Episode 6 "The Difference between Not Guilty and Innocent"

In Episode 6, the listener will find out why our justice system may not be perfect, but it is better than the alternative. Judge Small candidly explains the difference between innocent and not guilty. We also continue the story of True Justice.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:03

The Smoke and Gavel Podcast is now in session. I'm retired Judge Chip Small, who will preside over this podcast along with my bailiff Madeline Rose. We welcome you and ask you to join us as we take a look at our justice system from a unique, candid, and inside view. Maddie, what's on the docket today?

SPEAKER_01 0:23

Well, hello, Your Honor. Today you will explain the difference between not guilty and innocent. Then you'll explain why that is so important to not only the justice system but society itself. And then we'll continue the story of true justice. So, Judge, what is the difference between not guilty and innocent? Aren't they the same thing?

SPEAKER_00 0:45

As a defense attorney, I didn't care whether my client was innocent of the charges or not. All I cared about was whether the state could convince all twelve jurors that my client committed the crime beyond a reasonable doubt with legally admissible evidence. In other words, whether my client did it or not was irrelevant. Let me explain. Let's take the case of OJ Simpson, for example. Hopefully most of you listeners will recall that OJ Simpson was accused of killing his ex wife, Nicole Brown, and her boyfriend Ron Goldman. You remember OJ's defense attorney telling the jury, If the glove don't fit, then you must acquit. Indeed, the jury rendered a not guilty verdict. Does that mean OJ didn't kill his ex wife? Not at all. In fact, after the criminal case was over, OJ was sued for wrongful death. That case was a civil case where the burden is merely proving that it was probable, or more likely than not, that he killed them. And you don't need a unanimous verdict either. In fact, the jury decided OJ did kill them, so money judgment was entered against him. What does all that mean? OJ was not guilty. But he was not innocent either.

SPEAKER_01 2:09

So he got away with murder?

SPEAKER_00 2:12

Probably, but maybe not.

SPEAKER_01 2:15

Uh that's what it seems like to a lot of us.

SPEAKER_00 2:17

Well, you see, whether he was innocent or not didn't matter. What mattered in the criminal case was whether the state could prove that he did it beyond a reasonable doubt by legally admissible evidence. Since the civil jury found him liable, you could argue that he got away with murder. But the system worked. But if that were our system of criminal justice, then you'd have to agree that a lot of truly innocent people would end up in prison. With the system we have, some people actually commit the crime, get off scot-free, and that is troublesome.

SPEAKER_01 3:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:11

But what is more troublesome, what sticks in your craw deep down, is when a completely innocent person goes to prison. So thankfully, we live in a society where we don't have to prove our innocence. Rather, the state has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that we did the crime.

SPEAKER_01 3:31

Okay, well, Chip, I think it's time for our commercial break. How about you give that to us today?

SPEAKER_00 3:36

Okay, the Smoke and Gavel Podcast is sponsored by Judge Small Books and Gatekeeper Press, a full service publishing company empowering authors with complete creative control, professional guidance, and 100% royalties. Whether you're publishing your first book or your tenth, their team makes the process simple, transparent, and truly author-friendly. Listeners of the show can receive 10% off any publishing package with Gatekeeper Press. Just mention the code CHIPSMALL when requesting a quote or during your free consultation at gatekeeperpress.com.

SPEAKER_01 4:13

Alright, Your Honor. It's time for the next chapter of True Justice.

SPEAKER_00 4:18

Chapter 2. Until the tourist season begins, Lakeview is a sleepy town nestled along the shores of Cougar Lake, 30 miles north of Eagleton. At this time of year, other than responding to domestic squabbles and an occasional shoplifting, police focus on traffic enforcement. Sitting in his marked patrol car, Deputy Homer Hernandez takes a sip of his Mexican coffee, a rich, dark roast blend with a bit of cinnamon, cocoa, sugar, and a pinch of cayenne to give the sweetness some bite. It's his favorite wake-up brew. Today he is parked just north of town where the oncoming traffic can't see him until it's too late. Homer is concerned about what his younger sister told him the night before about Arturo Azul. Homer first met Arturo about three years ago at Eagleton's Youth Center when Arturo was 15 years old. Homer saw something special in Arturo that reminded him of himself when he was growing up. When Homer was in middle school, his older brother was killed in a gang fight. After that, Homer was determined not to get involved with gangs. Like the Arturo he knows, Homer was a good student. He eventually attended Franklin University, majoring in criminal justice. He became a Franklin County Deputy Sheriff soon after graduating. That was almost ten years ago. Homer is the epitome of a caring and generous officer, equally beloved by the Hispanic and white communities in Franklin County. Known especially for assisting at-risk youth, he oftentimes helps troubled teams overcome addiction and supports them during recovery. But his main off-duty focus is counseling wannabe gang members. The last time he saw Arturo, Homer was convinced he was getting through to him. As Homer takes another sip of his special blend, a silver and black motorcycle roars past him heading north. His radar detector displays fifty-three miles per hour. The speed limit is only 30 miles per hour due to the meandering nature of the shoreline road. Homer immediately flips on his wigwag lights as he accelerates after the biker. Coming around the curve, Hernandez calls in the license plate number. On the straightaway, he can hear the high pitched scream as the bike accelerates. The more powerful cruiser begins to gain on the offender. Dispatch advises the Suzuki GSX 250R motorcycle is owned by Jose Azul. Homer knows he's Arturo's father. No traffic infractions of record for Jose, but his son's driver's license status is suspended. DWLS is a criminal offense. By the looks of the driver, Homer knows he has probable cause to arrest Arturo. Shit, Arturo exclaims as he sees the patrol car in a side mirror. Not now, I've got to get to Lupe. Pull over, Arturo. Don't make things worse for yourself. Passing the orchard by Lupe's home, Arturo makes a hard right turn. Sliding on the now dirt road, he loses control of the bike. As it skids onto its side, Arturo hangs on until it almost comes to a stop. He jumps free of the bike and dashes into the orchard. The deputy slows his vehicle and watches the rider taking off into the orchard. Before exiting his vehicle, he contacts Dispatch and advises that he is at a residence at 1953 SR 120, Lakeview, in foot pursuit of the driver, Arturo Azul. In this chapter, we learn about Deputy Hernandez and Arturo Azul. However, we're left wondering about how the deputy's pursuit of Arturo will end. And who is Lupe?

SPEAKER_01 8:13

In our next episode, we'll continue reading True Justice, and because I am so into true crime, we're going to begin to get some of the stories of the truly evil people that Chip Small has known. And I know that he's known some truly evil people as a judge for 27 years in the Pacific Northwest.

SPEAKER_00 8:32

Thanks for listening today. We hope you enjoyed this episode of the Smoke and Gavel Podcast. To learn more, visit judgesmallbooks.com. Don't forget to like, subscribe, and share to stay connected. Until next time, God bless.