Episode 4: Hot Girls and Benefits (Part 1)

This week we have celebrity guest John in the hot seat to break down workplace benefits and his best non-expert tips for 401k management (really exciting stuff, right?). We start with a rapid-fire “good benefit or bad benefit” game to discuss common misconceptions around workplace benefits, and then John gets into his best practices for easy 401k management. This episode is probably best for the girlies who are newer to investing and 401ks; you'll have to talk to the bro podcasters if you want to go deeper. We end with some fun topics like terrible children’s books and parents having “favorite” kids at times.

00:00 Welcome and John’s Career Story

05:23 Hot Girls and Benefits Game

15:59 401k Basics and Terms

20:09 401k Tips

34:56 Budgeting Tools Tips

36:36 Big Deal or Little Deal: Terrible Children's Books

41:23 Favorite Child Debate

45:13 Closing Thoughts

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:02

Hey girl, welcome to episode four of Working Girls. I'm your host, Lacey. Mal will be here for part two. But today we're going to be breaking down benefits in the workplace and giving you tips on how to maximize your compensation package. I'm also very excited because we finally got pop filters for our microphone, so I can say and the audio won't hurt your ears. Okay, so today we have a celebrity guest appearance introducing my 35-year-old husband, the man with the best hairline on the north side of Atlanta, my financial advisor. He's a Gemini vegetarian from the great state of North Carolina, John.

SPEAKER_00 0:38

What's up?

SPEAKER_01 0:38

Welcome to the pod.

SPEAKER_00 0:39

Yeah, I'm excited to be here.

SPEAKER_01 0:40

Are you stressed?

SPEAKER_00 0:41

I'm a little stressed for sure.

SPEAKER_01 0:43

It's okay.

SPEAKER_00 0:43

I'll like ease into it once I get going.

SPEAKER_01 0:45

Yeah, it gets easier over time. You can always tell that me and Mal start off like a bit shaky, so it's very normal to be stressed. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 0:52

I feel like I'm being interviewed. Like for a job, right?

SPEAKER_01 0:54

You kind of are. Like the girlies are really looking to you for your financial advice today. So don't mess it up.

SPEAKER_00 0:59

Yeah. Which I think I should start off by saying I'm not an expert in this field.

SPEAKER_01 1:03

No one, the the beauty of this podcast is that we are not experts in anything that we talk about. Okay. So you're in good company. So my first question for you is I want you to tell us about yourself and your career, like how you got to where you are today. But have you seen that TikTok where that girl is like, why is your husband in the background of your TikTok? Like, I don't know him. I know you. I don't want to see him.

SPEAKER_00 1:23

Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:24

Similar vibes here.

SPEAKER_00 1:26

Okay. Yeah, I won't go, I won't go deep.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Okay, so you're just here to like further our agenda.

SPEAKER_00 1:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:31

You know, but like, and that's the goal. The goal is not to make you the star of the show.

SPEAKER_00 1:35

For sure. Okay, sorry. I don't want to be the star of the show.

SPEAKER_01 1:38

Okay, just as long as we're all on the same page about that.

SPEAKER_00 1:40

So I work in the consumer products business, specifically in food. And my dad used to was in the same industry basically. And when I was in college, he got me a job with one of his customers, and I just really liked the business and ended up working for a food distributor. And then I work for a big like energy bar company for a long time.

SPEAKER_01 2:00

You keep saying working for, like what were you doing specifically?

SPEAKER_00 2:02

Oh, yeah, I'm in sales. So I'm always uh I'm always selling, I'm always talking, I'm always connecting. Yeah. I worked for an energy bar company for about eight years, and then since then I've been helping smaller companies get into this like niche space of consumer products that I work on specifically. And then just recently have gone out on my own and I do more consulting work now. So I've gone from big company to small startup company to self-employed.

SPEAKER_01 2:29

He's an entrepreneur. We love it. We love it. Um, also it's scary, but so proud of you. So happy to have you on the pod today. How do you feel about me and Mal having a pod? Let's just back up there for a second.

SPEAKER_00 2:41

I feel, I mean, I've always felt good about it until I was bullied into joining this week. Yeah, I think it's cool. I listen to it. I like it. I don't know if other people like it, but I like it.

SPEAKER_01 2:50

Are you a fan of the pod?

SPEAKER_00 2:51

I'm a fan, but I don't know if it's just because I'm a fan of you guys.

SPEAKER_01 2:54

Well yeah. Are you an advocate for the pod? Like I know last week you're at a trade show, and some of the folks that um you used to work with follow us on Instagram. Are you like out there spreading the good word of the pod?

SPEAKER_00 3:06

I don't know if I spread the word of the pod. It just didn't come up.

SPEAKER_01 3:09

Okay, that's something that maybe we should put on the agenda for your next conversations with folks.

SPEAKER_00 3:13

For sure.

SPEAKER_01 3:14

Okay, so you're in sales, you're in the consumer packaged goods industry, also known as CPG. Really exciting space, I guess. One thing everybody knows about you is that you're the snack god. You always know what the latest and greatest snacks are.

SPEAKER_00 3:27

So true.

SPEAKER_01 3:28

You've eaten way too many protein bars in your lifetime. I'm not a protein bar fan.

SPEAKER_00 3:33

You shouldn't eat a lot of packaged food, but because I'm in the industry, like I'm always looking for like the newest things. And you did you were you experienced virtually Expo West.

SPEAKER_01 3:41

Yeah, super cool.

SPEAKER_00 3:42

Which was last week. So you even said that you would want to go there. But it's this big, giant trade show where all the latest and greatest snacks and food products that you would find in like a Whole Foods would be.

SPEAKER_01 3:52

What are your like what are some of the snacks that you saw at Expo West that you're you would recommend?

SPEAKER_00 3:56

See, that's a that's like a that's too big.

SPEAKER_01 3:58

Loaded question?

SPEAKER_00 3:59

Big question.

SPEAKER_01 4:00

Protein is in everything now.

SPEAKER_00 4:01

Protein's in everything. You go to Kroger now and they have uh all their private label items are like protein crackers and protein, they have protein cheese balls, which I bought. They're in the pantry, and they are terrible.

SPEAKER_01 4:12

Are they?

SPEAKER_00 4:12

Yeah, yeah. So a lot of stuff I feel like people are putting protein in things that they shouldn't put protein in, and now they just don't taste good.

SPEAKER_01 4:19

What about fiber? Like, why aren't people putting fiber in things?

SPEAKER_00 4:21

Fiber is supposed to be the new thing.

SPEAKER_01 4:23

Oh. But I think Because protein's got everybody stopped up.

SPEAKER_00 4:26

Everybody keeps saying that fiber will be the new protein, but I think that nobody wants to be the first one to make like some big fiber product. Why? Because protein is what's selling right now.

SPEAKER_01 4:36

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 4:36

So if somebody wants to make the big jump into fiber, they gotta take the risk.

SPEAKER_01 4:40

Well, one day everybody who's been eating all this protein is gonna realize that they haven't pooped in six months. So they need some fiber.

SPEAKER_00 4:46

That's why everybody says fiber is the next, but we'll see.

SPEAKER_01 4:48

That's crazy. Well, one of the things that I love about you, really, I love a lot of things about you. And actually, shortly, I'll ask you to name 10 things that you love about me. But one of the things I do love about you is that you are the family foodie and chef. I'm going off script here. I see you like your eyes are darting around the page. Yeah. This is off the dome, baby. I love how you make the kids' lunches, you make our dinners, you make the breakfasts. I'm a feminist at my core until it's time to take out the trash or like make a meal for somebody.

SPEAKER_00 5:14

Or make literally anything.

SPEAKER_01 5:16

Yeah. And then I'm like, I can't. That's a boy job. But yeah, you do a lot and we appreciate you. And we appreciate you being our guest today. So the first activity I have for us today.

SPEAKER_00 5:27

What's the name of the episode?

SPEAKER_01 5:28

Oh, the name of the episode is Hot Girls with Benefits. Thank you. And so we're gonna start Hot Girls with Benefits with good benefit or bad benefit, rapid fire. When you start a new job, the company typically gives you a benefit package. And it can be hard to know what is a good benefit or an important benefit versus what is not a good benefit. So where I thought we would start before we jump into 401ks is just kind of like a rapid fire. Is this a good or important benefit, or is this like a relatively unimportant benefit that shouldn't excite you too much? You should look at other things.

SPEAKER_00 5:59

Got it. Okay. And I think that's the key because all benefits are good.

SPEAKER_01 6:02

I mean, all benefits are good until the company that you have applied to work at gives you an offer letter with no 401k and unlimited snacks.

SPEAKER_00 6:09

Yeah. But bad benefit means that you shouldn't take this very seriously.

SPEAKER_01 6:14

Right. Like don't accept the job because they have beer on tap.

SPEAKER_00 6:17

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 6:17

Okay. Are you ready?

SPEAKER_00 6:18

I'm ready.

SPEAKER_01 6:19

Good benefit or a bad benefit? Team happy hour.

SPEAKER_00 6:22

Bad benefit.

SPEAKER_01 6:22

Wellness programs like a gym stipend.

SPEAKER_00 6:25

Also bad benefit.

SPEAKER_01 6:26

Unlimited PTO.

SPEAKER_00 6:27

Very bad benefit.

SPEAKER_01 6:28

HSA contributions or dependent care FSA.

SPEAKER_00 6:31

Uh good benefit.

SPEAKER_01 6:32

We're going to talk more about what that means later if you've never heard of that. What about student loan repayment assistance?

SPEAKER_00 6:37

I'm going to say good benefit.

SPEAKER_01 6:39

Yeah, I would say good. What about commuter benefits like a$300 monthly parking stipend?

SPEAKER_00 6:43

I'm going to say bad benefit.

SPEAKER_01 6:45

I would say a good benefit.

SPEAKER_00 6:46

I feel like your parking, it's your parking should be covered wherever you work.

SPEAKER_01 6:50

So I'm going to at my last job I was paying$30 a day to park.

SPEAKER_00 6:53

I know. It was just bad in general, though. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:55

So I think that's a good benefit if you're driving to work.

SPEAKER_00 6:58

Okay. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 6:59

What about a home office stipend? Like a$1,500 minimum home office stipend.

SPEAKER_00 7:03

Good benefit. Good benefit. Great benefit.

SPEAKER_01 7:08

Yeah, why did that take you?

SPEAKER_00 7:09

Sorry. I was still stuck on the last one.

SPEAKER_01 7:11

Um tuition reimbursement.

SPEAKER_00 7:12

I thought we already talked about that one.

SPEAKER_01 7:14

No. Did we?

SPEAKER_00 7:14

Yeah, I think we did.

SPEAKER_01 7:15

No, we didn't.

SPEAKER_00 7:16

Oh, you did like loan forgiveness. Different.

SPEAKER_01 7:19

Tuition reimbursement is like pay for your MBA while you're working here.

SPEAKER_00 7:23

Good benefit.

SPEAKER_01 7:23

Good benefit. A professional development budget. Like we'll pay for you to go to conferences.

SPEAKER_00 7:28

Yeah, bad benefit.

SPEAKER_01 7:30

Okay. I had to give him a head shake on that one. Bad benefit. Fertility or family planning.

SPEAKER_00 7:35

Good benefit. But not one, still, it's not something you take the job for, you know.

SPEAKER_01 7:40

But I would I like agree and disagree. So it's not one that you necessarily take a job for, but if you're a woman of childbearing age, that is a really great benefit to have because that if you're going through fertility issues, can be anywhere from like 10K to 50k. Yeah. Yeah. In benefits. Sabbatical options, like three to six months off.

SPEAKER_00 7:59

Good benefit.

SPEAKER_01 7:59

I feel like that's a great benefit.

SPEAKER_00 8:01

It is. It just a lot of these benefits though, they're just designed for you to stay there. You know, I look at it almost like the unlimited PTO.

SPEAKER_01 8:08

Yeah. John worked at a company previously, a really great company that had a sabbatical option, but you had to work there for seven years.

SPEAKER_00 8:15

Seven years, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:16

So yeah. Great that they're doing it, but like maybe you don't have to be here for seven years before you take it.

SPEAKER_00 8:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:22

Maybe like four or five.

SPEAKER_00 8:23

Agreed.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

Okay. Volunteer time off.

SPEAKER_00 8:26

It's a good benefit.

SPEAKER_01 8:27

Okay. How much volunteering do you do?

SPEAKER_00 8:29

I mean, I do when I can. I don't I don't have I don't work for a company where I get volunteer time off.

SPEAKER_01 8:34

Okay, fair.

SPEAKER_00 8:34

I used to when I did. When I at the same company, they had great benefits. They had a volunteer time off.

SPEAKER_01 8:40

One benefit John had at a previous company was if you used an environmentally friendly treatment for your lawn or whatever for your yard.

SPEAKER_00 8:49

Oh yeah, they would reimburse you.

SPEAKER_01 8:50

They would reimburse you for like up to like$500. And if you followed us during the goat saga, we rented goats and they came and cleared our backyard. It's a very tree heavy and brush. And his company paid for that. Good benefit or bad benefit?

SPEAKER_00 9:04

That was a good benefit. I really like that. A lot of these are still like, I think overall benefits as I'm reading through these, they're not your benefits, are just that. They're just benefits. They're not something that you should really like as you're accepting a job, they're not something that you should say, like, you shouldn't add these to your salary and your compensation. These are like bonuses.

SPEAKER_01 9:23

Maybe. Maybe I agree with that.

SPEAKER_00 9:24

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 9:25

Okay, 401k match when it's 2%.

SPEAKER_00 9:27

I'm looking at your notes. A 401k match is a good benefit always. But I would say like the standard of a good benefit, a good match is usually 3%.

SPEAKER_01 9:36

Okay, yeah. I would say 2% is not great. I that is fair though. I have had a job before where they had no 401k.

SPEAKER_00 9:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:43

And you right now have no 401k because you work for yourself. Sure. So I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_00 9:46

And the company I worked for previously did not have a 401k at all. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 9:50

So not a great benefit. But yeah, 401k match is great, especially when it's 3% or higher. Agreed?

SPEAKER_00 9:56

Agreed.

SPEAKER_01 9:57

Okay. That was rapid fire, good benefit or bad benefit. Um, and like I said, we'll get into some of those a little bit more. So, John, tell us unlimited PTO is a benefit that I feel like a lot of startups are offering and like tech companies that sounds awesome. You're like, oh my God, unlimited PTO. Like my I think my typical PTO that I get is like 15 days plus holidays. So tell me why unlimited PTO is not the benefit that people think it is.

SPEAKER_00 10:22

I think it's one of those things, especially in the startup or tech world where it sounds great to have unlimited PTO until you start taking it. You realize quickly that you're not expected or you're not really able to take as much PTO as you want. At least when you have a set PTO, like it's three or four weeks a year, 15, 20 days, you're expected to use all 20 days.

SPEAKER_01 10:45

Because you earn it most times. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:47

It either gets banked and you can get paid out for it, or you're just required to use it by the end of the year. When it comes to unlimited PTO, it's more of a way for startup companies to save money by not paying you for those hours. So they just say it's unlimited. But then there's a lot of pressure for you not to take that many PTO days.

SPEAKER_01 11:06

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 11:07

Because uh catch 22.

SPEAKER_01 11:08

Another thing around unlimited PTO is if you have banked PTO that you have earned, that's like part of your contract, your 15 days, and you leave the company, they're legally required to pay you out for that time. So they're legally required to pay you for the time off that you have earned. If they're giving you like 10 free sick days a year, they don't have to pay you back for that. But if you have like PTO days that you have put in hours and received hours on your paycheck, they have to pay you out for that. John has what?

SPEAKER_00 11:34

I was gonna say not in Ohio.

SPEAKER_01 11:36

Oh, okay. Well, it sucks for Ohio. Sorry, Ohio.

SPEAKER_00 11:39

There's probably some other states too where they don't have to.

SPEAKER_01 11:41

Okay, well, this is why we're not experts, so for sure. There's your other um warning. But I think or I know that when you have unlimited PTO, obviously they don't have anything to pay you out for. And you've left a job before where you got paid out for your PTO and you made like Oh, yeah, four weeks' worth of salary. Which is awesome. Yeah. That's a month. So a better alternative to unlimited PTO is an actual guaranteed minimum number of days. Like 25 days would be like amazing. Companies I've worked for before give you, you know, 15 days of PTO plus all the holidays, plus they also give you 10 sick days that you can use whenever. And so make sure that those benefits are carved out. That's a benefit that you want and not unlimited PTO. Another benefit that we can talk about is something called flexible work arrangements, like working remotely, good benefit or bad benefit.

SPEAKER_00 12:29

Great benefit.

SPEAKER_01 12:30

Only if do you know the answer to this?

SPEAKER_00 12:32

I don't know the answer to this. I work in a fully remote role always. So and this is a little over my head.

SPEAKER_01 12:38

Okay. Well, it's only a great benefit if it's written down because I've worked at a company before, and I'm I can't believe you didn't think about this example, where they hired me as a fully remote employee, a flexible work arrangement. And then two years into my employment, told me I needed to relocate to their hub or lose my job.

SPEAKER_00 12:54

Because you didn't have it documented.

SPEAKER_01 12:56

Exactly. It was not documented. So flexible work arrangement or remote work from home only is like truly exists for you if it's written in your offer letter in your employment contract. Okay. So make sure that you have that. Benefits that people can sleep on, but that actually rock. We've already kind of talked about the fertility and family planning coverage, which typically covers like IVF, egg freezing, adoption assistance. It's often up to 50K in value. Like that's a huge benefit if you're of childbearing age. The dependent care FSA situation that we talked about, if you are a parent of children and your workplace offers an FSA that's a flexible spending account. John, do you want to tell us about that? Because I don't actually know a lot about it.

SPEAKER_00 13:39

Yeah. It's where you can use pre-tax dollars to pay for something like daycare or a nanny or your grandmother watching. I was about to say, or elder care. It's a kind of a standard benefit at most companies. And I think the thing that you should know about it is if you don't have this benefit, you can still write off these expenses on your taxes.

SPEAKER_01 14:00

Oh, we love a write-off.

SPEAKER_00 14:02

So it's it's kind of like a savings account for this.

SPEAKER_01 14:04

But isn't the thing with dependent care that you have to like use it before the end of the year or something?

SPEAKER_00 14:09

Anything that is an FSA, you have to use the funds by the end of the year. That goes for both a healthcare FSA or a dependent care FSA.

SPEAKER_01 14:17

So you can put money into the account and get to the end of the year, and if you don't use it all, it just goes away.

SPEAKER_00 14:21

If you don't use it, you lose it. Yeah, lose it.

SPEAKER_01 14:24

Okay. Wow. All right. Parental leave, actual paid time. So the the US is like the only developed country that doesn't have uh a fully paid parental leave. Parental leave can be a game changer for new parents. I would say that 12 weeks fully paid is a great benefit. I would say the standard benefit is like six weeks, maybe seven weeks, and then they give you like one extra week if you have a C-section. And I think it's an indicator of a company that is values aligned because I just don't understand how you can have women who are like low-key the backbone of your workforce, especially women like in our you know 20s and 30s and 40s who are having kids and you don't give them time off to recover with their kids. It's not a vacation. Anyways, tuition reimbursement is another great one. I would love to see full like MBA coverage with no clawback clause. So a lot of times if you're at a company and they pay for your tuition, a lot of them will cap it at like$5,200 per year, which is obviously not going to cover the full cost of your MBA. And then they also have some sort of stipulation where you have to work there for a year or two years after you get that benefit, so that they're getting the benefit of the benefit. And that is actually accelerating your career. If you get an MBA, I know people say that you don't need them nowadays, and I do agree with that in some areas. Like John probably is not going to need an MBA for what he does. If I want to move into an executive role in my industry, I would need an MBA. So that's a really great thing. So those are great benefits. And now we're going to transition to the meat of the discussion, which is 401ks. So the reason I brought John on is because John, like he said, is our family financial advisor, our financial planner. You are very good with money. I don't know if you know how to read, but I know that you know how to do math. We we are set up really well. I think our 401ks, when you met me, I don't think I was contributing a dime to my 401k. And now I have a really great sized 401k that I'm very proud of because of the contributions and the advice that you've made me implement in my savings strategy. And you also have a very sizable 401k. So I'm excited for you to impart your wisdom on our listeners today. So, first of all, what in the world is a 401k?

SPEAKER_00 16:46

Your 401k is your employer-sponsored retirement plan. So that is every paycheck, most employers take some of the money that you have decided what percentage of your paycheck comes out, and it goes into a retirement account that is pre-taxed dollars, which is money that you are not paying any taxes on, and goes into an account where it can grow in investments. And it is basically the new pension. Years ago, people had pensions. Most of our parents and grandparents had pensions that would take care of them as they got older. And companies, more to save costs, have taken out the pension as a benefit and have moved over to 401ks. So now it is everybody, it's now your responsibility to make sure that your 401k is being contributed to and invested correctly so that when you get to retirement age, which I think is 65. Uh yeah, I think you can start pulling from your 401k when you're is it 59 and a half?

SPEAKER_01 17:44

I have no idea. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 17:45

It's something like that. You can start, but usually I think it's around 65 when most people are retiring.

SPEAKER_01 17:50

I thought it was pretty interesting. I looked into why companies switched from pensions because, like you said, I mean, all of our grandparents and probably some of our parents have pensions, which is a great benefit because the pension is where the company is guaranteeing to pay for your retirement for your whole life.

SPEAKER_00 18:05

People started living longer.

SPEAKER_01 18:07

Yeah, that's what it is. People started living longer, and then the companies were like, wait, we can't afford this. So they realized they could shift that risk and ownership of planning for retirement to their employees, and duh, they're gonna do that. So now we are all responsible for our own retirement, which is scary. So I wanted to define some terms before we get into like your tips for 401k management. I wanted to define some terms that we need to know. So contribution.

SPEAKER_00 18:30

That is the money that you are putting in to your 401k on every paycheck.

SPEAKER_01 18:35

Can that money ever be taken away from you if you leave a company?

SPEAKER_00 18:37

The money that you put in cannot.

SPEAKER_01 18:39

Okay. Matching.

SPEAKER_00 18:40

Matching is the money that your company is putting in to the 401k, each contribution.

SPEAKER_01 18:45

So like the 2%, 3% that we were talking about earlier, that's matching.

SPEAKER_00 18:48

Correct.

SPEAKER_01 18:49

What's a good, what's a great matching percentage? What's the best mass matching percentage that you've seen?

SPEAKER_00 18:53

I've seen a company as high as 10.

SPEAKER_01 18:55

Oh, really?

SPEAKER_00 18:55

Yeah. And that's a that was that is a extreme case. I feel like that's like the best in class. I think a really good match is six, five to six, and then like your standard is three.

SPEAKER_01 19:05

Okay, and then my next term is vesting or vesting schedule, but I'll start that definition by asking you the money that is matched that your company puts into your account, can that money be taken away from you?

SPEAKER_00 19:17

It can. Okay. If it is not vested.

SPEAKER_01 19:20

So tell us about vesting.

SPEAKER_00 19:21

A vesting schedule is how long it takes you to 100% own the money that they've given you.

SPEAKER_01 19:27

And what's typical? What's a typical vesting schedule?

SPEAKER_00 19:30

Probably four years, I would say. It's what I've seen when I was at a larger company. It was you basically got 25% every year. So every year you're if they're giving you money, you're not actually 100% owning that money until four years afterwards.

SPEAKER_01 19:47

Okay. Yeah. Some companies do immediate vesting.

SPEAKER_00 19:49

Yeah, and that's great. Because you never with any of these benefits or anything, is just you never want to be locked in and have this holding over your head when you want to make a career move.

SPEAKER_01 19:59

Yeah. So always ask about the vesting schedule during an interview. I don't think it's going to be something that makes or breaks you taking a job necessarily, but it is important to know. Yeah. Okay. So are you ready for John's tips for 401k management?

SPEAKER_00 20:12

I guess.

SPEAKER_01 20:12

You guess?

SPEAKER_00 20:13

I'd say the number one tip is to start early, right? I think that I have seen the benefits of a growing 401k just from being invested in the market and starting early. So from my very first paycheck that I got out of college, I made sure that I was contributing to my 401k as much as I possibly could with my budget and making sure that those investments were or those contributions were invested correctly. And I it's just as many years that you have to compound, uh, you you see how much that grows later. And I think that to like double down on that, regardless of how old you are, the best time to start your 401k is today.

SPEAKER_01 20:49

Amen. We love that. Did you think about that quote before you came?

SPEAKER_00 20:52

I didn't actually. I think I've I've definitely heard that before though.

SPEAKER_01 20:55

Okay. Yeah. I love that. Okay, so you tell us that it's important to start contributing to your 401k today. Okay, I'm at a job. I have a 401k. What do I do? How much do I contribute?

SPEAKER_00 21:08

I'd say, I mean, it would be great to you know, I'm gonna put this because there might be some people who are listening that are like very financially savvy, and this is not the podcast for you.

SPEAKER_01 21:19

No, this is this this is like the spark notes. Yeah, this is explain it like I'm five.

SPEAKER_00 21:23

This is the keep it simple version. There's different versions of people say you should only invest into the match and then you should take your money and go put it into a different IRA, which we won't get into.

SPEAKER_01 21:34

Oh, we can have my dad on the podcast for that combo.

SPEAKER_00 21:36

Well, it'll be a two-hour podcast, but we um for purposes here is you should invest. I think the standard is 15%.

SPEAKER_01 21:43

But sometimes, like I know when I was working at a company and you had me investing 15%, and then I got pregnant, and we were starting to look at like daycares and realizing how much that cost, and we needed more cash then in that moment. And so you had me scale up. Back. So what's your advice on like scaling it up and down?

SPEAKER_00 22:02

Yeah, I I would try not to. But in that situation, I think we were in the middle of buying a house, daycares.

SPEAKER_01 22:08

We had a lot going on.

SPEAKER_00 22:10

Yeah, we needed a little bit more cash in those months. So I think we took you down to between eight and ten percent. And I think that should kind of be your floor. You always always want to hit the match. So if your company is investing up to 10% of your salary, you want to make the 10% work. But I'd say at bare minimum, if your company is matching 3%, you need to be putting in 3%.

SPEAKER_01 22:29

Yeah, I think that's the number one takeaway today is no matter what, if your company is matching your contribution, that is free money for you. Of course it's on investing schedule. So you need to know when it becomes 100% your money, but don't leave that money on the table. So make sure you're at least contributing that percentage. Okay. So I've opened my 401k account and I have decided I've I've set my contribution at 15%. Now I told Mallory on the last podcast that I didn't know this until my last job, but you have to invest your 401k. He's shaking his head. So where does your money go? Like what's next?

SPEAKER_00 23:08

Yeah, that was honestly one of the craziest the craziest experiences. But yeah, I didn't realize that you could possibly have a 401k and not not ever log into it to invest. So um yeah, the next important thing is that the money that goes into the account grows.

SPEAKER_01 23:22

That's how you get only if you invest it.

SPEAKER_00 23:25

Correct. Yes. That's how you get it to grow is by investing it. Okay. Um because I think, you know, if you start in your 20s, by the time you are retirement age, you're 60 years old, 90% of the money that's in that 401k is not money that you put in there. It is money that has grown over time with interest. So very important that it is invested so that you can start accumulating interest.

SPEAKER_01 23:47

Well, so how do I know where to invest it? I still don't know the answer to this.

SPEAKER_00 23:52

Yeah, for sure. There's uh a few different schools of thought on it. I think the easy one is most 401k companies or trying to think of like what the name is.

SPEAKER_01 24:03

Like providers.

SPEAKER_00 24:04

Providers, right?

SPEAKER_01 24:04

Like Charles Schwab and Principal.

SPEAKER_00 24:07

Fidelity or Vanguard or whoever your company has your 401k through, or any other kind of retirement account that you might have. Mutual funds. So there's a group of mutual funds in there. You want to find one or several, you kind of want to break them out into value, growth stocks.

SPEAKER_01 24:23

Oh, because like some are riskier than others.

SPEAKER_00 24:25

Some are riskier. And you want to a wide variety. So you want some that might be a little bit more aggressive. You'd put a little bit less money into those. You want something that's more value, and then you want some that's like more your growth stocks. And then that's I think if you're if you were really reading in, you can read, you can do a lot of reading on Reddit. You can talk to your AI friends about what are the best options for you if you want to get really granular about it.

SPEAKER_01 24:50

But also But also, don't those platforms have like people you can call and ask questions to?

SPEAKER_00 24:56

Yes, I would be very careful about those. Um I would say that yeah, you can call, ask questions. They're mostly there either to just do more like technical answers, or they are they would probably put you in touch with somebody who will manage your 401k for you.

SPEAKER_01 25:10

Does that cost money?

SPEAKER_00 25:11

And that costs money. And I would avoid that. There's just it they make it so easy for you not to do that that paying somebody a fee to manage your 401k will have you just losing money in the end. If you are just like, hey, I want to do something smart and I just want to do something super simple, easy. Most providers have something called a target fund where you will just log in and under your investments, you can pick the year that you are planning to retire.

SPEAKER_01 25:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 25:36

So let's just say it's 2060 is when you want to retire. You can go in there and find the retirement date for 2060 and it will basically auto adjust all of your investments. Like as you get closer to retirement, it will become more conservative so that you don't have a lot of fluctuations and you can kind of just set it and forget it.

SPEAKER_01 25:55

Cool. That sounds like it's made for me. You know?

SPEAKER_00 25:58

Exactly. This would be something that you would choose.

SPEAKER_01 25:59

Okay. So your advice is if you have no idea what you're doing, you've opened your 401k, you're contributing your 15%, which is what John recommends, and I think is like the standard. Everybody recommends that. And you don't know how to invest it, you don't know what you're doing, just pick the target date fund for your retirement year.

SPEAKER_00 26:16

Yes, that is the that is the simple answer.

SPEAKER_01 26:18

Okay. So let's say that you have built up your 401k, you've worked a few jobs, you've had some good benefits, you've gotten some good money, you've got a little pot of gold in your 401k. Can you ever withdraw against this money, like take it out to help you buy a house?

SPEAKER_00 26:30

Yes. But highly recommended that you don't do that.

SPEAKER_01 26:32

Okay, why?

SPEAKER_00 26:33

I think lots of reasons. One, this money is this money is valuable for you in retirement. And I would avoid, unless in a case of an extreme emergency, I would avoid taking out. You will you'll be taxed on the money that you take out.

SPEAKER_01 26:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:46

And you will pay penalties on it. You can also you can borrow from your 401k. You will then be paying it back. And I think the scary part of borrowing from your 401k is if something happens to your job, if you were to lose your job, you get fired, you decide you're gonna move jobs, you're required to pay back everything into that 401k by the end of the month.

SPEAKER_01 27:05

Oh, brutal.

SPEAKER_00 27:06

Yeah. So you could take out a large chunk of money and say, hey, I'm gonna put down a down payment on the house, and you take out$100,000, and then for some reason your company has a layoff and you get let go, and then next basically next week you need to find$100,000 to put back into your 401k.

SPEAKER_01 27:21

Yeah, I've seen people on TikTok talk about their death situations and how they've borrowed against their 401k to like buy a house or something, and it just I've always heard you say that, and my dad say that it's not good to borrow against your 401k.

SPEAKER_00 27:33

So yeah, we're very risk adverse people, I would feel like.

SPEAKER_01 27:36

Yeah, both you and my dad. So only like a that's like a very last resort option. It's not your 401k is not like an emergency fund that you should be taking money out of.

SPEAKER_00 27:44

Correct. If you are needing to turn the lights on and eat food, then you that's when I would take out of my 401k.

SPEAKER_01 27:51

So let's say that um you're leaving a job, okay? You've gotten a new job, you have your 401k, it's an employer-sponsored benefit account, but I'm leaving the job. So what happens next? What do I do with that money?

SPEAKER_00 28:02

Several different options. You can always just leave it there. That 401k isn't an account that will stay with you for life. So you can leave it there. A lot of people do leave it there just to make it simple. What I've done as I've moved jobs is I've taken it and I roll it into what they call an IRA, which is an individual retirement account, I think is what it stands for. And as you move jobs, you basically will start another 401k. When you leave that one, you can roll it into your IRA. So as you a lot of us, especially in the millennial world, I feel like we change jobs. We change jobs. You're gonna have five or six employers probably on average by the time you get to retirement age, and you can just keep taking your 401k and putting it back into your your IRA.

SPEAKER_01 28:43

Okay. So don't cash it out.

SPEAKER_00 28:44

Definitely don't cash it out.

SPEAKER_01 28:47

I'm not asking these questions for me. I'm asking them for the audience. Every time I ask a question, he looks at me with this like horrified expression. Like, why are you asking me this question? Um, if I if they've heard of a rollover IRA, is that the same thing?

SPEAKER_00 28:59

That would be a rollover IRA. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 29:01

Okay. Yeah, I've done you've made me do that a few times. Great. Let's say, for example purposes, and you're a great person to answer this, that you're self-employed and your company does not offer, or that you just work for a smaller company and they don't offer a 401k benefit, but you still want to save for retirement because we've convinced you that that's an important thing to do. So what do you do in that situation?

SPEAKER_00 29:21

Yeah, if you if your company, if you are not self-employed and your company does not have a 401k and you're just working for a smaller company, your options are limited, but you would do what they call an IRA, like what we were just talking about. You would be able to contribute just to a traditional or Roth IRA. If you are self-employed, you can either do what they call a SEP IRA or a self-employed IRA. I think that's what it's called. A simple IRA.

SPEAKER_01 29:46

Solo 401k?

SPEAKER_00 29:48

Solo 401k. And honestly, these are things that I haven't looked at because I just became self-employed. So this is things that I will worry about next tax season. Oh, so I will become an expert on this, but I am not an expert on this now.

SPEAKER_01 29:59

So I just have the family on my back. I'm the only one contributing to a 401k right now?

SPEAKER_00 30:02

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 30:03

Oh, period. Okay. I'm glad you admitted that halfway through the podcast.

SPEAKER_00 30:06

A lot of the I'm also like not taking my own advice. I think it gets weird with taxes that I will basically just do one large contribution at the end of the year, depending on how that affects taxes.

SPEAKER_01 30:16

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 30:16

Yeah, it's uh I'm not gonna worry about that.

SPEAKER_01 30:18

Yeah, don't worry about that. That sounds like it's for boys only.

SPEAKER_00 30:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:21

Okay. So we talked about some of the websites that you go to to open an IRA: Charles Schwab, Fidelity, Principal, Vanguard. Do you recommend any of those over another?

SPEAKER_00 30:31

So you don't get to choose. You do for your 401k.

SPEAKER_01 30:33

For your 401k, but if you were to open like a rollover IRA, they're all pretty standard.

SPEAKER_00 30:38

I think that everybody, whichever one everybody uses is the one that they like. You know what I mean? You know, I think your dad likes one of them and I like another one.

SPEAKER_01 30:47

I think my dad likes Charles Schwab. Principle was like built for millennials. I just think the user interface is cute and simple.

SPEAKER_00 30:54

I hate it. I think it's terrible.

SPEAKER_01 30:55

But I recently have started liking Fidelity because I think they have really good analytics.

SPEAKER_00 31:00

Well, are you analyzing a lot of things in there?

SPEAKER_01 31:02

No, I'm just a visual person and they have like they have pretty pictures and graphs.

SPEAKER_00 31:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:06

Okay. And it's green, which is the color of money. So every time I get in there, I just feel like I'm like making money moves, you know?

SPEAKER_00 31:12

Yeah, yeah. I think I like to stick with one though. So like my that's why I have with our rollover IRA, it's like I like everything in one place. So whichever one you choose, I would just stick with it.

SPEAKER_01 31:23

Do so I know that you also invest in stocks, you like to do that. Do I need to be constantly like watching my money and moving it around like stocks, depending on how it's performing or whatever?

SPEAKER_00 31:33

No, I this is one of those things that you actually don't want to do that. I think it's important to get excited about it. So I think when I was just out of college, it's one of the things that made me a big saver is that I like to look at it every day like a game. And it does drive you a little crazy because you watch it go up and down and especially as it starts to grow. I think the way that I looked at it as a straight out of college millennial is that when I was buying stocks or like when money was going into my 401k, it kind of felt like I had purchased something. You know, like the shares of this mutual fund inside of my 401k, it like scratched the itch of buying something where like you like buying clothes.

SPEAKER_01 32:10

Yeah, I can't relate.

SPEAKER_00 32:11

And you like buying stuff on Amazon. Like for me, it felt like I was buying something because I was buying stocks.

SPEAKER_01 32:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:17

And I thought that was like it was fun to watch it grow.

SPEAKER_01 32:20

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 32:21

And you kind of got addicted to it, you know. I think that that's important to get that feeling because it makes you it makes you hungrier to just watch it grow.

SPEAKER_01 32:28

You know, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 32:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

Can't relate. Yeah. Okay. I love that for you though. I love that for us and our family. Let's talk about really quick. I've heard the term Roth IRA before and traditional IRA and rollover IRA. What is the difference between all of those things?

SPEAKER_00 32:44

Yeah. Um, I think the biggest the thing that really the difference that you need to think about is Roth versus traditional. Okay. Roth on anything. So you can have a Roth 401k or a Roth IRA. Roth is after tax. So you have already paid the taxes on that money. Okay. And it is just like it is money that basically would be in your checking account at this point. And you can take that and put it into an IRA, and that money will grow tax-free, and you can take it out tax-free. Oh. So I think that's the cool thing about it is that when you get a retirement age, you can take the Roth money out and pay zero taxes on it. It's just your money. The money that's in your IRA, in your traditional IRA, when you take it out in 20 years, if you take out$20,000, you're gonna pay taxes on$20,000.

SPEAKER_01 33:28

Okay. Why would everybody not do a Roth IRA?

SPEAKER_00 33:31

Because with Roth, you're paying taxes now.

SPEAKER_01 33:34

Okay, who cares?

SPEAKER_00 33:35

What do you mean?

SPEAKER_01 33:36

Maybe my like peanut brain isn't understanding this, but like if I put in a thousand dollars and I pay taxes on that thousand dollars today, then you have seven hundred dollars, six hundred and fifty dollars left. Okay, and then it grows to twenty thousand dollars in the future, and then I take it out and there's no taxes.

SPEAKER_00 33:52

Correct.

SPEAKER_01 33:55

That seems kind of lit.

SPEAKER_00 33:56

Yeah, but if you took the$1,000 and put it in, you're just putting in the straight up thousand dollars.

SPEAKER_01 34:01

Oh, so you're saying it would just grow more?

SPEAKER_00 34:03

It would grow more, and then you're paying the taxes on it later. So there are like this is another thing that people kind of argue back and forth on is what you know, at based on the different level or like the amount of compensation you have in the tax brackets that you're in, at a certain stage you should be doing traditional, and at a certain income, you should be at Roth. And when you make too much, you should be back at traditional. So there's a lot of lots of schools of thought that I think I don't want to get into, but we can definitely be on the scope of this podcast. Yeah, you can definitely read about if you want to get into it. I think it's good to have both though. The way that I look at it is like we have a Roth IRA, we have a traditional IRA.

SPEAKER_01 34:38

Oh, good for us.

SPEAKER_00 34:39

And the Roth IRA is to me is if you wanted to buy something in your retirement age, you could pull out of the Roth and not have to pay taxes on it. It's just money that you have. Yeah. Where the traditional IRA is more like, I feel like that's your salary as you get older.

SPEAKER_01 34:54

Okay. Super exciting stuff. So before we close out, do you have any like last tips for us about 401k management or just money moves in general? Uh uh budgeting apps that you like, budgeting podcasts that you're always listening to.

SPEAKER_00 35:09

I'd say uh get a budgeting tool. If you've never done it before, I'm not somebody who uses a budgeting tool.

SPEAKER_01 35:14

I used to use the every dollar app.

SPEAKER_00 35:16

Every dollar, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:17

Great app.

SPEAKER_00 35:17

There was a time where I listened to a lot of Dave Ramsey.

SPEAKER_01 35:20

Yeah, I like psycho about budgeting.

SPEAKER_00 35:22

Yeah, for sure. And I'm not like not a huge fan of Dave Ramsey, but I just on a personal level? Yeah, but I just liked his he keeps it very simple. And I don't like to hear all of the, as you can tell, like the people who argue back and forth about you should do this, and they get really scientific about it. He is somebody who's he has a very simple program of like, here's what you should do, then you should do this, then you should do this, and then you kind of like customize it after that. But I think budgeting is the most important thing, and there's tons of apps out there that can help you budget. And if anything, it's just a good exercise to understand how much you're spending in certain areas, even if you don't want to follow the app. If you just want to put in one month's worth of your previous expenses into the app, Lacey and I have done that uh recently to show her where a lot of our money goes. And it might surprise you that you know it's not surprised.

SPEAKER_01 36:07

I know where it's going. I put it there.

SPEAKER_00 36:09

I was surprised. Yeah, you might find out that you're spending way too much on Amazon or you're spending way too much at restaurants, and it kind of gives you a good benchmark of where you are currently and where you should be either spending more money, in our case, where you should probably be spending less money. But and then if you really like using them, I never was able to like keep track of it. But some people love to just do the budget every single month. And if you can do it, it's super helpful and it kind of helps you control your spending.

SPEAKER_01 36:34

Okay, we love that. Thanks for those tips.

unknown 36:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:36

So now I'm gonna transition to a segment called Big Deal or Little Deal, where I go on a rant about something and then you tell me if it's a big deal or a little deal.

SPEAKER_00 36:43

I thought Mallory was coming in for this.

SPEAKER_01 36:45

Well, I'm just gonna see how you do. And if you if you can't hang, then uh we'll kick you to the curb.

SPEAKER_00 36:50

Yeah, I only got like 10 minutes.

SPEAKER_01 36:52

Okay. Here's a here's a rant. I'll wait until you're making eye contact with me. Okay. Children's book authors write the longest books about nothing. They're not interesting. They include words that children don't understand, like weary, or just just words that kids don't get where I have to change the word while I'm reading it because I know my kid doesn't understand it. Or they name the main character something like Geraldine, and then you have to say Geraldine 75 times throughout the book as you're reading the story.

SPEAKER_00 37:21

Big deal.

SPEAKER_01 37:21

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 37:22

Because I'm in this too. I put the girls to bed. Right. Right, as we said earlier, which usually includes a story every night. And there are some books that Evie will bring in, and I will just look at the book knowing that I've read it a couple times and be like, nope.

SPEAKER_01 37:33

Yeah, I decline books all the time.

SPEAKER_00 37:35

That's not gonna be the one.

SPEAKER_01 37:36

I wonder if all other parents do that, you know? Like, I feel like I'm being a bad mom when they bring me a book and I flipped through it, and there's like a paragraph in size 10 font on every page, and it's a it's a storybook like with pictures.

SPEAKER_00 37:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:50

I'm like, guys, we don't have 45 minutes to read this book, so go get another one.

SPEAKER_00 37:54

100%.

SPEAKER_01 37:54

Are all parents going through that, or is that just me and you? Are we being lazy?

SPEAKER_00 37:57

I feel like everybody has to go through that. There's one and with the words, one yesterday I read the book about the bear that goes into the laundry, accidentally gets in the laundromat. Uh-huh. You know, he it's Theodore. Yeah. Yeah. And in the book, he goes into the dryer and basically gets hot and he passes out and he gets into the dirty or the clean laundry basket. And then after that it says, Once Theodore came to, which you know is like he woke up. Right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:24

But you only know that if you're an adult.

SPEAKER_00 38:25

Yeah, I I've read that and I was like, Lucy has no idea what's going on, anyways, but like she was lost at that point. And Evie even says something like, like she thought I missed a word. Right. You know?

SPEAKER_01 38:34

And then what's the worst is now that Evie's starting to read, she's kind of like reading along with with me sometimes. But she's fact-checking you. She's fact-checking. So, like, if I changed, if I change a word, I mean, sometimes it's good to teach the kids words. Like, for example, if you're reading a book about raining and it says like it was sprinkling, I'll say sprinkling, and then if they ask me what it is, I'll explain it to them, you know, or or let them use context clues. But sometimes I just change the words completely because I'm like, this makes no sense if I'm your age. And Evie will be like, mommy, that's not what it says. Um, that's rough. Sorry, girl.

SPEAKER_00 39:03

Do you remember the the book of five-minute stories? Yes. That all of them are 10-minute stories.

SPEAKER_01 39:08

Like the Elsa and Ana stories.

SPEAKER_00 39:09

Yeah, those are I used to just look at the pictures and like come up with a quick paraphrased like story that went along with the pictures.

SPEAKER_01 39:16

100%.

SPEAKER_00 39:17

And all of them were like, that's how they got five minute stories.

SPEAKER_01 39:19

Yeah, literally half the time I just describe what's on the page. Because I can do that. For a while, I wanted to write my own children's books because I just feel like they're not written well.

SPEAKER_00 39:28

Is this a segue?

SPEAKER_01 39:29

No, this is not a segue. This is not a like a pitch, okay. But I was just like, how hard can it be? Like, are these people who are writing these children's books? And this was the these are written before AI. Okay, so I know that like an AI tool isn't being used here, you know, in a book that was written in the 90s. But like, have you ever met a child before? Like, who are you writing this book for? Because you're writing it in the sixth grade like level, but my four-year-old wants to read it because it's a children's book, and we don't know what you're talking about. And why are you using so many words?

SPEAKER_00 39:57

Agree. On that note, again, big deal. I'm I'm I'm here with you. I agree with you on this one. Lately, I have been using either Claude or Chat GBT, and I'll lay down with the girls and I'll say, please make a three-minute bedtime story for kids, and then I even let Evie tell what she wants the story to be about. Okay. You know, she'll be like a little girl named Evie and a little girl named Lucy who go on an adventure to the bookstore. And then Chat GBT will just write me a quick three-minute story, and they're not good, but I feel like it's on par with some of the books that you're talking about.

SPEAKER_01 40:30

Yeah, probably. But also, like, is that an ethical use of AI?

SPEAKER_00 40:33

I think so.

SPEAKER_01 40:36

When people are listening to this, they're probably gonna be like, you wasted seven water bottles by Oh, I didn't even think about that. Yeah, that's a thing that you gotta think about when you're putting stuff out into the world these days, is like what both the environmental impact and public backlash is gonna be. Oh, dang. I don't think it's the worst thing. Like, I do think an AI search and like a generated story like that is probably using the same amount of computing power that like an email send would be an email with an attachment. So as long as you're not like generating I thought you were gonna say that you're like generating images and like a storybook in AI.

SPEAKER_00 41:05

No, and we were simple two-minute story. Maybe we should cut those.

SPEAKER_01 41:08

Um, we'll see. Okay, so I'm glad that you agree with me on that. Do you have any rants to contribute to big deal or little deal? You're not really a ranty. You're kind of an easygoing guy.

SPEAKER_00 41:18

Yeah, I don't really rant often. I listen to your rants, though. And some of them are small. But this one was good.

SPEAKER_01 41:22

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 41:23

A good rant.

SPEAKER_01 41:23

And then my last question for you before we close out today is do parents have favorite children?

SPEAKER_00 41:28

At times, yes.

SPEAKER_01 41:28

Tell us more.

SPEAKER_00 41:31

We always say, uh our Lacey always asks if I have a favorite child.

SPEAKER_01 41:36

Well, we were just going through a period where, and I feel like parents of five-year-olds can relate to this. Like when they're five and they go to school, elementary school, like they start to get a little sassy and grumpy and they don't listen. And I think it's just like a transitional time. And anytime your kids go through a transitional time, like the going gets tough for sure. So we were going through a really rough transitional time with Evie where she wasn't really listening and she was kind of like acting out, she was being really disrespectful. And then we had Mills, who, you know, is like one and a half and he's like losing his mind. He screamed, he was screaming all the time.

SPEAKER_00 42:04

He's a monster.

SPEAKER_01 42:05

He was kind of being a monster. And we went to my cousin's uh engagement party, and on the way there, and there were no kids in the car. John was joking with me and he was like, I just I think Lucy's my favorite right now. Like she sleeps through the night, yeah, and she doesn't talk back, and she's just down for whatever. You know, and I mean, we obviously don't have a favorite child, but it was just funny that like in that child. Lucy was your favorite child.

SPEAKER_00 42:27

Yeah. At that time, she I think there is the easiest child. I would say there is a perfect age.

SPEAKER_01 42:32

Yeah, yeah, she was the perfect age.

SPEAKER_00 42:34

Yeah, like even Lucy drove me, drove us crazy when she was a baby.

SPEAKER_01 42:37

Yeah, she didn't sleep ever for longer than 30 minutes. I mean, we've loved her always, but it's hard to be like, I don't know, when you're when you're short on sleep, you're kind of like on edge.

SPEAKER_00 42:47

Yeah. She's getting kind of sassy now though. Oh, she totally is. But anyways, let me finish the story.

SPEAKER_01 42:52

We went to my cousin's engagement party and I was just joking with my sister that like John had a favorite child because we had just had the conversation. And my dad was walking by and he was like, Parents don't have favorite children. And I said, Yes, they do. And then from across the room, I said, Hey John, who's your favorite child? And he immediately goes, Lucy. My dad was like, What? You can't have a favorite child. What are you talking about?

SPEAKER_00 43:14

It's not true.

SPEAKER_01 43:15

Well, and she looks the most like you too. So that probably That's true.

SPEAKER_00 43:18

Just to be clear, she's not my favorite child.

SPEAKER_01 43:20

I think my dad wants me to be his favorite because I'm the most like him. You know, I look like him and I act like him, but I just piss him off. So for that reason, Mallory's his favorite.

SPEAKER_00 43:29

Yeah. Evie plays tennis with me now, though. She must have heard that I said that.

SPEAKER_01 43:32

She's coming up in the ranks.

SPEAKER_00 43:33

Yeah, she she plays tennis now. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 43:36

Who's your least favorite child?

SPEAKER_00 43:38

That's Mills for sure. Like we don't have a I don't have a favorite child, but I do have a least favorite child.

SPEAKER_01 43:42

No, you don't. That's terrible.

SPEAKER_00 43:44

He's just so loud.

SPEAKER_01 43:45

He is very loud.

SPEAKER_00 43:46

He just shrieks.

SPEAKER_01 43:47

Well, he's a boy. We compare Mills to the girls, you know. And I've I've had friends before talk about, and I think this is a very millennial thing where people say that they want to raise their kids in a genderless way, you know, and not push them towards being a girl. Or being a boy, which is, I mean, that's obviously a parenting philosophy. If you want to do that, great. But Mills has been such a boy from day one. He's been so different from the girls since the very beginning, which has been so interesting. The girls could sit in collar for three hours and you wouldn't hear a peep out of them. You put on some Taylor Swift in the background and you've got yourself a day.

SPEAKER_00 44:19

Yeah. Me and Mills, like we headbutt each other. That's what we do for fun. I know.

SPEAKER_01 44:23

You guys are like insane. Yeah. And just raising a boy is so different from raising a girl. So I think that you kind of got yourself too deep in the girl dad bubble, you know? Yeah. Where like life is sunshine and rainbows, and girls who are mostly pretty agreeable, you know, and who are just so calm and easy. And then we got Mills.

SPEAKER_00 44:40

Everything changed.

SPEAKER_01 44:41

And he loves us. He's so sweet and affectionate, which I love. The girls were never this sweet and affectionate.

SPEAKER_00 44:46

Oh, yeah, yeah. But he also likes to headbutt.

SPEAKER_01 44:48

But he likes to headbutt. He likes to pull hair. He will scream in your face. He barely does anything that you ask him. But he's just like the cutest little sweetest baby. But it makes John mad when he's like trying to do something fun with the kids, trying to teach the kids how to hit a ball off the T or take the kids to play tennis, and Mills is just shrieking the whole time. He shrieks. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:08

He's a shrieker.

SPEAKER_01 45:08

Yeah. Not all boys are shriekers, but Mills is definitely a shrieker.

SPEAKER_00 45:11

Yeah. He would get better.

SPEAKER_01 45:12

Yeah, he'll get better. Okay, any last thoughts before we close out?

SPEAKER_00 45:15

Um, no, this wasn't that bad though. Yeah, so you probably warmed up a little bit. I think we should let's take it from the top.

SPEAKER_01 45:21

No. Absolutely not.

SPEAKER_00 45:23

I'll see you guys next week.

SPEAKER_01 45:24

Uh, probably not as well. Yeah, this was a one-hit, you're a one-hit wonder on the Working Girls podcast. But thank you so much for being here today. We've really enjoyed this time with you. It's been great to get your thoughts on 401k management. And that's all I have.

SPEAKER_00 45:41

Awesome. Thanks, Gerg.