up in. The craftsman? No, no, you're talking about um the one that has a level and then one up or one down. The split level. The split level. It was the split level types of houses. It was everybody running on weekends. Oh, let's go mount, um, hike hike in the mountains. It was so it was a lot of that and very polite, you know. I still remember my first time in the East Coast. It was three. So so so Tara, do you know I would go home every Christmas and people ask me about America? And I spoke about America through the lens of Colorado. Because that's the only state I knew, and it met the standard, it met the bar. Because even the airports, Denver is quite a lot of the airports are lovely, yeah, and and has all this artwork and even the horse and everything. So it was really everything was checking out, if that makes sense. And then I show up to my first big boy interview job in New York, New in New Brunswick, New Jersey, and I still remember that evening. I was like, okay, that's where I'm going to have the interview. Let me just walk around and feel the area. And I was crossing the road. We can curse on this, and someone said, get the out of and I was it that just shook me because no one had cussed at me in the three years I was here.

unknown 1:03:13

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:14

Have you ever seen coming to America? Yes.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:19

Well, he felt it too because he had to fly into Newark, and then he said the smell coming from Colorado to Newark.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:26

Yeah, now when I went to Singapore, everything I thought Asia should give, it gave.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:32

Yeah. So you know. Interesting. Interesting. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:37

Um, downtown Chicago in the summer, it gave.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:41

It gave, you know. So I mean, some places, you know, have lived up to the hype, you know, and other places not so much. Alright, so we have a fan male that is audio.

unknown 1:03:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:52

So I'm going to attempt to play it out. And uh if it doesn't work, we'll see. But ready? Yes.

unknown 1:04:01

Hello Gordon and Namdi. Congratulations on this season finale. My dilemma.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:07

I'm an African male in my mid-the-living in Africa working for a double company. I'm part of a double team.

unknown 1:04:19

Sometimes I don't want that to be not doing it. Um for that centre as a high performer within the team and the organization. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:58

Tara, I'll let you start. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:00

Hey Gilbert.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:01

Hey Gilbert.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:02

He's an element. His name is Gilbert.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:05

Okay. How do you know?

SPEAKER_04 1:05:06

Is he okay? Because I know his voice. If he was okay with his voice, I'd be okay with his name.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:13

Oh.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:14

So if I heard Gilbert correctly, then his peers are making his life hard. Yeah. The only person's opinion who matters is his manager. And so ensuring that that relationship is solid is the priority for the end of your review. His peers can try to stir things up. That's very inconvenient and annoying for managers. As someone who manages people, if someone is complaining about someone a lot or not being solution-oriented or not being collaborative, that's a negative from a manager's perspective. So I think he should continue to manage, stay mature, continue to embody the leadership traits that are appealing to someone at a more senior level, and just stay focused on the performance, run out the noise. Because I, in my own experience, sometimes when people try To sabotage someone on the team, it's because they're intimidated and it threatens how they feel about themselves, and they're worried that it affects their own perception of their own performance. If you get sucked into it, you're super level.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:12

I think the other dynamics of what he said is he's just part of a become part of a global team. And so what it means is that he's also dealing with peers that are not necessarily from the same place. And so I think there's also some cultural clash that is going on as to how things are done in other places versus the way you do it and the way the other people do it. And so I think there is a you know, there's a quote I like to say to thy own self be true. There's a centering and grounding he needs to find to say, in all of this, in all the different ways of and different energies of people, who am I? What am I, what am I bringing, and how do I continue to execute without getting sucked into the noise? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:55

Can I add to that perspective? Then usually I'll say my own experience when you join a new team or new role, you have to spend some time listening and understanding what the cultural norms are. And if there's small things you can do to incorporate into your own behavior just to just to like kind of align with the norms on the team, take that moment to do that. It's gonna take time. People will forget that this transition period even happened in a couple months, you know? But if you're performing, you're performing. You know, it's just it's it's it sounds like soft, soft behavior, soft skills.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:24

Yeah, I just add that I think that is the best defense. Right? Like if you're in a spot, I know you said you just joined the team, but I'm assuming you're in that spot because you do know what you're doing. We do have evidence to support that. So like we recommend working in court with like everybody to brag folder or a brag file. Anytime anybody has any positive feedback, compliments that you're free, to help make this go through, to help support this initiative, um, screenshot, grab those, put it in the folder, say, hey, would you be okay with like getting the testimony or quick blur? Um keep all of that so that we can catch your peer review, tie everything accomplished that is subjective of the business, and then support that and back that up and say, Oh, also, by the way, people love work with me for these reasons. And so now if you do get negative feedback from the team, maybe it's just the team, it's not you. So that's the best way, I think, to defend yourself against if you feel like the peers are not being fair to you in your performance. Okay, great. I have a million other people that that say I do a great job. Here's evidence of that. So that's a good way to kind of make sure you're sticking to the numbers and make sure you can support your case.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:33

Brandon, you you once were in corporate and you ran in when you hear all these corporate woes, do you feel lucky?

SPEAKER_04 1:08:40

I'd rather deal with, you know, Shakwisha cursing me out over her son, lost his book bag, and I can't find it. Oh. That's a solvable problem. She can come off of it. Yeah, no. Um, no, sometimes, like, as far as like the I think level of professionalism, like I would I miss that. Um, because that is something that's bad, especially the older I get, but I'm doing my my life work and my passion, so I'm okay with with missing it as well. Um, but I empathize um with Gilbert and what he's experiencing, he's young uh in his career and stuff like that. So I would just say like keep grinding, like these things you learn how to deal with more as you grow. Um and like the promotions are coming for him clearly, um, as well. He's with a global company, um, so like he should just keep pushing, learning, and growing, and like uh to D's point, like you're not trying to like build up this type of defense where like now you've isolated yourself and even your peers don't want to deal with you because I think that will start to play into the minds of his superiors.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:52

The company and the higher you go, the pressure is there's more pressure, yeah. So like part of it is like developing that that armor against the noise, the BS, the toxicity, and that happens as you grow. Like you have your experience where like, oh, this person just talked to me crazy, but this I have to do my job, you know, or my team is mad at me because they don't want to do what they have to do, you know. It's just so it sounds like that that discomfort of growth is happening to him, and he just has to get comfortable with the growth.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:24

Okay, so let's take one more and uh start to wrap down.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:27

Yes. I think my friend is crazy. I have a close friend, guys, guys.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:34

We actual messages were you guys kidding. Okay, go ahead.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:41

That was the title. It says the title is I think my fence. I have a close friend who loves to lure men uh into liking her. When they start showing interest, she finds a reason to play with their feelings and push them away, eventually dumping them. She always says she wants companionship, however, she continues this behavior. I have suggested therapy to no avail. Have you ever experienced or do you have any advice I can share? Signed, hurt people hurt people, noted this person is in their 50s.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:17

Some people never grow up. They don't grow up in some ways.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:20

It's is this toxic femininity?

SPEAKER_03 1:11:23

Does that exist?

SPEAKER_00 1:11:25

No, I it just sounds like someone who has some um unresolved issues, maybe from childhood or something that they haven't dealt with. And not everyone heals, not everyone has the ambition to grow and change and evolve. It's just the reality of it. Some people will be in the cycle that they're in now for the rest of their life.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:44

Yeah, and because it is a cycle, I think like that's why it's hard for them to see like what is actually happening. Someone looking from the outside in probably was okay with it, especially if this is a long time friend, like you have that friend that like this has been their relationships out for a long time, and then you get older, everybody's mindset is different now, especially in your 50s. Um, none of y'all can speak to that. Um, but like uh and you start to say, like, wait a minute, like what is happening? Like, you're still back here doing that thing that was happening in our 30s or our 20s. Um, and so that you realize like that is just who that person is, and now you're trying to help them, and they don't probably really want help.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:29

They don't want that the cycle's comfortable with them, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:33

And it's okay, like they know just how far to go with that man and get but and then you're sitting there like if you're their female friend going, like, you just out here damaging me. Yeah, like and I'm like really looking for something serious and real, like you know, my Liberian hard worker. That was not me. It was me that time. Uh and then you out here, you know, playing with men's fillers and like And putting yourself at risk. And putting yourself at risk.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:03

I'd be curious to know that person's response when the friend raises to them, hey, this is your pattern of behavior, like what is the response that comes back from them? Because if you're showing it to somebody and like not being self-aware is one thing. When somebody else makes you aware, if you're still rejecting it, then like you like you said, you're comfortable being in that space. So I would just say, hey, just stop saying it for a companionship. This is fun for you or interesting, or this is what you do, or this is what you don't. But if you're being shown a better way and you don't choose that pattern, I don't know what you what's a friend supposed to do.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:37

Yeah, I think that's where the mind manipulation is happening because the friend is saying I want companionship. Like if the friend wasn't saying I want companionship and doing this, then there's no reason for you to have a conversation with them. Yeah. But if they're telling you like I really want to be with somebody, and then they they keep doing this pattern, like I would say that just a small little like thing here.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:59

I used to rock back in my chair when I was in school a bunch of times, seeing how far I could go before I fell. And my dad one time was like, and it at home, my dad one time was like, Look, I'm I'm tired of telling you you're gonna fall hard enough at some point and you're gonna stop. And that's kind of what it had to be. I did fall hard enough one point and I stopped. Your friend has to get involved with somebody to the point where, okay, I really do like this person too. I don't know how to not push them away, and I do, and now I'm sad to the point or angry or upset, I have some emotion that pushes me to want to change. And without that, it's gonna be a cycle.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:32

I think that's true. Like somebody's gonna catch her, and she's gonna evolve before she gets out. Uh, and that's when it's really hurt. She probably was hurt. My assumption is probably was hurt like early on, and then was like, I'm living this out where you won't get me again, like I won't experience that level of pain again. Um, and so it's just something that is psychologically telling her, don't fall.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:57

Yeah. The way that sounds out to me is luring. Luring someone because it it almost seems like she doesn't who that person is, doesn't matter. It's like she just wants to win, she just wants to like to feel that someone wants to know that they got it still in their 50s, like valuation, right?

SPEAKER_04 1:15:14

Yeah, I can see that too.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:17

Okay, well, good luck to your friend. Good luck to your friend.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:20

And you would set your boundaries on what you'll tell, listen to like if you have to like endure like woe is me, like cut that off, you know, like limit the time. Yeah, because that's not fair to you to if you don't cycle.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:33

Yeah, maybe I should let me take uh Jamal on vacation.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:38

And just you know, figure it out that way.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:41

Okay, I'll call it a trip.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:45

I'm sure he will enjoy sugar mama. Alright, so we give him that advice.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:51

This is the season finale and we're going on a break. What are you gonna be doing this summer without this episode or this recording to week?

SPEAKER_04 1:16:00

Yeah, so um I'm year-round, even though I'm in education, so summer school. Um going too. I'm traveling too. Uh going to North Carolina, going home for a little bit uh next week. Um we school ends tomorrow. Yay, but by the time this is not is this coming out tomorrow? Or later? What's that? When will you do it? Tomorrow. Tomorrow. Wow, yeah, never done that. Yeah. Like recorded and released the next day. It's usually a few days. So by the time you are listening to this, uh, school will be over. Yes. Uh as well. We usually release at 3 p.m. on Fridays when we release. So um school will be over uh for the students. Uh I'll still be doing some work in Tuesday. I'm flying out to North Carolina for a week. Uh so looking forward to that, and then come back for a couple weeks and then fly to um Tampa, Florida for my family reunion.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:53

Are we to go into Stone Island? Bragg, let's hear you.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:00

Where's the vacation?

SPEAKER_04 1:17:02

Um thousand dollar tentacles. We're not gonna start talking about it. Where is the vacation hands and buying new steamers just to clean your floors? Uh I don't know yet. Okay. That's the like that's why I didn't mention it. The plans are not finalized. The hope is to go, you know, somewhere tropical.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:22

Yeah, dower plans for the summer?

SPEAKER_02 1:17:24

Uh we've got a few. Nothing, nothing crazy, but we do want to take a trip to Mexico City again. I think we got the bug. Yeah. Um, so you don't like Mexico City. Oh, yeah. Yeah, but it's been on our list. We have to land 24 hours. I think playing for October, but we're probably gonna move it up to like August-ish. Okay. Uh definitely going to take us take a few trips there. Um yeah, it's just cake bowl is gonna take awesome time. Uh lovely hobby. Um, and then I think maybe a few family meetings, like, we'll see what it actually ends up being. I'll have something to say that we can work. So just a few things for the summer.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:05

There's cake ball every Saturday.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:08

Uh pretty much if we're not playing somebody's playing. Um, I just prompt. Uh pretty much it for the summer, just working, taking a few trips.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:31

Like just having the discipline and you know, just the wherewithal to like set boundaries better. So I actually don't remember much from the last few summers because I've worked so much that it's just like blank. Like I last time I really remember for it was like 2020. I'm not joking. So I really am just trying to be present and like eyes open in the moment, touch grass, that kind of thing, and then work on just building, you know, a life that feels feels good. It doesn't feel like just working for work's sake.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:00

So okay, so for me it's a mixed bag, so a lot of work-related travel, a lot of family-related travel as well. Um, thanks to Tara, I'll be doing something I'm soft-launching my you know academic lecture career. So, in case this doesn't work, I can go become a teacher somewhere. So, this weekend I'll be at NYU giving a guest lecture in the Ember, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:25

Stern Ember program.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:26

Yes, yes. So, very excited about that. Um, I'll be taking some vocal classes uh as well this summer, so that should be good. I'm going to be in New York for the 4th of July. So I talked to Tara, she said they're going somewhere. You are not going to be here, Brandy. So, guys, if anybody's in New York, um let me know. I'll come out and party.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:48

Do not let me not think because he flies out the next morning to UK.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:52

It doesn't matter. Listen, let me give people my itinerary. Someone can find me in JK. Exactly. But guys, if there's a party in New York, let me know. Just uh send me a fan mail and I will show up there, guest appearance, sign autographs. Who do we have like this? You know, Ralph and Roots is the one one of the two, you know, is there and all. But I can think we should say thank you to Randy.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:25

Thank you to you both. We are fans of the park and of you as well. We should be right to fan. Yeah, fan everything. So thank you for having us for yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:34

You're gonna love fan. Um, yes, you can catch us on, we can do rapid fire, like good. Yeah, we're gonna have to happy. Yes, yeah. Uh so okay, producer. Uh catch us on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and Amazon as well. Um looking forward to a great summer, and we'll be back in September. Yes. In September. Uh, so we will put something out there for you guys uh to listen in uh September and hopefully have more guests on on different episodes and uh answer some more fan mail. So we know we couldn't get to everybody, so again, thank you for sending in fan mail and apologies we couldn't get to.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:17

And keep sending them because now we're going to we we'll have more time in season two to talk about them, and we're also going to launch our social media presence. So we're going to have an Instagram page that Brandy will manage because he's on Instagram. Um, and um that way you can also interact with us. All right, thanks everyone. Thank you guys.