Wild Takes
A Wild Origins Australia Podcast.
Wild Takes brings you raw, unfiltered conversations with the people working at the front line of conservation and hunting. From scientists and traditional knowledge holders to adventurers and land managers — we explore the big ideas, tough decisions, and wild stories shaping the future of our natural world.
Hosted in partnership with Wild Origins Australia & the Origins Foundation.
Wild Takes
Return Of The Throwing Stick
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Warwick Nail is an Aussie boomerang hunter, YouTuber and designer of the "Wozzarang". Today on the show we take a look back at the humble throwing stick and how it developed into a precision, aeronautical piece of technology.
For a head as sharp and tough as the one on your shoulders. Bloody hell you got him. Cayuga broadheads.
SPEAKER_00Hi, I'm Warwick Naylor, and this is Wild Takes.
SPEAKER_01On this episode, I'm talking all things throwing stick with Wazza of Waza's hunting adventures. YouTuber, designer of the Wazirang, and Rabbit Hunter Extraordinaire. Going, mate? I'm very well, thank you. Wonderful to have you on. We are coming to you recorded from a beautiful area. What do we call this? Just outside of the Gippsland.
SPEAKER_00Yes, it's uh more central Gippsland. Um on the area of uh the Avon Wilderness Park area. It's uh basically the foothills of the Great Dividing Range. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Superb. Beautiful. 27 acres uh out here, wonderful little homestead, beautiful. You won't be able to hear it because I'll take it out in post, but there is a lovely sopher-crested cockatoo giving it large in the background. So Waza, you are most notably a YouTuber, and more importantly, importantly to me anyway, because I find it fascinating, you hunt with a boomerang. Is that correct? That's correct. Yep. Amazing stuff. Now, you actually devised your own boomerang, you have a boomerang that is your signature boomerang, is that correct?
SPEAKER_00Yes, I do. Um I had uh well basically I came up with a design in my late teens, and then uh it was just a standard wooden boomerang, and then I partnered up with uh throwsticks.com in America, and we developed the Wazerang from that original design from my own hunting boomerang, and that's made out of polycarbonate, and that thing it flies like a beast.
SPEAKER_01That is, is it Benjamin Scott, I believe?
SPEAKER_00That's him.
SPEAKER_01Who yeah, he runs probably the the the the number one place to get quality throwing sticks in the world, I'd say, isn't it?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, he was I did a bit of research and came across him pretty quickly and thought it looks like the best person I can come come across to get. I I was I was after some hunting boomerangs and um yeah, I couldn't find anyone with quality anywhere else but him, so that's how it's that's how the whole relationship started. So amazing.
SPEAKER_01What was it that inspired you to gain to hunting with a boomerang? Because there's not many people outside of community that go after it with a boomerang.
SPEAKER_00Well, it was more of a I like a challenge and I knew it'd be hard. And I went to Central Australia on a on a trip when I was about fourteen on a school trip, and I came back with a little ornamental boomerang. Um just uh it wasn't either a hunting or a a comeback boomerang. And I just started throwing that at at rabbits for fun. And eventually it snapped. And I made another one out of black box wood and with my dad's help, and I th I kept trying, and within a few weeks I actually I'd hit one. I I threw it and it was only a few metres away, it was running past me. I threw the boomerang down, it it hit the ground, and then the rabbit ran into the boomerang as it was still falling over and it knocked itself out. And then I uh finished off the rabbit and thought, I think this might be possible.
SPEAKER_01Wait there, go back. So the boomerang hit the floor and then hit the rabbit, or the rabbit looked at the boomerang and ran into a door, what happened?
SPEAKER_00The rabbit, well the boomerang stopped and sort of was balancing before it fell, and then while it was doing that, the rabbit hit its head on it.
SPEAKER_04Right, okay.
SPEAKER_00But it was close enough that I thought, well, I think I can keep trying and I'll actually get a good clean shot. And within a few more weeks I did have a clean shot.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Amazing stuff. So what was it that drew you to the development of the boomerang you use now? What what were the the attributes, should we say, that you were looking for in a boomerang?
SPEAKER_00Well, it has to be m most of the time they have to be a shape where there is a long section, uh, which is where the handle is, and a kink at the top, and that helps with the flying to keep it fly straight, as opposed to the returning boomerangs, which are more or the traditional returning boomerangs are more of a an equal shape. Now and uh I actually come across that design by mistake because when I snapped the end of one of my boomerangs, um I noticed that it flew straighter rather than curling off at the finish. And I kept that design going, and I also remembered at that point that I'd seen pictures of the Aboriginal people using boomerang that shape. I thought, oh, that's that's there for a reason. And uh that makes it fly straight, and I've kept that design ever since. So the wazerang now is a small hunting boomerang with that basic kink at the end shape.
SPEAKER_01So it's like a a swooping seven as opposed to the more traditional kind of even-sided boomerang. That's correct, yeah. Yeah, I uh being left-handed is a is an unfortunate place to be in. Whenever I get to tr use a boomerang that's been traditionally made or is available, I almost always have to use one which is an equal one that just flies straight because they're pertaining to one hand or the other, yeah, depending on uh which hand you are. And obviously most people are right-handed. Um, but yeah, interesting. So you found that was a much more beneficial design having the the swooping seven, the one side longer than the other. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yes, that's right. Um Benjamin uh from Throw Sticks, he uh has the uh model called the Kimberley Stinger, which is even on both sides, and it can be thrown left or right-handed, but it's the only one of that design.
SPEAKER_01And it would be a pointed one, yeah. The Kimberly, yeah, the Kimberly um model, should we say? They're they like a pointy one, don't they?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's interesting how they differ so much region to region, the styles and the the misconceptions of you know what tribes use them and how prevalent they are. Um so the ones that are on throw sticks.com, some of them I don't I've I've I've not gone through and I don't really know all of the designs he's got, but they are because there were there were throwing sticks that were used in North America, correct? They had uh a boomerang of their own.
SPEAKER_00Yes, the American Indians had uh something like quite similar to what I think is in Australia. Um I can't remember their model names, but uh they they would hunt and I have seen pictures of them hunting for uh hares or what they call jackrabbits over there and uh be successful in picking up game that way.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, right. Yeah, it's funny because it is one of the the original I mean it's just one of the original weapons you're gonna have after throwing a rock. You know, you're gonna if you're throwing a stick, you're either it's a straight one and you're throwing it like a spear, or it's uh another one and you're throwing it side on trying to knock something out.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, I guess it developed from once they realized once they had a more of a flattened stick, it would go a little bit further and they took it an another step further and deliberately made it flatter, and you can just see natural evolution there of uh experience and trial and error and how it all works together.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, for sure. And it's actually you're hard pressed to find a stick in Australia that isn't a bit kinked with how slow growing the trees are here. So it is just a natural, you know, having that curve in it would be yeah, a natural occurrence and trial and error, of course. They're gonna they're gonna come up with it. Where else has a boomerang, which I I mean obviously everyone was throwing sticks around at some point, but actually developed. I know there was so Africa, I mean Egypt, there were relics found of boomerangs now.
SPEAKER_00Yep, there's been relics found in uh Poland and even Germany, so even throughout Europe, I think even perhaps the oldest hunting boomerang in in existence now is it's either Polish or German. Um yeah, so from that area of the world, uh I b uh I think their their guess is it's about 10,000 years old.
SPEAKER_01So the oldest remaining relic of a boomerang. Yes, yes. Right. Do you think that's because things from that region are what's the word? Um kept better. They're uh preserved better, should you say?
SPEAKER_00Yes, that's likely uh being a bit cooler, not so harsh in the uh sun, say.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, some of those bogs up there, they've got some bogs they used to chuck stuff in, didn't they? Or the the silt on the bottom of rivers, they often dig things up there, bits of wood, old ships and such that preserve quite well. Do you know where they found it?
SPEAKER_00Uh no, I didn't look into that. Well, I did look into the history of it, but um there was no uh actually it does ring a bell. Maybe it was in a cave. Now that I think it's been a few months since I've read it, read the story, but yeah, it's um I find it fascinating. They've been uh in uh almost all places where they can find some decent amount of history. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Right. Yeah, and I think it is just one of those natural things you can't bitter a bit faster than you. We've got hands, we don't have particularly good legs compared to other animals. We're gonna even frustratedly chuck a stick at it, and uh sometimes they fly better than others. Now the misconception a lot of people have when you hear boomerang, you hear returning boomerang. Yeah. But they weren't as common as people might think, are they?
SPEAKER_00No, they were more the returning ones are more of a toy, um, although they were used for uh hitting birds as well. But as soon as they hit hit anything, contrary to you know popular cartoons and and shows like that, uh they drop out of the sky and that's it, you know, they lose their energy and they fall. So it's not a lot of point having a returning boomerang for a hunting one. You just throw it knowing that it's not going to come back if you're gonna hit your game.
SPEAKER_01Sure. I actually so the there's also the throwing it above birds because they they pick up the the the image and it looks like a bird of prey and makes them swoop down. I heard that a long time ago, and I had a friend of mine, Marbuck, on the show, and he was telling me that and that what they would do is have nets across the water, and they were inspired by the um Southern Cross spider that makes its webs across the river. And he was saying actually, at least the mobs he knows of, they would actually lay their nets on top of the water. So as the birds flew down and landed on the water to get away from the bird of prey because the birds of prey don't like getting on the water because they don't have the same waterproofing that the ducks do, and the geese and so forth, they would then pull the nets up. But it's amazing. I actually have a theory of where the return returning boomerang came from as well. Because I've made some boomerangs with community, and you have to heat treat them over the fire, over like a the hot fire, and that's because the thinner parts warp and in the they dry quicker than the thicker parts, and it causes them to warp because they shrink. Yes, and that warping will create that natural kind of turn that you get that makes them return. So I would think it was just a trial of errors where they were they weren't cooking them before over the fire, and yeah, they were just creating that returning. But yeah, it's so funny that there's such a a deep history or a deep connection to Australia and the boomerang and the rest of the world recognizes it, but they only know know it as a toy, they only know it is the kind of yeah, neo-traditional.
SPEAKER_00Yes, it's a little frustrating because I have to deal with that that um ignorance in comments quite regularly on the channel. People say, Oh, um, I thought they came back, you know, or and or um you know, watch out, it's gonna come back and get you the back of the head or and have to correct them. No, it's for just hunting only, and this is a very common one, and everybody knows about in Australia, but not many people know about it abroad.
SPEAKER_01For sure, yeah. Yeah, and uh I mean they are common across Australia, but also again, like there, as we you were saying with the Kimberly singer, there's different styles. There are some areas that it wasn't very common in the centre right here. They more traded for them in history, they didn't make them as much themselves, and it was more of something that was across the northern coast and around the edges that really where they had more time to focus on arts and crafts rather than straight up survival because it's slightly easier to live by.
SPEAKER_00Uh yeah, that makes sense.
SPEAKER_01Like, have you seen the the ones that are a cross shape as well? They're like a like a cross that they throw, and there's like a few different wacky styles that everyone likes to try.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I've seen them. Yeah, they look like fun, but I've never thrown one.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, they look they look dangerous as well, you know. One comes your way. And uh the big crazy number sevens that are like fighting ones, the war boomerangs. Yeah. Yeah, they look very interesting. I definitely wouldn't want one of those coming my way. No, no.
SPEAKER_00Um they look heavy, so yeah, leg smashes, those ones.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I find yours really interesting because yours actually is so finely developed for a small game. It actually has a drop-off when it reaches 40, 50 meters, is that correct? Yep. A little bit less. Yep. And can tell us a little bit about your design process. How did you go about it?
SPEAKER_00Well, I gave the measurements to Benjamin, um, and he, of course, wood behaves differently and is lighter than polycarbonate. So he made it thinner about two-thirds thinner from top to bottom, and uh the same length and uh and pretty much the same width. So the design was very uh true to what I sent him. Um and it ends up being uh about two-thirds lighter and it I mean the one I use is essentially a lump of wood. It it has a very small uh gap of of time when it hits the ground effect and it's gliding. Um and that is because I wanted to go as straight and and short range as possible because I'm pretty my style is to kick rabbits out from bushes and and and hit them as they're running off, which is within 20 metres. I've I've only ever hit a rabbit um over 20 metres, I think, twice. So um this design though, because it's lighter, it it gives it a lot more, as in the colicarbonate one, gives a lot more possibilities for hitting a gliding ground effect for a longer period of time. So it um it will go straight to the ground for the first about 15 to 20 metres, and then it hits the um the effect where the the the ground acts the air just above the ground acts as a cushion and it flies on that. It's called the ground effect, and it continues there for about 30 metres or 25 to 30 metres, and then it will drift off being left-handed, it drifts off to the left, and then um you lose your accuracy after that point. It might go another uh 25 metres sometimes, um, but it's an inaccurate in in that 25 metres. So the first you know, zero to fifty or fifty to forty-five meters is spot on, it's dead, dead accurate. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Right. Really interesting. So how did you go about so your one is much heavier, is that right, than the polycarbonate one. How much does that affect stopping power? But also how much does that affect flight? Is there like a a ratio you're looking for where there's give and take?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it affects the dropping, it drops faster, my original one, and it drops out quicker. So I can only throw that uh about 40 metres maximum, and that that might hurt my shoulder. So I can uh whereas I can throw the the wazarang. I have actually done a uh a throw of almost 100 metres with that thing. And um that that was an unusual there's probably something happening with the wind as to why that happened. So usually I get about um about sixty to seventy metres, um, and then yeah, like I said before, fifty metres that is accurate. But um yeah, the wooden one it's it's not a glorious thing, and I probably could cut it down more, like take more m meat off it so it would travel a bit further and glide a bit better. But I prefer it how it is because if I ever hit a post it it's not gonna snap, it sort of chips off. But if I cut it down any finer, I know it's gonna break in half. Right. So I've had that one for about 20 years. What material did you make your what wood type did you make your original? I made that out of Strickland's gum or eucalyptus stricklandii. And it's a uh West Australian, it might be in South Australia as well, and it's uh flexible um and very hard. Um it's a dense wood, so it's not light, but it it will um uh it'll it's well I like it because I was using black box and whenever I hit anything with a black box it would snap in half, but if I hit something with the Strickland's gum, it just chips. So um I've settled on that. I'd think I'd rather mulga, um, but there's not where I'm from originally there's no mulga trees, so I've never experimented with it.
SPEAKER_01Interesting. And whereabouts are you taking the wood from? I'm I'm not imagining you're just taking a round slab of wood and cutting one out willy-nilly, are you?
SPEAKER_00No, my parents um before I was born, they went on a trip around Australia and collected seeds from different types of trees um on s in the southern half in the dryer areas, and then took them back to Victoria, and when Dad built the house, they planted all these different West Australian, South Australian trees around the property. And so by the time I was in my teens, all these trees were, you know, uh 15, 20 years old, and growing branches outside that were kinked, and and I was selectively uh choosing them to make my boomerangs out of.
SPEAKER_01How fortunate to have such an array of trees to to work with.
SPEAKER_00That's right, yeah, yeah. And they turned out to be the best ones, the Strickland's gum. There was other ones in there, um, but the Strickland's was just uh it was generally thicker and um a larger heartwood to work with.
SPEAKER_01Larger heartwood, because you do we we do have for any of our foreign listeners as well. We are eucalypts, they're very, very dense in the core. And you usually you might get, let's say for a branch, let's just estimate you'll get about seven or eight inches on a big branch wide of the heartwood. On top of that, on either side, you've you can get up to three or four inches sometimes in a in a bad one with a small, much smaller heart. You don't sometimes know what you're gonna get until you get in there, yeah, which can be misfor unfortunate. So you're just looking for a bent branch, which you think is going to have what about if there's branches coming off of that branch, how's that going to affect the wood?
SPEAKER_00Well, that can cause knots, and that um if they go in deep enough, yes, it will affect it, and you've got to discard it and get a new bedstick. So you just kind of hope. You cut it up and you hope that first uh s slice down the middle is gonna be um show up that there's no knots going in deep enough to affect uh into the heartwood part where you want to preserve your boomerang from or get it from.
SPEAKER_01So you're cutting it straight down the middle lengthways? Yeah. And what where are we going from there in the in the the design the design process?
SPEAKER_00So I can get usually um I'll always get two boomerangs out of one um length of wood, and sometimes three, depending on the how thick it is. And I'll get I'll take that slice and I will then uh cut it around, I'll I'll get a um like a blueprint put on top of it, or a previous boomerang, uh, draw around that, and then get the jigsaw, cut around that shape, and then I'll just use the belt sander and take it down from there. It's pretty quick.
SPEAKER_01Amazing stuff. Yeah, the belt. I I like a flapper myself, the flap grinder is my best friend. Yeah, I think so I'm unfortunate. I worked for some time with um Onidingo and his Camping on Country initiative, going out to remote indigenous communities and working with uh is men's mental, physical, social, and cultural health. But the the medium, the main medium used, apart from the yawning circles, which was fantastic, is um making artifacts and hunting and doing stuff like that with these remote indigenous communities. And a lot of them are purists, they're like, No, we've got an axe, as long as we can sharpen it, we're gonna use an axe. And I'm like, that's cool, but I've got other stuff to do as well as wanting to do this, so yeah, I I don't get as much time over the course of the camp to to make my artifact. So I had a flat grinder, yeah. I also had an electronic plane, which is marvelous stuff when you've got one to hand so you can just use, and people turn around super quick when they see me smashing one out over the space of two hours when it takes them like two weeks.
SPEAKER_00Yes, yeah, people turn around quick. Yep, yep, yeah. I've I've used the electric plane as well, um, just strictly for the bottom half. And um, yes, it takes that wood off so fast. I've I've never had the patience to try with an axe, so I've always had in the back of my mind. I thought, oh, maybe one day I'll give it a go, just see how long it takes, but uh haven't worked myself up till yet.
SPEAKER_01I see I I wanted to be a purist, and my very first camp, I just did one with an axe, but I had like camp duties, and you're just making sure like running stuff, making sure the swag's not broken, blah blah blah, whatever else. And I was trying to make one with an axe, and I got my I've got the first bout of tennis elbow I've ever had in my life from the repetitive strain of just trying to use an axe and keeping my arm in like that kinked boomer boomerang shape and just trying to axe my way through it. It's yeah, it was a lot of great. ruling work so I went over to the flat disc and never looked back. Right. I don't think I've used an accent. Amazing stuff. So we're you're looking at a boomerang so you've got a nice flat bottom. What's the the rest of the boomerang looking like?
SPEAKER_00How's that well so you have your um you know top of the airport airplane wing look. So you have that uh I guess an arc. So um the reason for that is you have um it's you have the wind going over the top of your the arc and the and the wind going underneath as you cut through the air. So that creates a draw. So because the as the wind goes over the top it has to travel further. And then where the wind has to travel further that creates a vacuum and that pulls up the boomerang into the air as as it's just growing along horizontally and then as as opposed to underneath where it's flat and then it's just cutting through as per normal. So that gives a a bias to the upside and pulling it up against gravity.
SPEAKER_01Right amazing so it's it's aerospace engineering 5000 years ago. Amazing stuff. And so the curve that always points forward right and that acts like like a bit of a rudder.
SPEAKER_00I'm imagining that's what that uh It's quite complex how the things actually work. Uh Benjamin Fathrostix does a better job explaining than me so I'm just I'm stealing from him here. But uh he what happens is as the as it's going on there's that other effect that I was talking about before with it it being sucked up then there's a ground effect as it gets close to the ground it hits a cushion and this happens um in with pilots utilize this and birds utilize this you'll see birds coming down onto the water say a duck or something and they'll just glide and you'll just see them staying at the same height. Well that's called the ground effect before they land. And uh so there's that in play and on top of that they may even etch airfoils in the top of the boomerang to create more drag. So you'll see those more elaborate patterns. The furrows that go from yeah one end to the other and then um as as it spins it uh and starts to slow the rear of the boomerang or what becomes the rear every time it turns around starts to drop and the front starts to lift and that creates further uh wind resistance on the front part which then gives it more of a lift again. So there's several factors helping them fly.
SPEAKER_01That is amazing I had no idea because I just took those furrows that run those that that kind of pretty standardized design of the grooves that they run all the way from one side to the other as as design. Yeah. But that has that has a dragging effect isn't what you're saying. It has it as a reason Wow yeah and now you can tell me all day every day about the you know the idea of you know how something can be developed of through trial and error and this and how anybody would have noticed the effect of those furrows and then applied them and that just be a trial and error and there'd be no scientific process other than trial and error behind it is fascinating to me.
SPEAKER_00Well it's the same as what happened to me when I had my uh first boomerangs and I was making them all the same on each side and then one uh snapped one end snapped and then I threw it and noticed it went straight. So that was just a trial and error and that became my new design from that day on. So how big is the wazerang tip to tip? It is I think it's 43 centimetres. It's not very big. Oh wow yeah not very big at all.
SPEAKER_01Why did you choose because you were I don't know I you would assume maybe a less long larger boomerang gives you a bigger surface area and more weight when you hit the animal. Why did you opt for a smaller style boomerang?
SPEAKER_00It is lighter so easier on the shoulder and I've had a recurring shoulder injury that I'm trying to nurse while I'm throwing and the large boomerangs would just expose that injury I learnt on the smaller one and I developed smaller because of the style of hunting that I was doing as well. So I would hunt in an area of a dry uh lake and it had a lot of whorehound bush which is sort of uh about knee high and maybe up to metre across and the rabbits would be sitting in squat spots and I would be going out there and kicking the bushes or um uh the the dogs like use little jack russels to to flush them out and I didn't have much time to get a swing back and forward before they'd dart off into the a burrow or another bush so I had to create something that was very quick to flick and so there couldn't be a lot of uh you know like inertia stuff problems going on with a large boomerang I just couldn't get it to the rabbit quick enough so I had to use something I could just quickly cast and um pick them up that way.
SPEAKER_01Wow amazing stuff so you use dogs to flush as well interesting yeah never hit a dog either. I was just wondering I could you could come up into some issues with that but yeah no yeah good stuff. Yeah why is it that you chose to specialise it just the the love of history or just because it did it just the code what would what was it that drew you to the boomerang?
SPEAKER_00Well I grew up watching Bush Tucker bean like a lot of Australian children in the 80s and um loved like Les Hidden's is like one of my big big heroes and um he would be often spending time with you know Aboriginal people at Bush and I just wanted to be like them. You know I thought I I'm gonna they're obviously throwing the odd boomerang around I'll do that too and I used to go out looking for Bush Tucker and even though it was in southern half of Australia the bush tucker was very different. I still liked to play those games growing up and then I thought well um I was just attracted to the boomerang I was a I I like throwing and I played a lot of uh tennis as well and the this the style and the motion of throwing a boomerang is very similar so that just uh how it developed that way.
SPEAKER_01Amazing. Is that how you did your shoulder tennis? Yes it is you know what I find it to be the most dangerous sport in the world for how many of my friends are injured and how many of them are injured by tennis. Yeah yeah ankles rolled ankles and bumble shoulders elbows. There's literally an injury named after it the tennis elbow. Yes that's right it's phenomenal guys get into MMA or something is so much so much easier on the body. Very very good.
SPEAKER_00So you say that when you're hunting them you're hitting them on the fly is that right in in what percentage of cases how many still shots do you think you're getting is it mostly on the fly yeah yes uh I haven't hit one I have to be honest for many years because the conditions at the time when I was hitting them as a as a mid to late teen were different to what I've got now I had uh access to a lot more rabbits so I was getting a lot more practice of um genuine hunting practice not just target practice and it's it's very different. So um because there were more rabbits more of them were at f at your feet. So I was hitting them between the five and fifteen meter mark regularly and I could I had it down to one in every six throws was a kill. Wow um I hit a hundred I think it was a hundred and fourteen or a hundred and twelve I can't remember um rabbits in a three year period and only two were injured the rest were outright kills by the time we went to grab them.
SPEAKER_01That's sensational.
SPEAKER_00So I'm not sure what happens in the body when when they hit but it it it um apart from it crushing bones it always kills them. It sends us a shockwave through the whole body and they just they're just dead.
SPEAKER_01Oh wow yeah yeah I mean they aren't the hardiest of animals when they actually feel a trauma rabbits they check I I mean I've known them to die of shock from I've shot them with a gun and just the I I've I think the sound of the gunshot is enough sometimes to shock them to death. They're uh they're not particularly robust but they are fast. Yes. So to be getting that many one out of six is that's crazy.
SPEAKER_00Yeah they're I mean they're not going really fast within that first 15 meters um but they're accelerating so you have to you know calculate that in um but because of my experience with tennis and you're always focusing on a moving target that ball is moving it's very very similar uh mind um agility or or you know intelligence needed for the for that type of um guesswork to to throw it there and you're gonna they're gonna meet up over there type of thing.
SPEAKER_01It's so true that so many sports they do transfer into other aspects of life. Yeah and it's wonderful to think that being good at a ball sport when you were younger or being an avid fan of that sport can make you a a solid hunter later in life. Yeah yes so yeah guys if you think that there's no point in doing tennis or playing basketball you never know when you're gonna need it for survival. Yeah. Crazy stuff. So how do you go about training? You said practice is very different to hunting. How do you go about training?
SPEAKER_00Is there anything you can do for for training especially hitting animals on the fly well you do have to just train for hitting something that's still to start with say get your form right and get a general um pinpoint accuracy um and learn to discipline yourself to really focus on the target and and uh pick it up. But uh to throw out a moving target I one of the things I do is I just roll a ball. And because a lot of the time the rabbits are coming out from under your feet anyway. So if you just roll a ball that's fairly um similar to what happens in the world. And then um just throw it while it's still moving. And another one is I'll get somebody else like I've got a lot of children and I've teenage sons so they can uh get a like a bottle with a rope and they're a good length rope and they'll go for a run or put it on their bike and then as they go past I'll throw it at that bottle. So it's a pretty simple technique um bit crude but does keep my eye in and um it's uh i it's it's not as unpredictable as a as game but it's as best best I can do.
SPEAKER_01Amazing yeah no I mean it definitely works and yeah it keeps uh keeps the kids on their toes as well yeah very good um so when you're talking about throwing what technique are you using? How do you throw a boomerang?
SPEAKER_00So well for the mind is a good place to start so I when I'm pr doing target practice I use visualization. So if just before I throw it I see myself throwing it and hitting the target because then you have uh your internal goal and then I guess it works in a lot of areas of life. But if you don't have that goal then um you miss the the the grouping is a lot wider. It always happens like that. I don't I don't know why but um even if you're looking at it and and trying your hardest if you don't do that thought process first you just are not as accurate. So that's the first thing. The next is um your footing and if I ever slip or if I put my toe down a little bit of a hole or um any sort of uneven surface I'll it's a guaranteed miss. And then so your stance comes into that I then um a wide stance sort of more of a classic I suppose tennis uh player stance when they they do a forehand and then um it's a twisting it's a very much usual core muscles with uh you know your transverse muscles through the core because you're twisting the body from one side to the other so being left handed I start you know twisting towards the left and finishing twisting towards the right and then um I'm throwing horizontally the the boomerang has to travel flat and and parallel with the ground and I'm aiming to get it down to the ground fairly quickly so it could pick up that ground effect and start gliding. So I'm bending my knees quite a lot um to get that uh effect happening sooner rather than later. And then so just the standard sort of follow through with a say if you're throwing skimming a rock is probably the closest action you could probably have to throwing a boomerang. Where you want to get that um rock staying flat so it can skim across the water. It's like you're skimming the boomerang across the ground.
SPEAKER_01Very cool yeah so you would you consider that a hundred percent instinctive or is there some sort of aiming principle are you you're putting your arm up first, engaging is would it be a hundred percent instinctive do you think?
SPEAKER_00It when you're throwing at a a rabbit or anything that's on the run, it has to be a hundred percent instinctive has to be coming straight out of your subconscious. You don't you shouldn't be thinking about form, um feet, you name it, it has got to be a hundred percent automatic because you don't have time to think when that rabbit's you've got a three meter window to hit that rabbit and um and then you just got to hope for the best.
SPEAKER_01Yeah right yeah we are actually not far from ground zero for rabbits so supposedly the first rabbits were released in Geelong which is a couple of hours west of here. Reports change it was about 40 rabbits and now there's 200 million 200 billion rabbits on it I can't remember what the last the last number was there's there's quite a few of them around and it's it is definitely important work to try and reduce those numbers.
SPEAKER_00And they're breeding up again too because they released the first virus to knock them uh when was it? It was the 30s or I don't know I can't remember when they did it but um yeah they're they're out of control in Australia hundreds of millions of them everywhere and just um it's I think it's seven rabbits or is it nine rabbits uh to one sheep's worth of feed. About seven yeah so um it was worthwhile for a virus to be brought here and and eradicate them but uh then that became you know they became resistant to that and then in the 1990s they released a new virus and then they released another one when that one started to wane called Khaliesi II and now they're trying to develop another one again because they're becoming resistant to the Chaleesi viruses and um they're breeding up again in places like Melbourne and um there's there's almost miniature plagues now in places like Melbourne in some parts.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Certainly is I mean that is it it creates an issue in itself I mean mixed mitosis it destroyed the rabbit populations. When I was a kid in England there were rabbits everywhere it seemed they were really really commonplace and it was something that most kids were involved in you know going out rabbiting going out getting rabbits people would eat rabbits it was quite common especially uh definitely in the rural areas yeah they disappeared overnight and now they're bringing out Khaleesi's Khaleesi 2.0 I mean them becoming not only releasing these viruses willy-nilly it is only supposed to affect rabbits but who knows yeah but also them becoming resilient how does that change their genetics you know how does it change them they're becoming more resilient and then you know we can have like super steroid rabbits that are running around taking on foxes that scene well with that type of uh natural selection really what's going on so there's no from what I can understand there's no new genetics being created it's just that the ones who could withstand that sort of a virus they're the ones that survive and then pass on and breed up again.
SPEAKER_00So they're it's reducing their their gene pool in their own favour.
SPEAKER_01But that's how a a lizard becomes a dinosaur and how a dinosaur dinosaur becomes a chicken as well if if those if those genetics there anything's possible.
SPEAKER_00Yeah right for sure so have you attempted to hunt anything else apart from rabbits with your boomerang yes um hares and foxes um I've it's very rare well if I came across a feral cat I'd try that too but they're just so sneaky um I have thrown at two foxes and uh one was a very near miss but he actually saw me and saw me throw it saw the boomerang and he ducked so they're a clever animal a rabbit would never do that and I have yeah thrown at hares come very close to hares uh but there've always been shots have been a bit further away because they're such fast runners and they do sort of see you coming a bit so I've only ever caught the best best throw I did was a few months ago at a hare and I got within a few inches and he was about 45 metres away.
SPEAKER_01Because they're they're robust they're big animals coming like people it's like people don't realize the difference between the size of a tiger and a lion they're really big tigers are yeah and people when they they often people will be going along I'm in a car and they're like oh I think that's actually a hare I'm like no that is definitely still a rabbit when you see a hare you know you've seen a hare. Yes.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So they are is it just as effective for the stopping power?
SPEAKER_00Oh it would be yeah um hairs are fairly light boned um so uh they would quite easily smash them and I I grew up you know hunting hairs you know more conventional methods and they're a I guess you could say they're a fragile animal in one sense because they're a long distance fast runner so they've got to carry a lighter bone um as opposed to a fox I would say that my little wazarang would kill a fox given it it hits the right spot um but I'm not I can't guarantee it'd be a kill with a fox.
SPEAKER_01Right. Uh maybe a a bigger bigger boomerang. Yes. Yeah I've been around I've been been out on uh wallaby hunts and stuff like with boomerangs and the thing is they're actually really fragile and they're all neck and you know like between the neck and the shoulders they're all back sorry really they're all back legs but as far as the actual mass of a boomerang oh boomerang let me get my words out the far as the mass of a wallaby yeah when you've got past the back legs from there the up the ribcage is really small the top of the arm they've only got those little kind of T-Rex arms their head is super fragile one solid hit and it's all usually grown. And yeah if it's not dead already it's a quick dispatch thereafter. Yes yep yep but um yeah I don't fancy my chances using a boomerang or something like a pig. I think they're quite be a bit too robust maybe. I would say so yes yes uh do you have any other designs in the making?
SPEAKER_00Do you consider doing uh a Wazirang 2.0 with a I have thought of the Wazirang light um to make it more accessible again to uh younger people um because this one it can be thrown by adults and probably down to about I'd say uh uh like a 13-year-old boy um it'd be nice to make them more accessible to you know the eight to thirteen year olds. So yeah.
SPEAKER_01How do you think you go about doing that? And what is it about it that is makes it not child friendly it's a little bit heavy.
SPEAKER_00Um I've got a son who's twelve and he can throw it and get it maybe fifteen metres but it doesn't get that ground effect where it'll continue to glide. So it's probably just a little bit too too bulky for someone that age.
SPEAKER_01When you're putting it down to the the child's strength rather than their inability to master the technique.
SPEAKER_00Yeah yeah his technique is okay so interesting interesting stuff and how would you think you go about that'll be another conversation with Benjamin throw sticks right we'd have to come up with something new but yeah that hasn't even been uh it's not even in the pipe work so yeah that's just a pipe tree.
SPEAKER_01So uh it would have to be it'd be a great idea that the junior the junior rang because all of the available throw sticks they're all based on real like uh artifacts aren't they is that correct? Yep. Is that just did he just actually did he have a model when he just based his on other models or was he going on cave paintings or do you know how we went about?
SPEAKER_00Uh the I think every one of them uh a couple like the Wazzerang and another one are based on real life um historical boomerangs. Was the Wazerang based on any particular historical records or document any particular mobs and no but I did find out recently that it is very similar to some boomerangs that came out of South Australia in its design.
SPEAKER_01Is that correct?
SPEAKER_00Yep. Oh interesting what would they have been hunting with theirs do you think yeah the smaller smaller game there possibly things like bilbies and um you know the the the the small mouse supers are probably now extinct.
SPEAKER_01Yeah sure yeah anything small enough that a cat or a fox can get after it yeah in fact in fact it's funny I was talking to um some an an Ananou woman from the Uluru region and she was talking about cats and how they eat cats. I've spoken about this on the show before they they love feral cats. They don't eat domestic ones they're not good but they're the feral ones are good medicine and they use a boomerang. Right because they are very wily but because of the sand it's impossible for them to escape. So they'll run and they'll hide and they'll run and they'll and they'll try and evade but you just follow the tracks they just tie them up, bamboozle them, and then just yeah bonk them on the head with a boomerang okay. They're ready for dinner.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Uh so you have a YouTube channel. What are you documenting your YouTube channel? What's your YouTube channel called?
SPEAKER_00Was this Boomerang Adventures? And that is got two, I guess, aspects to it of uh the hunting side and then these how to throw a hunting boomerang side. And I just uh when I can, I go out and collect footage of myself throwing at uh mostly rabbits, and when I have enough to compile it and make a a few-minute show, I'll do that and and release it. And whenever I have an idea of how to throw uh a hunting boomerang in in a way that I haven't described before, I'll just get out for a day and I'll I'll shoot that and and put that together and uh release that video.
SPEAKER_01Amazing. Amazing. So you've got a wonderful resource that people can go to, they can see how you do it, how you're throwing, and you actually sell those boomerangs that they can give a get give it a go. Because that's one thing that you've got the almost the the the exclusive rights to, should I say? I don't know how to put it, but you cannot really purchase good quality throwing sticks that are that you can throw again when you get some that are props or toys or you know or their artifacts where you don't really want to be throwing them because they were made by some elder, you know, and it's more of a an heirloom artifact. Yeah. But you can you're pretty much the only person I think who actually sells a good quality throwing stick inside of Australia.
SPEAKER_00Yes, that wouldn't surprise me. I haven't come across anyone else. I don't think there is. Yeah, okay. For being in Australia, you'd think someone would have uh Yeah, capitalised on that now, but yeah, but no, I don't know why. Um like I was surprised that the only place I could get good quality ones was uh in California. It's crazy, isn't it?
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Yeah, buying boomerangs. Right. An Australian buying a boomerang from America. Yeah. Yeah, but he did come up with that great idea. It's is it polycarbonate?
SPEAKER_00Is that what it's the same stuff that Wright Shields are made out of.
SPEAKER_01Is that right? So you're it's gonna last a significant amount of time then.
SPEAKER_00You can throw it at a rock, point blank range and it'll chip um and maybe compress a little bit, but it'll basically maintain its shape.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Sensational stuff. So what do you think is the biggest mistake that beginners make when they start out when they're trying to throw a boomerang?
SPEAKER_00Hmm. Throwing too hard would be uh and trying to get a you know, an impressive looking throw, but that's that's natural for any sport. Uh I would say not uh bending your knees enough, not getting down low enough to the ground and not developing the proper cast style throw. So bending the elbow enough and then learning how to flick flick your wrist at the end. Um it it's more the I see people mainly just do like a a big archie sort of a throw, it's kinda like you would use a golf stick. It's not, it has to be a very bent elbow behind the head and a snap and and then a flick with the wrist at the finish, and that is how you to to release it. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Does it compare at all to throwing a frisbee back hand?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that would be a fair comparison. I think, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_01Because I'm just trying to get so the when you say because like you said, there is a a a grounding effect that it flies better when it is closer to the ground. Yeah. Yeah. So you're getting down and you're leaning back or going straight down, are you dropping weight or going back on an angle to get that?
SPEAKER_00I am yes, I would say leaning back a tiny bit, and then I guess you try to treat your body like a whip. And your feet is they're anchored to the ground and you're transferring the energy from your toes right to your fingers of the the hand that lets go. So um you're sending a wave from there and you load yourself up essentially like a spring. And then you uh the resistance to the spring is is the boomerang. And then as you are uh reaching the the point where you can't uh reach forward anymore, that's where you're letting go. And all that energy transfers, and you'll be throwing something at over a hundred kilometres per hour. Um I guess that's the best way I could describe it.
SPEAKER_01That's a great way. I mean, it's so it's kind of like throwing a good punch then, you know, like it stops at the feet, it doesn't start in the in the shoulder or the or the or the actual fist itself. That's yeah, that's amazing stuff. So is that the what it's clocked in at? You're getting a hundred Ks out of it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's about that, yeah, yeah. Um which is similar to say a a a a fast bowler in cricket or something like that.
SPEAKER_01Amazing. Have you ever tried getting one of those pressure pads and seeing how much it forces?
SPEAKER_00That that's that's my next That would be amazing to know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, please do let me know. That would be amazing.
SPEAKER_00And and one of those uh speed gun uh thing I had to see how fast they really are going, you know?
SPEAKER_01Well it's it's uh it's a king's birthday bank holiday, then I'm sure there will be a few guys on the motorway up there if you fancy go and see if they'll uh if they'll give you a hand. Um have you got any cool stories, cool hunting stories? Hmm.
SPEAKER_00Got a couple, I suppose. Um I my best throw would have been uh it was the 30 meter throw. No, it was with a a wooden one. Um I was about 17 or 18 years old. Um just heading back to the car uh after a hour or two hour hunting session, probably already had one or two rabbits in the bag and one came un from under my feet and but the second he did that he went past went over a bank and so I couldn't throw it at him. So I had to run up to the bank, which was about five to ten metres away, and then by the time I got to the bank, he was a good twenty to twenty-five metres away. And so I was standing on top of the bank and I threw uh as hard as I could, because I knew by the time I'd get to him it would be a a fair distance. And I w had a um I put a bit of pink tape on the top of my boomerang because I kept losing this one. I'd had it stuck down with a bit of sticky tape. And the sticky tape was lifting a little bit and as I threw it I could hear the sticky tape whizzing in the air. Anyway, the rabbit was a good I don't know, uh thirty degrees away from where I threw, and I had to make it to him. Um only if he didn't change direction. Would I knew it it would make it to him, but he kept that line and I was just waiting and hoping for about two seconds thinking he's gonna turn, he's gonna turn. And he didn't, and it as it landed on top of him, the the boomerang failed in the air and it just flipped a little bit, it lost its energy and couldn't maintain its its flight anymore. But that was perfect for hitting it right on the back of the head behind the ear, and it uh knocked him out and and crushed his skull a little bit. Um instant kill. Um when I scunned him later, uh it was just a little bruise and a slight crack of the skull at the back of the head. And uh that was my best throw. Amazing. Wow. And other ones, you know, 20 meter shots, uh uh couple of those. I had um several actually where I threw it and I didn't know I'd hit them because it all happened so fast. Uh one one time uh one came out from under my feet. I just very uh instinctively just pulled back through, um, barely saw it, and then I couldn't see where it went. I I I thought the rabbit stopped, but I didn't know if I'd injured it or or if it went down a hole in front of me. I spent a couple of minutes looking around and then I finally found that it curled up in a bush and had been hit on the back of the head and uh instant kill. Um that happened a few times.
SPEAKER_01How are you going about cooking your rabbits?
SPEAKER_00I haven't cooked a lot of rabbit, though I I have done it. Um I look I like to um I like to get the blood out of 'em because they do just taste better, so I I cut them up into thirds or or you know, maybe five pieces, put them in salty water, in the fridge overnight, the blood comes out into the water, tip the water out, and then I might crumb them and just fry them up on the on the pan.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, fair enough. Yeah, it's good to sometimes get a bit of that flavour out depending on what country they're in. Some people like a bit of saltbush with their in saltbush country with their rabbits. I'm not a massive fan. I think that the flavour of the rabbit doesn't compliment the saltbush as much as some say it does. Uh milk, poaching, like not poaching them, letting setting them in milk, the fat can draw out that flavour quite a bit. Okay. My next project, shall we say, the next thing I want to eat is a fox. So I'm gonna You game. Gonna cook a fox. Yeah, I know. Uh they're disgusting. Yeah. No, I've not had any. I've got friends that are pretty experimental when it comes to eating, and I've I've eaten lots of stuff. I haven't eaten a fox yet, and everyone I know who's eaten a fox is just like, yeah, I'm not ever doing that again. So my mission is to try and make it even slightly edible. Right. I've I've scan one fox for good reason. They do not smell good. Just uh yeah, I was actually out recently fox hunting and got a couple with a friend, and yeah, they uh the gun had already taken out. They weren't worth cooking data. They they'd seen a good good spat good scatter of shot, but um yeah, he was just like, no, we need to gut them now because they are gonna yeah. I um Euro mounted the skull, so I wanted to keep the skull on one. It's big his tooth was so big it was uh about the same size as a as a large dog. I mean you're talking about like an inch and a half, it was two inches of tooth. And the one of the canines, he had obviously had an infection and it had got rid of some of the the skull underneath of the tooth. It had been it was an old boy, like he was he'd seen a few years and he'd uh he'd avoided the guns for a while, but uh yeah, he just liked the smell of it. I was carrying it back on my shoulder because it was so big, it was like eight kilos of fox. Well, big fox. Yeah. Carrying it I had to go out on my shoulders, and the smell of it was crazy. Yep, yep. Pretty intense, pretty intense for sure. You said that you uh hunt rabbits by other means. You've been out with uh use ferrets sometimes, isn't it?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, I grew up with ferrets as well. Um my brothers used to head off on a Sunday every every once a month, I suppose, or even more during the cooler months, because I don't handle the heat and they the they uh will get taken by snakes sometimes, um as in fishing um in Australia. So um yeah, we we would go out, we'd have our warrens that we did sort of circuit on, and uh we'd we'd come home with however many rabbits we could carry. That's when we'd head home. And that'd be you know, seven or eight rabbits, and we'd just feed them back to the ferrets during the week.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, right. Oh, I've never thought, I'd never considered because obviously we don't have snakes in England, so I love a bit of ferreting, and I had ferrets for a while a little while ago because my neighbourhood had a terrible problem. I was trying to reduce the numbers. Okay. And I like making I made all my own nets and did all of that. And uh yeah, I just didn't think about snakes because I'm sure they like rabbit warrants, don't they?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, they hang out there, there's rabbits in there and they'll eat the babies.
SPEAKER_01So yeah, right. Have you have you lost a lot of have you lost money?
SPEAKER_00Lost one ferret one to a snake, to a tiger snake, and that was a bit sad because she was uh her mother had died when she was really little, so we brought we hand raised her and um so she's a very friendly ferret, and um then we we just were a bit late in the time of year when we went ferreting, it was getting warmer and uh because you know when you're ferreting you often hear the rabbits sort of screaming down in the burrow, and sometimes if it's close to the hole entrance, you can put your hand down and grab them. Sure, yeah. Um well I did that. Um I couldn't feel anything, took my hand out, but um after you know, after hearing the screaming, um, but the screaming was the ferret. And I realised I almost put my hand on the tiger snake.
SPEAKER_03Wow.
SPEAKER_00So because the the coils were coming out of the hole um a couple of seconds later. I thought, ooh, I nearly uh got bitten there. So and then yeah, dad tried to get a get it out with a bit of wire and it was too late, she would be bitten and uh the the snake took her down.
SPEAKER_01Well shame, yeah. But yeah, it's the the trials and tribulations of being any sort of animal in Australia when you've got those guys around. Yes. They don't mess around. Tiger snakes, they're they're well up there as far as potency of the metam. It's not yeah, a human's gonna struggle, definitely. A little little mustard like that's gonna have a lot of trouble.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, it's it was all over in a few minutes, I think.
SPEAKER_01But I mean only one, that's that's good, isn't it, I suppose?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, well um we we learnt not to to go out in the summer because of the snakes, as well as the fact the ferrets fit in the heat. Oh, they just can't handle it. And uh we had a ferret fit in the box one day and uh as in the carry box between uh holes and we we let him out and he was he was he was really aggressive, he was biting, he was going crazy. Um he bit me on the foot uh like on the shoe and I flicked him off and he we we were near a dam and I accidentally flicked him into the water and he tumbled around in the water and then we had to fish him out um and then he was on the bank exhausted and when he calmed down uh it had cooled him off, the water had cooled him off and he came back and came to and then we thought, oh, I don't think we'll do that again.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, fair enough. Yeah, that's fair enough. They are they're not from regions that have particularly hot times, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, crazy stuff, interesting. I'm actually gonna have a fet uh a ferreting man on soon. We're gonna talk about the wonderful world of ferrets and ferreting in the region, it should be fun. Yeah, um, so what I can't remember I was gonna say now um yeah, so you have your YouTube channel, you're doing some wonderful stuff. So, what was that? That was Waza's Adventures, is that right?
SPEAKER_00Waza's Boomerang Adventures.
SPEAKER_01Waza's Boomerang Adventures spectacular. Where else can the people find you?
SPEAKER_00Um also on Facebook and Instagram under the same name. And uh when I get around to it, I'm I'm send out emails too, so. Oh wonderful.
SPEAKER_01Have you whereabouts can they purchase one of your spectacular boomerangs?
SPEAKER_00Um from Wasis Boomerang Adventures uh dot com. And uh yeah, it's uh the the only one I have there is the Wasarang. Um I am working on getting more models as well, uh, which I know some people would like, but um the shipping costs are prohibitive, so I've got to have big, big orders, make a big order to make it actually financially viable to get them in. So that that isn't in the um in the planning to to get more models available. Amazing. Well, I've actually purchased one of your Wazarangs.
SPEAKER_01I'm very much looking forward to it.
SPEAKER_00I've got it in next room ready for you.
SPEAKER_01Amazing. I can't wait. Waza, thank you so much for coming on the show.
SPEAKER_00No worries.
SPEAKER_02Thanks for having me on.
SPEAKER_01Thank you, everybody. We hope you enjoyed the show. Wherever you are, whatever time of day it might be, good morning, good afternoon, good evening, and good hunting.