Me Versus Me: Pro Triathlete Meg Dirito on Racing, Motherhood, and Never Choosing Between Them.

Meg Dirito (@dirito21) has never separated who she is from what she does. She swam D1 at Bucknell, where she is now in the Hall of Fame. She became an emergency vet. She became a mother. And when triathlon found her in 2018 — she didn't know how to ride a bike — she became that too.

In this conversation, Meg talks about what it looks like to hold all of it without letting any of it go. Three workouts on her days off. Training during her two-hour lunch break between ER shifts. The grace she gives herself on the days that fall apart — and why playing Scrabble with her son sometimes matters more than the bike session.

She races as a pro. She comes in at the back of the field. She has made her peace with that completely, because she long ago decided that the only race worth running is the one against yesterday's version of herself.

This is a conversation about discipline, joy, and what it means to build a life where nothing has to be sacrificed — just integrated.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:01

Hi everyone, um, welcome back to Strong Core. Um, I'm Iris, and I have today a very special guest. I say it every episode, but Meg is very special, and you'll get to know her today and her heart. And I think you're going to fall in love. I have almost an unfinished business, if you will, with Meg. Uh, we were together on the same um triathlon squad, which was a lot of fun, and somehow our ways and our races never crossed. And I always wanted to interview her. In my initial study, she wasn't included because you learned today that Meg, among other things, is a pro-triathlete. And in my study, I looked at what the literature, I guess, called amateur moms, because I wanted to see what happens when you actually don't even get paid or get any benefits. Um, and that helped when you try to control the all, but I think that's not a study what we're doing today. And Meg's story is so inspiring, and I think you are gonna get um a lot out of her. Um in the show notes, I will include her um uh uh Instagram handler so you can follow her and learn more about uh everything that she does as a mom, as a vet, as a pro tri athlete, and everything in between. So welcome, Meg.

SPEAKER_03 1:12

Thank you. I am super excited. I absolutely love talking about this topic. And I'm just so happy to be invited to to talk today. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

Thank you so much. And I hear that from other moms as well, or other people who are training for an Iron Man or long distance endurance, and they say, I'm so glad someone is talking about it. And that's really the purpose. It's the lived experience of a very small group of women that um I'd like to amplify their voices and and share with the world how amazing these women are. So let's uh start at the beginning. Tell the audience a little bit about yourself, your family, what do you compete in, and what is a typical day looks like for you?

SPEAKER_03 1:54

Yeah, so a sport has like always been an important part of my life. Um, I started like just doing sport when I was three. My mom put me in ballet. Um and they always told me, like they always told my mom, like, oh, she can't be in, you know, in there, she's too young. And my mom was like, give her a chance, give her a chance. Um, so like starting at such a young age, sport became like who I was. Um, and I and I I loved it and I never stopped since. Um, but as I got older and you know, graduated from college and having kids, I kind of like maybe lost my identity, lost my sports identity. Um, I just feel like juggling with kids and and all of that, I just didn't I I told myself I didn't have time to do anything and I was tired. Um, you know, my husband was so used to me. Like he married me as an athlete and coming out of a D1 swim school, and he was like, Are you gonna start working out again? And I was just like, I was just like, Well, I'm just so tired. I'm just not ready. I'm like, I'll let you know when there's time, you know, and it took a long time for me to figure out that balance and that it was possible and and that it was, you know, I was capable of doing both, and not only doing both, but showing my kids what is possible, you know. So I just started picking up triathlon in 2018. I did not know how to ride a bike, I didn't know how to do anything.

SPEAKER_01 3:17

You knew how to swim.

SPEAKER_03 3:18

I knew how to swim, yes. I did. I swam for college, um, division one college. Um, so I was like, okay, if I can swim, and my husband cycled for NC State. So he was the one that taught me how to ride a tri-bike. I was not very good. I fell into a bush many times. Um, and that's kind of where I started and just kind of put it together. And I just kept at it. And I wanted to set an example for my kids to show them that, you know, it's possible to keep, you know, keep learning and keep moving.

SPEAKER_01 3:48

So before we go into your typical day, uh, there's a couple of uh questions I want to ask you. Um tell us a little bit how long was that period of time where you actually didn't do sport? You got um you you did it through college, you got married, started having kids. Did you not do any sport while you had um uh babies? Or and and when did you come back?

SPEAKER_03 4:10

So in uh in 2012, my daughter was born. So obviously when I was pregnant that year, I stopped doing everything. I just it was a little overwhelming for me. And just the pregnancy itself was a lot, so I didn't really do much. My daughter was born in 2012. And you stopped, you stopped because there was a fear exercising while being pregnant? Uh, I think it was the way that I felt. It was hard for me to like it was a new pregnancy was new, so like it was hard for me to like go at the level that I had been. Um, and so I just didn't really do anything. And it actually got worse after my daughter was born. I did nothing. Absolutely nothing. Same here. Yeah, and I and I had some complications. I had mastitis a couple times and just just getting through that. And my daughter all the way up to like eight months was very difficult. She was colicky, she didn't sleep through the night. I spent hours walking at 2 a.m., you know, back and forth and back and forth, and my husband driving her in the car to try to get her to sleep. You know, we just had worse, it was just sheer exhaustion. Yes. And then I got pregnant with my son. He was born in 2014, so they're less than two years apart and still tired. I was just like, I'm exhausted. I can't, I just can't even do this. And I was, I think I was just trying to figure out how to be a mom. That was my goal at the time. It wasn't to be the sports person that I was, it was how do I be a mom? I, you know, and now how do I be a mom to two kids, you know? Um, and then after my son was born in 2014, it was I was still figuring it out. And my daughter at that time had gotten better with her sleeping and her, you know, but now I had another child. And I was like, okay, how do I do both of these? And my husband has always been amazing. He is a partner, he shares the duties, like he, you know, but it's it's hard. It's new, you know, and you think like, I don't think I had time for me, you know. And as my son got slightly older, my husband was still like, are you gonna work out? And I'm like, no, I'm not. And it wasn't until I want to say 2016 that I actually started working out. That was four years. Um, and I think at that time I I had things maybe sort of figured out. My kids were a little bit more like even-keel and stable in their sleeping. And I found an old book that I had had from a while ago, and it was how to do your first triathlon. I I one day I was just sitting there and I picked it up and I'm like, I remember this book. I got it at like the bookstore. So I started flipping through and it had like your different programs, like your beginner, your sprinter, whatever. And I was like, okay, I'm gonna do a sprint. And that was the day that I started. And I showed my husband and I was like, I found this old book and I think I want to do one. And he was like, let's do it. So that's when I started.

SPEAKER_01 7:15

I usually don't actually talk about, I do talk about the kids with participants, but I don't talk much about the partner, other than usually it's they support me, they help me, we figure it out. But there is something about your story that got my attention. Husband knew you as an athlete. Yeah. And it sounds like I'm not trying to go into the marriage relationship, but just kind of understanding the psychology of identity. It sounds like he was missing the athlete identity that he knew in his wife, right? And that's why it sounds like he kept asking you, when are you gonna go back to training?

SPEAKER_03 7:49

He actually told me for like months and months he would get on the internet and he said, How do I get my wife to work out again? Why? I don't know, because when he when we met each other, I was in vet school down at NC State, and I worked out every day. We I ran a lot. Um, and he he so he was also an athlete. He kicked for NC State, and he was a cyclist, he was on their cycle team. So we identified originally as like athletes who like connected, and and we would do things ever when we went out on dates, it was let's go ride our bikes, let's go run around the lake, let's do all of this, and then all of a sudden, this woman that he knew was very different, you know, and he was just like missing his partner, yeah. And maybe he thought that something was missing in in me too. Yeah, and it was, but I he knew it, but I just I didn't know how to get there.

SPEAKER_01 8:46

Yeah, and and and it's okay you um to take the time and figure it out, but it sounds like he was holding up the mirror and saying, Hey, I see you, but you you couldn't see yourself. Okay, and so um there was a little bit of a void. Uh it doesn't sound like you were even, at least in your description, missing your athletic identity. You're so immersed in learning how to be a mom. So that wasn't even a ambivalence there. It's just yeah. And then all of a sudden there was some once you got things somewhat under control, to yourself, I'm gonna go after it. So I I I I cut you off because I was so interested in your story. Before we're gonna go how your day looks like, which I asked before, I I think the tag on question that makes sense to ask right now is you started doing sport at from the age of three, but when did you recognize, when did you start calling yourself athlete?

SPEAKER_03 9:38

I've always called myself an athlete ever since I was little. Just because I started so so young and from ballet, I went to be a gymnast. And I competed all the way up to elite level gymnastics when I was in third grade.

SPEAKER_01 9:53

So my For the listeners who don't know the gymnastics world, including me, explain to us what what that level means.

SPEAKER_03 9:59

So in gymnastics, you start at like your regular like classes. Level three would be like your first level, and it's more compulsory, so everyone does the same routines. So that goes all the way up to level 10, and then you go to elite. Um, when you get to like level 10 and elite, it's more of what you see on TV. Like everyone has a different routine, it's optional. So I started gymnastics in third grade, and we trained like I want to say 20 hours a week, even at a young age. And my mom um and dad never wavered every practice, every meet. We traveled, we went to nationals, um, and I actually competed up to that high level until ninth grade. And the funny thing is, I gymnastics is a very, very hard sport. Um, you know, and I loved it. But when I got to ninth grade, I thought, wow, maybe there's some other sports in high school, you know, that I would want to try.

SPEAKER_01 10:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 10:55

And I kind of, I kind of got really tall for gymnastics when I got to ninth grade, you know. So like being on the bars, I would always like clip my feet or whatever. And I think at that time I I was ready to experience something different. And the demands of gymnastics really started to get to me. And so I told my mom one day, I said, I love gymnastics, but I think I'm ready to move on and always support for my family. And they said, Okay, that's fine. Um, and my mom at the time was like, okay, we're done with this like intense sport thing. Like, we're good. And then I came to her one day and I said, Mom, I want to swim. And she said, Well, that's another very demanding sport. And I said, I know it's okay. I'll get a ride. And my mom was like, I don't think so. I I think we're gonna, we're good. And me being me, I didn't listen to my mom. And I signed up for swimming. And my dad was always the one that was like, Yeah, let's do it, let's do it. My mom's like, no, no. So I signed up for swimming, I got rides, and I started swimming in ninth grade and got a scholarship by my senior year. So amazing.

SPEAKER_01 11:57

Yeah, I just and I tell you just because I follow you um on Instagram, I know that for the listeners to know, Meg went to Bucknell and swam there D1, and she's in the Hall of Fame.

SPEAKER_03 12:08

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:10

So it wasn't like, you know, just getting by with college years. I don't know if you know this about me, but I actually have a similar tidbit of a story. I was also a gymnast when I was younger. Okay. I got also so tall that they moved me into artistic gymnastics. Oh, I love it. And the ribbon, and I loved it actually. But then something in me, I don't actually remember why or how. I also wanted to try swimming. So at 12, I moved into swimming and I was just natural floating. So sex stroke is my thing. Nice. And yeah, uh, that that's how my love with swimming. But it's it's like two completely different sports.

SPEAKER_03 12:46

You wonder how it translates. I have no idea. And why you like all of a sudden I want to swim. I I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 12:53

Yeah, the the that requires another study, I think. We're moving to to swimming, but yeah, uh just uh I I like the kind of your sequence and it it reminded of a little bit of my history. All right. By the way, your parents were athletes, or this type of support and pushing uh gently, at least from gymnastics at the beginning, came from their background or no?

SPEAKER_03 13:16

No, neither did sports. They were just so heavily involved in my I have a brother as well, and he did all the bald sports, so like football, baseball, basketball. Um, they were so heavily involved in our sports and our traveling, and I I can honestly say I've never been to a game or a swim meet where my parents were not at. They were always there. So my support group, and that that they taught me to be supportive, to be there, you know, because that's important in success.

SPEAKER_01 13:45

I was just about to say that I'm watching you following your kids to every tournament, every swim meet, I should say. Uh I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm using a wrestling mom language uh with the tournament, but it's every swim meet, I see you traveling with them. And so you are also mimicking that.

SPEAKER_03 14:01

And yes, they taught me well, yeah, to be an integral part of their growth is to being present.

SPEAKER_01 14:08

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:09

And we are. Well everybody.

SPEAKER_01 14:10

You always saw yourself as an athlete, you tried multiple sports, there was a break, and then you found yourself again. And then I go back to the loaded question I asked at the beginning. I said, tell me a little bit about yourself, about your family. I think by now we know that you're married, you have two kids. What are their ages?

SPEAKER_03 14:26

So my son is 11 and my daughter just turned 13.

SPEAKER_01 14:30

And they're both swimmers.

SPEAKER_03 14:31

They are both swimmers, yeah. They compete at high levels. So they train like 20 hours a week as well.

unknown 14:36

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 14:36

So we're just I'm gonna go uh in a little bit to the identity of a mom of an athlete. Okay. And so now back to you with the question I start with. Uh, what's a typical day look like for you?

SPEAKER_03 14:49

So I'm an ER doctor, so my shifts are very sporadic. So I work 10 shifts a month. So I have two separate identities of like days. So, like on the days that I work, I work 12-hour shifts. Usually my daughter will have morning swim practice. So we both get up at 4 o'clock. I get her, I fix her breakfast because it's important. I've been trying to teach my kids it's very important to eat before you do any kind of, you know, so we make time for that. And we have breakfast, we're out the door by 4 50, we're at the pool by 5 30. Um, we swim until 6 30. Um, no, this is this is twice a week. We do this. Yes. And usually on the days that I work. And then at 6 30, she gets a ride to school with some of her teammates. I come back home to get my son ready for the bus. He gets ready, he gets on the bus, he goes to school, I go to work. I work for 12 hours. I do get a two-hour lunch break. So my team is really good. They know that I leave for lunch for two hours. I go to the gym, I swim for an hour, I do mobility for 20 minutes, and then sometimes I'll either do like a three-mile run or I'll bike, and then I get back to work. I work until 8:30 and I'm home by 9:30. So that's my work day. That's my work day. If I'm home, which I'm home more than I'm working, my day revolves around my kids, you know. So I used to wake up super early, but since I'm waking up on those other days, I just get up when my kids get up. Again, I fix some breakfast, get them to school. My morning, so I'm huge on I have to sit down and have my coffee before I do anything. Do nothing. Like I don't want to like, you know, I just want to be me and chill. I'll have my coffee and then I'll do about three workouts a day. So I will hold on, hold on.

SPEAKER_01 16:41

What?

SPEAKER_03 16:42

Three workouts a day? Yeah. So after my coffee, I'll do my morning workout, which is either like an hour run or an hour and a half bike. And then I'll have lunch and hang out with my dogs. My husband works from home, so we kind of like hang out and chill because he he's always busy too, but I try to catch him. And then I'll do another workout and then I will shower really quick. I have to leave the house by 1:30. I pick my daughter up early from school because she does online school at the end of the day because she trains. Get her at two. She's at the pool by three. And then when I drop her off at three, I go to the gym, I do my third workout, and then I pick her up at 6:30. So she has like a three, eight hour workout. We head home, we cook dinner together, and then I do my recovery stuff. So, like my recovery boots, my Farragon, while we watch TV together. So that's my type of body.

SPEAKER_01 17:37

We can do some meditation here. No, this is I think I'm an intense woman, like with all the activities that I add up in my life, and that sound when I use the word intense, I mean it from like consistency and being so accurate with your timing. I think that's hard. How? How and why? What why are you doing why are you doing this to yourself?

SPEAKER_03 18:04

Um everyone always says, like, why do you do this to yourself? But I am doing this because I I love it. Like, I love my structure, I love the way that working out makes me feel. I love nutrition, I love being healthy, I love teaching my kids these things because I want them to like carry that on because they're in sports, they train just as much as I do. They have to understand what it means to be consistent. And and and and who am I to say you should go to practice even though you're tired if I don't show up? So I say, Well, I'm gonna drop you off at swimming and I'm gonna go swim too.

SPEAKER_01 18:42

So I'll be the devil's advocate, like maybe an a listener here that is not an endurance sport or maybe in the shorter distances, thinking about tapping into the longer distances. One might say to yourself, by the way, I saw a research, I think, from US uh triathlon that the majority of people are doing one, men and women, not just women, doing one Iron Man, kind of check the box type of a thing, and then not coming back. Yeah. I'm really interested in the persistence of keep coming back. Is there no moment that you say to yourself, I've done it, I proved them that I do hard things, I can do do other hard things.

SPEAKER_03 19:21

Yes, yes, and and and that does like pop up in my mind because I I love triathlon. But if you've noticed, and like for anyone that has followed me, I have opened my doors to doing other things as well.

SPEAKER_01 19:33

Gravel, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 19:34

Yeah. So like I have not pigeon pigeonholed myself into I am just a triathlete. I am a triathlete, but I'm a swimmer and I prioritize, I go to open water swims. I also love gravel cycling. I'm going to unbound this year and I'm going to gravel worlds. You know, so even though I'm a triathlete, I can also run and I can also swim and I can bike too. So you have so many opportunities because you do three sports and you can do all of them, you know. And and for me, that keeps me it keeps it interesting. It keeps it fun, you know, and you know, and if you talk to me, I love swimming, so I'll do anything swimming, you know. Like if my friend will be like, let's go to so and so and do an open water swim, the answer is always yes, I'll be there. You know, so I just feel like make it like at my age, I want to be happy. I want to do things that make me happy. So I do all of it, you know.

SPEAKER_01 20:27

If uh God forbid, knock on wood, you were to get injured and for a while, not permanently. Yeah. And you can't do all those things. What would happen to Meg, the athlete?

SPEAKER_03 20:40

I think I would adapt. I think I'm very adaptable, and I think that I would find something else I love. Because I I've always I have other passions too. I love writing, I love photography, um, I love creating, you know. I like as you can see, I work with a lot of brands to do their their UGC and their creating. I love it. And and I I you know, I told my husband, I'm like, I'm like, I I just do it because I I love it. I think it's fun. Yeah, you know, and sometimes people are always like, you're promoting all these brands. And I'm like, I love it. I have fun creating.

SPEAKER_01 21:11

I get it. I get it. I I really I get it. You know, I I I want to side note kind of this in this conversation, this whole podcast ID. I didn't know for a year after I finished my PhD, I was like, should I do it? Should I not? I really wanted to because I wanted to bring those stories to life, but I was afraid I don't know how to do the technicalities. We just had some issues before we started, as you know, you know. Um, what will people say? You know, stuff like that. And then I said, fuck it. Yeah, we'll say whatever if I do it or not. So do it. And the other thing that I loved, and I mentioned it um in in an interview actually the other day to someone else. I re listened to Rich Roll podcast, and uh, he was saying something about when you don't know what to do, lean into your curiosity. Yeah, loved it, and I was curious about it. So it sounds like that's what you're doing. There are other areas that you're curious, so you're expanding yourself and you're not. limited to the identity of a pro-triathlete and that's what I do.

SPEAKER_03 22:03

Yeah. And I I think it's learning too. Like I've always like learned like, you know, you pick up triathlon and you're like, I don't really know how to do this. Even like when you're like creating for brands, you're like, well, I don't really know how to create. You know, so I just started doing it. And, you know, I learn every single time. Like I'm like still learning. I'm like, oh, this is how you like do this and this. And oh that's cool. And like my things get better and better and better, just like sport. You know, you're like, I keep at it. You keep working at it. If you are afraid and you give up, you're never gonna get to that point where you're good at something.

SPEAKER_01 22:37

You know?

unknown 22:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:38

No, absolutely. I don't know. I don't think I need to apologize to bring the research here. I actually love how it meets and kind of validates. One of the frameworks I loved that I found out in in the literature is called hero. Actually it's called psychological capital, which is kind of your money.

SPEAKER_03 22:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:55

But when it's related you know to mindset and psychological capital have four things under it. It's called hero, which always makes me smile because we're in the Iron Man world and the hero world, right? And here we are talking about Iron Moms. Yeah. And what hero stands for is hope, self-efficacy is for efficacy, which is okay believing in yourself. R is for resilience, the ability to bounce back from setbacks, if you will, and the O is for optimism. And I'm mentioning it right now because what you just said about well if I won't have triathlon, I'll have other things. I will and that sense of optimism, right? There's al and hope, right? There's always a way uh I'll figure it out, I'll find something else to do is really important psychological capital that I think um it's so good that that you have it with you.

SPEAKER_03 23:44

Yeah and I think it's also important for kids too like that are in high like sport because their life becomes that sport but you also have to be like so I've told my kids I'm like you have to have other things. So they my daughter plays the cello my t my son plays the trumpet my daughter's in student council I was like you have to have other things. Swimming is not your only identity I was like you know God forbid you stop swimming.

SPEAKER_01 24:06

You have to you have to you know have other things and I think it's I'm following a few uh mental coaches if you will on Instagram that were D1 athlete and they're talking about that transition into life after you're a D1 and kind of you losing an identity of an athlete and trying to find yourself in the a lot of time it helps you find jobs right and talk about this but for the majority it's a huge loss. You don't have that structure and friend group that understands how you live and think and that's a loss also.

SPEAKER_03 24:38

Now you say that I honestly when I graduated from Bucknell and I was done swimming I was a maybe I don't say I I I'm not wasn't depressed but there was a void and I was like what do I do now? Like I don't know what to do. Do I keep swimming? I don't I don't know what to do. You know and it took a while you know and I did go to vet school so I went to the Caribbean to go to vet school and I found running and surfing you know so I I was like okay you know still swimming sort of with surfing and scuba diving but yeah there was that void when you're done the you know training for something big and you're like now what?

SPEAKER_01 25:15

You know? And I heard that in your story and many other stories. It happens again in motherhood for many many athletes moms were, even if they weren't D1, but you know they were exercising going spinning or running and all of a sudden motherhood just took over and you become wife of and mother of and you are also building your career it's early a you know it's around the 20s 30s of your life you're also trying to build your career. So sport is identities kind of being pushed to the side but then once women it sounds like to me mothers are able to establish themselves in the work right and start promoted and feeling more comfortable and also figuring in motherhood right um then they're like where's me in all of this and that's where I find the mothers yeah getting back into finding their identity finding who I am in the literature it's called me time. Many of them are saying I need time for myself to be away from wife of and mother of and um you need your own identity for sure you do you do a lot of discipline about and structure around how you go about your day no doubt that you're able to to keep this but I want to hear about the let's let's let's let's break it open a little bit what about the days that things are not working well and you're not able to do three workouts and the more breakfast and the dinner how do you feel when that happens um I am okay because I give myself grace and you know I say yeah I do race at a very high level but my life story is different than some of the other pro tray athletes that you you know that you've see.

SPEAKER_03 26:48

And I have given myself a lot of grace so like we'll spend like hours and hours on at on the weekend at a swim meet and I'll come home at like five o'clock you know and I I'll in my head I'll have like this huge workout and I'll come home I'm exhausted and and I say to myself okay maybe if I and even my husband is great with this he's like if you just do something turn it to something easy go spin for an hour you're gonna feel better and so like I allow myself to adapt and I'll change it. You know and I I've had a lot of coaches and they've all been great but I think we've always had trouble together because I have changed stuff so many times on my workouts because of what how my life is you know and eventually I'll be like all right if I can't get this hard workout in today I'll just move it to another day. Today is going to be easy.

SPEAKER_01 27:38

So I think it's just giving yourself grace that it is okay to be like I can't do anything today or I'm trying I'm trying to get on a bus store into Meg's brain on days that are hard like this and it happens a lot to moms with bitty k busy kids it and it's also and I want to ask you this so you just want to be on the sofa and just like chill and you say you and your husband encouraging you go go you know on the bike for an hour. I get the feeling good after I totally do. But does your brain say nah just stay on the sofa you deserve it and if not I I want to hear about this negotiation the two voices in the head the one that is telling you just chill calm down rest you okay nothing will happen if you'll miss the workout versus the other voice that is pushing you challenging you gently and at the end gets you out of the couch. Take us to the bus store in your mind.

SPEAKER_03 28:32

It's definitely a conflict in my mind. It's like the dedicated Meg that's like just do it be disciplined I know it's not gonna be good but do it and then there's the other Meg that's like maybe you should just stop and and relax and and so it it is a conflict and sometimes one wins over the other you know and it depends on the day and what I've done. So sometimes I do just say I'm not doing anything today because I just physically and mentally cannot um so I think it just depends on what I have done that day that is so taxing. Yes I mean there's been days where I just physically am exhausted like I'm like I just can't do one more thing because most of my day has been like driving like I am a taxi for my kids you know I know you know and it and it just it is hard it's difficult because you know you're like I have to train I have to train I have to train yes but this part of me is like no you have to recover you have to stop you need to stop and that's hard that's hard for me to not do it sometimes not every time when you miss a workout do you feel guilty I'm pausing because I want to say no but yes I do feel guilty because I feel like now you're behind you haven't done that workout but it doesn't last my guilt doesn't last I do feel guilty.

SPEAKER_01 29:54

What do you do to bounce back?

SPEAKER_03 29:56

I just hang out with my kids we do something fun we play a game and I'm like you know what this is way better than spending that hour spinning mindlessly I spent the hour playing Scrabble with my son and I was like I got way more out of that than just mindlessly spinning on the bike.

SPEAKER_01 30:12

Yeah so I want to put the spotlight on what you just said and say that one of the things I found in my study, this is where I kind of modified and added if you will to research is there's the hero as a psychological capital but it's one more thing that women do really well and it could be because they're mothers or it could be because we're wired differently as we as females. Yeah and the self-compassion so I call it she ro instead of hero and adding the self-compassion to the bit to the start of the hero and it's this ability to just say today you're gonna miss the workout you're okay.

SPEAKER_03 30:45

It's a hard concept to like to grasp you know because you feel like I have to do this I have to do this and I'm type A I gotta check the boxes and if one is empty it bothers me you know it does.

SPEAKER_01 30:56

Let me let me stay here in this diet because I I'm the same not that your level not three times a day but it actually used to really upset me. Let's say I had an hour workout but I got delayed with work and now I have only 45 40 minutes because I have to like shower quickly and change clothes and drive because you don't want to sit sweaty you know in the car for two hours. And then I'll say to myself no I'm not doing this because I don't want the the orange dot which is for those listeners who don't have an app it means it's incomplete. Maybe you overdid it sometimes or maybe you underdid it. I don't want that orange so I'll wait until we come back and then I'm gonna do the run and it will be green and either I'm running at 9 p.m which is not helpful because then your resting heart rate is off for the rest of the night right or I don't do it. I'll do it tomorrow and then I have to work well I shouldn't complain with you with having three but now I have two two workouts to do and it's like this chasing perfection that I had to learn how not to and be okay with an orange dog. Do you do you have the same do you feel the same?

SPEAKER_03 31:58

And and so one of my big like platforms as far as like that is really important to me is letting women know that you are strong and you are powerful and that you can you can be good like you can be a good CEO. You can be good at your job but you can also be a good mom too you know and and that's a hard concept for us to grasp because us as moms think that we just have to do it all and we we you know that we can't be good at sport or we can't do this. You know and it and it's hard and you know it's just you have to know that you're capable of so much and then and it but it's giving yourself grace too you know like I can be really good at my job I can be really good at sport but sometimes it just isn't gonna work out and I have to be okay with that.

SPEAKER_02 32:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:41

I have to be okay with not doing a workout or modifying it you know and and so we talked about the typical week when you have a long shift and when you don't take me through for those listeners who don't know how Iron Man or long distance endurance training goes um you have phases and there's the build phase really where it's a few months usually where you're increasing the distances and the time that you're putting in what does a hard week during the build looks like for you and how do you get through it?

SPEAKER_03 33:15

So a hard week for me is like so I'll know say I work like two days a week. So I have three open days. So a hard day for me is like fitting that long bike in so like it's down to like the minute basically my kids get on the bus, you know, say 730 I have to be on that bike by eight to be done by 1230 to leave the door by 130. There is no wiggle room whatsoever or I am not going to get it in. You know so those when I fit in those longer bikes and when I fit in those longer runs that's when my week gets really hard because I have prioritized my kids and the weekend is not for that. The weekend is for my kids so I refuse to be on the bike for four hours when my kids are home. Those workouts have to be done when my kids are at school because me as a mom it is very important for me to be present for my kids and to do stuff with them. You know so a bulk of my workouts is done during the week when my kids are at school or at swimming you know and I'll look at I'll think like okay how was my time with my kids this week and I'm like yeah they barely saw me work out this week because I did it when they weren't there you know because I just want to be there.

SPEAKER_01 34:29

Being a mom is more important to me than being an athlete you know I want to bring in the other identity you have as as a vet.

SPEAKER_03 34:37

I think as a vet in an ER you're probably dealing with a lot of uh difficult uh sometimes situations uh life or death really for we all know anyone who has uh um a pet this is an extended family member it's like another child and is the identity and the role of being a vet changed how you show up as a mother and an as an athlete um I think that veterinary medicine is a lot of compassion um and they often say that veterinary medicine you get like fatigue from the mental aspect of it because it's constant especially in the ER setting you know it's a lot of death or it's a lot of you know we really tried at this patient but there's really it's just you know not getting better or you know so it and and it's hard you know I always say like sport is hard physically but my job is really hard mentally so I do get mental fatigue like say for instance this week I worked three 12s in a row and by that third 12 I was so mentally fatigued and exhausted it almost was like I had worked like a solid week strength. You know and and that's probably why in ER medicine and even in human ER, they only work like three 12s. They don't work every day because you you can't you know and it's exhausting because you feel you give so much of yourself to these patients and when it doesn't work out and having to tell the owners that it's not working out is exhausting.

SPEAKER_01 36:08

I'm just throwing a an assumption here is it's possible that for you the emotional exhaustion is so high that you have to with physical exhaustion bring it to the same level to feel equalized or I don't know just throwing a thought here.

SPEAKER_03 36:22

Maybe I mean I started sport before I started med. So you know I I've always loved that physical exhaustion so that's always been there. But I would venture to say like I bounce better from physical exhaustion than I do from mental exhaustion. And just coming home and you know you don't want to bombard your family with like oh I had five euthanasias today and families that are crying and you know you you've heard stories of you know a dog and an owner getting hit by a car on the side of the road and you know and it turns out bad for both of them and I'm the one that tried to save the dog. You know it's like you get a lot of questions like did I fail? Did I do everything I should have? Did I do the right thing? Like you question yourself like was I good enough for the you know did I do enough for this patient and it ended I tried so hard but it ended up dying you know so I do beat up myself a lot and I have had a lot of rides home because my ride home is like an hour like did I do okay today you know so it's very tough job.

SPEAKER_01 37:28

It really is.

SPEAKER_03 37:29

So in sad days like this, which sounds like it happens a lot does it spill over into your workout or you you already talked about motherhood you're saying I'm trying not to bring this into the family but does it spill into um the workout I don't know maybe you cry out during a bike ride because your heart is broken or are you or are you able to just separate those two identities and say now I'm putting on my gym outfit and taking off the vet um um outfit and you're able to separate I think I'm most of the time I'm able to separate because I've dealt with so many sad cases in the ER and I hate to say this you get compassion fatigue. Compassion fatigue is where you're like it doesn't start to bother you as much because you've seen so much of it. It makes sense which is kind of sad in veterinary medicine because people are like how do you do this? How do you do euthanasias and you're like do you know how many euthanasia I've done in my career like I can't even fathom to to think and and you get to a certain point where you're like it doesn't bother me.

SPEAKER_01 38:36

It's a required skill almost to survive. It's not because you're cold hearted you're actually the opposite but it's still just what helps to protect you.

SPEAKER_03 38:44

Yes. And so I would say the days where I can't shake it are the cases that have really shook me. I'm either completely attached to the client and the patient or there are cases where it didn't work out in the pet's favor but the owners are mad at me and that happens. I'm not gonna lie you know they point fingers at the veterinarian like this is your fault. You did you know whatever and when in reality you've done nothing wrong they're just that upset that they have to point fingers at at somebody and that's usually us. And us as veterinarians we get a lot of hate. We do you know and that that those are the days those are hard to shake because you're like I've devoted my time to to help people and I still get fingers pointed at me. Yeah you're wrong. That's tough.

SPEAKER_01 39:34

I have trouble shaking those I can I can I can totally understand that. Yeah um before we uh summarize the interview and move into the rapid fire I have two two more questions.

SPEAKER_03 39:48

You touched on the being a role model for your kids and why it's um important to you uh to show them what are you what are you what do you want your kids to take away from watching you and the way you live I want my kids to take away a bunch of things but I want them to learn that they have opportunities in life and and to be successful you have to be dedicated and disciplined and I want them to learn what commitment looks like. I want them to learn that they're strong and that they can do anything that they want if they put their mind and their heart to it. So like my goal has always been to be a good role model for them and and I'm hoping that they're picking up things. You know so I just want them to know that there's so many opportunities for them and that they're basically they're capable of doing anything.

SPEAKER_01 40:42

There it's never um and I'm not talking for personal experience, just curious moment where mom, do you really have to go for four hours bike ride well you said you're not doing it when they're home, but maybe when you travel for races, mom, do you really have to go why are you not here this weekend or it's never it's it's never that because they compete just like I do.

SPEAKER_03 41:02

So they know what it's like to have like a big meet to go to they know what that means to build up to that race. Yeah um you know so unfortunately like my kids don't come to races a lot with me because they're in school and they're training too so like my husband will you know we'll take them you know and it's not like it's a surprise. I'm like mom's gonna be gone in three weeks this is where I'm going and they are all in my races you know as far as like when I race Iron Man my they'll give me a mile that is their mile you know so like when I'm running my son will be like I'm mile three this is what I want you to think about. And that so they I bring them into like you know this is your race too you know and they they are super supportive so they know what it's like to you know to be dedicated to something.

SPEAKER_01 41:50

I love that tidbit it sounds so simple but it's such an I think powerful tip to get from your kids you know a note for each mile. I love it or or a few miles uh during the hard moments I I love it.

SPEAKER_03 42:04

What is a memor what's a memorable note um uh that you got from one of your kids uh that you carry with you still so my son always obviously my son always picks mile 20 marathon that's a hard or is like 25 and I'm like that's a really hard mile Sawyer and he's like no because that's the mile where you you you know you've you're so strong you know and uh you know and just can you finish like my he's like I want you to know that you can finish that you are strong you've gotten this far and then you can finish and that's coming from an 11 year old you know so they just they're my inspiration honestly people say who are your role models and I say my kids because at their age with such dedication and showing up and the things that they do like I'm like wow they're amazing. I get it I get it I have a high level athlete as well and and the maniacal focus and the dreams is yeah I I learned so much from watching him actually yeah and you you like jump into their dreams like like my daughter and my son's dream is to swim at the Olympic trials. Like that's my dream too for them. You know so like I'm like I am all in whatever you need to do to get there, we're gonna do it. You know so just being a part of their dream is part of their success too.

SPEAKER_01 43:23

I love it. To wrap the interview I ask every um Iron Mom that I interview what would you tell a mom who wants to um stand in the starting line of an Iron Man or any endurance event. Maybe she's hesitating because she thinks she's not she can't do it. She doesn't have the time or she doesn't have the physical ability but she wants to what would you what what's the best advice you have for her?

SPEAKER_03 43:47

The best advice I can say is start. You have to start. You know wherever that start is for you whether it's three times a week or you know your start is gonna look different than someone else's start but you have to start You know, and then uh you'll figure it out as you go, you know, and your journey might not look like somebody else's journey and don't compare yourself to somebody else because your story is different.

SPEAKER_02 44:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 44:10

You know, and you just have to show up day one. And I think back to me and like I just showed up on that day one and look where I'm at now.

SPEAKER_01 44:19

But what if what if she's afraid because she doesn't have the time commitment? She feels busy and already torn to so many roles and identities. And how could I even take so much time for myself? It I'm not even talking about guilt, just literally physically, how can I do that? What would you tell her?

SPEAKER_03 44:34

I would tell her that you just find you find a couple little gaps in your day to do whatever it is because you deserve it. You are important. Your journey matters. This is still your journey, whether you have kids or not, you know. So you need to do something for yourself. It's important. And I think just telling people like you matter. Like I know you have your family and your kids, but you matter too. You are important.

SPEAKER_01 45:00

I love it. And um, there's this whole movement in the last few years about perimenopause, menopause, postmenopause, right? And this idea of um you need to work on yourself not just because um it's nice to have a nice body, right? Or a strong body. You want to do that so that you will be a strong um mature adult, right? When you get older. Um, and so I think you do that for your older self to make yourself strong and not be rely on your family to help you, you know.

SPEAKER_03 45:29

Yeah, yeah. Be strong for the future. You want to be there for your kids down the road. Like you want to be strong and you want to be there, you know. So you have to take care of yourself too.

SPEAKER_01 45:38

I know you're on the younger side, but I'm learning these days that perimenopause starts around 35 to 40-ish. I think you are you feeling any of the perimenopause um as a proto athlete?

SPEAKER_03 45:50

I don't think so, you know, and I always do some research on like what I would feel, but I I I haven't really like had any any of those like symptoms. Okay. Um, but I know, you know, eventually it's gonna come, you know, and it's and it's like, okay, we'll we'll adapt, you know. And will I be racing professional triathlon at 50? Probably not, you know, but will I still be do like doing sport and doing yes, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 46:18

I'll bet on that.

SPEAKER_03 46:20

Yeah, like I tell my husband, I'm like, you know, that 80-some-year-old girl that finished an Iron Man? That's me. Like, I'm gonna be yeah, or I'm gonna be swimming open water when I'm 90 or in master swim. I'm like, that is who I am. Yeah, I'll still, you know, I don't have to be at a high level. I just have to be doing sport because I love it. That'll be me, you know? And I'm like, if it's not, then then kick me into gear like you did when I was pregnant.

SPEAKER_01 46:45

This thread consistently shows up on when I ask women why. Why are you doing this? And surprisingly, it's the joy. Yeah, and and it might for some people who are not in it, and I get it, it's um it's a it's a paradox. How could you find joy in such a painful process? Yeah. Nobody will say that I don't know, racing 11, 12 hours is hard, 10 as hard as you is is joyful. But uh I I think that's really the the paradox, and what I'm trying to get into is how do Iron Moms find joy, that painful process. And that's kind of what we're talking about. It's the role modeling, it's finding who I am, it's taking some time for myself. It's things also I'm hearing is being alive, right? Feeling alive is the why.

SPEAKER_03 47:34

Yeah, especially like like I've I've gotten like, you know, we've all gotten sick before, like with the flu or whatever. And when you're sick, you're like, wow, your health really matters. Like, I get to do this. Yes. I get to show up. I get as scared as I am or terrified about this race, I get to be here. And I I have learned to really just like love that, you know, and embrace that. Because it's like not everyone gets to show up at the start line. Not everybody can do sport because they have an injury or they're stuck, you know, doing whatever. Like I am blessed because I get to be here with all these like-minded people.

SPEAKER_01 48:13

I love it.

SPEAKER_03 48:14

And you get get that opportunity, and I don't take that for granted at all.

SPEAKER_01 48:19

Absolutely. Something we didn't get to, and I probably will have to do maybe a second interview, is also the the pro-tra-athlete identity. It's not just an athlete, right? And how not to compare yourself and fall in the trap of comparing yourself to other uh because you are judged and compensated sometimes, right? When compensated, not necessarily talking about money, but having an entry into a race as a pro or not. And I think that's also adding so much complexity and pressure that that is is fascinating to me. Yeah, it's maybe give us a kind of just a one line on how do you deal with that type of pressure.

SPEAKER_03 48:58

That was a that was a huge struggle for me, honestly. Because, you know, you think, oh, I'm coming in at the end of the end of the pro field. It took me a while to actually be okay with that because I had to take the perspective of my life and what I do, you know, and kind of like, I don't, I have another job. I work, you know, and I have two kids. So like I can't do those 30-hour a week training sessions because I have other responsibilities. So I've learned to switch my mentation to just being happy to be there. Yes like I'm I'm I'm racing at the elite level. I'm glad I get to be here. I feel honored. I love the people I work with and I love the girls. They're all amazing. Am I gonna come in first? Probably not. And I'm okay with that. I'm just happy to be here. And have you?

SPEAKER_01 49:50

I don't think there's a lot of pro moms, I think, other than LC and Kayla. I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 49:56

And Sky and Emma just had a baby. So there's more. And I, you know what, I love that. I love this. You know, and Jocelyn has a bunch of kids. So I I love that because it it is proof that a woman can be a mom, can be an athlete, you can be a CEO, you can be all of them and be good at all of them. And and we we live under this, like, like people would always say, like, oh, if you're a woman and you're good at your job, you must be a bad mom, you know, and we've lived under that like shadow for so long. And seeing these women come out and do it all, that to me is amazing.

SPEAKER_01 50:34

That is the heart of my my my study, really, right? It's not, and and there's a complexity theory that I teach leaders because that's what I do as my job. And teaching leaders and also moms who are listening to here right now, it's not an either or. No. It's both and. And it doesn't mean you can always have it all. I get that sometimes you have to choose, and it's okay. Like the story you told me. This is my personal story. I had to choose early on in motherhood, actually, for a long time in my motherhood, to step away and not take care of myself because there was so much other things that I wanted to take care of. But it's you can do you the mindset of both end is really it's the the real flex.

SPEAKER_03 51:14

Yeah, and you can't you can't judge or look at other people because their stories are different. You know, and I think as we as women need to bring all other women and moms, you know, we need to build each other up because we are capable of doing so much. Yes, you know, and and we shouldn't judge or we shouldn't because we don't know everybody's full story, you know.

SPEAKER_01 51:36

And the first lesson I learned from my first Tratla coach, shout out to Gretchen. She wrote to me in the notes preparing for the first sprint, and she said, OPS. And she said, Don't fall into the OPS trap, other people's stuff. She said there will be women with like the nicest bikes and the best helmet and the outfit. You'll run faster than them. She was right. But the OPS syndrome is something, you know, um for life, not just for the race day, is run your stay in your own lane, race your own race. Just do you.

SPEAKER_03 52:10

And it's it's it's always you versus you. And I and I tell that to myself, I live by this. It's me versus me. What did I did I beat myself from last year? You know, and I tell my kids, I'm like, it's you versus you. It's a journey to be a better you. Whether you win or not, it's did you did you give it your best all, you know? Yeah, and we live in a world of you have to be better, you have to be bigger, you have to be faster, you have to do more, you know, and and it's getting out of that mindset and just doing things because you love them and just being a better version of you. And it takes it's hard because like everyone tries to push you, you know, in the other direction. You gotta be better, you know. And it's like, well, I am better. I am the best thing.

SPEAKER_01 52:58

I think we unlocked here the science of happiness and joy in this conversation, and I love it. And I think uh, yeah, that's probably kind of the theme of of this uh episode. Yeah, I love it. The science of being true to who you are, happiness and joy. All right, ready for the racket fire? I'm ready. Okay, whatever comes to your mind, uh, there's no right or wrong. Okay, and short answer, it could be one word or one sentence. Okay. I think you answered this already, but if you need to choose clinic or race day, which nerves are worse?

SPEAKER_02 53:33

Clinic. One word that describe you as a mom. Present. One word that describe you as an athlete. Dedicated. One word that describe you as a vet. That was hard. Compassionate. What grounds you? My family. And what pushes you to be a better version of me. What uh you stopped apologizing for? What do I stop apologizing for?

SPEAKER_03 54:14

You don't care anymore that I stop apologizing for working out as much as I do because I have reasons.

SPEAKER_01 54:24

What's the best advice that you ever gave to one of your patients uh parent?

SPEAKER_02 54:33

Owner, I should say.

SPEAKER_03 54:35

And the best advice I told them was that you gave them a long, fulfilled life and that it was a success.

SPEAKER_01 54:44

I'm a poor dog mom, but I lost one, but yeah. That always touches and that my babies are here listening. And I know you have a baby behind you listening. Um, baby dog, we should say. Two more, finish this. On my best days, I am the best version that I can be that day. And one other finish this.

SPEAKER_03 55:06

I do this because life is short and happiness and doing things you love is important.

SPEAKER_01 55:16

I love it. It's been such a pleasure getting to know you on another deeper layer outside of social media, right? Like I mentioned before, I'll drop in the show notes um your Instagram handler and any other if you have uh on social media. It's worth following you and continue to get inspired.

SPEAKER_02 55:35

Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 55:36

Thank you for for taking us along the Meg tour. It's a it's a busy one.

SPEAKER_03 55:41

It is a busy one. Thank you so much for having me. I love talking today. I really did.

SPEAKER_01 55:46

Thank you.