Hope Center Indy Podcast

Chris Mescall: A Legacy to Heidi and A Community To Belong To

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Welcome to the Hope Center Indy Podcast. When tragedy strikes, community reveals its true character. Chris Mescall knows this better than most. Chris and his late wife Heidi have been pillars of Hope Center Indy for years serving, building relationships, and helping create a community with Jesus Christ at the center. When Heidi passed away, that same community surrounded Chris with the love and support they had both poured out for so long. Today, Chris shares his heart about Heidi’s legacy, the power of Christ-centered community, and why he continues to serve even in grief. As a firefighter, veteran, and longtime advocate for domestic abuse survivors, Chris understands what it means to show up for people in their darkest moments. This is Chris’s story and honoring Heidi’s legacy.

SPEAKER_04

Welcome to the Hope Center Indie Podcast. When tragedy strikes, community reveals its true character. Chris Meskow knows this better than most. Chris and his late wife Heidi have been pillars of Hope Center Indy for years, serving survivors, building relationships, and helping create a community with Jesus Christ at the center. When Heidi passed away, that same community surrounded Chris with the love and support they had both poured out for so long. Today, Chris shares his heart about Heidi's legacy, the power of Christ-centered community, and why he continues to serve even in grief. As a firefighter, veteran, and long-term advocate for domestic abuse survivors, Chris understands what it means to show up for people in their darkest moments. This is Chris's story and Heidi's legacy. This is technically our second long conversation. We had a long conversation before we even pushed play. What a blessing it is to get to know you. And we started actually volunteering and serving at the Hope Center around the same time.

SPEAKER_00

Nice.

SPEAKER_04

And our path had crossed a bit, but we you know it's it's beautiful to see the opportunity that we have here. What how many years later to get to know each other and to share what Christ is doing in our lives and what Christ is doing for the Hope Center.

SPEAKER_00

Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_04

Right. So having that opportunity for people to get a feel for who you are, one individual that that volunteers, that serves in in a number of different capacities, that have seen a wide range of of all the different steps and work that's gone into the Hope Center. And to be able to share those stories. Right. And then also be able to share how we've witnessed Christ in so many different ways. I'm delighted to have the opportunity to talk with you today.

SPEAKER_00

I agree, brother. It's a blessing for me. The hard thing is, is all that you're mentioning, it's uh yeah, you can't put all that together in like 30 minutes.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, we're gonna we're gonna do our best, aren't we? Let's do this then. Share the period of your life where you first became aware of the Hope Center and you started to volunteer and help.

SPEAKER_00

I went to a uh a township merge just at the right time, and I'm working overtime, and I go out to one of the new firehouses that merged in with the Indianapolis Fire Department, and there's this guy who uh knew Pastor Nolan. And I was telling my story. He told me his story, how he became a Christian, we're fellowshipping. I don't know if he knew him very well or not, where he was at, but he's like, oh, he's retired, and he's doing the same thing you're doing. He says, You need to go find him, hook it up. I'm telling you. And I'm like, okay, whatever. A few weeks go by, and all of a sudden I just keep getting this weighing on my heart that I need to go find this guy. And then I start getting like visions of where he might be. I mean, kind of like thoughts. Because he did tell me, he goes, Well, I believe he's got a building with his son next to a bull diamond. All right, well, Lord's not. It'd be nice if you just speak it audibly so I could go figure this out. But he doesn't, but you know, not all the time. I need an address, please. Right. So I remember there's a building next to off Post Road, it dead end somewhere, heading out to uh Franklin Township. I go there and empty building, nobody can't find it. Look around the morning, I'm just giving up. In comes aka Gunny, best friend since second grade, one of the foundation Christians in my life, uh, who just continuously love me no matter what, calls me, says, Hey, the Lord just wait tomorrow. We need to have dinner gunning now. We haven't seen each other for a year. It's one of those relationships where time goes by, but the moment you're together. And our thing was we love Skyline Chili. He was a fraternity brother too, before I went in the Marine Corps. So we meet, we sit down, and the first thing comes in and says, Hey, tomorrow I'm going to this work party to help out, Pastor. No, I said, Stop. Wow. I'm trying to find this guy. And I tell him why. And he goes, Oh, well, tomorrow we're going there for a work party to help out in this building to do some cleaning. You want to go? Yes. Yes. But you never know what the Lord's going to do in your life because in this moment, because it's not, I don't understand this moment I'm getting ready to tell you about until a year later after my wife goes to heaven. I'm on the way, I'm driving, I'm excited, and I'm like, oh man, this is gonna be huge. Big. And I said, but Lord, I'll I'm gonna do anything. I don't want to paint. I wouldn't do any painting. So my dad's a fireman. Firemen didn't make great money back in the day, neither did police officers. And so they all had part-time business. Well, his was painting and carpet laying. And all the children had to learn to work at age 11. And so I've been working that since age 11. Even when I was at the firehouse working all day with him and all that, I'm done with painting. So we get there and everybody's just moving stuff around, clean it, and then Pastor Nolan comes by and Gunny goes, Hey, Pastor, he says, uh, why don't you meet Chris? And I said, and this is what the Holy Spirit told me when I went over there. Their voices are different, is uh at least to me. He says, I want you to go serve and learn. That's all he said. Just want you to go serve and learn. So I get there and I he comes up and I said, Hey, uh, he said, introduced himself and I said, I'm Christopher, and uh the Holy Spirit told me to come serve and learn. He had his little smile cracky, he smiled and he goes, I can believe that. Walks away. Thirty minutes later, we're working he comes back and he goes, Hey, by the way, do you know how to paint? My head dropped. Like, I didn't know. Oh, my heart was broken. Because we spend the next two and a half years, all he did was paint. And he told me, You can paint till God calls you home. This building's so big. But what the Lord showed me a year later after my wife went home was is to love God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength. And the one thing he needed there was my strength, my skill, because he needed this place painted. Because Dave and Pastor were already working on painting the offices. And so I said, Yes, absolutely, I know how to do that. He says, Good, you can start with that room. But he didn't understand my time schedule as a fireman. And I laughed because he doesn't like to get up early. I don't mind getting up early. And I started painting that it was the medical room at the time, but I only work seven days a month, 25 minutes. They're hard days, but I have a lot of time off, and I'm on fire for the Lord. I'm brand new. So I'm waiting in the parking lot at eight o'clock, as soon as I get off from the firehouse, and then he rolls in and I keep coming, I keep coming, and then one day he just says, you know what? Here's the key to the building. I'm tired of meeting you here. There's a lot of painting. But you know what I loved about it was is Dave and Pastor and family, and especially Mrs. Nolan, she is a warrior painter.

SPEAKER_02

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Is uh they work right next to you. They don't, they don't ask you to do anything they haven't ever done. You know, I'm a young Christian, I'm learning, so I didn't realize, you know, that I'm gonna be learning a lot from so many Christians. They're gonna be coming in. Those are coming from everywhere. I mean, not just one place. And there's just so much in that building that needs to be done. But that's that's how I got there. I mean, you I didn't see myself sitting here in the chair with you. I never saw myself at the Hope Center, right? But with God, right? The things that God did in the Hope Center is is beyond descriptive. There's so many stories.

SPEAKER_04

Well, one of which, going back, and to we talk about the idea how each of us have tools, talents, and treasures that the Lord pulls together in order to serve him and his children. And one of the stories that you shared with me had to do with while you were painting, there was someone that came in as a in a wheelchair that wanted to help.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, so uh back to more painting, insert Pastor Nolan laughing at me. And so volunteers were coming up and they send me this lady, and she goes, Well, they sent me to you. She goes, but I was a rodeo star, you know, and did all the riding and horse and all that. And she goes, but my back's fused. I can't bend over. That's okay. I says, I'm only using primer. I says, Well, you can just paint from the doorway up here, because she's like, I can't bend over. And I was like, Cool, just do that, and I can finish up the rest. And then it was a few days later, I can't remember which lady brought her up. I can see her face. She says, Hey, I got this guy downstairs. He's in a wheelchair. He wants to help, but I don't know where to put him. And he has a paintbrush. I go send him up. And we get him up there, and he goes, Hey, I can only do this, and I got this paintbrush, so I can do this, but I can only really get from uh waist high down.

unknown

Wow.

SPEAKER_00

And I said, Well, you see all that? He goes, Yeah. I says, Well, can you do the rest? He says, Yes. How beautiful. Right. So God sent me one that couldn't bend over, one that couldn't stand up. And they finished the project. Wow. And they loved it. They were happy. They were serving. But what he was showing me is uh we're praying to the harvesters to send more harvesters, but when they show up, they may not be who you think. He only has who wants to go in his name. Right. And that our responsibility is to utilize that. Now, I mean, there's wisdom in the staff where they recognize someone doesn't need to be here or there. And but that's few and far. Yeah. But that does happen. But to the most part, they just need to show up. And sometimes you start here and you move here. That's the one thing I noticed is there was a peace at the hope center. Extra peace. I already had that peace the Lord gave me, right? The peace that surpasses all understanding, because that showed up in my living room. But I heard somebody was sharing me, how do you know it's a it's a calling? If you can do anything else in the world and find happiness, it's probably not a calling. But when I would go to the hope center, there was more of that happiness and peace than what I had. And I knew I needed to be there. And others felt that too. His presence was there. And if you want to see miracles, which they happened a lot at the Hope Center, you need to go where he's doing a new thing where he's at. Because remember, he said, I only do what I see the Father doing, right? And you can see him there working. Because so many people came through. But the love that came through the Hope Center was just I mean, that was just one situation. You know, there's so many stories and the miracles and stuff.

SPEAKER_04

I met Heidi in the very beginning as well, way before I met you, and had an opportunity to work with her side by side on some projects and really quickly became blown away with her heart, with her passion, with her kindness, with her work ethic.

SPEAKER_00

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Her drive.

SPEAKER_00

Let's talk about Heidi. Ah, that's that's a tough one. Well, you know that uh she called for that intervention, and I think it was about a year after her uh divorce. You know, she would check in time to time, you know, how things were going, but she's like, hey, where do you go to church? Well, I go to the creek and she's like, hey, can I start attending? Absolutely. You know, I'm not thinking much because I I wasn't really focused on wanting a relationship. I was just like, man, I'm just on fire to serve you. It was not that I didn't want one, it's just I was focused. And so she was coming every Sunday. Then also I was like, Well, I'm at the Hope Center, you you want to help out because we're just painting. And uh she's like, Yeah, I'll come do that.

SPEAKER_04

It's and by this point, had she heard of the Hope Center? Had she been there before? No. Okay. Awesome. But I didn't know that's what I was doing.

SPEAKER_00

It wasn't too long after me, because we were the first marriage. We ended up being the first marriage. Right. So our relationship started growing from there. I wasn't really thinking, I didn't see it coming. I ended just she's only five foot tall, about 110 pounds, mighty heighty, right?

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, very mighty.

SPEAKER_00

Uh a teacher, right? Loves education, K through five. So she has an experience that is gonna be necessary. I I used to laugh because uh in some of the big rooms, like when I was painting uh Sarah Nolan's uh room when she was gonna move in as the lawyer, and you want to talk one on the most sweet, loving personalities, that's Sarah. And so I I got the honors of painting her apartment now. She was always going back and forth to work. And but Heidi starts coming to help, and I remember we're painting different parts and stuff, and uh I used to laugh because we had these windowsills all through the Hope Center. If you look at them, she painted most of them. Wow, right.

SPEAKER_04

There's a gazillion of them.

SPEAKER_00

She'd come in and was like, Well, maybe you can do that. And I remember it would be uh one of the no ones would say, Heidi, you can do the windowsills because she fit perfectly in there. She could stand up there and paint them and everything. So basically that's all she ever did. You know, and and as time went, Pastor felt this call that she needed to come there. Now I know they hired one employer already, the tax accountant. She's amazing. And you know, I got naming dyslexia. Most people at the Hope Center know, so names don't come out easy. And he says, I feel like you need to come here, so we're gonna pray on it. And by this time, we've decided to date seriously. It just worked out that way because I actually didn't know she was interested in me until one day after church, because we would meet out in the park a lot, we would sit, never went to her house or anything. But one day, she starts dating really close to me. And she's got this look in her eye, like, hey, I'm interested now. I don't know, I'm thinking about it. I'm like, okay. So eventually we had that conversation to start date and go to the Lord on it, see what he thinks, that we would be better together than apart. And he said together. And uh we start dating for seriousness, you know, we're at the Hope Center, and you know, a lot of stuff's gone on. We don't have a whole lot of money. And uh we're sitting in his office because we we talked about her being in the ministry full time. Also, we're pursuing marriage, we're pretty much there. I I know there's a lot of skipping. It's hard to put this together because with the loss of her, things get uh spacey, but we're sitting in the pastor's office and she's made a decision that yeah, I need to come here now. She's a teacher. That means she's got to walk away from her pension. I mean, that's that's a lot her teaching career in our life.

SPEAKER_03

I remember that.

SPEAKER_00

And we're concerned about insurance because she has she's type two diabetic. Well, yeah, but you know, we want to do this and we're waiting all that. He goes, Why wait? He goes, Don't wait. And we're like, he goes, We'll put on a wedding here for you guys, right? The Hope Center. I go, I look at her and I go, Well, I guess we're getting married. I said, I haven't even proposed to you yet. You know. She was happy as can be. Wow. Uh and they did. So uh that way she could be on insurance. So within two weeks, we're married.

SPEAKER_04

Beautiful.

SPEAKER_00

Right? Oh, yeah. Because I'm glad he did that because if we would have waited, because I didn't know she would be passing so early, going up to heaven, you know. And uh I did get the honors when she did come to Christ of baptizing her, right? I got the honors of that. Right.

SPEAKER_04

Oh man.

SPEAKER_00

Isn't that something? That is something. And um, we get married, they put on a wedding. I remember Pastor's sister, I'm bad with the name, she's gonna kill me. But she had all the stuff, everybody came together. It was a simple wedding. He did the valves up in the wedding ball, and we were married and uh immediately went on a uh missions trip, right? Because it was scheduled. And I didn't have plans for her to go. And she's like, Hey, I need to go to Alaska with you and Dusty, and all another fireman. We're going down to help build a church. And I said, Well, if the Lord wants you to go, He'll open a door. The moment I said that, the person who was running the missions work walked up and says, Hey Heidi, I think you need to go to Alaska with us. Well, I guess the Lord wants you to go. And that was beauty, so that we we weren't planning on, but we got married. So our honeymoon was in Alaska doing a missions trip.

SPEAKER_04

How cool is that?

SPEAKER_00

It was great. But she does uh ends up going there and starts out in the coffee shop and working on that. But the uh the thing there was is is you never that's the great thing about the Hope Center. I don't know if uh Pastor realized it at the time that the Hope Center was just gonna be hope for everyone in Christ. Yes. And um she was doing the coffee shop, getting that started. And then Pastor came and says, I think I'm gonna need you to go upstairs and work with the ladies. You know, we're we're working this through. Or our start with the program. I can't remember exactly where we're out because we're a little further down now. Uh some time has passed. But she heard the Lord speak and says, You can't go until you heal yourself. Now I I knew, but many people didn't, but that she was abused by her her dad. And the Lord needed her to heal and find forgiveness before she went up there. And so that was a journey that we went on. And she found that healing there with the Lord and the Nolan family, their love and all the people around her helping her and recovering. We we went to a counselor and was working through that. Guy was doing a great work, and the pastor started having her go on the his tour on Sundays, going around the different churches telling people about Hope Center, and she would share her testimony. When she got to the point where her dad was a Vietnam vet and he was uh Purple Heart and all that stuff, and uh she was always angry, and especially like you know, he doesn't deserve that. But she got to the point where the Lord healed her and she saw through a different lens and forgave him. All that went away, and to the point that she's like, I honor my dad. He fought for our country and freedom.

SPEAKER_01

That purple heart was earned. He was broken. We're all broken. And you could tell a change in her from that moment.

unknown

Wow.

SPEAKER_01

The memories were there, but the pain and the betrayal was gone.

SPEAKER_00

See, it was even harder for her because her dad had passed way before.

SPEAKER_01

So she never got to work things out. So when people come to the Hope Center, they're there for one reason or another.

SPEAKER_00

We're all there in his midst of his glory and healing. And the Hope Center is a place for hope. I have just seen so many people come through for one reason or another and get healed, find Christ, find fellowship, find purpose in his kingdom there. Some come quickly and the devil runs out the door just as fast as they got there. Some of them come back from that because he's trying to stop them, and you see the lot because when you're on the front line and I call the hope center those who are full-time there, they're they're frontline warriors. They are. And the devil's always hitting at them. And you would see that being there at the Hope Center over the years. And I didn't realize at the time that the enemy's gonna try to keep the roots from being grown in. Oh yeah. And when and the Lord's got to get them deep, and then he can attack all he wants, it's not going anywhere. Oh yeah. But he'll raise this whole place up just for one person. Yes. But to have a place that's centered, and then think of it as a Christian man that a place that is secure, safe, loving for these women to come to they've never had before. But what was great about Heidi is when she went up there, she could connect. Plus, some of the ladies come, they've been pulling away at a young age, so their mentality can be a little younger. Well, she's a teacher, she knows how to teach, she knows how to help people learn. She comes from abuse, and um she knows how to manage that and that schedule and all that. And the Lord really used her up there in different parts of the ministry at different times, but again, we could have never seen that coming. But I was thankful for the early because the sickness did come, and uh and it was a year after Dave passed. And what I love about Dave was I met I've never met somebody that had so much faith. Almost to this day. Uh he gave his dad a run for his money. It was a confident, it was a confident, joyful faith. No how much confident because he loved to pray for people who are hurting.

SPEAKER_04

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

I broke my back twice on the job. And I the Lord will do things to increase your faith. When you see miracles or you get a healing or something, it's for you to increase your faith. That's the way I've learned it. It's not out of Of like favoritism, you know, because he's a respecter of no one is above others. Dave was always praying, and I'm painting because Pastor wants me to. You don't know how much I don't like to paint. I mean, I don't mind it. It's kind of nice. I mean, you can get up in a zone and paint, but uh there's other stuff I would enjoy doing. Um, but my back would go out a lot. I mean it's hard work.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And I remember walking down, he goes, What's wrong with you? And Dave, and I said, My back went out. Get over here. He puts his hand on my back and starts praying, went away. Beautiful, right? Yeah. That was kind of a first for me. But I mean, that's how Dave was. He just had a faith of a giant.

SPEAKER_02

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And uh, I learned a lot from him. And he he'd always laugh and he's like, Well, you're the Lord. He goes, I don't get it. And I go, you don't realize what the Lord is shining through you with, right? You're in a place where a lot of us want to get to.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

But what a joy. So one of the saddest moments is when God calls him home.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And everybody, most people know that story, but what they don't know is a year later, and this is my what I saw in my vision through my lens. Other people might see it different. Heidi started having a lot of uh stuff come, but what happened with her, because we had quite a few heart attacks and just right in the same period. Um, hers was the first one. Um, and Lord will put you in the right place sometimes. That was one of the great things of her working there is I'm gone for 24 hours every third day. So one third of my life, I miss my family. I don't get to see them, all that stuff. I can't come home unless it's an extreme emergency, or even if it is, I might be on a run or a fire, and I won't know for hours later. But at the Hope Center, since she was there, and I was there on my off days volunteering, we got to spend a lot more time together.

SPEAKER_04

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And when I mean we were there, we were there for 18-hour days in the beginning, oh, yeah, doing a lot of work. There was a there was a lot that needed to be done and the joy of people coming through.

SPEAKER_01

But I was at the firehouse when she called and said, Baby, I don't feel so well.

SPEAKER_00

I said, Okay, what's going on? A lot of times when someone is seriously hurting, like we got a severe situation, they will start referring to wanting the person they trust the most in their life to come help them. Now it might be they call for their brother, their dad, and all that. Yeah, but she was actually called me, but she was like, I need my mom. Like, okay, you know, what's going on? And she's dizzy, she's not feeling well, and um, all right, something's going on. I said, hey, I'm gonna call 911. And then she doesn't remember any of this because she's not getting right now, she's not getting much blood to her brain. She's not making much sense. And I'm like, okay, I'm gonna come with. I was like, you can call 911, I'm gonna call 911. She goes, you know what? I'm just gonna call my mom. Hangs up on me. I look at um my my uh friend on the treadmill at the firehouse, and I said, and he didn't, I didn't even say anything. He looked at me, he says, You gotta go home. So I'm heading that way. She does get a hold of her mom. Mom calls another firefighter, Beth, down the street, uh, Christian woman. She's a paramedic. She runs down there. She's just two doors down from uh where we live, gets in the house, eventually calls 911. She's having a full-blown heart attack. She didn't realize it. And the bad part is, is being a fireman, I miss the signs because women are tougher. Because she was just waking up and she just had like a uh, like she slept on her neck wrong. Men are easier to recognize these signs, but women can be tough when they have heart attacks. In my career, I've never seen that many women heart attacks. It's always men. Yeah. And then she was having indigestion. The problem was is when I would give her medication, the indigestion would go away. Because if it doesn't, that's a sign, right? And that's really all we had. And we were riding the two days prior to this incident. I mean, we were riding 20 miles each day on our bikes, and I couldn't keep up with her. But the paramedics get there, and this is the blessing because the paramedic that showed up actually saw something that most paramedics don't, and he was able to tell that there was some when he put the leads on and he was reading the EKG, he's like, we need to go. And I'm taking her to the heart hospital. Yeah. So they get there, uh, she immediately goes into that. But here's the thing uh a lot of people don't know. Is you know, I'm sitting out there, people are praying, waiting. It's COVID time starting to kick out, you can't go back and all that stuff. And a nurse comes out and says, Hey, the doctor wants to see you back there, but you're not allowed to go back there. I'm not happy with this. And I'm like, okay, but he's the doctor. Okay. So she walks me back, and there's this room. And I mean, I've never seen anything like it. This not, you know, ER is a little different than these rooms. And it has all these TVs and it's her heart and everything. And he's looking at me and he goes, This is a miracle. He's like, Your wife should be dead. She should have never made it here. And I'm like, okay, what are you talking about? He goes, Look, he's showing it. I go, he goes, God spared her life. And I'm like, okay, what God are you talking about? He goes, Jesus, man. Jesus, he goes, Look, I've never seen this. And even the uh other cardiologist who wasn't a man of faith who said, we just don't understand the human body yet. He goes, This is new. Because she was basically 98, 99% blocking her artery. She wasn't getting anything. Shouldn't have been there. Well, it was so bad that she had to have another heart surgery more stents put in, right? It wasn't as bad as having a full open heart surgery. We're thankful for that. And she had to have a second surgery. And when she was coming out of it, I've always wanted to meet someone that had an encounter out, you know. On the street, sometimes people will say weird things come, you know, when they're sick or when they go in and out. In the ER, you'll hear it. Doctors hear it all the time. Yeah. You know, I see this, I saw Jesus, all that stuff. But I've never really met someone I know. And uh, she's waking up from the second surgery and she's like, he loves me. He loves me so much. And I'm like, Yeah, baby, I do love you. She goes, No, I'm not talking about you. Now you got to remember, she's under anesthesia. So she is out of her mind. And she's silly when she's under because all she wants is chicken and nuggets and she hates them. But when she's sick, she wants chicken McNuggets. Oh, so I knew she wasn't really there because I'm like, no, you like Jimmy Johns. No, I want chicken and nuggets. But I'm talking to her and I was like, okay, and then it hit me because I've I've listened to all these I went to heaven stories, but I don't know anybody. Yeah. You hear them in the hospital when you're there. Doctors will talk about patients say this and all that. And uh, and they do want to hear them because uh eventually I'm telling the story when she's in the hospital, and every doctor comes in and wants to hear the story. It's crazy. And I'm like, okay, baby. Yeah, and she goes, No, Jesus. And I said, Oh no. Did you hear his voice? She said, Yes, and the light. I'm like, okay. Now I did record some of it, and I've given that recording to a few people, but it's after this conversation, I go, Oh, I need to record this. I said, Well, what's he like? And she says, Baby, it's the brightest light you've ever seen. There's no words. Okay. And he loves me. He loves me more than I love my own children. I was like, wow. He put his face to mind and said, I love you, I'm sending you back. That doesn't make it any easier for her because when she does wake up, she's like, Why did God spare me and not David? Yeah. And we may not know until we get home. We can ask why all we want. Um, because eight months later he calls her home. Um, and uh the next incident, because I won't go into all of them, is I'm at Myers. That guy keeps me there. Um, because she had one after another. And when you have stents, you can't have surgery because they got a coat. They got a coat or you'll bleed out, and she's on blood thinners. And you have to be off blood thinner a certain period of time before you have surgery. So immediately she goes from that because her gallbladder goes bad right away. And he did this every time he pulled these miracles off. They had to fly someone in, Dr. Delimpa, because if it doesn't come out, not her gallbladder, I'm sorry, uh Pancreas. No, the little one that's dangerous. Appendix? Yes. So But he said, the good news is, he says, one, I'm really good. He says, we don't have time to stop her of anything. He goes, I'm just gonna make a little cut. He says, the good news is the appendix doesn't bleed much. If I can get in and out without nicking her, if I nick her just a little bit, the size of I mean, really small, she's gonna bleed out and die, and there's nothing we can do. This is dangerous surgery. But if it burst, she's done. Because what they have to do to clean it up, she won't survive. He gets in and out. Boom. Right. And every time we go to the hospital, they diagnose it really fast at the heart hospital. That's something else. And then um she has another incident where uh her stomach just shuts down and they want to do surgery. They don't know why. So they bring in Dr. Dunba again, and this is not too long after she's starting to recover, and we don't know why the stomach should not come in from the anesthesia, all the surgery. We don't know, but it's not working no more. And so they want to do surgery because they think there's a blockage, but they're not really seeing it. And then also they want to do something inside to stimulate the intestines to see if they'll start working again. But the crazy thing is that the limbus says, No, you can't do that. It will kill her. She has not even got the six months yet to stop the blood thinners. So he's like, I know an old technique. I'm gonna do that. I don't remember exactly what it was, so I'm not gonna describe it, but they did it and it worked. Great, comes back. Now I'm standing in Myers. When she calls her to pick it up and she says, Baby, my head hurts. I'm like, okay. From one to 10. She goes, That's the worst pain I've ever had. Where are you? I was over here, but you know, now I'm back at the Hope Center. I'm right around the corner.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

I didn't go home. Normally I go home, I'd been 20, 30 minutes away. Get there, assess it. You know, each time I assess whether or not we need an ambush or not. And this one I'm like, I'm I'm just taking you myself. I think the ambulance would be too slow. Lord forgive me, but I drove emergent just like any loving person would safely. And I drive a fire engine for a living. Oh yeah. Doesn't make it right. Get her to the hospital, and they're like mad at me for bringing her to the heart hospital, but I'm like, man, you guys, there's no way. And I don't know if it's not heart, right? They figured out that she's bleeding in her brain. She's not just bleeding there, she's getting ready to start bleeding out of everywhere. You know, I don't know if it's from the blood thinners or what, but they were even worried. But by prayer and everything, God spares her again, right? And um, we're doing pretty good. She's getting pretty sick, but uh, she doesn't want to quit. Pastor and Miss Nolan stopped by and says, maybe you should take a break for a little while. And she's like, No, I can still show up and everything. And he was okay with it. She didn't want to walk away, but she's got to have brain surgery now. And uh she's just got like this constant migraine. And the brain's different. Uh certain parts of the brain, pain medicine doesn't work, and that's the part that didn't work. So she's always constantly in pain. And uh she's learning to draw. I didn't even know she could draw. She was like I didn't know I could draw, I just asked the Lord if I can draw. Look at me. And she's drawing stuff, sending it to her son who's away in the army. She's just in a lot of pain, so she couldn't take it anymore. And uh, we decided that she should do the brain surgery because she's just something's not right. And because they had to do a blood transfusion. I had to decide for that to stop all the bleeding from that. She recovered pretty well, and now it's COVID. Now, I've skipped some of the other instances. There's more. I'm trying to shorten it down. It was just one after another after another. And and every doctor would say, This is not normal. Even Dr. Dunba, this is not normal. You know? And when we get to the the brain surgeon, she's the smartest person in the whole hospital of the state. They said that's going to do the surgery. And this lady is, I mean, my wife's hair started growing back. And we thought it was because after the heart surgery, she had better flow. And she goes, no. She goes, what medications are you on? She'll go, Oh, it's this medication. It's like, wow. She knew that. She said, This medication is causing your hair to get stronger and grow back. That's, I mean, she was good. And so we're going to do the surgery, and they won't let you stay at the hospital like you used to with your family and loved ones. And I'm there with our oldest boy, and they're kicking us out. I didn't want to go. The hospital's full. She's supposed to be in the ICU. There's no room. She's supposed to be in the PCU, progressive unit. There's no room. She's just in a corner in this room. And I don't even know if the lady that's running this hall is even a nurse. Uh, seems like it. She was hooked up on the machines when I left and stuff, got to say her goodbyes and kisses, and I was thanks for that. Of course, she made that happen. Went home and I get a call at three in the morning that they found her on the hospital floor, and they don't know how long she'd been down. And God had me there every moment.

SPEAKER_01

And you know, I had to work through this with the Lord, and God is good. Um that uh I wasn't there. She goes on full life support.

SPEAKER_00

Um eventually we have to pull the plug and donate her organs, um, which we know because my dad was a lung transplant receiver, and he came to Christ after his lung transplant. If he wouldn't have had his lung transplant, may not have been there. So that gift someone gave, God can use. And so we were big fans of that, and so we we donated uh uh her stuff. But it's like she went into the light, you healed her. So as I was wrestling, but what the Lord gave me a great piece many times is one day I'm standing, and this may be hard for some people, but I'm standing in the living room, and all of a sudden, it's almost like I'm in a Marine Corps position, hands went down, and I'm looking up to the ceiling, and I feel this presence. Was an audible voice, but I heard it in my head. I am she is with me right now. I am holding her. That is good news. You'll see her soon. Wow, and this piece hit me. The pain was real, but the peace hit me. And that peace he gave me with the pain was everything, right? And then later he starts to show that, you know, before I even spoke you guys into existence, your days were numbered. Yeah, everybody has a day that's numbered, right?

SPEAKER_01

And I take everything into account my plan, people's decisions, the consequences, and all that. And sometimes I have to do miracles to get you to that date.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and other times I have to stop doing miracles so you can come home and be with me. Still hard to understand, right? And grief is something I had to learn, and that's where you talked about relationships. Yeah, that's where the relationships of being in a Christ-filled community like the Hope Center comes in handy.

SPEAKER_02

Amen.

SPEAKER_00

And we talked about this earlier because some of us know how to put a band aid on the physical. Many of us come into the spiritual side of things, but why did Christ himself well when his best friend died? Yeah. He knew he was gonna raise him from the grave, he knew he was gonna spend an attorney in heaven with him, and I know he was upset because this is not the way it was supposed to be. He was upset, but he was a welly. He was welling this immense well that I know now personally, yeah, and I've heard on so many emergency runs. I mean, to give you an example, I was in church one time and I heard that, and I knew this was bad, and I just got up on the pews and just started walking over. And I get there, and this guy fully gone out.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

You know. Um, but you know that sound. And I didn't know what grief was. Because see, I had Heidi when I lost my mom and dad back to back. And I've lost, I've lost count, all my family members that have passed here in the last five, six years. I think we're 14.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

I'm down to like my brother. My sister talked about, she's passed. You know, my older brother, niece, mom, dad, wife, my aunts, my uncles, my cousins. I'm blessed that each one of them came to Christ right before they passed. That's the blessing of the Lord always reminds me, I'm gonna see them again.

SPEAKER_01

But this pain was talking about is, you know, he wailed.

SPEAKER_00

But the problem with, and I learned this with him and through the going through the hope center. So this was my healing. I have severe PTSD from being a fireman and in the Marine Corps. In my generation, your generation, we're told to suck it up buttercup. But I'm telling you, suck it up buttercup doesn't work. Most of us don't come in to understand the emotional side of things. You know, we just try to deal with it. And our quality of lives are horrible. Takes a lot of people to suicide. I've had a lot of firemen and military friends decide not to stay here anymore because we didn't know how to transition through the PTSD and the grief, right? And when this happened with my other family members, I had the wife there to help me with that. But still I didn't know how to deal with the loss of my mom and dad. And I had this fireman come up to me, one of the toughest firemen that we all say is tough, said a great thing to me because he understood this, and I didn't. When my mom passed, he walked up and he says, Hey, I just want to tell you, it's been 40 years, and even till this day, I still cry from time to time over my mom.

SPEAKER_01

And I looked at him and I go, You? You? Like, okay. Didn't make sense then.

SPEAKER_00

So when the wife passed, because you never know who's gonna affect you the most. It could be a neighbor, a comrade, a child, and all that. And we don't wrestle over whose grief is the worst, because that's not what we want to be. What we understand is we relate in deep grief, that we both know deep grief. Now, how can we help each other with this? And when that happened, man, I recognized that I'm in bad shape.

SPEAKER_01

I need help. I've never felt this before in my life.

SPEAKER_00

And Pastor Nolan sat down with me and said, Hey, I just want you to know that I took my family through Christian grief share, and it was one of the greatest things we've ever done. Trust in me that you need to do this.

SPEAKER_01

I'm gonna start it here at the Hope Center.

unknown

Wow.

SPEAKER_01

Well, I didn't want to go, but I knew I needed to.

SPEAKER_00

But because he asked, and I trusted him, because by then we've built this relationship, which with everybody just keeps getting deeper, right? Just like our relationship. Right. Kind of cool, right? And uh the Lord works in mysterious ways. I started going to it. And here's the here's what people don't understand. And even those ladies at the Hope Center, when they come there and they go through this, they understand it more than most people do. That it works. See, the world says suck it up, buttercup. That's just the double. Because Christ talks a lot about protecting your heart, transferring, learning how to live with suffering, loss, and all that stuff. There is a right way to go through it, right? It's not easy, but there's a way and his way. Because my children, many of you perish for a lack of knowledge of me. Most people don't grow up dealing with the emotional side. We wrestle with that on our own. And even though a majority of people live, their quality of life is horrible. Or they isolate or they wrestle with PTSD that they have to have all this different stuff.

SPEAKER_04

Addictions.

SPEAKER_00

Addictions and all that. And PTSD can come from anything, not just veterans' environment. I mean, just in life, abuse, all types of stuff. To show you how it worked is in this, one of the counselors said to me that one of the best things you can do is uh you're gonna have to go into work.

SPEAKER_01

Because I couldn't control the tears. This is the first time in my life I could not control the tears. They would just come. I've never felt pain like this before. And I lost both mom and dad within 29 days of each other.

SPEAKER_00

But I had the wife to help me comfort me. Now I have no one. And so they said you're going to have to go into the firehouse.

SPEAKER_01

You're going to have to have a conversation with everybody.

SPEAKER_00

That you're not broken. This is normal. See, that's what most people never hear. You're in a normal state. Yeah. And we're going to tell you what's not a normal state so that you can recognize that and either get help or transition through it. Because this is bad grief. This is good grief. How many people know that? How many people, other than shock, can recognize what stage of grief they're in?

SPEAKER_04

In Pastor Hubert's book, he talks about despair.

SPEAKER_00

Despair.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Well, I'll tell you for me, and the Lord lets us have different things at different times, is I have never had despair. Anything that's happened after Christ has not been like it was. I know despair. I wanted to leave. Yeah. I hit despair. And the Lord's never let me get back to there. And he saved you. Right. Right. And each different to learn something, right? Well, he was teaching me something here too. That's not what he wanted, but this is just the day that he called her home. And so go in and let the guys know that the tears are going to come, nothing you can do about it. You're fine. You can still pull them out of fire and all that. Because the counselor's like, yeah, you're good. You're you're here. You know, they're professionals. I do go into the firehouse and I have this conversation. And uh this tough dinner table, all the guys were really good with it and everything. And they're like, Yeah, we appreciate you saying that. And uh now we had a women's quarter, so I could run off there if the tears came most of the time. But when the first time it came, I'm standing at my locker and it hits me and they're coming. And a gentleman, a fireman friend of mine standing next to me, looks over at me, goes, Oh, come here, big guy. Puts his arms around me and starts hugging me. And I'm just like, okay, I didn't see this coming. You know? And I look up and he's got tears in his eyes. He goes, I just want to tell you. I've never really talked about it much, but you know, me and the wife just lost our child.

unknown

Wow.

SPEAKER_00

And you're right. I can still do the job. I'm normal. I'm not broken. I'm just hurting. And he goes, I've never been, he goes, I have so much peace now that you've said this.

unknown

Wow.

SPEAKER_00

Right? See, because the Lord says, My children, many of you perish for a lack of knowledge of me. And if you look through the scriptures, there's so much on getting through grief, through trials and tribulations and stress and different things. And as men were told to suck it up buttercup. And that might work for quite a few people in the world, but are you willing to take a risk with your children that it doesn't work?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Wouldn't you rather just teach them a little bit, like, hey, your first breakup, you're probably gonna go into a form of like when two people break up, you have that, oh, my whole world's coming to an end. And what you really want to do is buy time because most of these emotions will pass within time. And if you share with them that, hey, I had this, this is what's gonna happen, but call me, right? Because I'll help you go winter back. And if not, we'll go hunting for the next one because there is a next one. Because look, I found your mother and I dated this many people, right? So this is normal and you're not broken. So when this happens, it's a normal stage. But we don't want to stay there, right? And this is how we move forward. Nobody has that conversation. I've lost lots of friends who had a breakup of divorce, and it's a form of grief because they're just so close to each other. There's the loss of a loved one, then divorce or a breakup is a form of grief that most people don't understand. Sometimes it's worse. My wife went to heaven and left me whole. The first wife, because I know both of them, I call having an affair with another firefighter, left me destroyed and broken. There's a difference. Betrayal. Right. But the grief is very similar. And it can be devastating if you don't know how to process it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

And if the suck it up buttercup is stuffing it, stuffing it, stuffing it, not handling it, not dealing with it, not bringing it out, not letting our Lord shine his light on it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Right? Absolutely. The coping skills, how to transition through it, all types of stuff. And not just knowing. So this stuff works. And so I did it for four and a half years. And I wish I would have known this when I was a kid, because my life would be completely different now. Right. But during that time, just the family that came together, just I saw them come together for the Nolan family when Dave lost, when people would get sick and stuff, just the community, you know, and there were people there to help you that you never had before. And to go to show you that I was walking with a group of people, and I mean, I just buried my mom, just buried my dad, and and uh here's the wife. And it's like we didn't have insurance on anybody. And I had a group, my life group came together and they gave me $10,000 to help bury their sister in Christ. Wow. No one's ever done that before. Of course, now I'm at the Hope Center where Pastor talks about those we'll be receiving $10,000 gifts.

SPEAKER_02

All right.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

That he will provide. Just the love and what you learn being at the Hope Center. And then the stories of the ladies get there because that's that's the heart of Hope Center is for the ladies. But it's all worth it because, like the Lord said, He goes, I need people who know how to have the desire to protect and love these women because they've never seen it. And God would just give us these nuggets from these people at the Hope Center in the community that had this wisdom. They've been there. And if you would just humble yourself, like the Lord said, Yeah, oh my goodness. How things can get so much better. Because I'm I'm able to sit here today, right? Because of all those that the Hope Center had poured into me when I lost Heidi, right? And helped me out. Then the Lord using them to help me understand grief and then lately hear the PTSD stuff and everything. And for me, because I always wonder, I was like, everybody's getting these healings. And I'm like, you've just sent me here. And I've been doing all this and and and and it's all great, but it didn't re it didn't really come to until later, understanding until after she passed. Just like I said, you know, love your God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength. And I didn't know that until a year later. And uh my life is so because I was getting ready to lose a lot of people. It could have taken me down, maybe I got back to despair. Yeah. But because of Christ and the body of believers and the people coming and going everywhere and the miracles that God does at the Hope Center and watching those ladies' lives transformed one after another. And not all of them go perfect. Some ladies come and go. Oh, yeah. Still praying for them. And um just just working with him and his presence there and just being around so many strong people of faith, like meeting you. And there's just, you know, so much us just talking this morning that we were sharing what God's doing in our life and we learned. So powerful. That's what it's about. God's about relationships, and he's about us coming together so he can love us and find us. I mean, the simplicity of the Bible is he came to seek and save the lost.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And that's one of our heart's desires is to reach out in the way that he wants us to to find all those that want to come. Because he he longs for no one to perish, but all to come to repentance to turn back to him. Yeah. And the hope center has just become this great light. And the thing is, is he has to do miracle after miracle. I mean, it's expensive there. And to see all the money that comes in the last minute different places, all the people that show up with skills, or, you know, he's got a guy here, or the healings that you see. I mean, I'll tell this one. This one's hard to believe. I don't share this one a lot. So in the early days, I was painting, and I don't know why. I do know why. The Lord showed me, it's to increase my faith. I have pretty weak faith because he does a lot around me and increase it, right? So people say, Oh, you got a lot of faith. I'm like, no, actually, it was the opposite. We were painting this one room, and you know, it's at the very beginning. So uh Pastor came up and he goes, Uh, you got enough paint to finish the project? I said, No, I don't think we do. I said, maybe. I might be able to stretch it. He goes, Well, we're gonna have to pray over that bucket for God to expand that because uh I don't think we have enough money for the paint. We got a deadline, someone's gonna move in. Well, come get me. And I'm like, okay, well, I ran out. I prayed over the bucket. He didn't put paint in there. I go to find him, and I said, Hey, and he goes, Well, and reached his wallet, and he didn't say anything, but I knew that was his own personal card. Go get some paint. I said, Okay, why I go back up and get the bucket.

SPEAKER_01

And I reached down to grab the bucket.

SPEAKER_02

It was full of paint.

SPEAKER_01

It was full of paint.

SPEAKER_00

I dropped to the ground. My mind cannot comprehend what just happened.

SPEAKER_02

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I mean, literally, it felt like my mind wanted to come apart. Never seen this. I go back to the car, say, hey, we got paint. He ne I don't think he ever really asked. You know, because I don't think that was God's plan. It was for me. And even Bob was looking for paint. Bob comes back and goes, Hey, look, I got paint. I said, I prayed. We have paint. And he's like, Bob, I love Bob. Yeah. I mean, and he's like, Cool, man. Well, I got more in the basement that's an off-color, but it's gonna mess up the paint job. And I'm like, well, we don't want that. And it was just the right amount to finish it. I mean, he made the Israelites' shoes not wear out for 40 years in the desert. He made the oil expand in that lady's house to make bread for the prophet. He says, I'm the same yesterday, today, as before. Why would he stop doing this? And it wasn't anything to do with my faith in that moment. But sometimes I think it is our faith in that moment. It was just him loving on me and revealing and showing off, revealing himself. And um, yeah. And just it's like that throughout the Hope Center.

SPEAKER_04

Countless blessings. Well, this has been this has been fantastic, and I I thank you so much for sharing these stories of just how God is working in your life and and the the community of Hope Center. Yeah. I hope and pray that people listening that maybe have never been there to the Hope Center before will come out and visit and to be able to see all these great things that we we're given the opportunities to see on a regular basis. We all have tools, talents, and treasures, and God needs them for the Hope Center and so many other places in this world.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Thank you so much, Chris. Thank you, brother.