Hot Takes & Holy Things
Hot Takes & Holy Things is where bold opinions meet honest faith conversations. Each episode dives into real questions, everyday struggles, and the topics students are actually talking about—through the lens of Jesus and Scripture. It’s thoughtful, a little unfiltered, and always centered on what matters most - the Gospel.
Hot Takes & Holy Things
A Faith That Grows Through Challenge w/ Jimmy Scroggins
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
What happens when faith moves beyond comfort and becomes an adventure? In this episode of Hot Takes and Holy Things, hosts Jarvis Koyate, Cole Bearden, and Jake Kimbrell welcome Pastor Jimmy Scroggins for the season one finale. Jimmy is the lead pastor of Family Church in West Palm Beach, and a husband, father of eight, grandfather, and longtime mentor to students and families. Together, they talk about why faith grows when it is challenged and lived out in real life. Jimmy shares stories from his own childhood and young adult years, the ways his mentor helped him see the Christian life as bold, risky, and full of purpose. They explore why students need challenging spiritual experiences, how comfort can produce fear, and why following Jesus means being willing to be different. They also debate the best level of football to watch and address the rumor that Jarvis is not actually Jarvis. Tune in for a funny and faith-filled finale about confidence, perseverance, and stepping forward with Jesus.
Key Points From This Episode:
- Meet Pastor Jimmy Scroggins and hear the bio written by his sons.
- Learn about the family and what is new in the Scroggins household.
- Hear the full story behind how Jarvis accidentally became known as Jarvis.
- Today’s great debate: high school, college, or professional football?
- Celebrate a student from the Gardens campus for inviting others and sharing the gospel.
- Why Jimmy is encouraged by students who are committed to Christ and dreaming big.
- Explore the hot take that faith cannot grow without being challenged.
- How Jimmy’s mentor influenced his faith through Scripture, missions, and leadership.
- Consider why the Christian life should feel more like an adventure, not a simulation.
- Discover how fear and the need for comfort limit faith.
- Uncover why real Christianity is not safe, but good.
- Reflect on Jesus’ call to take up your cross and follow Him.
Quotes:
“Now, it almost seems like the argument that is happening is that, not only do I want the fastest way to get there, but I also want the easiest to get there, and I don’t think that’s God’s design for our spirituality.” — Jake Kimbrell [00:15:29]
“That is what I think is missing from a lot of young people. They get disenchanted with Christianity because they don’t see what God wants to do in their life as an amazing adventure.” — Jimmy Scroggins [00:18:08]
“Let’s face it, if you can’t be different, you can’t really do it for Jesus.” — Jimmy Scroggins [00:19:54]
“The real Christianity, the kind of Christianity that has taken over the world for the last two thousand years, is a Christianity people will die for.” — Jimmy Scroggins [00:23:56]
“Just because you’re faithful to God doesn’t mean it’s going to work out the way that you want.” — Jimmy Scroggins [00:25:03]
Welcome to Hot Takes and Holy Things. This is the podcast for the students of Family Church in South Florida. We're tackling the real questions students are asking and bringing you hot takes backed by God's Word. This is Hot Takes and Holy Things. What's up, students? Welcome to Hot Takes and Holy Things. If you're listening to this, then welcome to the final and greatest episode of season one of the Hot Takes and Holy Things Podcast.
SPEAKER_01Episode Episode number 10. And guys, I think this is going to be a good one.
SPEAKER_05Has to be our best one. Hey, I'm excited to introduce our guest today. And if you guys have been listening to the pod, you know I usually, me and ChatGPT come up with a great bio for our guests, or maybe we'll talk to the guests' children. Well, that's going to happen today. All right. So we talked to his guest's sons. We said, you know what, we need you to write up a bio for your dad. This is what they came up with. All right. So today's guest is a man who embodies leadership, legacy, and old school consistency. He's best known as christened husband, a proud dad of eight, and poppy to seven grandkids and counting. A true all-American. He raised in and still proudly lives in the free state of Florida. If sports are on, he's watching them, and if his kids are playing them, he's there. And over the years he's shown up to more than 3,000 sporting events. Oh my gosh. Come on, that's crazy. Includes basketball games, football games, lacrosse games, and everything in between. Proving that faithfulness isn't just preach, it's practice one bleacher seat at a time. This is preaching. Whether he's shooting in the 80s as a 12 handicapped golfer, diving headfirst into pickleball, or leading family church in South Florida, he brings passion, energy, and conviction everywhere he goes. He's the kind of man who loves his family deeply, leads with strength and humility, and still somehow has enough competitive fire left to argue sports takes with now his adult sons. All right. That's gonna come in handy later. That is gonna be all right. So please welcome a husband, father, poppy, pastor, sports fanatic, and a man who proves that the greatest legacy you can build is a life devoted to God and fully invested in people. Pastor Jimmy Scroggins. Come on.
SPEAKER_01Hey, gentlemen, for Pastor Jimmy, why don't we give him three?
SPEAKER_02There we go. There it is. Oh good. That was really strong. Yeah, that was good. You guys are super synced out really.
SPEAKER_01You couldn't imagine it. Well, Pastor Jimmy, we appreciate you being here today. I know that that was a great intro written by your boys. And so obviously, huge shout out to them, but we're excited to hear about what's new in the Scrogans household. Tell us a little bit about you and your family and those kinds of things, and then we'll jump in.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so so honored to be with you guys. I think the world of what you are doing in our church family, shaping the lives of young people, connecting with parents, helping disciple us as parents as we disciple our children. So thank you for doing that. This podcast is really awesome. I know it's awesome because my kids and their friends listen to it. Also, my wife thinks you guys are so cool.
SPEAKER_05It was an honor to have brother Pod.
SPEAKER_02It was awesome. So Krista and I have been married 31 years. We got married in 94. We've got six sons and two daughters. Our oldest is 30, and our youngest is 17. So we have a 10th grader, and we have one who's just graduating from high school in a few days. I got two graduating from college this year. I know. I've got three of them are married, and a couple of them are dating pretty seriously. So who knows what's going to happen. So all kinds of great things, and it's just a wonderful season. But I will tell you this last week before we recorded, my daughter, any cake, graduated from Palm Beach Atlantic University on Friday. We had a wonderful day celebrating. And the next morning, she and Mary Claire, her sister, packed up and drove down the road, drove away. And both of my daughters went back to Tampa where they're gonna live all summer. And man, that is brutal. I mean, one day you're bringing these girls home in the hospital in your arms, and the next day you're standing at the end of the driveway watching the taillights go down the street in tears.
SPEAKER_01I'm not ready.
SPEAKER_04I'm not ready for that day yet.
SPEAKER_02I'm telling you right now, it is brutal. But it's but it's wonderful. You know, like what did you raise them to do? You didn't raise them to stay home. You raise them to go change the world. And praise God that they're doing their best to do that.
SPEAKER_05I love that. That's so good. Well, Pastor Jim, I'll be honest and the boys, and there's been some rumors floating around in our student ministry. There's been some whispers talking about hey, Jarvis, I don't think that's your real name. I don't think Jarvis is your actual first name. Any idea where this started from?
SPEAKER_02I was being opening them out and dude. You gotta do that. I love that.
SPEAKER_01At least it was under the table, though. You tried to do that.
SPEAKER_05I was trying to do it, but then it was like, nah, that's just too loud. Hey, so they they said that, and I was like, you know what? Let me just settle the air on the pod, season finale. So I'm gonna share that story with you guys because you know what? It's been happening for a while. So let me share it. All right, so let me take you back to 2018, back at Liberty University, and I was showing up to this ministry. All these churches come to the school, and they show up and they're recruiting all these college interns to intern at their church. And so I show up there, I go to visit one of my friends because she had candy at her booth, and that's just what I do. I like candy. And so I show up and I write down Jarvis on my name badge as a joke. I'm like, ha, I'm gonna get him with this one. And so I slap it on my chest and I walk over. That's it. That's a great joke. I got him good. And so I walk over, and as I'm approaching the booth, this guy walks up to me with his hands in his pocket. He had this flat brim on, you can't really see his eyes. And he's like, Hey, let me speak to you really quick. He goes, Hey, I'm Derek. I go, Well, hey, Derek, I'm Jarvis. And so we're going back and forth, we're shooting the breeze. And so at the end of this conversation, he goes, You know what? Let's go to dinner. I'm inviting anyone who wants to like be a family church intern. And so I go to this dinner, and I'm gonna be like, you know what, I'm gonna tell him my real name, and it's a whole thing, but I didn't want free dinner because I'm gonna call I'm a college shooting.
SPEAKER_01So your real name's not Jarvis.
SPEAKER_05Not Jarvis. And so I get to- the rumors are true. Rumors are true, and so I get to this dinner and I show up, and I have this guy who's on my hall, he's sitting in front of me. And before I get to Pastor Derek and I tell him, Hey, my name is He goes, Hey, everyone, have you met Jarvis? And so he goes around and he goes, Hey, this is Jarvis, this is Jarvis, this is Jarvis. And so this whole dinner, I'm sucking there, Jarvis. You're just in it too deep now. I'm in it. And so this kid in front of me, he's on my hall. I'm his R A. And he goes, Man, you look just like my R A. And I'm like I'm like, the cover, I'm like, the cover is blown. I did it.
SPEAKER_00I have not heard this part of this story.
SPEAKER_05My cover's blown. And so what I did, I ran to the bathroom and I tried to block him on Instagram and on Facebook. And then I ran back into this dinner. Didn't do it quick enough because he brought my Instagram and he showed me a post that I posted maybe a week ago. And he goes, Man, you look just like my RA. Oh, that's wild. And I go, dude, that's crazy. I have no idea. How many, wait a minute? How many kids are you have when you're an RA? I mean, I have a haul of like 60 kids, but like every month we do like they don't even know who their RA is. And here's the thing, Pastor Jimmy. Apparently not. Every night you absentee RA. Every night you can. You trust me at liberty. You tell me that I'm out. I reproductedly fire you. We do room checks every single night. So I see this guy every single night. And so I didn't have any aviation interns lined up. So I texted Pastor Derek. I said, Hey, by the way, Jarvis isn't my real name. You'll see my real name on my application. And he never texted me back. And so a couple months go by. I show up to family church and Jarvis is everywhere. Like it's on my name bad. It's on all the paperwork. It's on everything. And I'm like, you know what? It's a summer. It is what it is. And so we did that, did a whole summer of it, and we came back and I was like, Well, I do love this church, and I do plan on coming back. And so I came back and was Jarvis ever since.
SPEAKER_02So wait a minute. Literally, no one called you Jarvis until you called yourself Jarvis to Pastor Derek. Quite literally.
SPEAKER_01So when I correct when I would go because it was a funny joke.
SPEAKER_05How many years ago was this? Yeah, this was back in 2019.
SPEAKER_02No, I knew I did it. I I chose a nickname because his other name's more difficult to say, maybe.
SPEAKER_05I don't know. Maybe. So when I would go to Chick-fil-A, I would say Jarvis because my first name was too difficult to pronounce. And so my real first name is Well, hang on, hang on, hang on, hang on. Maybe we save it till the end. Alright, we'll save it for the end.
SPEAKER_00We'll save it till the end.
SPEAKER_05I'll be good.
SPEAKER_00Well, why don't we kick things over to our next segment? This is our great debate segment. And I love Pastor Jimmy that your boys put in your bio that you've been to over 3,000 sporting events.
SPEAKER_01That's expensive, by the way.
SPEAKER_02That's well, yeah, but you know, the way we do it's not that expensive. You sneak right in. I got some wire cutters. I'll cut through channeling fences. It's amazing.
SPEAKER_00There you go. I love it. So, students, if you've been keeping up with the great debate, then you know that the score is currently one to one to one. And we are in a three-way tie between myself, Jake, and Jarvis. And so today, for the season finale, we are going to settle the score, and one champion is going to walk away feeling victorious. And so for today's great debate, we are going to be debating which is the greatest football to watch. Is it high school football, college football, or pro football? And now normally I've been the judge or Jake has been the judge, but today we get the privilege of having Pastor Jimmy as our judge, and he's going to decide on what is the best.
SPEAKER_05I don't have to worry about that because Pastor Jimmy will be on us. That's right.
SPEAKER_01Guys, listen, I'm going to tell you this right now. I know that last episode we announced to me as the winner of the word of the day, but I am going to go for the sweep this season, and I am going to take both of them.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, we'll see about that. I think we start with Jake in high school, and we'll just go by it. To the highest level, the best level.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, let's do it. Someone's got who's got time. You got time, Cole? Because obviously I can't keep time.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Here we go. In three, two, one.
SPEAKER_01Pastor Jimmy, I think that's something that you and I can both agree on, just as good, godly Christian men, is that we love authenticity. And for me, I used to go to college football for that, but now it's just all about NIL and money and inconsistency, and you're not going to be at the same place next time, next year. And let's not even talk about the NFL. But high school football, when you boil it down, is the most raw, authentic, transparent version of football because those kids are in it because they love the game, not because they love the paycheck. You guys can have the rest of my time. That's all I wanted to say.
SPEAKER_00Well, good, because your time's over.
SPEAKER_01Time's up. Okay, so I get extra points for being a timely, I guess.
SPEAKER_00That's good argument. I'll be the judge of that.
SPEAKER_05Yeah, you don't hand yourself the points.
SPEAKER_00You got me on the time? Call, I got you. Here we go. Go. All right. College football. It's the greatest level of football because everything about it feels bigger and more meaningful. College football, the environment is unmatched in college football. You've got packed stadiums, you've got crazy traditions, you've got fans who live for Saturdays. And the rivalries in college football are real. It's not like the pros or high school, like this is blood. This is real. And these schools have generations of history and pride behind every single game. The team spirit is real too because students and alumni. Ah, got me, got me, got me, got me, got me.
SPEAKER_01Cole, that was that was so loud in my microphone.
SPEAKER_05I didn't want no interruptions. All right. All right, here's St. Cole. That was awesome. Great argument, man. You killed it. That was so good. All right, here we go. Who's got my time? Ready for it? Appreciate it. Three, two, one, two. All right, the NFL. The National Football League. This is what every high school, every college football player they aspire to be at the NFL. This is the highest level of football. You're watching the best athletes in the world. You're talking about the best quarterbacks and the best of every position they were playing in the NFL. The 1% who have played football. Think about everyone who's ever tried to play football in their life. There's only 53 spots on this team. You get to be on it. And so you're watching the best of the best plays. So if you want to watch quality, time watch the NFL. I had to get that last piece out.
SPEAKER_01I know what you're thinking. Wow, those those arguments really blew away what I was thinking you guys were going to say. So it might take you a minute to come up with your answer, but we would love for you to decide the group. Yeah, here it is. Giving Pastor Jimmy a pen. It's a red pen. It's official. He's writing it down.
SPEAKER_05I think I got this one.
SPEAKER_01I feel good about it. Well, I feel like if he says Jarvis, that doesn't count because we don't know your real name. I'll tell you later.
SPEAKER_05Oh, I like that. I like the clipping. Yours is good. All right. Keep on. Hey, keep on listening.
SPEAKER_01We just got beat at our own game. I think all right, fine, Pastor Jimmy. This is your podcast now.
SPEAKER_04I think we all lost.
SPEAKER_05Man, well, hey, this next segment, we love it because this podcast isn't just for students, it's by students. And this the student shout out is one of my favorites because we get to shout out a student who's active in our student ministry, a student who's being the church in here, and also the church out there. And so we're so excited to present the student. This is Finn Kavanaugh from our Gardens campus. And let me tell you a little bit about Finn. So Finn has been a bringer, he's pulled people in because uh Finn, actually, three students have started attending regularly. He's been on advance, and another kid gave his life to Christ, and he shared his gospel with his family. And another one's going to camp for the first time. And so Finn is just being the church out there for all these kids. And so, gentlemen, how about we give Finn three, huh? Come on. That was better than the first time. Way better.
SPEAKER_01Pastor Jimmy, I know that we love the student shout-out just because, you know, we see these kids a lot in our own different ministries and get to see the things that they're doing. But I mean, what blows me away is that for every single one of these episodes, it's really been hard for us to pick the one student that we want to choose over the course of this season to be our student shout-out. And we only have 10, but we know that all of our students are doing so much more at all of their campuses. And so I just wonder, as our lead pastor, I mean, how proud are you of these students hearing about all the things they get to do?
SPEAKER_02Man, I could not be prouder. In fact, I think what's happened with our students, the ones that you're shouting out are awesome, of course, but there are literally hundreds of students involved in our student ministry. And a lot of them are so committed to Christ and so talented. And a lot of them are doing actually really creative things and interesting things with their lives to serve the Lord, different ways they share the gospel, but also different big plans that they have to make a real impact and to change the world for Jesus. So that to me is what's the most inspiring about our group. So when we go on these trips, we go to camps, man, I get to talk to these kids. It's unbelievable the thoughts that they are thinking. So what the dreams that they are dreaming for God.
SPEAKER_05Well, I'm excited. Today it's I know we say that every episode, we got a hot take. This one's gonna be the hottest take, but I love this hot take.
SPEAKER_01But I think what Pastor Jimmy just said, and even these student shout-outs, I think a lot of the reasons why some of these things are happening is because of what our hot take is gonna be today.
SPEAKER_05That's very true. That's right. All right, so today's hot take is if your faith has never been challenged, it has never grown.
SPEAKER_01Cole, you want to say your line? You know what I'm gonna say.
SPEAKER_05What you gonna say? Can you say it again for the people in the back? All right, come on, you already know it. Hey, if your faith has never been challenged, it has never grown.
SPEAKER_01See, I love that hot take because at Family Church, you know, our student ministry philosophy as student ministers and pastors, the things that we talk about all the time is how do we make sure that all of the environments that we're putting our students in embody challenging spiritual experiences? And the reason I think that this is so important is because we live in a world that wants everything easier. Like, I don't know if you guys have realized this, but like we live in a world that wants to lower the bar for a lot of different things for a lot of different people. And so there was a time where instant gratification was the desire. Like I just want the outcome of it right now. Well, now it almost seems like the argument that's happening is not only do I want the fastest way to get there, but I also want the easiest way to get there. And I just don't think that that's God's design for our spirituality and how we live and how we worship him.
SPEAKER_00And I think that's really good, Jake, because I think when we're talking about these challenging spiritual experiences, a lot of our students are probably asking, like, well, what does that look like? What does that mean? I think that we need to think about this in a way that these are experiences or opportunities that pull us out of our comfort zone. Right. And so if we did a case study, for example, on our student ministry, take advance, for instance. Advance, most people think about the challenging spiritual experience being the opportunity where they get to knock on a stranger's door, pray for them, and then share the gospel with them. But really, the entire program is a challenging spiritual experience because they're having to commit to reading the Bible every day. And for a lot of people, that's outside of their comfort zone. They're having to commit to invite five different friends throughout the advanced program to church. And for a lot of people, that's outside of their comfort zone. But then you think about even just physically sleeping on the floor in the warehouse at family church downtown while the lights are on and we can't turn the lights off. That is a challenging spiritual experience.
SPEAKER_01That was what I didn't have on my agenda beforehand, but it's up there now.
SPEAKER_00Right. It's a challenging spiritual experience. And so we need to think about these as students. These are in really anyone, these are opportunities and experiences that pull us out of our comfort zone.
SPEAKER_05Absolutely. So, Pastor Jim, we've heard you talk about this idea of challenging spiritual experiences. And we've talked about one of your mentors, Bob Tebow, who's with Jesus now, and we talked about some of your trips that you'd get to go on with him and how he'd put you on environments that would challenge you. So I wouldn't mind if you wouldn't mind talking a little bit about that and how that's sharpened you into the man you are today.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so Bob was a great mentor of mine. I knew Bob when I was eight years old. He and my dad became really close friends, and then when I was a little kid, our families planted a church together. So this was back in the early 1980s. So, guys, listen to this. This is like in your grandpa's times. And so we were back, and man, Bob, even when I was in elementary school, would have me out there knocking on doors, inviting people to come to church, learning how to share my faith. He would have me memorize scripture, like big chunks of scripture, chapters at a time when I was in middle school. And then when I got to be a young man, and he would take me to the Philippines and we would do all kinds of things. Man, we would be preaching the gospel and places. There's guys walking around with machetes and machine guns. Uh, we're crossing rivers. I mean, we're walking or driving or riding motorcycles all night. It's unbelievable the things that we did. But one of the things that Bob did for me since I was a little kid, and then when I was a young man, he made me feel like the Christian life could be the most incredible adventure that you've ever seen in your life. And that's what I think is missing from a lot of young people. They get disenchanted with Christianity because they don't see what God wants to do in their life as an amazing adventure. And so that's why mission trips are important. That's why developing spiritual habits like scripture memory or fasting is important. That's why getting leadership opportunities that you may not even quite be ready for is so important. And that's why the work that you guys are doing at Family Church is so powerful because you're pushing kids out of their comfort zone. And you're giving our kids opportunities and encouragement, and you're almost like trying to compel them to do things in a youth group environment because you have a larger environment that I could never successfully compel them to do just at our family. Right. So, like it'd be really hard for me to go, hey guys, since we're all sitting around here on a Sunday afternoon, what do you think about going door to door in our neighborhood and just like knocking on doors and seeing what's up? They're like, no, dad, I don't think we're gonna do that. Hey, how about doing it with 300 other high school kids out in Lake Worth Beach all day long in competition to see who has the best conversations? So there's some things that you can do in student mystery that I can't actually do as well, if at all, as a dad. And that's true about scripture memory, quiet time, all kinds of discipleship, leadership opportunities you can create. And so that's why I think all these things, these are the things that Bob did with me and other people did with me when I was growing up. And so what I'm hoping we can instill in our families and in especially our teenagers is a sense of destiny and a sense of adventure so that when they're doing things, they're doing things that are gonna mark them as different, you know. Right. Making choices that are different from every other kid in their school, doing something different with their lifestyle than every other kid in their school, doing something different with their spring break or their summer, or thinking about their future in a different way. Because let's face it, if you can't be different, you can't really do it for Jesus. Yeah. I mean, Jesus is a call to be different and unique and differentiate yourself from everybody else in the world. And that's what you guys get to do, and that's why I love what you're doing in our student ministry at Family Church.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I don't know about you guys. I am gonna go run through a brick wall and I'm gonna and then I'll be back. So I don't know if you guys want to ask some questions while I'm gone. But Pastor Jimmy, I mean, even what you just said, this idea of like people just lose this idea that like the Christian life can be so adventurous and can be so challenging. I mean, like I just think that that's so inspiring for us as Christians and believers and men of God. And I almost wonder, do you see that more in this generation than previous generations as far as like kind of losing that desire for that lifestyle? Has that been something that you've kind of seen for a while? Or what do you think about that?
SPEAKER_02Totally. I don't know if they've lost the desire for it, but parents won't let them do it. So, like, this is the bubble wrap generation, man. I mean, you you see all that stuff on Instagram about, you know, oh, back in our day, we, you know, didn't come home until the street lights came on. All right, well, which is not false. But I'm telling you, man, the things that it takes. So if you're not having a little bit of danger, if there's not a little bit of uncertainty, if there's not a little bit of, I'm not really sure how this is all gonna turn out, you're really not on an adventure at all. You're in a simulation. And so that's where God doesn't want us on a simulation, God wants us on an adventure with Him, and that's what we've got to teach our kids.
SPEAKER_01That's a hot take. I mean, that's the I'm renaming the episode.
SPEAKER_05That's a hot take. That is I love it. That's great. Well, hey, this hot take is so important and it matters, and I think this idea of being comfortable as a Christian sometimes can produce certain things in our world. So, gentlemen, like where are some things that we're seeing that sometimes comfortable Christianity can produce as a result of maybe some of the bubble wrap generation that we have sometimes? Like, what can be like a result of that?
SPEAKER_00I think some of it is also is also fear. Like if you're always stuck in this bubble wrap, or if you're always stuck in a bubble, well then you're always gonna be afraid of what's gonna come and pop you. And so you're never gonna actually put yourself out there, or you're gonna be afraid when challenges. Start to come your way because you're going to be afraid of how that's going to affect you or how you're going to react to that. I think another thing is like our culture teaches us that comfortability is the end goal. Like we should be seeking to just be comfortable because that's what's easiest. I think that's a lie that culture is trying to teach us because we see in scripture, Jesus tells us that if the world hates us, know that it hates us because it hated him first. And so we know that these challenges are going to come our way. But I think on the flip side of that, challenging spiritual experiences produce something else in us. And so where this bubble wrap Christianity or where comfortable Christianity might produce fear, I think challenging spiritual experiences produce confidence. Because when we're being challenged, we're seeing confidence not in ourselves and relying on ourselves, but we're seeing that confidence rooted in Christ because we're relying on him and the strength that he gives us because we know that he tells us that he'll be with us into the ends of the age. And we also see that it produces perseverance because the more that these challenges come, the more we're just gonna have to persevere because we know that God isn't calling us to run from these challenges or remove ourselves from them so that we can experience something that's easier or something that's safer. We know that he's calling us to sit in them, to be confident in them because he's with us and to persevere because we know he's with us. And so I think you get bubble wrapped Christianity producing fear, but then you also see challenging spiritual experiences producing confidence and producing perseverance that's all rooted and attached to Christ.
SPEAKER_01And all three of us, I mean, really any second now, all three of us are dads. And Pastor Jimmy, you've been a dad for a really, really long time. And so I just wonder for you, as you think about this idea that Cole's talking about about comfortable Christianity, as we think about the kids in our student ministries that we love, as we think about parenting our own kids, I mean, what do you think the biggest dangers are, or maybe even indicators are of people who are walking or living in comfortable Christianity?
SPEAKER_02You know, Christianity, the real Christianity, the kind of Christianity that has taken over the world for the last 2,000 years, is a Christianity people will die for and they die for it every day. And if whatever kind of Christianity you think you're pursuing isn't a kind of Christianity you would die for, then it's really not the real thing. And that's why C.S. Lewis in The Lie on the Witch and the Ward has this scene where the kids are talking about Aslan and they're asking about him, and they're like, hey, is he safe? And one of the characters says, he's not safe, but he's good. And the Christian life is not safe, it's not supposed to be safe. The only way you can build your faith is if you don't know what's about to happen. You do something not really knowing what's gonna happen. And the thing about it is it doesn't mean you always win. David had faith. He went out and he kills Goliath and cuts off his head. What a day. Stephen has faith and he goes out and preaches and they stone him to death, and he sees Jesus standing in the heavens. Both men exercise tremendous faith doing exactly what God had for them to do that day, different earthly outcomes, but they both demonstrated faith and they were both on an adventure for God and both on an adventure with God. So that's the hardest part about it is just because you're faithful to God doesn't mean it's gonna work out the way that you want, or the way that you hope, or the way that you think. And if you always know what's about to happen, then it's never gonna build your faith in God. So you got to put kids in an environment where they don't know what's about to happen. Yeah, good. And if they don't know, and then whatever happens and they can be faithful in it, that's how they grow their faith, and that's how they grow their confidence. Man, God's got bigger adventures for us out there. You know, Bob taught me that. I shared this at his funeral when I was like uh, I don't know, 11 or 12 years old. We went to this like lake house, this guy at a lake house, and we're out there, and Bob goes, uh, hey, you boys want to go out in the swamp? And it's in the middle of this massive swamp, and we're like, Yeah, we do. He goes, Okay, let's go. He puts like a 357 magnum in a holster around his waist, and he gets a machete, and we just start going through this swamp. Not on a trailer. Not on a trail, not on a path. We're like no waiters, nothing. We're just whatever clothes we had on. We're like waist deep in this murky water. They're as snakes, they're as alligators, and he's hacking his way through the jungle. And then he he brought us back, and I remember him just saying, hey, listen, man, you don't always know where you're going, and you don't know when you're gonna get there, but God knows. And you got to trust God. I just remember him just he was always teaching us object lessons, and that's what I have in mind when students are with us at camp and advance, other things. How are we gonna make them feel like they're on a total adventure with God, not knowing exactly what's gonna happen? And when good things happen, then that's when their faith grows. Because if your faith's not being challenged, never grows. Never grows. Come on.
SPEAKER_01You know, Pastor Jimmy, you sharing that story of you with with Bob Tebow. You know, I was spending some time with Daniel recently and he showed me a picture of him holding an alligator. And so uh, so I know that you're actually living out what you're preaching, and that Bob Tebow really taught you some things that you know you're transferring on. But one of the things I think that we think about about challenging spiritual experiences is that we it's like harder Bible studies, and it's like, and that's true, but also at the same time, like you're talking about things that are not even in the Bible, as far as like, you know, the Bible doesn't say go out in a swamp with weapons and hunt alligators, but yet somehow you're attaching that back to your faith and big milestones for you. And so how do those things go hand in hand?
SPEAKER_02Man, it's a sense of adventure. So I was with a spiritual mentor who's discipling me because he did things like he would say, Hey man, here's what we're gonna do. I think I was like the sixth or seventh grade. He's like, Here's what we're gonna do. Do you think you can memorize Romans chapter eight? And I was like, That's a lot of verses. Yes, I can do it.
SPEAKER_01What verse? Yes, I can do it.
SPEAKER_02No, yeah, the whole thing. Yeah, I can do it. He goes, Okay, you got to memorize it in the new American standard, and when you get done, I'm gonna take you on a fishing trip. And I was like, done. Well, I could memorize that thing pretty fast, to be honest with you, when I was that age, man. I memorized the whole thing in like a week or two weeks or something. I come back, man. He picked me up early in the morning. We went to the Okee Finoke swamp in Wake Cross, Georgia. It's my nick of the woods, man. We are out there in this in this in this kayak in the middle of as far as I knew as a kid, like as far as I knew, we were lost. And just stuff like that. And he just talked to me about God all day. So I always had this sense of adventure attached to it. And then even as a young man, the places that we would go and the things that we would do, and he didn't care. He didn't care. We'd go to like have a look at a parents meeting, the parents would be in there, and they'd be like, Hey, can you promise my kid's gonna be safe? And he'd go, Absolutely not. Next question.
SPEAKER_05That's awesome. I love that. Well, hey, this podcast, right? We've been talking about some holy things already, kind of weaving in scripture throughout, but I would love for like where do we see some of these ideas of these challenging spiritual experiences? Like, where do we see that in scripture?
SPEAKER_01You know, one of the verses that whenever we first started talking about this hot take for me was going back to the book of John. I love reading through the gospels. We're in the book of Mark right now at Sherbrooke in Student Ministry. And so we've just been walking through the gospels. And so I think about John 16, 33, and it says, I've said these things to you that in me you may have peace. And in the world, you will have tribulation. So what you should do is take heart because I've overcome the world. And I think about this, and I think about, you know, Pastor Jimmy, what you said, like if you know the outcome of what's going to happen next, it's impossible for you to build your faith. And so what Jesus didn't say is, here's the deal. I want you to go to the most comfortable places that you can find and preach the gospel there. Like go to the resorts in the Bible and preach the gospel there. Well, what he told him is, hey guys, like you're actually going to have trouble in the world, and that's okay. But what I want you to do is I want you to take heart because I've already overcome all of those things. And so when I think about our students who who have fear to go on advance because they don't know what's on the other side of the door, man, like, can we put you in environments and teach you things to where you don't have fear, but instead you take heart and you know that no matter what the result is, Jesus has already overcome the world. Like all of that trouble we're gonna face, Jesus has already triumphed over that, just like with David and with Stephen, like two different outcomes, but both men of God who were in those environments and had faith. And so that's where my mind goes to. And if if I could help teach our students anything, it would just be like, you are going to have these moments where you don't know what's gonna happen next or where your faith is gonna be tested. But if we can have faith in Jesus, because he's already overcome and triumphed over all of this, that's what I would say.
SPEAKER_00I really like that verse, Jake, because the verse that comes to mind for me or verses is from Romans 5, verses 3 and 4. And it kind of talks about almost like the process of how you get from the challenges to the hope that that Jesus brings. Paul says that we rejoice in our sufferings, knowing that suffering produces endurance and endurance produces character, and character produces hope, and hope does not put us to shame because God's love has been poured into our hearts through the Holy Spirit who has been given to us. And for me, when I think of challenging spiritual experiences or when I think of opportunities in my faith where I might be struggling through something, or it may feel like I'm suffering, I always reflect back to Romans 3 and remember that all of this, it may feel like it's hurting me, but actually it's helping me grow over time. Endurance is being produced through this, character is being produced through this, hope is being produced through this, and all of this points me back to one, Jesus and the hope that I have in him, the confidence that I have in him, but two, the sanctification that we see in that, and how over time I get to grow into the image of Christ. I get to be conformed into his image and not conformed by the image of the world. And so as we're enduring through these challenging spiritual experiences, and as we're enduring through the things that it feels like we're suffering through, know that those are things that are producing hope in you and drawing you closer and closer to Christ. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05Pastor John, I was wondering if you had anything that came off the top of your head that you were thinking of of when it comes to challenging spiritual experiences.
SPEAKER_02I just think Jesus was always, you know, of course, it gets dark quick, I guess. But Jesus said his disciples, he goes, Hey man, if you want to come after me, you gotta deny yourself and take up your cross and follow me. And the only people that were walking around carrying crosses in Jesus' day were going to be crucified on him. And so Jesus said, Hey man, you want to follow me, you gotta be willing to take it all away. He also told his disciples another time he said, Hey man, look, you don't need to worry about the people who can kill the body. You need to be worried about the people who can kill your soul. And that's why, man, what happens to us in this life, we don't always know. But we need to be raising young people who have a vision for expending every day of their life that God gives them, and every drop of sweat, and if necessary, every drop of blood to pursue the adventure that God puts in front of them and to have the faith and the belief that God can see them through and one day will take them home. Whatever it takes and however long it is. That's part of why you teaching them in little ways how to walk through challenging spiritual experiences, you set them up to believe that God is taking them on the adventure of a lifetime and that the end goal is heaven, and that's where we're going.
SPEAKER_01Pastor Jimmy, I think that's so good. I think that's exactly what our students need to hear right now. And so I guess the question that I'm I'm here with if I if I have a student in this room, if I have a student in this room, what's an easy way that I can apply this to my life right now?
SPEAKER_00I mean, I think what comes to mind for me is don't run. Like if we're talking about comfortable Christianity and how it produces fear in us, don't run. Don't be the comfortable Christian that when challenges and spiritual experiences come your way, don't run from those. Stand firm in those, persevere through those, stand confident, knowing that Christ is with you until the end of the ages and will always be with you, knowing that you'll come out stronger and better through these challenges.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I love that. And so just speaking of challenges, Pastor Jimmy, one of the things we like to do at the end of every episode is give our students just one challenge to hold on to before they leave and before we go to the next one. And so one of the challenges I want to give you, Cole, since you just said that is what if this summer, since it's so easy in the summertime for us to kind of check out and for us to maybe remove ourselves out of church and student ministry because of vacations and everything, and we trick ourselves into thinking, well, I'll just wait till back to school Sunday to get more engaged. What if the challenge this year is to actually not take a step back, but instead take a step forward?
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01What if instead of maybe removing yourself out of student ministry for this summer or for whatever season that might be, don't trick yourself into doing that. Instead, don't ask, hey, what's going to be here when I get back? Man, what can I do right now to be engaged, to challenge myself, to challenge the people around me? Man, let's get a group together, let's get a group together. Let's all grow for Jesus. So, Pastor Jimmy, how do you think about that challenge? Is there a different way you challenge our students? What do you think about that?
SPEAKER_02No, I love it. I wish they would lean into what you guys are doing because when they get there, you're gonna challenge them. Yep. They're not just gonna show up. We're not having a little pillow fight over there. We're challenging them with the real stuff that's gonna take them through life with God. The main challenge I would say to students, be different. Don't be afraid to be different. I know students work so hard to not be different. I wish they would just make a decision. I'm willing to be different for Jesus. That is an adventure all in itself. Absolutely.
SPEAKER_05Well, hey, it's been uh it's been a fantastic episode. Oh, I almost forgot. Oh, don't you try to sneak out of here? Almost ended this episode.
SPEAKER_00Don't you try to sneak out of here?
SPEAKER_05Oh, we have two things. All right, let's reveal who won because we got a championship to hoist. Is that the word hoist? Hoist.
SPEAKER_02So here's here's the deal. You said it was the NFL because basically that's the best players in the world. It is. You said it's a college basically because of all the traditions associated with it. You said it's high school because it's the purest form of ball. And I'm telling you, you all lose because the answer is little league. Little is the greatest level of football, the purest level of football. And which one of you would have said that? So congratulations, you're tied. What's your name of this?
SPEAKER_05Got it again. Uh I'll tell them season two. That's good.
SPEAKER_00Season two coming back season two. Come back season two.
SPEAKER_05Well, hey guys, thanks for listening to Hot Takes and Holy Things on behalf of me, Jake, Cole, and Pastor Jimmy. Gentlemen, for one last time this season. Let's give them three.
SPEAKER_00Thanks for tuning in to Hot Takes and Holy Things. To stay up to date on new episodes, follow us on Instagram at GoFC Students. Share this podcast with a friend and send us your questions. We'd love to talk about the stuff you care about. Catch you next time on Hot Takes and Holy Things.