Voices Unlocked Ep. 18 | Bubbles & Brick Walls, Time Matters, and Lorna in the Hot Seat

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In this episode of Voices Unlocked, the hosts share a disclaimer about not being therapists and encourage listener self-care, then swap roles to put co-host Dr. Lorna Brooks “in the hot seat.” Lorna explains how she moved from wanting to be a child psychologist into prison research, initially focusing on women in custody before dedicating her work to children affected by parental imprisonment through projects like Time Matters.

She describes her PhD research on how families experience support, including interviewing Liv’s mum, and explains the title “Bubbles and Brick Walls,” inspired by Liv’s drawing and another parent’s metaphor about barriers to help. Liv reflects on meeting Lorna at age eight, how Lorna’s safeguarding and advocacy helped reduce shame and empowered her to speak safely at conferences, and shares an example of Lorna supporting her family on her mum’s release day. They close with mutual gratitude, mention Lorna’s move to Australia, and invite listeners to share stories and tune in next time.

Chapters:
00:00 Important Disclaimer
00:34 Role Reversal Setup
02:44 Lorna Origins
04:51 Prison Research Pivot
06:52 Meeting Olivia Family
11:54 PhD Journey
13:18 Bubbles And Brick Walls
15:53 Release Day Story
18:40 Giving Kids A Voice
21:13 Safe Space to Share
24:58 Healing Through Speaking Out
28:03 Bond Beyond the Journey
28:45 Kitchen Discos and Breakups
29:36 Ethics of Youth Visibility
31:48 Gratitude and Future Plans
34:43 Final Thanks and Sign-Off

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey guys, just a quick disclaimer. As always, we do not claim to be therapists or counsellors. We are just sharing our stories of experiences that we have had from someone with lived experience and someone who is a researcher and a practitioner. When you are listening to these stories, please take care of yourselves as they can be a little bit heavy. There's some funny stories in there as well. Obviously, we are open to positivity in the comment section, please. Like I said, these are all truly based off people's lived experiences. So thank you so much, and I hope you enjoyed the episode. Love you, bye. Hi guys, welcome back to our next episode of Voices Unlocked. Now I know you're probably wondering what the hell's going on. Why are you in Lorna's seat? Why isn't Lorna next to you? Why is Lorna sitting in the guest chair? All these unanswered questions, guys. Chill. I'm getting there, I'm getting to the point. Today, I decided I wanted to put Lorna in the hot seat. Now, poor Lorna hasn't got a clue what I'm gonna ask her. She hasn't got a clue what's going on. And I just thought, roles reversed, let's do it. Because why not? I feel like just putting you on edge a little bit. I'm nervous. Oh, don't be nervous. Got nothing to be nervous about. So basically, I'm gonna ask you five hard-hitting questions. I'm joking. No, I just thought, like, we've spoken about how we met. We've spoken about how you're supported me. Yeah. And we spoke about all about that, and like you everything that you know professionally is amazing. But I don't think people out there actually understand how much of a superwoman Lorna is. So I wanted this episode to be all about Lorna, and I wanted her to experience what it's like being a guest on the podcast because you co-host it with me, but you've got so much information, and I just think how you got into doing what you do is just phenomenal, and like it's got to the point now where you are family to me, do you know what I mean? And we've worked with each other for years and years, and I just wanted to give you the floor. So in this episode, I'm gonna be asking you some questions that I want to ask ya, and I want you to answer as honest as you want. Yeah, honest. So you need to like do an oath for me and everything we're taking this court style.

SPEAKER_00 2:23

So do you solemnly say to tell the truth and not unput the truth? I I do. I do We're never married.

SPEAKER_01 2:36

Besties for life, married. No, um, okay. Okay. So Lorna Brooks, Doctor Lorna Brooks, may I adds. Um, I just want to know from the beginning how you got into this work that you do now. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 2:53

Um, well, I I don't know if I've actually said this on a previous podcast, so apologies if uh I am repeating myself, but I did always want to be Maria from the sound of music. So basically, the first love of my life was Captain Von trapped and probably still is, and I just watched the sound of Captain Vontrapp. Just give myself a little bit of water.

SPEAKER_03 3:22

It's to Captain Vontrapp. Cheers. Anyway, cheers, the hills are alive.

SPEAKER_04 3:33

No, they we no anyway. So um listen, I'm supposed to be in the guest here. You have to listen. Um, I don't know. I just my mum um was a nurse and a counsellor all her life. I think it's kind of in the genes that a little bit like your family, you know, we're with with helpers, it's in our family genes. There's a lot of paramedics, and um, my brother's a psychotherapist, and yeah, there's a there's a lot of that going on anyway in our genetics and our family makeup, and I always wanted to be a child psychologist. I always wanted to just be surrounded by kids, yeah. Um, and I wanted to have loads of kids myself, so it's really interesting that I'm the mum to only one child, which um you know, for for for various complicated reasons, but yeah, I just I've just always loved kids. I always just imagined this kind of fantasy world where you know people would be singing like Doe Deer and all of the it wasn't didn't obviously quite transpire. Yeah, we'll play heads down, thumbs up instead, yeah, which I still don't fully understand the rules of that, but anyway. Um, but yeah, no, and I wanted to be a child psychologist and just help kids, I guess. But I never obviously imagined that my hyper focus would be children impacted by parental imprisonment because it wasn't even something that I'd considered. Uh I just there's no degree in it specifically. I'd gone to uni and then I'd gone travelling to Australia, and then I'd done a master's degree and came back, did my master's in psychology, going, I'm gonna go into like the clinical doctorate. But then I just got invited to go in to do some research in style prison initially, and then it ended up being in in other women's prisons and male prisons and youth offending prisons, and my initial hyper focus was actually female, female offenders and why they were stuck in that kind of revolving door. And so I thought that that was going to be my specialism was hyper focusing on helping women in custody, but then it it wasn't, it was only because I just by chance was speaking at a conference and I was saying all these mums and dads were worried about their kids and we need to do something for the kids that I then suddenly got the opportunity to trial a project for children you know with imprisoned parents, and I just I just fell in love, I fell in love with the kids, I guess. I fell in love with you, and I just thought, wow, I need I need I just need to do this. I need I just what I want to do this, and I always say like it's healed so much of my journey because my journey's been not I don't have or haven't ever had a parent in prison, but I've had my I always say like I've had my own stuff like everybody. I've got my own traumas and challenges and things that I've found difficult and I think being part of being part of something that has felt like a f an extended family has healed parts of me that I didn't realise I needed.

SPEAKER_01 6:52

Yeah. I think with you I remember being eight years old and meeting you for the first time and my anxiety was through first of all, I thought you was another social worker and thought, ugh I've since working with kids in residential care, I've got a whole brand new different respect for social workers, by the way. But at the time you were scared, I was petrified. My favourite TV show was Tracy Beeker. So I always used to think about Elaine the Pain. So anytime a social worker would want to be in touch with me, I'd always used to go, oh, it's Elaine the Pain, Elaine the Pain's coming.

SPEAKER_04 7:32

So you thought you were getting interrogated.

SPEAKER_01 7:34

Yeah. So I thought this is just gonna be someone else to interrogate me about my mum. I don't care, I just want to see my mum. And then we sat at the table in my nans, and you made me laugh. But it was weird, it was like when I seen you, I knew, like, I knew like, oh, like when's she coming back? And he used to ask me nan all the time, when's Lana coming back? When's Lana coming back? And I just think the I'd never met anyone like you who'd I who'd was a professional but had the outlook that you had. I was immediately comfortable. You created such an enabling environment for me that was just amazing. And one thing I wanted to mention. Actually, um Did you meet my mum first before me? No. Or after me?

SPEAKER_04 8:25

After because I no, it it it was after get me timeline in in in order. Um because it was it was between the times that she'd gone away when you were eight and when she went away when you were 13. I was doing my I'd I'd been running my project for a while at this point. Um, but then I realized lots of people were saying, oh, this is really great and it's really helpful, but I didn't really know how to prove it as is possibly the wrong terminology, but I just I saw the opportunity and I thought I need I need to do I need to do an actual formal um you know ethically approved research project on that, which is why I I wrote my PhD. And my PhD was, you know, how do people, when when there's a family member in prison, how do they experience support? And that can be they they don't experience any support or they experience support badly, or though, you know, how do they experience support? And I decided I wanted to interview children. You were one of my participants. I wanted to interview grandparents and and I also wanted to interview people that had been in prison and that had come out, um, but people when I'd supported their children whilst they were away. So I remember approaching, I think I approached your mum, I don't know whether I approached her via Nanny Ginge, but I approached, I somehow approached your mum and I was like, would you be interested in being a participant for the inter and I was already in communication with her anyway, because when she was out, it was right that it was it was really tricky actually because obviously I'd only ever communicated with your grandparents, but respectfully she was your mum. So when she came out, it was it was like who who do I now communicate? Because I didn't want her to feel left out, you know, of the communication. So now I'm now communicating with both your mum and your grandparents, you know. Well, Olivia's coming to a support group this week, and and and this, that, this. So I'd started to build up some contact with her anyway, and then I got ethical approval to do that that PhD, and I and I said to her, Do you know, do you do you want to be a participant? And I I interviewed her in your nanny ginger's house on the couch. On as you walked through the door, it was the couch on the left, and it and me and your mum, and I think your nan was in the room actually at the time of the interview. I think she sat on on a chair and and I interviewed your mum. Um, and it was it was one of the most powerful interviews. I think and you've you've never to this day heard that interview.

SPEAKER_01 11:07

Never.

SPEAKER_04 11:08

I wanted to, it's a it's a hard interview to listen to, I've got to be honest. Like your mum suffered a lot of stuff. Yeah, she had a hard time, and I think that that that was possibly one of the reasons, you know, you know, that led to some of the challenges that she she faced and continues to face, but but she she she gave a very, very honest interview, you know, about how how much she missed you when she was away and then some of the the the wider challenges.

SPEAKER_01 11:38

I do genuinely want to hear that interview at some point. Like I like I'm ready, I want to listen to it before I go to Australia.

SPEAKER_04 11:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:44

I feel like listening to that is gonna close a chapter and so many unanswered questions, and I feel like I'm at the age now where I'm like, yeah, I'm ready to hear that.

SPEAKER_04 11:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:53

I do want to do that. Um can we talk about the name of your PhD? Yes.

SPEAKER_04 12:00

So obviously, two and a half to by the way, I got did my PhD in just under three years. Just want to put that out there. Unusual. Thank you. My daughter, uh single parent, and Matilda was three when I started it. I'm enjoying it. I I was scared of this interview and actually really enjoying it. Yeah, she was three when I started it, and she was six when I I got it. And I, you know, and shout out to my mum and dad at the time because it was I was Simon and Big Trev. Yeah, they at weekends I used to drive to Stoke, pass over my little child as a single parent, and then just lock myself in my childhood bedroom to write and write and write my PhD, 80,000 words, freaking hell. And you know, my mum would be like cooking Sunday lunch and say, you know, you need you need to come out and eat. And I'd be like, I can't, I can't, I can't even. And I was probably horrible as well at the time. I don't, you know, poor Matilda and poor my mum and dad, because I was it was stressful, and I didn't, you know, just sat sat in my back bedroom going, just leave me alone. I've got gotta write, and you know, co-pilot didn't exist then, so you did have to write every single sentence yourself. Like, you know, there's no prompts. Um so yeah, so you you get to the end of writing your your PhD and then you're trying to come up with some cool fancy title, and it ended up being called Bubbles and Brick Walls. And the reason why it was the bubbles came from you because you when we when we used to do some of our sessions, I think one of them I said, like, draw me a picture about how you feel. And you used art a lot, and you drew this picture, and there was like three kids all in school uniform in the picture, and then one of the kids, which was you, you drew in a bubble with like two other, like as if they were like two other kids. And I was like, Why are you in a bubble? And I've remember you saying, I just feel like I want to protect myself by putting myself in this kind of bubble where people can kind of see you, but they don't really fully see you. You won't be really, really good at metaphors, even from a young age, but it's quite flimsy, it can pop easily, so I'm not that well protected. And I remember going, freaking hell, that is so profound. Deep. I think you were 10 when you do that picture. Yeah, like and I was like, wow, so and then another participant, another mum that I interviewed, not you not your mum, but another mum. I I've specifically remember in her interview, she said when it all first happened when when my husband went to prison, I just wanted to put me and the kids in a box. And I and I I just wanted to like, you know, so it was a bit like I wanted to protect myself, but every time we try and get help, there was always brick walls. So it just evolved into to the metaphors that people said, and it really relates back to what Yanan was saying in in in like the previous episode of like, you know, that kind of protection and wanting to shut yourself away. So yeah, it just evolved into bubbles and brick walls.

SPEAKER_01 15:12

I remember drawing that picture because I remember I remember feeling as a kid that I was wrapped in bubble wrap constantly, and at this age now I'm so grateful for it, but I felt like I was wrapped in bubble wrap and I just wanted to protect everything everything about me. Like I just wanted to be able to have a childhood while dealing with everything else as well. And I think I always say the only reason I was able to deal with it as well as it did was because of you and because of what you did for not only me but for my family. So just a quick one this whole episode is just being appreciative of Lorna, like genuinely. Erm my nan can't drive. I lived with my grandma Ginge, love you, Ginge. I lived with Ginge, and no one else at the time drove in my family. And it was my mum's release date, and I think it was the day before my mum's release date, actually. We had no one to pick my mum up, she had no way of getting home. Lorna had Matilda, who was a tiny baby in a car seat, me and my nanny ginge in the car, and she drove all the way to the establishment. Waited for hours for my mum to be released because she was putting rollers in and air, um, waited hours for my mum to be released and then drove us all the way home with her baby in the car. Like you did not have to do that at all. And you did that for my family and for me. And I remember me nan. My nanny gins loves you so much, like she adores the bones of you. And I remember me nanny gines just saying, Oh, there's no there's no one find me a woman like her, because you can't. Find me a woman like her, because you can't. Like you couldn't, you couldn't write it, you genuinely couldn't write it. And I remember my mum being in the car, Gavin, why is everything moving so fast? Yeah, I remember that. You don't be in mind as well. My mum's not quiet. She was singing Shoop in the car by salt and pepper. She was, and she was going, Lorna, do you want to listen to me rap? Remember that? I can actually wrap up. Lorna's proper egg and wrong, no, you're so good. And I'm thinking, Lorna, please don't feed into that because she's not gonna shut up the entire time.

SPEAKER_04 17:42

I was so worried we weren't gonna get all your mum's stuff. She remembered the we opened the boot and she had a lot of bags and we were like squashing them all into the boot.

SPEAKER_01 17:50

We were literally like sitting on the boot, squashing, like squashing eggs.

SPEAKER_04 17:54

Squashing all of her stuff into the boot.

SPEAKER_01 17:56

It was in bin bags, wasn't it?

SPEAKER_04 17:57

It was, which is sad.

SPEAKER_01 17:59

It was bin bags. She came out with bin bags. I remember seeing the bin bags and being a little bit overwhelmed. Yeah. Feeling like my mum's getting bin bags, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_04 18:06

It's not, it's not it's a it's a bit like the whole care situation, isn't it? I do feel like this should be some more dignity.

SPEAKER_01 18:12

When we have a child transitioning anyway, we get them a suitcase, a suitcase or an actual pack and bags.

SPEAKER_04 18:20

Yeah, it's moved on a lot.

SPEAKER_01 18:21

Yeah, it's cheap wouldn't put anything on a bin bag for anyone.

SPEAKER_04 18:24

No, sorry, it's Yeah, it was bin bags, but it's I would like to think, and I'm but I actually don't know the answer to that that when people are leaving establishments these days they are taking their stuff in at least hodles or suitcases.

SPEAKER_01 18:40

So tell me about the first time you realised like wow, like we these children's voices need to be listened to. Like what was what was the the moment where you've gone because as a professional now, my anxiety of asking a 10-year-old if they wanted to do a conference.

SPEAKER_04 19:08

I know, I don't know to be fine.

SPEAKER_01 19:10

What was I thinking? That's a bit mad because like me now being I'd be like, um how do we ethically, how do we go about this?

SPEAKER_04 19:19

I I yeah, I I don't know. I think it was just I just knew that you guys from the onset were the experts by experience, and I knew that if we could do it, I think it, I think you're right. I think I think everything has to be done case by case and individual by individual basis. Um and you have to really get to know the child. And I'd already known you for two years by this point, and I like I think I knew you well enough, and I knew that you had so much love and support and safety around you, and I knew that we could do it in a closed setting. And you know, like we said, like before in previous episodes, when when you did other stuff, you know, we we protected you with with name changes and and stuff like that. But I just I I just think if if the child is one got the right love and support around them from school and family, if they're the kind of individual that wants to, wants to, you know, share their opinions and and have their voice heard. I I just I I just felt like that was the instinctively the right thing to do to give you the opportunity to say that this is, you know, this this is this is what I feel and this is how I think things should change. And obviously we did put like quite a lot of we did put a lot of prep in. And you were just you you were like your nan. You had you just had so much confidence. And I just see over the years, I I do think you do have to be really mindful. You absolutely 100% can't just have a child go and speak at a conference and there'd be no pre or post support. I mean, that that that'd be actually dangerous, but I think because we set things up in such a supportive way.

SPEAKER_03 21:11

Supportive, it's unbelievable.

SPEAKER_04 21:13

Yeah, I mean, I think obviously in the setting that you're in, it would probably be you know entirely different. I think you work with a a completely different kind of cohort of young people, probably.

SPEAKER_01 21:25

Um I think for me it it was just it was e it was an easy, yes, done deal for me, to be honest. It was the conference that it was in an enclosed space. Um we spoke about it, they spoke to me nan and stuff about it.

SPEAKER_04 21:42

We knew who was in the audience, people couldn't take photos, stuff like that.

SPEAKER_01 21:47

Yeah, it was it was so proof like it was I was so safeguarded to so many levels. Yeah, it was unbelievable. Like there was everything to protect me, and then even after it. As well, but I remember speaking and falling in love with it, wanting to do it again. Even like the radio, what we spoke about before of me going under his Bethany, like everything was to protect me and me family, and you did that so well and you navigated that amazingly.

SPEAKER_04 22:18

I think you have to navigate it very, very carefully. I don't think you can do this kind of thing without real thought and real care and real attention. But I've always been really a big follower of um an amazing person called Brene Brown. I think she's from she's a an American um American woman who's her background actually, funny enough, I think was in social work. But anyway, she's but but one of one of the things that Brene Brown says is that um you know shame shame exists. I've got we don't want to misquote her, but the essence of what she says is that you know shame can't really exist when when when you're kind of open and you and you speak your truth. Um and that and and she talks a lot about like vulnerability in a in you know in in safe environments, and I think Yan alluded to that earlier.

SPEAKER_01 23:15

It's vulnerability is powerful, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 23:18

The most creative people embrace vulnerability.

SPEAKER_01 23:22

You have to embrace the you being vulnerable makes you the strongest person in the room, yeah. Because how petrifying is it to be vulnerable when you think about it? How many people are scared of vulnerability, but the minute you step into that and you step into your vulnerability and you own it and you speak on it.

SPEAKER_04 23:42

I want to Google one of Brennan Brown's quotes to get it to get it right.

SPEAKER_03 23:46

So it's healing.

SPEAKER_04 23:47

I think I think I think people heal in spaces um where where they can where they can share their truth because shame can no longer exist in those spaces. But she says it so so much more articulately she says here vulnerability is not winning or losing, it's having the courage to show up and be seen when we have no control over the outcome. Um, and she says this is all this is this is Brene Brown um as well. Um what what does she say about strength? And she says, if you are not in the arena, also getting your ass kicked, I'm not interested in your feedback. Courage starts with showing up and letting ourselves be seen. Courage starts with showing up and letting ourselves be seen. And I think there's something in allowing people to go, yeah, this this is part of my story, and through that, I don't need to be ashamed anymore. I don't need to keep everything bottled up and inside. But yeah, but you but you're right, it has to be done very safely and very carefully.

SPEAKER_01 24:58

I think you help me not to be ashamed, you help me not to feel embarrassed. You gave me I had the spark, you just lit it.

SPEAKER_04 25:14

Well like it's in the genes, I mean interviewing you now.

SPEAKER_01 25:17

No, I know, but what I mean is like I could have went two ways with how I reacted to my mum being away. And a lot of the time to this day when I still struggle with my mum, I can hold it in. Like I mentioned something to you before and you went, oh my god, why didn't you tell me? Why didn't you say anything?

SPEAKER_02 25:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

And it's because a part of me sometimes gets scared of that vulnerability. But the minute I speak to you, or the minute I do a podcast, or the minute I go to a conference, or speak to people, or public speech, I get empowered again, and I feel like no, I I can actually do this. Like it's what mean alluded to in the last episodes. I I find healing in this. Yeah. Because I remember before look, I'm 25 years of age, and Lorna will still safeguard me to death's door. And before we did this podcast, up until the day we were recording the very first episode, she went to me, Are you sure you want to do this? Because we can back out now. Like she didn't care, she didn't care what what we'd spent on it so far, she didn't care how far we come with it with the idea. She literally said to me, If you want to drop out now, we can. And I think I've always said, No, because it's me healing, it's how I heal, it's how I process what is happening. I have to be vulnerable, I have to be in my vulnerability and find strength in my vulnerability to be able to overcome or handle and at least deal with the fact of what I've gone on with because I always say I'll never overcome it, so it's not something I will always overcome. No, I will just learn to live with it, and I will learn to live the happiest state I can be in with it. Because I'm the happiest of girls, I'm very happy, I'm a happy person, quite joyful actually, I like to think. Um but I think I've been able to process and go through what I've been through in a healthy way because of you. I've found a healthy way to do it because of you, and I'll forever, ever and ever and ever be grateful for that because I don't think I'll be able to without you.

SPEAKER_03 27:41

That's a lovely thing to say. I genuinely don't emotional.

SPEAKER_01 27:44

No, I genuinely don't think I'd be able to do what I've done.

SPEAKER_04 27:46

I I I I always think I think you would. I think you you it it it's who you are, and I think I think you and your family, you know, you you you would have found a way with with or without me. I think I'm just privileged to be part of the journey. No, no, no, I disagree.

SPEAKER_01 28:03

I feel like me and you now she's now say debate now. No, I think me and you, genuinely, I think me and Laura are covered from the same cloth. Like I feel like it's so weird. I feel like we'd known each other in past lives.

SPEAKER_04 28:14

I think Yeah, I absolutely do think it's I I I really like I feel like obviously we're bonded because because of the journey that we've had, because of your mum and me knowing you since you were eight, and we've we've got to know each other. But even if you even if you took that away, there's some weird weird like in terms of our personalities are very, very, very similar in so many ways.

SPEAKER_01 28:42

Lorna, we need a separate podcast.

SPEAKER_00 28:44

No, we do because I lived with Lorna for like over a year, and oh my god, I think that was one of the most outstanding like years.

SPEAKER_01 28:53

That was the best. Yeah, can we just say I mean I went through a breakup, so that was all it was like I went, it was so weird. I went through one of the hardest times of my life. I literally went through I was with someone for six years and went through like a heartbreak and breakup.

SPEAKER_02 29:11

No, you were like crying in the bath. No, I was crying in the bath.

SPEAKER_01 29:14

I didn't leave the house. I was like, I couldn't cope anymore. But it was also one of the best years I've ever experienced we had the best times.

SPEAKER_03 29:22

We just had the best of laughs of kitchen disco legendary the Andes Chippy night.

SPEAKER_01 29:30

Yeah, have demolish an Andy's Chippy night now, too.

SPEAKER_02 29:33

Yeah, we'll go get food after this, shall we? Shall we? Well, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 29:36

No, I I I am I am forever grateful, and I do, and I think you know, and funny enough, I have just weirdly written a whole book chapter about the ethics of children either being being seen when they are particularly vulnerable. Obviously, the academic in me, I can't help myself talking about kitchen disco, but it's I would I would say that's one of the hardest things to to navigate in as from a professional standpoint, because professionally, you know, obviously, number one, it's our job to protect children, but is pr is uh keeping everything a secret and hidden always the most protective thing. So it's public speaking isn't for everyone, there's lots of kids that come to Time Matters that just want to listen or just want to do the the art or just want to go on the activities, that's absolutely fine. But I do think for some children in the right set of circumstances, sharing stories is extremely powerful and extremely healing, and ultimately it's our job to learn from you guys. Like, who wants to listen to who wants to like I went to a conference yesterday with two young people? Do you think they wanted to listen to me? Of course they didn't, they wanted to listen to them because they're the most important people in the room. Of course. Um, but yeah, kitchen discos. We're gonna have to have one hell of a kitchen disco before you trust.

SPEAKER_01 30:58

Well, I'm having a leave and party. I don't know why I'm telling the whole podcast. Do you know why I'm telling the details of the leading? I'll link below at the bottom. I'll send you all out an invitation. Yeah, no, don't have to be Mark one hell of a buffet.

SPEAKER_00 31:11

Mark would let me have to club it.

SPEAKER_01 31:21

You don't know the date.

SPEAKER_00 31:26

Invite only off. Yeah, invite only.

SPEAKER_04 31:29

No, but um but if you would like to private message to see if you can have an invite.

SPEAKER_00 31:34

Yeah, actually, if I do actually know you then I haven't sent you an invitation yet, please message me because I'll invite you. Um sorry, I don't know why I'm plugging this in my leaving party. It's literally about Lord, and now I'm talking about my party.

SPEAKER_01 31:46

That's okay with the selfish only child syndrome. Anyway, but yeah, I wanted this whole episode to just take a little look at you and who you are and what you've done for all of us at Time Matters, and I want to say from me and Time Matters, and Voices Unlocked, even though Voices Unlocked is literally just me. Yeah, from from Voices Unlocked and from Time Matters, especially. Thank you, and we love you so much, and we wouldn't know what to do without you. Um we just can't wait to see where your journey goes next.

SPEAKER_03 32:19

No, Time Matters Australia.

SPEAKER_00 32:25

Oh we've said it now. Wait a minute.

SPEAKER_04 32:31

Hold on. Oh, let's just put a put a pin in that.

SPEAKER_01 32:34

Coming back to that, mate. Time matters. Yeah, time matters perth. Here we go. Anyway, but yeah, so yeah.

SPEAKER_04 32:42

It's changed my life, and it's changed my daughter's life. I started this when I was pregnant with Matilda, and she's never known another life other than Time Matters, and she's made the best friends, and people that came to her 18th the other week, and you know, you and and so many family members that have got her back and my back, and I think being a single mum, as a solo mum, and a lone parent with one child, it it would have been a very isolating experience. Yeah, now you've been a family, but it isn't, and that's because of you guys.

SPEAKER_01 33:15

I think I'm gonna be a mum by myself. Let's just think I'm gonna do it on my own. I want a baby next year.

SPEAKER_04 33:22

But no, I I'm so my gratitude is is to the time matters families for for being for being a my extended family always and and changing mine and Matilda's life.

SPEAKER_01 33:34

My gratitude you know what my gratitude is gonna be, it's gonna be you, isn't it? The whole episode's dedicated to you, so it's obviously you. My gratitude is you. I don't think you will ever understand how grateful I am for you. I don't think words can actually describe how grateful I am for you. You are another being, you are not of this earth, genuine. You've got a different type of soul, you've built different, and the love I have for you is so unconditional that you are gonna be you're in my life forever. Forever. Listen and right back at you. I just think this episode was needed. I mean, needed and appreciated. Maybe we'll have a Launa Day. National Launa Day. National Launa Day. I don't think ethically that'd be a lot. Yeah, but yeah, as always.

SPEAKER_02 34:24

Thank you so much. I love you so much. Always you're my whole life.

SPEAKER_03 34:29

Cry. Don't let me cry. Can we but can we have Matilda as a guest one time? Shall we? That'd be good. That'd be good. Growing up with time matters, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 34:36

And like as an outside, like talk talk about being that girl and what it was like to play that girl. That'd be good. But, anyways, thank you so much for listening. As always, please tune in to the next episode. And if you've been watching, thanks for all the support.

SPEAKER_03 34:54

If you've got any if you want an invitation to Liv's party, no, please reach out. No, please don't reach out to her because she will send you there for a laugh. Um, and shout out to Andy's Chippy on um Lot Lane Best Chippy. Honestly, me and Liv have had so many Andy's Chippies. No, it's actually not normal. Like it's actually I want an Andy Chippy.

SPEAKER_01 35:18

Can we tag Andy Chippy at the bottom?

SPEAKER_04 35:20

If you want the best scrum ever, honestly.

SPEAKER_01 35:24

Straight down, Andy Chippy for the chip chip arm or heavy. Anyway, yeah, if you've got any stories, anything you'd like to ask us, our emails at the bottom below. So please reach out. And as always, hope you'd have a gorgeous week. Um, thank you guys.

SPEAKER_02 35:40

Love you.