"Don't shoot the food!" - Gauntlet, Knightmare and a discussion about completing games (ReBoot s1e9)

Chris and Peter return to Mainframe to discuss Season 1, Episode 9 of ReBoot, “Wizards, Warriors and a Word from Our Sponsor.” When the episode's fantasy-themed game evokes memories of the arcade classic Gauntlet, the brothers find themselves reflecting on how they play games now compared to when they were younger.

Do we play games differently as adults? Have modern games trained us to focus on finishing stories rather than simply playing for fun? Or are there just different kinds of gamers? This sparks a wide-ranging discussion covering everything from Manic Miner, Jet Set Willy, the Dizzy games and Atic Atac, through to modern experiences like Marvel's Spider-Man 2 and Sea of Thieves.

The conversation also ventures into fantasy gaming history, revisiting classics such as Ultima, Shadowlands, and early Dungeons & Dragons-inspired titles like Eye of the Beholder. Along the way, Chris and Peter reminisce about iconic 90s UK children's television, including Knightmare and Bad Influence!

From arcade fantasy adventures and bedroom coding classics to modern open worlds and TV nostalgia, it's another journey through gaming history inspired by classic kids TV show, ReBoot.

Noobs by C.G. Regan

Cover Art by Charlotte Regan

Music by Peter Regan

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Welcome to Noobscast, the podcast where two lifelong gamers discuss video game adjacent media. I'm Chris Regan and I'm joined by my brother Pete. In this first season we're talking about the 90s TV series reboot, which was a kids' TV series set inside a computer system. Pete's seen the whole thing, I haven't. Each episode reboot featured the characters playing a video game, so as well as discussing the episode itself, we'll also use the games featured in the episode to talk about our video game memories. If you enjoyed the episode, please do follow us on whichever platform you're listening on and also consider leaving the reboot. Episode 9. We did episode 8. So this one has a a game we can talk about, and and as established last episode, we haven't played any games outside of Mouse PI. And I don't know, have you played any games? I could ask the question. No, you talked about Sherlock Holmes. That's you did play a game.

SPEAKER_00 1:05

I played a game.

SPEAKER_03 1:06

I'm getting confused. I haven't played any games. You played a game, I haven't played any games. There's no new games.

SPEAKER_00 1:12

There's no new games. There's no time to play new games.

SPEAKER_03 1:14

No. So we'll go straight on because this is a good episode, I thought.

SPEAKER_00 1:18

It was, although I didn't write much down.

SPEAKER_03 1:20

Well, it sort of just plays out then.

SPEAKER_00 1:22

Despite only just watching it ten minutes before we started recording.

SPEAKER_03 1:26

So this one is episode nine, Wizards, Warriors, and a word from our sponsor. So it's about how annoying Mike TV is. Is he called Mike TV?

SPEAKER_00 1:34

He is called Mike TV. I wrote this down before he said he's called Mike TV. It's because of Willy Wonka.

SPEAKER_03 1:39

Yeah. But I don't think it's an actual TV.

SPEAKER_00 1:41

He's also called but in Willy Wonker, he's not called Mike TV though, is he?

SPEAKER_03 1:45

He's called Mike. Hang on.

SPEAKER_00 1:48

He's called Mike TV, is he?

SPEAKER_03 1:49

Are you sure he's not called Mike TV in Willy Wonker? Willie Wonker. Mike TV. He's Mike TV. Oh last name TV.

SPEAKER_00 1:58

First name Mike.

SPEAKER_03 1:59

Yeah. So no, I think. I mean, I assume it's a reference. Yes. I don't know. Is it because or is it just that it is a TV? And it could be one of those things where you're like, Mike TV sounds about right, but without thinking about it, and then they then it's called Mike TV. I've done this before when you're writing stuff, you go that sounds like a cool name. That sounds like it works. And then you put it in something, and then you go, Oh, hang on, that's because of that. I've just nicked it.

SPEAKER_00 2:25

I think it's a reference. I think knowing every book has references left, right, and centre.

SPEAKER_03 2:30

I think it's a definite reference. So Mike TV's being annoying, and then Ryan. Because he won't shut up, basically.

SPEAKER_00 2:39

And then how do they get into the the game just starts?

SPEAKER_03 2:42

They just straight away, isn't it? The game comes in.

SPEAKER_00 2:44

Dot and Enzo go around to see Bob. Bob's hiding behind his couch. Yeah. Because Mike TV is Mike TV. Bob's very angry in this episode.

SPEAKER_03 2:51

Yeah, he is, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:52

Uncharacteristically so.

SPEAKER_03 2:54

Yeah. But they don't address that. That's not what the episode's about.

SPEAKER_00 2:57

It's quite angry at everyone.

SPEAKER_03 2:59

Yeah. Well, so then they're in the game and they are in a fantasy game, and like so we can discuss what type of game it is in a bit, but like there are different character classes, and Bob is annoyed, rightly so, because he is the thief character, and Mike TV has ended up as the warrior. I would also be annoyed because I tend to pick warrior type in games. Like it's not like a personality thing, I don't consider myself a warrior, but like in games, and normally I want a character where I can press one button to fight, and that's all I have to do. Whereas if you're like a thief and you have to use strategico, it's strategico involved and hiding and hypocritical. Hiding.

SPEAKER_00 3:43

He only has a dagger in this a button like.

SPEAKER_03 3:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:48

But true. You tend to only have daggers and you're supposed to just hide, be stealth, James stealth.

SPEAKER_03 3:54

Yeah. And so Dot is a wizard and Enzo's an elf. A wizard. An elf. What game did you think this was doing? I think it was very clearly doing one particular game, but I want to see if you agree.

SPEAKER_00 4:07

So my brain initially put it all doesn't make sense. So I've gone through it's there's two games.

SPEAKER_03 4:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 4:14

Because I think initially I see elf and you go, oh, it's it's it's just Dungeons and Dragons. There wasn't a Dungeons Dragons video game. I don't think Boulder's Gate had come out at that point.

SPEAKER_03 4:24

Had the arcade come out?

SPEAKER_00 4:26

But then I think it was going down the route. I don't know actually. Because then I thought it was going down the route of Gauntlet.

SPEAKER_03 4:33

That's what I thought. So I think clearly Gauntlet. It's the way they do the levels, because there's 50,000 levels. The thing with Gauntlet was they had millions of levels. I was gonna check and I didn't, so I have to check now. Because I always remember that Gauntlet, we had to obviously it was an arcade. So Gauntlet was like a top-down arcade. It was like one of the I mean it's probably not the first one because I know who knows, but it was like a dungeon, one of the first dungeon crawler games. It was top-down. You could pick one of four characters. I think it was famous for having the sort of one of those four voices, and it had the arcade machine had four joysticks, so you could have four people playing gauntlet. Um yeah, it was a it was a sort of barbarian, an elf, a wizard, or a velky. That means uh and then right to gauntlet on the spectrum.

SPEAKER_00 5:22

But you but you but it did what wasn't like gauntlet, because in gauntlet you just you constantly fight hordes and hordes of enemies, like that there was always like a spawning block.

SPEAKER_03 5:32

Yes, that's the thing. It had the enemy generators, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:35

Thousands of ghosts, and they would keep coming until you destroyed the generator, and then you got keys to get through doors and elf needs food, I think is something it says. Yeah, why could also shoot out food and it will come up with a warning say don't shoot the food, which is Sage Life Advice. It's Sage Life Advice.

SPEAKER_03 5:54

Trying to find out how many levels it actually had.

SPEAKER_00 5:56

Because that was the weird thing, wasn't it? Because you'd go down a level rather than it being like you'd find the exit, and it wouldn't just be like you're at now level two. You could get like a because you had to get like keys to different doors, and not you weren't always as many keys as there were doors, so you'd sometimes end up at different exits, and it'd be like you're now at level 35.

SPEAKER_03 6:18

But you just had to progress, it wasn't like oh no, I'm in level 40 35, I've got to go back to level 20 to get this thingy key. It was like you just had to get as far into the which is why it's like the the reboot episode reminded me of Gauntlet because it was just you had to progress through the levels in sort of sequential order and just get to the biggest number level you can. I'm still trying to find out how many levels. I just remember it being an insane amount, but I just wonder if that's because I was a child. So the right, no one seems to know.

SPEAKER_00 6:43

Was there were there even levels or were they just so the NES one went up to level 100?

SPEAKER_03 6:49

No to find the deck spectrum. Right. This episode Chris research is gone. It's because it's it seems to be a point of contention across the internet. Yeah, most players most I think it's a hundred and someone says 110. Not in the spectrum, because somewhere I saw a hundred, everyone ever yeah, over 100 levels. I thought it was more than that. Uh in my head it I thought it was. But even that, I just remember it seemed, and I think partly this was like because even in those days, we were sort of you we couldn't just sit and play the spectrum all day, partly because it took up so much room and we were playing on like usually playing on the main TV in the lounge. So you couldn't sit and play the spectrum, you couldn't do like a an overnight gaming session where we're playing the spectrum, like it was sort of we probably were only ever playing for like an hour or so at a time. And just the idea, you know, when you get to play Gauntlet and you get to like level 12 or something, and then either have to stop or die. And the idea that you would get be able to get through all 100 levels, it just seemed impossible to me. I was like, that's that's just something that can never be done.

SPEAKER_00 7:49

When do you think completing games comes into your consciousness? Well, because I can't remember sitting playing a tick attack and being like, I've got to complete a tick attack. And then you've got things like Horus Go Skiing, which apparently I'm sure Red does have an end. You just sort of played. The only one that we sort of completed was Chaos because you fight each other.

SPEAKER_03 8:09

Target Renegade, I remember having an ending because it just you beat the boss at the end and it just comes up and says congratulations. I was really annoyed. But but then you didn't you know the the spectrum, you didn't really have end sequences. I mean that was the that was the draw. I remember for ages it was like well, probably more on the Amiga and things. It was like, oh, you want to get to the end to see what the end sequence is, and then and then quite a lot of games just wouldn't have an end sequence, they just kind of do credits. But so but I don't think yeah, it was the I remember it being not really being a thing. I mean, you got ones like Dizzy, the Dizzy games had an ending, yeah. Um, but then a lot of games like Manic Minor, you know, I never got past level sort of three or four of Manic Minor, like it was just uh just put it on and impossible. Jet said Willie wasn't part Jets Willie famously had a bug that stopped you completing it, but no one had ever got that far. I mean, people do now, obviously, people are crazy and they've got ridiculous amounts of time. Um, and you can with like and obviously you can use save states and stuff, but that's yeah, but people seek seek out stupid challenges. There are yeah, you can watch long plays of Jetset Willie and stuff. I was just wondering if there's a long play of Gauntlet and how long I am gonna check this out.

SPEAKER_00 9:17

It was just a thing because I can't remember. It's like trying to work backwards, like Day of the Tentacle would have played, but that's quite late.

SPEAKER_03 9:24

But I can't think that's PC, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 9:26

I can't imagine going back to the Amiga and be like, I'm gonna put Zool on.

SPEAKER_03 9:29

No.

SPEAKER_00 9:30

Because I need to complete Zool.

SPEAKER_03 9:32

I think it depended on the type of game though, because then there were sort of in the Amiga days, there was sort of story games. I just don't know if you could complete Wheelie. That's too weird.

SPEAKER_00 9:45

Not Wheelie. I don't mean wheelie. Fall Guy. Fall Guy.

SPEAKER_03 9:49

Fall Guy had levels because I would also have like an attract screen where it would show you the levels if you just waited. So you always you knew there were more levels on the Fall Guy game. I'm trying to think of any other Spectrum games I completed. I mean, there were text adventures. I remember completing text adventures.

SPEAKER_00 10:05

Did you complete movie?

SPEAKER_03 10:07

I mean, you can complete movie, I don't think I ever did because that was impossible. It's got Sam Cruz I never completed it. I mean, Sam Cruz had like a story.

SPEAKER_00 10:15

Yeah, two for two, one episode maybe.

SPEAKER_03 10:17

Yeah, I mean I always reference Sam Cruz as the best game ever. Well, that was what was cool about it, was it had like a story and it had like things you had to do. You had to jump on the fat man. I remember that.

SPEAKER_00 10:26

But I think that's the only bit I can remember of doing because that's right at the beginning, isn't it?

SPEAKER_03 10:31

Yeah, it's quite near the yeah, it's quite near the beginning. And there was like an exact spot where he walked and you could jump off and and and land on him. But then you know, after that it just got really difficult. Gauntlet on the spectrum took someone two hours and 40 minutes. So that's not inconceivable at the time. Doesn't it seem that bad? No, I mean probably I haven't watched it, but you're probably skipping a lot of levels because of those warps. I imagine if you know where the warps are, then it's easier. It just seemed inconceivable that you would ever sit there for two hours. Even that, I just can't imagine ever sitting playing one game. Well, I mean that vaguely games going on the spectrum is you'd have like a selection and you go, Oh, I'll play this, and it would take ages to load, and then you'd put it on, and then you'd play the first screen for a bit and go, Oh, this is boring. Let's try something else. You do a bit of Jack the Nipper, sort of a bit of a tick-attack, do some jetpack.

SPEAKER_00 11:32

That's rare. Yeah, I saw that the other day, they've they had a good run of making games.

SPEAKER_03 11:37

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, so I don't I don't think it was as because I also don't think it wasn't as big a hobby, it was like a sort of cool thing to do. TV and films were still better, I think. Whereas now I think games are better. I think have been for a while. Uh I mean you know, it depends what you're looking for. Sometimes I do just want to sit down and watch something. I mean, I because I but I I play games for story, really. I don't care about gameplay and stuff. Completing it is the whole thing for me now. Like and if I play something that doesn't have an end, or you can't really complete it, or is really difficult, then I lose interest because I'm just like, well, what's the point? If I can't if I'm not gonna get to the end and can move on to something else, then that's not a complete experience for me.

SPEAKER_00 12:20

Yeah, that's just that's the issue I have with the sort of the online multiplayer things. Having this conversation the other day because I play a lot of pointless games like Lawn Mowing, but that's that's mainly to empty my brain to distress. Yeah. I clearly don't go anywhere. But it is this thing, it's like like I played Spider-Man 2, and as I was playing Spider-Man 2, I became very aware that it's not a game that you necessarily need to be good at.

SPEAKER_03 12:46

No.

SPEAKER_00 12:47

No point did I get stuck to the point where I was like, oh no, I need to get better at this in order to improve my gaming skills. No, it was quite like it gets difficult, but then your character progresses, then you get a different like sometimes it's difficult because you've not got enough energy and you just run around and just level up a bit.

SPEAKER_02 13:05

That's fine.

SPEAKER_00 13:05

But it never needed you to sort of it never needed me to get better. And that's what I it's it's in I just find it interesting because it's like you're following this story, and it is more like just an interactive story because it never really stopped me progressing. But then on the other hand, you get other games like Sherlock Holmes, where it's more about like there is something that you have to solve. There is like an element of skill involved. But then when you play things like Sea of Thieves, referencing all the games you play, there isn't any kind of like there's no real point to it. Like what what we were finding frustrating about Sea of Thieves is you're playing with online people who seem to keep killing us, but there's no like there's no progression in armor, like you can't buy a better weapon, all cosmetic. So it's purely down to people have played it so long that they have they they can click faster, they're probably on PC because we're all be playing PC users. Yeah, but but that seems to be it.

SPEAKER_03 14:04

Like yeah, I don't I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 14:06

It's like you play for hours and hours and hours, and there's no story, you're just getting better at playing this one game. And I basically a long-winded way, I sort of agree with you. I'd like I'm not really interested in if you play that for sort of 300 hours and then someone says, What have you got out of it? And you're like, I can now play Sea of Thieves really well. Yeah. Whereas you play 300 hours like Baldur's Gate 3 took us over a year, like even with that, there's the main story beats that you have to hit, but then there's enough random stuff that it does sort of flow, but there was like a long story, and it's like I have lived through a story. It's like when I don't know if we talked about it on this, we talked we've talked about it before. It's like I really got when Cyberpunk came out, I really got into Cyberpunk.

SPEAKER_02 14:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:52

And it is just a story, and everyone's sharing the same story, it's not really different, but it does work in the sense that you do sort of feel it is an experience to have.

SPEAKER_03 15:02

Yeah, I mean I think games they're like reading massive novels.

SPEAKER_00 15:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:06

It's like reading Lord of the Rings, they're like take hours and hours and hours, but you're kind of immersed in this this story with in an interesting world with characters, and I think that's really valuable as an experience. And I think not I don't know, I don't want to say that that's it's for me, but personally, it's not I'm not sort of saying that the other type of game because I think there are two distinct types of and people in the middle, but there's two extremes of gaming, the sort of gaming. I think gaming for skill for the game part is one end, and gaming from s for story is the other end. And I'm um definitely the sort of story end. I've just had no interest in in improving my skill. Like if I do something and I can't do it, and I spend an evening on the same, like on the same boss fight or something, I'll probably either reduce the difficulty or just give up because I've I just because I get so annoyed that I've spent my evening. Then I think it's partly being a parent and middle-aged, where time is so so free time is so kind of such a precious commodity that I'm like if I had to spend an hour of my free time fighting a boss that that I've then lost against, so I might have gained a bit of skill through practice, but ultimately I haven't progressed the story. Then I'm like, well, I could have watched an episode of something and had a story, yeah. There's still, I mean, because I do think it that games are an an art form, and I think there is still art in Fortnite, but it's just yeah, it's just different. Um and I just sort of prefer that contained experience.

SPEAKER_00 16:37

It's what you can, it's what you're willing to sacrifice to experience it. That's a strong word. But it's things like you could watch. It's like I have this thing with like I I don't care for reality TV, I don't understand it, but I will quite happily watch except I wouldn't, but I would probably more happily watch like five seasons of something like re-watch supernatural. Or 15-20 seasons of supernatural, but I'm not gonna I'm not bust about watching whatever the big reality thing is.

SPEAKER_03 17:09

Because for me, there's more merit in watching the story than I think it'd depend what you get out of it, and I think that some people get get enough out of reality TV, and that's and it's just different, but I do find the yeah, I think I mean I think part of it as well is just the is just the sort of ticking things off in your brain, like sort of ten, ten or so hours into Mouse PI, I'm not gonna just like stop playing it and do something else. Like, I mean I think I used to play games more like that. I used to, like I was saying in the spectrum days, I used to just you'd have loads of games and you go, Oh, shall we play? And probably is a is a I think it's I think a lot of it is to do with time as well. Like I think as a kid, I would just play micro machines. Or you'd go, or we'd play like a lot of when we were all all like you me and Tim all in the same house, you know, we would just play beat-em-ups or like games where just competitive games, because if we're all together, oh let's just play a game and Winner's Day's on or whatever. You you sort of do that because and it's it's inconsequential in terms of story, but like it is sort of Goldeneye is a great example. I spent most of my time at uni playing Goldeneye with people, and that's and that's exactly what people are doing now with Fortnite and things. So it's not like I don't I do think it it depends. So there's other factors. I think as an old man, I'm like games these days don't don't have stories and stuff, but actually, it's just that I think that's what I value more now. And if I'm going to play a game and invest the time into it, I need it to be a complete rounded experience.

SPEAKER_00 18:39

Yeah, I did feel quite sad when I I think the last beat him off I properly played. I think I got Tekken 7. I was like, I like Tekken games, let's get Tekken 7. Even though there's an eight like that. And then I remember playing it going, it's not as fun when you've been sitting on your own. No working through the story, going, Oh, it's another level. There's no one on, one off.

SPEAKER_03 18:59

Yeah, yeah, and I think they are better.

SPEAKER_00 19:02

That's what we're saying.

SPEAKER_03 19:03

Well, we don't I keep meaning to do it, but we don't ever do sort of I mean we played the um X-Men game, okay not long ago, that was good. But we don't Welcome to Die. We don't do that Welcome to Die. We don't do that sort of communal because we have because we've got access to the online world now. We don't necessarily do as much of the I mean sometimes you know even play even play with the kids in two separate rooms and we'll be online. It sort of because it depends on the game, but if you're it just sort of I don't know, more games are designed like that. There's less there's less couch co-op stuff. Um yeah. But I but I think like I say, I don't think any of this is bad and I don't I think it I think it's just my experience of the world.

SPEAKER_00 19:45

Well no, but I think you're right. I think it's it's what you have and it's what you have time for and what you don't. Like I remember when they remastered Tony Hawks, I found it fascinating that one I'm now just turning it into old people talking about games, but one that I could that we spent so long playing it when it first came out, and two, that I could do it. See, I was never good at Tony Hawks, I was never amazing at it, but even now I can't even like I could at least get enough to progress through the levels, whereas this time I think I only got halfway through because I just couldn't get the score high enough.

SPEAKER_03 20:20

I've bounced remasters so many times.

SPEAKER_00 20:23

I remember sitting like through I think it was Tony Hawks 4. And I clearly do remember sort of summer afternoons sitting back to get 900,000 points.

SPEAKER_03 20:32

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:32

And then getting it, and all you've done, and then you go, that's a good afternoon spent doing that. And now it's like I can barely crack 50,000.

SPEAKER_03 20:41

No, no, I try I mean I tried that recently. No.

SPEAKER_00 20:46

And pads are slightly, I will blame the pad, like the pad's bigger. I think when like the first PlayStation because it was tiny.

SPEAKER_03 20:54

But uh yeah, that's the that's yeah, that that's that's yeah, that is part of it. But um This has nothing to do with Gauntlet. No, it doesn't, but it's I don't well it does in the sense that Gauntlet so the w where the where this episode kind of ties into what I remember about Gauntlet is they do have to get through 66 levels. Gauntlet had a lot of levels.

SPEAKER_00 21:15

And I think we got to but I think going back to what we said before, like I think last episode we mentioned what are their because this is what I was this thing, this is the one where I thought is what are their references? There aren't that like with the ultimate games out, but they aren't sort of yeah. Like I presume the references it is Gauntlet because it's just that they didn't want to animate hundreds of skeletons because they'd still be rendering it.

SPEAKER_03 21:40

Well, although each of the rooms is sort of puzzly. Like they they encounter puzzles essentially rather than they do have enemies, but most but it's the solution is normally oh no, and partly that's because it's a kid's cartoon and stuff. It did and I wonder if that's another element, like that's kind of cool. Or cave adventure, like like sort of text adventure type stuff. Like what do you do in this room where you need to all put your hands in the same place? Like a riddle or yeah, and and uh I mean it's quite cool because then there's that room with the mirrors that's quite good where they have to fight evil versions of themselves.

SPEAKER_00 22:17

They were cool.

SPEAKER_03 22:18

Yeah, and uh the whole point of the episode is that Mike TV ends up sort of being quite useful. Like, not even at like one bit, like he at several points he sort of does something useful. So that's that's uh I mean it's sort of like another a whole other annoying sidekick.

SPEAKER_00 22:34

It was a bit I did wonder. It was nice to have a whole episode that was based that was set in a game.

SPEAKER_03 22:40

Is there like a whole episode about the French waiter character? Because at this rate I'm expecting that to be, or a whole episode about Hack and Slash, or just one of them. I guess we'll find out.

SPEAKER_00 22:51

I can't remember many of these, as I keep saying, it gets good in season three.

SPEAKER_03 22:54

It also reminded me, I don't I feel like I need to mention this because and it's just because of the era and the graphics, but it reminded me of Nightmare a little.

SPEAKER_00 23:04

I thought that because I remember it also being on ITV when it wasn't.

SPEAKER_03 23:08

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:09

And Nightmare was like the Nightmare. What's their crossover with Nightmare?

SPEAKER_03 23:14

Well, reboot Nightmare crossover.

SPEAKER_00 23:19

Not not an actual crossover. I meant in times of because nightmare is like 80s, late 80s.

SPEAKER_03 23:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 23:25

Uh yeah, not really. It was like 87 till 94. So there might have been some crossover with the end of Nightmare would have been on at the same time as that's mad to think Nightmare is still going in '94. Yeah. Yeah, 9th of September 94, the 11th of November 94.

SPEAKER_03 23:43

I mean, I remember Nightmare carrying on way after I'd lost interest in it, because like early nightmare was the best. Then because early nightmare was much more about we go into this room, because should I explain Nightmare? Yes. Nightmare was like a game show where so three kids so it was like four kids, three of them would be watching on a TV with Traegod, who was like a dungeon master character. The fourth kid would have a helmet on so he couldn't see, and he was in a CGI world, so they could so the kids could see. The other kids could see the CGI world and they could see him in it or her in it, and they would have to direct the other kids around the CGI obstacles that they couldn't see. So you'd have like a room where so the kid with a helmet can't see anything, they're basically blindfolded, and then they can see that projected onto this. Obviously, it's not real, but that there might be a floor that's crumbling, so they have to go, oh, sidestep left. Now go forward and and guide them around this this room, and it was various sorts of rooms. And I think later on it got more into here's some more crazy characters, and like the eye shield was all annoying. They got an eye shield which just meant a cutscene, basically. It's like they now you're going through some woods, and it would cut to the view of the eye shield, and you'd just be going through some woods, and it's like, well, it's not clearly not actually going through woods, they just sort of put a video on.

SPEAKER_00 25:07

So, anyway, it's essentially the loading screen whilst they actually for the kid.

SPEAKER_03 25:12

It was that again, it was quite an early use of CGI. Um, maybe we should do a nightmare podcast, but not if it ran for that long.

SPEAKER_00 25:21

Eight seasons.

SPEAKER_03 25:22

Yeah, we could do like a nightmare special, maybe. Because I would be quite interested. I remember watching a couple with the kids when like ages ago, just to just to sort of see what it was like. And it's still I think it's interesting to watch.

SPEAKER_00 25:35

I remember it being quite interesting because it also wasn't like if the team was doing well, they would progress to the next episode. Like you'd have multiple episodes, yeah, and then they'd just die and they'd get another team on.

SPEAKER_03 25:48

Yes, yes, it wasn't like strictly edited to the half hour, it was like if they did well, they'd carry on. It was a bit like doing a Dungeons and Dragons campaign, I suppose. It was sort of just like carry on until you died.

SPEAKER_00 26:00

I remember not wanting to go swimming so I could watch Nightmare.

SPEAKER_03 26:02

It was groundbreaking at the time. It had early computer graphics, earlier than reboot, I guess, if it ran for that for that long.

SPEAKER_00 26:09

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 26:10

And it was a combination of that plus the medieval setting, that's what reminded me of Nightmare a bit.

SPEAKER_00 26:15

Yes. Yeah, it's it's a weird episode of Reboot because I remember this one, and I think it's don't think I've seen it. Because it's all in the game, and you like that the game. But I don't really have much to say about it.

SPEAKER_03 26:31

No, I mean they do they literally go through level by level until they're at level 66 and then it comes in, there's some monsters, there's some computer graphics.

SPEAKER_00 26:39

Yeah, Bob's very angry all the way through and just shouts at everyone.

SPEAKER_03 26:43

They have to use teamwork a lot.

SPEAKER_00 26:46

They use teamwork a lot. I didn't quite understand. I thought there was going to be some crazy riddle at the end because they were all fighting their doppelgangers and losing.

SPEAKER_02 26:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:55

And I thought there was gonna be like, oh, it's because you need to fight them together. And it was just Mike TV had to distract them with his quips. But ultimately it was a fun episode.

SPEAKER_03 27:05

It was a fun episode. It reminded me of Gauntlet and Nightmare. Thinking about Gauntlet and Nightmare as is was fun. So yeah, no, it's it was uh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 27:14

I think my problem was it I sparked the conversation last episode of our podcast because this was the episode where I was trying to place what game it was gonna be and realised 94 other reference points. But we've had this discussion. Yes, because this thing because I was thinking things like is it like Ultima?

SPEAKER_03 27:32

I think Ultima was around.

SPEAKER_00 27:34

But that wasn't like team of four, there was one no Ultima was the one one Was it Shadowlands or something?

SPEAKER_03 27:40

Shadowlands had a you had a party. Is that on the I mean there are all those um recently uh like around the same time there were all the Dungeons and Dragons ones, like Eye of the Beholder and stuff, and the nightmare game that particularly in Land of Well, I mean this is probably later, but there they were those games where you had like a party of four people and might and magic and things and you had to click on them and they'd hit and you just had their faces and you had the inventory screen and there's a lot of arcade ones as well, it's like even like Knights of the Round. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I think that that King of Dragons, that kind of party mechanic was was in more games than than Gauntlet. It's the level progression that reminded me of Gauntlet more than anything else. But uh but yeah, I don't know. And I suppose you've got all the Japanese ones still. I mean, when did Final Fantasy come out? That must have been ages ago. Although were people playing Final Fantasy then? I don't really remember it existing until seven. I mean I've played the first Final Fantasy since, but like I don't remember it being a thing that I remember Secret of Mana, but um Yeah, I don't know. I'm just talking about random Japanese games now. Good.

SPEAKER_00 28:47

We've got another Enzo episode.

SPEAKER_03 28:49

What next?

SPEAKER_00 28:49

Oh no, not really.

SPEAKER_03 28:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 28:51

So we've only got but that was episode nine. There's a couple of Enzo episodes.

SPEAKER_03 28:58

Yeah, but they've they've mostly done Enzo. They have mostly done Enzo. So so that was episode nine. So we've got 10, 11, 12, 30, 12 and 13, you're like one, like a double episode, right? Like a two-parter.

SPEAKER_00 29:11

So that would yeah, so ten and eleven of the next individuals, then there's two parter, which I think is when it starts getting good.

SPEAKER_03 29:17

Okay, okay. So we're nearly there.

SPEAKER_00 29:19

Because going into season two, which only has ten episodes.

SPEAKER_02 29:24

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_00 29:25

Ten episodes. I think they start getting a bit more the stories get it starts getting a bit more story focused. Okay. And season three is the good one. Shouldn't big it up.

SPEAKER_03 29:35

I have to get there and it will all be enzoepisodes. Well and it'll it'll turn out that you only think of one episode. The rest of them are enzoepisodes. Well, that's gonna be like a thing now, and you're gonna be like, Oh, that would be spoiler.

SPEAKER_00 29:48

Season three, episode one, is written by Marvel Wolfman.

SPEAKER_02 29:51

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_00 29:51

I said, Yeah, Dan DeDidio started writing them. It started getting, I think, comic writers started coming in.

SPEAKER_03 29:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:58

I think they started to get wonder that you're not gonna sit here saying how good the thing is. Like, I'm enjoying rewatching them. I just know I think I have fond memories of season three.

SPEAKER_03 30:09

I did notice that in this episode, actually, and obviously it's probably been the case with all of them, is that the three the three main guys who we keep referring to who haven't don't know their names, but there's like three main reboot guys, but they just did this they're always the story by, but then there's always like two other writers. So that's I wonder if they relinqu the relinquished the story reigns, maybe later on.

SPEAKER_00 30:32

Yeah, it's like Gavin Blair, Phil Mitchell and Ian Pearson. Yeah. Well maybe I think I need to go back to watching that series. Yeah. I think there was a lot of them just making it up, and considering that they came out of not to complain about it. Think it is clear from this, like I do think they get a bit more complicated. What am I saying? I think there is very listen to it. I think there is a lot of what can we do? What's interesting to see? I remember playing Gauntlet, let's do a Gauntlet game. Like, I can see them having like a whiteboard with okay, it's 1994, Grand Theft Auto hasn't come out yet. What games can we do? No one's heard of a PlayStation. Can we get away with Mario? Because I think as it progresses, like you get into because we're so so when's this? So this aired '94. Season two is ninety-five, and season three is ninety-seven. By 97, you've definitely got like the beginning of PlayStation coming in, you've got heights of consoles. So I think the games get a bit more say interesting, but I think the games get a bit more interesting. Like I think at the moment it is still very much what quicker we've got an idea, let's do it. Will it work? Who cares? Let's just get it on.

SPEAKER_03 31:47

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:47

But I do like can't go on about it, it does get very world-buildy. I was gonna say for my little brain, but I think I was probably too old to be watching it because I would have been 16.

SPEAKER_03 31:58

Well, this is my problem, is I think I'd like stopped watching CI TV once I got up to 15.

SPEAKER_00 32:04

Too old to be watching reboots, but I did really enjoy reboot.

SPEAKER_03 32:07

Cool. Well, we will move on.

SPEAKER_00 32:09

Come on from the net. Like, how many people are disconnected to the net in 1964?

SPEAKER_03 32:14

Shit, that's another thing we should do is do the series The Net.

SPEAKER_00 32:17

So based on the film?

SPEAKER_03 32:18

No, it's like a BBC factual series. It was a bit like a trendy tomorrow's world, but it's weird. I started re-watching some episodes, I couldn't find them all, but I rewatched a bunch of episodes a few years ago, and it's just weird like it's very tech positive, it's very like this is this stuff's gonna change the world for the better, and then it's in which in some ways, many ways it has, but like I'm quite tech positive as well. But like you kind of it's weird watching it knowing what happens with technology and the internet. But anyway, yeah, with that that might be interesting to do. Anyway, good.

SPEAKER_00 32:55

What's quite fun is I keep seeing old clips from Bad Influence pop up. Oh, bad influence is good. Bad influence for anyone who doesn't know was again CI TV computer.

SPEAKER_03 33:06

Like a gaming magazine show. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 33:08

Must have been. I don't want to look it up because it takes too long. Must have been upset. But it's quite interesting. Like I remember Video Master on Amiga being on there, and it was like, look at this crazy thing that we've imported from Japan. It means you can record video on your Amiga. So, okay. Although we had one, it was so like this is weird.

SPEAKER_03 33:26

Yeah, Dad found lots of uses for that.

SPEAKER_00 33:28

But it's also quite strange that my favourite one is they did an episode on piracy and they copied the console, it was like a thing that would copy console cartridges onto a disc. But then in the episode they do it and they say, Now, and now we've got that on this disc. But now because we have just broken the law, we are going to destroy this disc and then they stab at it. It's quite funny.

SPEAKER_03 33:49

Nice.

SPEAKER_00 33:49

It's like good, good. I'm glad you've destroyed.

SPEAKER_03 33:52

I mostly remember Violet Berlin going to visit the set of Gabriel and Night 2 and then filming a scene as an extra. And then many years later, I actually played Gabriel Knight 2 and she's not in it, and I was really annoyed. Because it was a lie, or maybe they just cut her out.

SPEAKER_00 34:08

Maybe they cut her out. Maybe it's a secret, maybe you never saw it.

SPEAKER_03 34:12

Maybe.

SPEAKER_00 34:12

That's like you don't have to put this in. But that's like me watching Andy Peters record a line for Toy Story 2 because he did a let's go and see how they made Toy Story 2. And I mostly remember they got stuck with visas because he wasn't allowed to record. And this was in the making of.

SPEAKER_03 34:32

Right.

SPEAKER_00 34:32

They were like, yeah, just come into the booth and you can record a line. And then there was this whole hubbub because he wasn't allowed, he had the wrong visa. And then he they rang him up later. But now every time I watch it, there's this bit where Andy Peters shouts across the airport. Because I don't know why, and they still do it today. This weird thing, like they always have to put a random English celebrity.

SPEAKER_03 34:54

Yes. Well, it was like that's like a thing they do, like in animated films, and but in one scene that you don't it's like I think Jonathan Ross is in Shrek 2.

unknown 35:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 35:04

And you just think, but why? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 35:06

It never fits. There's someone in in the recent Grinch, not the recent because it's probably about five years older, but the CGI Grinch film, if you watch it on Netflix, it's normal. And if you watch the Blu-ray, there's one bit where a random English lady starts talking. It just doesn't make it doesn't fit in with the scene because no one else is English. No. Anyway, this has nothing to do with anything.

SPEAKER_03 35:28

I'm gonna stop there. I think we've covered this episode. This episode of Noobscast was sponsored by my book, Noobs. Noobs is a middle grade adventure book about three kids who take on an evil AI at an esports tournament. There's a link to the book in the podcast description, so please check this out if you're interested.