Fired In Montreal- Betting on Made In Canada!

What happens when two guys sit down and just start talking about pickleball?

In this episode of Kitchen Conversations, Mike sits down with David for a raw, wide-ranging conversation that goes far beyond the court. What starts as a simple chat quickly turns into something much deeper. From growing up in Montreal to navigating a winding career path, David’s story is anything but linear. Then one day, like it does for so many, the game found him. And everything changed.

You’ll hear how David discovered pickleball, why it hooked him almost instantly, and how that moment eventually led him to build Pickleball Authority Canada from the ground up. But this conversation doesn’t stop there. David also opens up about a bold decision he’s made as a business owner, choosing to support Canadian manufacturers only. In a space dominated by massive global brands, he’s doubling down on local, backing Canadian-made paddles and products, and putting his values ahead of convenience.

Along the way, the conversation weaves through the growth of facilities like Kingston Racquet Centre, the early days before the boom, and what it really looks like behind the scenes of a game that’s exploding.

But this isn’t an interview. It’s two people sitting down, telling stories, challenging ideas, and getting honest about what matters and what doesn’t in pickleball. 🔥

In this episode:

• How David found the game and why it stuck
• The early days before pickleball took off
• The real story behind Pickleball Authority Canada
• Why he made the decision to support Canadian manufacturers only
• Why most players are focused on the wrong things
• What actually matters if you want to get better

🔗 Connect and learn more:

👉 Kingston Racquet Centre
https://tennisclubs.ca/kingston-book-a-court/ 
👉 Pickleball Authority Canada https://pickleballauthority.ca 

📌 If you’re here for real conversations and the stories behind the game, subscribe and follow along. #Pickleball #KitchenConversations #PickleballCanada #SupportLocal #CanadianMade #BehindThePaddle #KingstonOntario #PickleballAuthority #RacquetSports #Podcast

And that wraps up this episode of Kitchen Conversations.

If you enjoyed the conversation, be sure to follow the show, leave a review, and share it with someone who loves the game as much as you do.

And if you want the full experience, including the visuals, head over to YouTube and watch the episode at

https://www.youtube.com/@KitchenConversationspodcast

Or search Kitchen Conversations Pickleball Podcast

That’s where these stories really come to life.

You’ll also find links and show notes in the episode description.

Until next time…

more than dinks, drops and drives…

these are stories from behind the paddle.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Hey, welcome to the podcast. I'm sorry. It's an hour and 17 minutes long. And for that, I apologize. And I get that's long. I get that it's too long. So for that, I'm sorry. But the original conversation when we sat down was over an hour and a half. I did my best to edit out a few minutes here and there, tried to buy some time back, but it ultimately landed at an hour and 17. So for that I apologize. But this person, his name, his presence, his involvement, and his contribution to the local pickleball community here in Kingston, Ontario simply deserved that amount of time. He has a super dry sense of humor. In fact, that's probably what he's best known for. He's an okay pickleball player, but he certainly is a great jokester. And I think you're going to love this conversation. He came at me immediately out of the gate, but I was ready for him. I knew it was coming, and I think I had a good comeback. I hope you enjoy this conversation with Kingston Racket Center's David Boussier on today's edition of Kitchen Conversations.

SPEAKER_02 0:56

People talk a lot, okay? People come in and they say, I'm gonna do this, I'm gonna do that. And it's about a, I believe it's about a 5% um execution rate.

SPEAKER_00 1:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:07

So to be here this quickly after you uh started the conversation and to see how beautiful this studio is and what you've done all on your own just using YouTube, apparently. I can't believe that. Yeah, uh, good for you. The only other thing I'd say it was a pleasure meeting your mother. And uh even though you live in the basement with your mom and you said it's to take care of her, yeah. I mean, you know what? That's very, very nice. Yeah, and I'm gonna go with that.

SPEAKER_00 1:31

It's all about the inheritance. Like, I don't really care about her, I just want her money. So if I I I figure if I'm if I'm good to her at this point, maybe that'll work out. Because I do have a brother and I think I'm in competition for that. So appreciate you mentioning mom because and she's usually not sober by this time of the day. So it's a real real treat that you got to meet her for sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:49

So just to preface this for anybody who has to listen to this or or randomly decides to listen, um, you'll find out that I have ADHD and uh and a very dry sense of humor. So if you don't mind keeping me on the on the track. Um so basically grew up in Montreal, Anglophone, uh many years ago. And let's see here. Uh reason why I ended up in Ontario. So what happened was I actually I still consider myself uh Montrealer. Uh I'm the most francophone person in my family. Uh and even when my my dad, who uh stayed his whole life in Montreal, uh I was still cons I I still am the one that can speak the most French. Um and I love the culture of Quebec and the French music and and everything. And anytime people come into the Dome or anytime I come into contact with anybody francophone, you know, I'm definitely trying to speak French because I don't want to lose it. Um however, um things got as you know, I mean, in the 70s and in the 80s and the 90s, and even to this day, there are political issues in Quebec. Uh so I I actually went through two referendums in my life. Um the first one I was uh I don't know how old it was. I think that was, I can't even remember what year that was, but uh maybe 1980 or something. But um and I was involved, you know, uh politically, we were you know putting flyers for the no side, of course. And uh eventually, uh fast forward, I'm working at Radio Shack, if you remember reading. Yeah, there's a name from the past, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:25

Blast from the past.

SPEAKER_02 3:26

You may have actually purchased equipment for this at one time if Radio Shack still existed. Yeah, um, so I'm working at Radio Shack in 1995, and by the way, I've had about 60 jobs. Okay. Okay, so like there's some kind of an issue. Well, let's talk about all 60. All of those bosses.

SPEAKER_00 3:44

That's great.

SPEAKER_02 3:45

But anyway, so I'm working at Radio Shack, right? There's a referendum coming up. Um, a buddy of mine actually was having brain surgery, my best friend Jamie, was having brain surgery the day of the referendum.

unknown 3:58

Wow.

SPEAKER_02 3:58

So he went in, it was like a 10-hour surgery, you gotta stay awake because they, you know, move your fingers, etc. So he went in at in Canada and he didn't know when he was coming out if it was gonna be Canada or Quebec. But anyway, um, so yeah, so the the referendum happens, it's so close. I'm like, oh my goodness, this is crazy.

SPEAKER_00 4:17

That was tight.

SPEAKER_02 4:18

And uh, you know, now at that point I am fairly bilingual, you know, to speak and to serve customers and all that stuff. But eventually I'm like, oh boy, you know, this is kind of getting scary. Um and then I think the clincher for me deciding to leave and go to Ontario was getting fired in French and not understanding what was happening with uh with the district manager. Right, right. Uh who only spoke French. Okay. So I actually asked him, I said, Listen, you know, uh, can I just ask you an English a question in English? And he said, sure. And I said, uh, are you firing me? And he said, Yes, I am. And I said, Okay, okay. So by the way, just for anybody out there, if you're um, if you ever hear the word congédier, that means fired in French.

SPEAKER_00 5:01

That's not a good day. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 5:03

You know, it depends on the job.

SPEAKER_00 5:07

Fair point.

SPEAKER_02 5:08

So I said, okay, perfect. So um, yeah, delivered Chinese food under the table while I was getting the unemployment insurance for a few months. That's long enough now, I believe that they can't come after me. Uh then um had an uncle who worked for Southam Publishing. I don't know if you remember Southam, Conrad Black. Yeah, absolutely. Famous Canadian.

SPEAKER_01 5:26

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:26

And uh that was in Toronto. He had a buddy who was able to get me a small like entry-level position in Toronto. Okay. So I got to move to Toronto. At that point, my uh my mom and stepdad had already moved to Oakville. Um, so like they were with CTV and CBC, they were in broadcasting, actually. Right. Uh so anyway, so I had a place to stay uh when I actually got to uh to Toronto and yeah, I started working as a business-to-business collector in Toronto at the same time. I'm this will end eventually, I promise.

SPEAKER_00 6:00

No, keep going. I love it.

SPEAKER_02 6:01

The podcast might just end with this question. That's good.

SPEAKER_00 6:03

We got all day.

SPEAKER_02 6:04

Uh Howard Stern came to Canada at that time. So that would have been around 1996. Yeah. And we had Q107 there, and uh I think before uh Stern it was uh John Deringer. Sure, Deringer in the morning. Now disgraced, but well that happens, yeah, exactly. Uh anyway, so I'm listening to Howard Stern. I'm collecting money in between calls from businesses and whatever at a desk and enjoying like I didn't think I'd like Howard Stern, but I'm actually you know captivated, not agreeing with like half the stuff he says, but it was quite entertaining. Yeah, so then I did I'd always wanted to go into radio, and so eventually I decide that you know, within three, four years, whatever, um, I ended up at Belleville Loyalist College. Uh studied radio, did a fast track, and then from there, um I met somebody that came to talk to our class. We've talked about that from a radio station in Kingston. Kingston, when you're in Belleville, which is if anybody's uh not familiar with this part of uh Canada, Belleville is probably like 60,000 people, and uh Kingston is the big city, it's like 130,000 people. Yeah. So if you can do radio in Kingston, it's bit you know, it's a good place to start. So I got a job right out of the gate uh before I didn't even go to my grad at Loyalist College, which was okay because I was 33 years old. So sure.

SPEAKER_00 7:23

You were trying to move on, trying to get on with your mom's basement.

SPEAKER_02 7:27

That's correct. And so here I am. And uh at the time my uh first wife worked for KGH as a critical care nurse. So I mean it all worked out, you know.

SPEAKER_00 7:35

So so we didn't really finish the thought, I don't think, about so you end up in Kingston, yeah, you're doing all of that. How how does that ultimately lead to pickleball? Yeah, did you find it? Did it find you? And I'm I'm intrigued by that moment.

SPEAKER_02 7:48

Yeah, I was uh I so I played badminton for most of my life. Okay. Uh hockey, baseball, badminton, those were my primary sports. Sure. And um yeah, so basically I was just playing at uh if you've heard of if you're a Kingston person, you've heard of Beach Grove. Uh it's now not a gym anymore to play sports, but we were playing uh badminton, and a gentleman came up to me and uh said, Hey, can you play uh pickleball tonight? And of course, didn't know what that was, never heard of it. And uh yeah, so I came out, came out with my wife. Um we were hitting balls back and forth, had no idea what was going on. But I mean, the cool thing about pickleball and the reason one of the main reasons it's so uh popular and it caught on so quickly, as I always tell people in their first new player lesson, is if you're going to start a sport, okay, we can look at Padell and we can look at pickleball.

SPEAKER_01 8:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 8:44

Um Padell, I think it costs a quarter of a million dollars to build a court. Yeah. Okay. Um pickleball, they just steal a badminton court. Pickleball goes to a tennis court outside in the middle of the night when nobody's looking under the cover of darkness, of course, with uh some tape, painter's tape, and they all of a sudden have four pickleball courts on a tennis court. So anyway, it was a babington court um and played. And after about 10 minutes, the gentleman who was uh leading us in uh playing uh asked my wife, he said, you know, come over here, and he brought her over to a wall, and she he said, just hit against the wall, and then we carried on. And I was okay with that for about 10 minutes, five minutes, 10 minutes, and then I was like, Man, this this is uncomfortable. Sure. Um, just because he wanted to have a challenging game. So end result is uh my wife actually uh became quite a great player, and she's very competitive, she's very fit, you know, opposites attract.

SPEAKER_00 9:41

Um anyway, your words not mine, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:44

And uh everything worked out okay, but uh so yeah, that's how I came to it. And then uh yeah, I mean, went to the at that time, it was very, very difficult. I mean, this is I'm talking 2013, you know, um, to find a place to play. Yeah, and so we went to the YMCA and they had pickleball, I think, every Sunday or something like that in the afternoon. Sure. Met another gentleman named Victor, who is um he's one of my best friends forever and uh an amazing human being. And uh we were both passionate about it, and then we just started uh playing together and getting competitive and so on. In the club, um, I could teach higher level, I believe. Um, you know, I've done okay in tournaments, and I I think I understand the game at a decent level. Um, and Nadal could never Nadal's coach could never beat Nadal, just so you know. So, like if you're a great player and you're just like, I could beat David in two seconds, I could still teach you something. Doesn't mean I'll beat you, but I might notice something. But anyway, backing up. Um, so I like to teach all of the new players. Okay, so when I got this job, um, you know, that was the one area I was like, you know what, I just want to do the new player lessons. I want every single player when they first come to the dome and they learn that very first time. Um, I just want to chat with them and kind of give them my like I just want to, I guess, shape their first visit. And uh so that and that's what I do. And I try to, you know, keep like I say, I want to be encouraging and the people that come, okay, many, many times it's just one person. Uh sometimes it's two people that are uh a couple, um, but it's brave, especially the older you get to try something you're you've never done before, and a lot of these people have never played a racket sport, uh, or they haven't played something in like 30 years because they've just kind of wrapped up a career, or they have a bit more time. Uh, sometimes very young people. I have a a gentleman right now uh in a lesson, he's I think he's like 12 or 13, he just loves pickleball. Wow, but anyway, um, so yeah, so I firstly would say to these people, I'd say, listen, you guys are brave. Thank you for coming. Because you know, it's it's not easy to do something new and it's uncomfortable, and uh so it takes a little bit of uh brevity to try something and then and then be patient and get better and so on. And if they are willing to do that, um then we get going. Um there's no anxiety, I don't believe, because we try to like do it nice and easy, joking around, encouraging. Um, there's different things like if somebody doesn't know how to serve right away, there's little things we can do to make it so much easier, and like you basically just want to make everybody feel successful and be successful. So when we do a new player lesson, another reason why I like to do them is uh it's my belief the quicker you can get people actually playing a game, and it's ugly. Oh, yeah, you know, but it doesn't matter, just get them playing. So if it's an we do 90 minute new player lessons, and I'm my goal is like 40 minutes by 40 minutes in, we're playing a game. And like, and then I'm praying, as I'm you know, kind of at the net in the middle, just watching things go back and forth. Um, I'm praying, and I'm not religious, that we'll see a rally of more than like um two shots, you know. Um, so yeah, and then I just like watch them and I want them to have a great experience, and I want them to have fun and have the like the adrenaline start flowing when it goes back and forth and all that kind of stuff. And uh yeah, and then what's great is so most of the time uh people sign up just for one lesson, okay? Okay, uh, but we really prefer they do three, and even three is very, very basic. But um, so anyway, so 90% of the people sign up for one 90-minute lesson. Right. And then what we do, it's kind of a loss leader, and uh, and then my goal is let's say if I have eight people doing one lesson, where how many people are we gonna convert to do two more lessons? Okay, some people sign up for the three right out of the gate. Um, and so at the end of the lesson, and I say, Okay, guys, you know, um, it was so nice meeting you. If you guys have any questions, whatever. And then as well, I follow up email them and everything, just because you know, when you're teaching people, it's a lot of talk. And yeah, so I tell them, you know, look, don't worry about listening. Uh you're gonna get an email and uh you can just look at it at your leisure. But anyway, I would say like 70, 80 percent of these people say, you know what, let's do two more lessons. So that way um it's good for them because the other side of that is you know what, not everybody's gonna like it. Um, but at least if they give it 90 minutes, they give it a a try and just see if they like it, then great. And maybe I wasn't the best coach for them, you know, you know how it is. Um, you know, not everybody learns the same way, and I'm that way. Sure. So at the end of the day, um, yeah, just like making sure that people uh are exposed to it and play quickly because, like you said, playing is is the thing. And then after that, like in the second, third lessons, then you can go back, okay, let's work on the serve. Let's let's take our time and and let's do this, and you can help them with all of the fundamentals. You still get to play in the second and third lesson, but uh those people are actually hooked to a certain degree, and then you can just go ahead and slow down and go, okay, guys, you guys know this is fun. Now let's do shot selection strategy and positioning. Sure.

SPEAKER_00 14:58

Yeah, it's uh it's such a moment, David. And and uh, you know, when I've been there and I've seen you come off the court and you've had a lesson with some beginners or new players, it's interesting for me as I step into my game to watch a few of them linger. It's interesting because I see them in the background and they've just come off the court with you. They've they've maybe hit the pickleball for the first time in their life, but they've they're they they're so interested, they're just now they're watching. And uh, and I did a lot of watching in my first couple of years. Like I would literally just go in and just sit and watch players, better players, and and and try to get a sense of their court management and how they set up the shots. And, you know, I learn better watching than doing. I find when I start doing, my brain takes over and I get back into all my old habits. But if I can sit back on the sidelines and watch a better game, you know, a game where I, you know, maybe would like to level up into. Uh so it's really encouraging for me to see the beginners wanting to linger every so often. They they might stay for 10 or 12 minutes, they're not there for the for the next game, but uh, they're trying to take it in, they're trying to absorb it. And they have a deeper appreciation now when they do watch a higher level game and how we're moving the ball around, or the more experienced players are moving the ball around versus what they just did. And I think for some of them, they say, wow, I can get there. But you know, on that note, if there's another thing to love about the game, there's so much to love about it, I think it's a fact that it doesn't really matter. And you can plug into this at whatever level you're comfortable with. You can find your tribe, find your group, and go out and have two hours of the best time of your life. Let's let's jump right into pickleball authority because it's on the list today of things I really want to talk to you about. It's a great time to do that. So thanks for that. It's um tell me about it. When did it start and uh how much of your day is it taking up? And if you don't mind, and maybe this is not public knowledge yet, and perhaps you don't want to share this, but you did mention uh, I think a terrific decision that you've made as far as the manufacturers that you're supporting. So give me some backstory on pickleball authority, and and um, you know, we'll certainly leave contact points in the show notes at the end of all of this, but I'd love for you to expand on that for me.

SPEAKER_02 16:50

So I mentioned a gentleman earlier named Victor.

SPEAKER_00 16:53

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 16:53

Uh so Victor and I, uh, as I mentioned, we met at the YMCA when we both first started playing. He was a former tennis player, I was a badminton player, and I continued playing Babinton for a few years after pickleball, but eventually just stopped. Um, but anyway, we decided like we were so into it and we both really wanted to win every game, and so we started trying to find tournaments. Sure. And I remember the first tournament we went to, this was a horrible experience. Uh so Victor would always leave it to me to be the one to like go on the computer and sign us up and all this kind of stuff. Right. So I'm like, okay, fine, whatever. Um, so I sign us up for some tournament, I think it was the Eastern Canadian Championships in 2013 in uh Kitchener Waterloo, right? Very nice area. And um we get there, and there's all these Americans. And I'm like, wow, this is like, I mean, hmm, that's interesting. Maybe they don't have tournaments in the US or something. Uh-huh. What's going on? Um, so we ended up we were playing against people that if you looked on YouTube, they were like the top players in the world at that time, but we had no idea. People coming in from California and New Jersey and everything. And so we were getting beat in each game 15 to one. Okay. Okay. And every single one, it was like they went to school. You would always get one point, and that was just so you didn't lose 15, nothing. So they wanted to, you know, kind of keep you in the game. So I apparently had signed us up in an open category or something like 18 plus. I had no idea about levels, you know. So um, anyway, that was our first experience. Eventually figured out that there are levels in pickleball. But at the time, the reason all those American people were at that tournament was because in 2013, yeah, there were hardly any pickleball tournaments anywhere. Uh, so the sport had not exploded yet. Um, so Victor and I uh at we got past that experience, and then we started playing tournaments, tournaments everywhere. And being from Montreal, um, when I had the option in Kingston, you're halfway to Montreal, you're halfway to Toronto, you're 90 minutes from Syracuse, and you're two hours from Ottawa at best. So I was like, you know what? Whenever there was a tournament in Montreal, I would want to go to Montreal. Just what I get to see some family on the way there and uh have some greasy uh Poutin and steamies and all that, exactly, you know, diet of a champ. So and Victor really enjoyed uh getting to know Poutine and smoke meat and all that stuff. He had never experienced that. So yeah, and we'd have a we'd have a blast. So we were going to all these tournaments, everything's going great, and then my wife said, Hey, excuse me, hello, you're spending a lot of money on these tournaments, like every weekend, every other weekend, you're in a tournament and everything. Um, so I said, You know what, you're right, you know, uh sure. I'll stop. And uh so Monday morning she went to work, and I worked from home at the time, and I started looking up pickleball companies and eventually connected with Onyx. Okay, so Onyx was I I think probably still are like either the top equipment provider in the sport, uh, or they're in the top three now. And uh they were based in Montreal. So anyway, everything worked out perfectly. I went I talked to my wife, that like they wanted me to sell their products.

SPEAKER_00 19:56

So sorry, just so I understand, you reached out to Onyx then at that point and said, Hi, this is who I am. Yeah, I love pickleball.

SPEAKER_02 20:02

I reached out to a bunch of companies at that time, Mike, there were probably only 10 companies. So there's like ProLite, Paddle Tech, uh, Selkirk, Onyx, but not very many companies that are selling pickleball.

SPEAKER_01 20:12

Right.

SPEAKER_02 20:12

And so anyway, I just wanted to kind of find out if I could be, I had a great job, but I just wanted to kind of rep their product, like be able to, because you'd go to a tournament, there'd be nobody. Right. Like I know, somebody I thought, you know what? If somebody sets up a table with balls and paddles and whatever, you might make, you know, it's a good idea. You make some money and people can try them at the event. Now, nobody tries a paddle at a tournament, just so you know, because they have their paddle and they're so you know concerned about winning, but at least you're exposing them. And then eventually everybody was now you can't, you probably have to pay and show on. So, anyway, I went back to my wife and I said, uh, listen, you know, I have to go to these tournaments. I apologize. I now work for Onyx. Um, and yeah, and that's how we start, that's how I got into it. And then she was cool with it. Um, and then I just started uh playing more and more and more. And uh so then we actually would we went with Onyx, which was really what was really cool was um I'm they said, you know what, when before I started, they said, Can we meet you? And I said, Sure, sure. I'll come up. It was uh like July. So Alice and I went up for a road trip, sat in the office, and um and they they say to me, Well, listen, we have a uh sports trade show in Niagara Falls at the Scotiabank uh center, and we need two people to teach people what pickleball is because we're we sell to like 300 stores that are gonna be at this, like the people that own the stores, right? And we need them to buy equipment, but they don't know what pickleball is. You know, so can you, you know, both like can you, you know, you and somebody come up here and and for two days we'll set up a court and you can just show people how to play and we'll pay you. And in my head, I'm like, oh my goodness, I just hit the mecca. Yeah, I'm a professional sports athlete. I love it. Well, and you look the part, and you look the part absolutely both my chins. So I'm like, okay, let's do this, you know. And I said, guys, guys, perfect. I got a buddy named Victor. He's awesome. And all of a sudden I feel an elbow in my ribs. And I said, uh, actually, Alice and I would love to do it.

SPEAKER_00 22:11

You picked up on the queue right away.

SPEAKER_02 22:13

And now to be completely fair, we get down to up to Niagara Falls, and um Alice would is a much bigger draw than me, and a much bigger draw than Victor. She's beautiful, and every so it was perfect. Like, you know, we had uh people coming over, probably just to chat with her a little bit. And but at the end of the day, we taught so many new people. We had a blast, uh, sold lots of equipment, learned everything. And I'll tell you one last thing. Yes. Um at that time, I'm looking at all the different paddles. I think they had like 10 different paddles, you know. One paddle was uh sub-zero, I think it was, Onyx Sub Zero, $159. Wow.

SPEAKER_00 22:53

I'm like, who, what idiot is gonna put that kind of money down for a paddle.

SPEAKER_02 22:57

And I've and and as you can see in 2026, yeah, I'm right. Like nobody pays more than what what does uh boomstick cost? Like 500 bucks?

SPEAKER_00 23:06

Well, it's yeah, but there's a mortgage program for that. You just you mortgage your house or one of your kids, it's either or, but yeah, the sports guy, you know, I want to touch on that hopefully too if I don't forget, but uh, we're the sports heading and and and part of it's at cost, but what a great story. Well, I didn't know that story.

SPEAKER_02 23:20

So then I name my company, so I get into it, I'm selling product all over, you know, Ontario and different places, sure. Um, to stores mainly, but then I start selling, and then I'm like, okay, I better set something up. So I set up my company, third shotdrop.ca or whatever, thinking, oh, this is the perfect name, nobody has this domain. Well, that was a terrible decision. Why? Because unless you're one of the six people that played pickleball in 2013, 2014, 2015, no idea what that is. Yeah. So um eventually I changed the name to pickleball authority, uh, because there used to be sports authority in the US, which Dicks, like I mean, anyway, there were some issues with sports authority, eventually went down. They had venture capitalists and they went bankrupt, etc. But dicks kind of took over. But um, I mean, I could have gone with something to do with dicks, but I didn't think that was appropriate. So I I just went with Pickleball Authority because I thought, you know what, it hasn't been taken. What a great name. Yeah, and so on. I want to just say one thing about selling equipment, okay? I don't want to be known as a pickleball uh seller of products and so on. In fact, I'll be completely candid with you. Um, I really need to like have sheets in front of me because people want to know about the paddles, and there's so many paddles, and they're, you know, what is this one gonna do, etc.? Um, so I like to like that's one of the things that I love about my store is like people can try, like go on a court, play for a couple hours, take two, try this one, try that one. That's the best way to figure it out, okay? What's gonna work for you? But I was gonna say there was a cartoon I saw, I don't know if you've seen this, and there's two wickets, okay? One wicket, it says um pickleball lessons, and uh there's a person there uh running the the booth, and then the other one is uh new paddles, and there's somebody there. While the line with the people for new paddles is like 50 feet deep.

SPEAKER_00 25:07

There's nobody at the lessons.

SPEAKER_02 25:09

The one on the lessons, the person's there half asleep texting. Yeah, so yeah, people will generally um blame their equipment, then I mean this is what I do I blame my equipment first, uh-huh, then my partner. 100% and uh and then bad line calls from the other side.

SPEAKER_00 25:24

Yeah, well, those three together are gonna ruin your day. That's no question. You know, it's funny to think about pickleball today, David. You've made some great points there, thank you. Uh, about the access to technology and paddles and balls and clothing, even. We haven't talked about clothing and feet and shoes and and sweatbands, and but you know, to go back, and I I wasn't there at 2012, 2013 when this all started becoming a thing. And I think maybe we don't, as newer players, me included, have an appreciation for the fact that this is still a relatively new sport in Canada. And it took a long time to come out of Washington. I mean, when it was developed all those years ago with Barney McCallum and his group of gang gangsters, and you know, it's interesting. I think those coming into the game today don't understand the history. I'm talking to a gentleman this afternoon that uh organized the first tournament in the USA in 1976 called the Bicentennial Tournament. Steve Peranto, the Hall of Famer, played in it. You we start drawing lines back to the history of the game, you don't realize what a slow start it had. And the explosion of it in the last couple of years has really elevated everything, including uh paddles, technology, clothing. So fascinating. Keep going on on pickleball authority because you've made a decision as a business owner, as a Canadian.

SPEAKER_02 26:39

I had been carrying uh I didn't actually care where products came from, as long as they were good products, you know. So I love Selkirk. I still have a Selkirk paddle in my bag. Um and of course I was representing Onyx. Right now, what I liked about Onyx, even though um they're based in uh Evansville, Indiana, uh, was that they actually invested in Canada well like well before everything changed, you know. Sure. So, you know, 10 years ago, we had a head office in Laval outside of Montreal, and they and we had 15 people that were Canadian, that were paying mortgages, rents, whatever, spending money in the community. Uh so they actually invested in Canada. Yeah, so I'm like, you know what? I didn't I I didn't care. I thought that's perfect, and I love the products, I still do. So then of course things change, etc. Um and now one of the first things is when I purchase uh one brand's equipment, uh I I made the decision because I'm a small business and I'm not rich, I don't want to have to deal with custom brokers. I want to try and do it myself, kind of like what you did with the studio. Right. You did it all on your own, save money, and you did a great job, right? So I'm like, okay, you know what? I'm gonna just do I research custom brokerage, etc. So then I ordered product from the U.S., I would have it shipped over to New York. If you're not familiar with the geography here, we can get to the border in about 35 minutes. Yeah, and then I would just drive over to um a little um hardware store. Yep, lots of people do it, and you pay like five dollars a box or something. They pick the stuff up, then you come back to the Canadian border, and then you tell them, hey, I got a bunch of stuff, I need to go in, and then you type on this old computer thing's from 1993 or something. It is, and uh, you've done this. Have you done this? Yeah, yeah. Who hasn't? Yeah, and then so then you you fill out this paper and you gotta you try to remember the codes and all this other stuff and um country of origin. Then you get to deal with a surly border person. And I'm look, I I respect in all seriousness, I I am I respect uh the border um agents, I respect the police, I respect the firefighter, I respect everybody, prison guards, it's a horrible, hard job, and thank you very much for your service. But at the same time, do not make mistakes on those sheets because those uh border agents they don't have any time for you. So uh anyway, so it was quite a process. I'd have to like go over there, and I mean I loved all their products and everything, and they would sell well, but it was quite an ordeal, and uh, and then bring it back in. So, like when things changed, um, I didn't want to visit Ecuador or uh any of the prison systems and any of those uh other countries. I don't want to visit our prison system, so I was like, you know what, enough's enough. Um, and at the time I'd already known that there was like Black Knight and I knew about combat. Um and sorry, sorry to stop you.

SPEAKER_00 29:29

Are the these are Canadian manufacturers of paddles?

SPEAKER_02 29:32

Pickleball equipment, yeah. Okay, so they make paddles and they make some other stuff. Great. So and then Boomer. So there's three three major suppliers that make uh paddles. Uh they are Canadian uh people that make paddles and other equipment. And and you know what? The quality of the products is fantastic, and so the only difference between an American, a big American company, and Combat, for example, is marketing money. You know, yeah. I mean, uh Combat, the guy that runs it, is fantastic, and he's like he really is proud of his product, and the raw carbon in his paddles is like tourée, and he taught he's excited to tell you like how great it is. And he's a passionate person about the sport because he plays it himself. So um he's out in British Columbia. So anyway, that's that's basically what happened. So what I decided was very quickly, I was gonna actually uh launch something on socials uh around the Olympics, but I didn't get a chance. Uh, but yeah, we're just we're just going Canadian. So as far as paddles, um I'm getting rid of all my uh paddles that are not made in Canada. And and one last thing I want to say, listen, I mean, this is probably gonna be watched across uh North America, across the world, hopefully. Um, I love America. Okay, I just want to say that. Like some stuff's happened, obviously, recently, and and it's uh it's unbelievable. Um, the whole world's affected now, and things are changing so quickly. I've never seen anything like this in my life, and I'm pretty sure everybody else could say the same. So I have family in the US, all over the U.S. Um, I used to love visiting the United States. I mean, if you ask Cracker Barrel, they know me. I got my picture in there. Yeah, I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_00 31:09

Well, I thought you were the VIP guy at one point.

SPEAKER_02 31:11

I love that place.

SPEAKER_00 31:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:13

And uh, and so anyway, and and I like you know, I think with politics, what I learned when I was a kid in Montreal, and is you know what, don't if you just listen to the politicians, you're in trouble. At the end of the day, especially if you were to get on a pickleball court, just saying, because we were talking about pickleball. Um, yeah, you when you meet people through pickleball, everybody gets along. It doesn't matter where you're from. Uh, I've talked to people that uh played in the Saddam Hussein's palace after they uh got rid of Saddam Hussein in uh Iraq and they all played together, all the people that were um fighting over there. But anyway, so getting back to this, so I decided like no offense to America, um, but I definitely don't agree with what's going on in the world. Um, and so yeah, I just want to support Canada. Always have wanted to support Canada, and um, and then in turn, people have been very, very generous and they've always been generous no matter what I did. I don't even understand it. Like, I I I can't believe how nice people are uh in this community and across Ontario and Quebec, like ordering online, etc. Clubs and governments and everything, they they support my business.

SPEAKER_00 32:16

I don't know why, but I really appreciate it. Well, David, congrats on all that. Listen, I think when your moral compass starts to bounce a little bit, and mine guides me. I I would say that if there's something my dad instilled in me, it was the concept of honesty and integrity. And I think, you know, we're in a moment right now. I mean, we really are, and and this is not a political podcast, and I'm not bright enough with my grade 12 education to even begin to have a conversation with you this morning about politics, but we are in a moment. We are really in a moment, and it will be interesting for you and I, you know, pushing up against 60 to look back on today in our 70s, because this is going to sort itself out. Whatever this is, and I can't define it, it will sort itself out. But I applaud you a hundred percent. I mean, having owned a small family business in Kingston, uh, my wife and I was part of our family for 50 years. Uh, we believe in all of that and everything that you're doing. So I I congratulate you on that decision. And I think the marketing point that you made a moment ago uh is well taken. And, you know, if there's a challenge in some of this, perhaps for you, and I think you're aware of this, it's that brand A has got so many marketing dollars behind it, and they've got the celebrity angles and they've got the tournament endorsements and so on and so forth. But these smaller Canadian companies, you know, they're not gonna have that kind of access to cash. So for someone like you to step up and say, listen, I'm going to take a personal interest in this, I'm gonna invest in it, and I'm gonna promote it. And let's segue into pickleball again off the off the note of Canadian manufacturers. As a professional coach and as a player, David, and with all the experience you've had, can we just finally can we do a little myth busting here? How important is that paddle? I mean, you take the average rec player, guy coming out to play, paddle in the rack, rotates into a game. Let's be honest, how important is that paddle to the success of his or her game?

SPEAKER_02 34:01

Well, okay, so I'm not an expert on like high-level skills or anything, but yeah, I mean, used to be that we'd go to Montreal occasionally back in, I don't know, five, seven, eight years ago, and there was one woman playing there high level with a wood paddle. Okay, it was before like USAPA approved mattered, right? Sure. So I mean, we have come a long way. So, you know, I uh I I I have people come to me every day and they're like, Oh, I want a paddle, I'm thinking about getting a paddle. And then I say, Can I see the paddle you're playing with now? And there was a lady uh yesterday who showed me a paddle, and I'm like, Oh wow, I still sell that paddle. And I said, Well, that was a great starter paddle. It was like, you know, 79 bucks.

SPEAKER_01 34:39

And sure.

SPEAKER_02 34:40

Um, but things have come such a long way. So, I mean, the paddles are changing, and there are I think there's over 200 manufacturers now. So like, yeah, the competition is crazy, and everybody's trying to get an edge. Um, so like right now, I kind of think raw carbon is the the big thing. Um, and then you know, the thicker the paddle, the more control and touch because it absorbs, and then the thinner, more power, etc. But um, when you're first starting out, I highly recommend not spending a ton of money on your paddle. Like, I think up to maybe a hundred bucks at the most is more than enough, you know, if you're not sure you're going to play. And the other thing is like your game's gonna change, right? So um, however, I've seen somebody come to a lesson in the last year. Okay, so this person had never played before but had a thick wallet, and he showed up with three Selkirk paddles. There's twelve hundred dollars in paddles, never played a game. Uh, I mean, so you know, you do you. I mean, at the end of the day, you know what? It's got to feel good in your hand, and uh, it's nothing wrong with starting out with something a little bit more expensive. But at the end of the day, yeah, no, the paddle shouldn't matter whatsoever when you're first starting. I would say in your first three to six months, most players just start with a basic paddle, just get in the game. Now, the nice thing about it is you buy like an inexpensive paddle, play with it for a little while, then you want to upgrade. Well, you keep that paddle because you're gonna be an evangelist for pickleball. You're gonna have like family coming home, kids from college, for sure. People visiting, you're visiting somewhere, you pop it in your suitcase, and voila. And you teach somebody else.

SPEAKER_00 36:18

Yeah, I think it's a matter of trust, at least as a player for me, and maybe I'm the only player who feels this way, but I think for me, what's in my hand is um there's a relationship with it, if that makes sense to you. I I've got to trust the paddle. I've got to feel that this is the right paddle for where my game is now. Now, I played for three years, and I, you know, I I would put myself in sort of, depending on the day of the week and the direction of the wind, somewhere between a 3-0 and a 3-5 player consistently. Well, that's it, that's that's kind. Um, but I think the paddle and I have a trust, and uh, it sounds corny to say, but a bit of a relationship. And even uh, you know, the number of wraps that you put on your paddle can significantly change the feel that you have as a player with that paddle. But I think, I think personally, just looking at it from the outside in, David, way too much marketing money being pushed, people feeling compelled to upgrade, to spend four or five hundred dollars on a paddle. And on that note, uh, and to go back to to uh some of your shoe people, I don't think this industry, this game, uh talks enough about feet. I think the hands get all the attention, and I don't think the feet get enough. Because if you're not properly grounded, uh whatever paddle you're holding doesn't matter. And I'm I'm interested in your opinion on that. And and and you've been very generous, by the way, and I want to note this in the podcast today. You are uh putting me in touch with with a couple of these Canadian manufacturers to uh to get them on the podcast and to chat about their thoughts, not just on the product because they're gonna rave about it and they should, because it's a great product, but also just about the industry and where it's going. But what are your thoughts on shoes? Are we are we as players not thinking enough about our feet? Because to me, it's a hand-foot game and they complement one another. And if you don't have good foot movement on the court, and whether you're talking squash, pickleball, badminton, paddle, any of these racket sports, the feet are so integral to the success of your game. How do you feel about that?

SPEAKER_02 38:00

So a hundred percent. I mean, you need to have uh good foot uh, you know, footwear. Um, the first thing I would even back up before you even get on a court, warm-up. Warm-up is so critical. Sure. Uh Achilles tendon going up against a wall and you know, just making sure that you stretch and everything. I know, I mean, the younger you are, uh, it probably is not as much of a factor, but everybody should be warming up. Everybody, from like a five-year-old to an 85-year-old. Warm up, warm up, warm up. Because if you just get on, and when I say warm up, I don't mean hitting four dinks on the court, oh, you know, as you're sipping your coffee, uh, which is my warm-up.

SPEAKER_00 38:38

Um, I mean like I was gonna say, I I I've yet to see your warm-up routine and I've seen you a bit. So this is you must do it in a private part of the building because I yeah, and uh but I don't think I want to see you in yoga pants ever, so maybe that's a good too late.

SPEAKER_02 38:51

Too late. That's what I came in today. No, but like, yeah, no, uh, do what I say, not what I do, you know. That's I think a parent thing, right? Gotcha. But in all seriousness, so yeah, warm up first, like 100% off the court, you know, stretch, do whatever you need to do, even if it's five, ten minutes, anything is better than nothing because they see so many people get injured. It's unbelievable. So, as far as shoes, um, so I I mainly dealt with acassia, um, gentleman named Rashid. He owns it. Um, kind of a cool guy. He had um been in broomball shoes. He started with broomball, then he did soccer and all this stuff. So Rashid is um he's got two houses, he's got one in California and one in Orleans, uh near um Ottawa, or I guess part of Ottawa. And um, he's really passionate about pickleball shoes. He loves pickleball. And um they went from like having one or two shoes, and now I I really I don't know how many types they have, but I used to I kind of dealt with Rashid um and Acacia shoes, and I I think they do a good job. I mean, there's lots of brands that are out there, so whatever. The the key with the shoes is um they have the the heel is up a little bit, right? Because when you get up to the front, when you get up to the non-volley zone line or the kitchen line, um, you know, you need to kind of be in a downward kind of pose to a certain degree so that you can um like you you basically don't want to have to like raise your heels, you want the shoe to do that for you. So, and then the other thing is the lateral movement, right? Like you want to be able to go side to side, so critical. Um, so that you know you get all those balls and stuff. So, yeah, like shoes are critical, you know, shoes. And another thing, even more important than shoes, even more important than a paddle, more important than a ball, protective eyewear. There you go. Protective eyewear. Every I I don't understand how it's not mandatory.

SPEAKER_00 40:34

Yeah, it's a strange question because I've thought the same and I've taken a couple in the head, you know, which isn't helping today, but uh, I've been saved a couple times. I wear prescription uh glasses. Do I like them? No. Are they comfortable? No. Do I think I look geeky? Yes. But I've got two eyes and I want to keep them. And when you go online, and if if anyone listening doesn't uh believe what we're saying here this morning, just Google pickleball eye injury. Just watch that two-minute video and tell me how you feel then. And companies like Kitchen Blockers uh and those types of organizations are trying to find a way to get more people interested in doing it because there is a certain glare, David, that if you haven't worn pickleball glasses before or badminton or squash, depending on the lighting within the indoor environment, uh you know it can be a problem. But uh yeah, great point. So glad you touched on that. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 41:20

If I can just say one more thing about protective eyewear. So um there are there are not just issues with getting hit with the ball. Um, and it's not generally a person like a person who has their paddle up and everything is doing everything right and the ball comes at them, it's very rare they're gonna get hit in the eye. It is, as you know, it's the partner. Like most people are playing doubles in pickleball, it's not full court singles unless you have an AED machine close by. So basically it's two against two, and maybe the ball comes off your partner's paddle at the last second, you'd have you have no time to react. No, so uh for me, I've had a cornea transplant, I've had cataracts, had like every possible retina tears and everything. So I don't want to add to that. Sure. Um, so basically that's why I really like uh protective eyewear. A couple things about that. Um, you mentioned the glare. So there is one brand that we carry, um, they actually have three lens choices in every um pack with their glasses, it's a little bit more expensive, like ten or twenty dollars more, but it's so worth it. Sure. Um, so you have like the blue, which is technically the anti-glare clear, and then you have the shade for outside play. So that is one option. Um, the other thing is uh while glass, like uh protective eyewear with the traditional glass or whatever it is, um, it's maybe not as sexy because you know, oh, it might they may fog up, etc. Um, the good thing about those is not no offense to any other brands, is if a paddle comes across like this, you gotta have something. Yeah, you gotta have glass. You have to have something protecting your eye because um and anyways, otherwise you could get hurt. Um, if you take some shaving cream very quickly, yeah, spray it on the on the lenses, have a shower, get out. We can do this later if you'd like. I I can help you. I've got some time. Okay. Uh, and then uh clear it all off. It's getting very uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_00 43:09

Some things you can't unsee.

SPEAKER_02 43:11

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:11

That may be one of them.

SPEAKER_02 43:13

So that will actually help with the anti-glare, okay. Or sorry, with the glare, or not the glare, the uh fogging up. Yeah, they're all on anti-fog, but it just helps, you know. And then the last thing I saw somebody do this. It's unbelievable. Okay. Okay. They want to protect their eyes. So uh Sherry, uh, she's in Australia right now for the next couple of months traveling. Tough life. And she bought two pairs of the exact same glasses. And what she does is while she's playing, after 10, 15 minutes or half an hour, they're foggy, switches them out. So, like your eyes, like you cannot replace your eyes. Yeah. So um, just saying, because people spend four or five hundred dollars on a on a paddle, and then they don't want to spend like ninety, like even what, thirty, forty, fifty dollars on eyewear. Just saying.

SPEAKER_00 43:55

No, David, I think it's I think there's a shift that needs to happen in the game. I want to go back to what you said about. With the mandatory requirement for eye protection. I think pickleball Ontario, pickleball Canada, uh Global Pickleball Federation, all I think we need to get a voice behind this. And and uh it's it's just good for the sport. And I think if it was mandatory, it'd be interesting to see if people like Tennis Clubs of Canada decide to take a stand on that at some point, uh, if for any other reason than liability and just simply say, look, if you're gonna play here, you need to do this. Uh and and that's a discussion maybe to have with Adam down the road. But uh yeah, good point. I just think the marketing dollars, listen, these manufacturers are smarter than you and I put together, and they know that paddles drive sales and profit. And so they're not gonna spend a lot of time talking about shoes or clothing. They're gonna put most of those marketing dollars, I would assume, behind the profit center within their business, which is which is probably the paddles. It's interesting. Let's jump into the game for just a sec. Um, and again, I'm watching the clock and I want to be respectful of your time this morning. So we're gonna wrap this up here before too long. But here's a couple of things that have happened to me as a player. I start in a game, I love the game. I'm playing normally at a rec social level. And then from there I build some friends and I find some people that want to get a private game. And so I get invited into the private game and it's a little more competitive, and I'm deciding I like this and I want to level up and I want to start drilling, and so I start doing that and I start moving up the scale a little bit. So I'm a I'm a half decent player and I'm playing with some of these uh folks that are sort of at that level in the game, and and it's going quite well, I think. And then I go on to court reserve one day to take a look for a court and I notice, gee, there's seven guys that I used to play with, and now David's with them. And why am I not in that group anymore? What happened? Uh how do you deal with that? You've been around this game for a long time. And the reason I'm asking, it's not about me, and I'm not asking you to be my therapist this morning, although I'd appreciate some help with it. It's more David because I see it as a problem within the game. I see very few issues with pickleball, but that's one of them. One of them is as these little groups start developing, the eagles start taking over, and the and all of a sudden somebody's not getting invited into a game. And I can tell you from having dozens upon dozens of conversations with people that have found themselves in that position, we're struggling as players when we find ourselves excluded from a game that we feel we should be part of. Well, what's your professional opinion on that?

SPEAKER_02 46:18

Well, so I um I I I I'm not I am competitive, very competitive, but then I'm not competitive. Um and so I I don't I want everybody to feel like they belong. I want everybody to have a great experience. And that's not just because I run the uh the center, the club. That's just the way I am. Like I love the game, yeah, and um, and I want everybody to have a great experience. So um a couple things. I mean, I try, I like to play with the people that I think are are fairly high level. Um, it doesn't mean that I actually belong there every week, but I I like the actual personalities um and the people and so on. We've been friends for a while and so on. Um but at the same time, sometimes I'm not enjoying myself. And uh our club is very open concept, as you know. It's a dome. So I mean they're the ceilings are incredibly high, and it's just basically like there's 12 courts, and so many times as I'm waiting for somebody to collect the ball, or I'm just standing there and they're talking, and you know, between games, I'm watching um some ladies that play every week, you know. Sure. And all they're doing, like they're having a blast, and they're not that concerned with winning, losing, but I can hear them laughing and yeah, like every two seconds, they're having like, and I'm like, gee whiz, you know, maybe I should just be over. I that's kind of where I want to be, you know, yeah, because um sometimes it gets too serious and I don't enjoy it. It almost almost turns me off the game. I'm not kidding. Like, interesting, you know, and that and it's so yeah, so like I personally, my philosophy, and I don't I'm sure most people are kind of like me in the fact that like you want to play at you want to be challenged, you want to have uh good games and everything, you want to get better, I think most people do. Um, but it's gotta be fun. I mean, I'm like like I say, we're like you know, we're pushing 60 here. Yeah, and um what is the deal?

SPEAKER_00 48:13

Like it really matters. Um it's it's funny, David. People seem to think that their game is somehow making the world a better place, and it it really is a pickleball pain point for me. That in combination with the fact that certain players who have leveled up, you know, absolutely refuse to quote unquote play down. Um, I remember a story uh very clearly from when I first started. And yes, listen, I wasn't particularly good. I didn't know where the ball was going, but I was trying my best. And there was a game going on, excuse me, of some better players. And uh one of the guys gets hurt, and I'm just there watching. I mentioned earlier I used to go and watch. So I'm sitting on the sidelines watching, buddy goes down with an injury, and uh, so they can't continue the game. They're down to three players. So one of the guys comes over and says, Hey, do you want to jump in? Boy, I couldn't get my shoes on fast enough. So I'm laced up and ready to go. And I go to step out in the court and one of the other guys goes, uh, yeah, we're good. And I go, sorry. He goes, Yeah, we're fine. We'll just call it a day. And I just thought, wow, so he waved me off. So here's a guy that would rather not play than give a guy who's trying to learn the game a chance to come into the game. And that just didn't sit well with me. And so the combination of people not being included in groups that they think they should, not being invited into, you know, for a 3-0 player, David, to step onto a court with let's just say a 4-0 player is the experience of a lifetime. I mean, I remember that feeling the first time I got into a game I didn't belong in, and just so thrilled that those folks would let me kind of come in and you can learn a great deal. And I I don't I'd argue, I'm gonna argue a lot on this one because it bugs me. I think those better players can take that as an opportunity to maybe work on the reset or the drop or you know, whatever they're struggling with, because everybody struggles. Uh, I wish we could fix that. I I I advocate for it and I really wish, and so at the risk of embarrassing you because you don't take compliments particularly well, um, the culture that you've created at KRC is magical. I've never felt that in my time there. Uh, you you've just done an amazing job. And there are more smiles and giggles and laughs happening uh within that building and within that bubble. And so congrats on that. I don't want to miss that today.

SPEAKER_02 50:17

Let me back up. Thank you for that. It's very kind. You're always so complimentary. I appreciate it. Um, but I just want to back up and say one other thing about competitive people playing together, okay? Sure. And my group. And I don't, I mean, they can watch this. I hope they watch this. So, you know, we start out and everybody kind of comes together as a group, and then they say, Well, this person, Joe, you know, we talk after. Yeah, Joe, he's too competitive. Oh, he's intense, he's too intense. We can't have Joe in the group anymore.

SPEAKER_00 50:46

Get rid of Joe.

SPEAKER_02 50:46

And in my head, I'm like, okay, well, you know, I've been through a lot of my life, like challenges and annoying people and so on. And you know what? Yeah, Joe is completely a very annoying person. I agree, I agree. But off the court, Joe is like one of my best buddies. Absolutely. Oh no, we don't want Joe in the group anymore. It was just too intense. All right. And now it's always fun. It's easy to say, I don't want this person in the group, or I don't want to play with this person on high enough level, blah, blah, blah. Yeah. Uh if you're not the one trying to get four or five people or eight people every Tuesday and Thursday or whatever. Sure, sure. Because then all of a sudden they're they're limiting your choices. Yeah. And now you've got like seven people and it's like six hours before game time, and you can't call on that person because nobody wants to play with. And then what happens is some of the people that didn't care for the person that was too aggressive or too intense, sure, become that person.

SPEAKER_00 51:39

Oh, absolutely. Somebody could have felt like that. Have you seen that? Oh, 100%.

SPEAKER_02 51:41

No, but they they become uh aggressive, like kind of uh you know, hard to play with and very similar. So, like, you know, I don't know. For for me personally, like most of the people I play with, I love playing with. Um, I think the bigger the group probably is better because then you don't have to go back and forth head to head with on with the same people too much. Uh uh, you could of course try and communicate, that might be a thing you could do. But um the other thing is the the nice thing about what I get to do, and I mean I'm not very I'm I'm being honest, like I have I've it's hard. Like I'm not good at I I fall down a lot because of this. I believe it's it's ADHD, laziness, I have no idea, but like trying to um make sure that you have enough levels and enough um space for everybody to make them feel welcome and to find the right group of people. Sure. Um that's that's the key. Like, and luckily we have 12 courts. Um we got you know basically we're open from 8 a.m. to 10 p.m. seven days a week. Yeah, lots of access, lots of access. So, and then what you just need to do is like find the right people, and then when people get together, like if you're in a group, okay, if you're playing socially, uh in any group, don't just think it's gonna last forever. So just like you know what, grab your phone, and if you like a couple of people, you meet a few people, you know what? I really like that person, like Mike and Fran, they seem really nice. Let's go. Can I hey? Would you mind if at some point we rented a court? I mean, I love playing with you, and I can like you know I could learn something or whatever, it's just a lot of fun. Do that because you know, if you're the change, like you know, they I think they say be the change. Be the change, yeah, yeah. So like if you're not feeling included, um, or you played with a group and then they don't invite you anymore and you walk by the court and you're like, oh, okay. Uh don't like you know what? Turn a negative into a positive. Um, it's not acceptable. Like everybody should be welcoming. Or if you're inviting somebody because you um you need a new you need a player and you don't it's not really gonna be a permanent thing, just be honest with the person. Sure. Just say, listen, we have a set group, um, and you know, we really mainly have enough players, but if you don't mind once in a while, we're gonna we'll we'll give you a shout if you don't mind. Just be honest up front with people. That way their expectations are uh I love that appropriate. But it's all about communication. And like I say, I mean, I see so many people start their own groups and they start with one court, and all of a sudden, every week they've got like four courts. It's unbelievable. And they keep bringing in new people and yeah, well, that's what's happened to me at Keras.

SPEAKER_00 54:10

You know, I came in kind of with the seniors group in Kingston, and and I think they do a lot of good for seniors, so I really I want to support them. So I signed up for some of their programming, and then I got playing, and then somebody came up to me. I think probably the second time I was there and said, Hey, we've got a Sunday-Tuesday game. We'd love to have you. And so I'm I'm in the Sunday-Tuesday game and I do seniors twice a week. And so, you know, I'm getting lots of pickleball, too much curling. And I know that's a problem between you and I, and I hope it doesn't break us up, but it's almost over. Um, but you know, I think David, that's the magic to it. It's a great point. Thanks for saying that. I think you just kind of got it, you know, deal with it. It is what it is. And and I I love the point about groups don't last forever. You know, sometimes things shift and they go. And the other point, very quickly before we kind of wrap up here today, is that I think we have to be honest with ourselves. We don't always play at exactly the same level. We have better days, whether it's diet, nutrition, sleep. We got some stuff on our mind. We're not feeling well, we're a bit under the weather. Nobody, including Ben Johnson and Elise Waters, is consistently their bandwidth of difference is slightly narrower than mine and yours. I mean, you and I can go from a 3-0 to a 4-0 in a heartbeat. We can actually do that game to game, not just day to day. So let's be real about that. There's not a player that plays at a rec level that isn't going to see some of that fluctuation in in just hand-eye coordination. It's it's a difficult game in that regard. So I'm glad you touched on that because it's been a bit of a pain point for me. And um, yeah, and I think because I've experienced it uh a number of times, and maybe I'm a problem, and maybe that's where I need to start with it all. But you know, I've seen it and and I've been around the game long enough to have talked to a number of different sort of rec level social players that have also experienced it. And I think it's something we need to talk about.

SPEAKER_02 55:46

So can I I I'd like to just say, so in your case, I I know that you're way too hard on yourself. Sure, perhaps. Uh no, you are 100%. Okay, because I see I see how well you play and everything. And I'm gonna say that 96% of pickleball people, especially when they start out, sure, they are too hard on themselves. So, like people get to a new player lesson. At the beginning of a new player lesson, I go around the horn. Okay, so we got eight people. I now tell people to come 10 minutes before the lesson because I like to talk, as you may have noticed.

SPEAKER_00 56:20

Sure, we've done good. Yeah, yeah, good this morning.

SPEAKER_02 56:22

I say to them, like, when I send an email before people come for their first lesson, I'll say, Listen, like, get there 10 minutes early if you don't mind. And then I go around and I say, Okay, listen, thanks guys for coming, you know, whatever. Yeah, uh, appreciate you. I would like you to go around and I want you to tell me a little bit about yourself. I don't care what you tell me. Are you from this area originally? Uh what other sports have you done? What do you like to do right now? What are your hobbies? And if you've ever met anybody famous, if you've ever met anybody famous, I prefer a negative encounter, but that's okay. Right. Just more interesting. Some dirt. Exactly. Right. So then, um, so they go around, you know, and then they talk about themselves, and that's to try to build community. And it's also I'm selfish. Like I'm very interested in knowing who these people are. They're they're uh it's you know, it's nice to see a good group of people, and hopefully we'll be friends after. So then we play, okay. So they oh, I've never played, I don't know how I'm gonna do, and blah blah blah. Sure. Then, like, you know, an hour later, they miss a drive or something, like they've never played before, they never hit a pickleball. And then they're after the game, oh yeah, I can't believe I missed. Excuse me, you've been on the court like an hour, you didn't know how to play an hour and a half ago. You were at Starbucks, sure. And now you're like, so that's the thing, like so many people are hard on themselves. So just just remember, you know, like your your age and like you were saying, and all the other different factors and everything, and just try and be consistent, and that's pretty much all I have to say.

SPEAKER_00 57:45

I think play with passion is a good way to approach it too. If you're out there to have fun and you're playing it, you know, the best you can, there is a certain reflection that you might get from your playing partner. I remember a game, uh, very quick story, David. We were going along, and it it every time I did something wrong, missed a shot, I could see them and hear them. There was size, there was eye rolling. And so I I, you know, I called for a timeout, which you don't normally do in a game like that, but I said, I just need a second. I pulled him aside and I said, Listen, this game just shifted. He goes, What do you mean? I said, A minute ago, it was me and you against those two guys. Now it's me against those two and you. Good for you. And he looked at me, said, What are you talking about? I said, Listen, the eye rolling and the sighing isn't working. And I said, if you think that's helping, it's not. Because now I'm basically turtling and I'm worried about what you're thinking. So I'm not even worried about those guys. I'm not thinking about where I'm shooting or placing the ball, or I'm just worried about you rolling your eyes. So can we can we knock it off? And uh, this is a very famous guy in this area, and everybody would know him, uh, but but we're not mentioning names, which is unfortunate because that could be fun. But yeah, it it doesn't help the game, David. And it doesn't horrible if it was a bad experience. And I laughed. Listen, we had the numbers. I think we had uh two courts, nine guys, so we had a spare. So I went to the organizer at the end of that moment and I said, Listen, I I'm leaving, I'm not doing this. I've got a short list of people I won't play with, and it's two, and uh this this person's one of them. So you know it's not worth it.

SPEAKER_02 59:05

That's horrible. And I know because I've been in that situation, and that like a thing will happen is you'll go to a somebody'll ask you to play in a tournament, and you're like, okay, like in my head, I'm like, in my head, I really don't actually enjoy tournaments anymore. Right. Because what do I care? I just want to play with people I like and have fun, right? And uh, and you can have like some amazingly competitive games just with people that are like that you hang out with all the time. Yeah, but so you say yes, and then you go to a tournament, you travel there together, and all this other stuff, and like you say, and then you're making you're doing your best. Like, what do you think here? You think I'm not trying? No, uh, and then they're smacking their paddle or huffing and puffing.

SPEAKER_00 59:40

It's like, come on. It's particularly awkward, too, when the Haldane Express messes up the room and it's a twin bed, you know, you're there for the weekend. It's not good, it's head to feet. It's not so it doesn't help, especially if you're not getting along on the court. Yeah, listen, somebody said to me when I first started, great advice, it rings true today. And and uh that advice was listen, Mike, no one likes to win 11-2, and no one likes to lose 11-2. And I understood what that meant uh better as the game progressed. I didn't necessarily grasp that in the moment, but what it was was an experienced player who said, Listen, we want competitive games. You know, we don't like to see it. And listen, I get pickled, I'm sure you've been pickled. Uh people listening have been pickled. People listening right now may be pickled in a different way. Who knows?

SPEAKER_02 1:00:19

I mean, maybe the podcast is better if you are pickled, but you know, the people that and one last thing I'll say about like the high-level people or whatever, it's like here's something that I used to do, and now I'd try not to do it, okay? Like I was trying to be helpful and I just don't do it anymore. So you'll you'll think you're a better player than the person you're playing with, okay? Sure. And so you might say, Hey, you know, can I just like can I just give you like a little bit of feedback? And they'll be, oh sure, I'd love to have feedback. Okay, you know, um, you're kind of like running and hitting at the same time, just whatever it is, okay? Sure. I guarantee you the next shot that comes to you, you're hitting it in the net, you're hitting it out. 100%. And so then I always, whenever I would give advice, yeah, I would and then I would make the next shot would be a huge mistake on my part. I would feel like an idiot because I'm like, here I am trying to pretend I I'm better or whatever. Yeah. And meanwhile, I just cracked it into the net and I'm like, okay, kind of feel sheepish right now, just keep my mouth shut for the rest of the game. Yeah. So like that's the other thing. Like you like you said, like sometimes you're playing great, and another time you come in and it's just not happening, the timing's off a little bit. So be very careful about who you um who you kind of you know treat poorly or whatever. In fact, obviously, just be nice to everybody, but unfortunately that doesn't happen. But just try to remember that you know what, when somebody's having a bad day or whatever, try to lift them up. Like just be like, hey, it's not a big deal, like you're doing great and tap the paddle and all that kind of stuff. And let's go. Just keep it positive because um that's the bottom line. I mean, we're there to have fun, like that's all it's supposed to be about is having fun.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:50

And listen, if you get into a lopsided game, if there's one advantage to a lopsided game, it's over quickly. Yeah, that's right. So the the guy that doesn't want to be with you doesn't have to be with you for a whole lot of time because it's gonna be over in four and a half minutes. So just you know, let it go. We walk out of that building every day, David, after playing, and we have not in any way made the world a better place. We may have enhanced our lives, we've made friends, we've made acquaintances. That's great. But in the broader sense of the world and all that's happening to go back to our earlier conversation, we're not changing the world. And um, let's not forget about that. So uh a couple final questions, and then and then I gotta let you go because I know you got a job. Um what um tell me what concerns you about pickleball today, the direction that it's going. Uh what threat is there to pickleball? Is it other racket sports possibly coming into play and stealing some of the pickleball audience? Is it technology getting ahead? Is it big money, big tournaments? There's lots of turmoil happening now with you know major league pickleball. And what as a player and as an advocate for the game certainly is an important part of the game here in this region and beyond, what what what bugs you right now? What is there, you got your eye on something? Is there something that's worrying you about the game?

SPEAKER_02 1:02:58

No. No, no, no, that's not the answer. Oh, I just thought it was quick. Yeah, I was gonna say so I honestly the there's not a lot that worries me about the game. I mean, one area that I would like to say is I kind of get concerned, and I've read about it and thought about it, is the paddles. Um, the actual uh some paddles, I mean, they're like rockets. They are, you know, and I just I don't know. I I I heard that racquetball, I remember in the 80s, uh back in Montreal in the West Island, if you're from Montreal, Beaconsfield, Kirkland, going to like the racquet and playing racquall, racquetball. Remember that? Right, it was a big deal, yeah, and thinking, oh, this is kind of cool, you know, but didn't really play that much, but tried it. Uh, and apparently the reason that racquetball crashed and like nobody hardly plays it anymore is because they kept on um improving the quality of the rackets to the point where it was so fast nobody could hit the ball back, so then everybody just switched to squash, right? You know, so um I think that's the thing. It's like I personally find like some people are playing with these paddles, and it's like everybody else like on the court is playing with a normal paddle, and then they have these rocket paddles and they make a lot of noise, and the ball is coming so quick. I think that's gonna I think it ruins the game to a certain degree, especially uh like maybe it's okay if all four people, but even then if all four people have these paddles and the ball's coming off so quick um with power shots and stuff and drives, um, I don't know. I don't like it. Um now the other side of that is like I mean they gotta these people must be very, very skilled that have these paddles because to be able to hit a soft shot, you gotta barely be holding the grip.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:41

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:42

And you gotta have your timing down perfectly because otherwise everything you touch is gonna, if you're trying to hit a soft shot, you're probably hitting it high and they're they're smoking it on the other side. So, like, that's the only area that I I'm not crazy about. Um, I don't care, like as far as tournaments and um PPA and whatever other groups there are and all that that stuff. I mean, that's fine. I mean, there's good good for those high-level players, and people like to watch um, you know, there's lots of pickleball on YouTube and different pickleball channels and everywhere. And people want to watch and and uh and see the amazing athleticism of these people, good for them. Like it's fantastic. Of course, there should always be professional players in every sport, right? Um, so I don't really it's not a big deal to me um as far as how many tournaments there are. I can say that that we're at a point where there's probably too many tournaments, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:05:33

Right, yeah, a lot going on, sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:35

Yeah, like everybody's like, oh my goodness, how we can make money. Uh let's do a tournament. And I know you might think, well, not everybody's motivation is money, but there are a lot of clubs uh opening everywhere, chains and everything, and they want for sure. They're trying to make a quick buck uh to stay alive and and keep going. So I yes, while I like think tournaments are great, and I think uh and everybody's um not everybody, but I would say I think only about 20% of people actually play in a tournament, by the way. Eighty percent of them just want to play recreationally and have a blast. Good thoughts. But anyway, really good thoughts. So I I think like the only thing that I can see that's a bit of a hindrance is uh those paddles where they come off like a rocket. Otherwise, I think the sport's going in a great direction. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:17

All right. Yeah, so paddle technology, I think, David, certainly something that a lot of people are talking about and uh, you know, power in your hand and and where does that end up taking us? But uh it's good to hear you think the game's in good shape. I I'm wondering about other racket sports possibly coming in. I heard about a new game yesterday. I can't remember the exact name of it, but it's a variation of tennis with a softer ball, and uh I'll have to look into it. It's something I never even heard of. Tiku or tip two or something like that.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:42

I've seen there's also another game that somebody was promoting. Um well it is everywhere, I guess, but it's very, very few people actually play it. But it's kind of you're using a tennis racket or no, it was a bigger, it was bigger than a pickleball paddle. So it was a paddle but bigger.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:57

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:58

And yeah, it was with a tennis, like a big tennis ball.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:01

But it's got strings, like a racket. No, no, it's a flat paddle. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:05

And it was like kind of a tennis ball and it bounced really high, but you were still playing on a pickleball court. I mean, I tried it, but uh, I don't know. Yeah, I think like the thing with pickleball, like I just you had said something a little while back, and I oh I know now I remember why we spoke about sports betting. Oh, it was because when you uh the reason pickleball is so successful and exciting and and captivating is it's like uh what the casino says know your limit and play within it. So like there is a game for everybody, there's a game for 75-year-old people that only want to exercise a couple hours a week. Um, and then there's a game for like a 10-year-old and their grandparent or their parents. Um, there's a game for everybody, and they and basically you just need to know your limit and play within it. So don't try to do too much. That comes back to injuries, too, where people are trying, like you said, it doesn't matter. Like when we leave the pickleball club, yeah, things are still the same everywhere, right? That's right. So for you to run and like a like a maniac and try and get a to hit a shot, and then you end up pulling a muscle and you can't play for two months, I don't know. So the same with a lob shot. Somebody lobs the ball. Let it go. Yeah, sometimes you know what, and my partner will look at me and they'll be like, and I'll say, listen, you know what? We're like, we're I think we're, I don't know, it's five five or something. Sure. Don't worry about it. We'll get the next one. Yeah, yeah, you know, it's not worth it. All that to say, yeah, that's so basically like if people just that's the reason it's so successful, is because you can play at any level. So you um that's that's what's really cool about it.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:37

Yeah, it is, David. It's a great point. And uh, you know, I think we do sometimes uh lose focus, and it's good to sometimes just have a chat and remind ourselves what are we really doing here? Yeah, it's terrific. Final question, and then we can wrap up. But when you look at yourself and you look at your involvement in the pickleball community, David, here, what what are you hoping your legacy is in 20 years? What what do you think about it at all? I mean, it's a tough question. It's a pretty standard question, it's nothing original. But, you know, I just I really have to compliment you on what you've done there and and uh how inclusive the club is. And I'm just I'm curious from your point of view. Um, are you conscious of your commitment to the sport and your contribution to the sport? Um, because I think it's uh, you know, without people driving this and being advocates and going back into 2013, 2014 and bringing the sport and making it more accessible and the things you've done with pickleball authority and now your current role with KRC, I just you know what tennis clubs of Canada is doing to grow the sport across the nation. And uh how how would you like to be remembered? I I don't mean to be morbid, but you know, what do you what are your thoughts on it? You know, I certainly have an opinion of you and uh thank you. No, I do, and I think I'm so glad we've become friends. It's an important part of my day and week, and uh so I appreciate that. But where where do you where would you like to see it all land for you down the road?

SPEAKER_02 1:09:49

Yeah, I mean, look, I I've been really, really blessed to have um played this game. Um when I played Badminton in Kingston, uh I had a really nice group of people that I got to play with. Um and then with pickleball, it just expanded because so many more people play the game. Sure. And then where I work. Um, so I want to thank, I'm not just saying this because like I said, I had 60 jobs and I'm I'm hoping this is the last one, but you never know, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:10:14

It might be time. Settle down, young man.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:17

I want to thank, like, I actually appreciate the opportunity that um they gave me to actually run this thing because it was a big deal. So they were only gonna build a tennis uh dome, okay? Oh, okay. Um and uh what happened was they contacted Bob Herdebees, who's a wonderful person in Kingston, because he was kind of a pickleball guy, been playing for many, many years, etc. Sure. And um the city, I guess, was talking to the tennis clubs of Canada when they were negotiating the property, etc. And they said, uh, you know what, before you finish drawing everything up, maybe you should talk to this guy, Bob, about pickleball, because there's like they're constantly harassing us at the city to get more pickleball.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:57

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:57

So um they ended up talking to Bob and one thing led to another, and um, they decided to invest millions and millions of dollars to put another dome up for just for pickleball, and we do volleyball, but like that was a huge decision, and it's uh like a multi-million dollar decision. Yeah, um, the pickleball dome ended up opening first, which was kind of cool. Sure. And um, you know what? The pickleball dome is doing pretty well. Like, I mean, there's competition, of course, like new clubs opening and everything. Um, but it's doing fantastic. So, first of all, I want to thank Tennis Clubs of Canada and the leadership, uh, Terry and Adam and Stan and all the people at the top, uh, Cody, for actually making that decision. Like, it's pretty amazing. So, then the next thing is like they they let me um be a part of the growth and start it off and everything. So, again, thank you very much. Um, it's been an amazing ride. Um, I just like like I I just like teaching people how to play and trying to make sure that every single time somebody comes in there, if I'm there, I'm the Walmart greeter. Thanks for coming, appreciate it. Thanks, have a great day. Just be kind to everybody. Um, one last thing um I'll say about maybe like just things that people will remember, hopefully, apart from my very, very poor sense of humor and um bad jokes and everything, um, would be that like Myra, okay, so there's a lady named Myra that works at our club, and uh uh I feel like she's basically doing what I used to do, but she does it better. And that is um when I used to rent like a church gym space or a school gym space when you couldn't find anything, I would play music, you know, uh in the background, and um, and then I would sometimes I would be on the sidelines and I would get to talk to the different players, right? And eventually I was running like six hours of groups, so I'd play in one group, and but for the other four hours, I'm just kind of hanging out, right? So I play the music, but then I would hang out with everybody on the bench, and that was actually the most fun was getting to talk to people about their kids, about their life, where are you going on a trip, uh, health concerns, political, everything, whatever was happening at that particular time. Yeah, and Myra and I talk about that a lot. Myra is an amazing uh communicator and a great person, and um, so she loves that too. Like when we have extra players, um, just having the chance for 10 or 15 minutes to kind of chill on the sidelines and and like build that relationship. And um, so like I think hopefully people, if um, if they do actually uh remember me, will be like, oh, you know, that guy was a good guy, he was pretty chill, he wasn't intense. Um, he taught me how to play, and uh, we had a lot of fun, and that's pretty much it. Um, though, hopefully, I have a dog named Monty that has become kind of a little star. We love Monty. Uh yeah, I I got Monty about a year ago, and uh he's gonna be six soon. And anyway, basically um I bring him to the club with me. He's like 25 pounds and uh bit of attitude, but he is um easily bought by treats. Oh, 100%. Forget me. He would forget me in a moment if somebody else gave him a treat. Uh but basically he walks around the like if you ever want to come visit our club, uh come check it out. He walks around the club with me, does not harass anybody for the pickleballs, could care less. We fix all the nets, we do like a net inspection every morning around all the courts, and um, he's by my side without a leash from the time we get there till the time we leave. Yeah, and um, yeah, so like I think people probably remember remember Monty more than me, actually.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:28

Yeah, I was gonna say, I think people want to be friends with you because they just want to get close to Monty. Yes. Are you okay with that? It's not about you, it's about your dog. I understand. Yeah, no, he's a star. He's great, he's a lot of fun, and uh he's a fixture. I mean, he's really he's really a fixture there. So well, David, I think that's uh that's a great legacy. I think uh I think you know, I don't think much about my legacy in pickleball, but I do as a dad and as a husband, and I think we all do as we age. I think it's inevitable. I mean, I'm thinking maybe more about it now than I than I was, and maybe this podcast in some small way is a way to capture that. There's a lot of reasons to do a podcast, and mine's not about monetization, and it's not about it becoming the biggest podcast in the pickleball uh space. It's it's about doing something that I'm passionate about and a chance to talk to those people that you've just mentioned who are sitting on the bench and and have a story to tell. I can't tell you the number of interesting and fascinating people that I've met through the game, and without the game, it doesn't happen. And uh so I'm thankful to the game for all of that. So yeah, listen, I appreciate you being here today. I want to close by telling you uh how much I'm uh just thrilled to have met you, made your acquaintance, get a chance to get on the court with you every so often and play. And I want to publicly apologize that curling has somewhat taken over my life. I I I'm I wasn't sure you'd show up this morning. I thought maybe I'd get a letter from you saying I'm not interested in hanging out with a guy that curls as much as you do. But uh it's over in another month. The playoffs are starting here, so I'll be back on a more regular basis, uh, you know, starting uh hopefully in uh in April.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:56

I like playing with you, and I'm happy you made it back to our club and you play. I love it.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:01

Uh because every time I get to see it, it's it's awesome. Listen, this has been fantastic. Um, is there anything we didn't touch on that you wanted to bring up this morning? I mean, uh I want to thank you for everything you've done to help support the podcast. Being here this morning means the world to me. Uh connecting me with some of your manufacturers and gear guys is important. And there was one comment you made to me a couple weeks ago, and that is I have somebody at the club, a mystery guest, that's gonna come on the podcast. Is that person still on your radar?

SPEAKER_02 1:16:29

You've got an interesting background. I think you'd like it.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:31

He, okay. So we've uncovered. See how tricky I was there? Yeah, that's he's a great me. Almost got you.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:36

Almost got you to say his name. You're kind of like the Columbo uh the Peter Falk of Pickleball.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:40

If I put my hand in the air and say just one more thing, you know you're in trouble.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:43

I'm wearing a trench coat.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:44

Yeah, listen, my friend, it's great to see you this morning. Appreciate all your time, and uh I want you to give my best to Monty. Um Alice too. Well, I want to be careful there. I don't want to, you know, make you uncomfortable. Her and I talk quite often, so I don't know. There's any reason for you to say anything that I haven't already said this morning to her. You did have to drive here. So there was a window of opportunity for her and I to come up and talk to you. No, listen, we got to meet both Fran and I got a chance here on a serious note to have lunch with the two of you a while back and we enjoyed every second of it. So same here.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:13

We love uh both you and Fran.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:14

I appreciate it. Well, listen, thanks for coming on the podcast.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:16

Thank you.