LIVED - Our IVF Stories

In this episode of LIVED, we open up about IVF through two very different lenses - 19 years apart.

Maryanne reflects on her experience, while Tara shares her recent, deeply personal journey to becoming a mum… the highs, the heartbreak, the decisions, and everything in between that led to the birth of her daughter.

This conversation is raw. It’s honest. It’s real.

If you’ve walked this path, are about to, or simply want to understand it more deeply - this episode is for you 🤍

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:05

Hello everyone and welcome to our lived podcast. I'm Mary Ann Sayers. And I'm Tara Steinwaid. Hello, Tara. How are you? I'm good, thank you. How are you? I'm good. We've made it to our second episode. We have. What an achievement. Just want to take this opportunity to thank everyone for all their support. We've received some wonderful comments from our first episode, and I think a lot of people are excited about the concept of lived and the topics that we're going to be talking through. I'm excited also. Absolutely. So today's topic, Tara, is IVF. Oh, it's a big one. It is a big one. It's an experience that tens of thousands of people in this country go through every year. And millions around the world would go through every year. And it's an experience that you and I have both been through. We have. Yours is a bit more recent than mine. Yes. So one of the things I was looking into about IVF, it's been going in Australia for 46 years.

SPEAKER_01 1:07

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 1:08

So it's been such a long time. I remember back in the day I was probably nine or ten years of age. And I actually remember you wouldn't have even I don't think I was alive. Not even thought of at that stage, Tara. But I do remember it being on the news. It was a big deal, the first IVF birth in Australia back in 1980. And since then, I mean I don't know what the stats are, but you know, so many families are having to go through the IVF experience. You know, I gave birth to my first child back in 2004, so 22 years ago. And I gave birth to my second child, my son, 18 years ago, also through IVF. So if it hadn't been for IVF, I wouldn't have my two children. So I just want to touch a little bit, I want to really hear your story, Tara, because it's more tangible, I think, because it's been so recent for you. But in terms of the reasoning for me going through IVF at that point, my first husband had a very serious and eventually terminal heart lung illness. As part of his treatment, he needed to go on a clinical drug trial with the St. Vincent's Heart Lung Hospital here in uh Sydney. And when anyone goes on a clinical drug trial, you basically need to sign a consent form. Because with clinical drug trials, they don't fully know the effects of the treatment. And they have some very strict rules around falling pregnant and conceiving, basically. So you're basically signing a consent form to say that you're not going to be conceiving or attempting to conceive. So at that time when the doctors spoke to him about that, we, you know, we'd been together maybe a few years. We certainly weren't, I mean, we weren't married at that stage. And there was one doctor in particular that spoke to him and said, Look, if there's any shred of a chance that children are in your future, you really need to think about uh basically banking your sperm. So so grateful for that doctor to have said that because my husband then went ahead and went through that process, had some of his sperm frozen. It all had to happen very quickly, I remember that, because he needed to go on to these this drug trial very, you know, very quickly. So very thankful to that doctor. So basically his sperm was frozen, and I'm thinking that was probably around the year 2000. And we continued uh our relationship, we eventually got engaged and then we got married. And then uh in 2003, that's when we first started the IVF process, went through a couple of cycles originally, which which didn't result in a pregnancy, but then I think it was maybe the second no, maybe the third cycle that resulted in a pregnancy. So and my daughter was born in 2004. She was born uh eight weeks early, that's another story. And uh here she is, she's nearly 22 years of she's 22 years of age today, and then a few years later, we we needed to go through the same process as well for our second child. So uh there you go, it's it's it's a bit more of an unusual reason to be going through IVF because as far as I know, I I didn't have any fertility issues, it wasn't a fertility situation for myself and my husband. But uh because he was then on the on the drug trial from that point, there was no other opportunity that we could have had to have had children because in order for it for us to do that, he would have needed to come off the off the trial and he wasn't able to do that. So there you go. That's our story of of IVF. I have very vivid memories of it, even though it was such a long time ago. I have very vivid memories of it. I'm just so thankful for particularly there was one doctor in particular that really kind of took the lead and and spoke to Peter and and basically asked to say this is something that I would recommend for you guys to to look at doing. And here we are.

SPEAKER_01 5:20

I'm glad they knew about the effects of that trial medication as well in terms of having children. Because imagine if they didn't know that, or the doctor, you know, not all doctors are thorough, and they had it said it to you. So thank God for that. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 5:36

You have two beautiful children now. Absolutely. So there you go. So that's my story about IVF. I'm really interested to hear yours because yours is much more recent. Actually, just but just on that, I was having a look at the number of births back in 2004 when I gave birth to my daughter. And then in 2023, which is when you summer. So, in very round figures, in Australia back in 2004, there was around 7,000 births through IVF or other assisted reproduction technology, so it was about 7,000, and then in 2023, that number was around 18,000. What an increase. Huge increase. So so many families are turning to it now. So over to you. Let's hear about your story with IVF Tara and take us through it. So, what was the original reason that you needed to go down the IVF route? Sure.

SPEAKER_01 6:33

We went down the IVF route. I have endometriosis, and we just weren't falling pregnant naturally, unfortunately. So we had been trying about a year. Um, I went to go see uh my doctor, and he said, Why don't we put you on a tablet called letrozole? And so we did six months of that, still no success. So I said to my husband, Matt, let's go down the IVF route. My husband is actually 22 years older than me, and he has six children already. So I knew that it wasn't his fertility, which we did have checked as well. It was mine, and the only reason we could put it down to was my endometriosis. So there you go. We went down IVF. It was a difficult but great journey, I still say. I have to be very grateful as we have our daughter now, Summer. Uh, so we started IVF, I think it was around May of 2022.

SPEAKER_02 7:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:39

We did our first round, which unfortunately we didn't get any embryos, which only happens to one in a hundred couples. So they retrieved 25 eggs, however, with the uh what do you call it, fertilization um process, we didn't get any embryos from that. So the first time they did the fertilization using the IVF method, which is where you put a drop of Matt's collection onto each egg and let let it happen. Naturally, I guess, is the way you would put it. Yes. Uh, and so we went straight into a second round, and the doctor said this time she'd like to try the IXE method, which is where they actually analyze Matt's sample and pick one sperm per egg and inject it into the egg. Um, so we were very happy with those results. We got three embryos from that cycle. We did our first transfer and it failed unfortunately, which I already knew. So you do the transfer and you're in a two-week wait, which let me tell you, is a long two weeks. Anyone that has been through IVF will understand how anxiety-filled the anticipation is of is this working or is it not?

SPEAKER_02 9:09

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 9:09

You assess every little thing that you're feeling. And I had actually started to bleed before I was able to go in for the blood test after the two-week weight called the beta blood test to test if you have any HCG in your system and if it was a successful pregnancy. Uh so when we found out, they confirmed it via a blood test that it wasn't successful. Was very deflating. I felt very defeated. Um, I'm just trying to tap into those emotions back then. Uh yeah, I guess I it was just hard for me to accept because a lot of my friends were falling pregnant around me. We'd all gotten married at similar ages. Matt already having six children. I was like, what's wrong with me? Why can't I fall pregnant? Yeah. And it was just, I felt like the weight of the world on my shoulders because I was the reason that we weren't falling pregnant, as far as we knew. So it was a it was a hard journey. I kind of said to Matt, I don't think I can do it again. Um, not yet, I'm not ready. Our doctor was happy to actually go into another cycle, like a frozen transfer straight away. Uh, and thankfully the timing actually really worked out because when you're doing IVF, timing is everything. You have to kind of put your whole life on hold and be available for every single blood test, uh, every scan, and just your whole life revolves around it. So we were actually going to qualia uh for a little bit of time together over Where's Koalia? It's in Hamilton Island. Sorry, in Hamilton Island. Uh it's the adult-only resort. I was thinking it was some exotic country. I was thinking, oh, qualia. No, no, it's in Hamilton Island. So we were going there. We had actually been for a honeymoon and I loved it there. So I said, let's go back. I think I needed a reset, and that's exactly what I got. So we were at the timing worked out really well, and we were booked in for our first blood test, which we went and had on the way to the airport. And then they rang and were like, that's great, you need to come back in for another blood test, which also worked out to be on the way home from the airport. So that was on the way there and then on the way back. Yes. And they had said if you need one earlier, there is a pathologist on the island somewhere, so you'll need to try and find it. Uh, or I guess fly back to Sydney and then fly all the way back to Hamilton Island, which I wasn't going to do. I was just kind of in the mindset of if it's not right timing, then that's just how it is. So that all worked out. And we got back, we had the blood tests, they rang, they said they're happy for us to go ahead with our transfer. I think it was about a week after we returned, and it was successful. That was summer. So I had promised Matt I didn't want to be in the limbo land and test, or I was hoping that it didn't bleed before that beta blood test. And we would just wait and see and have our final answer when the nurses or the doctor rang.

SPEAKER_00 12:22

Right.

SPEAKER_01 12:23

And that's what we did. It was a very anxious field two weeks, but I did feel positive about it. And I feel like going away really helped with my mindset. And Matt and I had quite a long, like long conversations around the what ifs and if it if it doesn't work, like what's our plan? And I think I just really locked into the process and I thought, look, there are hundreds, if not thousands, of other women that have been through years and years and cycles and cycles of IVF, and I've done one transfer and I'm already feeling deflated. So this could quite possibly be right at the beginning of our journey. Like, I'm not going to give up now. And regardless of how long it takes, I was prepared to keep going until I got our baby.

SPEAKER_00 13:14

It just shows you how much yearning there is, though, and how much is riding on it for everyone that goes through it, right? It's absolutely you like you're putting your heart, your soul, your body, your mind, you you know, there's so like I said, there is so much yearning. So do you remember? I'm sure you do, the phone call.

SPEAKER_01 13:32

I do. So I was actually, I I remember it so clearly. I was laying in bed because I did a lot of rest during those two weeks of the wait. And Matt had actually just popped home to see how I was doing. You get the blood test. Well, I always book in for the first slot, which was like 8 a.m. So I know that the courier comes at 11am to pick up the blood. And I know that the results are in that system by 12:30. I hadn't had a phone call, so I'm doing laps around the neighborhood. I'm waiting every minute. Every time my phone, someone else would ring, I'd be like, go away. I don't want that phone call. So I'd actually gotten home. Matt came in to check on me, and he had just walked downstairs to get in the car to go back to work, and my phone rang. And I was like, thank God. And I answered, and it was our doctor, not the nurses. And she said, Hi, Tara, how are you? And she's a very black and white doctor, which is actually why I liked her. Um, I'm that type of personality where I just need to be told straight. So bedside men are, I wouldn't say she's strong in, but that wasn't important to me. Uh, and she said, Hi, Tara, how are you? I'm like, Yeah, good. Like, get to the point. How are you? And she was like, Yeah, I am good. She's like, have the nurses rang you yet? And I said, No, they haven't. And she said, Oh, okay, so you don't know that you're pregnant. Oh, that's literally how she told me I was doing it. And I was like, No. And I just burst into tears and I put her on speaker and I quickly text Matt and I said, Come back upstairs. And she was like, Yes, you're very pregnant. And I was like, What do you mean? She's like, Your H C G. I think she said something like a thousand and seventy-six or something, it was well over a thousand, and they were hoping for anything over a hundred. That's what they would classify as like a viable pregnancy. And she's like, So I you need to expect multiples. And I was like, Oh my god, am I having twins? And she said, Look, we don't know for sure, but I said multiples, so it could even be more. I was in complete shock. My ears are ringing, and I could not hear a word she said after that. She was giving me instructions on I had to ring back, but she was giving me instructions on my next appointment I had to make with her, and you know, to get the referral to book in the dating scan. I just hadn't like I could not hear what she was saying. My ears were actually ringing, and I was bursting into tears. Matt walked upstairs, and by this stage I'm pacing up and down the room. So were you still on the phone? I was still on the phone looking out the window, but I had just been pacing up and down, and he's standing at the door thinking, Oh my god, it didn't work. Yeah, what am I going to do? Tara's not going to be in a good way. I'm going to have to cancel my day. And I just was like, Yes, okay, like thank you. Got off the phone and I looked at him and I was like, I'm pregnant. And so he gets out his phone to you know record the moment. And I was like, and there's more. And he was like, What? And he just did this big gulp. He was like, I was like, twins, she thinks. And then he's like, Oh, okay. He was petrified. So we he was, you know, he was happy that I was pregnant. I would think he was like definitely hoping it wasn't twins, but we would have been blessed if it was. Yes. Uh, so we had our big cuddles and our big kisses, and we were very happy and excited and over the moon. And then I was like, okay, you can go now. I wanted to call like all my loved ones and let them know. I was just so excited. I already knew I would tell people straight away. Uh I wasn't going to wait till the 12 weeks or even after the dating scan. I think, you know, this day and age, you can you can choose if you want to share early. I know back in the day it was you should definitely wait, but yes, if I knew if things weren't going to go to plan with the pregnancy, that I would want that support even more so. So I told and and I rang everyone and told them straight away. I was so excited. Matt was actually, which he told me after at the Haven, which is the the next suburb across from where we were living, crying. Because he was really so scared that we were having twins. Oh, of course, because this whole so at this at what point did you find out that it actually wasn't twins? Yeah. So that you find out that you're pregnant, you're about three and a half yeah, about three and a half week almost four weeks pregnant uh by the time you get that blood test. So you find out very early and you don't go in for the dating scan until you're around seven weeks. So it was about three weeks that we had to sit in that limbo land of oh my god, are we having multiples? And I had not told him that she said potentially more than two. Yes. Because he just would not cope, like passed out. Yeah, I think so. So I'm kind of glad I kept that news to myself. But we went in for our scan, and there was just the one bumber on there, and as soon as it you'll be amazed, as soon as I saw it, it's was you know, it's a little embryo still, or yeah, it did have a heartbeat though, so I guess you can I don't know at the stage that you start to refer to it as a fetus, but I it was still a circle, so it hadn't formed the limbs yet or anything like that. And I was like, it's a girl. I just straight away knew from seeing on that scan, it's a girl. And all I ever wanted, clearly, number one priority is a healthy baby, but yes, I always saw myself with a little girl, and I thought, if I don't get the opportunity to have another baby, I have to get my little girl. Like, I just that's what I'd envisioned for me. Yes, so we did, we ended up finding out again. Uh, I just needed to know. Um, we did the harmony test at 10 and a half weeks. I went on the exact day that you can go in, and it was in fact a little girl.

SPEAKER_00 19:25

Amazing, amazing. And going through the process, because hearing you speak about it, you speak with such depth of the process and what you went through. Um, I guess, do you feel that knowing as much as you can about the process helped you?

SPEAKER_01 19:42

I do. I think there's two ways to look at it. I personally am someone I need to know everything about everything, and I find a lot of comfort in that. So if I understand what's going on, like I said, even with the courier time, what time they come pick up your your blood samples, I can kind of work with that. Whereas when I'm in the dark, which some people do prefer, again, goes back to your personality type, right? You I just I function better knowing that. So other people would prefer not to know and that they're not, you know, knowing to to the exact minute when their results are in, or um, just understanding, you know, if you even you go in for a blood test prior to that beat a blood test, and they test, they don't do tests for HCG, but they test your progesterone, and you really do want your progesterone to be over 25. Right. Because that indicates you you potentially are pregnant, um, because your progesterone, as far as I'm aware, I will say I'm not a doctor. This is just my own experience and my own understanding. Yes, your progesterone flatlines when you're about to bleed, get a cycle. So I guess that's why they do that blood test because they want to have a little bit of an indication, because if it is on the lower side, they use something called like pezzaries or uh which is progesterone, so you can to try and ramp that level back up to try and save the pregnancy, I guess. Yes. Um, so I personally find a lot of comfort in learning as much as I possibly can. Like the nurses, every time I go in, I'm asking question after question after question. I'm sure some of them think I'm crazy, but I really don't care.

SPEAKER_00 21:23

Oh, look, I think it as I said, I think it's it's showing that you really want to know the experience that you know you're going through, what your body is going through, every step of the way, what needs to happen? Because as you said, I think it really depends on the personality of the person going through it and how much they want to know or not, whether that brings them comfort knowing each step of the way or whether they're just like, no, don't want to know anything about that. What about so how would you describe the say the mentic meant sorry, the mental and the physical parts of the process as well, the toll as far as that goes? What what did you find harder?

SPEAKER_01 22:01

I would say the mental toll was harder for me. The physical toll I think you're just so anyone going through IVF, I believe are to an extent desperate, obviously, to be become a mom and or parents. Um mum and mum or mum and dad or so on. Uh and I think you will just go to all lengths, really. So injecting, you know, you could have your partner do that for you or do it yourself. Some people will bruise, their whole stomachs will be covered in bruises. Um, you can get like bloated, um, even after the egg retrieval. Like my first egg retrieval, I couldn't walk for quite a few days. Uh it it was I was in excruciating pain. However, the second retrieval, I was walking and at my cousin's wedding the next day. So I think you don't know what to expect. Everyone responds differently, so you can't really tell someone this is what's going to happen to you. Um, because it may not. I think the mental load, some people might be really mentally strong, and it doesn't affect them as much as it would other people. For me, I had a lot of time on my hands. Uh I it's all I thought about every second of every day. Yeah, yeah. You do have to distract yourself as much as you can, but when you're so desperate for something and it's all you think about, it's hard to take your mind off of it. I think the best thing that I can advise for people going through it is the support system you have around it. And you for me for the first round that we did, I um had told quite a lot of people, like my close friends, that we were going through it and they just check in and ask how you're doing for me. That actually caused a bit of anxiety for like more so and uh felt more pressure that I needed to, you know, get these results not only for me, but to share the good news with others. So the second round that we did, I said to Matt, please don't tell anyone, I don't want anyone know like knowing what we're going through because I really want to protect my bubble.

SPEAKER_02 24:26

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 24:27

And I did. I uh with the first transfer, I kind of I think I kind of knew that it wasn't going to work. I don't know if you know they say law of attraction, I don't know if I attracted that, but I had a gut feeling even before we had even done the transfer. Yeah. I think I just wasn't in the right mindset, and I think mindset is everything when you're doing IVF. Yes. Um, that reset at qualia Hamilton Island was so good for me. It was over the New Year's, I felt like it was fresh energy. I just a new way of thinking about it all. Um, I really just locked into the process and I was like, if this is the beginning, this is the beginning, it could be a really long road. So I just need to, you know, in some sort of way, my own language to myself was suck it up, Tara. Yes. This could just be the beginning. So yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:18

And how important do you think selecting the doctor that you're going to go through the process with? Because I guess there's there's options to do it privately or or publicly, yes, here in here in Australia. So how important was that? You mentioned before that your particular doctor, great doctor, not uh probably the best bedside manner if you want to call it that, but ultimately was just very factual, yeah. Straight to the point.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

Which I think a lot of doctors can be that way in general. But I think when it comes to IVF, you definitely do get a lot of doctors that are more sincere or uh maybe understand or tap into the emotions of their patients. I think I touched on it before where I said it really just comes back to your personality type. I am a black and white person, so I wanted a black and white doctor. It was more important to me to be told straight than what it was have them have nurturing words or check in on me because I had that support elsewhere where I could get that from Matt to my husband or my friends that I was going through. Uh and also um yeah, IVF of also offers counselling. Yes, um, there's different um clinics, but we went through IVF Australia and they offer counselling, which is sounds so silly, but I was actually too scared to take on their counselling because because I was struggling so much the first round, I was worried if I told them how I was actually feeling that they wouldn't let me let me do another round. So I I was thankfully I had my own um support system away from the counselling that they offered. But I think you you can go on the website, uh, they have all their reviews of all of the different doctors and what they specialise in. Like you might also want to choose someone based off your reason that you're going through IVF. So our doctor specialises in endometriosis because that was what we put my issue down to, whereas other doctors might specialise in the male side of like male fertility, or if you're like say older, like you know, in your 40s and trying to conceive a baby that way, they they would specialise in older women going through the process.

SPEAKER_02 27:36

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 27:37

So you can kind of have a look at all of that, and then you know, you can even just go off the look of someone. Yeah you know, you can tell sometimes you can tell how someone is by their eyes, they all have their picture up on the website, and you might be drawn to a doctor.

SPEAKER_00 27:52

Yeah, I think it's important to know that there is support out there because for those who are going through IVF that may not necessarily have immediate support or family support, but you know, they're going through it on their own. There is lots of support groups out there that are attached to the fertility clinics. So going forward, am I can I ask, are you planning to have more children?

SPEAKER_01 28:16

Yes, so we are. That was a bit of a journey. So I think I had uh uh said earlier that we did get three embryos, so the first one was unsuccessful, uh, very hard on me, but thankfully we straightaway went into the second transfer, which was successful, and that was summer, and so we had another embryo left of that cycle, and uh summer was due date was actually September 29th of 2023. She was born on the 18th. The following year, we actually did that third transfer on September 29th. Oh, so it was so crazy how that timing worked out that it just so happened to be on Summer's due date, but a year later, uh that pregnancy was successful originally and actually ended in a missed miscarriage at 10 weeks, which we kind of knew things weren't great from our dating scan. So it was a lot of limbo land from like seven weeks through to ten weeks, um, which then I had to go in for a D and C. So that was that was quite hard. Um, but you know, I do have to put it back to everything happens for a reason. And I think I was just so grateful that I had summer and that feeling of am I ever going to be a mum wasn't with me anymore because I was a mum. Yes. And I just thought, if summer's my one and only, well, how lucky am I?

SPEAKER_02 29:42

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 29:43

So we were, you know, going back and forth whether or not we would go down the IVF route again, or even if we would try and have a second baby. We tried naturally, we came to the conclusion that we definitely did want a second, and we tried naturally for about 12 months. Uh, nothing happened, which I was really hopeful that something would, because you do hear of a lot of people going through IVF to conceive that haven't been able to for years, and then they fall pregnant pregnant naturally after. So I thought that would be the case for us. Unfortunately, it wasn't. So, to answer your question, yes, we 100% would love another baby, and we have just done another round of IVF in January, February of this year, yeah. Um, which I'm still recovering from ho hormonally because it is a lot, uh, very taxing to the body, like I breaking out and very hormonal. Um, and we were lucky enough to get another three embryos, so we have parked it for the time being. Right. They're frozen, and we will revisit that uh in the second half of this year, as I have it, I have an overseas trip coming up in a few weeks, so I didn't want to be pregnant for that. And why not? Well, I I I personally don't want to fly. Yeah, it wasn't about drinking or partying um for the holiday, it was I just don't want to fly whilst I'm pregnant. Yeah, and obviously I don't know what first trimester or even the whole pregnancy will bring, whether I'll be sick the whole time. Um, but I'm very hopeful that I'll be pregnant by the end of the year. Fingers crossed, that's our plan anyway.

SPEAKER_00 31:28

That's lovely. Fingers crossed. Well, I wish you uh Matt the very best with that journey. And I guess this time you're going into it having been through the experience before, with so much more foresight about it all as well, going going through it this time.

SPEAKER_01 31:42

Yes, I think so. I think I'm more mentally prepared for sure.

SPEAKER_00 31:47

Yeah, absolutely. Well, thank you so much for sharing that story. It brings actually just listening to it was bringing a lot of it back. Uh when you were talking about the self-injections as well, I'd remember those because I've always had a thing about needles, which I think a lot of people do. Yes. And so when I was like, oh, I've actually got to inject myself in the end, it was actually fine. In the end, I just do it kind of thing. But just hearing you talk through really did take me back. So thank you very much for sharing your story.

SPEAKER_01 32:15

That's okay. I'm sure I could go into a lot more depth, but that's all we have time for today.

SPEAKER_00 32:19

It is, it is indeed. All right, so now we go come to our final part of our episode. What's on your mind? I love this segment.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

Do you like it? I think it's great. I think it just lightens the mood because a lot of the topics that we will be covering on our podcast are heavy and they're raw. And I just feel like, you know, as much as it's a nice listen or people can relate to it, it's always nice to end on a funny or a nicer a nicer note, I guess.

SPEAKER_00 32:51

Exactly. So would you like me to start?

SPEAKER_01 32:53

I think so. So, Marianne, what's on your mind today? Okay, so here we go.

SPEAKER_00 32:59

I have an issue with people who place their dog poo bags in the bin, in the bin that's out been out the front because of garbage collection of life out the front. You're one of those. Hang on, because I'm not on board with it, okay? I'm not on board with it. Here's the thing I'm a dog person, I've owned dogs all my life, so it's nothing to do with that. But when you have someone putting their dog poo in your bin, and maybe there's two or three other people that walk past and do the same thing, particularly, you know, if you're if you live in a place where there's lots of walkers.

SPEAKER_01 33:36

We're talking about like in a centered dog bag though, right?

SPEAKER_00 33:40

We are, we are, but would you put like your baby's dirty nappies in a bag in someone's bin? Would you feel no, you wouldn't. Yeah, I wouldn't why would you? And I I have. So I just feel like, well, okay, so my question back would be why can't they just take that home with them or put it in a public bin? Because the problem is that when I'm getting really, really serious about it now, because when the bin's empty and there's two or three dog who's in there, it stinks the bin out. And I don't want that. The bin's outside though, right? Well, it's out on the road at that stage because it's been collected, but then you've got to kind of take it back up. But yeah, I guess my point I I reckon this is gonna be a really divided camp on this one.

SPEAKER_01 34:24

I don't think so. I feel like it will be. All right, I'd love to hear people's feedback on this one.

SPEAKER_00 34:29

Yeah, so like because I reckon people will either be vehemently like absolutely, or like, what what is your problem?

SPEAKER_01 34:35

I think, yeah, I'm definitely what is your problem? Really? Yeah, I think go get your coffee, Mary Ann. Smell the roses and get on with your life. Right.

SPEAKER_00 34:44

I'm such a nurturing friend, I'm thank you for the support on this one, Tara. That's okay. No, it's just something that was on my mind and I thought, hmm, that that really bothers me. Not many things bother me, and that doesn't, I see I I find myself sometimes looking out the blinds, peeking out to still like what to see if I can catch them. Because I'm gonna go out and have a conversation with them. I will. I'm not a nasty one, I'm very polite.

SPEAKER_01 35:06

Well, I won't be walking past your house, don't worry. No, I will just say personal experience though. The reason for me, if I'm walking past a bin because it's a bin, I don't care who owns it. Like I'm not just scooping up dog poo without it being in a scented bag, is when you're going for a walk, I'm going for a walk, you know, for my mental health and to get some fresh air. And you want to be free, you don't want to be clenching on to this little dog bag. But is that the whole time?

SPEAKER_00 35:37

Is that not your responsibility to take that home and or put it in your own bin?

SPEAKER_01 35:40

No, because it's gonna wreck my walk. What if my dog Poppy decided to do a poop?

SPEAKER_00 35:44

But why do I have to take on that load for you? Well, I don't see it as you taking on the load, it's just sitting in your outdoor bin. Oh, I'll have a think about it. But no, I'm I'm I'm no, I'm not happy with it.

SPEAKER_01 35:57

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 35:58

Anyway.

SPEAKER_01 35:59

All right, I'd love to see the feedback. I think it's going to be a 90-10. 90 siding with me and 10 with you.

SPEAKER_00 36:05

Oh no, I think there's some closet people out there that are like on my side. So if anyone's listening and wants to have a say on this, please drop us a line.

SPEAKER_01 36:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 36:15

All right, over to you, Tara. What is on your mind?

SPEAKER_01 36:18

Okay, it's actually a little bit of a story. I'll I'll make it quick.

SPEAKER_00 36:22

I love a story.

SPEAKER_01 36:23

Yeah, okay. I was in America last January with my daughter Summer. I went on a solo trip to visit my friend, and we were at San Diego Zoo walking around, and I had this lady stop me and she's like, excuse me. And she, you know, as you do, woman to woman, she's like, Do you happen to have a tampon? I was like, Yeah, I do actually. So I opened up my bag and I got it out and I passed it to her, you know, secretly, like had it in my hand, fully closed. And the look she gave me was just like absolute disgust. Oh. It was a really weird interaction. So I was like, there you go. She's like, uh uh, like I don't even think she said thank you. And I just continued to walk with Sama pushing her in the pram. And I thought, that was so bizarre. And I kept going over and over in my head. I'm like, she did ask for a tampon. Like I didn't hear her incorrectly. Um and it wasn't until I'm not kidding, it would have almost been a year later, so only a couple of months ago, I was laying in bed. I have no idea why it was on my subconscious, but it must have been this one random little interaction. You know when you're lying there about to fall asleep and the weirdest things pop in your brain. Absolutely. And I thought, oh my god, she looked at me like that and it was disgust. I was correct, because I don't know if it's all tampons sold in America, but a lot of them always come with the applicator. Oh, okay. Oh wow, the applicator. Yes. So you know rather than using your your hand. Yes. Or your finger, I should say. Your hand. Oh my god. Um but here in Australia, you can get the ones with the applicator. So much now. I don't see them right now. I think they're available, but I mean we don't you I none of my friends do. I don't. I mean, I hope I'm not the only one, but she it must have just thought, oh my god, like what did you just give me? I don't even know if she recognized it, or they just think, ew, that's gross if you don't have the applicator. But I thought, oh my god, that's so embarrassing.

SPEAKER_00 38:24

So she would have just gone on with the rest of her day thinking, what a disgusting human woman. And then repeated those stories to her friends. And you've been talked about a lot. Yeah. I actually didn't know that. That is oh god, now I'm more anxiety just talking about me to a fresh. She's she's moved on to something else now.

SPEAKER_01 38:44

But isn't it funny how that that's bizarre, but also the fact that it popped up into your mind so much so so long so long later, very random. But anyway, that's what was on my mind that I thought I would share with you today.

SPEAKER_00 38:56

Okay, well, I didn't know that that the applicators were something that are still obviously what they have their main method over in over in the US. Well, thank you for sharing that, Tara. You're so welcome. Uh well, that brings us to the end of our episode. Just want to give you a bit of a heads up to our next episode. Which I'm so excited about. I think I have a lot to learn. It follows on nicely, I think, from this topic as well. Yes. We have a very special guest in. Her name is Taylor Glacken, and she and her husband Sean are parents to quadruplets.

SPEAKER_01 39:34

Well, that is for I have followed Taylor on Instagram for quite some time as soon as the news broke out that she was having quads. And I thought, whoa, what a journey she's been on, right?

SPEAKER_00 39:46

Absolutely. What an experience. That is a lived experience, isn't it? Absolutely. Those beautiful babies, they're now two, I think. So anyway, we have Taylor coming in to have a chat and share her story with us. So I can't wait for that one. Me too. All right. Well, thank you everyone for listening, and we'll see you next time on Lived. Bye. Bye.