"Is It Racist?"

Tammie Gray & Marsha Garziano

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:21

Welcome to the Ebony and Ivory Show, where we talk about everything except politics. Hello there. I'm Ebony. And I'm Ivory. Welcome to today's show. Trigger warning. Today's show may not be for everyone. And once I tell you the title, you'll know why. The title of today's show is Is It Racist? Um, I received an email a couple of weeks ago after the first podcast from a Caucasian female. And she was referencing when I said that sometimes people say I talk white. And she said maybe they're referring to A V E. Now y'all know what that stands for? That stands for African American Vernacular English. And I must not be black enough because I had no clue what that was. Me either, but well, learn something new every day, don't you? Yeah. So her question was speaking to me, she said, do you use AAVE when you're with your family at gatherings or just speaking with another black person? And I have to say, probably not, because I didn't even know what it was. And then she says, sometimes I find myself speaking without using is or are. Am I racist for speaking that way? Two things. I want to ask you, who are you speaking to or with when you talk that way? And the second is if you have to ask it, then it probably is.

SPEAKER_05 2:18

That's a good point.

SPEAKER_04 2:20

Yeah. So I had to do some, well, actually, we had to do some research on A V E because neither one of us had any clue. And so we're we're gonna give you a couple of words that um appeared on this list of AAVE words. The first one is ain't.

SPEAKER_05 2:44

I use that one all the time.

SPEAKER_04 2:47

But it's funny that it says it depends on the context and the person's trying to be portrayed. Are you imitating a black woman slash person?

SPEAKER_05 2:57

No way.

SPEAKER_04 2:58

I hey, I'm just telling you what it said.

SPEAKER_05 3:01

That's crazy. And then there's brah. Bruh. Oh my goodness, that's everywhere, even on t-shirts. Yeah. Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_04 3:11

Okay, this one's this is a good one. It says B, B-E, as in they be killing it. Oh. So what's funny is they give you the A V E version, and then they go over to what's supposed to be the correct. I have to tell you, it sounds more like white people. That was racist, wasn't it? Oh, Lord help us. So they be killing it. They said it means, wow. They are amazing.

SPEAKER_05 3:45

That doesn't make sense to me.

SPEAKER_04 3:47

Or wow, you rocked. Oh you say that, Marsha? No. You don't say that.

SPEAKER_05 3:54

No, I don't. These things are so ridiculous.

SPEAKER_04 3:57

Yes, it is. So here's another one. Chill.

SPEAKER_05 4:00

Chill. Well, now I'll say that sometimes, but you know what they say it means? What does it mean?

SPEAKER_04 4:07

This person can't seem to calm down. That's a stretch. I mean, it could be that you know. So here's a good one. Tell me if you know what this one means. To dip. To dip? Yes.

SPEAKER_05 4:23

The only thing I know about dip is dipping tobacco. My brother used to. Skull.

SPEAKER_04 4:34

I don't think it has anything to do with tobacco or ice cream cones.

SPEAKER_05 4:39

See, I didn't even think about ice cream cone.

SPEAKER_04 4:42

Now I know what this one means. And and I don't know if I may or may not have used it, but it means to leave.

SPEAKER_05 4:49

To leave.

SPEAKER_04 4:50

To leave. So let me give you the example they gave. And I'm gonna put your name in a sentence. Marsha and I were planning on leaving after the food was served. That now you know that sounds like us.

SPEAKER_05 5:01

It does. We always want to eat and leave.

SPEAKER_03 5:08

And I promise you I didn't make up that sentence. That was there. That was there.

SPEAKER_05 5:13

But now I have to I have heard you say something about dipping into grown folks' conversation. But that doesn't mean that's the difference. That's not no, not the same dip.

SPEAKER_04 5:26

No, not the same dip. That's the only dip I know of. That's the only one you know. Uh-huh. Uh let's see. One more. Extra.

SPEAKER_05 5:37

Extra.

SPEAKER_04 5:38

As in. You're being extra. Now I've said being extra. I haven't.

SPEAKER_05 5:44

I don't know that I've over the top. Well, that's I've used that term.

SPEAKER_04 5:49

You've used over the top. Yeah. That's not extra. That must be uh is that the white term? That must be a w e. Oh wait, no. W. I don't know. White American vernacular English. W-W-A-V-E. Lord help us. Oh the top. That's that's W-A-V-E.

SPEAKER_05 6:14

Yeah, we just create created something new.

SPEAKER_04 6:16

Well, that that's you know, sounds like somebody else did. I had to call Darius and say ask him if he knew knew what that was. Now, there's such a thing as um a professional voice and a voice that you use to talk with everybody daily. Yeah. And I don't think I would call it A-A-V-E.

SPEAKER_05 6:37

No.

SPEAKER_04 6:37

You know, because if I was a person that answered the phone, I mean, I've even heard you when your family members call you, and when the doctor's office calls you, a friend call you.

SPEAKER_05 6:52

What do I say?

SPEAKER_04 6:53

Well, one thing is when your friend calls you, you just loud.

SPEAKER_05 6:56

Oh, I am loud. You're very loud. I don't know why.

SPEAKER_04 7:01

And when a doctor's office calls you, it's like hello.

SPEAKER_05 7:04

Oh like it's really I'm being real sweet.

SPEAKER_04 7:08

Yeah, and we know that's come on now. So have you heard me using a different voice? No, honestly.

SPEAKER_05 7:20

I don't think so. I don't think I mean, um, let me think now. If you're calling maybe somebody that has to do, say, with this led project or something that you really need to get across to somebody, you might use a different kind of voice. Probably.

SPEAKER_04 7:43

And I think most people do. Oh, yeah. Yeah, we have our I mean, when you worked for the school system, was there a voice that you answered I probably you answered the phone? Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 7:53

So we all do, and I don't think that has anything to do with no, I think we're reaching on that one to say it's racist.

SPEAKER_04 8:00

I think so. But what about for show? For show? For show.

SPEAKER_05 8:07

I don't know about that one. And I don't think I use that one. I haven't heard you use it.

SPEAKER_04 8:12

It says absolutely, that's what it for show means. Absolutely. Or I agree, of course. Or you're welcome, or not a problem.

SPEAKER_05 8:22

I might say for sure. That's what I was gonna say.

SPEAKER_04 8:25

That sounds like for sure, but but uh I don't say for show. I mean, but anyway, so let's get to the yeah, that was the AAV, uh, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 8:36

We had fun looking those.

SPEAKER_04 8:38

Yeah, really. Remember, AAV means African American vernacular English. I mean, you guys probably know maybe it's because I'm around too many white people that I don't have a clue. You got too many white people. Yeah, that's you know, well, I guess I don't know, Marsh. So tell me some things that you think are racist or could be perceived as being racist.

SPEAKER_05 9:03

Okay, let me let me see here. Well, you know, the first thing that comes to mind is the generalizations.

SPEAKER_04 9:12

There's that voice.

SPEAKER_05 9:16

So I guess I do change my voice. But anyway, the first thing that comes to mind is are the generalizations that we make, the stereotypical comments that we make, um depending on you know, race, whether it be black, Asian, Hispanic, white, or white, yeah, exactly. But you know, they categorize a whole group people group and might say they're always lazy, they don't want to work, right? Um, you know, all those kind of things that are really not true because there's a lot of people that fit that description.

SPEAKER_04 10:04

And it doesn't have anything to do with color.

SPEAKER_05 10:06

No, no, it doesn't. You know, um so we have to be careful about those stereotyping people.

SPEAKER_04 10:17

I mean, as far as saying all white people are racist, you know, yeah. That's stereotyping. That is, it is because on the other side there are some blacks who are racist.

SPEAKER_05 10:28

Well yeah.

SPEAKER_04 10:29

But it's true, you know, and I and I understand um we I guess blacks have dealt with the racism for a lot longer than most people. And I know a lot of times they say you want to play the race card. Sometimes it's not necessarily playing the race card. Right. It is the race card. Um, you know, I was thinking about some things that people say that is racism. Um we're referring to, or sometimes people say she or he speaks well, or you're so articulate. Right. So why does it have to what is surprising about a black male or female speaking well?

SPEAKER_05 11:16

Or being well or well spoken personally before. I don't know. And most of the time it has been referring to a peop a person of color. Absolutely. Um, but yeah, that probably is something that might uh might be considered a little racist.

SPEAKER_04 11:38

Um yeah, yeah, saying those things. Okay, what about this one? Saying you're colorblind or you don't see color.

SPEAKER_05 11:51

What hell? I have never thought of that as racist until I kind of started hanging out with you and you said it it was that you felt a little offended by that.

SPEAKER_04 12:05

Because I feel like when you say you don't see color it's like you don't it's like claiming not to um what's the word? Acknowledge to see race, not to see the person's race, which can invalidate their life experiences or their lived experiences. And so you really can't see say I'm colorblind.

SPEAKER_05 12:30

Yeah. Well, really we should embrace each other's differences, even whatever absolutely, whatever nationality, whatever ethnicity, you know, well I I don't know, that just but you know, I guess we need to be careful too, because we don't want to make our brothers stumble.

SPEAKER_04 12:52

No, you know, no, and then you know, and all this boils down to um learning to have a conversation with one another. You know, if if something offends you, and it took me a while to get there, but I can tell you, you know, that sounded kind of racist. And not that you say things often. Right. I mean, hardly ever, but in the beginning when we first became. Yeah. And sometimes those are or what?

SPEAKER_05 13:27

Am I making you laugh? Yes. Oh, I'm sorry. Learn behavior. Yeah, well, let me mention one other one that um you brought you brought to my attention about um, oh no, I have plenty of black friends, you know. I'm not how can you think I'm racist?

SPEAKER_04 13:48

I got plenty of black friends, but I don't or not plenty of black friends. I have a black friend. A black friend. Maybe that was a black friend, because that seems to be a common response sometimes when you talk about a person being a racist. It doesn't matter who your friends are.

SPEAKER_05 14:09

Right. It doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_04 14:11

You know, making you I mean that black person could be your housekeeper.

SPEAKER_05 14:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:16

And and it may not be, but that's that is that for us, that's a racist statement. Because I'm not gonna come to tell you, oh, I have plenty of right white friends.

SPEAKER_05 14:27

Right, right. You know, and you just it's things I think we just need to be made aware of. Yeah. Just so that uh there's no offenses, you know. Um we're not supposed to say or do anything that would cause um people to be offended. Because why?

SPEAKER_02 14:50

You know?

SPEAKER_05 14:51

Right.

SPEAKER_04 14:52

So um, so another thing, I I I despise the N-word. I don't like it when anybody uses it. I think one of the things that get me is when I hear, um, and it's usually like teenagers, young white teenagers that are listening to uh uh rap music that has the n-word in it, and then sometimes they feel like they can use that word because it's part of the song.

SPEAKER_05 15:19

Well, you know, young black men use that term.

SPEAKER_04 15:23

Well, you're right. And just like I said, I'm good. No, I don't like it. No, because I have people fought long to not be called those degrading terms. Right. You know, derogatory terms. And so I just I don't care how you spell it. Yeah, whether you and whether you white, black, purple, or brown. And so that brings me to this word. Um, it's called uh a wigger. Wigger. W-h-i-g-g-e-r. That's supposed to be a white person trying to be black. Oh whatever that means. Is that a new term for you? Yeah, that's a new one.

SPEAKER_05 16:00

Yeah. A white person trying to be black.

SPEAKER_04 16:03

That's yeah, and it's just like seeing a black person trying to be white. Yeah, yeah. So it happens on both sides. Absolutely. You know, and and that's like calling a dr um identifying a black male as a thug. If he's not wearing a suit and a tie, blue jeans, saggy pants, and a t-shirt, he's a thug. We don't know what kind of degree that young man has.

SPEAKER_05 16:28

Yeah, you can't judge by appearances, right?

SPEAKER_04 16:32

No. I mean, I don't particularly like the sag in pants, but that doesn't make a person a thug. Right, right. You know.

SPEAKER_05 16:40

So do you have any other examples like that?

SPEAKER_04 16:44

Um, one of the things is you're talking about on the other side, on the flip side, white trash.

SPEAKER_05 16:50

Ooh, eek. Sorry I asked.

SPEAKER_04 16:55

And and along that lines is is trailer trash, you know. Okay. That's another term. And neither of which I use. Of course. It's not. What about you? You have some that you've heard that could possibly be offensive.

SPEAKER_05 17:09

I've heard the word cracker.

SPEAKER_04 17:12

Oh.

SPEAKER_05 17:13

It isn't that one. Yeah. Well, you know what?

SPEAKER_04 17:15

And that's just as bad as using the N-word.

SPEAKER_05 17:18

I agree. It's I agree. Help us. Help us, Lord.

SPEAKER_04 17:23

Our mouth can get us in trouble, and our mouth can say things that can hurt people's feelings. And you remember when you were growing up, they'd say sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt. That's not true. Because you can heal from the sticks and the stones. Those words take a long time to heal from if you heal from them ever. That's very true. Words can be very, very hurting or hurtful, I guess I should say. Yeah. Very hurtful.

SPEAKER_05 17:49

And it's deep.

SPEAKER_04 17:51

Yes. Scars. Yes. Yeah. Yes. So I'll tell you one that um my boys probably got. You're so tall, I bet you play basketball.

SPEAKER_05 18:04

But I think people would say that to white kids too. Oh you don't think that's racist, do you?

SPEAKER_04 18:10

Well, more times than not, you know, it's assumed that all black boys play sports.

SPEAKER_05 18:18

Well, I know that's true, probably.

SPEAKER_04 18:21

Mine don't have a sporting bone in their body.

SPEAKER_05 18:26

Well, that's right. That's right.

SPEAKER_04 18:28

You know, they like the arts. They like and I guess martial arts could be considered a sport, but basketball, football, you know, when they were younger, I made them play the City League just to try it. You know, because I wanted them to get some outdoor exercise. But I might even make Darius play it in middle school. Sorry, Darius.

SPEAKER_05 18:53

Sorry. But to me, that's anyway, it doesn't sound like it could be racist. I don't know why they would feel offended by that. But I guess you okay, go ahead. If you get asked that question enough.

SPEAKER_04 19:10

Yep. No, I can see maybe not being tall. Because I've asked girls, white or black, tall, you play basketball. Yeah. But more more times than not, they feel like that's the only way. And it's been said, you know, they feel like when somebody's in college, are you in are you going on a football scholarship or a sports scholarship? You know, and that's not always the case. That's very true. Very true. You know, we make so many assumptions.

SPEAKER_05 19:38

And that's when you get in trouble.

SPEAKER_04 19:41

Go ahead.

SPEAKER_05 19:42

You do get in trouble. Um well, there's one I know you've mentioned this about what some people do to little black children. They want to touch their hair. Oh my gosh. You know, or ask first they'll ask, but sometimes people will just touch their hair. What difference does it make? Yeah. So I and I don't know. I think it's mostly maybe kids, huh?

SPEAKER_04 20:16

No, adults do that. Adults do that. Adults do that. Adults will walk up and ask, can I touch your hair? Maybe not me necessarily, but I know um people it's been done to. And that is racist. Because nobody walks up to you and asks you, can they touch your hair?

SPEAKER_05 20:32

No, you're right about that.

SPEAKER_04 20:34

You know, and I that that's racist. It is. It is. And walking up to me and saying, uh, what was it? Girlfriend, you would have been jamming. That sounds like something.

SPEAKER_05 20:52

Because I probably didn't know it was racist.

SPEAKER_04 20:54

Because okay, why would you say it like that? If you weren't talking to me as a black person, who would you what would you say?

SPEAKER_05 21:01

I would I don't I wouldn't say the girlfriend part.

SPEAKER_04 21:04

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 21:05

But the jamming, I use that word and you keep telling me to quit.

SPEAKER_04 21:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 21:10

That I shouldn't use.

SPEAKER_03 21:12

Yeah, she shouldn't use it.

SPEAKER_05 21:14

But you wouldn't say girlfriend, right? No, and I wouldn't say it in that tone that you used. Okay.

SPEAKER_04 21:20

But but if you were talking to me, so why what's the difference? Yeah. You assume that that's the way that I converse.

SPEAKER_05 21:30

Yeah, that goes back to trying to um relate to my culture. There you go. And and you can't I can not, let me just tell you, because I have no clue about what all y'all have been through, what kind of insults or any of that. So I can't relate. I have no clue.

SPEAKER_04 21:56

I wish I could say I couldn't, but I can. I mean, s I can remember my boys being in elementary school and that was back in the 2000s. And one one of my boys being called the N-word. And imagine me having to explain that to him.

SPEAKER_05 22:18

Because he hadn't heard it.

SPEAKER_04 22:19

No.

SPEAKER_05 22:19

He didn't know what it meant.

SPEAKER_04 22:22

You know, and you could call it sheltered or what. We just didn't use that word. My mama despised that word. Yeah, yeah. Well, I can understand. And so do yeah now that I can understand. Yeah. I can relate to that. Yeah. Relate to that one. Um, but anyway. So there's also stereotyping white people. You know, and I said that, saying that all white people are racist. And there's one that's very popular, is the Karen. You know, the only females they refer to as Karen's are white women. Oh, okay. And it and it's supposed to be a person, a white female that gets angry or tries to mind other people's business. I don't know who came up with that term.

SPEAKER_05 23:05

Okay. I didn't realize it was supposed to be white, a white female, but yeah.

SPEAKER_04 23:10

Are you the Becky?

SPEAKER_05 23:12

A Becky? A Becky. Yeah. Okay. Yes. See, I didn't know that, but I agree. You can't say all people, all white people are racist. That's a generalization. It is. Well, the same as saying all black people are lazy or whatever.

SPEAKER_04 23:28

Yeah, we have we have racist on, but you keep going back to that black people are lazy. Is that what you think?

SPEAKER_05 23:34

I know that's not true. You're one of the hardest working women I have.

SPEAKER_04 23:41

Oh and another thing is is saying that um people, maybe not as much. You should talk about the people from the Appalachia Mountains. Did I say that correctly? Appalachia. Appalachia Mountains in the Alabama, talking about they come from incest or inbreeding. You know, billies.

SPEAKER_05 24:03

Sorry. I probably called them a hillbilly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 24:07

Forgive me.

SPEAKER_05 24:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 24:08

Forgive me, Lord. They all have. Yeah. You know, and and the term redneck. Um, there's so much that we say that is not is not Christ-like. And I don't think we even stop to think about what we say and how it would make the other person feel.

SPEAKER_05 24:27

I know, and that should be our first thought. And you know, the one scripture that keeps reminding me of that is being slow to speak, quick to hear. And what's the other one?

SPEAKER_04 24:45

Quick to listen. Oh, you said quick to slow to speak and quick to listen.

SPEAKER_05 24:49

Anyway, yeah. Slow to speak.

SPEAKER_04 24:52

Slow to anger. Slow to anger. Okay, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 24:55

But anyway, we don't, I don't, I I speak without thinking plenty times, and that's not good. Make assumptions, like Tammy said. So I just have to ask the Lord, help me, because my mouth runs away with things that shouldn't be said.

SPEAKER_04 25:15

And I'm glad that we can have those conversations. Yeah. You know, without being getting upset or whatever. Yeah. Um, we do, and I I said this before, we have to learn how to talk to one another, have those conversations. If we sat down and had conversations with people that look different than we do, different or differently? Differently. Differently than we do, then it may be less strife in this world.

SPEAKER_05 25:44

Maybe, yeah, I agree. You know, I mean, if we could just try to understand each other.

SPEAKER_04 25:51

Yeah, because you can't relate to what I've been through. Not at all. But understanding is is a different one of the scriptures that has always been um that I've always thought about, and it's way back when things really got heated up, was from Ephesians 2, 15. It says, by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regular regulations, excuse me, his purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace. Now, here we're talking about the Jews and Gentiles, but it we you we have to insert ourselves in there. Yeah, it says, and in one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. Jesus died on the cross for all of our sins. Amen. And if we think about it, we all came from the same bloodline. Yes, we did. Because we all started how Adam and Eve. Adam and Eve, you know, and says, but through him we both have ask access to the Father by one spirit.

SPEAKER_05 27:00

Yep. And that is, it's talking about Jews and Gentiles, but like you said, that goes for whatever two groups that are hostile towards one.

SPEAKER_04 27:10

Absolutely. You know, and and and that's like I don't want to insert the Hispanics here, you know, sometimes they say they're lazy, but they take jobs that other people won't. That's for sure. So we can't really call them lazy. And I've seen females on top of a house working in the heat. So we just have to be careful. So you have anything else to say? I think that's it. So we want to thank y'all for joining us today. If you have any questions or any topics you think would be good for us to talk about, you can reach out to us at mom to mini-o-m, lowercase i m-a-n-y at gmail.com. Isn't it 04? Oh, sorry, mom to mini04 at gmail.com. Thank you. Or you can reach out to us through messenger and do us a favor. Go like and follow our Facebook page, Ebony and Ivory. So we thank you guys for stopping by to listen. And we hope that you have a blessed day. Yes, we do.