Topic: Titanic (1997) CoHost: Graeme Mitchell Taylor

Topher Mac is joined by old college friend and creative slasher Graeme Mitchell Taylor as they discuss James Cameron’s masterpiece Titanic (1997) while they try avoid a field of tangent shaped icebergs.  Will this episode do like Celine Dion’s heart and go on and on?  You’ll have to listen to find out!

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:01

I wonder, uh, are you prepared to talk about the 1943 movie Titanic? You mean the Nazi one? Yeah. That's what I told you to watch, the 1943 Titanic movie. Oh. Yeah, that's what we're doing.

SPEAKER_03 0:20

We're doing it. I miss, I missed that. Did you not get the so fuck so?

SPEAKER_01 0:25

So what you're saying is you know that there is a Nazi movie that exists that demonizes Bruce Ismay as a greedy uh person of Jewish faith. Yeah. And and you did not listen to the point where I was like, we're gonna watch Titanic and cover it for the anniversary of the 1943 edition. Okay. Directed by Herbert Selpin and Vienna Klinger. Klingler. Okay. It took two. Okay, I can make fun of them, they're Nazis. Yeah, I know. But also minimum Nazi sympathizers.

SPEAKER_03 0:58

Once again, I'm just like, oh god, that's right. I have seen clips from it, but uh obviously I'm fucking with you. You know, I know I do now, but it took me a second to realize that because again, yeah, that's yeah, yeah, there's telling you it's a symptom.

SPEAKER_01 1:14

There have been almost 20 main like big deal Titanic movies that have come out. And it could have been any one of them that I meant when I said we're gonna cover Titanic.

SPEAKER_03 1:26

I know, I know.

SPEAKER_01 1:26

There's yeah, and the only one you were smart enough to be like, wait, are we doing a night to remember or are we doing Titanic?

SPEAKER_03 1:32

Well, you said 1943.

SPEAKER_01 1:33

I was like, that's World War II, like that's the Nazi one.

SPEAKER_03 1:36

Yeah, I could have threw a curveball at you and then like we're doing Atlantic. Right. Oh my god. No, thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:43

So just needed everyone listening to know what a giant fucking nerd I am. Yeah, yeah. Uh speaking of um uh modestly sized nerds, uh, Mr. Graham Mitchell Taylor has joined us today.

SPEAKER_03 1:57

Ah, yes, yes, yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:58

He is a slasher. Well, on my off time. And by that I mean he is a writer, actor, musician, composer, and occasional filmmaker who makes slashers.

SPEAKER_03 2:12

Well, slashers was definitely on the dock the docket, really, but like my first feature film was not a slasher. Uh it I was running off of like the found footage craze. It was around the time that like the the paranormal activity movies were sort of getting into their like uh ridiculous number sequel number.

SPEAKER_01 2:31

Well, that sounds like a paranormal thing to do. Yes, yes. It is out of the ordinary, yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's the energy we're coming into this thing with today, ladies and gentlemen. Um, yeah, so I found out that there was a Nazi version of the Titanic movie, and I thought I'd throw them a curveball. Uh uh just like John Paul Edmondson had thrown me a curveball about the uh Friday 13th movie when we covered that, and he's like, So we're we're covering the movie from 2008. I was like, wait, what?

SPEAKER_03 2:59

What? I haven't seen that since theater.

SPEAKER_01 3:02

I've never seen the whole thing. We're not covering that movie uh on this particular day. Right. And he goes, I'm just fucking with you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, so yeah, uh, I want to thank you for coming through. Yes, thanks for having me. You were someone I met in college many, many moons ago. Yes, long time. And so I thought it would be appropriate to go to Pembroke, North Carolina and sit down with you and talk about a movie that is very um anniversary relevant right now.

SPEAKER_03 3:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:36

At least tomorrow-wise. Um no, no, no. It's the release day is April 15th.

SPEAKER_03 3:41

So that's right, okay.

SPEAKER_01 3:43

See, and yeah, and Taylor did a good job. I'm sorry, uh, Mr. Taylor did a good job of um of pointing out the obvious. We're actually recording right now during about the time that the Titanic struck the iceberg. Yes, yes. That time, of course, was uh 1140. 1140, yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, but that was not Eastern Standard Time, that was in the time zone that it was in. Yeah, we're just a little bit off of that. Yeah, pretty damn close. So I thought this would be an interesting time to do it. April 14th is when it struck, April 15th is when it sank. That was 220 a.m. That's what they say. Yep. Um, so we're gonna get into all of that in just a wee little bit. A wee little bit. But before we do, we gotta get nerd out about movies for a little bit. Yes. When we get back, we're gonna talk box office. And then we'll talk briefly about what we've seen recently. Uh, thanks for coming to Shadows That Shine, a movie podcast. I'm Tover Mack, joined today with Graham Norton.

SPEAKER_02 4:55

No, no, no. Close enough.

SPEAKER_01 4:57

Graham Mitchell Taylor.

SPEAKER_02 4:59

I wish I could be that skinny. Um, no, no.

SPEAKER_01 5:02

All right, we'll we'll be right back. Hola, como estas. We are still here. As I mentioned before, this is Shadows That Shine. I literally just said that. You did, it's a movie podcast. Yes. Um, so let's get into the books of fees. The books of east, this talk business, baby. Um do you are you where's your stance? Some of my guests couldn't give a fuck less about the box office. I love this segment of the it's it's fascinating.

SPEAKER_03 5:34

Like the the box office, well, versus the budget, you know, it it's important to understand like why was it a hit? Was it not a hit, like what makes a hit? And box office is important. It's a miracle that some movies were even made. Oh yeah, and so besides like how they're received, you know, against how they're received.

SPEAKER_01 5:53

Oh yeah, and I'm glad you mentioned budget because I have added a new statistic that I mentioned. Uh-huh. I am now moving forward going to be seeing the budget or estimated budget of movies as I do this. So here we go. I didn't even coach you into that. You just like set me up. I tried, I tried. Yeah, we can go April 10th to 12th. That's the weekend we're talking about. And again, we're just talking about domestic numbers. I mean, we'll mention some international numbers when we're just follow along, you'll get the idea. I'm listening. Number one movie of the weekend, Super Mario Galaxy. 68.1 million dollars was added to Universal Pictures coffers. Um that brings its totals to 307.2 million dollars domestically, 321.4 million internationally for a grand total of 628.6 million dollars on a budget of 110 million. So it's so it's a hit. It has made some money for Universal, who right now is my favorite company because they're extending the theatrical window. Can you see why? Because they're making money. They're making money, yeah. It's almost like maybe that should have never gone away. I mean, yeah, sure, six-month windows was ridiculous, but like four weeks. I I there have been movies this year. You don't know this because you don't listen to podcasts as regularly. But I've been upset. There were movies that I wanted to watch, like Iron Lung, that were out of the theater before I was ready to see it. Have you seen it yet? No, because I don't have access to it because I watched my movies in movie theaters.

SPEAKER_03 7:35

It it happened, oh you know, it was there for a short time in Lorneburg. So I I did I did get a chance. I know I did get a chance to see it. A Lorenberg local.

SPEAKER_01 7:45

Hey, guess what? Second place. Second place, yes. The fantastic movie known as Project Hell Mary. Yes. It added another 24.1 million to Amazon MGM Studios, which I'm mad at for my own personal reasons that I'm not gonna say publicly. Boo you MGM. I'll forgive you maybe one day down the road. Keep making Project Hell Mary level movies, and I'll forgive you. Yeah. Uh everyone's like, what is he on about? And I'm like, what? I got friends, and that's why like you hear stuff about that happens in the offices, and you're like, you know what, finger to you. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um all right, so this brings Project Hail Mary's total to 20 uh to 256.2 million domestically, 254 million internationally, 510.2 million dollars in total. Sounds like they've gotten a return on their estimated budget of 200 million dollars. People love the gospel. Also, like, why is all of these movies so high up on budget? I could see an animated film because of everything you gotta do, but yeah, I don't know. Well, we know that it's because Project Hell Mary was a special effects heavy movie, but you know what wasn't? Part three, our third place for the domestic box office. It's a film called The Drama. The drama, yeah. It's an A24 film, Zendaya and Robert Pattinson and Robert Pattiboy. Yeah. Um, apparently people are liking it. It added 8.7 million dollars to uh their coffers this weekend, bringing their total so far to 30.8 million internationally. Uh no, I'm sorry, domestically. Okay, domestically 12.4 million internationally for a grand total of 43.2 million. The budget, 28 million dollars. Okay, a24 likes those mid-range budgets. I don't know if you knew that.

SPEAKER_03 9:44

I do, yeah, yeah, I yeah, I did. Um, I'm I I definitely take in a lot of A24. Yes. Apparently, though, like people apparently people are going to see the drama more because apparently, like the trailer had a bit of false advertising. Oh, um, people were not expecting. Apparently, I won't spoil it, but apparently, like 45 minutes into the movie, something happens. There's there's a moment where it's like, oh, that's oh, it's this kind of movie.

SPEAKER_01 10:07

Okay, gotcha. All right, well, you did spoil it right there. Yeah. Well, well, but fuck it. Let's I mean, don't fuck the butt, but I mean, like, forget it. Let's go. Okay, good. Number four. Number four is a movie called You, Me, and Tuscany. No idea. Neither do I. Um, but if anyone remembers last week I said there ain't really shit coming out for a little while that I care about, and this sort of proved it. Okay, it was a new movie this weekend that made $7.8 million for Universal Pictures. Again, yeah, Universal, but I don't know if I would watch this movie. Um, I don't know enough about it to say I would not.

SPEAKER_03 10:44

Yeah, I was like, are there any monsters in this one?

SPEAKER_01 10:46

No, but see, that doesn't have to be monster. I know that. I like dramas. I like comedies. I like to laugh. Yeah. Uh so $7.8 million domestic for the weekend, one million dollars internationally for a total of $8.8 million. Here's the bad news. Estimated $18 million budget. Ouch. They came up short of halfway for that. That is not what you want to see. Uh, speaking of things I don't want to see, fifth place is Hoppers. Oh my god. That's Walt Disney Studio Motion Pictures release. $4.2 million added on to their grand total. This movie has super performed in the theaters. Families are coming out to watch movies. That's what I'm seeing. Good. Our number one and our number five are both family films.

SPEAKER_00 11:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:37

Uh, number two, a hopeful film. I don't know that I would call it a family film, but like if you got teenagers, sure. So it's a good time to be family. Uh, not a good time to be me who likes uh six and violence. Lots of boobs. Lots of boobs and lots of blood. Yes. But not blood coming out of the boobs. I mean, hey. No judgment. If that's it. I like my women strong.

SPEAKER_03 12:04

If you can bleed out of your tits, like that's pretty strong. And like still and like and still be able to like make it through the day, then yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:11

You sound like Rob Zombie right now. Absolutely.

unknown 12:13

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:15

Oh, that's a whole different podcast. Oh my god. Um pretty soon.

SPEAKER_03 12:19

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:20

So um someone who hates Rob Zombie.

SPEAKER_03 12:23

Oh, come on.

SPEAKER_01 12:24

I love Rob Zombie. I thought it'd be interesting. That's down the road.

SPEAKER_03 12:27

I like his I like his movies. I defin like I like his movies. I will I will say that definitively. Um, but one but I guess before we move on though, uh uh hoppers though. I do work with kids. Um, I forgot to mention that like um my regular like day job, I suppose, is uh I am an after-school tutor and I work with kids. The kids are definitely talking about hoppers, like people are people are going to see it. Isn't it a Pixar film? It wasn't called a Pixar film.

SPEAKER_01 12:54

I just assumed Disney one.

SPEAKER_03 12:56

I'm not sure. I I wasn't even sure it was Disney. I wasn't sure if it was that or DreamWorks, but um I mean because Pixar's lost its spark anyway, so it's unfortunate, but like it they're they are not beyond redemption. The thing is, like, they can fix this.

SPEAKER_01 13:10

It's just well, you know, I mean, we'll see. Apparently, they're getting a lot. I we're not supposed to be talking about this right now, but I'm just saying they've been getting a lot of heat lately because uh there's been some like solid ideas for movies that are aimed just at girls, and they were like, no, doesn't appeal to the boys enough. And then you're like, I don't know, man. Like, I heard the plot, and like I would have watched that when I was a kid.

SPEAKER_03 13:34

So whatever. I mean, what do I know, right? I don't know about the demographics of uh who went to go see the Barbie movie, but like well, that's not a that's not a family film. I know, but like guys went to go see that.

SPEAKER_01 13:45

I I'm one of the guys that went to see that that movie was not made for me. It was great. I mean, you know, but that movie was not made for me, right? I'm not the demo, yeah. I like it because I I think Greta Girlwig is one of the best work and directors. She's great, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 13:58

Yeah, um, um, and I guess the I have top 20. Right, and I have to constantly remind myself though that like their job is to make money.

SPEAKER_01 14:08

I guess. I guess. Speaking of money, yeah, uh, just to finish up this little uh Hoppers in total has made 157.2 million domestically, 197.3 internationally for the grand total for the Walt Disney Company, 354.5 million dollars. That brings the weekend totals, all films uh uh including films not named, uh uh domestically, 125.7 million dollars it made this week. That is down, that is down 37.1 percent, but that makes sense because there was no great new movies that came out. It's only April. We gotta wait for summer. You know, sure, why not? I mean, look, all I know is Project Hell Mary is keeping having me keep the faith. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It was a very good movie, yeah. Um, yeah, so that's where we're at right now. This has been your box office. I am uh Tover Mac, joined with uh he knows me by a different name. Taylor? He knows me by a different name. And uh yeah, so uh once I press the right button, then we're gonna we're gonna we're gonna get into the next little bit in just a second. Okay. Uh let's let's uh think about when we get back what we've watched recently. Thinking, yeah. Before we get into this deep dive, no pun intended on Titanic. And we're back. We're back. A dinosaur story. I make that joke every week. You think I would get tired of making it? I don't. I don't get tired of it. I don't even like that movie that much. I haven't seen that movie in 30 years. But you know what movies I have seen? Like new ones. This week is full of them, but I've narrowed it down to just talk about two for me. I don't know if you have any that you want to talk about.

SPEAKER_03 16:01

I I had to ask beforehand. I was just like, do you mean like what have I seen that that's recently new, like literally just came out? Or like movies that I've seen for the first time? Because I did have some catching up to do. I definitely have some. Let's see, I definitely have one.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

What's the last movie you saw? Like, even if you've seen it before.

SPEAKER_03 16:18

Okay. Oh, the last uh even if I've seen it before.

SPEAKER_01 16:20

Oh my god. I've watched so much I love that he's not gonna say Titanic. It wasn't Titanic. You would think the motherfucker would watch Titanic. I know, I know.

SPEAKER_03 16:28

It is my yeah, it's my second favorite movie. Um, the the last one that I watched at least all the way through, I recently watched uh Toy Story 2. Oh, okay. But I mean I've seen that a bazillion times. I had it on a VHS and everything.

SPEAKER_01 16:41

I'm uh notoriously a person that doesn't like animated films. Did not know that. Um, yeah, yeah. I get all the hate, all the hate mail, the hate texts, they all send them to me and they say, hey man, and you'll be getting one from me. This is art too, and then I'm like, I know it's art, but it ain't movies. Okay, okay. No, I get it, I get it, I get it. Yeah, there's a lot of things. There's some good look, the Toy Story trilogy is brilliant. Yeah. Everything after that shouldn't exist, but the Toy Story trilogy is Chef's Kiss. All right, you'll hear no disagreement. And I grew up on Disney films that I still love. Of course. Not all of them, but some of them hold very hold up very, very well. And you know, I kind of like Super Mario Brothers World thing. Yeah. Like it was kind of fun, but it's still not movies. But you know what is movies? The ones you've seen. The ones I saw. The one you saw, okay. I saw Casino. Yep. Which for those of you who don't know, casino is a movie by one of the greatest filmmakers of our day. Yeah. No, of all time. He's in the top ten of all time. I'd say it. I'm I'll say it to you, he says, stalling to remember the name of the filmmaker that he was. Do you not know who did Casino? Uh Wolf of Wall Street.

SPEAKER_03 17:57

Oh, uh Scor uh Scors Scorsese. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:00

Okay. My man Scorsese. That's right. I didn't just trick you into saying the name because I couldn't remember his name, even though he's like a person I look up to. Right, right, okay. Um, yeah, it's uh I did not I did not like the movie as much as I thought I would. Really? The problem is that it came out after Goodfellas, and Goodfellas is better. And he sort of did a better version of it when he did uh I'd paint walls. I mean uh The Irishman. Yeah, yeah. Like The Irishman's better than Casino and it covers kind of the same sort of stuff.

SPEAKER_03 18:37

So yeah, I would agree.

SPEAKER_01 18:39

It's not a bad movie, it's just not his early or his late career. It's that mid-career lull. It's like, oh, you're not quite as good as you used to be, are you?

SPEAKER_03 18:52

I I will say that I have seen casino, I've seen it once. My problem is that opening shot that you can fucking see the dots. Oh no, no, no. My pro my problem is I have a hard time remembering a movie that I've only seen once. Oh, well, that's a thing too. So it's like I know it exists. What about a three-hour movie that you've only seen once? Because that's casino. That's right. That's right, that's right. Yeah, exactly. You would think after three hours I would have remembered something, but no.

SPEAKER_01 19:20

It you know, I mean, it's not terrible, but it's not De Niro's best work, and it's not Scorsese's best work. I I can't remember the name of the woman that's in it, but she did a very good job. She felt very real to me. Um, she was a she was just a little bit not uh slutty enough to play what she was playing. Okay, which was sort of a prostitute-like character.

SPEAKER_03 19:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:44

But what are you gonna do? I'm gonna let me pull up uh try to see if I can pull up something who was in it. His phone is not on airplane mode, so he can look things up in the middle of the show. We'll see. So the king of I don't know their names.

SPEAKER_03 19:55

That's also yeah, I know. Um right. Uh no, it won it won't let me uh it won't let me load anything either. Never mind, never mind. We're both we're both at a disadvantage. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 20:06

That's that's what happens when you hang out on college campuses as old men.

SPEAKER_03 20:10

And you and and like when you haven't been there in a while, and so you are aren't a student, and so you don't have access to the Wi-Fi.

SPEAKER_01 20:15

It'd be a great horror film. This is a great opening horror film, but not because we'd be the killers, because they'd kill us because we're old. We're old now.

SPEAKER_03 20:23

We can't run as fast.

SPEAKER_01 20:24

Our bones are I mean, I'm a lot older than you, but like we're still old. You got some you got some gray.

SPEAKER_03 20:31

I got I got some Earl Grey. Yeah, and I'm I'm getting it too.

unknown 20:35

I love Earl Gray.

SPEAKER_03 20:36

Um, I noticed that uh I got a few gray hairs in my man saying he's got uh gray hair red.

SPEAKER_01 20:42

That's all I see. This guy looks Irish as fuck. I do, and I do, but it's like he doesn't sound Irish, but I promise you, he looks super Irish.

SPEAKER_03 20:52

I am from I am from the Hickey. I'm from Robco.

SPEAKER_01 20:54

Yeah, and you would you would know that he looked super Irish if you would have seen the photograph that we are gonna have on the InstaSham. That's right, at Shadows That Shine. Yes, follow. Uh follow me, and then uh are you on the Instagram publicly?

SPEAKER_03 21:11

I am.

SPEAKER_01 21:12

Um what's your public profile on the InstaSham?

SPEAKER_03 21:14

Uh it's uh it's Graham Mitchell Taylor. You'll you'll find it. Uh spelled G-R-A-E-M-E.

SPEAKER_01 21:20

Mitchell Taylor. It sounds like a reference to the first movie we talked about today. It sounds very Nazi. I know Mitchell Taylor. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um I'm seeing an I a super duper Irish name and saying that sounds Nazi just to show how stupid.

SPEAKER_03 21:38

I guess so. I guess so. All right.

SPEAKER_01 21:40

Um and then ca so Casino and then the other movie that I uh you thank you for getting me on. Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_03 21:46

I'm the the main host. I am so guilty of that too.

SPEAKER_01 21:48

All right, okay, we're co hosting.

SPEAKER_03 21:49

Yeah, good.

SPEAKER_01 21:50

Okay, we're co hosting. Um I am uh I also watched a movie called The Lure. Yes, it is a Polish film from twenty fifteen. 2015. Maybe if you're musical? Yeah. It's basically a dark, twisted version of The Little Mermaid. I don't like the Disney version of Little Mermaid, so I enjoyed this. And yes, for those at home, I did get a dirty look. It was an evil glare. I thought I died for.

SPEAKER_03 22:22

As someone who has played Chef Louie twice on stage.

SPEAKER_01 22:26

Well, you know, uh, I knew uh uh Le Poisson in my past, he was allergic to water. Oh is that not the funniest thing ever? His name was the fish, his real government last name was Poisson. That's he was allergic to water. In all fairness, and in the navy, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 22:47

Yeah, make that up. You're just around water. Um you couldn't even put that in a movie, it would sound too unbelievable. Oh, ms Mr. Poisson, listen, if if it's any consolation, I mean, you know, I'll I am allergic to all seafood. Poor best. I am allergic to fish, yeah. And so um after doing uh playing Chef Louie twice, that's just that's just hilarious. I mean, yeah, I can't even go near a crab much less chop one up.

SPEAKER_01 23:13

Well, you know, nobody wants to be near crabs. Yeah, I know that's speaking of uh sexual references, the lore has a lot of them. It is uh, like I said, dark and twisted, and uh uh it's basically an allegory for a woman's coming of age and loss of innocence. Okay. So it's good. It's fucking weird, but it's good. And it's a musical. They show the there's two mermaid characters and they look kind of youngish in a way that like I don't I don't wanna know how old they are because I'm scared to know how old they are in this movie because of the things that happen in the movie. I don't wanna I could have used more uh clothes on them. Got it, got it. Uh they're the when because they're mermaids, they don't have vaginas. Right. So when they have legs, they're they're all Barbie dolls. And they take a moment to show that in the movie. Apparently, this was based on the true story of um of the two singers that scored the piece. So much like you, they're musicians who also compose. Do you mean like the um not the mermaid part? Yeah, the meta like what it allegoried into. Oh, okay. So, you know, like they were children of uh children that grew up around the entertainment business. So obviously there's a scene in there that you're like, oh, someone's taking advantage of the mermaids, and that's obviously a different type of take advantage of.

SPEAKER_03 24:48

I I I uh you were asking before we actually uh started rolling again, uh the the lure. Had I heard yes, it sounded familiar. I have not seen it.

SPEAKER_01 24:57

You're like, I now know what you mean. I know what you mean.

SPEAKER_03 24:59

Yeah, I've heard about it.

SPEAKER_01 25:00

It's on the Criterion Channel, that's what made me watch it. Okay, okay. I'm a big fan of the Criterion Channel. Yes. I did not get paid to say that.

SPEAKER_00 25:07

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 25:07

I would love them to pay me to say that because I would happily say that for money and stand by that 100%. It's a hint, it's a hint criterion. Like I'm just saying, I want to go to their closet. That's the only closet I want to be in. I know. Same. Um, it's funny because he's a person of the arts.

SPEAKER_03 25:27

I'm I'm I'm a gay, yes, I am. You couldn't tell.

SPEAKER_01 25:31

Which is gonna come in handy when you come back on the show and we talk about a classic gay cinema.

SPEAKER_03 25:37

Yes, you wanted me to come. Okay, and I and I will do that. There are there are a ton. I might, I'm already the wheels are already turning. I'm thinking I might do one that's like the top 10, like my top 10 queer movies of all time or something like that.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

Yeah, we'll and we'll we will discuss that later. But you know what we're about to discuss? Um, we're about to talk about uh a bunch of millionaires getting into a submersible and going down to the depths of Titanic.

SPEAKER_03 26:03

Um now.

SPEAKER_01 26:06

Okay, I'm I'm sorry. Okay, I'm sorry. It is the plot of the beginning of the move.

SPEAKER_03 26:12

Oh, okay. We're not talking about the recent one. And it's also that. Because, okay, look, look, look. It is terrible. It is terrible what happened.

SPEAKER_01 26:24

It is, and we're not starting the deep talk just yet. Okay. And I'm gonna I'm gonna relieve you from having to say the thing that I was thinking that I'm gonna do. You know what I'm saying? You know what I'm saying? I'm not gonna need to publicly say what everyone at home is thinking. So I'm right. And uh, so I only brought it up because as you're watching the movie that I did what rewatch today, uh, there's a part where the guy down in the submersible and he's like, There's just one inch of glass between us and instant death. And then he like says like the exact time it would take for it to implode. And I'm just over there like, it actually happened faster than that. Yeah. Fun fact, we found out, we know now. Apparently, when corruption and greed is wait a minute, what's that? A break. Oh, we're gonna take it. We'll be back because we're Shadows that shine, a movie podcast. And I'm Topher Mack. And just like that, we're back. We're back for you. It was brief moments for us, so much, so many of the seconds. It was two minutes, Thomps. Yeah, sometimes it's longer than that, sometimes it'll be like a five-minute break.

SPEAKER_03 27:34

You never know what's gonna go wrong.

SPEAKER_01 27:36

I'm sorry, I need to tinkle. You know that kind of stuff. Get some snacks. Yeah, it's gonna be a snack attack. Yeah. Speaking of uh of of my old nickname. Oh, that was never my nickname. I just wanted to be gross.

SPEAKER_03 27:51

Hey, do you hear that in the background? Oh, it's gonna be your nickname now.

SPEAKER_01 27:55

It is the sound of a train. Which means that I just joked about having to stop the podcast, and we do have to stop the podcast. We'll be back in a moment. Alright. Um, I'm growing impatient. We might stop in a moment because of uh this thing called a train. We don't know where the train is. We don't. We hear it. Oh. Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh. Nothing like silence on a podcast. Good time to remind everyone. I do this uh podcast live to tape. Yeah. That means that anyone at any moment can say the wrong thing, and there we are, sitting in it.

SPEAKER_03 28:35

Yeah. Or we could be boring. I don't know. It reminds I'm right back at college. I'm on this campus, and then I hear the train. Like you'd hear it all the time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:44

All the time. I always wanted to do a movie about a uh drifter on a train. I'm not gonna be more specific than that. I actually have way more ideas around it that are like creepy and scary as as I get out. Oh we'll talk about that off camera.

SPEAKER_03 28:58

That's already very uh intriguing. Intriguing. Yes, I would like to. Okay, anyway.

SPEAKER_01 29:06

So Titanic.

unknown 29:09

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 29:10

Let's uh let's have some words about it. See, it was a 1997 film. Specifically, it was released December 19th, 1997. Three hours and 15 minutes long. We're not even on the Titanic for like 30 or 40 minutes.

SPEAKER_03 29:29

Yep. And like James Cameron initially apparently wanted that four-hour epic, kind of like in the in the in the vein of Gone with the Wind. Yeah, but uh I'm glad he didn't go the full four-hour uh route.

SPEAKER_01 29:45

Well, a lot of the deleted stuff he says he was cutting out a lot of the factual stuff that people cared about. Yeah, like they cared about his heart of the story.

SPEAKER_03 29:54

Yeah, they cared about his characters more.

SPEAKER_01 29:56

Yeah, it was well he he said he did, and it was apparently correct in that uh one of our fun facts here is this is one of the most profitable films ever made. Uh it's also like one of the highest-grossing films ever made. And you know why? Because the director was James Cameron, yeah, the writer was James Cameron. That's right. The researcher was James Cameron. I've always known that he directed this movie, and I kind of was like, I think he had something to do with the writing, and then I'm doing the show notes, and they go, wait, he's the only writer?

SPEAKER_03 30:33

Yeah, no, he wrote this. He wrote this.

SPEAKER_01 30:35

And it turns out he's the only writer on a lot of movies that he does. Yeah. And at the very least, he's the main writer on the movies that he does. Um fun fact, you know, uh, oh, by the way, films PG 13. Yep. Uh Paramount Pictures released it, but did you know that they're not the people who greenlit the film? No, who did? 20th century Fox greenlit the film, got cold feet, called in Paramount, said, Hey buddy, can you give us about 63 million dollars? We would like to, you know, that's right, because this movie was finished.

SPEAKER_03 31:11

This movie was risky as hell to make.

SPEAKER_01 31:13

Yeah, so Paramount basically like bought the distribution rights. I think they bought the the local, like the domestic yeah, yeah, yeah. And domestically, few movies have made this much. I mean, they almost made a billion dollars domestically, yeah. And that was in 1990 money. Yeah. Uh you know, 1997. Yeah. Uh like I said, highest gross in film of its time. Yes. A budget of 200 million dollars, which was also the most expensive movie of its time when it was made. And you know, looking at this thing, uh they had to be scared that opening weekend. Scream had just come out fairly close to this. Scream to Scream 2, yeah. No, Scream 1. 97. Oh, that was two.

SPEAKER_03 32:01

96 was Scream. Sorry, okay. Never mind. Anyway.

SPEAKER_01 32:05

Yeah. Man, I'm I'm falling off over here. That's okay. No, no, you're fine. No, no, I know that I'm fine, but I'm talking about getting facts wrong, not my physical appearance.

SPEAKER_03 32:15

Oh yeah, fishing for compliments from the gays. I I did I did tell him off I when we were when we were switching around. I was about to say off camera, but we're not on camera. Um, he's not bad looking.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

I'm just saying. And then I told him, you gotta tell the straight women that because of the heterosexuality that I'm not being service.

SPEAKER_03 32:38

Like ladies, he's he's good looking, he's got nice hair. Meaning he has somebody else.

SPEAKER_01 32:44

But this is a romantic film. It is a romantic film. A girl I used to date, she said, I we're way ahead because I at some point have to say other stuff. But real quick, I was told by someone a little bit younger than me who watched this movie for the first time and turned to me and said, You just like him. Like that character is just like you. Who? Jack. This woman saw in me that, but it makes sense because I uh especially uh a few years ago, I was I was a very romantic type person, very whimsical and floating through the breeze, and now I'm a bitter old man.

SPEAKER_00 33:26

Yeah, what the hell happened?

SPEAKER_01 33:28

Uh failure happened. Aw. So here's what's crazy $28.6 million opening day. Yeah, you know you're shitting bricks with a $200 million budget that month. You're like, oh god, what are we gonna do? Now that's the domestic release, and they knew it was gonna perform okay internationally. But they were like, oh, this isn't looking good for us. Yeah, except here's the thing $674 million domestic. That's incredible. That's crazy. $1.6 billion internationally for a total of $2.3 billion to this day that it has made. That's in four or five releases.

SPEAKER_03 34:04

What they really counted on, apparently, though, was you know, it was it was released in December, but everybody went crazy for this movie at Valentine's Day, like Valentine's Day weekend.

SPEAKER_01 34:14

I mean, I don't think they would count on it, but they were hoping for it.

SPEAKER_03 34:18

Yeah, and and it and it was and it was crazy successful because everybody was taking their taking their girlfriends to see it.

SPEAKER_01 34:25

Well, part of the problem also was everyone thought this was a disaster movie. At the time, you gotta remember, a lot of like volcano and Dante's uh peak and all that kind of stuff was coming out. So they thought this was they thought this was the towering inferno of ships, you know.

SPEAKER_03 34:43

And it's James Cameron, like that's kind of what we would expect, right? I mean, well, we know he's a huge nerd. It's like you know, he was the sci-fi guy. He was the sci-fi guy, he was the action flick. I mean, true lies had come out before right before that, too. Uh, or 995, I think.

SPEAKER_01 34:59

Uh yeah, I believe that was the movie before this. Uh he had given us Terminator and what is it, Aliens 2? Yeah, and uh The Abyss. The Abyss. The Abyss is actually the reason we got this movie. I'm getting ahead of myself. It is, yes, yeah. Okay, yeah. Um, I have just a few more little fun facts here. Uh, I mean, not fun, but they're facts, and I like them and care about them. Yeah. Fifth highest gross grossing film adjusted for inflation of all time. Yeah. But it's also currently the fifth highest grossing cinema release of all time. Isn't that weird? Because that's that's not normally the case. They're so close together. Now, it should actually um people who've been listening to podcasts know that I uh I'm very fond of excluding Chinese cinema from this tally because we don't know how accurate the numbers we're getting from China box offices. So that would actually make it the fourth highest gross thing if you exclude this year's release of Ne Jahatu. I admit I have to. That's what it says written down. There you go, buddy. Uh Nija Tu, I guess. Okay. Naija 2. Uh it has made $2 billion this year only in China. Sounds odd, right? Possible, theoretically possible, but odd, right?

SPEAKER_03 36:15

Maybe if you don't have anything else to watch.

SPEAKER_01 36:17

I I don't know, man. I just think it's a sketchy number, and I don't um I I like Chinese culture a lot. Like, I'm not trying to be that guy, but I would I would want to be Titanic as well. I I get it. Yeah, that's what it is. Hey, it's did you know also three of the top five uh highest gross films of all time are directed by James Cameron? Yep. Avatar and Avatar Avatar and Titanic. Yeah, yeah. Got it. Uh Titanic, uh, as I mentioned before, struck the iceberg at 11:40 p.m. 220. It uh it went below down, yeah. And um I'm not gonna make that joke because I'm I'm gonna pretend to be tasteful. We'll do it later. That's what she said. Yeah, but as we learned earlier, not to me. Yeah. Don't hurt me. Alright, so now we're now we're just talking. It's Titanic, it's 1997. You're like three, and uh, I'm not because I'm in the movie theater watching this.

SPEAKER_03 37:18

Yeah, I I remember I do remember it was a big deal when it came out because my mom and dad were talking about it. Everybody was talking about it. I I was not exposed to Titanic until we got it on VHS a year later.

SPEAKER_01 37:33

Now, VHS, for those of you not old enough to remember, oh my god, is how we used to watch movies and it needed two cassettes. There were two players, and it stopped at a very interesting moment.

SPEAKER_03 37:44

I still, yeah. And the thing is, okay, if you watch this movie on VHS, and but then now we have it on Blu-ray or we watch it in high def and it's all in one part, right? You still you I still can't see. It's like every time that part comes up in the movie, like where the first move video comes up. You feel the first tape, yeah. The first tape cut off. I'm like, I think I have a cut off.

SPEAKER_01 38:04

They have a DVD version of it that cuts just like that, and you have to switch the disc. I do too. I and I'm I'm amazed. What that's just such a long movie, and he he was like, I'm not sacrificing pictures just to fit it in. So they can here's a nice little spot to break it at.

SPEAKER_03 38:20

And then I finally got it on Blu-ray, and I was like, it better be in one part, and it was, and it was, and it's great, and it looks fantastic, and it's got great behind-the-scenes stuff.

SPEAKER_01 38:29

He he gave an entire full-length, well-made documentary to go with it. And like all new about Titanic.

SPEAKER_03 38:36

And like all new commentary.

SPEAKER_01 38:37

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_03 38:38

Like commentary, commentary tracks. I w I do I do listen to those.

SPEAKER_01 38:41

There was a film that's saying, so here's here's the thing. I remember one of the very first movies I ever saw in the movie theater was Titanic. I was about ten when I saw this. Um might have been getting close, you know, I was like 10, 10 and a half. Yeah. And I I have the distinct memory of someone yelling at the scream, Jack Frost, at a tasteless moment. By the way, spoilers, if you haven't seen this movie. Oh, if you haven't uh yes. I probably should have said spoilers. Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 39:16

Spoilers, spoilers, spoilers, spoilers, 12 times. Okay, now now that we're there.

SPEAKER_01 39:20

But instead, I thought I I would go the route of um Yeah, Jack dies at the end. Sorry.

SPEAKER_03 39:25

Like he freezes.

SPEAKER_01 39:27

You heard about uh Barry. Barry show creator's name is uh Saturday Live actor. Bill Hader. You heard about Bill Hader getting fired because of Titanic. Yes, because he kept spoiling the ending. Yeah. No, not kept. There were these people being rude to him. It was one group. It was just one person. No, it was a whole group. And as they're walking in, he's like, uh, enjoy the movie, Jack Dies in the end. Enjoy the movie, Jack dies in the end. Enjoy the movie, Jack dies in the end.

SPEAKER_03 39:54

Oh, that's right.

SPEAKER_01 39:55

And he was like, ah, you know I'm gonna have to fire you, right?

SPEAKER_03 39:59

Such an asshole, but like I love that dude. To the point where it doesn't matter. It I love Bill Hater too, but like, oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 40:05

I have this list of entertainment people that to me are the top of the industry and top of our generations. That's great. Like my generation and the bridging like over under of it. So to me, my my creative heroes, he's on that list.

SPEAKER_00 40:23

Oh.

SPEAKER_01 40:24

Along with uh Charge Gambino, aka Donald Glover. Glover, yeah. And probably the top of that list is Bo Burnham.

SPEAKER_03 40:31

He's brilliant.

SPEAKER_01 40:32

I think eighth grade is better than Citizen Kane.

SPEAKER_03 40:35

His whole Okay. Yeah. And then what what was the what was the And equally innovative? What was the thing that he's not equally innovative? What was the name of the thing that he released during COVID? Uh Inside is brilliant. That was great. It's one of the best things to like ever be made. And and like, oh, and that also reminds us that like part comedy special, part movie. And and like and and part part musical, like it's a review, it's its own um new thing. It reminded me also that like Bo Burnham, like, oh yeah, he actually is a songwriter, like he actually writes good music.

SPEAKER_01 41:07

Well, because we had never heard good music from him, uh we had heard comedy, like and and not to say unless you had heard Art is Dead, and that is a pretty good song. Yeah. Um but uh anyway, so yeah.

SPEAKER_03 41:21

So Bill Hader got in Bill Pader got in trouble for spoiling Titanic to hundreds of movie patrons. That's great.

SPEAKER_01 41:28

Sorry. Um yeah, you know, I forgot that we have wireless mics and I can stand up. Yeah, that's right. So I have the fat poking me because uh I switched to belts. I'd I'd been a suspender boy for a while. And uh I remember the reason why we're getting into all the Titanic facts here. Yeah, the reason why I quit uh wearing belts is because the thing pokes me in the back.

SPEAKER_03 41:49

They dig into your gut, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:51

I was just doing that, and I'm like, I'm too fat for this.

SPEAKER_03 41:54

You gotta stand up. Uh like at like at the end of the night when you're driving home after like a night out of doing something, and then you have the first thing you do is unbuckle the belt in the car.

SPEAKER_01 42:03

Yeah, except I don't have a belt buckle, I have uh one of those like strappy ones. Oh, yeah. So I I just have to there's way more work to undoing.

SPEAKER_03 42:11

Right. Okay, so we go from belts to boats. Yes. I mean ships, whatever. Boats and hoes, boats and hoes.

SPEAKER_01 42:17

Yeah. Um, look, hey, this movie is brilliant. It's really, really good. And I've been kind of consuming some things around the movie lately because I wanted to be able to bring something to this conversation. It always comes back around around this time, you know. Well, that's why I chose this. Uh, we actually did a vote for the first time on my Instagram. Not my Instagram, but well, actually, I shared it on my Instagram. Right. But on um the Shadows That Shine Instagram, we were like, hey guys, what should we do? It's tax day and Titanic Day. So which one are we gonna choose? And I just knew they were gonna pick Brewster's Millions, and here we are talking about Titanic. That's how impactful that movie is.

SPEAKER_03 42:59

That's exactly how impactful. Everybody like it's everybody.

SPEAKER_01 43:03

Also Boo, because Brewster's Million is a genius, yeah, fantastic fun.

SPEAKER_03 43:06

Yeah, but like this is a movie that everybody should see. It's surprising when people haven't seen this movie.

SPEAKER_01 43:15

Well, I mean, not only that, but it's also I mean, I it's easy for you to say that, but I've never seen any of the Avatar movies. Okay, and they're the highest grossing films of all time. So I it's plausible to me that you haven't seen it, but to your point, everyone should see it because it's the very rare time where artistic integrity and pop culture pulp can come together with brilliance. Yeah, and it's not nasty and edgy and mean like a Tarantino film, which often does that same thing. Yeah, instead, this is beautiful and sweet and makes you appro uh I think it can make you appreciate life. Oh, yeah. I don't know if I I've ever made it through this movie that I've seen at least 30 times. Yeah. I don't think I've ever made it through the scene and the with the captain without crying. Oh. At least a little tear, if not a full-on ugly card.

SPEAKER_03 44:16

The ugly cry, the full on ugly cry.

SPEAKER_00 44:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 44:19

Yeah. I I've definitely cried quite a few times for this movie. Um I because it's a brilliant movie. It's it's great. Like it's it's what it's one of those movies, at least for me, where I watch it just to cry sometimes. But but not necessarily but but also the fact that it's good because I have other movies that are just to cry. Like E.T. is one of those movies where do I feel like crying like a little bitch by the end of the movie? Um that's why I don't watch that one that often.

SPEAKER_01 44:47

Schindler's List movie.

SPEAKER_03 44:50

That's that is a yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:52

I like to the way I like to get out of depression is to push myself deeper into it, and so much so that you just don't have enough energy to be depressed anymore. So then you have to be the opposite. You have that you have to go up for that. And Schindler's list is that one.

SPEAKER_03 45:06

Right. The difference with this one though is that Titanic also has a lot of feel-good moments. I think there's hope to it.

SPEAKER_01 45:12

Like there is here's the thing at the end of the day, I didn't have this thought until today. You had sent me a video essay by Lindsay Ellis. By Lindsay Ellis, and I watched that, and then I watched some other interviews, and then I watched, I was watching the movie. Yeah. And when you pieced all these things I had seen together together, I finally realized it's a fucking like the Jack character is a metaphor for the type of like the sacrifice that he makes is the same sacrifice that the real men and uh made to put those women and them kids on that lifeboat. It was literally, I know I'm going to die, but I believe you need to live and through you appreciate that and make the world better because you're here. Because I think the world will be better with you than better with me.

SPEAKER_03 46:03

Yeah, there's that there's that shot also where they're still adjusting, trying to get onto the door, the floaty thing at the end. It's not a door, it's like a panel or something, but like the thing that they're floating on, and there's a shot of Jack where he's he's looking and he's addressing the situation, and he just kind of nods. He gets like a little nod, and that's that moment where he where he's like, I'm gonna die, but at least she's gonna live. Like we're like we're okay.

SPEAKER_01 46:27

Like, like yeah, that is the exact same thing as the moment where Guggenheim is sitting down with a brandy and saying, I you know, I'm gonna go down as gentlemen. I I lived as a gentleman, I'm gonna die as a gentleman. That's what you were closer to what he actually said than that.

SPEAKER_03 46:43

I also cheated on my wife and brought the side piece on the ship.

SPEAKER_01 46:47

And what are you gonna do? Yeah. Men are not always great, but it was a different time. And that day, they did the right thing at the end of the day. They did, he did.

unknown 46:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:56

Um, it's wild to me. Uh you did just mention one of the most controversial things about the entire uh this is a good time to mind, everyone. We are outside in a college town, so you are gonna get the occasional obnoxious motorcyclist or car.

SPEAKER_03 47:13

Or car. Yes, the car the trucks can be obnoxious around here.

SPEAKER_01 47:17

Anyway, but we're right here in this moment. Everybody likes to bitch about the stupidest stuff, i.e. the fucking door.

SPEAKER_03 47:27

I'm sorry, but they show you they both try to get on it and almost flips over. She screams at everything. Yes, like they show you you can't do it.

SPEAKER_01 47:38

Yeah. They on the day of the set tried to do it and couldn't do it. They specifically know that you can't do it, and everyone's like, both of them could have fit on it.

SPEAKER_03 47:48

It's like, you know, she's literally floating like in real life, like on set.

SPEAKER_01 47:53

Yeah, you know, and then some smart ass might go further and say, oh, well, like uh they could have taken turns. No, because then they'd have both died. Yeah. Because that's he's getting her out of the hypothermic water. The the real number of death, it took between two and 45 minutes for those people to die. Yeah. Depending on the person, depending on their situation, a handful of people lived. Like the baker, who's the guy who's drinking as it goes down. That was a real person.

SPEAKER_03 48:20

That was a real person, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:22

Uh, in on the ship, and he drunk an entire bottle of liquor, and that warmed his body up enough that he just barely got out of the uh water alive.

SPEAKER_03 48:31

But here's the thing that's the story he told people.

SPEAKER_01 48:35

That's the story he told people. Alcohol actually kills you faster.

SPEAKER_03 48:39

Well, it didn't that night. It brings on, it actually brings on. So I'm saying his story might have been a bit embarrassed. We don't know. He didn't know about the science of hypothermia, which by the way, by the way. Honestly, though, he could have been like, you don't know.

SPEAKER_01 48:55

Like he defin if you knew you were about to die, would you not have drank a whole fucking bottle of liquor?

SPEAKER_03 49:00

Well, the thing was, it was 1912. You're 1912. Yeah, totally. And we didn't know about the effects of hypothermia, but in fun fact, do you know how we found out about the effects of hypothermia?

SPEAKER_01 49:10

If you say Titanic. No, Nazis. I did not see that coming. This podcast has gone full.

SPEAKER_03 49:18

Yeah, it's unfortunate.

SPEAKER_01 49:20

You know, I think this is a good time to remind you the official stance of this podcast is that Nazis are bad.

SPEAKER_03 49:26

No, Nazis are bad. Not all Nazis are bad. Yes. I am uh well, I am te I am technically a Jew. Yeah. Hello, motherfucker. Yes. I had to follow it up with some effects of it. Yeah, exactly. Happy Passover. We had a good one. Um, but I think I'll pass that one over. Yeah. But the point being, though, that we the point being over. Yeah. So we did find out about the effects of hypothermia from Nazi medical experiments. That's a fine.

SPEAKER_01 49:52

All of that can be true, but the reality is he was drunk and he survived. I'm over here hypothesizing he was drunk and that's why he survived. You're over here saying science says that's impossible. All I know is he was drunk when he got picked up. He had drunk a whole bottle of he was wasted.

SPEAKER_03 50:08

We know that for a fact.

SPEAKER_01 50:09

So something happened.

SPEAKER_03 50:10

That's also a fact, yes. Maybe, and again, you know what? When I'm drunk, I embellish some stories too. So, well, anyway. He was in the water. He did survive. He was one of the he was one of the few people that.

SPEAKER_01 50:21

He rode the ship down like an elder.

SPEAKER_03 50:23

He did, he did. He they we do know for a fact though that he was pulled from the water. So he did survive the water.

SPEAKER_01 50:28

There you go.

SPEAKER_03 50:29

That is true.

SPEAKER_01 50:30

All right. Yes, he did. Take the fuck take that science. Speaking of take that science, they scientifically proved that the fucking door thing would have played out where Jack could not have been on the door with it.

SPEAKER_03 50:44

I heard one take on it.

SPEAKER_01 50:45

There's also a deleted scene where Jack is having to scare people off who are trying to crowd the door that she's on. Yes, because yeah, and it is a cringy scene, and it's a good thing.

SPEAKER_03 50:56

It is, I'm glad. There they did make a joke about it in uh Thumb Tanic, if you're familiar with that, where I do not know by uh Steve Oda Kirk, I think his name is Steve Oda Kirk, he was the guy who created Jimmy Neutron, but um they did a parody of Titanic that where all the characters are played by thumbs with faces on them. Okay and uh at one point uh the Jack character is like, let's head for that door that nobody seems to see. And so uh they make that joke. So the thing is, James Cameron did at least think that through. That like people would be like, How come nobody sees this thing that they're floating on? But it but it's good that it's good that he took that scene out because yes, it is very cringy.

SPEAKER_01 51:33

I'm glad you said this way because yeah, I'm realizing watching it today, yeah, as I'm thinking about it with my shadows that shine lens on my head. Yes, I'm like this movie is very similar to uh to Hot Fuzz because he's setting everything up in the beginning. Everything has a payoff to it. Like you're over here and you're first of all he he gives this is not a hot fuzz thing, but like showing the technical here's what we know happened gives you a reference point all the way through. Because if you're just sitting there watching the ship uh breaks in half, then you're over there going, Oh yeah, I'm sure it fucking broke in half.

SPEAKER_03 52:18

Except that's what really happened. It tells you right from the beginning.

SPEAKER_01 52:21

By telling you in the beginning, you already have gone, okay, scientifically, this is what happened. Yes. But then on top of that, uh they're the people that are telling a story are telling it cold and disconnected the same way that all of us would have told it. We're not thinking about the humanity of this, we're not thinking about people fucking died, a lot of people. Like I went to school with the same amount of people that were on that ship. Yeah, and less than my graduating class survived. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 52:53

But yeah, I yeah, he he he definitely and also it it's it it's just a good uh writing technique because again, if if you want to draw attention away from the fact that like like if you want him to focus on the characters that we're supposed to be focusing on, we can't have a big surprise in the middle, like, oh, and it's split in half? Really?

SPEAKER_01 53:12

Okay, yeah, and then and then to the payoff point, they show you how the ship works when when they're you know, you're sitting there watching it and it does it serves two things. It shows you the opulence of the ship, it shows you the mechanics of the ship, he wants you to care about the ship, like how amazing it was. But they're they're doing all the stuff to get the engine started and you're seeing everything that goes into it, and the reason for it is because there's gonna be the tension after it strikes, or right before it strikes, and then it strikes.

SPEAKER_03 53:40

Because they're the first people to get be really in danger when it has the iceberg.

SPEAKER_01 53:44

People don't realize how great the writing of this film is because you're thinking of it as oh, it's just this cheesy little love story between these two people, and it would never happen like that. And you're over there being distracted by that shit. Well, he's laying out a reason for you to care about something. But I mean, I would be willing to bet that one of there's two reasons why Titanic uh has stayed with culture this long. One is finding the ship in the uh late 80s, yeah. Uh late 80s, early 90s. Uh, I can't remember the name of the guy, but I used to have all that kind of stuff memorized. Oh, um and and then this movie. And the reason this movie has more effectively made so many people care and be aware is because he did a great job of using everything that great film does, all of the all the tricks and trades of things you can do to make you care both about the characters and the ship. They both become sort of a in a weird way, like a metaphor, because Jack dying is also in a lot of ways uh innocence and romance dying. Because when you experience a traumatic event like that, all the things that make up Jack's character is all the things that you would be losing and have to find again. And he's over there. That's why that whole speech about I you gotta promise me that you're not gonna lose the spark. And all that ties into the whole uh thing with the relationship, anyways, in that love triangle. Where she's over there, like, I just want to like not drown in this hardship that I'm in, of this ex I'm expected to be these things, and I'm expected to participate in the uh the society around me. She decides on the other thing. And I'm drowning in it.

SPEAKER_03 55:38

I will not die this way. Yeah, and I mean, and like that is presented in more ways than what.

SPEAKER_01 55:44

Yeah, and he literally presents that to her, but it's also this like whole metaphorical thing.

SPEAKER_03 55:48

Yeah, it's it's a beautiful essay in that regard. Yeah, because I I I I think one of the most like uh interesting things, I I think another thing that also made it made it stick with us is just the fact that like what would you do in that situation? That's constantly what I would think in that situation. Would I survive? I don't know. I'm technically a middle class person. I mean, with how much money I have right now, I would definitely I would definitely steerage for it. I would definitely be sitting in steerage, at least nowadays.

SPEAKER_01 56:22

Oh no. I'm old enough now to think she's hot when I was young. I was like, she's a silly looking woman, and like now I'm at that age where I'm like, she's kind of hot, right? Right. Like, like she can get it.

SPEAKER_03 56:34

Like I I am actress, I mean uh yeah, I uh what would be my equivalent? I'm definitely turned on by like the um the You like the Irish dude.

SPEAKER_01 56:46

Tommy, no, no, you would be you would be good enough to have bots fly out of here.

SPEAKER_03 56:51

Yeah, uh no, no. Um maybe Fabrizio, but that's that's a that's you're a Fabrizio guy? No, here no. Here's look like look at like look at my resume. No, I am the concertmaster guy. The guy who's leading the band. It's been a privilege playing with you tonight. Like a privilege payuto. That would be the guy that I would realistically end up with.

SPEAKER_01 57:13

Yeah. I love like the subtle nods of the history in there, like the um the uh the uh the the most code guys. Yeah, you can see him on one of the boats as as they're going out because that's how he survived on a flipped over boat. And like they have so many, like it's Easter egg heavy. The more you know about Titanic, the more you see everything's there.

SPEAKER_03 57:40

You catch something new every time, but I think part of that is just because there's so many, even if you just notice the one thing that that extra is doing in the background, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:48

And everybody was doing something. Like, what is that guy doing? You know, to pull back the the scenes a little bit, yes, this is a real scaled down version of the ship. But it's like almost almost full size, and it's it's just the half of the ship, not the whole thing.

SPEAKER_03 58:08

Yeah, like it's it's it's it's scaled down and and they built it, but they built it like yeah, yeah. They built it.

SPEAKER_01 58:15

They built it into this like area so they'd have a lot of control over it, and then they hire a whole bunch of actors and special effects people and get this lifeguard, yeah, and everyone's got wetsuits underneath oops, sorry about that. Everyone's got wetsuits underneath their fancy clothes so that they could stay comfortable and uh the technical stuff of this movie. I mean, the opening shots, you're over there like that's pretty cool. They got all this stuff on a sound stage. They shot they shot the actual Titanic for this movie. They all the fucking like going into the ship stuff, that's real footage.

SPEAKER_03 58:58

Yeah, there were some things there where they did use miniature.

SPEAKER_01 59:03

The boat shot is obviously not from the Titanic.

SPEAKER_03 59:06

But see, that's what makes it good because here's one thing I will say the 90s was about combining realism with CGI. That's why, that's why the effects still hold up. Um, not now.

SPEAKER_01 59:21

Like it does mix up. Oh shit. Are we are we in the wet zone? I don't think so. There's sprinklers. This ground is not wet, and we're about to find out if we're getting wet and not in the fun way.

SPEAKER_03 59:32

Don't worry though, you'll get us, you'll you'll get your studio at someday. Um, where was I? Oh, okay, so so the thing was we so Turfy, you and I were having that discussion last night about um the CGI in the movie. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Thank you for bringing that up. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:49

It's wild how it mostly holds up. It's 1997 that holds mostly holds up. Yeah, it's a little there's a few shots as I was watching a yeah, I is even more aware of it at this point. And this is bad placement. Bad placement! Bad placement! Here, let's go stand over here because we're still recording.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:12

Uh why did they put a table there then?

SPEAKER_01 1:00:14

I don't know. That was not well thought out. We're walking. Luckily, we're getting close to the end, but we're gonna we're gonna finish up here. We're at the actually we're at old main, the the We're at Old Main, yes. I used to be um I used to be the the radio's we had a radio here. It was the voice, I remember. I was the voice. You're listening to WNCP Radio, the hawk. And then I'd make the hawk noise. But I can't do that anymore because cigars are bad for you. Oh, um, okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:44

So the special effects, yes. Yes, the so what was great is that um it and this is just great, like having a filmmaker nerd mixed with a history nerd, mixed with a uh, you know, uh high-tech nerd. Like he he really put uh James Cameron really put every bit of his expertise into this. Yeah, um, so the point was he was very nitpicky about his scale models, about you know, like when the ship splits in half. There's not a lot of scale. No, they didn't do a scale.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:15

Well, what I'm saying is when they did though, no, no, they didn't do scale ships. It was either the actual fucking thing that they filmed on. I just mean okay.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:24

I mean you're not talking about miniatures, you're talking about I'm talking about during the action sequence, the parts where that like during the during the the splitting scene, for example, that like that was practical. Yeah, they did that.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:35

A lot more of it's practical than you think. Yeah, like that's what I'm saying. I then built those things you can definitely see anytime they're doing like shots of the ship during the day, you can see, oh, oh, that's just barely like I'll buy it. My suspensions of disbelief will take this moment right and accept it, but you can visually see this movie is right, right, right.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:02

It ended up being really good, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:03

Uh yeah, and and for where it's at, it was very advanced. And for where we are now, it's like what they've been doing at Marvel lately. Not good enough, not good enough. No. Um but it really uh some of it you don't see because they did such a good job with CGI in some of the moments, you don't see that it's there. Yeah, it's not noticeable at all. But those day shots, very obvious. Like you we both mentioned how much we hate. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:30

If you look really, really closely, like for example, during the daytime scenes, like when uh Jack and Rose are getting to know each other uh the the night after they first meet, or the day after they first meet. If you look closely, it's like you have to really look, but like the the ocean uh across from them looks kind of fake.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:51

Like see, I didn't even notice that. I thought you were gonna bring up the shot of uh the first the panning shot, the first officer coming back over and he's walking and they like exaggerated the water.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:03

There's one shot, there's one shot where uh Captain Smith is standing on front and then Murdoch walks out, and it's the part right before he says where he says, take her to see, Mr. Murdoch. Let's stretch her leg.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:13

Take her to see, Mr.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:14

Yeah. Um, the shot right before that where Murdoch first walks out looks so fake in HD. Oh my god. Those the that my it I'm like I said, the first time I've I finally have like a high refresh rate uh 4K television that's like gigantic now because I happen to have money that one time. And now you watch it.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:35

You can see now and you're like, oh that's oh, that doesn't look like that's not like there was like video game graphics at this point, but it was so advanced for the time, and it still is just good enough that it doesn't take you all the way out, it takes you a tiny bit out, but not all the way out.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:50

You don't like as a cat if you're like a casual film goer, you will not notice that.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:54

Well shit. What's crazy is like I didn't notice it until recently because that it was so good that like things had to get beyond a certain point for you to go, oh, that is fake, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 1:04:07

I thought they did it with like the real ship. And now that we understand how that stuff is made, especially watching those interviews, you know, with James Cameron that you were talking about, or listening to the commentary tracks, it's like, yeah, now that you understand how that's made, it's like, oh yeah, that is fake, but that's pretty damn good for fake. It's good fake. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:23

So um, you know, we could talk for hours and hours.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:26

There's no way to talk about enough stuff.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:29

It's a large movie, it's a large movie, and a large topic.

SPEAKER_03 1:04:33

We could have talked about how uh James Cameron is a dick to work for, or the fact that, or the fact that his whole uh cast and crew could have potentially uh gotten poisoned because they all were spike with LSD exactly in clam chowder, and we could have um uh talked about there was almost a big rift between Kate Winslit and James Cameron that doesn't exist.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:55

We could talk about the fact that Kate Winslit and Leonard DiCaprio still deeply love each other as human beings, yeah. Um not in a romantic way, but in all the other ways that uh almost are more powerful.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:07

When they when they both won their respective Oscars, like we live for watching their reactions to the other one winning.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:14

And and we can talk about all that, but you know what? The thing is, is that we're not gonna keep you here forever. I know.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:19

We still have it's further proof that time flies when you're having fun because there's still so much. I can't believe what's right. What you're saying is you're happy. You're you're this went well, you're gay. I'm very I'm very gay. I'm very gay, yes. I'm happy, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:34

This movie makes me happy.

SPEAKER_03 1:05:37

I mean, this this movie makes me very happy. It is a very good movie.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:41

It's a very good movie, and so good. It hits me both in nostalgia and in film nerd areas. So we're gonna wrap up our deep dive here. There is a little bit more to this podcast. There's just a little bit more. I want to talk about coming attractions. Yes. Uh, but we're gonna do that after the train comes. comes through. I have uh again, this is Graham Mitchell Taylor. Thank you. Graham Mitchell Taylor. It's been a while. And I am Topher Mac, clearly the most professional host ever. You're very professional. Don't worry. You're fine. And uh you're listening to Shadows That Shine, a movie podcast. Alright, so we're over here chatting away, waiting to get to this little like final moment. And we're gonna have this non-movie conversation real briefly right now. We're talking about how gay used to mean colorful or sparkly beautiful. And the example he used was Christmas tree.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:45

Yeah yeah I said a Christmas tree yeah yeah yeah and I was like well that did that does sound pretty gay or every level it is very gay I don't every level yeah yeah look look on my Instagram you'll see my Christmas tree from this past Christmas but and but anyway we were talking about like the the how the aesthetic and search on YouTube any you know and you'll you'll find plenty of videos about it but the fact that like color is disappearing from interior design.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:07

And when you said that I got confused because I'm over here like what the fuck are you talking about?

SPEAKER_03 1:07:12

And what you're talking about is how they're sterilizing interior design so everything feels like a fucking hospital uh now that was my words at least the fact that like Pantone released their color of the year and it was white ew there's there like I said tons of videos but you mentioned the bojangles my uh my well I mentioned the bojangles off the air so everyone else I walked into a new bojangles recently bojangles the representation of of southern warmth and comfort right but still on a fast food environment it feels like a wendy's in a in a hospital yeah my my and then like and then I'll give my defining moment and then I'll let you get to the yeah so that my defining moment though of like the aesthetic disappearing is because Pizza Hut, right? Their entire websites dedicated to Pizza Huts decorated the way they were in the 90s basically oh I missed that I remember that you remember that okay so anyway so in Lorenberg North Carolina uh Pizza Hut our local one closed for a while but then they reopened it a few miles away is it one of those delivery only ones now yeah and it and the thing was it was a it's a black box with a Pizza Hut logo.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:21

It's a black box and I was like I had that happen in LA what exactly so I'm like what happened please guys don't let please decorate your houses colorfully don't follow the trends because trends are like please put color into your life there needs to be color hey what's up Shawnee um um but but really though like make things colorful all right anyway movies movies we're at the coming attractions yes uh that is not a reference to porn we're talking about movies coming to the movie theater uh this week if you're listening to this as it's coming out that means Thursday will be the preview nights for these movies and Friday is the official release there are two movies worth talking about yes um I'm a big horror film fan and this Lee pornens The Mummy looks fucking weird.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:15

I think it might be good I have heard people saying that it like it is a weird fucked up movie.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:22

That's I mean you know that I'm biting at that that's what I need it sounds good. I want to see it like yeah on the exact opposite end of the world a Lorne Michaels documentary Lorne the creator of Saturday Night Live a documentary about this very private man is gonna come out and this is after Saturday night came out a few months ago and holy shit that was a good movie if you have not seen Saturday night you need to get on that that is that jumped into my I keep a list of my favorite film because it changes periodically and it is in the list because I it's like in the order that they're my favorites. That's a big deal I keep the yeah especially and it was especially a new release like yeah I I watched the movie two nights in a row I would have watched it three but I ran out of money.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:09

And um the end of most of most ventures nowadays it's because I ran out of money.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:15

And uh so that's where we're at and uh you know I gotta tell you uh Mr. Graham Norton sir Graham Taylor I appreciate you making time I appreciate you driving such a long way to come and sit down. I look forward to when we get to cover some topics we've talked off uh off the air about I definitely want I definitely want to come back this was fun thank you for coming and and and you co-hosted it because I don't have guests I have co-hosts I'll have guests if I'm interviewing somebody but this this is not interviews eventually you I think you've made it when you have the guy who brings you donuts I want donuts there's no fucking donuts oh see you ruined my night I ran up as a tragedy I read about it sinking of a billion dollar ship yeah yeah I hope y'all liked Titanic I hope you liked this episode Shadows that shine a movie podcast I'm Topher Mac this is Graham Mitchell Taylor he got it he got it he's a slasher and I am an entertainer a stand-up comic and a um soon to be filmmaker uh ladies and gentlemen I mean I guess technically I've made movies before and you're and you're a podcaster I'm a podcaster and I will I'll be back next week I don't know about this guy but I'll be back next week and you guys subscribe to the things and the stuff and the such I appreciate you why are you still listening this is the part where it ends by