How Joe Kavanagh Jumped His Close Rate From 37% to 86%

Joe Kavanagh is a true authority in sales, with over four decades of real world experience across appraisal, real estate, and high level consulting. He has built and run his own appraisal company, successfully sold real estate, and spent his career face to face and voice to voice with buyers, sellers, and decision makers. He is not guessing how sales works. He has lived it, refined it, and proven it over thousands of conversations and deals.

Joe shares how he took his closing percentage from 37 percent to an extraordinary 86 percent within 1 year. He did not get there by relying on charisma or pressure. He got there by studying how people think, how they decide, and how they want to be communicated with. He dove deep into the B A N K personality coding system and NLP so he could better understand the person in front of him and speak to them in a way that actually felt respectful, natural, and clear. B A N K stands for the 4 different personality types. 

Blueprint, Action, Nurturing, and Knowledge. If you would like to learn which personality you are check the link at the bottom. 

B A N K gave him a structure to recognize what truly matters to different types of buyers. Some crave structure and certainty. Some move fast and want results. Some care most about relationships and impact. Others want data, logic, and proof. Joe studied this so he could walk into every conversation asking, Who is this person really, and how can I communicate in a way that serves them. When he added NLP on top of that, he sharpened his ability to listen, ask precise questions, and match how people naturally communicate, so they felt understood instead of sold to.

What makes this powerful for young salespeople is that Joe proves you do not have to be born a closer. You can become one. He treated sales like a craft. He tracked his closing rate. He reviewed his calls. He used every no as information, not an identity. He understood that when you are in sales, your real job is to fulfill what the other person is genuinely looking for in the best way you can. When you approach it that way, better communication is not a trick, it is a responsibility. His jump from 37 percent to 86 percent is the result of that mindset and of doing the work to truly understand people. When you truly understand what kind of person is in front of you, how they think, what they value, what is important. Then you can cater to their needs. This is not manipulation it is simply providing them the solution as they would like to hear it. For example, many people who are ACTION based they do not want a bunch of data, they would like to know how you will provide the solution and what the bottom line is. 

Joe’s story is a reminder that you can build a repeatable, ethical, and high performing sales process by learning how people think, practicing how you speak, and caring about the outcome for the person across from you. 

If you want to go deeper, you can look him up on LinkedIn under his name, Joe Kavanagh, and, if it feels like the right fit, explore a discovery call to see how his approach with B A N K and NLP could help you grow your own commissions and communication skills.

Links below: 

First to contact Joe directly.

Second if you would like to learn about yourself on a deeper level in less than one minute. 

https://www.linkedin.com/in/joe-m-kavanagh/

https://codebreakerglobal.com/crackyourcode?code=kavanagh

If you liked this episode and found it valuable share to a friend. Please excuse some of the background noise as this episode was virtual and all noise could not be cancelled out. Thank you for your continued support and have a wonderful week. 

@PasadenasWolf

@CapitolsWolf

@OfficeOfTheDayMA

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

And now, a word with Mark Anthony, Pasadena's Wolf. Welcome back to Office of the Day. Today I have a very amazing guest who has over 40 years of experience. Mr. Joe Kavanaugh, a certified NLP and ICF coach. Go ahead and introduce yourself because nobody can do it better than you.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

Well, first of all, Mark, thank you for having me on your show. It's an honor. And yeah, my name is Joe Kavanaugh. Originally born in Ireland. Left there when I was a baby, raised in the Boston area. So if you do hear an accent, it is the Boston one. Moved around a little bit, grew uh moved to Maine, lived up there for nine years, got into being an entrepreneur, got tired of punching the clock for the man, making him money, and uh successfully bought and sold some businesses up there, got into real estate, and then we made a move to Charleston, South Carolina, which is where I've been for the last 32 years, and uh had a very successful career in real estate here. Both uh I own a real estate appraisal company, and I'm also uh a broker, real estate broker. So been there, done that, done a lot of different things.

SPEAKER_01 1:19

Out of all the ventures you've explored, we'll have a little bit of fun before we start. Which has been the most rewarding in mindset?

SPEAKER_00 1:31

Ooh, okay. Well, that's a good question. Um, that we didn't talk about ahead of time. But I owned a Christmas tree farm in Maine. And to me, that was heaven. I'm an I'm an action guy, I'm an outdoorsman. I love nature, uh, I love sports, just love being outside. And that was heaven. It really was. It was so peaceful where we lived. You could hear the wind blowing through the trees. It was so quiet. You had the coyotes off in the distance. Every once in a while you might hear a bear or a moose grunting. Um, I was just in heaven with that. But uh, due to some family situations and just social situations, whatnot, it it wasn't working out the way we wanted. Um, so we ended up selling that. So if there was any regret, it was that. But um basically it was for the children. They were isolated and weren't getting social skills, so we had to move back to society, as I say, just to make it simple. And um, yeah, so we had to give that up. But that I could have at the time I always said, boy, I could die here, so I could just live here the rest of my life. And I was just in my 40s then. So it's just a kid.

SPEAKER_01 2:48

Uh may I ask why you left? Or why you decided to why why did you decide to move from there when you were having uh an amazing uh time?

SPEAKER_00 2:58

Well, uh the main reason was because we were isolated and we had we had young children. Our oldest was just starting to go to school, and it was actually the school that made us aware of it. They called us in after a couple of weeks, says, you know, we can't get your son to interact well with the other children. And after we studied the situation, we realized it was that isolation. This is a kid who at five years old could cross-country ski by himself and he could track animals through the woods just by seeing what they left behind, rubbing against the trees, broken branches, footprints, things like that. At five years old, he was figuring all this out. And we called him our little Daniel Boom. And then we realized, yeah, he's great at nature by himself, but he needs to interact with society. And we had two younger ones coming up behind him that were two and a half and six months. And so we made a decision that we got to move back to civilization. And at the time, I had previously owned a campground and I successfully sold it myself and bought the Christmas tree farm. So a local real estate broker told me, you know, hey, you're good at real estate, you should get into real estate. So I did. And uh that clicked, clicked very well for me, and just have a natural ability to negotiate and get the deal done. So I thought, well, we'll stick with that. And then I was doing it for a few years. Um, and at the time, um, my wife at that time and my parents both passed away within about a year and a half period. And she said, you know, now that we don't have that connection to hold us here, I'd like to move south. So that prompted us to make that move and uh just sell everything and go. So we did. And as I was saying to you earlier, that I thought, well, get on, we'll give it a year, and if I can make a go of it, we'll stay. If not, we'll just come back. And I got here and I'll tell you what, it was it took off like wildfire. So definitely a great move. And um, 32 years later, here I am, you know, doing pretty well because business was well over the years. Real estate's been good to me.

SPEAKER_01 5:09

But come on now, let's face it, we're gonna go into the value. There is no true natural negotiation skills, right? There is a system that you have in place. Uh, go into explaining the bank code and how you implemented the bank code within uh educating and serving as opposed to selling, and then as well, NLP. Uh, please and thank you.

SPEAKER_00 5:33

Sure, Mark. Um just a quick background is I did have some ability, was even when I was in high school, my friends used to say to me, Man, you tricked me into that. I said, You can sell anything to anybody. So you should be a salesman. So I did go to college like everybody else back then, but I hated it. So I ended up dropping out. And I just I was searching, and it took me till I was 39 uh uh 29 to actually realize that I can't work for the man anymore. I can't punch a clock, I can't be told what to do. My personality, as you now know what it is, I just uh I can't just live in the box and follow all the rules all the time, you know. So uh that's what got me into entrepreneurship, and it was working out very well. And I was very good at sales, and I knew I had that natural ability. So my ego got big because I was successful, but it was also what was holding me back. But I had no idea why, because back then, think about it, we didn't have the internet. I had heard about getting coaches, but they all seemed expensive, and I didn't have the money, and I didn't want to do it, and I said, nah, I can do this myself. And I did quite well. I no real complaints that way. My only complaint is I wish I had listened to people back then and got a coach, because I'd probably be a multimillionaire today. I'm not, you know, I'm not poor off, I'm I'm I'm comfortable, but it would have been a lot accelerated a lot quicker, let's put it that way, a lot higher. And it took me several decades to finally get into that. And after the 2008 housing crisis that burnt me pretty bad, um, it was pretty much starting over. And I struggled for a while. And about 2015, I finally started to listen to other people and eventually got some coaches. Uh, started going to these um uh business conferences and things like that, and listening to these leaders like Tony Robbins and whatnot. And then that evolved to going to one of these um big conferences, and a lady got up and talked about a personality methodology that would help increase your sales. And I've heard that script before many times, but this one seemed different. There was something about it I just knew. I've never heard anything like this before. So skeptical, but my wife liked it too. But she didn't, she's not a salesperson, she's into relationships and communicating, and she loved that aspect of it. So we thought, well, let's spend some money and go into this together and see if either one of us can benefit from it. As it turned out, we both did. So I studied this methodology, eventually went and we went both and became certified trainers in it. And the reason is um in real estate, and I was doing it pretty full time, pretty much full time, um, I was a realtor distinction. I was in the top 10% of all realtors based on my uh amount of sales, and I just knew I could be better though. So I started using this uh methodology, and as I was telling you before the call, that in real estate on that first appointment, national average of getting that paperwork signed is around 20-22%. It's not very high. And they always tell you if you don't get it signed that first time, there's a good chance you're not gonna get a second appointment because some other agents are gonna come in and get it signed. So it's so important to do that. So again, I'm at 37%, I'm pretty high. I'm thinking I don't need any of this really, but I thought, well, we'll see what happens, we'll test it out. I started using this system, and before you know it, I noticed I was starting to close a lot of deals. So I sat down and did some analysis on it. And again, prior to using this, I was closing at 37%, and within a year, that shot up to 86%. It's almost nine out of 10 appointments. I was getting that paperwork signed and coming out at full commission, didn't even have to negotiate it down. And the owner of the company noticed this and asked me what I was doing different. So I told him about this tool, this methodology I was using. And he said, man, you got to come in and train the company. So we talked it over for a while and negotiated. And um, he hired my wife and I to come in and train the company. And what happened with the company, and he gave me a video testimonial on LinkedIn about it, is within in less than a year with the company, their company conversion rate went from 32% to 62%. And he said they grossed an extra $50 million in sales because of that. And he's an analytical guy, so I knew he knew his stuff. And uh quite honestly. But uh I'm like, man, we should have we should have charged more money. It was a good deal, it was a fair deal of where we have a good relationship, so I thought that was good. And then it came a point where, you know, do I want to work this hard anymore? And I started looking at it, I wasn't working that hard anymore. I the next year, what I did was I tested it out, and I I want to see if I worked halftime because I was getting a retirement age. I want to cut back a little bit, travel more. So the next year I worked about 52% of what I had worked the year before. So pretty much right at half. And I actually sold more real estate that year than I had the previous year. And that's when I knew this was a this was a winner.

SPEAKER_01 11:26

So um I saved more, it was like uh that 20 or that 37 to 70% mark, or how much more?

SPEAKER_00 11:37

Um I sold I sold a million dollars more in volume real estate that year that I worked half as much. The reason I get away with working half as much is because I now went in there with confidence. I knew within 90 seconds I could figure out their personality and their value system. And once you know both two things, you can relate to them. And as we know now, sales today, it's a relationship business, it's a people business, it's not just a numbers business. And that was the difference. Um, and little evidence of that too is I'd go with these newer agents to try and help them. And, you know, usually go in there to listen to their presentation, then give them feedback after. Yet on a couple, well, three or four of them that I can recall, um, they were I could see they were losing it. They weren't going to get it signed. And then I stepped in, and we had talked about this before we went in the call, into the meeting, is um, you know, they would say, hey, feel free to take over if you think I'm losing it. So I did, I'd step in, I'd speak their language, and then all of a sudden I'd bring them back around. Next thing you know, they're listening with us and getting the paperwork signed. And we'd walk out of there, and the agent's like, I don't know how the heck you did that, but I know I couldn't have done it. And that's when I started telling us, well, it's because I knew their personality.

SPEAKER_01 13:03

Yeah. So educate on that and show show the cards. And can you explain furthermore within the bank code system for the these young hungry salespeople and these uh also seasoned salespeople who maybe haven't dialed this in just quite yet?

SPEAKER_00 13:19

Sure, sure. Yeah. Um, there are several ways of doing it, but the easiest way when you're on the go and you're meeting people, as you do in real estate, is they come with four cards. Okay. Now, I didn't invent the system. There's a lady named Sherry Tree who did create it, and um, I just started implementing it. And it breaks down, it's it's just like all the other personality assessments, except that she says it's reverse engineered.

unknown 13:45

Right.

SPEAKER_00 13:46

In other words, you take a disc assessment, the Enneagrams, any of these things. Who do they tell you about? You. Your favorite, your favorite subject, they tell you about yourself, right? Right. People want to know about themselves. What this does is this now, if I'm coming to list your home, Mark, and I don't know who you are. Once I show you these cards and you hand them back to me, I now know who you are, what your values are, and how you want to be communicated to. So I simply stop and say when we sit down and talk to people in their home, say, hey, Mark, I'd like to do things just a little bit different and have some fun at the same time. You up for that?

SPEAKER_03 14:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:26

Already you got a smile on your face. I know you're gonna do it, right? So I take out the cards and I say, I have four cards here with a set of each one has a set of values on. Do me a favor and look at each card. And after you do, sort the cards in order. Which one sounds most like you on top overall? Then the next best one, then the less one, and then the least one at the bottom. And that's gonna help me to know you a little bit better and save us both some time. Now, right there, I didn't explain this to you earlier. There's scientific, it's been scientifically proven that I spoke all four codes right there when I asked you to do that.

SPEAKER_01 15:05

Wow. Yeah. So let's break down each code after it. When you get a second, go for it.

SPEAKER_00 15:11

Nobody turns it down.

SPEAKER_01 15:13

Right.

SPEAKER_00 15:14

And if they do, there's a reason. And I know which personality they are if they won't do it.

SPEAKER_01 15:20

It's the blue card, right?

SPEAKER_00 15:21

Uh actually it's the green card.

SPEAKER_01 15:24

Okay.

unknown 15:25

Why?

SPEAKER_00 15:25

I'll explain that. Okay. I'll explain that in a second. So I'll go through each of them. So you get this, the first personality, which is your blueprint. And bank, it's called Bank, and it's an acronym Blueprint Action Nurturing Knowledge. Okay? So these are the people, they live in inside the box. They have rules, systems, processes in place. They are risk-adverse, very key to know when you're doing sales. They are very risk averse. You've got to show them they want tradition, they want credentials. They want you to prove yourself that you're not the new kid on the block. Okay? Big on trust, hence the blue color, too, and the color blue. Um, then you got the action personality, now, which I'll give away a little hint to everybody. Mark and I are both the same. We have this as our first card. We don't like the box. We're like, box, what box? I'm not being a box, and we just get some dynamite and blow that thing up, right? Um, we like instantaneous, we like uh flexibility, we like to have fun, we like to win, and we like freedom, things like that. So don't fence me in, type things. Also, don't go through a presentation bullet point style. The blueprint likes that. The action person, no. Cut to the chase. What's in it for me? How much am I gonna make? That's the bottom line. Right. Don't waste my time spending an hour explaining everything to me because I'm not interested. So right there, you can see the diversity, and probably people are thinking already, that's why I didn't get those people to sign. Because they did one thing wrong or another. If I walk into a blueprint personality and I just say, you know what, I'm the best agent there is out there. I'm a top performer, I'm closing 90% of the time. I'm gonna get you more money than anybody else. All you gotta do is sign here, here, here, and here. You think a blueprint's gonna even want to talk to me? No, because I didn't explain everything I'm gonna do for him step by step by step.

SPEAKER_03 17:27

Right.

SPEAKER_00 17:28

The action with you, Mark, it's like, you know what, I got a great opportunity for you. I can give you details if you want, but here's the highlights, and this is how it's gonna work. How does it sound to you? You ready to go? Give it a shot. You're more likely to do it, okay? Right. So then our third one is a nurturing personality. Now, these think sunflowers and sunshine and you know, uh honey and pots of gold and things like that. And these are people that they don't necessarily follow the rules inside the box, and they're not gonna blow up the box. They'll repurpose the box, they'll turn it into a planter or a gift basket or something like that. They're into the recycling, conservation. They love to support people. That's why you'll often find them in nonprofits.

SPEAKER_03 18:16

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 18:17

So it's those kind of people they want to help out the community. They're into that. Um, they're also into uh relationships. That's really important with the nurturing. You've got to build that relationship. Authenticity. It's often said they can smell a wolf in sheep's clothing a mile away. Um, morality, they're in high ethics. You've got to have a lot of that. So that's where that personality shines. And then last but not least is the knowledge people. Now, if you're a knowledge, congratulations. You're probably the smartest person in the room. These are the people that like research, they uh they appreciate intelligence, logic, uh, self-mastery. They want to know everything they can about something, they're into technology, all that. And they look at the big picture. So, where do they fit in the box? Well, without them, you wouldn't have a box because they designed it.

SPEAKER_03 19:14

Right.

SPEAKER_00 19:16

So that's why they can have they can be green with envy too. Because you and I, as action people, we're the guys that are up on stage and we're selling the product and we're making all the big commissions and all that, right? But guess what? It's these guys that design that product you're selling.

unknown 19:32

Right.

SPEAKER_03 19:32

So they implement it and produce the product.

SPEAKER_00 19:34

They don't get the action. Yeah. You walk into a room, they typically don't want it standing off in the corner by themselves.

SPEAKER_01 19:42

So, how do you sell the person that's in the green box?

SPEAKER_00 19:45

Ah, great question. When I go into an appointment, and again, I do this right away. So within 90 seconds, what they do is when I they look at these cards and they sort them and hand them back to me. I now know how I should be communicating to them.

SPEAKER_01 20:02

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 20:03

In other words, what was holding me back before was I was always going in there as the high profile guy, the high action guy. And as soon as I thought they liked me, it's like, you know what? I was I'm a realtor distinction. I won this award. We had a listing contest at the office, I won it. I won a weekend at a five-star resort and all this. I'm talking all about myself.

SPEAKER_01 20:23

They don't care about us.

SPEAKER_00 20:25

No. They want what's the market doing? What's the data? Where's it been? Where's it going? What's your take on it? What's your interpretation on it? I gotta know more. I gotta know more. So two things. You can't, well, I was gonna ask a question, but I think I gave it away. You cannot close a knowledge personality. They have to close themselves. The reason being they have to analyze everything, they've got to run it through their minds several times and every which way and look at it from every every angle. And just like a scientist, when the proof is there, then they know it's right. They can also get stuck in analysis paralysis for that very reason. They can't seem to make up their mind and decide if it's right or not. So they typically need time to think about it. So if I know I got a person, uh knowledge personality, two things. I'm gonna give them all the data I can throw at them and bury them in data. And the more you do, the more they like it. And I also know, don't expect them to sign that first time. So ahead of time, my well-formed outcome is to get that second appointment. So, Mark, I understand that you want to analyze this data and you may have some more questions. I'd like to give you time to think about it before we make a decision and move forward. So if I today is, let's say today is Saturday, could you uh have a conclusion and do all your research by, say, Monday at three o'clock, or would six o'clock be better? We can have, I can come back and I can answer any remaining questions you have. If you give a knowledge a deadline, they will have their answer by that deadline. So they're good that way. But they're not ones that are just going to jump right in and say, where do I sign? It has to feel right to them. So by doing that, you've you've really accomplished the goal because you've taken all the pressure off of them, have them assigned. And now they're like, man, this guy just he's not rushing me. He's giving me data. He'll give me more data if I want it. I like this guy.

SPEAKER_01 22:30

And you're giving them the ideal situation the time to think about it, which is what they want to do anyways. Right.

SPEAKER_00 22:36

I'm relating to their personality style and their value system. Right. And the beauty of that is the studies have shown that 86%, I think it's 86%, of people will buy from people that they like, that can relate to them, they can relate to it. Pretty much it doesn't matter what they're selling.

SPEAKER_01 22:56

That they like, trust, and understand, right? What are the three?

SPEAKER_00 23:01

Yes, and that I see them. Because let's face it, what do people want? They want to be seen, loved, and understood, right? Right. So this guy, this guy sees me. He understands how I think. I like this guy.

SPEAKER_01 23:16

So what's the difference between a oh, go for it?

SPEAKER_00 23:18

No, no, your question.

SPEAKER_01 23:20

What's the difference between a green card and a blue card?

SPEAKER_00 23:24

Ah, great question. So the green card, they they want to just be able to sit and analyze the data and research it. The blue card, which is the blueprint, these are the people, remember, they have system processes step by step. So I'll give you a great story, probably the easiest way to do this.

SPEAKER_03 23:43

Let's do it.

SPEAKER_00 23:44

I had early on after I'd learned this methodology and I was implementing it, I had a client I listed their home. Now, this is pre-pandemic when things are going off the shelf in an hour. We were not getting multiple offers. And we weren't getting over-asking price offers. So I had this house listed at $599, if I remember correctly, $599,000. And we got an offer within five days from an agent, excuse me, and it was for, I think it was $615 was the number. And I looked at it, I thought, she does know the house only $599, right? Nobody ever asked over it. So I called her up one. I says, Is this right? And she said, Yeah, we've already lost out on two houses. Now, again, this is when multiple offers were just coming into vogue. And actually, I hadn't even heard of them at the at that point. And she said, We already missed out on two houses, and we don't want to miss out on this one. And I'm like, okay, I'll present it. And it was a great clean contract. They were doing like 30% financing, so it's almost a cash deal. They weren't worried about inspections, all this stuff. And I'm thinking, man, this is a slam dunk. They're gonna love me for this. So it happened to be, I think it was a Tuesday or something, and I was planning and grilling a steak that night for dinner. And I got the offer about five o'clock, and you're supposed to present them right away. So I told my wife, man, I got to run over there and do that. And she goes, That's okay, we'll have the steak tomorrow night. So to get a great understanding wife, that's a big go. So I went over there and I says, you know what? I'll I'll probably be 15 minutes getting this signed. It's so clean, I'll be home in an hour. So I get there and I sit down and I sell them, you know, Mr. and Mrs. Jones, uh, here's the highlights. They're offering over-asking price, they're not worried about that. They can close on your time frame. All you gotta do is initial these pages and sign here. And he stops me. Keep in mind they're both high blueprint. And he says, Hold on, hold on, before you go anywhere. What does this first section mean on the contract? And all that is, it's the names, the buyer, the seller, all that. Well, what's the second one? Well, the second one is the term, you know, it's the address, the legal address, and all this. I hadn't even really got into the meat of it. And all of a sudden it went off of my head. I said, Oh, yeah, I gotta walk through this step by step. Well, I'm gonna be here a while. So I just took a deep breath of myself, calm down, because being the action, I want to get in and out. They don't. I literally, and I I jokingly, well, somewhat jokingly tell this after the fact when I do this training, is I don't think I'd ever read the whole contract before until these people. We have 28 clauses over eight pages.

SPEAKER_01 26:35

So just so the listeners know, how many hours did that entail too?

SPEAKER_00 26:39

That was an hour and a half, just explaining that. Because I didn't just read it. After I read it, they're like, well, what does that mean? See, they had to understand everything. Well, he was a blueprint knowledge, which is some of the toughest ones I found to communicate with. She was a blueprint nurturing. So she was a little more forgiving because of that nurturing uh part that filters in. Him, he's like, no, I got to understand this correctly. And um, I did get it signed, but I walked out of there like, oh my God. And I just was thankful I understood that because I would have been so I would have been getting more frustrated by the minute every question they asked. And I then I started to think about other times when I did do that, and then deals went sour after, and I couldn't figure out why. And I think because it initiated there, they all of a sudden didn't like that I was pushing them. And then it filtered through and just festered. And so I was able to eliminate all those frustrations and uh made life easier, and that's when I decided to work less, work smarter, not harder, as they say.

SPEAKER_01 27:51

So do you think in total it was like a uh a two-hour meeting, uh two and a half hour meeting after breaking down every clause and reading the clause the next question?

SPEAKER_00 28:00

Yeah, yeah, it was um it was about a 20-minute drive, and I was there a good at just about an hour and a half on the button. Oak explaining and answering questions, and then drive back. So what's that two, two and a half hours?

SPEAKER_01 28:13

Yeah, I mean that brings me back to one of my closes in solar, and it was uh I was two hours and twenty minutes in the house alone. Right? They were, I think they were a blueprint, but also they were the wife was a relationship. So I end up having uh one glass of wine with them, and they wanted to just know a little bit more about me before actually signing on the dotted line and putting down the initial deposit at the time, which is like something super low, right? Because it's just a financing option.

SPEAKER_00 28:46

But that's the nurturing. She wants to know who you are before she can support you.

SPEAKER_01 28:51

Right. And I've never I I I don't know if you agree with this. I I don't think it's professional to have one glass even on the first meeting, but something told me that I needed to do it to close the deal. So I I did do it. Uh do you uh agree with that? Where's the like profession from professionality standpoint to the to the I I'm gonna help this client understand that I'm somebody that of value that they need to work with? How do you distinguish that based on this system, or maybe it relates to more on the NLP that we were referring to earlier?

SPEAKER_00 29:30

Yeah, first first thing I would say is one, it depends. Are you is this somebody meeting you know for their own personal home, or are you going into a corporation and talking to the the powers to be? Big difference there. I assuming this is at somebody's home, that lady is saying, Yes, I like you if you go along with what I want, and they wanted to share a glass of wine. That's their way of relaxing and connecting. So I am a drinker, I'm not afraid of the drink. So I would have one, and I may not drink at all, depending on, you know, have I eaten before that, is it gonna start affecting me and I start blabbing or whatever? So you got to stay in control, obviously. Um, but a lot of people that's that's their way of feeling comfortable and communicating, and you want them to feel comfortable. That's the whole idea of understanding their personality. So I would I have done that before. I actually had a guy who loved scotch, and he had this one of the best collections I've ever seen. I mean, he had $15,000 bottles in his cabinet. And he wanted me, he knew I was Irish. He was Scottish, by the way. And he says, he says, I know you appreciate a good Scotch. He says, You got to try this. I was like, Well, I am working, you know. It happened to be at the end of the day, so it was my last appointment. I said, Well, I am working. He said, Ah, come on, a little dram won't hurt you. And I says, All right, I'll do a little, but I I can't stay here all night. So I set the boundaries right up front. And uh he appreciated it. I ended up having two because there were two different ones he wanted me to try, which I was fine with. And uh that bonded us right there. That worked out very well.

SPEAKER_01 31:10

I I I believe some people will not do business with you if you don't have a a couple of drinks with them. I've seen that within as well the roofing industry, right? The roofing industry is crazy, and I say crazy because since they're overly worked, they have so much stress on them. You go to these conferences and you make these relationships, but they want to see how you are under the influence to see if you change, see how you are, because they say alcohol just reveals who you truly are. Depending on what you drink, right? There's certain like dark alcohols that will put you in a different uh way. But I mean, in in the Mexican culture, they love tequila, and that just heightens who you are ultimately. So, what what does it you think about that?

SPEAKER_00 31:51

Uh, it's interesting you say that, which brings up something else uh we hadn't talked about before is I am an international property specialist in my real estate. And matter of fact, our local uh real estate board, I'm on the global business chapter of our board. And I'm Irish, I go back to Ireland frequently, and I know that culture very well. I know a lot of cultures, but that one in particular. And over there, you're expected to go to the pub and have a pint either during or after the meeting. So a lot of deals are done that way. And if you, let's say you're in a corporate meeting all day and you're very successful and you're nailing them down and you're getting a deal, and then they're like, okay, we're off to the pub now, because they don't work late. They're not like Americans that way. They're all they're more blueprint, they're organized. So five o'clock, workdays over now. It's family time. And family time includes going to the pub to see what's going on. Uh, not all the time, but at times. And especially after a long day of conference. And um, if you don't go to the pub with them, there's a good chance you're not getting that deal. They'll back out. They say, you know what, guys got a great product, but it's a bit of a pasty, pasty soul.

SPEAKER_01 33:05

So do they think you're soft because of it, maybe? What's that? Do they think that you're soft because of it, or is this well that he's not bond with us?

SPEAKER_00 33:14

Right. He's not sociable. He's not one of us. And you gotta be one, it's not, it's not what you know so much, it's who you know, and can they relate to you? And that's again, brings it right back to the relation bit. And you you mentioned NLP. That's the other aspect of it, is uh which I didn't get into a lot of that. Um also they use a four-current system. And what I'm doing when I'm talking to somebody, I'm listening for these clues. For example, do they relate to visual or they relate to auditory, hearing things? Do they think things through? For example, uh, we use this earlier, was um, I see what you're saying. I said the word see. Right away, I'm thinking, okay, that's probably a visual person. So when I am speaking back to them, I'll say, you know, let me show you this, or let me make that picture clear. It's visual, okay. Uh, whereas somebody might say, for example, I hear what you're saying. Ah, they hear what I'm saying. That's how they like to connect. So let me let me set up a um a situation where you can really hear the in the sounds, you know, like the birds at the beach or the waves or whatever it might be, that sort of thing. Or somebody who thinks things through. Ah, I think I understand. Okay. So let me uh propose this to you for something to think about. See if you can understand it this way. So people do think differently. It's what's their personality? And that's the whole thing. And one of my taglines I like to use is it's not personal, it's personality.

SPEAKER_01 35:01

And the other one So not only using their words verbatim, but also putting it in a way to make them truly show that you're listening, right?

SPEAKER_00 35:12

Yes, I'm connecting with their uh way of thinking, their personality, their mindset. And their language. And their language. And um it's done so easily, too. It's like, you know, people talk about this. That's the big one, the personality methodology. Yeah, it's great, but first of all, off the top of your head, unless you're a disk uh user all the time, what does this stand for? I can never remember. Whereas bank, it's like blueprint action, nurture knowledge, you know, you use the right letters. But also, this it costs money every time you do the test. It's long, it's complicated. I've taken the disk assessment more than once, and I get so frustrated because they keep asking the same question different ways, it seems. And I've quit taking that test a couple of times. I didn't even finish it. And that takes so long to do, and it's expensive, and it takes time to analyze. Whereas these take 90 seconds or less. I can understand a person and I can start talking their language. And it's not manipulative, it's just I'm just adjusting my presentation to connect with your personality.

SPEAKER_01 36:21

Right, especially if you have a service where you can deliver, right? It's not like you're going in. It'd be different if you're doing this, and then you know you can't fulfill what it is that you're actually proposing, correct?

SPEAKER_00 36:33

Exactly. Yeah, if you change, yeah, they'll they'll pick up on that. Uh give you a quick real estate story in relation to that. Had a couple who I went to list their properties, very unique property for our area. It was a log home on 48 acres. And we we're in the south, we don't have log homes, so it's pretty unique. But this was a custom one, it was a beautiful property. So it was about a million dollars at the time. And um, I went in there and I got their personality, got it down pat. He was a blueprint knowledge. Uh, she was a blueprint nurture, I believe. And um I understood that. So, first of all, I gave them some data, but I also stepped, planned out what we were going to do. First, we'll do this, then we'll do that. And before we get to the next step, we want to take care of this and whatnot. And when I was done, I didn't know they had talked to other agents. But she said to me, keep in mind, she said it, not him, which again goes to personality. The nurturing is trying to help me. He's like, I don't care who said it, I want the data. And she said, you know, we're gonna work with you. And I said, Okay, great, no problem. She goes, No, what you don't know is we've talked to four agents. And the only the one thing that separates you from the others is you spoke to us. You didn't just speak about yourself and tout yourself and all that. You actually spoke to us and you seem to communicate with us pretty well. We feel like we connect with you. I like great. So again, I knew the system worked, and then so we get that property listed, get it under contract. This is the key part, and just think round numbers, a million dollars, you're right. What's the average commission these days? Six percent. Okay. So, not saying that was it, but that's the predominant one. And um we get under contract, and then we have a delay for six weeks because the people that are buying it are paying cash, but they have to wait for an estate to get settled out. The paperwork's all done. It was just a matter of getting in front of the judge so he could put the rubber stamp on and give him the money. And we knew it was a done deal, so I stopped communicating with the guy. Now, blueprints like to be kept in touch. You gotta call them even if nothing's happening. So two, two and a half weeks went by, and he called me up, and he says, Joe, I'm not happy with you. And I said, What's what happened? And he goes, Nothing, but that's the problem. You haven't called me. And I said, Well, nothing's going on. We're just waiting for the estate to close. He said, Yeah, but you told me that you were a man of your word and you're gonna stay in touch. And you also said if I didn't live up to it, that you would, or if if I didn't live up to it, that I would reduce the commission by one percent. Because I was on the high side and they were questioning it. I said, What? If I can't do what I promised, I'll drop that commission back down. And he said, I want you to be a man of your word. And I said, Well, you know what? You're right. I've I've let you know, and I did promise that, so I will do that because I have integrity. So I dropped the 1%. So that's good money right there. That's what, 10 grand?

SPEAKER_01 39:56

Right. And hold that thought. So and continue with the story after this quick question. So, how important is it to have a system and process in place for when you make a proposition like that to keep them updated? I mean, you've probably at this point had a bunch of clients. Did you change your process on updating clients to ensure that this wouldn't happen again?

SPEAKER_00 40:18

Actually, depending on their personality. Like an action person, they don't they don't care if you keep in touch. Matter of fact, you're bothering them if you if you contact them too often with details. Uh, just tell me if a big event occurs, you know, the buyer walks away or moving the closing up or something like that. Um, so it really depends on the person. But I have little tools I use, like I put their personality next to their name in my phone. I put their code next to their name. So when they call, Mark calls me up. Oh, he's a he's an action guy. All right, Mark, uh, we'll keep this short and brief. You know, here's what's going on, right? Uh, somebody else calls the blueprint. I'm gonna say, well, first of all, let me say this. And then, you know, first of all, then second, third, whatever. So you you talk to them in the way they like to communicate. Yeah, step by step. So anyway, um, does that answer your question?

SPEAKER_01 41:09

Yeah, thank you. Keep going. I apologize.

unknown 41:11

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 41:12

So we finally we get uh back on track. I said, so if I call you every week, even if nothing's going on, that's what you want. He goes, Yes, that's what you promised. I said, Okay, I'm a man of my word, I'll do that. So I was calling him, I said, nothing to report, but just checking in. He said, All right, thank you. And we get to closing. And a real estate agent, when you go to closing, you know, you sit there in case they have any questions, and they give you a copy of the closing statement. And I'm looking it over and I'm calculating and saying, wait a minute, that's at the full percentage that I started with. That's not the reduced rate. And being a smart businessman or a savvy businessman, I said, I'll wait till we get outside and mention it to them. So finish the closing, walk outside. They're thanking me, and I says, Hey, just want to mention, I don't know if you caught this, but the commission was the full amount. They didn't take the percent off. Do you want to go in and correct it? He says, No, no, you you lived up to your word and you redeemed yourself. He says, So I told him to put it back in there. Never even told me this, he just did it. And I saved myself $10,000 just by understanding their personality.

SPEAKER_01 42:20

So for the people that don't know and don't want to do the math, what was the total commission on this deal?

SPEAKER_00 42:26

$70,000.

SPEAKER_01 42:29

How much do you get out of this liar? 30%?

SPEAKER_00 42:32

That's some split now, right? Okay. That's not that's the Gross Commission. S gets uh split up between different parties, the agent that brought the buyer, et cetera, et cetera. And um, but yeah, but it it saved me $10,000 because I got that extra percent back.

SPEAKER_01 42:47

What does that split look like?

SPEAKER_00 42:49

Oh, it depends. It's really it's negotiated every time. Oh, it is. Oh yeah. And um, especially now, the laws have changed uh because of some big lawsuits that were going on. And uh it used to be just the seller paid all the commission to the buyer's agent, everything. It's not the case anymore. They don't have to pay that. Um, so everything's highly negotiable. Plus, listing commissions are negotiable. And I see more agents that when they get into a high dollar property, they automatically drop that percentage down because they're afraid to charge too much. But you know what? If you're an expert and you're gonna get them top dollar, like this guy, I could easily get him at least $10,000 more than another agent could. So it's worth that extra percent. And that's the way I approached it. I I am I am good. And it's just like the I use the example of the analogy of hiring an attorney. If you're getting sued and you're gonna lose your house, your car, everything you own, and you're gonna be homeless if you lose this case. Wouldn't you want to hire the best attorney available, no matter what the price is? Well, yeah, right. No. It's like that in real estate too. You want the best, you pay the best. And that's when I say, if I don't live up to my word and I don't get you, if if you don't feel I got you everything I could, I'm open to adjusting that commission in the end, if you don't think I did a good job. And that was the only guy that ever came back to me on it, and he even gave me that back.

SPEAKER_01 44:26

That's a that's a great point. So what would you say to people that are afraid to charge the true rate? And what is an action plan aside to implementing these two systems to know your your value, right? Because it's so important to know that. I mean, and sell it is a lot. It looks like it's not, but there's so much more that goes into it.

SPEAKER_00 44:51

Yeah. Um, I don't know if we touched on this very much, but um the biggest problem people have is their ego. And that was my problem. And I figured that out uh through coaching. I had two coaches that helped me figure that out. And the reason I preclude by saying that is you say when people get nervous or afraid to ask, well, everything's energy. So you're already picking up on the fact that I'm afraid to ask you for $10,000 when I'm thinking, I don't know if this guy's gonna pay more than three or four or five, so I better not ask for ten. Well, you're gonna pick up on that energy, and you're automatically gonna think it isn't worth $10,000 because this guy doesn't even believe it is. So, one, you got to have com. And two, you've got to look them straight in the eye when you ask. That's the other big problem. See, people look down, they look away, say, well, you know, I know it costs $10,000, but here's what you're gonna get. And they start defending it. And I just put it with confidence. You know, my fee is $10,000. All I gotta do is sign here. Or give me your approval here. I don't even say sign. That's another thing that you learn. NLP through the language is use the right verbiage. Yeah, that's a commitment. If I just want your approval on something, that's an agreement.

SPEAKER_01 46:18

Right. An agreement's different than a contract, right?

SPEAKER_00 46:22

Than a commitment.

SPEAKER_01 46:23

Yeah. And uh you just mentioned, and I I think it's something to good to touch on, the the belief and the confidence. I think we both know where it comes from. But for the new people who are getting into sales, where does this belief and confidence come from?

SPEAKER_00 46:43

Uh, through self-evaluation. Honestly, that's the that's what comes to mind right off the top of my head. Uh, what does all that mean? You've got to know yourself. You've got to know your strengths, your weaknesses, and you want to know that that's the other thing. That a lot of the nervousness comes from I don't know who I'm talking to. Right. I don't know if they're gonna like what I have to say. But when you learn, you get a coach and you and you learn these things, you get mentoring, or whatever it is you want to get, learn from people who know better. What's that saying? If you're the smartest person in the room, you're in the wrong room.

SPEAKER_01 47:22

You gotta pay to play, right?

SPEAKER_00 47:24

Yeah. And that's the other thing. You don't pay, you invest in yourself.

SPEAKER_01 47:29

Exactly.

SPEAKER_00 47:30

Pay the church. Yeah.

unknown 47:33

Right.

SPEAKER_00 47:33

My program's $10,000, but I can get you probably, if I can make you one more real estate commission because of what I teach you, what's your average commission? And you put it out that way, but like, that makes sense. My average commission is about $15,000. You're only charging me $10. You're gonna get me $15? Hello.

SPEAKER_01 47:55

But would you agree it starts also with self and the position of just committing to themselves and committing to their business? Many people, not all, but many people, and I maybe I'm pulling this percentage out of thin air, but from what I've been listening to, it's like 90% of people won't actually fully commit to themselves, let alone their business, on the for what it is that they might want for those goals. Earlier on the call, you said, well, uh, I had one individual who I spoke to said, Well, I'm hoping to hit 400,000. What's that difference?

SPEAKER_00 48:29

Yeah, that belief, okay, that that's a good example there is um uh touch on a little bit. I'm a big believer in what you put out is what you get back.

SPEAKER_03 48:39

Right.

SPEAKER_00 48:40

And I find that to be true no matter what you're doing.

unknown 48:43

Right.

SPEAKER_00 48:44

So if you put out, I hope to make 400 grand this year, well, you're gonna get back a lot of hope. And when the year's over, you're still gonna be hoping you made 400 grand. Whereas if you say, because it's mindset, whereas you say, um, I'm making 400 grand this year, great. What's your process for doing it? Now you get something to work with. Yeah, you can what we call chunk it down, which I'm sure you're familiar with. Okay? 400 at the end of the year, what does that look like? What's that a month? What's that a week? What's that a day? How many contacts you need for that? You can narrow it down to what you're doing every minute to get it.

SPEAKER_01 49:26

Also reverse engineer it, right?

SPEAKER_00 49:28

Yeah, basically. Um, when I wanted to get better at my golf game, I hired the local pro at the club. And he had a package of five lessons. And the last lesson, after he got my swing right and everything, was on course. And one of the things he told me, which I've always remembered, he says, don't play the hole from the T to the green. Play it from the cup back. In other words, what's your perfect approach shot to get that ball near the hole? So, based on that, what club do you want to hit to get to that yardage so you can hit that perfect shot? And what's that gonna take off the T-box to do that? So you may not hit a driver every time. Might hit a five-iron or something, or whatever it might be. And when you look at the big picture um in a meeting, same thing. What's your well-formed outcome? What do you want to see at the end of this meeting? An agreement? An understanding? Uh, or what? If you don't have that, you're not gonna get anything.

SPEAKER_01 50:36

So, how important is it to set the expectations and also ask? So let let's let's give you a situation, right? Because I I've noticed there's a lot of questions I've asked that haven't put the correct parameters. Okay. Let's say you're going into well, what's a uh deal? Uh let's do real estate. That's your not strongest suit, but it's something that you know very well, right? Yes. Uh imagine I'm coming, or you come to my house, or we where do you typically meet? How does it work? Usually at the house, meet in person because you want to see the property. So you can see the property. Let's presume this is the property they want, right? Let's put it in uh the most ideal situation.

SPEAKER_00 51:18

So you're the buyer, is what you're saying?

SPEAKER_01 51:20

Yeah, I'm the buyer.

SPEAKER_00 51:22

Okay, I'm showing you a home.

SPEAKER_01 51:23

Yep. And let's say I'm not the red, let's go with the most difficult person to sell to, sell to, which is the blueprint, right? Uh blueprint or the knowledge. Blueprint or the knowledge. Let's go with the whichever you think is more difficult. Yeah, how knowledge knowledge. Let's go with knowledge. Yeah. Why because yeah.

SPEAKER_00 51:47

And part of the reason for that is people buy an emotion. And your knowledge people are the least emotional. Right.

unknown 51:54

Right.

SPEAKER_00 51:55

They're very analytical. Think engineers, scientists, that sort of thing, architects.

SPEAKER_01 52:01

And they see through BS, right? Right away.

SPEAKER_00 52:04

Oh, yeah. Yeah, for sure. Especially if they have nurturing as their second code, because the second code supports the primary code. And so, but yeah, there's a combination I can also tell when people are stressed because they switch codes.

SPEAKER_01 52:19

They switch codes and do they switch codes fast?

SPEAKER_00 52:23

Depending on how quickly they get stressed, yeah. Right. In other words, I um well, let's answer your question first. So we're in the house. We're in the house. And and I want and you're a high knowledge guy.

SPEAKER_01 52:34

And I'm a high knowledge guy. And let's say I'm super closed off. Yep. You're gonna go ahead and show me how you start and also set the expectations, just so I'm aware, and so maybe this can benefit somebody who listens.

SPEAKER_00 52:50

Sure, sure. Um, so we're walking into the home. I know you're analytical. I'm not gonna be showing you how sweet the kitchen is or how comfortable it is or whatever, whatnot, and the beautiful backyard with the pool. I'm gonna say, Mark, um, I'm sure you've seen this in the brochure, but they have the latest and greatest thermo heating system. And matter of fact, I would have had all the specs. I would have gotten the specs on it. And, you know, this is a uh 18-sear system, and your your uh energy bills are gonna be reduced by this amount because this they have this kind of ceiling on the wall, uh on the exterior walls, and yet you're not pinned in in uh lack of air circulation because they have this uh I don't know what you call it, Cummings uh air filtration system that, as you know, is the best in the industry. Matter of fact, it's used commercially a lot. And this gentleman put it in here. So it's the most efficient home you're gonna have. And it's using the most the high-tech, everything's smartphone. Um, you can do it remotely. You can be sitting in a villa in Italy and you can answer your front door.

SPEAKER_03 53:58

Right.

SPEAKER_00 53:58

Which we all know is pretty common today. But I I remember when that first came out and a guy did answer the door when I rang the doorbell, and I says, uh, he says, Yeah, I just opened the door. I said, Oh, you where are you out back? He goes, No, I'm in Italy.

SPEAKER_01 54:17

What do you mean you're in Italy? That's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 54:19

Yeah, I know, because he had it on his phone. He had that on his phone. It's just like, you know, you can control the heat, you can turn on the lights, how they do in the commercials now. Knowledge people love that. That's tech.

SPEAKER_01 54:31

So is there a do you typically ask them questions first? Or let's uh say you met them at the home. Do you distinguish what it is that's important to them? Or do you oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 54:43

They want to know about the systems, um, has what kind of roof has got on it, you know, what technology, what materials are used, um the the appliances, you know. Um, hey, if you read uh I can't think of that magazine, but they test things out, consumer reports or whatever, you know that this is rated number one the last three years in a row. Uh this is the top grade oven. And you know, I know you may not be the cook in the house, but your wife's gonna love it. And you and you know, happy wife, happy life, right? So you touch on that a little bit, and um different things like that. Um got this anti- or dehumidifying system in the basement that is gonna keep the humidity below 40% at all times, so you know you're never gonna have any mold problems. And um yeah, just the technology amounts, the smart home.

SPEAKER_01 55:38

Yeah, the technology and then the ultimately the the value it provides to make their living easier, right? For for after work or when they want to come home and work if they do work from home.

unknown 55:51

Right.

SPEAKER_01 55:52

Exactly.

SPEAKER_03 55:52

Exactly. Yeah. So you look at the details.

SPEAKER_01 55:56

Yeah. And how much data do you provide for somebody for uh for the knowledge for their home? You said you fill them with or overload them with data, but how much is the right amount?

SPEAKER_00 56:09

Uh well, for knowledge, there's never enough data. Okay. They can always find more. They'll research the heck out of it. However, what I do when I go on a list of home, um, I typically bring charts that show the trends for the last three years. I actually have a chart that shows the last 40 years. There's a reason for that, but the main thing they're looking at is the last three years. Because one year doesn't necessarily give you a good trend, but three years does. You can see the change in the market. And then I can project, I bring data supporting studies that show what's expected to happen over the next year. And I have two scenarios. I'll have A and B. A is like the best scenario, B is like all of a sudden there's a world crisis and something changes, like the Straits of Hormuz, for example. How did that how could that affect you? Uh costs go up, inflation goes up, but whatnot. Um this is the worst case scenario. And that's the best projection we have because nobody can really predict the future, but you can see the trend, how it's following. And to get your house to to get into your new house, so you can uh enjoy that appreciation, we need to have your house priced correctly based on the last three years and where we see the market going. This is where your house falls on that price range. And I'll use a chart, the X and Y scale, and you can see the graph moving along. And you know, the the market's going like this, but you're pricing over here, you're losing the market. So even though the market's here right now, you want to be priced here because by the time we get it sold, you've met the market. Otherwise, you're sitting too long. When you get in details like that, they start to see the picture better. Again, visual.

SPEAKER_01 57:59

Visual. And more importantly, the ROI, right? And the equity that they build. And if they let's say wanted to sell for three years because they want to move somewhere else, seeing that 40-year chart makes it very simplified. So, okay, then I'm gonna be covered no matter what.

SPEAKER_00 58:17

Yeah. I also did one that reminds me, did one with the guy who was moving to um Austin, Texas, I think a couple was, excuse me. And I showed him what the Austin market was doing, not just our market.

SPEAKER_03 58:30

Right.

SPEAKER_00 58:32

And when he saw that, he's like, oh, thank you for that, because I thought I was gonna have to research it. So I just made his life easier.

SPEAKER_01 58:39

And at this time, where were you?

SPEAKER_00 58:42

Charleston, South Carolina.

SPEAKER_01 58:44

Okay, so and educate me here because I uh I might be wrong. So for and especially for people that are listening, when you show them the Austin market compared to the your market in Charleston, South Carolina, how much was that impactful for him? You're talking about Austin, maybe um Texas. Austin, Texas, I thought so. So two different locations, how did that actually help?

SPEAKER_00 59:12

Because I thought that maybe would confuse that uh actually it it helped him because he was concerned about making the move and buying there versus renting there.

SPEAKER_01 59:23

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 59:23

Because he didn't know what values were going. Sorry, he didn't have all the backstory.

SPEAKER_01 59:27

That's okay.

SPEAKER_00 59:28

Um so I showed him what that market was doing. And it at the time it was about as hot as our market, which it was appreciating at 8% a year. So I showed him that and I said, you know, if your job's gonna keep you there for three to five years, I'd say it's worth buying. But if you're only there a year or two, maybe not so. And uh they ended up buying. But that gave them the comfort of knowing that they didn't know if they're going to a market that was decreasing or increasing.

unknown 59:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 59:57

So at what time I'll go for it?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:00

Yeah, uh, for as an as a comparison, if I remember correctly, at the time the Las Vegas market was decreasing. So if he was moving to Vegas, it would have been a different story. Right.

unknown 1:00:12

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:12

But I gave him the data, and that helped him a lot. That I gave him that comfort of knowing.

SPEAKER_01 1:00:17

Absolutely. So, from your knowledge, based on 40 years, again, every guy, everybody who's now listening, if you are still at this point, thank you guys. 40 years, four decades. At what point does a person go from being a salesperson to a consultant?

SPEAKER_00 1:00:36

Ooh, uh, for me, it took a long time. And quite frankly, I don't mind admitting it now. I can see in hindsight, I was too stubborn to have a coach or a mentor or somebody to train me. I knew better. I've done this, I don't need help. I get that a lot from agents. I get two agents, the brand new ones who want the coaching and the mentoring and the training, but they don't have the money. I'll come back to you when I get the money. That's the cart before the horse. How can you make the money unless you know what you're doing? So you want to invest in yourself for that future return. Or I get the established agent who's already got a good success ratio or a good success level. They're making 150, 200 grand a year. It's like, I don't need you, I'm making plenty of money. Well, how would you like to make double that? Or better yet, how would you like to make that same amount half the time? Right. Get half your life back. What would you do with that? Spend time with your spouse, travel, do the things you want to do instead of working 24-7, which a lot of realtors do.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:44

They do.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:45

So it's that's the hardest obstacle to come over, is I just don't see beyond that. Yeah, and that was my struggle. And then I finally relented. Uh, there were several factors that led to that, but I I I kind of somewhat stumbled into it, but also I knew deep down I really needed help or could use some help. And once I found it, that's when things started to accelerate. What did you do? Uncle Ford. My grit is I wish I'd done this 20, 30 years ago. So my recommendation, if there is one, and I'm not just pushing myself, find somebody that you're comfortable with that has the background, that has the expertise, and has the relationship aspect with you. Find a mentor at least who can guide you, and ideally find a coach. Because what a coach does, and let me make the distinction, mentoring is I help give you the answers. True coaching, you come up with your own solutions to your problems. I just guide you to get there. I ask the proper questions to make you think about it, analyze it, then finally see the like aha moment. Like, for example, when I finally realized my ego was getting in my way. Um that was that was hard to admit. And I think a lot of people, successful people, would find the same problem. Um, but I finally admitted it, and that allowed me to open the change. And through coaching, and again, I had two coaches because I like both of them. They had different ways of looking at things. And all of a sudden I started to do a lot better. And next thing you know, I'm getting asked to go talk on different stages. And I mentioned to you earlier I got out to go out to Vegas and give a talk out there. And that's what I gave it on. It was about the ego. The reason being, when you're an entrepreneur, business person, successful one, business problems are personal problems. When you're at work and you have a personal problem at home, you can't help but be thinking about that. So it affects your work. And when you go home, you've got business problems, and you can't help thinking about them, that affects your personal life. And that spirals and that just builds upon itself. That's where so many people, not just in their business, either their business is successful, but their personal life is a disaster. Or they realize, okay, I got to focus on my domestic or my personal life, and then their business suffers from it. And they can't seem to make the both of them work. I finally realize what does make them work, and that's primarily what I help people find, is that balance. It's that work-life balance because it is a work-life balance. Even if you work punching clock and just work in a factory, it's still that. And you want to be happy. And once you get that guidance, it made me a lot happier, I can tell you that.

SPEAKER_01 1:04:54

What was it a deep reflection to get you out of your own way to hire the coach or get the help? And was there something that caused this trigger for you?

SPEAKER_00 1:05:07

Sure was. Sure. You just hit on what I wrote in a book about. Uh I got asked the co-author in a book, this one here, Ignite Impact. And what this author did was, or the publisher, she took these 30 people, maybe in one of them, and we were asked to write about an event that impacted our lives greatly, whether positive, negative, and whatnot. And basically what I wrote about was after the market crash, I was very successful up until 2008. The market crash really hurt me. I owned 19 properties at the time. I got burnt really bad. Um, my business went downhill, my appraisal business, and my sales. Everything just dried up. And I thought I was a failure after that. And I couldn't get my head out of that. I was in a bad funk for years. So badly, and I write about in the book that my first marriage of 37 years. Ended. So then I met who is now my current wife. And she saw right through me. And early on in our relationship, I was I was sharing my struggles with her. And I said, you know, I was really successful once and I'll get there again. And I was after making more money. That was my goal, money, action, right? And she says, you know, I know why you're not successful. And she does, she doesn't even like the word sales. I have to use the word influence with her. And I like almost laughed, and I says, Really? Tell me about it, since you know so much. She goes, if you really want to be successful, you need to be who you are at your true essence. And you are anything but that.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:55

At that one, she anything but that currently when you're going on your day-to-day.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:01

Yeah, I was living a lie, is what that really boiled down to. I wasn't being unique.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:06

Can you elaborate?

SPEAKER_00 1:07:08

Sure, if you got time. I was trying to be, and this is what my talk was about. I was trying to be the person I thought everybody else wanted me to be.

SPEAKER_03 1:07:19

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:20

Because when I was the child, the background to that is up until you go to school. Now, when I was a child, you didn't go to school until you were five, six years old. Now I think they start with five or six months. But those first five years, you're at home, generally, and you're always around your mother, your parents, your siblings, and there's that love and support, that home nucleus, right? Then you go to school, and all of a sudden things change. I can't be myself. I can't act up the way I do. I can't be emotional the way I was at home. Because kids started picking on me and making fun of me. And you're taught there's certain rules you need to follow to conform. And as I call it, you start to be conditioned to fit into society. You can't be yourself, your true self. So I put that self up here and I locked it up, threw away the key. And I started acting the way the other kids would like me. Because everybody wants to be liked, right? And that followed me for decades. And that became the problem with my ego because I was not being my true self. I was trying to prove myself to everybody. And when she said that, it clicked. I hated it, but it clicked. That that hurt, but it was true. And then I realized, okay, I have to find the real me again. So I went through a lot of different things group meditations, um, counseling, coaching, whatnot. And that's when the whole thing started. And uh it finally came around to now I'm just who I am. And people either accept me or they don't. And I found that a lot more people accepted me when I was the true me. And there's a there's a couple of sayings about that. It's like uh be what is it, be yourself as everybody else is taken. That's the one I like.

SPEAKER_01 1:09:36

What is the true Joe Kavanaugh? What does that look like?

SPEAKER_00 1:09:39

Pretty much looking at. Um, I don't try to push anything on anybody, I don't try to judge. Judging is huge with people. Everybody jugs everybody else. Somebody cuts somebody else, you you got a name you call, you know, it cuts you off in traffic, you get a name you're gonna call them. Somebody's mean to you, you you judge them. Uh somebody's got a grumpy face on. All right, you cannot not communicate. Uh you just think they're a mean person, you judge them. Whereas they could be having, they could be worried about something. I've been told I look pretty mean. You know, my wife said, What are you mad about? I said, Nothing, why? She goes, You look, you got this scowl on your face. I said, I'm just in deep thought. That's men we're always in deep thought. Yeah, but I look like I'm mad when I'm that way. And I didn't even realize it. So I'm conscious of that now. So I try to look happier. Um, so there's that different thing. I smile at people all the time. And for example, in a parking lot, coming out of the store, grocery store. You ever notice people when they're at a distance, they're looking at you because they want to see who that person is, right? But as they get closer, they look down or they look away, they act busy on their phone. I always say hello. Now, some people won't answer back. I don't judge them for being rude. I just say, oh, they're probably a knowledge person. Because a knowledge person tends to be antisocial. So maybe they're just not a talker. Maybe they're a knowledge person. And there are other people, I've noticed, especially older people, when you do say hi, they look up and they go, Oh, you like you talking to me? And they they'll say hi back and just say something nice, like, is it a beautiful day we're having? Is it great to be alive or something? You know, anything like that. They're like, Yeah, yeah, thank you, thank you. Have a great day. Now you just lifted their spirits a little bit. So if I can cheer somebody up or make them feel a little better, that's that's me.

SPEAKER_01 1:11:42

Do you think that also relates back to our personality type too? Because I'm the same way, walking outside. And especially here in California, it's not like you know, Texas and other places where it is normal to say hello and good afternoon, and how's it going today, or how y'all doing today? In California, people are even more antisocial because also there's things that happen here, right? A lot of things that we don't need to go into. But it's not typical for somebody like, hey, good afternoon, and they're like, have a wonderful day, or like, here, I'll open the door for you, look at you funny. Do you think that also pertains back to the bank system?

SPEAKER_00 1:12:21

Yeah, that's interesting. And that's a little bit of uh what would that be colloquialism? Because here in Charleston, uh people tend to be friendly. Um, I think nothing of a matter of fact, I think I should open a door. I know that sounds old-fashioned to some people, but that's I always think my mother taught me that. She get a we used to say you should come up out of the grave and slap you if you don't do that, you know. And um anyway, uh yeah, I just think it's nice to be nice to other people. But again, personality, my action is primary, but nurturing is a close second. We have a long assessment, we can score them, and it's almost even. They're one point apart. So I love to help people. That's why I still work. Um, I think I mentioned earlier I'm 72 years old. I don't need to work. I have plenty of income, passive income, and whatnot. Um, I work because a couple of reasons. It keeps me socially interactive, stay away from that boredom because that's a main killer of older people and loneliness. And I love to help people. And I have so much knowledge and wisdom and expertise that I feel good when I share that with somebody. And they feel even better because, oh, wow, thanks for doing that. You know, I just can't believe you would do that. It just gives you a good feeling that you make somebody help somebody be better off than they were.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:40

It does. Uh, I mean, it doesn't it? I can relate to that too. Doesn't it give you more life when you help somebody even in some aspect of making them smile for the day in the grocery store for somebody who looks like they had a long day, despite you know, saying like you look great today.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:56

Like yep. Yeah, or say uh they always say, say something. Women are good at this, they'll always say something nice, like, Oh, I love what you do with your hair, or great earrings, or that's a great dress, you know. Love the shoes. Guys don't do that. Say, hey, dude, what's up? You know, we don't notice those things. I now notice things, and I will I will say that to a guy. I'll I'll just say, you know, hey, I love that shirt. You know, that looks like a quality shirt. It's oh yeah, yeah, I got this, you know, uh wherever. And um it it's interesting because now people want to relate to you because you notice that. Remember, what are the things people want? They want to be seen, they want to be heard, and they want to be loved.

SPEAKER_01 1:14:44

So I I agree with you. I I couldn't agree more. I I think it's so important because, like how you said, you you don't know what somebody's going through. Uh a couple things I want to mention. You mentioned the word conform, and I I like that word a lot. Uh I'm sure you know who he is, because excuse me, but you're in that that time frame. Did you ever listen to any of the tapes from Earl Nightingale? And did he ever make an impact? Because that's one of my mentors who I've never met, obviously. He's from the 50s, and he educates on conformity uh in society, and he educates on what you think about or what you think about is what you become. Uh, how has that kind of frame helped you in the start of your career, midway through your career, wherever you want to touch on you see best fit?

SPEAKER_00 1:15:46

Great question. Uh to answer the first part, no, I never listened to them.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:51

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:52

Why? I either didn't know about them or didn't want to know about them.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:56

Fair.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:57

Uh, why didn't I want to know about them? I didn't, as I said earlier, I didn't go out searching for people to help me at the time. I just thought I could do it on my own. So I was too stubborn. I got it in my own way. My ego, again, comes right back to it every time. And I did hear about him later in life when I started working on myself. And I love what he did. I wish I had known it back then. Had I known it back then, life would have been a lot better. I believe well, can't say better, but it would have been different.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:30

Most successfully financially, I'm sure. So given all the knowledge you have.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:43

Let's say, for an example, like me, I'm building a sales team under me, right? What is the best way after you learn their personality types, so they become leaders and ownerships of their own responsibilities, do you think?

SPEAKER_00 1:17:01

Um, pretty simple through all that. It's just like speak their language.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:06

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:07

Again, people want they like people that are like themselves.

SPEAKER_03 1:17:12

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:14

So if you're talking to the action guys, hey, you're man, you're really crushing out there. Keep up the great work where everybody sees you. You're a leader, you know. We like to win, we like to have fun, we'd like to be seen. You know, give us the mic. That's it. We won't put it down. You know, get us on stage, right? So you want to make sure they're seen and out there. Um, nurturing person, you might say, you know what? This team wouldn't be where it is without your support. I would just want to thank you personally. Now you recognize them and they love to support. They don't want to be up on the stage, but they want to help you get on that stage. They'll do what it takes to get you there. The blueprint, well, the knowledge guide or lady, um, is you might say to them, says, you know, you're really leading this team, and you know, without your expertise, I don't know where we'd be. And I really appreciate all the behind-the-scenes research you've done and the work you've done to get us where we are today. Because we wouldn't be there without you. They want to know that what they're doing is is is worth it. And the blueprint, too. Um, hey man, I'll tell you what, you keep things so organized. I'm an action guy. I I wouldn't know how to organize, and I I couldn't begin to do what you're doing. So I couldn't get where I am without you. Or just want to say I really appreciate what you're doing for the team. Because you keep us all in line and keep us on schedule.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:47

See, yeah, that's a great point. I think that maybe myself and other people struggle with is you say to be authentic, and you are still being authentic. But when you speak somebody else's personality, sometimes maybe maybe I'm gonna speak just for myself. I lose maybe some of my authenticity because I'm so go, go, go, go, I need to go to this next thing. Where do you find, or for you, I guess, uh, when maybe you were the same way and maybe not, where how do you find that true balance of okay, I need to not conform, but alter my approach correctly um for this kind of personality so I can truly connect with them?

SPEAKER_00 1:19:38

Yeah, yeah, great question. And to your point, it is authentic because I'm saying the same thing, just in different verbiage. That's where the NLP can really come in handy, too, because it's the words you use that are powerful. Words have, my wife loves us saying, Words only have meaning, the meaning you give them. So I if I was speaking to the group and I just said, hey, great job, guys, let's get going and keep it going. I'm talking to 25% of them, the action people. The nurture's thinking, well, geez, I've been supporting this. What he didn't even say anything about that, just saying, you know, these action guys are doing great. And same with the blueprint, same with the knowledge, they don't get recognized. And all I've done is telling everybody that, hey, without you, this team couldn't be where it is today and be so successful. But I just changed the language, the verbiage I use.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:36

Impact one.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:38

Yeah, no, no manipulation. It's just uh it's it's basically just changing the verbiage to the way they want to hear it.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:47

So I have another question. Uh I'm gonna try to end it here soon. But when I have somebody who's got four decades of experience, I'm gonna make sure I maximize the opportunity, right? Uh so I appreciate you staying on longer than initially anticipated, Joe. Sure. You say Dallas, I'm coming back to this again, right? Getting out of your own way, losing the stubbornness. When it pertains to this, because many people that start in success deal with the same thing, right? I I just went to uh a conference, right? And the approach of the main person that did it wasn't ideal, but it works for su certain people, right? It wasn't laid back. I'm gonna simplify the question. How do you see from being the laid back, there's no pressure, I'm gonna educate and serve as opposed to I'm gonna but the the opposite, well how have you seen the difference let alone with connecting with people and then in your closing percentage? So the question is what yeah, the question, yeah, I I stacked it a lot. Yeah, the calm consultant frame as opposed to the what many people mistake, and I even myself have, of course, obviously, I'm still very young in influence and educating and serving IE cells. How is the calm consultant frame of just educating and serving compared to the other side when we're on the go action side? This is what we're gonna do, this is the bottom line. How have you seen the difference? And I guess we can put the parameter again, because now I'm asking a very general question with a knowledge uh-based buyer.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:53

Um, okay, so one way I see that is I'm a high action guy, I'm go, go, go. Yet I've got a knowledge person on my team that I want to reassure them we're doing the right thing. Is that basically what you're saying?

SPEAKER_01 1:23:07

Yeah, or a knowledge uh person that you're looking to help find a solution or help sell.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:16

Um so coaching or mentoring that person, is that what you're saying? Yeah. Um, again, it just boils back down to the stand on the way they think. And I hate to use the phrase, but get into the head a little bit. And it's not manipulative. It's just like, how does this person think? What would they like, how would they like to hear me say this? And at that point, once you do that, it's it it takes practice. I'm not, I'm not gonna lie. Um, but you get to a point, and again, it's when it when you when you're in the situation, it's a lot easier than trying to explain it like a classroom setting here, for example. And um it's just a matter of communicating in their style. And and are they visual? Are they auditory? Are they are they kinesthetic? Most knowledge people that I know are kinesthetic, they're always thinking about things. They're in their head a lot. So you want to be there with them. You don't want to be so out and open. Um, don't be so flamboyant. Be more reserved. That's important to them. They don't like to be put out there and don't put them on the spot. Like in a Zoom, if we do group calls, you never want to call out a knowledge and just catch them on the spot. And they do not like that.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:35

When you say group calls and call them out, like what's a good example for this scenario?

SPEAKER_00 1:24:41

Um, instead of saying if you're a knowledge saying, you know, Mark, um uh we were thinking about this, and I I understand you might know something about it. So what what's your take on this? And you might be thinking, well, geez, I hadn't really analyzed this, so I I don't want to answer this. And this is going through your head, right? Saying, oh God, why'd he call me out? I um this just upsets me. Whereas I might say, Mark, you know, we've been thinking a lot about this situation and and how this might work. And I'm just wondering, might you have some feedback on that, or have you had a chance to look into it yet? So that's what I'm saying. Now they can come out and say, I really haven't studied this, and not look stupid in plain English. You know, you validate that. And first of all, I I called on you because you're the smartest person in the room. And without even saying that, everybody knows that's why I called on you. And you know it. So you feel validated and you feel good about it. And I had the respect to ask you, I don't know if you studied this or how much you've looked into it, but if you have, can you enlighten us a little bit? Give us some more knowledge of what's going on.

SPEAKER_01 1:25:53

So it's fair to say that sometimes myself even the way I communicated was just completely incorrect to somebody, a knowledge person. Because what I thought was plain and straightforward actually was more confrontational as opposed to actually asking that question correctly. So that comes back to the NLP and the phrasing and the verbiage and the delivery, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:26:21

Yeah, yep. And that's that's exactly right. It's not confrontational at that point. Because otherwise, it it can be perceived that way. And again, I don't know that because I don't think like you. Because I didn't have the the tools. Now I have the tools, the onus is on me to adapt to you, not make you adapt to me.

SPEAKER_01 1:26:47

So it's that's yeah, and that thank you for that. I mean, the these answers are so valuable. I I'm getting so much out of this. You're continuing to educate, and I can't wait for the people to hear and uh and learn this. But if you were to disappear tomorrow and be off the face of the earth, and let's put the parameters of somebody who's been in sales now for a couple years, and I'm I'm gonna go back to me a couple years back when I came into roofing sales. I was so confident I had been off knocking doors for three years. I thought I knew very I thought I knew not everything, but I thought I was like, I have a really good understanding of sales. I've gone through the trenches, if you will. My question to you is what are a couple suggestions, right? Now here comes me with the right phrase. What are a couple suggestions you would leave with to somebody who has a lot of knowledge, but like how you said, we always have to be a student of the game. What are a couple suggestions you would leave with that kind of person with a couple years of experience in sales and they're learning to be that true consultant as opposed to just somebody. To make a commission and help somebody, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:28:04

Well, first of all, you can never know everything. And I turn that into you can never know enough. Even myself, I learn things. I get on calls to be the student in the classroom. Again, if you're the smartest one in the room, you're in the wrong room. So I will get into rooms that, you know, it could be a national online men's group. And I work with men primarily. Well, I work with everybody, but I I'd focus on men that are somewhat mature and successful because I'm a man. It's a little easy to relate, although I grow up around girls. And um, so there is that aspect of it. But um I there's a saying by I think it's Gandhi that said it, and I like this philosophy too. It's like live every day like it's your last, and learn every day like you live forever. So if you can learn something every day, you get better and better. And now what's that uh uh I can't think of his name now, the 5 a.m. club, and they talk about that 1%. Get 1% better every day at what you do. And in a year, you're 360 times 365 times better than you were when you started. I'm making 400,000 a year. This is how I'm getting there. Or how do I get there, Joe? Well, let's sit down and talk about it. And that's where coaching can come in handy and the mentor. Um, but that that's pretty much it. Um check your ego at the door. Stop letting it run your your business or your life. And I know there's a lot of people out there because I said it every time I heard it, say, oh yeah, my mine's in check. I think so. Let's get on a call. Let's see. I can find out in about 15 minutes where you're at.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:04

I'm sure you can find out sooner.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:06

Yeah, well, it can be. Um, it's a hard pill to swallow. And um yeah, my talk in Vegas was so uh good on that. Really, I when I gave the talk, I wasn't sure how it was gonna land, and it was phenomenally successful, and that actually was what led to writing this chapter of the book. Um but uh it's uh yeah, it's just it's check that ego. Now you need an ego. I'm not saying get rid of it, but you gotta check it at the door. Uh and I've got stories that could illustrate that very clearly, but I like you say, I don't know how much time we have. So, or do you edit this? I don't even know.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:46

They're gonna get the full scope. I'm not gonna edit this one. They need the full scope of this one.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:50

Uh I gotta help you charge you for that.

SPEAKER_01 1:30:54

Yeah, that's this. We gotta continue to grow and excel and also educate, right? And um, yeah, no, I I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_03 1:31:05

For the last thing, I guess, Mr. Joe.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:10

Um, would you suggest for somebody, like how you just said, and here this is where we gotta plug in Joe, somebody who's been successful? Let's say they've already made they're making ten fifteen thousand dollars a month, right? And passing, or they're they're they're doing very well, they've been in sales for a while. Do you still suggest hiring a coach not only to have them answer their own questions, but also keep them accountable with where they need to go?

SPEAKER_00 1:31:46

Absolutely, yes. The accountability is a great word there. Um, and I'm not saying you have to hire me. Uh it it hire whoever you want, but make sure that they relate to you. That's the thing. Uh make sure they understand you. And there are different ways of doing it. Um there's a lot of people out there are calling themselves coaches. Do they have the credentials? Do they have a coach? If they don't have a coach, run the other way as fast as you can. Get away from that person. Because you know what? It's probably therapy for them, not you. So you're getting in with the wrong one.

SPEAKER_01 1:32:30

And that leads to a great topic. What distinguishes a good coach besides them having their own coach? What should they look for before hiring a coach?

unknown 1:32:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:32:40

Relatability. Do I understand Mark? Do I know where your head's at and where you want to go? And do I have the tools to get you there? Those are great questions to ask. And a lot of times it's interesting because in the beginning, you say, well, you know what? I have some great tools, which you and I covered a few of them, not a lot of them. And let's give it a go and see. And I've actually done this with people where, you know, if we get into this in a month down the road or two months down the road, you think this isn't right, just let me know. We'll correct that, and I'll I'll compensate you back. So um I don't hold anybody to any contracts, you know, like, hey, you signed up for a year, whether you like it or not. Because there are people that do that and often no refunds. Um, I have clients who say that. Their last coach, God, they didn't even ask any of this stuff. They didn't care. They just spewed information. I left me on my own. No, that's not how it works. Um, you you've got your issues, let's get into that, let's solve that problem. Because once you do, that's one less thing you got to worry about going forward. Makes your life easier, makes your mind lighter, and takes the stress away, gives you confidence, all the attributes you want to be successful.

SPEAKER_01 1:34:02

And what's the benefit of working with a coach like yourself?

SPEAKER_00 1:34:07

I've been there. I've done it. Um I like to work with people that are going through what I've actually gone through. And it isn't just real estate. Um, I've been an entrepreneur, I punched a clock, I worked for the man. Um I flunked up, I didn't flunk out of college, I just hated college and finally withdrew. It was kind of a mutual agreement. They asked me to leave, and I said, See ya. But um no, it's uh I'm not right for everybody, they're not right for me. But interview coaches, and it's the end it boils down to the energy. I'm big on energy. And it's that relatability. Because even over Zoom, um, and if people don't believe in energy, a real simple example is that you ever be thinking about somebody you hadn't spoken to in a long time, and all of a sudden they call you or text you. It's like, hey, I was just thinking about you. Right? We've all had that happen.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:04

Absolutely. I mean, energy is how the world, I mean, I don't want to get scientific or political here. Yeah, I mean that's how we even exist, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:35:14

We are, yes, that's another topic. We are energy, yes. So yeah, I got I'm big on that's another aspect that we haven't even talked about, but uh that could go on a lot longer than this. Um, but that's the other thing is um oh, that was when I do train, uh actually training salespeople, that's one of the things, and they do this a lot in companies. They tell you before you call somebody, look, smile. Because they pick it up, they pick that energy up before they even answer the phone.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:44

You're so right. I learned that with college.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:47

In our real estate company, they used a mirror in your little booth that you're in. You say, look in that mirror and smile. And if you can't smile at yourself, call Joe. He can help you.

SPEAKER_01 1:35:59

So, just so you guys are aware, Joe does have financing options. He has different packages depending on where you want to go. Um we we could find a way to make it work. So if you guys are at all interested, Joe, where is the best way we could find you?

SPEAKER_00 1:36:16

Honestly, uh, because I'm organic, I don't have a website currently, although I'm toying with getting one. Um, LinkedIn is probably the best way to reach out to me. It's just my name, Joe Kavanaugh. And um yeah, I just I work with like to work with high-powered people or people who want to be there, be successful, help them check their ego. And um a lot of a lot of my clients are at a certain level, and they just can't seem to increase it and go up that next level, and I help them see how to get there and it's guidance. And um, but LinkedIn is probably the easiest way to get a hold of me. Now we can set up a call, discovery call, and uh we can see if we relate. Uh no pressure. I'm a man of my word. If you don't like what you're getting, um I'm not gonna charge you for it, I'll give you money back. And um, and like you say, I could work with whatever your financial situation is. And keep in mind that you're not just spending money to learn something, you're investing in yourself. What's the value of that investment? What's your ROI? And that's a mindset that most people don't grasp right away. So, does it sound expensive? Well, that's all relative. What's expensive to you? Quality costs, right? Yeah. And you look at the the best trainers in the world, what does Tony Robbins get? Like a million dollars or something? I'll know Tony Robbins, I'll say that.

SPEAKER_03 1:37:39

But um, you know, you get what you pay for.

SPEAKER_01 1:37:44

So anybody that's well we'll stick within the people that are growing sales that is interested, I'll leave his information down below. But again, you could take action yourself, but with there's always I believe collaboration is the best currency, right? You always need to find a way to collaborate and grow, whether it's through individuals that have done it better than you, typically that's the best route. Um, you know, I've gone to many conferences, and you and the either way, it's always an investment backing yourself. And just so you're aware, you guys, if you don't take action after the calls that we take with Joe, there's not nothing is guaranteed, but especially that part, it's a it's a partnership when working with an individual like Joe Kavanaugh. Right. You have to take actions on your own. Now, just so they have for maybe for the knowledge, I think this pertains to all of all personalities. Can you just give me like two different situations for clients and what their ROI was when they went ahead and signed up for your uh coaching program?

SPEAKER_00 1:38:55

Oh, absolutely. I'll give you two right uh I'm working on right now. I don't mind saying that. But I'll I won't give too much away. Um, I got this agent who is um new to real estate in her 20s, got into it two years ago, and her first day there, I happened to be in the office helping with the new agents, training them, and they're doing their prospecting calls, and my job was to listen to the calls, give them feedback, help them get better at it. And this one girl, she made two or three calls, and I like, you got this, you don't need my help, you got it. And she's like, How so? Nice. You just you relate to people, you already know a lot of what I'm training or can train. And that confidence helped her a lot. She a few minutes later, she came to me, she says, I got an appointment. And I said, Yeah, but you look a little frazzled or concerned. Again, NLP help. You cannot not communicate, so I can see it in her face. And she goes, Yeah, I don't even have my license yet. I said, What? What are you doing making calls? They told me just get on the phone and start making calls. I said, You haven't even taken the test? Oh no, I pass and everything. I just don't physically have my license yet. I said, That's right, that's all right. Just take a seasoned agent with you and you'll be fine. That girl sold $20 million of real estate last year. Second year in the business. And she reached out to me and said she wants my help.

SPEAKER_01 1:40:26

She did. And that was through a mutual connection, through a referral.

SPEAKER_00 1:40:30

That's when we worked together at the real estate company. And um now um both of us have moved on from that. But um, yeah, she wants to partner up and work together and get coaching and whatnot. So that's one aspect. I got this other girl who I met, um, the Uber driver I talked to you about. And we just got chatting. We're in the backseat, she's driving, and she came to find out she's fairly new to this country, um, legal immigrant, and been here seven years. She loves the insurance business and knows she can be very successful. And just the things she was saying, I could hear that she had the right frame of mind for this, but she needed help. And she even said that, I said, I just don't know what to do. Do you have any recommendations? So I started giving her a couple of pointers, and she goes, Oh, wow, you sound like you know what you're doing. I said, Well, this is what I do. And so the more we get into it, the more she wanted to learn from. And so we talked, and there's a case where her finances just don't warrant it. And I set up a creative program that I could work with her. Um, so we're working together. And you just don't know where they're coming from and what they're doing and where they're at. So, and you could be a beginner or you you could never have been in sales. There's another thing we talk about. I'll give one more tip, free, is that a lot of people hate the word sales. Well, just replace that with the word influence. How would you like to have influence on others?

SPEAKER_03 1:42:07

And when you can influence others, you can't carnival. Mm-hmm. Right. It's all relatability.

SPEAKER_01 1:42:19

Joe, this has been an amazing uh cast. I genuinely really uh appreciate the extra time. I appreciate the extra knowledge, the value, the stories, but more importantly, the knowledge and the value that you've been able to provide here. One more thing, uh it's not a question, it's more of a statement. For you guys that have tuned in for this long, you guys are already in the top 1% of the mindset because you realize and heard Joe from the start that he's somebody worth listening to. If somebody, because my listeners are in California, they're in DC, they're in different parts of the world, are they able, in certain cases, because you said energy is everything. A lot of my listeners and a lot of the people like me, like us, they prefer in-person. Is that something that you could arrange for them? Or does it have to all be through Zooms? And obviously, if so, there's just an additional fee, right?

SPEAKER_00 1:43:23

Yeah, I got to cover the expenses, but um I will say this if they want me to come in and talk to their group or something like that, and uh, I love to travel. And I'm more than happy to talk possibilities at that point. Uh matter of fact, I traveled to Ireland a lot. And every time I go over there, I I make it a point to meet and talk to different groups while I'm there. We also do things on Zoom. I've been to Germany, Switzerland, uh, Hungary. We were just in Hungary last winter. And um been to Canada. So, yeah, anything is possible. Whatever it takes to make it happen.

SPEAKER_01 1:44:01

You guys heard it here, because we Joe and I both understand that we have global listeners looking, wanting to learn, wanting to grow. Give yourself the best opportunity to continue to grow. Invest in yourself, get with Joe on LinkedIn, which I'll have in the description, and then if you have a little bit of struggle looking for him, my handle is very easy on Instagram. It's just Pasadena's Wolf. Message me and I'll send you his information directly. That way you can get in contact with him. Joe, is there anything else that you would like to leave off with before we conclude?

SPEAKER_00 1:44:43

Yeah, the one thing I did not say is um, and a couple of people have, well, a few people have said this, they love working with me because I like to have fun while we're doing it. So it's not a grind. It's and when I say fun is people enjoy it. It's not a matter of just telling jokes and laughing and whatever. Um, but and and I'm vulnerable. I mean, if I've got a story that where I was embarrassed or wish I hadn't done it and I know it's gonna help them, I'm happy to share it, especially in a private session. That's not an issue there because what happens there stays there. And um, there's that confidentiality. But yeah, I like to have fun doing it. I mean, life's you got the one life. Make the most of it.

SPEAKER_01 1:45:27

So do you feel comfortable saying that if they do the work that they need to do, they follow through, they take accountability with themselves for let's say somebody who's three years in sales, do you feel comfortable saying, depending on the action plan that they want, you can help them get to the point where they can have that freedom that they desire in the next couple years? The frame has to be under sky, right? 100%.

SPEAKER_00 1:45:52

You get out of everything what you put into it.

SPEAKER_01 1:45:54

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:45:55

So put it the work in, you'll get the work out, the success out.

SPEAKER_01 1:46:00

You heard it here first. Joe Kavanaugh can help you get to your goals, can help you realize them, distinguish them, keep you accountable. But again, you still need to put in the work. You still still need to take the actions, and you still also need to make the relationships connect with people and grow ultimately. Joe Kavanaugh, Office of the Day, Mark Anthony. Thank you, Joe. We uh had a killer on this one, and I I can't wait to see what business comes out of it for you. But more importantly, maybe new connections and maybe new shows you can get on too as well.

SPEAKER_00 1:46:36

Yeah, Mark, it it truly has been awesome, and uh really appreciate you having me on. So thank you very much.

SPEAKER_01 1:46:42

No problem, thank you, Joe. Let's go, you guys, and message of the day. Invest in yourself, invest time in yourself, and invest in looking for more options. If you seek, you will find you guys. That's uh biblical. Thank you for another day, and let's go to the moon, you guys.