Creating a Defensible Space Against Wildfires

 The hot and dry season can occur year round in California.   Our intrepid “In the Garden” host Master Gardener David Letourneau is bringing you a much-needed episode called “Creating A Defensible Space Against Wildfires”. David talked with OC Fire Authority representatives Teri Merritt, Fire Prevention Specialist / Wildland Pre-Fire Management and Captain Larry Kurtz to bring you new ideas plus all the recommendations to help keep your property safe from an oncoming wildfire. Beware of Mexican Feather Grass, a very popular landscape plant ,but it is now considered invasive and a fire hazard.   Those dead palm fronds up in the canopy easily catch fire. “Oily” plants like cypress are drought-tolerant but very flammable. Brush clearance 100 feet from structures is the rule of thumb. This may require cooperation from your neighbors so be a good neighbor and listen in on what to do to be safe from wildfires. For further information https://ocfa.org/ 

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:01

I'd like to welcome today to our show in the garden. I'm David Laterno, your host. This week's topic is creating a defensible space. My guests are Terry Merritt. She's the fire prevention specialist from the Orange County Fire Authority. And Larry, Captain Larry Kurtz, who's the public information officer for the Orange County Fire Authority. Welcome, Terry, and welcome Larry. Good morning. Good morning. Thank you so much for having us today. Our pleasure. This is great that you guys are able to spend the time with us today. Our topic today is about defensible spaces and what we can do because of the recent uh blessing of having all this rain, but kind of the curse of what we've produced with all this rain. We've got some great vegetation, but at the same time we have vegetation that is starting to dry up at this point and die off and becoming combustible combustible fuel for wildfires.

SPEAKER_01 1:05

That's absolutely true. During the winter months, we've had this great rain, and on the good side, uh it's taken away that five-year drought that we've had all across the state of California. The bad news, however, is created what we call a huge grass crop. Uh, and that's new growth of new grasses. Uh you look out in the hills, anyone driving up and down, any of your listeners uh driving up and down the freeways can look up in the hills and it tells the whole story. Uh during the spring, the grass looks nice and green, it's beautiful, but it's also one of the first things that dry out during the summer. And we've been uh getting a lot of these small, low-intensity but fast moving fires uh up in the hills. Uh we call it light flashy fuels. Uh they don't burn intensely, but they chew up a lot of acreage in a very short amount of time. And so we try and jump on these as fast as we possibly can.

SPEAKER_00 1:53

Yeah, and that's where the defensible space comes in that we've are trying to push residents to move towards and make sure that they have it. Uh defensible space refers to the area between a house and oncoming wildfire where the vegetation has been modified to reduce that wildfire threat and provides that opportunity for the firefighters to come in and effectively do something with that fire and stop it. Uh we do try and limit the size of those fires, but oftentimes that defensible space is simply just the backyard.

SPEAKER_02 2:23

Right. And we're j we're talking a lot of times uh there's several components with all this, I think, and and sometimes we think it's just a question of doing things to our home as the structure itself, which is an important aspect of it, but the other aspect is the vegetation that we have to deal with. And I think when people look at these wildfires, they think uh there's kind of a false sense of security that we're not that vulnerable because we're not that close to the actual uh material that's that's that's burning. And uh the reality is it it can it can really be intense and it can jump freeways, from what I remember of the uh Windy Ridge fire in Anaheim Hills here several years ago.

SPEAKER_00 3:03

Yeah, and that's what we try and educate the homeowners on that just because your backyard doesn't necessarily have or go right directly into what we would consider an open space or that wildland urban interface is what you often hear, that we're actually looking at where those embers are going to fly. Embers can go up to a mile. Uh so those ember storms will be what starts those spot fires in the inside of the communities, uh, and that everybody's home is susceptible.

SPEAKER_01 3:28

Right, absolutely right. When we talk about people who live in the wildland urban interface, and we talk about those when we say urban interface, that's people whose backyards are right there on the edge of uh the forestry area where it goes into vegetation. People think, oh, this only affects people whose houses are right there if your backyard uh backs right up to the hill. But as Terry stated, absolutely not. Uh these fires have the ability to spot uh a mile and occasionally sometimes more. And you can have fires that happen deep inside of uh very urbanized areas where people would never imagine fires would uh would drop in.

SPEAKER_02 4:06

And this this taxes the your your ability to fight fires, depending on how severe and how many fires are actually out there. So it it's really a great idea for all of us to consider how we can actually uh manage our our our landscaping, plan ahead when we do landscape, but also reassess what we have currently in our backyard. So what what are some of the things that you would recommend as far as vegetation management?

SPEAKER_00 4:33

What some of the things we look at uh you can go to our website, it's at uh www.ocfa.org forward slash R S G.

SPEAKER_02 4:46

To remember, we have people driving sometimes, so they don't click. So that's essentially the letters for the Orange County Fire Authority.

SPEAKER_00 4:54

Correct. It is RG, which is set for our ready set go program. Uh it is a national campaign that we use. Uh and what we're looking at on that website is you can do what we call a home assessment. Uh you can either ask one of our inspectors to come out and walk your property with you. It's free. It doesn't go anywhere, it's simply for your education only.

SPEAKER_02 5:14

So they're not going to be reported to anybody. It's not, no.

SPEAKER_00 5:17

No, there's it doesn't go to an insurance company, it doesn't go to any of our uh you know suppliers or any of our partners. It's simply just to start a conversation between yourself and OCFA and even your neighbors, because a lot of times it's just a community topic of what you can't. Well, and that's what you do. Each individual home, they say that you know it doesn't it just takes one person and it truly does. Right. When you're especially when you're talking about vegetation and the safety of a community. So being mindful of what you're planting. And what we'll do on one of your home assessments is you walk your house. We'll start with the outside, uh, again, going back to where those embers are going to land. I tell people to look at where the wind blows and the leaves sort of gather. Those little nooks and crannies are where an ember is probably going to sit and smolder. That's where they're kind of secretive. They can get up into your venting, up into your attic, uh, through small little spaces where the wood starts to break away from the caulking or the stucco on your home. So, what we do is we do an assessment, we'll walk through it. What are some of the small things that you can do? Whether it's changing out the venting systems uh along your roofing lines to one-eighth mesh, or going off and changing out your windows to double pane. Uh all those things are listed on our website and something that we would go overhead and talk to you about.

SPEAKER_02 6:39

So even if you have gaps in some of the fascia boarding or uh even roof materials, those are potential spots for embers to kind of sit and fester and they truly are.

SPEAKER_00 6:50

And you think about it, you know, again, if you go up into your attic space, you find leaves and things like that that have a way of getting in. These embers are going to do the same thing. Uh spark arresters are, you know, falling off chimneys, they get hit by birds or by wind. Uh little things like that, um, you you don't realize it, but it will make a difference. Uh the problem when those do get up into your attic, we can't see it when we drive a neighborhood. So we have engine crews going up and down, and that's what they're looking for. Smoke coming out of homes, or where is those, uh it may not have a what we call a direct flame. So that actual wall of fire is not at that back door or at that house. Uh they're looking for embers and they get in with decking systems, they get in on patio covers where again they kind of get in those nooks and crannies through different pieces of wood and just sit there and fester until it actually will catch fire.

unknown 7:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:39

As we go through, uh, we always look to history uh and our past fires and try and learn from those things. And what we've learned is that when the firefront comes through, people think, well, the fire front has passed. Yeah, I'm my home is okay. But a large majority of these fires that occur uh when people's homes burn aren't necessarily when the fire is actually there at your front doorstep. It's an hour later because that ember has dropped in, as Terry said, that's dropped into your attic space, it's dropped into those leaf piles.

SPEAKER_02 8:08

It's almost like an incubation period, right? It just needs to be the hen the hen has left the hen house.

SPEAKER_01 8:13

Right, yeah. Yeah, the the little child has left the building and it's slow, it's quickly growing into an adult that can really do some damage. And so what we uh what we always try and do, we call it firefront following. Uh what we do is when a fire goes through a neighbor uh uh bumps up against a neighborhood, we call it, um, we always trail with additional fire engines uh to check those areas, as Terry said, about you know, look for smoke, look for little embers. We look for those things because uh after you can go through a neighborhood and the fire can be long gone, the hillside is completely burned away, and you think, oh, the danger is over, and then come back an hour and a half later and you have a couple houses that are that are burning. And you know, that's no good. And those are the things that we're trying to avoid. And through uh proper prevention uh methods and tactics, uh people can have the best chance of their home uh surviving that.

SPEAKER_02 9:06

Right. And you you often see in the news where there's been a major fire and several homes have burnt, and in the middle is two or three structures. I don't know if that's all luck or if that's I think a lot of it's planning. I I have to tell you a quick story because I in my neighborhood we had a situation, this is going back several years, where there was cedar roofs, shake roofs, wood roofs, and um we had the Silverado fire. I'm out close to Silverado Canyon. Uh my compliments to the fire authority because we had a fire truck on every corner of our our development, every every street corner. So they were there just prepared to do the follow-up, like you were talking about. So it's always a it's always reassuring, but at the same time, we have to do our part. So, you know, I know landscaping is probably a major component of that. You mentioned leaves going into attic areas, and that's that's something you probably may not be aware of, but we need to deal with. But there are things that we can do on the ground with the landscaping to help prevent this.

SPEAKER_00 10:04

So there are there is definitely th other things that you can do. Uh people went around and especially during the drought, we're planting a lot of drought tolerant plants, which were great. Uh the problem is a lot of those drought tolerant plants are highly flammable. So being knowledgeable enough or asking the right questions of is this plant going to be drought tolerant? Some of the grasses, like the Mexican feather grass, is a very popular plant right now. It's highly invasive, which means that this plant will transplant itself. It's kind of one of those things that takes over your yard and ends up in cracks and everywhere else. But our concern with that is that it is a flammable uh plant. So if it does catch, it's one of those grasses like our grasses that you see on the hillsides that will continue to carry that fire. And it's not just that wildland fire coming through, but also an internal fire, say it's from cooking, smoking, or electrical, which are some of our other top fires that we have, that house now becomes a giant tender box. And that amount of fuel going out from your house and spreading to either the neighbors through your yard and what you've planted is also something that you need to look at.

SPEAKER_02 11:11

So forget barbecues. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 11:14

Well, and and barbecues are another you know thing that you have to be careful of is you know, what are you doing? What types of uh materials are you burning? Do you have one of those portable fire pits that you put out in your yard? And what do you have around it? You know, a lot of people say, Well, I've got a pool, I'm gonna use a pump. A lot of people we try and remind people you're not always going to be home when these things happen. So by making that buffer zone of that hundred feet around your house, if you have it, a lot of people only have 25 feet in their backyard. But being able to go in and watch the plants, watch the oily plants like the cypress shrubs and things like that that are very decorative but are going to burn really hot once they catch fire. Keeping your palm trees uh clear of any dead palm fronds. We go in when we do our home assessment, as we're looking at those types of items. Is the dead and dying material removed? And by dead and dying we mean those palm fronds, which is a big carrier of fire. Those palm fronds catch fire, they go sailing through the air, and what people forget is that fire creates its own windstorm and its own weather system. So, like with the Yorbelinda fire, a lot of those really tall palm trees caught fire just because the heat and the gases that were up in that height were ready and primed to be able to set something like that on fire. They didn't have to have a direct flame. So it will carry those fires. We look for your separation. How much vegetation do you have in your backyard? We play this sort of fine line with people, especially in areas where they'll have a slope behind their house, whether it's you know an upslope or downslope, not wanting to see their neighbors, so that privacy issue. But what type of plants have you planted up there and how much is up there? Because remember, if there is a fire at the base of that hill, that flame is now laying down on your hill and preheating everything that goes up to it. So once it's preheating, it's sucking all of that moisture out of those plants and just primes it to burn a little bit faster. So we do look at spacing. We want to make sure that you have adequate spacing so you're almost creating your own fire breaks back there.

SPEAKER_02 13:21

And you your your website kind of indicates uh it's almost like a a perimeter, if you will, that starts and and it's like a certain like a bullseye type with the home in the middle. Yep. And then the outer rings uh you know would be one area of territory and then it extends even farther out. So uh those are things that you mentioned in there. Um you know, I think the other thing that people fail to realize is pruning, because you mentioned palm fronds and uh how combustible they are. But there are other things that you can be doing to reduce the the the potential fuel for these fires, I think. And pruning is probably a simple one, right? But at the same time it helps to uh invigorate the tree and give it strength that maybe uh I don't know if it would be resistant necessarily, but it would certainly probably be a slower burn.

SPEAKER_00 14:11

Well, and it it will be it it'll help the burn. Again, we're looking at the amount of vegetation that you have. What we try and do, especially with shrubs and some of the lower hanging trees, like your pine trees and maybe your pepper trees that we see a lot of, even the eucalyptus, we see a lot of those types of trees uh in the areas that we go through and inspect. And what we're looking for is what we would call a ladder fuel. And basically what you're imagining is this ladder, and we're trying to take out the bottom rungs of it so there's spacing between one plant and the next. The bottom, very bottom rung would be your natural grasses or any of your grasses, or weeds even, that are growing up into the next rung, which would be a shrub. And that shrub then carrying it up to the next rung, which is the bottom of your tree. So by taking out some of those height distances, you're not going to have it burned as fast. Things are still going to burn, and people have to realize that you could have everything that we recommend that you do and still lose your house. Sometimes it's just one of those things. But it's it is being conscious and having that spacing, those fuel breaks. The misconception we get when we start talking to people about defensible space is that they have to have this barren yard with nothing in it, you know, these dull plants. The difference is we actually have a recommended plant list on our website again at the uh Google OCFA, and you'll be able to find it. But our plant list has probably six or seven pages of very small print of the different types of plants. And meeting with Master Gardeners with the UC Extension, you know, going to one of their seminars, we work really closely with them. You know, what kind of plants are best for my environment? And I live in a fire area, what else should I be doing?

SPEAKER_02 15:53

Well, and it's interesting you mentioned that. I uh pulled up your website. It's it's a bowlload of material. So if you're out there listening today and you really want to get into this, and it's not overwhelming. I I feel like it's very it's laid out really nicely and easy to follow, but you have a a page or an attachment with undesirable and invasive plant species which are contributors to these fuel situations for fires, and that's about one page, so it's not too overwhelming. No. But the other thing is there's a there's a whole 12-page list of plants that you can plant that would minimize the fuel fueling of a fire. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 16:34

We're not looking for people to uh you know create rock gardens in their backyard. Yeah, we we want people to you know have uh have the plant life back there. We we understand that. Uh and we try and provide as much as we can the most uh you know most variety types of plants that people can utilize in order to minimize their fire hazard and beautify their yard. And you were talking, uh Terry was talking earlier about the ladder fuels. You know, this is something that's not just uh an issue with backyards, it's issues in our state national forests as well. Uh there are actually, you know, a lot of people don't realize this, there are actually more trees in the United States today than there were when Lewis and Clark came across to you know look, you know, map the map the new world. Uh and a lot of that is the management of the forests. Um fire is a natural part of uh forest management. Uh for years, I mean the forest, uh the fire was just a part of part of life. In fact, you know, the pine cones would open up and reseed the grounds. You know, they only open up under fire conditions. Uh before there was just a very light amount of duff on the ground in these national forests, and the fire would burn along the forest floor and it wouldn't be too intense. Maybe one or two trees went up, but you know, eventually it would find some natural break and stop. Uh but uh now we you know have these forests that are very overgrown, uh extreme growth in these forests. And so now what happens when you have years upon years, decades of dead growth there on the forest floor. And now when fire goes through, you have a far more intense, and we've created what we call the ladder fuel. Now we burn every tree in the forest when we have these uh when we have these fires. And that's what people see, you know, they see this moonscape along the uh along the forest floor, and that's because of the overgrowth.

SPEAKER_02 18:23

Well, and at one point this was a natural progression for the life cycle of uh the vegetation or trees in these forested areas or wild areas. And I think with the way we fight fires, and I I may be wrong, but it seems like they're trying to pr stop it, but at the same time, when you do stop it, it just continues to that cycle of building up more fuel for the next one.

SPEAKER_01 18:46

Right. And and and we're they're working on thinning forests. Uh, you know, they're they're trying to, you know, take you know every other tree or you know, try and identify trees that can be removed. You know, and you know, there's you know, they you know, there's a lot of political views on that and a lot of th a lot of things going back and forth, and then but they're working on it. Uh, they realize the issues, uh the mistakes they've made over the last 50 years, and they're trying to correct them now. Uh but if you take that to a smaller scale, to your backyard. Um that's what we're talking about here. We're not talking about forest, we're just talking about your backyard.

SPEAKER_02 19:19

There is a there is a relationship there in the sense of how you deal with your backyard. Right.

SPEAKER_01 19:24

Absolutely. And what we want to try and take away is that dead fuel uh that Terry was talking about, uh, the ability for that dead fuel uh that can just take a little small spark or a little uh ember to get that going. And then that bush you know catches on fire, and that bush catches catches your tree on fire, and that tree catches on fire, and that tree catches your house on fire, and then we got a real problem.

SPEAKER_03 19:45

Right, right.

SPEAKER_02 19:46

Well, and I think the the other aspect of this too is there's times when we're we're trimming trees and which is great, and we're removing dead branches, but then there comes a point in time where you've got to take out plants or trees, and there's always that hesitation, and it's almost like there's gonna be a last-minute hail mary that's gonna save this thing, and we won't have to take it out. But on the other hand, you might just be prolonging the inevitable from happening, which is a fire that consumes that tree and in turn starts to burn your house.

SPEAKER_00 20:21

Well, and that's what we that's part of what we do, you know, with our home assessments and even doing our annual inspections. There's a handful of areas that we actually go out to annually and inspect. And one of the things we're looking for is, you know, is this tree starting to die as we're starting to go in and out of neighborhoods? Because we're in them constantly. Is it a pest that's causing the tree to die? Is it a drought condition? Is it just things have reached their their lifespan? And people forget that plants have lifespans. Uh, just because you plant something that's evergreen, it doesn't mean that it's going to be there forever and a day. There's a lot of shrubs, especially in a lot of the uh homeowners' communities, like the acacia plant that has become that started off as a ground cover and should have been kept at two feet, is now you know six, ten feet tall just because of how it's grown, but it's reached its lifespan. And those are the types and times where you have to come in and actually remove those plants, come back and look at what else can I plant? You know, do I put something similar back? Do I have slope stability concerns? We have a lot of areas in Orange County, San Clemente, Laguna Hills, Laguna Nigel, a lot of areas where uh the slope stability is a concern. So you want to work with a geologist or get what we call a geotech report before you start disturbing some of the land. Uh same thing when there's tree concerns. We encourage people to call an arborist. You know, have somebody come out there and help you out and say, this is how we want to save this. We have several redwoods without in throughout Orange County, which is unusual because it's not necessarily the area. Uh northern North Teston has several redwood areas and they're dying out because it's It's not really their environment. But what do we do about that? And how do we do and how do we work with an arborist to keep the trees there? We don't want to get rid of trees if we don't have to. At the same time, something that's infested by a pest, which we're having a major problem with, we need to get that taken out and taken out properly, and working with that arborist will help you out.

SPEAKER_02 22:19

You mentioned pest, and that's something that the master gardeners are concerned with. The shot hor shot borbeetle is a big one right now. But I I I was really happy to see on your website information regarding that. Because it's not just talking about it and saying there's this issue. There's actual pictures and examples of what the the signs to look for, and maybe you can prevent the destruction of the tree or at least be aware of it and realize that it may be time to take it out. Because again, it it's it's a fuel source.

SPEAKER_00 22:56

Right. And it's another thing that that goes back into the dead and dying removal that we're looking at. You know, what's what's the potential here? You look at a pine tree, uh, and there's some natural dyeing that it does. It it'll get slightly brown, especially in hotter days. Uh again, it's just sort of that cycle through of what that plant does. Uh, but when it really starts looking unhealthy, that's when you, as the homeowner, you're the one that's in there day in and day out that's going to notice that. We may notice as we drive past a neighborhood and say, hey, what's up with this tree, and contact you and reach out to you. At the same time, it's your responsibility to really look into it because if your tree is infested, your tree, once it starts to die out, it's it's already past a point where you should have taken it out. Uh those pests have moved on to the next healthy tree, and now they're going to destroy that. So again, getting those arborists on early or you know, talking to your landscaper of what's really happening in here, do I just need to do some deep watering? Um, you know, those things, those things play out and they contribute to fire.

SPEAKER_02 23:54

Right. And I think one thing I'd like to mention is that sometimes as we live in a place, we get complacent and we overlook things. Because it's it's every day that we see it. We don't see this what might be a slow progression to the death of the plant. Um and I just wanted to mention that you guys aren't really the plant authorities, but um with the Master Gardener website, if you go online, you see Master Gardeners, um there's information in there that can help people deal with plants that can maybe possibly be saved, or the realization that it's time for these guys, the life cycle's over. Let's get something new and and maybe replenish our our landscaping.

SPEAKER_01 24:36

Sure. I mean a lot of your you know your listeners obviously you know very into you know gardening and plants and you know having that tree in the backyard or having that uh that shrub in the backyard. It's almost like a family member, and the fact that it's come to a point where it's gotten its end of its life cycle and you know maybe it does need to be taken out. You know, it's almost like you know, taking your dog to the vet and realizing, well, the dog's not going to be coming back from the vet. You know, people don't want to do that. Right. But we what we find is that the the issues with the plants and vegetation management, as they turn, as these things grow and die off, uh it can be so subtle and so unknowing, you know, day in and day out, like you say, that you just don't realize it until it's too late. You really don't realize it. And we have a lot of homeowners uh that have lost their homes, and we ask them about the vegetation that was in their backyard, and they say, Oh yeah, that tree, it hadn't grown leaves for uh five years. I didn't think anything of it at the time, but uh I guess that might have been important.

SPEAKER_02 25:38

You're hoping, you keep hoping. But you know and another thing too that uh uh is is critical to be considerate of is the weather uh we need to do start doing this maintenance. Um weather conditions, the equipment, the time to do can you touch on that just a little bit?

SPEAKER_00 25:57

Sure. Uh Cal Calfire, who's the state fire department, uh has a campaign and it's called One Less Spark, One Less Wildfire. And what we're looking for that and what we're trying to encourage people is don't just randomly go out there and start hacking away at your shrubs and your grasses uh just any time of the day. What we're looking at is on hot, windy conditions, try and pick a different day. Uh pick a day, you know, in the morning where the humidity plays a factor, where maybe you have a little bit heavier humidity, it's a little more moisture in the air. Uh pick, it's it's usually about before 10 o'clock in the morning. Uh stay away from what the windy days, uh, stay away from anywhere where we start using the red flag warning days. Those are when the Santa Ana conditions are prime. Uh stay away from using any type of metal cutting tools around cement and concrete, move those rocks out of the way. It doesn't take much for a lawnmower to hit a rock and spark a wildfire. We've had you know hillsides recently, a lot of those interior slopes have been caused by this, what we consider string trimming, where somebody's got their weed whacker out there, and they it's a metal blade, it happens to hit a rock, it's enough to kick the spark and set those grasses on fire. So be really conscious of what you're doing. Keep some sort of uh water source on site when you are doing it, making sure that you have a water extinguisher, they're relatively inexpensive to buy and lightweight, some sort of a shovel perhaps, uh some sort of either a hose, and have a cell phone in your back pocket. Most of us don't leave home without our cell phones, but it's it's knowing when you you've you're you're not capable of actually taking care of that fire fire. As soon as the spark happens and you see some flame, call immediately. Don't sit there and go, oh, I got this, it's no problem. Those are the ones that are really take off on you. And Captain Kirk can actually tell you these things take off fast. They'll triple and double in size before you know it and before you're blinking an eye. Uh you know, and here you are now running away from the fire, trying to get your cell phone out, and you're panicking. There's a lot of chaos that happens when there is a wildland fire.

SPEAKER_02 28:05

And you start to lose your sense of Well, direction.

SPEAKER_00 28:08

You may not you may be on a slope. You may not be in this open field, you may be on a slope where you know your footing is not great. I've hiked some of these slopes. They're not fun to try and get up in normal conditions, let alone if I'm it got fire chasing me.

SPEAKER_02 28:20

So Well, I I was also referring to common sense. You know, at that point, I I think people are hesitant to call uh when there is an emergency, kind of they don't look at it as an emergency, it hasn't escalated to that point. But um I think that's when you just gotta realize hey, let's call better safe than sorry, I would assume.

SPEAKER_01 28:42

Some of our largest fires that we've had, uh we look back and we uh take a look at the 911 calls that came in. And some of our largest fires, we have the fewest amount of 911 calls on those fires. Because everybody thinks that everyone else called 911. They see the fire and they go, well, somebody must have called that in.

SPEAKER_03 29:01

Right.

SPEAKER_01 29:01

When in fact, nobody's called it in yet. And uh, you know, here at the fire authority, you know, we we're capable of a lot of things. We we do not have a crystal ball in our uh dispatch center yet. We're working on that. Uh I don't think it's gonna be coming out anytime soon. But uh we we need to know what's going on out there. We depend on the people out there. Sure.

SPEAKER_02 29:19

This is In the Garden, a show produced by the Master Gardeners of Orange County. I'm David Laterno, your host for the hour. And let's get back to talking with Captain Larry and and Terry. It's so good. This is like a like a tag team almost. But great information and really uh but let's let's talk about home hardening. Uh uh there the these are some interesting aspects and insights that you provide, and people need to be aware of it. And it's there's a lot of it's common sense, but we just don't think about it, I think.

SPEAKER_00 29:52

Yeah, we touched on a little bit earlier in the show about home hardening and what that means, and uh there is a way on the website at Google OCFA to be able to do your own home assessment. And again, really what we're doing is it's free, it's simple. Again, the information doesn't go anywhere, the insurance companies, things like that.

SPEAKER_02 30:11

But you you offer two options either do the home assessment or you'll you'll come up and actually visit people.

SPEAKER_00 30:16

Exactly. So when you find it on our website, you're able to go out and and walk your house personally uh and click on the different slides. There are literally pictures you choose from and different options. It's it's easy to use. I if I can use do it, you can do it. It is and we do try and make it very interactive and very simple. It doesn't take a lot of um computer knowledge even of how to do it. Uh you can also have one of our inspectors come out and walk that property with you. And what we do is we come in with recommendations. We will walk your house starting with the perimeter of it. We'll look at some of the vegetation you have, we'll make suggestions of maybe pulling things away from your house. We have a lot of people that like to have those decorative shrubs right up against the windows or that go or grow all the way up into the eaves of your house and your roof line, uh, recommending some of that stuff be pulled off. Making sure that you have that, you know, first five feet or so uh around your perimeter of your house that's maybe free and clear of anything. No patio furniture. Uh it doesn't seem like five feet is a lot, but it it really does make a difference. You're looking for that dead and dying material as well.

SPEAKER_02 31:21

So what about people want to burn in their fireplace, even? I mean, that's a that's something that does. You m you want to put it under the eaves because you want to make it convenient when it's well, it does get a little chilly here in California once in a while.

SPEAKER_00 31:33

But a lot of people don't have the luxury of having, we talked defensible space earlier in the show, of a hundred feet. Some people only have, you know, 10, 15, 20 feet in their backyard. So what do I do if I have that open burn area or have an older home where I'm able to do wood burning within my fireplace? And please make sure that you actually can do wood burning in your fireplace. A lot of people have converted their, you know, ripped out the gas logs because they are old or they look terrible and they they decide that they're gonna wood burn. Those chimneys are not made for that. And that's where we get those interior chimney fires and things like that. But if you are storing wood, let's say you camp a lot or things like that, what we're looking for is pull it as far away from your home as possible, but being mindful as well where you're putting it not so close up to your neighbors. If it's got to be stacked up next to your house, like some of the areas in the canyons where they don't have the space to put it, you know, put uh some sort of a tarp over the top of it. What you're trying to prevent are those embers flying into that and back to that smoldering or even the leaves that are collecting. Remember, that's kindling for that stuff.

SPEAKER_03 32:38

Right.

SPEAKER_00 32:38

So what we're trying to sort of is again just slowing down the fire enough to get you out and get our fire response in.

SPEAKER_02 32:45

Well, and those logs, wood uh cuttings can bring in you could be transporting pests that infect your the other the other parts of your landscape.

SPEAKER_00 32:55

Right. And that other campaign that you've that people may or may not have heard of is the Burn It Where You Buy It. Uh you want to make sure if you're going down to the beach, there's a lot of local areas where you can take that wood. I I realize that you've cut down that eucalyptus tree or that sycamore that's at your house and you're transporting it, but that's how these pests are being transported, is that they're still in those that cut down logs. Uh you taking it to another area is just now causing those things to be able to go somewhere else.

SPEAKER_02 33:24

Right, right. And that's that's our concern as well, because we're we're trying to minimize the invasive uh pests thing that come into the area. Right. So we got people coming into the country from traveling overseas that bring plants in, which is even more horrific. It doesn't necessarily uh lead to maybe fire over this, but it can lead to citrus loss, for example. Right. Um so what are a couple any other things that you would take?

SPEAKER_00 33:52

Yeah, so once we kind of do that assessment of your house, the outside, the exterior of your home, looking at the shrubs, the spacing, the amount of fuel that you have, the the types of fuel you have outside, we turn to your actual house itself. There are things you can do to your home that are inexpensive, and I inexpensive I mean either free or it can also be you know under ten dollars little fixes. Um we look at things such as having your double pane windows when you're starting to start look at new projects in your home and what upgrades can I do. Putting in those double pane windows may not seem like a lot, but it's energy efficient. But you're also looking at if this ember hits this window, it's got to go through two panes versus just one. You know, it's simple again, kind of a simple concept. At the same time, you're just trying to keep those embers out.

SPEAKER_02 34:39

But multiple benefits because you mentioned energy savings. Absolutely. It just uh we did our home, and it's our home was built in 1977. And just the the difference in the wind flow coming into our home. Exactly. You know, it makes a difference. But it's great for the fire thing. I didn't realize it about the double panes.

SPEAKER_00 34:56

Right. The other thing we look at is what are your the eaves look like underneath your home? Are they what we would consider boxed? And by that means is you if you're looking up underneath the eaves, do you have those rafters or those two by fours or whatever's underneath there coming out? Do you see that? If they're if they're covered, it's great because what happens again, that's one less place that those embers can kind of collect. Remember that windstorm we chatted about earlier in the show of creating its own wind space and its own weather storm? You can get those little whirlwinds that'll collect and those embers just keep shooting up into a corner, those cracks where the stucco and the wood are coming apart, they're gonna go right up in that. By boxing your eaves, it's one less place that those embers have to get into. Another thing we take a look at is do you have stucco or you do you have some sort of composite siding versus wood siding on your house? People are starting to do a lot of upgrades to their homes. Again, something less expensive, maybe a little less drastic because there's a certain look and feel. We're not telling people to completely change the way they look and feel of your home because you bought it for a reason. You know, but if you're going into it and replacing wood, replace it with some composite. There's some great products out there that you can't even tell the difference between wood.

SPEAKER_02 36:05

Well, I think Hardyback is a is a company that makes cement material that hard support. Yeah, and it but they're actually doing it in a design, I would say designer options that looks like rough sawn plywood, but it's cement. And it's very um probably resilient to paint versus the wood siding.

SPEAKER_00 36:25

And that's what we're looking for is you know, by choosing some sort of, you know, either going stucco, removing the wood completely, and going stucco, um, the other choice, the hardy board or any type of composite, is that it is better, it's a little more fire resistive. Right. It's got those components where I mean wood is what we use in a fireplace. Think about that. That's what's gonna burn. Yeah. You know, those types of things where you have the stucco, it's it's heat resistant. It's gonna sort of back that fire off. It's not, again, not gonna not cause it to burn eventually because everything will burn.

SPEAKER_02 36:56

Right. But it's gonna increase your chances of it.

SPEAKER_00 36:58

Your chances are much better to be saving your house. Some of the other things we take a look at is do you have a patio cover or any type of decking? Patio covers are notorious for taking out homes when in a wildland fire. Uh they're usually made of wood, a lot of them are dilapidated, falling apart, even the brand new ones that are put together, you're looking at wood up against your house and those screws and bolts and everything else that are now bolted into wood in your home. That heat's gonna transfer by those metal components. You don't think about it, but again, if you've got a cover over your patio cover, a lot of you use the coriated you know stuff on the top to kind of block the sun even more. We got uh more places where leaves are stashed, where those embers are gonna hide out. One more place where the wood is pulling away from the stucco. Again, embers are being able to get up into these little spots. In areas where you have your wood decking or your wood patio covers, a wood decking, you want to make sure that it's enclosed underneath. Use some sort of, you know, whether it's a mesh or something to help keep a lot of that foliage out from underneath your decking. Don't use under your deck for storing. You know, or if you are, you know, completely enclose it. Because again, what you're trying to do is keep those embers from getting up underneath areas where we can't see if we're passing through, or if you're at home, that you can't see those embers coming into that and causing more fuel or more um where fire is going to spread.

SPEAKER_02 38:25

You know, aside from from embers, this is probably a good way to keep pests out. Rats and rodents, too. Sure. And they bring in and probably build nests that's potential flammable material as well, I would imagine.

SPEAKER_00 38:38

Yeah, absolutely. And that and that's another thing that we take a look at is some of your vent openings, and not just up around your your home, you'll see those little bird hole type things that are up near your roof line. That's what helps keep your attic cool, but also keeps the moisture out, so kind of holds back from the mold. What you want to do on those is that birds do get up in those areas. Uh, I know for my mom's house, uh she's got some nesting birds, and we keep saying we're gonna wait until they've all hatched and then get them out. Well, those nests are just, again, those fuel beds of where this ember can potentially get in. By using a one-eighth mesh, most homes I believe are half or quarter inch that's in there now, by just changing it a little bit, the embers that would be able to get into those holes, they're still gonna get in, but they're not the size that science has found that's going to carry that fire throughout that house or sustain it.

SPEAKER_02 39:27

Is there a particular size that you're trying to get down to the other?

SPEAKER_00 39:31

The one-eighth mesh is what is what we're recommending, uh at least in the studies that they've been able to do and the live burning that they've been able to do, uh, that it's it's whatever embers still get in, and again, we're not completely blocking those off because you need that airflow within your house, uh, but it's not enough to necessarily sustain. Now, if it's pelted for hours on hours by this you know giant wall of flame, again, you can do everything right and still lose your home. But we're just trying to get it slowed down enough that we can get in and you can get out.

SPEAKER_01 40:01

We want to give you the best chance to save your home. Now, a lot of your listeners are listening to all this. We're talking about double pane windows, we're talking about changing things and boxing your eaves in, and all they can see in their heads are dollar signs. You know, that's all they can say. Oh, this is gonna cost so much. Yeah, you you may have to spend a little bit of money, you know, maybe. But ask yourselves what is worth uh a little investment in protection of my home? How much is your home worth to you? Because we're not just talking about the wood and the metal and the concrete and the paint that your house is made out of. We're talking about the memories that are inside of your home. We're talking about the people that are live inside of your home, the people that you love. How much are they worth to you? How much is that worth to update?

SPEAKER_02 40:49

And all of us know about moving and how difficult the move from one house to another is. So if you're trying to move photo albums and memories and stuff, so i that can be pretty daunting when you have a fire that you're thinking about coming up a hill or approaching your home. So it's probably a good idea to to be prepared, not only from the landscape aspect uh uh of this, but um how you deal with um being prepared as a family unit.

SPEAKER_00 41:20

We do, and and and Captain uh Chris can expand on this, but we do have a program called ReadySet Go. It's a national program, and basically what that is is this personal responsibility of hey, uh what can I do around my home and how can I prepare myself, not only myself, but my family as well. So the first piece of that is gonna be ready. We've talked a little bit about this. So these things around my house that I can do, the home assessment, walking through, and these upgrades, and you know, as cat the captain mentioned, it's what is that worth to you?

SPEAKER_02 41:51

So I'm gonna mention real quick that this is on your website too. Absolutely. So you want and it's really simple. It's Orange County Fire Authority O C F A dot or G forward slash.

SPEAKER_00 42:03

R S G, which stands for ready second.

SPEAKER_02 42:06

Okay. Yeah. I'm sorry, just because I think it's a great website and it's easy to use, um, it's user-friendly, um and it's a wealth of information.

SPEAKER_01 42:16

So if you even implement it, just change your homepage to to OCFA.org. Forget those other websites. Just just go to ours.

SPEAKER_02 42:26

Well, you can have Master Gardeners as a backup too.

SPEAKER_00 42:29

Yes, yes. Which which is definitely a great partnership for us, is there's so I'm sorry to interrupt you. No, no, no. It all comes into play. But yeah, I there's there's so much information when it comes to how to prepare yourself for a wildland fire and the things that we've discussed today that it's completely overwhelming. We could talk for hours about just the things that that affect a wildland fire and what you can do and how to protect yourself. So by going to our website, uh talking to the Master Gardeners when they have classes or their open houses, we are often at those events as well. So stop by and come and talk to us about it.

SPEAKER_02 43:01

Um sorry, that too.

SPEAKER_00 43:04

So being ready as we're talking here, you know, part of that research as you're you're doing your web searches is create a disaster supply kit in what we would call a go bag. So you're gonna have two separate kits. We've always heard, you know, have my disaster preparedness bag, right? Our first aid kits, those types of things. The Red Cross has great websites on our list on their websites. We have it as well on our website, uh being able to, what do I put in my disaster kit? Uh, you know, uh, what does that include? Uh and and how long do I want to have things for? So you're looking at food, cash. If people forget that, you know, this disaster means all disasters. We're talking wildland fire today, but it could be an earthquake, it could be heaven knows anything nowadays.

SPEAKER_02 43:47

So and people relate this to earthquakes more than they do fire. Absolutely. Which is an aspect I never really considered.

SPEAKER_00 43:53

Well, and there's more people affected by an earthquake. Right. Wildland fire, people always see people, you know, especially if you live in In a little bit more more urban area and away from that concept like, oh, well, I don't have that backyard up against a wildland space, so I don't have to worry about a wildland fire. You know, what we're looking at is making sure you have supplies for 72 hours, a minimum of 72 hours. Uh and don't forget your pets. And that means the fish, too. Everybody, you know, making sure that the dog's got dog food. If the dog's got medication, you know, that your medication and and theirs is all together, that you have that extra dose. You want to make sure you have cash. Again, if we're talking earthquake or some other disaster, a lot of the electronics are going to be down. You won't have cell phones, you won't have, you know, a lot of things that you normally count on and don't think about. Uh but having cash stashed somewhere, again, you never know what you're going to need it for. Uh the second thing that we'd be looking at is what we call, and it's part of the Ready Set Go program, is what we call a go bag. And those are going to be more personal items. So, you know, your toothbrushes, your medications, copies of important papers, any type of paper maps. Again, can't always rely on your cell phone because maybe you're in an area that doesn't have service. Making sure your pictures, any extra clothes, and tennis shoes, you know, make sure you have a decent pair of hiking boots if it's somewhere where you work in an area where you may have to hike out of. Keeping those things in mind. Uh, we have those listed also on the website that they're call our six P's. The second thing you kind of want to pay attention to on your ready piece of it is going to be creating and practicing your escape plan. We talk about this as well in uh at normal house fire is where are we all going to meet? If it's the middle of the night, do the kids know where to run down to? Again, that chaos, not just in the wildland, but also in a fire or disaster, it's intense. If you haven't lived through it, you don't get it. Uh you get a little complacent. So practice that escape plan. Make sure that everybody knows where you're gonna go, whether it's the mailbox or a Red Cross shelter. Everybody knows exactly what's gonna happen. And make sure, and and remember too that you're not always gonna be home. Know your kids' uh school's schedule. What's the school required to do? Everybody does a mad rush to the schools, right? And unfortunately, a lot of times if they're in an area where it's on fire, police are not gonna fire, not are not gonna let you in, and it gets even more chaotic. And trust us, we understand, we know those are your loved ones, especially the kids. But those schools are prepared to house those kids and keep them protected, and often that's the best place for them.

SPEAKER_02 46:24

I was gonna say they're probably better prepared than we are as as as families in some cases.

SPEAKER_00 46:29

Well, and you rushing in has now clogged up an area where fire or police can't get into. So you have to be mindful, and I I we know that it's a knee-jerk reaction because we would be doing the same exact thing for our families, but it's stopping and thinking, okay, what's the best thing to do?

SPEAKER_02 46:45

And after talking with you guys, I can tell you that I feel like I'm in good hands. If you came to me and said, we're taking care of this thing, uh I I think people should be reassured that it it's gonna be they're gonna be well taken care of.

SPEAKER_01 46:59

Yeah. And some of it and you look again, we always look to fires past what's occurred in the past. And you know you're you know the kids are at school, the parents are at work, you know, someone might be at home, and every family should ask themselves, all right, if the if we're all separated, what is our rally point? Yeah, where where can we get to? So if you can't get to your home, what's what's plan B? You know, uh we always uh and again, you know, everyone has, you know, no, everyone's dropping landlines for cell phones now, as Terry said. Uh you know, we all love our we love our smartphones, you know, we have all the maps on them, everything's great. Until the cell towers go down. Right. And when that goes down, you know, you have to be prepared for the 14th century. You have to be prepared to you know go just with paper maps, and then you might have to walk uh to some location to meet up with your family. And we want people to be prepared for that possibility. And we talk, I know this is uh you know about you know we talk mostly about fires here, but earthquakes are a real possibility. It's not if, it's when it's going to happen. It will be.

SPEAKER_02 48:05

You guys are involved in that as well. So but if we can be prepared for that, it's it's even better. I think the the thing that you mentioned, Larry, is that if you have this discussion with your family, it helps to reassure everybody that, especially children, that okay, this event is happening. My dad told me to do this, and we know this is the game plan. So it it's reassuring and it relieves a lot of anxiety and probably a lot of situations that you would otherwise have to deal with. Right. That makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 48:36

Well, it becomes also a reac uh reaction, right? You're not having to sit there and go, Oh my gosh, I don't remember. I know my dad told me I was supposed to do something, but we didn't practice it, so I don't remember. You know, those types of things. Uh you know, delegating who's gonna go get the kids, you know, is it Aunt So and so? Is it gonna be, you know, one sh one of the parents, so you're not both going for the same one and then forgetting the other one? Because that happens as well, right? Again, very chaotic, dynamic situation that's constantly changing. So, you know, turning on your radio, uh our office does the very best that we can to get out as much information as soon as we can. So, you know, here's your Red Cross Center, this is where it's set up. Don't drive the 91 freeway. People, please stay off, you know, off the roads. We've got personnel coming in, you know, monitoring that. Signing up for Alert OC is another one where you get all that information actually sent out to your cell phones. The alert OC is a great system. We use it internally as well, uh, just to notify our staffing if something happens.

SPEAKER_02 49:37

And this is an application that you could get for your smartphone, is that or just uh it's a website location?

SPEAKER_01 49:43

Uh the the alert OC system, it's uh built into the emergency broadcast uh it's like a uh a localized version of the emergency broadcast. Uh I guess a lot of people are familiar with the term reverse 911. Uh alert OC is very much like that. And so what we can do, we can actually call particular areas uh on your cell phones, on your landlines, and have important information for a particular area. If, you know, heaven forbid we have to evacuate a particular neighborhood or a particular area, we can contact you through the alert OC system and then contact and then let you know, hey, you know, we need to evacuate.

SPEAKER_02 50:19

That's great. I uh the these are part of the systems that are really good. Um that there's incredible resources here within the right.

SPEAKER_00 50:28

There is, and it all does go back to that that ready piece of it, and so much of these links are on our website. Um I know we're throwing a bunch of stuff out there, but even the alert OC is somewhere that you can go to the website or Google it and sign up. You can put just about any phone number that you can possibly think of uh and register it, and they'll be able to contact you through that. So how about the set part of it? Uh the ready, set, and go. Right. So so you've you've done all these things to your house, you've got your escape plan, uh, don't forget your defensible space is another big piece of your ready set of it, which we've discussed most of the program of. The set piece of it is really kind of that, okay, the conditions are primed, and by conditions we mean uh we've got higher temperatures, lower humidity, maybe they've issued what we call red flag warning days, so there's gonna be some Santa Ana winds. Uh conditions are primed for that fire to happen, or there's an active one relatively close. And when you have these types of conditions, what you're wanting to look for is pack up your vehicle with the emergency stuff. If you happen to be home, obviously. Or even you're leaving that morning and you know that you know we're gonna have red flag warnings for the next three days, have these things with you in the car.

SPEAKER_02 51:36

Because there may be a situation that you can't get back into your neighborhood.

SPEAKER_00 51:39

Well, it's not necessarily going to be a weekend. Again, we talk about not everybody's gonna be home, right? So it could be a Tuesday afternoon or Tuesday morning, conditions are hot, uh, you're at work, and all of a sudden something happens, and you're right, you won't be able to get back into your house. Uh it may be days or a week before you can get back into your home.

SPEAKER_02 51:55

So it's probably a good time at that point to remind your family and reassure them here's the game plan. Exactly. Here's what we're gonna do. If this happens or this gets out of hand, you know what to do and where to go.

SPEAKER_00 52:08

Absolutely. So you're wanting to pack your vehicle with your emergency stuff, uh, you're gonna pack your uh emergency supply kit, and you're also gonna make sure you have that go bag we talked about. Uh and the easiest way on a lot of these, so you're not necessarily carrying around photos and important papers, is I've put everything on a uh portable drive. You can get those, you know, something simple, uh, you know, whether it's a thumb drive, I've got uh an actual one, a hard drive that's a like a terabyte worth of space on it where I can download, I've downloaded all of my important photos. I sent it off to my sister in Ohio and forgot about it. But the copy is there. It's not anywhere where I'm at, whether it's an earthquake or whatever. We used to hide things in safety deposit boxes, so we don't necessarily have those as much anymore. But it's a good place to put it. You know, you have that secondary document, because if something does happen to your house, the first things the insurance companies want to know is first I need all those phone numbers, and second of all, where's your policy? What do you have? What's this information? Uh, you know, if you're in a hospital, what's my emergency card, those types of things. So have all those things ready to go. Make sure your your car is backed into your driveway if you're at home. And you want to stay aware to the latest news in the local media. So again, any of the local channels, we're feeding them information as the fire progresses. We actually have broadcasts and updates constantly of here's what's happening in this fire, making sure that you're paying attention to that. That alert OC is also, again, someplace else that you get that information from. If you are at home or again, these conditions sort of appear before you leave for work, move your patio furniture, and other flammable stuff away from the house. We talked about having that five, that five foot to thirty-foot sort of distance around your home that's kind of your safety zone. And what we're looking for that is just making sure if something does happen that you're not contributing to that fire. Sure, you have double pane windows, but if I have a shrub outside that's highly flammable and it's constantly hitting it because it's on fire, it's not going to take much to get through both panes of windows. Uh, and you want to make sure all your windows and doors are shut and your air conditioning is turned off, you know, or turn on the recycling so that you're not sucking in any of those embers and also smoke damage. Smoke damage is hard to get out of. Uh so you know, turn all that stuff off to make sure that your house, again, is a little bit safer. And that's really kind of the big concept for the set that you're you're ready to go. If something you can either get out of your house quickly, or you're sitting at your office and you realize that I may not be going back. Right.

SPEAKER_01 54:34

A few years back we conducted an experiment uh up in Cowan, uh, the Cowan Heights area, and we actually told an entire neighborhood of maybe about uh 20, 25 homes. I said, all at the same time, we want you all to try and back your cars into the street and get out. And it created the most amazing traffic, instant traffic jam you've ever seen. And you know, people don't realize that. You know, when when when we come and we uh the sheriffs come to your door and they say we are evacuating the neighborhood, we are not doing that for kicks. Right. We are we are not doing it for fun. You know, there's a reason why we are doing that, and we want you to leave now. Because while you're trying coming out the streets, the same streets that you're using to get out are usually the same streets our fire engines are trying are used to try and get out. And for I'm sure everyone's seen uh what a fire engine looks like nowadays, and that's kind of a large vehicle. And the streets that are in the wild and urban interface areas uh don't tend to be uh six-lane highways. They're kind of narrow.

SPEAKER_02 55:34

We we've got about three or four minutes left in our hour here. Uh I'd like to touch real quick on go, if you if you can. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 55:43

And that's what Captain Kurtz was was was leading right into is that when we say go, please leave early. We we get that you know you maybe you're fumbling around a few other things, but by the time the sheriff has gotten there, you really need to be out of the door.

SPEAKER_02 55:57

And they for they will will they force you out if I mean, or there are people that will stupidly or ignorantly be ignorant enough to not go.

SPEAKER_01 56:06

There there are, unfortunately. Um when we say, you know, we need you to evacuate, there are some people who absolutely refuse to leave their homes. And you know, we appreciate why they don't want to leave their homes. We we understand that, but by staying at your home, uh you become part of the problem. And now all of a sudden, you know, my crews, you know, my you know, the men and women of this agency, not only, you know, homes can be replaced, you know, bushes and trees, they'll grow back at the end of this. But you, if we, you know, if you are killed in this fire, you are not coming back. And all of a sudden, we have to apply resources, manpower, and equipment to oversee your safety that we could be spending, you know, protecting homes and maybe getting a handle on this fire. So a lot of people believe a lot of people believe that they're being part of the solution by staying at home. Right. Mostly you're adding to our problem.

SPEAKER_02 57:04

It's a pretty selfish act almost, I would say, because it interferes with your ability to do things. So we're getting at the end of the hour here. Anything you would like to say uh as we wrap up or remind people of? I know the website is an important factor. Orange Countyfireauthority.org, OCFA dot org.

SPEAKER_01 57:24

Well, as we've been talking over the last hour, uh vegetation management uh is at the core, uh, one of our core values when it comes to prevention, uh, protection of your homes, and for the tactical extinguishment of these fires. Denial of fuel is the number one way that we put these fires out. Uh we're making fire breaks to put these fires out, and what we're asking people in the residences to do with their backyard gardens, with their backyard shrubbery, is to try and help us out on that aspect. Uh deny the fire the fuel to help your house burn.

SPEAKER_02 58:00

Thank you. And Terry, any quick question or comment? Have your chance. You actually spoke very well throughout the hour, giving us some very useful information, both of you. This has been in the garden. I'm your host, David Laterno. We've had with us today Captain Larry Kurtz and Terry Merritt, uh fire prevention specialist. Is that did I get that right? It's been a really fun time with you guys. I've enjoyed it. Thank you for having us. Thank you for being and I want to remind people to take and look at their website as well as the Master Gardener website. You have a great day. Thank you very much.