The Future of Laser Restoration: Safety, Innovation & Manufacturing

In this episode of The Bolt, host Ryan Brown sits down with Ryan Hartwig, founder of Minnesota Laser Restoration, to discuss his transition from advanced manufacturing into the rapidly growing world of laser restoration and laser cleaning technology.

Drawing from over 15 years of experience in automotive, aerospace, medical device manufacturing, CNC machining, and industrial operations, Hartwig shares how his background prepared him to recognize the immense potential of laser technology long before entering the industry. Together, they explore why laser systems should be viewed as complete industrial processes—not simply tools—and why safety, compliance, operator training, and process integration are critical to successful implementation.

The conversation dives into the future of laser cleaning, manufacturing modernization, robotics, workforce development, environmental sustainability, and the growing role lasers will play across industrial sectors. Brown and Hartwig also discuss the importance of building industry standards, creating repeatable results, and helping businesses adopt laser technology safely and effectively.

Whether you're involved in manufacturing, industrial maintenance, surface preparation, or emerging technology, this episode provides an inside look at how laser restoration is reshaping the future of industry.

Key Topics:

• Ryan Hartwig's manufacturing and engineering background
• The growth of laser cleaning and laser ablation technology
• Safety, OSHA, ANSI, and industrial compliance
• Manufacturing efficiency and process improvement
• Robotics and workforce development
• Environmental benefits of laser restoration
• The future of laser technology in American industry
• Building scalable and sustainable laser operations

Listen in to discover why laser technology is poised to become one of the most transformative innovations in modern manufacturing.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:15

Well, welcome back to the bowl. I'm Ryan Brown, and I am here with Minnesota. Minnesota Laser Restoration, Ryan Hartwig. Yep. And what a background you have, sir.

SPEAKER_01 0:30

Well, thank you very much. I appreciate that. And that's um so that's one of the things that has brought me into this industry. Um, highly technical manufacturing is what I've spent the last 15 years of my life doing.

SPEAKER_00 0:45

Quite a very uh interesting experience, which I focus in on immediately. I can hear that. Yep. You know, that what value that has in the industry uh that you're venturing into. Tell us a little about your background there.

SPEAKER_01 1:01

Okay. So, you know, I have formerly educated in business and also manufacturing machine tool technology, but I've been able to spend a lot of time on CNC operations, uh tube laser, sheet laser operations, technical support, uh facilities maintenance, and even worked in through um estimating in advanced automotive plastic injection molding, also into medical device, where I've done everything from um RD work to contract manufacturing to OEM applications, and I've seen uh in the 15 years that I've been in manufacturing, I've seen where this technology would have been beneficial. And I'm really excited to be um taking this step here and and moving into this because it's it touches all of those angles of manufacturing from automotive to aerospace, from the the blacksmith shop all the way up to the place where you could, you know, eat food off the floor because it's you know so clean.

SPEAKER_00 2:11

I think the I think that that skill set in lasers is one of the most well skill set and experience is one of one of the most important things you can have in understanding how to apply lasers in plants and in varied environments. That's the whole that's the 80%. The laser is a is is a portion of it, very useful portion of it, but it's that kind of insight. And while you're in those plants and you are doing uh greenfield and and and the financial aspect of what a plant's got to do per square foot, and understanding a process or looking at a process and being able to understand that that process, that X amount of dollars per minute of things running through it, what happens and um and also how to how to you all of a sudden you're out in injection molding. Well, then you know what that is, and you know how those people um uh what their challenges are in a plant, um, how how to do work in a plant, having vendors come and go. And like you in that side, I'm down in the pits, you know, for years and years. I'm in, or in the plant shutdowns, or in the top of uh my uh my operations manager Darren Green was chief uh engineer in the big high-rise buildings, right? So then we're shutting that building down, or we're in different environments. But growing up, uh being in industrial, in aerospace, in uh manufacturing, pharmaceutical, it rubs off, but you never know exactly where that knowledge is gonna come back to play. You don't even remember you have it until somebody asks you an obscure question, right? And you reach down in there and go, oh yeah, that's it's this. So, what made you kind of decide to to pivot into uh into lasers?

SPEAKER_01 4:15

I mean, it's it's something that I've seen around in the industry being utilized and and growing, and um definitely have saw the the need, even I I need I knew of the need before I knew of lasers. And so as soon as I started doing some research, even deeper dives into what lasers are doing, um previous experience running fiber lasers, cutting tubes and sheet and stuff, but then knowing what what advancements have happened and and what's happening out there in the world, and um just becoming uh just being able to support and solve the problems that I had seen in previous in previous lives at previous times, it it became a rather no-brainer. And I I have um have a pretty structured rubric of you know checking the box and making sure, okay, does that pass the smell test? Does this pass the smell test? And and this is lasers are the real deal, and they're gonna only grow and only be more. And um, we're seeing what's happening in different countries, and actually USA is a little bit of a late adopter into some of the areas of laser, laser ablation, laser cleaning, and that kind of stuff, where some of our our foreign, you know, uh the foreign countries, uh Europe, Australia, China, and stuff like that have kind of picked it up, which is quite which is quite interesting because it is a technical area, but you know, the United States kind of focuses and prides themselves on that. But in the manufacturing world, um in in the US-based manufacturing, we're usually quicker to adopt some of those things into our as far as when I'm looking at regulatory environments, we have a more relaxed regulatory environment than some of the other countries out there.

SPEAKER_00 6:14

It's funny that you say that, and still it's uh stringent. But for example, in a plant, let's take injection molds, and you're you're you're talking about what you're seeing there are analogs of the big the printing companies, the big, you know, all of these sites. You know, just to be able to walk into those sites, the way we've seen it, is the mature companies that are in there that have the that have the knowledge of those systems. Well, they have the safety plans. They're in the sites. Those folks, you're submitting those plans. They're looking at um containment or confined space, joint occupant, uh joint occupants or ongoing operations within the plant you're working on. And the mindset, not only that, about the regular safety in and around the machines, uh, flammability issues, and we're talking about the oils that get kind of coated around, like like I think about it when you're talking about like a big old waffle machine. You walk through these plants and they're just caked with with stuff, but the right, the right lasers, the process, the setup. And I think there's two tiers in the United States right now about lasers sold as as a as a tool. Um lasers that but but but also the process in which they're using and the safety constraints and the proper setup to be able to work into a plant and not having worked in a in a plant like that to know uh what that requires, even financially, right? Right. And and so your insight was you you had a lot of the right questions early. We were talking mostly, it wasn't even about the lasers, was it? It was about safety. Yep. It's about that they're regulated equipment in the United States, about how to and and it's about using that equipment and integrating it into your services in the field effectively.

SPEAKER_01 8:17

There was quite a bit of discussion about that being a little different than what you I mean, you know, risk mitigation and manufacturing is what ISO is built off of. It's what all those different governing bodies are. And you know, it's it's one of the key aspects. This is a this is a it's a very awesome, you know, wow factor type of of technology, and you're doing it, but it also you have to give it a level of you know respect for the safety that it's required. And um, and you know, we've you've walked around them and I've walked around them, the different manufacturing facilities, we've all worked with EHS employees, and and every factory we go into has an EHS system in place. Yeah, and um really that's I've been able to interact with a lot of those, and and that's where you know average person might just think this is the next thing, I can plug it in, easily use it, and miss a lot of the key things that make a good laser system, a good laser operator, and a good laser company valuable. And that's where having those the trusted advisors, the laser safety officers, having the ecosystem surrounding it to be able to implement it safely in those environments, not counteracting or contradicting the the existing EHS and actually uh supporting it and maybe even uh benefiting it.

SPEAKER_00 10:00

I saw that as well. And with uh I was we were also thinking about that with customers. Now you you're gonna be working directly with our team, and we're we're doing projects together. And it goes beyond uh, yes, we have the lasers, but they have to do what when they hit the site? They have to be running in a co in a in a compliant, it could be as simple as a laser uh curtain, an area separation, or it could be a laser process environment with fume extraction interlocks, maybe robotic process going through. And and so if I don't think about ourselves as a warehouse or a you know, I I think understanding the equipment and uh but it's its application at the end point. 100%. And those are gonna be exciting jobs. I know we're gonna talk about a few just after this meeting, some pretty, pretty interesting. I think there's no shortage of meeting fascinating people doing fascinating things in these plants. It's just it's great. But being able to team up and uh you're up out of uh Minnesota, yeah, the Minneapolis-St. Paul area. You got the kind of the core of the the country. We have folks over in in Baltimore, Maryland. We've got some uh uh guy out of the marine side we will meet who's who's doing phenomenal things up there and integrating that with a coding system we were talking about, a flame spray type system using propane, uh, rapid cure, like immediate cure, and and so they're all doing these very interesting things. You're probably so you're out, uh you got a pretty solid field set up. Yep. I mean, you you you've got the uh components, so are you gonna focus mostly um implants for a while? I know you're getting set up uh for a kind of a base location. You will be out doing services. Uh, is there a core sector? Are you gonna stick just in manufacturing? You think you'll be out on the really?

SPEAKER_01 12:10

I mean, that's all good questions. This, you know, this industry is so broad and it touches so many areas that it would be very easy to dilute. And um with my with my expertise in the in the aerospace, automotive, med device sectors, along with how Minnesota, the manufacturing that Minnesota has, that's really where I'll be focusing on is that is the manufacturing, the integration, the design build, and the um and you know, really helping them create that envelope that they can safely do, helping manufacturing companies create an envelope for where they can safely do these projects, to get time efficiencies and labor efficiencies, operator efficiencies that they don't currently have, and um really benefit their process and put it directly in line or in-house to be able to get quicker turnaround on parts, to lower overhead on parts because we're not shipping it out, they're not shipping it out. And that's just the time factor. That's not even taking into consideration the environmental aspects of not having abrasives or other stuff like that, just it not being an abrasive type um process that's removing material where you're um, you know, when doing it right, that you you're only removing the the discoloration or the biofilm or the whatever you want to remove from the substrate.

SPEAKER_00 13:40

I think when in our first discussion, you know, you had um what struck me is is after kind of a run-in with with uh your your background, I felt immediately comfortable saying, you know, this is a person I could have right by my side in in these plants and kind of understand what we're looking at and how to protect outcomes for the client and our own workers. And the other part of it is that you are in the core of uh America is reinvesting in our manufacturing and industrial base as well as our workforce. And as you know, I'm heavily active nationally in workforce development. And we are also testing lasers. So you look at it like this mountain, you're helping these plants, they're gonna be coming through, they're refurbishing their upgrading process. I'm seeing robotics go in everywhere, but also technicians, tradespeople working with the robots, they will be working with them in uh integrating them into uh, like you said, hazardous work is gonna be done by robots. But the personnel and the upcoming trades and people that are in the workforce already will have to understand their operation and use. Yep. Right? So you're kind of like in uh ground, uh you're in a ground central area there, but we're actually it's a misnomer that that lasers are a tool. I never call them tools. They are it is they are a process, just like a machine is a process. Um and knowing how to take it apart, knowing how to care for it, but knowing how to operate it properly in the field. And we're just we're just looking at all these different substrates. And what looks like something that might look perfect to the eye could be damaged due to heat, or for example, we were looking not to take you in the rabbit holes, but we were looking at texturing lasers, and you're seeing a lot of the okay, but to what standard? Yeah, to what sure we can tech well the you know, the coatings company likes, they say it looks okay, but you know, who's it's AMP and standard best practices and understanding, getting some validation. And you know, I know we're having the discussion, you can't go out and sell a laser to somebody and say, well, yeah, it's a it'll it'll texture and likely it works. You know, we all look at it, but it's doing it with heat, you know, like and and then you're going, it could have a different appearance. If the coding inspector shows up, that job's gonna be inspected to amp, or yeah, like their their uh NASES inspector. Well, that's not an SSP SP, it looks a little different. What what are we what what can and we talked about overheating causing the micro melting or the flash and changing density, causing a uh corrosion or uh ionic exchange there with oxidation that forms a blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But you go, we're deep in the studies, and I know that you appreciate that kind of stuff and looking at it and going, but people are standing back going, yeah, but we're getting good. Adhesive, you know, it it works, and and they're what you're finding experientially needs, we need to catch up on the you know, the lab testing, yeah, so a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 17:15

You know, and I'm glad that you said lab testing. Lasers are a piece of scientific equipment. They always started out as a piece of scientific equipment, and they've expanded from there to find industrial and manufacturing and other personal uses, but they still need to be treated at that, as that scientific level of equipment. They're they're taller, they're they have tolerance, they're designed to specifically do certain things, either the patterns, the the amps, the all the different frequencies and stuff like that that you can adjust with it. And and you, and it's not just a hammer, it's a scientific piece of equipment. It takes a little bit of effort. I compare I compare it to like a CNC machine where you actually have to program and then you have to test it, and then you identify is this getting me the end result that I want from the part or from whatever I'm creating. Everywhere from is the part conforming to shape and size, or is the surface finish the right thing? And there's things that you can get into it. And I'm actually really excited to start looking at this at a molecular level and microscopic level to truly you know start to push the boundaries of how we create those polished surfaces better, more efficiently. How do we how do we create those um those replicable uh profiles and surfaces to be the repeatable results? The repeated results.

SPEAKER_00 18:40

And that's when you're putting it in somebody's hands, you're starting to see that it's like a well, it's just like the art of sandblast, the finesse of welding, the finesse of of uh, and there's some phenomenal guys out there that really know those lasers. There's guys, I mean, they're from all parts, and they're all they're all um getting there but maintaining that uniformity. That's one of the reasons why uh the folks that are out there doing phenomenal things in in robotics right now to maintain the um consistency and and a lot of it goes just fine, but it's those unique jobs that are um that are in have have a have a lot of uh I guess I'm excited about them because it has a lot of room for uh innovation. And there's so many people innovating out there right now. I just love to, I'm just like, yeah, that's cool. Yeah, and sometimes they work out, sometimes it's not quite there, but there's a wealth of information that are guys that are resources that are growing every day.

SPEAKER_01 19:47

And as I as I've been studying this and learning about it, I have interviewed, you know, five or six different manufacturers in in the US that are either importing or building to some level their own lasers. And one of the things that really impacted me in our conversations is your foresight into this industry and where you see it going, the way that you you see it developing, um, the way you're interacting at even uh a governmental level and in lobbying and talking to those levels. And um, and that was what really spoke to me was all the other providers were selling a piece of equipment. You are selling an envelope around a process, and you can sell a piece of equipment, but in that piece of equipment, you're also delivering safety, you know, instructions and just certain levels of those things that um that truly help it. And and take it from I'm an operator to I'm a I'm a subject matter expert, and that's where I saw your subject matter expert in the laser industry where you were vision envisioning this, where you've envisioned system lasers themselves to be positioned, is different than the other companies that I've interacted with in the United States that are providing similar or like equipment.

SPEAKER_00 21:22

That's interesting. Yeah, I I feel like um I feel like we were talking about we weren't even talking about lasers at the start. I remember you calling me. We were coming back from a job out of running out of Oregon, and uh, and we were talking about the FDA, we were talking about the the business of the lasers, and when you were telling me what you want to do, I can tell you I've been there. I have self funded this, we were running operations, twist it, move the company, do put the next phase of my life in this. So it's understanding. What is about, what happens after you buy that laser and how we can help you do that safely and to do that efficiently and to have growth. Because the next thing is where do I get the jobs? What do I do? How do I make this thing work or get access to the you know the bigger jobs? And I feel that intently. I've been there. I used to sit in this room. We moved much of equipment down and we were getting going. And I would sit in this room until very late, late nights. And I did it because it was quiet. And we have a good office here, like and I go, well, uh, but it gets um depressed. You know, you're you're rowing. And that's kind of why we have our Viking ship on our because get in the boat, guys. Yeah, oars, right? Yeah. But it's it's lonely if you're out there and there's no wind in the sand, and you're you're putting things together, deciding to manufacture, never, you know, you're putting these things and trying to keep your projects running downtown and keep the wheels on everybody and and make that transition. There were definitely easier ways to do it. It's not a cruise ship, it's a rowboat. But I will say I feel it. And it's like where two guys, you know, they go and I'm like, okay, brother, it's not this kind of shake, it's this kind of shake. It's like, brother, let's go. Let's do it. Yeah, let's do it. A good care of each other in the network, and you're running the core down the middle of the country. We're talking about jobs over here, and we're talking immediately about innovation, and immediately about improvement, and immediately about the need for accredited kind of you know, training in the United States, and how part of that's hands-on and and where that takes us in this boat ride, get through the surf, get out onto the to the open water, so to speak. You know, that's kind of I'm not an MDA, I gotta think in those terms, right, you know, to get to of what I want to do or or or how. But I think that um I think that your um your approach and gosh, I'd loved even hearing about you know the SOLIDWORKS and the estimating and the starts and stops of of the varied environments that that you've been in. And I I'm so excited for your future and excited for this future in the industry. I haven't showed you the other well, the other laser equipment and stuff in in here, but I know that we'll be collaborating, uh, supporting each other on jobs out there. And I think that's the other half of it. Think about it this way as well. Think about it like you invest in these lasers, and there's a big those are the quite questions you're looking at. We did the same thing, you know, and they're great guys. I mean, good, you know, every the the lanes, and and and you go, look, these are knowledgeable people, but it's being driven tribally from the industry, from the field, and out there, and it's flowing back up, and then kind of best practices get developed, groups start coming together to kind of going and and that's gonna help a lot of folks. But the next thing is, you know, they get the laser. We didn't talk about the lasers at all at the first thing. We know what we were talking about. I was showing you get fume extraction with carbon filtration right off your gun in sufficient quantities to remove those plumes. Second phase, right behind it. You know, it's the um proper respiratory protection, air washers for the boat, like you're in a room. Yep, you're talking about how you're controlling those environments in a in a plant to keep your PELs down under, you know, you can't and and the and not knowing what's the laser-generated air contaminants or so. We had these discussions and uh and and start, then when you can see it, put it together, what's the difference between a two millijoul laser and a 15 or a um or a uh you know, top hat Gaussian and changing settings, substrates.

SPEAKER_01 26:18

So I mean, you know, like any different industry, as we've been um as it advances and grows, it gets more sophisticated. So if you know, back when machining or any of welding and all that came in, you'd walk into those facilities, you'd see the blue haze in the room, you'd smell the cutting oil from the CNC. And eventually they got all the different extraction, they got all the different um proper, you know, health and safety stuff involved to make sure that it wasn't a blacksmith shop that's full of fumes. And that's probably one of the things that is benefiting us is that we aren't coming into we're coming into sophisticated systems, we're bringing this and being able to apply this in already sophisticated systems because of the forethought and the background understanding that we have about those systems and being able to apply it in a meaningful way from the beginning instead of all the trial and error that has you know that a lot of people have already done.

SPEAKER_00 27:21

Yeah, don't don't after the fact damage all the brick on the building and and like what you can do before beforehand and the test as well is is important. I think we're we're definitely in that sector, and it's good to have another set of hands out there that could be tested for because it doesn't stop, you know, it's a good thing, you know, and something and you have a great team here, and I've been we've you know, we've spent the day chatting about it, and we've spent the last few hours back in the back in the test room.

SPEAKER_01 27:50

And as I run more and test more and see more surfaces, it's not you know, the the magic of it hasn't gone away. It's only more magical from what's actually happening, and it's only um going to be this is the the first steps into this industry and what we what where this industry goes in in 10 years are gonna be built on the backs of people like you and and people in this company, um hopefully myself and other laser experts out there, and what we know of it today is so so infantile to where it's going to go, to the substrates it's going to clean, to the solutions it's going to bring to otherwise costly or maybe even impossible tasks today. It's going to revolutionize, in my opinion, a lot of what manufacturing does, can do, and might even, you know, send some different modes of manufacturing, you know, set them back a bit, you know, kind of like the buggy.

SPEAKER_00 28:55

If we have one sandblaster from shoveling a lot of sand, I'd be happy with that. We've been involved in in a lot of sand shoveling out there with subs and and and those guys and and uh and be environmentally and that environmental friendly aspect is the part that we haven't even really touched on, but it is so important to you know to leave it better than we've when we found it.

SPEAKER_01 29:19

That's you know, like you're walking a trail, leave it better than you found it. Pick something up. And and I think and I think that's what lasers can do. And I definitely think that's what this team that you're building and that you've built here has the idea and the mindset to do, to actually be able to not just operate, but to create systems, create processes and advance this trade, this new up-and-coming um, you know, trade that's that will be built over the next five, 10, 15 years.

SPEAKER_00 29:54

I think, I think, I think so. And I think you're gonna be a wonderful uh mentor. Like I said, all the things around, not just in the lasers, but all the things around the lasers. And if you're gonna put and show you'll be showing lasers, you're not a out here running. We have colleagues in the industry, and we are here to to help them. You be showing demonstrating lasers, helping other people with lasers. If if clients want a laser in a in a um in their fam shop, well they gotta put it somewhere. It's gotta, you know, to help them be operated safely and and get uh started successfully. The financial aspect of it is that lasers aren't when you look at everything around it, as you know, it's not cheap, but then you're gonna find the next bigger job. What's the constraint? See, I know that like I know, and a lot of others, they know what's gonna befall the operators to go to help get through those challenges. It's like, well, this is a bigger job, you know, but to maintain production, we're gonna need four systems, you know, or they're gonna have to scale, and therefore understanding the financials, how to bid a job, how to what exclusions would you have in for a particular job, right? Something how would you contingency, yeah. All sorts of stuff that you're putting in. Jobs is is one thing. Scaling efficiently. Yep. How can we help uh clients scale up for jobs? And and they're also busy, they're they're putting it in their employees' hands. Well, employees can forget to tie things down, they could set their cokes on top of the units and tip them over or drop the head from you know, these things. So the training, and they're also often what? Busy. Yep. So do you do that? Do they all come here? Do we go to the field and help with their team? Everybody's still on the payroll where you're integrating in and these ideas that help people efficiently scale and let the revenues scale their laser operations, not just dump in and pray, you know, or get get it going.

SPEAKER_01 32:00

And that's a great example of the reason why our conversation, the first conversation in my eyes, was as beneficial to me and um set you guys aside from the rest of the pack in the in the laser manufacturers that I had talked about, is it is that vision, it is that foresight to see where it's gonna go, what it's gonna do. And and you're right, the first hour and a half that we were on the phone, we very we minimally discussed, you knew I wanted to talk about lasers, and then we got into the technical aspect, the ANSI, the OSHA, all the stuff that is going to really the meat and the heart of what a laser system and process and whole envelope looks like when you're utilizing this or deploying this in a manufacturing environment, out in a in a you know, as a contract manufacturer as a contract job where you're out at a site, or if you're operating inside your own facility. And and that's that speaks volumes to your understanding of the lasers and just knowing how it's gonna apply and based on your previous experiences and you know, and all in all of your other endeavors.

SPEAKER_00 33:13

Somehow you gotta cash in on that strange knowledge that you never thought you'd that would come to play. And I I see a lot of but here it is right in front of you. Yeah, and I'm glad to have you with us, and we're gonna get busy uh right away, and and uh this is gonna be a um really a fantastic journey, and I think you're gonna look forward to it, and I look forward to it, and I look forward to picking up that oar and helping us move that shit. Get on the oars, let's go. Let's go. Let's go. You got one guy missing. What happens? That's uh you go in circles, right? You need to go in circles at the store you started from. So uh yeah, I get it. And but that's okay. That's all right. We get it.

SPEAKER_01 33:56

We we just uh and just by looking at other bull podcasts that you've done and the and the different uh professionals from varied industries that you've talked to about it just shows the breast of who this touches, where this goes, and where it's gonna go. You've just barely touched the tip of the iceberg already, but you've done a good job.

SPEAKER_00 34:18

It sure doesn't feel like work. I can say nowadays I do get tired some. But it doesn't feel like work. And, you know, up to then on some of those jobs, you know, it's not uh, you know, I think to start something it's hard enough. But you're starting something, starting your journey. It can sometimes knock you on your butt for a minute or two, but you get right back up, get in your truck, cry, cry on the side of the road, get back in your truck and come into work the next day and keep it going. So uh it's gonna be great. And and uh I hope it doesn't feel like work for you either.

SPEAKER_01 34:55

So you know it's um it's exciting, it's magical, and it's it's like you've said, different characters every day, different problems, different teaching. And and that's really what what we want to do, and and what what I pride myself on my previous manufacturing you know journey of being the subject matter expert in teaching and being able to bring up the next operators, the next estimators, the next project managers. And I look forward to taking that same step with with deploying the system lasers that I'm purchasing and working with you guys to help um help establish that that regional framework where I'm sitting in the middle and you guys have the coast covered, and um and really working together to best implement um your vision and also the vision that all the other really skilled people inside of System Lasers brings, you know, from Aaron to you know to everybody, Amy to Darren to everybody like that. It's it's really good.

SPEAKER_00 35:59

Well, Ryan, I think you're gonna be a leader in this industry if we keep working hard enough, long enough. Well, no, wait, wait, wait, brother. We got it. Yeah, no, I look forward to it. Thank you very much, sir. Good stuff. So thank you. Appreciate it.