We Are More Connected Than Ever -- So Why Do We Feel So Alone?

Are you surrounded by people yet still feel completely alone? You are not imagining it. In this powerful episode of the Love and Leadership Podcast, Trent and Star Postell dive deep into one of the most pressing crises of our time: the epidemic of loneliness.

In 2023, the US Surgeon General declared loneliness a public health epidemic, and it has only grown since. Despite smartphones, social media, and instant communication, nearly half of all adults report feeling lonely. Trent and Star unpack why surface-level connections are replacing deep relationships -- and what we can do about it.

In this episode you will discover:

•          Why technology is widening the gap between connection and isolation

•          How the shift from in-person to digital interaction is reshaping our homes, workplaces, and communities

•          What it truly means to build meaningful relationships in a distracted world

•          Practical steps leaders, parents, and entrepreneurs can take to cultivate real human connection

•          Star's personal story of overcoming social anxiety and what it taught her about belonging

Whether you lead a team, a family, or simply want to show up better for the people in your life, this conversation will challenge and inspire you.

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Love well. Lead with purpose. Steward what matters.

#LoveAndLeadership #LonelinessEpidemic #MarriageAndBusiness #FaithAndFamily #ChristianEntrepreneur #MentalHealth #LeadershipPodcast #TrentAndStarPostell 

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

What does it look like to love well at home and lead with purpose in the boardroom? Welcome to the Love and Leadership Podcast, where faith, family, marriage, and business come together to build leaders who last. Hosted by Trent and Star Postel. Love well, lead with purpose, steward what matters.

SPEAKER_01 0:22

Welcome to the Love and Leadership Podcast. I'm Star, and this is my husband Trent. And today we're going to be talking about loneliness. So if we're more connected than ever, why do we feel so disconnected?

SPEAKER_02 0:35

Man, that is a really, really true statement today. I mean, we have so much more connection with people more than we ever have. The internet, social media, at an instant moment we can find each other. But yet, so many people are feeling so much more lonely. So I'm asking you this why do you think people feel so much more disconnected today? We're gonna dive into that. We're gonna talk about technology, we're gonna talk about culture and all those things that are getting us to make us feel like we're disconnected.

SPEAKER_01 1:03

Yeah, this is um, I think a good topic, a necessary topic. It's one that, you know, we're not talking about as much as we should. Yeah. Um, in 2023, the US Surgeon General declared an epidemic of loneliness. Wow. And it has not gotten better since.

SPEAKER_02 1:19

That's crazy. Thinking about that epidemic of loneliness. Usually you think about, you know, we had COVID, COVID-19, you think about the virus and the flu, but we're talking about an emotional thing, right? As an epidemic. That's that's wild.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

Yeah. Um, and another uh stat here, it says nearly half of adults report loneliness. So this is something that is is plaguing a lot of people at all levels. And this is um throughout all walks of life, you know, it doesn't matter, you know, the race and and the age. Uh, there's a lot of people that are really struggling with this right now. Um, it also says studies link increased social media with a higher perception of isolation.

SPEAKER_02 1:57

Wow.

SPEAKER_01 1:58

So, like you said, we should be more connected by this technology, but somehow it's it's actually driving us further apart.

SPEAKER_02 2:04

Yeah. And I think a lot of it's especially with our younger generation, because I think that's where we have a huge part of this uh epidemic. You have a lot more kids that have anxiety, uh a lot more kids that are struggling on the spectrum, ADHD. And a lot of it is because of the screen time and social media and things, because social media is now becoming their parent, you know, and and their words of wisdom. Um, are we have a generation that's becoming more illiterate, you know, not reading books and the things that made us be able to connect and also just learn more about real life. And so now instant information is at a fingertip. You want to know something? Let me just get a chat about AI or whatever the case may be. And sometimes when you get that connected, you feel like that's your connection, right? To somebody or something that doesn't have any human communication or action, you know?

SPEAKER_01 2:47

Yeah. And I mean, this is definitely a multifaceted um issue and situation. And, you know, of course, when it comes to, you know, children with disabilities, I mean, all these things or people with mental health, it can be caused for a number of different things. We're not saying it's this or that, you know, we're not an expert on that. So I just want to throw that out there, you know, so nobody gets offended. I know we're in the age of offense. Yes, yeah, absolutely. So let me put that out there. Um, but you know, this is something that is contributing to these issues, you know, there there's um multiple levels that we're having to battle against. And of course, we we've been in the early childhood education space for uh myself for 18 years. You know, I have a master's degree in early education, and um, you've been, you know, working with teenagers for for many, many years, and then also part of our education uh program. So we see a lot of children and families that are struggling with different things, um, and then being, you know, in the education space for that long, you know, we we've seen layers of things and how it's affected the children over time. Um, and then also the families, the parents, I mean, the whole dynamic is affected by this issue of loneliness and and of course the mental health crisis that we're going through.

SPEAKER_02 3:57

Absolutely. And when your family's not connected, right? And the children draw out in the social media world, the parents are in a different generation, they may not even understand or can connect with the social media world. So they don't even understand what their kids are going through. There's that big disconnect gap. And I think a lot of it's just the human interaction of communication. And because that's being a lost art, I really believe that this loneliness epidemic is kind of bleeding into it. And it's actually having an effect as, you know, in the work face, uh, in the workplace, because now when these uh people uh young people are coming in, now understanding that they communicate differently, how they move differently, it's really a changed a culture dynamic in our society. And so I think we're in this in-between space where from the older generation and this and they're trying to figure out what this new culture looks like. So I think that's a big part of us trying to navigate it. And so I think this is a good topic to talk about because we can get into the realities and some of the deeper aspects of how do we begin to, I guess, bridge the gap and also find success. Because right now we don't want to pin one person against the other, younger generation, older generation, we our generation is better than the other. Like that's what's happening now. Now we have to figure out how do we live into the reality of the space.

SPEAKER_01 5:02

Yeah, we're we're here now. This is our reality. So what do we do with it? Absolutely. Um, so I have a question for you. So, why do you feel surface level connections um actually feel more common than the deep ones in this day and age?

SPEAKER_02 5:16

I think one, the biggest thing is the fact that you don't have to really, you know, foster a relationship when it comes to surface level things, right? Social media, for instance, is very social, is very surface level, right? Because you're talking to someone you usually don't know that much. And sometimes you can talk to your friends that you know pretty well, but it's better, you have to do more work when you're in person, right? To foster a deep relationship, that takes work, it takes time. When you're on social media, it's a quick text, a quick little, you know, emoji, quick whatever, quick like on whatever someone just posted as far as a picture. And that's not really deep. I mean, the fact that you took a picture at the beach, oh, that's nice. Click, like, and move on, right? But being able to experience a beach with somebody, right? Now there's connection. Now there's a memory that's involved. There's no memories with a picture. I don't know the last picture I posted on social media. I don't know the last picture you posted on social media, right? And so if I liked it, I mean, cool, right? But it's the like and gone. But when you create memories and you can't get deep interactions with people, that's more lasting. But that takes more work because it takes more time. And I think nowadays we're such a fast-paced society. Everything we want things instant. And we we we lost that art of just being able to just lose ourselves in communication and talking as a family, going to parks, going to different things as a group. Um, even like as teenagers, right? We used to, as teenagers, go to the skating ring, we used to go to the movies and the movies now. That's kind of not an existing thing for teenagers anymore. Some people still do that every here and there, but that was a regular thing. And that was our social interaction with people. But again, it took time, it took planning and meeting up. But now, again, a click of a button, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 6:49

No, it's funny that you mentioned that as teenagers. So I remember in my teenage years, it was more like, you know, before we had cars, we'd ask our parents to drop us off at the mall, you know? And then we'd kind of walk around the mall, like who's there, who's not, you know, the boy you like, is he there? And we would literally just, you know, kind of waste hours, which really wasn't a waste because you're, you know, you're you're learning things and you're uh developing those relationships with your friends. But, you know, we would just be there for hours. And now if you think about it, um, and then even games, you know, when we were a little bit younger, we would be playing, you know, tag in the in the streets or like we're going over somebody else's house, you know, we're jumping in the pool for a couple hours. So a lot of what we did was very hands-on and interactive and with our peers. And now, you know, our teens are spending hours and hours just on their phone. Yeah. So they may feel like they're with somebody, but you know, I mean, the reality is that they're probably alone by themselves in a room, you know.

SPEAKER_02 7:45

And I think that's why the loneliness has gone up because your body as a human being needs interaction with another person, right? A phone is not another person. Internet, social media, it's not another person. So there's nothing as far as an emotional attachment. We may feel emotions about things, right? But you don't get that emotional connection that your body, your mind, the stimulation you need, right? And now think about it malls are empty. You don't, malls are not a thing anymore.

SPEAKER_01 8:08

Yeah, there's a lot of a lot of closes, uh, a lot of stores that are closing down, you know.

SPEAKER_02 8:12

Sure, like the big malls where you walk through because it needs foot traffic. That's the whole point of a mall. People got there Sundays, Saturdays, the thing to do, hang out. But again, you know, those things are non-existent. What do they do on Saturdays? Oh, let me go check my social media account, let me go do this and that, right? And so it's a little bit different now, uh, the interactions with people. So those places where you would need people interaction, those places are non-existent now. But everybody's online, like say Amazon and the dominant things that are out there where you can get things instantly, right? You don't need to go very far. How we get our food, right?

SPEAKER_01 8:41

Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Just just so, right?

SPEAKER_02 8:44

That's not, you know, I can door down.

SPEAKER_01 8:46

I'm hoping that the restaurants won't start. Right. For real, right now. You can't do that.

SPEAKER_02 8:49

We can't have the food now, right? So, but I mean, just either click of a button, I do it, right? I'm hungry, don't feel like going anywhere. Click, get the food delivered here, right? Groceries, right? Grocery store. So grocery stores have moved to this model too as well, right? Because, hey, if I if I if I can't bring the people in my store, I've got to be able to take it to them, right? So, and again, if there's no human interaction with these common things, that's where this loneliness gap is starting to happen.

SPEAKER_01 9:12

Yeah, and you brought up a good point, is that, you know, we're noticing these huge changes and shifts as as a country. And I mean, I feel like nobody is really addressing the things that we're losing. Yes, we're gaining things. Maybe these uh companies and organizations are thinking, okay, we're we have more people online and we're being we're able to advertise more to them. Or, you know, like you said, all these um uh service organizations where they're bringing the product to you. Okay, that's that's an additional source of revenue. Maybe people are eating out, you know, or I I guess ordering food in more than ever before, right? So maybe the revenue is going up with these businesses. So it's like they're seeing the upside of it and how they're um, you know, like what they're gaining from it. Yeah, but we're not thinking as a society of what we're losing in the meantime.

SPEAKER_02 10:04

Yeah, and that relational component of just life is so huge, right? That connection piece. Because now if I'm hiring, you know, people into a business and there's no connection relationally because they bought into the purpose. That's what people did. People bought into something before they got there, or there was some type of something they were searching for. If they're not used to searching deeper level type connections because everything's instant, there's no draw into like a business mission, right? You gotta have to teach and learn people when they come in. It's like, hey, come over here to this. That's a sales job, right? Now, where it used to be a connection thing where people just instantly was like, you know what? I felt that. I I I I know what that's like because I'm used to these internet and these type of interactions every day. So when we've lost the the normal human connection of just interaction of how we, you know, do things on a day-to-day basis, when we lose that, now our whole society then is now affected. And it starts, you know, from our young children all the way up to you know where our adults are now.

SPEAKER_01 10:58

So yeah. Um, and I think about the fact that, you know, when I was uh 19 is when I got my first cell phone. You know, and nowadays you have kids that are uh, you know, four or five years old.

SPEAKER_02 11:10

You got kids at our center that have they have their own cell phone, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 11:13

And so not only do they have access to call anyone they want at any point, but then now they also have access unlimited to the internet. And yes, we have, you know, the the the programs where we can guard, you know, certain certain things of what our children are looking at. But a lot of times they're still able to see things that they probably shouldn't see at that age.

SPEAKER_02 11:33

Some lazy parenting, too. I mean, a lot of times it's a substitute for our parents just talking and communicating, reading books, you know, making again the illiteracy rate that's happening. So, I mean, a lot of times parents are busier, our society's busier, we're working longer hours to make more money because, you know, cost of inflation, all these things. So, what gets left behind is our kids, right? So, well, we've got this great technology thing. Let me put this in front of the child. Yeah. At least they're quiet, they're good, and I don't have to deal with the stress of them crying or having to do something with them. That's the thing. People need time. And again, going back to what a question you asked, why are we getting away from it? Like, what, why can't we, why can't we have these deeper connections? Because you have to foster it with time, right? So if our parents are getting shorter with our children as far as interactions, bedtime stories, that's that's non-existent now. You don't hear anybody talking about I read, you know, like we used to reach our kids like Bible stories and things when they grew up. Guess what? You don't hear that anymore, right? It's just like they're growing up on these TV shows and different things, anime is huge now and things of that nature. Again, nothing wrong with it. I grew up on cartoons. Shout out to He-Man and our Power Rangers, all that good stuff, right? But there was a balance, right? I was outside playing basketball and going to my best friend's house, right?

SPEAKER_01 12:37

Even when you think about cartoons, right? Because we can say, Oh, well, you guys watched cartoons when you were their age. The whole system is set up differently now. You know, we had to anticipate and wait. Oh, I can't wait till Saturday morning. You know, my parents are sleeping in, and that means I can go ahead and see if my favorite cartoon is on. It's different now. You can just swipe, swipe, swipe, figure out what you like, what you don't. You can you can watch everything you want at the click of the button. There's nothing to work hard for, there's nothing to wait for. You don't need to have patience. You don't need to have hard work and you don't need to have patience in some of the basic things of life that that you know you're taught as a child or a teen kind of coming up. And you know, you don't need to wait to have somebody cook a meal. You don't need to go to the grocery store and buy those ingredients, look up the recipe, yeah, you know, learn how to cook. I mean, everything is is at your fingertips. So it's almost like here right now.

SPEAKER_02 13:30

The human ability to just think, you know, a normal surface. The process to do things that, you know, because you think about, and again, not to bring the younger generation into it of things, right? Because a lot of adults that don't know how to think for themselves too well, right? But if you think about the process of how to think and do things, like we laugh for our kids sometimes, right? Because it's like as they were growing up and you think things that were common sense to us, it's like, well, why don't you just think about doing it this way? Like, well, I never thought about that, right? But some of those things came natural to us because of just how we grew up and what we were doing. Our problem solving was a lot better, you know, as far as how to do things and and have to go get certain things for ourselves. And so uh, but I think just the societal change, as you say, is really kind of we're losing out so much on these things. And the key word there was patience, right? Patience through any interaction. And like then, the name of the game now is like time and speed. If you can't get someone's attention like this, they're on to the next thing. That's what what is social media based on? How can I grab your attention for the quickest amount of time to keep it for the longest amount of time? And a long time on social media is literally 60 seconds. So if we're trying to judge people's attention spans on 60 seconds, wow! Like how they're gonna sit down and watch a 30-minute cartoon and wait till, like you said, Saturday. They ain't waiting for that. Yeah, I got it at my fingertips. I can watch, as a matter of fact, if I can like the episodes middle, I can look at the beginning and I can skip all the way to the end and figure out what the ending was. So now I can have a conversation with my friends, like, oh, I know what happened. This is what happened. And they didn't have to do the word work just to sit through an episode, right? And so it's just this a little we can get so deep into these things, right? And so, but I really think there is a shift society when it comes to those things. So uh so I asked you this, you know, um, how do you feel technology has changed the way we connect?

SPEAKER_01 15:09

Um, I mean, I think as uh I was saying before, you know, like we we really learned the basic skills of people in the beginning. And then we were able to use technology as a tool later on as we got older and we kind of had those basic, you know, skills, social skills already down. Yeah. And um, I think it the opposite is happening now, you know, more and more people are relying on the tech technological skills first, and they're never really getting to a place where they're being forced to develop their social skills. And we've seen this has uh been an effect in the workforce, as you, you know, you alluded to um some of the younger generation that's coming on and now becoming part of our workforce. And of course, we've seen it in the interactions, maybe with customers or you know, the vendors and the people that we that we work hand in hand with, um, and just our society in general. You know, we're we're having to um scale back a lot of the communication. So we're expecting people not to have an attention span. And we're expecting them not to listen to anything that takes too long. Even when it comes to training, you know, we're having to really think hard on how to make things um very diverse and you know, what do we need to do to keep the, you know, the people's attention. And so we're really um having to think outside the box to overcome the challenges that we're dealing with in the way of loneliness and in the way of uh the technology, you know, the the downsides of the technology and how that's um contributing.

SPEAKER_02 16:38

Absolutely. And actually, going back to loneliness, this is kind of crazy. You know, I just had this picture because you can be around people and still be lonely.

SPEAKER_01 16:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:45

You know what I mean? Loneliness is not necessarily just I'm not around anybody, it's the interaction. Um, one of the things I I fear and actually kind of see is even with business as entrepreneurs, a lot of businesses are now trying to be trendy, like you said, the next technology, outsourcing things, which again, it's more than just outsessing a job that somebody else can do. It's now again automating things that are now helping us lose connection. You know what I mean? Like I even think about the restaurant space, right? So shout out to my V Pizza in Orlando. We're the highest-rated restaurant all central Florida. You just had to get that in there. But but I said that for this reason, though, because the reason why we're highest rated is because it's not about necessary food or where it's some trendy, you know, thing. It's because of the service, right? Yeah, and service means people interaction. So I train my people, and listen, when it's a hospitality industry. At the heart of hospitality is service, it's people interaction. Being hospitable, right? Being hospital. Think about the hotels and the restaurants you go into. There's no communication, right? Even your servers nowadays is they want the tip, right? But how much communication are they having with you to get that tip? What are they doing? Before you would do everything it took, knew everything about that person, their children, and we serve them to the T. And now it's like, as long as I give them the right food, I get the right order, serve it to them, they're gonna tip me, right? There's an expectation I just do this. And it's like the communication aspect. So I train my people to say, hey, look, you know, get to know them, know their name, you know, explain who we are, what we're talking about. And that interaction, by the time they leave, not only is the food good, but they understand that person that served them and helped them is a human being that connected with them. And that connection meant something. So enough that they would leave a review and say, I want to come back because I felt this place was different than any other place that I went. And I think there's still advantages to that, especially in such an industry like service, which I don't think we can ever automate things enough to make sure that it's replaceable. You can't replace the human heart, you can't replace the human mind and keep that communication, right? And so I can't automate that. And so I'm not gonna want to. So I need people that are real to be able to still connect with people so that we can still run an amazing business that serves food, right? And again, that we don't lose that. And then now people are still gonna come into my restaurant because man, there's just something different about this place.

SPEAKER_01 18:52

Yeah. And I think about even the rise in AI and then, you know, the super AI and all this stuff that, you know, has been a big buzz and a big conversation lately. And, you know, just imagine if we do get to the place where there is no human there to take your order or to have a conversation. I mean, think about, you know, a simple thing like um maybe, you know, going to a bar or something, you know, people used to just sit there and you know have a conversation with the bartender and you know, they're asking about where you're from. And, you know, especially uh with our restaurant, you know, we have a bar and we have regulars that come in and you know, they may only get one drink and they may sit there for hours. But think about that, you know, they didn't most of them didn't come there for the drink. You know what I mean? Like they really didn't. Absolutely they came there for the interaction. Maybe they're out of town, uh, you know, like nobody's here, they're just here for a conference or something like that. And, you know, it's either that or sit in their hotel room. So they come here and they hang out for a couple hours and may watch the game, they, you know, they chit-chat with the bartender. But, you know, the that those are the things that we're gonna miss out on in our society. And the scary part is if, you know, as we get deeper into this AI stuff and a lot of um, you know, like certain jobs are are taken over by um by automated um um systems, you know, talking to a real person is gonna be considered a premium. Yeah. You know, that that's gonna be a selling point. People are gonna be able to say, like, hey, at my business, you get to talk to real person. You're gonna pay more to talk to real person. Yeah. And that's sad if we ever get to that place. But, you know, but then also let's switch gears and talk about the reality. You know, like what do we, what do we do about it? Because, you know, we can, we can we can complain about stuff, we can talk about the issues, but you know, we just need to figure out like what does that mean individually in our own homes? What does that mean in our own relationships? What does that mean in our businesses? And how can we assess the reality of the situation, utilize the strengths, but then also make sure that we're uh, you know, we're we're preventing ourselves from falling into those categories of loneliness.

SPEAKER_02 21:00

Absolutely. And actually, I think, you know, I want to bring up two words, I think combined intentionality and balance, right? You have to be intentional about communication, intentional about interactions and not losing these types of things. Um, because if you don't, then it's just gonna go by the wayside, right? And so we have the power as human beings still to make the choices and make things how we want them to be, right? So if we want a communication uh society, a relational society, if that's who we want to be, let's be that, right? Um, but also let's not fight the trend because technology is is is made us better in a lot of ways, right? I remember like the when the internet first came up, shout out to AOL and the in the in the in the in the in the dial-up tone. But our kids will never know. Right, all that stuff.

SPEAKER_01 21:41

They will not know the struggle of using a map to try and find their way.

SPEAKER_02 21:47

Yeah, all that stuff, right? Apple Maps, Google, but what was that, right? But still, I mean, all those things, and even in the beginning when technology started, there still was a lot of human aspect of things. There was much stuff that we had to do to be a part of it.

SPEAKER_01 21:57

Now things And then we couldn't rely on it, right? Because, like you said, you know, AOL, we all had that first account, and then we had to wait. It was like, uh, you know, it's making the noise, and and we're we're having to wait for a while, but we didn't know for sure if it was gonna work that day or wasn't gonna work that day, you know. And so you still had to have the backup plan.

SPEAKER_02 22:16

You're ready to go hang out with your friends, right? So I still know my instant messenger, you know, name and stuff from back then, right? Which is cool. But even still, I just think about this there's always uh a positive, but there's a consequence, right? When when you had the before internet, the dial up, guess what happened? Like, yeah, someone's on the internet, but now you can't use the phone, right? Because somebody's got a little bit busy, right? It's one or the other. So when you do use technology, there's always going to be something you lose from it and something you gain. So now we have to live in the reality of how do we make it better. So, how do we make it to where, hey, I can have the internet and not lose my phone call, right? That I can still use the phone. And I think that's where we're at now. How do we still invite technology, AI, and all the great things that are happening in our businesses and our culture without losing the relational aspect? Because as human beings, we're never gonna stop being human. We're never gonna stop having emotions, and there's a relational aspect of it. The Bible says it is not good for man to be alone. And I don't think that's not just about marriage, right? That's about the relational aspect of human beings, right? God made us to be relational, God made us to communicate and to want to be near each other. There's there's an invisible world that emote you can't see emotions, you can't see love, you can't see hate. But they dominate, but they dominate and they exist, right? They dominate our thoughts and our actions. So that invisible world we still are responsible for, right? Yeah, I don't think AI is ever gonna love me the way that you're gonna love me. At least I hope they don't get to that place, right? That'd be that'd be pretty scary. But I'll get uh replaced. Right. So uh so we still need to, and then also too, even think about that, our relationships are at stake, right? They're gonna become more surface levels, but we need deep connections in order for something to be sustainable. Our relationship can't be sustained as far as marriage unless there's some deepness in in and beyond just the surface, right? We we did the work to get deep and have that deep connection, right?

SPEAKER_01 24:00

Um, and so we we just came from a conference this weekend, and you know, I don't know if you remember what you caught, what the uh presenter was saying, you know, there was a workshop that was just on AI technology and how it was going to affect us. And we were thinking it was gonna be more specifically on, you know, utilizing the tools and what it was gonna do for our businesses, but it was actually, you know, the presenter took a completely different take and he actually talked about, you know, the humanity and the loss, the potential loss of humanity. And one thing that he said when he was talking about, you know, we had a question and answer session and somebody was asking a question about um, you know, the the workforce and how things have changed with employees and things like that. And he was saying, you know, a lot of times you're not gonna, you might be uh the place where people have to learn these skills. So he was saying that, you know, okay, we are where we are now. People are coming in without those basic skills because they've been raised by technology. But guess what? You can bridge that gap, you know, like know that in advance that this is the age that we're in. And as an organization, spend time figuring out what does that look like. Maybe we have to do a lot more mentoring and training and being more patient and communicating in a way that that is gonna be effective for them and that they're going to be able to um, you know, take in and understand.

SPEAKER_02 25:19

So that means we still gotta do some more work.

SPEAKER_01 25:21

We got a lot of work to do. Right. Absolutely. But again, and that and that's something to think about as entrepreneurs, you know, as as the stage changes, you change, you know, as the environment changes, it's never, you should never have the same practices and systems as you did when you first started off.

SPEAKER_02 25:38

That's good. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 25:39

Just like with marriage, right? Right. Like you can't, I I don't want to be loved in the exact same way that I was when I was, you know, 19 years old when you met me, you know, 25 years later. You know, I'm a different person. There's there's different needs and you know, and and thoughts and everything else that I have. And so we have to constantly relearn the space that we're in to be able to get the most out of it.

SPEAKER_02 26:02

Absolutely. So I mean, I think that's a uh a beautiful uh how you put that. Um so kind of just going along those lines, you know, let's talk about some lessons, some practical things that we can get out of, you know, like I said, instead of, hey, this is the problem, hey, what are some things we can do about it, right? So let's talk about some of the things we've learned in it, right? So I'm gonna ask you this. Um, how do we build meaningful relationships in the distracted world? Like what are some of the practical things we can do to make sure that we are relational with our employees or just even as a family or people, society in general?

SPEAKER_01 26:30

Yeah. Um, so I want to share something a little bit personal. So, you know, I've struggled with uh generalized anxiety disorder for many, many years. And um, I had uh social anxiety for as long as I can remember. Um, and I think it started probably in my preteens or early teens. You know, as you know, I I lived in a different country for a period of time. My parents were Christian missionaries. So we were in Brazil, and then we came over when I was 11 years old. Um, I think I was in fifth grade, and everything in the US was so different. Um and it just it almost put me into shock mode, you know? Yeah. And um, you know, I had obviously certain things that I was already, you know, that that were different about me, I guess, that became a big struggle. So, you know, I have a birthmark that's basically covers a third of my face. Yeah, I've I've I wear makeup now, so you you you know, you can't see it. But um, but when I came over in Brazil, everybody looked different, you know, differences were celebrated, diversity was was not a thing. And when I came here, people would say, What's that on your face? Like, what happened to you? Did you get burnt? I mean, the questions were, they just never stopped. Every time I left the house, I would get so many questions that I just started thinking, like, maybe something is really wrong with me, you know. Um, I had a speech impediment. I had to do speech therapy for a couple of years for that. So it was just all these different things that I, you know, when you're in one environment and you're fully accepted and known and loved, and then you get into another uh environment where you're constantly questioned and feel, you know, almost like alien, um, it really does something to you. So I think that's where a lot of the anxiety started. And and social anxiety was a huge thing for me for many years, I think, because of it. And I learned how to assimilate and blend in. I always joined every organization that I could, you know, I was a cheerleader, I was in student government, um, all the things, but I never felt like I could be myself. I felt like I had to wear, you know, makeup just to not be, I don't even want to say accepted, but I didn't want the first thing that you knew about me to be that my face was different. You know what I mean? Like I wanted people to know me. I wanted them to, I didn't want to be um known for just something, you know, like something physical on the outside of my body, but I wanted people to get to know me first, you know? And um, and so over the years, I kind of just became a chameleon. I just kind of like just, you know, like whatever else was going on, I would just sort of shrink back and I would physically be in a group because I would always join all these organizations, but I would never open my mouth, you know? And it took um a lot of intentionality, you know. Of course, I did, you know, some therapy and you know, some other things and and increased my faith. Um, but over these last few years, I've just learned to talk to people. I've learned to force myself to get out of things that had plagued me for years. And, you know, I I've learned that everybody's struggling. Everybody has something that may make them feel different or out of the ordinary. Um, and we all have things in our heart that we haven't communicated that we don't know how to process. And we're not the only ones that are, you know, maybe feel like we're weird or different. But that loneliness is not something that is like that that we're the only ones dealing with, you know? And I think um that that has been something that has become my mission is to make other people feel less lonely. And the good thing is when you focus on other people and helping them, then you don't have to think so much about yourself, you know. Like if you get out of your head, you can see that there's a lot of beauty in the world, you know? Yeah, and that's how you you you have to give out good and invite good in and not always assume that that um what your current situation is is what your current situation has to be, has to remain.

SPEAKER_02 30:19

So it's so funny, it's almost like you just said that in order to not feel lonely and distract the world, you gotta actually be the distraction, right? You gotta be like, hey, let me go be give others the love that I want to see, right?

SPEAKER_01 30:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:30

That's biblical. Like treat love your neighbor, love yourself, right? When you serve someone else, be the change you want to see, right? And so um, you know, the greatest amongst is serving among us. And so giving to people, I think a lot of times you feel so good about that, that in turn makes you have a good feeling about yourself, you know, so you're not really so much self-conscious. And I think when you're in a lonely place where you don't have communication or human interaction, you get more self-conscious, right? You start because you start thinking about all the things about yourself that nobody else is thinking about. But sometimes it then gets exacerbated sometimes when the wrong person does come by and say, like I said, what's happened to your face? What's going on with that? Right. And so those types of things can then, you know, make us feel more lonely than we already are. But I love what you said about also just, hey, I've got to go be the change. I've got to go communicate. Let me be the one to talk to people. And I know that can be hard sometimes, but again, you got to choose your hard. Do you want to stay in the loneliness? That's hard. Yeah. But do you want to get outside your comfort zone? That's hard too as well. But you'll get more benefits, obviously, on one end, and then you'll stay more in the place you don't want to be on the other. So I think uh, so kudos to you, babe, because you know, I've been I've been in this journey with you for so many years, and I've got to see the change in yourself. When I mean she's an introvert, yeah, she is, right? But uh, but she's also becoming an extrovert. Um, and I and I love it because now people get to see the beauty I see, you know, what attracted me to you so many years ago and our deep conversations. We never would have got to our start had we not had the deep conversation because I believe in that time period, especially when you're young, you don't really know what deepness is. You everything's pretty much surface level. Oh, you look cute, I'm cute, let's go hang out, let's, but we actually got into some deep stuff I think that brought us together pretty early. And so um, so just understanding that communication aspect can change your life, it can change and open the door to relationships. It opened the door for my marriage, right? And so, so I appreciate our deepness in communication we've had.

SPEAKER_01 32:20

So um, so I have a question for you as we start to wrap up. Um, how do you feel like leaders can create an environment for real connection?

SPEAKER_02 32:28

Wow, that's a great question.

SPEAKER_01 32:29

And that can be at home or, you know, in the business or wherever.

SPEAKER_02 32:33

I think one, you have to be in again, going back to intentionality. You have to be intentional about what you want to see. Um, sometimes we get busy and you know, just doing and sometimes just busy with the bottom line or just getting through the day that we forget those higher level things, right? Right. What what is the what is the culture supposed to be, right? Right? Is the culture right? Um, am I meeting the mission? How's my home temperature, right? Are my kids happy? Is my wife happy? Am I happy? So I think sometimes you have to go back and do a check to see where those things are and be intentional about it. Because if you don't ever check the temperature of those things, it's sometimes when they're not good, you want to kind of just gloss over them because it takes work to have to build it back up. So I think for one, you know, as leaders, we always have to make sure the main thing is the main thing. Hey, like I started with this purpose in mind. This is the culture I want to set. Don't lose that. Um, do all it takes to hold on to it because there's gonna be things that try to tear it down. Growing growth tears that down. Yes, right? It tears it down a lot because the more people set up challenges. Because the more people you bring in, the more you have to actually hold on to it and the more you have to continue to put out to make sure it happens. But also, too, I would say find people that you connect with that share that as well. Because there's nothing like having a bunch of people around you that you can rally behind something, then you feel more empowered. If you got a bunch of people that feel the same way you feel about something, when you you're not alone. Sometimes when you feel alone and you feel isolated, it's like, well, man, I just shrink back. I don't think I what I mean matters. And so, but when other people around you say it for you or say it with you, you I think you feel better. Um, and I think that can affect the workplace, that can affect your home. I know when me and you are on the same page and we're trying to, so it's so funny. Like sometimes when you want to do something like, babe, like, you know, if you come over here and help me and say it the way you say it, our kids are gonna be like, yeah, let's do it, right? Or sometimes if you just do it, it's like, oh, you know, they're gonna be like, nah, whatever, right? So, but I think the dynamic of togetherness on something, you can actually get more accomplished. And so I think for leaders, don't forget the power of togetherness, don't forget the power of unity with multiple people besides yourself when you want to try to be that change you're trying to be.

SPEAKER_01 34:37

Yeah, for sure. And I think being intentional of setting up those atmospheres for connectivity. And it can be something as simple, you know. I know with our organizations, we always make sure that we have a group chat and that we actually use it. You know, we're we're we always say um praise in public, correct in private. So if there's something that you need people to change, you know, sit them down and have that one-on-one with them. And again, you have connection and you're you're being able to communicate clearly. There's nothing worse than getting reprimanded in a text or an email. Because you really don't even know, you know what I mean? Like when you don't have the opportunity, yeah, to ask questions and to have the context. But sometimes it can it can just sound terrible, you know, and then they you can keep rereading that and just reliving it, like, oh, did they mean to say it this way? Did they mean to say, you know? But so we always say um praise in public. So when when we when something is going well, we put it on our group chats, you know, we're sending little emojis and you know, little little shout-outs and stuff so that everybody can celebrate the wins. Um, and then even, you know, creating opportunities, whether it's you know, monthly meetings or you know, a lot of our uh businesses, we've implemented like a quarterly outing where we get away from the business. You know, we'll shut down the our um preschool centers or we'll shut down our restaurant for a few hours and we'll we'll take our staff somewhere, whether it's universal, whether it's um, you know, just anywhere that's outside that creates connection and creates a you know fun environment. So I think there's definitely some practical things that people can think of that work for you know for their organization. Every organization is different, and you know, I mean it could be even like small bites.

SPEAKER_02 36:17

I said we invited our um when our employees are house like for Thanksgiving as our outing, right? Or the family. That meant everything, right?

SPEAKER_01 36:25

It just the fact that we we didn't have money, we didn't, you know, like that was the most we could do is hey, let's just do a little pot look at the house. But you know, start somewhere with building uh intentional connectivity.

SPEAKER_02 36:36

Absolutely. And so connectivity is so, so important, right? As a culture, as a society and business and family, what do we want to be, right? We don't want the technology to be the ones that dictate what we do. We want to say, hey, technology, this is what we want you to do for us alongside of who we already are. And I think that when we don't lose that relational aspect of things, I think that our society is better. And I think hopefully that epidemic we've been talking about, loneliness, we can be that change, right? If you know someone that's lonely, go give them a hug, go talk to them, you know, be that person and you invite somebody out for coffee. Exactly, right? Coffee shops are huge nowadays, right?

SPEAKER_01 37:10

Exchange actual phone numbers, not Instagram accounts.

SPEAKER_02 37:13

Yes, right.

SPEAKER_01 37:14

Phone numbers, phone numbers, right?

SPEAKER_02 37:15

So absolutely. So go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 37:18

But yeah, so let's get into some of these application questions. So these are just questions that we want you guys to kind of consider throughout the week and just figure out, you know, like how did this speak to you and how can you take it back and apply it? So the first one we have here, it says, um, who do you need to reconnect with intentionally? So just think about, you know, is there someone that that maybe, you know, does does feed your soul, somebody that you connect with, somebody that you feel like, you know, challenges you that you haven't made the time to reach out to, you know? Maybe, maybe that is something where you can say, hey, I only have an hour, I only have 30 minutes, but do you mind if we grab some lunch or some coffee this week?

SPEAKER_02 37:57

Yeah. And I think the familiarity of somebody you're already connected to, that helps, right? Because sometimes we don't know how to talk to strangers, and that's okay. I can talk to a stranger, you know. I think that's something that's, you know, I've been able to do over the years, and and especially being in the entrepreneurs and business that we do, we have to be comfortable with that, but sometimes we're not. But what can you be comfortable with? At least talking to somebody that you do know. And then I said that reconnection with somebody because you know, you never know what they're going through. And you know, that high or whatever just that interaction might bring them up. And now you guys can share an intimate connection moment with that person.

SPEAKER_01 38:28

Yeah, that's good.

SPEAKER_02 38:29

The next one uh application when a question leave you is what distraction is pulling you away from real relationships, right? Like what is happening in your life that's not allowing you to connect beyond that surface level, right? Are you connecting with your family? You know, hey, on the weekends we're doing something purposeful as a family, right? With your spouse, hey, we're deciding that we like to do what we call a dialogue daily, we date weekly and depart quarterly, right? If that if that's something you want to be a part of, that's got to be intentional, right? So what is pulling you away from those types of things? Or even your coworkers or entrepreneurs, the culture of your business, what are the things that are pulling you away from making sure that you're able to steward those things, like those real relationships that really matter at the end of the day, where you're gonna get the best out of things?

SPEAKER_01 39:09

Yeah, very good. Um, and then lastly, the last question we we jotted down here was you know, after you think about all these things, just take a minute to say what small step can you do today, this week, you know, to move towards more connectivity and intentionality when it comes to that.

SPEAKER_02 39:27

Absolutely. So we want you to know listen, technology is great, all the advancement we're doing is great. Nothing against that at all. Matter of fact, it makes our society, our businesses, and our lives better. But at the end of the day, we don't want to replace those things so much that we lose connectivity in relationships, right? Because this epidemic of loneliness, that's a real number. And we get to see it every single day with the people we employ, the people that we interact with. There's a real deepness and want for connection. Yeah. And I just want to leave you guys with this you know, ultimately, God is our person that loves us the most, right? And so if you don't feel love, know that God loves you, right? Jesus, He loves you. Like there's a connection there that will always be there if you're feeling like nobody's in your corner. And then we do too as well. So um, so again, we thank you so much for joining us. Have you not subscribed yet to our podcast? Hey, please subscribe to us at Love and Lead Pod here on Insta on YouTube. We have an Instagram and Facebook too as well. And so there's so many ways you can get a chance to connect with us. But if you love this type of content and all the others as well, make sure you join us back on the next episode. And so, again, we're gonna continue to give you great uh stories just like this and hope that we can be the change in other society that we want to see. But again, this is my beautiful co host, Star Postel. I am Trent, and this is the Love and Leadership Podcast. Make sure you love well, lead with purpose, and steward whatnot.