Episode 3: Christian Dupont on Leading Through Change and Transformation

In this episode, Lucy sits down with Christian Dupont for a thoughtful conversation on leadership, transformation, and navigating change in today’s business landscape.

Christian shares insights from his career and experiences working across complex organizations, reflecting on what it takes to lead effectively in environments that are constantly evolving. The discussion explores the balance between strategy and execution, the importance of clear communication, and how leaders can guide teams through uncertainty while staying focused on long-term impact.

Lucy and Christian also discuss how technology and shifting workplace dynamics are reshaping leadership expectations — and why adaptability, curiosity, and strong values are becoming essential traits for modern leaders.

If you’re interested in how experienced leaders think about change, growth, and the future of organizations, this episode offers practical insights and thoughtful perspectives worth hearing.

Visit our website: https://intechsearch.com

🤝 Connect with Christian Dupont:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/christianpdupont/

🤝 Connect with us on LinkedIn:

https://www.linkedin.com/in/lucyrayden/

https://www.linkedin.com/in/chris-thiel-insight/

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hello, today I'm joined by Christian DuPont, a CEO and deep tech leader working at the heart of photonics and AI infrastructure. Christian has led complex technology organizations across RD, commercialization, and scale, and brings a thoughtful perspective on leadership, collaboration, and building teams that can move fast in a demanding world. So welcome, Christian. Nice to have you here.

SPEAKER_01 0:27

Thank you very much, Lucie. Nice to be with you.

SPEAKER_00 0:30

So first of all, you know, Christian, we've known each other a while, and I'm really interested to look a little bit back at your career and how did you get to um where you are today and what experiences most shapes the kind of leader that you've become?

SPEAKER_01 0:50

All right. So so actually being an engineer, I started in a very uh nice company called Texas Instrument. And uh and actually uh this was my first experience, and actually I was thinking it would be a couple of years, it actually lasted 20 years. Um as we we we we we actually ended up being on surfing on the wave of the uh the wireless terminal um and uh take the the the product that I was in charge of in this company, which was uh DSP, digital signal processors, and actually make win into the first GSM at the time, and then it became cellular phones uh in all over the world. And we've been leading this market for I think something like 15 years, uh, and this market has been uh tremendously growing. I mean, we first we started with something like a couple million dollars of business, and then what was it? This was this was in '94, and in in 98, we were at 1 billion. Uh so it was just an incredible ray, ride. Uh and adding uh and the the big learning was uh you start with a component and then you add all the different ingredients that you need in order to go all the way to a complete solution uh over time. So you gain value in the market, not only with the units, but also with the value that you deliver, and you assemble the team that can do that type of more complex system versus just a device, and uh and you learn how to work with other players and big guys like Nokia Ericsson and um and align roadmaps, align teams, and if you do that well, you stay in business with them for 15 years, which is what we did, and it got us to tremendous business and a lot of learning.

SPEAKER_00 2:45

Yeah, wow, and you actually started your leadership career with TI as well, didn't you?

SPEAKER_01 2:51

Yeah, I sure did. I sure did. I got the yeah, I got the first teams to lead there, and uh and it grew up from marketing management, product management to general management, moved to TI Dallas, uh, learned what it is to work in this uh new environment. I mean a huge corporation in uh in Texas and in USA uh that was a different rhythm, and um versus France, and uh yeah, so so a lot of different and also when I was over there, um I got the opportunity then to come back uh in Europe, which was uh a tremendous opportunity uh to come back to France and lead the European division, which was 1,500 people. So that was yet another type of leadership. I mean, leading a very large team. So I've been from starting a business to growing a team, um, expanding the different skills to then leading a much larger team, no more hundreds of people, but uh thousands of people, which is another another type of challenge, and always following what the customer wants.

SPEAKER_00 4:02

And I mean, that is a huge amount of varied leadership as well, and that's a lot of responsibility. I'm curious to know what made you want to move into a leadership role and and and how did you manage that level of responsibility? Because that's huge.

SPEAKER_01 4:19

Oh, I mean, what made me uh actually I get my energy from uh being with people, and uh the fact is that when I'm in a room with people, I I rapidly take the lead naturally. Um that's not something I decided, that's the what just the way I am. Um and uh and I end up uh yeah proposing, uh helping, uh showing the way, and and always leveraging the the skills and the expertise that is in the in uh each of uh the person in the room or in the team. That's that's really what I've done always. I mean, I've never worked alone. I've never I've most of the time worked with big experts, I mean very talented uh people, and uh uh that's what I realized. And uh and then all my career I've had tremendous relationships with CTOs or I mean uh basically peers that bring the compliment to who I am.

SPEAKER_00 5:16

Yeah, amazing. And what about the kind of experience that have shaped the top the type of leader you are today? Is there anything that you can think of that that made you be more one kind of a leader than another?

SPEAKER_01 5:31

I think I think there is one thing that uh really shaped me. I mean, is um I've always been in markets which are evolving extremely fast. And uh so you you never really know what what is coming to you. So so you know you need to have uh you need to have a high sense of humility and um and uh in order to absorb and and learn from from these new challenges that are coming on you, and um and then adapt, and then uh once you understand it, convey it to the rest of the team and uh and uh adapt the solution to whatever is this new challenge. So I think uh that's something I've really learned is if you you need to have this humility and um humility to say, hey, I don't know, and then listen carefully, ask the right question, learn, uh put together around yourself the the right uh expertise uh for that particular new battle, and then oftentimes, I mean, if you do that properly, you have a good chance to succeed.

SPEAKER_00 6:40

Yeah, and I think as well, um, you know, the environments that you've worked in, you've needed to be incredibly agile. And even now in the environment that you're in, things are moving, you know. You've said, you know, with your time at TI, things were moving very, very quickly then. But compared to now, I mean, it it's crazy how quickly things move. So the agility that you have to have in you, um, that ability to adapt and that um um that knowing how to deal with people who are concerned, because it the the world is changing rapidly, and if we're not ahead of the game, we we left behind, right? So you must use all of these skills that you've built over the years to push forward to where you are now.

SPEAKER_01 7:26

Yeah, and actually it's it's um it's a question of anticipation. Uh it's a question of anticipation, and if you if you have the the luck to have had a little bit of experience before, you can maybe have leverage that. Uh and then you you if you are if you have, as I say, the humility to listen carefully uh to others' point of view or what is happening, you can uh you can anticipate on where the things will go, and then you can lead your team in this direction. And um, and super important is the flexibility. Uh and I think uh the flexibility, I mean, being able to uh move and then move fast, fail fast, adapt, readjust, and then after a couple iterations, win. Um, and oftentimes, if you have decided just to move fast and move on, uh you discover the answer uh as you move forward. Um, so that's that's really important uh dimension. And then when you build your your solution typically to a problem, keep I mean, if you have a choice between a frozen solution and a flexible solution, pick the flexible because in the space where we are, which is deep tech, and this was true for wireless space, this is true today for the data center space, we don't know what will be tomorrow. I mean, when we were in wireless, we were in GSM, and then the next day we were in CDMA, the next day we were in wideband CDMA, the startup changed on us, and uh having not only the people flexible, but also the solution being flexible enabled us to win versus uh frozen solutions or frozen teams that are anchored in their way of thinking.

SPEAKER_00 9:08

Yeah, and I guess when you have constantly moving goalposts, you need to have teams that can flex adapt to those situations as well. So it's not just your leadership, but it's how you um get other people to think in the same way that you're thinking, because otherwise you get stuck with people, right?

SPEAKER_01 9:26

Yeah, exactly, exactly. So so in the leadership, it's really keeping people aligned. Actually, I've realized that uh in the in, yeah, compared to where we were uh I would say uh 15 years ago, uh the iteration with uh my team is uh has increased in speed. I used to talk to the entire population of the company about every month, now it's about every week. And uh and uh and this way you can really influence. I think with the evolution of the the tools, uh the evolution of the generation and the evolution of uh yeah, the the communication speed, uh, we need to interact uh much much faster, much more often, and uh in order to uh I would not say change, but I mean give some uh some adjustment to where we are going on on a very regular basis so that then everybody is on the same page. And uh and we do that not in real time, but basically on a weekly basis.

SPEAKER_00 10:31

Yeah, wow. So it's a lot of uh a lot of movement and a lot of quick thinking. How do you have time to um step back and pause? Do you have time for that? How do you you know to give your time real thinking, time, real clarity, time when there's so much moving all the time?

SPEAKER_01 10:48

It's uh that's that's a very important element, and it's not often actually uh in my current situation, I'm uh actually in Spain uh in Valencia during the week and I'm traveling back, so I have a one-hour flight to commute back to France uh every weekend, and so I get a couple hours where I'm in the plane and uh in a cheap flight, so no space for PC, and the only thing you can do is close your eyes and think. And and that's that's pretty um that's pretty efficient. That's that's a way today. Um, in the past, I mean uh you there is a space, a very special space, which uh you and I know, which is uh COCF, uh, which is this group of uh hundred CEOs that get together every quarter for a couple of days and and uh step back, reflect, uh, listen to others challenge uh and realize that you may actually have the same challenge that this other CEO. So learn from it, anticipate. Really super, super powerful.

SPEAKER_00 11:55

Yeah, absolutely. And I think that that shapes so many leaders, actually. Um, the the members who are um privileged to be part of that organization and it helps them deal with challenges because being at the top can be very lonely, it can be very political. You may have investors, you might not want to tell everybody about your concerns. Um, so it I imagine that that organization shaped your leadership as well.

SPEAKER_01 12:21

Very much so. Very much so. Actually, it it taught me uh how to collaborate, uh, how powerful it can be multiple minds uh when they get around a challenge. Um, and just by the diversity of the minds that are around around this challenge, how efficient it it can be, and uh versus a single person or a coupled person just trying to solve something they know already. Um uh when you start to open to others, and typically others who who have absolutely no particular interest in in uh what this challenge, but just want to help, uh, and have different background, uh, different uh personality, uh you get you get some tremendous um, I would say, inputs that you can then use. And that's what that's what we were doing. Uh, and um that's really super useful. And actually, I now happen to do that also uh naturally outside of this organization, just by creating collaboration. And uh when we have a challenge even in the company, lining up different people to try to solve it.

SPEAKER_00 13:30

Yeah, it's a it's a great technique. Um, and the diversity of thought, the ideas, and I really like the fact that sometimes you get totally conflicting views, and no person has uh you know the ego of needing to be right, it's just these are the views, and then as a as a CEO, you can choose what you want to take from that and use it in your own decision making, which is incredibly powerful. Brilliant. Okay, moving on, Christian. You know, we've had conversations before, and you spoke about with me um choosing the right game for yourself and being willing to say no to things. So, how important um has that been in finding an environment where you can do your best work?

SPEAKER_01 14:15

Super important. I think uh I think it was um I had several experiences and uh and sometime as a CEO, um, you typically uh get in a situation where you you step out of a company, whether you're pushed out or you're pushing yourself out, and uh and quite rapidly um you realize you don't have incomes, so you need to find a new place, a new gig, and uh and uh that gets you oftentimes to be a bit too rapid in your selection. And uh so and the the one that has been really successful for me where when I really took the time to analyze and and look at it from uh is there a real market or should we create the market? And uh if this is a ladder, it's a problem. Do do I have a technology that is really responding to the problem of that market? Uh is that really a good a good fit there, even though it's still far away? Uh, I think this is this is also a super key important uh element. And then the third one is very simple is does this team and uh the people I'm gonna work with and this company have the same value that I carry? Uh can I swim in this water or will I will I be really consumed? And um I've sometimes ignored that and I suffered from it, uh really suffered from it. And uh when and now this particular time I did not, I I met the the founder and CTO, uh today's CTO of that company, and uh we could really see very rapidly that our uh I mean it was connecting, and uh and after now a year and a half we are collaborating very efficiently and and with a lot of fun and being fun in this type of tough environment. If you don't have fun, hey because it is tough, even though it's uh it's a it's uh I mean uh wireless or AI data centers are booming market, it is tough. I mean, the the battle is uh the the state the the the opportunity is so large that there is a lot of battles, and um so sometime you win, sometime you lose. But uh in both cases, you need to you need to smile.

SPEAKER_00 16:36

Yeah, absolutely. And I think you know, what you've done and what you're doing is important because any C CEO stepping into a CEO role, um certainly in a founder-led organization, certainly where the um founder may be very technical. Um, we have different kinds of personalities, CEOs, not all of them, but they may be more, you know, we've talked about before the colours of how people behave and react in psychometrics, you know, more red, more yellow, more blue, more green. And when you move into an organization that is founder-led, and you're a CEO who may be very red, maybe, um, maybe very red slash yellow, but you move in and um start dealing with people who have often the extreme opposite personality traits and ways of working and ways of thinking. Maybe they're more blue, more engineering in how they're thinking. This can be challenging for any CEO coming into an organization, and I see this frequently. You obviously now have built a great relationship within the organization that you're working now. How did you get that um that working well together for you? Like, what did you do to balance the kind of extreme? Well, I'm saying extreme personalities, I don't know the guy. So I you may have very similar personalities, I don't know, but it's normally that these are quite different types of people to work together.

SPEAKER_01 18:01

Yeah, they are. They are, and actually, it's a recipe for success is to try to assemble different colors. Um, if you if you take uh, I mean, the dynamic of teams and uh the type of profiles um that you assemble, uh, you need to have this difference. And this goes back to the the point I was making earlier about the different point of view that this generates. Um so first element then is to is to establish trust. And uh once you have trust, this means that you leave the space to the others uh to be able to perform where they are strong versus uh them then uh letting you perform where you are strong. And uh and so so then the complement of the of both is much stronger than each of us trying to do the whole get the whole uh the whole uh uh story. So that's uh that's one element. Um and this starts with with really respect and trust. So but it also needs understanding. So you need to understand who you have on your side. Uh so so that's that's something that uh I was lucky enough to be able to develop through the uh the the years of uh my career, uh, and also through going through this uh type of uh analysis, analyz analysis of uh profiles. Um and uh the beauty is when you get to the point where you meet somebody, and after a couple of minutes, you know who you have in front of you, you know what type of profile without going through an analysis, a formal analysis, and then you can adapt yourself. And um, and so that's that's really very powerful uh if you get to that point.

SPEAKER_00 19:43

And um I think that's super interesting because you've achieved that, Christian, and it's complex, it's not easy, but I think what I like about it is that there's a degree of self-reflection, and that's where it starts. You know, once we understand ourselves, who we are, how we behave, what our strengths are, what our weaknesses are, we can then understand how we communicate with others who may be different and others who may be this similar to us, right? There's actually a quite an interesting book for um that I read recently focused on all of this, and it's called Um Surrounded by Idiots, which is quite a funny title, but it really um breaks it down very simply as to how people are different and how you need to communicate and respond differently to different people.

SPEAKER_01 20:26

Yeah, exactly. And and other people, most of the people, especially I'm gonna be tough with them, especially the blue guys, uh, they don't really get this feeling about the other profiles, and they don't get the feeling about what they do to the yellow people, for example, who are much more sensitive and therefore get get hurt, get get impacted by by by situations or by words. And um, and uh sometimes you need to educate them and just tell them, hey, what you're doing here is is really impacting me and hurting me or exciting me or whatsoever. Uh, because uh not everybody has the same sense of uh or and can um uh yeah, sense this uh this uh uh situation. So sometimes they just I mean they don't see it. They don't see it's it's happening. So if you don't tell them, if you tell them, then oh wow, this is happening. Um so uh when you share that, when you share that with them because you identify that they are actually not this kind of profile, very sensitive, then they open uh themselves to this new situation and they adapt. They adapt because they're I mean they are smart. Uh it's a piece of data that they add to their overall piece of uh overall uh framework, which they use because they like data. So it's uh it's kind of uh interesting to to have that and uh and then have the team uh I mean have your team understand that out of the 10 people in your executive team, there are 10. Different profiles and that they need to understand who they are.

SPEAKER_00 22:04

Yeah. You know, I think it's such an interesting uh topic and concept because you can have a team that functions really well and one that doesn't function well at all. And actually, it often comes down to the leadership understanding and also communication and transparency. And when you can give feedback that sometimes people don't want to hear, it's not easy to do. It's probably one of the hardest parts of the job to give feedback that may be perceived as negative, right? So um, but it's so important. And when you can have a team that respects you enough to take that feedback on board and make a change, then you're on the right path, you know. Um, so I think everything that you've you've been doing is is working in that sense.

SPEAKER_01 22:48

Yeah, it goes back to the humidity point. If you have the humility to listen to somebody giving you feedback and basically shut up, just take it, absorb it, learn from it, become better. Yeah, that's that's super as a as an attitude. And yeah, and then on on the feedback, it's not just judge, but uh, I mean set the set the stage with existing facts and then uh explain the impact and then give the feedback. So so you don't start with the feedback, you start with the obvious, what is really I this is black, okay, and the black the fact that it's black is having an impact on our business. Therefore, I recommend next time you do it a little more, a little bit more gray, yeah, and and the person is not saying, Oh, why do you tell me to change? No, it's very clear.

SPEAKER_00 23:38

Yeah, absolutely brilliant. Um, so you're leading in a space that's um often described as a perfect storm. So you have AI, dental data centers, and photonics. What makes commercializing advanced technologies fundamentally harder than scaling software?

SPEAKER_01 24:00

I think it's it's harder, and the beauty of making it harder is that it allows you to differentiate and to create some uh some barrier uh of entry to others. I mean, uh that's uh that's the beauty of hardware, and in particular photonique, and uh I actually realized that in particular in photonique, it's not just the chip that you do, it's actually how you connect it, how you package it. And that's that's an element which uh when I was uh in semiconductor was I would say uh level level two challenging out of ten. Here, it's level eight or nine, the the all the packaging and how you connect the fibers. So so that's that's really uh that's really interesting as um as uh a way to differentiate, um, because you can differentiate at different levels. Now, uh versus software. I mean, I've been in pure software, pure software goes very fast, can adapt, can be copied very fast. What's really interesting is when you actually merge the software and the hardware in your solution, because the software brings a dimension of flexibility that can enable you to adapt your solution to this evolution of the of the call it the peak of innovation that this particular market is requiring. So you can you can move from a peak to another one super rapidly and and capture the early value of this uh peak of innovation. And uh so so we're blessed in the iPronix that we have actually a layer of uh photonic hardware, then uh some electronic, and then a software that gives in, gives, I mean brings a lot of uh flexibility so the customers or us we can adapt uh the solution to the evolution uh even in real time. And uh so uh and here in the team, we have about a quarter of the team uh is uh dealing with software. Uh and then it's about three other quarters, which are uh complementary uh technology, whether it's photonic, electronic, packaging. Um, so that's uh having this balance is is making it a super strong team, and I think is also building uh differentiation.

SPEAKER_00 26:12

And how do you how for someone coming from semiconductors wanting to move into more photonics, how difficult is it for people to adapt to those different environments?

SPEAKER_01 26:27

So uh I mean moving from semiconductor to photonic, uh, you need to understand, and uh it's very interesting. I recently read uh an article from uh a veteran of uh of semiconductor who said what what semiconductor execs need to understand about photonic. And uh, and for example, I mean the fact that connecting a wire to bring uh photons is much easier than connecting actually a fiber, an optical fiber, because uh you deteriorate the signal just by not being perfectly aligned. And um and uh depending on what type of yeah uh of uh um glue you use, it's it's incredible. And so that's that's one piece of information. The other the you need to build, um, there are other um, I would say also human factor. Um, the photonic um space is a very small um uh community of experts and uh executives. I I am blessed to be now part of it, but I I still discover a lot of it. And um they know each other, they all know each other. They are super talented, super well trained. Most of them are PhD. I mean, you can see that this this space have been have been waiting its its uh its D-day, uh, and now it's accelerating, and and all of them can enjoy large volume business, and uh, and that's really exciting. We see the the the all the trade show, the conferences growing, growing, growing like crazy. I mean, we recently had a had a a webinar. We we organized ourselves, it was close to 1,000 participants. Wow, that's just incredible. So so it's it's actually connecting all these people around this new challenge and and potentially huge opportunity, and uh, and uh so we this I discover those people and I I also leverage the fact that they are connected. So several of my members and uh my team members, and in particular uh the CTO uh Danny is very well connected to this world, so it's important to know who they are, how they are connected, uh, and uh so we can really build uh uh collaboration across the ecosystem of Tonic. So we move faster. Again, we don't try to do everything in-house, we we collaborate with others.

SPEAKER_00 28:58

Yeah, I mean that's so important in in today's environment, the partnerships that you build, not just trying to do it all yourselves, because that's a that's a lot, right? So, no, that sounds brilliant. And we've talked before, Christian, about um maybe your role being more of a an orchestra conductor than center of stage. I know we've had this discussion before. How do you build teams um of deep specialists whilst keeping up speed, humility, humility, and collaboration, whilst keeping all of those things high?

SPEAKER_01 29:32

So, first of all, first of all, you try to bring people who have this type of values. The same way I was uh checking that this environment, this company has uh the value that I uh I are important to me. Um when you bring people in, you validate that point uh with each of the person. And uh that's something we do systematically. And when you do that, then you build you build uh a ground of of uh I mean a ground uh yeah uh of of people or a group of people that can really are shaped or are uh to are open to collaboration, are open to bring their expertise and and make it complementary with the other ones and and not try to sit on top, but really get together at a higher level. And that's that's really what uh we're trying to do. And and then you push the you push the the idea and and try to fight as soon as there is something else than uh then this happening in the company. Uh, because naturally uh it's like when you when you do your yard, there are always some bad grass that you need to keep fighting.

SPEAKER_00 30:42

Yeah, absolutely. And I think you touched on something really important um there, is that having the the values-based and culture-based discussions early on when you're interviewing, and I always say to my clients, do you have part of your interviewing process, which is based on values and culture? Because if you can get that right early on, it makes life a lot easier um later later down the line. But I see so many people missing this part out, and they go straight to the technology questions or you know, or something else. But this is absolutely crucial in getting the right fit to move forward. So, you know, hearing from you that you do that, I think is is absolutely brilliant. Um, another question for you in such a fast-moving and capital-intensive space, what leadership behaviors become essential and which traditional ones start to hold companies back?

SPEAKER_01 31:38

So it's a it's a question of, I think it's it's a lot a question of um, first of all, speed. So uh uh I brought with me some some way of working that we had in TI in a large corporation. And uh when I actually deployed here, I realized that um we are so agile, adapting fast, that uh we need to uh uh the cycles that we're going on the HR side, for example, we need to accelerate it. I mean, twice the speed, four times faster. So so really um that's uh that's one of the so really accepting to change the rhythm, the cadence, um, to be able to adapt uh to a new evolution that the team is taking and um the the company is taking. So that's that's one element. Um I would say, yeah, uh the other thing that is super important is uh, and it's something I've not seen a lot. I've seen it in a lot in in Nokia actually, uh, when we were collaborating with them, the decision making was really very low in the organization. It doesn't, it didn't have to go to a uh senior VP or VP to make a decision. They were a group of people knowing what they were doing and they were making the decision and they were empowered. And um that's something uh you don't oftentimes see. Uh you see much more of a pyramid type organization. And uh that's something we have deployed in iPronix. Uh we have what we call MDT, uh, multidisciplinary teams that are running big projects, I mean, fundamental project for us. And they they can, if things go well, they they we don't even hear about it. I mean, we just see the progress, but then they make the decisions. Of course, when they face a challenge, they have a dilemma, they can call uh the CTO or the VP Engineering or myself if need be, and then we help them make the decision. But it's really we help them make the decision. It's not we we end up taking the pen and doing it for them. So so that's uh that's a change uh that um that I have not seen often, and uh that I spotted when I arrived here, and I could see the the parallel to the success that those Nokia team in the wireless space had at the time. And I say, wow, that's another big plus, and that that's something that pulled me in as well.

SPEAKER_00 34:05

And I think, you know, I I hope um, Christian, people are listening to this and thinking, we need to think about this in Europe at the moment because there's so much going on in the world, and if we don't start changing our habits of how we're working, how decisions are made, we can't keep up. We can't keep up, you know, and you have this international experience, you've worked um, you know, in France, in the US, in Spain, and you've seen how different organizations run and you've seen what works over your career. And the fact that you've found yourself in a place now where things are working and they need to work and they need to work quickly to have success is absolutely brilliant. So I really hope that people take some of this on board because, you know, quite frankly, I I watch from the sidelines a lot of companies and I I look at how long things can take sometimes to get through, and how, I mean, in my job, you know, how some companies lose amazing candidates because they take six months to come to a decision on those people. And these are people who are absolutely top of their game, you know, and then then they lose another six months trying to find someone as good as that person they found in the first place, you know. So I see this all the time, and it's a disaster, quite frankly. It's a disaster for how quickly we need to be moving in Europe. So the fact that you're living this and you're seeing this, I really hope uh I hope that's a good idea.

SPEAKER_01 35:25

That's that's one of the reasons that's one of the reasons why we have fast as one of our value, and uh and that's one of the three. I mean, it's super important, and uh and I oftentimes translate that to my team. Hey, you can fail fast. I don't want you to fail slow, but you can fail fast, and then we'll adjust.

SPEAKER_00 35:47

Exactly. Exactly. And looking ahead, you know, maybe five to ten years, it I mean, it's so difficult to do that at the moment, but what what strategic dis decisions um that are made today will separate photonics and AI infrastructure companies that truly succeed from those that struggle?

SPEAKER_01 36:07

I think it goes back a lot to two elements. First of all, flexibility. So the fact that we build solutions that are future-proof. So so you can you can uh you can change. So, and that's that's part of the the reflection that our our product and RD team has in mind always is okay we deploy that. Is it is it ready for for evolution? Uh will it enable the the network that the the data center um uh hyperscaler is building to evolve. So it's uh evolved because AI is gonna continue to surprise us, uh, and we don't know how. So this flexibility is gonna be super important. So that's that's uh that's one of the I think the key elements that I would uh I would push. Uh and then the neck the next one is is try to have um enough um uh network architecture uh expertise in the company in order to anticipate on what could be the future uh peak of innovation that will or challenges that will pop up. Uh so it's really uh try to anticipate as fast as possible. And and in doing that, if you if you if you succeed uh to collaborate with leaders of this uh of this market, then you can start to actually get visibility on what their view is of what will be the future peak of innovation four years down the road, six years down the road. And then as semiconductor or photonic takes time to design, you can line up the roadmap together. And uh if you get to this type of uh really synergy uh with uh with those big uh companies, and we're lucky to in iPronix to have this type of relationship with real leaders in the data center space. Uh so hopefully this will develop it and and will get us to have this five, ten year visibility. Um then you can you can uh plan together. Uh you can of course adjust when the plan is changing, um, but at least you are on your way uh by opposition to just waiting for the thing to surprise you.

SPEAKER_00 38:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:28

So that's that's that type of relationship is super important to build.

SPEAKER_00 38:32

Yeah. And I mean, you collaborate with much larger players as well as competing with them. How do you how should deep tech leaders think about partnerships versus competition?

SPEAKER_01 38:44

Oh, I think you need to be super open for I'm personally always pushing the fact that uh we need to be open. What you need to have is a clear understanding of where you can collaborate, where you really compete hard. Uh and you need to be clear with your team and then give them the key of the car. So, hey, now it's clear. The trunk stays closed, but all the rest can be open and can be tuned. Uh, like for example, we we we we created a group in our domain, which is OCS, optical circuit switch, uh, for this data center. We created a space in OCP, uh, which is a standardization body, kind of, uh, where um actually a part of our solution, which is the software part, can be standardized, can be unified so that the type of product that we're doing can be uh rapidly uh adopted and uh and moving from one to the other at the software level. So it's not a problem, it's not a pain point uh for the for the end customer. It's actually uh a lot of standardization. Then below that, there will be a lot of differentiation and trade secret. So so I think that's how you build collaboration even with uh competitors, and uh so that's co-petition, that's something there are books from many, many years ago. Uh but uh I think it's a question of defining what what is in the trunk which is staying locked, locked, and what is open uh that you want to uh make uh make the life of the customer easier.

SPEAKER_00 40:17

Yeah, brilliant. And um how do you balance moving fast and failing fast with the realities of hardware and long development cycles and customer risk?

SPEAKER_01 40:31

So this is this is um uh actually something that uh I want to give credit to my my team, and what uh I've seen them do is uh they anticipate. So uh we are building something which is new, uh which has never been made. And um, so they try to solve the future problem ahead of time and and plan some solutions that are in selectivity in the fab uh with uh three, four months uh lead time, but they they trigger new versions with potential solutions ahead of time. So then when we face a problem down the road, we know that there are some alternatives that are coming. So it's really a question of anticipating and playing some alternatives, several alternatives uh in the pipe. This is costing money, obviously. The beauty is that silicon photonic is about 10 times cheaper in terms of wafers, uh, and doing a tape out in a silicon photonic fab is about 10 times cheaper than in an uh advanced uh semiconductor node. So um you can actually do that. Uh and uh so we're doing it. We're doing it massively, and by doing that, when you face the problem, you know, oh, by the way, next week we have this version, and then the week after this version, and then you can find a solution out of this uh uh this multiple uh iteration or alternative that you have pre-built.

SPEAKER_00 42:03

Okay, great. And for you over your career, what have been what have been uh the most personally challenging moments for you as a leader in such a demanding environment? Because it is a demanding environment, and anyone at the forefront of any of these deep tech of photonics chip companies, there's an enormous amount of pressure and there's an enormous amount of stress that may come with that. So, for you over your career, what have been the most personally challenging moments for you as a leader in such a demanding environment?

SPEAKER_01 42:37

So, when you ask this question, the the memory that comes to me is actually the situation where I have taken roles where actually the value were totally orthogonal with mine, where I was forced by by the board and by the shareholders to do things which are not me. And uh and when you do that, you actually can really become even sick. Um, you can really deteriorate yourself. And um, so that's one element I've learned uh is not to accept that. Uh, but sometimes it's difficult actually to uh get the information before uh taking such a role. So that's uh that's one uh that has been really fundamental to me and uh and and very painful. Um but then you need to know how to uh unplug.

SPEAKER_00 43:32

Yeah, exactly. And how do you unplug, Christian? I think I know, but for everyone out here, what do you do to get away from it all to relax? Where do you find yourself?

SPEAKER_01 43:42

Okay, so so uh actually uh I have I'm blessed to have a first of all a very nice family and very large family. I mean, I have four kids, I have now 10 grandkids, so uh it's it's uh it's amazing. I mean, I really encourage anybody, I mean, have kids because. Not only are they beautiful people, but they actually uh are always ready to exchange, to benefit from what you can bring them, and to show you some tremendous funny situation, fun situation. So that's really uh uh super um to have. And then then what I have also is uh I have a I have a passion uh which is uh sailing. So I do a lot of sailing, actually a little less these days, uh, but and I do racing in sailing with uh with a boat, very very advanced boat and uh and uh very advanced team. We're about 10 in the team, and uh that's so there are a lot of learnings from this experience when you are at sea uh in a race with a team of 10. You can see exactly the same situations as uh when you are uh fighting to make a design win and uh getting feedback, and you need to respond the same night, and then everybody gets on the phone or in the room, and uh that's very similar. There are a lot of similarity, and I I could speak for hours about that.

SPEAKER_00 45:09

I love it. And what about um over the course of your career? What have you learned about yourself as a person and what's changed for you over the years?

SPEAKER_01 45:21

I've learned who I am, and I've learned to try not to be somebody I'm not. And uh I think that's that's really what uh what I've learned. Uh yeah, that's that's the the fundamental one. And uh if you if you stress on who you are really and how it this can help the team, and you put this available to the team, then um yeah, it's being used, and you're satisfied because then you add value and the team is satisfied. If you try to to play it upside down and you try to be somebody who you're not, uh and pretend one day or another you're you're not efficient, you are viewed, and you are not uh yeah, uh adding value. So that's the thing.

SPEAKER_00 46:09

And yeah, yeah, this is so important. It's such an important point. And and I I always say to leaders to try to figure out about yourself where your unique brilliance lies. What are you amazing at and where are you going to bring most value? Because often, when certainly when you start a company or you're in a growing company, you end up doing a bit of everything because it's like there's no one else there to do it. So you end up having to do loads of stuff that maybe you're not brilliant at. But actually, when you can move more towards the things that you are brilliant at and build a team around you that supports you and does the things that you're less brilliant at, that's when the magic actually happens. And so that self-reflection, the taking the time to sit down and go, hang on a minute, what energizes me? What lifts me up? When I'm doing which pieces of work do I feel great? And of course, we all have moments in our work that aren't great, but the more work we do that lights us up, the more the company benefits, the colleagues benefit, and we benefit, and the much less likely we are to burn out, which is a big problem in senior executives because a lot of people try and do it all. They try and feel like they need to know everything. And you know, you don't need to know everything. You know what you know, you can't possibly know everything. And once you can drop that kind of ego that's in our ear of saying we should know that or we should know that, um, then you start to go, well, I don't know that. Do I need to know it? Not always. We don't need to. So it's that self-awareness that that for me, I learn over the years is what makes a good strong leader. And when they start with themselves and they look at themselves first, then they can build a strong team around them. But before they get to that point, they're gonna have many failures because they're trying to do it all, they're trying to know it all, and it's impossible. And I watch companies, people sitting in in senior positions, and this to me is a big point of failure. So once they've got to that part of their life where they can actually be really honest and say it doesn't matter that I can't do that, it doesn't matter that I can't do that because I'm actually brilliant at this, and that's where I'm needed. That's when the good stuff starts to really happen, and satisfaction happens in the career.

SPEAKER_01 48:29

Exactly. And and I think the name of the game is uh don't lie to yourself.

SPEAKER_00 48:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:35

Because oftentimes you know yourself, you know yourself, but you lie to yourself. Yeah, and uh I've been I've been doing it. I've been doing it now. I'm lucky enough that I'm in an environment where I can be myself, and uh and that's that's so much fun.

SPEAKER_00 48:53

Yeah, and I'm you know, and I'm I'm watching from the sidelines, Christian, and I'm sure um that you're gonna do a great job, and the company's gonna go a long way. So it's exciting times, absolutely. One last question for you, Christian. For leaders who are early in their career, what helped you the most and what would you approach differently now?

SPEAKER_01 49:16

So, first of all, you need to um you need to as soon as possible try to get really what lights you up. Uh so I was speaking about values uh and what really lights you down, um, and uh and try to avoid to go to the ladder. So that's that's the first point. Um, so really avoid it. There are many, many companies, many, many places where you can act. Um, that's one element. Then I think um you should, I mean, don't try to um be alone and resolve all your problems alone. Um there are people that can help you because actually you you know about yourself what you see, okay, which is the front of yourself, but actually people see what's in the back. And so by construction, they have more information than you about you. Uh so if you if you I really encourage uh people, I mean those leaders to uh get support from the outside from other people that are uh genuinely uh willing to help and have a have a this different point of view about uh the individual. And um, yeah, so absorb. Absorb as much information, have the humility to listen quietly about yourself and about your environment, and then absorb it and reflect and then move on.

SPEAKER_00 50:45

Brilliant, thank you. And final one, Christian, for you. When you look ahead, what do you believe will remain timeless about leadership, even if technology and markets continue to change at speed?

SPEAKER_01 51:02

I think the word that comes to me is the is fun, is the pleasure to actually be with the team and and and build tremendous things or actually small victories um with the team. Uh and and this is super satisfactory and and fun. And uh and that's really what's gonna remain for me. And when I look back and I I see those, I uh I look at uh what remains, it's really those super fun moments where we were together fighting challenges and uh deciding which solution we're gonna pick, and then uh playing it and hopefully winning it.

SPEAKER_00 51:48

Wow, this is this is amazing.

SPEAKER_01 51:51

This is amazing.

SPEAKER_00 51:52

Yeah, brilliant. Well, thank you so much, Christian, for sharing um all your thoughts with us today. I've really enjoyed our discussion and learned so much um from you as well, and I'm sure many people will. So thank you so much for being here, and um, I wish you all the best um with iPronics. I think uh I think it's gonna be one to watch.

SPEAKER_01 52:12

Thank you very much. Bye Lucy.