Episode 6: Dad and the... Digital Tug-of-War

Episode 6: Dad and the... Digital Tug-of-War

Let’s be honest: Nothing triggers "Dad Guilt" quite like handing over a tablet so you can finally finish a work email or just drink a cup of coffee while it’s actually hot. We’ve all been there—the internal battle between wanting to be "unplugged" and the reality of surviving a rainy Tuesday afternoon.

In this episode of Dad and the What, we’re pulling back the curtain on the screen time struggle. We’re moving past the "screens are evil" headlines and getting into the real-world challenge of raising kids in a digital age. It’s not about being perfect; it’s about being intentional and improving how we navigate technology as a family.

We’re diving into:

• The "Digital Babysitter" Guilt: Why we feel bad about it, and why we need to give ourselves some grace.
• Intentional Consumption: Moving from "mindless scrolling" to high-quality, educational content.
• The Hard Transitions: Tips for ending screen time without a total nuclear meltdown.
• Leading by Example: Realizing that our kids are watching our screen habits just as much as their own.
• The Long Game: How to use technology as a tool for connection rather than just a distraction.

Whether you’re fighting the YouTube Rabbit Hole or trying to set better boundaries for yourself, this episode is a judgment-free zone. We’re all just trying to find the balance.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Every dad knows this battle. The thing that keeps kids quiet and occupied for hours bites you a little piece, but somehow always leaves you wondering if you've gone to grow the crack.

SPEAKER_01 0:29

We don't need to die to level down from the dead way from the backyard.

SPEAKER_03 0:38

In the beginning, I would like to st by thinking about how screens have become and became part of our everyday family life, including all the phones, tablets, smart TVs, gaming, etc. And I would like to start asking a question from you, especially that how have you noticed the change within this situation in your own childhood and of course adulthood now later on?

SPEAKER_02 1:10

Yeah, that that's uh interesting uh question because when I was a kid I remember so clearly that my dad, he was uh having this big it looked like a suitcase. It was probably one of the first like mobile phones we had uh at that time and it was with a big antenna and it was so heavy I couldn't even carry it. I have at that time, what have I been like eight, nine years old, something like that.

SPEAKER_03 1:44

Yeah, pretty young.

SPEAKER_02 1:45

Pretty young. Um and and and then maybe even younger actually. But but then we were at this stock, and he took it out of the car, and I remember to playing with it, and he was very like, Oh, you can't touch it. Uh no no no, it's uh very expensive equipment and yeah and stuff like that. To to clip when when when I was around 12, that's why I also evaluate probably a little younger than nine, maybe six, seven.

SPEAKER_03 2:14

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 2:15

But when I was around twelve, eleven, twelve, uh, the first phones came in. It was uh as I remember very clearly Nokia, who who had the market at that time.

SPEAKER_03 2:26

Pretty much.

SPEAKER_02 2:26

Yeah. Uh you remember the the 3310 uh model and and 33 the indestructible phone. Yes, exactly, man. And snake. Yeah, it had snake. And uh this was like the first introduction to to mobile phones, and and what was cool compared to today, where we have touch screens with everything, uh, was that you could feel the the what do you call them, the buttons. Yes, and under the table while you were eating, you could sit. The problem was you looked so serious into the lamp or into something else that you know you had to be really skillful if your parents shouldn't notice if you wrote long messages. But you could actually write a very, very long message without even looking, knowing exactly what you wrote.

SPEAKER_03 3:15

Yes, you had memorized the whole letters inside the numbers that you were pressing up like one to three times every time you had some like some specific letter, especially. And oh, I remember those times like you were just spamming out the buttons pretty much to write one text message, and it has so it it has gone so far with development like after those days.

SPEAKER_02 3:39

Crazy man, crazy. Also, just well, if we we compare to the phone conversations, uh at that time, yeah, we were memorizing each other's home phones uh landlines, and uh and we were calling to to come out to play. But when we begin to to to get in the teenage, and we were also talking a lot in phone, and that could be for hours like hours and hours and hours, and that could be both in the landline, but it could also be on the mobile phone or on video call uh when that came around.

SPEAKER_03 4:11

Yeah, with Skype and everything.

SPEAKER_02 4:12

Yes, exactly, and then the social media platforms start to pop up, Arto, uh Facebook, and all these uh different sites. It's uh it's been a crazy development since I was a kid till today, where my six-year-old boy and soon also my four-year-old is completely capable. I gave him the access code one or two times for my phone when he needed to do a game or he wanted to watch a uh picture or something like that. He he very found the oldest one, uh the both are but to run around and take pictures of everything with the with the phones or cameras for that matter.

SPEAKER_03 4:52

Yeah, they got into it right away.

SPEAKER_02 4:55

I mean, three weeks after he completely memorized it and I found out he was every morning when I slept in stealing my phone. And then he used it like to watch some uh cartoon or like a video he took or something like that. Yeah. But had a lot of fun with that when I found out. I can imagine. Yeah. A little bit proud, but also a little bit like hmm.

SPEAKER_03 5:18

Yeah, I can imagine that it it gives you some thoughts about like how is this gonna turn up, f especially later on. And of course, now the screen time means so much more today, as in our childhoods as well, because the mobile phones, tablets, and computers have become part of our everyday life with entertainment, learning, socializing, gaming, and even homework sometimes.

SPEAKER_02 5:46

Huge impact then. And we of course we had the TV, right? Yes. Um and but that was more like of course when when when when when I get into the teens, you got a TV on your own room in your own room and and and so forth. It was different because then you had all the nights or all the weekends or whatever, you could just lie in all day and and and kind of watch whatever you wanted. But before that, it was kind of an event.

SPEAKER_03 6:12

If you watched a movie, you know, it was probably a Saturday night, and there was some candy and there was some uh chips and there was some soda and you had to plan it out so much more and now you just spontaneously like take your phone or whatever up and open up an app and you can watch whatever you want pretty much.

SPEAKER_02 6:30

Exactly. And that's also another concern, uh, I would say, is that you you have everything so available, so you you never have to kind of wait on anything, like you say. You never have to in the old days you could also tell like a story. You know, you heard from somebody and you heard it from somebody that'd been in a faraway country and and all these things. Today you have 30 seconds and then some AI or Google or whatever have you given you the the the complete history and correct answer.

SPEAKER_03 7:00

Yeah, that's very true. Like the storytelling has become so different and strange in some ways, especially if you need to talk about long stories. Of course, it's still very interesting, quite gladly, I would say, but all the information is so easily accessible all the time. It's pretty strange.

SPEAKER_02 7:20

It is pretty strange, and and and and if you think about it, it also cut away, I would say, a lot of of our as adults, uh, last bit of fantasy. Uh we we we are so consumed by data and measurement uh instruments and and and things we can compare. Exactly. So so it's been in the end, it's so convenient that that you wonder sometimes like what about your kids? What product are they becoming when we only were part of our childhood with screens and mobile phones and video calls and accesses like we we we just talked about? They have it all and a lot more in five years, even crazy more in 10. Like what product are we we we ending up with 15, 18 years old? Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 8:11

And of course, also in this case, the coin has its both sides, the good and the bad as well, because like we talk, they're able to use the screens and everything to learning, to education, homework, etc. But also on the other hand, they have the unlimited entertainment and it can really take the attention away of very essential things also, so there's a very thin line between what is good and what is bad, especially especially for their development.

SPEAKER_02 8:45

And how how do you see the side of educational apps versus the social media rabbit holes pretty much nowadays, then which of course the educational is probably better somewhat, but how you see like where the line should be drawn, like what is good and what is bad between them both or the screen time in general it it is a big subject um and and and hard to to kind of compress several things that lay in in this matter. Um and and and one thing is educational ideas the social media is is also a way where we are unlimited given unlimited access into other people that that not necessarily want the best for us.

SPEAKER_03 9:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:48

So so so if you put those two up against each other, I would always say educational will win of that reason alone.

SPEAKER_03 9:55

We we I I try to uh grow a very honest uh relationship and I try to uh be so as as transparent as I can at this point, and that you're actually able to see and guide them, like how should they act, especially with social media, because in most cases I would say nowadays the social media is able to give you so fictional human interactions that it might give a very wrong idea to young human beings of how they should they talk and interact with people in real life as well.

SPEAKER_02 10:35

I'll guess when our kids is on social media they we we are there 100% with with AI generated content and and uh you can't tell friend from foe in in in in in in reality. Yeah. Um but I have after introducing the educational apps seen uh demand in a good way for playing that game or resolving that uh puzzle or what it could be. And uh we had introduced very early educational books, these big books you can buy where there's a whole lot of different funny assignments. Most of them is like draw the line out of the uh out of the what is it called? Lab Labyrinth.

SPEAKER_03 11:27

Labyrinth.

SPEAKER_02 11:28

Labyrinth. Draw the line out of the labyrinth, and uh then there is like connect the same pictures, these kind of easy tasks. And he enjoy and and and the middle one actually also enjoy very much do those. And I think that of course also promotes so when we introduce educational apps, it's something they are used to, it's something they they they find funny. The the healthiest choice is to use education educational apps.

SPEAKER_03 11:58

I would say so too, and of course, like the educational side of the social media or the screen time in general can be very beneficial for learning as well because it might make some of the things much more interesting because they're maybe more interactive or showed up in a little bit, you know, entertaining way. But of course, like I said previously, there's a very thin line when it's purely educational and when it's entertainment, also uh at the same time. So we need to be a little bit careful with that one as well. Absolutely. And of course, the whole educational side comes very much with the age of our kids because if they are too young, they're just too young to look at the screen at all, especially with my kid. He's only seven months old, so how are you doing it?

SPEAKER_02 12:50

Like to to prepare for for screen time and and vice versa.

SPEAKER_03 12:54

At the moment I would say I'm only trying to plan like how am I gonna introduce my kid for the screens, social media, educational apps and everything. But for now, I don't let my kid watch the screen at all, especially the phones, the TV and everything, because it has the blue light and everything, and it might affect their brain development at the same time. And of course, I'm a dad and I want the best for my kid for and for their health as well.

SPEAKER_02 13:25

Absolutely, absolutely. And I would say my two-year-old daughter, she of course, watching when the boys are watching a TV show or movie or something like that. Yeah, um, she she definitely looks at it, but she finds it more funny to play, you know, so she she not sit down and look at it, she maybe running by, stand look for a couple of seconds, and then she goes back to her playing. So she's not so captivated. No, not not as the boys. Uh they are like sold as uh in right away. Um and it it was not like a lie when when people say you get uh a moment of peace, you get completely quietness if it's something they they are consumed about alike. Yes. In our case, at the moment it's uh transformational robots, tobots it's called, that is hitting big time. They know all the names, all the different transformation models, and it's like they're singing the songs, and yeah.

SPEAKER_03 14:25

Yeah, that gotta be so fascinating.

SPEAKER_02 14:27

Absolutely, absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 14:29

And of course, like we were talking about previously, like how do we monitor this and how are we able to guide them with which content should they watch and should they not watch it, especially so what are your takes?

SPEAKER_02 14:43

I was in the beginning very monitoring because I knew, like I said earlier, they had access to to YouTube and stuff where they were not monitored at all. And that created uh a little bit split difference because they started to watch things on other languages. Content that was shit, after my opinion, but but also in other languages. So suddenly some of they started to say things in Spanish and you know stuff like that. Because they are like sponges, they they really uh quickly absorb. So after that, I I changed to being very radical about it, and uh I made lists. I even uh created an app and that was like kind of parenting control on their devices, they had an iPad, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:34

Uh or have sorry, they have did they like only have access to places where you where I kind of uh give permission to, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 15:41

And I can monitor the screen time, I can monitor what they have access to, I can shut it down remotely, everything. Okay, and we have have had situations where we watched uh a movie, there was some uh animals from a Sioux escaping, um and then I think it was actually the oldest one that said, Daddy, it's scary. Can we change? And you know, that was the first time ever, and the only time ever anyone of them has said that because I am very aware of what we are watching, and we changed, and we went back to that movie and watched it finished another day, but but but I felt like he was able to say this is too much, uh in in in the most closest way of a healthy way to say it.

SPEAKER_03 16:28

I would say so too, and that sounds very nice from him, especially that he's able to really like think about and process like this is too much for me in the moment, especially.

SPEAKER_02 16:38

Exactly, exactly. But to be honest, after that half year, then it kind of slipped a little out. I'm of of course, what can watch on Netflix what they're watching on YouTube and all this, but we are within boundaries now where I can almost on everything say okay.

SPEAKER_03 16:55

That's very cool, very cool. And of course, uh one of the applications that I'm really pondering about is TikTok. And are your kids able to use or watch TikTok?

SPEAKER_02 17:07

Unfortunately, I cannot say they never do because I know there's family members who are promoting. Uh and by promoting I mean sit next to them and watch, and they there is some dogs, there is some, you know. Yeah. So unfortunately they get a little bit of it. But in my house, I have one rule, and that is very simple. When my kids is unless I'm on the phone, like I'm speaking, but then I still take my time and say, excuse me, one minute, listen, I'm on the phone explaining them. I cannot talk right now, so even if you keep on asking, I will not be able to answer. Yeah, I will be able to answer when I take my phone down from my ear and hang up and I come to you again. So instead of you know, stand and and and keep pulling me or making a situation, you can go back to playing and I will come to you.

SPEAKER_03 18:00

Yeah, that's really teaching some patience for them.

SPEAKER_02 18:02

Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. But but when it's on the phone, always right away down, uh turn it off, you know, uh put my uh eye contact and my full attention at their disposal right away. No matter if I know the situation already, or if I know it's like oh for the fourth time you come in with uh this one and and and I have seen it, or you are out of energy. This is just a rule I never ever ever break, even when I'm out.

SPEAKER_03 18:31

That sounds very good and very healthy, especially for the kids. It's very nice to hear. And uh of course, like the thing I'm afraid of about the TikTok is the actual doom scrolling, especially if the kid is able to, let's say, spend two to three hours even with the phone alone and just scrolling up whatever comes next after every short video, and you never know what might pop up in there.

SPEAKER_02 18:58

That was actually the reason why they got iPads, because they were sitting with the family's phones and using them. And then we were free on yeah, it could even be YouTube because they also have these short reels videos where you just you know, doom scroll like uh TikTok. And yes, I'm very afraid and uh very aware about it, but I'm pretty sure that when they turn to the age where this is relevant, like in maybe three, four years for the oldest one, yeah, um, then it will be something different.

SPEAKER_03 19:36

It could be, it definitely could be, and I think it's very good to think about it, especially now, so we can teach like some proper, let's say, social media hygiene for them and how to act with it later on.

SPEAKER_02 19:49

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 19:49

Yes, yes. That's that's very nice. And as we were talking about the health, the other thing I'm thinking about is the actual physical health. Because if they're only interested about the screen and what to do with that one, they might forget about the outside life, I would say, like playing outdoors, doing real interaction with their friends and other humans as well.

SPEAKER_02 20:14

So that's there's many things in that one too, but but but mainly I would say re remember two things. Uh first of all, they're becoming zombies. Yes. They become completely zombies. And second, remember who put them in front of the TV or the phone.

SPEAKER_03 20:32

Exactly, who has the actual control.

SPEAKER_02 20:34

Exactly. So the remote control to controlling kids that is because I know many parents is frustrated when their kids is not listening. I am too. Um one point where you can be almost 100% sure they won't listen is in a situation where they are watching something. Mainly I would say because they don't get the span of time to end their cycle of what they are doing, because we are too quick to judge on oh my god, you're not listening, oh you're ignoring me on purpose, and all these things we we which I have been through myself. But I came to the conclusion that's not true. The the truth is that the kid needs a steady system for closing down what I'm doing now, if you could say it so. And if you follow that system and give it time, and we are not just talking 30 seconds, we can talk minutes, sometimes 10, 15 minutes. It could be shower situation, it could be uh going from the playground, it could be going home from school. But if we don't have a crystal clear system of how we are ending something quicker than they expect, then they will ignore you.

SPEAKER_03 21:54

That's very true, and also one of the practical tips I could definitely give on this one already. is to set some sort of timers or routines for the screen time itself because we all know that kids respond very well to structure and routines as we have talked previously. So if we are able to give them certain times, for example, when they are able to watch a movie, look at the screen in general, they're more than happy to end it when they already know how it's gonna end up.

SPEAKER_02 22:26

If they don't with many other addictions also including sugar, but but but it's very important also what time of the day are we doing it? Yes. What type of activity did we do before? Because if we haven't burned any energy, we had a lazy morning, we're watching TV up a 10 10 to 11, 10 to 12, something like that, take a kind of a midday uh nap or whatever.

SPEAKER_00 22:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:54

We only ate breakfast and and went to shower and played a little bit, then they haven't burned energy and they're gonna be impossible. Impossible after this. Oh I can imagine overtired they haven't burned energy they you know so but if you do the opposite and burn a couple of hours energy and come home and watch half hour or one hour TV then it's a totally different situation.

SPEAKER_03 23:18

Because they are relaxed they are okay with it their body is is actually doing something uh yeah they are not so overstimulated about the whole thing that's that's very true and also we are giving them some alternatives as well like going out playing games playing cards whatever you like to do with them so that's that's very good is there any time where screen time can can be uh beneficial or even promote like a healthy thing do you think I I would say so especially when it comes to learning as we tal talked in the beginning of the episode because if they're going through some very difficult or uninteresting topic that they're just not going to put effort into otherwise then if we are able to give them some alternative options for example in in the in the in the form of a game we could for example and in that way make the topic more interesting and help them learn it actually then I think it can be very beneficial also.

SPEAKER_02 24:33

Do you think that that like I mean I don't believe that you and me are very afraid that we're gonna lose the battle to the algorithm or if if you say so but I could imagine that there is many hardworking, dedicated parents out there that is uh using amongst other tricks and and and and a TV time or a screen time for cooking the dinner or m cleaning or whatever it could be who who sit out there and and and blame themselves again back to the Tad guild. Yeah but but because they also maybe deep inside thinking that I'm losing my kid more and more to to exactly what you say the the social media or whatever it could be.

SPEAKER_03 25:28

Yes that's very true and also in those moments I think everyone should be able to stop for a moment and try at least to take the matter to their own hands and actually do something about it and of course it all begins with yourself because if you're a person who watches your phone all day long also at home with your kids the kids are gonna look after you and like no not look after you but look what are what are you doing and they're copying it right right away and one thing I'm really trying to avoid for myself also is watching the scream before bed especially if my young kid is still awake because I don't want him to try to mimic me and start wanting to watch screen before bedtime.

SPEAKER_02 26:19

There is some certain moments about my own dad where I wake up very young come out in the middle of the night and he's watch watching the OL yeah and there was a lot of boxing matches and spear cast and stone cast and stuff like that. And if I was lucky and I said I couldn't sleep I could sit down for maybe 10-15 minutes with him. Sometimes he would even like hog me in you know yeah and that was the best safest feeling in the world plus I got to be up at night and and watch TV with my dad.

SPEAKER_03 26:54

I I can relate to that one as well that's a fantastic moment and I remember very similar moments from my childhood that I was supposed to be in bed already but I couldn't sleep so I went downstairs and my dad was watching a TV series or movie and we both knew that I should be in bed already but I kindly just walked into the living room and sat beside him and said nothing. I just watched the TV with him and he would also like cuddle me and say nothing in those moments. You were like kind of if I say something you're gonna I'm gonna ruin something or it's gonna break you know you're afraid and you feel the tension in the air that is something gonna happen if I'm gonna say something about it. Exactly. But yeah it was amazing when you had like 30 minutes extra time doing something that you probably shouldn't be doing especially with your own dad. Exactly but now that I think about the whole situation I think I'm able to give a little bit slack with it and maybe maybe allow some some of those moments as well.

SPEAKER_02 28:02

Of course I don't think you should uh restrict it completely restrict it completely that that also extreme things is producing extreme products. Yes so agreed. Yes but I think we covered uh a lot of things today and and uh about the screen time and and and also the evolvement uh through time that uh that we started with the nothing and landlines came and then we suddenly have uh video calls and TikTok all over the place. Exactly and also nowadays it's so relevant topic to talk about and I think it's very very interesting to share our own experiences and share how we feel about the whole thing evolving especially now if we should sum up a little bit from today we have been talking about is screen time ever a good thing and we definitely would say yes that it can be a really really good way to gather the family on certain times scheduled we also covered will the algorithm win or will we as parents trust ourselves enough to to to actually take control and I think we both definitely agree that if you take control and and and sit down and when I watch my first cartoon which my kids were watching in in the early days I was like so afraid that I was gonna be bored out of my mind. But when I found out what crap they produce for kids today honestly I was like game on man let's watch this shit. You know right now they're watching uh they just finished up uh Avatar the the cartoon that's very nice I actually have seen it as well me too and and you know there is some some some battles and some fights and some blood and some different things yeah but the values in it is incredible. The songs in it is incredible and it's something where they never ever came to me look scared or anything it's like fire earth bending and we are playing outside and very nice effects as well super nice. Yeah and I think it has a beautiful plot in the cartoon itself it goes beyond imagination in many ways in in in many ways yeah but keep updating yourself not just with new products on the market but with the youth because they are the ones that have the fingers in the fire they are the ones that are using the products and they are the ones that will be able to tell you exactly what is trending what is not and what their issues is today. Absolutely and of course how they feel about the whole situation and what are their values gonna be like regarding that as well this is of course dear listeners a fragment of of what me and Daniel have have been through and and and this is what we are going through of of thoughts process and data at the moment and so I'm sure there's a lot of controversial or or side stories to to to to what we came with today. Don't hesitate join in the conversation and and please send us every story every bit every evaluation or every positive or negative criticism the stories is is what we did this for.

SPEAKER_03 31:25

Now we are here on episode six doing episode seven and the next episode is gonna be a very interesting topic to talk about especially when it's concerning us as dads maybe even more and the kids and it's gonna be our married after the kids there's there's something to talk about there. Absolutely and I'm looking forward to the next episode and I thank you for this conversation once again thank you for sharing thank you listen good night