Sweet Corn Ice Cream?! And Somehow It Actually Works | Cooper Lane farm

Host Suzanne Rajczi, visits Cooper Lane Farms with Katie Hines and Bob Ferris to explore the farm’s history and how it evolved from a former dairy property into an operation focused on hay, sweet corn, and local food education. Bob discusses hand-picked sweet corn, hay production and crop rotation, and the challenges and satisfaction of sustaining agriculture, including land conservation and changing economics. Katie shares her 4-H journey from Cloverbud through showing and selling Southdown sheep at the Dutchess County Fair, detailing sheep care, lambing, and animal stewardship for quality meat and wool. She also explains how she built Zo’s Ice Cream, emphasizing small-batch production, local sourcing, the “cow to cone in three days” model, seasonal flavors like sweet corn ice cream, and educational school programs connecting kids to where food comes from, ahead of the Dutchess County Fair’s 180th anniversary.

00:00 Podcast Welcome
02:34 Sweet Corn Work
04:27 Hay Fields Rotation
07:53 Animals and Aging
08:41 Katie 4H Journey
11:02 Fair Auction Lessons
14:57 Sheep Care Basics
18:55 Local Lamb Quality
21:21 Zoes Ice Cream Story
23:27 Local Flavors Ingredients
24:20 Sweet Corn Flavor
26:13 Sourcing Local Ingredients
31:52 Future of Local Farming
38:25 Advice for Young Farmers
43:11 Sheep Raising Basics
46:32 Podcast Wrap and Fair

Transcript

SPEAKER_05 0:00

Welcome to A Legacy of Agriculture and Community, a podcast celebrating the people, farms, and traditions that define the spirit of the Duchess County Fair and our agricultural community. I'm Suzanne Roetzi, and today we're visiting Cooper Lane Farms with Katie Hines and Bob Ferris, farmer, educator, entrepreneur, and lifelong advocate for agriculture. Katie's story is one rooted in the values many of us cherish: hard work, animal stewardship, community, and education. From starting in 4-H as a clover bud before the age of five to raising and showing sheep at the fair to now producing sweet corn and hay and operating Zoe's ice cream, Katie is living proof that agriculture continues to evolve while honoring its roots. Today we'll talk about raising sheep, local food systems, agriculture education, and how one farm can help connect community from cow to cone. Welcome everyone and thank you, Bob and Katie, for inviting me to talk to you about um your farm here and what you do. And I'm really interested in this piece of land and the history of this land. So tell me a little bit about Cooper Lane Farms and how did it begin as a dairy farm and how it evolved into what it is today. So, Bob, you want to take that?

SPEAKER_00 1:30

Um well Cooper Lane, um, I named it Cooper Lane because the Cooper family owned this for generations. And they had a dairy farm here. Uh the dairy barn uh was taken down in the 60s. But um they lived here, well Jack Cooper lived here all his life. And um I bought it in 1946. Um my family not 46. Um 86. And um my family and I've uh lived here, we the kids have grown up here ever since.

SPEAKER_05 2:18

So you have five kids, right?

SPEAKER_00 2:20

Five children, yes.

SPEAKER_05 2:22

And they are all in the community or all in the surrounding community or not all of them?

SPEAKER_00 2:27

Four of them are. Okay. Four of them still live in Duchess County. Great. The fifth one lives in California. But every flew the corn they had a rule when I came here about growing sweet corn, that they had to pick the corn, but then they sold the corn over on 55 on our commercial property. And um so every one of them um not sure about my son, he's the oldest. Uh he got into it a little bit at the end. Okay. Uh, but the other four, the girls, have all got up early in the morning, gone out and picked corn, got wet, got uh hot, but had to take it over. We took it over to the off over to 55, and uh um they sold it.

SPEAKER_05 3:25

So corn, you know, growing corn and picking corn, there isn't a machine that does that, or you you did it all by hand because of the type of corn they can.

SPEAKER_00 3:34

I do it by hand, we're not that big.

SPEAKER_05 3:36

Okay. And the type of corn was bread and butter or sweet corn?

SPEAKER_00 3:41

It was um I started off with silver queen. Yeah. Uh but I've I've changed to a multicolor uh now. And you're uh Zoe can pick faster than the boys can. I had boys that worked for me. None of them could stay up with her. Matter of fact, Raymond, I don't think, can pick corn as fast as she can.

SPEAKER_05 4:07

Uh-huh. So what's the secret on on picking corn fast? The faster you pick it, the quicker you're done. So you're motivated by the end of your task and and being done with it. Yes. I get that. You know, you put a woman to that type of work, we figure it out. So, you know, our need for speed. Uh so corn and hay, right? You have hay you have hay?

SPEAKER_00 4:31

And on these hay is the primary thing. Uh we grow approximately a hundred acres. Well, the farm isn't a hundred acres, but we grow approximately a hundred acres of hay. Here. Here in the neighbor farms, neighbor land and things, yes.

SPEAKER_05 4:51

So you actually actually farm other surrounding properties. You hay you hay them for the purpose of selling hay, correct?

SPEAKER_00 5:01

Yeah, selling it to horse people primarily.

SPEAKER_05 5:05

And do you are you have a good reputation for high quality hay here? I'm thinking you do.

SPEAKER_00 5:10

Um yes, I think so. Yeah, it's hard to talk about your own hay, but uh um we fertilize it every year and uh we try and keep it up and keep it rotated.

SPEAKER_05 5:26

Yep. So you know, I think that the audience would like to know about just hay growing and the crop in and of itself and how big it is and how it's done. So you actually plow fields and plant hay, or does it come up year after year in the same way?

SPEAKER_00 5:43

Well, it it it's perennial, it comes up, but it uh in about four years it starts to uh run out is the word we use. And it uh so you have to we plant corn and then we go back to hay again.

SPEAKER_05 6:03

So crack crop rotation out of the road.

SPEAKER_00 6:05

We rotate the sweet corn, yes. Uh-huh. And the sweet corn takes out the nitrogen and things in the ground. And um if we grow alfalfa and we've grown some of its alfalfa, some of its grass A. And the alfalfa puts nitrogen back into the soil. Plus, we always fertilize.

SPEAKER_05 6:30

So every four years you kind of rotate.

SPEAKER_00 6:34

It's best if you um uh reseed in the f you can reseed in the early spring, but it's really best if you reseed in the fall in September.

SPEAKER_05 6:47

And so you plant you don't have to worry about irrigation or watering, you just let it.

SPEAKER_00 6:52

No, we don't worry about irrigation. Um expensive and uh uh we have times like last summer, um we didn't get much second cutting because it was dry. Right.

SPEAKER_05 7:09

So you cut hay more than once a year as it grows?

SPEAKER_00 7:13

Twice in the twice usually. The dairy farmers get it three times because they chop it the first time. Right. For their dairy cows. And then they uh bale it twice. But we don't uh since it's just for the horses and things, we don't get the third crop.

SPEAKER_05 7:33

Do you bale it or roll it?

SPEAKER_00 7:35

Because I've seen bale it into little square bales because they're easier to handle for the horse farmers. Not every horse farmer is big enough and to manage equipment to handle the big round bales.

SPEAKER_05 7:50

Mm-hmm. That's true. That's interesting. So on this property, corn and hay, but you know, I really want to kind of get into raising animals here and a little bit of the sheep.

SPEAKER_00 8:03

We've always had uh we started with sheep and the girls were involved in sheep in 4-H and showing them at the Duchess County Fair. And um recently we've had some beef cattle here, and we may go back to sheep because I'm getting too old to handle those. Handle the uh beef cattle.

SPEAKER_05 8:27

Uh-huh. Because they can be a handful, right? Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_00 8:32

And I'm 85, and so it's different times.

SPEAKER_05 8:37

You might have met your limits, right? At 85. You know, it I'm gonna jump kind of jump into that 4-H and the Duchess County Fair and kind of segue into you, Katie, because we had a great conversation about you know, you starting and how you grew up uh through 4-H and you know, talk to me about being a clover bud because I had no idea what you're talking about on the phone. But I would really like to learn, you know, about 4-H and how it kind of impacted your growing up and what you did and what you showed, and if you would if you would share with us, that would be awesome.

SPEAKER_03 9:15

Sure. So I started as a clover bud, and a clover bud is um the younger age group for 4-H, so it's part of 4-H and it's the introductory group. It's normally between the ages of five and eight. Um, and when you're a clover bud, it's more learning, um, you know, responsibility, teamwork, communication, um, and you get to show your animals without the competitive side to it. Um, you know, kind of makes it fun and um a learning environment. And so I started as a clover bud and then I've showed sheep my entire life until I was 18. Um, primarily south the South Down breed, and we attended the fair every year. Um, once I turned nine, I could sell in the livestock sale auction. So I've sold animals in the livestock sale every year. And yeah, I loved growing up in 4-H. So South Down sheep, why them? Um, a few things. They're super temp uh, their temperament is very docile. Um my older sister showed them and uh she chose them because she's short and they're a smaller animal. Um, so they're a little easier to handle for a younger kid. Um, but they're also super hardy. Uh they make it through the winters, they lamb fairly well with little assistance. Um, so and they're very cute. They have almost like a teddy bear face.

SPEAKER_05 10:30

That's great. And when you say lamb, I don't know if our audience knows what lambing means.

SPEAKER_03 10:35

Sure. So lambing is um when the sheep has a baby, you're a lay you're considered a lamb for your first uh year of life. So, and then once you uh turn the once they're a year old, they turn into a yearling.

SPEAKER_05 10:47

So and you know, the actual showing, are you still showing at the fair? Are you or your children at the year?

SPEAKER_03 10:53

Yeah, my boys will start showing at the fair. He'll be able to be a clover bud this fall as he just turned five.

SPEAKER_05 10:58

So you'll be bringing some livestock back and showing. And you know, tell me how you when you said you sold your your livestock at the fair and through the auction process, what did that mean to you and how important was that? Was it you know, was it I would be too attached, I think, to potentially sh, you know, sell my animal, but everybody's different. And I have a feeling that that was very instrumental in developing your entrepreneurial spirit because I see it and what you've done and Zoes and so share, share with me how that sure.

SPEAKER_03 11:34

I mean it's definitely harder when you're younger um to sell them because you do get attached to them. I didn't normally name my market lamps and that always helped. Um, but it, you know, that money my parents would help put away for college. Um, so and I think once you sell once and you see the dollar amount that you can achieve, it kind of motivates you. Um but I'm not I mean, even today it's still hard to bring a market to animal, but it's also the circle of life and something that everybody should learn about.

SPEAKER_01 12:00

Right.

SPEAKER_05 12:01

Um, so some of your mem some can you just share some of your favorite memories of kind of showing and being at the fair?

SPEAKER_03 12:09

Sure. I'd say uh the friendships I made. Um, you know, it wasn't kids that I went to school with on a daily basis. You know, there's kids from all school districts in Vetches County. Right. So, you know, it I always look forward to going to my 4-H meetings and everybody looks forward to the last week of August going to the fair and being able to hang out with those, you know, friends who I still have to this day. Um, you know, and made life time memories.

SPEAKER_05 12:33

When you went to the fair, did you stay there with your livestock?

SPEAKER_03 12:36

I got dorm ones.

SPEAKER_05 12:38

I mean, I think that that's an incredible experience, and people should know the commitment you make uh to kind of bring your livestock to the fair and you know, kind of loading in and getting your animals ready. Could you speak to what that meant, like getting your livestock ready so it would kind of create or demand, you know, a premium ribbon or selling it at a premium for premium money for at the auction?

SPEAKER_03 13:05

Yeah, so it starts at home, um, because you nobody wants to be the one to bring a crazy animal to the fair.

SPEAKER_01 13:10

Right.

SPEAKER_03 13:11

So working them at home, walking them um the week before you're washing and getting them ready to make them presentable. And then while you're at the fair, you know, you're responsible for feeding them. And as a young kid, it's you know, you're normally up there alone at times without your parents. So it truly is. It's not like being home, it's your sole responsibility um to take care of them, and you know, getting those ribbons at the end always makes it worth it.

SPEAKER_00 13:34

Something that I've noticed uh I was a town justice in this town for many, many, many years. I never had the kids from 4-H come to court.

SPEAKER_05 13:47

How about that?

SPEAKER_00 13:48

That they need um they they were getting uh a different kind of um experience, and the court system didn't have a problem with the kids in 4-H. I don't know of any 4-H that's ever gotten into trouble, frankly.

SPEAKER_05 14:09

Well, you have with the law. You have to think about foundationally, you know, you should start you start at a young age, the values that you learned, responsibility, respect, commitment, dedication, friendship. I mean, you talked about how important and how much you l and you know, you you were as a young person, it put you in a position to kind of develop your own pathway forward. It taught you responsibility and kind of responsibility and respect. So, yeah, I mean, 4-H is an incredible program, and foundationally it sounds like it provides a great foundation for successful people as they kind of journey through life. So it's awesome. Um, and thank you for saying that because I probab I agree with you. Um, I want to talk a little bit about the sheep, you know, raising, you know, raising that breed, talk about where it came from, uh, how big it is, because we're probably going to show pictures and share with the audience what what they look like and lambs look like, etc. And you know, the whole process of um where they sleep, do they graze? Do you have to feed them? How big do they when they're born, do they melt from their mothers? Um, what's that process, etc.? And flock life. So sure.

SPEAKER_03 15:32

So the lambs are primary, you can have lambs in the spring or the fall. We always have spring lambs, um, and by spring lambs I mean January, February. Um, so the lambs are born and they are with their mom um for a good amount of time and then they get weaned off just like a human. And uh the Southdown breed is, you know, at a full size, they're anywhere from 90 to 140 pounds. Um, they're not the largest breed, but they're certainly not the smallest. Um, they're primarily meat animals. They do graze, but they also uh get grain as well. Um we do both. Um, you know, it's important for their meat quality to have both. Um my sister raises romneys, which uh are known for their wool. So color uh yeah, so she has natural colored and she has white romney. She has both. Um and that wool, you know, can be made into socks, hats, anything. Um and wool is a great product because it ho it's good for the summer because it'll actually cool you down. It sell temperature self-regulates. And then in the winter it'll obviously keep you warm. Um and it wicks away, everybody likes wool socks because it wicks away moisture. So if your feet get wet, um they'll keep your feet dry. Um and it's renewable and um, you know, biodegradable, so it's a great product that way. Um, but yeah, so you know, taking care of them, the happier the animal is, the better wool you're gonna have, the better higher quality meat. Um, so it all goes back to that.

SPEAKER_05 16:59

And would you say your animals are happy here?

SPEAKER_03 17:01

I would say so.

SPEAKER_05 17:02

Because they're very well, very well cared for it. Yes. You know, you shared with a story with me. We talked about how they winter and um you know it's really okay to be outside with four inches of snow on their back because they wick they you said that they wick they wick the moisture, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:19

So it's actually keeping they're keeping themselves warm.

SPEAKER_05 17:23

And you know, sh shearing sheep, you said maybe two times a year here.

SPEAKER_03 17:29

So normally it's one time a year if you're like a production sheep farm. Um but if you're showing, you're gonna be shearing them twice a year um to go to the fair as well.

SPEAKER_05 17:38

And is that a process shear sheep shearing?

SPEAKER_03 17:40

Um if you're ha if you're using their wool, so the South Downs, we don't use their wool, so it's not a process, you're just trying to get it off. Um but when you have something like the Romneys, yes, you're trying to preserve the wool. So the shearer, if they're talented enough, um, which many of them in the area are, you when you take the wool off, it's being taken off in one fold like and so then it can go on to get washed and processed.

SPEAKER_05 18:04

I've uh been at the sheep and wool festival at the fairgrounds, and it's it's in just in that is it's an art. It's an it's incredible. And and you know what I find really extraordinary is how people come to that to buy the quality of the wool, and they buy those bags of unprocessed wool in order to spin clean and spin, and I mean they get premium dollar for that wool. Yeah, yeah, that's it. And I get to pick it up and I smell it, and I'm like, oh my god, this is a $280 to $85 bag of wool or $300. But you know, the species of sheep has a lot to do with the type of wool or the desirability, I think, of the wool. So um your flock today, how many do you have? Between my sister and I, about 15 to 20. Uh-huh. And and um we talked about the size. Uh, you know, I think that and we spoke about this, that the majority of the lamb consumed today in the United States isn't necessarily domestic. Correct. And it comes from you said Australia, New Zealand. Yep. Uh, you know, I've heard about Colorado lamb as being, you know, a desirable lamb, but it's really important to you. I know in your place of business, you like to, you know, you say that you grow lamb for the purpose of creating a locally of lamb burgers. A lamb burger, and that's one of your signature probably items along with your ice cream. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. And and you know, you said the happier the sheep or the happier the lamb, the better quality, because when you're processing it, you get better yield, you get it better um Yeah, everything. Everything. Yeah, you gotta help me here a little bit. You get better. Better flavor. Better flavor, right? You know, the meat block I'm sure is better, etc. So um and you also spoke, uh, I mean, we talked about animal stewardship and how critical that is in the the outcome of the meat, you know, kind of being directly how why why did how animals why does how animals raised matter in kind of the output in the yield?

SPEAKER_03 20:15

Yeah, so just like any animal, so to use a dairy cow for um example, most dairy cows actually have nutritionists. Right. And it's somebody who's testing their feed so that you get the highest quality output of milk um, you know, by yield and quality, because I want the heavy cream milk for my ice cream.

SPEAKER_01 20:34

Right.

SPEAKER_03 20:35

Um, and it's the same with all animals, whether you have a nutritionist for your animal or not. But you know, just like a human, you are what you eat. So, you know, those animals have to be healthy, well taken care of, exercised correctly, um, and that'll give you a high quality product. Are they do they are they kept inside and outside?

SPEAKER_05 20:54

Or most they're both. Uh-huh. So at night do they go in? Like the I I mean, I've talked to other farmers and they talk about how they come in at night and go out in the day, et cetera.

SPEAKER_03 21:05

So we don't break them in at night per se, but most of the time they go in to sleep at night. Uh-huh. Um, and then they come out during the day. And they graze normally like in the hot, hot summer, you'll see them grazing in the morning, and then normally they go find a shady spot in the afternoon.

SPEAKER_05 21:20

Um, yeah. So let's kind of switch our conversation and talk about Zoe's ice cream and how the idea for the ice cream business came about.

SPEAKER_03 21:29

Sure. So when I was in high school and I had to figure out if I wanted what I wanted to do, I didn't know if I wanted to go into agriculture or I had a love of baking and pastry. So I decided to go to the culinary and I'm a graduate of the culinary. Well, at the culinary, you really only do a very small segment on ice cream. It's like a two day thing. Um, but I loved it and I loved how it tied back to agriculture and it kind of brought it all together. And I realized I knew a lot about it compared to my peers um because of the agriculture background. So fast forward a Of events led me to working at Henshin uh after graduation, working at Henshin's old farmhouse. So they were an ice cream store in Pauling, New York. Um, and I that's where I learned how to make small batch ice cream, and I also managed the store for five summers. Um, so that's where I learned the basics, and then I took I went down to Penn State and took an ice cream short course, um, you know, just to get in my foot in the industry and things like that. And I always knew I wanted to own my own place um and go back to my agricultural roots, and that's where Zoe's was born.

SPEAKER_05 22:29

That's incredible. Talk about the process of ice cream making, and you said small batch to where you are today. Um, what are those what what makes it unique? What makes it different?

SPEAKER_03 22:41

So our slogan is cow to cone in three days, and that really is what separates us from the average ice cream store. Um, you know, the cows are being milked on the second day it's going up to the plant, and the third day it's coming to us, and we're turning it into ice cream. So our we are a small batchmaker, so it makes nine gallons of ice cream about every 16 minutes. Um it's not like and it's all done by hand, it's not some large-scale, you know, factory machine or anything like that. Um, and the ice our ice cream is 16% butterfat, which makes it uh desirable.

SPEAKER_05 23:13

Yummy.

SPEAKER_03 23:14

Yes. You know, just for reference, a lot of grocery stores are 10 to 12 percent. Yeah. Um, so the flavor is definitely there. And uh yeah, we make over 50 flavors, they rotate daily. Um, so we have a little bit of everything for everybody.

SPEAKER_05 23:27

How about those ice cream ingredients? Do you try to buy local I mean, and maybe share with the audience the flavors you're making there?

SPEAKER_03 23:34

Yeah, so our mo one of our most popular flavors, aside from my you know, vanilla chocolate, strawberry, is maple walnut. And the maple is from Sukup Farms. Um, and they give us the darkest syrup that they can give us, um, stuff that you wouldn't want to put on your pancakes. Right. But it's super rich flavor once you mix it with the cream. Um, and we I do ship ice cream nationwide in the over the holidays, and maple walnut is definitely the most popular flavor that I sell um or that I ship, and it's just simple ingredients. So, like our maple walnut is the syrup and walnuts, that's it. Um, less is more. Our strawberry ice cream is the ice cream base, and then we puree fresh strawberries. Um, I just have the right combination. But I feel like less is definitely more.

SPEAKER_05 24:15

And some other unique and popular flavors you share to seasonal summer flavor.

SPEAKER_03 24:20

So every summer we make sweet corn ice cream. Um, and it just with our grown sweet corn. I know. Do you have to cook that sweet corn?

SPEAKER_05 24:28

So I grill it. You grill it. Yep.

SPEAKER_03 24:30

Because it kind of it probably brings out the intensity and flavor and smather I slother it in butter actually before I put it on the grill. So it almost tastes like a caramel corn once it's in the ice cream. Um, it doesn't, you know, people always are like they look at you a little funny, like, sweet corn, can I try that? And then they try it and they're like, oh my god, that's actually really good. Um and when you have a cult following, I the end of July I'll start getting messages, when's the sweet corn coming? When's the sweet corn coming? And they're buying three gallon tubs to take home because they know it's only a very limited window when they can get it.

SPEAKER_05 25:01

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 25:02

Yeah, it's not something I expected the very first time I went to go try it.

SPEAKER_05 25:06

Uh-huh. And do you follow like seasonal patterns like pumpkin and apple? You do those types of flavors?

SPEAKER_03 25:13

We do a lot of our shake of the month every fall. Uh our two most popular ones are like an apple crisp and a pumpkin. And then in the winter, you know, we have peppermint ice cream and things like eggnog with Hudson Valley Fresh is eggnog.

SPEAKER_05 25:25

Mm-hmm. Incredible.

SPEAKER_03 25:26

Their eggnog is incredible. And again, it's just the ice cream mix and eggnog. It doesn't get more simple than that.

SPEAKER_05 25:31

So an ice cream mix, um, maybe share with the audience what is an ice cream mix?

SPEAKER_03 25:35

Yep, so Hudson Valley Fresh, it has to be pasteurized. So ice cream uh Hudson Valley Fresh makes our ice cream mix for us, which is just milk, cream, sugar, and eggs.

SPEAKER_05 25:43

Mm-hmm. And it's at a certain ratio that once you churn it.

SPEAKER_03 25:48

Yes. Yep. So what you're the ingredient you're adding is air essentially. So the more air you add, the more volume you're gonna get, but the less creamy the ice cream.

SPEAKER_01 25:56

Right.

SPEAKER_03 25:57

So uh we add the least amount of air possible, and then the faster it gets into a freezer, that's like negative 30 degrees, the better, because then you don't get ice crystals.

SPEAKER_05 26:07

So And you make uh you said three gallon tubs, is that a standard? Like a standard size. Yep. That's great. And those other ingredients like blueberries or fruits and chocolate and those things, do you try to buy them local or?

SPEAKER_03 26:20

Yeah, we try um, I mean, definitely the fruits um uh we're selling or we're purchasing local. Um things like uh for the chocolate, it's hard. I get a very high quality cocoa um that actually comes from Europe. Um it's expensive, but that way you have the consistency year-round because chocolate's a flavor I want to offer year-round.

SPEAKER_05 26:42

And probably at a premium price. Yes. Yes. Um because the cocoa market and the tariffs, I'm sure, have gone like sky high, so to speak.

SPEAKER_03 26:52

How about other things like eggs? Do you use local eggs? So I have chickens at home that my boys are responsible for. Um so we sell eggs are in ice cream are there eggs and ice cream? Yeah, are eggs and ice cream, but that is done at the plant through Hudson Valley Fresh.

SPEAKER_00 27:04

Okay, yeah. Hudson Valley Fresh. Yes. Right, yep, yep. All the milk and the ice cream products.

SPEAKER_05 27:14

Which is really I mean, that in and of itself is incredible, you know, supporting a local business and to, you know, cow to cone that whole program. I mean, so incredibly interesting. Um, and let's kind of go talk a little bit about that program and how the cow-to-comb program works and um the educational aspect of it and how you're involved.

SPEAKER_03 27:38

So right before I always offered birthday parties at Zoe's um from when we opened, and the kids would learn how to make ice cream and such. Um, but even now having my own kids, it's a little chaotic with a birthday party. Uh, you get different age groups and things like that. But from those birthday parties, stemmed into school groups and community organizations like Girl Scouts reaching out to me wanting to learn the process. Um, so I do less birthday parties now in more school groups.

SPEAKER_01 28:04

Right.

SPEAKER_03 28:04

Um, and the kids come, they uh do an activity when they arrive that has, you know, kind of connects the cow to the cone. We talk about the dairy farms and such, and then they come in the back. They we make ice cream, we use that ice cream for our ice cream cakes. Um, so they get to see the machine working, and while the machine's working, depending on the age group of the kids, they make homemade whipped cream in a mason jar so that they kind of make that connection. And we talk about, you know, all dairy products and where your food comes from. And I mean, some of these kids think that brown cows produce chocolate milk.

SPEAKER_05 28:37

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 28:37

Um, so we go back to the basics depending on the age group, and then um, you know, at the end they get to make their own ice cream Sunday, pick out their flavor, you know, use the whipped cream that they made, and um, it's great to teach these kids about and it they're super engaging and asking a lot of questions, um, which is always nice.

SPEAKER_05 28:56

Yeah, the fair has you know built this new program and the community outreach and the work with the school districts has just really been incredible. And you know, seeing now they are they're adopting a calf and you know now they're seeing the calf and writing letters to the calf.

SPEAKER_03 29:12

So a lot of sweet treats people are gonna be going to see sweet treat and then coming to Zoe's to make some ice cream.

SPEAKER_05 29:17

Yeah, sweet treats is the calf's name, right? Yeah, it's pretty incredible. Yeah. Um, you know, so again, that student experience and you know it you often what what's the qu single most popular question a student asks you?

SPEAKER_03 29:31

They w actually want to know how many times a day a cow is milked. Really? Yes. I think some of them think that it like a cow is on a milker all day. Uh-huh. Which I I mean, I guess I grew up knowing it, so I would never think that. Uh-huh. Um, but yeah, we talk a lot about the cows being milked.

SPEAKER_05 29:46

So they think like there's a constant supply and a constant flow of milk coming, you know, that's available to make products. And you know, why do you think it's so important for students to really understand where food comes from?

SPEAKER_03 29:59

Um, I think that'll, you know, if you have no ties to agricultural farming, a lot of people just think their food comes from the grocery store and they don't even realize what's past that. Um, but you know, connecting the kids to see the product, especially if they're going to the farm and seeing the animals first and then coming to us, it's almost like a full circle moment and it gets their little minds spinning.

SPEAKER_05 30:20

Yeah, for sure. You know, they they kind of puts it all together for them.

SPEAKER_03 30:25

And what do you hope these students take away when they leave your what I hope that in, you know, in the long run they either if they don't want to go into agriculture, they just support agriculture and support the open farmland in Duchess County.

SPEAKER_05 30:39

And the local, you know, buying local and how important that is. I mean, as I've been enjoying this process of creating these podcasts, I as much as I thought I knew, it continues to just open my eyes and uh, you know, just knowing the the caliber and the quality of the farms and the quality of products that we're producing here, and you know, the variety of different types of agriculture, and and you know, Bob had a great suggestion about you know educating and showcasing whether it be a horse farm or dairy farm or beef farm or poultry farm, you know, just really what's here in our community. It's so or cheese, you know, even cheese making. So um, so do you feel like programs like this could maybe help the next inspire the next generation of farmers?

SPEAKER_03 31:28

So now being open 10 years, I had a girl come um who actually interviewed with me and and I hired her this spring. And she was a Girl Scout 10 years ago who learned how to make ice cream, and she said she still remembers that day. And so that just little reminders of maybe I am doing something that they're actually listening.

SPEAKER_05 31:46

What an incredible impression, a long-lasting impression that it carried forth 10 years that it kind of came back to you. So um, you know, so let's get to the agriculture aspect and kind of looking ahead. Uh, you know, what gives you hope for the future of agriculture in Duchess County? And maybe, Dad, you may have some thoughts on that.

SPEAKER_00 32:07

It uh well, it's it's um Hudson Valley Fresh is number one, is doing a great job in keeping some farms active. It's dairy farms in Duchess County. Uh that they're doing a tremendous uh great job of um making it possible for them to make a reasonably good living. Uh secondly, uh the farms are changing from uh just being farms to agritourism and the future of agriculture in Dutchess County, I think part of it is gonna be agritourism.

SPEAKER_05 32:48

Explain that to me. What do you mean by agrotourism? Um tell the audience what that means.

SPEAKER_00 32:53

Well, to come to the farm and uh pick your own uh products for one thing, right? Um but but cater to the people that are moving into the area and coming up from New York City and the metropolitan area and and um um um farmers markets, right? Uh pick your own operations. Um I always felt that if uh I was in the the futures, I mean my grandson's going to Cornell, and um I've talked to him about um I think he's gotta think more. He he's very interested in animals. But um you also have to think about uh how much an acre will produce. Right. And um uh it takes uh an acre for an animal to uh depending on the size of it, uh if you have a a cow or something like that and you're pasturing it, it's almost an acre per cow. And uh there's i if you grow a crop on it, right, um that's for the public. If you plant an acre of blueberries, for example, uh there's a lot more money per acre coming off of it from the blueberries. Versus or from the uh versus uh just having it as pasture land example. Right. Um and I think you have to think in terms um in the future with agriculture, with doing things like that.

SPEAKER_05 34:45

Mm-hmm. It's interesting because you're kind of leading me into my next question. You know, the biggest concern, the challenge is it's really the economics and the ability to sustain and make a make a living in agriculture and you know the different costs associated with maybe livestock versus fruit farming versus dairy farming, etc. You know, do you have kind of thoughts as it relates to those concerns?

SPEAKER_00 35:12

Well, uh the She's smirking at you, I gotta say. And um uh I'd like to see this farm stay in my family. I don't know whether it will. I've I've got my will set up in a certain way though that uh gives each of them a chance to buy it if they want to buy it and not get into arguments between the family members. Um and um but um really I think um uh the way that you can get into agriculture and you gotta really love it because it's hard work is it's a key. I've seen some young people. I mentioned one young person to me, yeah, Will Woolley, who was just through sheer work, knowing what to do, being smart about it, and uh reducing the labor as much as he could, uh he's making a good living. Yeah. Uh started with from scratch. So it can still be done. That's the point. It can be done. Right. Uh but uh on the other hand, I think horticulture is uh gonna be part of it in the future. Uh it's gonna be more uh if the population continues to grow in the world, it's gonna take more land just to grow crops, and there's gonna be um less people eating beef because it's expensive. Right. It's extrem tremendously expensive right now, for example, because of the shortage of animals for the demand.

SPEAKER_05 37:07

Supply and demand and the economics of it for sure. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 37:12

And and obviously, uh, you know, what the consumer and and Dutchess County um um conservation council is doing a great job with uh in Millbrook and around those areas and buying the development rights. So it's keeping the land open. Right. And then there are farmers that will farm that open land, and there's getting to be less of them, but they're still the land is still used for agriculture. Right. Uh with um uh bigger farms, but uh um but the land is still in agriculture and that's important. And politics are up that's what I do for um farmers because they're such a outvoted. Yes. Uh there aren't as many of them in the zone. Sure. Uh they're outvoted, it's the state keeps putting in more regulations and things. And uh that that's difficult too.

SPEAKER_05 38:24

Certainly is. If you were what would you what what would you say to your young person today considering a future in agriculture? And I I'd like both of your opinions on this because I'm thinking Katie's might be different than yours. Or Zoe.

SPEAKER_03 38:40

I think that hard work, um, you know, it's definitely hard work, but it's I feel like the most rewarding work. Um and so if if you want it, go after it. And if you work really hard, it'll come and it'll be hard. Um but in the end I feel like the reward out outweighs the hard work.

SPEAKER_05 39:02

How about you, Bob?

SPEAKER_00 39:02

Do you Well I think it starts number one with 4-H and learning and learning at a young age and enjoying it. And then as uh Zoe says, it's um it's hard work and uh but young people can still do it. Uh they can make a living and and my son my grandson is gonna find that out because he's going to um do it in it's and you've got to be probably not too materialistic in the sense that you want to just make money to buy fancy cars and things because you're not gonna do that in agriculture. Right. You're gonna need to reinvent it. But you're gonna get more satisfaction. Uh there's definitely more satisfaction in growing a good crop, uh seeing it grow, seeing it um uh come with um high yields and things like this. Yeah. And uh there's there's definitely more satisfaction in that than uh uh just buying a shiny car or things like that.

SPEAKER_03 40:22

And I think a lot of people you gotta realize that agriculture is not just being a steward of the land. There's you know, you could be a scientist who's great with soil and water, you know, food distribution, um, veterinary care. There's a lot of different you you know, be open to a lot of different things. Yes, um that all goes back to supporting your local agriculture and the open farmland.

SPEAKER_05 40:44

That's great. I mean that's certainly great feedback. Um so if you could take away one lesson from your story and you know, what you've what you've created here on the farm in your life, um, what would you hope it is? Say that again. If you could take away one lesson from your story and you know, what would what would you hope it is? One lesson.

SPEAKER_00 41:10

Well in my case I think it's just being able to look out and see nice fields growing even as I'm getting older, and I never minded the hard work. Um the hard work, I like to work hard, and it it never bothered me. Uh, but it's also just the satisfaction of sitting here. I'm seeing some good um uh uh cover crop that we put in last fall. Beautiful. Uh and it's uh growing and it's going to be I'll be selling it for ten dollars a bale uh for the straw. It's gonna turn into straw. It's winter rye actually. And um what you're looking at when you look beyond where we just an area and uh it's just a satisfaction of watching something like this grow and mature and it's just the whole thing is enjoyable.

SPEAKER_05 42:23

Yeah, full kind of full circle gives you a lot of reward and satisfaction. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And you know, Bob, a tribute to you and what you've done here and the family you've created and you know their support of of agriculture and you know, it's thank you. I mean, I I feel like I should be thanking you for what you've done in in support of building this incredible farm and creating this incredible legacy here in Duchess County, whether you doing it or through your generations and your family.

SPEAKER_00 42:55

Well, my family's been in it a long, long time. Uh my family came from Pauling and um there were generations of dairy farmers.

SPEAKER_05 43:09

For sure. Um all right, so I would really just, you know, again, I I want to just kinda end with understanding kind of sheep and because I always like to focus in on a specific type of livestock, um, and and talk a little bit about why those we talked a little bit about why those sheep and their disposition, but sheep I don't know how how do I say sheep growing or sheep sheep raising. Sheep raising, um, you know, how has it complemented your life and specifically because you've always had sheep, you know, as opposed to Bob, your dad being in dairy and now in you know, fields and crops, etc., you're the sheep girl, right?

SPEAKER_03 43:52

Are you the only sheep girl in your family? No, so my other two sisters and their boys are all sheep.

SPEAKER_05 43:57

All the same species of sheep? Everybody's got

SPEAKER_03 44:00

A different choice. Oh, let's hear. I I'd love to hear the mall. So I have the South Downs. Right. Um, and then they raise um Romneys as well as like a Hampshire market cross. Um, but I think that sheep are the perfect, you know, if you're getting introduct, you want to start somewhere, and um it's like the perfect species to start with. Yeah, they're small enough to handle, but they're bigger than a chicken, um, and more rewarding or satisfying, I feel like. Um, and yeah, they teach you a sense of responsibility. Um, and you know, it's you get a lot out of a sheep. So you can use them for meat, you can use them for their wool. Um they're great grazers. I know people like rent them out to just eat down their lawn. Right. Things like that.

SPEAKER_05 44:46

Uh-huh. Um how long, I mean, what how long do sheep live? I mean, what's their average life cycle? I mean, if you're not pro if you're not processing them, I mean, is this a an animal that's going to be with you for 10 to 50? 10 to 12 years, I think. 10 to 12 years. Yeah. And um typically you keep the females and process the males? So we we castrate the males and then process them. Okay. For the reasons it makes them nicer, yes, man, nicer to be around.

SPEAKER_03 45:16

Uh well, if we're castrating them just so that testosterone isn't in the meat when you go to process them.

SPEAKER_05 45:22

That's an excellent point. Don't want that because it doesn't probably taste as good, right? Yeah, it makes them have happier meat, nicer meat. That's an interesting, interesting point. Um, so your the South Downs are w white. Is that there's they are both, but they're primarily white. Uh-huh. Great. And we're gonna take a look at them, right?

SPEAKER_03 45:43

Yeah, some romneys as well that you'll see that are natural colored.

SPEAKER_05 45:46

And natural color on a romney is dark. Yes. Brown? Yep. Dark brown? Dark brown. Like chocolate brown. Yeah, very, very cool. And your other sister, she she raises a cross. Like a market lamb. Yeah. Um and what's their color? Uh white. White blackface. All pretty much the same size, and uh for the most part. The market animals are a little larger. Uh-huh. Great. Awesome. Yeah. I again just letting the audience understand, you know, the species of what you raise here and how it's impacted your life and uh your family's life. And you said your kids now are starting to show, and we hope they kind of bring them to the Duchess County Fair, right? As clover buds or through the 4-H program. Excellent. Thank you for joining us for this podcast episode of a legacy of agriculture and community. Today, Katie Hines reminded us that agriculture is more than production. It is stewardship, education, innovation, and community. From forage show rings to South Down sheep, from sweet cornfields to ice cream cones, her work reflects the enduring values that keep local agriculture alive. But to our listeners, thank you for joining us for this meaningful conversation. If you've enjoyed this episode, please like, share, and follow the podcast and help us continue telling the stories that keep agriculture alive and relevant for future generations. By sharing these episodes, you help shine a light on the farmers, producers, and agriculture stewards who make such an important contribution to our region. Be sure to mark your calendars for the 180th anniversary of the Dutchess County Fair. Opening day kicks off on Tuesday, August 25th, and the fair runs through August 30th in beautiful Rhinebeck, New York. I'm your host, Suzanne Roitze, and we'll see you next time as we continue celebrating a legacy of agriculture and community in Dutchess County.