Nick Nimmin EXPOSES What's Working Now On Youtube!

Meet Nick Nimmin, one of the most trusted voices in the YouTube education space, as he shares what creators actually need to focus on to grow a channel today. If you're serious about YouTube growth, this conversation breaks down the fundamentals that separate channels that struggle from those that consistently build momentum.

In this podcast, Nick Nimmin exposes what's working now for YouTube growth! Ditch old tricks & boost your channel with these fresh strategies. We talk about what really drives YouTube growth in 2026: how creators should think about the algorithm, why consistency and viewer experience matter more than most people realize, how small channels can compete with larger ones, and the mindset shifts creators need if they want to turn YouTube into a long term platform for their business or brand. Nick also shares lessons from years of helping creators grow their channels and building a massive education community around YouTube strategy.

Whether you're just starting a channel or already publishing regularly, this episode offers practical insights into how creators should approach YouTube today.

Learn more about Nick:
Website:
https://tuberschool.com
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https://www.youtube.com/@NickNimmin
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https://www.instagram.com/nicknimmin
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https://twitter.com/NickNimmin

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

What if everything you have been told about growing on YouTube is actually wrong? Tags, the algorithm, collaboration, short form fitting long form. Nick Niman has been on YouTube for 11 years. And today he's here to set the record straight. Thank you so much for doing this, Nick. And for people who might not know your work yet, how would you describe what you do in the YouTube space today?

SPEAKER_00 0:21

Yeah, so uh my name is Nick Niman. I teach people how to thrive on YouTube. So I've been in uh on YouTube for the last 11 years. And uh when I first started my channel, you know, like everybody else I started, I had no idea what I was doing. I did have a little bit of an advantage because I knew graphic design, I knew how to rank blogs and things like that at the time in search. So I already had some conceptual things covered, but in terms of making content, that was all new to me. And in terms of how the platform worked, that was new to me as well. And I started the channel that people know me for now, but I had about 150 subscribers and another person that has a YouTube channel.

SPEAKER_02 1:00

I can't hear you.

SPEAKER_00 1:01

They at the time they were working with like major companies. They still work with major creators, some of the biggest creators on the platform. But um, at that time, they were crossing 100,000 subscribers on their channel. And they said, if my content has ever done anything for you in terms of helped you, make a video. And if it's any good, we'll add it to our celebration video. So I was like, hey, this looks like something fun. Let me, you know, send him a video. And I told him how I was watching his content now to help me and things like that. And he reached out to me very quickly and was like, hey, uh, we need to talk. Um, you know, because I invested in the camera and good microphones and all that stuff when I first started the channel. So I guess it was, you know, clear that I was serious. And uh, and he said that uh he wanted to work with me on a different channel, um, just start something scratch. And since he had all this experience, that he would, you know, kind of mentor me through it and, you know, we partnered up on this channel. And everything was going great. I was, you know, you know, publishing videos, the channel started picking up momentum really fast. People were enjoying the content. I loved making the content. But unfortunately, like most people, when I started the YouTube channel, I also had my design business that I was running at the time. And because of that, I was so into YouTube, but I had to keep my design business going. So because of that, I was burning the candle at both ends. And after about a nine-month stretch, I just completely burned out because I wasn't doing anything else except for those two things. So, because of that, I was hooked on YouTube. I caught the bug and I was like, man, this is great. I see the potential here. Um, I'm all in on this. I just got to figure it out. And uh, I told him, I said, man, I'm just not gonna be able to keep up with this uh channel because that content just took a really long time to make. And I came back to the channel that I am currently on. And on that channel, um, I just started talking about things that were relevant to people who made videos because part of being a content creator, if you want to get the most out of it, is learning how to monetize it. So as soon as I came back, I built a website that sold graphics and I offered services through that website. And right out of the gate, I started picking up customers through that and I was able to transition into providing stuff for YouTubers, not just, you know, regular people, but providing stuff for YouTubers. And that got me fully immersed. And then I just dedicated myself uh from that point forward to making content for people that make videos. But I wasn't talking about how to grow YouTube channels or anything like that. Um, I was just plugging away, making videos. And as I was plugging away, making videos, I had people start reaching out to me because I was making videos on things like how to rank your videos and search, and people were really loving those and asking for more. And um, and I started just kind of walking down that path as I was figuring things out. I was sharing them with others, which not a lot of people were doing at the time. And then people started reaching out for consulting, and I was like, no, because that wasn't on my roadmap. I didn't have any plans to do that. And then I had one person that was like, hey, uh, I know you don't want to, you know, do this because I turned him down. And I said that that's not, I don't, you know, I'd never done that before. And uh, and he said, Hey, uh uh, you know, if you are willing to do it, you know, I'm totally open to the fact that you haven't done it before. Um, it's just from your channel and the things you talk about, you seem like you know what you're talking about. So um I would love to, you know, try it. And I said, Okay, you know, let's try it. But you've been warned. And uh, and we you started getting some, you know, serious results from his channel. And I was like, okay, this is this is good. And uh, we kept going, you know, that route for a while. And then other people, as I was talking about that channel, then you know, they would reach out. Next thing you know, you know, I ended up working with a bunch of content creators and you know, it which really opened your mind when it comes to how everything works, because when you're looking at one channel, um, you know, you're you're pretty biased in terms of how things work and what works. But then when you start spreading that out across different niches on YouTube, then it really opened your eyes to uh, you know, the things that work across the board and the things that are nuanced that, you know, work on some channels and not as well on others. So that's pretty much the story, you know, in terms of uh in terms of you know how we got to uh you know, sitting here having this conversation with you right now.

SPEAKER_02 4:51

In that moment that you were like first hired, did you know that you knew more than other people? Or was that something that you were still like, maybe I don't know enough?

SPEAKER_00 5:00

Yeah, you know, like I I think that um at that point in time, because I'd never done any consulting before, so I didn't even know how to do it. Two is um at that point in time, you know, I was you know still relatively new to YouTube, right? Like, I mean, I'd I'd been, you know, with the other channel plus, you know, the current channel, you know, maybe a year in on YouTube. And, you know, at that point, um, because we didn't have uh, you know, access to the information that everybody has now when it comes to growing YouTube channels. So, you know, because of that, you know, I was still pretty green when it came to YouTube, but I was really good at the stuff that I was good at, right? So one thing, uh, one kind of superpower that I have is I'm able to see like nuance in things. And I think that that nuance um is something that, you know, helps me be able to, you know, just be good at at this sort of thing.

SPEAKER_02 5:48

Awesome. When people come up to you and they ask you, like, how do I grow on YouTube? What do you say? Like, what's the first thing that comes to your mind?

SPEAKER_00 5:56

Um, I ask them really what they're actually trying to do because a lot of people want to grow YouTube channels and they're thinking of it from the perspective of like, I want to get big or I want to get a lot of views, or I want to get a lot of subscribers, but there's something underneath that, right? So when it comes to growing a YouTube channel, people don't want to grow a YouTube channel just so they can get a bunch of views. They want to grow a YouTube channel so they can get views so that, right? Um, they want to have a lot of subscribers so that. So the first thing I do is I try to figure out what it is that they are trying to accomplish. Like, what's the real goal? What are you trying to do? Are you trying to make money? Um, are you trying to um position yourself as an authority of some kind? Are you trying to make an impact on the world in some way? You're trying to bring attention to your business, like what is it that you're doing? So, step number one is figuring out what it is that you're doing or what it is that you're doing it all for. Because, as you know, when it comes to all of this, like it takes time to put videos together, takes a lot of energy to think through, you know, what is it that I'm gonna make videos about? How am I gonna make a thumbnail that's going to connect with the people I'm trying to reach? How do I capture their attention when they first come into the video? How do I keep them engaged as we get through the video? You know, like all these things, um, you know, it takes time and a lot of energy. So, because of that, if you are just publishing content for the sake of publishing content, um, some sometimes it works out. You'll get that clarity down the road. But often channels like that typically end up not doing well because they don't know why they're doing it, um, which means that they don't have any clear focus with what it is that they're actually trying to do on the YouTube channel, which ultimately leads to them publishing uh just a mess of content on the channel that will add value to a bunch of different types of audiences, which really dilutes the offering of the channel uh as a whole. So, step number one when you are trying to grow a YouTube channel is really just to dig into what it is that you're actually wanting to make the content for. Because, you know, just chasing views will drive you crazy. Just chasing subscribers will drive you crazy. And with both of those things, they may or may not lead to anything. But if you have a clear goal on what it is that you're trying to accomplish with the YouTube channel, then you can make sure that you're tracking that goal and you can make sure that all the decisions on the YouTube channel lead to you achieving that goal. And sometimes that does require getting a lot of views, getting a lot of subscribers. Other times you can do a lot with a lot less. Meaning, um, you know, some channels, by the time they reach 10,000 subscribers, they're already making tons of money from YouTube or they're driving tons of leads to their business, right? So you really don't have a lot in order to be able to, you don't have to have a lot in order to accomplish a lot when it comes to YouTube. So because of that, getting clear on what it is that you're trying to do is fundamentally one of the most important aspects of growing a YouTube channel.

SPEAKER_02 8:27

And regardless of what people are actually trying to do, what surprised you the most about how the platform actually works?

SPEAKER_00 8:33

Um, in terms of how the platform works, it makes sense that YouTube prioritizes the things that they do. So, for example, you know, they prior prioritize how often people click on your videos when they recommend them to people. And they compare that against all the other content that they're recommending to those groups of people that your content is primed for. So because of that, um, you know, like if your videos don't get clicked on at a competitive rate against everything else that they're showing to those groups of people, then what can happen is your video gets essentially demoted in place or uh in other videos that are getting a higher response than yours, they will take, you know, take the priority. So it's not just click-through rate, it's the whole entire viewer experience because what YouTube's trying to do is they are trying to uh just create the most satisfactory experience for viewers that they possibly can so that viewers will keep coming back in and viewers will, you know, keep watching ads or they'll keep paying their premium membership. Um so because of that, they're you know focusing everything on the viewers and trying to make sure they have a great experience. So because of that, the way that they measure everything in terms of watch time, um viewer satisfaction, do people come back to the YouTube channel often? Yes or no? Um, do they, you know, click at it, click on it at a competitive level? Once they get to the end of the video, what do they do? You know, those types of things that that they measure. Um, all of that makes sense in terms of why they measure it. So on the YouTube side, I'm not really surprised. On the creator side, though, I'm really surprised about something. And that something is people will come onto YouTube, um, content creators will come onto YouTube and they will start publishing videos and those videos won't do well out of the gate, which is really normal. Um, and because of that, what will happen is they'll get discouraged and they'll think that YouTube is against them, or they'll think that, you know, like, oh, there's no way I can, you know, do this because I'm getting, you know, 18 views or, you know, whatever the number is. And the the thing that happens is they are gauging their brand new experience of not having any other content on the channel, but having, you know, just a handful of videos on the channel against content creators they see getting tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands, in some cases, even millions of views. And because of that, um, it discourages them because they expect to do as good as people that know what they're doing when they don't know what they're doing yet. So the the biggest uh problem that I see when it comes to content creators, it's not YouTube, it's the expectations that they put on themselves that that say to themselves that every video that I publish has to get a thousand views on it. And I don't even know how to make videos yet. I haven't even learned how to make thumbnails or come up with good video ideas, but this video should be getting a thousand views. And that expectation comes from the just from them seeing other people do well. So I think it's an unfortunate thing that causes a lot of people to quit when in reality, you know, if you and I right now, um, I mean, I don't know how you know how good you are at guitar, but I'm not very good. So because of that, you know, I can mess around on a guitar for I think I've been playing guitar now for maybe uh a year and a half, maybe two years, and I'm horrible. I'm still absolutely horrible at guitar. And because of that, I don't expect to, you know, for somebody to call me up and be like, hey, we're we're doing this world tour. Would you, you know, would you come and play guitar, you know, for our band? You know, and and and I think that people look at YouTube and they expect it to be this magical experience when in reality, YouTube, you have to show up, you got to learn how to do all the things, you gotta work on your skill sets, and you have to go through that process of turning yourself from somebody that doesn't know anything about how YouTube works, about the audiences you're trying to reach, about how important it is to target a very specific type of viewer, things like that. You go from somebody that doesn't know how to do all that, and then you have to do the work that will get you to the point to where you say, okay, now I think I know how to make thumbnails. So now let me, you know, start really trying to experiment and spend some extra time on making thumbnails so I can confirm that by raising my click-through rate. Right. Same thing with coming up with really good video ideas, like those types of things. So um, a lot of creators just put the cart before the horse. And I think that that is the most unfortunate thing because I think a lot of people that would have potentially been an awesome content creator long term, uh, they give up. And they give up on, you know, themselves, they give up on any dreams that they had about being a content creator. And even for business owners, you know, they give up on the opportunity to tap into the gigantic opportunity that YouTube is. So yeah, I I think the the biggest surprise for me is the people that really don't see the opportunity and they don't understand that you just have to build skills. Just like if you start any new job, any new hobby, you start playing an instrument, anything like that, you start playing a sport, YouTube's the same exact way, right? You start, you don't know anything, and then you just have to go through the process of learning the skill sets involved in um and you know, figuring out how to get people to respond to things.

SPEAKER_02 13:26

So, from what you're saying, mindset actually plays a bigger role in actually um differentiating the creators that are actually succeeding from the ones that are giving up, right?

SPEAKER_00 13:36

Yeah, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 13:37

Actually, yeah, that's actually interesting because uh what I what I see happening, I see a lot of people worrying so much about the algorithm, but I don't think about the audience. When I think what they need to worry about the most is the audience. How is the audience reacting and not how the algorithm is reacting to my content? Would you agree with that?

SPEAKER_00 13:56

100%. Um, even YouTube employees, they say, you know, don't think about the algorithm, think about the audience, right? Um, the people that actually work on YouTube's algorithm like, don't worry about the algorithm. The algorithm's fine. Just work on like how do you connect with the people that you're trying to reach? Like, how do you make content for those people so that they'll just love what it is that you do? And if you can figure that out, then the algorithm just follows you because then you start getting a response because you're making content that people enjoy. So, you know, with YouTube, you know, you're not making video calls, right? That's not what YouTube is. You're making content for other people to get some type of value out of. And a lot of people, they'll publish videos and they'll, you know, they'll be like, well, you know, I think it's a great video. It's like, well, that's great if you want to watch it by yourself. But if you want other people to watch it, you have to go through these processes in order to, you know, um, in order to understand what it takes in order to get people to respond to things.

SPEAKER_02 14:46

Well, we'll just say it's the biggest misconception that creators have about how YouTube actually works.

SPEAKER_00 14:51

So yeah, so when it comes to, you know, how how YouTube actually works, a lot of creators think that um, you know, that YouTube caters to the creators, but in reality it caters to the viewers. So if viewers are enjoying your stuff, then they're gonna show it to you more. It's just a response-based system. So you don't get rewarded because you publish, you get rewarded based on how people respond to what it is that you do.

SPEAKER_02 15:10

One thing that we hear a lot is creators saying, like, oh, the algorithm is against me. When they say that, what's the reality of what's actually happening there?

SPEAKER_00 15:19

Uh the reality of what's happening when creators say that the algorithm against is against them is simply that they just don't know how to do it yet. That's it. So YouTube's algorithm isn't against anybody. So the the thing is, is when you have a brand new channel, you can compete with big channels. I wouldn't say that you can compete right away with people like Mr. Beast, who are like the biggest channels on the platform. But you know, with a brand new YouTube channel, you can compete with people that have 100,000, 500,000, you know, a million subscribers on their channel. You can compete with them based on the modern version of YouTube. Where back in the day, you know, it was a lot more biased towards, you know, the channel size and things like that. But in modern YouTube, a brand new channel can compete with channels that have a history, with channels that have audiences already. All they have to do is make good videos that that people respond to at a level that is competitive with those bigger channels. And as soon as that happens and they've crossed that threshold, then they can start directly competing with those larger channels.

SPEAKER_02 16:16

How do you think creators should balance the relationship the relationship that they have between like the algorithm and the audience? Like I I want this to be uh more more as a personal question to you. Like, how do you balance that?

SPEAKER_00 16:30

I don't even think about YouTube's algorithm when it comes to like me making content. I don't even think about it. Like it it's it it doesn't do you any good to to think about okay, um how's the algorithm gonna respond to this video? Like it doesn't do you any good because you know, because the the like how your content does in the algorithm is simply a reflection of how people respond to what it is that you're doing, right? So because of that, um, yeah, the the algorithm isn't even a consideration. And another thing also is there is you know a little bit of nuance involved here. So when it comes to like how their system works, I'll just give you an example here. So if somebody clicks on your video um and they watch your video, let's say it's a brand new viewer, and they click on your video, they watch your video in its entirety because it's a good video, or they watch it long enough that you well, we'll say in its entirety. Um so they watch it to the entirety and then they get to the end of the video. So what happens there is once the video ends, then they can leave YouTube. Um, they can go click on another video, you know, in the sidebar or under the video, you know, whatever device it is they're watching on. Um, or they can click into another video that's at the end of your video where you're recommending they go watch a piece of content. So what happens there is when you are thinking about the algorithm, instead of thinking about the algorithm, what you want to think about is okay, if I want the algorithm to love my videos, the way that I'm gonna do that is by getting the highest response possible from viewers. How do I do that? Well, they're gonna have a great experience from the moment they see my video, wherever it is that YouTube shows it to them on the platform and on whatever device. They're gonna watch my video in its entirety. And then once they get to the end of my video, they're going to enjoy it so much that a certain percentage of those people are going to click into my screen. It's called an end screen on YouTube. They're gonna click into my end screen and it's gonna take them into an additional video or playlist. And the magic that happens when that event takes place is that you increase the likelihood, massively increase the likelihood of YouTube recommending more of your content to those people. You can see this in action for yourself. You can log into your YouTube on your phone, on your TV, on your computer, wherever it is, and go and just pick any random channel that is being presented to you that you haven't watched before. Click on the thumbnail, let it watch all the way to the end of the video. Maybe like the video, you know, if you want. Um you don't have to subscribe to the channel, but you know, like the video, watch it all the way to the end. And then as long as they have an end-screen video, click on that one and then watch that one all the way to the end, maybe like that video. And then what you're going to see happen is you're going to see YouTube start recommending that channel to you because their system has detected that you've gone through that process and you've had a great viewer experience and you didn't just enjoy that one video, but you also enjoyed additional videos from that channel. And then what's going to happen is YouTube's going to chase you around for a little bit and they're going to be like, hey, remember this channel? Hey, remember this channel? Hey, how about this video? How about this video? And they're going to keep trying to show that channel to you for a little bit of time. And if you respond to it again, then in that case, then they're going to just keep showing that channel to you. However, if they keep showing that channel to you and you don't respond, then eventually they're going to be like, okay, well, they're just not interested in this. So because of that, we're not going to show this to them anymore. And then, you know, the system's going to move on uh from that point. So this is where understanding your target audience is extremely important. Because, for example, let's say you're publishing a video about um like YouTube, something that would be related to like YouTube viewers, right? Then in that case, you're bringing in viewers of YouTube, not people that are, you know, creators, not people like in your case that are looking for video editing or something like that. You're just making uh a video that viewers of YouTube could enjoy. Well, what happens is when you have people, and we'll just use your channel as an example because you do video editing stuff. So if you make that video and then you have a lot of people coming into that video that are just regular viewers and they're enjoying that content, they got all the way to the end because you you're showing them something about YouTube. Then in that case, what's gonna happen is if they make it to the end and YouTube detects that they enjoyed that video, then if they try to recommend another one of your videos and it's not targeted towards the viewers of YouTube, but it's targeted towards video editors instead, then in that case, what's going to happen is YouTube is going to show some of that video editing content to them and they're not gonna respond to it. And then YouTube's gonna be like, well, hey, we're trying to show this to people, but they're not responding to it. And then what happens there is creators are like, well, you know, YouTube isn't, you know, showing my videos to people. They are. You can see it in your impressions. The difference is that the people that they're showing it to have responded well to your other content, or they're new viewers that they think will respond well to that content and they're just not responding to it. Right. Now, if we flip that over and let's say, like in your case, every video is about video editing. Um, then in that case, if you're targeting video editors and not people looking for video editing, um, then in that case, you know, as long as your channel everything has to do with video editing, then what's going to happen is video editors will start seeing you as a resource. And as long as you keep publishing videos that they will see as a resource, they'll keep coming back. And when you hit those topics that are meaningful to them, then they'll keep, you know, coming in and they'll keep watching your content and just rent and repeat. And as you build an archive of content on your YouTube channel, that same thing happens because then they can enter in any of your videos and you have an entire library that's a perfect fit for that one audience that you're trying to reach.

SPEAKER_02 21:44

Out of all like the advice that you've heard on YouTube, is there anything that you wish that could be erased from the internet? You're like, this is BS. People say this is too much.

SPEAKER_00 21:55

Tags. Tags is the thing they should they should erase. So back in the day, you know, tags matter. Mattered, but they haven't mattered for a long time. So, you know, like I said, I've been on YouTube for 11 years. So when I first started, you know, we'd put time in the tags. You know, we'd put time, you know, because it it's like, you know, adding keywords to like blog posts or websites and things like that. So, you know, that's how it was worked out at that point in time. But many years ago, YouTube has devalued the uh the impact of tags. So I still recommend that people fill out the box just because it's there and I'm weird about making sure everything's filled out. But um, but when it comes to tags, you don't even have to use tags in your videos and your videos will still be fine. It doesn't matter if you're targeting search, it doesn't matter if you're targeting YouTube's recommendation system. Um, you don't need tags in your videos. But a lot of new creators, especially creators that are using Chat GPT for advice, they will put a lot of emphasis on tags because ChatGPT and some of the other uh AI models, they are still looking at historical data. And based on that historical data, you have tons of information on the internet from when tags were important. So because of that, they still recommend that sort of thing. But when it comes to tags, at the end of the day, you know, fill out the box, but don't spend time on it. Like you don't have to spend tons of time. Just think, is this tag relevant? Yes or no? Right. And just add, you know, whatever would be relevant to the video, just add a few, just off the top of your head. You don't even have to put any energy into it. But they're but they're not important. But some people will claim on Reddit and, you know, other like Facebook groups and Discords, new creators. It's always new creators, it's never experienced creators, but new creators will be like, well, hey, this video did better, and this one is the one that I added tags to. And it's like, well, just because you added tags to that video probably isn't because it isn't the reason that it did better. The reason it did better is because people responded better to that video. Because that's what makes YouTube work on your behalf, not the tags that you that you add to your video.

SPEAKER_02 23:43

Because I feel like tags, uh, from what I hear people saying, if you put like too many tags, they might actually hurt your content. Is that true?

SPEAKER_00 23:50

So um uh when it comes to tags, like uh, yeah, so so YouTube tags, they have the box. In that box, I think you get like 500 characters. So, you know, with that, you cannot put too many uh tags into that box. Um, what they might be talking about is hashtags. And with hashtags, they don't necessarily hurt the video. But if you do more than, I believe the number is 60 now, because it used to be a lot lower and then they raised it. But I believe the number is now 60. And if you do 60 or over 60 hashtags, it invalidates all of the hashtags. But even with that, like those types of things are such a minor uh thing to think about when it comes to YouTube. So, you know, if you are watching this or listening to this and you're somebody that spends a lot of time on like hashtags and tags and things like that, spend that time on your content instead. Because at the end of the day, what YouTube is looking for is they're looking for content that competes well against other content in terms of watch time. So, in order to get more watch time, you have to get enough people clicking on your videos and they have to enjoy your videos for a long enough period of time. If you can just focus on those two things, then those by themselves will trump anything else that you're gonna do when it comes to YouTube. And that'll kind of level up where your focus is as well. So actually, let me redo that. So video topic, right? Because that is also leads to watch time. So video topic, thumbnail, video topic, how you're expressing that topic through your packaging, which is your thumbnail and title, and then of course, you know, the quality of your video. Like focus on those things, and then nothing else ultimately matters. So there are additional things that you can do. Um, but when it comes to the core of what you need to be uh a successful content creator and get views on your videos, yeah, focus on those things and and that's that's the way without having to think about you know all the other all the other minor details. And one thing to think about is when it comes to things like tags and hashtags, you know, one thing just to consider is that's the easiest thing to do on YouTube. And because of that, like you know, like just typing some words, you know, on your on your keyboard um because you might show up in some hashtag result. Um like anybody can do that. But when it comes to like like you can like you can seriously have like you know, you can have like mental problems and still be able to pull that off, right? But when it comes to how to come up with a good idea that people are gonna love, how do I get them to click on it? And then once they click on it, how do I create a great experience for them? Like that's the hard part. That's the part that you have to get figured out. And then once you get that figured out, then then you're good to go.

SPEAKER_02 26:22

Would you say like the key factor now to grow could be uh collabing, like inviting people to collab so you can post content together?

SPEAKER_00 26:29

Um, I would definitely not say that's a that's a key um area that can be advantageous in terms of um, you know, like if you if you collaborate with a large channel that has a very active audience um and a very engaged audience, and the types of viewers that are interacting with that channel are a perfect fit for your channel, then in that case it can be advantageous to use that collab feature. Um, outside of that, though, um I think collaborations are great in terms of just a way to get to know other creators. Like, for example, you and I haven't this conversation here, um, you know, we're we're gonna chat for a little bit after this is over. And, you know, this gives us an opportunity to connect. So when it comes to collaborations, you know, it's the same exact way to where it gives you that opportunity to connect with other content creators. And I believe that that's important because um it's a lonely thing. You know, being a content creator, you know, you're making your own videos in a lot of cases. Um, you know, people are the only people that they know that are making videos. So it's an isolating thing for a lot of people. So because of that, making creator friends and uh, you know, having people that you collaborate with or at least that, you know, that you you know send messages back and forth, hey man, my numbers are down right now. How about you? You know, those types of things can just be really valuable when it comes to sustainability um as a content creator.

SPEAKER_02 27:42

Well, just what would you say are like some signals that a creator is improving, even if their views are not increasing, their subscribers number is not increasing, but there's something that is like working in their content, like there's quality there.

SPEAKER_00 27:56

Um so quality is not up to us. Um, it's up to viewers. So um a content creator can sometimes break things when they are on the path to improvement. So sometimes um people will really love a content creator that just everything is amateur, right? Like their thumbnails aren't that great. Um their video content when you go in, it doesn't have perfect lighting. Uh the audio, it's okay, but you know, it's not it's not perfect. But that makes it all relatable, right? And those channels sometimes they'll start getting momentum. People will love what it is that they're doing. And the default thing that people do is it's like, okay, things are going well now. Now I gotta get serious. Now I gotta upgrade my camera. Let me get a microphone, let me hire a thumbnail designer and things like that. And then when they start doing those types of things, it kind of removes that magic that people responded well to. And then the channel can start stalling out from that moment. So when it comes to quality, it's important to, you know, make sure that, or improvements. It's insured, it's important to make sure that the improvements that you're making are something that the audience that you're trying to reach is responding to. Um, because, you know, just making an improvement on your thumbnails will get people clicking on your video more as long as the topics are good, because you know, your thumbnails and your topic impact people clicking on your video, right? So you might have an amazing thumbnail, but if the topic sucks or it's not of interest, then they're just not going to click on it anyway, even though the thumbnail is great, right? So you have to get the whole package together. Um, but when it comes to uh improvements, the, you know, uh you really do see it reflected in the stats of the video. So, you know, for example, if you are working on video ideas and packaging those ideas up, you'll see the difference in your click-through rate. Um, if you are working on making your hooks better, your intros better in your video, you'll see that reflected in turn in your audience retention reports. Um, if you see people getting a lot of value out of your content to where they're wanting to come back to the channel, you'll see that in your stats under returning viewers and to where you'll see that line increasing. So, you know, all of the improvements um that the viewers respond to, you you will see that in your stats.

SPEAKER_02 30:05

It's interesting because uh from what you said, like I was thinking here, and I actually do gravitate towards more uh relatable content, let's say. And a real discussion that is happening right now is this marketing tone and language that people use on YouTube and the relatable language. Do you think there's a difference? What do you think works best? Do you think there are different strategies and different spaces for each category? How would you separate it?

SPEAKER_00 30:32

Yeah, there's room for everything. So there's people that respond to you know the polished stuff. There's people that respond to the amateur content. So I think there's definitely room for everything. Um, you know, that that's one of the things. Like when you are trying to establish yourself as a content creator, um, you can wing it and you can be like, hey, I'm just gonna try a bunch of stuff. And then if something works, maybe I'm gonna lean into that and then just kind of go from there. Um, it'll take longer, but you know, you can absolutely do that. But if you back up a little bit and you pause for a minute and you're like, okay, what is it I'm actually trying to do? And if that's what I'm trying to do, then what content would I really love making? Um, and would that actually serve what it is that I'm trying to accomplish by publishing these videos? And if so, then who is it that I'm actually trying to reach with this content so that I can make sure that I'm designing everything for them and I'm keeping in mind, like, am I trying to reach somebody that is more into the amateur style content? Or do I want somebody that is that will click away if I'm not giving them 4K with, you know, with great depth of field and, you know, all that stuff to where they want that higher quality, you know, vibe. Um, but getting clear on those types of details, even though it might sound like if you don't have experience, it might sound meaningless, but you know, those types of or that type of clarity can make a really big difference on how um you're designing the experience for other people. Because, like I said before, if you just want to watch it, then you make everything for yourself. But if you want other people to watch it, then you make content that you enjoy making, but you make it for other people, which means all of the decisions that you're making are around, okay, how can I make this the best possible piece of content that I possibly can for these people that I'm trying to, you know, reach and connect with through my content.

SPEAKER_02 32:13

And also like talking about retention, we talk a lot about the first 30 seconds. I hear people saying the first 12 seconds, some people say the first 15 seconds. What is your take? What do you usually teach people?

SPEAKER_00 32:27

Yeah, so um every second matters. So when people click on your videos, literally every second matters. If you can't get them past 12, you definitely aren't gonna get them to 30, right? So because of that, you know, 30 is the target. 30 is where YouTube actually has the cutoff line in your stats. So they have a special line in your audience retention reports reports for that first 30 seconds. So that first 30 seconds is also important to YouTube in terms of how people, you know, are responding to that first 30 seconds. And typically, if you can get a large amount of a large percentage of people through that first 30 seconds, then you know, you'll be able to hold them for the most part, unless you make a mistake, you'll be able to hold them. You'll most likely see like a gradual drop-off over time. But the more people you can get through that first 30 seconds, the you know, they're committed and they'll they'll watch the video. So because of that, trying to figure out how to get people to that 30 second mark. And then of course, beyond that is important. But it's also important to make sure that you're not stopping there. Because, you know, like if you're, you know, if you're going after 12 seconds, that's great because that means that you're almost halfway to 30, right? Same thing with, you know, 15 seconds, you know, if you go up to 20, you're just getting closer to 30. But once you hit 30, then what? Right? You still got to give them a great experience with the content. So, you know, even if you get people, yeah, like it's still the whole thing's still got to be good. So even if you get them past that first 30 seconds, if you make a mistake um in the video and you start doing something annoying or you switch scenes or you switch topics or whatever the thing is, and people just start leaving the video, then it doesn't matter what you did in that first 30 seconds because you're making everybody leave and at the 45 second mark instead, right? Um, out of a you know, 10 or 15 minute video. So because of that, it's really important to just think about the entire experience that people are having with the content. But focus on that first 30. Because if you can't get people there, like you gotta get them, you gotta get them into the actual, you know, video itself.

SPEAKER_02 34:13

What are the biggest mistakes that people make in the first 30 seconds?

SPEAKER_00 34:18

Um, introducing themselves. Like when your videos first start, people will do things like, you know, hey, I'm Nick. I am a I'm somebody that teaches people about YouTube. Um I've been on YouTube for blah, blah, blah, and you know, things like that. And when the video first starts, like, people don't people don't care about that. What people want is they want confirmation that they're in the right place or they want to be hooked in some way. So because of that, like save all of those things until you believe that you've got the viewer hooked. So you can still do those things, but make sure that you add a hook first. So, you know, for example, instead of, you know, hey, you know, I'm Nick, if this is your first time here, blah, blah, blah. Instead, the video would start, like, let's say the video is about um some, you know, AI tool. In that case, the video might start, and I might say something like, um, this AI tool, and I'll just leave it, you know, vague. Uh, we'll we'll use like Opus Clip. So I'll be like, okay, um, Opus Clip will help you clip up your uh Opus Clip. No. Opus Clip is gonna help you get more reach out of the content that you're already making. And in this video, I'm gonna share with you exactly how to use it so that you can work less but achieve more with your content. And we're starting right now. And then uh for me, I would have like a little very fast logo flash, like you know, two seconds max, and I'd start talking under it because I want people to know that I'm not gonna have some long intro. If I would even put the logo splash in there. And then after that, if I wanted to do any type of introduction, that's when I would do it. So the whole thing is like I'm leaning it on, and I'm just kind of doing that on the fly. I would write this down and and workshop it. But uh, but basically, uh, you know, I would lean the whole intro and the whole hook towards, you know, how the tool is going to help them and then get them like, okay, yeah, I can see the value in what's happening here. And then after that, that's where if you wanted to add any type of additional information, then you can.

SPEAKER_02 36:12

Because a lot of mistakes that I see on the other end when people try to be too extreme and they overwhelm the viewer with information in the first 30 seconds. But from what you're saying, it's more as like a simple teases statement in the first 30 seconds, right?

SPEAKER_00 36:27

Yeah. So so what you what you're what the what the goal really is in that first 30 seconds is um, and you have to you have to go like before they even enter your video, right? So once they enter your video, then what you're what you're saying and showing them should keep in mind the expectation that they had when they clicked on the video. So when you're thinking about your video ideas and you're thinking of how to package your video ideas, another part of that is you should be thinking, okay, so if I have this in my thumbnail and these are the objects or the object that I'm gonna use to try to help people identify this content about something that they're gonna care about, so that they'll then read the title. The title is this, and it's going to compel them to click inside of this video because it's gonna be clear that it matters to them. What's the first thing that I can show with them or share with them, um, or a pain point that they have that I can express with them? Um, or if it's entertainment content, you know, what's something that I can kind of tease them, you know, right there or tell them this, you know, challenge that I'm getting ready to do, whatever the thing is, um, uh, that's what you want to do when the video first starts, is you want to consider, okay, this is what I think people are going to expect when they come into this video. And then that's what you want to give them when the video first starts. So, yes, absolutely. Try to, you know, create open loops and you know, curiosity gaps and all those things. But the idea is just to think, okay, if they are clicking on this, then what they're expecting is probably and then fill in the blank. And then from there do that, right? Just confirm they're in the right place, right? With uh when they come into the video, and then get into you know the actual content.

SPEAKER_02 38:07

And how do we actually evaluate whether an idea is actually strong? And how do you balance like things that you enjoy doing and things that actually perform well? Should it be 50-50?

SPEAKER_00 38:18

Um, I think it depends on on where you're at. So for me, like right now on my channel, um, I just like I just do stuff that I enjoy. Like um, you know, like my channel's established, all that good stuff. So, you know, like YouTube's been really good to me. So because of that, like now, like I just focus on, you know, like, okay, what can I make that's gonna help people or what can I make that's interesting to me that I think other people will be interested in? And then I do live streams and stuff like that to answer questions and look at channels and that kind of stuff. But for, you know, me, um, you know, it's about, you know, what's gonna add value to people that I'm also going to enjoy. Um, but when I was in the, you know, okay, we're, we're, you know, trying to trying to, you know, get that growth happening, um, everything was about the viewers. Like I, like what I, you know, like what I thought that I should make a video about didn't matter. It was what do I think that they're going to want to watch next. Um, because, you know, when you are trying to grow the channel, you're trying to get momentum on the channel, you know, those seasons of, you know, okay, this is about them. So, you know, I'm enjoying making the content because uh, you know, it's about topics that I enjoy. And I committed to that, you know, when I decided to start the channel. But, you know, the decisions that I'm making on what actual videos to publish, I'm gonna make sure that I'm making those for the audience that I'm trying to reach and make sure that um I'm thinking of the viewer first, essentially when it comes to the videos that I'm publishing.

SPEAKER_02 39:39

And how important is niche selection in the beginning if you're starting a new channel? Let's say people are starting today.

SPEAKER_00 39:46

It's very important. So the reason uh niche selection is important is because if you uh have one goal on a YouTube channel, like let's say, for example, you want to monetize a YouTube channel and you're like, hey, I want to be a full-time content creator, and you decide to do that with a gaming channel. Well, it's gonna be it's gonna be hard. In order to go full-time as a content creator to make like, you know, a good amount of money every single month as a gaming content creator, because your your ways to monetize are limited. Um, you need tons of views as a gaming creator to go full-time. Um, you can do some light affiliate marketing, uh, you can get sponsorships and things like that, but you're still gonna need views for those things too. So when it comes to being able to monetize that, it's challenging. Um, so if you pick that niche and the goal is to be a full-time content creator, then in that case, you know, you're kind of working against yourself. Well, not working against yourself. Like you can still get a lot of views. You can do well and you can learn how to do everything and get a lot of views, and then it'll work out, you know, for you. But if the goal is my job sucks, I want to stop my job and I want to be a content creator, then in that case, going into a niche that is something that has a high probability of being able to monetize in the easiest way possible, that's the smart move, right? Because then you're like, okay, this is the type of content I'm making. This is exactly how I'm gonna monetize. It's got a ton of monetization options. They all have, you know, these great uh, you know, opportunities that come with these monetization options. And because of that, I'm gonna go into this. And you also have to ask yourself, could I make content about this for the next five to 10 years? Right. So you have to enjoy it. But uh when it comes to the niche selection, it's really important. So you, for example, you know, with Vid Pros, you know, because you guys can turn those viewers into leads for vid pros. So because of that, you know, just thinking, okay, um, every video that we make needs to be towards, you know, people that hate video editing. And we can present ourselves as a solution. So we need to make videos for people that hate video editing. Um, and we need to make sure that every single video is for people that hate video editing, um, or that don't just don't know how. They either don't know how to edit or they hate it. And and then that way you can position yourself as a solution just here and there, you know, throughout the content. Um, but when it comes to, you know, making videos that you want to make versus videos that would help you achieve the end goal, which I'm assuming with VidPros is that you, you know, use it to generate, you know, leads and brand awareness. Of course. Uh, then in that case, you should be making videos solely on like, okay, um, if somebody hates video editing, uh, would they click on this video? Or if they don't like, you know, if they don't like it or they don't know how to edit videos, would they would they click on this video? If the answer is yes, then go for it. Um if the answer is no, uh then, you know, move on and keep working on your idea until you, you know, find something they would that they would click on. And there's also nuance here, right? So when it comes to the audience that you're trying to reach, um, just because I mentioned people that hate video editing versus people that don't know how to edit, that's also two very different, you know, types of viewers and two very different types of solutions that you would offer there. So for example, for the person that hates video editing, you know, with them, you know, your titles might even say something like, you know, um, you know, uh, um, you know, this is why video editing sucks, right? It it wouldn't be that, but just off the top of my head, you know, this is why video editing sucks. And then that way you're just directly connecting with those people. Whereas if it's somebody that doesn't that that doesn't know how to edit, is it that they don't know how to edit or that they don't like to edit or they are just new to editing, but they're okay with editing, you know, um, and and getting into those nuances is also important because if you're making videos for people that um that you're trying to help them learn how to edit, then in that case, it's working against the goal, which is, you know, using the channel to drive leads, right? Because then you're just enabling them by themselves to where they don't need the service compared to like what can we make for them that would uh you know, that would just you know get us in front of enough people that that would need this service.

SPEAKER_02 43:41

For people trying to make quick money, you've mentioned there are some niches that are more profitable. What niches right now would you say are more profitable?

SPEAKER_00 43:50

So you can do a lot with a little bit when it comes to educational content because of all the different monetization options built in. So with educational content, if you're teaching people how to do anything, um there There's likely going to be some type of affiliate programs related to that. There's probably going to be products that you can create that are related to that. There might even be services that you can offer that are related to that. But educational content is a, is a, is like a fast track. But the problem with educational content is a lot of people aren't confidence, not the word that I'm looking for. A lot of people have imposter syndrome. So because of that, a lot of people, you know, won't go that route because they're like, hey, you know, I might know how to build model trains, but I don't think that I know how to build model trains enough that people would watch my videos and get value from it. Right. So because of that, they put these roadblocks up. But when it comes to teaching people things, um, yeah, like the it's just wide open in terms of in terms of what you can generate. And also depending on on the on the the skill set you have and and what it is that you can offer, like you can do a lot. Like I have a friend of mine. Um, he does sobriety content. By the time he hit uh by the time he hit 30,000 subscribers on his YouTube channel, he went from like no money to 30,000 subscribers on his YouTube channel by sending people into a high-ticket um program that he put together. Um, so he took people through that process. And by the time he hit 30,000 subscribers, he had generated uh over a million dollars um in profit, like in the in his banks, investment accounts, all that stuff. By the time he hit 30,000 subscribers on his YouTube channel, which I think took him like a year and a half, maybe two years. So when it comes to you know what it is that you're getting into, just thinking like, what is it that I can, you know, that I can offer.

SPEAKER_02 45:29

That's actually crazy.

SPEAKER_00 45:31

Um what's funny is is I've seen people do that um just with like views in terms of you know, like like starting a YouTube channel, getting just crushed with views. Uh, I have friends that do this where you know they they'll start a YouTube channel and then they just get crushed with views, and then they the only thing they care about is ad revenue. But they're really good at getting views and you know making broad audience content that is likely to get large amounts of views once they figure out how to make the content good for them. And they will start channels and then you know, within a year, they'll generate, you know, half a million dollars uh, you know, uh off of you know, off of those channels. It's it's wild, absolutely wild.

SPEAKER_02 46:09

How much of it would you say it's editing versus storytelling or delivery style?

SPEAKER_00 46:15

Um, I would say delivery and storytelling are the most important. Um, because if you can't deliver, then you can't tell the story either. So I would say delivery first, storytelling second, and then editing would be third. Um, but editing is important. However, when it comes to YouTube, there are, you know, there's channels out there where they just turn on the camera and they just sit there and talk to it. Um, and for example, I don't know if he's still doing this or not, but there was a channel called Dry Creek Wrangler School that I use as an example. And with this one, the guy, he's like some cowboy guy out on some ranch. And basically his thumbnails look interesting. They're just screenshots, like he breaks all the rules. So they're just screenshots, but it's like him sitting in these cool environments and like a cowboy hat and he's all burly looking, and uh, and he's you know just sitting there. And uh and you click on the video and he's just this like older cowboy type of guy, and he's just giving life advice to to guys. And you know, as soon as you click into it, his storytelling and delivery is I mean, it's primo. And uh you go in there and you and next thing you know, the video is over, and you're like, wow, like that was that was amazing. Um, but you know, in his case, he's carrying all of the weight by his delivery and his storytelling. Um, and those were just one-take videos where he just sits there and talks to the camera. So you absolutely have fun. Say that again.

SPEAKER_02 47:30

That's my favorite type of content, actually. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 47:32

See, see, yeah, and and with that too, you know, I don't want to discredit you know, the power of edits because most people can't pull that off. Like I can't. I've been on this for 11 years. I've made, you know, uh like way over a thousand videos, uh like long form videos between my channel and other channels that I've worked with. And out of all of that, I still wouldn't be able to just sit in a chair and just one take go through like a 30-minute, you know, 20 or 30 minute video. Just wouldn't be able to do it without, you know, edits. Even during this, you I don't know if they'll cut it out or not, but even during this podcast, I had like one time where I blanked out and it's okay to leave this in, but I had one point where you know I was answering a question and my brain just trailed off because it's like uh, you know, almost, yeah, it's almost 11 p.m. where I am. So my brain just kind of trailed off and I had to pause and I was like, where were we? You know, what was the question again? So, you know, when it comes to being able to just one take content, like that's a massive skill just by itself, in order to be able to do it in a way that other people will enjoy. Um, so that's where editing comes in because with editing, you can just cover up all your mistakes. You can take as many takes as you want to, say the thing as many times as you need to in order to get it right, and then just put it all together in the edit. Um, so that's where that's why most content creators edit their content because it's just the easier way to make everything good for people.

SPEAKER_02 48:50

Also, a lot of people say that storytelling content is dead now that it had its its moment like five years ago. Would you agree with that? Or do you think this is the moment?

SPEAKER_00 49:00

No, people have been telling stories since since we were since we were drawing in caves. Um, and it's going to continue being that way. Um, people listen to podcasts because they like hearing, you know, the stories uh when it comes to podcasts. They like the information, but in in all podcasts, you have all these little side stories. Like when we first started this podcast, you know, I had my little you know story about you know where, you know, what got me into YouTube and you know, to kind of how my journey has been. And, you know, those types of things, just people enjoy them. So yeah, when it comes to storytelling, it's definitely not dead. Uh, if you look at a lot of big YouTube channels that are doing like documentary content and just commentary content, you know, commentary on popular events, things like that, they're doing awesome. And in a lot of cases, those channels don't even have people in them, right? They'll just use, you know, slideshows or they'll use animations or whatever the thing is, but they just tell a great story and that keeps people engaged. And I think that'll, you know, as long as people enjoy movies and as long as they enjoy uh that sort of thing, I think people will, you know, always enjoy stories.

SPEAKER_02 50:04

Now, talking about short form content versus long form content, we hear a lot of different opinions lately. Uh, would you say it's the same audience? And would you say the short form is actually going to help your long form content, or is that not the case anymore?

SPEAKER_00 50:20

So when it comes to uh long form content versus short form content, you're playing two totally different games. Um, the there are the same viewers in both places. Um, you can actually go, if you have a YouTube channel, you can go into your analytics, go to the audience tab, and then when you go into the audience tab, it's going to show you the formats that people watch. And it's going to show you out of your viewers who is watching videos, um, how many people are watching. It doesn't give you a number, it just gives you this little chart and it says, you know, like, okay, live streams, everybody's watching these videos, everybody's watching these. Shorts, everybody's watching these. Um, so it just tells you out of your audience. Like with mine, even though I stream a lot, um I actually am one bar down from 100% on live streams. It's actually the thing that people don't watch the most, but I still do it. But uh, but when it comes to shorts, if you look in your analytics, on almost every channel, not every channel, but almost every channel that I've looked at, which is a ton of channels, um, they they show that shorts viewers are people that are watching their long-form content, they're also watching short form content. So the way that I uh recommend you think about shorts is if the people that I'm trying to reach are in YouTube Shorts and they're watching shorts, what can I provide them there that's going to give them value there? Because they're in shorts because they want to be watching shorts, right? Or YouTube has, you know, lured them in by having them somewhere else, you know, on the platform that they pulled them in from. But now they're in the short shelf and they're sitting there flipping through shorts and then they run into yours. Well, you want to make sure that you're thinking, like, how can I, how can I add value to these people while they're in shorts? And yes, I can absolutely say that, you know, I have this longer, you know, video, you know, I made a full video about this. You can check it out, you know, through the uh related link here. You can do that sort of thing. Some people will go over, but when it comes to shorts, it's important to think at scale. Shorts is kind of like a shotgun approach to your YouTube channel, which is why, um, which I mentioned the tool Opus Clip earlier. Um, this is why tools like that are so valuable because um it gives you the opportunity with like no effort to make a bunch of short form content out of your long form videos. So you can create entirely different channels if you want to and just bombard it with shorts for the sake of like brand awareness, right? And it's all repurpose stuff. Um, you can also, with like VidPros, for example, I'm sure you guys do clipping services. So, you know, with that, you know, they can also do something similar to where they find, you know, those points in your video and they're like, hey, you know, let's turn this into a clip, let's turn this into a clip. And then you can put those up as well. However, when you are doing that, I do recommend that you do supplement it also with custom-made content that is designed for shorts. And the reason for that is because sometimes clip content will just blow up on its own. Other times, in order to get, you know, like steady views and all that coming from shorts, you know, you got to jump in from time to time with something custom that will cause a spike. And then once it causes a spike, similar to how YouTube will chase you around if you interact with a video that we talked about earlier where you watch the entire video, go to the end screens, watch another video, that whole thing. It's the same in shorts. So if you have a shorts that just does awesome, um, then in that case, you know, then you can go back to clipping if you want to, or you can just follow it up with more customs. But um, but if you do that, then you have that larger audience that has recently interacted with it. And as long as they find value in your repurpose content, then that can help that do well also. So one thing that I do want to talk about though, uh, really quick, if it's okay, is when I mentioned earlier that that YouTube and long form are two different games. Um, I'm gonna explain why super quickly. And the reason I'm explaining this is because a really common problem when it comes to new content creators is they will say, My shorts are getting views, but I can't uh get any views on my long form content. Therefore, my shorts audience doesn't watch long form videos. Okay. And then from there, they think that it's shorts content that is holding their long form content back. So the difference is one, the views that you see on YouTube shorts are not actual views, they're impressions. They've changed that. So it used to be views, but in order to compete with TikTok and Instagram that that count an impression as a view. And just for clarity, an impression is when YouTube shows your content to somebody on the platform. So uh they count impressions as a view. So they have a different metric inside of your analytics that most people don't even look at that is called engaged views. That's the real view that you that you get, the real amount of views that you get on your shorts. So, first off, there's that. So there's the inflated perception of how many views you're getting anyway. Two, when it comes to a YouTube short, it shows up. It just happens. So you're sitting there and you're you're swiping on your phone, and then bam, there's a short, right? There's another short. Don't like that one, swipe, bam, it's an it's another short. So shorts happen to people. Yes, shorts can also show up in YouTube search. They can also get recommended in other places on the platform. And with that, people will still, you know, click into those and they'll come in and you know enjoy that, you know, content from those places too. But when it comes to the short shelf itself, it just happens to people. So they don't have to make a conscious decision to click on that because it's of something that's of interest to them. Instead, you got to hook them. And then if they enjoy whatever it is or if the topic is relevant to them, then you know they might watch. Now, when it comes to long form, the reason long form is so different is because with long form content, you have to have a good video idea. You have to package that idea well in terms of your thumbnail and title just to get people to click on it, right? That you have to do all three of those things just to get people to click on it. And people have to make the choice. And not only do they have to make the choice, but when it comes to shorts, it's focused one video at a time, one video, one video. When it comes to long-form content, you're competing against a grid or a feed of other content that YouTube thinks is going to be a great fit for the people that you're trying to reach. So because of that, um uh what happens is people see shorts, and because they happen to people, they think that, hey, people are, you know, just responding to this better. I'm getting, you know, 100 views or a thousand views on my shorts, but I'm getting nothing on my long form. All that means, it doesn't mean that your shorts viewers aren't watching the long form. It means that you just haven't gotten good enough good enough at long form yet that people will respond to your content at a level that's competitive for the platform. Like you might not even be able to get people enough people to click on your videos, and that's why they're not doing well, but it's not because of your shorts viewers. So, because of that, um, it's just a totally different game that you're playing. And another thing when it comes to the long form content is even once you get past that first part of like how do I get people to click on this and how do I make topics they care about and all that, you also have to create a great experience for those viewers, like we talked about earlier, so that they'll enjoy that content at a rate that's competitive against the other videos on YouTube, so that YouTube will continue to show it to people. So you have all of these other things involved when it comes to long form content that you don't even have to think about when it comes to short form content. So that's why a lot of content creators see huge differences like that.

SPEAKER_02 57:08

When it comes to the long-form content, you've recently mentioned that getting a thousand views is already a big deal for most creators. How should beginners set expectations without killing their ambition?

SPEAKER_00 57:18

So, um, in my opinion, I think your ambition should never be destroyed. So everything is just an obstacle, right? So when it comes to obstacles, um I think it was there's like a stoic philosopher, and he said something along the lines of like the only way up is through, I believe is the quote. I might be distorting that a little bit, but the idea is, you know, if you have ambitions and you have something that you're trying to accomplish, um, the only thing that stops you is if you decide to stop. That's it. And all of the obstacles that go in your way, whatever those are, if it's like, man, I just can't get people past this first 30 seconds, or I can't get people to click, or you know, like all that means is that, you know, you just have stuff that you have to work on, right? So like if you're not getting people to click, then you just spend more time learning how to make thumbnails, spend more time on your video ideas, spend more time, you know, putting the content together. Um, or getting people to click is not putting the content together, but spend more time on those. Maybe you need to um, you know, start copying other people's thumbnails, not literally taking them and and and using them, but saying, okay, people in my niche that are doing well, what are they doing? First, let me go look at their thumbnails. So, what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna go and I'm gonna download their thumbnails. I have a browser extension that helps you do this. It's called Creator Dashboard. It's free. Um, it's a little complicated to set up. You have to put in like your own API key and stuff, but there's a tutorial for it. But uh, but basically it shows the thumbnail like on the sidebar of the video that you're watching. But you can download that and then open it up in Photoshop or Canva or whatever it is that you use to make thumbnails and just try to replicate it, right? Try to do, you know, everything and be like, okay, instead of them, I'm gonna put myself here, um, whatever graphic it is or object or whatever the thing is, um, I'm gonna, you know, do that. I'm gonna try to replicate the text and do that with a bunch of successful videos in your niche. And if you do that, you know, 10, 15, 20 videos, your brain, you're gonna start seeing things that you just didn't see before. So for example, you might find that in your thumbnails, you're just putting way too much stuff in there. And all of that stuff is taking away from the viewers that you're trying to reach, being able to instantly recognize that your content is about something they might care about, right? So that type of exercise, it just really helps you be able to see things. And by trying to recreate them, it forces you to go through the process of not just looking at it and thinking about it, but if I recreate this, now I'm trying to understand it because I'm, you know, taking the person, putting that person in here, and you're you got to be mindful about it. You're not just, you know, just swapping stuff out. You got to be mindful about it and think, okay, like why is it that they're just focused on this one thing? Why, instead of having all this color and all these things going over the thumbnail, why do they just have like three big words on their thumbnail? Like uh three big words in their face, or you know, why do they have uh like in my case, I put YouTube logos in almost every video that I make um in my thumbnails. And I've had people ask me, like, why do you why do you do that? And the reason for that is because if I'm trying to reach content creators, that YouTube logo is something that content creators recognize instantly and they think about all the time because they're YouTubers. So it's just a little thing that I put in there to help them be able to identify that my content has something to do with YouTube because all I'm trying to do is grab their attention with the thumbnail so they'll read my title, right? So when it comes to things like that, if you start analyzing what people are doing in your niche and then try to recreate some of it, it can really help things like that stand out.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:35

I have one final question for you, because I hear a lot of people saying that 2026 is the year to grow on YouTube, that the algorithm is actually boosting new content creators. What's your take on this? Is 2026 the year to start a new channel?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:50

Yes. The reason for that, I'll actually give you a few reasons. One is if you have a new channel, um, YouTube is reserving, um, I believe it's two spots per page load on YouTube for new YouTube channels. Um, I mean, that could change by the time, you know, we're having this conversation. I mean, you know, like they do all kinds of experiments like that, but they've had this running for quite some time. Um, and that gives new channels the opportunity to get more impressions, which means they're showing your content to more people so that they, because it's always about them, right? So that they can um better learn who the right people are for your content. Because sometimes if you're a new creator, you might not package things up in a way that makes it super clear. And because of that, YouTube is doing this so that their system can figure out, like, okay, who's actually clicking on this, right? So they can fine-tune what it is that they're going on their end. Um, so that's one reason. But but that's a minor reason. The real reason that now is the time is because one, it's going to just continue to get harder. Um, I've been doing this for 11 years. Every single year has been the best year to start a YouTube channel. Um, I have friends that have been wanting to start YouTube channels for the whole time I've been on YouTube and they just haven't done it. And man, the opportunities that I know through my experience of myself and working with others that they've missed is just monumental. And because of that, um, you know, the just the point of like, this is a gigantic opportunity. How can I tap into this? Uh, you should start a YouTube channel just for that alone. Number two is that there's so much information on everything it is that you need to do. So when I first started, there was maybe like a couple of editing channels that I may have ran across, maybe. Um, there were like three channels that were talking about YouTube related stuff. And it was all vague because they were trying to get coaching clients. So it was like, these are things you need to do, but and they weren't really giving like, you know, real information. Um, they were just kind of gatekeeping a bit so that it could be like, hey, I know what I'm doing. Hire me and then I'll give you the sauce. Right. So uh, so now though, you have people like myself and a whole gigantic group of content creators that are making videos for creators that that tell you about YouTube and just how the system works, things like that. You got to be careful. There's some shady people out there too, so be careful for them. Um, and they just like they'll just get scripts from Chat GPT and then they'll just, you know, regurgitate stuff or they'll hang out in R streams and then they'll just go regurgitate stuff that they don't really know. Um, but you know, people, you know, the information is still there. Um uh in addition to that, you have entire niches now of people teaching video editing. You have entire niches now of people teaching presentation, you have entire niches now of people talking about copywriting so you can get better at titles. Um, you have entire niches now, because we talk about presenting, but just communication, you know, in general. Um, you have entire niches now about graphic design um to where just tons and tons of channels that are all talking about, you know, how to do all of this stuff better. And because of that, I mean, you even have channels dedicated to like script writing. So because of that, the amount of information at your fingertips is more than it's ever been. And then you also have AI. You got to be really careful with AI though, because if you don't know what you're doing and you're using AI, it can give you some information. Some of it can be good, but some of it's also outdated garbage. It doesn't really apply. Um, but you can absolutely use AI to also get a lead on some of this stuff. So for example, um, inside of Tuber School, uh, you know, one of the things that, you know, we go over is your audience avatar. And with that, some people are, you know, confused about it and, you know, that kind of stuff. So what they can do in that case is of course, you know, we're gonna help them through it, but they could also just go into Chat GPT or Claude or any of these LLMs and they can say, um, okay, this is the type of content that I have. This is what I'm trying to accomplish. Um, I'm filling out this PDF right here and just upload the PDF and say, just could you help guide me through this and, you know, ask me any questions that would inform me to fill this out in the best way possible based on who it is that I'm trying to reach with my type of content, right? So just you have that now as well. So since we have all of these tools and it's easier to make content, you have everything that you need in your phone, technically, in terms of cameras and all of that stuff, you should probably still get a mic. But uh, but you know, you have high quality images that you can make on your phone as long as your lighting's right. And uh, like, yeah, the the barrier to entry is almost zero. Um, and all of the knowledge that you could ever ask for when it comes to learning how to do it is all there if you just choose to seek it out and apply what it is that you learn, um, which is just a really quick thing that I want to mention. You can spend time learning everything all day long. It's really easy to learn the stuff and to know what it is that you need to do. Um, the the work is actually doing the thing and applying what it is that you learn. Um, when it comes to making content and learning about this stuff, like you can know a lot, but you have to apply what it is that you learn. Because um, over the time that I've been doing YouTube, even though a lot has changed, a lot of the core fundamentals are still the same. And once you get those core fundamentals under control and you learn how to do, you know, the basics, then from there, you know, you're you're in motion. And then you can learn and keep developing skills and, you know, things like that from there. But you you have to apply what it is that you that you learn. Um, because if you if you don't put it into practice, then you don't see how your audience responds to it. And in your mind, you're like, yeah, hey, I know. But when you're not actually applying it, then you know it just, you know, it doesn't help. Right. If you know the stuff but you don't apply it, it doesn't help. Um so because of that, anything that you've picked up from this, you know, podcast, anything that you know you pick up, you know, watching the BidPros channel or watching my channel or anybody that's helping you with anything, um, you know, you have to, you have to apply the information order in order for it to work.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:29

Got it. So overall, people just do it. Just be out there and do it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:35

Yeah. Like if it's something, if it's something to where you're like, yeah, you know, this is something I've been wanting to do, start now. Like, you know, another year's going to go by and you know that year's going to go by and you're going to be like, oh man, you know, I I knew that I wanted to do it. So here's a here's a a a trick for you when it comes to content. It's not really a trick. It's just, you know, if you think it through, this is this is how you do it. So just like if you have a doctor's appointment, you make time and you go to that doctor's appointment, right? So it doesn't matter what's going on in your life, you're like, hey, I've got to be at the doctor at uh you know three o'clock on Tuesday. No matter what's going on, you're going to be, unless something, you know, catastrophic happens, you're going to be, you're going to be at that doctor's appointment on three o'clock on Tuesday because you have to be there, just like you're at work because you have to be there, just like you go to school because you have to be there. If you look at content in the same way and you say, okay, um these are the days of the week that I'm going to work on my content. I'm going to work on them for these blocks of time. And you go ahead and just schedule them into your calendar and then you commit to yourself that no matter what, you're going to make sure that you keep that schedule. And some of those days can be for learning, some of those days can be for execution for you know doing different parts of the, you know, the the task of creating content. But if you schedule it in and you commit to making sure that what gets scheduled in gets done, then in that case, by this time next year you're going to be in a totally different position when it comes to going from wanting to have a YouTube channel.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:52

Real quick before we get back into it, if you're a creator or a business owner and you're serious about growing on YouTube, you already know that showing up consistently is non-negotiable. Nick just said it himself treat it like a doctor's appointment. Schedule it and show up every single time. But here's where most people fall apart. They spend so much time in the edit that they either burn out, slow down their upload schedule or just stop posting altogether. And when they stop posting everything stops. That is the exact problem VidPros was built to solve. VidPros gives you a dedicated human editor, not a random freelancer you found on Fiverr, not an AI tool that spits out something generic. A real editor who learns your style, understands your brand and delivers polished videos on a consistent turnaround so you never have to slow down. Our creators go from averaging four uploads a month to over 17. That is not a small jump. That is the difference between a channel that is stuck and a channel that is built in real momentum. So if you're sitting on ideas, if you have content you want to make but editing is the thing holding you back, this is your move. Head over to vidprows.com and start your $100 trial today. Now let's get back to Nick.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:57

To having a YouTube channel and possibly having that YouTube channel you know start picking up momentum you know somewhere within you know that one year period. Sometimes it takes longer though. It just depends on you know how fast you learn how fast you can apply what you learn how often you're publishing so that you can test some of the things that you learn stuff like that.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:14

Yes. Nick I've learned so much from this conversation. I'm actually going to apply so many things that you've talked about. Thank you so much for doing this again. And it's my pleasure thanks for having me on.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:25

Yeah it's been a great conversation.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:26

Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:26

If there's anything you'd like to promote please let us know and we'll keep yeah absolutely tuberschool.com definitely check us out there it's where we're helping content creators um and then from there go to nickniman.com and then that will take you to you know the different apps and tools that I have uh for content creators as well.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:44

Awesome. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:46

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:47

Nick said the only thing that stops you is deciding to stop. Every low view count every video that flopped every time the algorithm felt like it was working against you that it's just an obstacle and obstacles are just things to work through. So if you have been sitting on the idea of starting a channel stop waiting. Start now if this episode gave you something to work with subscribe drop a comment down below and we will see you in the next one bye