Episode 13: “Youth Growing the Future”

In Episode 13 Of Seed and Soil: Unincorporated Voices of Food, Farming, and Freedom, host Sommer Sibilly-Brown sits down with Zavira Wilson, a student at the University of the Virgin Islands and an emerging voice advocating for youth engagement in agriculture and community leadership.

Zavira represents a new generation of Virgin Islanders who understand that food security, community safety, and youth empowerment are deeply connected. Through her work and studies, she is helping to inspire young people to see agriculture not only as a career path, but as a powerful tool for strengthening communities and creating opportunities for the future.

In this episode, Zavira and Sommer discuss:

    •    Why youth involvement in agriculture is essential for the long-term sustainability of the Virgin Islands
    •    How agriculture can play a role in building safer, more connected communities
    •    The importance of mentorship, education, and opportunity for young people interested in farming and food systems

This episode is a reminder that the future of food in the Virgin Islands is already taking root in the hearts and hands of its young people.

Learn more at: https://www.goodfoodvi.org
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Subscribe and follow for more conversations with the farmers, advocates, and leaders growing a more resilient food system in the Virgin Islands.

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:10

Welcome to Of Seed and Soil, unincorporated voices of food, farming, and freedom. I am Summer Sibley Brown, your host, and this podcast is about capturing the stories of farmers, fishers, healers, caregivers, people who eat food, cook food, mech food across the US Virgin Islands, and hopefully we expand out into the Caribbean. And today I have with me Miss Xaviera Wilson.

SPEAKER_00 0:39

Hey Xaviera. Hi Samar. How are you today?

SPEAKER_01 0:41

I'm wonderful. I'm gonna call you Zavy. So, Zavi, one of the reasons I invited you to be on this podcast is one, you came very highly recommended. I want you to know that like the elders in farming was like, you must have Zavy. You must have Zavbi. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_02 0:58

I was like, yes.

SPEAKER_01 1:00

Um, and I was like, I really want Zavy. So this was good. We we matched, but um because I think a lot of times we think that people who are interested in farming are a certain age, right? And we have this view of a farmer as not you, you know, not a young, beautiful person in the prime of their life who is beginning something and just like has this connection. I'm assuming you're gonna tell us about that, but have this connection to Food Farming Earth. So I would love for you to share with us, um, listeners of our podcast, who is Xaviera Wilson?

SPEAKER_00 1:36

Um, I was born here on St. Croix. Um, I was raised in the rainforest. I've always been a bush baby, I've always had a connection to the land. Um we my parents they started Mount Victory Camp, and that was a community space for people to come and live, stay in the rainforest. They had a bar, they would do pig roasts, like they really tried to get people of the Virgin Islands up there to enjoy the space, like join the enjoy the green space. And um, from a young age, I've always been social, I've always been around new people and in the bush. Like I always hear stories about when I was a kid, they'd be like, Yeah, we didn't know where you were, and then we'd look up and you're in the tree.

SPEAKER_02 2:17

Yeah, okay.

SPEAKER_00 2:19

So um that's always been like a deep memory for me, is always being barefoot in the rainforest. Um, but when I was nine years old, my family packed up and we moved to Portland, Oregon, um, which is still very green, very beautiful, but it's a suburban city. So um I kind of had to hide my Virgin Islands identity. Um, it was too cool for kids when I would say, Oh, yeah, the beach and the food and the people and the culture, like it was too much for Portland. Like they didn't see it and appreciate it. It was a jealousy thing, especially at the young age of like 12 and stuff. Um, so I felt like hiding it. I didn't speak of it anymore, I didn't really visit anymore. Um, I lost a lot of like connection to this island. Um but in about 2019, right before COVID hit, um, climate activism became a huge thing from the high schools and middle schools. There were massive strikes where thousands and thousands of students were walking out in the middle of class and marching on our bridges. Portland has like a bunch of bridges, we're known for it. And so we take over a bridge and walk across it. Um, and that was like a very I just that kind of sparked activism for me and advocacy and speaking and like the power you have as a student, especially. Um, but then it also had me thinking about climate and just like the earth that we're on, which is slowly helped me like reconnect the pieces of like I'm supposed to be doing something for the earth. I'm supposed to be part of the earth and connected. And so as I graduated high school, COVID hit. I got I became really, really involved in the George Floyd protests. Okay. I was part of a group, uh, we called it uh PDX Black Youth Movement. Uh it was about 20 of us, um, and we were fundraising for protective gear for us because we were in the like dead center of the protests in Portland. Are you aware of any of the protests?

SPEAKER_01 4:20

No, I like you. I'm quiet because I'm like, I'm in it. So please share more.

SPEAKER_00 4:25

So in Portland, there's a long history of anarchy and Antifa and liberal like movements, mutual aid. And so this kind of like after COVID or during COVID, like sparked it all up. Um, so there was a lot, a lot, a lot of police confrontation, a lot of very intense protests for specifically the bla community in Portland, which not a lot of people know that there is a black community in Portland. So, like the history of Oregon, it's one of the maybe even the first and only white white-only state in Oregon was a white-only state? Yes, and so people moved across, they went through that whole walk across the plains just to go to this white-only state. Um, so they started inviting people of color in to because they could work, they could build the railroads, they could build all these buildings and the dams and everything. And so there's always been communities of color, but they've always been workers and they've always been kept tightly knit. And so in Portland specifically, they've been moved all across Portland, like in different the gentrification in Portland is so intense and so serious. They were literally herd like cattle all throughout Portland. And so that kind of made the community really tight knit and very strong, and but it's kind of quiet, like people not you have to look for it, you have to find it.

SPEAKER_01 5:45

I have like literally what you were sharing, I have no idea. Like my brain is going like because like I want to go home, I'm like, I want to research it. So, yeah, keep going. This is good. Yeah, I'm learning.

SPEAKER_00 5:57

Um, so I went to a high school called Jefferson High School, it's the only uh historically black high school in Oregon. And um I kind of went to it at its downfall, unfortunately, um, because as of now it's majority we majority white. Um so when I was there, it was the last couple years of it being majority black. So this is because the gentrification around Jefferson High School has gotten so bad that all of the black families are now moving out, even outside of Portland proper area. We no longer they no longer have ability to be there.

SPEAKER_01 6:32

So after high school, then you choose to well the protests were really intense for me.

SPEAKER_00 6:39

Um I was really in the thick of it, um, especially with this organization that I was there to create. Um, we tried to, I mean, we did create a 501 prop nonprofit. We were you when you guys created this 501c4. I was 18. Okay. Actually, I was no, I was under 18 because I couldn't be technically a part of it. I was 17.

SPEAKER_01 7:01

But you were part of the process. Part of the process, but you made an advocacy, you were a founding member of an advocacy organization, which is what a 501c4 is. Yes, right. That's a nonprofit status.

SPEAKER_00 7:13

Not C4 because it's kind of stupid now that I look at it older, but like we chose a C4 because we wanted people to donate the money because they wanted the money, not because it's not stupid now that I say it though. They wanted we wanted to donate the money because they want that money to go to the right place, not because they're trying to get a tax benefit off of it. Um it was more of like a a statement for us to do it.

SPEAKER_01 7:35

No, I think it sounds really smart in the Virgin Islands. Um, I don't know of any, they may exist, but one of the things that I think about in terms of the work I do as a 501c3 is that we do need a 501c4 arm. We do need an arm of our work that is just for like advocacy and lobbying and like really taking the policy fight on because as a 501c3, there's limitations, right? We can educate, we can advocate, and there's a small portion of what we can do that is lobbying, but there's a lot of work to change policy that and and so I I agree, I think it's really smart, and I am like super impressed um with the fact that young people, no matter where you are, right? Virgin Islands, Oregon, like took up that charge to see something that they wanted to change in their community and they organized and formalized.

SPEAKER_00 8:31

Like exactly that process, Portland taught me that process as a 17-year-old. I can start a 50C4 and do so much change. We made fundraised around $30,000 and we directly distributed it to black families and black students and black people. We didn't do any like go or like we supported GoFundMe's. We were Venmoing people. One of our one of my favorite fundraisers we did is we directly uh supported people's Thanksgiving dinners and their Christmases. So we supported like six families. We bought all of their Christmas presents that year so that those kids could be have a good Christmas, you know? Like we really just wanted the money to go directly back to the community in ways that we weren't seeing with the organizations that were there. Um, because we saw we saw a lot of adults making a lot of bad mistakes and being bad leaders for us, and so we took their mistakes and tried to do better.

SPEAKER_01 9:25

As an adult who probably at times is a bad leader. I just like want two examples. Like, what are some of the decisions that you see adults in leadership make blanketly that you're like, hey, that's actually maybe not the right decision that you wish you could have informed differently?

SPEAKER_00 9:42

Um, uh, some of the groups would take the money and support white people because they were activists in the community, they were putting a lot of work into the community, so they were putting the money into them, and there was a lot of debate as to where money should go, how it should be used. And for us, it's so simple. Money goes back to black people, goes back to supporting the cause and back to helping us stay safe in the streets, especially because we were young. Um, we got a lot of support for that because we were there not only to help uplift black voices, but protect black voices out there because we were getting targeted, we were getting doxxed. Um, like a lot of my friends, like we found what is doxxed? One of my friends, we found a website, her father's name, her mother's name, her home address, her school, her entire is sitting there, and we've had specific people coming after us, looking after us. It gave like another reason I came to St. Croix is like the intense paranoia that Trump supporters and um people who were against George Floyd gave us. They really were scared by children fighting for their existence, they were terrified. They came after children because we tried to protect and amplify our voice.

SPEAKER_01 11:02

You gave me goosebumps. Um, and the reason being is because currently in the farm community, with the state of like immigration and the need for advocacy and the need for people to speak up and stand up and amplify voices and protect at my ripe old age of 47, right? It's actually the first time I heard the term doxxed, right? And so I was like, well, what's that? Right, understanding that people who across the US who are trying to amplify voices, who are trying to protect people, like there's a place where all of their information is stored and they're being watched, right? And they're like on this watch list, and like their houses are getting phone calls, and so I can't imagine um one experiencing that myself, right? Because we live in a world where that doesn't happen in this way. Yeah, um, you know, there's there's a layer of safety being here. So like I don't know if Virgin Islanders, um, maybe other Caribbean islands, you know, might experience it, but I don't necessarily know that that's something that to live in the US Virgin Islands, you have like a fear or even an understanding of what that means. And to go through that at 17, yeah. Wow. Okay, so you're activated, you're active, you're part of this movement, you create a 5014. How did you end up coming home?

SPEAKER_00 12:27

Um, for everything was becoming too much. So during online school, I decided to start taking semesters down here. Um, so my parents we kept property in the rainforest um and we started building. So I would just join my dad for a couple months and start helping him. And so that involved um painting the house, planting trees, a lot of just sitting around and doing nothing, walking down to the beach, and all of that just like calmed my brain down in a way that it hadn't been calm in so long. And then watching my parents farm and like getting back into that, like waking up early and doing the work you need to do, and then you can go to sleep and have a great night's sleep. Like that process was just like a cool blanket over my brain that I hadn't had in a long time. So I um when I graduated, uh, the School of Agriculture had just opened up. It was its uh second year being open, and its first year of like announcing it and welcoming a lot of new students. And so I found that that was like alignment perfectly, aligned perfectly with me of like finishing high school, wanting to come back to St. Croix and wanting to do agricultural work. Um, I remember the like realization I had one day. I was like, I was like, I don't know what to do, what my major is gonna be in school, like it's just so much, there's so many options and choices. And I literally just sat there and I looked at a tree.

SPEAKER_01 13:53

Back to the tree. Tree is a tree's a focal point.

SPEAKER_00 13:56

And the tree was, I didn't, it didn't, I was just looking at the tree and I was like, yeah, I like trees. Back to the tree. Let me let me look at this tree thing, let me think about this tree a little longer. Um, and so I looked into botany, agriculture, plant science. Um, I landed on plant science because I didn't know too much about like vascular systems of plants and like the process of crop science and everything. So I wanted to like really understand the nitty-girdy.

SPEAKER_01 14:21

Um, you just said something that I want to highlight vascular systems of plants.

SPEAKER_00 14:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:26

Um, when we talk about the vascular system in the human body, we're talking about basically veins, capillaries where blood and oxygen and nutrients travel. And you're saying that plants have a similar system. They have a similar system. Get out! Who knew? Who knew? Uh no, and seriously, I didn't know. I mean a little bit, but to the point that it's actually called the vascular system of the plant. I didn't know that.

SPEAKER_00 14:54

Yeah, it's like even with the soil, there's capillary systems, like the plants, the way it moves nutrients up and down. It's really similar to the human body. Like we have a lot of similarities with plants. Um, but yeah.

SPEAKER_01 15:08

No, okay. So I wanted to bring this up. Do you remember? I remember now. So do you remember where we met?

SPEAKER_00 15:17

Now that you, yes, it was the um ag business boot camp that I had said to.

SPEAKER_01 15:22

James Amps Institute.

SPEAKER_00 15:24

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 15:25

What happened on Sejia Farm? Do you remember your project?

SPEAKER_00 15:27

Yes, I remember. Um, it was a flower project, and so it was multi-levels to it. So it's like a flower farm to have fresh cut flowers. At the same time, it's renting land from farmers. At the same time, it's also beekeeping because if you have bees on the property, it's helping our flowers, but also the farmer.

SPEAKER_01 15:48

So I remember because I um so the Amps Institute, um, you know, for our listeners, it was a was it a three-day, four-day yeah, it was like three days. It was a three-day weekend institute that took what it was like kids ages 14 to maybe 18 or 20. Yeah. Kids of 14 to 20, and like it was uh agricultural intensive where they had to, it was a business intensive where they had to build an agricultural business. And I um I was a judge. Yeah. Um, and I remember sitting down and looking at the layers of the flower project, and it stood out because it did have those three things, and it was this desire to increase um pollinators through this like lease me a piece of your land, we'll plant the pollinator bed, but we'll also get cut flowers from it. And I thought it was pretty smart. So I from the first time we met, I was like, Oh, this is really, really good. And I remember telling you, I know a flower grower, Gary Matheson, um, who lives in Maine. And I was like, when he comes on island, I want to make sure you all meet. So, like, that was our first intersection. How old were you then? Like 18. 18. Um, and then you know, like our world's touch points, and then I realized that in the very small island that is St. Croix, my dad knows your dad. Like, of course, and my mom was like, It's like, Matilda, Bruce, and then I found out that my dad's your dad's friend, and so we are about 30 years apart in age, right? But like still, there's just these small intersections of relationship that happen. Um, when you live in Oregon or when you live in the US Virgin Islands, right? Community matters. Um, and to the farming community, I want to say I think your generation is a really precious commodity. So you looked at the tree, you chose agriculture as your major. It's been a two-year journey so far. Three years. Three-year journey. What has did you do? This is gonna be a hindsight question. You think you made the right choice? Are you still interested? Did you fall more in love, or do you feel like you were disillusioned? Like, what has happened for the now 20-year-old, 21-year-old? 21, almost 22. 21-year-old, almost 22, Zavy, in terms of like this three years and this choice.

SPEAKER_00 18:22

Yeah. Um, I still stand by it. I think I made a great choice. Um, not only for my education, I got to learn about this island in ways that I never could have. Um, like getting an education in the States and coming down here would be such a different experience. I'd have to relearn everything. So getting to learn about the world, but specifically from the VI perspective, is beautiful. Like it's really been nice to take things from the world, the US to St. Croix specifically. That's how every single one of my classes were around, or how they went. Um, not only that, I was able to reconnect with my community and meet so many new people. My favorite thing about the School of Agriculture is the fact that half my class is traditional students, so people my age, and the other half of the class is over the age of 60. And so I am learning all these new things as a student, but then also I'm learning about life from these 60-year-olds. Like it was they knew so much about every topic, they had so much insight about life that like every day was like a life lesson, a college class, like a new friend to be made.

SPEAKER_01 19:35

So you there is an intergenerational bridge being built there, and I didn't know that, and I think that could probably, like you said, most students attending larger universities, not here, they're not having that experience. I'm sure there are older people in their class, but to say like half of my class is above 60 while the other half is like in between like 18 to 22, like that connection that's super beautiful. And I don't I don't think many people here who live here even realize that's happening, but there's definitely a transfer on knowledge benefit. Okay, and I and I have actually thought about like do I want to take a class? Do I have time to take a class? Um, just to get into the more specifics of growing, so plant science. What do you intend to do with it? Like, if you get it when you graduate with your degree, what do you intend to do with it?

SPEAKER_00 20:35

Well, I did plant science at UVI. I got my associates with it. Um, thank you. I um decided to expand beyond that. Um, I'm happy that I have a really good understanding of how plants work, um, but I want to understand the environment around them and how it how they relate to each other, how humans relate to it. Um, so I'm doing a bachelor's in natural resources and environmental management this upcoming semester at the University of Hawaii. So I'm expanding beyond it a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 21:10

Environmental science.

SPEAKER_00 21:11

So this is management.

SPEAKER_01 21:14

Environmental science management. On one of the episodes, um actually we speak to Luca Gaspari. And I am talking to Luca and he is talking about all of his, like, I'm like, what do you hate, Luca? And Luca's like, you know, you Luca so sweet. He's like, well, if the thing that's giving me the most trouble is he talks about like rodents, he talks about drought systems, and then he talks about wildfires, right? And those are all so what we come to is right, like the things that are driving him, um, or the things that he finds most challenging on the farm are all things that have to do with climate and environment. So when you say environmental. Management, what is your best understanding of what that job could look like? I don't know. Like, and you don't you don't have to get right or wrong. Like, this is the exploration. Like, what do you think it'll be like? What do you think you'll be able to do when you're done? Or hope you'll be able to do when you're done.

SPEAKER_00 22:17

Well, yeah, I'm not. I've done a natural resources training course. So I know Luca because we um I was part of this group and we, it was a natural resources training group. We went to Luca's farm and we spent many days working on his farm, planning about his farm, um, creating a like farm management, not farm management plan, um, I'm forgetting the word right now. It's been a while. But um, we created this plan for him to be able to help him as a farmer, but help the environment around him. Um, this was with the NRCS as well. So using working with the government and being able to help farmers get the money from the government, which I had never dealt with NRCS or any of that part of the government before. And that is a headache. I will say that. Um, it's hard. There are so many um steps you have to do to be able to get this money, and as a farmer, I don't know how they would be able to do that and grow their plants at the same time and produce. Like you need someone to be specialized in this to be able to help the farmer.

SPEAKER_01 23:22

Correct.

SPEAKER_00 23:23

So that's kind of what I am. I want to be able to help farmers. I want to be able to help them do the legwork that they can't really do because they need to be out on the field.

SPEAKER_01 23:33

So I get that. So, like at VI Good Food, right? One of the things that we do is technical assistance. Um, and we find ourselves in trainings with partner agencies on how to do just that, how to navigate NRCS, how to navigate um FSA, how to fill out their forms, how to advocate for yourselves, um, you know, how to execute your contract. So there is that is a whole skill set that is necessary. And I think when I talk to farmers, that's what I hear. It's like, hi, I'm a farmer and I'm farming. And so I get that you want me to write grants to support my business. I get that you'd like to see a business plan. I get that you would like to see my pesticide management plan. I get that you would like to see my farm layout, you know, like all the things, my farm management plan, wonderful. In the Virgin Islands, we have a lot of smallholder farms who are either single-person farms or just like husbands and wives, and they also have to have a job. So, like here, I don't know, there's a great need for that skill set. There's a great need for one, a person to train other people on how to support farmers, and two to give that direct support. So I'm super happy that you are going to Hawaii. Are you excited? And what was the application process like?

SPEAKER_00 24:58

Um, so last year I was lucky enough, lucky enough to do an internship with the Hawaii Ulu Cooperative. Um, so I'm very interested in cooperatives, and really I'm interested in how farmers can get support without the government, how we can support each other as the community can support farmers, how farmers can support farmers. Um and there's just I see uh I don't see the need to rely, like we shouldn't be so focused on how do we get the government when we don't have the backbone ourselves to be able to support each other. And so with cooperatives, as a farmer, you are in charge of your business. You are making these decisions, and you have the ability to like help yourselves help your other farmers, and the community can chip into it. I love cooperatives. If you ask any of my classmates, they're like zero cooperatives.

SPEAKER_01 25:49

Let's talk about cooperatives, right? So let's talk about cooperatives. From your knowledge, what are like the basic principles of cooperatives?

SPEAKER_00 25:58

Um you need a group of farmers who are facing the same issue, who are passionate about this issue and want it to be fixed. You need them, you need to follow the framework of the cooperatives, um, making sure that it's really the farmers, the board of directors and all of them who are making or the board of directors, sorry, the members who are making these decisions and getting the help that they need. Um, cooperatives have failed many times on this island, and so that's something it's been really interesting researching it, talking to um different people who have been involved in those cooperatives, hearing why they failed, learning why a cooperative failed is the best way to make a cooperative so that you can learn from those mistakes.

SPEAKER_01 26:43

So I myself also did research. So um, and I do know that you're right, in our community, um, there are cooperative efforts that have failed. If you what do you think? I don't what do you think, why do you think it failed?

SPEAKER_00 27:07

Um, not following the rules behind a cooperative. There to be a cooperative, you have to have follow these very specific ways of incorporate creating your cooperative. Um, when I've looked in the past, especially the more recent cooperative, it wasn't a cooperative, it was a business kind of, or it was, I don't even know what you would call it, but it wasn't following the rules that you need. Um, another step is trusting each other, like having a community. Like farmers are very like, and I don't blame them, they're on their own. They have to get the things done for their farms however they need to do it, for their animals, for their plants. And so they've kind of got a tunnel vision sometimes of like, this is how I've done it for so long. This is the only way I know how to do it. I'm not gonna deter from this path, otherwise, that might cost me money. And so, kind of I'm hoping to be able to show farmers that like it's not bad, like just because it failed in the past doesn't mean it's not gonna work, um, doesn't mean you can't trust it. Because, like, in the end, a cooperative is going to help everybody involved if you do it right.

SPEAKER_01 28:13

So, it like in my experience, I think you said the key word. Well, you said a few important things. You said following the cooperative model. In my research, I feel like people did try to follow the cooperative model. I felt like we are you remember they made this film about education waiting for Superman?

SPEAKER_00 28:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:38

I think that um in some cases farmers are waiting for Superman. Um, and so any person who comes forward and speaks up or has a little bit of bandwidth, we tend to strap a cape on their back and then we default action to them, even in our cooperative model. So Xavi and Summer are a member of a cooperative, you have a little bit of advocacy experience, I have a little bit of a nonprofit experience. All of a sudden, the other four or five people they step back and they start to default to they they force us into a position, a superimposed position of leadership. So then we start taking on decision making, right? And that one member, one vote kind of thing doesn't work. But when it starts not going right, all of a sudden there's like blame aside. And I know it's not that simple, right? But I think that that's one of the problems. Like our cooperative mindset has to be cultivated with one technical assistance. There has to be real-time support to make sure, like training wheels that while we are becoming a cooperative, we are being guided in that development. So I think you're you're on target there. I think trust. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00 29:52

It's a big one, yeah. Like people aren't trusting.

SPEAKER_01 29:56

Um, I think people aren't trusting. I think the the inherent implications of past failure and a society that has learned um blame and shame as a mechanism for justice, right? And that's not the farming community. To me, that's the Virgin Islands, right? Unfortunately or fortunately, we have on another podcast episode, we talked about how young we are in governance, right? Yeah, um, and in that podcast, like as a measure of our usefulness, like there is some maturity that has to happen in terms of like you were 17 and you understood, and the group of young people you understood in the community where you existed, that the mechanism for change, yes, it is advocacy and uplifting voice, but needed forms of organization, and you were able to foster and build yourselves in to an organized body that had a focus, which I interpreted as direct support to the most impacted, exactly, right? So, this is who's impacted by the issue, this is where our resource goes, and we've organized ourselves to fundraise to do just that.

SPEAKER_03 31:13

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 31:14

We have advocacy, right? People raising their voice, but uh it quickly devolves from being like issue-driven to personal, right? Like we're we're we blame each the government blames farmers. We also talked about this on another episode. Farmers blame the government, right? Like we're in this cycle of blame and shaming each other very loudly. You ever seen a movie Shaka Zulu? No, doom doom doom doom doom, right? In the beginning of Shaka Zulu, like my mom loves it, like by it, ungozulu. Like I can hear the song in my in my head right now. But the two villages, as before Shaka Zulu in the movie, engages in actual warfare and building swords and like knives, and he's villages used to shout and scream at each other and throw rocks from across a distance, right? But it was a shouting, a loud, loud shouting match. I feel like that's what we're doing. It's a loud, loud shouting match where people throwing pebbles, but there's actually very little progress in solutions that you're saying a cooperative could be a part of, and the thing we gotta tackle is trust.

SPEAKER_00 32:26

Well, even before a cooperative can happen, like one of the main things I learned in Portland was mutual aid. So like creating bring it all, bring it all, Zavi! Creating these networks where you are getting close to your neighbors, where you can rely on your neighbors. So I think that first we have to do just the first step of like trusting each other before we can go into business with each other. Like that's it's a big step. Cooperatives are a lot of work and involve a lot of resources and money, but um, mutual aids don't. They require you to want to see your neighbor thrive. And um, when I was in Vermont last year, we met, it was so cool. We were in Vermont, in the middle of Vermont, doing whatever. And this group from Puerto Rico was also in the middle of Vermont doing this like agroecology workshop. And so we met with them and they were talking about how in Puerto Rico they do brigades, they all gather together. Hey, Xavima, go say it, say it, say it, talk about the things. When I was in Hawaii last year, did they do the same thing? I don't see that happening on this island. Can I I don't see us going to farms and just doing it?

SPEAKER_01 33:38

So um, this is so good. So, in um this next iteration of Virginia's Good Food, we also have been traveling to Puerto Rico and we actually just came back from big brigading in Vieques. Um, and we're working with farmers all across the Caribbean to begin to build like this network, and so we have partners, we part of literally I wrote this week in a grant to help support the research for mutual aid development in the Virgin Islands and what forms it could take across island. Because what we saw when we went to so El Ancong is this place in Loisa that is historically known for like being the place where the Ankong, the barge, used to travel across water, but on their historical family property, they have a small community garden um which people come every weekend and work from like 7 to 12 every day just working in the garden, and the food is free for community. Then we learned about Hosco Bravo, and Hosco Bravo is a place that has made a thousand new and beginning new farmers, right? And they do it, and brigading is part of the structure of how you earn your like their certification. Like you go through some weeks with them, but then you brigade. So I was like a saffron. They do they do they do brigading where they do regional brigading two times a year. Um, my friend Blaine, they do solidarity brigading. He came down here after the hurricane to help repair. So this mutual aid system, I think, is where the next step is. Yes, and it requires relationship. It requires relationship, it requires commitment to each other. And so actually, we have an episode with um La Colmena Simarrona from Vegas where they do weekly brigading and monthly brigading, right? So, yes, to the mutual aid network. I like I think that is where that is exactly where we start. And young people are brilliant because to tell you the truth, I have not heard um I'm learning this now, but I haven't heard anyone else in our community really be like, we need mutual aid networks.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

Um, so and yeah, in Oregon, there's a place or there's a group called the Oregon Land, Oregon Black Land Trust. Um they're giving like they're trying to find black farmers and giving them the land that they need. They do the brigades, they help them support to be able to create the farm of their dreams, like doing whatever with Lamb, if it's wooling, if it's tree orchards, like it's they there's a lot of examples in the states that we can draw from. It's not going to be the same, but we can get a lot of good ideas for it.

SPEAKER_01 36:33

Hence why we like, okay, just fund us to do some research to figure out because the challenge for our mutual aid is I'm thinking, okay, so we have we will have on-island mutual aid systems, but there are times where we will need inter-island mutual aid systems, right? Um, one for like how do you use mutual aid for resilience in terms of disaster recovery? But then how do you use mutual aid for skill building, like to share agroecological labor? I mean, like labor, like land practices, and then there's the labor and workforce need. People don't have labor, affordable labor here, or skilled labor. So, like if I'm building this mutual aid network, we can actually use mutual aid to sow and harvest weed tend, right? And there's mutual benefit, right? Mutual aid also means mutual benefit.

SPEAKER_00 37:27

I want to say too though, we are kind of already doing mutual aid.

SPEAKER_01 37:30

Talk to me.

SPEAKER_00 37:31

It's whenever a hurricane comes, passes through us, everybody gets together and is checking on their neighbors, checking on their house, clearing the roads without WAPA, like doing at least this might be this the rainforest, but we are we got our chain, like we get groups of people, we got our chainsaws, we're going through and doing all of that. That is mutual aid, but we're doing it in a time of need where it's urgent and it's you have to do it quickly. And I learned in Portland when you have that sense of urgency, you kind of lose a lot of like connection and friendship that you could have done. So, like, if we were to get that same energy that we would have after a hurricane of needing to support each other, but without that sense of like, oh, we need to do this now, and like more calm, we'll be able to kind of start building on that.

SPEAKER_01 38:17

So I think you just highlighted that the yes, I do agree that we do mutual aid already, and that we need to look at the rainforest and the farmers or people who live in the rainforest and their response, or even not just the rainforest, but in our communities, right? Disaster community level disaster response and learn from what individual communities are already doing to be like here's where mutual aid exists, and name it as that. So people don't think it's a new foreign thing coming from the outside that somebody you know trying to put on top of us, but actually elevate internally where does mutual aid exist already? Yeah, how can we iterate it to serve other needs? That's also very smart. I see why the people then were saying you have to have zombie. So, okay, so you will in the next two years or so graduate with your degree. You will be um pre prepared to provide support and assistance to farmers um by environmental emergency, event environmental farm management planning and how to well okay.

SPEAKER_00 39:31

My main plan is I'm gonna go to Hawaii, get my degree, immediately come back here as well as fast as I can. You're coming back! I'm definitely coming back. I am yes, I am leaving for my education and I'm excited to for my new experiences, but I'm very happy to come back. Like coming back from high school to hear you didn't even know how to make my heart so happy. It just Saint Coin is it, you know, it's a secret thing. Say again, Saint Love. Saint Coin is it. This is sad. Like, I don't know where else I'm gonna go.

SPEAKER_01 40:01

I could at least find across this table and just like hug you because I think I hear so many young people who feel like in order to live a good life, they have to leave here. Um, and in some instances, I see what they're talking about, and I'm just like, you are our most precious resource. What do I have to do to help you want to stay? Yeah, what do you need? Tell us what do you need? What do you think? This is a good maybe you could help enlighten that because I'm so happy. Like, what is you said St. Croix is it? What makes St. Croix it for you? Like, you feel like I want to be here.

SPEAKER_00 40:36

The community. Like, I coming back and like going to the grocery store and running into the auntie you haven't seen in years and catching up with them. You can't do that in other places. At least I can't, because this is like where my family is. This is where I've grown up. When I drive around, I have so many memories of my childhood. Every year, every month there's a new fruit coming off the trees.

SPEAKER_01 40:59

You are making my heart sing.

SPEAKER_00 41:01

There's so much beauty on this island, and I even I've been here two years, and I still like it's every month is like a new, it's like I just got back.

SPEAKER_01 41:11

It's it's beautiful. Yeah, no, I um I feel emotional because it's just like this is what if I could bottle this feeling because this is what I feel about home, yeah, right. And I find so many people don't sometimes share that sentiment because we have a lot of issues, yeah. You know, um, we have a lot of issues around farming, we have a lot of issues around healthcare, around education. Um, you name the systems, and we're like, we have issues. Um, and I'm always like, but what place doesn't? Right? Like at different scales, like different places have different conveniences, like every place has their beauty and every place has their challenge, but the fact that the people of here like don't find value in it sometimes, it like literally breaks my heart. So you are filling me so much to hear that oh, there are young because where there's one, there's two, yeah, right? And where there's two, there's four. Where there's four, there's eight. And so, you know, in my world, I'm I'm in writing, I'm I'm working, I'm I'm trying to get into the system. So to know that maybe there's eight or sixteen or thirty-two people out there in Xavi's age group who are like, no, I want to be here. St. Corey's it for me. That was like super filling. I feel great.

SPEAKER_00 42:28

So when I get back, there is a in DPNR, there's a newly funded organized, not organization, division, TIPA, territorial parks and protected areas. Um, they are just now starting to be able to like really start building a park system on this island. And so I'm very interested in that because um I just think especially like getting youth like into the park system. Like I grew up in Oregon doing like park summer camps all the time. So I was in nature all the time, even when I was up there. Like our kids need to be out touching grass every single day if they can. Like they that is, I think, the disconnect that is happening, why we are importing so much food, why we are throwing our garbage outside of our car window, because we don't see that beauty in the island anymore. People, I love it. I live in the I drive up Creaky Dam every day. My favorite thing is seeing people on Creaky Dam sitting there taking it in, going to the pools and washing their hair, like walking up and down with their kids, going and picking all the mangoes off the bush mangoes everywhere. It is beautiful, and I wish I saw it more all over the island of people really enjoying the nature and the beauty that we have around.

SPEAKER_01 43:44

So I think it's possible. And again, it goes back to relationship, right? Like if you don't have a relationship with the environment, then you won't see value in it. I was talking to her name is Cynthia Burgos from La Marrana in Puerto Rico. And she was the first person who said to me, We were talking, um, we're talking about environment. And she was like, humans don't, until we monetize the ecosystem services that are provided to us, this is these were, I think, I'm paraphrasing, right? We won't, we won't have value for it because right now in the capitalist world that we live in, value is associated with cost or dollar, right? So until you can monetize how much air costs, how much you know, clean water running outside costs, how much grass costs, people aren't gonna see the value in it unless we revert to what our ancestors did and just go be in relationship with it, right?

SPEAKER_00 44:41

Um, I was uh I went to this meeting for the Black Heritage Tree project that's happening soon. It's a very cool project if you don't know what it is. It's and it's beautiful. They're planning on like getting uh more just uh more understanding of like different old trees on this island that have historical and cultural value to it. Um, but one of the we were talking about like how to get youth involved into the project, and someone brought up how if we gave each child one tree to look after, and that was their tree to watch after for the next 20 years of their life, that could like easily just bring a connection to nature right away. This is your tree, take care of your tree, watch your tree, clean the garbage up around your tree, go sit next to your tree. Like, we there's a lot of ideas out there that we can do that can just get our kids involved with it, like get them touching grass. That's a meme out in the world to help, like put your phone down, go touch grass, and I think that really works for our as we round out our conversation.

SPEAKER_01 45:45

Question Do you consider yourself a farmer because you grew up on a farm?

SPEAKER_00 45:51

Um, I consider myself a farmer because I grow and sell produce.

SPEAKER_01 45:58

You grow and sell produce. Um, do you think no matter what you do, farming will be part of your lifestyle?

SPEAKER_00 46:07

Always. I am currently in my mind trying to figure out how to make a bush tea garden in Hawaii. Do they have lemongrass? Someone let me know.

SPEAKER_01 46:15

I think we can find that out. I have some friends. Um and what is if you could tell another young person or old person, because apparently your class is filled with both, um, one thing about why they need to consider agriculture, food production, or even environment to work. What's that message?

SPEAKER_00 46:40

When you plant a seed, take care of the plant, and harvest the fruit, there is no joy, like the feeling that you get from doing that, especially your first time doing it, it you it's so nice and calming in your brain. You didn't walk to the store and pay money for it, you put it in the dirt next to your house and grew it. Like that, everybody has the ability to do that. We don't need to be relying on the grocery store as much as we do when we can do something in our backyard that brings us way more joy and way more happiness, way more time, more money, but more joy. And I just think people should follow that a little bit more.

SPEAKER_01 47:19

I think people should follow their joy. I want to thank you for sharing your story. I want to thank you for your courage because it takes courage to share your voice and protect the voices of others. And I want to tell you how excited I am for who you are becoming and what that will mean to not just the Virgin Islands but humanity. Um, and you can expect an invitation back because I don't want all the tea, I don't want all the updates. I'm gonna I'm gonna want to know if your bush tea garden survives in Hawaii. Um, and if you are just joining us for the first time, we hope you enjoyed this episode. Please like, subscribe, share. If you know if bush tea could grow in Hawaii, leave it in the comments so Zabby can know. And also, you know, the charge today is try it out, get a seed, go outside, plant it next to your house, nurture it, take care of it, watch it grow, and let us know if it brings you just a little bit more joy um than getting it from the grocery store. Thank you so much for watching.