I Love Mondays-Ep 45, May 1, 2026

Back from a vacation and calling out the "fake outrage" radio crowd on the Badgers NFL Draft failures. WHAT? ... we needed that to confirm what we already knew?  Colten Bartholomew of the Wisconsin State Journal shared what's to like, and what to worry about after Spring Football at The UW.  Why the Brewers story so far is impressive...and the Packers are still a SB contender.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

I love Mondays with Mike Heller.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

Broadcasting live from an undisclosed bunker in the Badger State. This is I Love Mondays with Mike Heller. Powered by determination and a little bit of duct tape. Here's your host, Mike Heller.

SPEAKER_03 0:27

So this is what it feels like to be back in the chair. You know what? I left my microphone down just for a second and a half just to make Jeff Vilker feel better. Treadmill, uh, great thank you, great appreciation for you sitting in the chair while I was gone. So I am back. I would uh say Guten Morgen, which is German for good morning. Uh, but it's in Germany, it's in Frankfurt, which is where we kind of staged out of. It's uh it's five in the afternoon. I only joined one day, the very first day. I thought I might sit on top of the, you know, the top deck of the river boat on the Emma Prima and uh and join in more often, but once was once was enough. I had fun doing that. Matt LePay was on the other side. That was good. Uh the rest of the days, we we had a we had a whale of a trip. We had a fantastic trip. I'm so lucky uh that we have been blessed with the opportunity to do those things. That was a red and white wine and bourbon bar trip. So there were 20 of us on the trip, if you include Kari and I. There are 148 people on the boat. Uh Ammo Waterways is the company that we went through on the boat, and Travel Leaders Wisconsin was uh who put the trip together for us. It was fantastic in all rights. I mean, it was uh our weather was something you can't control, and it was beautiful, and all of it was good. Uh thank you uh from James. Welcome back. I feel good about it. Uh look at now, this guy is actually still there, Guten Morg from Switzerland. He is um, that's my buddy Craig. He and his uh lovely wife Diana and a few others uh stayed a little bit longer. They're at Lake Lucerne, I believe, in Switzerland. We flew out of Switzerland uh to come back. We flew out uh a couple of days ago. Um it's a long anybody's done it. We haven't done it before. Anybody that's done it, it's a long ass travel day. Uh, but I I think it's been easier on the jet lag and the time difference coming back than it was going. I thought going was harder. And coming back, I can I can power through wanting to go to sleep at six o'clock at night because it's six o'clock, it's one in the morning uh on our body clock for the last nine days. But um, yeah. So it was it was so cool and loved all of it and hadn't done it before. And there are places I want to go back to. Uh the river cruise concept has its place. I loved it. It's you know, it's a floating hotel. You you don't have to unpack and repack. And so that part was really cool. They took incredible care of us. The food was fantastic. Um, I liked Germany a lot. I didn't use the word love. There were certain parts of it that I loved. I would go back and do it differently. I would go to places that we didn't go. I'd spend more time in France and southern France for wine or Italy for wine. So you're talking about Florence or the south of France, where the Bordeaux region. Uh, now I'm getting a little bougie on the wine side of things, but that part we didn't have as much of. Drank some really good beer, saw amazing cathedrals and castles, and the history there is, you know, my goodness, it is so spectacular. Uh, Spencer, no, and good morning. And Spencer making, you know, shoot, they made the television broadcast on the Brewers TV network the other day. On the flannel day, they were all wearing flannel, centered by uh my guy Spencer, who's everywhere. And no, I I didn't get the Friday memo. Uh, James is gonna miss us next week uh for his wife's fifth retirement tour, uh, a tour of the Caribbean. That's awesome. That's it's really cool. Wish I can't even say I wish I was going because I d I do, but I just got back. I miss this when I don't get to do it. It's part of the reason why this show is called I Love Mondays, because I love every day I get to do this. And I've gotten to do it for 25 years in the talk format, and for an additional 11 in-ish in television, a little golf mixed in between. It I've I've had I have a blast doing this, and I missed it. So I'm so happy to be back in the chair. But I have great appreciation for treadmill, what Jeff did sitting in the chair. He's not a media guy. This is not his gig. He doesn't have this as his background. And most days, not every day, I'm not gonna lie, most days I tuned in for a portion just to see that it was up and running and what jersey he was wearing. I don't have jersey. I do have logoed quarter zips, you know, a lot of UW, a lot of packers, uh, you know, free stuff typically. Although this I think I paid for. Um, but I miss it when I don't get to do it. So I'm so happy to be back and back in the chair. Uh, and I appreciate uh Treadmill and Cordy Corning. They did a great job. Ceci filling in, you know, as he jumps in on Super Fan Tuesdays. Um Chris Gilmartin joining uh Treadmill the other day. I have a background with him. He was at the UW as a student manager with a basketball team when I was working at Channel 15. And uh that that's really cool to see him do such great things and Treadmill having him back on. Uh Vinny Rettino, who I just chatted with uh this morning about the Brewer situation a little bit, uh him jumping in and doing it on days that he had games, which isn't always easy to do. Uh so and he makes it easy, and Trev Mill would send me a note that Vinny is just the greatest, and he is. And uh Matt LePay jumping in, all that stuff. I have a great appreciation uh for people that made it easy enough for me to step away. This is a trip that we had planned. Um, you know, like I said, we did it with uh red and white wine and bourbon bar that we have traveled with now for three straight late Aprils into early May. In fact, the last two years we were gone on Kentucky Derby Saturday, which is tomorrow. We were in uh Napa Sonoma one year and in Paso Robles, California, both wine country, uh North, you know, Napa Sonoma is very famous. Paso Robles is more central coast, south and east of San Francisco, but gorgeous. And now this year we were uh obviously overseas on that uh river cruise. Next year, we'll we'll send out notes on this when we get closer, but let me cover this ground too. Next year, I think, I think initially we were gonna go to Willamette Valley in Oregon, and we might still. Uh, but we're kind of getting a little pull to go to Court d'Alaine, Idaho, Great Wine Region there, and split the trip between there and Eastern Washington State, Walla Walla, Washington, that area known for great cabernets uh in both places. So we're thinking about it. Uh, we've got some time to figure it out. And oh, by the way, let me just throw this out there before I get too far down the road. I should have a bourbon prepared for me. Uh, I don't, hey, uh treadmill in. Uh happy to have you back in the chair. And yes, I'm gonna uh broker that horse rematch with Gilly. It's on, so possibly yeah, he's gonna get Gilly. I think he's gonna lose, um, but nonetheless. So we have a bourbon trip coming up July 8th through the 12th. Now, I've sent I sent this out the last time. You can email us at red and white 331 at gmail.com. Might be the easiest. You can always email Hellerpods, uh, which is our email address on our podcast. Hellerpods, the number two, Hellerpods number two at gmail.com. You can do that, or you can uh or you can send it to directly to red and white. We have maybe six spots left right now. We'll have to update. And we're going to uh Louisville, Kentucky, but we're gonna stop at the Hard Truth in southern Indiana, Nashville, Indiana, before we get to Louisville. Then we'll stay in Louisville. Um, and this is uh Wednesday to Sunday, July 8th through the 12th. And on that Thursday, we're gonna go to Frankfurt, Kentucky, not Germany, I was just there, and we're gonna go to Buffalo Trace in the morning and Woodford in the afternoon. On Friday, we're gonna go to Bardstown, Preservation in the morning, Heaven Hill in the afternoon, and on Saturday, we'll go to Michter's, which is in Louisville. And we have about six spots left. Uh, round trip motor coach from Wanaki. We can make arrangements, but yeah, from Wanakee, going to Louisville, staying in downtown Louisville, beautiful hotel called the Bourbon. Uh, it's a block away from Whiskey Row in Louisville. It's got a rooftop bar, uh, great bourbons. You can walk to and from wherever you're gonna bourbon it up that night, uh, and great restaurants. So all of that going on July 8th through the 12th. Again, like six spots left. 24 is our max. Uh, because places won't take us for tastings if we go more than 24. In fact, at 24, it's a little hard at times for them to accommodate and do it the right way. All right. Anyway, I've got stuff I needed to get to and say. So let me do this before, and I'll set up the show, tell you about sponsors, all that good stuff. Colton Bartholomew uh with the Wisconsin State Journal will join us here in what about four or five minutes? Badger Football Spring Practice has been put to bed. That's where I'm gonna begin. Uh, and I'll do this now with the fake outrage that some of the daily talkers go to. Because I listen even when I'm away, or when I got back and I saw some of the tweets and video tweets and the thumbnails they pull off their shows, which is clickbait. It's what it's supposed to do. We do it too. Uh, you'll take a little small portion of the show and run it out there as a video trying to entice people to click the link and watch or listen to the show andor subscribe. So I get it. I understand the underwirings of what's going on. But shoot, the fake outrage over Wisconsin football, not having a player drafted into the National Football League again. It's fake outrage. It's real in the grand scheme of things. But okay. This is where I get into camera two here. Um the outrage now on that is bullshit. Now it's just, I mean, it's just clickbait, it's just fake rage. Now you're gonna be super upset. That this is an all-time program low. What are you talking about? Seven and six, five and seven, four and eight, that's the program low. I don't give a damn if they didn't have somebody drafted. One is emblematic of the other. But to pound the table right now because they didn't have a player drafted is just stupid clickbait. Really, honestly. I'd say it to the to the person who is out there doing it as well, because I but but I understand it, but it's silly. We know, we've known the badger football has an issue. I think they have moved in a direction to correct the problem. They did it too late, but that is not a coaching issue. That was an administrative issue, and the administrator is left to go work at the Big Ten. That part was on, that lays at his desk. You want to have outrage that Wisconsin football didn't have a draft, didn't have a player drafted into the NFL, by the way. Badgers have not had any players now selected in the first three rounds since 2023. The fact that they didn't have a player drafted at all, Badgers, no drafted players for the first time since 1978. I get it. But the outrage, we all had it when they finished the season last year and the year before. But I live in the now. And the now is I think that they're doing the right things to move forward in a direction that corrects these problems. To me, that's what I want to focus in on. I'm sorry, I'm just gonna look at my phone quick because I want to make sure that I did uh sent out my um my invite properly to Colton. I did. It should be good. Um, so I wanted to get in on that. I'm not not outraged that they didn't have a draft choice or haven't had a first three rounds draft choice since 2023. I'm not not outraged, but now's not the time. They didn't reach an all-time program low on Saturday when the draft finished by not having a player selected. Their program low was 1989. Now they're treading on that thin ice, but I think they've made the moves to not repeat what they had to go through then when Barry came in. But but they better have. But that outrage was fake now. That was just clickbait stuff. Uh Brewers treading water impressively without Cherio Vaughn Priester throughout so far this year and without Yelits recently, now maybe without Brandon Woodruff. Uh, but the Brewers at 16 and 14 is super effing impressive. Honestly, that's a super impressive number. Let me give you a couple of stats on the Brewers. Um, we're I like OPS. It's a pretty good measure. It does skew towards extra base hits and power, but that's kind of how the game works a little bit. Uh, the average OPS right now in Major League Baseball, average, is 715. That's the average OPS of their available rostered outfielders. Garrett Mitchell's OPS is 770. Pretty good. You know, significantly above average. 800 starts to get you into all-star territory. Uh South Freelate's at 645, buoyed uh by a home run yesterday and a couple home runs in the series, but they all count. He's at 645. That's, you know, that's 70 points below average. Brandon Lockeridge, 643. That is uh 68 points below the league average. Uh Matos is at 438, too many points to calculate below the league average. Blake Perkins, 429, and Greg Jones, 190. Greg Jones was kind of my poster child, as I tweeted out yesterday, that uh maybe the most frustrating non, maybe the most frustrating roster characteristic of the Brewers is that outfield group. And I get it, Yelitch can play outfield, and he's hurt. Churio hasn't had an at bat this year. So I get all that. But that should be better. Honestly, there are very few answers. I looked at Luis Lara, who's 21 years old, 108 at bats so far this year at AAA, hitting 324, 416 um and 519 slash line. So a triple A OPS of 935, a gold glove winner a year ago in the minor leagues. Not on the 40-man roster. That's a problem. And the Churio comes back on Monday, and so does uh Andrew Vaughan, probably on Monday. So when that happens, Vaughn and Bowers will go into a platoon at first. Uh Jake can play some left field. When Yelits comes back, hopefully sooner. Don't know how long that's gonna be. But when those two players come back, then Churio's in your outfield every day, and your outfield on a normal, everyday basis is Churio and left, Mitchell in center, and Freelick and right. Lockeridge and Blake Perkins would be four and five in the outfield. Luis Lara needs at bats. He needs to get plate appearances. So it doesn't bug me that he's not up, but it is hard to watch. When you're watching, when you're watching Greg Jones, who is now hitting below 100, he's two for 21. What is that, 098? Whatever it is. It's low. And an OPS of 190. Those are pitchers' numbers when pitchers used to hit. Back when pitchers used to hit, people people argued the pitchers should keep hitting. Well, Greg Jones would be a good argument for that, but that's kind of silly. Well, I think we all kind of get that, don't we? Let me tell you a little bit before I welcome in uh Colton to the program. I have to get used to uh to read doing this stuff now. It's been nine days. So uh let me do this. Tell you about our sponsors, one community bank where clients are the number one priority. Feel good banking, presented by one community bank. Visit them at onecommunity.bank, onecommunity.bank to upgrade to feel good banking. I appreciate their support of the show. Also, presented by M3 Insurance, where you get it all. Personal guidance you need to protect and grow your business and a team that provides tailor insurance and risk management. Go to m3ins.com. Brought to you and presented by Neuroscience Group Excellence in Brain, Spine, and Pain Care. Choose Neuroscience Group in Northeast Wisconsin or anywhere you are. It's not too far to go to get the relief you need, neurosciencegroup.com. And also presented by our friends at Pottawatomies Sportsbook, Bet Above the Rest, and by Habish, Habish and Rotier. 13 locations to ensure you get a hometown attorney who understands your life and the impacts of your injury and is personally committed to your recovery. Those are our beautiful sponsors. And I appreciate them being part of the show. Hope you support them as uh you're a listener to the show because that matters. I bring in Colton Bartholomew, who's uh who's uh kind enough to join me as on my first day back from a little vacay. Colton, I I think you can see and hear me. You good? How are you? I'm great. Thanks, Mike. Thanks for the trip in doing this. Oh, the trip was great. I have never been to Europe. Yeah, so going going to Germany, France, Luxembourg, finishing in Switzerland. It was really cool. Uh and but even when I'm even doing something like that, which is so much fun, I miss this. Um, so I'm I'm happy to be back. Now I kind of opened on you were before you logged in, so I don't know if you were watching or listening, but there was um what I would call fake outrage by some people and a little clickbaity on you know, program reaching an all-time low by not having a player drafted uh for the first time in 47 years by going three straight years without a player taken in the first three rounds. But if you're reacting to that right now, I think I just got off a boat, but I think they you would have missed a boat by reacting to that now. I mean, the reaction should be about what they didn't do the last three years from a player retainment and procurement standpoint. And Colton, the kind of the view outside looking in is that they've endeavored to fix that now. Well, we're gonna find out starting in September if that has worked uh on what they do this year. But to have the outrage because they didn't have a player drafted, did we think they were?

SPEAKER_01 20:47

I mean, where was that? I I think the only real surprise in my book was Meissen Ryger not getting a pick, but he's also got a medical history that I'm sure if you're a draft or a team that's late in the draft, you're just saying I'd rather have a cost-controlled player that I'm not really worried about his knee blowing out in two weeks of training camp. So I I understand it to a degree. I think it's you mentioned the retainment and the procurement part. There's a development piece that's been slipping, and this is before the fickle era that's been dropping down in this program. That you know, that's really got to change for this program to actually compete because whatever amount of money they were able to secure here in this offseason, whether that can be matched again, exceeded again is a question mark. And then more importantly, you're still, even with the amount that they spent this year, they're still not gonna be in the top tier of the Big Ten in terms of what they're spending on the roster and their ability to recruit at the you know four and five star level year in, year out. It's always going to be fluctuating depending on how many four stars are in Wisconsin, how many guys can they you know realistically bring in. So I think that the development piece is something that has to get kind of ramped back up because that was really this program's secret sauce for a long time. And I understand the dynamics have changed where you're not gonna be able to keep guys for four. Years all the time, like that's just not a reality of college sports anymore. But at the same time, like in the two maybe three years you do keep a player, they've got to make leaps and bounds from whatever the state that they came in at, whether they're a transfer or high school player. So that would be to your point, like get mad that the result didn't happen, sure, but like the steps are what you really should be mad about.

SPEAKER_03 22:21

Yeah, and it would it would appear, we'll get a little bit into recruiting, not deep water recruiting, but it it appears that they're also addressing that in-state, the 27 class, the class that comes in next year, which um really impressive uh at its face value. Let me ask you about what we learned this year in the spring. And it would be I would be remiss if I didn't start at the quarterback position, but not just with Colton Joseph, but with the depth at the quarterback room, because one of the big issues on this program the last three years is the quarterback they brought in got hurt and they were ill-equipped at the backup of the quarterback in depth to manage that on paper and through spring. What did you see from the quarterback starter and the depth of the quarterback room?

SPEAKER_01 23:09

Yeah, I'll start with Joseph just because you know it's gonna take a miracle/slash an injury for him not to be the starter, just given what they've invested in him. But my thing with Joseph early on was there was a lot of mechanical stuff that just seemed like he wasn't finishing throws, everything was high, and everything a lot of stuff was off his back foot that didn't need to be. Like sometimes you've got to when you're under pressure and whatnot, but there were a lot of things that just weren't sound. And then when they had that break between the first four practices and spring break, it seemed like he came back and that was a little bit of a reset. He talked about getting with some of his throwing coaches from back home, and at least he's getting a little bit away from football, maybe not throwing every day. Uh, and it seemed like he came back from spring break a lot more in tune with his body and a lot more in tune with his throwing mechanics because there was just a steady improvement from that point on, and the overall comfort in the offense seemed to improve as well. We heard from Luke Fickel and a lot of other coaches and players about his confidence in terms of how he deals with people in the huddle, how he dealt with people throughout the program. You can just see him getting a little more comfortable in his new school and new location here in Madison. So I think there's a lot of signs that it's like, okay, what we maybe saw early on isn't what he's going to be. And the thing that we saw late in spring was this is a guy that's going to extend plays with his feet, maybe a little too often, but at the same time, like that's such a different thing than Wisconsin's been able to have in the last three years from the quarterback. That ability to create plays or just avoid negative plays is going to be massive for this offense. And we've seen through how they call plays and what plays they call, the quarterback run game is going to be huge in this offense. So Colton Joseph's skills are going to be really utilized throughout this whole scheme. And to your point about the backups and how this room is a lot just deeper and better than it has been, they don't have a complete shift in how the quarterback or how the offense has to play if Colton Joseph weren't able to go. Each quarterback they have right now is mobile and is a guy that can be trusted to run the ball. So there's a lot more alignment there. And that gets to the uh really ascension of Ryan Hopkins, the freshman. You know, I'm I'm a guy that when it comes to any freshman in spring, I am hold the brakes, don't really talk about it like unless it happens day after day after day. And Hopkins was probably on offense the guy that surprised me the most in spring. And the way that Kenny Guyton, the quarterback coach, talked about him was about as effusive in praise as I've heard any coach here talk about any freshman. Just the way that he came in and immediately got with players, leads players, understands the playbook and what his role is, and just the throws. Like this is a guy that's as talented of the quarterback as they've brought in in a long time. I mean, I would say, in terms of just overall physical talent, he's on that grand merz level where there's a reason that late in his recruitment, other schools like UCLA, USC were giving him real looks. His hometown teams, he's a Southern California guy, and you know, he was getting some looks that had he not already been committed, I wonder just what that overall recruiting profile might have looked like. But his his improvement and his seemingly being ready to be the quarterback, too, along with the fact that you've got Deuce Hopkins from the Louisville transfer, who you know, the the complaints on him are that we need him to run more. He's a guy that wants to win from the pocket, which historically is probably the better way to go or more sustainable way to play quarterback. But I think the fact that they've got three guys that they could feel comfortable throwing out there, maybe not snap one against Notre Dame, but sometime in the season is a much better spot than they've been at the quarterback spot.

SPEAKER_03 26:38

You you wrote uh a couple of uh pieces at Badger Extra uh that talk about what you like the most. So let's begin there and then we'll talk about the biggest questions going into summer, which is essentially your the the two storylines you wrote about. What did you like the most?

SPEAKER_01 26:54

I think the two things that jumped out to me most were the depth in the the talent of the secondary, because that entire that cornerback room and then uh a couple of safeties were all brought in through the transfer portal. And that's a spot that they've had to do that because they just haven't been able to retain players uh for very long at the corner spot. But that that group's depth and talent is just uh a significant step above. And there's a lot of talk about how they want to play more man coverage and they don't want to be so zone reliant and really have to back off to have a you know functioning pass defense, which you know last season was not a good, not a good year for the pass defense. Played a lot of elite quarterbacks, a lot of elite receivers, but you're gonna see those in the Big Ten. You've got to be ready for that. I think what they did and bringing in guys like Javon Robinson, Bryce West, you know, this the improvement of Jameer Scott, who was here last year, is going to make this cornerback group, especially five to six deep. And they haven't had that, at least in my time covering this team. Like you look at the last seven years, it's basically the top two corners are playing every snap. And there's a certain point where that becomes really tough. And I think they finally got it to a place where they don't have to rely on just two or three guys that can rotate a little bit and get some talent on the field that they might not have been able to before. And then on in the back end, Marvin Burks, the safety, the transfer from Missouri. I think this guy could have a four to five interception type season, a lot of pass breakups, because he's a guy that understands how to bait quarterbacks, but is also one of those dudes that you just don't throw at? You know, you just don't test because he's always in the right space and he's always, you know, got the athletic ability to move and get to the spot he needs to. So I think there's a lot of depth and talent in that secondary that is an elevation of where this program has been there in the past few years.

SPEAKER_03 28:40

Can Mason Posa and Cooper Catalano uh be take the next step from what was a very impressive back half of their freshman year because they didn't get enough playing time maybe early, but once they got it, they were difference makers. Can they make this next step and what around them gives the opportunity for that to happen?

SPEAKER_01 29:00

I think they can. And I think especially POSA, because I think the what they did in terms of bringing in additional talent at the inside linebacker spot, guys like John John Camara, uh Taylor Schaefer, uh the JUCO transfer, uh, had a really good second half of spring. I think he's really kind of pushed what coaches think of him in terms of being able to be a spot player there. But I think what they want to do with POSA is kind of make him a hybrid, you know, be our inside linebacker on first and second down, but then go be a pass rusher, go get make plays happen around a quarterback on third down. And you go back and look at the Washington game, uh, one of their you know most important wins of last season to kind of get some momentum going finally at some point uh in 2025. That was the the game plan against a really mobile quarterback that needed Mason Posa to be almost a spy/slash rusher. I think you're gonna see a lot of that this fall because you don't want to waste, and waste isn't a relative firm, but you don't want to have a guy like Mason Posa who's so you know destructive and so athletic to be you know sitting in zone as an inside linebacker, kind of being under trying to be underneath plays. You want him getting after a quarterback, and you can allow guys like Cooper Catalano, who's always in the right spot, or the other inside linebackers I mentioned to kind of fill in that other role. So I think those are the things that are gonna allow this, those two, Posa and Catalano, to be you know a step above what we saw last season. And then also like the fact that I think this defensive line and outside linebackers are kind of thrown in that mix with this defense is I think going to be able to match the performance of last year, where they were very solid throughout the year, had games where they looked elite, you know, especially late in the season, but I think they're not going to allow offensive lines to get up to them too often. So it's gonna be on uh Catalano and Postal a lot to have those 12, 13 tackle games that we saw late in the year.

SPEAKER_03 30:48

Talking with Colin Bartholomew at cbart WSJ on X and Twitter. The questions that remain in your mind heading into summer, and by the way, I'm just gonna throw this out there because some people don't fully understand this part of it. None of these questions get answered until you play somebody. Yeah, right, for sure. Not in camp, not even when they go to the you know the beginning of August. They'll get start to get answered on that Sunday night at Lambeau against Notre Dame. But nonetheless, questions remain. What are they right now?

SPEAKER_01 31:23

My big thing is for the offensive line, because especially at tackle, you've got Kevin Haywood, the the returner, he was hurt last year, but a guy that they've had a lot of high hopes for ever since that he got recruited and has all the physical talent that you need in the world and is just refining things more often than not. Uh, playing on the right side, and then on the left side, you have the old mistransfer, PJ Wilkins, and those guys had really solid camps. There was a few times you know they would get beat here and there, but when we're talking about 700 to 800 snaps when you're talking about a full spring, you're not going to go perfect. My problem or my question would be do they have anybody else that can play a swing tackle type of role? Because right now, their backup tackles were Michael Roski, who's you know a developing guy and a guy that still needs to put on weight because he's he came in as a thinner, taller guy and is still working on that. And then it was kind of a mixture of Lucas Simmons, the uh Florida State transfer, and then you know they never got to see Barrett Nelson because he was coming off of surgery. I just don't know what type of depth they have there. I think they've got some depth at the guard spots, especially with Emerson Mandel uh going out later in spring. We saw guys like Blake Cherry and Styles Blackman step up and then really take on those roles. But I just think that the depth on the outside, and then especially center, because they don't they have one center in the program right now that you can really trust to snap the ball and block at the same time. So it's uh it's a problem that has to be fixed, and it's been a multi-year problem that I'm not sure where the disconnect is in the program that hasn't been able to fix it. But uh those two spots, center and tackle, are the ones on walking into the summer and into the fall questions of where they can be when they get to the game.

SPEAKER_03 33:02

The carousel of offensive line coaches might have something to do with that, right? Have you kind of done that every year?

SPEAKER_01 33:08

For sure that, but then you've also guys got guys like Casey Robach who's been here for multi-years and played center at times, and like you you I don't think it's a teaching or coaching thing, I think it's just not being able to get anybody to stick there. And Ryan Corey, when he's just blocking, is a pretty solid offensive lineman. And it's not like he snaps every ball poorly, but there's just too many that it's really hard to trust. And you go back to last year, and it's the same thing. So uh the fact that there hasn't been a fix there is very surprising.

SPEAKER_03 33:36

What one of the other things about this program that doesn't get talked about enough is that for a very, very long time, they were a running back school. I mean, they the in the 2000s, you just think of Monte Ball and Melvin Gordon and Jonathan Taylor, James White. I mean, I mean, we all know it. I don't need to recant all of the the players that were at that position. Is Abu Sama, one of those Abu Sama, is he is can he be that guy? And how much of this is related, especially in this three-year run, of not having an offensive line that could road great some some defenses and allow for some space?

SPEAKER_01 34:18

Yeah, I'm gonna answer your second question first. I think it's uh an offensive line issue to start with because you talk about some of those gaps between those elite running backs, like you know, the PJ Hill year, he still had a great season when he was the main guy because they had an offensive line that was just mauling people. And the fact that that the offensive line has slipped, it's gonna affect everything, not just you know, their individual performances, it's gonna hurt the running game as well. But with Abu Sama, he's a guy that fits a lot of this wide zone scheme that Jeff Grime wants to run. I think they had to get away from him at times last year because they just couldn't block it. They were just better at going straight ahead, playing some traditional gap scheme uh offenses. But I think now when you got Sama and I'd say a little bit more athletic offensive line as a whole, I think you're gonna see some of the wide zone stuff that they want to do. And that's gonna look a little bit like 49er-ish to give an NFL comp where everybody's kind of moving in one direction as an offensive line and the running backs, and then it's on the running back to pick the hole and go at it. And the thing about Sama is you watch him at Iowa State, which where he played uh before coming here, the speed's there. Once he gets to the edge, he's a guy that can outrun secondary guys in the secondary very easily. The question that I think he's starting to answer here in spring and has got to continue to is how well he can do between the tackles. Yeah, because I think he had a tendency because he has that speed. This is kind of a typical thing, but because you have that speed to try to always use it and try to always get to the outside, and that just doesn't work when you're gonna be the lead guy for an offensive line in an offense. You've got to be able to run through the tackles and got to be able to make some plays there. And I think he showed in all their scrimmages on Saturdays that he's gonna have the power and he's gonna have the willingness to go run through some contact and make some things happen. And then, you know, if you break one tackle at that first level, then you get to that those explosive plays that were just completely absent last season. So I think he's gonna be a guy that could be in that level. And then the fact that you've got Brian Jackson and uh Darian Dupree to really kind of spell him at times and serve different purposes is gonna help him not have to be the only guy that's being relied on.

SPEAKER_03 36:25

Colton, let me ask you a uh Marcus Sedberry question. He he played a great role in this offseason, a much more impactful role. I think that was by design in the in the offseason. And on paper, it looked it has looked very good. Now he's switched over to be the interim AD and likely is a candidate. I don't know. I'm not gonna dive into how deep of a candidate he is or if he might be the guy. But what's that impact on the football program? And is it lesser because of where we are on the calendar?

SPEAKER_01 36:58

Yeah, it's a little bit lesser because there's no spring portal, and really the role of the GM here at this point, like your team is pretty much set. You might be looking at those next classes, like you're looking at the 27th class to try to get the at least the beginnings of the conversations about Rev Share and NIL and all that stuff started with the guys that are gonna be coming in in December. Uh, you're the GM is gonna be involved in your 28 recruiting as well. But I think the biggest thing for me is just it's another example, another layer of inconsistency and change that this program has to go through, specifically with football, not even just the athletic department, but football, where you know there's been, you know, you mentioned the carousel offensive line coaches and receiver coaches, and like there's so many levels to it where there hasn't been any consistency and ability to build together. And I think finally last season, the extra money is a big factor as well. But the fact that Marcus Sedbury had a plan, they as a whole department worked it together, made this plan, created this infrastructure. The fact that they only get to see it for basically one year because they're gonna be looking for a new GM pretty soon because we don't know how long Sedberry is gonna be the interim AD, or like you said, maybe he becomes the full AD. It's just tough for this program where it's always just like, all right, we got a plan and new new person comes in, we got to adjust to them, or you know, we got this other idea, and never mind, that's not gonna work. So I think overall, whatever move they make, whether maybe it's a shift somebody internal to go to their GM role and they kind of replace that underneath, or if they bring in somebody from the outside for the GM role, I think they've got to stick to whatever they did this offseason because obviously the extra money helped them get some of the top-tier guys, but their idea of you know attacking some of those guys that maybe were four to five-star recruits in high school that didn't start right away at their other schools, like that was something that I think they weren't able to afford or really tried to avoid at times in the last few years that I think is going to be their sick their path to success here in the Big Ten because you've got to just elevate your overall talent level and then hope your coaches and development plan gets them to reach their potential.

SPEAKER_03 39:06

Um, I this is probably a better question for the first week of September, but let's how would you define success in 2026 when they go to the calendar and we're talking about September, October, November? What would success look like?

SPEAKER_01 39:23

So I think there are two answers to that. I think anything above eight wins, so nine nine or above, I would say it would be an overall success without a doubt. I think if you're at that eight and four or seven and five level, you've got to talk about how those individual games went. Because if you're at that same level, eight and four, seven and five, and you're still getting blown out by Iowa, still losing to Minnesota, and not showing progress against those teams that are you know financially kind of in that same area you are, and you know, reputationally, you know, if you go and lose at Penn State, even though they're you know going through a coaching change and whatnot, that's not bad, as long as it's not like you know super lopsided. But if you're losing you know at home to you know, I think the couple they play at home this year, like Minnesota, or you're you know going on the road to Maryland, can't beat them again. Like that was really where the fire fickle stuff started last season, was when Maryland was running up the score in the first half against this team. So if if you're in that same spot where you're not beating or at least competing with those teams that are on your same level at this moment, then you've really got to question like a six and six or seven and five record, is that enough progress to continue with the Luke Fickle era? And I think you know, whether it's Sedbury or whoever the AD is, is really gonna have to look hard at how these individual games went and the the processes that got them there because you you just can't stay at this level that they're at and expect that it's going to get any better without making changes.

SPEAKER_03 40:48

Uh well, what I miss, uh, what do you got going on? Because now they they step away, right?

SPEAKER_01 40:52

So you know they lock in for some finals for a few weeks and they go home and they'll come back, you know, late May, early June for their summer program. But uh really it's it's tough because in spring we have all these practices that you know people love the practice reports and let them know what's going on there and how guys are progressing. Then we get all these interviews, and it's really our only time in the offseason to talk to some of the assistant coaches and some of the players. So for me, it's like this next week is getting all that stuff transcribed and decompressing, like, all right, what are some actual stories to tell? Because I didn't want to just completely fire hose here this month of April, and you know, people aren't gonna are gonna miss it. So we'll see some stuff that it came from interviews in the last few weeks coming up in the next few weeks here.

SPEAKER_03 41:35

Colton, I appreciate it. I I know it's uh it's it's a little bit of a grind, but it's a get-to job as well. The things that that you were just going through with along with uh everybody else on the reporting front. Uh, but I appreciate you jumping in here and sharing some of your insights and look forward to the next time we get to do it.

SPEAKER_01 41:52

Thanks, Mike. Appreciate it, John.

SPEAKER_03 41:54

Thanks, Colton. Colton Bartholomew, Wisconsin State Journal. You can see him uh on his Twitter account at CBart W SJ. Uh so I got I mean, listen, I I they practice at a time that I don't get to go down and see, and then we had some travel. So having um the eyes on it from and and being able to talk to Colton or to Jim Paul Zine or as we've done with Nick Osen, um with Nick Bruswitz. Having those eyes on it, Matt LePay. I mean, to me, those I'd rather have those guys come in and talk about the intricacies of what's going on than for me to just opine about the bigger picture stuff. So uh and while we were doing that, oh a really nice uh note on our YouTube feed uh from Christian uh who says the podcast is less viable than live golf, even the Saudis can't save you. Pitiful. Very nice. Love that. It's part of what I miss when I'm gone, Christian, is that I don't get those kind of fantastically warm-hearted kind messages. So keep them coming. Very nice of you to engage that way. And then, you know, you listen, you made the podcast. That was the goal, right? I mean the goal, Christian, was for me to talk about you for I don't know however long this is going to be, 35, 40 seconds, and you get your little 15 seconds of 45 seconds? That's the goal, right? You you got a little mention on a podcast that you think sucked so bad that Saudi's couldn't help it. It's it's akin to live, and yet here you are watching the damn thing. Come on, dude. I'd rather have you I'd rather have you uh put that in and have me read it than you say, well, I don't I don't even watch, I don't even listen. Because obviously you do. So thank you for your continued support. And appreciation of what we do on I Love Mondays. Very nice of you. Speaking of which, let me tell you about my sponsors. One community bank, proud to be associated with one community bank. Go and see them online, onecommunity.bank. Also with our friends at M3Insurance. Go to m3ins.com, sponsored and brought to you by Neuroscience Group. Go to neurosciencegroup.com and our friends at Pottawatomie Sportsbook, Bet Above the Rest, and Habish, Habish and Rotir, all a big part of what we do. Yeah, Christian, I I mean, again, you guys, I should put you guys in touch with one another. James wants to know why listen if you don't like the podcast. Yeah, I don't listen, James. I don't know the answer. I do know if you've ever if you ever paid any attention to Howard Stern. One of the famous lines in uh in the movie about his radio career was the people that don't like him listen longer than the people who do like him. You know, the program director was bitching that all these people don't like him. I don't intentionally ever go out to be disliked. I like being liked. But it doesn't, at its core, it doesn't bother me that somebody who I don't know, Christian, wants to send in a nasty note. I know what the what the reason is. He wants to get mentioned. And he did. I'm not afraid of that part of it. Sometimes those messages, if I'm gonna be fully transparent here, they don't feel good. Like I don't like that. But I also know that for me to just ignore it and let it eat at me a little bit, that's not healthy. So when somebody does that, whether it's on Twitter, you know, with a comment in that's that's nasty, or if it's here watching the YouTube feed and sending in a note, I won't ignore it. Typically, those will make the show. I mean, so far, everybody that sent in a message to the show, I've brought them into the show, including Christian. Now I wonder, I have to look it up, if this Christian is the same as the Christian that was affiliated with the dude who got after me about the Tiger Woods story, which I ended up being right about, but then took it and made it personal, that I then blocked on Twitter? Because you you can you can be critical of me and my opinions, but once you make it about my career or my whatever that is, I don't even know how exactly how to define that, but once you make it personal, then then I I don't love it. Like, was that personal? Even the Saudis can't save you, pitiful. Um, nah, whatever I think is kind of funny. That's why I put it up on the screen and mentioned it. All right. Uh, the other things I want to get to the Packers draft, because this happened while I was away. Um, six players selected. I think it's well directed. I don't play in the games of draft grades, program directors for years and years and years. So you've got to have strong opinions about the draft. Give it a number, give it a letter, give it whatever it is. Um, I think it's a good draft. How the hell do we know? You you don't know if it's a good draft until Brandon Cise is, you know, it turns into a lockdown cover corner, or he becomes your number two corner. Or if you can't get him on the field in nickel and dime packages, then you know it was bad. You got to play games in order to see it. Chris McClellan, the defensive tackle from Missouri. They needed that's a positional draft, but also a good selection, is what many people have said about it. Uh, Danny Dennis Sutton, the edge from Penn State. Jagger Burton, the center from Kentucky. Only one offensive player. So you want to talk about this, the six-player draft. It's a light draft for them. They like their offense. They didn't draft a skilled position player on the offensive side, a center. They needed offensive line help. Uh, then they go to another corner, so two corners, and then they traded up to get a kicker. Listen, everybody was bitching last year about the kicker. They don't often, they don't always work in the draft. Many times taking kicker in the draft ends up being somewhere else. Uh Carlson would be uh the most recent example of that. I don't know. I like that uh four of the six players were on defense, which should give Jonathan Gannon, the former Arizona Cardinals head coach, who replaced Jeff Halfley, should give him an opportunity. So I think that is good. Uh yesterday I was on uh a little bit of Twitter stuff as we were kind of trying to figure out how to recover from a uh 24-hour, 25-hour travel day coming home. Um one of the things that that caught my eye yesterday was uh a piece from Kay Adams, a little thumbnail, a little clickbait, I'm sure, at some level, talking about the Packers making a Super Bowl push. So Kay was in there talking about visiting her family in Appleton slash Greenville. And I took it to say, Well, what did I just learn here that Kay Adams is from Appleton, my hometown, Vilker's hometown, treadmill boy, Brian Butch's hometown? No, but she has a sister that lives there that she spends a lot of time with. So when she was talking about visiting her family in Appleton, that's so I misinterpreted a little bit. I think she's from Cicero, Illinois, and went to Missouri. Uh, but it reiterates the idea, concept that I believe in right now is that the Packers are a Super Bowl caliber team. They need to get a little lucky from a health standpoint on their offensive line. Zach Tom needs to return to health and he doesn't have to worry about it. Like that's what I see from a little bit on their offensive side. Tucker Kraft, I would imagine that Tucker Kraft and Micah Parsons are the type of personalities that have attacked their injury in a way that is uncommon. And I think that they'll return and be very good. I I love the opportunity for those guys to return without skipping a beat. But it's gonna be a little bit. Micah Parsons, I don't know what the timetable for him will be, but it'll be one of the stories in training camp in late July is where is the Micah Parsons timetable? And they're not gonna tell you. Rookie minicamp, the rookie camp going, uh, by the way, starting today in Green Bay, first uh camp practice for the rookies. It's going on. Small camp. I shouldn't say that. Small drafted camp. They they got a lot of players in there. Um, but I think it when Kay Adams was saying that yesterday, that I ran a video back out of on Twitter. Um, I do think that Green Bay is a Super Bowl caliber team. And they were 9-3-1 and leading by double digits in Denver in the third quarter at 9-3-1, which at the time was the second best record in the NFC. Now, it all went to hell in a handbasket after the injury in that game and the loss in that game, and the four straight losses to end the regular season, and a playoff loss in Chicago that is one of the most dramatic meltdowns that we've seen. Well, for me, the most dramatic since the 2014 NFC Championship game loss in Seattle. All of that's real, and you can't escape your history. You are what you've done. That's how you're defined by what you've done. And then there's the hope that you can do more or be better. And that's called, you know, the upside. Or what are you, what is that player, what is that group, what is that team capable of? But you are who you have been on the field. I think that Green Bay to that point, when the injuries finally took their the most destructive toll with Micah Parsons in particular, but later with Devontae Wyatt, also with Jordan Lovell and concussion, those injuries, in addition to Tucker Kraft and others, to me, it robbed them of the opportunity. Good teams, great teams overcome them. It was not a great team. But when they were 9, 3, and 1, they were certainly a Super Bowl caliber team. I think that that team will be Super Bowl caliber again this year. But the the clock is ticking on Jordan Love, the head coach, and the GM, even though the latter of those two just got extensions. I think the clock is ticking as we uh ride this deal forward. I'm so happy to be back. I I love Mondays, is a product of me loving the opportunity to do this. And I love Fridays. You know, listen, I got a meeting after this, so I am on the water side of things today to finish the show. But that bourbon that sits right there from Jay Henry, there will be bourbon tonight. On a river cruise, I will tell you, more beer. I had more beer than wine, and certainly more beer than bourbon. I had a couple of late night doubles uh to end the night, the last one that I had a little double Woodford on uh this next to last night on the river cruise, and as we stayed um up and go until a little after midnight. Kari looked at me funny. Well, not funny. Kari looked at me and said, you know, like with her eyes, really? Really? Yeah. I didn't have a whole lot of bourbon while we were gone. I will, um, but I we did, you know, been on a cruise ship, whether it's a river cruise or an ocean cruise, um, there's a fair amount of consumption. It was a daily deal and and more beer, like I said, more beer than wine. Most of the wines that we had, and they were fantastic, but the Rieslings, I like Rieslings. It's my second favorite white. A Sauvignon Blanc is to me in New Zealand Sauvignon Blanc is number one. I like the the citrus, grassy uh taste of that. That's my number one go-to white wine. Riesling would be probably in the second position, but I'm a red wine drinker at my core, and not as many red wines on that trip because we were in uh a portion of Germany in the Rhine Gorge area on that river, that their reds are Pinot Noirs, um, which is a cooler weather varietal. And they're different flavor, different taste palette on those Pinot Noirs than the ones that I like from Willamette Valley and Northern California or Northern California, and so uh a little bit different, but yeah, the beer was good. Bitburger was the beer on the ship, on the boat. Bitburger. That's what we had on a regular, but then we had other stuff in towns. Uh last little story there. Went um, trying to think of where we were, um, maybe Rudesheim, Germany. Went to a Scottish bar in Germany and and played uh Liar's Dice and drank like a Guinness and then something else in a Scottish bar in Germany. We were just trying to get all the countries uh represented on the trip. Uh a big thank you again to uh, as I'm gonna wrap this up, big thank you to Jeff Vilker, treadmill boy, for jumping in and sitting in this chair and doing stuff a little bit out of his comfort zone, handling the technical side of a show that took me weeks to figure out. For him, he had days and he did a great job. Ben Ben Bano bailed him out a couple of times, making sure everything was gonna go okay. Uh, he was here in person, at least on one of them. Uh for my son Jackson, who uh kept the doors locked one morning. Vilker had to pound on the bedroom uh window to get in the house. Thanks. Uh, but you know, he didn't panic. We were getting phone calls. I had my phone on Do Not Disturb and getting phone calls and text messages because he couldn't get into the house. Well, that would have been a problem. Uh, David, thanks. He says great show, Mike. Appreciate that. Um, he's pals with that with our crew. So good to be back. I love being here. I appreciate the opportunity to be here. And uh, we're gonna continue to grow this and do it better and better as we roll forward, even if Christian doesn't like the damn show. And then uh, you know, Mike said, uh a different Mike has said blank Christian, let's talk bourbon. We are gonna talk bourbon uh as we go, uh, but I'll hold it now to next week. I'll just drink it for the rest of this weekend. Uh yeah. Gewertzamor. I don't like Gewürzerheimer. Um probably saying that wrong. It's a hard word to uh hard varietal to pronounce. Um yeah. All right, let's wrap it up. I'll see you on Monday. Again, a big thank you to all of our sponsors on this show. And that goes from one community bank, go to onecommunity.bank to m3insurance, m3ins.com to neuroscience, go to the neuroscience group, neurosciencegroup.com. And then, of course, our friends at Pottawatomi Sportsbook and Casino, Bet Above the Rest, and Habish, Habish, and Rotier, 13 locations, go to Habish.com. And a big thank you to them. The Brewers into this weekend. They are 16 and 14, three and a half games out of first place Cincinnati. The the Reds lead the Cubs by game. The Cubs are home this afternoon against Arizona. The Brewers will be in Washington to take on, um they'll be in the nation's capital. Miz, Kyle Harris, and Chad Patrick are the three scheduled starting pitchers for the Brewers. No news on Brandon Woodruff, probably won't be. Somebody's gonna take his spot uh from AAA in the starting rotation, you would assume when his turn comes up again. I think he's gonna be on the IL for a bit, uh, a bit, at least a couple of weeks on that front. Again, a big thank you to all of you for jumping in. We'll do this thing again uh when we get back here on Monday. Looking forward to that. Appreciate you again. Have a great weekend. I love Mondays back in a couple of days.

SPEAKER_00 59:50

I love Mondays with Mike Heller.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:00

Broadcasting live from an undisclosed bunker in the Majesty. This is I Love Mondays with Mike Heller. Powered by determination and a little bit of activity.