Ep. 8 // Eddie Caipo (No Doubt, Gwen Stefani)

Welcome back friends!

Today's episode we have Eddie Caipo on. He talks about his current position as monitor engineer for No Doubt. 

No Doubt is currently in the middle of their residency at T.he Sphere Las Vegas.

This episode focuses mostly on what its like to be there doing that gig.

Hope you all enjoy this episode you can find this on Apple, Spotify and anywhere you get fine podcasts, as well as YouTube.

Hit the link below to find everything related!!!

https://linktr.ee/JeffSuburu

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:01

Welcome back to the Noflakes podcast. My name's Jeff Sabrew. Today I have my good buddy Eddie Kaipo. Eddie is the current monitor engineer for No Doubt and Gwen Stefani. He works with Gwen Stefani throughout the year, but right now, No Doubt is doing a residency at the Spear. And so we caught up. Eddie's in Las Vegas. And so we really got into that gig. Um it's really interesting, at least to me, uh, just talking about what it's like mixing that band, dealing with each personality. Um it's it was a fun conversation. I hope you all enjoy it. My conversation with Eddie Kaipo. I like how you you gotta open it up with the watch clank.

SPEAKER_00 0:53

Oh, shaking. Oh, I didn't know it came on with a camera, so I was looking.

SPEAKER_01 0:57

I was like Yeah, bro.

SPEAKER_00 1:00

How you doing?

SPEAKER_01 1:01

I'm good, man. Are you in Las Vegas right now? I am very nice. Are you uh so are you are you posted up there the whole time?

SPEAKER_00 1:12

Are you 45 days?

SPEAKER_01 1:14

45 days. That is kind of awesome. And is that maybe the longest you've ever done a Vegas?

SPEAKER_00 1:22

No, because I've done the the uh previous residency with Gwen.

SPEAKER_01 1:26

Oh yeah, yeah, and she was longer. Wow, huh?

SPEAKER_00 1:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:32

Nice dude. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_00 1:34

How you been? You been alright?

SPEAKER_01 1:36

I've been good, man. Been good. Um yeah, just uh trying to wrap up my school year with my kids and then um getting ready for the Fife for Fighting tour was in LA last week. Um, so yeah, that was cool. Um yeah, it's funny because we rehearsed last week for a tour that isn't starting until the third of June. So it's like you know how that goes. It's like we do all the work and then we're like, oh shit, are we gonna remember all this? Yeah. So but yeah, man. Well, we've done this before with the green room.

SPEAKER_00 2:15

We haven't started yet, though, right? Or just start how does this start?

SPEAKER_01 2:19

I'm already recording. I'm already recording. I basically I'll chop it in once it gets interesting. Gotcha. Yeah. So, but yeah, here we are. Eddie Kaipo. So maybe that'll be my starting point right there. There you go. Um, so you're in Vegas, you're doing the No Doubt. I almost said Gwen Stefani, but this is the actual no no doubt, man. Yeah. That's uh that's a little bit of another level. A little, you know, that's where she comes from and all that. So how long is how long is this re uh residency happening at the Spear?

SPEAKER_00 2:54

Uh it's basically uh six weeks. Um we're doing 18 shows. We did show number seven yesterday.

SPEAKER_01 3:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:05

Three shows a week, you know.

SPEAKER_01 3:07

Man, that's so cool. Is there much uh variation? I mean, I know how it goes like on tours and stuff, like night to night. Has there been anything in there so far that's like set other shows apart from you know, let's say the first to like you know, the fifth show? Or is it the first one?

SPEAKER_00 3:27

Yeah, I mean, there it was I can tell you that it just keeps getting better and better for sure. Like it things just start getting tighter and uh you know you get in the groove, as you know. You know, once you once you're doing the show, uh you get in a groove. Even though we put in a lot of time rehearsing, so musically they were really pretty tight. This is more about the production side of it where just things keep getting better and better, you know. It's a really good show, it's a lot of fun.

SPEAKER_01 3:56

Yeah, it looks so cool. I mean, I've just watched videos, you know, like of like her hand coming down, you know, like it's so sick looking, it's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 4:06

It's a pretty good looking show, you know. Um, and as you know, the whole sphere thing is immersive as well. Um so yeah, it's it's cool. It's cool. You should take a trip and come see it.

SPEAKER_01 4:18

Man, I would love to. Um, I don't think I'm gonna have time, but yeah, you're busy. When you guys add like, you know, the next the next run, I'll try and make that.

SPEAKER_00 4:31

I I hope we do, yeah, because it's a really good show.

SPEAKER_01 4:33

Yeah. Has anybody um obviously you got Steven and Gabe there? Is anybody from Gwen's band came out?

SPEAKER_00 4:41

I haven't seen anybody yet. No, not yet. I'm sure they will at some point unless they're busy touring or something, but um hopefully they will soon, because we I mean we're show seven, so we still got eleven shows.

SPEAKER_01 4:56

Yep. Yeah, it goes so what'd you say June 8th?

SPEAKER_00 4:59

June 13th is the last show.

SPEAKER_01 5:02

Nice, yeah, nice, and you'll be like, okay, get me out of Vegas.

SPEAKER_00 5:07

Yeah, it's it's uh you know, it we try to keep it uh uh I don't know, try to be active somehow. The other day I went to the Valley of Fire and just kind of like hang out. It's like a area very remember that place we went to in Saudi Arabia that had all those rocky formations, and yeah. It's kind of like that, yeah, it's like old red rocks and like nice it's pretty cool. You just kind of walk around, you know.

SPEAKER_01 5:33

Yeah, you go out, shoot some freaking machine guns, no, nothing like that.

SPEAKER_00 5:38

In fact, when you walk in in, the first thing it says no, no shooting, no hunting, no nothing. And there's a sign, I don't know if you saw it on my post, it says uh uh a heat warning, you might die. That's Jesus. That's the sign. I took a picture next to it. I'm like, check it out.

SPEAKER_01 5:55

Yeah, okay, cool.

SPEAKER_00 5:56

Literally, it says you you might die. So yeah, okay. That's a lot. Yeah, I'm gonna get in my car, stay on the AC.

SPEAKER_01 6:03

You're like, I gotta, I gotta be alive until June 13th. Yeah, I gotta be alive at least for another month. Yeah, being in Vegas with you know, you got like your whole week off. I'm sure you're like, there's plenty of places to eat, which is awesome. Yeah, but but every week you're probably like shit, okay, what am I gonna do now, right?

SPEAKER_00 6:22

You know, uh there's only so many places you can go that are like you know, like you know, fan not fancy, but you know what I mean, like like places to go in Vegas, restaurants and stuff. You can visit a few of those, but at some point we just want regular food, you know. You just kind of find a spot that you can have some lentil soup and maybe there you go, you know. I don't know, some grilled chicken with rice, I don't know, but like something simple, you know. Um exactly something less Vegas-ish, but yeah. I I mean I don't mind it too much, and the the rooms are comfortable and and you know, we're hanging out and and you know, we get we get time off, so it's you it's only three shows a week. So uh but because they're scattered through the week, uh sometimes there's no time really to go back home and and make it back in time or at least to make it you know cost efficient. So basically I stay here, you know.

SPEAKER_01 7:16

Yeah, I mean sometimes those because sometimes those Vegas flights are actually pretty expensive to just get yourself just to get yourself back, it's like damn, dude. It's not like a Burbank kind of a flight.

SPEAKER_00 7:27

For some reason they're expensive, but yeah, and and as you know, we live far from the airport, so when you add what it's gonna cost to go back and ground transportation, well, it's just it's just I'm like, you know what, I'm just gonna stay. Yeah, uh, and I'm always working on something uh here or whatever, so or you know, just trying to find something creative to do or for sure.

SPEAKER_01 7:49

I need to get creative and send you some tunes, man. Yeah, yeah. But um, yeah, so that's where you're at now. So we kind of did this on the green room, did a little Eddie backstory, but let's let's get into it because we got more time. Oh snap. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 8:07

Like time is not an issue.

SPEAKER_01 8:09

Well, it's always an issue. We're not gonna go crazy. Don't go that deep. Yeah, so originally from Lima, Peru, right? Yeah. As the uh story goes, grew up in your family's nightclub working, yeah, like from super young, right?

SPEAKER_00 8:29

When you were Yeah, actually born in LA, raised in Peru. Right. And then so yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:35

So to stop you there, so that makes you you're you're a city US citizen.

SPEAKER_00 8:39

I'm on USA. Well, you are you working with ICE or something? Do I need to show you documentation? Oh, so so what you're saying is I'm like, this just took a turn. I'm gonna close the laptop.

SPEAKER_01 8:56

Clank.

SPEAKER_00 8:57

Clank.

SPEAKER_01 8:58

Someone just comes behind you as a podcast.

SPEAKER_00 8:59

Yeah, I just come and just arrest me. It's like, damn, dude. That's how we that's how it is now. No, no, no. You're just recruiting. Shit. I know a guy.

SPEAKER_01 9:13

No, because I didn't realize because I interviewed Sean Hurwitz too, and he was the same story. So, you know, coming he came from Israel, but you know, it's a huge advantage, is my point of bringing that up of being a citizen. And and so, anyways, moving on. We're joking, I'm joking. Moving on for the political stuff, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:34

Uh yeah, so I grew up in Peru, and then my parents owned uh the only Mexican restaurant at the time uh in Lima, right? And it was a pretty cool restaurant. Yeah, and it had it had like a it was like you had dinner and a show, basically. And so we had a stage, the whole nine yards, PA, and my dad being a musician, uh, he uh you know had the the house band, and there would be I don't know, three, four, five different artists that perform a night, you know?

SPEAKER_03 10:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:10

And uh there was a moment where they had a sound guy there that he hired. But you kind of know me, I guess. I always thought that he wasn't that good, and I wasn't I was a teenager, but I was always reading books, audiobooks, and and you know, uh sound reinforcement books or studio recordings or whatever, and learning techniques or whatever. And I just and always doing stuff with my dad in his studio, so we kinda I kind of jumped in and told the guy, you know, every time you're mixing this feedback, this all this you need to step aside for a second. And he didn't say anything because I'm the son's owner, so he kinda let me he thought he thought it was gonna be a train wreck, right? And it wasn't, and all of a sudden, at least in other people's eyes or perception, they were like, Oh, it sounds better when this kid is running it, and before you know it, he wasn't working there necessarily, but I was working in and and and learning more, of course, by doing it, you know. Yeah, at the time that there were no faders at the time there were we had this board that was a tapco that if I'm not mistaken, eventually years later became Mackey, but it had knobs, zero to ten, and like it was just old school, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:29

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 11:30

So you would just have like channel one, knob, yeah, channel two, yeah, knob, and then it had you know, treble mid-bass kind of thing, and then right one one reverb send, and that was it, you know.

SPEAKER_01 11:43

That was it. That's crazy, and I just keep doing that, yeah. And so like how you're like what 13, 14?

SPEAKER_00 11:50

Yeah, I'm uh maybe 12, 13, maybe 12.

SPEAKER_01 11:54

Yeah, so when you're that age, that's crazy. Like, so are you already like aware of certain mix engineers that you're like this guy's the shit, you know, or was it just kind of like natural for you to be like that doesn't sound right, I want it to sound better? Or were you already thinking about like, oh, like this engineer, like I want, you know, like he's the man, like I want to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_00 12:20

Yeah, there was there was definitely some of that as I was discovering things. I used to always love I mean you're you're younger than me, but I'm sure you still gotta you get to see all the credits and CDs and stuff like that. So I used to be a stickler for that. I used to always read that. I want to know who did what. Not just on the audio part, but like musicians and stuff, and yeah, and of course, you know, there was I used to really like the mixes of this guy, Eric Schilling, who's the he was the Miami sound machine engineer. I liked I just like the way he mixed things. Of course, Bob Clearmountain.

SPEAKER_01 13:00

That's that's funny. I was gonna say his name, but I wasn't sure if I was like in the right zone. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

No, he's he's the guy. I mean, he basically mixed my whole childhood. Yeah. Well, and many more, of course, but he he's definitely one that I would always uh like.

SPEAKER_01 13:15

Uh so who who are a couple artists that clear uh that he that he mixed? Like just off the top of your own.

SPEAKER_00 13:25

Tears for fears pretenders, like I mean, it's all that era he he had his hands on that. Right. Oh yeah. Um so it was it's just looking into that always I didn't really understand necessarily, even though I was kind of doing it. And I thought I knew a lot, but I didn't really. I was just learning and figuring things out. Plus with limited equipment, you know. Um but you know, kind of trial and error, just moving things because I had the time, I had the patience, and I had the gear at home. Um one of the things I would do is make you know, mixtapes for you know, friends in school. And because you copy for one, like I would come to the States and buy cassettes and then take them home and then make the mixtapes, you would there would always be be some kind of signal loss or sound sound would be different when you copied it.

unknown 14:20

Right.

SPEAKER_00 14:21

So I would always be the one who would compensate for that, you know. Like make sure it sounded as good as the original, you know.

SPEAKER_01 14:27

Eddie's mixtapes.

SPEAKER_00 14:29

Yeah, so I would just kind of like EQ it so it sounded as close as possible to my original cassette, you know?

SPEAKER_01 14:35

Wow, that's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 14:36

And I will I will just you know either sell them or give them away at school, whatever, or just have them for fun, or just practice like that. Just why why does this frequency, if I move this, oh what is it doing, you know, in identifying things or whatever, just learning, you know?

SPEAKER_01 14:52

Yeah. Yeah, that's awesome. So you're doing that, and we've talked about before, like, you know, you were basically like in in school, like just reading, like, you know, if Pro Tools came out, you're like reading about that, you know, like instead of like not that you weren't.

SPEAKER_00 15:08

Protests came out once I moved to back to the States. So that was years later. But I was I was definitely reading books about recording, you know, recording, uh, and and anything that will I could get my hands on that was either a magazine or something where I will read interviews from people who are mixing tours or making records, you know. Mixed magazine was one of them back in the day. Uh uh, yeah, whatever I could get my hands on, or like if we would go to a guitar center, uh we would take trips, a lot of vacation trips to the States or whatever. So I will I will just like uh you know go with my dad to guitar center, and there's always magazines. I would just buy anything that was related to sound.

SPEAKER_01 15:48

Yeah. So for you it was because you're per you play percussion too, and you play various instruments, but it was always pretty much sound for you. Yeah, like being an engineer. That's pretty cool, man.

SPEAKER_00 15:59

Yeah, I was in the band too, but it was uh I was never really great at it. I I I mean, I could play keyboards just enough to support the rest of the band in a way, just to support.

SPEAKER_03 16:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:11

And I'll play samples and some chords, but I will I always had a percussion rig around me where I could, you know, play keys and percussion at the same time, sort of like you know, yeah. Tamarine and chords, you know.

SPEAKER_01 16:23

Sure, yeah, like we talked about in Smash Mount, but we should we'll get to that. But um, and so uh sorry, I didn't even really introduce I'm gonna have an introduction for this, but obviously you currently do monitors and you do FOH when that comes out what comes up to. Um But I think it's so important um for people to understand, like in your job, you are like I am an engineer. This is what I want to do. I want to do um monitors, and I want to be the best at it, and you are the best at it, which is why you get all the work. You really you are, man, and every anybody you work with, and I find not to throw shade on anyone, and I'm not naming anyone specifically, I find a lot of times though, with engineers, a lot of times they're kind of like, Yeah, I'm gonna be the monitors today, but you know, normally I'm like a bass player, like normally I'm doing front of house, or normally I'm doing this, and take not taking the pride in the actual job. Yeah, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 17:31

There's a lot of that.

SPEAKER_01 17:32

Um I feel like there's a lot of that where it's like, man, like you know, someone like you, you're like, no, like this is what I love doing, and the job is so important, and it's such a creative job, you know, if you want it to be. Um, and it just makes the world of difference, you know, when when you have someone like you back there going, like, you're already doing things before anyone has to say it, because you're listening, you're just listening to the mixes and and going, like, well, yeah, like you know, he's a guitar player, so he probably wants this, and like you just you make moves before I even have to say anything, which is amazing. It's so great.

SPEAKER_00 18:13

That's the idea, but it's also I think I I appreciate you saying that. That's very, very cool. I and it is true. I I love what I'm doing, I love what I do. I always wanted to do this, so I'm like, I guess the cliche of like I'm living my dream, right? Yeah, so I will never ever, and you made a reference to this because you know me for many years, no matter what I'm doing, I'm never gonna phone it in. And there was a I I made a comment on one of your posts, uh, and I and I stand by that. Like, no matter what you're gonna do, and you're the same way, musically speaking. I do it with audio, you do with music, you never phone it in, and that's key because technically speaking, engineers, there's always gonna be someone better than me. There's a million waiting to take my gig or whatever, like that are just really good at what they do. But it's more than that, right? You gotta have work at it, you have to uh care about what you do, and you have to anticipate, you have to know how to deal with artists and and their emotions, and a lot of times what they're asking you is completely unrelated to audio, right? You know, anybody any artists who come in freaking out about something and they're gonna blame audio, but it's not audio, so you have to know how to navigate that and all of a sudden make you feel like oh you're in a safe place, you know, safe space, and then you're gonna be fine. Don't worry about this, we're gonna fix this, but I can do this for you if that makes it any better. And before you know it, they're doing great and they're calm, and you haven't really even changed anything, maybe, or you made a such a small adjustment that they're just like, oh, everything's normal, everything's it's just they get in their heads, right? So, and also like keep it in mind, like no matter whether I'm doing a big gig like I'm doing now, or any other artist that is pretty big, or I go to my former kids, kids' high school where I mentor a theater program and we're working with a little tiny mixing board, right? I I give that same effort. Like when I'm there, to me, that's just as important that I'm imagining at that point we're in Broadway now, we're doing Broadway theater, not high school theater and Brentwood. You know, where I'm gonna give it everything I have and I'm gonna try to learn other things to teach them to always be at the highest level, right? Right, doesn't matter what it is, and then the next day I could go mix a stadium, and it doesn't matter. Like it to me, I I gotta give uh the same value and effort to it, you know?

SPEAKER_01 20:43

Absolutely. I mean, logistically, obviously things get way more complicated with the bigger gigs, but when you when you break it down to the smallest and the most important elements, it's the same thing. Yeah, it's the same thing, like you're you're mixing a show, and and I look at it the same too. It's like if I'm playing in front of two people, I'm still playing songs, I'm still doing the same kind of art, so it's always the same. You have to look at it like that. Like, um and I witness you do that.

SPEAKER_00 21:15

I witness you do that because you could go do your solo stuff uh uh you know at a bar or a wine bar or whatever, and you're playing, and I see you you're doing your thing, you don't phone it in, and then two or three days later most of the time. Well, you know, well, maybe you're not showing it, which is still important, right? Yeah, because you know, it you know, some some gigs could be, you know, could become like a routine thing, and but I get it. However, it doesn't feel that way, and then two or three days later, you know, you're performing in front of sixty thousand people, and that's cool because then yeah, you get to uh experience both things, but you also you know, uh again, you give the importance to all gigs. Because you love music. That's the bottom line. You love performing.

SPEAKER_04 22:03

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 22:04

And really, it's like uh I I want to get back to something else, but yeah, someone told me this on kind of on this idea of like the relativeness of playing, like it's like even the farthest we go and all this knowledge we get and music and sound and professionalism, we're still kind of always like chasing that initial feeling we had when we were like 14, right? Like, like that whole feeling, it's like that is the most important thing, like when we're doing our job. It's like this is why we do it. You know, like it is just that initial, that initial excitement about it with that keeps you going, like, no, like I'm gonna stay here and I'm gonna work on all your guys' stuff and I'm gonna make sure everything's tight. And you know, it's like it's it it's not you're not just like collecting a paycheck, you know what I mean? Um it's it's making sure that everything's just how it needs to be. And then another thing on how you were saying um working with artists, and it's more than giving a good mix, it's more than that. Uh you told me a story with Enrique, actually, how you know, like you were the one that would always come in before the show, and he would talk to you, you'd give him his his pack, you know, and you'd give him a little pep talk, and sometimes even he would be like, Man, I don't know, like I'm I'm not feeling it, or whatever. And you would give him like words of confidence, right?

SPEAKER_00 23:36

Like, I remember it happens, it happens.

SPEAKER_01 23:38

You told me that that one time where you're like, you're like, no, man, like you have like the it factor, right? And he was kind of like, I guess I do. This is Enrique Iglesias, you know, like even he gets like to a point where he's like, Oh, I don't know if I want to do it, you know, and and that's kind of part of your job is you you come in, you're like, no, dude, like we all got you. We got you on this, like just do your thing. You're the you're the guy, you know.

SPEAKER_00 24:04

Yeah, I mean, it and it happens. I mean, people think that people forget, I think. People who are not in our industry industry forget that um, or even some people who are in our industry don't understand that part of it, where they're like they're people like just like us. They have fears, they have insecurities, they have worries, they have you know, all that. So uh every now and then it will happen. It's you know, it's for some people it's rare, for some people it's every day, for some people it's once in a while. But this one time that you mentioned, yeah, I walked in to you know, give him his pack and just standard hi, here's this, I would go to show, walk away. But I could tell there was something going on, and I kind of like, are you cool? Is everything okay? He was like, Well, you know, you know, he was just nervous. You can tell he was nervous. And I said, you know, you don't have to worry about anything. You have like the best team, you know, we're we're all here, we all got you. We're you know, we will never let you fail. We were you're gonna be fine, you're gonna be okay. You know, plus you, you know, you're the guy. Like this, all these people are coming to see you, you're gonna be great. Just come out. You can even hear him. Like we were in the dressing room far away, but you can still hear him. And uh I said, it's gonna be great. Just you you have this, you have this it thing that you know, because like he made a reference, like, well, you know, I'm not singing that good. I was like, no, no, it's like it's not it's not all that, you know. It's it's you have this thing that people love about you, they want to see you, they want to hear you. So just go out there, do you do what you do, don't worry about anything else. Yeah, and and all of a sudden you can feel him and see him kind of go like he got a little lift. Yeah, and and and maybe he was just having a bad day or he was missing home, you know, his kids, which happens to all of us, right? So we get to experience a little bit of that, also, and we understand why he could be thinking that. So it that's all it was, you know. And I would have done that with him or you or anybody in the band, also, like you know what I mean, or a crew member if they're having a bad day, you know, or something, you know. We have to be aware of that. But it happens all across the board, though, right? From the artists all the way to any of us, you know. Sometimes we need, you know, it I mean, when you really think about it, it takes a lot of courage for all of you guys to set foot on stage and play in front of thousands of people. Like it's not an easy thing for any it's very daunting for anybody to just go up there and go, oh shit, all these people are watching. And their phones are on me too now. So if I make any mistake, if I say the wrong thing, it'll be posted within seconds, right? So yeah, that adds another adds another element of stress and pressure. Um so it takes a lot of courage to do that. So keeping that in mind, I think I've learned to be more empathetic with musicians and artists and understand that if they're having a moment is not personal, it's not like they're attacking the sound that I'm giving them. It's more like, man, something's not right, I don't know what it is, help me out. It's basically what they're telling you.

SPEAKER_01 27:18

They just act and a lot of times it's not even anything that is a change for you, it's a change for them, right? So it's the thing is like going on stage, if it was like, okay, once a year you're gonna play this massive show and make sure you're ready for it, and everyone could just be ready for it and be like, this is gonna be the biggest day of the year, that would be one thing. But the thing with musicians that play a ton of shows, it's like nope, you're gonna play 150 shows a year, and every day something's also gonna be happening in your life, and so like if you're having just a total shit day, guess what? This is still the big show, you're still going out, and you gotta put on that face. And for someone like Enrique or like Gwyn or Christina Aguilar, all these people that he's massive stars, and their name is the one that's out there. Like, the amount of pressure where you're like, oh my god, like this is all on me. Like, I feel it getting on stage, yes, but at the same time, I'm a guitar player, my name is not on the freaking, you know, my name isn't on the stadium, you know, where it's there's so much pressure with that. Um just like, yeah, I'm a singer, you know, it's it's so much more than that.

SPEAKER_00 28:48

Oh, for sure, for sure. And and you know, every position has different levels of pressure, but you're right. The one that has the name of the marquee, that's the one that is like potentially feels it the most, right? Uh yeah. So it's I have to be understandable of that. Like, of you know, there are limits. Uh, if there's if it's there's an artist who is just a pain in the ass always, no matter what day of the week it is, then that's a little different. But and you just manage it differently. Um, but I I'm trying to be very aware of that because especially mixing monitors, if I'm a front of the house, then I don't have that interaction. But if I'm at monitors, it's all about mood and perception. A lot of it is, you know, it's not necessarily a technical thing all the time.

SPEAKER_01 29:35

Yeah, it's because our ears actually are changing, especially with travel. And I've heard you say this a bunch of times, you know. It's like, hey, you know, I I can't uh this are these the same ears, like no, it sounds muffled. Well, I've heard people say that, and it's like it's like, did you just get off a flight? You know, like are your ears plugged? Because sometimes we don't even know it, you know, or like like, oh, this sounds really weird. It's like, well, you did just fly for like 14 hours, you know. So and or maybe we did just play a show last night, you know, you you might your ears might be.

SPEAKER_00 30:14

Yeah, I mean, all those elements I try to keep in mind, and and and I I bring I bring something like that up if they're asking for weird changes or they're making global decisions on something that hasn't changed, you know. Uh in the analog days, you know, a knob could be moved by accident or something with a cover or something. But with digital, if if I saved it exactly as it was yesterday, when I load it up again, it's exactly as it was yesterday.

unknown 30:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 30:43

You know? So I at least we know that our starting point is exact. Anything that adds a variable will be maybe a little bit of the the venue could alter certain things, but but even that, everything's so close in your ears, and yeah, it should be exact.

SPEAKER_01 31:00

I've heard it countless times of you, someone, including myself, saying, Did something change? And you're like, all the same here, man. Everything's the same. Yeah, you're like, nothing changes, yeah, and we're like, oh, and then when you realize, like, oh shit, it's me, something's wrong with my ears or something, you know.

SPEAKER_00 31:19

Yeah, there's been time where someone says, It sounds muffled or this and that, and and and trouble was not an issue or anything like that. And I double check, I always give the benefit of the doubt. Of course, I always check my stuff to make sure maybe a plugin didn't get disabled or something, and then it did change the sound. But if I'm very confident that nothing changed on my end, I I say that. But then my next step is to check, you know, their body pack or or their in-ears themselves, it could be plugged up with wax and it's plugging up the the high-end, you know, tunnel part. It's like, yeah, uh, it's like okay, it could be anything, and sometimes it happens. You take the ear out, it goes, oh, it's compacted with wax. Let me clean it up, you know.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

Yep, yeah. Yeah. I mean, that's what's that's why you're so great, honestly, because you will actually do that, you know. Some guys will be like, nope, nothing changed. That's yeah, and they don't, yeah. End of story.

SPEAKER_00 32:16

Yeah, it's just you know, that's a personality thing, I guess. I I care about everything from from the source, right? From in your case, from the guitar all the way onward to the board, and then what comes back to you guys. It's all important. I I can't ignore any of those things because it it makes a difference. Because if it if it starts from the source and it sounds good, it'll be very easy for me to send it back to you guys and make it sound good. It's it's really at that point, I'm not doing much. I'm just kind of making sure that it's right, you know.

SPEAKER_01 32:49

Yeah, yeah. I think it's uh for my listener, my one listener out there, it's important to understand like your job as a monitor engineer is the most intimate um relationship between the band because that's what we hear. So so front of house has a huge job too, because that's what everybody that's what every the audience hears, you know. But we're not hearing that pretty much, you know, because we're all in in ears, our ears are plugged with these little earbuds basically that are molded, and so we hear exactly what you are giving us. And so it's just yeah, though what you're wearing right there. Um so yeah, the artist, you know, that is a very um, it's a high pressure relationship between you and the artist, because they're looking at you like, make this sound good, you know, like like it and sometimes they'll even say that, make it sound good.

SPEAKER_00 33:50

You know, oh yeah. I heard that.

SPEAKER_01 33:53

Yep. And um, I mean, that's some people could buckle under that pressure, you know, if they're like like, hey, this sounds weird or whatever, you know, but you're always like head in the game where you can fix it. I don't know, I don't think I've ever heard Gwen say anything. I don't know how she is, but um, I know she's specific though, right? She's very yeah, she's specific. She's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_00 34:14

She likes so far, she likes the sound that I've been giving her. This it's gonna be 10 years this in the next couple months. So cool. Uh and she's always been great. Uh the other day before we started this sphere thing, we were doing the first day of rehearsal. And and it's funny because I spoke to her about this yesterday. So that's why I'm gonna make a reference to it. I have never had one issue with Gwen. The most, because she's like super nice and super respectful, the most is that one day if she's you know, she just flew in, which is what we were talking about earlier, and maybe sounds a little muffled, she'll make a reference to that, and I'll I'll discuss with her and say, look, this is what's going on, and I can brighten it up more, but you're still not gonna hear it. All it's gonna do is just hurt your ears at this point. So I can do it right now for the sound check, but hop out for the show, I put your settings back to normal, because you got like whatever, six hours prior to show, and by then hopefully your ears will get unplugged. Because yeah, yeah, no problem, do that. Great, and we do that, and then after the show, I check up on her and she's great. She was like, everything was great, thank you. So that communication, right? But uh on that first day of rehearsal, she came in, and everything was wrong. Like she was like, What is happening? And she was she for the first time in 10 years, she showed a little bit of frustration. And I was like, She wasn't rude, but she was just frustrated. Why doesn't why is it not sounding, you know, your usual sound? This is something's not right, and and I don't know what it is, but this is not the sound that you normally give me. Now, in her defense, she wasn't wrong because there were some slight differences in equipment that we had, uh, and formats and how we were routing things, but nothing that drastic. But somehow, between the flight and the fact that she was a little bit uh altered in her ears, between that and and the difference in format, I think she picked up on it and she was like, Something's right, and she was really adamant about it, and she was she even might have even used the word this sounds really bad. And I and I have never heard and she even told me, You've been here 10 years. When have I ever told you something like this? And I go, Never. Yeah, so so you know that I'm not lying, right? You know I'm not making this up, and and I go, No, I totally understand. Let's try this, let's try this. And we tried things, and we were very uh uh, you know, pragmatic. She was patient. No, it was she was patient, and I tried a few things, all of a sudden everything was fine, and we fixed things or whatever. Uh the next day I ended up putting things basically back, and she was perfectly fine, so it was a combination of things, but you still gotta work with them, right? You still gotta work with them and try to find what's going on, right? I I knew that it was maybe half and half, half audio, half emotional per per se. Right.

SPEAKER_01 37:24

Was this before the first show?

SPEAKER_00 37:25

Oh, yeah. This is weeks ago.

SPEAKER_01 37:28

This is so she's like this is probably nerdy.

SPEAKER_00 37:31

Yes, this was the first time she showed up to our a rehearsal. Because first we get a uh we got a rehearsal with just the guys, and then she showed up and then stayed for the rest. So this is weeks ago, weeks ago. But yesterday we were joking around before Sanchez goes, hey, so everything's cool. Any notes from the last show? He goes, No, everything was great, thank you, blah, blah, blah, blah. And it goes, uh, and he goes, No, I was just not feeling uh good uh yesterday, whatever. And but I think I'm good now. I was a little, I was my mood was a little, you know. I think I was I might have been cranky yesterday. I was like, oh, nobody noticed anything. We were like, you were fine. Uh and I go, plus, I've never seen you ever in the 10 years I've been with you. I've never seen you cranky except for that other day when you almost fired me. And and she goes, Oh, come on, I would never fire you. And and and and and you know what? And that was just me being being emotional. That was there wasn't really nothing wrong with anything. I was like, she said that on her own, kind of thing. I was like, I think that was just being I was just being nervous, uh, not emotional. Sorry, she said, I think it was just me being nervous about getting everything started. I'm like, yeah, but no worries, we we've sorted it out, and everything was cool. Sorted it out, yeah, and that came naturally from her. Like, I'm not saying this publicly to make her make her or anybody, you know, weaponize it to say, oh, Gwen Stefani's rude or nothing. Not at all. Because she was never rude at any moment. No, this was the only time I've ever seen frustration, and it turns out weeks later, she just tells me on her own, says, I was just really nervous that day, and I just didn't know what I was doing.

SPEAKER_01 39:08

It's like, oh, it's the same thing. I mean, she's they have this massive residency at the sphere, which is so insanely expensive to get this whole thing together. Oh, yeah, and it's huge, and in a band that never plays, and so it's like, no doubt's coming. This I mean, the pr that's it's the same thing we're saying with the Enrique all the pressure, and it's like you know, she's probably like, Oh my god, this uh this sounds this doesn't sound exactly how I think it should sound, you know. When really there's probably other things, and also one thing, uh her mix, I would imagine, you have to do a totally different kind of mix when you're doing No Doubt, as opposed to when you're doing Gwyn by herself, because it's different players, different inputs, different guitar stuff, different drum stuff. So it's a whole new thing, right?

SPEAKER_00 40:00

Yeah, it's a little different. I mean, the one of the important things to to I want to say this before we finish the side of the the con the emotional part, where it's important to always have a safe space for them where they can feel comfortable saying those things without us utilizing. I said, Are you moody again today? No, we we can't we can't use it against them, right? Yeah, right. They have to feel safe that they and that's why she she's able to say these things to someone like me in this case. Yeah, and then going to the mix part, my approach is the same, whether it's her solo stuff or or this band stuff, uh, as far as mixing, because we're still mixing music, right? But but the differences are on certain things that get featured more than others, uh, like like uh in her solo stuff, uh we rely a little more on the click for her because we have clicks and slates that are built in into one channel, yeah uh or cues. Um but here I feature more like the band, like drums, like like the full thing.

SPEAKER_01 41:11

Like interesting.

SPEAKER_00 41:12

Click tracks are only in on on like if there's a break, if there's a stop, yeah, or or for some reason because fear it's has a particular delay time on the PA. If for some reason uh you know she starts drifting in time because everything's sort of delayed, then I I I bring in the click immediately to lock her back in and then it goes back out. But on uh on you know, the approach is still the same on my part. I try to make it very musical, try to match the records a lot. Yeah, you know, uh, but there's always something that is gonna be a little different. Like for instance, uh on that song Underneath It All, uh it has like a farfisa uh organ during the choruses, right? Doing some arpeggios. On the choruses, she doesn't want to hear the that farfisa because it has sort of like a dissonance, sort of detune sort of sound. It can mess up your singing, it can mess up her pitch, her pitch reference, right? So I feature I turn that down or off on the choruses only, it's on on the other parts, and I feature more like the guitar or something, and then yeah, that's her pitch reference, right? Um so things like that that change depending on the song, and and that's different also from when we do that in her solo shows. Uh, but other than that, it's still the same as far as music sort of mixing, you know, uh a lot of automation and things that are happening to make sure things stay nicely balanced for everybody.

SPEAKER_01 42:47

And so it's I heard her say I heard her say uh when we did uh the good morning America, and there was a different engineer there, you weren't there, and so she was you know, she was vo voicing her what she wanted, and it sounded like she likes a ton of delay. She liked delay delay on her vocal.

SPEAKER_00 43:07

We have delay, she likes delay on her on her vocal, and I have I even have it ping-pong, and like I I have a t tempo map uh on per on a per song basis, and then uh or per section, even some sections are different tempo. Uh but she likes to hear it, she likes delay. That's cool. I I believe that before I started, it was more of a slap, or more like a 300 millisecond that would just stay steadily, is my understanding. I could be wrong, uh, but I what I what I learned that they would just find a delayed time and they would just leave it on.

SPEAKER_01 43:48

Yeah, so it's just kind of like a shh like a reverb, right?

SPEAKER_00 43:53

Well, it's like a 300 millisecond delay that is just there, so it's a little beyond a slap. Yeah, but but what I what I Did from the beginning is I want to tempo map it and I play with delays too. So sometimes the delay is on as a texture, and then I also do delay shots for fun. Like yeah, so she gets and she plays with that. She'll she will use it during songs because I'm doing like dub delays for her. Yeah. Or I also do long quarter note delays or half note delays, depending on the song. And I play with that, and so does she. And even when she's speaking to the audience, the delay is on.

SPEAKER_01 44:35

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:36

And she also plays with that as she's speaking to the audience. She speaks in a sort of a rhythmic way. So what I do is if we have a particular song that's kind of coming up next, I make sure that the delay is in time of the template of the song that's coming up next as she's talking.

SPEAKER_03 44:52

Yeah, that's cool.

SPEAKER_00 44:53

And you'll you'll hear her and you'll see her as she's walking and talking to the audience, she'll be like, in time.

SPEAKER_01 44:59

That's sick.

SPEAKER_00 45:00

It's pretty cool. Uh like I I I kind of figured that out with her, kind of that she started enjoying. I just tried tried things, and then I can see that she liked it.

SPEAKER_01 45:09

So I was like, Yeah, did you so did you did you guys like have a conversation about that? Like, hey, like I'm gonna put this delay in the time of the next song, or she just kind of figured it out.

SPEAKER_00 45:19

I just started doing it, I and I just noticed that she was playing it and it's all written, she kept it in rhythm. Yeah, that's so then when the song starts, it's also it's already at the tempo. Yeah, uh, the only conversation we had was at the very beginning when I first started with her. Is that do you want me to turn the delay off when you're talking?

SPEAKER_03 45:38

Right.

SPEAKER_00 45:39

Because she's talking and the delay is going like and it's yeah, wow, wow, wow, it's prominent. It's not that it's quiet, you know. And and she goes, no, no, you can leave it on. I was like, okay.

SPEAKER_04 45:50

That's cool.

SPEAKER_00 45:51

You know, yeah. So the only the only times I may turn it down a little is during rehearsals if she's communicating with the band. That way when they respond to her, they're not she's not hearing her her repeat over them. So for communication purposes, but during the show it stays on even while she's talking.

SPEAKER_01 46:11

So yeah. So how do you manage um mixing her? Because you're very focused on her, but then you're mixing the band too, right? Yeah, yeah. So do you have like a whole different board for the band? No, no, it's all the same, it's all the same board. Um, so yeah, I mean, that's got that's tricky right there, because in your position, your main focus is the one that's name is on the marquee, right? You gotta keep them happy because they're you know, they're your person. Um, but then managing that where you're like, okay, and you got like a bass player, like, hey, I need more bottom snare or something.

SPEAKER_00 46:51

You know, yeah. I need 20 dB on 20 db. We won't say who. I need 20 dB of the pads, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:02

But the pads are not playing. Oh yeah, at rehearsal before there's a crowd. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Do you want to wait until we're playing it with the nope, nope, I need it now.

SPEAKER_00 47:13

Uh well, like in this case, uh like when you know, I tend to do this, and I think you have been a witness to this, like where, yes, there is if it's a solo project like Enrique or Gwen Stefani as a solo artist, right? They're on the marquee, and and uh you know, most people, and including me, we're gonna focus on on them during the show, right? Like we're we're we stay on their layer and we're mixing them, especially I'm a very active mixer, so I stay on their on their mix. That being said, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I I believe that we have an uh with Enrique, it was a nine-piece band, and and I used to give everybody the same attention. Like, if you guys needed something, I will absolutely do it and take care of it. I was never and I've never been, and I'm pretty sure I never will be. The type of engineer goes, Yeah, no, stop. I'm I'm I'm mixing the artists, you guys could wait. You had your chance of sound check. No, because to me it's just as important that you guys are comfortable to perform well, because if you don't perform well, I'm not gonna get your guitar in your case. If I bring it up in a in a spot that is like a cue for Enrique in this case, and I bring it up and and you because you couldn't hear yourself, you you clam the note or whatever, then at the end of the day, we all lose. He's gonna say, Why was the guitar off or what happened? Well, he couldn't hear it. Well, why couldn't he hear it? Well, I didn't do my job, right? So I always take care of everybody. I I'm not even dare say equally, but then during the show, I'm focused a little more on the singer or or who whoever the artist is at that time, but it just I will never ignore anybody else, right? And then in this case it's a little different. In this case, it's a little different because they're a band. Yeah. And and and the artist is the band, it's everybody. And it's funny that you ask that because many people have asked me that. And they think that, whoa, so you just you just take care of Gwen. I was like, no. Even Gwen in a non-official way, meaning we haven't spoken about this, she realized right away that I'm taking care of all of them. Even when it comes to putting their ears in and like taking care of them, having a conversation right before the show. Like, I I I do my rounds and I make sure I I speak to everybody, make sure I make sure that I make sure they're all okay. It's not like, oh, Gwen, here are you cool? Okay, and then not not even talk to anybody else. No, everybody's they are the artists, the whole band is the artist. Uh not that it's about this, but I'm also under their their payroll as a band. Sure.

SPEAKER_03 50:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 50:06

I'm not just there with Gwen. So all these factors come in play, and and I have to earn their trust the same way I I had to earn uh Gwen's trust. And I I believe I have, and and and things are going well. And yes, so during the show I stay on her mix, but if anybody needs something on their talk back, they just go, you know, hey, I need this. And it's very rare, very rare. Right now, because we've we've done so many rehearsals, everything's pretty dialed.

SPEAKER_01 50:35

Nice.

SPEAKER_00 50:35

Everything's I already automated a bunch of stuff too that is happening in the background. That I don't I could I could be on Gwen's mix, and then uh automation is happening in the background for other musicians, you know. Yeah, so we already took the time to make that happen. Um so it's pretty cool. It's pretty cool in that sense. And they uh without sounding uh uh weird about this, but they're also very easy. Like they they they know what they wanted. We gave them that from the beginning, and they're happy. So they're not really asking for changes constantly on anything.

SPEAKER_04 51:15

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 51:16

So it's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_01 51:17

They're a band that came out of like, you know, coming out of Orange County, they're playing clubs and they've played with wedges and they played in the smallest places, and I mean, yeah, where they're at now coming into like we got Eddie Kaipo mixing us, it's probably I mean, arguably the the best they've heard themselves playing because they've taken time off and you know came back. And yeah, so I mean, they're probably like this is great.

SPEAKER_00 51:47

Yeah, I mean, I mean, there's a lot of that stuff is subjective, of course. And I know they had a they had a uh uh a guy, uh uh I think it's John Shemke was his name, and I I know he was with them for many years, and they were very happy. He was like part of the No Doubt family, and right, and I believe he also makes Gwen when she moved into the solo project. Uh, and she was also very happy with him. So uh, you know, I can't say because I wasn't there listening, I can't say whether mine are better or worse. I have had a lot of compliments from both, either Gwen as a solo or the band guys. Compliments of of things that, yes, you know, some things they they have never experienced, certain things, because everybody has a different approach, but it doesn't mean that whatever the previous person was doing is right or wrong. It's just yeah, just different, right? Of course, yeah. Uh, I I I tend to because I've done front of house and I do studio work. I I think the comments I get most, I think people get to understand or they feel like I go further along, deeper into details that perhaps other modern engineers don't do, right? Yeah, and that's cool. I'm okay with that because that's how I am and that's what I like to do. And for sure, you know, you know, like really going to details, changing e maybe an EQ on the vocal on the verses versus the chorus. You know, like why not? Like, who says that we can't do that? You know, I can automate it or I can do it manually. So many versions of that, changing reverb times in different songs. If it's a fast tempo song, shorten the reverb. If it's a ballad, make it a little larger, you know, changing the tones on guitars on a particular song, maybe. Uh, I may not do that for the actual guitar player in your case, but I do it for the for the singer because their mix is a little different, you know. No, well, because maybe because maybe uh you don't want that because your patch is set to the way you want it. Exactly. Yeah, but in the context of the mix that the singer's hearing, yeah, I have liberties of changing EQ and compression on instruments that won't affect the person actually playing the instrument. That way it doesn't throw them off going, why is all of a sudden my piano compressed? I don't do that, I don't process what they're hearing, I'm processing what the singer hears.

SPEAKER_01 54:12

Sure. I mean, yeah, as a musician, playing so many shows where you literally could hardly hear yourself, you know what I mean? And basing things off of like the band, and like you're in wedges and you got guitar ramps. So yeah, I mean, just being able to come in and be like, wow, I can hear myself super clear. This is amazing.

SPEAKER_00 54:36

Yeah, so it's it makes a difference, it makes a difference in it.

SPEAKER_01 54:39

It's pretty awesome.

SPEAKER_00 54:40

And also, my my goal is always to try to make it where you can hear everything, but at a lower volume.

SPEAKER_01 54:48

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 54:49

So I try to impl I try to always implement, you know. I mean, I we're not gonna get technical necessarily, but I use a lot of compression and limiting and things, but hopefully without hearing it. Right. My goal is so people don't go, oh, you're using compression. It's just it's just means for me to allow the the artists and musicians to not have to run their pack so hot. Exactly. I use to avoid fatigue, you know.

SPEAKER_01 55:13

I think I've heard you tell this story. It was either Christina Aguilera or it was um um Rob Thomas, where you there was something up, and you had to like tell them. I thought it was Christina, where you're like, just trust me, try running your pack like here, and you had her turn.

SPEAKER_00 55:36

Christina, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 55:37

How what was that? That was there was like something there, right?

SPEAKER_00 55:40

Well, yeah, she came in hot one day. It was like it sounded like it sounds like shit, and blah blah blah blah blah.

SPEAKER_01 55:47

And I was like, okay, and she has a loud band, right? You would mention that.

SPEAKER_00 55:50

Yeah, very loud band. They're amazing musicians, they're all incredible musicians, some of the best in the world. But they want uh uh the musical director wanted the ciphers to be freaking cranked, like you're in a nightclub, like cranked, but everybody's wearing in-ears, and and then uh he basically he had he wanted me to set the levels where he needed him to be. But then when Christina would come in and check her mic, and then the music, it would just be too much. As powerful of a singer as she is, at the end of the day, the microphone's picking up everything else. And I'm like, why we have all that, whatever. Anyway, so she comes and she walks in, and they wouldn't really let me speak to her or anything. There was a distance there. Uh and they come in and did what they did before, which is run her pack all the way up.

SPEAKER_01 56:42

All the way up, all the way up.

SPEAKER_00 56:44

And freaking whoever whoever taught her that in the past was like, Oh I guess I guess that was their way of locking the volume so they never have to.

SPEAKER_01 56:54

Would that blow your head off?

SPEAKER_00 56:56

Well, it depending on the game structure. Well, yeah, what what you're sending from the board and what your game structure is from the transmitter.

SPEAKER_01 57:05

Because I mean, just to give some reference, not to cut you off, I run my pack loud at like freaking 12 or 1. Yeah, right? Like that's loud.

SPEAKER_00 57:16

That's that's loud, loud, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 57:18

Like that's like if you're playing for a stadium. Correct. Crap and you need it that loud, or you're at the C stage or something, and it's you and you need it that loud to where you're not hearing all the noise. So I'm sure her game structure was not the same, because that would just blow your head off.

SPEAKER_00 57:37

Well, that's what happened because that was basically my first show. Uh no, that was my second show. Somehow the first show went without a hitch. She didn't say anything, didn't ask for anything. I never met her or nothing. And then the second show, she walks in and was like, sounds like shit. And she had her pack all the way up.

unknown 57:55

Fuck.

SPEAKER_00 57:55

And I'm like, of course it's gonna say it'll be distorting. I can't even get my pack to go that high. Like, right, and it sounds distorted, and this and that. And and I was like, and I I went to talk to her, and she wasn't as nice as as other artists are, to say the least. She was like, What do you want? Well, you're wasting my time, kind of vibe, right? So I go, Can I please see your pack? I want to see where you're running it. And then she goes, Who are you? I was like, I'm your monitor engineer. And so she shows me the pack, she goes, Here, you know, here's my pack, you know. And I look at it and it was all the way up. I go, okay, so here's the first thing. I said, Why don't we try running this? Let's start at half. Yeah, but then what if I don't hear myself? Well, that's for me to fix for you. I can send you more of you, right? But all the way up is too much. Like, well, but this is what we've done in the past. I'm like, I understand, but I I highly, highly do not recommend that you do this like this. Can we try it, please? She was like rolling her eyes at me and being really upset, and and I go, and and so we put it half, let me get to the board. Because she started testing it as soon as I made the change, testing, see, but now it's too quiet for me. I said, I I need to get to the board, let me get to the board. Because I was on stage, yeah. And then and as I'm making my way to the board, and make sure I don't lose my reverb. I was like, of course, I'll no worries. And then I also brought down the sci-fiels. Uh at that moment, at the level that she was running, the sci-fi were not the issue necessarily, but I knew they'll get so I brought down those. Her pack was in the middle. I rearranged her game, going to her. He goes, Oh, this actually sounds pretty good. All right, can we try a song? I was like, Yeah, they tried a song, and then she was happy, right? But it was like a weird thing like that, where you have to, but at the beginning, they wouldn't even want me to talk to her. In fact, what the fact that I went on stage to speak to her, they're like, Oh, yeah, they were like, Don't what are you doing? What is he doing? Oh, he's gonna be gone tomorrow, you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:04

She's like, Who are you?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:05

Yeah, yeah. But I I you know, I I did quite a few shows with her. I did maybe you know, one-offs here and there, very sprinkled up. It wasn't like a tour or nothing, but it we did like a cut maybe two years of one-offs, and then at some point I was like, I don't want to know. This is just unnecessary, uh unnecessarily stressful sometimes. For I was like, nah, I don't need to do this, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:31

Sure. I mean, she's a straight up uh you would give her the name a diva. She is a diva, like a singer diva, right? Like so she's she's doing her thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:43

What's cool was what was cool is that even after I went through that experience with her, and then we go do the show, as soon as she opens her mouth and starts singing, I'm like, well, okay, okay. Do whatever you I forgive you. Yeah, but I mean, but but you can only do that so many times, right? So at some point I was like, and we didn't we didn't end up badly, but I just spoke to management after a couple other situations we had uh towards the end of it, and I go, you know what? I think it's time she probably just needs to find someone else. I'm like, I don't I don't need the aggravation, I don't need that gig that way. It's been great. I appreciate it. It's been awesome to work for someone like her, but I think I'm good. I won't leave you hanging. We still got like a couple more shows or something. Don't worry, I won't leave you hanging. I'm gonna continue until the end and then find someone else. Uh and that's how it was. But it was cool. I mean, she's pretty great. The band was smoking, the band was just incredible.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:39

I what's uh Adam Blackstone or something?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:43

Well, when I was there, it was uh uh Randolph uh what's it uh the Stevie Wonders drummer. I forget what his first name was.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:54

I think his last name is Randolph, but Michael Fish on guitar.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:00

He's great, yeah, great, great with her for a long time. Uh and then Rob uh Lewis is the keyboard player and musical director who's been with her for many years. Yeah, I believe Nathan East was her bass player for a little bit. Jeez, but then when I when I was there, when I was there, they had a couple subs on bass and drums, and then uh I don't know why I'm forgetting his name, but the drummer for Stevie Wonder came back. So I started with a sub drummer and sub bass player, and then those two guys came back, but it wasn't Nathan East, it was another bass player else. Yeah, but yeah, all smoking musicians, the whole band was incredible, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:42

Man, yeah. I mean, and back to Gwen. This is kind of a Gwen heavy show. Yeah, that's all right. Um, yeah, I mean, that's where you're at right now. The one thing that I noticed, and just how she is, she's a band chick. You know, like like she she gets it, like she's like, yeah, I'm just like I was in a band my whole life, and she acts like that. Like she's like she is so cool, and just yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:10

You remember when you met her, when you met her, first thing she wanted to do is go meet you guys and say hi and you know, what's your name? Or what do you do? Whatever.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:18

It's like yeah, dude, yeah, she's the shit. Like, yeah, the first time I met her, um she it was it was like in a rehearsal was me and Kyla, right? The new bass player, we were both new, and she just rolls in, totally laid back, played some songs, and then she left. But um, yeah, one of the biggest things that I remember is when we did we started rehearsing for her new album when we did that video. Um and she came in and she just started crying when she heard the songs because she never heard the songs played before. Played loud, that was kind of that was kind of special to be part of that. Where you know, she's like she's a real songwriter and just a real person.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:00

Uh well, and those are the things that we get to experience, right? Like, yeah, but but she would only do that because she feels like she's in a safe space. Yeah, right. Yeah she came in and she got emotional when she was hearing these things come to life. Because in the studio they do everything. I mean, I know the recorders a lot of it live, but there were a lot of overduffs too. So things get pieced together. Now she got to see it come to life, you know, with a full band, right? And we had two guitar players, and it was just and we got the whole band there, and it's actually sounded really nice for her, and everything's just like, oh wow, and she got emotional, and that's yeah, that's when you notice, oh wow, she's really feeling this, and the songs mean something to her, and she likes the band environment. She really, she really thrives there, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:49

Yeah, that's pretty sick.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:51

Yeah, there's been times where if she'll show up to sound check and it's a big stage, and the risers for the band are further back. She'll like very nicely ask if there's a way to bring him in because she wants to feel like they're all part of it. Not that it's her and everybody far away. It's it's yeah, she wants to feel like she's in a band.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:11

Yeah, it's so cool. I mean, because you can think of her as just a big solo star, but watch any of those old videos of No Doubt, and she's just a singer in like this ska crazy big just she's just part of it. It's so rad. Um yeah, man. Um dang, we've already been talking for an hour. Normally I go into your whole your whole beginning, and we were gonna go there. I guess if you want to get into that, check out our green room episode.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:46

That's true too.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:47

But yeah, this was fun, dude. Um uh anything else you wanna throw in before we get out of here? Like anything you got coming up? I know you're gonna you're obviously in Vegas until the 13th.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:00

Yeah, no, I'm I'm I'm just doing this for now. We have a few shows coming up with Gwyn after. Nice. You know, for the rest of the year and and you know just doing my thing, you know. And this is cool. I'm glad you're doing this new podcast too. That's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:15

Yeah, you know, I'm trying to keep it going. It's uh you know, it's just another thing for me to do, but it's been really fun. I mean, honestly, just I get to talk to you, I don't get to talk to you enough, you know.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:26

So um even though we live like a mile away.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:29

I know, dude. We need to do some music. Um for anybody that doesn't know. Eddie mixes all my music, so anything under my name.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:38

All but one song.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:40

Except one, the one that's got the bad mix is actually no, it sounded really good.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:45

I was like, oh shit, I'm not gonna be hired anymore.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:48

Nah, dude. That was just a honestly, I knew you were busy and going through some stuff. That was one reason. It was my song No Lights, and this song was very stripped down. Um, and I just took a stab at it and I mixed it myself. I think it's appropriate. Randy never got back to me, though. I said He was like, okay, yeah, Rand Randy's our you know, drummer who's amazing, but I can't make his drums sound like Eddie can make his drums.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:18

Well, we can always do a we can do a uh a new a version two of it, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:23

I I'll just I'll have some new songs, maybe some new music. So yeah, go check out any of my Petrito music and hear Eddie's you know magical mix of or on my Instagram post where I use you as a soundtrack. Hell yeah, dude. I appreciate that. Yeah um yeah, man. Well, this was fun, and I want to see you soon. So when you're done, hit me up, dude.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:46

I'll hit you up. Thanks for having me, man. Appreciate you. Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:49

All right, brother.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:50

All right, brother. Bye. See ya. Bye.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:54

Thank you. Thank you for listening, everybody. And if you haven't heard the past episodes, go ahead and go back. We have seven more before this, and I'm gonna keep working to get more guests. Uh you can find me at Instagram, Noflakes Podcast, find us on YouTube. And if you enjoy this, also check out my other podcast, The Green Room, with Jeff Sabrew and Bray Gunari. And you can find us at the Green Room Music Podcast on YouTube and Instagram, and it's also available wherever you get you get your find podcast. So thank you again, and I'll see you all soon.