Dr. J and the Bible
This podcast features Dr. Jonathan Behler, a Christian therapist and theologian, discussing the Bible.
Dr. J and the Bible
Revelation Chapter 12
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Today Dr. J discusses Revelation Chapter 12.
Welcome to Dr. J in the Bible. Glad you're here for our next study in Revelation chapter 12, The Woman, the Dragon, and the Cosmic Conflict. Man, there's some good stuff in Revelation. Remember, I want to remind you guys don't be scared. This isn't to scare, it's to prepare. That God wants us to be knowledgeable. This is the only book in the Bible, not that the other books of the Bible don't bless us, as they certainly do, that is guaranteed a blessing. And so we're we're gonna do that today. We're gonna look into this. And so Revelation chapter 12. So we look at here, verse 1. Now a great sign appeared in heaven, a woman clothed with the sun, with a moon under her feet, and on her head a garland of twelve stars. So this great sign appeared. And this is the first of seven signs John uh discusses and is describing as a great sign. In Revelation chapters 12, 13, and 14, the main figures of the great tribulation describe. And the great sign introduces the first of the seven. And the woman represents the nation of Israel. The dragon represents Satan. The man child refers to Jesus. The angel Michael, the head angelic host or uh being, and the offspring of the woman represents the Gentiles who came to faith during the tribulation, and the beast out of the sea represents Antichrist, and the beast out of the earth represents the false prophet who promotes the Antichrist. So the woman clothed with the Son, because John plainly said that this is a sign. We don't expect this woman to appear literally on the earth. God will use this sign to communicate something to John, and for that matter, to us too. And the women often represents religious systems in the book of Revelation. In Revelation 2, verse 20, Jezebel is associated with a religious system which promotes false teaching. We also know that the great harlot is associated with false religion in Revelation 17, and the bride is associated with the church. So the woman clothed with the sun, scripturally, this woman clothed with the sun should be identified with Israel, according to Joseph's dream in Genesis 37, 9 through 11. In that dream, the sun represented Jacob, and the moon represented Joseph's mother, Rachel, and the 11 stars were the sons of Israel, which bowed down to Joseph. And in the sign with 12 stars, Joseph is now among the other tribes of Israel. So in the other Old Testament passage, Israel is often represented as a woman. You can check out Isaiah 54, Jeremiah 3:20, and Ezekiel 16. And the woman gives birth. Then being with child, she cried out in labor and in pain to give birth. Being with child, so it's clear that this child born out of Israel is Jesus. She bore a male son who was to rule the nations with a rod of iron. And we know that from Revelation 12, 5. And she cried out in labor and in pain to give birth. And this pain is descriptive, descriptively refers to the pain of Israel, the tribulation of Israel at the time of Jesus' birth, under Roman occupation and oppression. And so in verse 3, and another sign appeared in heaven, behold, a great fiery red dragon having seven heads and ten horns, seven diadems on his head. So what is this sign here? We are reminded, I believe, that this is a sign. The creature here is not a literal dragon, but a fiery red dragon. A dragon representing his character, his nature. And in his description, it represents a fierce power, a murderous nature. The picture of fullness of evil in all its hideous power, which none other than Lucifer.
SPEAKER_00The seven diadems on his head.
SPEAKER_01He claims the royal authority. Crowns represent his claims of royal authority against the true king. He wants to be king. Remember in Isaiah 14, I am, I will, I will, I will. I want to be like the Most High. That's what he wants to be. From a similar description in Revelation 13:1 and the parallel references in Daniel 7, uh 7 through 8, 20, and 24, it's clear that the revived Roman Empire is in view. Because the Roman Empire has never been totally destroyed. Yeah. You know, it's broken up, and now we have the European nations. But by the way, he has become the European Union, and they're building their oneness. They even have their own currency. And so these seven heads and ten horns refer to the original ten kingdoms, of which three would be subdued by the little horn of Daniel 7-8. Who is to be identified with the world ruler, I believe, of the Great Tribulation, who reigns over the revived Roman Empire. In verse 4, his tail drew a third of the stars of heaven and threw them to earth, and the dragon stood before the woman who was ready to give birth to devour her child as soon as it was born. So his tail drew a third of heaven, set of heaven. And I think these stars describe one-third of the Jellicoast who fell with Satan. Right? Satan didn't just fall on his own, he took one-third with him. So there's an army of beings in league with Satan that makes up the world of the divine spirits. Some people will even say that's what the Nephilim, you know, the mixing of angelic and human from Daniel or Genesis chapter 6, and um, and that it's inferred that returns, Jesus said it'd be like the days of Noah. Some people will even associate that with the alien, you know, uh ETs and this UFO stuff. Possibly, um, because Satan's outnumbered, he only has one third. God has never made an evil being, but he made angels, principalities, powers, with the capacity for mighty joys and distinctions in a very glorious domain. Yet, because of their choices and the hardening of their hearts, some chose the other. All for God's glory. People are like, what? Even demons? Ultimately, demons aren't good, they're evil. But ultimately, God will demonstrate his glory all the more. How do we accentuate or stress, emphasize God's glory more than to have evil? Now, permitting evil ultimately is under God's decree, although he did not cause it, he does not do evil, he doesn't have to, he just lets us do it.
SPEAKER_00But ultimately, under his permissive will, all of it's working for his glory.
SPEAKER_01And for believers, our good, only for believers. And this is to devour our children as soon as it was born. And this attempt to devour her child was initially fulfilled by Herod's attempt to kill Jesus as a kid. Matthew chapter 2. It was also fulfilled throughout Jesus' life as Satan attacked him. Told, you know, Satan wanted him to jump off the temple uh high up on the temple, and said, Yeah, if you do this, you know, call your angels, and they'll won't let your heels dash the rocks. Um, I'm sure he was tempted, and and people try to kill him. The Pharisees try to stone him throughout his life. And then let me just say this Satan has been trying to kill God's seed and God's gospel from the very beginning of creation and time.
SPEAKER_00Uh Cain kills uh Abel. Esau tries to kill Jacob. You have Ishmael and Isaac. You go on and on and on. And so this is nothing new.
SPEAKER_01Verse 5 She bore a male child who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron, and her child was caught up to God and his throne. So this male child was to rule the nations with a rod of iron. And this is clearly refers to Jesus, the Messiah, King of King and Lord of Lords. He rules the world with a rod of iron.
SPEAKER_00Psalm 29. She bore a male, and it refers that he will rule the nations with a rod of iron, refers to the triumphant reign, second coming of Christ, when he will set up his millennial kingdom, and the gates of hell won't prevail.
SPEAKER_01Persecuted by the dragon, the woman is protected by God and prepared for a place for the 1,260 days.
SPEAKER_00You know, and this helps us a little bit with certainty that the woman is Israel, not Mary, as the Roman Catholics would say.
SPEAKER_01How could Mary possibly flee into the wilderness in this way? This reference to, I mean, because Mary would not be around for this uh 1,260 days, this is Revelation. And so the reference to this three and a half years, period, connects the events with the final seven years of Daniel 9. And Revelation 12.5 and points to the ascension of Jesus. 12.6 describes yet to occur in the seventh week of Daniel.
SPEAKER_00And if she goes until the wilderness where she has a place prepared by God.
SPEAKER_01Some believe, and I take this view, that this place is uh where the Jews will hide during the persecution, the Holocaust of the Antichrist, the rock city of Petra, kind of south of the Dead Sea.
SPEAKER_00Um I don't know for sure, but I think it's a good possibility.
SPEAKER_01Prepared in the wilderness. Um just the same Greek word Jesus used. I go to prepare a place for you. John 14. Descrip demonstrates God's careful planning, the works in heaven, every detail. 7 through 8, the war broke out in heaven. Michael and his angels fought with the dragon. The dragon and his angels fought, but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them in heaven any longer. Now, some people are saying, isn't he fallen already? Yes, partially. If you read in Job, there's a time the angels went up to uh the Lord of hosts, which is Jesus, and uh that includes Satan. Uh that there's still a place where the even the demons, the fallen angels, still go to today. Um that does they're not in all of heaven, there's a part, and so they're partially kicked out. Um during this time, I believe right here in chapter 12, they will be kicked out permanently.
SPEAKER_00And boy, they're gonna be angry. And this is what this is talking about.
SPEAKER_01So a war broke out in heaven. This is the midpoint of the great tribulation. God turns the tide on Satan, first in heaven, now in earth. The battle would take place that would deny Satan access to heaven. Uh, Michael and his angels, some individual groups, such as the Seventh-day Adventists and the Jehovah's Witnesses, both are cults, insist on saying Michael is actually Jesus, even though Michael himself said in Jude, Lord rebuke Satan. Why would he do that if he's Lord? But anyhow, yeah, that was just a little sidebar. They're wrong. Some say Michael must be Jesus because he has his angels, but if Satan, a fallen angelic being, has his angels, can't Michael, an unfallen angel, have his angels? I think that's just common sense. Of course so. Jesus is not an angel because Jesus said before Abraham was, I am. Yeah, he's pretty blunt. And angels don't accept worship. Jesus did.
SPEAKER_00Jesus said very clearly he is God. Um so we look at this, and Michael is not identified with Christ at all.
SPEAKER_01Only that he is his servant. So Michael and his angels fought with the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought. This is a dramatic scene, a battle between good angels and bad angels. God's elect, gods are elect, faithful angels, fallen angels.
SPEAKER_00Who's fighting in this battle?
SPEAKER_01Well, this is truly a battle between equals in many ways. The dragon represents Satan. Satan is not the counterpart of God. God is over all. You know, God is sovereign over Satan, so it's not like God's on one side and he's sweating this. And oh no, he, you know, uh Michael could lose. I don't know what's going to happen. Jonathan could make a mistake, and no, God is sovereign. God has no counterpart. If anyone, Satan is the counterpart of Michael, who seems to be the chief angel opposite this chief of fallen angels. And so it's it's really Michael versus Satan, elect angels versus the unelect. Um, why is it fought? In a previous scene of conflict, Michael and Satan, Satan wanted to prevent the resurrection and glorification of Moses. Because he knew God had plans for a resurrection and glorified Moses. There is another occasion where Satan wants to get in the way of God's plan for the end times. It's Daniel 12:1. At that time, Michael shall stand up, the great prince, who stands watch over the sons of your people, and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never since there was a nation, even to that time, and at that time your people shall be delivered. Yeah. So Satan is trying to get in the way of God's plan through all this, because in Satan's arrogance, and in this, in his mind and heart, he thinks he can beat God. Remember, he says the for the original line in Genesis to Eve was you be like God.
SPEAKER_00And Satan said to Isaiah 14, I will be like God. Now, was a place found for them in heaven any longer?
SPEAKER_01It shows at the midpoint Satan no longer has access to heaven. Where he accuses God's people before his throne, praise the Lord. You ever go through life and and and you're reminded of your sins all the time? That you you know God's forgiven you, but you can't can't forget it because it keeps coming back. Well, that's that's Beelzebub, that's Lucifer, that's Satan and his buddies.
SPEAKER_00Because he's the accuser of the brethren.
SPEAKER_01God does not shame, God convicts. He convicts, we repent, we move forward. Satan likes to kick us when we're down.
SPEAKER_00But his door is gonna be shut. You know, it troubles some to think that Satan has access to heaven. I get it.
SPEAKER_01Um because many because many mistaken the teaching that God can allow nothing unholy in his presence. But the Bible clearly says that while Satan appears on earth and describes him as the principality heir, it also says that Satan has access to heaven where he accuses God's people before the throne. Um, he doesn't have full access now, but his partial access will be denied in the near future, I believe. Verse 9 So the great dragon was cast out, the serpent of old called the devil and Satan, who deceived the whole world. He was cast to earth, and his angels were cast out with him. And so this single verse, uh, the dragon was cast out, uses many different titles for our spiritual enemy. Dragon, serpent of old, devil, saintan, accuser, um, deceiver.
SPEAKER_00The title devil is actually from the Greek word the diabolos. From the word we, you know, diabolic.
SPEAKER_01And its meaning is defaming, slandering. He is the master accuser of the brethren.
SPEAKER_00So he's cast to earth and all his you know, different his other angels with him.
SPEAKER_01Um really the reason he's cast out is because he glorified and he profaned God. He he was so he was totally so he tried to glorify himself in order to profane God, and so he was kicked out of heaven for that. From having access to heaven, he was the consequence was was that to restriction to the earth, from the earth to bondage in the bottomless pit for a thousand years, and then ultimately he will be thrown, according to Revelation 20, and with in the lake of fire, with all those people that rejected Christ or took the mark of the beast. And that gets in hell, which we won't take aside, but our hell is eternal. It it it's something that goes on and on for eternity because you're sinning against an eternal God. Luke chapter ten verse eighteen said, I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.
SPEAKER_00And this refers to the the first fall of Satan from glorified to profane. Could it it could also be prophetic looking ahead? Um but nevertheless Jesus saw it and all his angels falling with him with rebellion against God. All we have to do is look at society.
SPEAKER_01One of the first things that convinced me that Jesus is the way the Bible's true is all the evil in the world. There has to be evil and good and evil fighting. You can see it in Hollywood. You can see it with the people hating authority, like the police.
SPEAKER_00You can see it in politics. Yeah, I mean, the things that some things are no-brainers. Marriage? Abortion?
SPEAKER_01Right to life? That's a no-brainer. It's very scientific and biblical, the right to life and marriage between a man and a woman. But our society is hostile towards truth. 10 through 12, then I heard a voice saying in heaven, Now salvation and strength and the kingdom of our God and the power of his Christ have come, for the accuser of the brethren, the who accused him before God day and night, has been cast down, and they overcame him with the blood of Lamb by the word of their testimony, and they did not lose their lives to the death. Therefore, rejoice, O heavens, you who dwell in them. Woe to the inhabitants of the earth and the sea, for the devil has come down to you, having great wrath, because he knows his time is short.
SPEAKER_00He I heard a loud voice.
SPEAKER_01Whoever is behind this loud voice, it represents the redemption of humanity. Not an angel or God.
SPEAKER_00The voice speaks of the accuser of the brethren. Yeah. The accuser of the brethren's time is limited. Redemption is near.
SPEAKER_01Um the accuser of the brethren, the accuser did good day and night. Satan goes up to God, accusing, and he accuses us. But it ends here. He is cast from the access to heaven, and today we today we have no need of an intercessor or advocate, by the way. We go straight to Jesus. We can pray. We're not, don't need to be intimidated by this. But if you're experiencing the accusations, that's why. Because and they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, and they did not love their lives to death, to the death. This tells us that the keys to the saints' victory over Satan, our victory. It overcame by the blood. Without the shedding of blood, there's no remission of sin.
SPEAKER_00The blood overcomes Satan's accusations.
SPEAKER_01And the accusations mean really nothing to us because Jesus paid the price, the penalty, once and for all. He took the wrath of his Father that we deserve, that by grace through faith we have eternal life by trusting he died and rose from the dead. And the fact of the matter is, let's just be honest, we're probably worse than Satan's accusations, anyhow. But we're still made righteous because of the work of the cross, the work of Jesus on the cross. And we don't, so yeah, you know, sometimes I say, Satan, you're not wrong. I deserve hell, but thanks be to God. Jesus paid for my sin. By his stripes I am healed.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01How does the blood of the Lamb conquer Satan in the life of the believer? How does the death of Jesus on the cross or substitute bring victory? The blood is from a sinless Lamb of God. If Jesus was just a man, only man, and say he was able to live a sinless life, we can't, because all sin falls short of the glory of God. But say he did, just being a man. He could have only died for one person at that time. But because he's not just a hundred percent man, he's a hundred percent God. God cannot sin. And he was born of a virgin, and he did not inherit Satan's uh or the fall or sin nature. So he went to the cross and paid and was able, because he's outside of time, to pay for the past of the Old Testament saints that believed in the first coming, and the present of all those who believed or would, and the future, all those who will believe in the future. And he overcame by their testimony. Testimony overcomes Satan's deception, knowing and remembering the work of God in their lives.
SPEAKER_00Because remembering what God did protects us against Satan's lies, fabrications. John 9 25 says, Jesus says Satan's the father of lies. And talks about the man born blind. You know? They did not love their lives to the death.
SPEAKER_01Loving not their lives overcomes Satan's violence because we give up our lives to follow Jesus, to pick up our cross and follow him. Disciples, people today clinging and not clinging to the earthly stuff. They're not clinging to all their money and all their fame. They're clinging to Jesus. And the threat of Satan has can bring bring only accusations, and we know because of Romans 1, there's no condemnation. For us to live as Christ to die is gain. So rejoice, O heavens, on you we dwell. Heaven rejoices at the eviction of Satan. But heaven's gain is Earth's loss. All hell is going to break loose on earth because Satan knows his time is short. 13 through 16, when the dragon saw that he had been cast to the earth, he persecuted the woman and gave birth to a male child. But the woman was given two wings of great eagle. She might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time, a time and a half, from the presence of the serpent. So the serpent spooed water out of his mouth like a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away to the flood. But the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened its mouth and swallowed up the flood, which the dragon had vomited out of his mouth. He persecuted the woman who gave birth. And, you know, this is not the Catholic Church. I believe that the harlot, the false prophet, will be a pope. I really do. That will be the false prophet that will be supporting the Antichrist and pushing his agenda, so to speak. We'll get to that later, not today, but in the future. But the woman symbolizes, I believe, the faithful Israel and those that will believe Gentiles. And so really the woman represents all God's people, but specifically in context, the Messianic Jewish people, the Jewish people that have received Christ and are being persecuted by the Antichrist, trying to kill them. Remember, there's going to be another Holocaust. Why does Satan attack the Jewish people?
SPEAKER_00This is a question for all history.
SPEAKER_01It's not only the great tribulation, this is from the very beginning. From the very time of Abraham, Israel holds the critical plan of God's redemption.
SPEAKER_00First, it was bringing the Messiah the Redeemer.
SPEAKER_01It was through Israel. That's why Paul says for the Jew first, then the Greek. It starts with the nation of Israel because that's where the gospel, that's where the promise came, that's where the seed came. That's the Messiah came from the Jewish people. And Satan hates God. He hates his redemption. And so he really hates all people, but he hates the Jews. So this was a fulfillment of his plan because Jesus promised the Jewish people would exist and welcome him when he returns in glory to the world. So they are, the Jewish people are being persecuted by the Antichrist here in Revelation. But we know the Jewish people at the end, Jesus said this 2,000 years ago, would welcome the Messiah. The Jews don't like the Messiah right now, Jesus.
SPEAKER_00They don't. But they will. I already know it.
SPEAKER_01Jews were persecuted from the very beginning.
SPEAKER_00Babylonians, Persians, Syrians, Greeks, Antioch Antiochus, Ticus, we know the Romans, Hitler, yeah, Stalin? Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Right now, anti-Semitism around the world growing faster than ever? Because if Satan succeeds in destroying the Jewish people, then God's eternal plan will be thwarted and he will win. And we know God won't lose. So hold tight, because Israel's gonna get this stuff, you know. I know that President Trump was really dedicated to getting rid of the evil government of Iran. And then he went to China and came back, and he was like, Man, those Iranians are good people. Went from being wicked to good people, and we're gonna let them. Something happened there. I don't know what happened there. Maybe the Chinese uh leader told him that this would be World War III, and you don't want to do this. Maybe. Spiritual, really is. So the persecution of Israel is part of a satanic plan to thwart and hinder God's work. Israel is hated by Satan not because of any of its own characteristics, but because of its chosen of God for the essential to overall, overall purpose of God for eternity. The woman was given two wings of a great eagle that she might fly into the wilderness to her place.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it gives an idea of deliverance.
SPEAKER_01Um have even referenced the two wings as a great eagle to like military transport planes, things like that. Could be. Might be. Where she's nourished for a time and time and a half. Um so there's another reference to the three and a half year period, indicating that these events really, dramatic persecution of Israel, takes place during the 70th week of Daniel. And the serpent vomited water out of his mouth to flood after the woman. And this fury poured out against Israel is after the abomination of desolation. And this is after the halfway point of the 70th week of Daniel, seven years, which was spoken of Jesus. And this is where Matthew 24, 15 through 22, that Jesus stated, if you're on your house top, don't even go get your stuff. Get out of there and hope it hope pray it's not winter. Don't get anything, just get out of Dodge when you see the Antichrist in the Holy of Holies. Some people think, why did he say not to go and get your stuff? Um, well, I think time is a reason, but I think also it could be the technology. Our technology knows everything of what we're doing. Jesus is saying here, don't do that because they're getting your information. Get out of Dodge. How do how are they able to see it in Matthew 24, 15 through 22? The abomination of desolation when they're in Judah. Yeah, several miles away. And only one person can go in the Holy of Holies. Must be uh technology, right? The earth opens his mouth, swallowed up the flood, but the dragon has vomited out of his mouth.
SPEAKER_00We see a great protection here from the Lord.
SPEAKER_01And then verse 17, and the dragon was enraged with the woman with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of the offspring who keep the commandments of God and have testimony of Jesus. So this dragon's enraged, and he went to make war with her. Um, and I think this woman, once again, is Israel, and the Gentiles who came to faith Jesus during the tribulation, the rest of her offspring, right? Because that's what it says. This is indicative of the church in Israel. The dragon's enraged with a woman, the woman's Israel. And then he went to make war with the rest of her offspring. That's the Gentiles, that's the church that's left people getting saved during the tribulation.
SPEAKER_00And these two groups are targets today from Satan. The church in Israel. And so we have to make a choice here.
SPEAKER_01We have to make a choice, we need to make it now that we're gonna follow Christ, and we're going to prepare by being faithful to God because his word's true. We can see prophecy is, I mean, this stuff gives you makes your hair stand up because it's so great. We don't have to be scared, it's not here to scare, but to prepare. And this is this is we are in times the prophets, the prophets were excited about. They would have dreamed about. So once again, I hope you guys have a good one and uh have a good fourth of July. And remember, God can take your mess, turn to a message for his glory for your good.