The Spark Factor with Torri Silver
Welcome to The Spark Factor with Torri Silver. It's the podcast where conversations ignite new ideas, spark new energy, and fuel new momentum in the workplace.
The Spark Factor will feature prominent experts, thought leaders, change makers and strategists. Examining important topics, including self-fulfillment, professional development, connection and enlightenment, the weekly podcast gives listeners actionable strategies to thrive in their careers.
The Spark Factor with Torri Silver
Wired for What’s Next! Change, AI, and the Future of Work with Dr. Britt Andreatta
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In this thought-provoking episode of The Spark Factor with Torri Silver, Torri sits down with Dr. Britt Andreatta, an internationally recognized thought leader whose work brings together leadership, neuroscience, psychology, and education.
Together, they explore what happens when the pace of change exceeds our ability to adapt—and what individuals and organizations can do to navigate disruption more effectively. Dr. Andreatta shares powerful insights from brain science, including why change can trigger stress and survival responses, how change fatigue can contribute to burnout, and why strong leadership and clear communication matter more than ever.
The conversation also takes a timely look at artificial intelligence and the workplace. Dr. Andreatta discusses how AI can be a valuable tool to support human potential while emphasizing the importance of protecting critical thinking, judgment, creativity, and ethical decision-making.
From her unique journey from competitive ice skating to becoming a respected expert in leadership and neuroscience, Dr. Andreatta also shares insights on purpose, meaningful work, belonging, and the importance of finding stability in the midst of constant change.
Whether you're a leader guiding others through transformation or an individual navigating uncertainty in your career and life, this episode offers practical strategies and fresh perspectives to help you manage disruption, reduce burnout, and stay grounded while moving forward.
To learn more about Dr. Britt Andreatta visit www.BrittAndreatta.com. Use the links below to discover new tools and insights to grow and reach your full potential:
Hi everyone. Welcome to the Spark Factor of Tori Silver. I am Tori Silver, and I want to extend a heartfelt welcome to Dr. Britt Andreata for joining me today. I am super excited about this conversation.
SPEAKER_01I'm excited to talk with you, Tori, as well and also connect with all of your listeners.
SPEAKER_00Yes, I'm so glad that you're here. So I want to do an introduction of Dr. Andreata. Dr. Andreata is an internationally recognized thought leader who uses her background in leadership, neuroscience, psychology, and education to create science-based solutions for today's workforce challenges. Dr. Britt, as she is known in the industry by her clients and her colleagues, is the CEO of Brain Aware Training and a former chief learning officer or CLO for Lynda.com, which we now know as LinkedIn Learning. That is huge. She has over 10 million views, 10 million views worldwide of her online courses and is the author of several best-selling books on the brain science of success, including Wired to Grow, and then I have this one, Wired to Resist, Wired to Connect, and Wired to Become. Yes, I'm gonna be wired. I'm super, super wired. Um, she is frequently named a top 10 influencer and regularly consults with organizations on leadership development and learning strategy. Dr. Britt, welcome again. Super excited about this conversation.
SPEAKER_01Thank you. And it's as an author, it's always so fun to see my books out in the world because you know, when you write them and you send them out, you hope people will read them. And it always excites me when I see people actually holding a copy. So thank you for your business.
SPEAKER_00Yes, um, always looking to um learn new techniques and tools in my business. I do a lot of uh change management and learning and development in my full-time work. And so always looking to add to um my bookshelf where I can, you know, sharpen my skill set to better support my clients. Me too. I'm another reader as well. So yes, I cannot wait. So these are gonna be my new favorites that I have on my bookshelf that I'm gonna be leaning in on to better support my folks on the job. Thank you. All righty. So I want to get started. Um, I am a person who um made a huge transition um, you know, at the tipping point of my career, going into 10 years in my career after undergrad. And so I'm always fascinated by people like you, Dr. Britt, who make significant transitions. You initially started out as a competitive ice skater. Want to talk a bit about what sparked your interest in this field?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so I mean, I was an ice skater in, you know, in elementary school through high school and, you know, skated in Lake Placid and Colorado Springs, but I had an ankle injury. So that kind of just ended that dream abruptly. And then I went off to college. And um, I had a pretty typical undergraduate experience, kind of finding my way, finding what I was good at. I ended up being a double major in sociology and communication. And I got a master's in communication and media. And then I got a job at the university where I was running orientation programs and first-year programs. And then it kind of landed on my lap that I needed to support the leadership development program. And so that was really my first interest in it. I took over a course that someone else had designed and I started learning all the leadership theories, and it really sparked my interest. So then when I decided to get a PhD, I studied education, leadership, and organization. So I was really looking at that intersection between learning and leadership. And I stayed at the university for many years, did a lot of great things there. But at some point I realized I was kind of done with this stage of life, 18 to 22-year-olds for the most part, was our population. Um, and so that's when I made the leap over first to another university. And there I realized, oh, I'm kind of done with higher ed, but I still love leadership and education. So that's what took me to lynda.com where I became the chief learning officer and I brought leadership training, both to the employees. We were about 500 employees at the time, but um the employees loved the content so much that we started putting my courses, they would film me and we'd put the courses in the library. And that's when I started to get a much wider audience for um kind of the way I view leadership. And it was during that time that I got interested in neuroscience. And that's when I started bringing in the neuroscience lens and wrote the first book, Wired to Grow, which is all about the neuroscience of how we learn and and gain new skills and become better. So that's a little bit of my journey. I stayed there for several years, went through the LinkedIn acquisition, and then that's when I launched out on my own and started. I'd been consulting for a while, um, but that's when I really started my own big business.
SPEAKER_00Wow, that's an interesting story um hearing about your journey. Talk a bit about um, you talked a bit about um how you initially started to develop um Wired to Grow. Talk a bit about how it's grown into a series, a collection of books and how you know.
SPEAKER_01Well, I didn't intend for that to happen. So I wrote Wired to Grow, which was all about learning and building great training and all of that. And then we were acquired by LinkedIn. And at the time I was certified in all the change management programs, and none of them explained what we were going through. None of them were helping. So since I'd just written the other book, I was like, huh, I wonder what brain science says about change. And, you know, I'm a very curious person. So I oftentimes just follow my own curiosity, and then I'm finding all these amazing nuggets and and helpful tools. And then that I I first usually put things out as a presentation, and then if people are loving it, then it becomes a book. So that became book number two. And it was around that time that I thought, huh, I guess maybe I'm doing this. I'm gonna be the person that translates, you know, all the academic and research studies into real world business applications. So that lent itself to the next big topic, Wired to Connect, which is all about um teams and collaboration and inclusion and belonging, all that research. And then during, and then we went into the pandemic and I saw everyone, all the clients I was working with, as well as myself, we were going through a shared global trauma and also a huge values clarification around what is our purpose, what is our meaning. And so that led itself to book number four, which is Wired to Become, which is all about purpose and meaningful work. Um, and I bring a neuroscience lens into all of them because we are biological beings and parts of our biology are really designed to operate in the world in certain ways. And yet sometimes work settings are actually set up against how our biology naturally works. So I really like to help people understand the why and some of this information, but I translate it into here's what you do tomorrow when you go to work. Here's some practical tools. Um, so yeah, I've really enjoyed that journey of curiosity for myself and the fact that people have found a lot of value in these books.
SPEAKER_00Wow, that is amazing. Um, one of the things that you talked a bit about, and I've seen, you know, um offline and doing research and then having the discussion, we're talking a bit about um you talked a bit about the pandemic, which was um, you know, six years ago, where I think that people initially started to feel maybe a lot of, you know, disruptions sort of overnight, right? And um now in the, you know, in the past year and a half, um, it seems like we're sort of back in that space where um, you know, we are experiencing massive disruption, you know, be to, you know, you know, be it, you know, contributed to um, you know, layoffs or terminations or um, you know, or AI. Talk a bit about um, and and you've had so much experience working in academia and then working with your clients. Talk a bit about um what we're seeing in today's workforce and organizations and maybe some concerns you have with regards to the disruption that's happening now.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I know that's a great question. You know, I'm very fortunate and grateful that my consulting practice now and my business works with a lot of corporations around the world. So I work from with government organizations, large national corporate international corporations, smaller nonprofits, NGOs. So I really get to see the gamut of what's happening across my clients because they represent lots of different types of business and industries. But humans are humans, right? We have not changed biologically in 300,000 years. So we show up a certain way, and yet technology has exponentially and rapidly changed. And it's become clear that we have now entered an age where technology has outstripped human capacity. That's part of why we're feeling overwhelmed, is that, and particularly with the AI models that came on board just in the last couple of years, it's really accelerating. Um so now it's not about can we keep up with technology? We cannot. Technology has outstripped our capacity. It's really about how do we merge and marry human biology in useful ways with technology and not let technology overrun what makes us uniquely human. Because while some of these uh, you know, some of these artificial intelligent platforms and programs are amazing, they also don't have human instinct, they don't have intuition, uh, they are knowledge models, but they don't necessarily have expertise or wisdom. And so I'm a firm believer that it's really we're at this time now of like maintaining what makes us uniquely human and the skills and gifts that no machine could ever do, and yet utilizing some of these um machines and platforms to make our lives easier. It's not going very well though. So part of it is just like we're in this messy period of time. I have a lot more to say about AI, but let me kind of get back to your original question, which is yeah, we're living through a time of a lot of disruption, a lot of change. And so part of what we all need to get better at is managing ourselves in the face of that. So it's change management as a human skill, adaptability, self-regulation, right? Being able to just manage and monitor your emotions because these waves of changes and this amount of disruptions probably not going to get is not gonna end, but we cannot, we can work on not being so thrown by it, right? We can have a very triggered reaction to it, a tense reaction to it, or we can have a calmer approach and bring our critical thinking, make some decisions, make some choices. Um, and right now that's the part that's a little bit messy, is that our skill for handling the pace and disruption levels of tech is not matched with what's being thrown at us. So the skills need to shift a little bit.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's interesting that you say that because um I I feel like as an individual, I like to say that um, you know, I sell change for for a living. I'm a change professional, and then I do L and D, then I do a little bit of org design. But just seeing um, you know, the rapid race, you know, with the increase of AI, all the various tools, it is sometimes mind-boggling. Um, and I will say this, I recently made a career pivot. Um, I have been for well over a decade. I work in the federal space, and I recently transitioned into working for um in state government, which is very different. And for state government, we use a lot of AI tools. And so for someone who I'll probably say maybe, you know, um a year and a half ago would be a little, you know, um reluctant to using AI, I now like it and sort of see it as a valuable tool, right? To as you said, you know, you AI is not going to replace the individual, your expertise, your skill, your wisp, your wisdom, your intuition, but you can use it to supplement your work. Um, and so I sort of feel like in because of the transition, I had to use it, right? But I was starting to sort of, you know, um play around with tools and techniques in my own personal time. And so now I feel like I'm in a better space, you know, a year later than I was previously. How can you, what would you say to change in learning professionals? Because there are some of us who are still not quite on the bus. They're not on board with AI.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, uh, I have a couple thoughts. One is I like to remind everyone that the tech bros have have invested everything in AI. So right now they are doing a global media push to convince the world that we need AI, we need it for everything, because they they bet the farm on it, right? So they are heavily invested and they've been able to lobby governments, media channels, et cetera, to keep this push of messaging because they need a certain percentage of business in the human race to adopt these technologies so that they don't they don't financially collapse. So I like to remind everyone like, hey, let's not forget that there's an intention here to get us to buy this technology. Um, and it's on a scale of marketing that has never been done before. So um so I like to say, hey, let's slow our roll a little bit, right? There's definitely some benefits to AI, but don't just start taking it in. Um, and now the good news is, you know, we're seeing how AI is really playing out in the workplace. Like a couple big corporations did massive layoffs last year and they replaced big chunks of their workforce with AI solutions. Well, what's happening today? They're hiring back a lot of those workers because AI still has hallucinations, it does, it does messy work, um, it it doesn't have some of the ethical considerations that we need. And in addition, it is hugely expensive. Even if it's doing a good job, the resources to drive AI cost more than human workers to do the same work. So we're seeing actually a pullback on AI investment in across organizations. And it's also it's also still really messy. You know, every time I open up any software package or any website, there's an AI option there, right? Right. My, you know, my my my QuickBooks has AI, my Google has AI, Zoom has AI, but they don't talk to each other in any meaningful way, right? So we can use and and benefit from some of these automations within programs, but having whole processes driven by a really needs thoughtful design. And one of the things I love is um Josh Cavalier, he wrote the book Applying AI in Learning and Development. One of the things in his book is this continuum that goes from fully AI agent to fully human. And there's seven stages along the way. And sometimes you need it like equal involvement, right? Human AI collaboration, where maybe AI does the base work, but humans double check and verify and launch. And you make those decisions based on um how quickly things need to be done and how critical they are. So we should not be handing over to AI super critical, super serious, super potentially dangerous issues. That really still needs some human containment and human oversight. Um, so it's now really about do you have a philosophy and strategy that you're bringing to evaluating AI solutions, deciding how to use those solutions and maximizing those benefits. And I think everyone kind of rushed in a little bit and we're seeing some of the messiness of um some of those decisions, maybe not being as thoughtful or as constructive as they should have been. And that's why people are calling back and kind of reevaluating. The other thing here is that for businesses to truly adopt AI, you need the workforce on board with that. And humans are not gonna participate in their own demise. We are survival creatures. It is our core biology. And so if you need a good chunk of your workforce to participate in adopting AI so that you can ultimately fire them, guess what? They're not gonna participate. And so, um, and and smartly so, right? So I think a lot of these things are still gonna be playing out for a few years, but I like to kind of take the pressure off, like, hey, you know, let's make thoughtful choices here and not just do this because it's the new shiny tool or the cool kids are doing it, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I agree. I um I again I I like I like to use it in terms of supplement my work, like for um, you know, like for basic, maybe admin tasks, but you know, and you know this in doing um developing learning programs or doing change management, there is a lot of diagnostic work and then the building of the programs. And I wouldn't want, you know, a tool or methodology to take the lead in doing a lot of the analysis or the recommendations. Um, and so I, you're right, I would definitely warn professionals against um relying ahead 100% on AI tools.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I, you know, I think it can be useful for doing some research for you. It can summarize big chunks of data. There's oh I've seen some amazing, like it can take some of the learning that you want to generate and create like interactive role play scenarios or um HTML-based quizzes and practice scenarios, right? There's a lot of roles it can play. Um, but I also want to highlight that there are some people that are offloading all of their critical thinking to AI. Like they're just letting AI do everything and they won't even make a decision now without running it through Claude or chat or whatever. The studies are showing that people are seeing a decrease in their brain capacity. Like it if you don't use your brain, it starts to atrophy a little bit. And people are having significant drops in their critical thinking skills, their now, their just their brain capacity if they're overusing this tool. So I think we need to be very careful about it too, that um not only is it not doing the best work, but it can absolutely atrophy some of the best things that make us human.
SPEAKER_00And this is something I would imagine is very troubling for you as an expert who studies, you know, neuroscience, then you do L and D. All of these, all of your, your professional, your, your world sort of collide here. And that's something I I would imagine you would find really troubling that we're not um actually doing the work.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and I think it it comes down to personal choice, you know, how do we each use these tools? Um, you know, and we we also have the double level of how individuals, Bob, Sue, Mary, are using AI in their own personal life, and then what's expected of them at work. We've already seen several organizations get into some pretty big lawsuits because of how their employees used AI, but it wasn't an official policy or practice or tool of the company either. Um, and so there's personal use and then there's professional use, and how do companies make sure that um they're making the right choices, they're training their people appropriately, and how are they protecting from misuse of some of this technology? Right.
SPEAKER_00Interesting topics there. Um let's talk a bit about um individuals and organizational or sometimes personal change we're talking about. Um, what is your research telling you about um about change, fatigue, and burnout? Um, with so many changes, you know, be it in our personal lives or professional lives, or even sometimes what we're seeing um, you know, outside of work or home can be especially um, you know, depressing things that bring us down. Talk a bit about your research about what you're seeing around um change, fatigue, and burnout with individuals.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so in the book Wired to Resist, that's the one about change. As I was studying, okay, what happens neurologically when we're going through change? What is the, what is the what happens to us on a biological level? It was really clear that change activates a lot of things in us. One is it naturally uh activates our survival centers because um the amygdala is the the brain structure that kind of kicks off if you're in danger. Well, how it works is all of our sensory nerves, the optical nerve touches it, the auditory nerve touches it. So right now your amygdala is scanning your environment. And as long as everything stays the same, it feels safe. But if all of a sudden we heard an explosion or smelled fire smoke, it would kick off, right? Like I might be in danger. So change, just any change, is potential danger to us neurologically until we get more information. So, and and we're all the survivor, you know, we're all the descendants of people who had highly tuned amygdalas and uh realized that the grass looked different today than it did yesterday, and there's a lion hiding in there, right? People who didn't have highly tuned amygdalas were eaten by the lion and they're not our ancestors. So um, and now with our smartphones, we can be taking in dangerous messages beyond what we were built to take in. We really were built to live in tribes of about 150 people. And what's cool about technology is it connects us to folks all over the world, but it also means we're taking in information that we can't necessarily process the scale of. Um, but so any change kind of activates survival until we get more information. There's another brain structure that maps physical and social space. So if a change makes some change in the physical or social space. It's got to do some heavy lifting. If the change requires develop new skills and habits, that's going to make the basal ganglia do some work. Um, so there's some different neurological things that can get tripped off with change. And when I teach some of this content to leaders, they realize oh, we're actually making the reaction worse. We're making people more freaked out than they need to be. We're not being as transparent, or we activated a change, but we didn't bring the training and support to make sure people could actually develop the spill. Right, let's fix that. So there's some really great lessons for leaders in terms of how you activate and ask people to respond to change. And then what change fatigue is what happens when change is coming at us too fast and furious that we can't settle into the new normal before we're being hit with more change. And people already were experiencing change fatigue before the pandemic. The pandemic kind of put it into overdrive. And we were just coming out of the pandemic when Chat GPT launched its first edition. So we weren't able to really come back to stasis before the whole tech AI push hit us. And then there's environmental change too, and you know, political, geopolitical stuff. So we've been just kind of like, you know, getting punched in the face over and over again as a species. And we can only do that so much before we experience change fatigue. And then change fatigue is on a continuum with burnout. So if you don't have time to recover from change fatigue, you move into burnout, which is a medically diagnosable state of physical and emotional exhaustion. And I'm seeing that in workplaces everywhere that people are just they're not okay. They're not able to kind of manage what's going on. And executives are like, but I need them to get on board. We're pushing this big change. And I'm like, well, they're not capable of it. So what are we gonna do to either help them give them more support or change the timing of this or merge it with another change so they're not hit with two, they're hit with a combined one? There's choices we can make, right? So those are some highlights of change, fatigue, and burnout.
SPEAKER_00And so you talked a bit about um, you know, what executives can do. What can um, you know, individuals do, professionals do to really help themselves? Is it um, you know, being in tune, being aware of your thought processes or understanding how you, you know, biologically, physically respond to change? Is there something that we can do that, you know, if there's a huge, like you said, you talked a bit about like there's a fire alarm that goes off, but if there's something that we see that's in, you know, that's happening, you know, we talked about kind like this new program that's, you know, going to be implemented over, you know, over an 18-month period. What can we do if we're, you know, sort of going to work to an all hands and there's new information that's shared, something that we that won't send us into a tailspin?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, it's a great question. I think all of us need to take some personal responsibility for ourselves, you know, at home and at work, and realizing I've got to be better at change management, it's just the new normal. So some things you can do. In an ideal world, the leaders design and announce a great change, and then the managers help roll that change out and really support their employees. I kind of give people tips and advice if the two layers above you are not doing a great job, how do you still take care of yourself? So part of it is like, we need information. And and my guess is you're being provided with information, but you may or may not pay attention to it. So one is just be proactive and like, okay, what's happening? When is it happening? Who does it impact? And and get curious because the more information you get, the more your your internal alarm bells can simmer down. Um, so so be proactive about finding information. Another thing we need to be good at is self-regulation. Like if every time I get really freaked out and I get really stressed out and I worry a lot, I'm gonna burn a lot of energy. If I can learn to like calm my system down and self-regulate, I can now kind of go through the day and be the driver of my own, my, my own body's response. So I think self-regulation and emotional intelligence is a skill. One of the hacks that can give you a huge leap forward is mindfulness practices, that when people engage in a mindfulness practice like meditation or yoga, um, the studies are really, really clear that first of all, their baseline is lower than non-meditators or non-mindful people. When something disruptive happens, the spike is lower, right? So the disruption is lower. And then they get back to baseline faster than people who are non-practices of practicers of um a mindfulness technique. So uh the research on mindfulness is a mind-blowing. If you want to read a book about it, um, the one Altered Traits by Daniel Golem and Richard Davidson has all the studies of how powerful mindfulness is. And it also even can like manage pain at the same level as prescription drugs. Like mindfulness is something we should be doing. And you can even in as short as five minutes a day, you can have a significant impact on your biology. So that would be a hack or a shortcut I would offer people that will help them navigate all kinds of things. And then also with change, you know, starting to one of the tools I give people is like map out what's coming. When does it start? When does it end? When are you going to be holding a lot of changes at the same time? And and then make some decisions around that. If you've got a bunch of change happening and you're likely going to be at minimum exhausted, if not overwhelmed and stressed out, then maybe that's not the time to visit the in-laws, right? Maybe that's not the time to start the kitchen remodel. Like you need to look at managing your energy, become your own chief energy officer, so to speak. I love that. And so that means you got to kind of get the lay of the land. And so my husband and I would do that. He'd map his change, I'd map mine. We'd sit down at the table and look, and we'd do this every six months and we would make choices.
SPEAKER_00That is a really good idea. That's a good tip. Or heck, as you said. Um when we think a bit about um where we are today, um, you know, really as a nation around the world, um, and we think about so much change, a lot of folks are saying, because we we struggled with this in the past, but now it's always, you know, am I working in my purpose? Am I for am I fulfilling my purpose, right? Like when do I know that I am um I've pursued or I am in the middle of my calling? Talk a bit about your research and maybe help to unlock some of the questions or secrets that folks have been longing for for a long time. Around as a professional, how do I know when I have discovered my purpose?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's a great question. If you're if you're in the inquiry of that, get the book wired to become. I wrote it almost like a workbook. So there's a lot of questions you can ask yourself and and help on this journey. You know, all of us have our own journey around purpose. Some people know at a very young age, like Taylor Swift is a perfect example, right? She knew at a very young age that she was meant to be a singer-songwriter, and she has been on that path and very clear about it. Others of us wander around. And, you know, I had a certain sense of purpose young at in my younger years, then my mid-career, it changed a little bit, and then it's shifted some more. Um, our purpose can change over our lifetime, right? Um, some indicators around purpose is first of all, your inner barometer. I'm always going to tell you go to your biology first. How does it make you feel? What is your physical response to it? Do you feel calm? Do you get in that kind of flow state? Does it bring you joy? Or does it always feel hard? Is it always kind of stressful? So your inner barometer is a big indicator. Another indicator is what you're good at, right? Like what comes naturally to you. Now, some of us are good at things, and and and that doesn't mean that needs to be our career. It could maybe be a hobby, but what you're good at is also an indicator. Okay. And then when we decide what purpose is, you know, use uh lowercase P. Some people think of purpose with all capital letters, like it must work for a nonprofit and I must be doing some social good in the world, right? As defined by other people. You know, if you love baking and that is brings you joy and you're really great at it, you are doing good work. You're on purpose, you're building something beautiful for others to enjoy, right? So I think we need to demystify that only people at nonprofits or first responders get to claim that they have purpose in their life. Like, you know, we all have a sense of that. Um and sometimes you got to experiment, see what works. The other distinction that came up in the research that I think is really important for people is when we define our meaning of work, there's actually three levels. The first is the meaning of work. That's given to us when we're little by kind of how our parents talk about jobs and work. Is it a means to an end? Is it a place you go to be fulfilled? Um, is it a clock punching kind of thing, or is it where you find your identity? So we all kind of grow up with the definition of the meaning of work. Then there's the meaning in work, and that kind of shapes your career. Like I've chosen careers that are about education and helping people grow, right? My husband chose IT and technological systems. Um, so generally that kind of shapes your career choices in the industries or paths you take, is what is my meaning in work? And then the third level is meaning at work, meaning this job under this boss at this company. And so for me, I like to ask people where's the disconnect? Like, do you know that you love IT, but you hate this job or you're uncomfortable under this boss? Then don't walk away from IT, maybe find a better match, right? But if IT isn't doing it for you anymore, and we saw this happen during the pandemic. Um, I want to circle back to this because there's some important data, but we saw a lot of uh healthcare workers and teachers who had always found a lot of meaning in their work, they all got burned out and they couldn't go back to it. So they actually changed careers completely, big swaths of them. Um and that's because the balance of how much stress was tied to meaning got way out of whack because of that global pandemic.
SPEAKER_00You've you've had so much um, you know, experience as a consultant, as an executive in organizations. Can you talk a bit about based on your experience and based on your work? Can you talk a bit about when you've seen individuals that you've worked with or in your organizations and you say, you know, this person, they found their calling. They are living and they are, you've seen just making an observation, you've seen that in action. Can you talk about that?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, one of the things I did in the book, a lot of my books feature personal stories. Um, because I think we can read about a concept, and I can certainly share my share my journey, which I do in my books, but I want people to see kind of a wide swath of it. So when Wired to Become, I asked people to share their stories of finding their purpose or losing their purpose. And what did that look like for them? And the book has over 20 stories from people who knew at a very young age and made it happen to others, like one gentleman um found his purpose after he was paralyzed in a motorcycle accident. And he had a paralyzed mentor who helped him help him navigate this very scary and difficult time where your whole life is redefined. And he received so much benefit from that, but then he became one of those mentors and he said, I've never had such a clear sense of purpose in my life. That came out of tragedy, right? Yeah. So things can can shape us in different ways. Um, but I think it's really important, like we know it when we see it. Like you can tell who is who's on purpose in their life and doing it because of the joy of it and their gift of it, and they get great satisfaction. Um, I do want to articulate that there is this balance between purpose and happiness, they're not the same thing. And oftentimes purpose-driven careers can be dealing with heavy things. Like a lot of people who work with nonprofits or marginalized populations, like social workers, they have to deal with hard things. And sometimes they can they can be so focused on, so the difference is, you know, purpose, you feel like you're making a difference. It's longer-term impact. It's not necessarily immediate happiness and joy. Happiness and joy is those fleeting moments that give us a lot of pleasure, like eating really good cake or having a fun game night with friends, right? You need both. So if you lean too much into purpose and don't give yourself enough joy and happiness, you're gonna feel out of balance and you can burn out. But if you're all about pleasure and happiness and you don't have a sense of something that gives you a feeling that you're making a contribution that's that's meaningful and important, then you also feel out of balance. So it's about both, if that makes sense.
SPEAKER_00It does. Um, this is really a this is this is really a great conversation. I know that's gonna help um so many people. Um, and I want to be mindful of um your time. Can you talk a bit, um, Cheryl, a little bit about your passion and your personal interest? Um, I know you talked a bit about some of your your your favorite books that you rely on as a career expert. Talk a bit about some of your favorite, like your personal books, your favorite person.
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah. Okay. Um, you know, someone gifted me the book called The Earth Is Enough. And it's it's a it's a novel, but it um it really speaks to me. I end up reading it probably every couple years because it's really about being in balance with nature and what that means. And it just spoke to me. I'm a huge fan of Outlander by Diana Gobaldin. Like uh it turned into a movie series, and so a lot of people know it now, but like I was one of the original readers when it first came out, and it's all about time travel and Scottish history and and all of that. I love that book. In terms of like a book that blew my mind, um, Michael Pollins How to Change Your Mind, which was all about the research around um psychedelics and how they they they were proven to really help people heal from trauma and addiction, and how the government shut it down because they didn't want they they just shut down that whole vein of research. And now there's an emergence of it. It's fascinating, like all the studies that show um how how powerful and really beneficial some of these materials are. And he did a very scientific look at it. So those are some books that I I recommend and I reread often. Awesome. Um, favorite pastime. I know you like to travel. Yes, I love to travel. You know, I've been uh bitten by the pickleball bug. So I play probably three times a week. Um, I love it. I just it's fun, it's an easy way to get exercise, it's very social. And I also fly fish is another hobby of mind. I love to go and stream fish or do a float. And um, I've been very lucky to fly fish some great rivers. I really love fly fishing. Something I did with my dad, and um, and we don't get to do it much anymore because he's he's gotten in years, but I love it. It's very zen-like, and it really puts me in that flow state for hours.
SPEAKER_00Uh, fly fishing, that's something I've always said I wanted to go fly fishing, never been, and that's something that you would definitely recommend to get out into the great outdoors.
SPEAKER_01I think it's incredible. And if you, I mean, definitely hire a guide and have someone help you the first couple times you do it, because it can be kind of complex, but you're out in nature. And for me, it's the whole like you know, you have to figure out what's hatching and pick the right fly that looks like the bug that's naturally hatching. And then you got to figure out where the fish are laying in the river, and then you have to cast your fly to land in the water before where he or she is, and then float right above them so that they grab it. So for me, it's like a chess match with a fish. And then when I catch the fish, it's like so great. I always do catch and release. Um, but to me, there's just such, it's just so cool. And then you're in these beautiful rivers, you know, you're kind of out in in nature and it just time passes. It's so beautiful.
SPEAKER_00Very nice. Um, so a lot of folks have been talking about this for uh well over a decade now. Um, the bucket list. Yeah. Talk a bit about um what's on your bucket list, some things you've done, but some things you definitely want to do in uh the next decade or so.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, my my daughter just launched off to college. So my husband and I are at that phase, like we're high-fiving each other, like, yay, she's a successful human, she's out in the world. Um, so it's freed up more of our time to travel. A lot of my bucket list items are travel. So we just did one of those, which was a trip to Australia and New Zealand, which was super exciting. And I got invited, and I got invited to keynote a conference. So it got to be work and bucket list. Um, so a few places in the world, I want to do an African safari at some point. We just did the UK trip and I kind of got to see the land of my people. We're Scotch-Irish all the way back. Um then a lot of the rest of it is just spending time with friends, you know, just having time with people that I love. And and then I I feel really lucky that I get to live my purpose. So continuing to contribute through my research and my work, I I get to live my bucket list that way too. So I'm I'm really fortunate. But it's gonna be a lot of travel and hanging out with my my the people that I love.
SPEAKER_00Love that. Um, also a nice transition into the next question is what continues to inspire you and motivate you in your work?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I mean, I'm a curious person. So I, you know, I'm not someone who's ever gonna retire because I'm always gonna be like, huh, what's going on with that? And then reading a book and then doing some investigation. And then when I find stuff, I want to share it with people. So I'll continue to do that. Um, for me, I'm still very inspired by humans and the best in humans. I really believe that um most humans want to be good in the world and care about others. And so for me, it's about how can I keep contributing to that, the rise of that, the increasing that. Um, and there's no there's no shortage of opportunities to play with that. So for me, it's just continuing to focus on bringing out the best in people and organizations, and and that gives me a pretty wide playing field. So I also then can kind of follow um sub-interests within that.
SPEAKER_00Nice. Um, and you said one word I'm gonna hone in on best. Best lessons you've um learned in your career and in the best advice you've received in your career.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's great. I really believe that humans want to be their best selves. I don't think people um even really traumatized people. I I don't believe that people are like, I just, you know, want to to harm folks. They may not have the tools or the support that they need, but I really believe people hunger to be better. Um, and I have found so kind of the best lesson I believe is knowledge is power, that when we give people information, like, here's the why of what's going on for you. I felt like it helps people go, oh, I have felt that, I've seen that. So bringing the neural science lens gives people kind of a way to see themselves differently. And then giving them a tool, a practice, a strategy to work. Um, people want to do better generally. So uh to me, knowledge is power and give people the tools. And then the best career advice I ever received was and it was actually I it was a quote from American Idol, and I remember it was Jennifer Hudson, and she was giving advice to these up-and-coming singers, and she said, be someone who is good to work with, and you will always have plenty of work. I love that. And I really took that in, like, as a consultant, I want to be someone who brings a lot of value that is warm and and easy and fun to work with. And that's always been kind of my philosophy, and um, and I've I've always had plenty of work. I really believe it's true.
SPEAKER_00I love it. Um, any closing thoughts that you want to share? Any questions that I may not have asked during the interview, but just any question, any uh closing comments around um, you know, today's workforce, innovation, um, knowing when you found your purpose or any um your favorite quotes, perhaps?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I would just say, you know, tune in. We were given emotions and feelings for a reason. It's really part of our barometer system. So tune into yourself and see how you're feeling. I know a lot of folks are experiencing a lot of stress right now because of AI, and simultaneously the trades are experiencing huge shortage of workforce. So there's some amazing opportunities for hands-on work in a lot of the building trades, trades of all kinds. So if you're if you're worried about this AI thing, go to careers that require hands-on, um, and you will find lots of opportunities. I think that's and we need people to go into those fields to rebalance our workforce anyway. So I think there's a nice win-win there. And then um I think it's also just think about how do you bring value? There's lots of problems that need to be solved in the world, um, even just at your job. If you see something, hmm, what could you bring to that? What what it you know, enliven your own curiosity and and and exploration? Because for me, that's where the dopamine and serotonin comes from, is like, oh, there's a little thing. Oh, I found something or I came up with an idea. And that that that biologically brings us satisfaction to experience that. So maybe if you're feeling kind of bored in your job, where can you get curious? Where can you bring some new ideas or some new approaches to something?
SPEAKER_00I love it. Uh, Dr. Britt Andreata, thank you so much for joining me today. Um, this has been an amazing discussion. I feel like I learned a lot, um, especially how to. I'm consistently trying to learn how to how to better deal with stress and change, right? And I feel like I learned some new tips. Want to make sure that folks get the wired series. I've got wired to resist, wired to become, but there's also wired to connect. Um, and be sure to follow Dr. Andreata on social media. Thank you so much for joining us. That does it for this edition of the Spark Factor with Tori Silver, and we'll see you next time.