Make More Money! Jerry Bostleman | Wait What!? with Aimee Mayo #4

Jerry Bostleman co-founded Vaco from zero, built it into a $1 billion company, made over 100 millionaires, and has invested in nearly 100 companies across industries. He also got pushed out of the company he built — and what he learned from that is the most valuable part of this conversation.

In this episode Aimee and Jerry get into the real truth about how to raise money when you have nothing, what investors actually want to see before they write a check, why "Yeah But" is quietly killing every great idea in your life, why being a control freak is the fastest way to stay broke, the explosive growth of the THC beverage industry and why it isn't federally legal yet, how to build a team that wins without you, what he'd do with $1,000 and a laptop in 2026, and how childhood trauma can make you unstoppable in business while wrecking everything else.

Raw, funny, unfiltered, and genuinely useful. No fluff. No corporate speak. Just the real stuff.

Follow Aimee Here: https://linktr.ee/WaitWhatPod 

Transcript

Cold Open: Invest, Delegate, Survive

SPEAKER_00 0:00

How many things you invested in?

SPEAKER_01 0:02

So I've invested in, I mean a lot. Like maybe 75 or 85?

SPEAKER_00 0:07

I spend a lot of my time doing shit I'm terrible at that I don't need to be doing in the first place because asking Chat GPT, what do I keep doing wrong?

SPEAKER_01 0:17

What are the things that only you can do and as soon as possible offload the rest of it to everybody else?

SPEAKER_00 0:23

Yeah, yeah, that's such great advice. Oh my gosh, that's such great advice. Can I keep these guns for him? I'm thinking, no, I'm not keeping these guns for you.

SPEAKER_01 0:32

You should be in the dictionary able to look up entrepreneurialism and see gritty and soul crushing and devastating and cry yourself to sleep. And am I any good at this? Am I an imposter?

SPEAKER_00 0:44

I was just spraying fix to fly on the tar. Opius and daylight saving time. I hate both of those about as much as I hate anything.

SPEAKER_01 0:54

It's okay to think outside the box as long as you know what the F that's in the box in the first place.

SPEAKER_00 0:59

I've never wanted a song on a record as bad as I wanted on Adam Lambert.

SPEAKER_01 1:05

It's not either or it's yes and.

SPEAKER_00 1:07

That's one of the smartest things that I've heard about this. A little bit stuff.

SPEAKER_02 1:13

I'm feeling it too.

Seltzers And The Nightcap

SPEAKER_00 1:30

Hey, it's Wait what with Amy Mayo, and I'm here with a businessman, Jerry Bossman. We're gonna talk about investing and all kinds of stuff to help us make more money.

SPEAKER_01 1:45

Ultimately, I usually like to prepare so much for these things that I make it look easy. Only Amy Mayo would have me come out with absolutely no preparation. But I do think we should start with a beverage. What do you think?

SPEAKER_00 1:56

Yes. This is something the jury's invested in that I love, that Iris loves, that like these are so good if you don't want to be hung over. Like if you want to go out and have fun, and if you get a lot of social anxiety, that's why I think a lot of people drink.

SPEAKER_01 2:13

A lot of songwriters love it because it chills them out for the most part. As a business guy, my position is we should all be drinking this Sunday through Thursday. Ultimately, Sunday through Thursday.

SPEAKER_00 2:23

Every night to calm down.

SPEAKER_01 2:25

Make a nice dinner, watch a movie, make love to somebody you really care about, wake up with no hangover. And if you want to go crazy on Friday or Saturday, have at it.

SPEAKER_00 2:33

That Lola, when you said that, it reminded me of Lola, our daughter Lola, saying um she worked it public. I was asking about what do people buy, and she's like, all the women all buy wine, that's all they buy. And then I asked what her friend's mom was doing, and she said she's drunk on the couch, like all the moms. And I'm just thinking, holy shit.

SPEAKER_01 2:53

Well, wine is something. It's hard to put, it's I mean, it's a whole bottle, so how are you gonna put that down?

SPEAKER_00 2:58

So bad. Like it will make you feel bad. Like, but these things, okay, let's open them. You ready? Should we coast first?

SPEAKER_01 3:04

I love that call. Here's to Amy Mayo and her extraordinary podcast, maybe a tremendous success.

SPEAKER_00 3:10

And here's to Jerry Bosselman. I'm just here for the can't wait to learn. Learn, learn, learn.

SPEAKER_01 3:16

Let's get temper our expectations. They always say a good conversation is when you can pull one or two things away. Let's just go for one tonight.

SPEAKER_00 3:23

Oh, I'm gonna learn a bunch tonight. I know it. I know it.

SPEAKER_01 3:26

Sound.

SPEAKER_00 3:27

Okay, so I've been working on questions.

Childhood Money Lessons And Adoption

SPEAKER_00 3:30

Did you grow up with money?

SPEAKER_01 3:32

That's an excellent question. I used to say if everybody were I were related to were to die and leave me everything, I'd own about 30,000. But I'll tell you this: my mom went back to school when I was 13, ball state, ended up going to TSU, was a renowned kindergarten teacher, and my dad was a trim carpenter and also managed Bowling Alley, and they cobbled together, and now they have over a million dollars. Oh, that's a good thing. So it's an absolutely incredible story.

SPEAKER_00 4:03

Oh, I love that. So, like, what did you learn from them about money?

SPEAKER_01 4:08

Man, that's a tough one. Better to have it than not have it. You know, everybody says money's not important, but I know what it's if you don't have it, if you don't have it, it's hard to think about anything else. So I mean, I my dad worked, it's my adopted dad. My biological dad skipped out like a ghost when I was three and never saw him again. So this dude rolled in and adopted three kids that weren't his in the 70s, and worked tons of hours every week. And like I said, my mom went back and became a kindergarten teacher, and they just put it all out there. So I learned from them just get in the grind and get it done. Hard work. Yeah, he was a trim carpenter. My brother and I, we would go out and work with him every single weekend, and he would use lines like, Boy, help me, don't hurt me. Tighten up every chance you get. And I guess the the trade skips a generation because my former wife used to say, the kids are not allowed to play on anything that I put together. Oh shit. But I did hold the light. I could burn trash and I could move gravel like nobody else. So I learned a work ethic from those guys. Uh, and I am eternally, I didn't understand what love looked like at that time as a kid. But then when he stayed in a tough situation with three kids, added one more for a fourth, and provided in the 70s, and my mom slate it, I try to pay it back every chance I can now.

SPEAKER_00 5:30

Yes. Well, you know, that just made me think about Jeff Bezos because like I think he had a similar story where like he got adopted, you know, by his like whoever his mom married. I don't know exactly the whole thing. And I don't know if his dad like is alive wishing I'd been nicer.

SPEAKER_01 5:49

That's a funny situation. Um, that's a longer story, but my biological uncle, I found him on ancestors.com. And so I texted him, I said, I mean, I'm not looking to cause any trouble, but maybe close a few chapters in a book I haven't opened in a while. Yeah. And I'm gonna go see him in the next couple of months. Oh, that's so crazy.

SPEAKER_00 6:10

That will, I'll tell you one crazy thing about Ancestor or what Ancestry.com.

SPEAKER_01 6:15

That's it, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:16

Yeah, that and 23, 23 of me sold everybody's information. So they somebody people need to sue them because they took everybody's stuff and just sold it. But Ancestry.com, I found out, like, um, okay, so I I know this is gonna be outrageous because I know your story.

SPEAKER_01 6:36

I can't wait to hear this.

SPEAKER_00 6:37

It's nuts. I found out, okay, so my mom has a sister that I used to play with growing up. Nobody knew it was her sister, like it was the neighbor. Like, so my gosh. Then Chris's mom has a sister, and so like we both found out. I think people are finding that out like crazy now.

SPEAKER_01 6:58

I used to joke around. You know that old parlor game? If you could know what everybody thought about you, would you want to know?

SPEAKER_00 7:05

I don't know. What about you?

SPEAKER_01 7:07

Well, in 2026, we don't have a choice, it's all on the internet.

SPEAKER_00 7:10

So Oh, and everybody leaves so many comments about stuff.

SPEAKER_01 7:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:15

I don't even know if I'll read the comments on the pod on the podcast once people are leaving comments about stuff. I don't know, but I try not to take stuff personal because usually the comments they're leaving are shit about them.

SPEAKER_01 7:29

Oh, yeah. You know what I mean? I promise you, my mom will leave a good one.

SPEAKER_00 7:32

Oh, that's so sweet. Yeah, my mom, she's gotten all into podcasts now that I've got one. I've seen

First Big Raise After 9/11

SPEAKER_00 7:39

a lot of fun. And um, like, so okay, I want to talk a little bit about high rise.

SPEAKER_02 7:44

All right, all right.

SPEAKER_00 7:45

And okay, before we do that, how many different things do you invest in and have you invested in?

SPEAKER_01 7:52

I mean, my primary gig was a company called Vako, and I had the best investors imaginable.

SPEAKER_00 7:57

So if you're talking about Vako too.

SPEAKER_01 7:59

And my investors too, like Lucius Birch and those guys. That's a fun place to start from where the where I learned about investing. Lucius is the world's.

SPEAKER_00 8:09

Yeah, okay, let's just go there and come back to high-rise.

SPEAKER_01 8:12

All right, all right, all right.

SPEAKER_00 8:13

Because that's kind of more the beginning, right?

SPEAKER_01 8:15

Right. So up until that point, I worked at a major corporation called Chili's Waiting Tables. Uh I also worked at Arthur Anderson in public accounting. Uh, and then I worked at Robert Half, and then I had an opportunity and an idea to start something. So I went and saw Lucius Birch, who was taking 19 companies public, Crom Carmichael, who is an entrepreneur's entrepreneur that's been invested in a lot of things, and a guy named Toby Wilt. He used to invest in the Outback, one of the pivotal banks in Nashville. And I was 30 years old.

SPEAKER_00 8:46

How'd you meet these people?

SPEAKER_01 8:48

So I had a client, I was trying to raise money. I needed $500,000, which sounded like $500 billion to start it at 30 years old.

SPEAKER_00 8:57

What year was this?

SPEAKER_01 8:58

That's a great question. Important. It was uh 2001, which was right when you needed 500 grand. And the World Trade Centers had just come down. So when I met with Lucius, Lucius, it was Lucius and Crom, and Lucius spokes of pipe, right? So I had written a business plan, I laid it all out, and uh I needed $500,000. I'd already done it at Robert Half, so I was willing to give up 17.5% of the company. This is exactly what Lucius says. He goes, let me see if I understand the economics of this deal. You come in here with a great company that consists of this stack of papers. You don't have dollar one in revenue, you take yourself a salary, we take virtually all the risk. Scratch at all the risk, and you benevolently offered us 17.5% of the company. Crom, is that something wrong with my math? And I said, Look, Lucius, I've never raised money before. You know, I when I bought my wife's diamond, the jeweler said I was getting a good deal, but I didn't know. He goes, Well, it ain't gonna be all complicated. I ain't gonna ask you to put your wife's panties up as collateral, but needs to be a damn sight fed on 17.5% of the company. And then when he talked about the timing of it, he said, it was crazy. Because remember, I'm 30 years old, and this is the most important meeting in the business world I've ever had.

SPEAKER_02 10:23

I love this.

SPEAKER_01 10:25

It was crazy. He said, son, you could not be raising capital in a more disadvantageous climate. The stock market has collapsed. The World Trade Centers had collapsed. My peers are not investing in anything. But I'm not the type of person to hide my head under the pillow and wait for the world to change. I will invest in you and we'll do extraordinary things.

SPEAKER_00 10:48

Oh my gosh, that's so great. So, what what was your pitch to him?

SPEAKER_01 10:53

I mean, I didn't.

SPEAKER_00 10:54

I mean, you had a business plan, but what was it for?

SPEAKER_01 10:57

That's a great question, Amy. Ultimately, we at Arthur Anderson, it was really cool because it's public accounting. I'd the very first time I interviewed for a job at Arthur Anderson, I would I'd been into Marines too. So I kind of had that background and I failed at first in college, and then I came back and I killed it. So I'm interviewing for Arthur Anderson, and I didn't know I had suit and a docksiders, like those boat shoes. And I get the internship, and Kennetham's this really uh feminine guy that hired me. He was a great guy. And as soon as I'm in a conference room for my internship, I'd bought new shoes. The first thing he did look down under the table and go, ooh, somebody got him a new pair of shoes, didn't they? So Anderson really taught me how to be a professional. I'd always waited tables, worked construction, Marine Corps.

SPEAKER_00 11:48

I love this. Did it was so were they like both mentors or just the fur the what's the first guy's name?

SPEAKER_01 11:55

Well, that was at Anderson when I when I joined that. But Lucius Burst was. Lucius, yeah. Lucius was Crom's a character.

SPEAKER_00 12:01

He sounds like a rich guy. That name, Lucius.

SPEAKER_01 12:04

It does. It does. He'd taken 90 companies

What Vaco Actually Does

SPEAKER_01 12:07

public. But Anderson, what what what I pitched Lucius was Anderson was a place where we were very collaborative, we were consultative, and clients really needed our help, but it was audit and it was terrible. You would lose your mind one day as an auditor. It's just so boring.

SPEAKER_00 12:23

I bet.

SPEAKER_01 12:24

Grateful for them, made a career off of them, but don't want to do it.

SPEAKER_00 12:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:27

Then we joined Robert Half, and it was a corporate sport, man. We we were actually helping companies with CFOs and controllers on a project basis. It was a lot of fun, but it was a company that really they were more brand-centric than talent-centric. They thought any monkey could do the work. You never really felt like your job was secure. So it was a soulless bureaucracy. So we thought, what if we could get that consultative type a killer environment of Anderson, but bring the corporate sport of Robert half and create a place where the best and brightest could be liberated from those soulless bureaucratic machines and come to a place where the best and brightest could spend the rest of their careers. And Vaco meets for yourself on a master. So that was the whole idea of that.

SPEAKER_00 13:09

That's so cool. Like, so what does Vaco do?

SPEAKER_01 13:14

So now, I mean, since I've left, they've really done a phenomenal job building it even further.

SPEAKER_00 13:19

So are they headhunters?

SPEAKER_01 13:21

It's a basically anything that a really smart, cool human can do. So it's like if you take the top level, we have a retained search division that'll find your CEO, your CFO, your COO. But unlike Hydric and Struggles, we're not one and done. We're just getting started. Then we go to what used to be called Morgan Franklin, that's now High Spring, where we do methodology-driven consulting. And that's a game changer. Nobody else can do that. But unlike in Ernst and Young, we're not one and done. We can bring out our project professionals through traditional VICA, but traditional VACO to help on uh mass moves of corporations.

SPEAKER_00 13:57

So you're doing like bigger thing, like CEO stuff, like at Vake, like that's what they do. Vaco, like, because I'll tell you this, this is complicated, it's hard to explain for sure. Okay, so most people that are busy people that like have a family and have a job that keeps them pretty busy, they have to hire somebody. You know what I mean? Whether it's like a nanny or a housekeeper or something like that. And so trying to find somebody to hire is just like I was determined that I was gonna find somebody great, and I did, and I got lucky. Well, actually, I don't even know if I got lucky, I worked my ass off like and went through a hundred interviews, but like a lot, they were online, you know, like questions. I would go through questions first, but I was just like determined to find somebody really great, and like on Indeed, that's a damn free-for-all, indeed. But then on LinkedIn, at least there's a picture, like because you don't know if it's a guy or a girl, you don't know anything, and um, which can be good about not knowing because one thing I found out was like the people I linked up with a lot of times, like they're the people that I had the same ideas with and we matched up. I would have never thought, like, but the two there was two other people besides Luke who is so amazing, and I do feel like I got lucky. But so like they were people I would have never even thought, you know, like this one guy in Atlanta, he was this older black man that like he was so smart, but we had the same ideas about stuff, but he was in Atlanta, and I need somebody in Nashville and Luke. Luke is just perfect. I just think well, I'm I just feel lucky we're gonna be.

SPEAKER_01 15:46

Must be in the name, you know. I got a son named Luke.

SPEAKER_00 15:49

Yes, yeah, and I'll tell you, like, it's

Hiring, Firing, And Nanny Nightmares

SPEAKER_00 15:52

hard to find. I don't know if you know this story. I'm changing the subject, but so we needed a nanny, and we've known each other like for a long time. Like our kids grew up together, so we co-parented in almost a communal fashion. Always, yeah, because both of our boys were best friends, like, and so we we got this nanny. Well, she got recommended by Angela, so that's where where this came from. And so um, when we hired her, I was just like, I'd been praying to find somebody good, and she comes over and she had a binder that was about three, like three inches thick, and she said she won nanny of the year in LA, and she had this crazy resume, but everybody she worked for were people you couldn't talk to. Like she was Justin Bieber's nanny. I mean, she had these crazy stories, and so it didn't take long till I realized she was a compulsive liar, and the kids were like, She's best friends.

SPEAKER_03 16:53

I remember this.

SPEAKER_00 16:54

Yeah, I mean she just was insane, and like she had these things called nano points, and the kids like we came in and it just looked like some kind of crazy Chinese algebra, if that exists, like on this board. And it's like she was, I didn't understand, like she wouldn't let Lola go somewhere because she didn't have enough nano points. But anyway, so one day I'm at Waffle House. I didn't know what to do because I was just like, we have got to let her go. She said she had a bunch of monkeys in the attic. So that's when Chris is like, she's fucking crazy and we're letting her go. So then at Waffle House, I was there with Missy Gallimore, a friend of mine in Faith Hill. And Faith Hill, like that, I guess she's just had a lot of employees through the years. She was like, you just gotta let her go and don't look back. And I said, Yeah, but she was nanny of the year. And she's like, There's no such thing as nanny of the year that doesn't even exist.

SPEAKER_01 17:53

Those are the type of wise conversations that happen at Waffle House.

SPEAKER_00 17:57

And I finally was like, I came home and I did learn because Faith said, you gotta just let them go and don't look back. So I learned it was a good lesson for me because it's it's only gonna get worse if you have somebody working for you and like you're you know it's not right, but you're afraid to let them go. So how do you deal with hiring and firing?

SPEAKER_01 18:18

Man, actually, I don't know if you've ever been in a relationship, but do they usually get better with time? I mean, that that's a very good point. No, exactly. No, we won't go down to some of those conversations, but ultimately, I mean, you actually told the story of why Vaco works beautifully because what you said was you had to go through a ton of different resumes. Yes. One thing you also made a point is the halo effect. The good thing about not seeing a picture, there's something that says really good looking people have it so easy. And if you see a picture, you think, oh, they must be good. But not seeing that picture probably helped you as you can. Yeah, it was interesting.

SPEAKER_00 18:53

I definitely taught me a lesson because like there were people on there like that I just wouldn't have thought would have been the right people. If you look at, you know, if you look at pictures, you're gonna go for somebody who looks like either somebody who's worked for you or somebody who probably looks like you or looks like you'd hang out and be friends. I'll tell you the funniest thing about okay, so one thing I learned is indeed there's no pictures, you know. That was the cool, like kind of cool. But on LinkedIn, there is pictures. So the funny thing is on LinkedIn, like a girl on LinkedIn will be one person, like in a business suit, and then on Instagram, she's butt naked with like a teddy bear, like and you know what? I I don't even give a shit. Like, I just want somebody that doesn't have to be a good thing. Right. She's living a world, but you can tell somebody's nuts pretty quick. Like if you just look at a little bit of stuff, you can usually tell, regardless of that. Our best nanny, I saw a picture of her on a cop car, like funneling a beer, but she was the one of the best nannies we ever did.

SPEAKER_01 20:04

I can't shake this feeling that you've probably been on a car funneling a beer at some point.

SPEAKER_00 20:07

Yeah, probably in Panama City.

SPEAKER_01 20:08

Who even knows? Club La Vila, baby. But to your point about what you did, that's why Vaco matters. When you really come to Vaco, you're not really trying to find a person, you're not really trying to do anything specific. You what you're we're really trying to do is save time. Oh, gosh, create certainty.

SPEAKER_00 20:27

Because it takes so much time. It takes so much time and it's so stressful.

SPEAKER_01 20:32

What if somebody had said, okay, we can interview for uh 30 days if you want, or I'll give you Luke.

SPEAKER_00 20:38

Oh, God, it'd be amazing. It'd be amazing. Really?

SPEAKER_01 20:41

What we're trying to do is bring more loops to the table is pro is the primary strategy.

SPEAKER_00 20:46

Yeah, because like with nannies, it always felt like a crapshoot. Like sometimes you get lucky, but then you start like we had one nanny that she worked here one day. Taylor Swift came to write, she left the kids in the pool, and she was we went out there and Taylor even got on her ass. Like, you know, because she just saw her in the driveway and came running out, like because she just she just wanted to be around the music business. You know what I mean? Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

We'll just probably really talk to you guys.

SPEAKER_00 21:15

Well, I quit saying we were songwriters.

SPEAKER_01 21:17

What did you say you were? What's your cover? I didn't tell them nothing.

SPEAKER_00 21:20

I just said we need a nanny.

SPEAKER_01 21:23

Hiring a nanny is exactly like hiring a project team to help you go public or acquire a company or assimilate a series of businesses. You really want certainty that it's going to be successful, and then you want it done on a timely basis, and you don't want it to take all your busy time. Would you rather h spend a hundred hours hiring someone or write a great song?

SPEAKER_00 21:47

Yeah, write a great song. Like that's another question, like delegating.

Yes And: Better Business Conversations

SPEAKER_00 21:52

Are you good at delegating?

SPEAKER_01 21:54

I like to straddle the line between autonomous leadership and leadership by neglect. Because ultimately If you just don't respond to enough emails, most stuff's gonna figure it out. Like, and I think that's a big one of the biggest problems with entrepreneurs is often entrepreneurs think they need to know the right answer. Yeah. I'm the boss. I'm supposed to know this. But really, an entrepreneur that's really good knows they have to know the right question and who to ask that question to.

SPEAKER_00 22:21

Yeah, that's good. I've not seen that. Asking the right questions is really smart.

SPEAKER_01 22:26

Two of the right people.

SPEAKER_00 22:27

Yeah, yeah. Because I love this one saying, it's a new one I just heard not long ago about if somebody's telling you no, you're asking the wrong person. And it's so good.

SPEAKER_01 22:40

Well, you know the laws of the rules of improv, right? Have you ever heard those? They were made for Amy Mayo. So ultimately, we had the improv guys come and do a training at one of our companies, and it was so good. The guys from Second City that had like the Lucy.

SPEAKER_00 22:56

That's where all the SNL people come from.

SPEAKER_01 22:58

100%. We didn't have any of those guys, but it was still awesome. And they say, here are the rules of improv. You can't say no in improv because it shuts it down. Like I'll practice. I'm gonna keep saying things and you say no. You say no, you say you just say no to all these. Say no? You say no to everything. Hey, what if we did a podcast? No, but what if we had the kids out on the boat? No, but what if we uh did high rise and had a good time? No, yeah, and I'm kind of feeling like this, it's deflating because I'm getting no, no, no, no. And then they say you also can't say yeah, but because yeah, but is no with a tuxedo.

SPEAKER_00 23:34

Oh and I'll do that one.

SPEAKER_01 23:35

You throw some ideas and I'll hit you that back.

SPEAKER_00 23:37

Throw you some ideas. Okay, um, should I invest in? Let me think. I'm gonna need to think. So, what am I doing here? So, like just say anything you want to talk about.

SPEAKER_01 23:48

Like just say, hey, maybe we should go to the park on Sunday. Oh, just simple questions. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 23:53

Okay, maybe we should go to dinner.

SPEAKER_01 23:55

Yeah, but I mean, what about all those calories?

SPEAKER_00 23:57

Oh, wow. Okay, maybe we should buy a dog.

SPEAKER_01 24:02

Yeah, but then it would shed everywhere, you know. And they so it just don't you feel like difficulty.

SPEAKER_00 24:08

It's no, you're right. It's no.

SPEAKER_01 24:10

So yes and is what they say. Oh, I love that. And yes, and gets the conversation going, which is like Amy Mayo personified it.

SPEAKER_00 24:18

You're not gonna do it, yes and because it doesn't matter.

SPEAKER_01 24:21

Like, just say something outrageous to me that you can think of. I can't wait to hear this.

SPEAKER_00 24:25

You know, it takes a lot for some to be outrageous to me. So I'm trying to think like I'm gonna do a thousand cartwheels down the street.

SPEAKER_01 24:33

Yes, and think about how much calories we'll burn. And then you hit it back to me, and then we roll the yes and, and ultimately the best answer is gonna come to the right spot because we're collaborative, smart people.

SPEAKER_00 24:45

So you just run crazy stuff back and forth?

SPEAKER_01 24:48

Whatever the idea is, yes and, yes, and like one example might be hey, should we buy this company? There's a million reasons. Like what I always say about being an entrepreneur, there are thousands of reasons to fail with your head up. Nobody knows our name, we're not funded enough, we don't have the relationship, somebody else has got more education, somebody else is more connected. And yeah, you can we can fail with our heads up. But there's two or three reasons almost always that we can be successful. So if we obsess on that side of it, we can get there. So if you think about a business solution, should we open a restaurant there in Brentwood? Yeah, but you know, there's already a bunch of restaurants there.

SPEAKER_00 25:27

I hate that so much. I've never realized how much I hate that. The yeah, but I've never even thought about that.

SPEAKER_01 25:34

I didn't mean to make butt such an enemy of yours, but it is the enemy of creation.

SPEAKER_00 25:37

Well, you might as well say no. Yeah, yeah, but you know that saying hesitation means no.

SPEAKER_01 25:44

That's your saying, and I like that. Like you it is a really, really good one. If it's not a yes, it's a no. And I I I think that's Amy Mayo. I thought I I think that's amazing. When I think about that sometimes.

SPEAKER_00 25:57

The thing is, it's I love this. I'm gonna have to remember this because one thing I've seen with ideas is like you can deflate somebody pretty quick. I mean, actually, you can deflate them so they don't even you know keep going with it. Even if they were gonna pitch it to somebody else, you can shut them down. It kind of reminds me of song titles. You know what I mean? If you're pitch, because you pitch song titles when you sit down to write. And like a lot of times, like some of the titles are just especially, oh my gosh, this one guy, this songwriter I love, he sat down to write, and he's like, Of course, what I write with Garth Brooks, he's got the red strokes. And he's like, But you're stuck, you gotta do what that. You know what I mean? You gotta write that. So you better figure out a good way to write it.

SPEAKER_01 26:50

And so your thing, you're confident enough, and you've been through your business, has got so much rejection with it, and you're naturally a woman that can go through it. Think about the person on the team that is like I this is my big idea, and I want to throw this out there. And then somebody like you says, yeah, but we might need to that like that's devastating. That person might not have another idea for 17 or 18 years. Like you're you're probably gonna be resilient on the other side of the I'm so resilient.

SPEAKER_00 27:16

That's the thing. Like, my dad was nut, so I kind of had to be resilient growing up, but yeah, because just because one person says no, that don't mean anything. A hundred percent because there's a million billion people, you know, like, and you're just probably it's just like that saying that I I was talking about like if somebody's telling you no, you're asking the wrong person.

Beating Bureaucracy With The Right Person

SPEAKER_00 27:37

Right. We were trying to get this permit for Airbnb, and this guy, like, I'm not gonna say his name, but it was one of the worst experiences of my life.

SPEAKER_01 27:47

If he controls permits, we won't need to talk about that guy. He's one of the most powerful people in the world.

SPEAKER_00 27:51

Like metro people that do permits. This guy was a nightmare. He was just trying to make me just miserable. But so I heard that saying about if you're you know here and no, you're asking the wrong person. And so then we hired a lawyer because I knew this guy was wrong. It we're on 10 acres. I mean, give me a break if we want to rent the house. Shut up.

SPEAKER_01 28:16

That would have to be one hell of a party for that to bother your neighbors and your own.

SPEAKER_00 28:20

Exactly. We they've never said a word about anything, and we've had a lot of parties. Then we hired a lawyer. We had that permit. She talked to a different guy. Right. We had that permit before lunch the next day, and it cost us $2,000 to get it, but it was worth it. And that guy was wrong the whole time, just like I thought he was wrong. Because what he was saying didn't make any sense. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 28:46

Man, I'm actually going through something just like that right now. That's crazy. You just said that. The boring company, are you familiar with that? They're gonna like uh it's a terrible name. But the boring company is such a bad name. I know, but it's actually like boring underground, making tunnels. You you know how Vegas has the Vegas lube. So if you get off of the airport, you can take a Tesla tunnel directly to the hotel.

SPEAKER_00 29:07

Oh, I didn't know that.

SPEAKER_01 29:08

It's a time machine. You will go crazy on it. And then you can go like from uh the New Virgin Hotel to the Bellagio. You just go in and you go under the ground, you don't have any traffic at all. Well, they're doing it in Nashville, so we have a music city loop.

SPEAKER_02 29:21

What? I didn't know this.

SPEAKER_01 29:23

Oh my gosh. I'll introduce you to these guys. So one of our properties might be a good site for them. And so we went to the city council. They're paying for it 100%. So it's absolutely free to the city. And I'm telling you, man, you can go to Cain Prime, another fantastic restaurant that I might have an investment in. And sometimes you're at Cain Prime, you're like, I don't know if I want to go to Broadway or not. You get into the tunnel, into the time machine, you're there in three minutes for $4, and you're right at the foot of Tootsie's.

SPEAKER_00 29:53

When is this thing happening?

SPEAKER_01 29:54

Should be done by 2027. The whole idea, though, to your point, is we're working with them. And so I presented a city council about that, and city council is really opposed to it because they want rails and they want buses and things like that. Well, the reality is it's not either or, it's yes and. This is free and it's going under the ground, and we can rock and roll with it, and it's free to every person. But there's so much inertia and fear of change. Yeah. There's not one single credible reason why we wouldn't do that. And there's a building full of screamy people opposing it. Luckily, Governor Lee has got it all squared away, and it's gonna be you're going to lose your mind. I'll I'll take you out.

SPEAKER_00 30:38

Well, that's such a great idea. I love great ideas. You know what I mean? That to me, like an example to me of a great idea, is that I don't know if you've seen that cube. It's like see-through the Apple building. All you see is the Apple down there across from Central Park. Have you ever seen that building? I don't think so. Okay, so this is like one of my favorite things in life: a creative solution. That was one of the best like pieces of real estate in New York, except for it was in front of FAO Swartz and nobody ever bought it. I mean, it was like it was across from the Plaza Hotel and across, I mean, it was it couldn't even be more prime location. And so Apple bought it and they came up with the plan we're just gonna make it see-through. We're just gonna make a see-through cube. You go down those stairs, and the store's actually beneath it, and all you really saw was that Apple. And I mean, that shows you there's always a solution to stuff.

SPEAKER_01 31:42

I'm so happy to hear you say that. And you do love stuff like that.

SPEAKER_00 31:44

I love stuff like that.

SPEAKER_01 31:46

If you look at the city, man, they're a no or a yeah, but to tie it back to that. I mean, if we can copy off, it's Elon Musk's company. So if we can copy off a paper who uh the paper of somebody who put satellites into space in an affordable way, who has a phone that can work anywhere in the world that has made electric cars and a grid service. I know you've had a Tesla if you don't know.

SPEAKER_00 32:10

I got one, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 32:11

Yeah, that can go anywhere. Would we want to copy off these guys' paper for free? Yes or no?

SPEAKER_00 32:17

Like, I don't even understand how he's invested in so many things. And he does he's also doing those, um, what are they called up in the sky, like where everybody gets internet?

SPEAKER_01 32:27

Like that's what I meant, the Starlink, the fucking Starlink anywhere in the world.

SPEAKER_00 32:31

Starlink. Yeah, you can be in the middle of the ocean and get internet.

SPEAKER_01 32:34

And National's number two, baby. The boring company is coming here second. It's Las Vegas, Nash, and then they're going to Abu Dhabi or no, Dubai, well, somewhere like that. And then also down to Orlando. So they're soon enough, and we don't want to get sidetracked on this, but it usually costs a billion dollars and takes six months to tunnel a mile. They can do it for $25 million in a week starting next year, and they're going to try to get it down to $5 million, which will make a tunnel cheaper than a lane addition to a highway. So bitches coming to us.

SPEAKER_00 33:08

Like there's some interstates here that have been building since I moved here. They're still screwed up. Yeah, it's pretty. Do you know about that neural link with Elon Musk? That thing, I think he's got that thing. I talk about this sometimes. I know. I heard you talk about it. He's got a little bit of a delay. I think he's got it. And I think there's a handful of people that Mark Zuckerberg could have it. I'm not quite sure. They just like, I don't know, maybe, but also it could be somebody that's just crazy genius that processes a little bit different, you know. It could be something like that too.

SPEAKER_01 33:44

You make a really good point about that too, Amy, because really the city council isn't against the loop. And I'll kind of give the boring company a hard time. It's like adding the chess team. And the chess team doesn't have your personality and your ability to sell and your ability to engage. They're like, we're giving you the best gift you could possibly imagine. The words you're looking for are thank you. And probably another way to do that would be to get with the national city and say, what are your questions? What are your concerns? How can we work together on this? But it's all about that state versus city challenge. And that's what's so hard about a bureaucracy that if we yes and it, it would be great for every single person.

SPEAKER_00 34:24

Okay. Speaking of that, you just made me think of something.

Building Drinks In Tennessee

SPEAKER_00 34:27

So tonight I got on Uber Eats, like to go to that total wine place. There we go. And I was gonna get some of the high-rise drinks because they're so great. Why the hell don't they deliver them on Uber Eats? Did you know? Well, I couldn't find them. Like I put in THC Seltzer, I couldn't find them. So I could be wrong. Before this comes out, I'll look and see. No, you might be right. I didn't find any of those freaking drinks on there because I was gonna get them delivered. And to me, it's insane that like it's at Total Wine, but why wouldn't they deliver it?

SPEAKER_01 35:04

That's a great question, Amy. So I got involved with high rise because we have a beverage production facility in Mervisboro. So we basically have diplomatic immunity to do whatever we want to do because it's a Mervisboro and it's a Wild, Wild West. So we do RTDs, which are like high noons for other companies. We do seltzers, which are like White Claw, and then we are doing a ton of THC drinks. And we also do functional beverages and things like that. But what's cool about the THC world is it is an entrepreneurial wild, wild west. It is the gold rush. So we think what we're doing is selling picks and shovel to the gold rust.

SPEAKER_00 35:43

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:44

We make all their beverages, but it's and what I love about high rise, one, it's crazy healthy. It's the hardest drink that we make, honestly. Sorry, Matt, but it's uh because it's based on puree and it's really healthy, it's low calories, and it's delicious. And the guy who's a CEO, Matt, I always say he's got a festival coastal cool. And so he is, he and his wife have a vision about creating this and a different experience for everybody. And he's doing phenomenally well, and he's now backed with a lot of players. That is fun, but then you have like Crescent Nine, who is backed by a bunch of MBA.

SPEAKER_00 36:19

What's Crescent Nine?

SPEAKER_01 36:20

Crescent Nine historically has had a higher THC content. High rise is more 10 milligrams or less. So Crescent Nine has done a higher one. It's a little bit different demographic, but it's really good too. And we make their drink, and ultimately their team is a bunch of MBA grads from Tulane out of New Orleans. So they have a vibe. And then we do hits, which is do you remember Paul Frank, the the most t-shirts? Well, the guy John Oswald and his beautiful uh wife Heidi, uh, they came up with a concept and said, look, we love fashion, we love the whole rock and roll vibe. They've got a sunglasses line. They said, Why don't we add a THC line? There's a guy named Michael Ramirez who handles all the Cheech and Chong stuff. And so you're talking about these people coming into our facility in Murphursboro. And what we like to say is, we can take your dream and put it in a can and in the hands of the people that can't wait to enjoy those. And so I love the THC space because outside of the dot-com world or the tech world, I've never seen an opportunity for people to be successful like this. And the entrepreneurs are running the race. And I've got such a history with that. Yes. I can be a resource for our clients. And I've learned some hectors. I feel like I should name everybody like an award speech because we do so many of them. Uh, but it it really, really is cool. The hard thing about it is, first of all, it's healthier than drinking. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 37:52

And you don't wake up feeling like shit.

SPEAKER_01 37:54

No hangover, rock and roll, totally. So it's a great product, but it's not totally understood. The other thing about a beverage versus smoking or a gummy, we can do this here, right?

SPEAKER_02 38:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:05

You know, it almost feels like we're in a bar. Yeah. And if somebody that's not a big drinker can actually be part of it, if you go out back and fire it up, that's a lot of fun too. I'm not gonna knock it, but it's not the same social experience.

SPEAKER_00 38:17

So yeah, I get what you're saying. Like the thing with these drinks, I just think so many people, I know I have a ton of social anxiety. And like, I think it's good because it just makes you like just chill out a little bit and be silly, you know? Or who wants to not be silly? Like, totally fun.

SPEAKER_01 38:37

And you came out that way, but a lot of people, maybe not so much. I'm not gonna pick on Iris over here producing this thing, but she's Callie Sober now, and she saw that. She's like, oh man, if I go to a bar, that's what I want. And that's pretty cool to bring a community together for something like that.

SPEAKER_00 38:53

So and I'm so happy that Tennessee's even letting it happen. They just like slam the brakes on everything, it feels like.

Daylight Savings Time Sucks

SPEAKER_00 39:00

I'm so pissed off about daylight savings time, I could go wring somebody's neck. I wrote this thing. I don't, I'm not political at all, but I wrote a thing to Governor Lee, Donald Trump, JD Bain, every single person going batshit about daylight savings time. I love it. And I didn't realize I had it backwards. And I was telling them all this stuff, but it's backwards than it sounds. What I meant is I want more sunshine. You know what I mean? But it's like I can't remember now because it's so confusing. Do I want to keep daylight savings time? Do you know the answer to that? It's confusing.

SPEAKER_01 39:40

Man, I just want as much sunshine as possible. Me too. That's why I hang out with Amy May.

SPEAKER_00 39:46

I just want like, I'm so pissed. I almost thought I'm gonna run for governor on one black. For daylight savings time, for legalizing weed. And there was one more thing. Oh, get rid of machine guns. That was the other thing. And I know we're in Tennessee, and I think everybody can have a gun, but machine gun is kind of excessive. You just kill people with them. They don't, you don't dare hunt with a full. Well, there's a purpose for them.

SPEAKER_01 40:13

Like I was in the Marines and I shot every weapon imaginable. I wouldn't trust myself with a machine gun uh here now.

SPEAKER_00 40:19

So yeah, and especially when people get their hands on them so easy.

SPEAKER_01 40:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:23

Um, I I don't know why I went into that. I probably should.

SPEAKER_01 40:26

Well, it's always, I mean, I love that about you that you live out loud and you've got kids and most women ain't gonna like machine guns.

SPEAKER_00 40:34

They may have a gun in their car, and you know what I mean? But that's just something that it just brings too much pain to the world.

SPEAKER_01 40:41

That reminds me of one of the best Emmy Mayo lines I've ever heard when you Chris was doing a song with somebody and you popped in the mail and said, Hey, boys, ain't no woman in history ever give a damn about a guitar solo. It needs to be more Shakespeare than Ozzy Osbourne.

unknown 41:00

I'm pretty good.

SPEAKER_01 41:02

I know you love Ozzy. Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00 41:06

I'm so sad about Ozzy. I've watched so many things about Ozzy.

SPEAKER_01 41:11

Too many of the great ones left. To the point on the THC that's that's why you probably can't get it. It's legal on a state-by-state basis, but there's a powerful lobby in the alcohol space that thinks if we don't sell it anymore, nobody will buy it. Well, guess what happens if you can't buy these? If you really don't want illegal immigration, we're gonna buy weed somewhere. Yeah, and it's gonna come from somewhere outside the U.S. So hashtag America, baby, if you really want to do it that way. These are all created within the country. And I have no idea why it hasn't been passed at a federal level.

SPEAKER_00 41:46

Me neither. It's insane. And opiates, like we talk about that. I hate opiates. That's my thing I hate. And I just hate opiates.

SPEAKER_01 41:54

Opiates and daylight savings time.

SPEAKER_00 41:55

Yeah, opiates and daylight savings time. I hate both of those about as much as I hate anything. And the thing with opiates, it's like people like my aunt Debbie in Alabama, she was doing CBD. Alabama, everything's illegal in Alabama, and it's the same here. Like, but she was doing these C B D gummies and THC gummies and stuff that like they made her not hurt so much. 100%. And it's like somebody's gonna tell her that's illegal and and they're gonna give her Laura tab.

SPEAKER_01 42:27

One of my friends is dying, and he's been dying for two years, but he's got to play football in the high school, and it's been kind of awesome because it's brought us all together and we spent more time. I mean, I joked around because you're supposed to only have a few months, but it's been like two years. I'm like, hey man, if you're faking this, I'm about it. It's working really well. He's like, too soon, Jerry, too soon. But I called him, I told him in this one heartfelt story one night, and I just shared with him this thing. He goes, Man, I'm so glad you called me and told me that story, but I'm in so much pain. And I'm so high. Oh, shit. You might call me in the morning and tell me that again so I can remember it. Because it really is. It's the only thing that's given him peace. And this guy is one of the most beautiful people in the world.

SPEAKER_00 43:07

And and like Chris Owenby.

SPEAKER_01 43:11

Chris Owenby. Married to another Chris. Really?

SPEAKER_00 43:14

Chris Owenby.

SPEAKER_01 43:15

Yeah, she's they were not high school sweethearts, um, but like right afterwards.

SPEAKER_00 43:20

And I love those stories. That's like um how my friend, though, her daughter has epilepsy, and weed helps her. They're going to a drug dealer. I I don't even call it a drug dealer, but they're going to some shady place. You know what I mean? Like the two of them.

SPEAKER_01 43:37

It's like, not even we would have known where that would be, or we'd ever have any history of those things.

SPEAKER_00 43:42

When you were talking about a second ago, like when somebody going to get weed or whatever, this guy, this friend of mine, I won't say his name because he's so paranoid about stuff, but I love writing songs with him, and I've written a lot of hits with him, and he's awesome. But so He said, man, it just sucks trying to buy weed because my my weed dealer always wants to write.

unknown 44:07

He comes over there.

SPEAKER_00 44:08

And then he's stuck there, and that guy's playing him songs and wanting to write with him. And it's just like, oh my gosh. I mean, that but it is crazy. You can't just go.

SPEAKER_01 44:19

No, you can't make an enemy of that guy either.

SPEAKER_00 44:21

Oh, I know. Like, because he's like, but he had written songs with him. It's like, this is this. You know what?

SPEAKER_01 44:26

That's a yes and for the weed right there.

SPEAKER_00 44:30

I love that.

SPEAKER_01 44:31

Well, I live over by 12 South, you know that. And it used to be a great place to get weed. And a dude was telling me recently, he said there was a place you could go that was a dry cleaner, and you could ask for an extra, extra, extra, extra large shirt. And they give you a dime bag and you'd roll out the back door.

SPEAKER_00 44:47

Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01 44:48

Thanks for nothing, gitrification.

SPEAKER_00 44:50

And it just spreads around word of mouth. Like that's what you do. Exactly. Oh, I love that. I was gonna ask you too, like, um, what is the dumbest thing you ever like? You look back and you're like, I what the fuck was I thinking doing this? You know what I mean? Like, like, and because I have a follow-up after like about that question. Like, invested in, you know what I mean? Or like something.

SPEAKER_01 45:16

Yeah, man.

The Mistake: Ignoring Your Own Demons

SPEAKER_01 45:17

Well, I mean, if you wanted to really know a fairly serious one, like I mean, a lot of people would have said Baker was my first love. So I it takes what it takes to run that for 20 years, and it takes a little bit out of your soul to build a big company like that. And I didn't address some of the demons that I should have had at a young age. And ultimately, I got bounced out of the company that I started as a result of it. And I never thought I could take a break long enough to deal with some stuff, or I never thought I'd have enough time to, I mean, work on a marriage, everything it had to be. I was so important in that role. So I looked back on that and said the best thing I could have done for me and everybody else was take time and take care of myself. So that's what I tell a lot of young entrepreneurs. It's if there's anything you haven't resolved, it's gonna come out. It's either gonna come out in therapy and working on things, or it's gonna ooze out in addictions and bad decisions and broken relationships. If I look back on my childhood, being a child of abandonment, it made me a killer in business because I was like, I'm never gonna be by myself again. I better understand what somebody wants and give it to them, and nothing's gonna last forever. So I better have two or three back. And that made me a killer in business, but a nightmare in the personal life.

SPEAKER_00 46:28

Well, you know what you said though, it's one of my favorite things. Like the first line in my book, it's like all my greatest gifts have come wrapped in ribbons of pain.

SPEAKER_01 46:36

That's so pretty.

SPEAKER_00 46:37

The pain, like, pain is your gift. You know what I mean? So that growing up and having that pain, you turned it into a big gift. And I feel like if if people look at their lives, you know, a lot of times that ends up being their story. Like, so after you like left Vaco, did would you say that you were happier? Or it's so funny.

SPEAKER_01 46:59

I would have minded a cake on the way out, but ultimately it wasn't what I wanted, but it's definitely what I needed. I mean, life has a way of presenting what you the lessons you need to learn. And if you don't learn it, it's gonna be a harder and harder and harder, harder lesson to take. So ultimately, for me, it allowed me to focus on myself first and deal with all those things. And just it also peels away all the layers, you know. Like there's not, I always say success is a thief. It tries to replace who who I am with what I've done and what I have. So when all that stuff is stripped away, it's all about the skin end. So ultimately, it gave me an opportunity to think about what's important to me. I went through some programs, I did a lot of things to get healthy with that. And now my son sees me as a human being. Like we're closer than we've ever been, not some guy that's at the podium running the show. Like I was a bit of a joy bully. Like, I'm like, basically, it's a control thing. I'm running a carnival. Isn't everybody loving this? How awesome is this? And I didn't realize that even at a carnival, some people are going through different things. So it made me understand empathy. It made me more aware. And it's, I mean, every single person that I'm close to, it's a better relationship than it's ever been. And um I'm in a great place. Some people look at me with sad eyes, like, man, how you doing through all that. I'm like, now you should ask me then. When I was winning like nine different games and I was doing all these things that were not healthy for me, I'm in a place now where I really care about my impacts and I want it to matter. And I'm pretty happy with the way that's going.

SPEAKER_00 48:35

Oh, I love that because that's the thing with you want to help people, and it's hard to help people if you're like falling apart. That's one thing that's one thing that or you want people, you want to be like in people's lives and be offering something to them, you know, making them feel good. You know what I mean? Like, not and that's when it's so simple, but that's another thing. Like, I've always been such a workaholic. Like, I I mean, I probably always will be, but like, like we were hearing the kids just if you want to just get humbled, ask the kids like a hundred percent ask them something about like, well, what was your childhood like or something like because the kids complained constantly that well, you know, you always just forgot to pick us up. Like, you know what I mean at school? Because we would forget major stuff, somebody would pick them up, but like we were usually late if we were the ones picking them up.

SPEAKER_01 49:31

Because you have a lot going on, and it's it's hard to do all those things. I mean, if you really, I made every we joked around a Vaco, we made every mistake imaginable. If we miss one, we go back and make it just to get the lesson out of it. But to your point, Amy, I can see my son, Max, like put your BlackBerry down. I can hear him say those words, and I know that weighed in on him away. And I've really worked to deal with some of those things. I mean, my former wife used to say, Jerry, I wish you loved us differently than you loved everybody else. And I didn't really understand that at the time. But I mean, sometimes you can just get a coffee from a barista without going into too much conversation. So just really drawing a circle tighter and loving people to different levels. So I love that quote. It's not what you know that you're wrong about that's gonna get you. It's what you think you know that you're dead wrong about that kills you. So there's a lot of stuff in that I've come through the last Renaissance period that made me think, wow, man, how could I have seen the world like that?

SPEAKER_00 50:30

You know, you made me think a second ago, you and me both are like real. Well, I had my doctor say, she always says the same thing, you need to meditate. Like, because I'm just so like she's got you've got the will. Like if somebody put me on an island, you know, to survive, like I've just I do, I have this will that I don't know where it comes from.

SPEAKER_01 50:52

You know where it comes from. Maybe you it was instilled in you, and it took what it took to get through.

SPEAKER_00 50:57

Just growing up how I did. Yeah, that's leading me to another thought. Like, I'll come back to the other thing, but it's crazy to me how people can grow up, like maybe say brothers or brother and sister or whatever in the same house with the same parents, and then one of them thinks they can do anything, and they take it like I'll show you, you know what I mean? And then the other one just absorbs those words, and it's like they just believe, you know, that they can't do it because that's what's made total.

SPEAKER_01 51:30

And they're both flip side responses to the same trauma. Yeah, you know, and it's like we're all wired so that's another thing I would have done differently. Just like I'm a talent whore, I love really talented people. I like to spend time with those players. Uh and I wish I'd have been more patient and seen those people that are honest and consistent and show up and dependable and things like that. So I do think, yeah, good two people going through the same different experiences, and neither of them are always that healthy, you know. Like one of them is I'm gonna achieve like a mad woman, or I'm gonna be a victim for my whole life. And there's probably something in the middle that says that really sucked, that hurt, and I'm gonna work hard enough, but I'm gonna show up and put my blackberry down.

SPEAKER_00 52:18

That just made me think, you know, they're both trying to not feel pain.

SPEAKER_01 52:22

A hundred percent.

SPEAKER_00 52:23

You know, whether they're the one that's the workaholic successful or the one that, like, you know, is barely getting by and hates the world.

SPEAKER_01 52:32

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 52:33

I was gonna ask you another thing. I keep thinking of questions.

Investing Criteria: Teams And Coachability

SPEAKER_01 52:37

Get them.

SPEAKER_00 52:38

Another one is what's the best investment you ever did? What's the best like chance you ever took?

SPEAKER_01 52:45

We lived the American dream of Eco. Like it, it really, really was. I had people that I love that were partners. We started from dollar zero and built over a billion-dollar company together, and we made over a hundred millionaires as part of it because we had a very collaborative team. So, and people said, Well, how did you do that? I said, I definitely didn't do that. Remember, I said I strode the line between autonomous leadership and leadership by neglect. We got the best and the brightest, and we collaborated and we shared the pie. There's a great quote that says, Doesn't matter what part what your piece of the pie is, as long as it's a giant pie. Ah! So sharing that allowed us all to win at the table. I mean, our love was battle-hardened. We went through 2009, which was one of the hardest things we went to. We went through startups, we made tons of mistakes. But if we get the right people and everybody is in it for the right reasons, and we had some core tenets like assume positive intent. If I don't call you back, it's not because I didn't want to, it's just because I got busy. So assume positive intent.

SPEAKER_00 53:51

Yeah, that's one of my favorite quotes is always assume the best. Like no matter what somebody's doing. Now tell me yours again.

SPEAKER_01 53:58

Assume positive intent. Which is yeah, so they mean good. Yeah, exactly. Like they're doing the best. Like we all get like that. Why don't they call me back, man? Come on. Like, then they call and say, Oh, I lost my sister. God, I'm the biggest asshole of all time.

SPEAKER_00 54:11

Yeah, there's so many times in life like that. And I feel like I always get assume the best about people because I miss so many emails, I miss so many things. Like I was in my hometown, and like a couple people I ran into thought I hated them because I didn't like do something on Facebook. Well, I never read those messages. I'm gonna try to start now that I'm doing this.

SPEAKER_01 54:37

It takes so much time to get it done.

SPEAKER_00 54:39

And there's so many places people can find you and reach you. You know what I mean? Like used to, used to, you had to be at home when the phone rang.

SPEAKER_01 54:48

Was Amy there? You put Amy on.

SPEAKER_00 54:51

And now, like, I don't know how anybody keeps their notifications.

SPEAKER_01 54:55

I didn't get on FaceTime for the longest time because I'm like, I don't need one more place where I cannot return a message. Like it's the word.

SPEAKER_00 55:03

I'm telling you, like, all of that stuff. My everybody in my hometown is on Facebook, and like I'll I'll not find out news because they just, you know, nobody talks about it. They just put it on Facebook that somebody passed away or something like that. 100%. And it's just crazy. Okay, so how many things you invested in?

SPEAKER_01 55:24

So I've invested in, I mean, a lot, like maybe 75 or 85 things, or maybe a hundred.

SPEAKER_00 55:31

What what extreme did the other?

SPEAKER_01 55:33

Like, that's a great question. Like one of the best investments I joke around, it's the Gardner School. Did your kids go to the Gardner School or no?

SPEAKER_00 55:41

I've heard of it, but they didn't go there.

SPEAKER_01 55:44

Well, Scott Thompson, um, it's another Lucia story. So Scott Thompson is a CEO of that. He's one of my best friends, or he was a CEO. And there was an opportunity to invest in it. And what I like to call the Gardner School, it's a very pricey, high-end daycare where your children can learn Mandarin, and there are plenty of guilty dual-income parents who are willing to pay for it. So, and he's done a great job of building it throughout. Well, Lucius called me one time. He goes, Well, what do you think about this? I mean, you think it's even gonna work? And I'm like, Well, Scott Thompson seems really sharp, and it does it does seem like he's gonna go. He goes, Well, let's do it then. I said, Well, how much should I invest? What do you want me to invest? He goes, invest whatever you want, and I'll pick up the rest.

SPEAKER_00 56:28

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_01 56:29

In retrospect, I should have invested much, much, much, much, much, much more. Because Lucius once again made way more on that deal, too.

SPEAKER_00 56:36

So, like, how do you decide if you're gonna invest in a company or if you're gonna like a hundred companies, that's a lot.

SPEAKER_01 56:44

Well, there'll be plenty of mistakes. You talk about mistakes made?

SPEAKER_00 56:47

Well, I'm talking about like how do you decide? Do you go with your head or your gut, or how do you make the decision what you're gonna do?

SPEAKER_01 56:56

I mean, through a series of extraordinary and giant mistakes, what I would say today, what I would like to invest in, uh, when I think about who to invest in a perfect world, if you can find for me, like I'm not saying like take, for example, Alan Must stuff. It's just crazy outrageous. That's not really my thing. I like old economy things where we can get the best team and do it better than anybody else can. So if I could cherry pick the perfect investment for me, if it was a de novo start, I would love to find somebody who had done it for a big company before that had been successful. And the reason for that, well, I'll tell it all and then I'll break down the components. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 57:38

You mean put together a team from scratch?

SPEAKER_01 57:41

Like if I were going to invest in something, I would want the team that that says, Hey, will you invest in my company? I would want it to be a team of people that had worked for another big company. Oh, yeah, they've proven this that or at a big company. They haven't done it themselves, that are incredibly coachable.

SPEAKER_00 57:56

Yeah, yeah. That's such great advice. Oh my gosh, that's such great advice.

SPEAKER_01 58:02

And something that I felt like I could contribute to as an investor, and some viable product that it's a very easy thing that could be to be successful. The reason why I say they've done it before at a big company, entrepreneurs, and I don't know how we could do a better job of this, but so many entrepreneurs that have never worked for a big company, they build, they build, they build, and every single step they hit, they've never been at before. Oh, wow. So everything's new. At Vaco, I'd been running a territory that was 60 million. So I was grossly unqualified to start it. And me and my partners, Holliman and Waller, we were better when it got to be 60 million plus. So from that point, we could take it and grow with it because we'd seen what success looks like. And an entrepreneur that starts it from nothing, coachability is incredibly important.

SPEAKER_00 58:53

I think one of the smartest things that I've heard about business that is so wild to me. Because I was asking Chat GPT, what do I keep doing wrong? Trying to hire somebody because I had one thing after the other of messed up experiences because I would just hire the first person I interviewed because I don't like doing it. You know what I mean? And that happened like one guy was awesome, but um then he kind of drifted away and it's like I don't even know what happened. But I'm just picking people that I like that they may not have any of the qualifications of anything.

SPEAKER_01 59:32

And I bet one other thing happened too, because you're such an entertaining person that, and I've been to lunch with people like you, like you're so entertaining. You leave a lunch and you're like, well, that was awesome. That was great. You don't think about the fact, oh, I was the entertaining person there. So it's hard to sit back as a somebody like you and let them do all the talking and let that happen. I talked about it. Because you're like, hey, that was a good time, wasn't it? It's like, oh yeah, I was the funny one there. That was the situation. And then you realize that through 30 days later. That's why it's hard for somebody with a big personality to recruit. Sometimes you just gotta be patient and let it go. Did I just blow your mind?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:10

I went in the house and Chris is asking questions after an interview. He's like, he's just like, How much do they want an hour? Where do they live? And I'm like, I don't know, I didn't know the answers to any of the questions. I just talked, like, and just talked and talked, but that is so true. That just made me think about like this guy that was I worked with for a while, he was telling me this thing, and he said, your best quality is also your worst quality. And I know, like with me, I think that's true. Like there's great things about it being just hyper and excited and all that, but there's also bad things about it. Like if somebody needs you, sometimes you might not recognize it because you're so in your own, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 1:01:00

Like, I don't know if I would say bad. I think it's something that needs to be augmented. I love the thought process that let's not spend all our time working on our weaknesses, let's get great at what only we can do. Yeah. So if you're you've got this team here that can free you up to do those things. One of my things about being a leader that I was pretty good at that a lot of people struggle with, because uh micromanagement is also a killer in entrepreneurial life.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:25

That's my thing. That's the thing I do most it's not scalable. Trying to, because I have a thing on my wall that says um done is better than perfect. Like, first of all, I obsess over things like when it came to a logo, I probably made a hundred myself. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 1:01:40

And probably nobody could do it better than you. But if it was close, would it really matter? Because being a control freak is just not scalable. If it's someone, and that's what I would like to say to every entrepreneur that is.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:51

Yeah, I think people need to hear this. So look at the camera and tell people.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:55

Being a control freak is not scalable. If you're comfortable running a small company and you want to be responsible for the on uh for all the answers, get comfortable because you're always going to run a small company responsible for all the answers.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:07

Okay, what do you mean by scalable?

SPEAKER_01 1:02:09

Like for me, my claim to fame is I've never fired myself from a job where the next person didn't do it much, much, much better because they're able to spend more time with it. So when I think about a leader, especially somebody like you, there are three things that you can do that nobody else in the world can do. And if you did that 95% of the time and everybody else handled everything else, you would go 10x quantum, like year over year over year, to the extent that we can let go of the things that somebody else can do.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:39

Oh, that's so good. I did this class. Have you heard of master class? Like I love that. I don't have done it long.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:46

I I pay for it, but I haven't done it yet.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:48

I have to like get your link. Like, I need there's a couple new ones.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:53

Great. Well, send me some of the good ones.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:54

Yeah, there's uh the one I really love. I think my favorite on there, it's Sarah Blakely, the first female self-made billionaire. Yeah, and she says, like, all kinds of great advice, like start before you're ready. And then she says you should be doing what you do best and letting other people do the rest. Like, and that's the thing, like with me, I'll fuck around trying to edit a video for four hours that would take Luke like 10 minutes. You know what I mean? And if you're trying to do something and get something out, like say you were trying to make a post about something. Well, you you mess with it so long, and then by the time like I would get it out, it'd be too late when somebody else can do it and put it out, and it might not be exactly how you would do it. Like, I'm so ticky about stuff. A hundred percent. But I want that's one thing I really want to work on. I'm starting to see tonight and understand like a big reason I I mean, maybe the biggest reason you've been so successful, and that is that thing about hire people you can coach is one of the smartest things I've ever heard. But the thing I can see with you is you can get a team together and inspire people and teach them and believe the best in them, and then get them to do uh their best.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:18

Well, free yourself from a master. That's the whole idea, is that like and one of the things I think about a company, everybody thinks, well, these are the good old days, these are the good old days. And I can remember we went to Vegas and then what we everybody fit in one party bus and was like, it will never get better than this. This is a good the next time we had to get a full-size bus and it was even better. The next time we had to get a series of buses and we got a bigger place, it was even better. And then the yes, next next next year we didn't go to Vegas, we went to Costa Rica, and they did these fireworks in the sky that spelled out the company name. And it's kind of cool because you can see the company name, and it's also legit dangerous. So you're kind of like in it together. It's a big event. But the whole idea being bigger should be better because there's more us. And it's only better if everybody has a voice and they've got an opportunity to be successful.

Entrepreneurship Feels Like Dragon Slaying

SPEAKER_01 1:05:08

I mean, but I've been there, Amy. When I first started Vaco, I was by myself and I would sell in the morning, make my sales calls, I would recruit in the afternoon, I would do my invoicing. You know how it is when you think you go to an advertising firm, you're gonna be able to get them to write your copy. No, you know it. So you have basically have to write all the copy. And then one night I still remember I was doing invoices. It's like two o'clock in the morning, and I printed them out and they were upside down on the letterhead. And I I like to say, I said, forget it, but I used another F-word. I said, I'm sending them. So I sent it out like upside down. And finally, like for years later, people would say, Man, you remember when those invoices got sent out? I'm like, Yeah, I fired that dude. And I kind of did, because the next person that did it actually knew how to send invoices out, and there were no mistakes. So just the entrepreneurial, everybody talks about it. Entrepreneur, like it's an American hero. Yeah, yeah. Oh, look what they did. You should be in the dictionary able to look up entrepreneurialism and see gritty and soul crushing and devastating, and cry yourself to sleep. And am I any good at this? Am I an imposter?

SPEAKER_00 1:06:16

Somebody who could take a beating pretty much.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:18

Yeah, till finally, somewhere down in Middle Earth with dragons and trolls and dusty, you open up that little box, and it's a comeback. And after all that pain happened, that's when the turn happened.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:32

Yeah, I've seen in my life some of the times when I was the most down. Like we were trying to get a song on this guy, Adam Lambert. He won. No, wait, he didn't win. He maybe came in second place. I've never wanted a song on a record as bad as I wanted on Adam Lambert, except for my very first song.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:53

You know, that I was like, Well, Rick Springfield here, but yeah, go.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:55

Oh, God. Yeah, well, we wrote with Rick, it was insane. So I had never wanted a song cut so bad on somebody as I did Adam Lambert. Well, he wasn't coming to Nashville or anything. Like this basically seemed impossible. Anybody I told like that I was trying to write for him just kind of just laughed at me pretty much because he was more, he was way more rock and he was working with all the biggest.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:23

Were you really successful at this point? Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:25

Yeah, but he just was in a different world. Yeah. Like he was working with the track guys. He'd be working with like, say, I know her, so this don't work. Taylor Swift's track guys are the best in the world, but that don't work. That don't work right. Because it's weirder when you don't know the people and they're just far off. You know what I mean? Like, and so the thing with Adam Lambert, I just wanted on that record so bad. And they did it. I I remember reading online, this lady did an article, and she was like, people working on the Adam Lambert record, and she named like Max Martin and Dr. Luke and just all the biggest writers. And then at the bottom it said, desperately trying to work with Adam Lambert.

unknown 1:08:11

That's my name.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:13

That's good. And I just saw it. And but I got so down because I thought, so wait a minute. So this is manifesting. I do believe somehow I'm manifesting.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:24

So did you get it that time?

SPEAKER_00 1:08:25

You're still no, well, it's a crazy story. So yeah, I know. That's how they're the best. They're my stories are always crazy. So Adam Lambert, we didn't know anybody that like did anything for Adam Lambert. Like, Andy's so rock. Like, but my favorite singer is Freddie Mercury. So that's why I looked out on Adam Lambert.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:50

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:50

And everybody thought he was going to be the biggest star ever. Like, and he was on the cover of Rolling Stone before it even had a hit. Like, and so I wanted on that record. And I didn't see any path in sight to get there. And then out of nowhere, this guy calls to wanting to write. And he had this song, It's Too Late to Apologize. You know that song? It's It's One Republic. He's the lead singer of One Republic, and he was wanting to write. And that song was out. And so was the Leona Lewis song, um, Burning Love. I think it's Burning Love, something like that. Do y'all know it's Burning Love? And um, so like that song was massive on Beyonce. And was it Beyonce? No, that's Leona Lewis. He had Halo for Beyonce. So he's this insane writer that like I just couldn't even imagine getting in the room with. And he called us wanting to write. And I was like, Well, how's he ever even heard my name? He worked at the publishing company where Chris wrote. He worked as a like dude typing our lyrics.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:59

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:00

Like when he was like a teen, like late teens. And then he moved and he became this crazy songwriter. Like, and he was on that show Songland. And he's had a million hits, you know, with him singing them. But so he wanted to write. We ended up flying to um Colorado. We stayed up all night and wrote, like, and we got that song recorded on Adam Lambert. First of all, he'd I need to toast that, baby.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:26

Yeah, Vuya, baby.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:29

Ryan didn't even know who Adam Lambert was. He's like, I don't know if I want to write. You know, I've never even heard of him. And then Ryan, he produced it. Like, it was crazy.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:38

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:39

That whole story was a detour from when you said. All your all the best stories are detours. Yeah, they are. They are. You like when you said you were getting down, you know, like when things weren't going good. Like I was so down and thought we hadn't made that record. I mean, I was just heartbroken and really depressed. And two days later, I found out we were on the record, you know, like we just hadn't found out.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:03

And then you feel so the full living experience. You're slaying the dragon, man. You're throwing yourself up against the wall, going for it. And I think that's the cool thing about entrepreneurialism and probably songwriting too. That, like, I mean, I used to be an accountant, and as an accountant, you're it's a pretty certain process, like, but it's homework. You're doing homework. I appreciate everybody that does accounting. But for me, it just kind of just made me smaller and smaller. But an entrepreneur, or it's you're constantly slaying the dragon on a day-to-day basis. So I think it makes you younger, more aggressive, more interested in your cocktail parties because just trying to stay curious and going after it.

Assume Positive Intent And Forgive Faster

SPEAKER_00 1:11:43

Yes, that's the thing. That's part of why I'm doing this podcast. I'm so curious. I'm so curious about so many things. And I'm trying, I made myself a promise. Like, I just want to talk to people that I'm genuinely curious and interested in what they're like. I have questions that I want to ask, you know, like with answers, not just like, you know, so many of these, like, there's a lot of celebrities I've that are gonna be on, but they're people I want to talk to about certain things, you know, like and not just like trying to, I don't know if it's gonna work. I mean, I don't know if that's gonna work.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:20

Smashing success.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:22

I hope so. I'm sending it out in the universe. I want it to. I love Theo Vaughn. I don't know if you know him. He's my favorite podcast.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:29

He lives over in 12 South. Uh I know that because I know people that fangirled him. But to your point about, I actually think the curiosity you bring is huge. And if you take Lucius, for example, one of the things to think about is where do we take the money? It matters where we get the money. You know, like I call it Caucasian male syndrome, where there's a lot of people that have been successful, guys especially, and they've done it one way. And that one way is how you have to be successful. And the that's most old white guys. It's like, well, you just do this, just do this, just do this, which is terrible advice because there's thousands of ways to be successful at something. Yeah, and they have the mind tracked on replaying that same story. Lucius was always the richest guy in a room, and he was perennially curious. And I'll give you an example of how he he's always asking, Well, what do you think? Well, what about this? What about that? And he's the most successful guy. Like one time I said, Well, what would you do if one of your kids was in love with somebody and you knew it was a bad choice? And like, how would you go at that? He goes, I'd be real careful in the uh affairs of the heart. If my son's into somebody, he's into somebody. What turns me on may repulse you. What you're into, I may never understand. I would say that's a mistake that we let him make or a success he finds on his own.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:55

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:56

And it's hard to find an old white guy that's not gonna answer that question. Like you just do this, this, this, and this. He just said, I'd be real careful answering that. So I think if when I think about investors, I want one that says, I'd be real careful answering that. What do you think?

SPEAKER_00 1:14:14

That man, that is so good. Like, I'm learning a lot. I'm learning a lot, but I love like learning about this kind of stuff. You know what I mean? I'm always thinking, how can I make more money?

SPEAKER_01 1:14:26

Right, right.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:27

I'm always thinking like, but I also want to add value. That's the first thing. I want to nothing's as good as like somebody about my book said you made me look at my life different. And I was like, that might be my favorite compliment I've ever gotten in my life. Like, like you made me look at my life different. Like she, I think she left this abusive guy and just took a whole new path. I've had people tell me stuff with that book that like it just blew my mind because that that's what we're alive for to help people like that. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 1:15:03

My favorite thing about that book is it feels like I'm having a conversation with you as I read it. Your voice, you literally pop off the page and tell the story. I love it. It's such a story of resilience and vulnerability and love when it's hard to love somebody.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:20

Yeah, yeah, that's true. Like, I forgive everybody. You know what I mean? Like, I'm big on forgiving. I've got like some people in my family, they're like, How can you forgive? It's like you're just letting them keep on hurting you if you don't forgive them. Oh, you ain't gotta think about them no more once you forgive them and just kind of brush them out of the way.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:40

The way I think about it is I'm looking for a lenient judge at the end of this ride. So I don't have time to judge anybody and I don't have a good enough memory to remember why I'm mad at them.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:48

Yeah, that's the thing. You know, we were talking about this a second ago. I think this is a great like thing about assuming the best when we were talking about that. I was telling somebody the other day, if you think somebody don't like you, or if okay, a good example is like I saw I love Martina. She was on she was on this show a couple weeks ago. But if you see somebody like with Martina, she was having a big Christmas party and we didn't get an invite. And I was just like, she's mad at us. You know what I mean? She, I don't know what I did, and then my mind went wild, like just trying to figure out what I could have done, you know, to upset her. And so I couldn't figure it out. Well, and my feelings were a little bit hurt, and then I went to Fresh Market and Martine's in there, like in a little headband. She's like, girl, I've been looking everywhere for your nub. Like, I don't know, my phone. Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:46

Like, and assume positive intent. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:48

And then I was just like, I just felt so good. But another example that'd be better, I keep giving the wrong examples.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:56

No, that's a great example. I mean, it is because you think, how'd I get invited? And she's like, yeah, doing the best she can. Yeah. And so all that energy that you have. Assume positive intent, man. Yeah, totally.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:07

And one thing about people, like, say you think somebody, like, say there's some guy that you know, like, because Will goes to college with the kid or whatever, and you see this guy and y'all talk about business or whatever, and then you like call him and he doesn't call you back. Well, if you don't assume good intent, like you're saying, what most people would do is think, oh, that guy's a dick. You know what I mean? He just didn't call me back. So then the next time you see that guy, you're gonna treat him like he's a dick. Right. Because that's what you got in your head. When a lot of times he's he's just like you said, busy or something fell through. I mean, that can happen to everybody.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:52

And if usually when we're we're called out on that, it's like, man, I've been meaning to get back to you. Because I hate seeing somebody I haven't called back, and I'm like, ooh, I know what this is about. I I think too, like when tough things happen. I'll be interested in your perspective on this. So I think that if you think about the world as a or people as a whole in our community, I think maybe there's like 15% of the people who really like to gossip and like to run people down and like and that they just can't get over it. It's trauma-driven, but their whole thing is a level of meanness or something about that. And then I think there's probably like 20% that will answer the call no matter the what, that will be there. Like I know if I call you that you're there, and I know you're gonna be there to make my day. But if you take the middle, what's that leave? 65%, they're just too busy with their own lives to really opine, you know? Like they don't, they're not necessarily great communicators, or they might be nervous about something, or they might be scared to talk to somebody like you. And the vast middle just needs those people at that 20% just to pull them into it and create a bunch of joy. I think the 15% are just gonna be the gossipers and the and the people who want to create the negativity. And again, they're not happy, so I'm not hating on them, but that's the reality. But the vast majority of the middle just wants to be inspired and wants to be engaged and wants to be noticed and wants to be heard and wants to come out and play.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:21

Yeah. I want to know more like advice. Like when you said this thing, there's been a couple things I love, but like maybe two more things, like the assume the best thing, like that people that can really help people in business and help them like to find the right people, like to work with. Because most people that have a job, they work with somebody, whether you're their boss or not, you got to deal with, figure out how to, you know, work with them.

Business Plans And Escaping Micromanagement

SPEAKER_00 1:19:47

Like, so say that um somebody had, I'll do two different numbers, but say that somebody had $10,000 and they came to you and they were like, This is my last 10. Say it's a a guy with a pregnant wife, they're just having pro, you know what, living in a trailer, and he's like, This, I got ten thousand dollars, and I just want to make it more and invest it and make more money.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:13

Well, I would be able to opine more on an entrepreneur that's starting a company. So I think I understand your point. Now, if someone were to come up to me and say, hey man, I've got I want to do this so bad. I really want to start this company. My wife's 14 months pregnant, and it's our seventh. And you're giving this guy advice. That's what we're doing. Yeah, and he's coming, he's asking me, I want to start this company. My favorite line is it's okay to think outside the box as long as you know what the F is in the box in the first place. So do the work. Like write a business plan. And yeah, almost no entrepreneurs will take the time to write a robust business plan.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:50

How do you write a business? What do you do?

SPEAKER_01 1:20:52

You go to Palo Alto.com, pay maybe $39.99.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:57

What is Palo Alto.com?

SPEAKER_01 1:20:59

Business plan writing website. And basically it coaches you through how to do it. I did it back in 2000 and wrote the business plan. And someone, if someone will not write a business plan at that level, they probably shouldn't start a company because that's the very first step in saying, well, it'll do things like who am I going to hire? What does success look like? Oh, and it gives a roadmap to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:25

P-A-L, how does it?

SPEAKER_01 1:21:27

I'll send it to you, Palo Alto.com. Like it's a city in uh California.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:30

That's so good.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:32

It is. And then doing the work through it, you'd be surprised how many times I've said that and how seldom it actually happens. And then the second thing would be the idea of being an entrepreneur is fantastic. Think about what it really looks like. Yeah. You got a 14-month pregnant wife at home that's got nine kids and you're got this much cash. Let's take a walk on what that really looks like. You're gonna be working the weekends. This is what it looks like. Are you resilient? What are some experiences that you've had in your house? And really challenge that person to see if they are entrepreneurial in style. And then I would say, specifically set a plan on a go-for basis. Show me how you're gonna make money on this thing. I have a one entrepreneur that I coached, she really loved this idea of doing this project. But there was one thing she had to do. And if she did it and it didn't work, then it was a bad idea. This is the way the brain works. She did everything else but that because she didn't want the answer of if it was a good idea or not. So nine months later, she did that and realized it was a bad idea. So she did, I would say, just prioritize what the success factors are and validate and work towards those things. I would say recognize that being a control break is not a good thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:53

That's one of my big problems. Oh my gosh. But I'm getting better and I'm trying.

SPEAKER_01 1:22:57

I mean, you have to be to start. I mean, there there is something to it, but like what are the things that only you can do? And as soon as possible, offload the rest of it to everybody else.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:08

I'm gonna write that on the wall too, because like I love your wall so much. I love quotes. Like, but what can only I do? I spend a lot of my time doing shit I'm terrible at that I don't need to be doing in the first place because I'm I got this idea, you know. I'm so picky about little things, but if you don't let people help you, you know, you can't be successful.

SPEAKER_01 1:23:31

Well, it's not fair, Amy, for you to be so charming and so creative and so engaging and also be good at spreadsheets. And so it just would be the universe isn't gonna give you all that. So, like, what be what are the what are the gifts that you can really just devour and get better at in radio?

SPEAKER_00 1:23:53

I've never done a spreadsheet, right? I don't know what I do. That's what made me laugh. I'll put in my numbers and there's all those things to the side, like those little columns, and then it'll be like, what the fuck is that? Because it'll be like diagonal in the bottom of this, like uh in this row. It just spreads out, and then you can't print it because it's too long. Do you know any? Do you know what we did again?

SPEAKER_01 1:24:19

So I'm decent spreadsheet. But I'll get my example would be one time I tried to fix the brakes on my tie my car, and I ended up with an extra baggie of parts. I took it to the mechanic, and he goes, You thought you was a mochanic, didn't you, boy? I said just fix a car, man. You know I can do this. So there's some things that we just can't do.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:37

That just made me think when I was in probably right out of high school driving to Nashville. I had a flat and a cop ended up pulling over, but I was just spraying fix a flat on the on the tire, just like such an airhead idiot.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:53

That's hilarious. Well, look, I imagine people are gonna pull over and help you before they pull over and help me. So it might work out okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:59

Yeah, but I I've had some crazy stories coming back from one time. Okay, my dad was nuts. Like, but one time I'm driving, he was asking me, could I keep these guns for him? I'm thinking, no, I'm not keeping these guns for you. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:15

Top K question do you never want your dad to ask?

SPEAKER_00 1:25:17

It's like, I don't know. Uh no. And so then, like, I get pulled over a couple weeks later. I was probably 21 at this time. I get pulled over a couple weeks later, and there's a pothole in the interstate about the size of like a baby pool. And so everybody's been hitting that pothole. I hit them. I've hit them. I'm on the side, like you it just looked like stranded turtles up the interstate cars, you know, just like that hit that pothole. And so this, like it was sleet and rain, and this cop, like, I'm over on the side, he comes over and he's gonna help me, like, or he's gonna do it, probably change the tire. And so he opens my trunk, and when he pops the trunk, it's just full of fucking guns. Like there's like it looked like a machine gun. I don't know. I I those are legal, so maybe that's what it was. There was even a grenade in there. There was just that it was full of guns. And that cop could tell when I saw it that I didn't know it was in there. And I, this is the first time I'd seen it too. I I was in shock when he oh, you know, he just pops open the trunk and it's got full of guns.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:27

Only Amy Mayo could be running guns on the interstate, get pulled over, and still have the cop fix their tires and roll on about a day.

SPEAKER_00 1:26:33

Yeah, but the thing is, he looked at me and then he looked up the interstate and he said, I don't even want to know what this is about. Because I told him though, I told him, I was like, these are my dad's guns. I swear I didn't know these were in here. You know, like I had no idea.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:48

That reminds me of Talladega Knights where he puts the line in the car with him. I slapped a kilo of cocaine under the tire tire. Here come the cops.

SPEAKER_00 1:26:57

I freaking love tequila nights, that movie, because I'm from Gedston, Alabama, which is like 30 minutes from Talladega, where that's great.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:08

I don't know what to do with my hands. I don't know what to do with my feet.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:12

That's so good. And then remember the part with those those little boys at the table. We threw all your medals in the creaker.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:20

Good, good. No winners, winners do what they want.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:23

Oh shit, that movie's so good. And I'm all jacked up on Mountain Dew.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:28

Like, there's just a lot I know you use that line a few times.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:31

We were like in Colorado, and Tim McGraw and Faith Peel, a bunch of people were in this house, and Tim hadn't said a word for like two hours. And then out of nowhere, he's like, he's by the fireplace. He's like, I'm all jacked up on Mountain Dew.

unknown 1:27:47

Like, that's the first thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:27:48

Olive is great. Olive's great.

SPEAKER_00 1:27:50

That whole movie, I just love that movie. And Step Brothers, both of those missed. That's my brother's favorite movie. That's probably my favorite comic. Stout Brothers.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:01

It's so good.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:02

It's so good.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:03

Did you play with my drums?

SPEAKER_00 1:28:08

Man, that movie is a classic. I just want them to make a part two. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 1:28:13

100%, man.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:15

And we wrote with um Mary Steinberg and that's the mom in that. And she said it was weird when they asked her to be the mom because, like, she's not that much older than Will Farrell. But she did it and she said they just would make her laugh. They would cuss and try to just make her laugh, you know, when they were so. That's so funny.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:33

Like Danny McBride and East Bound and Down, the Will Farrell character. I love that. All that stuff's ridiculous.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:39

And those outtakes. Yeah, man.

SPEAKER_01 1:28:41

That's exactly what I was thinking about. So good. I won't quote some of those, but they're good.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:45

It is so good. Okay, let's see. I had another. What if somebody had $100,000?

Making Money By Scaling

SPEAKER_01 1:28:50

It's a really crazy world right now. Like the AI stuff that's coming up. It depends on what they want to do, I think, Amy. If somebody wanted to start a company.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:58

Do you start more companies than you invest in?

SPEAKER_01 1:29:01

I'm more engaged in those things. Like for me, I've done everything from well, I would say I invest in. Lucius used to say he loved investing in private companies versus the stock market. He goes, I love investing in private companies because I got some say. And if people made decisions in the public market based on what I know in the private market, they go put me in jail. Because uh the public market, everybody has the same access to the information. So in a perfect world, Iris, Luke, you, and myself would start something from nothing and we would build it. Yeah. And we would be, we would get the the play. Because if we build it from nothing, we get the rewards. If we're buying it at the stock market, we're paying 19 times earnings, which is not real money. We're cashing checks the whole time we're building something and we're creating wealth as we go. So I'm an entrepreneurial junkie. Like I love the idea of somebody coming up with a concept and putting a team together and stone cold slaying it until they finally fight through their crucible and find a way to win. And even when they don't, there's still a lot to learn.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:12

Okay. Talking about all that, I didn't understand exactly how you worked. And maybe this is part of it too. I thought maybe there would be somebody that said, I'm going to start a restaurant and I need somebody to help me start it, and you just gave them money. But you're you're doing this.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:29

It's still the same decision in that scenario. So if you look at where I have investments now, okay, so I have invested in restaurants. And what I've come to learn about restaurants You got a bunch of restaurants around. Well, I'm I'm just an investor in all these things. They all operate it. And as a general rule, this is a key point about a restaurant. So often people play small ball. They're like, I'm gonna open a restaurant and get ownership here, ownership here, ownership here. You can never sell that restaurant for any amount of money. Yeah. The only way to make money, as a general rule, in a in the hospitality space in restaurants, is to open a great restaurant here. Like I invested with my hair in a piece. And we opened in Birmingham. The Peace is like the only restaurant I'm involved in.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:11

Wait a minute. Are you talking about the one in Nashville?

SPEAKER_01 1:31:13

12 South, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:14

Holy shit, that restaurant. Tell everybody again the name of it.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:18

I love all of them. I mean, Monique Shohan, come on now. It's so good. And we've made all our money back from all of those restaurants.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:23

But you're you're investing in a ton of restaurants.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:25

Yeah, I love Manit stuff. I love Mikey and Brian's Mockingbird. I love Heinemann's M Street restaurants. I love all of those restaurants.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:33

Okay, here's the thing with that restaurant. I can't ever remember how to say it.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:37

A piece. It's my hair. He's from Lebanon. A piece. And he's fascinating. And he's run big companies before. And what we're doing at a piece is we're opening one in Birmingham. We're gonna open one in Huntsville. We're gonna open one in Orlando.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:50

I love that restaurant.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:51

So it's one that you can eat every day and be healthier than not eating there.

SPEAKER_00 1:31:56

That place, like I've only had fish. My favorite meal is salmon. Chris cooks this salmon that's outrageous. It's bourbon salmon. And but the only two restaurants I've ever had fish in and liked them was Beramundi at a piece. A piece. And then Margot Cafe. So good. Um, like, but so absorbed.

SPEAKER_01 1:32:18

So if you think about those restaurants, though, it is amazing. And if you think about Cain Prime, I've made all my money back and had returns, and it gives me home filled advantage. Uh Shohan, I was there the other night, lost my mind on how tasty it is. So it's a great home filled advantage, but you're never gonna make a multiple of revenue unless you're able to show, hey, we opened 11 pieces. Now private equity, you can open 70 from this. So write us a big check and we'll get out.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:45

Wow, that's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 1:32:46

The whole concept being, unless you're doing something creative where you can blow up like this, it has to be replicable, like meaning you can do it on multiple locations to be successful. So that's one thing. Another example of something I'm involved in is like the beverage facility out in Franklin. I mean, in Murfitsboro. It is a great business, but manufacturing is hard. And like if you look at what I did, I kill it from my leadership style with really educated, really money-motivated, really type A drivers who want to be whipped into a frenzy and want to be part of a team and bring swagger that nobody else can. That's my space. So, and I love it because I'm like that too. That's what fires me up.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:31

Yeah, and so many big companies are like that. It makes me think about that that show, it's on Apple, it's so good. About that guy that that the WeWork thing, just the energy of bringing that company to life. And Uber was like that too. Just that sense of the stuff. 100% and that dream.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:47

And what WeWorks issue was like the why has to be right. Like our why was solid. The businesses I've been at. I tried to bring that same style to a manufacturing facility, is what we have in Murphy'sboro. And manufacturing is really, really hard. Manufacturing is basic. We have a huge facility, 85 acres. The machines whirl, it's really cool. But in the juice we make, they're just like cans of joy. But manufacturing is fixing a series of small problems. It has to be somebody who likes to deal with it. And if you asked anybody at most of the companies I'm primarily involved with, their job is between number one and number three important to them. But if you're working on a line in manufacturing, it might be eighth or ninth because it's a hard job. And so I tried to bring a charismatic, autonomous level of leadership to that business, and I was unsuccessful because it takes a stronger hand of the wheel.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:42

But then we put a leader in there that was more like they can they can learn from and listen to.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:49

Well, not yet. That's what we're getting to. Okay. So put a guy in there that was very process-oriented, really, really good, real problem solver, but not a people person. Yeah. Really much better than me for it because he at least understood how to fix the problems. But all the people feel like they're in trouble a little bit. You know, it's kind of like a hall monitor. So now we brought in the Mexican Jesus, is what he calls himself, Gabe, and he has, he's gamified it. So on the board, it shows here's what we're gonna do from eight, here's what we're gonna do from nine, here's what we're gonna do from 10. And everybody's bringing and he's bringing ideas in. Like everything I would do at different companies, he's able to communicate in this type of a business. And everybody's motivated. And my heart just jumped out of my body so happy because I felt like, well, maybe to lead this, it means not to be a lot of joy. But Gabe can bring that level of joy and excitement that we all went together. So I started making hot dogs and burgers on Fridays and doing it up that way and telling stories. And Gabe's a continuous improvement. He's curious, and it revolutionized the whole experience within the walls.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:56

Man, that is so

Leading Manufacturing With Process And Joy

SPEAKER_00 1:35:58

cool. I've always thought like encouragement, like if you encourage people, I talked to a lot of songwriters about this. Like song pluggers, that's the people that pitch your songs and everything. Like, they just get so jaded that if somebody goes in and plays them a song, I remember I had this Kenny Chesney song that was it's still one of my favorite songs I've ever been a part of. Which one? It's called Who You'd Be Today, and it's it's about losing somebody young. And it was about my friend that died like 22 from cancer, and he was gonna move to Nashville with me. But so I went in to play that song, like for my song pluggers. And when I got in there, after I played it, it's so emotional. And me and the guy who wrote it with Bill Luther, we're like all emotional about. I mean, I was just love the song. So I was just so grateful for it. And then I remember the song player said, Well, what do you want me to do with it?

SPEAKER_01 1:36:54

Right. And then I forgot that it's something that you birthed.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:58

And I that was back still when people had CDs, and I picked the CD up and I said, I don't want you to do anything with it. And I walked out and then I sent that song to Kenny Chesney, and he's like, Love it, cutting it tomorrow. And it was his first single off that record. And like, bring it up, baby. But that's the thing. Like, you just never, you know, you never know with people, and you can discourage somebody so easy, you know, and you can encourage them so easy. And that's the other thing. Our friend um Marv, his song plugger, he would hear that we were writing with Marv, and he would call and he would call Marv and it'd be like, You guys have done so good together. You know, you've written so many hits together. Today's gonna be a killer day.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:44

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:37:45

And it totally would change.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:46

And it will work that way. Yeah, it's what you just described is so common in almost every business. Like if you take the beverage facility, for example, the sales guy would be in, hey, I just brought in Better Than Booze, which is a national company. We take care of those guys, they're phenomenal. And everybody's like, Well, how are we gonna work that into the schedule? I mean, because they're operators and they're having to solve the problem. That one, I think that person might have been miscast, but as a general rule, in most of the business, there's this team that creates the opportunity and the team that actually has to do it. And these guys are like, oh, well, how's that gonna work? How's that gonna work? And this person just wants to be told thank you. Yeah, right? Yeah. But this person sometimes will come in, and I used to be like this in my 20s. I'd come in with a deal, I'd throw the steak down on the table and say, Everyone, feast, gag you with my greatness. And then what I realized was I mean, me coming in with an ego, we weren't winning together, you know? They all felt like, okay, I'll just do this and I'm not really gonna be a part of it. And their voice got smaller and smaller, and I'm really grateful to have learned that lesson. Waller told me one time, he goes, Man, I just feel like wish it was more integrated and we could all win together. And I was very intentional from then on out. And like, how can we do that? And that was a good lesson. So, I mean, anytime we have something, hey, look, I think this is gonna work. How do we go after it and create in that environment? I love that quote that says, if you want to build a ship, don't send one person to gather sticks, one person to get the nails, one person to tie it all together. Inspire the team to yearn for the endless possibilities of the sea. And that type of mentality that we're not doing individual tasks, we're creating something that could take on the ocean.

SPEAKER_00 1:39:30

Oh, I love that so that took me a second to take that all in. I love that so much. That's so mine.

SPEAKER_01 1:39:38

It's ripped.

SPEAKER_00 1:39:39

There's like a quote. I used to have the poster on my wall about you can't find the new horizon or something if you don't lose sight of the shore. Yeah. And I always love that. There's another saying I love called burn the boats. Like, like, say you're gonna start a company or something. Well, you gotta look at it like you're going to an island, and when you get to that, you're gonna have to figure it out because you burn the boats, so you can't leave. You know what I mean? Yeah, I've heard that quote.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:07

That's a great one, too. I love that one too. Because there is something you can't steal second with your foot on first. There is something about I love those sayings. Yeah, me too. People say it's so axiom, but they're that like that for a reason because they're true.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:21

Yeah, I love growing like a weed. It's one of my favorites because it's so true. You see a kid and they were growing like a weed, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:28

And I love to garden what's that John Prime song where they do a bunch of them like five.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:34

Oh, are you talking about um oh shit? Is it a do-wet?

SPEAKER_01 1:40:39

No, Daryl's one, but he's got one where he just talks about sayings over and over again, like I don't remember.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:46

We'll have to find it and I'll say it at the end.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:48

Okay, perfect, perfect, perfect.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:50

But I love John Prime so much. Okay, so here's another funny thing. Chris knows all about this. Like, okay, so I have this idea.

Secret Ideas And Favorite Investments

SPEAKER_00 1:41:00

I know it's a billion-dollar idea. I'm 100% sure it's a be a multi-billion dollar idea. It's so good. Like, I know it's good because like Dennis Quaid and Laura both said, like, his wife is so, so, so, so, so smart. Um, she's one of the smartest people I know. Um, but they both said, like, this idea, like, she just flipped out and called me immediately. And then I told this movie producer guy, and he's like a crazy rich guy. And he's like, You fucking better have people signing confidentiality agreements if you're gonna tell anybody this idea.

SPEAKER_01 1:41:38

Are you gonna tell it on a podcast?

SPEAKER_00 1:41:40

Because but here's give us a hint.

SPEAKER_01 1:41:42

I can't. Oh man. Okay, I got a secret too. I'm not gonna tell you either.

SPEAKER_00 1:41:46

It's too big of an idea.

SPEAKER_01 1:41:47

I have a huge secret, I'm not gonna tell you either.

SPEAKER_00 1:41:51

It's gonna exist. All right, I look forward to it. But the thing is the scale of it to figure out how to do it. But see, that's why I like that saying you said um yes and you know what I mean? Because like the thing about this idea will happen, and I got a great name for it. I emailed um Mark Cuban.

SPEAKER_01 1:42:12

Right on. I mean, that's the ball, that's the two or three ways to be successful instead of thousands reasons to be failed.

SPEAKER_00 1:42:19

I was like, I have a multi-billion dollar idea. This is, you know, one of the biggest ideas. Like, you're not gonna believe I don't even want to compare it to stuff because I don't want somebody to get it from that. But I think it could be as big as Amazon. I'm not kidding. I mean, I'm sure such a tease.

SPEAKER_01 1:42:38

Come on now.

SPEAKER_00 1:42:38

No, I'll tell you, I will tell you, but somehow steal this. The thing is, nobody I've told about it knows how to do it. That's the problem. That's why I thought Mark Cuban, if he didn't know how to do it, he'd know who did know how to do it and invest in it because it's that good.

SPEAKER_01 1:42:55

But it's just figuring out how in the world, you know, like you would need a big database, like you're thinking about it the right way because ultimately the the way to take an idea to an actuality is to say, okay, here's the idea. Is it really viable? Do the business plan, see if that works, and then who has experience on something like this? How can I bring that to it? And then keep on working until the five right person pops in.

SPEAKER_00 1:43:25

You're not gonna when I tell you this idea, you're not gonna tell you. I've got an agreement of confidence. No, I'm joking. That guy's like, you better not tell this idea one more time. Um, yeah, and I'll tell them after I tell it to you what you thought about it.

SPEAKER_01 1:43:42

Okay. That's a little pressure.

SPEAKER_00 1:43:43

Yeah, I can't wait to see what you think. But see, I didn't know like this idea, you're not gonna take it on shark tank, so I'll just steal it, you know, because it's not, it's not something my guy. I have a business plan for I know exactly everything about it and wrote a bunch of stuff out, but I don't have the business plan of how to do it. That's why I would need to, it is a business, but I don't know how to make it. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 1:44:08

Like you're killing me. Like I need I opened my Christmas presents on Thanksgiving. I'm gonna need to know this idea ASAP.

SPEAKER_00 1:44:14

I'll tell you because I'm very curious what you think about it. Like, I don't know that it's in the world you're in. I I don't I hadn't heard that you've done anything like this, but you probably know the people.

SPEAKER_01 1:44:24

Some other thing, I've done some stuff that more if I'm not working on it, it usually means it's going pretty well. Like, for example, if you've ever stayed a youth hostel, yeah, there's if you usually go uh to say you go to what is it? Like, they've got some funny, funny names.

SPEAKER_00 1:44:40

I've never stayed at a youth hostel.

SPEAKER_01 1:44:41

You can do it now. Bomber's youth hostel.

SPEAKER_00 1:44:44

Well, I was thinking like a girl, I see a guy do that more than a girl. That seems kind of dangerous.

SPEAKER_01 1:44:49

Well, man, there's a ton of girls. Like I stayed at Bomber's Youth Hostel in Switzerland, and I still have that cup from when I was like 24 years old. And it it's badass.

SPEAKER_00 1:44:58

But maybe I just don't know like anything about hostels.

SPEAKER_01 1:45:02

It's bigger over in other countries than it is in the U.S.

SPEAKER_00 1:45:04

Like where people share a space, like in Switzerland.

SPEAKER_01 1:45:07

You can have your own room. I have some funny stories about that. I'll tell you some other time. But ultimately, historically, if you want to stay at a youth hostel, it was all pencil and paper, and it you couldn't really reserve it. You didn't know if you're going to have anything. Well, CloudBeds, I had an opportunity to invest in them. So got named Steve Hanno, his cousin was involved, got a bunch of really cool people, and they revolutionized that business. So now you can go to CloudBeds and you say you want to go to Brazil. You can find out everything, you can book it there, and they're like, well, what if we also did the payments on it? So they get a VIG off all of the payments and they just continue to do it. And then they started doing Airbnb's, some luxury, boutique hotels. So that type of thing, I do love that idea. I took a flyer on that one with a little money, and we've done incredibly well with that one. Another opportunity is group 360 with Kemp Galileau and then Dave Clippel. They were heavy hitters at Gaylord. Uh, and then um Marriott bought them, and they said, if the say that the four of us wanted to go somewhere, there's not a really good, easy way to for me to know, okay, say we want to go for an awards thing. And it's actually we're gonna bring 20 people with us and we want to go somewhere. Historically, we'd fax a proposal, nobody will send anything back, we would never want to know anything, but they have an algorithm that will actually say, okay, if you have 20 people and you want to go to a beach destination and you need this level of a ballroom and this gym, and okay, here's what the price would be if you do that. So suddenly everything closes. So their idea was how can we make it easier for people to travel as a group? And they partner with Marriott and Hyatt, all those companies, and it's revolutionized that business.

SPEAKER_00 1:46:50

Man, that is so cool. I'm a little bit stoned.

SPEAKER_01 1:46:55

I'm feeling it too. It's so funny because you were telling a story a minute ago, and I just went.

SPEAKER_00 1:47:00

I'm like, Mike, you'll be telling me something, and I'll just be thinking about Legos. Like, there's something like that.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:06

The primary question is how good does it feel?

SPEAKER_00 1:47:08

It feels good. It feels good. Like, it's not a sad mopey feeling like drinking either.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:16

Um I want to give it up to Crescent. I want to give it up to everybody to uh Hectors, give it up to high seltzer, bunch of great players. Uh, but my boy Matt, the festival coastal cool. This is a nice little tasty buzz, conversation builder. And tomorrow morning, guess what we're gonna wake up with?

SPEAKER_00 1:47:34

What? No hungover.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:35

No hangover.

SPEAKER_00 1:47:36

Yes, it's true. Well, let me think a second. I was gonna ask you one more thing.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:41

Um, that's so funny because I just got stoned too. Like you did. Totally.

SPEAKER_00 1:47:45

I was gonna ask you, do you have any food? Do you want to be a sponsor for this?

SPEAKER_01 1:47:51

Uh, for the podcast or for high rise?

SPEAKER_00 1:47:53

With high rise on the podcast.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:55

Well, we'll talk to those guys about it. Like I said, I'm just a small investor in that business.

SPEAKER_00 1:47:59

I gotta tell you something.

SPEAKER_01 1:47:59

Lay it on me. I love a good offense.

SPEAKER_00 1:48:01

I'm smiling so hard thinking about asking you that question.

SPEAKER_01 1:48:05

I love it, baby.

SPEAKER_00 1:48:06

No, because I need a reaction. My mouth is so fucking dry. Is yours?

SPEAKER_01 1:48:11

Yeah, but we got some water. Oh, you want some amazing?

SPEAKER_00 1:48:13

I drank on my water.

SPEAKER_01 1:48:14

I forgot I was sitting on there.

SPEAKER_00 1:48:16

The only thing I say, get a glass of water with it.

SPEAKER_01 1:48:18

I like that call. Genius. Genius. I mean, I think this would be a very sponsorable thing. And I think those guys will be good to be able to do it.

SPEAKER_00 1:48:26

Really and truly, I was only kidding about. I love a good offense, baby. I love a good offense. Get it. I was I was feeling stoned, and I started thinking, what can I ask him to get a good reaction out of him? You know what I mean? And then I couldn't wait to watch your face. And I that's why when you were talking, I was smiling so big because I was thinking, I'm about that.

SPEAKER_01 1:48:46

I really don't think you could ask me a single question that I wouldn't be all about answering. Some stuff I haven't talked about at all before hanging out with Amy Mayo.

SPEAKER_00 1:48:54

Oh, I love it. But I think you've gave a lot of good like inspiration tonight. And I think I love knowing that you the thing about like if you want to work with somebody trying to find the person who's the perfect thing you got in your head that like, no, find somebody you like that's smart, that y'all can learn together and try, you know what I mean? Like you said about just teach them how to do whatever it is that that's good advice.

SPEAKER_01 1:49:19

Yeah, there's a million ways to fail. I mean, what our line is if I pick you and you pick me, we start a company, you can fail, but you can't quit. We're in it for the duration. We don't lose our legends. That's the thing. We're gonna find it and we're gonna win this thing together.

SPEAKER_00 1:49:33

That's awesome. Well, let's have one more toast. Jerry Bosselman. I know everybody loved this. I love this.

SPEAKER_01 1:49:41

To Amy Mayo. This this is the only time, seriously, I like to prepare so much that I make it look easy. I didn't prepare one single bit, and as per usual, it's a rollicking adventure with Amy Mayo.

SPEAKER_00 1:49:52

Truly as you got the best energy. Back at you back.

SPEAKER_01 1:49:56

Or maybe we're just hi. Who even knows? Who even knows? Know who even knows?

SPEAKER_00 1:50:02

Oh shit. Okay, yeah. I've got to pee so bad. I'm just sitting here. I don't know. We're we'll have to when we like watch this, you have got to watch the part where I am smiling so badly. That's so funny. When I thought of that question, I was thinking, what can I do? I love it. I love it. I love it. What can I ask him that'll throw him? Like so we can get like we're supposed to try and get like a reaction. Okay.

Laptop + $1,000 = MILLIONS!

SPEAKER_00 1:50:30

So if all you had was a laptop and a thousand bucks, what would you do? What business would you start? Or what would you do in 2026?

SPEAKER_01 1:50:40

So if I had a thousand bucks on a laptop in 2026, the world is an absolute turmoil. I mean, who knows what's going to happen with uh AI? I mean, it's impacting crazy things.

SPEAKER_00 1:50:53

People are really, I don't think people really understand how scary it is.

SPEAKER_01 1:50:56

It's and it's also awesome, but it's very disruptive and it's hard to make a decision around that. If you think about all the routine things, a lot of those businesses are gonna be significantly affected. So if I had $1,000 in a laptop in 2026, I would throw as much creativity as I could around creating something exactly like this.

SPEAKER_00 1:51:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:51:18

Because what can you do that only you can do? You can sit down and you create a conversation and an experience that people want to be a part of and it enriches their lives. That's something that is way more valuable than almost anything else in the world. So if I had $1,000 in a laptop, I'd find a way to engage, educate, and enjoy what I'm doing and bring the same thing to those I serve.

SPEAKER_00 1:51:45

Boy, that's so good. I've got another question that just made me think of like AI, like, how do you feel about it versus how your kids feel about it?

SPEAKER_01 1:51:56

That's a good question. I actually primarily use Chat GBT to roast people in a photograph, though. Like if we take a selfie, you can say roast everybody. And that's one of my favorite things about it. I mean, ultimately, I've got a lot of people that are a lot more engaged in AI than I am. I always like to think in when the businesses that I'm involved in that technology is gonna end us tomorrow. Yeah. So we need to be able to master the tools. But the reality of it is like if you take the Baco business, when the job boards came out, you thought, well, nobody's ever gonna go, like Indeed. Why would anybody use a recruiter? Well, because you have to go through 100 people on Indeed, and people want to save time and certainty and be successful. That's why you use that. So ultimately the job boards made us 15% more effective. And then when LinkedIn came out, you're like, oh my gosh, everything is on LinkedIn. There's no reason anybody would ever use a consulting firm or et cetera. But the reality of it is LinkedIn can suck you in and you can spend hours and hours and hours. And why do you use somebody to provide certainty, to save time, and guarantee success? So LinkedIn made it easier for all of us and we became 40% more effective in the pandemic. Suddenly, before that time, only like 3% of jobs could be done remotely until we realized that we have to do it through Zoom. Now 40% of jobs are can be done remotely in the professional world. So ultimately, those companies like Avago that collaborate, they've got an unfair advantage because they can offer the world with a local phone call. So after that, I would say it's a 25% increase in productivity. So AI, properly harnessed with the right people, will probably result in a 50% increase in performance for the best companies, but it is going to be heavily disruptive. And the one thing that it will be the last to disrupt is the creative mind. And that's why I think a thousand dollars in a laptop all day long. Sit here and entertain.

Closing Toast

SPEAKER_00 1:54:09

You guys rock. Thank you for watching.