One of Canada’s Top Pickleball Coaches- Cameron Taylor

What does it take to build one of Canada's most respected pickleball coaching organizations?

In this episode of Kitchen Conversations, I sit down with Cameron Taylor, co-founder of Taylored Pickleball Academy (TPA), to explore the remarkable journey from restaurant management and volunteer firefighting to becoming one of Canada's leading pickleball coaches and educators.

Cam shares how a simple invitation from his uncle changed the course of his life, why coaching is about relationships before technique, and how Taylored Pickleball Academy has evolved into one of Canada's premier destinations for:

🏓 High-performance coaching

🌎 International pickleball vacations

🇨🇦 Canadian "Campcations"

🎯 Skill development programs

👨‍🏫 NCCP-certified coaching

🤝 Building community through sport

We also dive into:

✅ Why pickleball is changing lives

✅ The secret behind great coaching relationships

✅ How AI could transform player development

✅ The early days of pickleball in Canada

✅ The future of coaching and player development

✅ Cameron's role in helping launch the Canadian National Pickleball League (CNPL)

Whether you're brand new to pickleball or chasing your next DUPR milestone, this conversation is packed with practical insights, inspiring stories, and plenty of laughs.

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Learn More About Taylored Pickleball Academy

🌐 Website: https://www.tayloredpickleballacademy.ca/

📘 Facebook: Thttps://www.facebook.com/share/18xZyqVqwB/?mibextid=wwXIfr

📸 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/tayloredpickleballacademy

About Kitchen Conversations

Kitchen Conversations brings you thoughtful, long-form conversations with the people shaping racquet sports across Canada and beyond. From world-class coaches and elite athletes to volunteers, entrepreneurs, and community builders, every episode explores the stories behind the game.

Thanks for watching—and thanks for helping us grow the sport, one conversation at a time.

#Pickleball #CameronTaylor #TayloredPickleballAcademy #KitchenConversations #PickleballCanada #CNPL #PickleballCoaching #NCCP #PickleballTraining #DUPR #PickleballVacation #PickleballCommunity

And that wraps up this episode of Kitchen Conversations.

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That’s where these stories really come to life.

You’ll also find links and show notes in the episode description.

Until next time…

more than dinks, drops and drives…

these are stories from behind the paddle.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

When I say coaching, pickleball coaching, one name has got to come to mind, and that is Cameron Taylor. Cam Taylor started TPA or Tailored Pickleball Academy several years ago. It is by far one of the most respected and recognized names in the coaching industry here in the game of pickleball. He also has a vacation arm where you can go and play pickleball, get coached in some of the most exotic places on planet Earth. I had a great chat with Cam Taylor recently, and I know you're going to enjoy this conversation on today's episode. Well, Cameron, good morning, and welcome to the podcast. Welcome to Kitchen Conversations and thanks for being here. I um took a moment this morning and I asked ChatGPT to tell me how busy Cameron Taylor was, and uh I'd be interested in your reflection on what it had to say. It said this isn't a guy running a few clinics on the side. This is a full-scale operation, year-round programming, multi-location camps, private coaching, leagues, international training trips, and on top of that, building a brand that's positioning itself as one of the premier pickleball academies in the country. And I thought that was pretty flattering. Would you agree?

SPEAKER_01 1:09

I mean, I can I steal that and uh, you know, put that up on our website and my my maybe my LinkedIn bio there. That's great. Um, I mean, I would be the one hesitation I would have on that is I I definitely haven't built this brand and this business by myself. I have my wife Colleen, uh, who's a huge part of it, as well as we have a director of operation, uh Nadine Hughes, who works full-time in our business. And we have an amazing team of coaches uh and individuals that that we have involved with us as well. So I mean, for you know, for them to be able to go in and pull that, I mean, I'm definitely not doing all of that by myself, but I mean, I appreciate the uh the respect that we're receiving. Um I'm also and what's not pulled up there is I also do uh NCCP facilitation. Uh so I travel all around uh Ontario and Canada, uh facilitating Coach the Coach's opportunities, which is great too.

SPEAKER_00 1:59

So yeah, well, Cam, you've done it all and you're doing it all. And I know when I first started the game here in Kingston at the Kingston Pickleball Club, one of the first names that kind of floated up to the surface was Cam Taylor, you know. And I know you've got a connection with the club in some way and through Ryan Haynes, Pam Bid Nost, and some of the founding members. And so I've kind of known you through name for for quite a while. So it's a real pleasure to get a chance to spend a few minutes with you this morning. And I also want to thank you uh not only for your time this morning, but for bringing guys like Ken Bakarski into the game and into the coaching world. And Ken and I met at a tournament, a true north tournament in Kingston, and he's just become a buddy. And uh, you know, I think the game is better off with more people like Ken uh being out there and coaching and his philosophy and his approach. And and so I want to thank you for that as well. You saw something there early on, and I appreciate you doing that with Ken.

SPEAKER_01 2:43

So well, yeah, there's definitely some flashbacks there with the Kingston Pickleball Club. Ryan and I go way back. We used to play uh in quite a few tournaments together. We would we would do some traveling and and we actually started doing some coaching and stuff together. Uh so yeah, definitely and Pam, another another flashback name there as well. To uh long before the facility in Kingston was built, we were working out of the the curling club there uh in Kingston and and doing some stuff at the In Vista Center, I think, who's where nationals and stuff. So yeah, yeah. Uh I mean Ken Pikarski, what a guy. Uh we're we're so lucky to have him. He's been with us um, you know, since we kind of started to expand this from an I business to a we business. Ken's been Ken's been a huge part of that. And I mean, he takes on a variety of different hats and roles. We're we're extremely lucky to have Ken for sure.

SPEAKER_00 3:30

Yeah, well, you'll notice this the backdrop to the screen today, and that won't necessarily be the final edit, but at the very bottom corner by you is it says all round nice guy. And that was at the request of Ken Pikarski. So I he reached out and he said, Would you mind doing this for me this morning? He said, Absolutely, my friend. So that's uh that's the root of that little note there at the bottom of the page.

SPEAKER_01 3:49

Well, as long as you go back and tell him that he has the greatest veneers in pickleball, I mean, you know, he has best smile in pickleball, and uh you you already know what I'm talking about, right?

SPEAKER_00 3:59

So Yeah, I certainly do. Yeah, well, I've had a chance to do a podcast with Ken. I've got uh Pam, we did her and featured her on the podcast last week, uh Cam, and uh I've got Ryan booked to come on, of course, his new role with pickleball Canada and all that he's taken on, and uh it'll be a fascinating conversation. So yeah, well, listen, great start to this morning, and uh appreciate all of that. If you don't mind, I I like breaking these conversations down, Cam, into three kind of rallies to keep in the spirit of the game. And uh in rally one, I'd love to talk a bit about your background, your working career, you know, maybe some of the sports that you've played in the past that brought you into pickleball. And then in rally two, I want to jump into this great game. I mean, it's a game that uh it's changed my life, and I know personally others who it has done the same for. It's just a game changer, it's a life changer, and uh, so I want to hear your passion for that. And then rally three, I'd like to spend as much time as we can there talking about tailored pickleball, uh, talk about the academy, talk about your camps, your vacation packages, and all that you're doing there. And I know that's evolving. We talked a bit off camera, so we definitely want to get into that in rally three. So, that aside, can I invite you to start with rally one? Give me a sense of your background if you don't mind, Cam, and kind of some of the things you did growing up as a kid and the sports that you loved, uh, you know, as a Canadian kid growing up here in this great country. Awesome.

SPEAKER_01 5:10

Yeah, definitely. I mean, so it's it's interesting. I mean, growing up um from a like a work standpoint, I was always in entrepreneur remote. Um, like my parents had businesses growing up, so I was always working in those. Um, as part of that, um, you know, I then started to explore what I wanted to do as I grew up. And I uh firefighting was going to be a passion of mine. I went to school for firefighting, I went to school for paramedic as well. Um, I was a volunteer firefighter in Sable Beach, where I grew up for 13 years. Um during that time frame, I also started to transition into restaurant management. And um, you know, I was in restaurant management for uh about 15 years. Um, and that's kind of where, you know, during that period of time I started to find pickleball was, you know, I happened to be available during the day, during the week. As, you know, as a manager of restaurants, I was primarily working evenings and weekends. So I was able to kind of, when pickleball was being played, I actually happened to be available, which was very rare at that time for somebody in my age category. So it kind of worked out naturally there. Um, but where that work background, whether it was the firefighting or whether what it was the restaurant management, uh, really allowed me to kind of launch into pickleball, is I've always been in the customer experience business. And to me, uh being a pickleball coach or provider of pickleball programs or events or vacations or camps or whatever we do, ultimately we're still in the customer experience business. And the medium that we're using is just pickleball at this point. So I've I've had this background of talking to people, working with people, engaging with people, providing positive experiences. And it's really it's that mindset that I've taken into what we do in pickleball that I think has really lent us to being successful.

SPEAKER_00 6:54

Yeah. Well, there's so many parallels that you can draw in life and pickleball, I think, Cam. And I I see them, you know, constantly. And uh the friendships that you forge, you know, on the court are lifelong and they seem to be quick, you know, and we'll get into a bit of that maybe this morning as we get into rally two. But yeah, it's just such a game. And uh, you know, the moment you step on the court, you're done. I I think I warn people if you step on the court, you there's no turning back. That door will shut behind you, and from that point forward, uh, you're gonna be in it for life. So so as a kid growing up, was there one other sport that kind of you would highlight as being the one that you thought maybe there's a future in this for me? Was it basketball, volleyball, anything like that? Did you play hockey as a kid?

SPEAKER_01 7:29

Yeah, so I mean, my I I always say my sport background is volleyball. Um, so that's the sport I grew up um, you know, playing competitively. I played it a little bit post-secondary. Um, I also stayed involved in volleyball uh from a coaching standpoint as well as a refereeing standpoint. So I'm a level three volleyball referee, so I would do um, you know, college and university matches. I would be involved in the you know Canadian nationals and provincials here in Ontario. And um, that was my ability to stay into that game at a high level. Um, but yeah, I find there is a lot of transferable skills from volleyball to to pickleball. Um, as much as people always say, like, hey, if you have great racket sport backgrounds, I think then some really great synergies coming from volleyball as well. But I'm assuming anybody who's got a sport that you know background says it translates well.

SPEAKER_00 8:16

So yeah, fascinating. Well, volleyball was a big part of my wife and I, you know, we we had two boys who played high school volleyball. One of them won off the gold one year, which was a big deal, triple A, and uh, you know, went to the the big show, if you will, for for high school. But uh, I'm not afraid to tell you, but I hope no one else is listening, that I cried at that last game, that last high school game, because I knew neither of the boys were going on to, you know, post-high school uh sports in any particular way, pick up stuff and some rec league stuff. But uh yeah, it was a moment as a parent, you know, to be on the bench and know that was the final game for the kids. It was a bit of a heart tug for me for sure. But it's interesting to hear you say that about volleyball, Cam. I don't think anyone's mentioned uh anything other than racket sports being sort of a helpful start to the game of pickleball. So soccer, I think, maybe have come has come up on a on a podcast or two about footwork. Um is there something specific about volleyball that you would say lends itself to pickleball when you when you say that?

SPEAKER_01 9:05

Yeah, like I mean, I think one of the really, really interesting ones for me is like when we think about our defensive positioning, right? And how as a volleyball player you set blocks on edges to, you know, kind of be into the court and stuff. So having your paddle prepared in a position almost like you were blocking. Um, the ability to relate to people about how you would do a push block versus a soft block, and a lot of you know, individuals who are up at the no-volley zone kind of stand there with their paddle prepared in a soft block where you want to be pushing it forward to be able to press down on the ball. I find there's a lot of kind of synergies in those conversations with people that are struggling to handle pace around the no-volley zone. I find that really connects as well as, you know, almost we always talk about like following the ball or following our partner on the court, but like setting yourself up to be successful on how you want to play that next ball is no different than an outside blocker setting the edge, right? You don't want to be kind of reaching, and we used to call those flow box flocks or drift blocks, right? A lot of people play defense like they drift block or they float block, right? So we can really start to have that translate to people that kind of get that concept.

SPEAKER_00 10:08

Well, I love that. And maybe that's encouraging to someone listening, Cam, because the goal of the podcast is very simple. It's not to monetize the channel in any way, it's just to get the word out to spread the love. And I woke up in January with a sense of responsibility to try to give something back to the game. And I'm not going to be a Cam Taylor or a Cam Pikarski. I'm I'm I'm not good enough to coach or train or teach, but if I can somehow motivate just one person that's listening today through this podcast and maybe something you say uh to pick up a paddle, you know, for the first time and try the game, I think then I'll be happy. It's all I'm looking for. The one comment that says, hey, I heard the podcast, I gave it a try, and I loved it. Um so I think, you know, people maybe misinterpret the fact that, oh, I've not played any racket sports, I probably wouldn't be any good at pickleball. So I'm really glad you went there today in the volleyball. So thanks for doing that.

SPEAKER_01 10:52

Yeah, Mike, just on that one point there, I think that's such an interesting comment that you have there because I have so many people that come up and say, Well, I'm not going to be as good as my friends because I haven't played tennis or I haven't played another sport. And I mean, my favorite comeback at that point is, well, great, you don't have any bad habits yet. So here we go, right? Like, yeah. So yeah, I do think I think you're on the right path there. And I think that's a great message you're trying to put out.

SPEAKER_00 11:15

Well, I appreciate that. Yeah, because I brought some really bad pond hockey, not even real hockey, Cam, but pond hockey habits to golf. And they haunt me today. I mean, they I look like I look a little bit. Happy Gilmore had nothing on me. I mean, absolutely nothing on me when it comes to my golf swing. So yeah, it's a great start to the conversation. I appreciate all of that, and I really appreciate you touching on how other sports can, in fact, help you get off the court and get going on this game. So, well, listen, rally two, let's get into it. This is just the greatest game in the world. I'm gonna start with that. I'm sure you would agree with that. Tell me how it started for you. In other words, did you find it cam or did it find you? And do you remember maybe your very first game and hopefully the person or people that kind of brought you into the game? You've brought so many in, you've helped so many grow and learn and fall in love with it. But uh, what's your story as far as pickleball in the start that you had with it?

SPEAKER_01 12:01

Yeah, it's really easy for me to remember because he won't let me forget uh that he's responsible for everything that I do and keeps asking for royalties on all of my business. Um, but it's it's my uncle Scott. Um uh so he lives he lives down in Woodstock, and uh even though he's you know of that generation uh ahead of me, him and I were always very competitive with each other growing up. So whether it was baseball, whether it was golf, whether it was, hey, let's go to the beach and all of a sudden we're throwing a frisbee around and this becomes into some kind of competitive game. There was always something. And he kept talking about this, you know, silly game called pickleball and uh, you know, no interest in it. And finally one night he kind of wore me down where he said, I don't know what, no idea what this game is, but I'm gonna kick your butt at it. Right. And I went out and he happened to get my butt kicked by all the other individuals that were on the court that you know had different colored hair like than I had, and you know, whatever. And um, yeah, I was I was very motivated from there. Like you said, got on the court, fell in love with it. It was a great way to I was in that weird phase in my 20s where I was transitioning from like, hey, I was really competitive in sports, but I was kind of losing that edge, and that kind of allowed me to fuel that little bit of a fire there, which was great. And I mean, this is back in 2012, um, when I first started playing, and I mean, trying to find pickleball spaces at that point was was difficult, right? So I was living in Salville Beach still. Um, I would be doing like this tour of driving to Hamilton, driving to uh London, driving to Doorknock, uh sorry, Dorchester, um, to try to play. Yeah, we had to travel, Kitchener Waterloo was a big hub for us to be traveling to at that point. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 13:46

Yeah, it was hard, wasn't it, Cam? I don't think today's players, those coming into the game today with the sheer number of indoor courts, outdoor courts, you know, is a lot of momentum behind the game, clearly. And I've that's you know, kind of an that's a redundant statement. We all get that part, but I don't think we, me included. I started maybe three years ago, and of course I mentioned Pam Bid Noss, Ryan Haynes, the Kingston Pickleball Club, and they came online, you know, a few years, several years ago now, but uh it just wasn't there. And people were bringing the game back from Arizona and Florida and trying to, you know, find ways to play, talking to cities, municipalities, trying to clean up tennis courts. It was it was a grind. And so uh yeah, we we're lucky today, and those coming into the game today are very lucky, and uh yeah, I appreciate that. We we all have that person, and it was actually Pam Bidnaz for me. She was a neighbor and a friend that brought me into the game. And do you think there do you think on that note, Cam, was there something about the name that held it back? I mean, it started, you know, as we both know back in in 65 in Bainbridge Island with the guys and the kids and whacking the ball around. But do you think if it had been called, you know, kill ball or you know, beat your buddy or like I wonder did you think the name in any way held it back? Or do you think because I think there was a time when people were, I wouldn't say embarrassed, but you know, a bit awkward, you know. Do you play pickleball? And there there just seemed to be this, nah, it's not not for me.

SPEAKER_01 14:55

And yeah, that's interesting. Um, I don't know, I don't know if it held it back, but I do think it was it provided a hurdle for people to start trying to play the game, right? Like, so I don't know that it held it back, but it definitely was one of those things, like it was almost like became a little bit of a secret club that you had to like know how to get into it to start with. And I can remember telling people, and you kind of mentioned earlier in uh, you know, in our conversation where you were saying, you know, once you step on the court, like you better be prepared. And it was the same thing. And even though social media and the influences were quite different, like as soon as you started playing, your like, you know, I can remember talking to my mom and she's like, I never see anything about pickleball on on social media. I'm like, well, start playing, and that's all you're gonna see, right? Because it it just changes who your friends are, you know, who your contacts are, what you're kind of searching and following. Um but yeah, like I don't know that the name necessarily held it back, but I do think what it did is it provided almost like an excuse for people not to try the game, right? That were kind of like, you know, hey, like sitting on the fence, or this is an old person's game, or why would I play a stupid game? It's called pickleball, whatever, right? But as it also like, once you started playing, then it's like you're part of the club and you embrace that name and you love it and you love the unique aspect of it, right? I think that's where anyone who plays pickleball at this point would probably not want that name to be changed because that's part of the identity of the whole game, right?

SPEAKER_00 16:23

Yeah, it is. It's one of those words. I don't know if this, not sure if this happens to you, but every once in a while, maybe it's just the way my brain does not work the way it should. But I'll I find words odd sometimes. Of OF sometimes makes me chuckle. I don't know why. And and you know, when you say pickleball, like if you just say it as a standard, if you don't use it in a sentence, if you just say the word pickleball, it's just got such a fun ring to it. And uh, yeah, I I agree. I think you try changing that name, there'd be a it'd be a mutiny at the high seas. It wouldn't go well. So yeah, it's great. You know, it's I talked to someone in the UK, uh, Cam when I first started the podcast about a month ago, and I asked him, it was Patty Hunter Murphy who runs a senior pickleball tips Facebook group. And I think he's well over 140,000 people now that kind of follow him along each day and each week. And uh I asked him, you know, coming from a 50-year tennis background, what he thought the success in the game was, what was driving the growth. And he really tied it back to the length of the game. And I'd love your insight on that. You know, we go into a social play, let's say on a Tuesday, meet a couple of new people, make friends quickly, get out, play 11, 12, 15 minutes. We come off the court, we're chatting, you know, and then we rotate back in. Or would you agree with that that the length of the game is partly due, you know, is playing a role in its success at this point?

SPEAKER_01 17:28

Yeah, I I think that's uh a great perspective, especially for some some individuals. Like I think this is where the transition and kind of the, you know, the image that was being presented about pickleball is like, hey, like when you're ready to retire from squash or tennis, because those games would, those matches would just be generally longer, right? So when you're ready to retire, you can go play the shorter game. But what it also does, I mean, in in the open kind of presentation that pickleball originally was when we were showing up to our clubs and you were dropping in and you would rotate, which is kind of like what pickleball was when you first started. There was no booking your own courts and there wasn't really programming for this skill level and that skill level. It was like, hey, play starts at nine o'clock and it goes till 12 o'clock, and you line up and they have different ways to kind of manage that. I mean, I think that's where that whole social aspect of pickleball really took off, right? And created this climate of, like you were saying, it's not just that you know, you become addicted to the game and you play in your life around, but your social circles completely change, right? And my wife and I talk about this all the time is like we really struggle to connect with people outside of our pickleball group as a separate social group at this point, because I mean, especially from a work standpoint, but even like a recreational choice standpoint, there's very few things that we can we have the time to be able to do outside of pickleball. So that social group, that social network changes. And I think part of that is speaking to what he was talking about with the length of the game where you could go on any given day. And let's say that you were to play three hours of pickleball if you're doing your math on 12-minute games plus breaks and rotations, you may, you may hate hit eight to 10 games in that, and you could have three different people on the court with you in all of those games, which is just such a cool aspect of that.

SPEAKER_00 19:16

Yeah, what a great point you've made about that social network, though. And I would echo that a hundred percent, Ken, this morning. We had dinner, you know, last Friday with a guy that I just met and his wife. And, you know, I'm playing with him on Tuesday now, you know. It just and it's just click, click, click. And uh, you know, I I yeah, our entire network is sort of evolving now around pickleball. My wife plays very socially. In fact, I'm not convinced that her and the girls keep score. It's like it's it's that much fun. There, it's it's as Ken said to me in his podcast, that's a hit and giggle game, and they love it, and they have probably more fun than everybody else that's at the club that morning. But she came home one day, and I've mentioned this previously, but uh it's worth repeating. And she says to me, I'm, you know, the girls and I are thinking of going to Iceland. And as most husbands would do in that moment, I nodded and said, Well, that's nice. And well, geez, if they didn't do it, you know, and these were people that had just met playing pickleball a couple months previous. So off to Iceland, these these five or six women go and they shared accommodations and rented a car and drove around Iceland for a week, you know. And and and, you know, Cam, none of that happens without this game, you know, none of it. And so when you start talking about that, and I guess, you know, to make the point one more time here, you know, the goal of the podcast is to get the person listening right now to pick up a paddle and give it a try because it, yeah, it's a game. And you, you know, this is what we whack around, you know, it's a little wiffle ball with a bunch of holes in it. And that's part of it. And that's that's enormously fun. I mean, I love it, but I I really do love the social side and the people that I've met. And it just seems that there's a um a process of friendship that happens so much quicker at pickleball than it would, say, through a work environment or almost any other sport, you know, that that I've been involved in in my life. It just seems to be an almost immediate connection to people. So yeah, great points. Well, thanks for all that. I love it. And uh I I uh do you get a chance to play at all? Like, I mean, just play for fun. Is that like I mean, forget the competitive. Do you do you ever just go out and play for fun? Is there time for that?

SPEAKER_01 21:01

Yeah, I mean, we're we're trying to figure out how to carve out more of those times, more of those opportunities for us as we kind of go through here. Um, you know, there's there's one of the battles that I'm constantly fighting is I mean, we all we all love this game pickleball, we all love the opportunities that it provides. You know, I don't want I don't want it to start to feel like work, right? And there's times where it starts to border on, hey, this is work. And I mean, you know, like like most of us in our working backgrounds, we don't necessarily enjoy going to work all the time, right? And you know, it's it's a fight to make sure. So, you know, we're trying to find, you know, the opportunities that my wife and I get to go and play. We try, you know, she's uh setting up groups to start to try to go and play. I'm trying to find, you know, opportunities to go and play. I'm still in that weird phase where like I still think I can be super competitive, and then I have to remember that I probably can't be, and you know, and and and try to balance that as as part of that. Um but yeah, you know, we We d I I do like to be on the court. I like to get a hit in, but I it definitely doesn't happen as often as I would like it to at this point.

SPEAKER_00 22:07

Yeah. Well, you know, I've I'm convinced. I'm 59, uh, Cameron, sitting here today, and uh I've I came to the conclusion probably in my mid-40s that the brain and the body do not age at the same pace. It's it's incredibly unfair, especially to men. I think women are smarter about it. I think they recognize that, you know, okay, my time has come and gone. Not us, you know, we're still thinking, you know, my brain's you know, my brain's about 37, probably. My body's definitely, well, my body's probably 63, but my brain is 37. I keep trying to tell myself I can play pickleball for six hours a day and still walk the next day. And uh, yeah, it's a bit of a challenge. Yeah, I just love it. So we'll it's great. Well, thanks for all that. Well, listen, let's get into rally three because that's where I want to spend most of our time. I am uh intrigued by your family business, your model. We come from a family business background. My wife and I went to work every day for 30 years together, uh, came home together, ate dinner together, spent our entire life together running a family business. And so I have a sense of what that's all about. And I wouldn't have traded it for all the money in the world, Cam. I just wouldn't. It was just the greatest experience for me and for her, and it was her parents' business. We sold heating and cooling product and uh loved every minute of it. But it it is a unique relationship. And I'd like, you know, spend a bit of time explaining how tailored pickleball came to be. You know, when did that seed get planted? And what were the steps that you and and your wife and ultimately, and I really appreciate you complimenting your team as well, because for Frances and I, um, you, you know, 50 years in business, uh, Cam, you'd never hear us say we had anyone that worked for us. We had a culture of working with us. And it was just something that her parents drilled into us when we first started. We carried that culture forward. It was very important to us to speak in those languages, you know, in that language as opposed to for and with. And it you you change that one word and it changes the entire relationship that you have with your team. And we had about 55 or 60 people that uh came in and worked worked with us every day. And so we sold that business in in 2017 and uh, you know, uh have enjoyed a little more time to play pickleball. But uh yeah, I'd love to hear your story on that, if you don't mind.

SPEAKER_01 24:07

Oh, it's great. Um, so like I mentioned, uh I I started playing pickleball in 2012. Um, I played in my first Canadian nationals in 2013, right, which was out in Abbotsburg, BP BC. Um, my uncle Scott, who I learned the game from, him and I took a road trip and we went out there and kind of hit the national parks and finished in Abbotsford and and played in there, and just like some experience to like at that point, Nationals was way more open than it is. So there's a lot of Americans that were coming up from, you know, Seattle and in Washington State and all that, um, which was great. So it kind of opened us up to like what the game could or should feel like. Um, coming back from that, uh, you know, 2014, 2015, there's like pickleball was still really kind of green, and like we were talking about kind of that climate of secrecy and like nobody wanting to talk about it. So like there was no coaching going on, everyone was figuring out everything as it was going. And then maybe as you started to be a little better on the court or you started to win more games, people would be, you know, asking you some questions. Hey, like, hey, is there is there something that you're doing that I'm not doing? And you know, that's when the coaching brain of and you know, my background of what I was doing starts to trigger a little bit here. But at that point, you know, to ask somebody to pay you money for that was like not not happening, right? It was really it was a really interesting um climate that was being created. People wanted information, but you know, either there was no market for that still, or the market hadn't evolved. So it was still trying to work through those processes a little bit. But then coming into 2016, 2017 is when you know that that transition to there was some coaching um products starting to be put out of the states. We had a couple individuals that were starting to do things in Canada here. So the opportunity to start hosting like group clinics or working with a pickleball club because some of the more um bigger centers were were starting to have pickleball clubs being coming established at that point, and you could put on some things, and again, like from where the business is currently to where it was back then was still like extremely different, but you know, $15 for a private lesson or $20 for a private lesson, which was really just kind of getting people used to the process of exchanging money for this service. And 2018, my wife and I started uh we moved to Collingwood. Um we started a not-for-profit pickleball club at that point. Um, um, so we started the Georgian Triangle Pickleball Club, which is still running um at this point, uh, to fill a void kind of in the community. And it also created a an opportunity for us to start to experiment with some of our programming that we wanted to do. We started to run tournaments, we started to have a captive market that we could run a captive market that we could start to run clinics and and private lesson opportunities. And I worked with uh the facility at Blue Mountain there as well. So I had we had a lot of options at this point. Our business was still uh really an i business. It was like Cam Taylor on the court. My wife, um, she was on maternity leave at the time, and we kind of managed the pickleball club um at that point. Um, and I was still working full-time in in restaurant management. Um and then um, you know, as much as you know, COVID has been negative for a lot of individuals, uh, it was actually really positive for us because it gave us some time to reflect on where we were kind of at and what we wanted to do from a business standpoint. So just going into COVID um prior to it happening, I was getting really busy with pickleball. I was traveling more. Um, it was great to have the opportunity to go to different communities all across Ontario. I was even starting to explore some communities outside of Ontario at that point. And we were kind of at the at the point where it was like, hey, is this a a leap that we take? Like, do we really believe that pickleball could be something that I could do or we could do full time? And you know, COVID kind of pushed us in that direction. Why not? Like, you know, been out of work. Um, you know, where obviously everyone was out of work, especially in the restaurant industry at that point. And then coming back, uh, yeah, with full steam ahead uh out of COVID, uh relaunched the business where I was full-time in it. And and very quickly um we recognized that there was a bigger opportunity that it couldn't just be about me being on the court and we needed to expand into that we business. And Ken Ken Pakarski was a great individual uh early on. We also brought Corey Osborne on um as well, and Corey and Ken were instrumental in us taking our business from that I to our we business. Um and it's just kind of gone from there. The next couple years after that, out of 2020, you know, we expanded our team to have different regions. Um, we still have a lot of those original team members involved with us at this point. Um, we went through some health issues with my wife, uh, which during that process in that time, um, Nadine came more into the business. And uh as part of that process, she's now our full-time director of operations. And really, probably to 80% of the people that deal with Taylor Pickleball, she is the business, yeah, right. And right, she's uh, you know, manages a lot of the stuff that we see, and then I'm the the encore piece of of what we do at this point. So we've really been able to take like what we were doing with just myself and then kind of work to expand it. And then uh, like there was just been this huge shift in these about the last 18 months, 24 months, specifically in Ontario, where facilities are opening up everywhere. And I mean, you know, anybody and everybody that you talk to is is probably gonna be talking about you know the facility boom that's going on and how this is gonna work. And I mean, you could probably run multiple podcasts and just on the shape of what that's gonna mean and look like, right? Um but for how we do is we need to continue to evolve our business. Where, you know, what we used to do is we used to have um our team and our and our pickleball family that would travel the communities. Well, now some of these communities don't need us to travel to teach them pickleball or learn to play anymore, or early beginners, because we have so many great coaches out there that are that are able to do certain levels now, and we need to figure out how we evolve, and that's kind of where our camps, our campcations and our vacation businesses really start to step up is that hey, there's this opportunity that we have coaches introducing the game, uh, which now which is great, and we have kind of that next step. So if you think about like a learn to play being a 101, coaches are really great at doing 101s and 102s, which would kind of be the next step. But then in that, you know, advanced beginner plus intermediate phrase is where we kind of are finding, hey, this is our niche, and these individuals are looking for more, right? An hour and a half clinic is great, but we want longer experiences, right? We want higher bang for our bucks, we want, you know, more of a premium experience. And then that's where we've started to shift a lot of our energy and focus. And out of that, we kind of have three streams that have developed, and we have our high performance camps, and our camps are usually two-day camps. Um, so you know, Mike, if you were to sign up, you would sign up for, you know, uh a two-day camp. You would participate on two different days. Uh, gives you an opportunity to kind of diffuse the knowledge a little bit more. It's great, it allows us to have a lot of time on the court together. Um we have campcations, uh, which are a little bit of our hybrid model. So they're not like a full, all-inclusive vacation where you think that your flights, you know, your food and your excursions and your travel and your hotel, all that's included in our vacations generally, right? The campcations are more Canadiana-based. They're, you know, destinations that you know Canadians are generally interested in traveling to anyway, and they're looking for pickleball opportunities, and and you know, we kind of set those up. So it's, you know, this summer we're really excited. We have um we have PI, we have um Quarter Deck, which is in Nova Scotia, um, we have the Yukon, and then we have uh Okanagan Valley. And those are our four campcations that we're running this year over the summer. Uh, all locations that people are looking to go to and travel to anyway, and then figuring out well, hey, we want to play pickleball, and oh, here's a great opportunity that we can still learn and have people to play with. Um, so we we kind of facilitate those. Uh so those would be our campcations, and then we have our vacation stream as well, which is um big focus on the Caribbean, people looking to travel in in the general, you know, the the Novembers to February is that kind of time frame in the Caribbean. So we do like um Mexico and Punta Cana's were our original standard ones. Um, we're building upon those. We're adding uh a Turks and Caicos as well as a Jamaica into that mix uh this upcoming season. Then we do um outside of that, we've we've gone to Croatia. We we did a Croatia experience, which was unbelievable. Uh we're just about to launch the Croatia 2027, which is gonna be great. Um, we fly to Italy at the end of May, so we're doing an Italy one at the end of May. Um, and then uh in 2027, we'll be launching a Portugal and Spain one. Uh so yeah, there's just a lot of really cool opportunities coming up. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:31

God, Cam, I was gonna try to convince you that selling furnaces for a living was the most exciting career one could have. But uh I'm gonna I'm gonna let that one go. I think I think I'll I'll park that attempt. Yeah. What a life, what a career, and what a way to do it. And congratulations on all of that. I you've just put together, I think, what we're all looking for, you know, and the ability to plug in perhaps to what you're offering. There's not just one item on the menu, if you will. And I love that about what you've done there. And uh, and I would just it, you know, I want to mention Nadine as well because she's somebody that I've not connected with directly but indirectly. And uh she's just fascinating, you know, at her job. She's just, yeah, she's just a great person to have out there and uh appreciate you mentioning her as well today. And I think one of the hard things in a family operation cam is to, you know, step back and and trust. And I, you know, I say that carefully, but you know, when it's your baby and it was our baby, and and maybe a little different for us than that her parents had started it. So we felt a strong sense of responsibility to them as well as ourselves and growing the company and growing the business. And so, you know, we we needed to uh allow that to happen. And it really was an important moment in our business. So it's great that you you're there and you're doing it and you're seeing the benefits of it. So congratulations on that. Yeah, what a what a story. What a story. Appreciate all of that. It's just great. I think um, you know, I'm watching the clock, so I'll be very careful. I promise to try to get you out of here in 35 or 40, and we're just bumping up against 40. So just a couple of final questions, Cam. I'd love your insight on. Um, and I'll give them to you both at the same time. One is how important is that relationship in on the coaching side? I want to get back to that just briefly, but I I've asked this of other people on the show, and I'm interested in your insight. But how important is that relationship between, you know, whether you call it a client or a student or a player and that coach? Because, you know, I had an experience that didn't go particularly well with a coach, and uh, he's a great coach, knows what he's doing, great player. I uh it was me. You know, we just didn't connect. And uh so for those listening that may have tried coaching in pickleball at one point and it didn't quite work, the connection wasn't there, they didn't get the benefit of what they were hoping to get. You know, I'd love your thoughts on the important role that the relationship between coach and student or player uh plays. And also, do you see AI? We mentioned it out of the gate. I'd asked Chat GPT about you, and and I'm wondering where you see AI potentially fitting into coaching, not necessarily in the moment, but perhaps down the road. And I'd love to hear your thoughts on both of those.

SPEAKER_01 35:46

Yeah, great. No, um, so first off, I mean, I think to answer your first question, I think it's important to keep in mind, like how, yeah, like, you know, I'm sorry that you had a negative experience to start with with a coach. I mean, that that can potentially, you know, for certain individuals, if that negative experience was so bad, or you know, everyone has individual triggers where they're like, well, I'm never taking coaching again. That can be such a like a turnoff. Um, so I hope that you're willing to explore, you know, future opportunities. And it really does depend on like you have to build trust in a relationship with uh, you know, again, like not sure that I like the word student, not sure that I like the word client, but you know, it is really a partnership in learning. And and it's really important that especially in a private or a smaller group situation, that it's all about the learner. Too many coaches come in and here's what we're gonna learn today, Mike. Here's what I want to teach you, right? But it's not about what I want to teach you, it's about what you need to learn, right? And that has to be the relationship, and that's like that has to be part of what we're structuring when we put this together. Is if you're coming in, and especially for a private life lesson where Mike comes to Cam and says, Hey, hey, um, you know, I'd like to take a private lesson from you. And I'm like, Great, here's what I'm gonna work on for you, Mike. And you're like, Well, I don't need any help with that. Like, right, well, of course that's gonna be probably a tough relationship, and there's gonna be no trust in there. And I mean, at some point too, when when we get into it with our players, it's it's not just about the skills, it's it's about the person and being able to take those skills and put them into play. And if there's no trust where you're gonna open up, and some of the conversations that we might need to have could be pretty vulnerable about like, hey, I'm I get really nervous, like in you know, male-to-mail conversations there where you tell me you get nervous in a competitive environment, you have to be pretty open with me uh as part of that, right? Not everyone's willing to have those conversations. So um I think it's really important that you know you're able to create that trust. And then the challenge that we have is, you know, and and we'll go back to our vacations for a second. Um, you know, our Mexico vacation in November, we had 84 students on it, right? And the ability to to still make that learner-centric or learner focused where they're feeling like what we're learning is a the more excuse me, what they're learning is about what they would like to learn and and some of the opportunities that they need to improve their game, right? That's the challenge when you get into these big group environments. Um, and I think that's one of the reasons that we're extremely successful is that we don't make it about us, we make it about our learners. And um, yeah, like this, and then what this does, I think, is it feeds into your next question is you know, the role of AI is, you know, that that human touch, that human connection, and that ability to still be able to have a conversation and be able to adapt on the fly. Because it's one thing for a coach or an instructor to write curriculums and then just read from it and deliver. And I mean, at some point, AI is gonna be able to do that. And here's what we're working on today, everyone go do it. But having that ability to have a conversation, have a recognized recognization of what's going on on the court, and then being able to adapt on the fly and put together something that's actually gonna benefit your students. Um, where I think AI is going to fit. And I mean, there's some great tools out there right now. Um, and I mean, you know, neither one of us have a relationship with any of them, so we're not gonna plug any of them, but like um, you know, where they can analyze video and give you a ton of data, and I could come back to you and say, hey, Mike, um, you know, what we're gonna do is I know you I know you reached out about a private lesson, but why don't you submit a video to me and you know, we'll analyze this video. And when we get together, we can have a quick conversation. And as our conversation comes together, I can be like, Mike, uh, based off the video that you sent, I noticed that um, you know, two out of 10 of your serves were applying pressure to your opponents. And on those two times, you were you won the rally because of that. But every time that you didn't apply pressure on your serve, right, uh you you weren't winning the rallies because they were able to apply pressure to you. Do you think that's something that you would like to improve upon? And you're probably going, I didn't even notice. Yeah, I think that would be like, hey, if every time I'm applying pressure, maybe I should be doing that more, right? Great, right? Like, so AI can be a great tool for data, I think, right? And you know, the ability to expediate that process. Um, yeah. So I think that's kind of where I would think it's gonna fit into. And, you know, just like any good profession, if you're not using your tools that are available to you, you're probably not doing the best job. And it's just finding like, is it the right tool for the job? Right. I think is gonna be the interesting piece because I think some people are going so far that they're they're using this tool as an everything tool, right? Which I mean, we can't, we can't, as coaches or as uh professionals in this industry, we can't lose our ability to connect with our students. And I think that's one of the most important things that we do.

SPEAKER_00 40:59

Yeah, well, I love all of that and appreciate your insight, Cam. You know, I'm an old school sales guy, so I'm still I love looking people in the eye and I love that human connection, that human touch. And and I I'm, you know, obviously at the age I'm at, I'm gonna fight this and I'm gonna push back. But I it's here to stay. AI is here to stay. And I think to your point, there's a there's a a spot, a space, a need perhaps for it at some point in in not only pickleball, but in just a broad sense. And uh, but how we use that and how we apply that, I think is critical and it's important. And uh I appreciate, yeah. And I'm really happy we had a chance to get to this question about coaching, because uh to me, there's someone listening today that either has not tried coaching, is intimidated to try it, worried that, you know, there may be someone listening, even Cam that says, I'm just not good enough to even, you know, start with coaching. And I've always said there's a couple things you should do before you play pickleball. One is you should read the history of pickleball, the book that Jennifer LeCour wrote, and and get a sense of the history of this game, because I think that's important to understand the foundation to the game. And the other thing is I think you should take at least a learn to play, and then maybe a follow-up lesson after that. Get the foundation down. And uh, because there's something I call the accidental reset at the beginner social level. And it's really fun to watch. And I see it regularly at the clubs that I play at uh Cam. And that's when you've got a bunch of people that are just whacking this ball back and forth, and and it's it's a you know, it's just a firefight, and then all of a sudden somebody makes a mistake and there's this accidental reset, and all of a sudden you've got the rally that goes from three or four to six or seven. And I think the game really starts to become I I think it was designed around long rallies, in my opinion. And if you can learn to get into longer rallies with this, if this can go back and forth over the net seven, eight, nine, ten times, and you can slow it down, speed it up, and get, you know, maybe an intentional reset, you will see a side of this game that, you know, if you're not doing that, you can't fully appreciate. So take some coaching. If you've had a bad experience, give it a second try, give it a third try, make that connection and uh and get out there and enjoy this great game.

SPEAKER_01 42:53

Right. And I think, and I think that's so important too. Like, I mean, and that's one of one of the great things about pickleball is how easy it is for individuals to get started in the game. But it's also one of the most difficult things about the game, right? Is how easy it is for people to get started. Because there's like, you know, as an adult, if I wanted to learn to play hockey, because I've never played hockey, there would be a program that I would go. Like I wouldn't just go jump out on the ice and start playing hockey with people at a pickup game, right? I would go through a program to start. If I wanted to at this point, like, you know, as an adult, learn to play baseball or whatever sport, like there would be a like a formal process that I would go through to get started. Pickleball, it's not as well established. However, like I mean, with facilities coming on board, it it does become more established facilities offering introductions to the game. And hey, if you sign up for a membership, you get a free learn to play or you get a free like development pathway or whatever it is, right? Or a discounted one, which has been great because it's allowing this kind of plant in. The one thing that I would want to add to you, I would love for that to be changed, like coaching from a certified professional, right? Right as as part of it because like when when we run the NCCP courses, like there's no sport that that you take in Canada that you're not learning from an NCCP coach, whether that's youth hockey, whether that's youth soccer, whether that's tennis, whether that's any other sport, you can't learn this game from anybody that's not certified through the NCCP. Right. And I think it's really important that they're learning on that pathway because what that changes is when we teach people at that level, we're not just teaching them the skills and like you're talking about the accidental resets and they're not just focused on like, hey, I should be slowing this down. We teach the why. We teach the coaches to teach the why. And if you understand the why, well, then you're gonna be more motivated to try it, right? And that's such a huge like awakening for students when they start to, hey, I'm maybe gonna still struggle with the what I'm trying to do, but I understand why I'm trying to do it. It makes a huge difference, right? And I think that would be a shift I would love to see in you, Mike, is in the next time you explain that to somebody, it's like, hey, they're learning the game from an NCCP certified coach.

SPEAKER_00 45:11

Consider it done. It's a great point, it's a valid point and appreciate it. I knew this was going to be a great conversation. I knew I'd come out of it learning something, and so that's definitely gonna be at the top of that list. And and I'll I'll be very mindful of that going forward because if there's anything that you get too much of in pickleball, it's advice. I mean you can't play enough, but you also can, you know, there's just a constant flow of advice and and thoughts out there in the court. And there's a lot of people that, you know, they think they're playing at a certain level and it's a challenge, and they want to share that knowledge. And it's all well-intentioned, Cam. It really is, but it can be it can be harmful, it can be hurtful. So yeah, great points. Well, listen, I'm gonna let you go here in a second. Was there anything we didn't touch on? The only thought I had was the Canadian National Pickleball League and uh maybe your relationship with that. Did you want to touch lately on that and where that is? I did have a chance to meet four of the six Kawamotas a couple weeks ago and had a lovely chat with Linda and Jessica and Stephanie and Matthew, and uh it was just a great, great chat with them. But I'm following that to a lot closer now than I was, and uh I think it's something we want to promote. The podcast certainly wants to promote more of what they're doing as a league and uh you know the important role that they're playing here in Canada. So I just I just wondered if there was any final thoughts or any thoughts you had on the CNPL.

SPEAKER_01 46:16

The the Kawamoto's are the best. I mean, uh, you know, have a great relationship with them. Uh Matt is Matt is one of our um contracted uh on our vacations and stuff, you know, contracted professionals. So Matt's come on quite a few of our vacations. He will be coming back on our vacations in the upcoming round, which is great. Um yeah, long, long history of pickleball with the the Kawamotos, uh, which is great. Um, yeah, CNPL. I was uh one of the the four original founders um that started that league. Um, you know, was quite involved in that for the first two seasons, and then you know, through some of my wife's health, I've had to take a little bit of a step back. And obviously with uh the focus on our business and stuff, I'm not anywhere near as involved in the CNPL, but still follow it. I know, you know, most of the players still, most of the owner, the team owners, and engage with them in conversations. And I'm definitely very excited for where that's going and just seeing more opportunities for uh professional pickleball play in Canada is great for everybody.

SPEAKER_00 47:15

Yeah. Well, listen, we all love ALW, we all love Ben Johns, but you know, Captain Kalamoda, we know we've got we've got to pound our chest here and raise the flag, if you will, in the pickleball court camp. We've got some great players in this country. And uh yeah, I get a chance to talk to I think three people directly connected through the league uh in the coming weeks ahead. And I'm excited to learn more and share more. Because I would say to you that going into my club today and talking to the average pickleball player and asking them about if I said what is CNPL, they might not even know, you know, and I think we're most aware of it's there, but I think and I I think we're gonna see a shift in that. The social media is gonna gain a lot of traction here in the next couple of years with it and uh doing a great job. And I just love it. And the bit I've learned about it in the last few weeks, I've really enjoyed.

SPEAKER_01 47:54

So I'm not sure who you're speaking with, but I know everyone who's who's there, they're all pulling in the same direction and and they're doing a really nice job creating a presence, and and they they've done some really nice things with alignments and partnerships to hopefully explore and grow that reach. And I mean, we've also got a lot more buy-in from the top players uh that are participating in that league right now. So it does become more of a defining aspect. If you want to be considered a pro in Canada, you are participating in that league now, which is great. And I mean, they continue to do great things, and I think it's it's only good for the game of pickleball if they do.

SPEAKER_00 48:28

So yeah, it really is. Well, listen, thanks for all this this morning. Any final thoughts you wanted to share? I appreciate every minute you've given me today. So thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01 48:36

No worries. I again, like I think happy to happy to be involved and and have a conversation with you. I think uh kind of your meaning and your your path is great, and uh, you know, kudos to you and the respect that you deserve as well, Mike.

SPEAKER_00 48:48

Well, I appreciate just trying to grow the game that I love. And you know, it's funny, whatever that moment was in January, Cam that I mentioned earlier, that I woke up and felt I need to find a way to give something back and I know my limits. And so this might be it. This I may be in over my head on this even, but I'm gonna keep trying trying to get the word in. If I get one comment one day saying I've played this game because of your podcast, then I'm gonna hang up my headphones and be really happy about that. So and uh I will mention to our uh uh you know our friend Ken about his great veneers for sure, 100%. Because he deserves to be poked as much as he pokes me and you and everyone else that he encounters.

SPEAKER_01 49:19

Best veneers in pickleball. Sure, yeah.

unknown 49:22

Yeah, I love it.

SPEAKER_00 49:23

Well, enjoy the rest of your day and all the best to what you're up to. And uh, you will find me on one of those vacations one day. Fun. Well, listen, Cam, enjoy your day. Appreciate all this, and thank you again. Thanks, talk you.