Episode 4 | Dillon Anderson - From Childhood Adversity to Ultra Running

A compelling conversation with my friend Dillon about overcoming childhood adversity, making something out of nothing, finding purpose through fitness, and pushing physical and mental limits through ultra running.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:09

Back with the Steven Show episode number four. I'm here with my boy Dylan Anderson. Dylan, thanks for coming on, dude. Yeah, man. Thanks for having me. I not only wanted you to come on just because we're good friends, we have a lot of similar interests, but you have a super cool life story. Um, and I don't think too many people have really heard you tell your story. So I just wanted to give you the opportunity to come on here and share it. I think a lot of people can learn from it. And yeah.

SPEAKER_04 0:36

Cool. Well, I don't know if it's a cool life story, but it's a life story. But yeah.

SPEAKER_00 0:40

You've faced a lot of adversity that other people haven't.

SPEAKER_04 0:43

Yeah, so uh well I was born into uh family up here um of Where at? Well, I was born in Redman, Oregon, and then right around the time I could start remembering things, we moved up to um you know Four Corners.

SPEAKER_00 1:05

Yeah, right over like Maple Valley, Covington area.

SPEAKER_04 1:08

So you know Ravensdale? Yeah, you know where Selleck is? Yeah. Palmer Selleck? Yep, yeah. So out there.

SPEAKER_00 1:15

Okay. Yeah. Yeah, Palmer, Kanaska area.

SPEAKER_04 1:18

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So we're kind of out there. Yeah. Uh and when I was a kid, we would get on a bus, go to Black Diamond Elementary, and then transfer from there and go out to um Enimplaw for school. And so I was going to school in Enumplay. Wait, Black Diamond Elementary and then Enempla for middle school or no Enampla Elementary. So we'd get on a bus transfer at Black Diamond Elementary just to get us all the way out to Eden Claw. Yeah, it was weird. Um, so I grew up in a uh family with seven of us, all of them 100% white. I was the only one of any kind of shade. And I had never met my dad at this point. Uh the guy I thought was my dad was my stepdad. Um but when I was going to Enum Claw Elementary, I was getting picked on quite a bit because I was the only guy of any kind of color in the early 90s or in the you know late 90s. Yeah. And so uh I got bullied quite a bit as a kid, and I always thought I was black because that's what everyone told me at school. It's true. I uh I came home crying one day, um first grade, and I was bald and my mom said, What's wrong with it? Everyone in school keeps calling me the N-word. I know I'm the N-word. And uh Jeez.

SPEAKER_00 2:42

How old were you at this point? I was in first grade.

SPEAKER_04 2:44

Jeez. Yeah, and so I went there um until I was in second grade, and I had a lot of stuff going on at home, but either way, uh we got taken from our parents when I was in second grade, CPS came, and I moved in with my little sister's grandparents who are very strict Mormons. Okay, very strict Mormons. I see and change of lifestyle. Oh, and as you can imagine, like I grew up in a house, we got taken away by CPS, there were no rules. Like I never saw my parents ever. I was always out doing things, they would be gone for days at a time, like it was I never saw parents.

SPEAKER_00 3:32

So you know like who reported your family? Like, how did that talk about that whole process? Like leading up to the point that you say obviously you weren't like kidnapped, but like up to taken. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then what was that transition like?

SPEAKER_04 3:48

So my mom's boyfriend at the time was in some trouble back and forth with law enforcement, and so he had um some eyes on him, I'll say. And one morning I was sleeping and I got pulled out of bed by a SWAT member. They stormed the house, took him and my mom away, and pulled all the kids out. Then we all got separated.

SPEAKER_00 4:22

That's pretty dramatic, pretty tragic.

SPEAKER_04 4:24

Yeah, it was a whole mess. But me, my two younger sisters, and my brother all went to go live with my youngest sister's grandparents. Okay. Only her grandparents didn't have any actual relation to us, but super thankful for them. But it was the only time in my life I'd ever had structure. And I don't know how much you know about the Mormon community, but structure is pretty important.

SPEAKER_01 4:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 4:50

So I know a lot. Yeah. So if you wanted to talk about that, that would be super interesting too.

SPEAKER_04 4:54

Well, it was the only time I'd ever met anyone with any kind of discipline. Like I didn't know anybody that was disciplined at all. Yeah. Um, I grew up, you know, with my brother. My oldest brother was in gangs already, and he was kind of out in the streets, you know, doing whatever. And my oldest sister, Kayla, she's passed away now, but her and my second oldest sister, Haley, they looked after me most of my childhood life until that point.

SPEAKER_00 5:30

How far apart in age, right?

SPEAKER_04 5:32

So Haley is five years older than me. Okay, and Kayla is seven years older than me. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 5:38

And is every are you the youngest?

SPEAKER_04 5:40

No. I have two younger sisters on my bottom side. So I'm kind of the middle child. Okay. Um, so it goes Casey, Kayla, Casey, Kayla, Haley, Hobie, me, Stormy, Tessa. Okay. A lot of us. So we go to live with Tessa's grandparents.

unknown 5:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 5:59

These people appreciate a lot of what they did, but I went from knowing really no rules to living in a house with very structured rules. Like, if we went out in public, we all matched. They dressed us. No caffeine in the house except for diet coke and diet Pepsi. They had dinner at five, bed by seven, and I came from never having a bedtime.

SPEAKER_00 6:33

And you know, here you're a feral child, and then you go into I was literally a key kid.

SPEAKER_04 6:41

I had a hard time. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. And we would have to go to bed, and I would look out the window, and it's 7 p.m. Yeah. And at this point I'm in third grade, and all the other kids in the neighborhood are out playing outside. Yeah. And it's still sunny outside. Yeah. And I'm laying in bed on a Saturday night, like, what the fuck is this?

unknown 7:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 7:04

And so I started pushing back a little bit. Um, started getting in a lot of trouble.

SPEAKER_00 7:10

In what, like, in what ways? Like at school or just like with your parents? Just with them.

SPEAKER_04 7:14

Just like saying no, you know. I told them to fuck off one time. They threw me in the bathtub, put a bar soap in my mouth, made me bite down on it, stuff like that. Just like.

SPEAKER_00 7:25

You still tell everyone to fuck off, anyways.

SPEAKER_04 7:27

Think of back now, like, not that crazy, but coming from no discipline, yeah, that was nuts. Yeah. And so we lived with them for about a year. They realized like this isn't gonna work long term. They shipped me to go live with my cousin who I'd met a couple times, but she lived down in Oregon. She lives in Eugene, real hippie, gross weed, real, real hippie. So I went right back to no rules. Yeah. My older brother at this point is starting middle school. Yeah, starting middle school. And so me and him get shipped down there. We go live with her, and he's he's really pushing back. I mean, you know, because he's a little bit older when all this stuff starts happening, and so he's he's got this real defiant mentality now. And and so to him, like his worldview just got shaped a little bit differently than mine because of where he was in life when it all happened. And so he's getting he's pushing back a lot. After another year, they realize like it ain't working with both of us, they can't do it. So he gets shipped back up here to live with his dad. Okay, and I'm still down there.

SPEAKER_00 8:34

So I live with my cousin. How was it was that hard to get separated, or at this point, are you kind of just used to bouncing around?

SPEAKER_04 8:41

A little bit of both. Yeah. You know, it was uh at this point it wasn't bad because I got along with my cousin well. She had two kids that were younger than me, two little girls, and and I was I felt kind of like the older brother to them. Okay. And so I was just glad like I wasn't getting pulled away from them because I felt like not necessarily a role model, but like someone that they look up to and someone that I I had somebody to take care of or look after, or you know, whatever.

SPEAKER_00 9:08

It seems like everywhere you went from childhood, like you were surrounded by family still, but every move you're like leaving one person behind and going with one person slowly, just like trickling off to basically being on your own, it sounds like.

SPEAKER_04 9:22

Yeah, and it seemed like at least to me at the time, it just felt like I was getting pushed further out of the family. Like that's kind of how it felt to me. And so to me, it was difficult because I just kept getting separated further and further, like you said, but almost going with more and more distant relatives, it seemed like, you know? Yeah, and so after another year of that, I got to this point where um my biological dad had reached out. Yeah, and and I had never met him. Yeah. So I didn't know who he was. How did he reach out? Like that's a good question. I don't really find where you were. Yeah, I don't really know. I don't know because You think it was through CPS? No, I think what it was was my mom. I think, I don't I don't know this for sure, but I think my mom, I know she was still in contact with her sister who lived down in Eugene. Her cousin, or my cousin, was her daughter. Um, and I think that they had kind of figured it out and then reached out to my dad because my dad was in Bend, Oregon, or just outside. And so when I was in third grade, my dad drove over and met me. And I remember he used to take me, he would come over like once a month on a weekend, he'd take me to Walmart, buy me whatever the fuck I wanted. And then he'd leave. And I was like, this guy's alright. And then my cousin was like, okay, well, now that you know your dad, like I don't really have the right to have you. Like, as much as I would love for you to live here, I that's not up to me. And and you don't really get to anymore. Like, now you have to go live with your dad. And so it might have been a CPS thing.

SPEAKER_00 11:05

I don't really know how that worked, but I So was it did it seem or feel like if you go back in that time, did it feel like they were pushing you out, or your dad was trying to get you?

SPEAKER_04 11:14

I think it was more my dad. I don't think my husband was pushing me out because with her, after I'd went through this really strict period, and then I go back and live with some hippies, like I didn't really cause that much trouble. Yeah, I was I was pretty good for their standards.

SPEAKER_01 11:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 11:34

Um, but then I go and live with my dad, who like as a child you feel like you now know this person because they're buying you shit and like they're coming to visit you, but as an adult, I'm like, I didn't know that guy at all. Like I never met that guy. Yeah. And my dad is from Mexico, crossed the border when he was a kid. His mom sent him across the border. He's a very, very Mexican dude. Like thick ass accent, still doesn't know every word in English, like, very Mexican dude. But one thing about Mexicans is they are really, really hardworking, like all of them. And I was not, and that guy did not like that about me. Yeah. And so we kind of butt heads immediately, and then I meet all of these other siblings that I just did not know about. So I had two younger brothers there, a stepbrother that was my age, and four older brothers. Kyle. Holy smokes. So three older brothers.

SPEAKER_00 12:38

So, how many total siblings do you have?

SPEAKER_04 12:41

Okay, so I got seven on my mom's side, and there's six on my dad's side that I knew about. In the last five years, I found out about two more on my dad's side.

SPEAKER_00 12:49

This is gonna sound racist, but that's the most Mexican thing I've heard of these things.

SPEAKER_04 12:53

Yeah, it's so fucking Mexican, it's crazy. Yeah. So, anyways. Uh yeah, so I get shipped to live with my dad, and uh then at my dad's house, I finally get into this position where I'm now getting old enough to like join sports.

SPEAKER_00 13:16

What age is this?

SPEAKER_04 13:17

So I moved to my dad's in fourth grade. Fourth grade. Yep. I don't know what the age that is off the top of my eye. I don't know, is it like 10?

SPEAKER_00 13:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 13:24

Something like that. And immediately getting bullied again because one, I'm new to this school in a town with 600 people. And two, I'm one of a very few Mexicans again. But now I'm a little bit more defiant, have lived a little bit more, and now I'm getting in trouble because I'm fighting a lot. Like most of them. Not all of them. Definitely, yeah, most of them. But I got in elementary school from fourth grade to fifth grade, I got suspended five times because people are just being brutal. And so I was like, okay, well, this isn't gonna work for me, and this is where I'm stuck, so now I'm gonna figure out how to make it work. Yeah, luckily, after fifth grade, I started playing football, and that's when things really started to change for me mentality-wise, because I was always overweight as a kid, always when I was in fifth grade. I weighed 150 pounds, I was a little frijole. Yeah, and I like that bothered me a lot, yeah, but I didn't really have an outlet because one thing about Mexicans is like they're gonna eat. And you do not get to be done eating until your plate is clean. Yeah, doesn't matter how full you are. And so I went from literally making my own meals as a little kid because my parents weren't around, or my sisters are making me meals, to living with D stoners that are eating all the time, to living with my dad, who's a Mexican, making outrageous amounts of food and making me eat it all. Yeah. And so I'm just this chubby little kid. Uh, but then I get into football and I'm pretty good. Like for a small town, you know, whatever did you play? So I played running back my whole life, um, and then I was a linebacker in middle school and then moved to strong safety in high school. Okay. But for a small town, I was I was pretty good, and I felt like I was pretty good. Yeah. And and so it made me work harder and harder and harder, and I had this teacher in middle school, his name was Mr. Hamby. I'll never forget this motherfucker. He wanted me to feel like I was garbage. Like, I don't know if he knew that that would motivate me or what, but all he did was tell me I sucked. He would pick on me, he would push me. Like, I remember in seventh grade, he bet me $500 I wouldn't graduate high school. He was like dead ass hideous. One time I was in the bathroom peeing at the urinal and he punched me in the kidney and I pissed blood. Like, this is not a joke. He was a dick.

SPEAKER_00 16:12

But say his name on your stuff.

SPEAKER_04 16:16

I already said it, yeah. But this guy, I'm sure he's dead now. He had to have been 55.

SPEAKER_00 16:22

It sounds like he just didn't really like. I don't think I don't think this is a motivation tactic.

SPEAKER_04 16:28

But like I mean, you're very much the same way. Like, that shit does motivate you though. Whether he liked you or not. Yeah, that shit just sits in your head. Lit a fire underneath. And so I was one, just I was still very defiant to like authority figures because I didn't really have one that was like settled in my life, you know. Yeah. And so like I had a problem with authority still. It was people telling you what to do. Yeah. And so I know that I know that that was part of it, but what it did was it really pushed me to work hard physically. And so that kind of shit stuck with me. And then I went into high school and I I got super fortunate. Our strength and conditioning coach, my sophomore year, was the owner of one of the first CrossFit gyms down in Bent. Um, and so he took our weight room, got everything out of it, essentially made it a CrossFit gym. Okay. We had rings from the ceiling, we had it all. It was cool. Yeah, it was awesome.

SPEAKER_00 17:38

Sweet. I wish I got into that when I was younger.

SPEAKER_04 17:40

Yeah, and what we would do is we would have school at nine, so at 7:45, we had optional workouts for the varsity football team. Yeah, optional.

SPEAKER_00 17:56

It's like show up or you're not playing.

SPEAKER_04 17:58

But my dad had to be at work by six. And he's like, I'm not dropping you off of the school. If you want to go to these things, you gotta figure it out. Yeah. And so he would go to work about three miles from the school. That was the first time I ever did any kind of actual running because to actually get there in time, I had to run. Like, yeah, I'd get to there at six, I'd have to get there and change in time to start. So I'm going from his work, and I'm still fat. So bear with me here. Three miles was tough, dude. It was a lot of walking. Yeah. I say I was running, but you know what I'm saying. Yeah, you gotta start somewhere. Hey man. Uh so I'm getting to school, and then I do these CrossFit workouts, and then I go to class, and then we have football practice, and it goes on like this for a little bit, and I don't do anything outside of it really until that fall we're sitting in PE and we had this big old butch PE teacher. Okay, this lady, she was a trip, but we're talking about pull-ups because we're gonna do a pull-up test, right? We're gonna see who can do the most pull-ups or whatever, it's gotta get written down on your chart. And so she's explaining how pull-ups work, whatever, and she goes, Dylan, can you show the class a pull-up? And I cannot do a pull-up, and I know that. And I'm like, no.

SPEAKER_00 19:28

Was she just like trying to single you out?

SPEAKER_04 19:31

No, I think she knew like I was on the football team. And so I think she just assumed because I was always strong. Yeah, I was just also fat. Like I was. Yeah, so I'm just both of those things. So I'm like, I can't do a pull-up. And she's like, no, no, no, come up here and show the class pull-up. I'm like, I'm I'm definitely not doing that. She's like, you're gonna do that, or you're going to detention. And I fucking sat in detention all day. And I don't know how it was for you in school, but our detention room was four feet by four feet with a desk and a chair and no windows. It was just the wall door behind us, had a little window in the door, and you sat in that room all fucking day.

SPEAKER_00 20:11

Yeah, I got um in sixth grade, I got in school suspension, and then suspended for two days after that for a fight, and that in school suspension was exactly yeah, I did. Hell yeah, dude.

SPEAKER_04 20:22

You kicked him, didn't you?

SPEAKER_00 20:23

Now he uh, if you want me to tell the story, we were leaving because Sumner Middle School was in the process of being like rebuilt. So they moved a lot of the all the sixth graders like into portables at this time, and they were the portables where they had the built-in like walkways. You wouldn't walk out of the portable, then walk on the ground, go to the next one. They had like the built-on ramps to all of them. Oh, yeah, yeah. And so it was like how it is outside right now. It was wet and rainy. We're going to our next class and it's crowded in there. And at this point, I was going to PE, so I had to go from the portables all the way through like the construction zone to the other side of the school. So I had to hustle. And this dude is walking super slow in front of me. I remember his name, Jeremiah. Motherfucker. Fucking Jeremiah, dude. He was walking super slow, and I like tapped his shoulder and I was like, hey man, can you speed up or move out? I forget what I said, but I was essentially I was being very nice. I was just trying to get him to get out of the way so I could hustle. Yeah. He takes it as me being a dick, trying to like push him or nudge into him. He slams back into me and like we're surrounded by it. Everyone sees us, and I slipped and fell down to my knees and caught myself. And so I got embarrassed. And I look up and he turns around and looks at me at this point, and I just come up and like super man punch him from the ground. And then my other buddy Micah, I didn't even know he was there. But right after I punched him, he comes up behind him, throws him in a headlock, and he's like, Steven, go. He was the fucking home. He's like, Steven, run. And so I was like, Hell yeah, Micah, let's go. And then I ran into the class, and then like halfway through PE, the superintendent or whatever his name was, comes in and's like, Steve. Come here and then took me to the office and and then I sat in school or in the in-school suspension room all day.

SPEAKER_04 22:06

They suck. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 22:07

It was terrible.

SPEAKER_04 22:08

So, anyways, I get this in school suspension and then I have to go home because you get written up and your parents have to sign this slip.

SPEAKER_00 22:16

Yep.

SPEAKER_04 22:17

So I go home and I'm still pretty defined at the time. I try to forge my parents' signature. Yeah. I bring it back to school the next day. It doesn't work. He calls my parents. Wow. It looks like dog shit. I don't know. So he catches it, he calls my parents. My parents have to come pick me up. I'm suspended for two weeks. And in that two weeks, so I don't know how much you know about Ben, but it gets really hot.

SPEAKER_01 22:49

Even through the fall.

SPEAKER_04 22:50

Yeah, it gets really hot. It's it's similar to Eastern Washington. Okay. And so in that two weeks, I am pulling weeds every single day. The entire time school is out. And like pulling weeds, moving rocks, just doing labor, Mexican work. And so I'm just stewing out there in the heat, just so fucking mad. It just everything. Like the fact that this lady tried to make me do a pull-up, and I knew I couldn't, mad at myself for not being able to do a pull-up, and just like I'm I'm so angry, I'm just seeing red. And so as soon as I get out of trouble, there's a hill. So we used to live in a small town called Terrabaum. That's where Smith Rock is.

SPEAKER_01 23:33

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_04 23:33

If you go, like as soon as you drive into Terrabomb, there's like five streets. There's gonna be a grocery store on the left. On the right, there's a big ass hill. So you'll go like down four blocks, and there's a big ass hill. We lived right on the top of that hill. It's almost the size of the Tahali Hill. It's about the same size. And I decided, like that day, I'm like, all right, I'm done. Like, I'm gonna figure this out. And so I started running down the hill, catching my breath, and running up the hill. And at first I was doing it once a day, and then I was doing it twice a day. And then since we're doing these CrossFit workouts, I start figuring out, like, okay, a lot of these workouts, you don't even need equipment. Like Cindy, you can do without equipment. Yeah, and we live pretty close to an elementary school. So I was going to the elementary school, like doing Cindy by myself, or running the track, or like doing football drills constantly, outside of practice, outside of school, because one, I was a kid and delusional. I thought, like, I could I could get really good at this, like, I'm pretty good. But two, I just didn't want to get embarrassed again. That was the whole thing. I was like, I just I'm tired of like feeling like I'm fat. I am fat. I am fat, but I'm just tired of feeling like I'm fat. So I'm like, alright, I gotta fix this.

SPEAKER_00 24:54

And so I feel like I swear I'm fit, I just can't prove it right now. Under this, dude, there's some stuff.

SPEAKER_04 25:00

Alright, yeah. Yeah, so I uh I decided like, alright, I'm gonna I'm gonna start really like trying to figure this out. And so I started working out a lot more, and then luckily that summer, so every summer I would come, I'd ride, my dad would take me to Eugene, and then I would have to ride either the Greyhound bus or the Amtrak by myself back up to Seattle to hang out with my mom. And this happened from the time I was in fourth grade. This happened every year by myself. Holy smoke!

SPEAKER_00 25:32

You probably got some stories just from sitting on the bus seeing.

SPEAKER_04 25:37

I'll never forget this. One girl, so pretty. She talked to me the whole ride, and I was like, I think I'm in love. I'm in fifth grade. She was like a seventh grader, anyways. Uh so I would come up here, and luckily we had that CrossFit coach. He started printing us out workouts to do all summer.

SPEAKER_00 25:54

Heck yeah.

SPEAKER_04 25:55

And my mom's still gone all the time, still doing whatever. So I'm sitting every summer, it's a different house, and it's just me there. It's me and my one little sister every summer alone, like all summer. And so I started having her come do them with me. And we would do these workouts every single day. Like in the summer workout, I'll never forget the first workout was the Murph. No vest or anything, but it was the Murph. You do all these workouts every day, and the last workout was the Murph, and you write down your times for each. And then when you get back to school, you turn it in, and the coach would he says he'd verify. He was obviously not verifying, he just wants to see that you're doing it. Yeah. But every summer I was like, okay, I'm gonna beat that first year or that first benchmark no matter what. Um I'm just gonna keep getting better every time. And so by the time I'm a senior, football dreams are gone. I'm still playing football, but I've dislocated my shoulder eight times by now. Holy had two surgeries, I'm I'm destroyed. Like my body is wrecked. Holy smokes. Yeah, so my right shoulder, I had torn 95% of my ligaments. I had stitch marks all down my shoulder. That's why I have a tattoo there now, so you can't really see it. Yeah. Couple concussions, like, so I'm my football dreams are basically gone. But at this point, I'm six foot, 200 pounds, yeah, bigger than I am now, and I feel pretty good about myself. So I'm like, okay, cool, I'm gonna I'm gonna keep going. And then I did that until I graduated. And the day I graduated, because by this point, my dad and I get along fine, but it's not a great relationship, and I have nothing down in Oregon that's tying me there, and in my mind, I still have my sisters, like my older sisters that looked after me when I was a kid. Yeah, and so my idea is I'm going up so I can be with them. Like I'm going back to the family that I've known since I was a kid.

SPEAKER_01 28:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 28:03

And so the day I graduate high school, we're we're having this graduation party or whatever, and I get $500 like from all my cards and everything. Yeah, buddy. Felt rich. Well, yeah, my sisters, my sisters came down to the graduation, and I just told him, Hey, I'm I'm coming back with you. Like, what? Yeah, I'm coming back. You know, we don't have anywhere for you to stay. I was like, I'll figure that out. Like, I'm coming. So I told my dad I'm leaving. So I I move out the day I graduated high school. I was like, anything I can take with me, I'll take anything else, just throw it away. It's fine. What made you make that decision? Like I just felt like it was interesting because like I had a lot of friends and I was on the football team, and like everything was good in my social life, but like at home I still felt like I didn't belong.

SPEAKER_01 28:52

Okay.

SPEAKER_04 28:52

Because I didn't like, yeah, I grew up with these people, but by the time you're in fourth grade, that's not like it's still your childhood, but it doesn't really feel like your child anymore, you know. You're getting into those teenage years, yeah. And so it felt like I lived with these people, but they're not my family. Like as an adult, I look back and I feel very different about the whole situation. But at the time, I was like, I'm going back to who I feel is like my family. Yeah. And so, and and I still like my sister is like one of my best friends, and we still live right next to each other, and you know, so anyways, I'm like, okay, I'm I'm going with you guys. Anything I can fit in my bag, I'm going. And so I move up there, and on the way up, I'm calling different apartment complexes. Like, hey, you know, do you have somewhere like somewhere like 100 bucks? Exactly how it was. And I found one apartment complex in downtown Kent across from Kent Meridian High School. Okay. On East Hill in the fucking ghetto. Yeah. And all they wanted was 500 bucks down, and they didn't need a first and last, and I moved. And my girlfriend at the time, she I feel awful about this still, but she had a scholarship to go to school, but she was like, I'm moving with you. And I was like, Don't move with me. That's a bad idea. And she was like, I am, I'm just gonna apply for UW online, whatever. So she moved with me. You're like, all right. And then I thought, like, I'm gonna get a job, no problem. Like, I had a job in high school, I'll get a job. Couldn't get a job, it was impossible. Like, how long did it take? Two months. Two months. My luckily my girlfriend at the time got a job through the city of Kent in the parks department. Okay. She was like, you know how like they have like the low-income programs where they'll pass out free lunches at the parks and stuff in the summertime? Yeah, she would do that. Okay, and it was just enough to pay our rent. So was that just like a seasonal job or yep, that's all she had was like a seasonal job. And so you guys are hanging on by it. I like I apply for food stamps, I don't got shit, dude. And every day I would go to Starbucks and I would get like a refresher tee, because they were only $2 at the time, and I would sit with my laptop and apply for jobs for like six hours every day. That's all I did. Anything. I was trying to be a janitor, I was trying to do anything I could.

SPEAKER_00 31:22

You just needed some consistent flow of money.

SPEAKER_04 31:25

And then they were applying or they had like open interviews because they just opened Chipotle down at Kent Station.

SPEAKER_00 31:33

Oh, okay. So I went down, interviewed. What year is this? Do you remember? 2011. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 31:39

Went down, interviewed, got the job, because I'm brown. This guy looks authentic, but he speaks white. This is gonna work. So I go down to Chipotle. Of course, I'm working in the back though. I'm a prep cook, so all I'm doing is cutting onions all morning for hours, just crying my ass off today. It was the worst.

SPEAKER_05 31:59

That was just onions.

SPEAKER_04 32:01

You're cutting 500 onions a day with so many red onions, because it goes in everything. The fajita, the guacamole, it goes in everything. And so I'm doing that, and then my girlfriend at the time, she leaves or the seasonal job is over, and all summer she had paid for everything. Because I didn't have a dollar, like I had nothing. And any money I could get, I was paying my sister's boyfriend to come pick me up for gas money so we could go smoke weed and drink. Because I was like, there's nothing else for me to do, man. I'm living on food stamps.

SPEAKER_00 32:33

I had a buddy I would be depressed.

SPEAKER_04 32:35

Dude, I had a buddy that was working for Comcast at the time. He came to the apartment complex, cut the box, and gave me a legal cable. So I was watching fucking memorial all day smoking weed and drinking. And it I mean, it was awful looking back. At the time, it's just like this is just what it is. But uh, I get this job at Chipotle. My girlfriend at the time gets a job at the Ram down in Kent Station. Okay. And so every day I'm getting off Chipotle at like 11 after I'm prepping everything. Yeah. And I'd go over to the Ram and I would just meet the servers and stuff and just kind of chop it up with them. And then eventually I'm sitting in this booth for like three hours and they're giving me an appetizer, and I'm just taking my sweet ass time.

SPEAKER_01 33:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 33:17

But I become friends with all these servers, and then the manager starts coming over to talk to me about sports and whatever. Yeah. And then he offers me a job.

SPEAKER_00 33:24

So I get a job there. So you're you're in Chipotle in the morning, prepping everything up until like 11, and then you're going working like an afternoon night shift. Yep. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 33:37

Yeah. Like I'm working my ass off. Paying 900 bucks, not even 900 bucks. It had to have been 650 bucks, I think, for a studio apartment. I got an air mattress on the floor.

SPEAKER_00 33:47

Is your girlfriend still spotting rent, like helping you out with rent? Or at this point was she like, I just paid for everything. You gotta pay for everything now.

SPEAKER_04 33:54

Um it was pretty 50-50, but I was buying all the groceries and stuff because at this point, I'm like, the second I could get off food stamps, I did. Because my thing was like, and no knock to anyone on food stamps, yeah, but I lived on food stamps my whole life until I met my dad. Like, I was always on food stamps and always on free lunch, and it embarrassed the shit out of me. Really? It fucking I hated it. Like, because in school, free lunch, and I was on free lunch even with my dad when I was in elementary school. But free lunch, we had a different color card that we'd give them to scan, and so everyone knew you were on free lunch, and I hated pulling that shit out. I wouldn't eat sometimes. I was like, like if there was a cute girl next to me in line, I could have wouldn't eat. You couldn't hide it. No, I was like, nope, I'm I'm I'm good, I'm not hungry today. Yeah. But so I just like I don't know. I've just never I don't like free stuff. Like, like everyone likes free stuff. I just don't like things being handed to me. And so I just didn't like the idea of being on food stamps. So the second I could get off food stamps, I was like, I'm doing it. It's gotta be a good feeling.

SPEAKER_00 35:00

Obviously, food stamps are very important, like a lot of people. Yeah, no, no, no, no knockish. Obviously, it helps you a lot, but I I totally get that.

SPEAKER_04 35:07

Listen, I'm sure you've heard Joe Rogan say it, and it makes so much sense. And like this is something that I believe to my core, like the whole pull you're up by your bootstraps, not everyone's wearing boots, man. Like some of us just don't got the same thing.

SPEAKER_00 35:19

Yeah, you're not dealt with the same deck of cards, like my childhood and upbringing is vastly different than what his issue. That's which is why I wanted you to come on, dude. It's so interesting to me to hear stuff like this.

SPEAKER_04 35:32

Yeah. And like to me, I was like, okay, I just want to be able to like support myself and and figure out a way, and I didn't know any other way than hard work because that's just like all I had from the time I was in fourth grade, it was just like work hard, it'll happen. Yeah, just keep working hard, it'll all happen. Yeah, and so we still don't got a job or a car. Like, I'm still taking public transit or walking down the hill to Kent Station every day. Yeah. And like anytime we needed groceries, I'd call my sister. Hey, can you please stop at the store and give me groceries and I'll pay you? Or I had to walk to the grocery store. And so, like the safe way from there is is on the Washington Avenue, which is like on the three miles away. Yeah. Or we could walk to like a Rays, but Rays doesn't have everything, and then it closed, and now it's like just Safeway. So I'm walking all the way through downtown Kent with these groceries. I'm like, if I need milk, like I'm screwed. Yeah. And so someone jumps you and takes all your shit. So this goes on for a while. Um, and then me and my girlfriend at the time we break up. Um, you know, stupid kids doing stupid shit. We end up breaking up, and she introduced me to my now wife, and so I meet my wife. Wait, your girlfriend introduce you to her? Yes, and so this is kind of a crazy story. So my girlfriend was working at the Ram in Kent, and then so was I. And then eventually I quit Chipotle because I got moved to be an expo, which is the guy that runs out the food.

SPEAKER_01 37:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 37:11

And as an expo, you get tipped out by every server. You get tipped out like 10% of what they make. Okay. The thing is, if you are good or if they like you, then they will tip you more. Okay. And I'm a 20-year-old kid with all these single 32-year-old females working in the bar. All I did was flirt with them to get more money. Yeah. And like, I like them all. We're all friends, and we were all very good friends at the time. And all the servers that I had already known, like, we're all like those are some of my best friends still. Like, one of them flew from New York to Maui to be in my wedding. Like, we're still really cool. Yeah. And so they're all tipping me, and I'm finally like making, even now, pretty good money. Like, and so I'm like, okay, I can quit Chipotle. My girlfriend at the time moves over to the Federal A RAM to help open up that store.

SPEAKER_01 38:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 38:08

She meets a bunch of new people, obviously. I go over there, meet these people. One of the people she introduced me to was my wife. And so when we break up, I hit up this really cute girl that I got introduced to. Was she working at the Ram too, or did she just she was? Oh, okay. The Fedora Way one, though. Yep. Okay. And so that's how I met her. But in that time at Kent Station, I got to meet obviously a lot of people. And across the street is a showwear center where they hold the CrossFit games.

unknown 38:43

Oh.

SPEAKER_04 38:43

The regionals. Yeah. Oh. They used to hold the regionals there every year. Oh, sweet. And so I would meet all these CrossFit people. They would always come to the Ram afterwards to get a beer and a burger with an egg on it and no bun. You know, CrossFit sweet potato fries.

SPEAKER_00 38:57

Counting their macros.

SPEAKER_04 38:59

And so I uh I met a dude named Ryan. He used to own Imperial. He let me go there a couple times. And so I'd go there, and then I met a dude named Jake. He owns Devotion. Yep. And so I started going to Devotion. And that I had gone. What year did you start going to Devotion? For a while now. Probably 2014, maybe? Oh, okay. 2015, something like that.

SPEAKER_00 39:23

But I went, you know, three years without working out at all because I couldn't afford a fucking gym membership. That's what I was I meant to ask. Like, how was your health during all you moved back here, you're in that apartment. I know you said you were going smoking weed, drinking alcohol, all that stuff.

SPEAKER_04 39:36

How was Remember that fat kid? Yeah. He didn't know anything about this dude. All right. I would eat Chipotle every day.

SPEAKER_01 39:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 39:43

Because that was the only food I could really afford, like to go out and eat. Yeah. And then I was eating the RAM every day. Yeah. And I didn't have a gym membership. There wasn't a gym near me, nor did I have a car to get to a gym. And so I was putting on the pounds. Yeah. And I got up to like 225, 230, maybe. Is that the heaviest you've ever been? I got up to 245. 245? During COVID when my kids were born.

SPEAKER_01 40:14

Dang.

SPEAKER_04 40:14

Yeah. That was anyways. I I start meeting these CrossFit dudes. I start going back to Devotion, and that's right when Brad had started. Brad and Brian. Yeah. So I'm working out with them. Shout out. Shout out to Brad and Brian. I start working out with them. And I finally have a car, so I can drive there. And so I'm doing pretty well. And then I meet my wife. And then, you know, I'm living in Kent. She's living in Renton. I'm spending almost every day in Renton driving from Renton to Covington to get to CrossFit. Not really that feasible. Yeah. And I'm working night shifts. So I'm not waking up at five to go. Yeah. And so I fall off of fitness for a little while. And then I move in with my sister down in Auburn. Okay. Um, and so I'm living with my sister, and she's the one, her her husband is the one that got me into the trades and all that. But um she also was the one that introduced me to Kesha. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 41:25

And so how did she know Kesha?

SPEAKER_04 41:27

So after Auburn, she had moved to Tahali. Kesha was her neighbor, and she was one of the first people to work out for Assemble because she was at Evolve. And then when Kesha left, she used to follow Kesha and was working out of out of her garage when they first started doing the gym thing. Before that was a building.

SPEAKER_00 41:43

That's how Kesha started it, right? Like in her garage. Just workouts in her garage.

SPEAKER_04 41:46

Yep. And then when they first got the gym, my sister was like, hey, I think you'd like this place. You should come check it out. And this is right about when I'm 245. It's 2020. Like right when the gym opens. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:00

And think she opened during COVID.

SPEAKER_04 42:02

Uh yeah. You'd have to ask her, but it's right around then because I've been there for almost five years.

SPEAKER_00 42:07

She's gonna come on here, so I'll ask her on the podcast.

SPEAKER_04 42:10

Uh yeah, so then I meet Kesha, and I'm still like I'm still a pretty heavy dude at this time, but like I've always been pretty strong, you know, and the heavier you get, the stronger you get. It's just math, you know? Weight moves weight. And so I'm going and I'm only lifting. Like, I'm only lifting there. I'm not running really. Like, I'll go to Max Days here and there, but I'm skipping them when I can, and I'm I'm not about it. I always told her like forever. I was like, this ain't a runner's body. I'm not a runner, I'm not gonna run it. She has told me that you used to always say always every time there was running in the workout. If it was optional, I wasn't doing it. If it was recommended, I would light jog a vest. I was like, I'm not a runner, this ain't a runner. I'll sprint a little bit here and there, but I'm not running.

SPEAKER_00 42:56

And you've done a lot of CrossFit, and like the most running I've ever done a CrossFit workout was maybe a mile, maybe a little over a mile.

SPEAKER_04 43:03

That's it. And outside of that, it's like 800 meters every time. That's like the standard.

SPEAKER_00 43:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 43:07

Or 400. That's what they do. And so I'm I'm working out with her and stuff, and then it's probably 2022, I think, was the first time I heard David Goggins. Yeah. And just like everyone else, man, I was like, this guy knows, this guy knows. But then I listened to his book, and that shit hit home with me hard. Like it did that for a lot of people. It did it for me too. Well, and I skipped over quite a bit, but like I wouldn't say I got the shit kicked out of me when I was a kid, but I got beat a lot. Like a lot. And so, like, in his book, when he's talking about that, I'm just like, everything is like flooding back. And like shit that I don't even really remember. And like, it's just fucking flooding. And I'm like almost crying listening to this book, and I'm like, Jesus Christ. And then he gets The end talking about San Diego one day. And I was like, that's so crazy that somebody can do that. Like it's it that seems impossible.

SPEAKER_00 44:06

And he also was like 230 pounds when he did that too.

SPEAKER_04 44:10

And so then I'm like, okay, well, if this guy can do it, like I can do it. Yeah. And so I start running. Like thinking one day I'm going to try an ultra.

SPEAKER_00 44:19

Like, I'm going to do it sometime. That you already you had that thought just from listening to his book. You're like, I'm going to do an ultra.

SPEAKER_04 44:24

Immediately I was like, if this guy can do it, I can do it. I'm going to fucking do it. I don't know how. I don't know how you sign up. I don't know where they're at, but I'm going to find one and I'm going to fucking do it. And then I met Colby and Maddie. Through the just through the gym. Through the gym. Kesha introduced me to Maddie. And she's like, these this couple, they're going to start working out here. I think Maddie, my coach, blah, blah, blah. She's like, you're going to like them. I was like, why is that? She goes, well, they ran ultras. I said, really? Yeah. And I was like, oh shit, because at the time nobody at the gym ran ultras. Yeah. And uh so I was like, okay, well, introduce me to them when they're in here, please. And so they introduced me to them. And at this time I'm still not running. In my mind, I'm running an ultra, but I haven't started running. I'm still like, I'm doing more running at the gym, but I'm never running outside the gym. Okay. And then I meet Colby finally, and I was like, hey, I'm gonna try to go run. You wanna come run with me? And like in my mind, outside of ultras, when people go run, it's like three miles, five miles maybe. Yeah. It's like, yeah, let's go do it. So, okay, let's go tomorrow. So I go, decide to run with Colby. This guy takes me out for eight miles on the trails. Where? Into Holly. I never ran before. He's like, come on, buddy. Beats me down. Like, and he, you know, Colby's smiling. He's having a good time.

SPEAKER_00 45:50

He's talking. Oh, probably not even paying attention to that you're hurt or anything.

SPEAKER_04 45:55

He's just we're running 10 minute miles. He's basically walking backwards. This guy's got no issues.

SPEAKER_00 46:00

And he's always just so happy. He's always like in his own world. He's probably like, yeah, come on, dude. Just not even seeing that you're struggling.

SPEAKER_04 46:07

And I mean, I don't know what it is, but we did that. And I got home, and about 30 minutes later, I was like, all right, I'm I'm gonna do this. Yeah, I'm gonna figure this out. Like it's just like everything. Like, practice and I'll get it. And so I started running, and I started texting Colby all the time. Can we go run? Can we go run? Let's go run. Come on, let's go. And then he so this was in October of 2023, I think, at this point. And after the second run, he called me and he said, Hey, there's a 50k in January. Do you want to do it? And this is like, oh shit, this is the moment. And like, I was like, give me a week, I'll get back to you. If I don't call you in a week, call me. Yeah. I just I really have to think about it. Because I've ran you know a total of eight miles at this point.

SPEAKER_00 47:05

And outside of the gym.

SPEAKER_04 47:07

Outside of the gym. And and at the time, and I don't know if she would admit to this, but we didn't run nearly as much as we run now. It didn't use in the gym? Yeah. We used to run, but it was not like it is now. Yeah. Um, and I'm like, you know, kind of hemming and hawn, and I called him back about third minutes later. I was like, I'm in. I'm in. Where do I gotta be? Yeah. And it was fucking stupid. It was a dumbass idea. Cause this is October 31st. It was Halloween. No, it was November 1st. It was a day after Halloween. It was my sister's anniversary. I remember that. That ultra took place January 19th. And I had ran eight miles of my fucking life, basically. Like in one go. Yeah. And I mean, but I kept thinking back to that David Goggins book. He's like, you know, I gotta lose 100 pounds in three months. If this fucking guy can do it, I can do this. Like, and I just I was like, alright. Every fucking day I was strapping up, I'd go, I'd get my ass lost on those fucking trails, and I'd find my way back.

SPEAKER_01 48:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 48:12

And I did it. I ended up shedding 40 pounds.

SPEAKER_00 48:20

Down to what?

SPEAKER_04 48:21

About 190-ish.

SPEAKER_00 48:23

Dude, that's perfect.

SPEAKER_04 48:25

And I went and ran the ultra. And then it beat me up so bad that I never wanted to run again. And then I'm done. That is it. I ran my ultra. I never have to do it again. And that's right about when David Goggin's second book came out, I think.

SPEAKER_00 48:43

Yeah, right?

SPEAKER_04 48:45

Probably. And so okay, well, I gotta listen to this one. The last one was so good. And I was like, God, you fat little bitch. You are being so lazy. And then I was like, okay, we're gonna I'm gonna do another one. So okay. This is also this is about like a year later. Because I went and watched them finish the Wokusum One. The year after? In 2024, yeah. Okay. I went and watched them at the finish line. Okay. And I saw them, and I fucking hated myself. I hated myself. Because you did it the year before. I knew that I could do it, but I was being too much of a pansy. Like I was too afraid of being hurt. I was like, it just because I didn't prep right, I didn't know how to prep, it was snowing in like 35 mile-an hour winds, and I was wearing a t-shirt and shorts. Like I didn't have anything. I was wearing Brooks road shoes up that clear cut. You know what I'm talking about. It was brutal. I I got my ass kicked.

SPEAKER_01 49:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 49:43

It took me like seven and a half hours. That's what, like, because every time I do the same thing, just like Colby did to you. Like, my other buddies are like, hey, I want to get into running. And then if I am doing a race and there's like a shorter race distance within that same race, I'm always just like, hey, sign up for this, sign up for this. And I always like it when people are just like, fuck it, and they just sign up and just go for it. But there can be a downside to it, like how you reacted to it. And just like you do it and you're like, fuck that, I'm never doing it again. You just stop. So some people just react to it differently, but I do like when people just jump right into it because there's no like I hate it when people are like, Yeah, I'm eventually gonna get there. Those are the people that never actually end up doing it because they think too much, they sit on it too much. It's just like, no, pick pick something, put it on the calendar. Now you know when it is, you're set in stone, just train up to it and just get it done. If you don't like it after that, at least you know what it is, you experienced it. Right. Whatever.

SPEAKER_04 50:40

But yeah, so I I watched that next year, and I'm fucking I'm drinking cool's lights in the parking lot with a bunch of people at Assemble, like which is fine, yeah, but I'm also not doing anything else. Like I'm lifting it assemble and I'm running it assemble, but I'm still putting on weight because I'm still drinking and doing whatever and not taking it that seriously. Yeah. Like I still want to be fit, but I don't want to be that fit because I don't want to work that hard and I don't want to try that hard. And so that when that happened, that kind of fucked me up a little bit. And then I start running again. I'm like, okay, I'm getting back into it. We're gonna we're gonna do this. And then we have a birthday party that Kesha and I are both at, and you are running Cascade Crest. Yeah, buddy. And I hadn't even I'd met you one time at a Ranio to Rustin, just very, very briefly, but I didn't really know you. I don't I don't remember. Right. We shook hands and that was it because Brad was like, Brad was talking about you afterwards because we would work out at Devotion all the time.

SPEAKER_00 51:42

I remember he snuck up on me. Yeah, I was standing there waiting to go. Yep. And um, what's I know that Juvik is his last name. What's his name? Yeah, he was with Brad when he came up to me too, and they said what's up.

SPEAKER_04 51:54

It was super, super brief. And but Brad had been talking about you.

SPEAKER_00 52:00

Yeah. Um I'd been talking about Brad too. When I saw him, I was like, this guy's fucking crazy. Oh, he smoked me in that Rainer Rustin.

SPEAKER_04 52:08

Dude, he was flying.

SPEAKER_00 52:08

Yeah, he was running like six six fifteen's the whole time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 52:12

Uh, but, anyways, yeah, so Kesha's there and she's watching your live tracker, and so I'm keeping up with you because I'm interested still, you know. I'm like fresh off that second book, and I'm like I'm struggling through that.

SPEAKER_00 52:24

That was my first one.

SPEAKER_04 52:25

Dude, this guy's running a fucking hundred miles. And I knew Colby had tried it a couple times and hadn't done it. Yeah. And then Colby had Badger, and I forget which order this is in. Colby could have had Badger before this, but Colby has Badger, and I keep telling him, I'm like, I'll come crew you, I'll come pace you, just keep me updated, let me know when it is, whatever. And he tells me, and I don't put it down on my counter, whatever. And then I'm at work, and Maddie sends me a picture of Colby at Candy Mountain, five miles in. It's like, Colby's going. And I'm like, fuck. So I call my boss, I was like, hey, I gotta go. I don't feel good. He's like, okay. I go home, I get in my car, and I drive straight over to Eastern Washington. Uh yeah. I tell my wife, I was like, babe, I'm sorry. Like, I already promised this guy I'm not gonna let him down. Like, I'm going. I'm sorry, like I know you got the kids at home, but I gotta go. Yeah. And so I drive over there. What a friend. Immediately get out of the car and run 30 miles with him.

SPEAKER_00 53:24

Where where did you meet him?

SPEAKER_04 53:26

So I met him. I met him at Candy coming out of the 50-mile turnaround. So he's at 55. Where's so Candy's Candy Mountain's the first aid station?

SPEAKER_00 53:44

Oh, that's right. After you do that first little climb, you come down, go down the road under the bridge, and then up to the left. Yeah, that's candy. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 53:51

Yep. Okay. So, no, no, no. That's the second aid station. That's Jacob's road. So you're going over um Badger Mountain, and then you cross across the road, go down, and go left to that big parking lot. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so the bridge is the natural stuff. Anyways, yeah, so that's Candy. Um, so I meet him at Candy, he's like, I'll take over. Brought my vest, I'm good to go. And so we're moving slow, but we're still jogging and stuff. And then I take him from Candy all the way to McBee Ridge, and it's pretty dark at this point, and I haven't slept at all. So Maddie's like, okay, I'll do McBee. You try to get some sleep.

SPEAKER_00 54:33

McBee Ridge is at the bottom of the big where you go do the little loop. The out and back. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 54:39

Yep. So I'm at the bottom of McBee Ridge, it's fucking 15 degrees. I didn't bring anything. Like I just brought the clothes I'm wearing, and I'm like trying to sleep in this car, shivering my ass off. Yeah. They get back down about four hours later. Uh-huh. I wake up and I take him. Yeah, that's the worst spot. So I take him from McBee all the way back to Candy. And then Maddie wants to do the last five. Okay. But then I see him finish his first hundred, and I'm like, and you know, he's crying. It's emotional. Your verse hundred, it's a big deal. And I'm just sitting there like, okay. If Colby can do it, I can do it. Like, no knock to Colby, he's a great athlete and he's a freak. He's a savage. But I'm like, he's really no different than me. Like, because even in my mind, I'm like, if David Goggins can do it, I can do it. But he's also two steps removed. You know what I'm saying? It's like like saying Cam Haynes can do it, I can do it. No, the fuck I can't. Like in my mind, because I'm stupid, I can do it, but I can't fucking do it. And so I see Colby finish this thing, and then I it's that's so that's in March, and then the birthday, that's in July or June or whatever. Yeah, July is cascade. And we're following you. Uh-huh. And I'm like, okay, like this is fucking cool. And then Kesha tells me you're gonna come work out at the gym, and that's when I actually meet you and we're working out together, and then I was like, telling you about it. Hey, I want to do 100, and you're like, Well, do that drawer. I'm like, well, I'll do the 100K. Because I know if I can do 40 miles, I remember we were 60.

SPEAKER_00 56:13

We were texting back and forth because this was in February. We were a whole group of us was in Sonoma because we're gonna do the Lake Sonoma 100 miler. We got Jalen and I got cut off at the 50 mile mark because it was the rainstorm and there was flooding and all that stuff, so they canceled the race. And so at this point, I'm thinking in my head, like, damn, I really wanted to get the hundred in which one is the next closest race that I can get into. You happened to just text us like literally the day after we finished that 50 saying you you signed up for the 100k or we're going to. Yeah. And I looked on there too, because I was like, maybe I'll do the 100k. I saw they had the 100-mile option. And I was like, why does motherfucker? There's a option. Like, why do a hundred K if they're offering the hundred? I know you want to do that. You've talked about it before. Why not? Just sign up for it.

SPEAKER_04 57:03

Well, and in my mind, it was just such a big jump from a 50K to a hundred mile error. It is. And I was just like, I know 50 miles is definitely in the realm of possibility because we had just done the 50K in January that year. And I was like, okay, that's almost 40 miles. 50K.

SPEAKER_00 57:22

Yeah. Almost 40 miles. Yeah. His 50K is or not 60K. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 57:26

Plus. So I'm like, okay, if I can do 40 and I can still walk around and everything, like, I can do 50 miles. Like, I can definitely do that. And I'm like, well, if I can do 50, I can do 63.

SPEAKER_01 57:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 57:38

But then that jump isn't a 10 mile jump anymore. Then it's another fucking 40 miles. You know? I'm like, okay, so I know I can do 63. And you're like, just sign up for the 100. I'm like, well, I don't know. Like, I don't think I'm ready for that. I haven't prepared enough for that. Like, I know I can get the 100k done, and I don't know how many opportunities I'm going to get to do a hundred mile, or like if I do it, I I want to be able to finish it. And you were like, don't be a bitch, just do it.

SPEAKER_00 58:01

Yeah, because at this point, dude, like, yeah, I understand if people are doing this, because you're talking about signing up for a hundred miler like three weeks out from it. Because it's like mid-February, and Badger is actually coming up the end of this month. Um but yeah, you were like a month out, and I understand if like you hadn't been training up to that point, and then you're like, dude, I haven't prepared enough for that, then I would I would have given you more grace. But leading up to my 100 miler and Sonoma, you were training with me. Yeah, like you were hitting 50 to 70 mile weeks, like doing long ass runs with me. I've seen you run, I've seen you do 20 plus mile runs. We've done them together. So I was just thinking in my head, I was like, what is he talking about, dude? He can do this. We did uh the 50k together, and this 50k we keep talking about is the Wilkeson mega fat ass. Um it's a sweet race, it's growing every single year. I've done it the last two years. Dylan did his first Eric. Yeah, Eric. Um, but yeah, if anyone's interested in doing their first 50k, they should definitely look into uh what 2027? Yeah. 2027, yeah. Yeah, 2027. Fucking awesome race. Yeah. Anyways, where what was I even talking about?

SPEAKER_04 59:07

Oh, just the jump from 100k to 100. That's so silly.

SPEAKER_00 59:11

Like no. I yeah, you you were coming up with all these like reasons, like, oh, why you shouldn't. And I was just like, dude, fucking go for it. And then you did, and another funny thing you did because you were still nervous about it, you made a note, like a shared note, and you were like, I forget what you titled it.

SPEAKER_04 59:28

I get it now, all right? But you don't know until you know. Yeah. I mean, you were like, and I'm listening to all these fucking podcasts, and they got all this shit in my head, and they're like, All right, you need to make a list of the only reasons you would DNF. Yeah. And I'm like, okay, okay. And it was like on the list was like, I broke my leg. If like shit that like I just couldn't finish.

SPEAKER_00 59:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 59:49

And then I don't remember if it was you or Jalen or somebody went in there and was like, if I get a boo-boo, if I hurt my toe. That was that was Jalen. And then I go in.

SPEAKER_00 59:58

Oh, okay, now it makes sense. I remember that popping up on my phone too, and I went in there and I was like, I I wrote up in there, I was like, what the fuck is this? Delete this right now, and then you responded back in the notes, and you're like, you're right. And then you deleted it right away.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:12

But yeah, you just this is the thing, like if you have these big goals, right? And like, like you at the 200, and it's a little bit different because obviously you don't know what that feels like, but you do know what hell feels like. Like it is horrendous.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:00:28

But if you don't know, one, it is worse than you think. It's fucking awful. But it's like, if you don't know, it becomes this thing where it's like a wall you can't get through. Yeah. And so then you start to like try to find people or things that corroborate your feelings. And so I'm listening to all these podcasts, and it's all these people that have DNF'd races and why they DNF'd and shit. And then when you sent me that, I was like, you know what? You're right. This is fucking stupid. Flip the script. Yeah. I was like, I told my wife, I was like, look, if they pull me off this course, I'm coming back tomorrow to finish this thing. I'm getting the hundred miles done. There's nothing stopping. Like, I do not care. I will go to CVS and get crutches and finish this shit on crutches. Like, I'm doing this fucking thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:17

A lot of people make fun of me for always saying this. I always say it's always it's all mental. I say that all the fucking time, but it truly is. Like if you just flip the script and you're like, unless you're going into these things trying to get top three, then obviously I understand having all those nerves and like, okay, I need to DNF so I can possibly go win this other one or some just there's more reasons too if you're a top athlete, but if you're truly just going to finish, obviously push yourself and get a respectable time for you. Finishing is finishing is a fucking feat in itself. Oh, finishing at 50k is like that's fucking awesome. What percentage of the population actually does that? In our world, it feels so normalized because everyone around us now does it. Yeah. But think of people outside of the gym. How many people do we know?

SPEAKER_04 1:02:04

Like the amount of time, are you fucking crazy? Are you nuts? I wouldn't drive that far. You're a psycho. I would never do that. Do you hate yourself? It's like, well, yes, I do hate myself. Thank you. But also, like, yeah, I I tried to explain this to somebody a couple months ago because they were asking about it. And the way that it clicks for me is like, I just think as an adult, especially an adult male, and like you can take that however you want, but like as an adult male in my eyes, I don't have a ton of times where I'm like genuinely proud of something I did. It's like that was cool, but what's next? That was awesome, but whatever. Or like, that's just what I'm supposed to do. Like being a good dad is great, but in my mind, I'm like, I'm supposed to be a good dad. Like, I'm not proud of being a good dad, that's my job. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. But like doing something like that, and obviously everyone's journey is different, but for me, I had built up this thing for three years, and I thought about it all the time, and it ate at me. And it was like, am I good enough? Am I fit enough? Am I do is my will there? Like, am I strong enough mentally to get through this? Like, all this shit, like the culminating emotions when you finish like a goal that's that big in your mind, like this was Mount Olympus. This was it. And like that feeling, like I was legitimately proud of myself for like a month. Like a week, like super proud. Like, I fucking did that shit. That was crazy. And then you think back and you're like, that's a whole lifetime you feel like you lived in that oh 30 hours.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:53

It's it's insane. Like, you can't describe it to people. Maybe like the 50-mile distance you can kind of knock on the door of what it's gonna start to feel like, but doing that whole hundred like something about starting in the morning one day and running through the night and seeing the sun come up while you haven't slept and you've still been on your feet, just something about that makes you feel like you've lived a whole life within it, like just like you said. It's it's so crazy feeling.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:19

Yeah, I don't think like, and now I've done 50 miles and 100 K's and stuff, and and I don't think even those touch it.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:25

Like, no, and and I can't I can't wait. Pain pain-wise, you get in the same realm, you feel it.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:31

Yep, but uh I think right around that 60 miles, it's like maybe the 55, depending on the course, obviously. Every course is different, so they're working different muscles and stuff, but like I'm interested to see how this 200, what your story is, because like it's not gonna be a hundred miler and then another hundred miler, because as you know, it gets exponentially harder.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:04:55

Like the first mile and the tenth mile might feel pretty similar, and even the twentieth. But once you get to 30, 30 doesn't feel like 40. No. 40 doesn't feel like 70. Yeah. And 70 sure as shit doesn't feel like 90. Like at 90, I wanted to die.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:11

It might for half a mile within there. It comes back and it goes and it comes. Yeah, so many ups and downs throughout that whole thing. It's like one one time you'll be running a 730, and then next thing you know, you're doing a 20-minute mile, and it feels like you're running a six-minute mile.

SPEAKER_04 1:05:28

On flat, and you're just shuffling. And I remember sitting in that chair at Jacob's Road looking at Kesha, and she's fucking having a ball, laughing her ass off, and I'm like, this is the dumbest shit I've ever done. Yeah, like I feel like I could die. Like, I don't feel good at all. And shout out to my wife, she's great. She brought me Starbucks and a McMuffin, and I was so excited or a McGriddle. I was so pumped. I took one bite of that McGriddle and almost threw up. I was like, Oh, dude, I hate that you just did this for me because I cannot touch this.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:58

She was awesome there too, because she Would every time I came into aid stations, everyone who was there would jump in and help. And yeah, I remember I was having a really hard time eating, and I think it was at like mile 60 or something like that. It was after Kesha stopped pacing me. Um, and she came up to give me a Krispy Kreme donut, and it sounded so good. And she it was so nice of her to come just go out of her way to come hand me one. And I I took two bites of it and I wanted to fucking throw up too, and I just kept it in my hand and we started running, and we got like out of their sight, and I just threw it. Like I was like, it tastes so good, but I just can't stomach this right now.

SPEAKER_04 1:06:37

Yeah, it's crazy what your body's going through.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:38

I mean, it you know also you mentioned Kesha. Kesha's a fucking gangster. She showed up, picked me up at mile 50 of this race, ran all the way out, did the hardest climbs, like saw the gnarliest weather that we had throughout that race, went from dusk all the way until like 4 a.m. with me, went got to experience the worst winds up at the top of McBee. Like she saw the nasty part of it, and I felt so bad because I was hurting the whole time she was with me, and we were moving so slow. And she still she did like 30 something miles with me, and she hadn't ran further than a marathon before this. But granted, like we were power walking and like trotting around, so it wasn't crazy hard for her. But just to be on her feet that long and come and pace me, it helped me a ton throughout that race.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:26

But people don't understand this, like, unless you've done them, and I'm sure people listening to this have done them, but like pacers and crew members are never gonna get enough credit. Yeah, like those people like it's such a big ask, and it doesn't even seem like it to them if they haven't done it before, but like hey, can you drive way the fuck out of your way, take a weekend away, not sleep, go through the night, sit in the rain? Like, they get not nearly enough credit, but like if you have a good team with you, like your mom's great at this, Riley's great at this, Kesha, Andrea, like my friend Olivia flew from Chicago to come help me. Yeah. Quick side note, we did uh so Olivia, my friend from Chicago, she came, so she used to coach at Assemble.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:08:18

Yeah, so she she knows everyone, but anyway, so she did 50 to 55 with me. And uh, you know, 50 miles at Badger, for anyone that doesn't know, it's an out and back twice. So you're 50 miles, you're back at the start line, and a lot of people take that time to change shoes or socks or you know, really recover before you go back out for the the night shift. And so we're at 50. I'm like, okay, we're gonna start moving again. Let's get back up the mountain, let's get over to Candy and start working our way through the night because it's starting to get dark. And we walk up, Badger, and we're kind of just slowly trotting along the ridgeline before we start going down. She's like, this is all it is? This isn't bad at all.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:03

I'm like, in my head, I'm just like, shut the fuck up.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:07

She hasn't seen the Jeep Trail, she hasn't seen the other little rolling hills all throughout that, or the McBee climb.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:12

Like, well, and she's like pressing me to go faster. I'm like, I'm going as fast as I can. She's like, you can run faster than this. I was like, maybe at mile 10 I could have, but I'm at mile 60 now. Like, give me a break. So, anyways, at one point, I said, Olivia, I love you, but you ain't making this any better. And she goes, What are you talking about? I was like, I'm dropping you off a candy, we're gonna run to Jacob's together, and I'm picking you up at Jacobs, and you're going through the Jeep Trails with me, and you're gonna see how fun this gets. Yeah. And so we get to Jacob's and then we leave, and from Jacobs, you have four and a half miles to Orchard or six miles to Orchard and then four miles to McBee Ridge. It's about a 10-mile stretch. So, but crews can't get to orchard, right? Yeah, so it's pitch black now. Oh, yeah, that's right. That was that little one, like tucked on the side of the hill, and then right from there you go up. Straight up.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:04

Yep. And so we got headlamps on, and we're like shuffling, power walking down the long gravel road, through the orchards or whatever, and then we get to the Jeep Trails. And I mean, you've hiked with me before, like, we're both pretty good at the incline, like, it doesn't not that big of a deal. Even when your legs are dead from running, for me the second time. Yeah, the climbing is still something that like usually I'd rather just go fast up it.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:29

Yeah, you know what I'm saying? I wasn't the second time on the Jeep Trails, dude. I was crawling. And that dude Simon who who put out the YouTube video. Hey, shout out to Simon if you can see this, dude. Thank you. The short like five-second clip of him climbing on the Jeep Trails, I'm right in front of him during it, and you can just see me like dragging my feet. It's me and Kesha, and we're going so slow, and he got that little part on the YouTube is running with Simon, Badger Mountain, 2025. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:55

Go look it up. Uh yeah, so, anyways, I'm like hiking up this trail, and I keep having to turn around because now she's dragging. She's like, this is really hard. It's like, I've done this twice now, plus all the other shit. Alright, don't say this shit isn't that bad ever again to me. Yeah. And I'm like, anytime there's a hill, I'm like, I'm leaving her. Like, I was so you know, you get like your moons are crazy too.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:20

Like, yeah, you get angry.

SPEAKER_04 1:11:21

Sometimes you get so angry over small shit. And yeah, I remember my my wife, I told her, hey, at the 50-mile turnaround in the minute, I need the headlamps. Because you can't park by the aid station. You're parking way over the park lot. Yeah. I said, I need the headlamps. And she's like, okay. We get there. She doesn't have the headlamp. So, babe, I need the headlamp. She goes, You don't need the headlamps, you're gonna have plenty of time to get to the next one before dark. I said, I need the headlamp. She's like, I'm not going to get them. I was like, okay. It got dark. I didn't have a headlamp. And the whole way to the next one, I'm fucking fuming in my mouth. Yeah, dude. I'm so mad at her. And then we get there, she hands me the headlamp. I go to turn it on, it doesn't have batteries in it. I'm like, what the fuck are you doing? I need batteries for the headlamp to work. And she's like, Don't shout at me. I'm sorry, I'm trying to help. Yeah. But then, you know, once you leave everyone, and it's just me and Colby, Colby's not talking, and I'm not talking because we're both dying.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:15

We're jogging down the backside of Candy Mountain, and in my head, I'm just kicking myself. I'm like, what a piece of shit, dude. She's been up for 20 hours. Like, she's trying to help. And so I come, I turn to Colby and I say, Hey, please don't let me forget to apologize to my wife after this because I can't do that.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:32

That was my next like thought I I was holding in my head to say after you're done talking was like, there's so many times in these races where like my mom is the best crew cheap. She, like, without hesitation, anytime I sign up for a race, she's like, Okay, I'm gonna get an Airbnb where when what like she's just always been at every single one of my races and helps me out so much. And there have been so many little times where I just like snap at her at races just because like over dumb shit like that. Yeah, and then in the moment, you don't really give a shit. You're just like trying because you're just surviving, like you're just trying to get from point A to point B. Body shutting down, keep moving, yeah. But then after the fact, every after you have time to like think about it, you're like, damn, I was a fucking asshole.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:17

Like, I feel really dude, you like hate yourself.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:20

And now that's something because there was one time in Cascade Crest where it was my first hundred, yeah, my mom's first time crewing me for a hundred, and I snapped at her pretty good. And I remember like there's a song 20 miles after that where I was like, I gotta have more gray, like I feel so bad, I gotta have more grace for her too. Because we're both trying to figure this out, right? Right.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:41

Especially well, that was like the same thing. Like it's my wife's first time crewing, she's never even seen an ultra. Yeah, like she saw me finish a 50k, but that's not the same thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:49

Yeah, like and anyone who's there, it helps more than more than they can even understand her now. So, like, I'm I'm always super grateful for everyone, even if they show up and see me at one aid station for one minute and they're like, all they say is you look great, good job. Like that helps so much.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:04

Even like so, we're talking about Badger a lot, but that's just because that's a hundred that we've done together. So, like McBee Ridge has the houses right there. Yeah, and like the kids are coming out of their houses to cheer you on and shit. Like, that means so much when you're so in the throes of despair, you're like, just head down, don't stop moving, just keep walking, and then you see a little kid like go! It's like, oh, thank you. Yeah, I'll never forget there was this old lady, I don't know how old she was, 65, 70, not super old, but it's an older lady, and she's just holding the sign, and she lives in one of these houses. She's sitting over by the porch, and it just says relentless forward momentum. And I thought about that lady and that sign for like 35 miles because I wanted to quit, and I was like, just don't stop moving and it'll end. Like it will end. You just have to keep going.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:54

Yeah, it's I get like that too. Like I see something or just a thought pops in my head, and I always have like little mantras that I keep repeating in my own head. I don't sometimes I would look like a psycho because I do say shit out loud to myself, just keep repeating it just to keep myself going. But every like 10 to 15 miles in these things, I always have something that I'm like trying to repeat in my head just to keep going, or I'm completely zen down. But but yeah, little things like that help so much.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:21

Yeah, dude. Pacers, crew members, race directors, volunteers, like it all, and it means the world. Like I try to be so nice to everyone, but shit, sometimes it just ain't there. Like sometimes I just don't got it in me.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:34

That's something I have been a lot more conscious about, like going into this year, because I'm doing a ton of races and people are coming out to help me and stuff. So I'm like, I'm gonna try to pay attention to that at my best. Have some grace with me at Bigfoot for everyone who comes out there because that's gonna be a whole new realm. I don't even like compare it to what hundreds are gonna be like. I think of it as a completely different category. It's a multi-day thing. Like multiday. Hundreds are what 35, 36 hours at the most. Like you can you can hammer down for 36 hours, like that's a day plus a couple in some change of just motor and buy. But like you're pushing 40 hours, 48 hours, that's two days straight. Like after that, too. Like, I have no idea how my body's gonna react. Like I the longest I've ran was Cascade Crest. So it took me 33 hours, I believe. It was like just over 33 hours. So anything past that, like, I don't know how I'm gonna be emotionally, physically.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:37

Like, I don't know things, like we said, dude, you you just don't know until you know, and then I mean, obviously, af after that you'll have such a good gauge for I mean, really everything. Because at this point, I mean, not I guess technically the longest, but the longest like big race is the Arizona Monster. So it's like if you do the 200, it's like, okay, well, where do you go from there? But the opportunity to get into anything over 200 is so hard, like so far and few between.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:05

All those people just jump on it. Like, I remember when I was signing up for I just knew I wanted to get a 200 or 200 plus Miler in this year, so I signed up for Bigfoot, Tahoe, Kodona, and Moab. I just threw my name in the hat on all of them, and it doesn't charge your card until you get into them. And so I knew how competitive it was to get in. They only like some of them you have to qualify for, some of them they'll throw you on a wait list of like Kokonona. I was number like 800 something on the wait list. Yes, Bigfoot was the first one that I like got accepted into, so I just canceled all the other registrations, and I was just like, that was my thought process. I'm gonna throw myself in the hat for like four or five of these things and just take whatever one accepts me into it. Um, but yeah, I think my next jump after 200, we'll see um if I even want to go any further. But I think my next one will probably be like Moab or Coca-Dona would be sweet. That would be so cool, and then eventually, sites on Arizona Monster three. Eventually, I don't know.

SPEAKER_04 1:18:06

If you gotta do one, you gotta do them both. Go Coco Monster, all 550.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:09

And then at that point, they're probably gonna have a fucking 500 mile or so. Right, who knows?

SPEAKER_04 1:18:13

It'll never end, man. Yeah, uh as long as there's cycles out there, yeah. I'll keep pushing it.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:17

We can have I know you've been dealing with a little bit of uh Achilles issue. We kind of had similar stuff going on, but mine's kind of mine went away a little bit quicker than yours. You're still dealing with it. What's what's the plan for like from today up until two years from now? Like, what where are you at mentally with where you want to go?

SPEAKER_04 1:18:35

Well, I really wanted to get a hundred miler in this year. Um, I don't think a hundred's gonna be in the cards this year. Like I said, I got kids, I got I got two little girls, so fitting in uh I'm gonna call it a hobby. Yeah, a hobby like this is is difficult, you know. Um it just it requires a lot of time away from family, big sacrifices by by everybody, but especially by my wife. Like for me, like running or working out, like I don't view that as a sacrifice. I know a lot of people do, like that is something that they don't want to do or they dread. Like, I'm excited to go do it. I I like to do it and I enjoy that. It's kind of like my meditation, I'm sure it's similar for you. Like going out and running in the woods feels good, like and it makes me a better partner, better parent, more forgiving, more compassionate. Like everything about it I enjoy, but then there's the reverse side where now my wife is being a single parent while I'm gone. And when you're training for a hundred miles, you're putting in 80 mile weeks, you're doing 30 miles at a time. Like when I did Badger, I did my best to run before everyone woke up and then at night when everyone was sleeping.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:51

Which works, but not all the time. Like that shit really beat me down quite a bit in that training cycle. So I wanted to try to get 100 in this year. It's probably not happening this year. Like I said, I got I don't know if I said this before we started or not, but I got a um Spartan like obstacle core style ultra um in May. Then I got the Devil's Gulch 50 Miler. Heck yeah, dude. And then I'll have one more this fall sometime. I haven't signed up for it yet, but I'll be finding something in the November-ish time frame. Okay. Um I'm pretty pretty set on doing Wilkinson every year. Um I like to start the year, I feel like and and we have a lot of friends that do it, and it's just it's just a good time.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:35

I've done it for the last two years, and it I feel like it's just like a good baseline because it's mid-January. It's like right at the beginning of the year, and it's not super long. Yeah, and it tests every part of your running.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:46

Yeah, it tests everything. I mean, you have long strap flat stretches, you have gradual climbs, you have steep climbs, you got a little bit of everything, a little bit of technical trail. So I like that race a lot. I'll keep doing that. Um, I really want to try to get into a fifth or a hundred miler next year. I don't know which one. I'm I like Badger, I do, but shit, that weather is volatile.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:09

So I'm only doing the 50.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:10

Yeah, I don't mind the course, just that weather at nighttime can really fuck with you. And the top of McBee with those rocks, like that's just an easy way to hurt yourself. And I'm I'm not trying to do that up there because there's no way back down.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:23

But I've looked into it too. There's been years where it's like 80 degrees the whole time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:28

There's been nice years. Like when Colby did it, like I said, it got really cold at night, but no 70 mile 70 mile-an-hour winds. And when we did it, it was 30-ish, if not colder. Yeah. And it was pouring rain and 70 mile an hour dust in there. Like that shit was tough. Yeah. But I I do want to do one. Um, there's just so many, there's so many around, I guess, that I would like to see kind of where I fall into with timeline and stuff. Um, but I do want to get one where my girls are a little bit older and they can experience the whole thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:09

Maybe come run like the last five miles with you.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:12

Yeah, I mean that would be cool. Yeah, I want to get one next year and I want to continue to stack them. Um, probably not every year, but at least get one every couple years. Keep, you know, keep me at a baseline, not let myself get too far ahead of myself.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:26

Um, and then I really I've been talking to some people about this. I want to try to get into more not more competitions necessarily, but other physical things. So I want to I really want to get um Rainier Summit in. I really want to do the entire Wonderland Trail. Same. I really want to do Seattle to Portland in a day, even though I hate riding bikes, but I want to get that done. I would like to do an Iron Man at some point. It's just the cost prohibitive factor of that is pretty crazy since you do have to get all the way to Sacramento with a bike, and I don't even have a bike because I don't ride bikes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:07

And those bikes are expensive too.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:09

Yeah. And so that's kind of where the the Spartan Ultra came from. Um, just because it's a little bit more uh using strength than other physical attributes, not just running.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:20

You already told me, but which one, where are you doing it, when is it?

SPEAKER_04 1:23:24

Oh yeah, so uh it's uh May 9th, I believe, or May 8th, one of those that weekend, um right by Glacier National Park in Montana. It's uh 34 miles with 77 obstacles. So we'll be uh it'll be a a day. I I don't know how long it's gonna take. Six miles, six hours, twelve hours, who knows? But it's it'll be fun, it'll be interesting, something new.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:45

Um and then if anyone listening sees Dylan there, go blowing by them or try to keep up with him.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:51

Try to keep up with uh and then I really I really want to try to get into one of the big ones. Um Bad Water has always been something that I wanted to try to get into, so the next hundred will probably be focused around that. Try to complete one of the uh the precursor courses. Um and and either try, I mean I know that one's impossible to get into, but don't know until you try. So try to get into one of those. Um I I don't have any interest at this point in a multi-day 200, anything like that. But I totally get that, dude. Not a lot of people, yeah. Uh but a hundred, um badger's not my last one, that's for sure. I I got a lot more. I uh just don't know when you but they're coming.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:37

Aside from all the long stuff, uh I know you've done like half marathons and stuff, but a lot of times you've done these like halves and things like that to help other people finish. Yeah. Do you have any aspirations or goals of like getting a fast time for a half marathon or a full marathon or whatnot? And if if so, which races appeal to you?

SPEAKER_04 1:24:58

Um, I really I like the half marathon distance. I think that's honestly a perfect race distance. Um, I just think that sub-two-hour race is a really nice kind of jump-off point into endurance racing. I think that that's something that like if you're a runner, even if you run five miles three times a week, you could go do a half marathon. So I I like that distance for that. It's not like you need a giant training block. You can do that if you try and get a fast time. Uh, my fastest now is 140 flat. So I'd like to try to get a 130 at some point.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:35

I think it's doable.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:37

Yeah, I think it's doable.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:38

I think what, like 640 flat, like 649?

SPEAKER_04 1:25:42

Yeah, and I'm I'm definitely faster now than I've ever been when I ran a half. Like, yeah, because now when I was doing my halves, like my like Eugene, I think I ran a 142 or 144. Somewhere like that. Eugene kind of like a hilly, like nothing. I had a little bit of hills of course. Yeah, I had a little bit of hills, but even like Tacoma, um, that one had quite a few hills. He ran the marathon there.

SPEAKER_00 1:26:07

Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:26:07

That first half was a lot of hills, and I did a 142 there.

SPEAKER_00 1:26:12

Which is a respectable time, like going through Point Defiance Park, like that's a lot of up and down.

SPEAKER_04 1:26:18

My thing is like, and maybe it's because I typically run longer races, but I never feel like that was the wall. That was it. And so I think if I really put together a training block, I could I could probably do a 130. Um, I'd like to do that someday. I need to do an official marathon just because I don't have one. I don't I don't love a marathon distance. I don't need no one does.

SPEAKER_00 1:26:43

It's dude, it's such a good test. So like I feel more beat up after marathons than I do after like a 50k or 50 mile or just because you're redlining and pushing the pace so hard. And granted, like I haven't got a super, super fast time ever, but it was the fastest I could run for that for that long time. Super respectful time, right? What is it? 308 is my fastest time, and I have aspirations of getting in the 250s, like just sub-three hour. I think I probably can do that at the end of this year just with the amount of mileage I'm putting in every week. And by December, I'm going back. I'm gonna do the Phoenix marathon again this December, which is a cool one. If you're looking for a half or a full to do, you should come do that one with me in December. But yeah, it it's such I think people who have done um 50s or anything like that should definitely at least like try to go all out on a half marathon because for me, I did two last year where I just like pushed as hard as I could. I think it's a great baseline to have, and just to see um what like what you're made of at that because like I was tasting blood when I was pushing it. I got a 127 half. That's my fastest ever, which again isn't a super crazy fast time, but it was super fast for me. I was running 6'4. On that, and I was like redlining the whole time. Like it felt hard from point one oh in that race to the finish line, and it's I think it helped me a lot mentally going into my longer runs, knowing that I could hold 630, 640 paces for a half marathon going into a 50-mile race. Like, okay, I'm I can jog 11-minute pace for 50 miles straight.

SPEAKER_04 1:28:24

And I'd like to get your input on this because I hear this debate online all the time. Like, I'm sure you've heard it, what's harder, a marathon or an ultra? And when they say ultra, they're talking about the 100-mile distance. Okay. My thought is mentally, they're both or mentally and physically, they're both very difficult. But you can walk a marathon in a hundred miles way harder. But if you're just trying to finish a hundred miler and you're trying to win a marathon, winning a marathon is way harder. Like they're very different things. Um, but like you say, if you're going for your personal best in a marathon, that's a very, very tall task.

SPEAKER_00 1:29:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:09

Especially if you're someone like you, where your personal best is truly your personal best. Because that word gets thrown around a lot, like a PR or PB, like, oh, that's just the best I've done, so that's my personal best, but that doesn't mean it's your personal best. It just means that's the best you have done, but you could do better. Like we all know people that could push harder but don't. Yeah. And they because they haven't hit that wall and got over it, yeah. That wall is the end for them, but that's not the end. Like that's just where you want to quit, so you pull back. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER_00 1:29:46

I didn't pull back, I push as hard. I was throwing up ten minutes straight. You're that.

SPEAKER_04 1:29:52

Yeah. Yeah, you're the Nate Jacobis, the you know, the ones that do push. Yeah. Like there are certain people and certain mindsets that a personal best, I believe, is your personal best. But I've never ran a marathon before, technically. I could go out and run a 345 and just say, well, that's my personal best. Yeah. That's not the best I could do. I know I can do it. It's just the best time you've done. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I think one, I want to do it because I want to see what I can do. So I do want to do a marathon.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:30

It just comes back to again, I hate to use the excuse of time because it's not a time thing. It's just how do I allocate my time to get the most out of what I want? And I gotta tell you, rolling 800s ain't it. Like, I don't want to be spending my time running on a track. Yeah. If I'm doing it, I'd like to go run in nature and in so I have this goal of a 10-hour, 50 miler. I'd like to get that. That would be Dude, you could you'll get that this year. You'll get that. I don't want to do it on a flat course, because I've done it.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:05

You'll get that at Devil's Gold try to.

SPEAKER_04 1:31:06

I did a because I did a 12-hour 100K. My 50 miler was I want to say it was like 845 or something. My first 50 miles was pretty quick, and then I kind of tanked at the end. Um, but I would like to do it on a difficult course. I'd like to get a sub-10 hour, and then I would really like my next hundred, I would like to get in the mid-20s. Okay. And I would love to get a sub-24. But again, I don't want a sub-24 on the road.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:45

I don't want a flat. I know the one I just did was like barely any climate. I don't, I'm not counting that again. Sub-24 on the road.

SPEAKER_04 1:31:53

No knock to you. There are some we know 100 mile runners that run flat courses and put up insane numbers and stuff. And like, if that's your jam, great. Like you're doing it, it's still really hard. It's just not fun for me. Like, I don't like that. It's just even when we did the 100k, it wasn't my favorite course. Race was cool, director was great, staff was great, everything was great. Don't love the course. I did not like that.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:19

Speaking of Janelle, um, she goes to assemble now. Uh, what was the race that she just competed in, the one where Ashley Paulson got the world record for the 100-mile time?

SPEAKER_04 1:32:30

It was the American Championship Series or something like that.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:33

It was some, some, which was a huge race. She got third place in that race, which is crazy. And so so is Ashley. And Ashley's getting all the spotlight, but I think it's crazy that we don't know who these second, third, fourth, and fifth place people are.

SPEAKER_04 1:32:49

Like at every race, really. If we're I mean, like, if we're doing it for this, we need to do it for everything. But like everyone knows the winner of Moab. Like, if you follow the sport, you know who won Moab. People put up insane numbers in second and third place. Like shit that should be talked about and celebrated and stuff. Like everyone that's finishing in the top 10 in these big races, like, these people are savage. It's insane.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:15

So it's a it's just that's another thing that like I'm plugging assemble here. Like, there's so many cool people that go to the gym like that. Like, we also were talking about Nate earlier, too. I think what's his fat, he's got like a 240 marathon time, which is fucking insane. At least in my mind, that's crazy. Like 308.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:36

Right? How many people does this town have in? No, I don't I couldn't tell you, but it's a small town. 15,000, maybe at the most. Yeah. Probably not even that. Yeah. The amount of people that we know personally that go to this gym that are putting up times to qualify for Boston, placing in the country, well, in the world, that was a national race. It was people from every country.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:00

Placing a podium on a podium, running hundreds, running a 200. Yeah. Not yet, but it's gonna. Yeah. Like putting up solid Iron Man times. Like it's it's crazy to think about, and to think about how it's all like, I don't want to say it's culminating because it's not done, but how it's all coming together and how the pieces are building on each other, and like great athletes are pushing great athletes to do crazier and crazier things. It's really it's really fucking cool to watch.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:30

And even high roxes, like we have some killers putting that like that, like right in that hour time frame on in high roxes, which is hard as fuck to do. Oh man, like it's assembled. Assemble's just a little hornet's nest of a bunch of killers, like iron sharpening iron in there. Like, there's there's people who were damn near obese that started going there and just like are running half marathons now.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:53

In great times, yeah. People lost 120 pounds in the last year. Like it's crazy what's happening.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:58

So it's a cool place to go to if you guys want to drop in, check it out. Both of us coach there. It's right on Main Street in Buckley. Assemblecommunity.com.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:07

Good plug. I wouldn't have known the website was that good call.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:10

All right, dude. Well, I think that wraps it up. Yeah. Uh is there anything you want to plug or shout out? Like where can people find you on social media? All that.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:18

Oh, uh Dylan T. Anderson on Instagram. It's just D-I-L-L-O-N-T Anderson. Um, that's basically it, man. Uh look me up on Ultra Sign Up before running our race. Say hi.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:33

Heck yeah, dude. I'll have a lot of respect for you.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:35

Appreciate you.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:36

Yeah, you just love your friendship, dude.

SPEAKER_04 1:35:37

So me too, Doc.