Paradigm Shift: Police Brutality

Rob & Jesse Dive Deep Into Police Brutality, Personal Stories From Their Own Lives And Situations involving Racism And The Bar Being Set Too Low To Become A Police Officer Is In Question In Todays Episode.

Thank you for your support for what we do,👇👇👇👇 

https://www.buzzsprout.com/2600905/support

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:01

Welcome back to another episode of the Paradigm Shift. Hope everybody's having a great day. We're a little bit uh a couple days behind, but we're here for you nonetheless. We got a double feature for you tomorrow. You'll have another one. So let's get this party started, guys. We try to make sure we do one every Sunday and every single Wednesday. Uh I am Big Rob, and of course, I'm back with my partner of crime, Jesse. What's going on, buddy?

SPEAKER_00 0:25

Hey, what's happening, man? Glad to be back for another episode of the Paradigm Shift, where today we're going to be talking about police brutality.

SPEAKER_01 0:34

Are you ready to offend some people?

SPEAKER_00 0:37

I think we're going to offend all sides on this one.

SPEAKER_01 0:41

Why don't you kick things off this time around if you don't mind, my friend?

SPEAKER_00 0:45

Yeah, yeah. So, you know, obviously I I'm in the US. You're in Canada. I don't know if if this is a US specific issue with with the cops kind of beating the crap out of people, or if it's kind of it goes into multiple countries, or it depends on the government. Um, even in the US, though, I would say that I think the stuff that makes the news is sometimes taken out of context, sometimes not, right? And you see these videos that come out all the time, and it's like somebody in their car, all of a sudden the police officer just punches them right in the face. Or like like where I live, um, sometimes they'll do uh big events, right? Like whether it's like a football game or some kind of big sporting event. And there's there's almost always videos that come out after the fact. And maybe it's just that everybody has a cell phone now of the cops just beating the crap out of people. Like it's it's just kind of crazy. And you know, one of the things that this may be a difference too with with some of the US and some of Canada. And I've noticed this where some of the neighborhoods that the police are in routinely, they almost get like jaded, right? Because everybody's there in there's like F you cops, you know, get the heck out of here, you know, you're not welcome here, yada, yada, yada. And so when something does go down, uh like they're all like everybody in the neighborhoods out there like antagonizing the cops, you know. And and it seems like just crazy stuff seems to happen. And so I figured, you know, this this whole topic is uh is a very fascinating one to get into. And I don't I don't know what it's like in Canada, so maybe you can kind of inform me.

SPEAKER_01 2:34

It can be very, very polarizing. It is very similar in Canada as well. I I think that it's universal in the West, probably because I mean, for example, I I've had friends who go through um corrections. We'll use corrections just as an example. It's got to be a pretty close parallel to uh to policing, right? And I've had friends who go through and they get jobs and corrections and stuff, and when they end up quitting or coming out of that job, they're just not the same anymore because of the stuff that you see, the stuff that you deal with, right? Um, and you're not allowed to talk about it really. I'm sure that they allow you to go see therapists and stuff at the end, but at the end of the day, uh, and I really want to explore both sides of this. I want to be clear about that. So I'm not making excuses or or you know anything like that, but there is obviously is we like to discuss both sides of every coin, right? So the amount of stuff that the police have to deal with and see, I can imagine, is emotionally and mentally scarring for sure. And it definitely changes, I would imagine, how you would respond to things, and you know, you're probably pretty defensive, you're probably aggressive, uh as time goes on, I would imagine, right? That's just human nature. However, there are a lot of assholes they give badges to at the same time who should not have them, right? I think the bar is just too low when it comes to qualifications for um for policing. That is that is undeniably true, in my opinion. And I think it's because there's a let's be honest, there's a shortage of police, right? Nobody seems to want to really do the job except for assholes, right? People who want that bit of power over your average person, right? We could go through examples. I mean, I remember a time I was out, I mean, as you know, I'm in Manitoba. I was out in uh British Columbia, BC, and I had just moved there. This was years ago. This was when GPS, you remember the GPS's the clunky ones, a little bit bigger than your cell phones, you'd put them up on your window or your dashboard.

SPEAKER_00 4:41

Yeah, like the garment.

SPEAKER_01 4:42

Yeah, yeah, like yeah, exactly. Yeah, so I had one of those, and I was coming up on this this I was on the street, and up ahead you could see there was like a police checkpoint or something. It was the middle of the afternoon, two or three o'clock in the afternoon, broad daylight, whatever. And so I'm just we're bumper to bumper, slowing, inching and squinching our way, and then I get to the front, and this cop waves me in to the to pull over, right? So I'm like, okay, whatever, and pull in, pull over, and uh he comes up to my window. And this is the funniest stuff I think I've ever seen. He's got the heaviest Australian accent you've ever heard, right? Clearly, clearly not born and raised in Canada, right? Yeah, which nothing wrong with that, but it's funny when it's paired with what he had to say to me, right? He I roll my window down, he comes up, he leans in my window, and he points at the GPS that's on that's on my dashboard, right? I'm completely hands-free, and he goes, What's that? This is my worst Australian accent. What is that, sir? Right? Like, it's it's a GPS, like what it's telling me where to go. He's like, Uh, you you're a distracted driver. I'm like, uh, no, it's hands-free. I said, and it's stuck to my dashboard. He's there, and he just goes from like a one to like an eight, and he's yelling, sir, you are a distracted driver. I'm like, I'm like, sir, why would they but make and sell these things in the stores if I wasn't allowed to use them? And he's just, but he just takes it from one to ten, screaming at me. I wasn't being a dick at all. I was just trying to explain to him. I don't know if he didn't know what they were or what, but he kept accusing me of being uh a distracted driver. But I could tell that he wasn't a hundred percent positive because he didn't end up giving me a ticket, right? I said to him, I said, okay, fine. If you want to argue with me, fine. I said, tell you what, give me the ticket. I will see you in court, and I want to see you argue to a judge in court when I'm fighting this ticket that a GPS system designed for drivers is a distracted driver when it's when it's on your dashboard, hands-free, not touching it, right? I want to see the judge's face when you tell him that, right? He wouldn't show. There's no way he'd show to that. Yeah, absolutely not, right? He'd look it up and he'd go, Oh, yeah, no, I'm not going to that. So he didn't give me a ticket, but it was just a principle that instead of asking me what it was, listening to my answer, and you know, having an open mind about maybe something he didn't know about or whatever the case might have been, he just decided to go to like an eight or a nine and start screaming in my face, calling me a distracted driver, and it's like, how dare I say otherwise to him? And that that's an ego that is out of control, right? I can't be wrong in this situation, right? So um, that's just one example, and I know it's not, you know, uh, he didn't physically abuse me or anything, but again, that's an example of people who should not have badges, right? You should be able to engage with the public in an adult, respectable manner. If you come up, come up to someone, you don't know what something is, and you ask them, they give you a reasonable, logical explanation, you should be able to say at that point, oh, okay, have a good day, right? You don't need to start screaming in people's faces, threatening violence and threatening all this stuff. You don't need to do that, right? That's ego that's doing that. Um, what about you? You ever had any kind of an engagement like that?

SPEAKER_00 8:24

Yeah, yeah, uh you know, the the I'm I'm thinking off the top of my head though of a couple of sports examples of this that happened recently. I don't I don't know if you've heard of either one of these, but one of them involved um Scotty Scheffler, who's like the number one player in all of golf, right? And this is a couple of years ago, and he was trying to go, I I think it was like the Masters or something like that, and he was running late, right? And of course, there's a checkpoint, and he he kind of like puts down the window, like clearly it's Scotty Scheffler, and he sort of just kind of casually drives around them, and they're like, whoa, whoa, you know, and they they chase after him, like pull him out of the vehicle, tackle him, you know, handcuff him, all this shit. And it's the number one golfer in the world trying to get to the tournament, you know? And it it's like uh clearly somebody didn't get the uh the memo on this thing when that happened. Wait a minute, I lose you. You there? Oh, I can't hear you. You're muted. Okay, wait a minute, you're back.

SPEAKER_01 9:35

I'm here, I was muted. Did I freeze?

SPEAKER_00 9:37

Yeah, you froze. Okay, anyway, sorry, I'll I'll keep telling that story. So, so anyway, so Scheffler tries to go around the checkpoint. He clearly puts down the window, is like, I'm Scotty Scheffler, the number one player in the world. And they're just like, No, you know, and they went after him, tackled him, pulled him out of the vehicle, handcuffed him, took him to jail like he got a mug shot. And uh, like on X, I follow the uh the parody account for Shooter McGavin from Happy Gilmore. He's like, Welcome to the club, Scotty, you know, and he's like posting the shot next to like John Daly and Shooter McGavin. So, you know, that was kind of a funny example of like the the tuned-up cop. I've also seen it where they do it's the tuned up cop racial example, right? Where um I think the guy is uh he was like one of the star receivers for the Miami Dolphins, you know, and he's again trying to get to the game to play the game, and he's in his his black Lambo or whatever, and they pull him over and they're like, get out of the vehicle. And he's like, What? Like I'm just driving, you know, and sure enough, they tackle him right into the street, you know, they we're taking you away, you know, and so he's like, What do I do? Like, no one knows, you know. So I think you have those, there's there's some of these examples where they're like, they're like tuned up and they're ready to go. But like you said, I think they get um kind of jaded. And so, like one of my uh best friends growing up, he's a corrections officer, yeah, just like you had mentioned, right? And I I asked him at one point, I'm like, you know, how's it going over there at the jail? He's like, Well, you know, I babysit assholes all day. Like, oh, okay, great. He's like, Yeah, he's like basically they stay in line, we don't have any problems. They get out of line, yep, we're gonna have problems. It's like, huh. And and you know what I I think their their patience goes from like real wide to real thin. It's like razor thin. And and you just give the slightest bit of back talk, and like you said, they they go from like one to ten in an instant, you know?

SPEAKER_01 11:50

Yeah, yeah, there was another time I was driving in Ontario. Uh, I was driving back to Manitoba and I was working for a dealership at the time. So I had uh, I don't know if they have them down there, but they're called dealer plates.

SPEAKER_02 12:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:05

Yeah, for transporting vehicles, right? Uh, from when when you're someone trades in a vehicle or whatever the case might be. When a vehic when a dealership is transporting a vehicle, we use a dealer plate, right? Uh so I had a dealer plate on the back of the truck that I was bringing back to Manitoba, and uh must have been about 10, 11 o'clock at night, and this OPP pulls me over, and it was this old cop and this young cop, this rookie, and I was like, I see what's happening here. It's training exercise, right? So the the the old cop, you know, the he comes over to my window and he asks me he asks me to get out of the truck. I get out of the truck, and uh he starts asking me, you know, is there is can we search the vehicle? Is there anything in the vehicle? I'm literally transporting a vehicle. There's like my little backpack and like some burger wrappers. That's it, right? In the truck. And uh I'm like, yeah, go ahead, search the vehicle. I don't care, right? So they go through this search of the vehicle, it takes them, I don't know, 20 minutes or so, and I'm just standing at the back of the vehicle waiting and waiting. And uh the old guy comes up to me with the young guy, and he says, You're lucky. I said, I'm lucky for what? He's like, You're lucky you gave us permission, otherwise, we would have brought the dogs here to search the truck. And and I was like, Okay, your dog would have found a hamburger, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:25

Right?

SPEAKER_01 13:25

Like, what do you what's going on here, right? He ends up giving me a ticket for a uh default uh defect on the vehicle, which was the the dealer plate, because he didn't know what a Manitoba dealer plate was, so he gave me a ticket for it, and I tried to explain, he wouldn't listen, and then they towed my the truck back to the the the closest town, which cost me about 400 bucks, right? Because it was laid at night.

SPEAKER_02 13:52

Really?

SPEAKER_01 13:52

Wow, yeah, they wouldn't let me drive it because this apparently the plate wasn't a valid plate, so they they towed it. So I ride with the deal uh with the tow truck guy back to town, and the cop just takes off. And I told him, so he's like, Where the tow truck guy's like, where do you want me to drop it? I'm like, just at the Husky truck stop or whatever, right? He's like, Okay, he's like, You're gonna drive it, aren't you? I'm like, Yeah, like I'm gonna go into Husky, I'm gonna eat something, and then I'm gonna hop in the truck, and I and I'm just gonna GPS the dirt roads until I get past this jurisdiction, right? And that's what I did. And I ended up going to the closest town, the district, for to fight the ticket. And this was funny. I go to court, of course. The cop doesn't show up, right? And but I've I've never at this point I'd never been to traffic court before. It's this tiny little courtroom, it's me, a judge, uh, I'm a prosecutor, I guess. I don't know, somebody there representing the crown, whatever, right? And then there's me and like three people sitting there watching, and so there's like five or six people in the room total. And I go up to the stand, and the judge is like, uh, where's your lawyer? So I don't have a lawyer. He's like, You have a lawyer for for court. I'm like, it's traffic court. I was unaware I needed a lawyer, right? Like, what are we talking about here? And uh, because I had all the proof that it, you know, it was a valid dealer plate. The judge looks at me and goes, So what do you what do you plan to do here? I looked at him, paused for a second, said, Win?

SPEAKER_00 15:26

I don't know. That's where he calls the cops. Hey, bring him outside, beat the shit out of this guy.

SPEAKER_01 15:33

Yeah, he actually starts laughing, right? And he's like, Okay, he says, Well, he said, uh, officer so-and-so uh didn't show up, anyways, so we're just gonna throw this out, right? And but he he got a hoot out of me saying, When I don't know, like that's my that's my expectation here, right? But just the fact I had to do all of that because this cop wanted to be an asshole, right?

SPEAKER_00 15:59

Yeah, so uh I I was gonna say, you know, I I think um, you know, in a way they profiled you, right? So they they didn't necessarily profile your race, but they profiled the dealer tag, and they said, Hey, we're gonna make an example out of this one, you know.

SPEAKER_01 16:20

I was younger too, so yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:22

But I I I think they do that a lot of times, where it's like they do kind of profile certain things. And so I had a former boss of mine that he was a cop for like eight years, right? And he he used to tell us all of his old cop stories, and some of them were like hilarious. And um, like one of them was uh if you were look if you were anywhere like uh like a Friday afternoon after five, anything like that, if you spot a vehicle with a ladder on it, pull him over. You know, he's got warrants, he's he's fucking he's halfway drunk, you know. And it was kind of like you know, there the he's he's got uh there's there's definitely drugs in the vehicle, pull it over, and you got an easy one there. That's a slam dunk, you know, because there's a ladder on it.

SPEAKER_01 17:13

Well there you go. Wow. Not driving around with a ladder on my truck after uh 6 p.m. anymore or whatever. Jeez. Yeah, it's true though, but the the brutality side of it, right? Um it's it's a complicated poor uh paralyzing polarizing topic because I would say that probably 60-40, 60% of the time, whenever you see a video of priest police brutality, what you see is the video starting about, you know, in in in a in a just you know favoring the victim kind of thing, right? Yeah, so the they don't record what the asshole, what the person did to antagonize the situation, they start recording where the cop is throwing them on the ground and putting them in handcuffs, and then everybody loses their minds. And nobody has the logic in the in the in their mind at all to say, well, what led up to this? How did this happen? Because they would have you believe that the cop just walked up, not knowing this person at all, decided to just grab them and pull a macho man Randy Savage on the dude, right? Right, right, and that happens all the time. Every time I see one of these police brutality videos, it always starts there, it never gives you what it led up to it, right? This person's probably in the cop's face screaming. For all you know, he hit the cop first, or she hit the cop first, whatever the case may be. I mean, I've seen videos, uh, I think it was last year, there was like at least two I could think of where you had these uh these angry, I think one was a black woman, she had a knife and she was trying to stab the cop in a hallway. Wow. And she's you could see it on his on his uh camera here that he, you know, on that he carries on his chest, whatever the body cams, right? And she's got this knife, and she's violently just you know swinging trying to stab him, and eventually he shoots her, right? And suddenly he's a racist, and you know, police brutality and stuff. I'm sorry, man. I don't care. I got a family, I got kids. If you're coming at me like that with a knife, and you're trying to do that to me, it's you or me, man. It's you every time my son needs me, right?

SPEAKER_00 19:32

Right, right, yeah. I agree with you 100%. I I think there there always seems to be an antagonist. And like we said, the the cops already got a short fuse, so it doesn't take much to light it. And when you do that that little tiny thing, that'll set them off. And you know, like one of the one of the new things today is like the the cameras, right? Like how the police wear cameras now, but they didn't used to. And you know, kind of like going back to my boss that was a cop, when he was a cop, they didn't have the cameras. And you know, he they had all these lines like, you know, like like two of us would be beating the shit off somebody, and the third guy's saying stop resisting. You know, like that's that's like how it would work, you know. It's like, yeah, we tuned this guy up over here. He kind of had it coming mouthed off at us, you know. And I mean, you can kind of you you can you can see how it's a real uh slippery slope. Like one of the funny things um where I live, the the police are referred to as JSO, right? And at one point in time, um, I worked uh downtown in this downtown environment, and you know, there's random homeless people that walk by and stuff, and there was some completely insane homeless guy that walked by us. We were you know coming back from lunch or something, and he goes, Hey guys, and we're like, Hey, he goes, He goes, you know what JSO stands for? And we go, uh, and he goes, just shot one, ha ha, you know, and off he goes. We're like, what?

SPEAKER_01 21:13

Okay, crazy man. Well, I think that there, I mean, there's like I said before, there's two major problems when it comes to police. What policing? One of them, as I said before, is the antagonists, the people who uh let's face it, at the end of the day, it doesn't matter what your race is, people are just stupid sometimes. They say and do stupid things in front of the police, to the police, and you get what you you get what you pay for at the end of the day, right? Yeah. Um but on the flip side of that coin, it's it's because of those people that I think part of the part of the the soup, you know, part of the ingredients of the soup here that you're throwing in is is those people. Who caused the police to start to stereotype everybody? Um, you know, because listen, I just dealt with someone who attacked me who looks exactly like you do, wearing the same clothes and everything, right? Two days ago. And now here I am dealing with you. I'm probably gonna approach it a little more aggressively because of I almost got, you know, I almost got a pokey poke the other day, right? In my little ribs. So um that's one of the problems, but you combine that with a combustible personality with a lot of these police. Another another incident I had where I was uh I was driving this truck on this highway, and this uh there was an RCMP in front of me, right? And he was driving 10 under the speed limit, and now there's like uh there's like five cars behind me, and we're driving down this highway. Again, he's driving like 10 under, so this little split lane opens up for about two kilometers, right? So I speed up to about I was going about seven kilometers over the speed limit, right? And in Canada, uh you can go up to like usually 11, 12, 13 kilometers over the speed limit, and there's no fine for it. You're just going a little a touch over, right? I think it starts it starts at like 20 over or something like that, right? Okay, yeah. So I'm going like seven kilometers over the speed limit, and just enough to inch past squinch past him as he's driving 10 under, right? So I take almost the high the entire two kilometer stretch there to just kind of slowly pass him, and he's speeding up a little bit because he's trying to get me to speed, right? Real asshole, right? So I end up passing him. He ends up coming in immediately. Susalyn changes, cherries come on, and he pulls me over like that, right? So I'm like, sure. So I pull over, and this guy, he must have been about five foot five. Uh oh, small man complex. Exactly, little man complex.

SPEAKER_00 24:04

Oh no.

SPEAKER_01 24:04

Here I am, six foot, 275 professional wrestler, right? Yeah, so comes up to the truck, and uh he's like, I he starts arguing with me about he's like, you know, how fast you he's like, you why did you need to pass me? I said, because you were driving under the speed limit, right? And uh he's like, Well, keeping everybody safe. I'm like, that's fine for you, right? But you're going under the speed limit. He's like, so you felt a need to go faster than the speed limit. I said I was going seven kilometers over the speed limit. That's like four miles an hour over the speed limit in the States, right? That's how insignificant it was, right? Yeah, so as he's arguing with me back and forth, and I said, Look, I said, Clearly, you got little man complex going on here, right? I said, Oh yeah, because I didn't do anything wrong, right? I said, I'll tell you what, buddy. I said, give me the ticket, and I'll see you in court for seven kilometers an hour over the speed limit. And he starts arguing with me. I said, You're not gonna give me a ticket because there's no ticket in existence, there's no fine set for going seven kilometers over the speed limit. It starts at 20 kilometers over, it's like 50 bucks or something like that, right? And I was like, There is no ticket to give, you're just being an asshole, right? And um, he argued with me some more and he said uh he kept saying, So just stick to the speed limit, just stick to the speed limit. Yeah, sure, sure, buddy, right? See you later, kind of thing. And because he didn't have anything, he didn't like I wasn't doing anything wrong. He probably had a bad day, he had a little man complex, he was antagonizing drivers by going 10 kilometers under the speed limit. For me, you're antagonizing the traffic by you want someone to pass you so you can pull them over. That's what you're doing, right? Yeah, yeah, and uh, and you could tell by his attitude when he walked up, too, that you know he had every intention. So that's what I mean by a combustible element with, and I get it. The three stories I've told they pale in comparison to some of the abuse that happens in the States and stuff like that, right? I get it totally, but I'm using them as examples of why a lot of these personalities should have been screened more through psychological evaluations and said this person has a you know can doesn't have the personality to be able to have authority over people without abusing it, right? Yeah, because most people don't. I mean, shit, I'm probably one of those people. That's why I'm not a cop. I'd probably be an asshole. Eventually, I might start with the best of intentions, right? But eventually, I'm probably gonna be a dick just like the rest of them. So I'm not doing it, right?

SPEAKER_00 26:51

Right. I mean, you you get talked back to enough times you you eventually would just be be ready to go off. Like, you know, it's it's funny you bring up the different traffic stories. Like my wife, um, I remember at one point here in the US, she got a ticket and it was literally three miles over the speed limit. Like, that's that's that's like a a fart in the wind. It's like, what? Like, what do you mean three miles over the speed limit? Like, what the hell kind of ticket is this? And she said, I couldn't believe he pulled me up. I'm sure she probably chewed him out, and he said, You know what? That's it. I'm writing you a ticket, you know.

SPEAKER_01 27:27

She that pushed a little too far and got it, right?

SPEAKER_00 27:30

Yeah. Um, have you seen? I don't know if you've seen this. There was a really funny skit that uh Chris Rock did this years ago. And it was it was basically around the idea of black people getting profiled and getting pulled over by the cops for no reason, right? And in the US, I mean that that happens all the time where it's like, hey, you're black, we're pulling you over, you know? And even even my former cop boss was like, you know, if you're gonna drive like the hoopty or whatever, like, yeah, I'm pulling your ass over. But at the same time, if you drove like a run-of-the-mill, like gray Honda Accord, he's like, No one gives a shit, you can just keep on going, nobody cares, you know. But anyway, so so going back to the Chris Rock thing, it was a really funny skit, and it was how to avoid uh being pulled over while black, and it goes through like like multiple scenarios. Like one of them was like, get a white friend, you know, and he's like in the car with him. He's like, Yeah, I'm driving with him. They're like, Oh, it's okay, you know, and it's it's one of them was like uh don't don't drive with a with a mad woman, and she's like, He got weed, and the cops are like, what? And it shows them like beat the shit out of him.

SPEAKER_01 28:49

I think I saw I think I saw uh Cat Williams do that too. He was talking about get you some white friends. He's like, if you get pulled over and you're in jail, it could be two o'clock in the morning. You call them, they'll be down there at the police station in their pajamas. What the fuck did he do? You get him up.

SPEAKER_00 29:08

You know, in seriousness though, I do think that there's certain like police departments as well as maybe groups of police that are kind of like a-holes, and then there's others that that aren't. And and maybe maybe there's some that are, but I think there are some good ones sprinkled amongst uh the bad ones. And so, like to give you an example of this, so like the the town that I grew up in, the police were just assholes, just all the time, you know, right? Um, they didn't they didn't listen to anybody on anything, they know everything, you're wrong. They don't, like you said, they don't let you talk, you know. They're what what what'd you say? What what what? You know, they're they're just like ready to like rip you out of the vehicle and take you to jail. And on the flip side of that, um, I had this really unique job in college. So uh in college, I had a roommate who got a job as a valet at a hospital, right? And I thought, hey, that sounds fun. I'm like, I could do, I could be a valet at the hospital. And so I ended up getting this job. And so at the hospital, there's multiple different um areas where they have valet, right? So one is like at the front of the cancer wing, one's like at the main uh entrance. And then they had another one at the ER. And the ER was like really entertaining, right? So I was like, shit, I'm like, this sounds cool. I'm like, I'm gonna try and get that one. And so what was interesting was at the hospital, you know, the the ambulances come in this loop, right? And they had this little room right there. And I would sit in the room, there would be the one guy from hospital security, which they're kind of usually like former military aspirations of being a cop. They're they're kind of at this stepping stone job of uh hospital security. And then there would be an off-duty uh police officer there with us. And so it would be like the three of us in there, just like hanging out and shooting the shit. And it was really, really interesting. Like I really got to know a lot of these guys pretty well and came to respect a lot of them. And uh the uh like the hospital security, they would get calls like like in the US, they refer to it as being baker acted, which basically means somebody's here on drugs and then they think they could be uh harmful to themselves. So we need you to go strap them down, right? And so they'd be like, oh, we got another one. They'd be like all jazzed up, yes, you know, they open the cabinet, grab the straps, throw off, you know. And so, like, like the uh the police officers, I would hear some of their stories as well, just sitting there, and they would kind of give me like the backstory of things. And it was it was really interesting. And so, where I'm going with this is one day I'm at Valet, right? And the way that the loop went, our lot was kind of on the side of it. So I'm just parking a car and I'm kind of coming back, and I see this Jeep come screaming around the corner, kind of going the wrong way, goes in through the one-way ambulance loop the wrong way, right? He's got like 15 police cars behind him, okay? Comes peeling in. I'm like, holy shit! I'm like, what's going on here? You know, I'm like, all right, I gotta, I gotta see this. You know, this is interesting. And so some lady gets out of the passenger seat. She's like, clothes are half ripped off, purple, bloody, runs up, you know, and I'm like, oh my God. And then the and then all the cops like get out of their vehicles, right? And they all get their guns out. Get the fuck out, get the fuck out of the car, you know. And I'm like, holy shit, I'm like, this is this is about to get crazy here. Like, we're gonna have a shooting, you know? And uh, and so anyway, so they're like, get out, get out, you know, and the guy won't get out of the car. And and he he must have just been like loaded on some kind of drugs or something, right? And so they eventually end up pulling the door open. I see the the vehicle starts kind of rocking, you know, they're trying to like pull him out of the vehicle, they can't get him out of the vehicle. And at one point, you know, going back to cops being tuned up, he reached for one of their belts. Oh no, oh no, yeah. This is this is like what you do, you do not reach for the cop's belt under any circumstance, right? And so I see the cop just just full-on haymakers, right? Just just blasting this guy in the car. And in the car still rocking, like I don't know if he had his seatbelt on or what, or you know, who knows. But but they're just blasting this guy, and eventually they uh they end up ripping him out by his ankles out of the vehicle, just just like you know, this is like 4 30 on like a Thursday or something, you know, like this just randomly happens, right? So they rip him out by his ankles, and uh at the same time, there's one cop that pulls out a taser, fucking tasers him right there, you know, like the the things fire out and stick in you in the pins. So he's tasering him, and then another cop's running up with the German shepherd, and they realize like they couldn't let the dog go because he just took you know 10,000 volts over here and apparently it would kill the dog if the dog went at him. So so it was it was like pure insanity, man. And uh, and so eventually they they smear the guy into the road, they handcuff him, they lift him up, and while they that they finally get him up, he's kind of like you know, like laughing, and his his face is blasted to eternity, you know, and the cops are just like ah, you know, like ready to go, like we got another piece of shit here, you know. It's insane.

SPEAKER_01 34:58

I've been on the other side of it though, or where I've benefited from crookedness um in the past. I used to um I used to work security at a government casino in Ontario for you for a few years. Uh with a obviously it and like you said, that was kind of like a stepping stone for a lot of people to get on with uh the OPP or the RCMP or whatever, right? Uh the police basically. And um so I was there for a few years. We were friends, I was friends with all the guards and stuff. And anyway, years later, I'm driving back through Ontario in my truck. I'm going like 30, 35 over the speed limit, right? I'm in a hurry. I can't remember why, but I I was I was very guilty. Very guilty.

SPEAKER_00 35:42

I'm starting to see a pattern here with all these traffic problems.

SPEAKER_01 35:45

Yeah, it's like 20 miles an hour.

SPEAKER_00 35:48

It wasn't my fault, it was them.

SPEAKER_01 35:50

Yeah. And so I'm I'm coming over this hill, and uh a cop comes over the other side, and I'm like, ah shit, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Fair enough, Yui. You know, he follows me for about two kilometers riding my ass and then turns his cherries on, right? Pulls me over, walks up, no BS. One of the guys I was working with at the casino, right? And he's like, Rob, how's it going, man? Blah blah blah. We're just sitting there talking, we're joking around. I'm like, how's the wife? How's the kids? Blah blah blah, and yeah, and I'm like, uh, and he's like, all right, man. And he's like, yeah, and I'm like, so you want my driver's license? He's like, no, man. He's like, okay. He's like, we take care of each other. I'm like, okay, I'm I'm not gonna argue with you here. This is very wrong. I'm very guilty. You have me dead to rights. I'll take, you know, I'll take it. Um, so I have benefited another time. I was working as uh I was working as the head of security for uh Walmart. I was I was a regional manager for uh loss prevention for Walmarts uh in my province. And I was uh I work all the time and I went to the movies in the same mall as a Walmart, right? I went to the movie theater with my wife at the time. We hadn't been out on a date in a long time. We were looking forward to it. So I'm in the movie theater and I'm getting these phone calls from from my office, right? It's like seven o'clock at night or whatever, so I'm I finally answer, I'm like, what? And they're like, they arrested this guy and the the two people on shift, they were two girls, petite girls, right? And uh they've got like this 40-year-old guy, I guess, big compared to them, right? Average size dude, probably six foot, two fifteen, something like that, right? Okay, and he's telling them because the cops, when you arrest somebody in that situation, the cops take like eight hours to show up to take the person off your hands, right? Really because they just have oh yeah, they just have more important things to do, right? So they I mean, for a shoplifter that's already in custody, they're like whatever. But the problem is the longer somebody sits in your security office, the more anxious they get, the more the time they have to sit there and think about the consequences of what they're you know, what they've done, they start getting froggy, right? So they call me and they're like, Man, Rob, we've had this guy in here for half an hour. He said that you know, if the cops aren't here in 10 minutes, he's coming, he's leaving, whether you know, and if we try to stop him, he's coming through us or whatever. And he could if he wanted to, right? So uh there was a buddy of mine who worked with me, big, big dude. And I was walking, I told my wife, I'll bring it back. I leave the theater because it's in the same mall, and I'm walking towards the Walmart. I see my buddy, and uh that works for me, right? And I'm like, I explained it as I'm walking, so he's like, Okay, like I said, big dude. I'm a big dude, he's like twice my size, right? So we go, we walk into the security office, and he's sitting there, and my buddy says, Uh, so you're gonna get up and leave at uh at uh seven o'clock or whatever the case might be on the penny if the cops aren't here yet. And he just he didn't say nothing, he just kind of looked like oh crap, right? My buddy walks up and just gently places his hand on the side of the guy's face, right on the side of his head, and just goes, wham, right into the drywall, right? His head goes to the drywall. The guy's half covered, his whole head's covered in drywall here. The cops show up, and the guy's like, Look what they did to me, look what they did to me. They put my they my head put that hole in the wall, right? The cop looks at us and he looks at the guy and he goes, You know what? I was here yesterday, and that hole was already in the wall. It's like I don't you're saying, right? So they because they know what we deal with too, right? Yeah, it's you know, similar stuff, so they know that there must have been a reason the guy was was being the way he was being, he was threatening women, so he kind of got what was coming to him, right? But again, it's just the fact that they just kind of let it slide. They shouldn't have. And we benefit we benefited from it, but we you know, people should not be handled that way. Um you know, after my after the guy put his head in the wall, I I stood him up, turned him around, put his hands behind his back, put him in handcuffs, and sat him back down. And then I just said, I'm gonna stand here in the doorway, right? Until the cops come and you're go through me instead of go through them, right?

SPEAKER_02 40:22

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 40:23

But yeah, just the fact that the cops didn't, I mean, you know, they they at the very least they should have scalded us a little bit for doing that, but you know, I mean, I didn't do it, I didn't put my hand on the guy, put it you know, but the other guy did, but it's just a fact that that's that's acceptable to them, right? And that's brutality while the guy deserved it for being an asshole. It was excessive force at the same time that should not have been used, right? And that they were perfectly fine with.

SPEAKER_00 40:53

Well, if if it happened, but I don't I'm not sure it happened.

SPEAKER_01 40:57

No, it's just that whole that hole was there.

SPEAKER_00 41:00

That hole was already there, yeah. I mean, that's a great story, but uh obviously it didn't happen.

SPEAKER_01 41:08

He's got the evidence all over his head, hey, they're just drywall.

SPEAKER_00 41:16

Oh boy, oh that's funny. You know, uh yeah, so my former boss, the cop, he would tell us stories of some of these guys that they would arrest. And uh he's like, Oh man, he's he he he always had crazy stories like the time he had lice or the time he got crabs or the you know that he acquired something from whoever was in the backseat. He even had one about a lady that was in the backseat that was like, I gotta go to the bathroom, you know, and she's like completely drunk, right? And he's like, We're almost there. And he said she put her legs up and just pissed all over the back of the car. Yeah. And so you you can you can kind of see how they get tuned up just dealing with shit like that, you know. Like again, it's you for the most part, the normal people are not the ones that come across your radar as a cop. You know, it's it's the it's the everyday shitbags. And like, I don't know if you've heard about this, but like I think in the US, this is a thing. It it probably is in Canada too, where you get you get some of these people that they come from a they come from a an environment where they've got no prospects, no money, nothing. Nothing's nothing's going for them. And the easiest thing to do is to get arrested so they can go to jail. And when they're in jail, they got a roof, they got food, they got a bed, they got people to hang out with. And and there, there's some of them that you know, they kind of refer to them as like repeat offenders, you know, that it's like this is just what they do, you know. It's like, yeah, I could get out of jail, but I'll probably re recommit a crime here so I can get back in jail.

SPEAKER_01 43:04

Well, they do that here, they do that here in uh in Manitoba because the winters we get at least a couple of people who who are unalived at at uh bus stops, they try to sleep in bus shelters and stuff. When it's like 45 below stuff like that, yeah, they yeah, they just they just uh you know they don't wake up again, right? It happens at least a few times a year here every winter. So a lot of them that's what they do. They they say, you know what, it's it's winter time, so I'm gonna go do something that's gonna get me six months in in jail, and it's warm. I like you said, I got a bed, I got three square meals a day, I'll come back out in the summertime, right? So yeah, it's it's strategic almost, and it's on the taxpayers' dollar. So they often say, Well, you know, there's not enough money to build enough shelters for for homeless people and stuff like that, right? Well, we're spending that money. Anyway, sheltering them in prison because they do it intentionally. A lot of them do it intentionally. Right. Like winter's coming. I'm not sleeping outside in a bus stop at 40 below. I'd rather be in a structured environment, right? Where no one's and no one's gonna bug them, right? They're just some homeless dude, they're not affiliated with anybody. They're not so I mean it's short term, and that's where the tax money's going anyway. So why not just you know build better shelters, bigger and better shelter houses and stuff, you know?

SPEAKER_00 44:35

Okay, what do you what do you think about um about sometimes you have scenarios, I think, where you get cops where they they're always working OT, right? Because you know, they do OT at this place or that place, they get paid like time and a half or whatever they're making. And I think there's times where they do kind of like stand down and they're like, I'm not, I'm not even touching this one, right? And again, going back to my my freaking former boss, he was telling us that he did uh OT a couple times in Daytona, right? And Daytona has a line that uh it's arrive on vacation, leave on probation. So some of these people, it's like they showed up at Daytona at like spring break 97 and they never left because they just like went to jail and then they were kind of out and then they went back in and you know back and forth. But he was telling us at one point, he was like, he's like, you know, he's like the worst, the worst assignment I ever did was he worked, um it was it like in Daytona, they have uh one of the events is bike week, right? Where all the bikers come in. Well, apparently they have like a rival event that's Black Bike Week. And he said he's like this lone, like a white cop in like a you know, a little convenience store or some shit, because you know, the owner's like, hey, like I need I need security this way. I know I need to make sure I'm not getting all my shit stolen, right? So he's in there and he says, he's like, it just gets like ransacked. He's like, you know, there's like 50 people that come in at once. He's like, I can see him stealing shit left and right. He's like, Whoa, what am I supposed to do here? Like, how do I how do I even do this? You know, and then again, like if something does happen and it and it gets crazy, you know, uh it's kind of like they're antagonizing it in a different way, right? Like, you know, I can think of another example of this that's kind of kind of common today in the US is um, and it really got popular in California in particular, was that they they changed it so any theft of like under $1,000 like wasn't a felony, right? And so you get all these people that they show up at you know a CVS and there's like 35 of them, they have like suitcases, and they're just stealing all the shit because no one no one can stop them. And the employees are kind of caught in the middle, and the cops either they're they're going after them full force or they're just like, I'm not touching this one, you know what I mean? And I I again you have that antagonistic aspect of it that it's like if I was a cop and I got called out, like you know, if they were like, hey, all units to the Apple store, we've got it, it's getting ransacked by 50 assholes. You know, you gotta take the call, and then you get there, like, what are you supposed to do? I'm I'm sure you're probably looking at it, like, all right, I'm just gonna pick one and like just beat the crap out of this guy, you know.

SPEAKER_01 47:37

Yeah, yeah, pick pick one from the herd and pick one up, you know.

SPEAKER_00 47:43

We'll make an example out of that guy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 47:49

There was uh, you know, I I ran security in in bars for over two decades, and I was running this this one bar, uh and it was known, it was a known police bar. It's where all the cops went off duty to you know have a good time and let loose because we had a good relationship with them, right? When something happened um that required the police, they always look the other way, or whatever the case may. They never gave us a hard time as security there, right? And and kind of in response to that, we would always make sure that they're okay in the bar, they're taken care of. Um, you know, they they get to skip the line, they don't get it, you know, they don't the bouncers don't go too far with them and stuff like that, right?

SPEAKER_02 48:37

Okay.

SPEAKER_01 48:38

Because they come in and they're they're basically they feel safe there when they're off duty, right? Yeah, and this one night the bar's clearing out and it's almost empty, and there's this guy standing over at Kochak, and he's just screaming at these two petite girls in Kochak, and I walk over and I'm like uh nice and calm, like I'm talking to you right now. I'm like, hey, hey, I'm like, what's going on? And he starts screaming about his jacket. He's like, they won't give him his jacket. And I look at him, I said, dude, you're wearing your jacket, right? He's literally wearing his jacket, right? I'm like, you're screaming at these girls, you're up here. There's nowhere to go from here except physical violence. Are you prepared to jump over the counter and start being physically violent with them? What are you doing? Right? You've brought it to a level, there's nowhere else to go except violence, right? Yeah, yeah. So you need to come down a little bit here. And he starts screaming at me, and he's like, Um, you know, some something like I'll kick your ass or blah blah blah. And the girls start laughing, right? And he's you know, he's obviously now he's a fed and they're like, You don't bite off more than you can chew, buddy, kind of thing, right? And sure enough, he you know pushes me. So I just grab him. I bounced him. I I I got a little bit, you know, frustrated. I'm bouncing him off every wall, and I can tell this guy is he is just you know, booger sugared out, right? And I'm bouncing him off the walls, I put him on the ground, I put my knee in his back, I've got his hands, you know, and he's on the ground, he's foaming at the mouth, he's so mad. Wow, and he can't feel anything that I'm doing to him, right? I'm not striking him, but when I'm bouncing around and stuff, I throw him on the floor, he's just foaming. He's so mad. There's literally foam coming out of his mouth. And uh, this other bouncer comes over, a buddy of mine, black dude, and he just leans on it. I'm the only one with my hands on this guy. Again, he's down on his chest, right? And uh face down, and he's screaming. And my buddy's like, dude, just calm down and he'll let you go. And he's oh you, you black, you know, and he's I'm like, dude, he's not even touching you, right? Like he's gonna say so. I'm like, you know what, he's not gonna stop, right? So I turn him around, I grab him by this his collars, and we're right at the door. So I just pick him up and I just launch him backwards, and he goes flying, gets the back of his head on the concrete, whatever, right? And I just close the doors, bars close anyway. See you later, buddy. Yeah, and uh I I show up the following weekend for my shift, it's like 6 30 p.m., 7 p.m. And these two uniform cops are there and they want to talk to me. So we sit down at the table, and I'm like, they asked me about it. They're like, so turns out he was a cop.

SPEAKER_02 51:23

He's a cop, yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 51:26

So they so they asked me about it, and I told them what happened, and um they I thought I was like, I was like, oh great, here we go, right? We're gonna cause a lot of friction between us and the police now because I I beat up one of them, right? And uh they both start howling, right? And I'm like, so now they're like, we're never gonna let them hear the end of this, right? Because they were they were pissed off at him because he started a problem in a bar that's a that's a police bar, it's where they like to go, and they don't want problems between security and them. It's a it's a good environment, it's a good relationship. So they're like, We're gonna bug him about this forever. Then he got beat up, hey, by security. And but the fact that he was in there, you know, freaking out, you know, borderline getting violent with two little women, yeah. You know, booger sugared out of his tree to the point where he's foaming at the mouth, didn't feel a thing I was doing to him, right? That's how far gone he was. That's the kind of guy that should not have a badge.

SPEAKER_00 52:32

Yeah, great point.

unknown 52:34

Excellent.

SPEAKER_01 52:35

You know, what is what is that personality doing with a badge?

SPEAKER_00 52:40

Well, he applied. There was an opening, right?

SPEAKER_01 52:44

Yeah, but how do you pass the psych with something like that? Like, you know, and but that goes back to my my kind of thesis that I think that there's a demand for police officers and uh not as much of a supply, so they kind of lower the bar in terms of you know qualifying, it seems like I I well I think it's fair to say that not every police officer has good judgment, right?

SPEAKER_00 53:12

And that's a perfect example of it. Like, not only are you a cop, but then you're making a terrible decision to get loaded, then an even worse decision to do it at the cop bar, yeah, you know, and then you get kicked out of it, you know. So it's it's it's like a domino effect of terrible decisions, you know.

SPEAKER_01 53:37

Yeah, I never saw him again. He never came back. I guess he just you know didn't feel he was welcome anymore or whatever. But uh, you know, the the police they like to have that relationship, they because they need a place where they can go and unwind too, that they're they can feel safe, you know, when they're off duty. And that guy put that in jeopardy by behaving that way, right? So I was surprised at their response. They just started howling, they're like, ha ha ha, he deserved it, right? And but probably did. He probably did 100% deserved more, right?

SPEAKER_00 54:13

So my uh my former boss, he um he would tell us that at the police station, like it was common that like they all kind of like dated like each other between the the women officers and the male officers. Like, like he was like, Yeah, like it was very common that like first you were dating this person, then you broke up with them and started dating that one. And it was it's like high school for cops, you know, and and I think in in that respect too, you know, you get these like crazy tuned up people, and then all of a sudden you have this weird love triangle that like goes to hell. Like every once in a while you'll hear like just some crazy story about like like, yeah, there was a double murder, and it's you know, three cops, you know, and so and so was it's like an office uh quarrel, you know, but but they're all police, you know, and and you would think to yourself, like, okay, that's probably the last place you want to date people, but that's that's the first place they start dating people because that's who's that's who's in front of them, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 55:18

Yeah, well that's that's who's around you on a regular basis, exactly. Yeah, yeah. Well, they they also say that I mean the the domestic uh uh violence uh statistics are extremely high in police households.

SPEAKER_00 55:36

Yeah, yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01 55:39

And I think that leads back to again, it's not a justification by any stretch of the imagination, but I think that leads back to uh what they see, what they deal with, and it just mentally and emotionally uh changes them into someone that shouldn't be in a family environment, right?

SPEAKER_00 55:58

Yeah, yeah, I know. So I had a a really good friend that he always kind of had an aspiration of being a cop, right? And he was a uh plumber, right? And he was like, you know, like I'm doing great. He had his own business. I mean, he had like a hundred thousand dollar Jeep. I mean, he was doing very well on his own, right? He's like, I really want to be a cop. And I was like, You sure you want to do this? You know, kind of questioning him, right? And he was telling me, he was like, he's like, Yeah, you know, like I've always wanted to do it, and I I I think I want to try it, you know, before it's too late and this and that. He's like, but I do have a friend who's a cop, and he's told me some of his stories. I was like, really? Like, what what does he tell you? And he and he was like, Well, you know, basically, like the the cops are kind of like only sporadically on the good in the good parts of town, right? Really where they live the most is the bad parts of town, you know, and it's like, oh yeah, the other day, you know, he got his finger broken, and you know, and then you know, somebody bit him, and then he had to get a rabi shot, you know, and it's it's like you hear these stories and you're just like, what? You know, and it even my uh my former boss, he told us a story where he said he said the worst fight he ever got in was with a college kid. And he said uh they they started wrestling around and somehow they got they were on the ground, and he said the kid took a brick and hit him in the ear with it. And he's he said he's like, you know, my my balance has never been the same since after getting hit in the ear with a brick. And and again, you hear that, and it's like, you know, no wonder they're they're just ready to go because this guy over here hit him in the head with a brick. Like you and I would never do that in a million years. Yeah, yeah, you're somebody that did, and and he's gonna have permanent damage forever, you know, with his balance because he got hit in the head with a brick, you know.

SPEAKER_01 57:58

Yeah, it's gonna throw your equilibrium off forever, right? Like, yeah. It's you know, and you got the extreme cases as well. I mean, you got your uh uh what's his name? Uh Floyd.

SPEAKER_00 58:10

Oh, yeah, George Floyd. Well, that's definitely on the cop on that one. I felt, you know what? In the story of George Floyd, obviously this is this is a charged issue, right? Well Floyd supposedly used a fake $20 bill, and then he decides to arrest him. And the cop that killed him put his knee on his neck for like you know, 10-20 minutes, whatever the crazy thing was. So the other three officers that all got they all lost their careers, they all went to jail. Uh, like a couple of them were like brand new, you know, like like that. It was like training day, you know, like like they were like with with a crooked Denzel, and Denzel decides to kill this guy. And now Yeah, and now and now by the way, you're going to jail also, and now you're no longer a cop. Like, holy cow. And it's because you didn't do anything, but again, like what what are they? I I get it that that guy's not doing the right thing, but in the moment, like, what are they supposed to do? Like arrest the cop, arresting the guy?

SPEAKER_01 59:15

Yeah, arrest yeah, like it's their first day on the job, right? Like, do you go into superior? Yeah, if you and it's not an excuse or a compo, but it is true. I mean, if you go into your your new job, it's your first day working in a kitchen, and a guy's cooking the food wrong, he's sending out raw meat, you don't know what the hell you're doing. So you're you're not gonna say, hey buddy, what are you doing? He's gonna you know what I mean. Like, yeah, no one realistically you know does that on their first day at work, right? Right you're there trying to be a sponge, you're just you know trying to get through the first day, right?

SPEAKER_00 59:53

But you know, truthfully though, I I think that's kind of how these things happen is there's like like let's say a group of cops, and there'll be like one bad actor. And the one bad actor doesn't have good judgment, does something way off, and everybody else is just kind of there, and they almost get like shell shock, like like what do we do? And they just don't know what to do, you know. Kind of like like the ice uh shootings that happen in in Minnesota, you know, same deal, right? Where it's like, you know, hey, this guy's got a camera. Okay, let's tackle him and beat the crap out of him and pepper spray him. And then some guy's like, hey, I'm gonna execute him now with my gun. All right, like that was that that you just took this like way too far, you know. It went from like one to ten in like ten seconds, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:42

Yeah, absolutely. And it, you know, it's uh it's that thin blue line as well, they talk about the the blue line or whatever, where they say they just cover for each other no matter what, because you gotta I understand the whole thing, you gotta watch out for each other, but not when one of your fellow police officers is is breaking the law, right? Do you have to protect each other and be there for each other? Yeah. But if somebody who's supposed to be on your side or you know on your team is doing stuff shouldn't be doing. Are they on your team?

unknown 1:01:17

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:18

Yeah. Yeah, but but again, if you're a lone actor and turning them in, then you could have a lot of fallout coming to you as being the one turning them in. Like, like you see that sometimes with like uh, you know, these shows in like Baltimore or like Philadelphia, you know, where it's like, yeah, not everybody in the department is like on the up and up. Like there's there's a quite a few of them that they've been doing this so long, they hate everybody, they hate you. Yeah, they're taking money because the world owes them, and now you're gonna turn them in. Like that's that is that's like a uh the keg getting ready to blow, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:57

Yeah, it's it's it's a lose-lose, in my opinion. Well, I mean, we're just about out of time, brother. What are you uh what are your thoughts summing up uh summing up the whole police brutality topic?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:13

It's that's a loaded topic. You know, I I think I think like we what we touched on earlier, usually in every form there's some sort of an antagonist. I can see how the cops are just sort of jaded because of the daily shit they have to put up with constantly. Like I said in that last example, I can see where you don't want to be the one outlier, like, hey guys, this isn't right, and then all of a sudden they're clubbing you, you know. I mean, I can kind of see like how the whole thing like just unravels and and kind of goes to shit. And then likewise, I mean, like you said, you get some of these cops that are totally unqualified that probably should have never been there to begin with, but they are and and what do you do because the department needs people. I mean, it's it's a very complicated issue. I don't know if there's there's any like right way or right path or right schematic. It just kind of seems like every situation is case by case, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:03:18

Well, for me, the way I look at it is is really quite simple. At the end of the day, there's a lot, like you said, it's a loaded situation. There's a lot of nuance to it. However, having a uh having a police force, having the existence of police in our society is the only thing that makes our society what it is at the end of the day. I don't care. Yes, I don't care how nice of a person people think that they are, if you know that you can do something to another without consequences, it's in our nature to do it. Greed, selfishness, and self-preservation will persevere if there's no fear of consequences of your actions at the end of the day. So while there are a lot of issues when it comes to policing, they're the only thing holding our society together is the enforcement of the law, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:22

I think that's spot on. You know, you you've seen a lot lately about uh like the message of defund the police. I disagree with that 100%. Like, that's absolutely insane. And then, like, what's kind of ironic where I live is the police chief is black, and often, at least like once a year, there'll be a video that comes out and they'll be like, Yeah, the racist cops are you know beating people up or this or that. And then the police chief comes out and goes, No, you got all wrong. Like, here's what actually happened. Let me give you the real facts. And you can tell he's just like sick and tired of talking about it, but he has to do it, and it's like, yeah, this isn't a racial thing, this is a you broke the law thing, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:06

Yeah, but we don't we don't like accountability in our society today, though. So we like excuses and cop-outs, somebody else's fault.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:15

Yeah, it's always someone else's fault, right? And then all of a sudden you get you know your ass beat by the cops.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:21

Yeah, I'm innocent.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:26

I didn't do anything, sure. Okay, yeah. This just happened, they're just like, um, that guy, right? Yeah, he's got a ladder on the roof, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:05:36

Yeah, get him, he's got a ladder. Oh man. Well, guys, we will be back tomorrow with another episode of the paradigm shift. Hopefully, you guys will be here for that. Thank you as always for supporting us. Whether you are watching us on YouTube or listening on Spotify, Apple, or any other uh podcast location. Make sure you give us a five star review, like and subscribe on YouTube. And we will see you guys tomorrow. God bless. Shift out.