Mating Season & Buff Ducks | The Duck Ladies Pondcast Episode 5

Welcome to Episode 5 of the Duck Ladies Pondcast with Host Krissy from @DunkinDucks  and Emily from​ @CheeseandQuackersHomestead  ! In episode 5 we discuss all things Mating season, answer follower questions, and feature buff ducks as our breed of the week!

Table Of Contents: 
0:00:00 Intro
0:00:18 Emily's Homestead Updates
0:03:39 Krissy's Hobby Farm Updates
0:06:42 Mating Season Discussion | Seperating Males & Females | Drake Jail | Male:Female Ratio
0:29:25 Sponsorship | Metzer Farms 
0:34:34 Drake's Picking "Favorite" Female Ducks 
0:45:00 Breed of the Week | Buff Ducks
0:49:15 Answering Follower Questions | Winter Water Setups | Ducks & Geese Together | Mama Duck Hatching vs Incubating Eggs | Calcium Supplements
1:00:37 Wrap Up 

Special Thank you to Metzer Farms for sponsoring this episode. You can check out their wide variety of ducklings and goslings available here: https://www.metzerfarms.com

Love wearing adorable duck shirts? 
Check out The Pondcast Merch here: duckladiespondcast.dashery.com
Check out Dunkin Ducks Merch here: https://dunkinducks.dashery.com/
Check out Cheese & Quackers Merch here: https://cqhomestead.com/

Don’t forget to follow the podcast across all social channels!

YouTube   @TheDuckLadiesPondcast 
TikTok: @duckladiespondcast 
Instagram: @duckladiespondcast
Facebook: @The Duck Ladies Pondcast 
Snapchat: @duckpondcast 

Subscribe to Dunkin Ducks: www.youtube.com/@DunkinDucks
Subscribe to Cheese & Quackers Homestead: www.youtube.com/@CheeseandQuackersHomestead

Thank you for watching and supporting the pondcast! Please drop any questions or ideas for future episodes down below!

Contact us for sponsorship inquires at theduckladiespondcast@gmail.com

Thanks for watching, and to support the show please feel free to leave a review on your favorite podcast platform! ❤️

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey everyone, and welcome to the Duck Ladies Podcast, episode five. I'm your host, Chrissy from Dunkin' Ducks, here with Emily from Cheese and Quackers Homestead. And on today's episode, we're gonna be talking about all things mating season, featuring the Buff Duck as our breed of the week and answering some more questions sent in by our followers. But before we get to that, as always, I have to ask Emily, do you have any updates on your homestead this week?

SPEAKER_00 0:22

Yeah, I think the podcast is cursed. I just want you to know because I was thinking, I was like, oh, we're gonna have to do so many topics because there won't be that much going on all the time. And ever since we started this podcast, why does it feel like I've had things going on all the time? Well, at least we haven't run enough things to talk about. I know. That's why we're doing mating season today, is because I've been having Drake issues. So that's the first thing that's going on. I'll tell the podcast first, I guess. Cashew is booted. He's done. I actually, this is the first time I've ever not cried rehoming a duck. I genuinely got to the end of the road with Cashew, and I feel like in my heart, I knew that this was not gonna work, and I feel fine. I feel like I'm not sad. I don't think I'll cry when I let him go. I genuinely feel like me and him, I hate each other. We're on the same page. Like I feel like we have personal beef. And I think it helps because the other day I did cry about this. The other day, Cashew, and this is just like a Drake thing, he's at the whim of his hormones. Like his behavior has been so bad because his hormones are driving him to be so bad that his life has had to become so restricted in the batch flock. And in our batch flock, he only ever has one other duck, which is not a lot. And he wants to be in the main pen so bad, and he wants ladies so bad, and he's good with ladies. The other day when I put him back into the Drake pen, he was depressed. Like he literally went into the corner, did not engage with Omelette, who's the other Drake that was in there. Went into the corner, laid down, tucked his head, and would not move. Like was just pissed. Like, and so I think that was the moment where I was like, I'm this duck isn't gonna work here anymore. He needs something different.

SPEAKER_01 1:58

Yeah, and you really did exhaust every single possible option for him. So at the end of the day, it just came down to what's best for him because it's clearly not working with you, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_00 2:11

We'll get way more into that when we talk about mating season because he's definitely a Drake I've had problems with. I keep a lot of Drakes, so I know Drakes well, unfortunately. Goku is a victim of cashew, and I had to pull him into my basement last night. I had to pull him from the flock because his eye was just so bad. Chrissy already knows about this because I texted her, but Goku got a pecking injury, or not really, I wouldn't call it like a peck injury. It was a mounting injury from cashew when I tried to put them back in together. Granted, it never got bad, thank God, because I was waiting for that to happen. So unfortunately for Goku, he was kind of the sacrificial lamb to see if it would work. And since it didn't work, he got a little bit of an eye injury. He had some foamia yesterday. I was kind of waiting to see if it got better with the lack of irritation, just lack of cashew being with him. And it didn't. So he got pulled into my basement. I actually didn't start teramycin yesterday, and I'm glad I didn't because today he looks much better. I have a very big homestead update that we're not gonna share yet. I don't think. I don't know. That one. Percy already knows about it. I will talk about it. It's just it's a big update and it's a big conversation. So I think I want to save it for an episode where we can talk in detail about it because I think both of us have a lot to say about that topic. So we'll save that. Now we're really just gonna keep people on their toes with that. I know. I'm so excited to tell people about that. That's pretty much all I have that I'm going to share this week, except for the big update. Chrissy, what's been going on with you?

SPEAKER_01 3:41

We had a sad week this week. We unfortunately did lose Slim Jim, my quail. Slim Jim was the worst quail I've ever owned. I'm gonna do a candlelit Slim Jim while you talk about this. Can I show this? Yeah. Could not be within 10 feet of female quails. He could not be within 10 feet of male quails. He couldn't really be around anyone. He was a very aggressive quail. I was actually his second home. He was re-homed to me because he was being aggressive to a friend of mine's quails, and we thought that putting him in a new environment with way more female quails, a different setup would do him really good. But unfortunately, and I've it sounds like this is a really common thing with quails. Sometimes their aggression is just so bad that you really can't do anything but completely separate them, which is like sad. But, anyways, quails have a very short lifespan, so Slim Jim passes natural causes this week, which is of course sad. But also, I don't have a quail that's gonna kill the rest of my quails anymore, so that's kind of nice.

SPEAKER_00 4:45

Rest in peace, Slim Jim. I'm sad. I have a little bit of affinity for like vicious birds. I don't know, like I don't like them because they're so problematic, but I find them funny. And so, like, this photo, this photo of Slim Jim, like this means a lot to me. I think about this picture often.

SPEAKER_01 5:03

This is an epic photo. The thing about that photo is that I have a memory tied to it because I had Slim Jim separated for like a month prior to that. Because I was hoping that maybe like separating him for a while and then reintroducing him, things would go better. And he was only with the female quails unsupervised for like 10 minutes. And I go back out just to check on how things are going, and there is blood splattered everywhere. Slim Jim is covered in blood, and it's not his own blood, it's the blood of like every single female quail I had. Everybody was injured within minutes. It was horrible. Like the aggression in male quails can just be horrible, which is why if you're going to get quails, I really, really strongly, strongly encourage getting from someone who breeds for temperament because Slim Jim is like the average quail. And they're just they're not they're not great.

SPEAKER_00 5:55

The best, the thing about this picture I think that makes me laugh the hardest is he looks crazy. Like he looks he looks murderously crazy. That's he was it's pretty epic. I love this photo, truly. It's actually art to me.

SPEAKER_01 6:10

The fact that you captured this, people would have given up on Slim Jim a long time ago, but I was also like, well, they have like short lifespans, so it's not like I'll be dealing with it for 10 years. So I was like, I'll give him the best life I can and put him in male prison with my partridges, which I don't normally condone cross-species interaction like that, but I kind of had no other choice. And he did fine with the partridges, so I think he had a good end to his days, but if he was in the care of anyone else, they would not have kept him around.

SPEAKER_00 6:41

That actually leads us really nicely into the topic for today, because you're definitely going to be hearing the perspectives of two people who do the most for Drakes that they can. I think both of us try to keep Drakes even when we don't want to. Absolutely. Even when they're difficult, and there's several reasons for that, which we'll get into. But the biggest r reason being, and the first thing that I think we should talk about in this episode is the Drake rehoming crisis. It's a massive problem, and Drakes are ill-treated, they're not kept appropriately, they're not given equal chances uh in many circumstances, not given the opportunity out of life, and their enrichment is often turfed to the side because not not just because people don't care, it's not always that, it's that they have no choice. And the amount of resources, and I was explaining this to somebody yesterday, both of us, and this goes for really a lot of the things we talk about on this podcast is because of the position that me and Chrissy are in, being social media influencers with a following, we have luxuries that many people don't. I will keep more difficult Drakes because I can do more. I I I'm here 24-7. I can have a difficult Drake and trust the fact that I'm gonna catch an issue fast. There's no periods of time where I'm not around to monitor him. I also have the resources of being able to do all of this, put all this work into this bird that most people that have a nine to five or a regular job don't. When it comes to Drakes, a lot I think a lot of people aren't able to house them safely. They're not able to dedicate the time that is required to separating out the Drake and doing all this maintenance with Drakes during mating season. And I think that's part of the reason why there is such a large rehoming crisis. Honestly, when it comes to the Drake rehoming crisis, I think the only solution is let farmers eat them, which I know a lot of people will get sad about. But the reality is, is we're playing a balancing game of these birds and drakes in general. Drake behavior during mating season can be dangerous. It's not they're annoying, it's that birds can start dying. Your flock can start getting injured. And so that's why the balancing game for them is, in my opinion, we're saving lives by letting them be purposed for meat purposes. So that might be something that comes up. I'm just letting you guys know that that's my take on the Drake crisis now before we get too far into it.

SPEAKER_01 9:05

But so neither of us eat our ducks, whether they're females that are old enough to stop laying or they're males that are causing problems. We don't, we don't eat our ducks, but I feel I feel so bad for drakes because it's it's not their fault that they act like this and that they cause all these problems. And it's not their fault that they hatch at the same rate as female ducks, so there's all these male ducks that are unwanted for no fault of their own. So for me, I will always have a Drake in my flock simply because I want to give a good home to a Drake. And I feel responsible for the ones that are in my care to give them the best quality of life possible that I can. Um, and sometimes that means separating them out because the only other option is rehoming them, which, like you said, we have a rehome in crisis. Who wants a Drake? Basically, no one. Nobody is out there looking for more drakes. A lot of people give away their extra drakes for free because they can't, you can't sell them. No one's willing to pay for a Drake when there are so many people who are trying to get rid of them.

SPEAKER_00 10:10

It is really sad. And the difficult thing about Drakes is I struggle to rehome them. I try I like Chrissy, I will always have a Drake. I will always have as many drakes as I can safely have. That's my rule. I always try for more drakes than I can safely have, honestly. I always see what I can do. I've temporarily housed drakes. Some of you might remember I had a Drake named Nacho and he was a rescue. He was a dump duck. I took Nacho in and I kept him here until I was able to find him somewhere to go. And so I'll do things like that with my standard Drakes. If I have a Drake that I can't keep and a farmer is willing to take that bird and purpose it for meat, if I can't keep it, it goes for me. That's what happens. It's I give him the best life I can here. If a farmer is going to purpose it, I don't sell my drakes. The goal is to keep them here. I don't sell my drakes for the purpose of meat. I don't do that. I'm a vegetarian, so I also don't eat duck. But I don't sell them out with the intention of them being meat. But if I have to move a bird and I have to move a Drake for the safety of my flock, I do not look for, and like to be transparent, I do not look for a no-kill circumstance for that Drake duck. I think that one of the reasons I don't do that is because I used to. And I actually stopped doing it because I became way more worried that somebody was going to take and inappropriately house a Drake. One thing I really worry about is somebody already has a lot of drakes at home. And now they're taking this Drake because they just want more ducks. They don't fully understand the behavior of Drakes, and we create this horrible situation at their house. So I'm actually very careful with re-homing drakes. And sometimes I actually feel better rehoming them for the purpose of meat. When it comes to my call ducks, this is just a meat thing. I will not re-home a call duck for meat purposes. Why? Because I think it's wasteful. I think it's a wasteful thing. The breed was never intended for meat. It's not gonna give you a good meat yield. It for this is my opinion. Like, don't this is not something that I think you need to carry with you or transfer into your farming practices. This is all stuff that comes down to your own personal morals. But I don't I view that breed as a pet breed. And when I take on a pet breed, I give them the pet standard of care. I give them the pet expectations. If you served me as a pet, I treat you as a pet. And so with my caldray, a lot of people were saying when when it came to Cashew, eat him. Like he's awful, just eat him. No, he's a pet, he's a pet duck. He was a pet duck in my care. He's treated as a pet duck until the day he dies. I'm gonna find him a home. Whether that be he has some kind of purpose and a breeding sense for somebody else or whatever.

SPEAKER_01 12:41

I think there's one really important thing that we have to note here. And the only thing that I do not find acceptable when it comes to having to get rid of a drake is dumping your drakes in the wild. That has caused a huge problem for the rescue community because, first of all, most of the ducks that are dumped in the wild are drakes because nobody wants drakes, like I said. Rescues can't take in all of the drakes because they don't have enough females for the drakes. And then if they do take in all of these drakes, then they end up having to separate them in a hundred different pens because they're not getting along, because you have 50 drakes and three hens, like it's it's very difficult. So the one thing that I find absolutely cruel to do is to dump them in the wild because they can't survive. They're probably going to s have a horrible death via predators. Or if by some miracle they get rescued, they're probably going to end up in a situation where I don't want to like speak ill of rescues. It's just that they're probably gonna end up in a situation where it's hard for them to get adopted. Um, and they could be sitting there for a really long time taking up, you know, resources of a rescue because it's very hard to get them placement, especially when they don't have extra females to go along with them.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

And rescues do excellent like you're definitely not speaking ill on rescues. This is an insanely difficult thing for rescues to balance. I can genuinely say I don't know how I would. And actually, people get on me about rescue more birds, rescue more birds. The problem is 99% of the birds that are available to me for rescue at any point, because I do look out for opportunities to rescue, especially if I have the time or the resources, are drakes. And I have a responsibility to the birds that I have here to not create a dangerous environment for them. So rescues have an incredibly difficult job with this animal and rescuers, even, because when you take on more drakes, the more pens you're having to create, the more building, the more land you're having to allocate, the more time. It's a very difficult thing, keeping drakes in general. So it's not, it's it's not on them. It's an insanely difficult task to juggle. I would cry probably do what they do with all those drakes.

SPEAKER_01 14:54

And I feel so bad when I see like rescues that like come across a situation where there's a bunch of dumped ducks on a pond and they can only take in the females, and they have to leave the drakes behind because they don't have space for them and they don't have adopters lined up, and they know that they probably won't have adopters because they already have potentially 10, 20 drakes at their rescue already that have no interest. I think if someone is going to go the rescue route as far as getting ducks, I think that can be absolutely amazing because you can adopt from a rescue who already has a group of ducks that are like bonded and getting along well together. So they could give you, you know, two drakes and six hens, but they know that those eight ducks get along really well together. I find it really complicated. There are some rescues that will only let you adopt a hen if you also adopt a Drake, but then you have a one-to-one ratio, and that can lead to a lot of problems. So it's a really tough situation all around. And I'm incredibly lucky that the two rescue ducks that I have, they were actually taken in as a bonded pair and they were both females. So I was able to add them into my flock because just like you, if there is an opportunity where I can rescue a duck and give it a good home and not negatively impact the ducks that I already have here and I'm already responsible for, I'm gonna do it. I am all for rescue, but I do understand why people are unable to rescue because it can be it can put you in a really hard situation. And and rescues are hard to find sometimes, especially if you're looking for females.

SPEAKER_00 16:26

While we're on the topic of Drakes, because we're just kind of going over Drakes being so difficult and kind of their history a little bit here, a couple things. So, temperament, I think a lot of people get obsessed with like finding Drakes with good temperament. And one thing that I think is really important to understand about Drakes is the the bad temperament of a Drake duck is in rooted in their biology to the extent that it's integrated into their anatomy. There is only so far that you can focus temperament breeding of a duck to get them to there's I want to say and I want people to really understand, you will never have a perfect Drake. It's absolutely I've never seen it, I've never met one, I've never seen it in the wild. This this behavior is not, and I think a lot of people don't understand this, it's not exclusive to our domestic backyards. This is happening in the wild. This has been going on for years. It has to do with, we could do a whole episode on this exact topic because it's a long topic, it's a really interesting topic, but it has to do with the high frequency of female loss in wild settings because of raising young on land, caused males to go into a direction where they had to do more forced copulation in order to reproduce. And the females got very selective. There, they the males developed the danger noodle. The um the females developed a reproductive system that counteracted them, and it actually started this sexual, essentially biological warfare between these two animals, which is actually one of the very few times this has ever been seen in history. Super interesting stuff. But so when it comes to this topic specifically, drakes are difficult, period. You can breed for better temperament in a Drake, but you can never expect a good Drake. Drakes are always gonna be more difficult when they're younger and they're figuring themselves out. First year drakes are always gonna be more difficult. They're gonna be very hormonally elevated. So you don't fall into the trap of thinking you're ever gonna have a perfect Drake, and also don't give up on drakes too early. That's one thing that a lot of people do.

SPEAKER_01 18:28

I'd say the only time that I have really seen drakes that I would say are like the best behaved drakes is when there are no other drakes around. If you only have one, you're much less likely to have issues. But once they see competition, they tend to get a little more rowdy, especially during mating season.

SPEAKER_00 18:48

For those of you that don't know, uh, a lot of people always ask, when is mating season? Like that's the big question because they get into ducks and they don't understand what mating season is. Because it is a little different, because chickens don't really have a mating season. Correct me if I'm wrong, right? They don't really have that. It's a specifically duck thing. Actually, I don't think I've ever heard anyone say mating season in the season. I don't think I haven't either. I think they just breed. Like, except for when they're not laying in the winter. So it is it's more talked about when it comes to the waterfowl community for sure. It is a little different if you're coming from other poultry. It is a lot longer than you would expect, and it's a lot longer than wild types, because one thing that happened when we selectively bred for higher egg production is that also created a longer breeding season, which is very unfortunate. I wish that could have not gone together. I would love to get more eggs in less breeding season. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:39

I honestly, if my ducks laid no eggs or like three eggs a year, but I didn't have to deal with all these mating season issues, I would take that. I would absolutely take that route. But it's not really an option.

SPEAKER_00 19:52

No, very unfortunately, no. So yeah, you can expect it to start as early as February, truly. That's when I usually start to see my ducks kick up, and it lasts all the way through summer. And then the only time I'm correct me if I'm wrong, the only time I see it settle down is once that first molt, that big summer molt hits, and everybody feels like crap. Once that happens, it all kind of ends, and that's great. Yeah. But it does take, it slows down mid-summer.

SPEAKER_01 20:19

Timing of that can depend on where you live, of course. But like for me, my ducks usually molt by like the last week of July, first week of August, and then things finally start to calm down. So I'd say like very end of summer, beginning of fall, really end of summer, though, is what I typically see here.

SPEAKER_00 20:36

Yeah. So you have to, the biggest things that you can do to be ready for mating season, especially if you have drakes, and especially if you have multiple drakes. Realistically, if you're going into mating season with one Drake and a good hand ratio, you're gonna be fine. I don't think you really need to worry about this. You could get a really problematic Drake, but I don't think you need to do like doomsday prep, like you do if you have multiple drakes. There's especially if you have multiple young drakes. Oh, that's what I'm going through. Make sure that you have something set up at minimum to keep them separate from the females in the pen at night. In the pen at night is when things are going to be the worst because ducks don't sleep through the night like chickens do. I think you could speak to this too. The most of my overbreeding injuries I find when I opened the coop doors in the Yes, yep.

SPEAKER_01 21:29

Same here. I think the easiest way to separate them at night is if you have like a large wire dog crate. Or personally, I just like went to Walmart and got a little dog fen. So it's like tall enough that they can't really fly over it unless they're like extremely determined. But for most breeds, you don't have to worry about them flying anyway. Um, it's like three feet tall and it's just a wire fence, so it's like the perfect size to split my coop in half so I can put ducks that get along on each side.

SPEAKER_00 21:57

Built a little extension coop to put our boys in a Night when they're in the main pen. We used to have the batch flock where we would just move the boys over there to reduce the ratios. And then typically they were fine overnight with the two to twenty-two ratios. They're sleeping on and off 24 hours a day. Since that's all actually usable time, you're giving them all of that overnight time as a resting period where they're not continuously getting a lot of people don't realize that ducks don't sleep through the night like chickens do.

SPEAKER_01 22:23

They're constantly active at night. They like sleep for a little while, they're awake for a little while, but that's like their constant cycle all day. They don't just like go into a deep sleep like chickens.

SPEAKER_00 22:33

Yeah. Yeah. So that is, I think, the biggest thing you could do if you're really running a risky ratio. A better thing that you can do is have a daytime separation area. Ideally, this is like, and I understand that many people cannot do this. Set up a bachelor pen. Set up an area. If your ratio's bad, bad. I think if your ratio's bad, bad, you have no choice but to find a way to do this or rehome. Is build a second living area for your Drakes to go. I did a rotation and I had great luck with that for a while until Cashew. Okay, the only reason the rotation doesn't work is because Cashew can't be with another Drake. So with the amount of Drakes that I have, it would just reduce everybody's time if he had a one rotation and everybody else had a two. So it was just like, I'm not gonna let everybody feel the wrath of Cashew, basically, is why I stopped doing the rotation. But the rotation did work. So you pair off the boys that get along and you have your second pen and you move them, like say one week, two boys are in there. Next week you take those two boys that get along, move them back, and move those other two boys in. I had great luck with that. It worked well. Um I did that for last year. Last summer, I did that the whole summer, and I started to do it this year. Um, and the other great thing about that is if everybody kind of is living in the batch pen at some degree, or if you're changing which boys are on rotation together, so all the boys stay knowing each other and stay in contact with each other, you can reduce your ratio at any point. So I did that last year. If I started to see overbreeding, take one boy out. Now it's only one boy on the rotation. And I was doing a one rotation actually throughout the winter because of cashew. Because cashew started to have issues. Cashew started to have issues after last breeding season. His behavior was really unique. So a lot of people were obsessing with the fact that cashew, this was a hormonal issue, and it is a hormonal issue, but it's also a behavioral issue in cashew because it started not when hormones were fine. I think I texted you about it. You're like, it's not even the season. I was like, yeah. Yeah, that's why I had switched to a one rotation throughout the winter because of cashew. And keeping them all familiar with each other helps with that. So if you switch up which boys are going in at the same time, solid. But I thought that worked really well. I liked that option. Having a bachelor flock is life-saving if you want to keep Drakes during mating season. I'm actually super sad. I really won't need it anymore. I'm not adding more Drakes because the boys that I have right now are difficult and I need to focus on them. I need to focus on that group. So I'm I'm gonna be running a two to a 26 ducks in my main pen once I move these out. So two to 26. So I'll be running my Bantam flock with a 1 to 12 ratio. I'm leaving it like that. I think it's gonna be a fine ratio. I've been running them two this season. The only ducks that are overbred is peanut, who is overbred because she chooses to be, I don't care when she's over. I genuinely, I don't worry about it anymore. Because she's not overbred for my Drake. She's overbred for any duck that's in her premise. Like she is all everybody's peanut is what that means.

SPEAKER_01 25:32

She asks for it. It's not unconsensual with peanut.

SPEAKER_00 25:36

TD, TD was saying that yesterday because I was like, Peanut is like overbred, and I'm getting a little bit worried about it. And then he goes, Peanut is flat in the pond all day, every day. Like you need to, you need to just let her do her thing. Like, that is just part of it. Really worry about when peanut is, but nobody's missing feathers, nobody's showing severe signs of stress or anything like that. So that flock will be fine running a two ratio now that I don't have cashew. I can't tell. See, this leads naturally into what's gonna happen in the batch flock. To give you guys a small hit, Omelet will not be integrating back into the main flock, which he is my fourth Drake. We will not be moving back into the main flock. There will be a, I think, a situation that Omelett will be very excited about happening for Omelette. I think he's winning the lottery a little bit. So I'm very excited for him. But that's how I'm gonna be, I'm gonna be making arrangements. So there will be no more batch flock here, which is a bummer. But this is also something I want to encourage you guys to do. If you can do it safely, that's the important thing, is because I have had so many drakes and wrote it out. I have learned so much about managing drakes that I've built so many things to keep drakes in a way that's convenient. And yeah, so that's what I think is so awesome about not giving up on them at the first indication of an issue. Because I've done it with my standard flock, I've done it with my bantam flock. My standard drakes are now old, just so everybody knows. That's why there's so many drakes up there and I don't have issues because they're all old. Beevs doesn't have a ween. Don't think that's gonna change his behavior, by the way, for anybody wondering if that's like a solution. Like it's not gonna change him hormonally. It's not the same as like spaying or neutering a dog. It's just the removal of the penis, which in itself does not drive hormone production. It's not responsible for that.

SPEAKER_01 27:18

I believe the same term would be used for chickens as it is ducks, because with chickens, if you were going to neuter a chicken, you would call it caponing. You would capone them. But that's like not a thing in the United States. It's like I don't want to say front, but it's dangerous.

SPEAKER_00 27:33

They their anatomy just outweighs their reward.

SPEAKER_01 27:35

Right.

SPEAKER_00 27:36

If you go into mating season, the number one thing that you probably know about is the recommendation of a male to female ratio. There's a couple different ratios that are recommended. They all kind of fall within the category of like four to seven, right? We'll just make it that so that you guys have the full scope. Because sometimes people will say like three to five, sometimes people will say four to six. It's gonna be different depending on what source you're reading from. They're all kind of acceptable because the reality of the ratio is that what people don't understand is that is not a golden number. And I experienced this very intensely with my standard flock. When I was dealing with my lightweight Drake, General Sal, which just so you guys know, lightweight drakes tend to be a little bit more difficult because they're fast. So they are fast, they have lots of energy, and they can go all day. When I was dealing with this with my lightweight Drake, I found I gave him six females. So I had a ratio that allowed him six females. It's not like when you think of a ratio, it's not like he gets six females and those are for him. It's just I have enough birds that he would have six females. So I did that, and it was not enough. I had to keep, in order to keep that Drake here, I had to keep adding adult females to adjust my ratio for him until I finally got it balanced. So every Drake you get is gonna be different. If you're gonna keep drakes, build out your pen to allow more females or have a separation area because that was one thing we had to do with him was just keep adding females until we found a point where it was all golden and he was fine now and everything was better. Guess what? Guess what, guess what? He doesn't suck anymore. He doesn't suck anymore. He's finally a good boy.

SPEAKER_01 29:15

Five. Yay! Wow. I'm so happy. It's up to five though. That's that's amazing news. But speaking of having to add more females and more females and more females, I think that leads us into a very good place to talk about today's podcast sponsor, Metzer Farms.

SPEAKER_00 29:32

This is the perfect opportunity because I've said it before and I will say it again. When it comes to getting ducklings, especially if you have an already established flock, go to Hatchery Direct. Go to a hatchery. Metzger Farms is the best waterfowl hatchery that you could possibly choose. They are our waterfowl experts. Me and Chrissy both trust them and love their birds. Most of the birds that you see here on my homestead at Cheese and Quackers are Metzer Farms birds. And I've had great experiences every single time. The thing that Metzer Farms offers that is heroic when it comes to keeping a proper ratio is you have the option with specific breeds to be able to select gender-specific ducklings. So you can actually get that ratio right from the start. And that is fantastic. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:14

And if you're in a situation where you have too many drakes and not enough females, Metzer Farms can literally save your flock by offering sexed females of all of their standard sized duck breeds.

SPEAKER_00 30:27

Yes. It is a it is amazing. I remember the moment because I actually, I think I've talked about it before. I started my homesteading journey with a batch of straight runs from Tractor Supply. And the moment that I realized that I could get gender-specific ducklings direct from hatchery was like a life-changing moment in my duck keeping career.

SPEAKER_01 30:47

Yeah. It really does make a huge difference to just start with a good ratio from the beginning, which is why we highly encourage you to just go through Metzer Farms from the beginning. Or if you're in a situation where you're like, man, I really need to add more females or sex from Metz or Farm. So you don't end up with straight-run ducklings and end up with even more drakes that you don't want or need. Because I feel like sometimes I see people who like have straight-run ducks and then they're like, hmm, I'll just hatch more eggs or buy more straight-run ducklings to fix my ratio. And then they end up making it even worse. So really the only way you can go in that situation is get sexed females.

SPEAKER_00 31:26

Yep. If you're looking to start your flock or you're looking to get into waterfowl keeping, or you're already a waterfowl keeper and you're looking to add more ducks to your flock, Metzer Farms has a wide variety of breeds that you could choose from. Absolutely the place to go when it comes for waterfowl. We love them for our ducks and geese, and they even do offer some chicken breeds. Definitely check them out at MetzerFarms.com. I know that I already have an issue with ordering from Metzer, so I'm sorry if I created a new addiction for you. There's nothing you want to know how obsessed with Metzer I am. Can I tell a little story? I tell, but yeah. No, I I know you know how obsessed I that I am. I okay. This is gross of me though. So I maybe I'll cut this. I have a very severe emotional attachment to the Metzer Farms boxes because, like, for me, it's like where my babies came from. So like I keep them. Stop. I keep the boxes too. They're in a pile in my basement. Why? Okay, okay, this is another gross thing. I need to know if this is not just me. I have an obsession with the smell of the Metzer Farms box. That's like the front, like the baby duckling smell. That one might just come.

SPEAKER_01 32:31

But guys, but guys, if if you can relate, comment down below so Emily doesn't feel alone.

SPEAKER_00 32:36

It doesn't smell bad. Like it doesn't smell like poopy. I think it's the heat pack that I smell. This is not like a poop smell. Like I am not emotionally attached to the poop smell of a duck. But ducklings also ducklings also don't have like very strong smelling poop. So I think it's the heat pack or something. And I think it's like the the like fond memories I have of like the moments that I got messed up. But I think it's so funny you keep the boxes too because Dee Dee always tries to throw them out.

SPEAKER_01 33:02

My dog dad tries to throw the boxes out too. He's like, why do we have these? And I'm like, I might need that someday.

SPEAKER_00 33:08

Katie and Mark are gonna watch this and they're gonna be like, guys, throw your boxes out. Like it's okay. There's little one, there's one in my office still, and it's what um the first group of ducklings came in, and I'm like, Didi has tried to throw that out like 10 times.

SPEAKER_01 33:22

I was like, no! We need to know how many other people keep their boxes because I feel like it can't just be us.

SPEAKER_00 33:28

Yeah, I fear it might be. I think it might just be us. I think we are like, that's that is a little weird of us, but we should do so. We need to think of something to do with them to like purpose that I have an idea.

SPEAKER_01 33:41

What if we like when we get new ducks in, right? We have them like walk on it on like pet safe paint and like put their little web footprint the day we got them. And then once they're adults, you can put another web footprint on the other side so you can see how much their little feet grew. And then frame it.

SPEAKER_00 34:01

That would be so cute. Yeah, so if you're not gonna go to Butzer Farms to buy the ducklings, maybe just buy a box because their box has some like superior power over me and Chrissy.

SPEAKER_01 34:11

Best boxes you will ever receive for some reason. I mean, truthfully, when it comes to like receiving a box in the mail, there is no better box you could ever open than a box of ducklings. There really isn't. Anyways, I will have MetzerFarms.com linked in the show notes of today's episode. And make sure you check it out if you want to get yourself a box of ducklings. Thing I want to talk about when it comes to Drake behavior during mating season is a problem that I have been having for years and years and years, which is that sometimes your Drake will pick a favorite lady, or your Drakes collectively will pick a favorite lady, and that specific female duck will get so overmated, and unfortunately, it does not matter what your ratio is, that specific female is always going to be overmated if she is with Drakes during mating season. And I have that problem with my duck sugar. Sugar is my smallest and my weakest duck, which I think is why she is the favorite because she's easy for the Drakes to catch. I hate them. Yeah. Without getting too into the detail, sugar is the weakest duck because she was bred from show lines and she was unethically bred, and that resulted in her having a really short neck, a really short bill, really short legs, really small nails. So she has a whole plethora of health issues because she's just not like proportioned correctly. But that makes her an easy target for the drakes during mating season. So what I have to do, which I would say probably 99% of people and cases, it makes the most sense to separate your drakes and put them into like a Drake jail. But in my specific situation, I separate sugar out and put her in a sugar shack during mating season because due to all of her health problems, she is not really a fan of other ducks in the first place. So it just makes more sense for me to separate her rather than to separate all three of my drakes. But this year I specifically put sugar, bubbles, and mr. Whip together in the sugar shack because bubbles and Mr. Whip are both blind in one eye, which is leaving them at a big disadvantage during mating season. And they are the only two ducks that sugar really tolerates. So they have their own like little pond in there. They hang out on the porch. And honestly, I think they prefer to be separated during mating season because they don't want to deal with the antics of mating season. But if you're in a situation where you have a favorite lady, you might have to bring your lady inside so she can first of all heal because it can go from zero to a hundred real quick. Like I hate to say it, but sometimes, like in some years, I let the ducks, you know, into bed one night, everything's fine, let them out in the next morning, and sugar's neck is just like raw and bleeding. And it's horrible that they would all the rest, the other like 20 females are fine, but sugar specifically got picked on, and I feel super bad for her. But 99% of cases, you're gonna want to be separating out the males. But if you also happen to have an unhealthy introverted duck, you could consider separating out the favorite female.

SPEAKER_00 37:08

One thing to keep in mind when it comes to a favorite lady, if you start to notice this happening, is no amount of female additions is going to fix this problem. The only solution is to separate the problem Drake from the selected female. You're that you're stuck when it comes to that case. Another thing about mating season that I want people to be aware of is that if you are going into mating season with a bad ratio, you have two options. Well, three options. You could do all the things we were talking about earlier, which is separate and do all of that and reduce your ratio that way by reducing the amount of males your females have contact with. Or you could rehome your drakes, or you can get adult females. You cannot safely introduce juvenile females with a bad ratio. So you do not want to be getting ducklings to fix a ratio unless it's outside of mating season and you have the four, four to five months it would take for those females to be reproductively mature to be introduced to that drake, but ducklings will not save you. So you need to be planning for this before breeding season starts. That's the time to get ducklings. And if you want to use ducklings to fix your ratio, otherwise, if you're in the thick of breeding season and you have a bad ratio and you're having overbreeding issues, you got to go find yourself adult mature females, ideally laying age or late juveniles that are about four to five months. That's that's your window. Go to your Facebook groups, go to Craigslist, go wherever you need to go to find those birds. Because putting juveniles in with a Drake that's already being problematic in overbreeding means he's gonna be targeting those juveniles and could be very damaging to their reproductive organs if they are not ready to be in that circumstance. If people don't realize that a lot of people think that if they go get female ducklings, they can throw those in after mating season goes. Me and Chrissy both, and I I'll say this be careful with this if you go to integrate juveniles into a mating season, like in mating season flock with drakes. Watch your drakes. I have never had my drakes go after a juvenile in any of my flocks ever. Yeah, but it can happen.

SPEAKER_01 39:02

I can say the same thing because I have found that my juvenile ducks are always so fast and they're so almost like afraid of all of the adult ducks. Yeah, they they could never catch them even if they tried. I have found that my favorite time to get ducklings is like late summer because mating season is is winding down, and then I get cute ducklings, and it's still nice and warm out outside, so I'm not worried about not being able to integrate them because it's the middle of winter. So I can raise the ducklings in the house, and then by the time that they get to move outside, mating season's over, and the transition is so much more smooth. It is the boss, or if you were to get ducklings in like the dead of winter and put them in before mating season starts, but you're gonna have them in the house for a longer period of time because it's winter and you can't just throw them outside. I'm going through that right now.

SPEAKER_00 39:54

I'm going through that right now. I had so much faith that it would be nice out by now, and of course it's not. Of course they're not ducklings. Of course. Just like this morning, I texted you this morning to say that I needed to stop and call duck eggs to fill a hatch order. Do I not get two and a fairy egg? Two! 20 laying birds in that flock. Two in a fairy egg. I was like, who first of all, who laid a fairy egg? What the hell? I was so mad. I was like, this is a gag. I hate you all. They knew. That's the problem that you have with ducks, is if you ever need eggs, that will be the one day they don't produce every time.

SPEAKER_01 40:27

You're like in the middle of making a cake and you're like, let me go out to the coop to grab an egg, and there's no eggs. And then you gotta like call your neighbor and be like, Can I have an egg? And they're like, Don't you have birds that lay eggs?

SPEAKER_00 40:40

No, I don't. I literally don't. I have birds that lay eggs when I don't need eggs. That's what I have.

SPEAKER_01 40:45

Imagine buying eggs at the store. What is that like?

SPEAKER_00 40:49

Never ever had to do that. Everybody lays here all the time. So, to make this super simple, I want to wrap up the mating season topic so that you guys all have the core information that you need to know. I'm gonna do it in one quick rundown. If you ever need to reference this spec, come back right back to this time slot and you'll have it right here. So you're going into mating season. The first thing you need to be worried about is your male to female ratio. Also, you need to know that your drakes are gonna suck. It's gonna happen. Happens to all of us. So if your ratio is good or you just have one Drake, I think you're perfectly fine to ride it out and see how that Drake does, and you don't need to do any doomsday prepping. If you have multiple drakes or your ratio is bad, make sure that you have some kind of separation area set up, whether that be an overnight separation to just get started, or some kind of overnight and outdoor separation, or some kind of additional living space that the drakes can go if they become problematic. If you're having a lot of issues, you're gonna want to make sure you're getting adult and mature females to fix any ratio concerns or any overbreeding concerns. If you have a favorite lady, you have to make sure that you separate the favorite lady from the bird that is picking her as the favorite lady or potentially all of the drakes if it's becoming a flock-wide problem. What else? And if you need sex ducklings, go to Messer Farms. If you need sex ducklings, or this is way prior to mating season and you can get those sex ducklings to fix your ratio now, or you have juveniles right now and you're thinking about next mating season, go to Messer Farms, get your sex ducklings, and you're gonna be good to go. Mating season lasts a lot longer than you think. You're gonna want to be prepared for this for the entire summer. And then once winter hits, you can take a little break, but it starts back up again in February. If you're a new flock keeper, try to really think about like what are your rules when it comes to keeping drakes? What kind of homes are you willing to rehome drakes to? Don't dump drakes in the wild. Don't dump any ducks in the wild. Don't dump them. Don't irresponsibly get drakes and dump them at shelters or rescues. Consider if you're willing to pass drakes on to farmers. Consider if you're willing to process your own birds for meat purposes. Find your moral ground and stick to it. That's for you to choose and you alone. Good luck. May the odds be operated in your favor. Mating season sucks for all of us. We truly all struggle. And be willing to learn and work with your birds. Don't give up on drakes too early. One to two year drakes are typically the worst drakes that you'll have. Sometimes you have a one to two year Drake and he's terrible. You get to year three, like I just went through, well, year five for general. So you get later on and their hormones mellow out, and you have a wonderful bird. So those are the things that I think you should know going into it. Chrissy, do you have anything to add?

SPEAKER_01 43:18

Yeah, or you end up with a Drake like Maple, who every year I'm like, he's so old, he'll be fine. And then he is just as thirsty for sugar as he was when he was young. He's Maple. He's like at least nine. Like he was an adult when I got him, and I've had him for nine years. Yeah, he looks old. He looks like an old man because he is. But when it comes to mating season and sugar, he's he's a cougar.

SPEAKER_00 43:45

Let's just say So, last thing that we should really talk about so that you guys know that we kind of forgot to talk about is signs of overbreeding. Very important if you're going into mating season with hens. Uh, it's super easy to spot. You're gonna see it right away. It's gonna be balding on the back. Of the neck and on the back. One thing you might start to notice is some feather degradation, like feather quality degradation in your hens from continuous mounting. That's normal. I don't consider that a sign of overbreeding. I really look for those bald patches. That's the big thing. I'm gonna warn you guys if you have multiple drakes, you're gonna see bald patches. It's gonna happen. It's not the end of the world if they are missing some feathers or stuff like that. It's not like, oh my god, my my females are sick. It happens. You're really looking for injury. So raw bald patches, red bald patches, blistering, really stressed out females. You'll see, you'll notice if your females are really stressed out and they're really exhausted, you'll see it. Um, but yeah, go into a cop. I know people freak out and they see like this tiny little bald patch. The feathers on the back of their head, by the way, are not very strong feathers. So it's like it it doesn't take much to get those to look a little sparse. A bunch of my females will look a little sparse this time of year. Don't panic. We're looking for injury-based overbreeding concerns. That's what you need to jump on.

SPEAKER_01 44:57

This waterfowl Wednesday, our breed of the week is the buff ducks, also known as orphancting ducks. And I know that Emily, you have buff ducks. So could you tell us a little bit about them?

SPEAKER_00 45:06

Yes, I love buff ducks. I actually, Didi's one of Didi's favorite standard-sized duck breeds is the buff duck. Oh, really? I think yeah. I think they're a very underrated breed. They are marked conservation status threatened by the livestock conservancy. So that might be a reason that we don't see so many of them. They are offered by Metzer Farms. That's where we got our buff ducks. Love them. I think they're an awesome breed. They have good egg production of 130 to 180 eggs per year. Um, I find I'm I might be wrong because honestly, there's so many duck eggs that I could not tell you which one the buffs lay. Um, but good large-sized eggs, not like a runner or a khaki. They are a five to six and a half pound bird, typically. Uh so not a heavyweight breed, probably falls them cleanly into the medium weight class. Buff ducks are medium weight. So they're a medium weight class of duck, which is a good weight class to be in. I usually like to pick lighter weight classes. I try to avoid the heavyweight class because of some health issues associated with size. That doesn't mean that all breeds that fall within the heavyweight class are going to have those health issues. I just personally like to keep lighter weight breeds, so that's one of the reasons that I like the buff duck because light to medium is usually my goal. They are a multi-purpose breed, so they're good for meat production if that's something that you're doing. I know me and Chrissy, it's always weird when me and Chrissy talk about meat production. I feel like it's important because there's people there's people that are here and do this for reasons different than us, and that's completely fine.

SPEAKER_01 46:29

I think it's worth noting what a breed was bred for. Like, yeah, even if we don't want to use it for that purpose, you should still know why it was bred to better understand the duck.

SPEAKER_00 46:38

Yeah. And so really interesting if you're in the meat realm or you're just curious about their history. Really interesting thing about the buff coloration, and one of the things that's popular about the buff duck for meat production is there's oh yeah, I don't know if it's proven, but I recently learned this that there is like stipulation about the fact that the buff feathering actually has lighter feathers that are easier for plucking. Really crazy. I had no idea. So that's one of the reasons that the buff duck has become popular for meat production and remains popular for meat production as well, with the dual purpose function of them. To have like a medium temperament. I find mine to be very friendly and very charming birds. Like I don't think they're my friendliest ducks. I don't think they're my most curious ducks, but I like their temperament. They typically get along with everybody in our mixed flock very well. Um, yeah. And they're beautiful. I just love the buff color.

SPEAKER_01 47:26

The buff coloration reminds me of the pastels in Call Ducks. They're not the same, but they are similar. And I just love pancake-colored ducks. I think it's just a a lovely color for a duck to be.

SPEAKER_00 47:37

It is a lovely color. And when it comes to both pastel call ducks and buff drakes, in my opinion, prettiest Drake you can own. That like bluish slate head. Yeah. Love it. It's a stunning bird. I really do love our buffs. They're almost like a peachy color. They're a little bit more, and this is the difference, I mean, at least between I have both Metzer pastel call ducks and Metzer Buff Ducks. The buff ducks are almost more pinkish. They have like a pinkish undertone, and certain lights they look very like pink. It's very, very pretty. Call ducks actually do come in buff color.

SPEAKER_01 48:08

It's just very hard to find. So while we were doing research on this breed, I actually pulled up Metzer Farm's website to read more about the Buff Orphington ducts, and they have something on here that I found really interesting. So they are the only poultry breed admitted in the American standard of perfection with their name as a color only. Orphington should have been used to describe the breed and buff for the variety, but they're just called buff ducks. And I find that really interesting.

SPEAKER_00 48:34

I read that too when I was doing some research on this breed for a project, and I think that's interesting too. I kind of love that fact. They were introduced to the APA in 1914. I love this breed. I think they're an awesome breed. Um, I think that this would definitely be a breed that I would think would make a really cool breeding project. If that's something you're interested in, especially with their threatened status, if you're looking to add buff ducks, I think you will not regret your choice. You can check out MetzerFarms at MetzerFarms.com, check their availability, and that is a great place to order. I can personally speak for their buff ducks. I think they were not only gorgeous birds, but they have awesome temperament and great egg production for me here. So I think you'll have a great experience. All right, we're gonna move straight into answering follower questions because we're me and Chrissy tend to always say we're gonna make it a short episode and then we don't. Yeah. Every time. So yeah, we just get into it. We get into the topics. What can I say? Ariana asked, I love your duck pool setup, but do you have any suggestions for someone in the winter with a smaller flock? What would your water setup be like?

SPEAKER_01 49:32

So this is actually a good question because before I lived here, I actually didn't have outdoor water and electric in the winter. So I had to DIY a pool setup. So in the winter, it's still very important for your ducks to be able to swim so that they don't get wet feather. When they swim, they preen their feathers, they spread their natural prenoil or yeah, they spread their prenoil all over their feathers, and that's what makes them waterproof. If your ducks end up not waterproof in the winter, they have a condition called wet feather, and if they have wet feather, they can't regulate their body temperature as well. So it's just not good, and you should make sure your ducks have access to swimming water as much as you reasonably can. So, what I would like to do, I bought cement mixing tubs at Lowe's. I think they're like$15, and it was just enough space for the ducks to be able to like get in them and swim and dive a little bit, but I was able to just carry five-gallon buckets of water from inside the house, outside the house to fill it. You just have to make sure that you dump it before nighttime so that the pond doesn't completely freeze. Um, but I found that to be a great solution. And Emily, I think you just use like the rubber tubs, right? And let them swim in there. Yep.

SPEAKER_00 50:37

I did pretty much the same thing just with the different tub. One thing, this is this year more than ever. I've seen people having wet feather associated with removing water access over the winter. I've seen multiple cases of it. A lot of people are going off of the understanding that ducks technically only need enough water to wash their head or dunk their head and submerge their eyes and their nares. Now, there's an important thing that people are missing in that part, which is ducks need enough water to wash their eyes, nares, and splash down their backs. So, your ducks, I think a lot of people are giving their ducks enough water to submerge their head, but they're not, especially because a lot of people are trying not to have their ducks make a big mess, right? They might not actually be allowing for that opportunity for the ducks to splash that water down their backs. So make sure you're doing that. If you are going to be restricting your water over the winter, make sure you're offering enough for them to actually effectively bathe. Water is incredibly important for maintaining feather health in ducks, and ducks need to be able to maintain their feather health and structure in order to utilize their pren oils appropriately. So don't restrict their water too much in the winter, guys. Like a very common beginner mistake. Don't beat yourself up if you made that mistake. Um, we could talk about that in a whole other episode.

SPEAKER_01 51:48

Yeah, I know it's like really annoying to have to be carrying buckets of water out there for them and dumping it every night, but it is what's best for your ducks' health. And it keeps them happy and not as bored in the winter. So I think it's totally worth it. Moving on to our next question. Alexandria asked, Opinions on housing ducks and geese together.

SPEAKER_00 52:05

We house ducks and geese together here. I think there's a lot of really awesome things about housing ducks to ging geese together. One, I think it's kind of natural because in the wild you'll notice that ducks and geese kind of all cohabit in the same area. So I like that social aspect of it. Geese are really awesome when it comes to looking out for your duck flock. They're good alarm systems, they'll let you know what's going on in the sky. Way better than any ducks that you'll ever have. So they do add an element of safety to a duck flock. There are some things that are rough about housing ducks and geese together. You have to make sure you have a duck-friendly goose. I think one of the best ways to obtain this is to raise your ducks and geese together. I've raised geese independently of ducks, and I've raised geese with a group of ducks, and my goose that was raised jelly bean doesn't have a lot going on in her mind. So she's she's fine with the ducks, but I did have some issues with the other geese that I raised jelly bean with, came to being housed with ducks. Whereas it comes to Goosey Goo who's raised with ducks, she's much more bonded to ducks than Jelly Bean is. Doesn't she hang out with the runner ducks? Yeah. She her she has a relationship with my runner ducks, actually. Right. I think geese are awesome. I think you can definitely house them. I think you have to be prepared to not be able to house them with ducks or re-home if it doesn't work. And you have to watch it very closely because the thing about a goose is it's very capable of hurting and killing your ducks very, very easily. Right. I I remember one time when before I re-homed the other two geese that I got with jelly bean, I rehomed those geese because one of them picked up a duck and like fully ragdolled it. Literally picked it up and was just like and I was like, oh my god, okay, yeah, no, that's the line. We're done here. Wow. So I got I got rid of those geese.

SPEAKER_01 53:44

But I think it can work really well as long as you're very careful about it. And one of the great benefits of ducks and geese together is that they can eat the same food, which is a problem that a lot of people run into when you're housing chickens and ducks together, is that they eat different food. Not that it can't work, I just like wouldn't recommend groundfowl and waterfowl together, whereas ducks and geese are so similar, works a lot better.

SPEAKER_00 54:09

They also have the same level of parasite resistance. The even reason I don't like housing ducks and chickens together is because of the parasitic load that ducks bring and the parasitic risk.

SPEAKER_01 54:18

And neither ducks nor geese have like a sharp beak that can peck like a chicken does. So they're kind of equal in that aspect. Yeah, but they're they're not gonna like peck out the ducks' eyes. Yes, probably. Probably not gonna do that. Whereas a chicken might.

SPEAKER_00 54:34

Just so you're aware of that, like for anybody getting geese that has ducks though, you know, when your ducks go to fight each other, they pull each other's feathers. Sometimes they pull each other's feathers out, but it's usually they more like break their feather or whatever. They have safety beaks, they can't do that much. When your goose fights a duck, or when they get into a squabble, or when geese get into squabbles, they're taking a mouthful of feathers because they have little grippers. So every single time it's like feathers everywhere. And it's like not because ducks have so many feathers that it's not damaging, but in the moment it looks chaotic. So I've seen I've seen that happen a couple times where it was just like uh they were pecking or like a little tiff because sometimes the runner ducks will get really up in the face of the geese when I'm throwing treats. And one time one of my geese went and just grabbed a runner and just grabbed it. She didn't do anything with it, but then when she backed off, there was just a mouthful of feathers. I was like, ah! That's horrifying. It was horrifying. I was like, this is this is rough. So be careful with your geese, is the best thing I have to say. Just watch it. Um and raise them together if you can. Matthew asked, Do you let moms sit on the nest to hatch or do you use an incubator? I've actually done both.

SPEAKER_01 55:40

I don't necessarily have a preference. I think either method is fine. I would say I mostly go the incubator route because I have found that my ducks tend to be terrible parents. Oftentimes they won't fully incubate the eggs, they'll be committed for like two weeks, and then they'll be like, you know what? Being a mom is boring actually. Um, abort mission, I'm just gonna leave the eggs, let them get cold, and then they die. Whereas when I incubate them, I'm in control and I am very meticulous about making sure everything is good in the incubator. I do like that ducks seem to have like a sixth sense about if their ducklings are forming well in the eggs or not, which obviously I I can't I don't have that sixth sense. So I do find that very interesting. Broody ducks can be kind of annoying to deal with, and I do worry about them because they like don't eat or drink or swim a lot when they're broody. Um I think you can really go either way. What do you do?

SPEAKER_00 56:36

I do I do the incubator for a variety of reasons. One, some of you might know this, I keep crows on my property. Oh, right. So we have a lot of crows in my my big duck area, and crows will eat the crap out of ducklings. So I I don't have a closed type aviary to let my standards raise out young. Uh so it's it's not worth it, it's way too risky. So I'm always gonna be raising the young anyway. If I'm gonna be raising the young, I'm not gonna force a mom to brood it. Right. Because brooding's hard on them. So why would I do that? Right. And when it comes to my call flock, they just lost privileges. Like I don't trust them to be good mothers. So I just I would rather just me raise them and not them not go through the brooding process if they don't need to. So that's that's why I use the incubator.

SPEAKER_01 57:17

If you're going to let the mama duck hatch the eggs, it would be incredibly emotionally distressing for most of them to just take all of her babies away. But if you're in a situation where I'm assuming if you're letting them do that, you also have a drake in your flock to fertilize the eggs, and there's a solid chance that the drake is not going to get along with the ducklings and could injure or kill them. So you're gonna need a separate place for the mama to raise her babies, but like you probably don't want to bring her inside because moving her is gonna freak her out. So it is a bit more tricky, I'd say, um, to let the mama duck do it. But like with call ducks specifically, I think a lot of people have trouble hatching them. So in that case, it might just be easier to let the mama ducks handle it. But you really gotta weigh what works for you.

SPEAKER_00 58:01

It also depends so much on the bird. If I had a phenomenal brooder and a phenomenal mother that I had reliably like had done it before, like maybe I'll let them sit this year to see if anybody's changed their mind on being a crap mother. And if that ever pops up for me, especially in my flock where I have a closed top baby rate, I might utilize the ducks more to do the incubation because I don't want to.

SPEAKER_01 58:22

I had like a really good silky chicken, I would absolutely let her incubate called duck eggs because I feel like, well, I don't have a rooster, but also chickens tend to be like super, super, super protective over their young. So I feel like a silky chicken would actually do a good job raising young within my pen setup. Whereas when I let munchkin hatch ducklings, she would just like run away from them and they would like struggle to follow behind her in the grass. And she did protect them, but like not she should have protected them more.

SPEAKER_00 58:52

I think it depends on your birds. I think it's bird to bird. It depends. And what your setup's like and what you can do safely.

SPEAKER_01 58:58

And we had a few people ask this question do you supplement oyster shells on the side of your feed?

SPEAKER_00 59:03

Yes. I supplement oyster shells for all my birds. All my birds are a mixed flock where I have drakes and hens, so I have to make sure that I have not as much calcium in whatever I'm feeding them. And I have the option for the hens to go get that supplemental calcium so that I don't overload my boys on calcium that they don't need. And my hens can get that resource. So there's a couple great options. We use free choice calcium. We just put that on a dish on the side for our hens. The hens are smart enough to know when they need that calcium, they take it when they need it, and the drakes leave it alone. I talked about recently though that my drakes do tend to eat calcium.

SPEAKER_01 59:36

They want strong bones. I don't know. I do the same thing with my flock. I just have a bowl of oyster shells out all the time.

SPEAKER_00 59:41

Yeah, it's super easy. I don't really, I don't know if you do. I don't offer them in the winter when nobody's laying them.

SPEAKER_01 59:47

No, but I always get scared and start offering it like when I think they're gonna start laying their first eggs in February. Because one time, because one time I had a duck get eggbound when she was laying her first egg. And it was probably because she was a call duck laying her first egg and didn't have anything to do with a calcium deficiency. But in my mind, it could have contributed. So I'm like, I need to make sure they get the calcium before they start laying.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:12

Yeah, yeah. I do the same thing. I think I start it like late winter. I start putting the oyster shells out a little bit earlier. My chickens start laying earlier than my my call ducks at least. And my standard flock, I have to give it to them year-round because they actually do lay through the winter. So it depends. But sometimes, like, if everybody's heavily molting in the entire flock, I don't put it out. And I find no nobody's laying. All right, guys, and that concludes episode five of the Duck Ladies podcast. Thank you guys so much for hanging out with us. Don't forget to check out our new merch line. I'm wearing our hoodie today. It will be linked in the show notes and on all of our social platforms. We, of course, have the Dunkin' Ducks merch line and the Cheese Quackers homestead merch line. You guys can check those out in the same place. Thank you so much to our sponsor, Metzer Farms, for sponsoring this episode. We're gonna be linking Metzger Farms in the show notes as well. If you guys are looking for ducks and ducklings to add to your homestead or start your very first flock, don't forget to leave a review on wherever your favorite place the listener watches. It helps out the show so much. We would love to hear what you guys think in the comments or any mating season advice that you might have.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:10

Make sure to be following all of our social channels because every week I put out a post asking you guys for your questions that you want to hear answered for the show. And we'd love to know what you guys want to hear about next week. That's all we got for this one. Bye guys.