Paradigm Shift
The Everything Podcast, hosted by the dynamic duo Rob and Jesse, is your weekly dose of unfiltered conversations that truly cover everything—from the latest crypto market rollercoasters and tech breakthroughs to wild life stories, random hot takes, and whatever absurd rabbit hole the hosts tumble down next. With Rob's sharp, no-BS insights and Jesse's laid-back humor keeping things grounded yet unpredictable, each episode feels like kicking back with two old friends who aren't afraid to dive deep, roast bad ideas, or just geek out over the weirdest corners of culture and current events. Whether you're into finance, memes, or pure chaos, it's the show that somehow makes it all connect.
Paradigm Shift
Paradigm Shift:JFK Conspiracy theories
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Listen As Big Rob And Jesse Breaking Down What REALLY Happened To JFK And Who Was Involved
All right, guys, welcome back to the paradigm shift. I'm of course Big Rob back with little Jesse. What's going on, buddy?
SPEAKER_00Wow, so demeaning to start off the episode. Thanks.
SPEAKER_01In the first statement.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. Just just sweep the legs out right off the get-go.
SPEAKER_01How are you doing, buddy?
SPEAKER_00Doing great. Doing great. Uh, looking forward to today's topic. I think this one will be very interesting down the rabbit hole of conspiracy theories.
SPEAKER_01Yes. The old JFK conspiracy top 10 conspiracy theories. Uh, do you have anything you want to get into before we start the list?
SPEAKER_00Hmm. Well, I would say that uh I know we talked about doing this as a part one where we're going to focus on JFK, and we're going to do a part two where we focus on uh RFK. So I think this is going to be very interesting and uh possibly eye-opening to a lot of people on the different possibilities of what really happened with each assassination and maybe why and all that uh comes with it. So yeah, should be uh should be interesting.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. All right, so coming in at uh the number one conspiracy theory for um, and this is not there's no uh order in terms of I say number one just because it's the first one we're going with, it's not the biggest one. Um that makes sense. But number one on our list is the CIA or rogue CIA elements did it. Uh motive often tied to anger over the failed Bay of Pigs invasion, Kennedy's uh perceived softness on communism in Cuba, or his threats to reorganize or dismantle parts of the agency. Oswald is sometimes cast as a CIA asset or Patsy, popularized heavily by Oliver Stone's film JFK.
SPEAKER_00Right. And to add to that, um, apparently the theorists also said that JFK's uh refusal to provide air support during the Bay of Pigs was part of it, along with his apparent uh firing of the CIA director Alan Dulles. So that's pretty interesting as well, because you know, fun fact, uh in Washington today, uh, you know, Dulles Airport still there, right? So pretty prominent figure that Kennedy fired. So when you look at this theory, it's it's kind of the we they took him out from within, right? Uh a rogue part of the government took him out. And we're saying it's a CIA, and we're saying it's politically motivated, and it's also because of him removing Dulles.
SPEAKER_01So well, let's expand on that briefly. Why did he fire Dulles?
SPEAKER_00I don't know the exact reason why he fired Dulles. We may have to look this one up. I don't I don't know the specific uh reasoning around it. Now, I would say that a president, uh, you know, like you see this uh with Trump a lot, uh, has the right to fire most of the heads of government of the different government departments in the U.S. at will, whenever they want.
SPEAKER_01Um and maybe why couldn't why couldn't Trump why couldn't Trump fire Ginsler then?
SPEAKER_00That one was different. That's that's different. Uh because he's the what was he, the SEC?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, he was the chair of the chair S E C.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I I think that one's a little different. They're not all exactly the same. Um but something what's that?
SPEAKER_01I suppose Dulles.
SPEAKER_00Uh D-U-L-L-E-S.
SPEAKER_01E S?
SPEAKER_00Okay. Yeah, Alan Dulles. Why was he fired?
SPEAKER_01While we're waiting for that to load, go ahead and continue on with what you were saying.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I no, I was just saying that, you know, in the US government that they can in most of the departments fire or remove the head and sort of like appoint somebody new. So um was there reason to remove Dulles that upset the apple cart in the case of Kennedy? Possibly, you know, like like one of the things with the Kennedys is that I think what's going to be a recurring theme throughout this episode and the next one is that they were very popular, but with that popularity, they equally made a lot of enemies along the way. Both of them.
SPEAKER_01Well, according to reports, uh Dulles, uh the director of Central Intelligence, was forced to resign by JFK primarily because of the disastrous failure of the Bay of Pigs invasion in April of 1961.
SPEAKER_00Okay, so there you go. So he was the fall guy for the Bay of Pigs. That's what it was.
SPEAKER_01The Patsy.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, the fall guy. Interesting. Very interesting.
SPEAKER_01So So what what would the motivation be, though, like behind taking out JFK? Like, who who would have been so upset with him, with the exception of Dulles himself, to the point where they would want to eliminate JFK because of this?
SPEAKER_00Well, I think he was extremely popular, right? And arguably the US hasn't had a president as popular until Obama came around, truthfully. So, and I think that era of the US, um, it at least from what I've been told from you know professors and you know, my parents and stuff like that, you know, there was like a lot of uh a lot of hope at that time, a lot of like national pride, and kind of, you know, like a lot of people really liked where the country was at. So he had a lot of power. Um lot of power. And you know, his his dad was in the government, he was uh, I think JFK was in World War II. Um, so you know, there was a lot of uh he had a lot going for him, right? So so he's a formidable uh adversary if if you got in his crosshairs, right? And something like the CIA, you're saying, like, well, uh a person in that position of power, they really kind of need on their side. And so the moment that they're at odds, that's that's a problem, and a pretty a pretty big one at that. Um yeah, so I you know, where do you stand on it?
SPEAKER_01I mean, I don't know. I don't know how I feel about uh Dulles being terminated being the reason for eliminating. I think it's I think it's probably bigger than that. Uh while I would agree probably was a very influential you know individual. I I don't know, I I feel like there's more to it than that. Maybe, maybe.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that could be.
SPEAKER_01It could be one of the straws that broke the camel's back, so to speak. But yeah, I just uh I don't know. Going well, like so going over to the CIA, which is our original number one, so you think that the CIA would have you know been involved in this, or or you don't.
SPEAKER_00Well, uh think about it like this, too, right? Like, who who has access to the president? The government, predominantly, right? I mean, they would have common access to him at different times, and then equally they would know his schedule and kind of where he's gonna be and when. They would know it in advance. Um, you know, like something like JFK assassination. I mean, this is an event that didn't just happen in an afternoon, right? Like, there's there's work that goes into something like that.
SPEAKER_01Um well, it's it's funny, sorry to cut you off there, but it kind of brings me towards Trump and the similarity here with the shooter on the roof in Carolina, I think it was.
SPEAKER_00Pennsylvania.
SPEAKER_01Pennsylvania, sorry. Yeah, um, very similar in an aspect of someone had to know where I don't want to call it a blind spot, but an opportunistic position for a shooter to be in, you know, the that would have to be inside information. You don't just lock upon a blind spot or uh a weak point uh of fantastic opportunity in terms of line of sight, right, to the president. Um, you know, the the the Secret Service doesn't just hand those out like tic-tacks, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, if you think about this, like let's let's just go down the rabbit hole and say it's the CIA. I mean, this would be this would have been something that was planned out for the highest rate of success, right? Where's the highest rate of success? Where could we get a a clear shot if we had a sniper somewhere? Well, you know, he needs to be at this point of the route. This particular building, you know, nobody was in it, so we knew that sixth floor was abandoned. It has a clear shot. This is all true. But, and we haven't talked about this yet, where the interesting wrinkle is in this theory is the CIA, um, at least what I've what I've seen in different kinds of breakdowns of this and and other events, likes to have a full uh playbook of what's going to happen, right? Like they plan this out to like the nth degree, like they know who's gonna be where and when. Now, that said, what they really like to do is have somebody who is a Patsy that everybody looks to. That guy did it. And then in reality, the person who actually does it is not that guy, it's somebody who's right next to them.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's right. I can't believe you did that, Peter.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so again, if you think about this, like if you were the CIA and you let's say recruited Oswald, and you said, Hey, you know, you you don't like the Kennedys, we don't like them either. Here, here, we're gonna set you up, we're gonna get you a clear lane, we're gonna leave the door unlocked, you go the sixth floor out the window, you have a clear shot. Do you honestly think that the CIA is gonna put all their eggs in the basket of one extremist? No way. There is no way they're gonna guarantee that if they're carrying this out, he's dead at the end of it, and that that's where you have the potential other shooters, right? And so I I guess what I'm what I'm getting at here is that do I think that Oswald was likely recruited or at least influenced by the CIA? Probably. I think he probably was, but do I think that he's the guaranteed kill shot? No, I think that was the driver, and I do think it's CIA.
SPEAKER_01I did see that video where you can almost see pretty clearly the driver kind of you know, reach back and just kind of blow his brains out there.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. So in one of the um in one of the breakdowns of this conspiracy that I've seen, uh, somebody brought up something that was really kind of an obvious statement that we we just don't think of it that way, is that, you know, back then, I mean, this was the 1960s, right? Like you really didn't have like video editing, you had like film reels and stuff like that. And in the in the particular piece that I was watching, he said, if you watch it, it skips right right at like right around that time when the shots fired, like the video skips, and he said the video's edited, and it and they skipped out the frame where the driver leans over his right shoulder and shoots him in the head. And when it when it happens in in real time, and he gets shot like that, you see Jackie O climb up onto the back of the car.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. You know, I mean this from the driver, not towards them.
SPEAKER_00Correct, correct. I mean, think about this. Like, if somebody was firing from the back from above, then you your first instinct would be, oh my god, duck, right? Get down. Yeah, she didn't do that.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's a that's a very, very good point. Because yeah, your instinct, like you said, would be to get as low as possible on the floor so that so that the sides of the the insides of the car are gonna kind of protect you or shield you from a shot coming from. But yeah, if it's coming from the people who you've been trained, by the way, you've been coached to run towards in those situations so that they can protect you and you know put their bodies over your body and protect you, and so that's what you're told to do. Go towards the Secret Service, not away from them.
SPEAKER_00Right, right. And and and think about this: what is more far-fetched than you have an extremist on the sixth floor of a building firing a sniper round from what what was it, like a hundred yards, two hundred yards, whatever the distance was, or you have the guy sitting right next to him that turns around and shoots him in the head.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, it's and then, like you said, the response of her to jump on the back of the car. I've always thought that was weird until you and I sort of just kind of broke that down. I've always thought that was out of place. Every time I've watched the video, I've always thought, why does she jump on like the trunk of the like the back of the car? Like she's trying to get away from the car. Like, I'm not understanding that.
SPEAKER_00Well, well, and and think about this: like, if it was the driver, then when he shot the gun, I mean, I I I would assume it would have some sort of silencer or something, but whatever whatever happened, she would have heard that sound in the car, yeah, right? Which would have been right there, as opposed to the shot ringing out in the distance and then him getting hit in the neck. Like, do I think that Oswald hit him with one of the shots? Yes, I do, but I I think the guaranteed kill shot came from in the car.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, that's they wanted a zero, zero margin for error, right? If you if you're reaching back and you've got the gun pointed a foot or less from his face, I mean, you're not missing that shot, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And and you know, kind of going back to like the the Bay of Pigs is sort of being the maybe the catalyst for some of this, right? Um, like if you think about it, yeah, like that was like a black eye for the CIA. Like you, you and everybody found out about it, you know, you had this like operation go bad and it was a complete disaster. And then, like they said, you know, Kennedy didn't provide any any air support or anything, you know, these guys just got wiped out. I mean, it does make the CIA look pretty bad. And, you know, at the time, I mean, the CIA, you know, is kind of in that era of like Hoover, J Eger Hoover as well. I mean, they didn't play by they didn't play by any rules. I I don't think they play by any rules today, to be honest. Um, I mean, you you still see this today, right? Like, like, yeah, there's uh, you know, they'll say like there's CIA black sites around the around the world that we just no one knows what goes on there, like or if this if this thing is there, you know, or likewise in the US, one of the areas that is uh free of US law is these Indian reservations. So if the CIA is on that reservation, do you think they have to follow any rules?
SPEAKER_01Probably not. Nope. I don't think they're worried about following rules, regardless of anywhere that they are, because anyone who is potentially going to you know cause a problem for them. Guess what? Barrel of acid, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, absolutely. So okay, so for this theory, the CIA, what do you think? Did the CIA do it?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I do. I I think it was the driver. I think CIA, the CIA did it for sure. Yeah, I think uh Oswald was the Patsy, he was the person because, like you said, they're not going to do this without someone to blame. You gotta have someone to blame. What are you supposed to do? Oh, we don't know who did it. The shooter got away, that's not gonna fly.
SPEAKER_00Right, right. And and likewise in this story, um, Oswald was later killed by Jack Ruby. So the moment Oswald's dead, well, what's that? Deadman tell no tales? Yep, right?
SPEAKER_01Jack Sparrow.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, Jack Sparrow. Yeah, so I mean, you know, you got you you have theoretically the lone shooter who uh you know has this like radical tie to Russia. I mean, it's like your perfect villain, right? And then and then he's killed instantly, and we'll never know. Case closed.
SPEAKER_01Done. Yep. File it away. That's yeah, that's exactly what I think happened. But why? That's what we're diving into here.
SPEAKER_00Why? Why, right? Enemies, right? Let's go to the next one.
SPEAKER_01Next one, the mafia or organized crime was behind it. The Kennedys, especially RFK, as attorney general, aggressively targeted the mob. Uh, theories frequently name New Orleans boss Carlos Marc Marcello, uh, Chicago's Sam uh Garciana, uh, and Teamsters leader Jimmy Hoffa, Jack Ruby's killing of Oswald is often folded into the mob cleanup. And that is kind of if you've ever watched Sopranos, they do tend to tie up loose ends, right?
SPEAKER_00They do, they take care of loose ends. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01So what do you think? Do you think that the mob, maybe we can expand on that? I don't know how much you know about this theory.
SPEAKER_00I know I know a good little bit, and um I'm I'm pretty familiar with the mafia in America and kind of its rise and where it was at that time period, right? The 1960s. Um, you know, what's what's really interesting with the mafia is that um, you know, these guys are kind of like a basically like a gang that has a code of ethics, let's say, or not really ethics, but a code. It's a gang that operates by a code. And they try to follow that as as much as they can, and they build this, you know, family, the mafia family, right? And what is interesting, I think, with the mafia is that eventually somebody in this pyramid of of people slips up. You know, it usually happens somewhere along the lines. And likewise, I think if you were a Don, so you're one of the guys at the top, you know that there's a target on your back at all times because you're simply at the top, right?
SPEAKER_01Imagine living like that.
SPEAKER_00It it's it's got to be crazy, absolutely crazy. Yeah, there's always you always got to be looking over your shoulder, you know, when somebody's starting up the car engine, you know, it's kind of like, is today the day it's blowing up? Right, right. So it anyway, what I'm getting at is that there is motive, I think, for somebody at the top, um, as well as someone in the chain to flip and be on the take for the government. And there's numerous examples of this, like throughout history, of where the mafia, uh, you know, the person was also working with the feds one way or the other, right? And so I think that there's a high exchange of information that happens between the two. And I think in the case of the Kennedys, you have this rare event where both of their interests aligned together. Rid of JFK. So could theoretically the mafia have been working with the CIA?
SPEAKER_01That's a very interesting theory. Very interesting theory. And I could see it. I could see it, but here's the thing. Would the CIA not see it as similar to the way that the mob sees it, in a sense that, okay, it the deed is done. Now we got clean up loose ends, which is the mafia.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01They wouldn't just allow the CIA wouldn't just allow members of the mafia who were involved to just go on knowing what they know and where they could just be flipped by some other agency like the FBI down the road for clemency, right?
SPEAKER_00I don't know. It depends. It depends on the handler, right? Like who was who is the matchmaker? You know, who was the person that, or was it multiple people who set up Oswald, who set up the driver, who set up Jack Ruby, right?
SPEAKER_01I could see I could see the CIA involving the mob to the at to the event um to the degree of getting rid of Oswald.
SPEAKER_00Right.
SPEAKER_01I could see them involving them to do that, you know, the easily. Why? Maybe the mob didn't even know it was a CIA hiring them to do it. Right.
SPEAKER_00That that's true too, right? I I mean if you think about like the secretive parts of the US government are very compartmentalized. So, you know, it's like the left hand doesn't really know what the right hand's doing. They're completely independent of each other. So theoretically, could you have sort of like different operations part of one main goal? Sure. Yeah, you absolutely could. You know, you could say, uh, like on one hand, we're setting up Oswald and the driver to take out JFK. And on the other hand, we're setting up the mafia. We got a sweet deal for them. We're gonna ease off, you know, now that we gotten rid of him, we'll take care of the Kennedys for you. We'll ease up. And you know, what we need in return is for you to take out this shooter, and that and that's exactly what they did, right?
SPEAKER_01Oh, yeah, because the mob definitely would know at that point too, that it would be an easy deal for them because getting rid of Oswald, no one's gonna look too deep into who did it.
SPEAKER_00No, and and again, this I mean, this this guy's like uh, you know, uh build is like this Russian extremist. I mean, in the US, that's like enemy number one at that point in time, yeah, right.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, 100%. There was no sympathy for you.
SPEAKER_00No, no. So, okay, so where do we land on this? Mafia involved, yes or no?
SPEAKER_01To the degree of getting rid of Oswald, yes.
SPEAKER_00Do you think they were aware of the greater plot to get rid of JFK?
SPEAKER_01No, I think the CIA managed to hire the mob under false pretenses. I think that the mafia knew later after it was done down the road, I think that they had their suspicions that it was the CIA that hired them to do it for sure.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_01But I don't think they have confirmation. I don't think they ever had confirmation.
SPEAKER_00That's true. I I could see the mob getting wind of like, hey, you know, so-and-so told us they want to take out a little birdie, and therefore they need us to do them a favor. I could totally see that going down that way. So maybe they don't have all the details around Dallas and what transpired, but you know, it again, their interests theoretically aligned here. So yeah, why wouldn't they be a part of the you know, quote, solution, right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, and you gotta you gotta figure that they wouldn't be interested in asking too many questions, anyways. So if we do this, uh no more, no more Kennedy coming down on us.
SPEAKER_00Okay, well, it it at the same time though, it was uh RFK uh was the one with the aggressive war against organized crime. Yeah, so that would still be a loose end, but taking out JFK would put a huge dent in that, you know? Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Where do you land on it?
SPEAKER_00Um I do think they were involved, and I think I think they probably knew more than they ever let on, right? Um I do think they killed Oswald. And uh they're a part of it, they're a conspirator, right? I do think they're a part of this thing.
SPEAKER_01All right. Number three, LBJ orchestrated or enabled it as vice president. LBJ stood to gain the presidency immediately in his home state of Texas. Uh some vi versions claim he feared being dropped from the 1964 ticket or wanted freer reign on the Vietnam policy.
SPEAKER_00I feel like this one's a bit of a stretch. Um on the one hand, you look at LBJ and you say, okay, if Kennedy's gone, who stands to gain? Well, it's it's the VP, clearly, right? Because he now takes over. And would he have ever been president otherwise? Maybe, maybe not, right? I think he only did that that one term. Um so probably not. So does he have a motive if he's power hungry? Yeah, he kind of does. Uh, but but is that of his character is something that he would do or participate in or go that far, right? Is he that kind of a you really gotta be like a narcissist to do something like that, like an extreme way, you know, like power hungry. Was he by any accounts power hungry? I don't know if that's necessarily true.
SPEAKER_01Well, I think that if he was truly that aggressively power hungry, he would have found a way to win in the following election.
SPEAKER_00Great point, right? Like the escalation to go from I want to be elected to I'm gonna orchestrate multiple shooters to kill the president on a campaign uh trip in Dallas is a pretty far jump, you know?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I don't like this one. Is and then the added uh wanting freer reign on the Vietnam policies. Again, another reason that I think is kind of soft for that degree of consequence, right? Taking out the president because you want freer reign over policy in Vietnam.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that that doesn't even make sense because you know, in the US government, usually you have checks and balances between, you know, the House, the Senate, the president, etc. The the military. So this idea that like it, well, if you changed him, now you're just in charge of everything, it definitely wouldn't have flown in in the 1960s. There's no way.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, absolutely. I agree. So for me, that's an that's a no.
unknownNo.
SPEAKER_00I agree. I think that one's a no. I I can I can see where LBJ had a lot to gain, but I don't think it was in his character to participate in what actually happened. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Uh number four, the Soviet Union or KGB ordered it. Oswald had defected to the USSR, lived there, married a Russian woman, and expressed Marxist views. Motive is framed as revenge for the Cuban Missile Crisis, humiliation of Krush Khrushchev Khrushchev? Khrushchev? Khrushchev? Khrushchev? Khrushchev, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, Khrushchev.
SPEAKER_01What do you think about that one? Was Oswald a defected USSR agent?
SPEAKER_00No. I'm gonna say no, and and let me explain why.
SPEAKER_01Um expand on that.
SPEAKER_00Okay. Typically, from everything we've seen, even even recently, when the Soviet Union andor Russia wants to take out a pigeon who's squealing or doing whatever, you know, the whoever they deem is their enemy, and they want to take them out, they either poison them or throw them out a window. There are numerous stories of this, like uh, like in Russia, every time one of these oligarchs dies, they fall out a window.
SPEAKER_01Okay, every time in the back three times and threw himself off a bridge.
SPEAKER_00That's exactly right, right? Or like in uh in the UK, you know, it's it's like, yeah, he had a sip of his tea, and then all of a sudden he went to the hospital and he's got plutonium poisoning because he drank radioactive tea. And it's like, huh, okay.
SPEAKER_01Damn Starbucks.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. So so anyway, so my my point is I think their method of taking out and killing a target they don't like doesn't match up with what transpired with Oswald and and the you know potential other shooter or shooters. It's just not the way they do things, right? If anything, Kennedy would have been on the sixth floor and he would have fallen out the window, and then you could have said, yeah, it was probably Russia, you know, something like that. But but that's not what happened at all. So personally, I I can see where I can see where you could say I have a I have a strong distrust of the USSR, and I could see where you could say that you know having Kennedy in office is bad for us, and we need somebody who's favorable to our country. I can see all that, but at the same time, I think they would have done it differently if it was them.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it's a no for me because I feel that this was simply a convenient way to paint Oswald as the villain and have no one care what happened to him later. You know, having the the theory out there or the the aura out there, whatever the case word you want to use, that he was a defected USSR agent, especially like you said, Russia and the US at that time. No one was going to feel sorry for you uh in any way, no one was gonna look into anything that happened to you. Um so I think it was it was easy to use this to attack his character among the US people, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think you're 100% right on that. I think I think if you think about it like if you look at it from like the KGB angle, right, like this network of spies and operating in the shadows, would they kill Kennedy at a public event, like a campaign rally when he's he's in a motorcade? I no. And again, you know, when you think about um those examples I gave earlier, uh, you know, kind of like when we talked about the CIA and in that theory of the driver killing him, that the CIA isn't putting all their eggs in one basket of Oswald who's 200 yards away. They're gonna have the guy sitting right next to him because they can guarantee the kill. Well, likewise with Russia, Russia is not gonna put all their eggs in a guy that's 200 yards away and hope for the best that he, you know, he completes his mission. They're gonna serve Kennedy the plutonium tea or throw him out a window. That guarantees that he's dead, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I agree. So for for I guess we've landed on no for that one, not the Soviet Union. Number five, Fidel Castro, the Cuban government was responsible. Retaliation for repeated CIA assassination attempts on Castro and the Bay of Pigs, Oswald's pro-Castro activities and Mexico City visits to the uh Cuban embassy are cited. Funny how it all keeps coming back to uh Oswald's character.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it isn't interesting, isn't it?
SPEAKER_01It was Russia, uh Oswald, it was Cuba, Oswald.
SPEAKER_00You know what's funny with all the Oswald stuff is I uh correct me if I'm wrong. I I could be totally wrong on this, but you know, like did did we ever truly hear Oswald's story anywhere? Like, did anyone actually hear Oswald say his story or view? Or did we did we did we really track his movements very well? You know, I mean, like, like you said, everybody keeps framing Oswald, right? Oh, it's Oswald, you know, oh, he's the Russian extremist, oh, he's the Cuban, you know, uh uh defector, you know, he really likes Cuba, and and but we really never heard it from Oswald, did we? No, no, we didn't.
SPEAKER_01We didn't hear, of course, they keep they kept him quiet, right? They gave him the they gave him the um Epstein treatment, right?
SPEAKER_00The Epstein treatment. Yeah, and well, and and think about this too. Here's a here's another thing to consider. So, you know, at that time we we hadn't had the assassination of a president since Lincoln, right? So I don't know what what was that, a hundred years, give or take, whatever, right? So if you think about it, if if Oswald was like, you know, jazzed up on you know going to Russia and uh you know had it fixated in his head, he's taken out Kennedy, and that's that, because I'm pro-Russia, wouldn't he have had some sort of like manifesto, like you know, his journal detailing all the ways that he hates the US and loves Russia, and you know, how you know, like these guys, what I'm getting at is that you have to be a narcissist, and a narcissist craves the spotlight and the fame and you know, the glory of afterwards, you know, being infamous, right? Um, even in the case of uh going back to the Lincoln assassination, John Wilkes Booth was an actor, and he was known widely throughout Washington, D.C. as this guy that was on the stage in the spotlight. He liked the spotlight, right? So it actually kind of made sense that he would kill Lincoln. But with Oswald, what the hell was he before? You know what I mean? And and where's his manifesto?
SPEAKER_01Well, the he did no public interviews afterwards. Of course not. He did a couple of informal statements to the press, you know, as he's as being hauled away. That's what they're labeling it, informal uh statements. Uh, on the evening of November 22nd, and again on November 23rd, reporters shouted questions at police escorting uh him through the corridors. Oswald Oswald replied with denials such as I didn't shoot anyone and I haven't shot anybody. And the famous line, I'm just a Patsy. He suggested he was being targeted because he had lived in the Soviet Union. In one brief appearance, sometimes described as a press conference, notably on November 23rd, he told reporters he had not yet been charged with killing the president. At that early point, the formal charges were all developing. That the first uh sorry, that the first he heard of the accusation was from reporters themselves, and that a bruise on his face came from the police hitting him. He also reiterated his request for legal assistance. So apparently, when they arrested him, he didn't even know why he was arrested. Reporters are the ones who told him what he was being charged with.
SPEAKER_00Okay, I didn't, I just gotta say I didn't know all that. That is fascinating.
SPEAKER_01I was wondering if he had ever kind of you know come clean and said, Yeah, I did it, but no, he he maintained to his death that he was a patsy. That's an exact quote. I'm I'm just a patsy.
SPEAKER_00And you know what's fascinating? We're gonna get into this with our part two on RFK. But the guy who was uh found guilty for the assassination of RFK, Sirhan Sirhan, has said the exact same thing.
SPEAKER_01What a coincidence.
SPEAKER_00But again, what a coincidence. You and I talk about this all the time. Rob, do you believe in coincidence?
SPEAKER_01Absolutely not. I'm not saying it was aliens.
SPEAKER_00Well, okay, so that that kind of changes things a little. So think about this. So to be the lone gunman, you would have had to have some sort of manifesto or urge for fame or slightedness in in your life or something, or reason, motive, right? Motive for killing the president. Yeah. And he in every example there denied it. To his last breath. Did he even fire the shot? Do we can we even confirm that?
SPEAKER_01Uh was there ever confirmation that he fired a single shot?
SPEAKER_00Find out. Yeah, we we we need to find this out because think of this. I unless somebody, and and it's it's been proven throughout history that eyewitness testimony is garbage because people never quite remember exactly what happened, right? But unless somebody clearly saw him at the window and him pull the trigger, and then the president died, then how do we know that somebody else didn't pull the trigger and he was simply in the building?
SPEAKER_01Facts. Well, we'll find out in a minute. But to sum up the question, for me, it's a no for Cuba.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, going back to Cuba. Um, okay, so let's think about motive. So would Cuba have had the motive to take out JFK? I would say yes, because they did try and do the Bay of Pigs, right? Um Cuba was closely tied to Russia. Uh we had the Cuban Missile Crisis, right? Um there's multiple reasons. I think I do think there's multiple motives to say yes, they had a motive. Um, but at the end of the day, could Cuba have orchestrated what transpired?
SPEAKER_01Not against the CIA and CIA. There ain't no way.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there ain't no way. I mean, you know, you think about this this whole event, it wasn't really like one event, it's like multiple events that occurred, right? And for Cuba to be involved in that, they would have had to have been involved in multiple events. And I I don't see it, I don't think so.
SPEAKER_01Well, from what we saw, or from what I see here, sorry, as far as firing the shot. Uh so the rifle belonged to Oswald, uh, was found hidden among boxes on the sixth floor. Uh, ballistics, a nearly whole bullet found on the stretcher at Parkland Hospital, and two large uh bullet fragments from the presidential limousine were fired from Oswald's rifle to the exclusion of all other weapons, according to the FBI, but that can be faked. But as I scroll down here, there's limitations on the confirmation. No, no one testified to seeing Oswald's face at the moment he fired a specific shot. Uh, the case is built on the physical linkage of the rifle and bullets fragments and Oswald's ownership. So they confirmed that the rifle that he owns was the rifle that shot the bullet, but did not confirm that it was him who shot the rifle.
SPEAKER_00That's interesting.
SPEAKER_01So I mean, again, coincidence? I don't know. And why like why would he, if he did, if he knew he did, and they told him, like, look, bro, we got your rifle. The mullet, the bullet matches ballistics, right? If he had done it, why would he still be like you're cold busted? You're straight caught at that point, red-handed, hand in the cookie jar. Why would you still be saying I'm a patsy? Unless, you know, you were a patsy, unless they used your rifle, and then you know, if because listen, that's would that fly in court? Well, listen, it's his gun, and the bullet matches his gun. No one saw him shoot his gun. However, is that enough to put someone in jail? I don't think so.
SPEAKER_00Honestly, it probably depends on the jurisdiction.
SPEAKER_01That's a lot of problem. That's a lot of reasonable doubt.
SPEAKER_00I agree. I agree. You're 100% right. Yeah. Um, think about this though, also. Like, did did Oswald even have the skills to make that shot? Think about that too, right? Yeah, yeah. I mean, you know, he's he's on the sixth floor. He would be shooting, this is in the 60s, at a moving car with the president in it, and he would have actually made a kill shot.
SPEAKER_01Did he was even with, by the way, the president continuing to move as well, waving around at people and stuff like that, turning his head repeatedly looking both ways. It's not as though he was sitting perfectly still either. Yeah, you've got motion inside of motion from a hundred yards plus away.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, like I'm thinking like, I don't know if if you own any guns um or how how many you've shot in your like have you shot guns in your life?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I trained with uh right with sniper rifles when I was uh doing military training.
SPEAKER_00Okay, yeah. So I've I I've shot guns as well, and uh actually really like shooting guns, you know, which is kind of funny, but just love it. Have a great time firing some guns, you know. But if America, yeah. If you told me um, like, hey Jesse, uh we need you to take a shot from 200 yards out at the president at the motorcade at a campaign trip, and I need to make sure you don't miss. How do you even practice that? I mean, this is like a a one in a million shot. There is no practice for that shot, is my point, right? So you have to be good enough that you're just gonna make it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, the wind has to match like everything. Right. It's just way too much of a risk that he could miss. Aim small, miss small, patriot, Mel Gibson.
SPEAKER_00Spot on. Yeah, but you know, like did did you ever see um did you ever see that movie American Sniper? Yeah. Um that great movie, right? And and excellent point, right? Like a sniper in the military has a spotter. They have somebody, you know, with the with the binoculars, and they're like telling feeding them in the information, and you know, the guys like clicking the dial and and you know, moving it, and they're they're calculating like mathematically, you know, like okay, the trajectory of the bullet, and how far can we go till we make this this shot, and you know, will it connect all these things? And you're telling me that this guy went to Russia, had a good time, got a wife, came back. Now he's a quote extremist, and he's an expert marksman all of a sudden that he's gonna make that shot? Bullshit. No way, there's no way, you know.
SPEAKER_01Some of the it would that would be a very hard shot for some of the best snipers in the world.
SPEAKER_00It would.
SPEAKER_01So he would have to be among the best snipers in the world, best shooters in the world, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. And and clearly he wasn't. Um and then for him to say, yeah, I I'm a I'm a Patsy, I mean, it it kind of goes to show, you know, like, could he actually be a Patsy? Like, yeah, he probably could, you know, because it's like, was he in Russia? Yes. Uh, could you could you like reframe this to he's like this like dirty Russian sympathizer or something along these lines? You probably could, and that's exactly what they did. And then, you know, when you have the mafia clean it up and take him out, well, we we're never gonna know otherwise, you know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I agree. Uh, moving along to the next one. So we did land on no for Castro and uh Cuba, right? Yeah. Um anti-Castro Cuban exiles carried it out. Furious that Kennedy refused to provide direct US military support during and after the Bay of Pigs, some exile groups support uh supposedly took revenge sometimes while trying to frame Castro. It falls in the same category as Cuba for me. Okay, it's too much, too much of a stretch.
SPEAKER_00I agree. Um so I here's what I would say. So, like in the US, especially in South Florida, um you do run into this thing where uh some Cubans that are exiled will, you know, sort of they come from a place where the only way you survive is sort of by like getting any advantage you can, right? And so what I'm getting at is that there's a lot of like soft fraud uh that comes out of South Florida. And over over time, it was sometimes alleged that, well, some of that could be from the the exiled Cubans that have come from Cuba, basically had nothing. The only way that you're gonna survive there is being scrappy and adaptive and get what you can where you can, right? And so you're you're telling me that that group of people who sort of scrappy and adaptive is gonna pull off this whole orchestration of the Kennedy assassination. I don't see it. I just don't see there's no way, yeah. There's no way. Yeah, I I go ahead. No, I was just gonna say with them, I think again, it it it just doesn't line up. It it really just doesn't line up. Like it in the sense of them being scrappy and adaptive, if Kennedy was gonna die by the Cubans, it would have happened in South Florida.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I agree. Yeah, so that's a big fat juicy no on that one as well.
SPEAKER_00Yep, teed that one up for a no.
SPEAKER_01Uh number seven, there was a second shooter on the grassy knoll or multiple gunmen. Well, we kind of touched on this one already. Uh, I want to hear your take on it first. I because I I do have uh a little, I kind of want to tie up my theory on it that we talked about earlier.
SPEAKER_00Okay, okay. So was there another shooter on the grassy knoll? Um so they say here, what'd they say? Countless witnesses reported hearing a shot or seeing smoke near a small hill in Daly Plaza, um, leading to the enduring belief of a second front-facing shooter. Um I I I gotta say no to that one. Um I think you would be too exposed on a hill. I don't know though, you know, now that I think about it, you know, you you you brought up Trump earlier with like the shooter on the roof, right? I mean, look at how exposed that guy was.
SPEAKER_01Literally filming him with your folks.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you know, maybe if you thought about this in terms of rather than framing it as a shooter on the hill, maybe a patsy on the hill, could could there have been a second patsy? Maybe, but again, to pull this off in the orchestration that it was done, that would not have been the kill shot if there was somebody. So I guess what I'm saying is I think there was a possibility somebody was there. And if they were, the intended purpose was to be a distraction, not to be the kill shot.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Uh for me, it is a no because what I think is that like you said, for starters, uh, we go right back into the difficulty of the shot aspect of it, but the bullet we've already confirmed did come from his gun. I think they simply put used his gun and then you know, put him up as the Patsy. I don't think there was a second shooter. I think that a different shooter used his someone who was trained to make the shot used his gun. And that's kind of how it played out.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01Because again, they they they were able to prove that it was his gun and that the bullet came from said gun, but they were not able to prove who shot said gun.
SPEAKER_00Well, in in this theory, think about how flimsy this evidence is, right? It's that people in the crowd, again, we just talked about that you can't rely on eyewitness testimony, reported seeing a puff of smoke. Well, that could be anything. You know, how do we know that somebody didn't light a cigarette or it could have been smoke? Yeah, it genuinely could have been smoke. It could have been a cigar puff, or you know, it could have been a firecracker, you know. I mean, like it could have been like a million different things that could have been that puff of smoke. I agree. Yeah, so when when you say I'm I'm linking it to a gun, it's a shooter. I I don't know what you got there. You know what I mean? That's too far.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so we land on no second shooter on the grassy knoll.
SPEAKER_00Nope, nobody was on the grassy knoll.
SPEAKER_01We can put that to bed, guys. Tell the Simpsons, stop making episodes.
SPEAKER_00Hey, let it be known. Paradigm shift. This is where it finally came to rest. Right here, July 28th, 2026. There was no shooter on the grassy knoll solved.
SPEAKER_01Confirmed. Uh number eight, the military industrial complex or elements of the U.S. military were involved. Kennedy was allegedly planning to withdraw from Vietnam or ease the Cold War tensions. His death cleared the way for escalation that benefited defense contractors and hawks.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think it's too far of a stretch. I can I was thinking of the same thing.
SPEAKER_01It's the bridge too far, man.
SPEAKER_00It's a bridge too far, it really is. You know, again, going going back to the way that he was killed. Um, you could say something like, well, if it wasn't Oswald that shot the gun, who was the shooter? And were they a military contractor? Or I I feel like they would they would have been like an like a contractor, like ex-military. You know what I mean? Like it wouldn't have been active. And I think in this theory, it's kind of leaning towards an active military uh person. And I I don't know, I just don't see it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I'm with you on that. It's a bridge too far, man. It's a stretch. Number nine, the FBI under J. Edgar Hoover was involved or covered it up. Hoover disliked the Kennedys, allegedly wanted to control the narrative, and some claim Oswald had been an FBI informant or was under surveillance that was mishandled.
SPEAKER_00There's a lot to unpack there. Um so Hoover, you know, remember at the time the Kennedys were like rock stars, right? And um I don't know, I don't know if you ever saw there was a documentary on uh Netflix about Marilyn Monroe, and they alleged in the documentary that both of them slept with her, both. Uh, more so RFK, it it by all accounts genuinely had a thing with her, but JFK too. So, you know, this was like the you know, the most attractive woman on the planet at the time was Marilyn Monroe, right? And Hoover, uh, by all accounts was sort of like the opposite. This guy was not attractive, he had no prospects, kind of had to axe to grind all over the place, uh, sort of wielded his power, I think, outside of his swim lane uh repeatedly, right? And so did Hoover, you know, dislike the Kennedys? I could totally see him disliking the Kennedys and not having any good feelings for them whatsoever, right? Um, could Hoover have known about it ahead of time and turned a blind eye? I I I gotta say no, but I think he would be capable of that, you know.
SPEAKER_01I agree with you on that. I I see in terms of his character, I could see him going look over here, but you know, I don't think he did.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, what's what's what's that line? The uh the enemy of my enemy is my friend, right?
SPEAKER_01But the thing is, you know, when you're when you're organizing something of this magnitude, I think what's get lost, what gets lost in the sauce is you obviously want to include as as few people as humanly possible, right? Right. Eliminating that margin for error. And if it's wasn't necessary to to fill them in from the C if it wasn't necessary for the CIA to fill them in, then it wasn't necessary.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you're 100% right. Nobody nobody in that plot would have been under obligation to tell him of that plot. And the CIA doesn't answer to the FBI.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00You know, uh, you know, it's it's kind of like uh in in the US, like our different military branches, they're always kind of like at odds with each other. It's like you know, the Navy, you know, talks crap about the Marines, Marines talk crap about the Navy, you know, like it goes back and forth like that. So I could I could see that between the FBI and the CIA sort of being like, yeah, we're on the same team, but you know, you guys are on that side of the fence, we're on this side. So they're not going to include him uh up front on anything. There's no way.
SPEAKER_01It's unnecessary, it's loose ends and and more risk than you need to take. Risk. So it doesn't, yeah, it doesn't make sense, right?
SPEAKER_00Exactly. Like at the end of the day, if everything is geared towards the kill shot and him being dead, the more people you tell, the harder it's gonna be to pull that off.
SPEAKER_01Exactly. And the more hard it is to keep a secret afterwards.
SPEAKER_00Absolutely.
SPEAKER_01So what why have interagency fighting? You don't know how someone's gonna respond at the FBI. What if it leaks to other agents? Yeah, it's it's way too many, too much margin for error when it comes to that. It doesn't make sense. Um, and then number 10 kind of just ties into uh that same thing, uh, deep state, you know, involvement.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's I feel like that's like a crux that people rely on when they haven't done adequate research. It was the deep state. Well, give me some proof, you know, like uh provide literally anything to prove what you're saying, you know.
SPEAKER_01Trust me, bro.
SPEAKER_00Come on, yeah, try trust me, bro. Not saying it was aliens, you know. I mean exactly.
SPEAKER_01I'm not saying it was Hoover, right? Right, yeah. So so those are our top 10. Wow, that hour flew by. So I I think that we landed on. I could be wrong, I feel like we've reached a consensus here that it was the CIA that organized it, orchestrated it, got the mob to take care of the whole Oswald loose end, and that they used Oswald's gun, but it wasn't Oswald who shot it.
SPEAKER_00Correct. And that I think the driver shot him in the head. Yes, that's the other part. Yeah, but yes, all correct.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, it wasn't a sniper from far away, it was within a foot of his face.
SPEAKER_00Correct, yeah. And and who the actual shooter was from the from the book building, that honestly, that could have been somebody within the CIA. Like I said, it could have been a contractor who was prior military that they just recruited for that job and that job alone. I mean, it wouldn't, it wouldn't have been hard to find a candidate to do that. Um, and and even, you know, if you think about like kind of kind of that world of like wearing masks, you know, like uh Mission Impossible, where they where they has like the mask of somebody else and then he pulls it off and it's actually Tom Cruise, you know. Like whoever the person was, they could have even staged somebody that sort of resembled Oswald in that building, and that's who took the shot, right? With his gun.
SPEAKER_01Um but they even but they even I even looked it up, and nobody even saw nobody even gave even the vaguest description of the shooter.
SPEAKER_00How is that possible? This is a campaign rally, there was like people everywhere.
SPEAKER_01That's what it said. Not there was not one person who testified to seeing him shoot that shot. That's why I said it's kind of hard to convict somebody of something when ballistics match the gun and the bullet, but nobody saw you shoot.
SPEAKER_00Well, you know what? Let me give you an example of this. The um God, those two brothers that are in uh Southern California that killed their parents, the Menendez brothers, right? The story of the Menendez brothers exact is exactly that. So no one actually saw them kill their parents, right? But what what happened was that the younger brother under duress told his uh therapist that they killed their parents. And he told the therapist that they killed them, and after they shot them, they picked up all the shells and they took the guns and they drove them like an hour and a half away and buried them in the sand, right? So there's there's no casings, there's no guns, there's no video, there were no eyewitnesses, and those guys are both in in prison right now for life under this testimony that the little brother, which again, was he telling the truth, was he lying? To to be determined, but they're they're both in in life sentences, and there is no proof whatsoever that they actually did it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I think there's a lot of people who are in prison right now, to be perfectly honest with you, who gave confessions under duress, who are probably didn't do who didn't do it, right?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah, absolutely. But but you know, the thing with Menendez is they might have done it, yeah, but there is no proof. That's that's odd.
SPEAKER_01That's it's odd because, like I said, really theoretically, the way the court system is supposed to work, if your lawyer can create reasonable doubt, they cannot, you know, it's a lot harder to send you to jail that way. But yeah, we don't always work in a perfect system.
SPEAKER_00So well, in in something kind of going back to Menendez, was one of the allegations of why they were found guilty was that was on the heels of OJ being found innocent. Uh and the theory is that they needed somebody to hang, and here we go. You know, Patsy's. Now, did they actually shoot him or not? Who knows? Did Oswald actually shoot Kennedy or not? Who knows? We'll never know.
SPEAKER_01I know. Well, paradigm shift, we've already confirmed it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I'm I mean, you know, come on, I mean I'm just you know paradigm shift, we do actually know.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we know everything. Come on. So let us know what you guys think in the comment section, guys. As always, make sure you give us a five-star review, it would be greatly appreciated. It's absolutely free to do, and um, yeah, let us know what you think. Do you think we're right or do you think we're barking up the wrong tree? Till next time. I'm Big Rob. God bless.
SPEAKER_00And this is little Jesse. See you later.
SPEAKER_01Shift out.