I Love Mondays with Mike Heller
Mike Heller is back talking all things sports and all things Packers, Brewers, Bucks, Badgers and beyond.
I Love Mondays with Mike Heller
I Love Mondays-Ep103, July 23, 2026
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A great breakdown of the Packers 6-days away from the start of training camp. Bill Huber painted a less than "glowing" picture of Green Bay's defense prior to the expected return of Micah Parsons in late October or early November. We also got the lowdown on Badgers recruiting with Nick Osen from 247-Sports
I love Mondays with Mike.
SPEAKER_04From another school's bunker in the Badger State. This is I Love Mondays with Mike Heller. Powered by determination and a little bit of duct tape. Here's your host, Mike Heller.
SPEAKER_02Hey, welcome in on a Thursday. You know, normally when we kick things off on a Thursday, we're going to talk with Vinny Rettino. Well, we had him on the show on Monday, so we've uh we've changed up the format today. It's not a Vinny baseball brewer-centric Thursday. We're going to go to Green Bay and talk to Bill Huber, who's been covering the Packers for a very long time. He'll be uh our guest here in just a few minutes. He'll be our guest in a few minutes, and then uh we'll talk to Nick Osun of 247 Sports about Badgers recruiting. But uh let me begin here before we get things underway. It is a Brewers off day, by the way, anyway. One of just six remaining in the entire season after today. Do the math. Five off days remaining the rest of the way after this. Uh James wishes us a good morning and thanks, James, for weighing in and setting that uh into motion. Mike and Merrill, good morning all. It is a fantastically beautiful weather day, depending on where you are, I think, in the state of Wisconsin. I think we're all covered by that. Let me uh let me spend a moment talking about um my adopted hometown of Madison, where I've lived since 1988. Moved here in August of 1988. Um so last night, one of the things Akari and I love to do is we clear our red and white uh work schedule on Wednesday night so we can go down on the Capitol Square and enjoy a bottle of wine and some food and the Madison Chamber Orchestra for concerts on the square. If you've never been, it's kind of a slice of Americana. People bringing down their blankets and their little tables and their little chairs and set up and enjoy about an hour and 20 minutes of music, uh, about seven o'clock. So we we do it whenever we can. So we were there last night. We got down there a little bit later because I stuck around here and did our Brood Daily uh podcast after that game went final. And then we're there on just a fantastically beautiful night. I don't know that it could be better. And there are not many times where I've seen more people on the square for that. But concerts never happened last night, and it is uh it was a very unique situation that unfolded as there was uh an officer involved shooting that included the death uh uh of a of a black man that they were trying to uh take into custody. There was a struggle, uh there was a knife, and there were gunshots, and the the man died. So there was a and to be honest, that happens mid-afternoon. I'm not even aware of it. As we we went down to uh to go to the concerts, um we're not even aware that there had been an incident. You know we didn't have the news on. So I don't know, just before seven o'clock, there's a loud, large contingent of people coming up um East Wash towards the Capitol. If you're familiar with concerts on the square, the the concert and the where where the chamber orchestra sets up is at the southeast corner of the Capitol, on the Capitol steps. The protest came up uh just to the north of that, from the east, and then um towards the Capitol. And and that's just behind us to our right hand side. And and I said, I don't know what this is, but um there's a fair chance that they're gonna disrupt or interrupt or cancel this event. And it was uh because the the protesters were large in number, and nobody was gonna know, and I don't think anybody tried to prevent them. They then walked across the stage and they they were given the microphones by the the leaders of the chamber orchestra, which was I think the right thing to do, and they had their say about what had happened. And shortly after that, I mean they they weren't gonna go anywhere, and they said we're not going anywhere until the police officer is arrested and named, and we all kind of knew, okay, well, that's not gonna happen now. So shortly after, many people began to pack up, including us, and go. And here's the to me, the whole concept of what happened. Um, it's tragic on all fronts, certainly uh end of life tragic for one person, but also tragic for the community, and tragic for those in that community of Willie Street. Um tragic for our law enforcement. Nobody wants that. And then you just hope that here's the trust. Some people aren't gonna trust, and I get it. I do get it. Some people aren't gonna trust. I trust that there will be a transparent investigation into what happened and they'll act accordingly. That might not be enough for some people, and I and again, I get it. I kind of straddle that line a little bit. I trust and I believe that the system will do the right things, and certainly some people don't trust that the system will do the right things, and I get it. It's one of the very first times, maybe one of the only times in uh our lives for both Kari and I that we're front and center at a significant protest, not of our choosing. Would we have joined the protest? Well, certainly they offered, they wanted the people that were on the square to join the protest. We didn't, and it wasn't because we don't believe in it. We just find uh a different avenue to trust that the system will do the right things. And again, I'll just repeat it for the last time. I understand that some people don't trust, and they will look to some history of things and say, we can't trust. I thought it was peaceful. I didn't think I thought sometimes the language was inappropriate. There are a lot of kids there. I mean, this was a cinematic uh tribute night. So they're doing Hollywood movies, and there was a big fundraising effort last night. There were a lot of kids, and I I understood the uh the passion of the protesters. The language was um inappropriate for who was on the receiving end of the language, but I understood again what the purpose was. We left, we came home and and watched the remainder of the coverage on it because it did make national news, obviously, and the local news networks did a pretty significant job of covering the event. It stayed peaceful. Um, so I just wanted to add, I wanted to put that in there. I don't want to ignore it. We were there, you know. I I posted a picture on our my Twitter account of you know, our setup with a bottle of wine and food and beautiful summer night in Madison, but it wasn't a beautiful night, it was a mess. So anyway, I I wanted I didn't want to ignore it. We were front and center in in that situation last night, and uh I believe that that remained peaceful um as far as any of the coverage that I've seen. All right, uh on to what today's show is gonna be. Bill Huber is gonna join us. We're gonna listen, I talk sports, but I'm not gonna ignore those things either. So we talk sports and we will. Bill Huber will join us uh to talk about what's going on at Green Bay Packers Camp that opens six days from now. And one of the more significant question marks about Packers training camp is what the running back room looks like, because we don't know. Josh Jacobs is the number one running back. But I don't know when all is said and done. We haven't, the Packers haven't been, at least that we know of, cleared on the Josh Jacobs front. So we're gonna talk with Bill Huber about the running back room, about the wide receiver room, the the positions for the Packers of some significant interest uh with depth chart questions on who's healthy and who's coming back from being unhealthy and at what point, and what does that defensive line look like with Devontae Wyatt and the new additions uh at linebacker and Hargrave on the defensive line, all of that stuff. We'll also visit with Nick Osun of 24-7 Sports, 247 Sports. He is significantly tied in uh and cued in on what's going on on the recruiting front. So Nick Osun will join us. And also some news on the Badger broadcast front today. Let me just share that quick before I bring in Bill Huber, and that is that the the broadcasts of Badger football and Badger basketball in the Milwaukee market are it's a shared rights deal, but good karma broadcasting. Uh, they will on WTMJ and ESPN Milwaukee carry football and men's basketball in addition to what they already carried. Now in that market. So it's a shared, it's a shared hosting flagship station event for Wisconsin Athletics. So in the Milwaukee market, good karma broadcasting, uh, which is WTMJ and ESPN Milwaukee, and their online format, they'll carry Badger Football and Badger Basketball in addition to what they already had. And in Madison, it will stay with WIBA, AMNFM, and other brandings on you know, uh 1070, WTSO. So that that news came out this morning. The broadcast cruise won't change, at least uh in the now. Um, Matt LePay is going to be your voice, Hall of Fame voice of the Wisconsin Badgers for as long as he's doing it, uh, which is great news for all of us. I'll stay on the Badger football pregame, halftime post-game coverage. Billy Schmidt and Lance Allen will continue to host the Badger post-game for football show. Uh Matt will obviously continue to do basketball. Post's gonna do hockey, John Oddius on uh volleyball, women's basketball. So just want to put that out there. That also that news came out um earlier today. All right, so welcome in. We bring in uh my friend and uh Bill Huber is uh is ready to go. Billy, how are you?
SPEAKER_00I'm great. How about you, Mike?
SPEAKER_02Very good, very good. Can't wait to uh when I say can't wait to get uh training camp started, are you also in that group? Uh uh it's it's a there's a grind that's involved with it, but I would imagine you're also in the group that says can't wait to start training camp.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I can't wait. Uh, you know, I always call like the month of July the the time of year where I make up stories. It's just like, man, I gotta find something to write about. And uh, you know, it's it's whatever little shred or whatever spin you can put on something. It's gonna be unbelievably great to have real football. Uh, we don't have to project things anymore. We're gonna have concrete answers. Obviously, not right away, but all those things are work themselves out. I'm I am I'm super, super excited for it.
SPEAKER_02Let me uh let me ask you uh what I was talking about just before you joined us, and and that is the running back room, because uh we're all going to go under some assumption that Josh Jacobs is gonna be available and your lead number one running back, as he should as he should be on the field, but there's off the field stuff that isn't final and cleared yet. Is that how do you look at it? How do you tell people what's going on with uh Josh Jacobs?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I'm just a hundred percent thinking he's fine. You know, I'll tell you why. When the NFL um put out their top 100 list of players, Jacobs was 72 or whatever he was, and the Packers put out like a Josh Jacobs hype video. Right now, would the Packers do that if there is any question whatsoever about his availability? You know, maybe, but um, I find that hard to believe. So the fact that Jacobs practiced throughout the offseason and then they brought up this little hype video thing, I'm just assuming that he's gonna play the season. And look, we have no idea what happened that day. I certainly do not, but um whatever it was, I'm just assuming NFL is gonna let it go until until next year. Ezekiel Elliott is one of those guys, you know, a while back where he had some allegations and it nothing happened until the beginning of the following season. So, you know, different players, different timeline. I get all that, but um I'm just thinking he's gonna be good to go for the season.
SPEAKER_02So um what is what is the depth in that room look like?
SPEAKER_00Um that's a great question.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, right? Because it's yeah, it's different.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, like Emmanuel Wilson wasn't like this great running back, obviously, but he he ran for almost a thousand yards last year. So he was a he was a reliable guy who can who could grind out the tough stuff. Number two this year, you got Chris Brooks, who's been a third-down pass protector slash good special teams guy. So he's been a really good role player. And when he's gotten the ball, he's done pretty well, but he's got like less than a hundred carries in his career. So I don't know per se if he's ready to be a guy who can carry the ball a hundred times in a season. And then obviously the wild card is Marshawn Lloyd, as we all know, and um touches in one year or in his care one career game, didn't play last year, but he got through every single part of the offseason. Like he didn't even practice last offseason. So I I think that that's a pretty big jump there that he was a hundred percent good to go for all that stuff. Um we'll see. But like, even if he is healthy, like, do we even know if Marshawn Lloyd's any good? Yeah, like we're all we we all look at his college production. That doesn't mean anything. We've seen a 100 running backs over the years with college production who stunk. Um he fumbled a lot in college, yeah. Um, wasn't a great receiver side. Obviously, even if you're not practicing, you can you can't improve those things. They obviously interested to see Marshawn Light as anybody.
SPEAKER_02Sure. They I mean the the Packers obviously believe there's something significant there, otherwise, they cut ties well before this, right?
SPEAKER_00Well, even if they don't cut ties, they do something about it. Yeah, they they draft someone, they sign, you know, they'd be signing Manuel Wilson for me. He didn't get paid any money by the Seattle. Um, so yeah, they'd have been more proactive at a running back in that in that they weren't. I think you give you either some optimism that Lloyd is gonna be fine or complete disbelief that the Packers are that stupid. It's it's one or the other on that one.
SPEAKER_02Bill, if I went through like a uh and you just divided it out into specific uh position groups, offensive line, running back room, wide receivers, tight ends, and then and defensive line linebackers in secondary, and then even to special teams. Which of those are you convinced is better than a year ago? Which position group are you convinced? No doubt about it. That position group is better than the one that left the field in Chicago in the playoffs.
SPEAKER_00Well, tight end because Tucker Kraft will be healthy.
SPEAKER_02Sure. Start there.
SPEAKER_00So we'll pie past the the obvious asterisk there, or not asterisk, but the the obvious one there. Um I think the offensive line.
SPEAKER_02Okay.
SPEAKER_00You've got you have to project every single thing I'm gonna say, you have to project it to be true. And that is Jordan Morgan is better than Rasheed Walker. Could be. Aaron Banks stays healthy and therefore is better than he was last year. Could be. Sean Ryan, who learned center on the fly last year, will be better after a whole offseason all of training camp. That could happen. Anthony Belton, who's a college left tackle, will be better after playing, I think, eight games at right guard. Could be. I don't think any of those things are far-fetched, Mike. I think all five of those things you can look at and say, yeah, though I think those things are gonna happen. I don't think it's like leaps of faith or you're gambling or anything, or you're wishing and hoping. I I think those are five things that honest to goodness could happen. And if those things happen, I'm I'm I'm running offensive line right now. I'll have it published by 11. Last year, Jordan Love out of 32 quarterbacks was the ninth most pressured. Meanwhile, the running game averaged 0.6 yards less per carry than last year.
SPEAKER_02Sure.
SPEAKER_00So the line play stunk last year. Yeah, it could be a lot better this year.
SPEAKER_02So uh Banks and Zach Tom are really interesting because Banks, when he was healthy later in the season, was more like the guy that they thought they were getting from the start and they didn't get that guy. And then Zach Tom obviously tried to play through it and then couldn't at the end. And his return to health, when we want to talk about significant returns, Zach Tom being healthy is one of the a little bit unknowns, but it's one of the big caveats, isn't it? Uh on what this offensive line can be.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it is. You know, left tackle gets all the hype.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00But, you know, I've written a story like every year since Belaga was right tackle. The days where the left tackle faces the best pass rusher are ancient history. Sure. It doesn't work that way. If you look at the pro football focused pressure numbers, there are as many of the top pass rushers who are gonna go against Zach Tom as will go against Jordan Morgan. And it's been that it's been true for more than a decade. Um it is a it's gonna start right off the bat, you know, with with well not right off the bat, but you got Aiden Hutchinson of the Lions. He is a he's one of those guys that he's that Zach Tom is gonna have to face like almost every snap. Um if you if your right tackle stinks or isn't any good, you're gonna have a heck of a time stopping a pass rush. So Zach Tom is legit one of the best guys in the league. In fact, in 2024, he was third of the all-pro vote, and now one of those guys, Penny, who was playing left tackle. So based on that, I mean he's he mean he's clearly a top five right tackle and healthy. He's a huge part of this thing.
SPEAKER_02Let me let me stay on offense just for a minute. Romeo Dobbs is gone, Wicks is gone, Heath is gone, and you get uh Golden into his second year. Is the wide receiver room healthy, Christian Watson, is the wide receiver room better today than it was when they finished the year uh last season?
SPEAKER_00No, because Sky Moore and Savion Williams are not as good as Romeo Tobbs and Don David, believe it or not. Now it's been wonderful pie in the sky talk, listening to people talk how you know they're gonna have three guys and define roles, and that's gonna make everybody better in the chemistry, and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know what? Those guys have all been hurt. All of them.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_00You mentioned what Reed's been hurt. Golden was hurt last year. You are one injury away from having Bo Melton playing 50 snaps a game.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00That's not better.
SPEAKER_03Right.
SPEAKER_00So that now that's position that is a wishing and hoping. You are wishing and hoping that three guys with injury history, some more significant than others, are gonna stay healthy. And I'm not buying it. Now, I'm not saying that I mean Bo Melton has had some good games. He could be better. We have no idea if Xavier Williams can do anything, and that's not a knock in Savion Williams. He just wasn't asked to do anything last year. So I mean, those guys could be legit players. You know, maybe Isaiah Naylor steps up and they could be fine. I just don't know. Um, I so I I think anybody who just assumes that they're gonna roll out Watson, Reed, and Golden, and they're all gonna combine for 3,000 yards, I just think that's that's nonsensical. And you're not better. Maybe it will be, but at least as we sit here on what's the 23rd, you're not better.
SPEAKER_02What is uh what does success look like for Golden?
SPEAKER_00Um if he plays the whole season, he's gonna be fine. I mean I mean you you were at enough practices last year. All he did was get open and catch passes. Yeah. Like the and I don't I don't know if he's a great runner or people are just scared of death that he's gonna run past him. Whatever it is, he's he's open a lot and he's got great hands. Um I think Matt DeGold is gonna be really good. So again, I I can understand why people. Think the receiver cores can be really good because it it the their top three are. Um, and I think Gold's gonna have a really good year.
SPEAKER_02So on on defense, Quay Walker was somebody who always had the potential to be. I think fans looked at him with potential to be better than what he was, but uh, I like Quay Walker. So did they get better on the move for uh Franklin uh coming in from Indianapolis and Quay Walker leaving? Are they better in that spot today than they were last year?
SPEAKER_00Gosh dang. I don't know. Franklin is 30. Yeah and if his 2024 numbers were, I mean, he was second team all pro for a reason. It was they were ridiculous. He wasn't as nearly as good last year, but a down year from Zaire Franklin was still big. Like Franklin had 125 tackles last year. Cooper had his career out of 128, so you're probably not worse, although the age thing kind of makes sure we're watching. I do think that Franklin is so experienced and he's so smart, and like all the intangibles, you know, the whole green dot thing, I think all that stuff, you're probably better, and if you're better there, then it probably makes Edrian Cooper better, so therefore the linebacker group is better. So I I certainly could see that. Um if Franklin's anything like he was in 2024, though, holy man, I mean he had a hundred like 175 tackles and five force fumbles. Walker had zero force fumbles the last three years. Right. Jeez. I mean, and those are the plays that that win games, the tackles for losses and the and the turnover plays, those are what win games, and Franklin really gives you a big edge there, potentially.
SPEAKER_02Let me let me go bigger picture defense for a minute because uh obviously we we know they're gonna be without Micah Parsons until sometime latter part of October, but probably more like early November. So, whatever that is, how does this defense tread water or be better than tread water in the interim until Micah Parsons returns and has the impact on the game that we saw last year, or hope that he has uh coming back from injury?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's I mean it's gotta be Jonathan Gannon. He's gonna have to do it. I don't see. Um to me, this is this is gonna kill him.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00Like who's like who's gonna rush the passer, Mike?
SPEAKER_02So Right, because we're waiting on Lucas Van Ness, right? And I don't know if that wait is gonna pay off.
SPEAKER_00Right. So you had say what you want about Rashawn Gary. You know, and I'll I'll agree, yeah, I'll agree with everything you're gonna say about him, but the fact remains that Parsons and Gary gave you 20 sacks last year. Every edge rusher on this roster gave you four. Right. Your quarterbacks, your quarterbacks aren't any good. So how are you how are you how are you gonna beat Kyler Gurry in week one? I think Kyler Murray's a great quarterback, or his receivers sure the hell are. Um I just I just think this is a colossal problem. Okay, maybe Jonathan Gannon can make it work, or maybe Colin Oliver's healthy. We have never seen the guy do anything, actually, and he hasn't practiced. Uh maybe Dennis Sun's an instant impact guy. Maybe you mentioned Van Ness right off the bat. Maybe he really is ready to take that jump. Maybe. But so you're talking about maybe, maybe, maybe, and a bunch of guys who have never done anything. Um I d I just don't. I I don't know how they win games without Jordan Love just going crazy, honestly.
SPEAKER_02So you you you believe to paraphrase there or to set you up the paraphrase, you believe John Ganathon's task is significant.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, he's gotta find a pass rush out of something. Um maybe just let an Edrian Cooper you know be that guy. I don't I don't know. Honestly, I don't know.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_00Because Vanessa's eight and a half sacks in three years. I mean, you're you're expecting him. You're expecting Baron Sarral had one and a half last year. You're expecting I mean Sarral might all those guys might be better, but the baseline is so low. It's just like if you if you are, I don't even know the Vikings offensive coordinators, couldn't tell you. You think he's losing a bit of sleep over the Packers Pack rush, Packers pass rush? No, he's not.
SPEAKER_02Right. And that was the conversation when Micah's healthy, the offensive coordinator on the other side does lose sleep. And right now you're thinking no OC's losing a whole lot of sleep about the Packers pass rush.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and you know, everybody from the coach to the players say that a good pass defense is a combination of Russian coverage. Which part of that combination do you like right now?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. Well, especially since uh, you know, I mean, I'm gonna go to the next spot, and we you can't identify who your number one cover corner is. I mean, it's supposed to be um, well, who's it supposed to be?
SPEAKER_00I don't have any idea. Yeah, um, yeah, um Keisha Nissan's gonna start.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_00So it's gonna be Valentine versus St. Juice versus um Cisei, the the rookie. Yeah um you could be you could be significantly better there. Like Juice was a part-time guy for the Chargers last year, but his coverage numbers were really good, like really good. Now he hasn't done it throughout his career, which is why he didn't get paid much by the Chargers last year or the Packers this year, but he has played pretty good football, and he's six foot three, and I really like that because at least at least he gave you some options against some big guys which he didn't have. And I have no idea if the rookie's gonna be any good. I mean, you go back to the year where they drafted Jair in the first round and Josh Jackson in the second round. Well, Jair was really good and Josh Jackson stunk. Um, so you have no idea. So I mean they could be they could be legit significantly better there. But again, we're at you again, you're just totally projecting things on hoping almost, really.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, uh I know you're not doing it intentionally, but you're you're making me doubt uh that the Green Bay is a co-favorite in the NFC North.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I just I don't see how they are.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um again, we'll go back to the offense. The offensive line could legit be really good. If that's the case and Jordan Love has time and the running game is better, and you go score 30 points and you you score your problems away. I mean, that's a legit, that could legit happen, but um the defense just seems like a big problem until Parsons gets back.
SPEAKER_02We haven't touched on uh, and let me do this before we let you you finish up your offensive line piece that uh needs to be published by 11. Um we're talking about a special teams with a coaching change there and a special teams unit that, to be fair, has not been anywhere near good enough in recent years. You've got you drafted a rookie uh kicker. Um how do you grade out? You take a special look at special teams at the end of every season. How do you grade out what you see there on the start on the jump before we get going?
SPEAKER_00I think they are going to be at least pretty good. And if the kicker is at least pretty good, um they will have an above-average team. Look, Sky Moore was one of four returners in the league last year who was top 10 in punt returns and kick returns, and he was the reason why the Niners went if you're a D V O A nerd, which I'm not, but at least I can I can read numbers. Um the Niners went from 31st to 13th. Wasn't all because of Sky Moore, but it helped. There's this quote I keep going back to was from John Lynch last year, which I was in the 49ers GM. And I know um Sean Slocum said the same thing back in the day. If your kick returner is good, everybody else is better because they all block better. They all block better, they block harder, and they block longer because they legit believe that the guy that they're blocking for can take one. If Sky Moore is the guy who's in the Niners, then the return game will be better and then they'll block better. Um obviously the punter is unbelievably good. Um the snapper's pretty good. If the kicker's fine, the I I like them. I I think if the kickers fine, I think the special teams is gonna be it will be a reason why they win games, not a reason why they lose them.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. All right, Billy. Uh I'll I'll let you get back to work. I always appreciate you joining me. Thanks for jumping in here. We'll look forward to seeing you up at training camp.
SPEAKER_00Sounds good, Mike. Take care.
SPEAKER_02Thank you, Bill. Bill Huber joining us on uh I Love Mondays, the Thursday edition. Um, yeah, I listen, I jumped on CHGO Sports yesterday with uh with Adam Hogue on a podcast they did, and it was a Packers Bears version of it. And I painted a better picture than Bill just did. It makes me doubt a little bit of some of the things I talked about. And if this is a fully helped, if Micah Parsons is part of this out of the gate, I think uh Billy's view on this uh is different. I think it's different for all of us. I think of it in some ways as what the Brewers did when they started the season. It's not apples to apples, but uh starting the season, Yelich missed a bunch of time, Churio missed a month, Vaughn missed the first 40 plus days, uh Brandon Woodruff. Now he's not there again, but he missed, and you were hoping that he'd be part of the mix. You didn't have um, you know, uh uh Quinn Priester, another starting pitcher. You I mean, you had a bunch of issues, right? And they treaded water on April 26th, they were 13 and 13. Since then, they're 51 and 25. I don't think that Micah Parsons is gonna play a game in October. Maybe the dude's a freak, but they're gonna have to protect him from him. So if he plays in October, which I think is a significant if. That means there are five, maybe six games, maybe seven games that he doesn't play. You you invested your franchise into him when you acquired him last late last summer. He's the guy. So when you get started this year, he's the guy is in street clothes. So Lucas Van Ness, first round draft choice, hadn't lived up to that billing. And I know that Micah Parsons is is really, you know, presenting flowers for Lucas Van Ness. I mean, he's he's given him that treatment. This guy can really play treatment, but we haven't seen it. So I think a lot of people were hoping against hope that when Lucas Van Ness was that choice that he would turn into an Aiden Hutchinson. He hasn't. That's not a conversation to be had. So, where on this defense are the playmakers? Zaire Franklin, I think, will probably, as Bill was just talking about, be better than Quay Walker in many facets, but age is a question. Devontae Wyatt getting the deal and coming back from injury, he needs to be a difference maker up front. Because he the uh the defensive line, Hargrave is is been brought in. But to Bill's point that he made, the offensive coordinator for the Minnesota Vikings, week one's opponent, is not looking at the Packers' defense and going, okay, we've got to take care of this guy, which is Micah Parsons. The Packers don't present that guy. I don't know. Makes me maybe rethink. I picked the Bears to win the division. I think they're the favorite, but I had the Packers right there. And I do think they will be right there. But listening to De Bill talk about this defense gives me pause. Maybe pause that I didn't have 25 minutes ago. So that's that's part of it. Let me spend a moment um talking about the Milwaukee Brewers before we bring in Nick Oson here in a couple of minutes. So I think it's interesting that now in the month of July, and the Brewers are 64 and 38, 26 games above 500, and lead the division over the second place Cubs by seven. Seven full games. Neither team plays today. Cubs have a day off, I believe. Yes. Cubs have the day off, Brewers have the day off. When I think of this, I'm I'm looking, wow, you you've had a uh a good July again, and you're five and one out of the break. You're getting production from your your big boys. You know, I mean that's how you win at this level. You're 51 and 25. That's better than 667 baseball since April the 26th. So obviously, especially even now in the kind of the dog days, July, your big boys are carrying what you're doing from an offensive standpoint. Well, here's the the big boys and what they produce so far in July. Jake Bowers has been your best offensive player for the year. In July, he's hitting old gen, 190 is his batting average, and his OPS, 688. League average is somewhere just above 700. He's got six extra base hits, nine runs better than three home runs in the month of July. Another big boy, William Contreras. Contreras is hitting 148 with an OPS of 450. Those are Joey Ortiz's April numbers. William Contreras, three extra base hits, seven RBIs, and a home run. Now that home run was significant. He won a game with the home run, his only round tripper of the month. Jackson Churio hitting 222 with an OPS of 606. He only has a home, one homer in July and six runs batted in. He's got 22 strikeouts this month and four walks. I just went Bowers, Contreras, Churio. I haven't gotten to Vaughn. Vaughn in some limited opportunity, right? I'll get to that in a moment. Vaughn is hitting 205, old gen batting average stat. His OPS is 612, almost 100 points below league average. Three extra base hits, a home run, two runs batted in. He's only played 10 games in the month with multiple at bats. So a few pinch hit come off the bench late, but he's only got 39 at bats in the month in 10 games. So maybe some of that's on Murph for not having him in there on a regular. And then I'll give you now he's on the IL, but South Freelick, he did play in 12 games, had 34 at bats, almost as many as Vaughn. His old gen stat, 118. That was his batting average in July. Certainly injury driven. We just didn't know it. And his OPS was 378, two extra base hits, three runs batted in. That's Bowers Contreras, Churio, Vaughn, and Freelik. Five significant contributors to a team that's playing well, but not in July. So they've won in spite of that. Who's carried the water? Ortiz, Mitchell, and Pratt. Ortiz hitting 333 with an OPS of 984. Nine extra base hits, nine runs batted in, three home runs. Joey Ortiz has three home runs in the month of July. That's two home runs more than Jackson Churio. Garrett Mitchell has carried the water. 362 batting average. 11 extra base hits, 10 runs batted in, two home runs in the month of July. And Cooper Pratt is hitting 291 with an OPS of 793, almost 100 points above league average. Four extra base hits, six runs better than a home run. And then there are your midling guys who have done enough, but they haven't done as much as you hope that they're going to be doing when it matters. And I'm talking about Tarang and Yelich. Tarang 261, 810 OPS. Again, that's 110 points higher than league average. 10 extra base hits, 13 runs better than two home runs. People look at Tarang and go, oh, he's kind of struggling to the numbers and go, no, he set the bar high. He's not hitting that bar, but he's got an 810 OPS in July. Yelich, again, not carrying the water, but not carrying the water. Hope you follow me on that. He's hitting 203, 695 OPS. Eight extra base hits, nine runs better than a home run. And then Luis Lara, I've just gone through the whole deal. But Lara now is pretty much your Freelick, right? He's in right field most days. 240 batting average in his 10 games, 647 OPS, one extra base hit, one RBI, 10 games, 25 at bats. He's going to get more of those as you roll forward. Um all right, just a quick little deal here before I bring in uh Nick Osun to spend some time with us. I want to thank our friends at the Neuroscience Group, and I'll be up there a week from tomorrow at Fox City Stadium, neuroscience field at Fox City Stadium. I I should probably get that right. I'll get it right by next Friday. Neuroscience Group is a big part of what we do. If you've had a concussion of any type or a back injury, a spine issue, neuroscience group is the place you go to get help. So if you're struggling through that, through brain fog and headaches and post-concussion stuff that just isn't clearing up, go to somebody who really knows what they're doing. Neurosciencegroup.com. I also want to thank our friends at One Community Bank, your feelgood banking, onecommunity.bank. Let them earn your business. Find it what find out what feel good banking is all about with one community bank. And uh I think you're gonna find that they'll earn your business. They are a member, FDIC and an equal housing lender. Uh let me jump in to bringing Nick Osun to the program. Uh segment I always look forward to because Nick brings energy and he's uh he's really smart. Nick Osun, how are you?
SPEAKER_01Mike, I really appreciate that, my friend. You know, I always look forward to these as well. I'm I'm doing very well, man. It's a little bit crazy just how quickly this summer's flying. We're we're coming up on true football here soon.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we get to go to camp here in just uh just a couple of weeks. No Plattville now. They're they're gonna stay put right where they are. You know, they're it it we always talk about this that uh investments and the element that is put into play in college athletics is still not transparent. So we don't know what the the spend is. But Nick, it seems apparent to me, not only in the portal, what they did in the offseason, but in true high school recruiting for both the class that's in, the class that's um verbal for next year and beyond, that it appears they must have had a somewhat significant, although not transparent, increase in budget money because the recruiting continues to be impressive.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, Mike, you're spot on. You know, I I kind of got word, I think it was like around November, early December, especially after things kind of were more clear about Fickle coming back, that there was going to be, frankly, a massive infusion. Uh, you know, I've I've heard numbers, but like you said, not transparency. I don't really like to speak uh in rumors, but obviously millions, you know, double-digit millions kind of infused into uh what was able to be a huge portal hall. I mean, we'll see how the guys do, of course, but one of the largest in the country, uh, you know, 34 players, I believe, just from kind of the portal action. And then, yeah, still sitting here as we get closer to August with the top 25 class, I think the badgers are 24th uh in the class of 2027. So certainly what I always say, Mike, with the high school level, and and I know obviously you being a great Wisconsinite, you can kind of uh recognize this too. Basically, it's not going to get you in the door necessarily. You've got to eval, you've got to have the great relationships. But if you do everything else right, it can maybe help you shut that door a little bit sooner if you have the funds that are needed to lock those guys in.
SPEAKER_02We we talk about this from performance on the field a lot over the course of time. Nick and I've been doing this for a little while, but player-led teams, coaches say that their player-led, star-led teams are the best when those guys are the best leaders. I'm gonna equate that, and you and I have had this conversation before, to recruiting is best done by your current players andor your commitments. So when we talk about Corz Logan and the impact he's had on the recruiting front for next year's class, or you talk about what Cooper Catalano and Mason Posa have meant to what you're doing now, either in the portal or also in recruiting. Can you speak to that a little bit? Because I think you're around these kids more often than almost all of us, and you get some of that same sense.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, Mike, spot on. You know, I'm very fortunate to have forged some really good relationships actually with the exact guys you mentioned. Uh, you know, I spent an hour, hour and a half, about two weeks ago, uh, with about nine, I think, in state commits. Logan was there. And, you know, what he's done is is frankly, I'm not gonna say unheard of, but it's a little bit unbelievable because he jumped in. And sure you had Post and Catalano kind of doing great things on the field at the end of the season, but like he jumped in, I think it was early January, where you didn't know what this portal hall was going to look like. It was coming off a tough season. He did it on a national stage. And then what does he do? He just kind of hops on Twitter, gets all these guys' numbers, and really tries to bring guys in. And like I said, I've gotten to know him. It is very, very authentic. It's pretty cool. And what Posa, Catalano, I'll mention uh, you know, Kevin Haywood, uh, Darion Dupree, he's a little quieter, but like some of these guys that have been in the program, whether it's showing it with their play or being hosts for these recruits, Mike. Like I can tell you flat out, you know, I'm fortunate to kind of hear who some of the player hosts are. Those are a lot of the guys you hear. And it's not just, hey, we can be this, but it's I jumped in during a tough time. These are the opportunities that I got. We feel that the culture's in a good place, which I do tend to agree with, Mike. And now it's just about guys really need to show it. And as we talk further, as we get into camp, like we know that needs to happen, but I think everything else, they are checking off the boxes this offseason.
SPEAKER_02Let me ask you a non-recruiting question about the current team a little bit and just to see if you can add some perspective. Without getting into specific numbers, it would seem obvious to me, considering the landscape, that Mason Post and Cooper Catalano were there had to be poaching attempts, other schools that wanted them. Any sense of how the badgers were able, the university was able to keep them here? Is it just investment based, or how much of it is about their person, personality and desire to be here? And maybe they gave what we would call a hometown discount, or just said, hey, I'm not interested. Because obviously, to me, maybe I'm wrong, but they had to have been offered significant dollars to leave.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, you know, with what I will say, Mike, to that part especially. Uh, I I can confirm I heard buzz about it from several key players out there. Uh so you know, similar with those guys and others. But what I would say is I think they're very, I think the program is fortunate, and especially was fortunate at the time, uh, because you know, they they maybe could have gotten more money off there. I know that guys like Posa, uh, you know, Catalano was awesome. I think Kevin Haywood was somebody that people tried to check in on. And so they're not getting, I don't think, the short end of the stick by any means staying here. Like I think the badgers took care of them, from my understanding. Those were some of the guys they were made priorities right away. But also, I think back to I want to say it was mid-November, we had a presser. You you were down there after a game. Uh Mason Posa was talking. I think Catalano had already gone through. And there is a sense of loyalty, I think, with Catalano. It's especially the Badgers. He grew up 50 minutes down the road, you know, an hour down the road. So I think there's a true loyalty. I've gotten to know him, his family, uh Posa's family, Haywood's. You know, they're all pretty loyal guys. And I also remember Post has said, look, I'll never forget how these guys recruited me. And I have a true connection to Luke Fickle, to these staffers. You know, a couple of his key recruiting guys, I'm sure you remember Max Seineker. Like he's moved on now, but these guys do love fickle. I remember people were doubting some of my reporting in November when I was saying, hey, Fickle's gonna be back. He still has this locker room, and he really does. I think that culture has grown. And that's a great question, Mike. Those are just a couple key faces of this program.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and I I think it's obvious that Luke kept the locker room. You saw it in how the team played down the stretch last year, and in particular starting with the Oregon game, and that's really the game that POSA and Catalano uh are on the field uh for significant snaps for the first time. From that point forward, whether they were responsible for that as real true freshmen or just other leadership and that, I thought that they were together. And now we'll we'll see. And they made a very strong point of it, didn't they? Uh in the offseason, just after the season ended and throughout the offseason, that they were gonna be the drivers of what goes forward here. Uh let me tag on to that, talking about the recruitment, because the summer is the preferred camps, and the players come in. And Wisconsin is again, at least on paper, which isn't on paper, they're all verbals. They've done very well, right? This summer, they've done very well in those preferred camps and getting the verbal commitments for players who are of substance.
SPEAKER_01They they've done a phenomenal job, Mike. I think what was so nice and beneficial, and again, Wisconsin deserves credit, of course, but I I want to note this. I know I told you back in the winter, it helps having arguably, and I say this about basketball too, I'm gonna say the best in-state class I've ever seen, you know, since I was a kid. So 15 plus years, maybe best ever for basketball. And so what they did is you got a guy like Logan. He kind of helps start uh start this thing going. And Pat Lambert, Nate Lenton, Luke Fickle all did a great job there. Then he's kind of a driver with it. Then another huge one that had powerhouse offers all over, Cole Ryder. He's a little bit, you know, quieter maybe compared to Logan, but like he's played a role in that. Then you get the Malinger twins, and so it is a domino effect.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And so then what I think that allowed this summer was A, you know, there's some good funding, some good investment to be able to lock guys down. But B, nothing is better in terms of recruiting, Mike, than somebody coming. You know, you look outside, it's kind of like a beautiful Madison weekend. Yeah, and you've got six or seven guys that are already committed that can kind of make this pitch to you or hang around, hey, this is what sold me. I I know you from the Ohio State visit, from the Penn State visit. Like these things happen. And and so it's it's a really cool thing. I think that the staff does deserve a ton of credit. I mean, if if there wasn't the wins and losses last year, like I think that collectively the fan base would be soaring because it's been an A-minus A offseason. I think even the staunchest of people that maybe aren't pulling for things, you know, to go well would say that. And so now obviously, what needs to translate? But right now, the class is still pretty intact. You know, schools will be in contact, guys like Yazin Zion, Makai Williams, I'm sure some of the other offensive skill players. But right now, and you know I'm checking in every week, uh, you know, with the program and things, good spot right now.
SPEAKER_02All right, let me finish. Uh, one one football, one basketball question before we jump. Um, football, I'm kind of doing an informal poll at some point before the season comes uh to a start. Uh, I'm gonna list what I think in the 15 years that I've been covering Wisconsin football and traveling with the team is my list of stadiums in the Big Ten from I'm not gonna go 18 because two of them I haven't been to and won't be, you know, anytime real soon. I haven't been to Washington uh and haven't been to the Rose Bowl for UCLA. We will be this fall. What is your all things considered? What is your favorite road trip stadium and least favorite? In a little informal poll here.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I would say my favorite that I've done, it's it's crazy, it feels like so long ago, but that I was able to do uh was USC. The Coliseum, I think, definitely was impressive, and I would say least, and it's you know, not even taking a shot, just nothing super memorable. I I would probably say Purdue. Okay, you know, it's a nice press box, but I don't remember that kind of jumping out of me. Though I will note real quick, Mike, I thought the big house was a little overrated.
SPEAKER_02It it is overrated, thank you. It is overrated. There's history there, you can feel it, but it is underwhelming from a stadium standpoint, a noise standpoint, yes, all of it. It's it's the there's not the buzz. Um I would put Champagne near the bottom too, uh, although they've renovated. And prior to uh a certain coach showing up, Indiana was the the nothing trip of all of them, right? Northwestern's gonna be different now, too, with a new stadium. All of that is in play. Let me touch on hoops before I let you run. Um, because basketball continues to what what they have done with Greg Gard has been impressive in many ways. Now we get an even more foreign player influence on what this team is with both New Zealand and and other places around the the continent, the the total world map. What can you tell us about how they have managed recruiting with certainly a lesser budget than who they're trying to keep up with?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, Mike, and I'll add within that answer real quick. I just put out a story uh with with Mark Van Wettering. He spoke with the media as a group this week. And so I think he outlines that a little bit too. What I think they do so well, and frankly, by the day, by the week, I'm I'm learning more and I'm further impressed. Like you said, limited budget. It's not bad, but it's not the most competitive, you know, it's it's not the top of the big 10. I think they're so good, Mike, at evaluating, and especially with you know, some of the international guys getting in early, because you're not worried, you know, it's not like a tampering thing or anything like that because they're not playing for another college program. So you start to get the names, you start, you've got the Kirk Penny pitch, you've got the offense, which I can tell you obviously with high school recruiting too, guys are starting to pick up on that. Guys really like it. You pitch a clear-cut role, and it's basically, hey, if you come here, I'm thinking of, you know, AJ Store at one time, right? Or or Tanja or Boyd, Blackwell, Winter's still here. If you come in here and and really do what you're asked to do, A, this place is really just about basketball and a strong culture. B, if you're able to hit these levels, you will be playing professional basketball, whether it's the NBA or overseas for eight to ten plus years. And so I think guys have latched onto that.
SPEAKER_02And the 27 high school in stake class starting to add up, right? I mean, yeah, they they've hit on a walk me through that a little bit, our our viewers, listeners, walk us through that, and then we'll let you go.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, one of the best classes in school history. Uh, it's currently sitting at number three in the nation. You know, it won't finish there necessarily because other five stars and things will jump, but still phenomenal. Jalen Brown, uh, you know, one of my favorite players that I've been able to see, in-state guy, Tosa West Star, uh kind of a combo guard, four-star that Wisconsin got. Another four-star Babukar on from Minnesota. He's like an off-ball guard, forward type, uh long, athletic. You know, I think of him as maybe the potential to be a little more skilled, like Khalil Iverson type of guy. Uh, like I said, long, can defend. And then Jack Phelan, high three-star, true seven-footer, somebody that, you know, will continue to develop, Mike, but if he hits, I think he can definitely be a multi-year contributor.
SPEAKER_02Is there a keep an eye on guy that that's out there in the 27 class as well?
SPEAKER_01I actually think that this class is full uh because, you know, I don't think they'll want to go over three. I will give you a 28 name, though, because I was just out scouting uh across the country. KJ Wilson, 6'1 guard for Minnesota. Wisconsin loves him. They've been at a lot of his games. So watch out for him down the line.
SPEAKER_02Nick Osen, it is really good stuff. What did you just put out? Go ahead and plug what you've got running now.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I appreciate that. So, you know, Mark Van Wettering spoke with our group this week. Uh, so just a nice rundown of what he talked about, just really informative because you you don't often talk to the GMs. And then I've got all camp mailbag and some recruiting updates coming this week.
SPEAKER_02Nick Osen, thanks for doing this. I always appreciate it. You're always fun to listen to, and I learn something every time we talk. Thanks for doing this. We'll do it again really soon.
SPEAKER_01You know it means a lot to me, my friend. Appreciate it, Mike. Thank you.
SPEAKER_02Nick Osen, 247 sports.com. If you don't follow him or subscribe, you're missing it. The kid works, I shouldn't call him a kid, he works so freaking hard at it. He he he never stops. I used to give there's a guy in Milwaukee, Spencer, who I don't need to talk about the at any length here, but I always said to Spencer, you're everywhere. You know who's everywhere? Nick Osen is everywhere. High school camps, showcases. I mean, uh dude's never here. I mean, he's here when you have to be here. But I mean, I I would say to Nick, you know, uh do you ever just take some downtime? Because the answer is no. Like there's no way Nick golfs. He he's not a bowling league, right? He's not playing uh sand volleyball on Tuesday nights because he's not here. He's off working, working. And his information is fantastic. Killing it. Keep doing what you're doing, kid. Twice a kid. Twice I kidding him. Uh man, keep doing what you're doing, man. Uh he's he's got great stuff going on. I hope you hope you follow and subscribe to what he's got working. Uh, I want to thank our friends at Habish. Go to Habish.com, Habish Habish and Rotier, 13 locations. That ensures you get a hometown attorney that's working on your side. Isn't that what you want? You got a personal injury legal situation going on. Habish is who you get a hold of. Go to habish.com on that front. Our friends at M3Insurance, m3ins.com. So if you're involved in whatever that size business, small, medium, large, but you're associated with employee benefits, risk management, those things, and you haven't talked to M3 Insurance, then you're missing out. M3INS.com. It's what they do. They have national reputation, local service. It is who they are, what they what they've got going on. By the way, it's a really good time right now to enjoy what happens at Pottawatomi Sportsbook and Casino. How about the futures on certain Packers? You know, Jordan loved futures. How about Packers team futures? Don't bet based on what Bill Hubert told you today. That was not, that was not, hey, go put some money on the Packers to win the NFC championship game. He's he's um it wasn't an endorsement necessarily today. It was honest, is what it was. Uh but Pottawatomi Sportsbook and Casino Bet Above the rest. And my friends at Traditions Lighting have talked about them. They're gonna be out here doing some work for us a week from now. Um if you it maybe now's the time for you. Well, I know it's the time to book them, but maybe now's the time for you to make that decision that come last week in November or first week of December when it's nine degrees outside with 15 mile an hour winds, for you to not go up on a ladder and to hook up lights that you're not sure whether they work still from last year on the eaves and to put those. Well, how did this one secure? Oh hey, honey, get me a nay, some nails, and a hammer. No, not a good idea. Let traditions lighting do it. Have them do it. They store it, they keep it, they install it, they take it down, they do it on your schedule. Traditionslighting.com. And we've got such a good group of core sponsors on this show, and I appreciate their trust and belief in what it is we do. No brewed daily today. No brew daily. There is no game. So come on out and join us at Red and White Wine and Bourbon Bar in Wana Key. We have uh old-fashioned Thursdays. We make old fashions tonight, and we're doing it for a very good cause. Uh, we got music tonight. That'll be a fun good weather. I think it's gonna be good weather night to do that. I'll be back in with you tomorrow. Jeff Jenkins, the former Brewer star, is in town. He will be part of the Legends alumni game following the Brewers and Rockies, which tomorrow is first pitch at 310. And then following that, they will have the Legends. Remember they had the home run deal last year? This year it's a Legends reunion game going on. Uh, a couple of quick notes on the way out the door, Jason. I think a lot of people overlook him as good as he's been. I don't know who you were talking about. Um I think I I I assume that you were talking, Jason, about Joey O. I'm not sure, but I'll make that assumption. We're gonna run out of time for you to come back. Logan uh Henderson, really good at solidifying his spot in the rotation and keep giving us five plus in each start. I was hoping he'd go a little deeper yesterday, um, or two days ago. Yeah, Logan Henderson is who Jason was talking about, too. Yeah, he's really good. Um, you know, when you talk about uh acquisitions at the trade deadline, uh Miller's drawing interest in San Diego as a closer, and what they're gonna want is a controllable starter. So does Detroit. They want a controllable starter in exchange for the conversation starter for Terek Scuble. But yesterday was uh a little bittersweet. Tigers beat the Cubs. Tigers win, they're staying in the race and they're not making a deal with anybody if they keep winning. I'm glad that the Cubs got beat. Uh and uh David reminded me, can't be trading off Mitchell at this point. No, that was a two-week ago story. It's it's changed. That was also a Terek Scoobyl story that you know anybody that's trading a name of significance wants both prospects and an everyday, everyday guy now. And depending on who they want, no, Garrett Mitchell is not a trade chip for me. He was, he isn't. Things change. All right. What a what a great day, a fun day. I'm glad you have been with us uh for today's show. We'll come back and do the same thing tomorrow. Big thanks to Bill Huber and to Nick Ossen for joining us on the program. Uh, that's a wrap for us. Enjoy the rest of your Thursday. We'll talk to you tomorrow morning on I Love Mondays.