Answering YOUR Duck & Goose Questions

Welcome to Episode 11 of the Duck Ladies Pondcast with Host Krissy from @DunkinDucks and Emily from ​@CheeseandQuackersHomestead ! In episode 11 we answer questions sent in by followers of our social media channels!

Table Of Contents: 
00:00 Intro
01:43 How do you introduce goslings to adult geese? What is the best time to introduce them?
12:24 Pecking Order Disputes | What's normal? | When to Rehome or Cull
24:58 Is Fermenting Duck Feed Worth It?
30:07 Metzer Farms Sponsorship
33:19 Thoughts on Keeping Exotics?
35:30 Are Call Ducks Always Noisy?
37:31 How Do You House Multiple Breeds of Ducks Together?
40:41 Do Ducks Need To Go In The Coop At Night Even If They Have a Predator Resistant Pen?
45:27 What Style Hardware Cloth Is the Best?
52:27 How Do You Get Your Ducks To Go To Bed At Night?
55:00 Can You Use Sand In A Chicken Coop?
56:08 Closing

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey everyone, and welcome to the Duck Ladies Podcast, episode 11. I'm your host, Chrissy from Dunkin' Ducks, here with Emily from Cheese and Quackers Homestead. And today we are gonna spend this entire episode answering questions that you guys have sent in to our social media.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

This time we're actually answering your follower questions. You guys are seeing this before. We tried to do this last week, and me and Chrissy went on a tangent talking about like a million things. We're still gonna release that episode, but it's gonna be the episode following this. So this is us attempting to redo what was supposed to be last week's episode. So that's why. If things seem weird because we're talking about in next episode that we were supposed to do follower questions, that's because we're posting that one after this one because we really, really need to answer these questions for you guys. You guys have been, we've been saying it for like three three weeks that we were gonna do it. Also, the reason me and Chrissy got on such a tangent last week is because our homestead updates just, I don't, we just got on topics because of our homestead updates. So we are both intentionally skipping homestead updates because we don't want that to happen again. We just want to answer questions. So that's why we're skipping that portion today.

SPEAKER_01 1:09

So you'll get our our full hour of homestead updates on our next episode.

SPEAKER_02 1:15

I don't even remember what we talked about, but I know it was interesting. A lot of we were both there's a lot of different things. We told you guys that the podcast was genuinely gonna be you guys listening to me and Chrissy's phone calls, and that's exactly what happened last episode.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Yeah. It was literally we ended up just being on the phone. So, what we're gonna be doing for this episode is checking out our our comments on our social media in real time and picking questions to read to each other and for us to answer together or separately, depending on the question. So, the first question that I have found that I wanted to ask you, Emily, because I can't answer this one because I don't have geese, is a question sent in by Meg, and she said, How do you introduce goslings to adult geese and what is the best age to introduce them?

SPEAKER_02 1:56

This is such an awesome question for me right now because like I actually had the exact same question this week. Because I have never actually been in the situation where I even had the opportunity to introduce younger goslings to an adult goose, because by the time when I got when I got Jelly Beans group of goslings last year, it was in the winter. So I ended up moving them out with the weather, and by that point they were already full grown. That was the worst experience of my life, mind you. I had full grown geese in my basement.

SPEAKER_03 2:25

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 2:26

It was awful. I forgot that I did that. Didi rightfully probably is traumatized.

SPEAKER_01 2:31

So don't get goslings in the winter.

SPEAKER_02 2:34

Don't. I had no choice because Goosey Goo was alone. So I just wanted the soonest possible geese because I was I was really worried about her. Anyway, so this year for the first time I actually had goslings and adult geese. And I was like, a couple things were different that I did. I didn't ever even really had to research because I was like, it was kind of strange. So, first of all, goslings are hardier than ducks when it comes to coming off heat. So you could technically remove goslings from heat slightly earlier than you even typically would with ducks, even though they don't seem to be as feathered as ducks. Because they feather out really, really slow compared to ducks, about three to four weeks. I actually called my friend who breeds goslings and I said, they're so big, like, do they really need heat? And she was like, Oh no, mine are out in the garage, moved out and starting to like wean off heat. Like they still get it supplementally as needed since it's really cold in New York, but like I've already started the process. Difference isn't so much that it's a different age point, it's that geese are so much less feathered than ducks are at three weeks, it seems like, in my opinion. They're also just bigger, so it might just be that. So at three to four weeks, weather dependent, um, you could start transitioning your ducks and geese off heat. So, like, tentatively at that point, you can start moving them outside. When it comes to introducing them to adult geese, this is what I was also confused about. Because with ducks, you can't introduce young offspring to adult ducks and expect them to take on that offspring or like really honestly even be nice to it. Like you've probably experienced if you introduce like early, like if I introduced a three to four-week-old duck to my adult duck flock, they would attack it persistently. Absolutely. Yep. Where the weirdest thing, and I thought it was the same for geese for the longest time. So I put my geese out in a separation with my young ducks that I was raising with my geese, and my two adult geese wouldn't leave that area. They like were staying in the coop and like staring at the babies. And I was like, what the heck? And from what I understand of geese, geese operate their their pecking order and their dynamic with their flock is just different. Um, and so I had a thought. I was like, do they want the babies? Is that what they're doing? Do they see young geese and think, I want those? Those are those are familiar. Those are familiar.

SPEAKER_01 4:52

It's a baby, someone needs to keep it warm.

SPEAKER_02 4:54

Yeah. And so I called their breeder and I was like, hey, what is this behavior that I'm seeing? Why aren't they leaving the babies? And she said, Oh yeah, they probably want them. She's like, they'll surprise you, let it let the babies out and see what they do. So at first I pulled one of the babies and brought it out to Jolly Bean and Goosey Goo, and they were hissing. And I was like, oh no. And I put the baby back. And then I thought to myself, what if they were hissing at me and not the baby? And so then I put the babies back out, let them hiss and hiss and hiss at me, put the babies down, and then Goosey Goo just took the babies and started taking care of them. And I was like, That's amazing. I I was so bamboozled in what I learned because then immediately I was so curious. I was like, this is the coolest thing. Geese kind of community raise, they don't necessarily like they all are kind of taking a part in raising young, and they'll even take on teenagers and help out with teenagers if they just see young. Like geese are just so maternal. And so geese are like really small. They are they except jelly bean. Jelly bean is the exception. Jelly bean, I think if you did a craniotomy on jelly bean, there would be half of what's supposed to be there. But that's just a jelly bean thing. Um, but they're really intelligent. Like, goosey goo is incredibly intelligent. Like, I could tell that that bird has full thoughts, like full complete sentences in her brain in goose language. Like, she is so cool. Jelly bean just it's radio silence and like maybe some music, and that's but Goosey Goo has been like since she they haven't left. Like, I still I'm paranoid mainly because one of the things the breeder did say is that you can really introduce them at any age that they're strong enough to be outside to adult geese. You just need to supervise and make sure that the adult geese are doing the right thing. And I'm paranoid because she said to me, she said, I don't have a pond, so I would be extra careful since you have a pond with adults on the pond and stuff like that. And that's so that's the only reason that they Jelly Bean and Goosey Goo haven't been raising the babies full time. So I still put them away in their separation area when I'm not up there. But if I'm up there, I just let the babies out and goosey goo takes care of them. It's so cool. I feel like I have like a babysitter.

SPEAKER_01 7:05

That's awesome.

SPEAKER_02 7:06

I was so excited. I've so my analysis from what I learned, and granted, I as much as I could kind of speak on this, I haven't raised that many geese. Not like I have ducks, I've raised hundreds of ducks. I haven't raised nearly as many geese. So it's hard for me to really give you like the best advice on geese. I'm still learning. But as far as I can understand, it is different, and you can introduce much earlier than you would expect, even if you raise them or it's not necessarily the offspring of the goose. Like you don't even really have to trick a goose that much. It's so weird, it's so cool. I love them. But I think three to four weeks is a good mark because you know that you know you're at a good point and they're much hardier and they're much cold hardier. Um, and then just see how your geese do. I personally would not trust even Goosey Goo overnight until they're like maybe six weeks. Just just cause. I don't know. Yeah. God forbid she changes her mind. She's like, you know what? I hate it. That's the scary thing about geese, is like even ducks, like I they're not that capable of hurting each other. Like they can, but like it's not like critical wounds. Whereas a goose, if a goose decides it doesn't want it, it'll just pick that thing up in the air and rip it into pieces.

SPEAKER_00 8:19

Like, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:20

So I'm like, uh, but it's so cute right now to watch Goosey take care of her babies. I love it.

SPEAKER_01 8:28

I love that goose geese have like such cute, like family bonds.

SPEAKER_02 8:32

Yeah, that's so cool. Like, and I think ducks don't really have that. Like geese, I think geese also have a stronger memory, and ducks are more like like if you take a duck from its home and its family, it's like way, and then it's like, all right, whatever. Like, and it just moves on, like within like 15 minutes. It might like yell for like 10 minutes, but then it's like it gets over it. Whereas a goose, like I genuinely would never like I would actually take rehoming a goose that's been like say I had to rehome jelly bean or goosey goo that's been like integrated into my flock, they would have to kill like multiple animals on my home set for me to move them because I do think they would actually have an emotional impact to that. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 9:13

Like, I feel like like much more similar to parrots in that sense, where they like they just seem to understand things and they live so long.

SPEAKER_02 9:21

It's like they remind me a lot of parrots, actually. And so that's one of the reasons I get so excited. I'm trying to get more into actually the goose dimension of keeping waterfowl because they remind me so much of parrots, and every time I get them, it feels like it doesn't just feel like getting another bird for the flock dynamic, it's like getting this entire individual with like such a specific intelligence, and like it's like getting a dog, that's what it feels like. And I know they're really make me want geese. You need you need geese. I need more land. They're so cool, like and their behaviors are so cool. Like their protective instincts and like the way that they supervise and like except jelly bean. All this is except jelly bean, by the way. It's all goosey goo. Goosey goo to me is one of the most incredible animals I've ever had the pleasure of keeping and like raising and taking care of. So cool. That's why I really want you to get them because they truly are individuals. It's a lot like if you've ever had experience with parrots, in my opinion, it's a lot like keeping parrots.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

Yeah. I actually grew up with two African gray parrots. They're both still alive. They're smarter than that. I just have one and my sister has the other because they hated each other.

SPEAKER_02 10:30

That it's it's like it's like having a person. Like my parrots are like people. They're to me, like they're very specific in their traits and their personalities, and you can see like the thought process behind their like everything they do. Like, you could see them solving equations in their head. Birds are so cool. I love it. And that's like geese. That's except for every once in a while the geese do something really stupid, and then I'm like, nah, maybe not. Goosey goo hates Stanley cups, like she hates the the style of tumblr. She doesn't mind like regular cups, but she doesn't like interesting. The the battle she had because I dropped my Stanley cup outside, and she was like, absolutely not. Like she treated it like a predator. She was like out of the coop at the Stanley Cup. Why? I don't know. It's so that I then I'm like, she can't be that smart. Like that, you know, and then I have a moment like that. I'm like goosey, it's all right. But it's yeah, I love I love the way they protect my flock. I trust them with my flock. Like, I don't trust anybody with my flock, if that makes sense. I'm like very particular about who watches over my flock. Yet if I go inside, I go, it's the geese, the geese have it, they'll take care of it, they'll watch them, they'll make sure they all do the right thing, they'll make sure nobody gets hurt and like that. It's so cool. Like they they keep my drakes from overmating my hens. How cool is that? Because they see that's great. They see such a benefit. They see my hens being bothered. They don't interrupt normal mating, but when they hear my hens being distressed, they go and rip the Drake off. My Drakes probably hate it, but it's great, it's the best ever. I love that. But moving on, I could talk about geese for an hour. I love them so much. Do you have oh, you don't really have anything to add because you don't raise geese? Yeah, I don't have geese. The thing you have to add is you're gonna get geese. Just two. Just two. Okay. I like this question. Sarah Kinesis. I like your username, Sarah Kinesis. If that if I'm pronouncing it right, maybe their last name is Kinesis and I'm turning it into telekinesis, but um, can you talk about pecking order disputes? When do you decide if it's becoming too much and you just need to separate versus re-home call?

SPEAKER_01 12:41

That's a very good question, because I think it really depends on your flock dynamics. Ducks in general, I think it's very hard, like, for them to hurt each other, like you were saying. Like, okay, they're if they're pulling feathers out of each other, it's like that's just pecking order behavior. Uh, I witness that a lot when integrating younger ducks. I occasionally see my females like pull out each other's breast feathers when they bicker over something, but like that's just not concerning at all to me. I've actually never had a duck that was part of my flock. Like, I've rehomed, you know, ducklings that I hatched or whatever, but I've never had a duck that was like fully integrated into my flock and I needed to re-home it due to aggression. But Emily, you have had experiences with drakes who just went off the wall during mating season and you had to make that choice. So, how, yeah, how do you approach that? That's a good question.

SPEAKER_02 13:34

I've actually had a lot of bullying experiences. I have a lot of flocks and I've had a lot of issues. So, with pecking order disputes that are bullying related, so the biggest indication that it's not hormonal and seasonal and whatever is if it's happening at non-hormonal times of the year. So if you're seeing like bullying, that's completely different than pecking order disputes because pecking order disputes are designed to resolve. Like a bird should find its place in the pecking order. There's a couple things that can make it not resolve, especially if you're getting involved a lot. So if you keep intervening, what's gonna happen is that bird's never gonna establish itself. They're never gonna actually have a winner of the fight because that's what's happening, is the birds are fighting and they're trying to find out who won. So they get to be above that bird and whatever it is that birds are doing in their brains. And if you're constantly intervening, nobody's winning the fight. So the fighting's just gonna keep going. And so you have to have to have to let that go. Now, if you're seeing it outside of the window of like hormonal pecking behavior, if this is a long-term flock, all of the birds are older, that's when I start to get concerned that somebody might need to be broken up. I usually do like a lot of observations and other things that will really help is trial runs. So if I'm trying to figure out a problem, start removing birds and seeing if it gets better. So one thing I just did with Gimli to see if the problem would resolve without Gimli is I put Gimli into a separated area within the pen and I saw if all of the problems improved, and they did. So then I know that he's the problem and I know that removing him is gonna fix this. As far as like packing order squabbles when you're integrating new ducks, it they shouldn't go on that long. I would say it's about one to two weeks of them fighting, and then you start to notice that maybe they're living, they're cohabiting well. And no, you know what? I'm changing my mind on that. I'm thinking back, it's really just a couple days of like actual fighting. And then after that, there's some like chasing and like get out of my way, move over, maybe for a week.

SPEAKER_01 15:34

And then they're playing so fast.

SPEAKER_02 15:36

Yeah, but they shouldn't be like full-blown chest to chest. Like you see, you'll see the full-blown chest to chest when you first let the birds out, and they really are going. After that, it should be rather settled, but they're a little off for a while, where like the adults didn't fully accept the babies, but the babies are like able to be in, they'll kind of like find their spots where they're allowed to be for a while. Yeah. And then, like, I would say like three to four weeks, you're gonna start to notice that the babies are more dispersed, they're not all clinging together. They're starting to hang out. You might see two of the babies with one of the adults doing an activity together, and that's how you know everything went good. But if it's going, I would say if you're like at a month and things are still wonky, I would start to get concerned. Have you ever had that happen?

SPEAKER_01 16:22

Cause I I mean, yeah, like they they I find that they just they do tend to integrate really well. I think if your ratio was really off, then maybe you would have some bigger issues going on there. But like my guests don't hurt each other. I mean, like, like I said, pulling out a feather is one thing versus actually causing significant damage where they need like medical help.

SPEAKER_02 16:47

For pecking order reasons, I've never had that happen. Does that make sense? The oh, except cashew. Cashew, yes. But that was hor that was like it was because of hens. Does that make sense? Which makes me think it was hormonal, even though it was in the off seasons. It's different with a Drake, but like, because Drake's Drake's are just different, really, like in the pecking order sense. They're always trying to stay at the top. They're designed to. But I've never really had them, like, outside of a Drake on hen crime. Like, I've never had except Drake on hen or Drake on Drake is the only thing I'm worried about, if that makes sense. I've never had my females actually do anything to each other or a Drake do something to a female outside of like a mating season hormonal injury problem.

SPEAKER_00 17:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 17:31

But so yeah, I would give it a month, and if you're still having problems, then I might might start to get concerned. I would also try to isolate, like, what are you actually dealing with? Because like there's some things that can cause your flock to bully a bird. So, like, you may actually be dealing with flock bullying. Say it's just, but that the thing is is flock bullying, so say you're introducing a group of birds. The reason flock bullying happens isn't because of that. It's typically because the flock sees a weakness and they're trying to eliminate it. So that's typically going to be one to two birds max. If you have a whole, if I had a whole group of ducklings that I was integrating, or ducks that are now adults and able to integrate, and my flock was bullying them all, not pecking order fighting them all, I would be like, are these birds sick? I would be very confused. Because that really the reason we see flock bullying is because the birds deem a bird unfit and they're trying to get rid of it. Answer this person's question about like the rehoming and culling part. My like it really comes down to the individual bird. My questions that I ask myself, like that I run through when I get to the point, like, say you identified an irreparable problem. Like, this bird can't live with another bird in my flock, no matter what I do, right? Like, they can't be together, they need to be separated. Say I get to that point. That's when I start to think of the quality of life of each individual bird. So a good example of this is sugar in Chrissy's flock. So Chrissy has sugar. Sugar is capable of living in a separated area and prefers it. Yeah. That sugar wants that anyway, and has a full life that way. That's the life that suits sugar. So you have to decide: is this bird able to handle that kind of isolation? Is there one of the birds that can handle certain things? I also take into consideration, can I safely relocate this bird to someone else's flock? So I just went through this with Gimli, because Gimli was having issues that were very dangerous. And I said, I I told Chrissy, I said, I can't safely relocate Gimli to any flock with hens. I can't put them around hens because I can't risk somebody else's flock because I I knew that the specific problem Gimli was happening would persist in the presence of hens, period. And so I this is this is gonna be really hard for my audience to hear, but a genuine consideration for Gimli was culling. Like a j I I that was awful. One of the worst things I've ever had to ponder. I'm so glad I did not have to explore that route. But Gimli wasn't a bird that I could make live in isolation for an extended period of time without massively impacting his quality of life. At which point, culling was on the table if I could not find a better solution. I was able to find him a bachelor flock, thank God. But I couldn't risk other people's birds. And that's when you start to think about that, you know? Yeah. But it's all a hard thing for me to tell you how to approach those decisions because those are decisions that you have to create guidelines for, for yourself and your birds and your morals, and all of that has to get into play because you might not feel the same way about certain things I do. For me, I would always cull a bird before I subjected them to a life that was torture. In my opinion, I think that if I isolated Gimli for the amount of time that I would be having to isolate him in order to keep him away from hens full time during breeding season, it would be massively detrimental to his mental well-being. And in my opinion, death would be a better solution to that problem than to do that to be selfish.

SPEAKER_01 20:47

Like, I wouldn't, if you had isolated him like that, I wouldn't have even been surprised if he like literally just starved himself to death because he was so stressed.

SPEAKER_02 20:56

Like that's not a death. That can very much happen when you separate a bird. They cannot eat. I had Goku. Actually, sorry to Goku right now because I separated Goku this morning because he was pissing me off. He was just having a day. I don't know. He and so I just said, you know what? I'm gonna give the ladies a ladies' day because I do that every once in a while anyway. So I put Goku in his little separation area and he hasn't eaten a thing because he's just so frustrated that he can't get to all the girls and be out. And so that's the problem that you run into with long-term isolation, especially in a bird that doesn't handle it well. Now, if Peanut started being a monster or something, I don't know, if she started beating the crap out of some other duck, she'd be fine. That duck has like four thoughts in a day. And so I would just put her in separation. I don't think it would be massively impactful to her. This is one of the reasons that it's so important to get to know your individual birds because it helps you make decisions in line with their wants and also to get to understand your birds on a deeper level than their happiness isn't always what looks like happiness. You know, you gotta understand, you gotta think like them, which is hard. I did this last. I did this last night because I had to re-home a bird and I was sad and it was bothering me. And so I started trying to figure out. Like I really always try to figure out how do ducks think? Because they don't sit there and be like, I miss this, I miss that. You know, and so I was like, how do ducks think? How what what what do they think? And they live in the moment and they think of like safety and am I safe? Am I like enriched? Do I have the things that make me feel safe? Where's the food? Do I have that? It's like when I re-home a bird, as much as I wonder, do they miss here? Do they miss home? They don't. They might miss it for a second, but then they're more happy that they're presently safe. That's what they care about. And so it's the same thing. So you start to try to think like a duck, and I think about the fact that Gimli would never be able to relax. Like he would never fully relax. He would pace the fence. And I know that behavior is not a relaxed duck. And so But he can now. He's he's in a bachelor flock living his best life now. He is. And so that's and that's that's the hard decisions that I feel like it really is helpful to know your individual birds in order to be able to make those decisions. Yeah. Because each one is kind of different, you know. Every duck, like there's certain things that I would do. Yesterday I thought Peanut had was it yesterday or the day before I called you and said Peanuts being weird? Yeah, I think it was the day before. I thought for a second she had EYP, and I think it's because I have EYP on the mind that I'm like all traumatized. And so immediately my brain was like, We're going to Cornell. She's getting an implant. She's gonna have 45 appointments a month, and that's I was just like, I was just like, Peanut's dramatic. She's probably fine. She was fine, she was just being weird, but there's there's a time of day where if you look at peanut, she's all messed up. Like it's like her, I think she has narcolepsy, like the duck version of narcolepsy. So, like, if you if you catch her during that time, first of all, it's impossible to diagnose her because she's just like she's like a wet rag. Like it's like this, she's so weird. And so it's impossible to tell if she's actually sick. And then she acts super sick. I don't know, it's to her. It's like noon, it's like her nap time. She's all messed up. And I the reason I would be able to do that with her is because she does not care. There is no behavioral difference in peanut, no matter where you put her in the world. Like, she doesn't act stressed when she's in my house, she doesn't act stressed when she's not around other ducks, she doesn't act stressed, and I know what they look like when they're stressed. I've seen them all stressed. I know how to make them stressed if I ever needed to check it. Unoccupied t-shirts. If there is a shirt off of a human body, they are mortified of it. So every once in a while, when we need to get them somewhere or they're being bad, Dee Dee will rip off his shirt and start throwing it in the air and they're all gone in the coup. So I know what they all look like stressed. And that is like a big thing that I use to read their behavior. So that, yeah, I feel like we about I feel like we finally covered that. That was a lot like an oddly large question.

SPEAKER_01 24:50

It's just so easy for us to take a little tawny topic and like go crazy with it. Yeah. I have pulled up another question that I already know our immediate answer to. Peek and pals asked, have you ever tried fermenting your duck food and is it worth it?

SPEAKER_00 25:06

No.

SPEAKER_01 25:07

So, no. I will start off by saying, as far as the is it worth it part, a lot of people take the concept of fermenting feed to save money. That's why they do it. Now, when we're talking about fermenting feed for waterfowl, I don't think it's worth it because I don't think it's worth your bird's life, to put it simply. I think it's dangerous given the fact that it can mold extremely quickly, and ducks can be very susceptible to issues from that. I don't know how to pronounce this illness. Maybe you do, Emily. How do you pronounce asperg aspergiliosis?

SPEAKER_00 25:43

Yes. Aspergiliosis.

SPEAKER_01 25:45

I think it I'm just I'm just saying ducks are particularly prone to that, and it's caused by oftentimes caused by food or mold growing on the feed. So that's not a risk that I would be willing to take, or really, I should say that's another corner I'm willing to cut to save money. Now, a lot of people also do it for chickens. I still wouldn't do it for my chickens, but I think it's less risky for chickens. Don't quote me on that. Not a chicken expert. I don't think it is. I'm a duck expert.

SPEAKER_02 26:13

I don't think it's less risky. I think it's always just such a bad idea. I mean, it's such an easy thing to mess up. It's just not worth it.

SPEAKER_01 26:21

So many people like aren't doing it correctly when they like make videos on like how to do it. They're like not even really fermenting, they're just like letting it sit and get wet. And like I know from personal experience that so I prefer to feed my ducks on water because I just feel like it's the most natural for them. I buy a food that's specifically formulated to float on water and not instantly disintegrate. And even that, if it's like a hundred-degree day, which doesn't happen very often here, their food will mold in just a hot summer day. And so I don't put their food on water in a hot summer day because that's how quickly it can happen. And without actually understanding how fermentation works and like having a deep understanding of that, you're just putting food in hot water and letting it mold. No, I yeah, it's just it's not I don't recommend it at all.

SPEAKER_02 27:07

No, I wouldn't, I wouldn't, I've never done it. I would never do it. I just think it's not, yeah, like I Chrissy said, it's not worth risking my birds to save some money. I don't think there's that many actual really good nutritional benefits that you couldn't get in other directions. Sometimes the fermentation, like there is some arguments that like fermented foods can increase like a healthy gut biome or improve gut health.

SPEAKER_01 27:29

I don't much rather feed my birds like sprouts to like fully unlock the nutrition of feed, which I can actually like monitor the sprouts because I have had sprouts go moldy too, because I'm not like growing them properly and then I just have to throw them out. But like I think that's much easier to monitor versus just a wet pile of duck food.

SPEAKER_02 27:51

Would you eat the wet pile of duck food? Is the real question. No. Also, I wouldn't stinky. No, yeah, it's just it's it's it's far too it's like the I don't think the environment, you know what I feel? I feel the same way about fermented feet as I do about water glass tags. Could it work?

SPEAKER_00 28:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:11

Could it work? Sure. But should we do it? Nah.

SPEAKER_01 28:15

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:18

It's like it's botulism scares me. It's one of those things that one even on an even a factor that's outside your control could really, really have detrimental effects, and it's just never worth the risk, in my opinion. I think ever talked about it.

SPEAKER_01 28:36

And then it molds. Yep. Like that's that's a risk I'm not willing to take.

SPEAKER_02 28:40

And I feel like you'd be like 20 times worse in that direction if that was to happen. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 28:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:46

No, I don't recommend doing it. I don't think I kind of hate the push for it in the poultry keeping community. A lot of people have been driving people to do it, and I I'm not a fan. No, me neither.

SPEAKER_01 28:56

I actually I hear about it a lot more with chicken people. I never really hear duck people talk about it. That's why I was like, is it safer for chickens? But like, no. Why would you still gonna grow mold at the same rate? Basically if you do it wrong.

SPEAKER_02 29:07

If it's bad for a duck, it would kill a chicken 45 times. True. True. Like a duck is a tank. So like if it's if it's killing a duck, like the chickens died because you talked about it. Like you know what I mean. I feel like it, I don't think they're any more resistant to much of anything. Chickens are so dang fragile. So I would say avoid it.

SPEAKER_00 29:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 29:29

I think another if you're really looking to save money on your feed, say you want like a premium feed or like you want a better feed, but you're like worried about spending money, mix it with a lower budget feed. Like go to the go to your farm store, get a feed that's within your budget and cut your feed, have the higher nutrition feed as like a larger portion of their diet, and subsidize it with a lower budget feed if you need to save money. I think that's a far better way to go about saving money than to try to ferment and start a little lab experiment and potentially kill all your purpose.

SPEAKER_01 29:58

Or even just letting them free range longer.

SPEAKER_00 30:01

Yeah, 100%.

SPEAKER_01 30:02

Free ranging is a great option. So before we move on to our next question, today's episode is brought to you by Metzer Farms.

SPEAKER_02 30:08

I have the ultimate conversation about Metzer and their birds being healthy and strong. I have a call duck flock that is the start of my breeding project. So this is my very first group of breeders that I've ever kept for breeding. They are all Metzer Farms birds. They are call ducks, which is a notoriously bad breed when it comes to fertility and hatch rates. I just had a hatch of 100% fertility in every single egg in the dozen I sat in a hundred percent unassisted hatch rate from their call ducks. Incredible. And I told them Absolutely incredible. Absolutely incredible. I told them this morning when they commented on my post when I posted about having 100% fertility, 100% hatch rate. I'm like, this is your legwork. Like, this is you. You did this because I yeah, these are from your hatchery, and you guys have been working on these birds for as long as you have. And this is an attribute to show that they are truly doing exactly as they say and breeding in the direction of health and longevity in Calducks, which is very hard to come by. And so we both have Culducts from Metzer Farms. We love, love, love our Calducks from Metzer Farms.

SPEAKER_01 31:13

And we love their personalities and we love that they have so many different color options. I think they have six colors of Culducks that they offer, right? White, snowy, gray, penciled, blue, and black.

SPEAKER_02 31:22

Yep. And they're gorgeous birds, beautiful personalities. Most of the birds in my flock that you see that you love are Metzer Farms Calducks. But the outcomes that you saw me have in this hatch is such a great reason why Metzer Farms Caulds would be a wonderful start to your breeding projects. That's exactly how I started my breeding project. I ordered in from Metzer Farms, got a group for this year, and then I'm gonna pick out my favorites going into next year so that I could eventually get my breeding project to be exactly what I've always dreamed of and the birds that I want them to be. But Metzer Farms was the perfect start because they brought in so much health to my breeding project, which is so awesome. I love them so much. I also will be placing an order for Australian spotted ducks with Metzer Farms to do a second breeding project to help hopefully keep that breed around because they're a critically endangered breed. I think it's so cool that Metzger Farms offers them, and I'm so excited to start that breeding project. And it's awesome that they are doing the work that they're doing to keep Australian spotted available to us.

SPEAKER_01 32:21

It's honestly incredible because like there's so few breeders of Australian spotted ducks, and they're really a wonderful breed. They come in three different color varieties, they all look they all look different. They're all so cute. I have all three color varieties and I love them and I love their personalities. Kiwi is one of mine from Metzer Farms. And Kiwi's like the cutest duck in my vlog. Kiwi is the cutest duck in the world.

SPEAKER_02 32:43

I if I ever like leak, if you leak your address, I'm going to rob Kiwi in the middle of the night.

SPEAKER_01 32:48

I don't care if it ruins our friendship. I want Kiwi. Both love all of our ducks from Metzer Farms. I think my call decks have the best personalities, and Metser Farms is just incredible, and we're so grateful that they support our podcast.

SPEAKER_02 33:00

So my laptop is not making me finding questions easy, and my iPad has died, and my phone is my camera. So Chrissy is gonna take over all of the question seeking for us, unfortunately, because I don't have the tools.

SPEAKER_01 33:14

Well, hopefully I pick some good ones. This one, I feel like we've maybe touched on this a little bit before, but Connor asked, What are your thoughts on keeping exotics like mandarins, whistling ducks, teals, etc.?

SPEAKER_02 33:25

Can I change my opinion? Can I change my opinion? Like to surprise you. You can have whatever opinions you want. I don't like it for most people. Yeah. I love when the right people have exotics. Scott Nevin changed my mind on that because they talked about that's totally fair. The they talked about the Nene goose, and the only reason the Nene goose was able to be repopulated was because of small collections. And that was a huge reason that I started to feel differently on it. However, I don't think it should be something that's just available to the general public. Like I think there should be very strict regulations.

SPEAKER_01 34:09

Like heavily. I think you need to have an enclosure already finished before you even consider bringing them home. And that enclosure has to be the right kind of aviary for those birds. Like if you are getting diving ducks, like say a ruddy duck, I don't even know if you can legally keep those. Probably not. Maybe. I don't know. But say you're getting a ruddy duck, like they don't walk well on land, their legs are placed further back, they're meant to be diving ducks. The average person would think, oh, it's a duck, let me just get a little kidney pool. Like, that's not gonna cut it. If you are doing exotic birds, you have to do it the right way to do right by them. And that means spending a lot more money and doing a lot more research than you would have to do just to own domestic birds. Yeah. So I think for the average person, no. For the right person, yes.

SPEAKER_02 34:56

It genuinely has to be a passion for you. And I think that if you're gonna get into it, you have to have had a pre-existing passion for waterfowl that extended past I'm really excited to keep ducks. I think you need to like I wouldn't feel comfortable taking in exotics and I keep like 70 waterfowl on my property. Right. I don't feel comfortable. I don't I don't feel like I'm ready to take on the amount of work that an exotic.

SPEAKER_01 35:18

I don't feel like I have the setup for any of them.

SPEAKER_02 35:21

Out of the knowledge, I don't feel I don't feel like I have the knowledge.

SPEAKER_01 35:24

Yeah. So let me pull up another question. Davey asked, are call ducks always noisy?

SPEAKER_02 35:31

Yes, all the time. Yes and no.

SPEAKER_01 35:34

Like call ducks are very loud, especially females. The males are on the quieter side. But like my ducks don't just like scream all day. They take naps too. And then those are quiet periods.

SPEAKER_02 35:44

Mine scream all day. Mine scream in their sleep. They will lay with their nose in their feathers and scream. You have some interesting ducks. They're psycho. Mine, yours are much chiller than mine. Mine are psycho. They are like just out of everything. Mine are savages. They they literally are so awful. But also, you gotta think about the fact that I have multiple duck flocks, so they're all talking to each other. So, like the big ducks, oh, the worst is you know, they're alert when they alert. Yeah. I hate, I get so mad at my big ducks when they alert because if they do it, the calls are gonna do it for the next four hours. And so my big ducks will be like, there's a squirrel. And then my call ducks are like for the for the rest of the day. And I can hear it from inside my house, and I'm like, oh my god. And so yeah, I think the lights start.

SPEAKER_01 36:33

I don't think mine are nearly that bad, but maybe I'm just like tone deaf to their their calling. Because I really like they call and like loudly every time I walk outside because they know me and they're like, Mom's here. Um and they will call if they see like a deer or my neighbor walking their dog or a leaf falling. But generally, I don't hear them.

SPEAKER_02 36:54

Yeah, mine are all talking to each other, so I feel like that's part of the problem. That's probably why mine are so loud. But also every once in a while, they'll be silent. Like none of them are going off. Like I'll walk outside and everybody's quiet. And I go quack, quack, because I'm like worried that something's wrong. And then they all go and they all start popping off. And I'm like, okay, there they are. Because it's like weird for them to be quiet. Like it makes me worried. So mine are really, really loud, but it also might have to do with the fact that they're they have a giant, there's a lot of birds chatting around here. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:24

So I wish we could answer all of these questions because there's so many good ones. And I'm just trying to pick as many as I possibly can. So Cheyenne asked, How do you house different breeds of ducks together? And when do you know to separate them? Runners with peacings, call ducks with call ducks only, runners with calls if they're only female. My take on this is generally bantoms with bantoms, standard or large fowl ducks with standard or large fowl ducks. The only thing that I would say to keep in mind is you don't want a heavyweight drake and a lightweight female. I would try to keep your drakes on the smaller side so the size different isn't huge. I think if all of your birds are females, you don't really have to worry about much of this at all. But I do prefer keeping bantams and large fowls.

SPEAKER_02 38:10

I have a weird take on this from experience. I actually like keeping heavier weight drakes with lightweight females. I do. Because because they're slower. They can't catch up. I would feel differently if I didn't have a large pond. My my they run to the pond, they're always they always pretty much breed in the pond. We're really, it doesn't matter the weight, the size difference nearly as much if they're on water because we don't have those leg concerns that we get into when it comes to breeding on land. But yeah, I my heavyweight drakes are so slow and fat. So when they sprint after a girl, they get they get tired, man. My lightweight drakes are the problem. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_01 38:43

So if I when I picture size differences, I'm always picturing like back when I was in middle school, I had khaki cambels and calls together, and I obviously had to separate them, but the khaki cambell drakes were horrendous to the callbook pens. And like size difference wise, if we're talking about like a Rowan Drake and say a Welsh Harlequin hen, it's like that's a pretty big size difference, too. But that is a very good point. They're just depends on what type of just slow.

SPEAKER_02 39:08

It depends what type of Rowan, because like the size difference between a utility Rowan and a Walsh Harlequin is not that vast. If you're talking about like a standard bread or like exhibition Rowans, then yeah, like that's that's big. You know, those are those are bigger words. Jumbo Pekin, it's not catching them, it's just not. Like, I don't think it is. That's my take on it. I mean, I think honestly, you know who's my worst strike right now? This is funny. My Bantam.

SPEAKER_01 39:38

I was gonna say, is it um it's not General Sal. What's his name? Waqin. The Mallard is a good one.

SPEAKER_02 39:43

My Mallard he's my problem and he's the overbreeder this year, so he is the problem child. Everybody's legs are great, but yeah, he's good. He's annoying the crap out of everybody up there. So um that's my take on it. I think you have to test out your Drakes and make sure that you're having the same experience if you go down that route. I think what Chrissy said still applies. This is just based off my experience. That's what I've found has worked with my drakes. I actually have held on to my heavy boys. General Sow has almost been rehomed like 85 times.

SPEAKER_01 40:14

He's a khaki Campbell, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 40:16

I hate how fast they are because they always catch the hens. That's what drives me mad about it. They always and they they have so much energy because they don't have that weight driving them back, so they don't give up. So yeah, he's still here though. He's getting old now, and so he's being a better boy. But for a while he was my yeah, I had the worst years of my duck keeping life with General Sal.

SPEAKER_01 40:35

Yeah. Well, we're glad he's getting older and calmer now. But our next question, our next question was sent in from Aria, and she asked, if I have a fully enclosed and predator-protected run, do they still need to be put back in the coop at night or can they free roam in their secure spaces 24-7? I always put mine in the coop at night. I think it keeps them quieter, which like it's not just about them being quiet, but I think them being noisy at night when nocturnal predators are lurking would be not great. I also don't want the ducks to see predators at night because I think it would stress them out immensely if like they're out there swimming in their pond, having a party all night, because that's what they would do. And like the fox goes walking by and the fox is facing the pence. Look facing the pants. The fox is facing the fence and looking at them, that's gonna freak them out and stress them way out. So I think they're safer in the coop and happier.

SPEAKER_02 41:33

I think out of sight, out of mind is my rule. Yeah, a predator is a thousand times more driven when you put food in front of its face when it can see it. Yeah. So you want to shut them somewhere where they're not visible. That's my take. The other thing that I think is everything we have is only ever predator resistant, it's never predator-proof. And if you give a predator an overnight opportunity, I think it can make it through anything if it really wants to. I always shut mine in the coop. I will say the only benefit of a secure run is I'm always home at 30 minutes before the sun sets, every single day of my entire life, because of my free range birds. They will never be out past dark, except the other day. Walkin is a little jerkbag, and Didi and me were laying in bed, and it was just getting dark outside because we go to bed at eight. So it wasn't really that, it wasn't really that dark outside. This wasn't nearly as big of a deal as I made it out to be to my husband. I almost divorced him. And he had put everybody away for the night, and Watkin is a little jerkbag and just likes to not go to bed when he knows he's supposed to. Like he he acknowledges you, but he likes to just sit in the pond.

SPEAKER_01 42:34

He's just like Blackberry.

SPEAKER_02 42:36

Yeah, he's like, I'm in here though. Like he's like a he's like a little snotty little kid. And so we know that Watkin does this. And so me and Didi got into bed and we're laying there, and he goes, I feel like I missed a duck tonight. And I was like, Did you? And then he was like, No, I don't think so. And so I was like, I couldn't, I couldn't handle that. So I went out to check and Watkin's standing at the door, like, I'm out here. And so I opened the door and I shoot him and I was like, You little jerk. So I'm home every night for those birds, but when it comes to having a predator-proof enclosure, like I predator-resistant enclosure, like I do for my calls or my chickens or my smaller birds, I don't panic about leaving them in there if I'm gonna get home late. So, like, say I I knew I was gonna get home a little bit after dark, I would still put them away when I got home, but I would be like, all right, we're running late, we're running late. Does that make sense? Like, if I didn't have the free range flock, I wouldn't have a meltdown. Or like, I also wouldn't have a meltdown if I woke up the next morning and there was a bird in there. One time popcorn did that. I went into the coop and I was greeted to popcorn at my feet because she slept in a bush and Didi didn't see her when he put them away. And so I was like, I I wasn't I wasn't worried if that makes sense. I was like, oh whatever.

SPEAKER_01 43:50

Yeah. I also have one duck that always tries to avoid bed, but it's Blackberry, and she's Duck Dad's little princess, so she can do no wrong. And he's always like, She just wants to be carried to. Bed and I'm like, she doesn't want to go to bed at all. She's trying to hide and blend in with the darkness so she can avoid bed. She's spoiled. She is. Duckdad really spoils her. He loves that duck.

SPEAKER_02 44:12

My my duck dad has his handful of ducks that are treated like royalty. Actually, his right now, ironically, isn't one of this the designated DD ducks. It's uh Apple Cider, my silver appleyard. That is his baby. I actually got him the Metzer t-shirt with the silver apple yard on it, and he ran outside to show her. He was like, look before that I would never own another silver apple yard because I do think they're really big birds, and I just think they're too big. I worry about them a little bit. But I love, I have to say, I love their personality. I really love that bird. And now that Dee Dee is so emotionally attached to silver apple yards, I already know that if that one ever goes, I'll get Dee Dee another silver apple yard. So I think we will now always have a silver apple yard, regardless of how I feel about them, just because I love, love, love their personality. And Dee Dee loves them with his entire heart. They're also like very pretty birds. They're gorgeous birds. Oh my gosh, it's like the prettiest bird I think I've ever owned. It's like golden. The thing is like, it's like a golden lace look. Oh, it's beautiful. It's one of the most stunning in-person birds I've ever seen. Like where I genuinely like pictures do not do it justice. It's an incredibly beautiful bird.

SPEAKER_01 45:24

They're wonderful. Our next question. Katie asked, What style hardware cloth is the best bang for your buck and where do you buy it? And I have, I'm this might be a hot take. If you want the best hardware cloth that's the best bang for your buck, buy the cheap hardware cloth. If you want the hardware cloth that's going to protect your birds, PVC coated 16 gauge.

SPEAKER_02 45:48

It's so hard to find though. That's the hardest thing about the 16 gauge. It's really hard to find. I use doubled up 19 gauge.

SPEAKER_01 45:55

So I think that the most the easiest thing you can buy is like PVC coated 19 gauge quarter-inch hardware cloth off of Amazon. I had to get my half-inch 16 gauge wire from an actual like fencing company in the city. I had to drive my little Toyota Corolla into New York City, into like the gates of I thought I was gonna get murdered. It was an experience. And then like the rolls are like four feet long. I have to like put the seats down the back of the car to fit them in there. It was really something. But I was like Chrissy's determination for her birds, I swear. I was determined to get the best hardware cloth that I could. That is the best. But and then my reasoning for the PVC coated hardware cloth, it's not because it's black and that makes it easier for you to see their birds, although that is a benefit. That's not why I like it. I like it because the regular standard galvanized hardware cloth can leach zinc into the ground and give your birds zinc poisoning. Is it automatically going to happen? No. But is it a possibility? Yes, and I don't like that, so that's why I go with PVC coated.

SPEAKER_02 47:02

It's smart. I recently started using PVC coated for the first time. I've used galvanized the whole time. My birds don't have zinc poisoning, but does that mean it could have happened? No. Do a lot of people use it and don't have zinc poisoning? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 47:13

Yeah. So interestingly, I don't I I don't know, and I'll never know the answer to this, but I had been using the regular galvanized hardware cloth when the ducks were living at Duck Dad's parents' house. And pumpkin would have these little spells where she would like not function. And I'm like very I think it was zinc poisoning. But the thing about zinc poisoning is that they just like you can't you can't fix that. They just like have that kind of forever. There's not like a there's nothing I could do. So I was sus and of course she would never like like they were quick, weird little spells where she like couldn't walk. And she would never, of course, never do it like on camera or she she had that appointment. Was it like what Napoleon's doing? No. Pumpkins was always super random. And the one thing about pumpkin was that pumpkin was always a very mischievous little duck, especially in her younger years, and she was always digging for worms at the side of the fence. So it would get like really muddy there, and she was always digging for worms there, and I think that's how she got more zinc than the rest of the ducks. And then interestingly, ever since moving here and leaving that environment, she's never done that again. So that's like, I think it was zinc poisoning. I don't know. Don't quote me on that. She's fine now, it's just very bizarre. Maybe peanut has zinc poisoning, and that's why she's so slow. Some people have also actually gotten zinc poisoning like with their ducks from using galvanized like stock tanks for them as a pool. Really? I think it was I think it was actually a rescue that I followed that had that that issue, and it's uh frustrating. Any kind of metal metal poisoning sucks, but I'm gonna try and not get off topic.

SPEAKER_02 48:58

Yeah, I don't have never used a metal stock tank, but a lot of people use them, so that's surprising.

SPEAKER_01 49:04

Yeah. I think like again, I had at the time I probably had like a dozen or so ducks, and like pumpkin was the only one acting like that. So like I think the chances of it happening are low. I just I don't like taking risks.

SPEAKER_02 49:15

Okay, no, that makes sense. I if I could change it all now, realistically, my hardware cloth is in the ground. She is in there. Yeah. If I could change it all now and do a PVC coated, sure, I probably would. I've started using the PVC coated as of this year. I don't have the 16 gauge because I don't, I don't, I it's hard because it's so hard to get. I use the 19 gauge half inch hardware cloth. I don't actually use the quarter inch, but that's mainly because the minute you get to the quarter inch, it all becomes 24 gauge, and then you can't get that. So I use the half inch as and I double it in all low points of the enclosure. So like the half the top half is just one sheet, and then the bottom half is two sheets overlapping, which really kind of turns it into half-inch hardware cloth realistically.

SPEAKER_01 49:58

And the thing is, half inch, the only thing getting through half-inch hardware cloth is mice. And well, I don't nobody wants mice, but half inch should be just fine. I have mine also double layered, so it's this the half inch on the outside and the quarter inch on the inside.

SPEAKER_02 50:15

Half inch for anybody curious, half inch is safe and trustable for there's so there's a difference between daytime and nighttime security. In my opinion, honestly, 19 gauge half inch hardware cloth is safe for daytime security, period. You're good. Does that make sense? Overnight security, especially if you have an open air style coop or your birds are visible to a predator. I would want, I would, I would not be willing to just trust a sheet of 19 gauge hardware cloth in that setting.

SPEAKER_01 50:43

I double up all windows. Yeah. There's there's one other thing that I now also want to add as far as that question goes. When we talk about gauge, that actually matters a lot because some people just say in order to predator proof or predator make your coop predator resistant, you need to use hardware cloth, and not all hardware cloth is created equally. If you can cut your hardware cloth with a regular pair of kitchen scissors, any animal's claws can also rip that thing apart. That's why you want a thicker gauge. We say like 19 gauge minimum. Gauge actually works the opposite way that you would think. So you want like 19 or a lower number because something like 24 gauge is like so thin, you can cut it with kitchen scissors, which is not going to protect your birds.

SPEAKER_02 51:25

Yeah. I actually have the wrong, I have the wrong hardware cloth because I tried to get 16 gauge and I tried to switch to that. Or not 16 gauge, I tried to get 24 gauge. No, what the fuck am I saying? Okay. I have the wrong hardware cloth on the top half of the pond deck in the main pen because I tried to get the quarter inch hardware cloth and it came in too small of a gauge, and I didn't notice when I bought it, and I didn't notice when I was putting it up, and then the other day I noticed. And I was like, it doesn't matter because the bottom half is still good. It's still the 16 gauge on the bottom half, but I'm still gonna rewrap that top half one day when I have time because I was like, this is not the it's so complicated to find like the the perfect hardware cloth because it's like this one's the right gauge, this one's PVC coated, this one's the right number of inches.

SPEAKER_01 52:13

Like it's just it's it's annoying. I get I just buy it on Amazon when I'm getting rolls because the rolls at like Home Depot and Lowe's are so much more expensive for so much less. I think the Vivo sells some. Our next question is from Josephine, and they asked, How do you get your ducks to come in at night? Reke a power. I chase them with the rake. I'm not kidding. That's what I do. I use the pool skimmer, and actually, if I walk in there and I say go to bed, they will start going to bed. But like, particularly Blackberry will like purposely be so slow. So if I just go behind her with the pond pool skimmer, you don't even have to actually like I've never had to touch a duck with the pool skimmer. You just put it behind them and they like go where they want to go.

SPEAKER_02 52:53

And then like my chickens, your chickens put themselves in, right?

SPEAKER_01 52:56

Yeah, well, so if the chickens put themselves to bed, but if they're like out free ranging, um, and I need to get them in, I literally just stick my arms out and I'm like, I'm a big bird. Go to the coupon. They uh they go in.

SPEAKER_02 53:07

My walk-in, my little jerk bag that lives in my standard walk, he won't get out of the pond every night. It's the most annoying thing in the world. And so what we have to do is we have to take the rake and just splash the water until he finally because your pond is so big, like my pond is so so we have to splash water at him until he gets out. We yell at him the whole time. So it's like an integral part of my night. Because Didi is usually the nighttime, like he closes everything up, and I always hear him, come on, get out and like hitting the pond with the rake. So that's how I do it. I just chase him in with the rake. If we're like saying so, because sometimes if we're like standing outside and we're gonna be standing outside, I don't like rush necessarily to beat the sunset because like if a predator shows up and tries to get through me, like, good luck, buddy, I will lay my life down for these birds. And so, like, sometimes it'll be like getting dark if we're like home and sitting outside, so we're like just moseying through the chores. And if I do that, they will put themselves to bed. Like, I'll go and I'll see they're all like already in there.

SPEAKER_01 54:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 54:11

But usually we put them away well before it's at the point where like the sun's actually setting, so that doesn't happen.

SPEAKER_01 54:16

Yeah. You want to know something real funny? Hmm. Sugar. Sugar always goes to bed at dusk. Good girl. And she will make other ducks go to bed with her. So generally, sugar goes into bed and then she will scream for Mr. Whip to come with her. And now she's also taught Bubbles that when it gets dark, you need to go to bed. And it's kind of funny because she used to be able to get a lot more ducks in bed, like during the winter when they're all together. But now that it's breeding season and she's like separated, she can only get Mr. Whip and Bubbles into bed. But like it was kind of nice having her because she she straight up yells at them, like to come to bed. And they will listen to her. That's so funny.

SPEAKER_02 54:53

Sugar is their leader. I love sugar, their spiritless leader. I think we have time. Do you want to do one more?

SPEAKER_01 54:58

Yeah. All right. Our last question. How am I gonna pick the last question? All right. I think you did you do sand in your chicken coop? I have sand in my chicken coop. Okay. And then I'm gonna ask this question. Katrina asked, I saw where a lady who has chickens did a type of sand in her chicken coop and it looks so easy to clean. Can you do this with ducks? I don't think so. Chicken poop is siftable. I have chicken sand in my coop for my chickens. It's siftable, it's great. Love it. I did use some sort of sand that I got at Lowe's uh many, many years ago in my duck pen, and they just made a mess of it. It got caked into like a solid sheet of duck poop sand mixture, and they would track it on their feet and bring it into the pond, and then the pond would get so messy, it was horrible. Do not recommend.

SPEAKER_02 55:45

Yeah, I don't I don't use it because I s I just kind of guessed that that's what would happen because if you've ever poured water on sand at the beach, it just gets nasty. And so, like, that's what I expected would happen, so I've never even considered trying it.

unknown 56:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 56:00

Duck poop is too watery and it's just not a good idea.

SPEAKER_02 56:04

It works great for chickens though, but yeah, not not for ducks.

SPEAKER_01 56:08

Thank you guys so much for joining us for this episode. We had so much fun getting to answer your questions. I would love to do more of these episodes in the future. If you like this kind of episode, please let us know. We would love to hear your feedback. Um, and hopefully you guys like it, and we could do more episodes like this in the future.

SPEAKER_02 56:24

If we didn't get to your question today, please keep leaving your questions. Like, don't feel annoying adding your questions on future posts. Because I think we should do more episodes like this just because it's the busy season for me and Chrissy, which is why it's been hard for us to keep up getting out the weekly episodes that we've usually been doing. It's we're we're both booked. We have so many animals, our animals are doing a million things. It's breeding season, everybody's laying eggs, everybody's having babies.

SPEAKER_01 56:47

It's it's trying to improve things season because it's warm outside. Like so we have this so much going on.

SPEAKER_02 56:54

This kind of episode is really easy for us to jump just do. Um, and it keeps the conversation going and it keeps us interacting with you guys, which we love. So please keep leaving your questions, even if we didn't get to them, ask them again, and we will get to them eventually because this is so much fun. I love this style of episode.

SPEAKER_01 57:10

So, one thing before we go, just a reminder that we we have merch. This is our little duck ladies podcast mug. And then from you have your crazy duck lady mug. I'm wearing my beep beep shirt from my merch line. And when you purchase things from our merch shop, it helps us keep going and keep creating great content for you and keep educating people about pet ducks and just having fun conversations like this. So we really appreciate your support. And if you have a moment, please feel free to leave us a review on your favorite place to listen to the podcast. And we'll see you next week. See you next week. That's all we got for this one. Bye, guys.