Medicare School Daily

The 10 Year Social Security Rule For COUPLES | April 29th, 2026

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0:00 | 57:19

Did you know a 10-year marriage can impact your Social Security Administration benefits?

In this live event, we’ll explain how the 10-year rule works for couples, divorced spouses, remarriage situations, and when a spouse may be able to claim based on an ex-spouse’s record. We’ll also cover common mistakes, timing considerations, and real-life examples that can make a big difference in retirement income.

Join us live, ask your questions, and get clear guidance on one of the most misunderstood Social Security Administration rules for couples.

SPEAKER_02

Welcome to Medicare School Daily. If you were married for at least 10 years, and maybe you're no longer married, there are some special Social Security rules that you need to know about. And in today's episode, we are going to talk about that. Uh, thank you for joining Medicare School Daily. We're so excited to be here with you today. If you need help with your Medicare situation, you have come to the right place. Medicare is confusing. There's a lot of people out there trying to sell you something. And welcome. We are here to educate you, demystify everything so that you know exactly how to get on the right Medicare plans uh with confidence uh and no confusion. Uh Medicare School Daily is brought to you by MedicareSchool.com. We are a team of insurance brokers, and our goal is to uh not only educate you through programs like this, but also if you need help or when you need help, comparing Medicare supplement plans, Medicare Advantage plans, drug plans, uh prescription drug plans, dental plans, vision plans, all of the types of plans that go along with Medicare coverage, we would love to help you. So if you ever need help, I'm gonna give you our office phone number. You can rewind the show and listen, uh, catch this number, but it's 800-782-6676-800-782-6676. If you have questions about your personal situation or you have an experience that you think it would be helpful for other people to hear as it relates to Medicare or Social Security or anything retirement related, we'd love to talk to you. If you want to be a part of today's show, uh the phone number is down there at the bottom of the screen. Uh 833-824-2004. 833-824-2004. We would love to chat with you and get your questions answered. And guys, this is an opportunity to talk to my dad, Marvin Music, who's literally the nation's leading educator on Medicare. And you get to talk to him. He's not going to try to sell you anything. You just get to hear from somebody who's seen tens of thousands, maybe hundreds of thousands of cases, educated millions. Um, so take advantage of that, please. So let's hop into the 10-year Social Security rule that if you've ever been married, you need to know about.

SPEAKER_00

All right. Well, uh, we uh discuss Medicare uh a lot on uh our um our program, but we also talk a lot about Social Security, and the reason for that is because uh sometimes they go uh uh hand in glove. Uh we know they're separate decisions, but sometimes people want to start uh Social Security at the same time as Medicare and vice versa. And so I think it's important that people know uh everyone knows the rules that uh apply to uh Social Security. And so if you're um thinking about uh taking Social Security benefits, uh you have some options. You can take your own retirement benefit, uh, you can take um espousal benefits, you can also take uh survivor benefits, meaning you know someone has uh is deceased. Um so uh the way that you do that is going to vary. And of course, today in our our our uh climate of Social Security decisions, uh you have to uh take the benefit that is the the the the largest, uh unless you're taking a survivor benefit. Uh in the old days when we would set plans up for people, we had some options, but we can't do that any longer. So today uh we all have to live by this deeming provision rule that says that whatever is the highest amount available to you, that's what you must take. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_02

When you elect to take.

SPEAKER_00

When you elect to take. Exactly right. So as we uh discuss this particular uh topic today, uh what happens is uh there's sometimes that people uh don't have much of their own Social Security benefit. So if that's you and your benefit is very low, your own retirement benefit.

SPEAKER_02

Why why would why would that be the case?

SPEAKER_00

Well, it's because they didn't either work a real long time uh or uh they didn't have high income. Because when we calculate our Social Security benefit, that's gonna be based upon our top 35 years of earnings. And so let's say if it was a lady that was a stay-at-home mom and her priority was her children, great priority, by the way, uh, but uh probably did not not pay into the Social Security system a lot, so may not have 35 years. So regardless, if we don't have 35 years, they're still gonna uh uh divide our lifetime earnings by uh 420 months. That's going to happen. So that really draws your Social Security benefit down. And so if someone doesn't have a large amount on their own, it's very possible for them to get uh a spousal benefit. And that's what everyone really needs to understand today, and that is if you don't have um uh a large account of your own, if you were married uh but are now no longer married, the rules are this you had to be married uh for at least 10 years or longer. We must prove that with a divorce decree. And uh you cannot remarry prior to the age of 60. So we can still get that ex-spousal benefit as long as we didn't remarry. If we remarry uh uh prior to 60, you cannot go back to that previous spouse. And so as long as you didn't, now we're eligible to draw that uh um uh ex-spousal benefit. So you had to be married for you know for 10 years. And so when you apply for Social Security, um uh they will look at your own account and they're gonna look at that ex-spouse's uh to see what is gonna be the greatest amount. Uh and so that spouse um uh uh uh does actually does not have to be taking uh Social Security as long as you've been divorced um over two years. If you've been divorced younger than less than two years, then that spouse um must be taking their own Social Security benefit. Uh so what they're looking to do is they want to make sure that you're are an independent spouse, meaning divorces over two years. Uh if you've been on a divorce for a year, uh you may have been married ten years, but you may not have a draw unless that spouse is taking their benefits. Um that's the 10-year rule. Um and so when we apply for Social Security, uh you you you you may be eligible for that. So that's that's the rules on it. Okay. That's interesting.

SPEAKER_02

I think when social security when did social security start? Do you know?

SPEAKER_00

I do 1935. I'm pretty sure. 1935, Medicare began in 1965.

SPEAKER_02

Okay. I feel like I was gonna look up percentage of single-income households in 1935. 90% of them back in 1935 were single income. So I feel like when this system was set up, it was set up because it was assumed nine times out of ten that it was just a single earner.

SPEAKER_00

That there was gonna be somebody that would uh be the be the spouse. Now, if um if you are um uh married to someone right now, you actually can can uh draw a spousal benefit as long as you've been married to them for a year or longer, and they're taking. Say it again. Okay, I'm saying that uh we we just discuss ex-spousal, but a present spouse, that uh benefit is also available to us, but you had to be married to for a year, and the spouse you're gonna draw from uh has to be taking social security. So if you remarry, is that what you're saying?

SPEAKER_02

Or you're you get married.

SPEAKER_00

I I get I'm I'm talking about two different scenarios now. I'm saying if someone uh is uh married right now and they have a low Social Security benefit.

SPEAKER_02

So, if you're gonna say they are eligible for a spousal after a year of marriage.

SPEAKER_00

One year of marriage is all it takes, but that spouse has to be taking social security benefits.

SPEAKER_02

So let's say if they were married 10 years, like at what point does that does the It always applies to take it.

SPEAKER_00

It always applies. Yeah. Yeah, they just started that a couple years ago. So in other words, you you cannot draw a spousal social security benefit today unless your spouse you're married to that your neuron benefits uh off of is actually taking Social Security. That's the way it works. It used to be that. I mean remember we used to do the file and suspend.

SPEAKER_02

So you can't take a spousal benefit unless the other spouse's taking social sector.

SPEAKER_00

That's exactly right. It doesn't matter at all. They have to be taking. Um but but if I'm if if you're divorced, then what happens is as long as the marriage lasted 10 years and the divorce is now over uh two years in period, then it that that rule does not apply. You can take it. Exactly right.

SPEAKER_02

But if you and it doesn't affect, does it notify the other person?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that's that's very good, very good, yes. So you're not hurting uh your ex-spouse by doing that. You I mean some people wouldn't want to hurt them, others would like to, but you're not gonna be able to do that. It has nothing to do with that. And Josh, your point is valid because back in 1835, when the Social Security system began, uh nine out of ten, I didn't know that stat, but that's why they want to make sure that the other person, the spouse, was able to get some type of benefit. So that's how this all began.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, so if you take off of your ex-spouse's benefit, it doesn't hurt them, doesn't help them, doesn't do anything. Do they get a notification? Do you know? Not at all.

SPEAKER_00

No, no, because it's it's irrelevant.

SPEAKER_02

Uh but but do they have the ability at a later date to go up to a higher benefit once they're owned? Do you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00

Well, no, member, because of the deeming provisions. So what happens is when they apply when you apply for Social Security today, they're gonna look at your own benefit, which would be 100% of your, you know, your um uh whatever you're eligible for, uh, and they'll compare that to 50% of the spouse. So whatever's greatest you have to take.

SPEAKER_02

Isn't there one scenario that I've heard you explain where it does kind of like it does.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, it's one survivor benefit. So this is the only benefit today where your own account can grow.

SPEAKER_02

So like have a meaningful stuff.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, exactly right. So let's say uh your spouse um uh uh passes away. So what happens is uh you can draw uh survivor benefit. Uh the the rules are if if you were if you you're married and they passed away, you had to be married for at least nine months. That's it. Oh, really? Yeah, that's all. That's all it takes. But if it's um at nine months, but if it's an ex-spouse that passed away, again, as long as you're married for more than 10 years, didn't remarry to prior age of 60, you can actually get off of an ex-spouse uh uh you know uh deceased survivor benefit then. So here's my point. If I'm gonna take a survivor benefit, then uh I I do not have to live by the deeming provision. I can elect to take survivor, and then my own account will continue to grow. Now, could you do that at 62? Yeah, you you actually can take at 60. Oh, a survivor. In fact, and if if you have dependents, you can actually start at 50. Uh but again, most people this age are not. But we can start taking you can st take um survivor benefit at 60. However, you still have the two rules. Number one, you're still going to take less if you haven't reached your own full retirement age, and uh and you also have the earnings test. Uh if you decide to take before full retirement age any benefit, you're still subject to reduction. Even survivor. And even survivor, exactly right. Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

But if you take a survivor, let's say you take it at 62 or 60, whatever it is.

SPEAKER_00

You take your penalty. Take your penalty. But your account continues to grow. And then once it exceeds that or you wait to age 70, you've maxed it out, then you can turn on your own benefit.

SPEAKER_02

When the moment it exceeds it, does it automatically switch over or does it have to be a good thing? No, it does not let it go. No automatic.

SPEAKER_00

You actually would have to call them and say, I I want to take my own now. Interesting. Yeah. Will not happen automatically. You must apply for it. So that's the only way. Otherwise, when you deem you've taken whatever you can. It's the only people that can actually now grow their account.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

Let's just do a quick recap because it can be confusing. So what we're talking about right now has to do with um a spousal benefit. Um and then so if someone uh uh has uh a marriage that lasted at least 10 years or longer, uh, and they did not remarry prior to the age of 60, we know that they're they could be eligible for that spousal benefit. Now, if their own benefit, retirement benefit is greater than that spousal benefit, then they're gonna have to take their own. Uh but if it's uh spousal benefit is gonna be greater, uh then they they would be able to take that. Uh spousal benefit is 50% of whatever that spouse's benefit is at full retirement age. Uh so if I'm if my let's say my spouse decides to wait until you know age 70, uh, they have grown their own account, but that doesn't grow spousal benefit. Spousal stops at that full retirement age. And so if I'm uh been married to someone at least 10 years or longer, then I can go back and draw from them if again, if it's going to be a greater amount. And the and the clarity here, I think, is primarily whenever people are dealing with um a spouse uh that has um uh you know been deceased. Uh and so we can go we can go back and we can look at that again. If it's I'm actively drawing a survivor benefit, meaning I was married to that person.

SPEAKER_02

Thank you for sharing all that. I think that's uh hopefully enlightening for uh uh everyone that's listening today. Guys, if you are uh looking for ways you can get answers, maybe from real people about uh Medicare questions or Medicare situations or your own what what do I do? We have a Facebook group that I would invite you to join. You can go to your Medicare or you go to your Facebook app and type in Medicare School Community and join that app. There's I think 50 or 60,000 people in there that you can ask questions to and get feedback from real people that are on Medicare. Some are our clients and many are not. Um but I encourage you to go in there. Uh, we're gonna answer a couple of questions that have come in on there the last couple of days. And so let's do the first one. Uh Stella said, Can you assist me with appealing surcharges from Medicare since I no longer work? That's a great question. It is.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. So Stella, of course, um is talking about IRMAS. Yeah. What's an IRMA? IRMAS stands for income-related monthly adjustment amount. That's a an acronym that applies to people that have uh uh been uh high income by Medicare standards. Um so if you're out there and you're and you're um uh uh going on Medicare, uh then the Part B premium is going to be based upon uh your modified adjuster gross income. A lot of people don't uh are not aware of that. In fact, I talked to a guy last night, 8 o'clock, uh old friend that called me and said, Hey, will you explain what I need to do? And so we spent about an hour on the phone with this. Is he just starting Medicare? Just starting Medicare. Yeah, actually. High income. Pardon me? High income. Exactly, right? What are those thresholds? Okay, right now, if uh you're a single filer uh and your modified adjusted gross income is above $109,000, you're gonna pay an IRMA. If you're married and uh file a joint return, you're gonna pay IRMAs above $218,000. And they were certainly above those amounts. And so when we go on Medicare, you're going to have to realize that uh your premium may not be what uh the average person pays. The average person today that's below those thresholds pays $202.90. Um but if you're can consider to be high income above the thresholds, minimum you're gonna pay is about an extra $95 a month. High side about $575 a month extra for Medicare. And so what happens though, the government realizes that people may be high income because of your um your salary or your commissions working, but they're also aware that you uh may have a um uh a reduction when you retire or when you semi-retire. So they call those life-changing events. So if I have a life-changing event and that causes your income to go down, then what will happen is you have the right, as Stella is asking about, you have the right then to appeal the IRMA. It's actually officially called a reconsideration. So your reconsideration uh has to be it's a in uh it's a paper that has to be filed. What form is it? It's called the SS-44. SS44. Uh I do want you to know that if you do appeal the IRMA, you can download that that um uh uh that application. It's eight pages long, uh, but you do not have to submit all eight pages. Yeah, it's just the first pages. Yeah, first three pages. First three pages must be submitted. The last five are just simply giving you instructions uh to appeal the IRMA. Now, if you are a client, we'll we'll do this for you and with you, help people with this all the time.

SPEAKER_02

Which was their question. So Stella said, can you assist me with appealing surcharges from Medicare since I no longer work? That's exactly right.

SPEAKER_00

So we can help Stella, we can help anyone that ha has this need that would be our client.

SPEAKER_02

And so Yeah, so if you have if you've gotten a notice of an IRMA, let's ask a couple of questions. When do they get that notice? So let's say let's say maybe you're signing up for the give me a date. Let's say we're saying you're signing up for Medicare, it's gonna start July 1st. Okay. You've just applied online. Okay. You know your high income.

SPEAKER_00

That's exactly what I'm saying. Here's what's gonna happen. Well, okay, you're saying July 1, which is just a couple months away now. So uh what will is probably going to happen is you're gonna get a letter stating that you have the base uh uh Part B premium, 2029. And so about two or three weeks after that, the IRMA letter comes. Okay. And they're gonna say, we heard from the IRS that you make this much modified adjusted gross income, and if that is the case, then we're gonna charge this extra amount. So here's the point. You're gonna get that first letter within about a month of applying, and then two to three weeks later, you get the IRMA letter. Okay. And so if you have had a life-changing event uh that would cause your income to to to be less because they're always looking back at your modified adjusted gross income two years prior. Right.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_00

So this year, they're looking at 2024.

SPEAKER_02

Uh this year. So if your income has gone down because you're retiring this year. Right. Right. What if what if you've already made over the threshold for this year? And you're retiring now, but now are they ever going to look at a monthly amount that you make, or is it just going to look at the has to do with social security earnings test, has nothing to do with urban part B premium.

SPEAKER_00

And so if if we're going to be above the thresholds, we'll get the letter. Uh and then uh they the letter says they would like to hear from you within 10 days. You don't have to do it then. I would do it as soon as possible. Uh, but they will do they will do retroactive typically for about six months. And so if that is you and your your high income, but you've had a life-changing event. I want to clarify a couple things. Uh there are eight different life-changing events that allow you to appeal the IRMA. Uh the one is death, one is divorce, and one is marriage, work reduction, and which means semi-retirement, or work stoppage. Those are the top five. Okay. Okay, now I had a lady not long ago that was uh married, excuse me, excuse me, she was single two years prior, uh, had an IRMA because she was above the 109. Uh she got married, and marries uh now they're gonna file a joint return and they're gonna be below the married threshold. Okay, so that's right. Exactly right. So I helped her appeal the IRMA. What did we have to do? Well, we had to fill out the form SS44, and and the life-changing event was marriage, and we also had to put the date in there so it could be within the last two years, and had to submit a marriage license to prove that. Okay.

SPEAKER_02

Where do you submit this stuff?

SPEAKER_00

You would sub-well, today you could.

SPEAKER_02

Right. If you guys, if you're in this situation and you got an IRMA appeal, we've done thousands of these. Right, right.

SPEAKER_00

So what I would do and what you would do is is to you can either upload it through the new SSA system. And again, that's still new, so I think they're still working some glitches through on that, or uh just simply take those to your local Social Security office uh uh and drop those off. Some of the drop box. Exactly right. That's what that's the safest way to go. And now, uh if you want to mail it in, that is fine, but I would tell you this I wouldn't just mail it. I I would mail in fax. And I wouldn't just fax, I would fax a mail. Uh you you you can't overdo this. You want to be sure that they get that. Uh so then there's three others, though, that I just want to note real quickly because there's a lot of confusion on this. Um if um uh uh we have the five death, marriage, divorce, work reduction, work stoppage, but there's three more. One of those is called loss of income-producing property. Uh many people will look at that and say, well, I had a you know eight full. So the rental property took a loss on it. That doesn't mean that at all. It means that you had that rental income in 2024, but that that it that that you know four-plex, a plex burned up or it went in down a mudslide or a flood.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, like a like a federally declared disaster or something like it's like pretty it's not just if it burned up.

SPEAKER_00

Oh yes, it's no longer available.

SPEAKER_02

All so you have to do is you know, you get the insurance money, rebuild it.

SPEAKER_00

Well, that's true. Well, then and this may income comes in, then that's gonna it's gonna happen now. They'll affect you in 2028.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

Uh but if that is no longer available, meaning So it's a true loss, though. That's right. Yeah. The property is gone. And then uh there's uh employer employee uh employer settlement agreements and loss of uh uh a pension plan because it went belly up or expired, whatever. There's a variety of reasons. So those would be the other. Now, I've been doing this 15 years, and I have done all the other five. I've never done loss of income producing property at all. But uh there are instructions. Now, one thing I think it's very important for you to know is this if you do have a work reduction or a work stoppage and that affects your your income, you don't even have to pr provide proof. You just simply sign the form, you're signing an affidavit saying this is accurate, and it should be accurate.

SPEAKER_02

And they're gonna check in on like two years later on your uh your tax return.

SPEAKER_00

Absolutely they are. They're gonna go back and audit that, I can assure you that. But also, you Ms. Realis, do this because they they don't want to charge you an IRMA. Uh they're they're going to if your income stays up, and if it stays up, this is a great problem to have. But if it goes down, then take the time, work with us, and we'll we'll make sure that it's done properly. Trevor Burrus, Jr.

SPEAKER_02

I've talked to several folks, and um, you know, they they they're like, well, I don't know exactly how much money I'm gonna make. Okay. So how do I tell them how much money I'm gonna make?

SPEAKER_00

All the time. Do your best you can to to make that estimate. Okay. Yeah, that's what I would do. Be just be as accurate as you can and and not don't worry about it. Yeah. Uh you don't have to be to the dollar, but uh we know where the threshold is going to be, so hopefully you're gonna be underneath that. If not, you're gonna be above it. Just uh reveal that. That's fine. Uh because they will check it for sure.

SPEAKER_02

We will uh go to Terry now, I think in Maryland. Terry, are you there? Yes. Hello, how are you? Good, how are you? Good. Welcome to Medicare School Daily. What questions do you have for us, sir?

SPEAKER_01

Um thanks for taking my call. Um the question I have is I will be turning uh 67 next July 4th. And I would like to my A and my B, and I've already got a self plan in mind. And uh my retirement, my social security kicking in in July. 4th of July is gonna be my last day here. Congratulations.

SPEAKER_02

Where where are you retiring from?

SPEAKER_01

Um I work in the power uh industry. Let's just put it that way.

SPEAKER_03

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Um power generation. So the question is, can I and you kind of touched on this several times, but I'd like to time my HSA. I'd like to pay it right up until the end of June of next year.

SPEAKER_02

Okay.

SPEAKER_01

Can I time my A so that it will start in July? And that way I'm not, you know. No, sir. Actually, I'm sorry. Not paying, I'm sorry, I misspoke. Not paying my HSA all the way up to June, but paying it to the end of this year, rather. And that way I have the six-month back spread from when my A kicks in.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Yeah. You're you're not gonna be you're not gonna be able to do that. Now you can if you want to work a little bit longer, but but here let me let me tell you the best case scenario for you. I'm too eager uh to get to questions, and I'm sorry about that. You keep asking questions. So I understand about your A date. What else did you want to ask, sir?

SPEAKER_01

No, that that was really it. I just want to time everything to start when I retire.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, got it. Here's my question to you. So if you're gonna retire July 4th, typically you that means your insurance is gonna run through the month of July, which means you would probably want to start. Yeah, I'm asking. So typically in this scenario, we would say you really want to start your insurance on Medicare August 1. Would that be correct?

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, so that's August 1, 2027.

SPEAKER_02

And then you'd want to get your Social Security check then too, right? In August.

SPEAKER_00

Well yeah. Okay, that'd be good. So so here's here's what happens. Let's say probably the the latest you'd want to put this off would be uh June. Uh June of 2027, you would apply. I wouldn't want to do it in July. It just gives us one month. That's not enough time. So I would be fine with the June 1 enrollment. So from June, when we enroll June 1, they're gonna backdate that six months. So let's let's put six marks. The way I always do it, I put six marks on the paper. And so we're gonna have a June 1 date. So we're gonna apply June uh six, five, four, three, two, one. Okay, very good. It would work. Yeah. So as long as we apply June, um uh because they backdate six, so uh it may be twelve. They may give you a twelve one. Yeah, because you you apply in June, they're gonna they're gonna backdate you six months. So I'm thinking it's gonna be five, four, three, two, one, twelve. So what I probably would do if it were me to be on the safe side, uh I would probably apply in June. And let's say we're gonna go ahead and contribute 11 months uh on your HSA. Uh it could be that you this year, exactly right. It could be that they'll give you uh uh a 1-1 start date, but I know they backdate six months.

SPEAKER_02

So I would say So he could technically do this in July.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

And then it would backdate six months to one-one.

SPEAKER_00

Exactly right.

SPEAKER_02

But just the point there is like if you do it in July, you've got one month to then wait for the application to be approved to get your cards, then to go and get your supplement set up and your drug plan and all that stuff. It's a lot. It's a little extra. Yeah. Probably not.

SPEAKER_00

I I it wouldn't it wouldn't be for me. I would go ahead and just play it safe, do it in June. That way you've got everything set up because you've got to remember something. You're Terry, you're you're coming in uh using the special enrollment period, so you've got some additional paperwork involved. So I would do it in June. Now, what's gonna happen is this when when you make that application, and by the way, we'd be happy to do all this for you and with you, but when you apply for uh this in June, they're gonna ask you, when do you want to start your Social Security benefits? So if you say I want to start in July, then you'll get your first check in August. If you say you want to start in June, then you'll get your first check in July. Uh but you're working in July. So I you know you you're you're already you you've reached your full retirement age, so you don't have to worry about earnings tests. So it's like Josh had said, if you want your first check um in August, then that's the way I would do that. You would select to start your your your Social Security in July. Because it's always paid a month in a route. That's right.

SPEAKER_02

Your first check would income in August.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So to me that'd be safe. Now let me ask you this, sir. Are you maxing out on a monthly basis on your HSA contributions? Yes. You are maxing. Okay. All right.

SPEAKER_02

So don't you have to take the max dums 11 months? Exactly right. Yeah, because they're going to program.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, that's what I would do. I I would I would apply in June if it were me. And then that because I really think you're going to get a 12-1A date. Your B date will be August 1, no problem. Um that's the way I would do it to be safe. So put 11 months in. Uh, I don't know if you are you contributing family or just individual?

SPEAKER_01

Just individual.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. Okay. So uh you're above you know 55. So you're probably putting what about $450 a month in, something like that?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, they calculate. I I do it, I can't remember exactly what it is. My company kicks something and I set it all up for the year.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, this year it's $4,400 for the year, $1,000 for catch up. So you take $5,400 divided by $12, and then multiply times 11 months, and you're safe. Uh, then you don't have to worry about it. But that's the way it is done. And that's what I want you to know, and really everyone to know, that once you apply, it's from that date, then they backdate six months. Okay. So you you do you you apply in June, I think you're gonna have a 121-8 date. If you apply in July, I think we're pushing it a little risky. Now you'd still be covered, but it's just kind of pushing the window a little bit for sure. Okay.

SPEAKER_02

Do you really want to retire on July 4th and be stressed out about your insurance getting in place and your social security by August 1st? Yeah, seems like a terrible plan. Probably not probably not worth $450 of extra HSA contribution.

SPEAKER_01

No, you're right. You're right. I was just curious about it. I have I've heard you say many times that they backdate the A six months. Yeah, you're right. I didn't want to get go ahead. I didn't want to get on the wrong side of that date because I didn't know what the penalties were.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. Have you built up a good amount in your HSA?

SPEAKER_01

Um Yeah, I mean, I'm using it. I'm gonna I'm getting some dental work done that's kind of expensive, and I've been using it as well, not as fast, just about as fast as I've been saving it over the past several years.

SPEAKER_02

Okay. Well when he goes on Medicare, what can he use it for?

SPEAKER_00

He can use it for everything medically uh related other than his med suppremium. So uh Terry, if you decide to get a Medicare supplemental plan, you can't pay your supplemental premiums. The monthly costs, a month or something. Yeah, but it's a stage we're set up to to cover things that go towards the high deductive premiums. Yeah, not for premiums. So you can prescriptions, yeah, really anything and everything. And and the truth is he could go out and get a pair of you know fancy sneakers and call it you know something else. There you go. Uh we want to be honest, but it is true. It's qualified medical expenses. I've seen the list, and I'm telling you, they're very they're very generous. Exactly right. So just not meds up. So good for you, you save that money. And I I think I I love HSH. And remember, uh, for you and really anyone, uh, what happens after we're 65, we actually, if we have so much in there, and I've had people that you know, 40, 50 grand in, they'll never gonna spend it. So you can actually pull the money out uh can like an IRA, you pay the taxes on it, there's no penalty at all, and bike a boat. You can do whatever you want. You should have been filling that bad way up. Okay, very good. All righty. Well, hey, it was great to talk to you, sir.

SPEAKER_01

And uh nice talking to you. And uh you set my wife up earlier this year. She she uh she just turned 65. Um so you got her set up, and uh I'm looking to jump ship next year.

SPEAKER_00

All right. Well, hey, we'll be here for you when you're ready. And remember, uh, you'll get a household discount too, and a um uh uh a discount if you both go with the same company. So those are really, really nice. Um yeah, multi-policy.

SPEAKER_01

That's the plan. That's good. So we'll be calling you and and setting up with you here next year.

SPEAKER_00

All right, and also they don't forget you tell the agent that yeah, you want help with that SCP paperwork as well. We'll help you with all that. Yeah, there's a lot of things. We fill it out.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I know I'm happy to do it. I know I need those two forms.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_02

All right, very good.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, good.

SPEAKER_01

Thank you, gentlemen. Take care. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, let's go to Sharon in Florida. Sharon, hello.

SPEAKER_04

Yes, hi.

SPEAKER_02

Hi, welcome to the show. What questions do you have for us?

SPEAKER_04

Hey, I'm on the CarePlus um HMO, which has worked out for me pretty well.

SPEAKER_03

Okay.

SPEAKER_04

Um, but I'm having problems with the dental plan, and I'm wondering, did I pick the wrong one? Or are there ones that are any better? I just had to pay $8,000 for dental um surgery yesterday. And so I'm trying to figure out what I can do in the future. I know it's too late now. But um, and you're in Florida?

SPEAKER_00

Hey, Sherry, what what would you have done? Uh that cost $8,000.

SPEAKER_04

I had a bridge that had an infection underneath it and on two different teeth, and they had to drill up under it and cut my gums all the way back like a flap.

SPEAKER_02

How are you even talking today? How are you even talking? That's amazing.

SPEAKER_04

I I'm numb. Yeah, I had a I had that on two different teeth. It's shocking to me that it all just happened.

SPEAKER_00

Wow.

SPEAKER_04

And I was shocked when I got my dental thing and they said it covers nothing. And I was like, oh my God.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, and probably Josh is gonna look it up real quickly or Sharon, but it's not uncommon today where a lot of these plans are only covering preventive. Yeah. And again, I'm not saying that's your issue, Josh is gonna find that out, but sadly they have uh dropped back a lot of those dental benefits on these plans today. Uh so they may only cover preventive. We'll find out.

SPEAKER_04

You need Medicare as a rule across the board?

SPEAKER_00

No. Well, just Medicare Advantage plans. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

So if I got out of the advantage plan, would I be able to obtain a better dental plan? Because I that's imperative for me, more than medical. Yeah, well, here's I always have problems.

SPEAKER_00

You have any answers for there, Josh? Because I'm not sure. Yeah, no, I'm gonna try to yeah, keep going. Okay, so let me share this. Uh for you, anyone, uh, i if you you can get a standalone dental plan, even if you're on advantage plan. So the advantage plan, if it has some dental benefits, then you can use those, but you can also get a standalone dental plan. And so what I would suggest doing is calling in and and uh we can we can talk to you about that because right now, uh probably not going to be able to move your advantage plan at this time of the year. Uh do you do you have any kind of let me ask you this now. Do you have any kind of a a chronic condition, meaning uh you know, uh any kind of lung issue, diabetes, heart issues at all?

SPEAKER_04

I had I'm a chronic diabetic.

SPEAKER_00

You are okay, okay. Well let me tell this, sh share this with you. Now you may already be on this kind of a plan, but there is if you're not, there is an option. The these are called chronic SNP plans. SNP is an acronym that stands for special needs plans. And so if you have diabetes, you would qualify for a chronic SNP plan. And so what we could do uh is you could find out if there may be a chronic SNP plan available in your area uh that would be better than the the CarePlus plan, and maybe it would have some better dental benefit. And then you could take advantage of that. But I still would suggest buying a separate dental plan. And so if you talk to one of our agents, if you want to, uh they would we could explain all that to you. But that would be a reason because once a year we can move from a just a traditional advantage plan onto a chronic uh uh SNP uh advantage plan if uh the as long as you we can verify that you have that disease and diabetes qualifies. So that may be a good option for you. Okay, do you can you see anything there, John here?

SPEAKER_02

Is she on a chronic SNP? Uh no, I don't think so. So that but the problem is there's only there's there is one plan, uh one care. Uh it's but I don't think you would probably qualify for it. It's it's like an MA only plan, doesn't have drug coverage. Most of those care plus plans, they're just preventive dental. And that's why you're not getting drug coverage. Like it's just for your cleanings. That's it. So nothing else. Here's the other thing you need to really know. So you can go out and you can get, and we could, you know, we would be happy to help you get a dental plan. We've got, you know, some that I think our max is like 10 grand or something, what it will spend on in a year. Um, and you should do that sooner than later because there are these things called waiting periods. Okay. He already said waiting periods. Yeah. So in and if you think about it, it kind of makes sense. Let's say you got this dental, let's say you got a dental plan um in March, right? And you you paid $50 a month or $40 a month or $30, whatever it is, you paid for that plan for one month, and then the next month, you went in and got $8,000 worth of dental issues that then the care insurance carrier turned around and paid for. And then next month, meaning May, because you had your surgery, you think, well, I'll just cancel the dental insurance. So what did the what did the dental insurance carrier got? They got maybe $100,000, $150 in premium, and they paid eight out $8,000 in your dental surgery. Right. So what these dental plans do is they require you to keep the plan for a little bit before they pay anything. Right. So you get the plan, go ahead. Yeah, they're gonna cover your cleanings, your x-rays, your you know, your oral exams, but they're not gonna cover much until you've had the plan for 12 months because these aren't Yeah, I called uh Delta, yeah. Delta, yeah. There's several, there's several that are out there. How much do they charge?

SPEAKER_04

Who I've had most of my life, yeah, and they told me the waiting period for was one year.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and that's very common. Hey son, can you tell me look on your zip code, do you see any chronic snip plans uh in her area at all? Because you may have a way to improve your position instead of having to wait till the end of the year if there was a chronic snip.

SPEAKER_04

Now, the journalist thought it might fall under medical, but I said, I don't see how.

SPEAKER_00

No, no, it's not going to. I I wish you would. It has to be very extreme. I'm talking, you know, you have you have jaw cancer and they have to reconstruct your teeth. Medicare would cover that. And medically necessary. It's not your normal routine dental care. I mean, you obviously you needed it, but it's not going to be covered by Medicare. So why they would say that I have no idea.

SPEAKER_04

But that's No, she was just trying to figure out how I could cut costs because she had to deliver the news to me.

SPEAKER_03

Sure.

SPEAKER_04

Well that it covered nothing. Yeah. And I was like, oh my God. Because I would have never taken any, I don't need preventive.

SPEAKER_00

Right.

SPEAKER_04

I could just go pay to that myself.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, so Sharon, what I want you to do, uh, if if you like, uh, I think you ought to you ought to call in. Let's let look and there are there are plans.

SPEAKER_02

There's C SNP plans. Good.

SPEAKER_00

Like there's a Okay, here's what I want you to do. I want you to call in. And uh you tell the reception team, you you you talk to Marvin Josh today, and you want to talk to an agent, one of our agents. We know them, we've trained them, and then you tell the agent, whoever they transfer you to, that we said there's a possibility of a chronic SNP plan. SNP is special needs plan, it's an acronym C SNP, a chronic SNP plan because you have diabetes. And uh tell them you're looking for something that would you know, of course we want to make we're gonna check your docs, your hospitals, all that, your medications, but also see if we can't get some dental benefit built within that so you can start using that now, because those Medicare Advantages, there is no waiting period on those. And then what you want to do is say that Marvin mentioned a standalone dental product, a separate one. And so let them tell you the options available in your area, and then you'll decide, hey, do I want to spend an extra $50 a month to get a premium on that so you'll have some additional coverage beyond what the Medicare Advantage will cover for you. Did that make sense to you? Yeah.

unknown

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, let's go and give her the number.

SPEAKER_02

Just so we represent that we have access to 65 different plans in your zip code. Yeah. So there's a lot of there's a lot of options. Now we you know, we're gonna filter that down to ones your doctor takes, gonna filter it down to chronic SNP plans that you can even get in. Um, and then we'll filter it down even further to make sure that there's you know dental benefits. So I'm gonna give you our phone number. Are you ready? Hold on one second. Yep, I'm ready. Okay, the phone number is 800 782 6676.

SPEAKER_00

82 6676. And just tell the receptionist.

SPEAKER_04

782676. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Okay. Tell tell them that uh you talk to Mervin and Josh on the show and you want to get a C SNP plan that has good dental benefits. That's right.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Okay. And they'll they'll they'll they know what to do. They really do. And then you want to talk about a separate dental plan as well. That's something you may want to do. You can and you can do that. And then that just means when you go to the dentist, you're gonna give them your advantage card. You're also gonna give them your standalone dental plan, and they'll coordinate the benefits. That's the way it works. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_04

Sounds good. All right. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_00

Sharon, you are very welcome. We're privileged to serve you. Thanks for calling in today.

SPEAKER_02

See ya. Okay, let's talk to Sharon in California. Sharon, are you there?

SPEAKER_05

Yes, I am.

SPEAKER_02

Hi, welcome to the show. What questions do you have?

SPEAKER_05

Thank you so much. I appreciate the opportunity to speak with you. Sure. Um, I and I appreciate your service tremendously. Very helpful, very educational. Um one quick question I had is I hear um I've listened to the audit information on the website and the weekly teleconferences, and I hear um group coverage and employee employer coverage. And I just wondered if there's anything besides employer coverage, whether it be one's own employer, previous employer, or spouse or um par uh employer coverage that's considered group. Anything besides those?

SPEAKER_00

Okay, Sharon, we'll answer your question. I I have to um understand a couple things. First off, uh, are you already on Medicare? Yes. Are you you working any longer?

SPEAKER_05

No.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, you're not. Okay, so uh so what you're asking for is what's your question again if you go to the presentation. I just want to understand kind of your situation. So are you saying is there anything a group plan today would only be an employer provided plan of you or your spouses, if you're married, uh, that has 20 or more people on the payroll. Anyone that's in that situation then does not have to actually go on Medicare. So that's the only type of group plans available. So they have to be active employer-provided plans, you you or your spouse, okay? 20 or more people on the payroll. And that qualifies as then someone that does not have to go on Medicare. Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_05

So that's that's where I got tripped up is um because in California uh I had Affordable Care Act, and everything I had had a group number on it.

SPEAKER_00

So they had to provide. Sure. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05

And so when I was listening, I would listen. I thought I caught, I thought I would have caught it. But and when I called in a couple times, I remember speaking.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, even even drug plans today when you get a card, it's gonna have a group number on it. But that's not referring to group coverage, it's more like yeah, I don't know.

SPEAKER_00

It's for billing purposes. Yeah, yeah. It's just class, it's just a number. So uh is there anything else, Sharon, that you that you're curious about?

SPEAKER_05

Yes. Okay, keep it. I had a sort of a a trifecta. So that tripped me up, so I thought I had the early enrollment period to sign up for basic Medicare, as well as the if I want additional coverage, which you're spectacular at teaching people about supplemental versus advantage. So I knew I wanted supplemental first time I heard you describe it. So I thought I because I had group on my prescription card, even on my medical card to go into the office, I thought, okay, I have that seven, I have that early enrollment period to sign up for basic Medicare. So that's one mistake that I've learned. So I and signed up, started November and then got a Medicare card in November that said I started in July. So I had to drill down to figure out what was I did I have group coverage or not? So that's why I I asked up front, is there sometimes I hear folks use them interchangeably.

SPEAKER_02

And so because you know, did you end up with a advantage or supplement plan in place? Or you just still have A and I did because I did it all in October. Good, okay.

SPEAKER_05

I did it in October because I compared the premium if I went on, I figured out what the premium would be for the supplemental versus the affordable care premium. And I said, okay, uh supplemental higher, so I'll wait till the end of the early enrollment period to do that. So that was another piece I wasn't completely correct. There's basic Medicare, and then you if you want additional coverage, you can get supplemental or advantage. But sometimes the you get supplemental coverage, and then supplemental is also the name of one of the two options.

SPEAKER_00

It's confusing. Okay, do me a favor, share someone to walk you through. I've gotta know. I've gotta know. Tell me. Yeah, what's your what's your what's your B date on your card? What do you have? I know you have a 7-1, the B date, Medicaid. 7-1. 7-1 as well. So A and A and B are both 7-1.

SPEAKER_03

Yes, sir.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, 2025. Sounds like she's got your all your coverage. Okay, that that sounds great. And what what supplemental company did you what'd you go with on your supplemental plan?

SPEAKER_05

Uh UK United Healthcare.

SPEAKER_00

You're good. I I know they're competitive in California. That's good. That's a good what would what do you have for your drug plan?

SPEAKER_05

Um, I think it's Wellcare. Yeah, Wellcare. It's interesting because I signed up for one, but sometimes it shows up as a different name, which was interesting. They have an interesting formula.

SPEAKER_00

Centeen or Yeah, it could. They're owned by Centen. That's who I have also uh on my drug plan is is welfare.

SPEAKER_02

So now did you have a question about like Roth conversion or something?

SPEAKER_05

Yes. Okay. Yes. Are you okay to go into that? We got time.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. Go ahead.

SPEAKER_00

Question number three.

SPEAKER_05

So what what yes? So what I did also in 25 is I did a ro I did a Roth conversion. I took funds out because I the RMD is coming up at 73 in anticipation of that. I I wanted to do a conversion in a in a large one. So I knew I'd pay that triggers a tax liability when you take money from a rollover IRA or whatever IRA into a Roth. I was prepared for that and anticipated what it was going to trigger. What happened though in doing my taxes when we did put in the 1095 showing I had coverage and then had to do the five 5498 for the 1099 R. It it put because I had um kept the affordable care I fill out through October, so I had four months of premium there. Then I had to reimburse Medicare for the their start date, so double premiums for four months, that's fine. But um the by can doing the conversion, once it goes into the Roth, it's frozen for five years. You can't touch it. So it's income per se in terms of yes, I owe tax on it, but they also counted its income. You must now reimburse the government for all their portion of the Affordable Care Act premium, which was added up to like $13,000 to $15,000, dollar for dollar reimbursement of that. For the full I wondered, Marvin, have you for everything they paid on my behalf?

SPEAKER_02

Absolutely. Yep.

SPEAKER_05

Yep. So it's income. Yes, it is income. Pay tax, good, but I can't touch it. I couldn't use it as income per se. So I just wondered, Marvin, have you ever heard of that happening? Or someone does happens to do that in the year in which they turn 65 when they didn't have group coverage?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Oh yes, yeah, it it definitely happens. So you did your big conversion in 2025.

SPEAKER_02

Uh so that that's when did you when have you retired? Or have you retired, or when did you retire?

SPEAKER_05

You know, I I some I do a ton of volunteer work with seniors and veterans, and so I love it, but I'm also produced I've met so many seniors who have nobody to help them financially, so I'm pursuing a fiduciary license. So I am going to go back to work once I complete the licensure piece.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, but Josh, Josh's question. Yeah, Josh's question though, was you retired? What was your official retirement date? Anytime? Was it July?

SPEAKER_05

My official retirement. Well, I I also five years ago in terms of what the government calls earned income. Okay, we got you. I would say about five years ago. Yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_00

Very good. So what's going to happen then is uh in next year uh you're gonna have to have probably an ERM. Are you single or married? Single. Single. So uh I'm assuming that you're gonna be above the $109,000 uh in modified adjusted gross income since you did your Roth conversion. Is that correct?

SPEAKER_05

I did it in 25, so it affected tax year 25. Yes.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I know that's taxed to 25, but Medicare is gonna show up for next year, remember, because they always look back two years. So that 2025 conversion is gonna show up next year. Now you're gonna hear about it uh in December because they'll send a letter to you saying, hey, this is what you made in in 2025 and this is what your Part B premium is going to be. I don't have my IRMACR with me. Josh is gonna look at it. So let me ask you this beyond the Roth conversion, did you have other income in tw in 2025?

SPEAKER_05

Yes. None of that was earned well, it's not a good thing. That doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_00

If it's income, if it's passive, yeah, it doesn't matter at all.

SPEAKER_02

So great for a single filer greater than 205 but less than 500,000, there's an IRMA of $446 a month.

SPEAKER_00

Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_02

So so and Josh, that that was above $220, $220? Above $205.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, above $205 to $500,000. So you got how much $450.

SPEAKER_05

Oh my adjusted was lower. They don't care, they don't care about adjusted to $205,000. Okay, no.

SPEAKER_00

No, that's for my two zero. Yeah, what's your AGI for 2025?

SPEAKER_05

Oh, my adjusted was down to like $140, $140-ish.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, that's good. Okay, so I have including everything. Okay, good. And and then uh $140. Yeah, I oh I whittled it down. Good, you'll have a small ERMA then. Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_02

So it's twice as much. So she's gonna pay two times that amount of time. That's right.

SPEAKER_00

So and then her drug ERMA probably what, $35, something like that. Let me see. Um here's what we think is gonna happen for you next year. Uh based upon what you said. Your your your Medicare is gonna cost you about an extra two hundred and forty dollars a month. That's the B and D ERMA, and that's only for one year. And that's the effect of you know, based on what you you said uh your AGI was. Uh and so you get a letter sometime in December letting you know uh that you're gonna have the IRMA. Go ahead, John.

SPEAKER_02

Is there any way to reverse a Roth conversion? Because what ended up happening is she had to pay fifteen thousand dollars in ACA subsidies. She's gonna have to spend an extra two forty times twelve. How much is that?

SPEAKER_00

240 times twelve, about uh twenty, what, three thousand almost?

SPEAKER_02

Because two fifty so called eighteen thousand. Uh-huh. Just in like extra stuff. I know that. Yeah. Which probably which probably eliminates any benefit that a Roth conversion will be gone.

SPEAKER_00

I I've never heard of that, son, with someone reversing a Roth. I I have not.

SPEAKER_05

So I don't I don't I think once it's done, it's done. I think because it you know, I've paid the tax on it for the year I did it, etc. So interesting though. I didn't so it's a gift, it keeps on giving with the extra. Yeah, it keeps giving. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

So and that's why I had asked if you stopped working. Because we were gonna look for a way to appeal. Yeah, if you stopped working, then you'd have what's called the life-changing event, right? Because you retired. And then you would be able to appeal that IRMA, that income-related, that surcharge, that $240 extra a month, that's gonna just last for one year in 2027. But it doesn't sound like Yeah, she retired five years ago.

SPEAKER_00

You would have had to retire, semi-retire uh in the last two years to be able to appeal that IRMA. And Roth conversions cannot be reversed.

SPEAKER_05

This is what I would say I do I have done. So I don't know what there how expansive the definition of retire could be, because I one of the things I did when I was working is it just m bought some rental properties, and so I when I do my 1040, I spend over 750 hours a year. I fit the definition of a work with a tenants. So is that retire? I mean, so I'm working, but it's not a W 2. Well, could it could be that's that's for even now, 25, 26, like that. I was I've done that.

SPEAKER_00

I was gonna say it could be work reduction.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, mm probably. I mean, you could try, but the amount of money you make is probably more than three thousand dollars in penalties, right?

SPEAKER_05

Money I make is more than three thousand penalty.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I mean if you're if we if we're just saying you're gonna have about three thousand dollars worth of Medicare Irma surcharges next year.

SPEAKER_03

Yes.

SPEAKER_02

Right. So if you're right, if the amount of money you're making by doing all of that is greater than three thousand, I wouldn't stop doing that.

SPEAKER_05

Oh no, I yeah, I think so because I could yeah, it's interesting how it's the the IRS will define something one way and care of excess another way. You're exactly right. I I completely acknowledge that. And Social Security looks differently as well.

SPEAKER_02

Did you have uh like a financial advisor that helped you with this Roth conversion?

SPEAKER_05

Uh yes, yes, but you never talked about it.

SPEAKER_02

You need to go talk to him about all of this disaster he created or she created.

SPEAKER_05

I know. Oh, I'm with you. That's why I was wondering, um, it's gonna be a it's a tax. I'm gonna have to talk to a tax professional because I completely acknowledge and embrace I have to pay tax on that conversion, but I can't touch it for five years.

SPEAKER_02

So if you're not gonna be able to do that, for five years, you had a ACA subsidy revoked for 12 months, and you also had you're gonna have an IRMA.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, let me ask you this real quick, and then we're we'll have to let you go. Here's my question to you. Sure. Could you honestly say that you are working less this year than you worked in 2025? Could you honestly say that?

SPEAKER_05

In 2026, you're saying? Yeah, this year. Less than 25?

SPEAKER_00

Yes, ma'am.

SPEAKER_05

Oh no, I'm working the same amount. I'm working the same amount.

SPEAKER_00

Can you figure out how to work that you're not? Because I'm managing the property. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, yes, sure you can. Take a day off. The year's not over. But the point is, you could say that you had a work reduction. You had a work reduction, let's just call it uh you know, June 1, 2026. But it needs to be truthful. No one wouldn't lie about anything.

SPEAKER_05

So if you if you have a working, because I did a lot more maintenance on property 1025.

SPEAKER_00

There you go.

SPEAKER_05

I I had a guy down my my adjusted growth.

SPEAKER_00

I listen, I had a guy that owned 150 single-family dwellings, sold off two-thirds of it in the inventory, sold off 100, and he was left with 50. And he appealed, did a work reduction.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, but okay, here's the here's the what what do you think your income will be this year?

SPEAKER_00

2026. It's gonna is it gonna be below the 145 or whatever you had had you told us for 20?

SPEAKER_05

Oh, absolutely. I did a smaller conversion. I think I've done 18,000 so far and maybe.

SPEAKER_00

Okay, you will you so you'd be below 109. So what I would do, if it's honest, I would set a retirement, semi-retirement date of May 1, June 1, uh, and do it. And you reduce your hours. Uh, and then when you get your IRMA appeal, I mean you get your IRMA letter later this year, you're gonna appeal using the SS 44 form and you're gonna put on there uh work reduction. And again, it's gotta be truthful. Check the box work reduction. They're looking at 2025, you're gonna give them 2026, the number you just gave us, you'll submit uh page one, two, and three to your local office, and uh you will win that appeal. And that's gonna save you a couple hundred bucks three thousand dollars next year. Yeah, next year. That's work reduction. Okay. So work less. And then you can honestly say it, but you gotta you gotta set a date. So I'd say May one or June 1, if it were me. Okay? Okay. You'll win you you'll win that for sure.

SPEAKER_05

So is there any Okay, that's great. Is there any way to appeal having to reimburse the government because it counted as income, but not I couldn't use it?

SPEAKER_00

No, ma'am.

SPEAKER_05

I couldn't touch it.

SPEAKER_00

No, ma'am. No appeal for that. Because you're you're talking about IRA rules versus ACA rules. So you're not gonna win that. I promise you. I I I can't even imagine. I mean, think there's yeah, it's not even possible. Okay. Yeah. Uh the the pro the bottom line is he uh I wish the financial advisor would have told you the consequences of making the conversion. That's the only that's the only thing.

SPEAKER_05

I think he he didn't he didn't we didn't know about the Yeah, he may not have been.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, exactly right. Yeah. And quite frankly, that's not real common, honestly. Yeah. So, anyways, but that's yeah, I didn't think so. Okay, okay. Sounds good. Well, listen, Sharon, we have enjoyed talking with you. Um, oh thank you so much.

SPEAKER_05

I never expected you all to be able to tack you tackled it beautifully. Thank you. Yeah, we enjoyed it. Very popular feel it.

SPEAKER_02

Take care. All right.

SPEAKER_05

Enjoy the rest too. Thank you again so much.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, take care. Bye-bye. I've been thinking about this Roth conversion and RMDs at 73 and Irmas, the whole, you know, all of these things do impact people because if you have a um, you know, an IRA that's sizable and all of a sudden, you know, you hit 73 and you're gonna have RMDs now, it's gonna bump a lot of people into IRMA. If they're large, yeah. Yeah, exactly. I can have tens of thousands of uh dollars of extra income a year. And then if part of your plan is to do Roth conversions, I I never had this wrinkle of an ACA subsidy.

SPEAKER_00

I've actually had to buy that's uh Yeah, the best time the best time to do a Roth conversion would be the year you're you're uh either one year or two years before you retire. And that way you have that uh change in events exactly right.

SPEAKER_02

So you do all of it. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00

Because the government doesn't source the money.

SPEAKER_02

At a certain point, you know, uh you will be bumped up into the next marginal tax bracket, and maybe that's not as big as a Medicare surcharge. Guys, thanks for being with us today. If you are turning 65, uh tomorrow's episode is for you. Uh there is a wrong choice that we see people make, and we want to prevent you from doing that because it can be a wrong choice that ends up affecting you for life. And so join us on tomorrow's show. The wrong choice at 65 that you don't want to make. You can also make that wrong choice at 67. Oh, really?

SPEAKER_00

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02

What about 66?

SPEAKER_00

Uh absolutely. Yeah, one way to tell the wrong thing. Exactly right. Okay.

SPEAKER_02

Well, no matter what age you are, just to listen in, it's gonna be very important. Uh uh guys, if you need help with your Medicare situation, if that's enrolling in Advantage Plan, enrolling in a supplement plan, getting a drug plan, getting dental benefits, whatever it is, filling out those complicated government forms, um, call our office. We have people uh right outside these studio doors that come to work every single day wanting to help you make sure that you are on the right coverage for your situation. The phone number is 800-782-6676. 800-782-6676. We would consider it an honor and a privilege to help you make your move to Medicare with ease and confidence.