Episode 9: Sports, Arts, and Unfinished Stories

Episode 9: Sports, Arts, and Unfinished Stories

"Parenting isn’t cloning yourself — it’s discovering who they are."

It’s a classic dad trap: You grew up living and breathing sports, so naturally, you buy your kid a baseball glove before they can even walk. But what happens when they’d rather paint watercolors than score goals?

In this episode of Dad and the What, we are tackling the heavy realization that our kids’ journeys are not our sequels—they are their own debuts. We unpack the subtle ways we project our own unfinished stories onto our children, and the beautiful (but sometimes difficult) process of learning to cheer for a passion you don't fully understand.

In this episode, we get into:

• Passion vs. Projection: Why we push our own interests, the subtle sting when they reject them, and how to pivot.
• The Pressure Problem: The fine line between healthy encouragement and heavy expectation. Are we actually supporting them, or just performing through them for other parents?
• Embarrassing Dad Moments: From yelling too loud at a Tuesday night game to crying at recitals and accidentally filming the wrong kid—the hilarious, cringe-worthy reality of caring just a little too much.
• Finding the Balance: Practical tips on when to lead, when to follow, and why you should let your kid pick one activity that is 100% theirs.

Whether your weekend is spent on the sidelines of a muddy field or sitting in the front row of an auditorium, the real trophy is raising confident, curious kids who know their dad is proud of them, no matter what they love.

🎧 Season 1 is almost wrapping up! Listen to Episode 9 now and share it with a dad who spends his weekends on the sidelines.

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:05

Yeah, and I think this is a very good example, like how it changes, like when you're actually being the one who leads the situation versus when you're the one who actually follows what's happening. You really set the example for them like what might happen if you don't act this way, and what could happen if you do it that way.

SPEAKER_02 0:37

There's a big difference on being one weekend at the soccer field, training your ass out in the gym, or at the art galleries. Yes. Another weekend.

SPEAKER_03 0:47

Yes. And of course the big question once again is are we raising our kids' dreams or are we trying to relive our own?

SPEAKER_02 0:55

That's really interesting because I think that many people out there, including myself, up to some sort of level, is trying to relive our own through what our parents did, which we think was wrong. And then we try to better it or cover it up or wrap it in some kind of pink, my kid shouldn't be hurt like I was, or shouldn't end up in the same bad situation and as I did. Or what is your take on that?

SPEAKER_03 1:26

Yes, and I actually agree on that one, and I have a story to share with all of you guys because I remember when I began training it when I was around six to seven years, so quite a while, and I was always super passionate about it. I was aiming to be a professional and everything, I was putting everything else on the side so I could, you know, really focus on training and become a professional player. Nice. And my parents always encouraged me a lot, like they were buying all the gear for me and making sure I'm in the practice in the right time. They were showing up to all the games and everything and really supporting me as much as they could, and I'm always very grateful for them. But when I was getting closer to the age of 14, 15, I started to feel like that I'm actually missing out so much other things in life that I might not actually want to play ice hockey in the way that I was actually doing it. And I had a little bit of conflicts, of course, with the management of our team at the same time because they weren't really pushing me to the places where I wanted to go as well, and we had some issues, I would say. But those issues really helped me to make my mind in that sense, and I wanted to quit playing the whole sport because all of the thing things happening around me. And that really didn't suit for my dad, especially in that time, because they had lived with my dream for so long already, and they adopted it. Exactly. And also, of course, my dad has a long background with professional athletism as well. And they wanted me to become one as well. And I remember when I told him that I actually want to quit, he looked into my eyes in such a pressuring way and asked me, like, are you sure? Almost like, meaning that no, you don't. And that was terrible because I I remember that we had to go pretty much back and forth with the whole thing quite quite a long time because uh before it they were actually accepting me quitting the sport itself, and that's definitely one of the things that I want to reflect on and not to do for my own kids. Of course, I'm not saying that I'm you know mad for my parents or anything. Of course, they wanted all the best for me, etc.

SPEAKER_02 3:55

Absolutely. I remember mine was with violin, and I remember my dad being so damn proud that he was talking to some of my teachers. One of them was like the general, I think it's called, the one with the stick who is Yeah, and the head of the orchestra or how is it called? The composer. Composer, yes. And the other one was my violin teacher. Yeah, and I remember my violin teacher was playing on a violin course called Strativarios, very expensive brand. Yes. This violin in itself was at that time, I think it was around two to three hundred thousand dollars. Yeah, very expensive, and I was four to five years in it, I think, and I was getting to a level where they were talking about they were actually fighting about if I was gonna be the head of the orchestra or if I was gonna be a violinist. That's the level I was at, and I was at that point puking over that fucking violin. Yeah. Because it was practicing two to three hours a day, and I was very easy to anger and had a hard time um calming myself down, so I exploded many times how many bows I have breaked because it didn't want it what I tried to do. Yeah, so you were very impulsive in that sense. Absolutely, and my dad was pushing me too hard in the end. Absolutely. I'm I'm sure today it was not his intention, but like you said, they were kind of he was living on the proudness and my dream for me, and it got to a point where I couldn't see friends, you know, I couldn't maintain my social status at that time, was much more important for me than that violin. I'm pretty sad today that I didn't kind of keep that relationship with the violin, yeah, at least at some level, because today I can maybe play a few songs, but I cannot read the notes anymore, and you know, I'm a bit sad of that. Um but I totally understand this whole situation with being a dad and thinking that these things I did right I want to impose on my kids too. Yeah. And the things I did wrong I want to protect them from. But what about you? You said you were very into these days you are into martial arts.

SPEAKER_03 6:20

Yes, a whole different sport. But before we go into that topic, of course I want to add on to the previous things that even though I was a kid, I was probably very short-tempered and very impulsive as well. And I think even though my dad was trying his best to talk to me in a way that I would understand that I could actually have the possibility to continue with the ice hockey and become a professional one day, I think he might have done a small mistake by talking to me like an adult talks to the adult. So I might have become way too defensive and not listening in a way that I probably should have.

SPEAKER_02 6:59

Similarly, here and I will agree that at the time when we had the situation, it was probably one of the hardest conversations when I said to him, I'm gonna quit. Yeah. And like you said, the look in his eyes and the disappointment and the rejection, it was very hard for me to process at that age also. We are probably talking 13, 14 years old or something like that. Um and that is, of course, looking back, usually that age where you're becoming really good at something that you have to pursue it. Yes. For becoming somewhat professional on on a level like that. But yeah, it's kind of scares me to talk about it because we will probably uh stand in a situation similar to that with some kind of interest. But I think you're right, it is much about trying to be so what you call bread spraxim as possible with opportunities and support them as well as you can, and then when we get to the point where they get sick of something, yeah, just try to manhandle it as best as possible.

SPEAKER_03 8:11

Yeah, even though it's a very hard pill to swallow in that sense. And of course to jump to the next thing, as you mentioned, that nowadays I'm very into martial arts, especially Brazilian jiu-jitsu and Thai boxing, and I'm trying to push those hobbies not to the professional side, but very close to that, because I'm very into that thing and I also like how it shapes my body physically, but also what it does to my mind at the same time.

SPEAKER_02 8:41

You must also, in that regard, had some thoughts about taking your son into that world. Yes. Am I wrong?

SPEAKER_03 8:49

Yes, even though my son is pretty young at the moment, so I need to wait a couple of years maybe before he can actually walk around and move and everything. But I have planned to introduce him at least to the Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, not because I do it as well, but because it's very hard physically and mentally. And I want to teach my son persistence and of course athletism in the sense at the same time, and also how to calm your mind when you're feeling aggressive, impulsive, and all the other things besides that.

SPEAKER_02 9:23

Agreed. I actually heard and talked to a lot of people, did a little bit MMA, did a little bit Brazilian jiu-jitsu, very little, and liked it a lot. Time-wise, it hasn't been able to fit in my schedule yet. Um, but I have really wanting to push both of the boys to start that because it's such a familiar sport. People are protecting and helping each other in in a way you rarely find in sports, yeah, like that. Plus, like you say, the training you get for your mental and the training for the physical is very well balanced in a way, I would say. Plus, you get to, as a boy, you have so much testosterone that's just burning energy and fighting and yelling, and you know, you can get it all out right there on the mat, and when you come home, you even like know I can see the boys when they fight now, it's going in so many different funny directions, you know, their balance, their coordination is not there yet. Um the oldest one is getting there, but it but I think it's it's really good to get them into some sort of activity or sport, but BJJ is absolutely one of the one I wish I can get them hooked on.

SPEAKER_03 10:37

Absolutely, and uh one thing I could say that they should definitely try it at last. Absolutely, they will do. Yes, and doesn't matter at the end of the day if you have a son or a daughter, I think it's a great sport in the sense of self-defense at the same time because it brings out the confidence with the kids so much more out as like oh I I don't want to say that any other sport, but most of the sports in a sense, and even though it's an individual sport in a sense, while you're training with your with the other members of the gym, it feels like a team sport at the same time because everyone, at least in those BHA gyms that I have been into, are so welcoming, so warm-hearted that it's always nice to go back as well. Agreed.

SPEAKER_02 11:21

I mean you can see in the eyes of the four-year-old experienced guy that he's a little bit like bored to hook up with you, but he's still doing it, he's still doing it, like you say, in a warm way, and there's no not welcoming feeling at all in that kind of sense. And if I could hit trio with all three, it could be in any sports, but especially BJJ, I would feel like I won.

SPEAKER_03 11:45

Absolutely, and it's amazing to see so many different types of people at the same time, because even though in the outside world you wouldn't necessarily spend any time with them while you're in that gym, in that situation, it feels so much closer and intimate to hang out with them at the same time.

SPEAKER_02 12:04

That's a little funny thing because I have been doing a lot of Muay Chai training.

SPEAKER_03 12:08

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 12:09

And many years different places, and I had the first one with me at the gym when I was doing it, so he was like running around, punching bags, and you know, having fun.

SPEAKER_01 12:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:22

So so he's kind of familiar with that environment a little bit. And at that time, it was of course a Muay Thai I would like to promote, but I think many parents, including my own, is making the mistake to either wait until they ask their kids, do you want to try this? instead of just pushing them out to try it. Not forcing in any way, but making them curious about it. Exactly, in a good way. And that also comes with the other thing, which is if you do it, you are halfway there. Yes. I believe. Yes.

SPEAKER_03 13:02

Yes, and I think this is a very good bridge to our next topic of this discussion, which is the pressure about these hobbies and sports that we want our kids to do versus what they actually want to do, because sometimes they might not align at all. Because of course I have been thinking already that what if my son doesn't want to do martial arts at all? For example, if they want to play violin, piano, play soccer, ice hockey, or some other sport, and of course I need to be the person who is encouraging them, encouraged encouraging them to move along with their passion, with their hobbies as well at the same time. Because if I become very cynical and you know selfish, yeah, small minded, etc., that's not gonna do any good for them either. Absolutely, or yourself for that matter. Yes.

SPEAKER_02 13:56

I also think that this correlates a little bit to the what we're gonna talk about in the next episode, like how we implement how we implement values in our family and in our kids, and those two kind of go hand in hand together, because I think if you early on is able to implement some really strong values and habits, these will also be a part of pushing them, like you say, curio making it cu making them curious on on the thing in a good way, because there's definitely bad ways you can do it, and there's definitely also smart and better ways to do it.

SPEAKER_03 14:30

Definitely, and of course it all comes to the encouragement versus expectations at the same time, because like we have been talking now, like we're setting these sort of expectations.

SPEAKER_02 14:43

Yeah, that's true, and the expectation and encouragement is a huge part of them to find it fun and find find the interest and find the motivation to it in in the whole picture of doing any kind of new thing. It doesn't only correlate or relate to sports. Yeah. But also the social expectations, not just from you as a dad, towards other families or other people with kids, but also with schools and with everything. I remember a certain situation where I was traveling and we were at this really nice beach bar in a very warm place. We were sitting down and I meet some um very interesting people, a real estater, and she was very friendly, warm. And you know, we were there. My wife was at the hotel with the kids, yeah, unfortunately for her, and I was there with my my dad-in-law having a beer and talking, and they were kind of some somewhat the next table, and we got into a conversation, and she was like asking about our kids and stuff like that, because she was asked by another expat about schools and where the best schools was, and she was interested where I was from, what my take on it was, and I could hear just from the other parents she had been talking with that they had some unrealistic high expectations for their kids on a school level of when they were learning, how fast they were learning, and I was kind of getting sick on their behalf because it was like you are not at all present with your kids in the situation and figuring out what they actually like. You are 100%, as we just talked about on your own journey, what you want for your kid, and you are just pushing it down around their heads.

SPEAKER_03 16:33

Exactly. You try to perform through them almost as a parent, and that's terrible because you try to mold something that cannot be mold necessarily.

SPEAKER_02 16:43

Absolutely, absolutely, and of course there is situations where parents definitely know best. Yes. I mean, they have a lot more data on life and all these things, and they have been through a lot themselves, but we just need to be very realistic that both the world is turning at a speed it never done before, not just not just like around, but more with the development and like we talked about in the previous episode also, like we have everything convenient at our doorstep within five minutes, ten minutes, yeah, almost everywhere, or otherwise we can get it like the day after. We just have to remember like when I was young, and that is what twenty years ago, and teen, you know, we had to call on a landline to ask if somebody could play. If we were lucky it was the same day. If we're not, it was like uh we we agreed on a day uh two, three next week, you know. So it was not as available as things are today, and I think a lot this is also for another episode, but a lot with how available screens, phones, all these things are today, by pushing them, we make the same mistake as we do as men, especially where we redrawn uh from our normal habits, our normal joy and our normal um vibration level to deep, deep I would almost say um I would almost say we we start digging our own hole to hide in. And it it can be through social media, it can be through TV episodes, it can be through online whatever, it can just be without anything. But by putting that pressure on on small beings, especially when we're talking zero to ten and also maybe twelve before the teens, they are not ready and they should be encouraged to do what they feel is right with our boundaries and our values and our um skill set that can uh that can make them on their journey take the right choices or the more right choices than we were able to with the skill set we were presented with.

SPEAKER_03 18:59

Of course, and also it matters a lot how we react to these things like when things are going as we expected versus when they are not. Because if, for example, we set expectations sports or hobby-wise for our kids and they want to do something completely different, if we're the ones who are, you know, really shouting at them and being very angry regarding it, it it teaches them a wrong lesson compared like if we're open-minded and encouraged encouraging them to try something else instead.

SPEAKER_02 19:33

I actually have a very funny story about this where I caught myself. We were out, I think, at a playground somewhere. Yeah there was a lot of people and a lot of kids, and I caught myself being extraordinary after my own kids for either playing nice or not, you know, uh too much. And I was like at some point realizing like what the fuck are you what are you doing? Like you're you're standing here and interrupting their totally own curious way of exploring the world with frames that is not necessary at all. And that was maybe a little bit back to other people's expectations and your own social expectations, which were like, oh no, yeah, my my kids should not be the one that fuck up, you know, or do something bad. So I'm here to make sure that not happened, and I was laughing so bad at myself, stressing about so uptight things. Exactly, exactly. But that was probably saying more about me being uptight and then anything.

SPEAKER_03 20:40

So it was most likely. Most likely, but like after that situation, like did you just be quiet about it or did you talk about it with your kids, for example?

SPEAKER_02 20:50

I would say that I didn't have a long talk with them. Sometimes I have a talk with them where I try to navigate a little where they feel I am.

SPEAKER_03 20:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:59

And I asked them frankly uh straight up, what do you think is the best part with daddy? What do you think is the bad part with daddy?

SPEAKER_03 21:06

That's very good reflecting as well, because even though like my son is not old enough to help me with this thing, I try to do a very similar thing with my wife as well. Like I try to ask, like, okay, when I'm with our son, like what are the good things, what are the things that should be better, etc. And it it gives out a lot.

SPEAKER_02 21:26

Absolutely. And I also have my wife, she's more automatically coming. I'm not having those talks too often, but she coming automatically and tell me if she feels like something is up, something is down. I remember a certain situation where she said that she needed me um because the boys wasn't listening at all. And we actually had a really funny day and we had a sit down where I talked to them and I said something in the lines of boys, listen, this is really important. When I'm not there, you guys You're the only men that is here. Yeah. And if you're not listening to mommy, get really sad and obsessed, and then she sh shout, then she gets angry because she cannot be there without daddy's help. When you are there and you're running around, you're fighting and stuff like this. Something around that. And we ended up in they were actually both agreeing to help mommy in these situations and listen more and it helped.

SPEAKER_03 22:30

Yeah, and I think this is a very good example, like how it changes like when you're actually being the one who leads the situation versus when you're the one who actually follows what's happening. Because in here you really set the example for them, like what might happen if you don't act this way, and what could happen if you do that way, and then you took the step back.

SPEAKER_02 22:50

I would say I I just to not sound too holy ass up here, because this is something come from many years of reflecting and many years of trying different things. I also have situations I remember with the oldest one where I was in a much more unstable mindset about being a dad, about everything where he didn't want to shower, and I consequently just took him with all his clothes screaming, and I went in with my clothes and I just turned on and then we were showering. And I reflected back on that situation, and I was thinking like that could possibly have caused him a little trauma. It might be. In the shower, we ended up showering and having a good time.

SPEAKER_03 23:37

And then I would say But if it ended up like having a good time, I don't think it's that bad in a sense. I d I hope not.

SPEAKER_02 23:43

But yeah, you get better and you try to reflect about these things. But my point being was that coming to this point, I find it very interesting and very funny to do these reflections and take it as a task and an assignment to, yeah, man, this is a particular hard situation. How can I take lead on this one, like you said? Yes. And how can we do it in the best, funniest, most engaging way for them?

SPEAKER_03 24:10

Exactly. And of course, we live life like we remember things and forget them pretty easily. So if we're able to remember these things and journal it, like really write it down so we're able to relive or revisit that moment later on in much easier way, it helps so much more.

SPEAKER_02 24:27

I was like, if you guys listening haven't tried journaling yet, and I'm not talking about the old school journal where you sit down every day, write two pages, and every part of the day has to be reflected on. I'm talking about taking five minutes out of your day, either in the morning or in the evening. But usually it helps better in the evening because you can reflect better, like you say, when you write it down. Take five minutes, just set the clock or something like that, and write down what you think went well and what you think went less well. Yeah, just a couple of bullet points. You don't need to write the diary. Exactly. And you have the whole night to reflect over it. And when you wake up in the morning, usually when I do it in periods, I do it very often. Sometimes I do it more rarely. I could do it on my phone, in books, uh like a notebook or on my computer or something like that. Sometimes I do it actually on my work computer because the last five minutes of the day when we get off, then I take five minutes to just write.

SPEAKER_03 25:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:21

And then I go home. But many mornings I wake up with many clarities about the lesser good things I did. Because I kind of use the night and the subconscious to reflect on it. Yeah. And I wake up with an answer, I wake up with a better way. And it all starts with just doing it, and then you will find yourself reflecting over these things more and more and be able to take your thing, take yourself in the neck earlier and earlier in these situations. And that is so much a pointer that you are starting and you are getting in the right direction and you get better and better just a little bit every day.

SPEAKER_03 26:00

Exactly. And of course, along the way, you learn to embrace the effort as well at the same time regarding that. And after that, it's so much easier to reflect that same thing to your kids as well, because when they are putting effort to some things and you're embracing that one, it teaches them that it's about the journey, not the goal always. Even though it sounds such a cliche, but it means a lot for them.

SPEAKER_02 26:23

Agreed. Well, it's not always just about taking the lead, is it? No, definitely not. I mean, there's the whole other side where you actually need to follow also your kids. And in those situations, I would say we had an earlier talk in the earlier episodes about the whole dad thing coming down to your own dad in the middle of the night. And I remember you saying you need to have those moments also. That sat right really deep with me. Last night, actually, my oldest one, he came down around I think it was 10, 10, 11-ish. And I was sitting wrapping it up, just to walk the dog, and he came down and he was just like, I asked him, like, oh, you wanted me to come and sleep with you? And he was like, Nope. And he just lied up with me next in the sofa, completely awake, and we were just, you know, I was curling his hair a little bit, and we were talking about what he did today, and he was still a little groggy because he sleep. And then we just watched the aquarium a little bit, and then we went up and then we slept. But I had that story we were talking about in my mind, and I hold it in that moment. Yes. And I believe, at least myself, that we created one of those those little moments.

SPEAKER_03 27:39

I think so. I think that became one of the core memories as well regarding the childhood. I really hope so as well. But it sounds sounds super nice. Yeah, that was that was quite funny. Yes. And I can also think about like a couple of nights before and today actually, I went back home and my son wasn't there. He was visiting his grandparents, and I was thinking about that. It would have been so nice to come home tired after a long day and really just cuddle my own son and really like tell him how much I love him as as well at the same time.

SPEAKER_02 28:15

It can give so much energy and so warmth. Yes. Just to hold your kid like or they are right next to you, lying on top of you, and like rolling around you. Exactly. It it it gives a meaning and a comfort that uh rarely is found other places. Yes, the presence is so common. Exactly. Exactly. And I also think many of the things we do with the kids, especially when we're parenting, and it's coming from in encouraging and celebrating the effort, not the outcome. Where we are living in a world today where everybody is celebrating the outcome. You're so good, you can walk, you're so good.

SPEAKER_03 28:57

Yeah, you did this, that's amazing, you achieved that, that's even better, you know. Exactly. It teaches the wrong things.

SPEAKER_02 29:04

Exactly. It teaches them that the outcome is more important, and when it gets hard, you get frustrated.

SPEAKER_03 29:10

Exactly.

SPEAKER_02 29:11

Rarely we're addressing that frustration and labeling and teaching them how we are getting rid of the frustration.

SPEAKER_03 29:18

Yes, and of course, like if we teach these type of lessons later on, like when they actually need to learn it, it's all about like their internal validation and not the external validation. It becomes so much harder to relearn the whole shit.

SPEAKER_02 29:34

I think we can sum that up in parenting is not supposed to be making a clone of yourself. It's much more about discovering who your kids are.

SPEAKER_03 29:47

I agree on that one. And of course, like whether it's sports or arts, it's never really about the field or the stage. It's about seeing our kids for who they are.

SPEAKER_02 29:57

And I mean, as dads, it's so easy to fall into the trap of chasing both our own unfinished stories through our kids, but also their journey isn't our sequence. It's their debut for everything is new. And I think we kind of reflect in that in a way where we relive some of our own curiosities and some of our own, I would say almost we've been missing it in some kind of way, and when we're getting it back, it it get a hold of us that we uh have a tiny chance to live a little bit through them. Yes. And if we subcumb to that side, we very quickly get demanding, we want to absolutely be the decider of everything they do and how they do it, and that is a very uh evil state and loop to be trapped in.

SPEAKER_03 30:49

Exactly. It's like a small devil nagging on your ear, dude, you should relive this moment, you miss this so much, don't you? It's terrible.

SPEAKER_02 30:57

Look at what the other are doing right now, exactly.

SPEAKER_03 31:00

Exactly, and of course the goal isn't to raise mini me's like we talked previously, it's to race confident, curious human beings who know their dad is proud no matter what they love. And that's the real trophy.

SPEAKER_02 31:14

I'm just saying, ballet is a no-go for the boys. Just kidding. That is the real trophy, absolutely absolutely right. Okay, so guys, this was kind of it for today. And I would say thank you for listening again. If you have any stories out there you're sitting with that correlate to what we've been talking about, something totally new, funny, or instead, we'll be happy to receive these messages and we will be happy to review them in later episodes. Also, next episode is gonna be very easy.