Stage 3 Cancer, Divorce, and Financial Collapse… Then God Stepped In

What happens when cancer, financial collapse, and personal breakdown hit all at once? In this episode, Kim Stevens shares how a stage 3 breast cancer diagnosis during the 2008 market crash became the turning point that reshaped her life, faith, and business.

We explore entrepreneurship, discomfort, spiritual growth, and the power of integrity in leadership. Kim discusses trusting God, recognizing signs, prayer, meditation, and applying faith in real estate and everyday life. If you're navigating adversity, building a business, or seeking purpose, this conversation will challenge and inspire you.

TIMESTAMPS: 

00:00 Meet Kim Stevens

04:26 Real Estate Family Roots

07:28 Discomfort and Trusting God

10:52 Recovery and Breakdown

13:32 Finding the Lump

20:28 Structure With Magic

22:32 Integrity as Currency

28:42 Boundaries and Competency

31:36 Signs and Spiritual Laws

38:09 Mediums and Discernment

47:17 Encouragement Mission

53:11 Cancer as a Turning Point

59:52 Discernment in Business

01:01:43 Prayer Meditation Fasting

01:09:05 Spiritual vs Practical Healing

01:15:01 Desires Ego and Idolatry

01:23:11 Who Is Jesus

01:27:32 Rapid Fire Business Wisdom

01:29:45 Eagle Sign and Perspective

Transcript

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Can you walk us through what was going on in your mind? When did you find out? How did that happen? I got had stage three breast cancer. My marriage was really a mess. My kids were in trouble. My finances were a mess. The next day I'm in the shower and I'm like, maybe I should do a breast self-exam.

SPEAKER_00 0:16

I think I found a lump.

SPEAKER_01 0:18

And that's how I found it. Once I had the surgery, it was stage three. I had a complete breakdown physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, financially. I didn't want to give up and die. And then things just started happening. Doors started opening. How do you get through those times of discomfort? I said no to a lot of things because I had to say yes to myself. I'd be dead if I didn't have cancer. It was a gift to me. That's really a big part of how I look at everything. We donate 1% of our commission to a charity of our clients' choosing.

SPEAKER_02 0:51

What's one piece of wisdom that you can leave to the entrepreneurs listening?

SPEAKER_01 0:55

I offer unique perspectives to refresh, uplift, and empower the individual spirit. What do you want people to say about you at your funeral?

SPEAKER_02 1:06

I always remember like the concept, but very rarely do I remember the exact quote or or I struggle to even remember who said it. But I I read all the time, but I feel like I've read for sport, right? Where like, oh, it's part of personal development. You got to read a book a week or whatever and you've done that. Right, yeah. But then like to what end? You know, because I found that I'd read a book and then I wouldn't actually apply the information that I was reading, you know?

SPEAKER_01 1:30

Or maybe you're applying it and you don't even know you're like you're a subconscious guy. Yeah. Right? Absolutely, yeah. So maybe it's in there more than you think. You're not consciously, maybe, yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_02 1:43

Yeah, I've I've always been curious about the the learning process because as someone who's come from like subconscious reprogramming, and you probably speak this language too, for mindset purposes, it's like, well, we're learning things, programs from childhood, or even nowadays from from trauma, or heightened emotional events or teaching our brain different things, and this is leveraged through neuroplasticity. But what I've what I've come to find out is yes, there's probably some subconscious thing going on when we take an information, but also this active reading, right? It's like, okay, I'm gonna be intentional with this book, I'm gonna take notes on it, and then I'm gonna take one or two things and actually apply them in the physical world, right? That is my jam.

SPEAKER_01 2:21

Yeah, I love that. That is my jam, you know, is just uh it's great to know things, but if you don't have the ability to actually apply them, and it's very exciting to apply them and you know, see how it goes and get real experience to back the theory is just super cool.

SPEAKER_02 2:43

And so many people like focus on the information. And we and but when you look at like knowledge is important, wisdom is important, but that's the application of information. You just said apply the knowledge or apply the information. Yeah. I know every host on a podcast says that they're excited to see their guests, but I really am because as we were talking before the show, we have a lot of uh synergy, a lot of things that are gonna overlap that we probably haven't even teased out uh prior to this. Um, but I'm here with uh Kim Stevens, and this is our first time meeting in person, but I've heard a lot about you because of uh the podcast studio here. They've done a lot a lot of work with you. Um, you know, on this podcast, it's interesting. This has been um a new creation of mine and with the help of Bryce and the team here uh to focus on business specifically, um, but also as it relates to uh faith and some of the supernatural things that happen in our life and in our businesses. You know, I come from more of a new age background. Um, I'm I've been labeled as a professional hypnotist. I've done subconscious reprogramming. I rose to TikTok fame because of practical manifestation advice. Um and I saw a lot of the things that you post about and your videos talk about things like energy and manifestation and potential. Um, and so my hope is today we'll have a conversation about the crossroads of all that. Like where does faith meet um, you know, manifestation, or where does um belief in a higher power meet our own personal practical business uh endeavor? Um, so I'm happy to have you here because you're I know you're a wealth of information. You have nearly three decades in in real estate, if I if I recall correctly, which means you're an expert in leadership, you're an expert in teams, I'm sure you're an expert in culture. Um, I know that's the big thing um that you talk about. So let's start there. Take me back to the real estate because I'm actually I got my real estate license when I was 18. My mom was a broker for a long time. Um, so what got you into it in the first place?

SPEAKER_01 4:36

Uh my family was in real estate. My uncle had a brokerage up in the Adirondacks uh in Old Forge, New York. Oh, yeah. And so it was not a planned thing. But my um husband at the time and I had a commercial building that we bought on foreclosure. My mom did mortgages, my dad was selling new home construction. And uh we were like, we should open a real estate business. Yeah. Very not planned at all. What year was this? 1995. Oh wow.

SPEAKER_02 5:09

So it was it was it was boob booming back then, right?

SPEAKER_01 5:11

Yeah, I mean, it was. I mean, we were just like my mom and dad and I, my brother, you know, that's how it all started.

SPEAKER_02 5:17

So all of you doing real estate at the same time.

SPEAKER_01 5:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:19

That's cool. What was that like to be working with family?

SPEAKER_01 5:23

It was great. We didn't know what the hell we were doing, which was okay, you know. Um, yeah, it was great. It was, it was um, we were creating something together, and I loved that. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 5:37

There's something special about working with family. I'm an only child, right? So I've never had the the privilege of, you know, I see Bryce and Morgan here working together side by side. There's something really special about that that you can't you can't create in just a friendship or a partnership outside of family. But I have seen um in my own life with extended family or or business ventures, even with close friends, that you learn some hard lessons about working with people close to you, right? So was there any uh hard lesson you had to learn from from working with the family?

SPEAKER_01 6:06

Uh yes. Yes. There was a time when um my mom and dad retired and um I kind of took over. And it was a little dicey at that point, just navigating that transition and uh, you know, them relinquishing, you know, what wasn't gonna serve them anymore, and me saying, but this is what I want, you know, and I I do want to move forward and I want to do it in a way that's maybe a little different than we did it before. So I was gaining a little autonomy in myself. And so navigating that was a little tricky. It was tricky, but we did it.

SPEAKER_02 6:48

It's uncomfortable to leave the comfort zone, right? Yes. I I know when I was involved in my mom's brokerage, I had these ideas to these new commission structures and whatnot, because we've we've seen that over the past, especially the past 10 years. It's seemingly a race to the bottom. And this happens in a lot of industries where like you're cutting commissions and you're finding new fee structures and whatnot. And some of it's useful, some of it's not. But I remember bringing it to her team and her. And we had she had like 20 agents at the time who were in their like 50s and 60s, and they were very set in their ways. And it was all instant no's to the ingenuity and to these creative ideas. And my point here is that it's tough to break the mold of someone's comfort zone. What do you do when you're feeling uncomfortable, specifically in business? Because I imagine as an entrepreneur, someone who's led teams, uh, there's been moments where you're like, Am I doing the right thing? What do I do? You know, maybe there's missing pieces of clarity or confidence. How do you get through those times of discomfort?

SPEAKER_01 7:46

Yeah, it has to do with God. Yeah. I mean, honestly, at the end of the day, is just uh trusting everything that I do that there's a higher power, name it what you will. Um, you know, I have my whatever version of that. And um I think yeah, trusting that and listening to that.

SPEAKER_02 8:07

Um what are you listening to specifically when you say I'm listening to a higher power?

SPEAKER_01 8:13

I don't know. I I want to go like this. Um, you know, some arightness, you know, even or um it's even maybe it's quiet or it's strong, even if it's not loud. It's um this is gonna be really hard, but it's the right thing to do.

SPEAKER_02 8:33

If I remember correctly, you had a a quote on another podcast that it's not it's happening for you, not to you. Right. And actually, here's the like what's the actual quote?

SPEAKER_01 8:43

Well, that's what it is. Yeah, if things aren't happening to me, they're happening for me, or life isn't happening to me. Life is happening for me. Like the next like iteration or version of that is life is happening through me. Well, I really like that, you know, as like the next version of that or the higher level of um engaging with life is that wow, this is happening through me.

SPEAKER_02 9:06

Um you're a conduit. Yes. Yeah, a conduit for what specifically? When you say life's working through you, what does that mean?

SPEAKER_01 9:16

A conduit, uh, you know, for God. Um I think ultimately the highest version of that would be that I think I call in certain scenarios, situations, but I also believe there's a highest version or best grandest vision of what it can be. And if I remain open to the guidance, the communication, however that comes. Sometimes it feels like words. Sometimes it's just like, oh, I should say this, or sometimes it's like, don't say anything, you know, um, that I can be a conduit to the highest version of what a scenario can be. I can be a a goodness there, or a a voice of reason, or an illumination, or uh guidance, or a something.

SPEAKER_02 10:13

Yeah. Well, we see in the Bible the truth shall make you free. And that's that's what's I'm reminded of. You're kind of working towards this truth, right? Of goodness and all that. It feels really good.

SPEAKER_01 10:23

You know, it's it's really uh, you know, we talk often in like in recovery, in the recovery circles about God's will and my will. I think they're actually both the same. I really do. And so that feels really cool when I'm in that, when I know that, you know, it's um it's a dance, it's a synchronistic dance between, you know, what I want and what God wants for me or from me.

SPEAKER_02 10:52

Where did you find God? Was it in recovery? And and I I'm not sure I know the full details of it. So tell me what when you say recovery, what what was going on?

SPEAKER_01 10:59

Well, um, it started with Al-Anon, really.

SPEAKER_02 11:03

You know, it's interesting. My wife's grandmother was a big speaker for Al-Anon. Um uh Carol uh Cooney. Do you know the name of Carol Cooney? I don't know. She would travel all over the country uh speaking um for Al-Anon, actually. Yeah, yeah. So so anyway, sorry, go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 11:20

Yeah, so I mean, listen, I had a complete, you know, breakdown physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually, financially, you know, as happens to us sometimes, you know. Like I love Joseph Campbell and the hero's journey. And, you know, are you gonna change what you're doing? And we get a call. That's what he says, a call to the adventure, you know, a call, and that was my call, you know. Um felt like I was just living my life for everybody else. And um when was this? Take me back to the the settings. This was back in like the real, like 2007, eight, nine. I got had stage three breast cancer, just all my marriage was really a mess. My kids were in trouble, my finances were a mess. You know, I mean, I'm a real estate broker, and some of my commercial real estate was in foreclosure. It didn't foreclose, but it was a it was a time in my life when it was like you got to do something differently. And I was introduced to that fellowship and that program, and that really changed everything for me.

SPEAKER_02 12:24

You said breast cancer, you were diagnosed at the same time.

SPEAKER_01 12:27

This was around stage three in 2007, stage three breast cancer. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:32

This is prior to business going down, right?

SPEAKER_01 12:34

This because or was this well, it was in in the conjunction, if you know about real estate. Yes, exactly. So it was all I don't know, it's a mis mishmosh for me a little bit. It just felt like boom, boom, boom, boom, you know.

SPEAKER_02 12:47

I remember that time because um my mom owned a brokerage and my dad was a real estate attorney. And all of a sudden they're selling their cars, selling the boat, right? And I I I was very blessed to be brought up in in um not wanting to want anything or need anything, right? We got to go on nice vacations, like I said, they had a boat, lake house, and all of a sudden they start stripping those things away because of the 2008 market crash, right? So you have that on top of stage three breast cancer, which another synchronicity we have here is um my mother got diagnosed with breast cancer back in 2019. Um, stage one, though, thankfully they found it soon. Okay, you know, hasn't come back. But I want to double-click into that because I saw what it did to her, her mental state, um, and how it stretches someone mentally, emotionally, physically. So can you walk us through what was going on in your mind? Maybe even like when did you find out? How did that happen? Did you go in through a routine exam? And so what happened?

SPEAKER_01 13:41

Not even close to that. I had been getting mammograms for many years because um my couple of my great aunts had breast cancer. So I probably got was screened earlier than they recommend, but that's not how I found it. Here's how I found it. My best friend, who I hadn't seen in many years, called me up one Friday night and said, Hey, me and her partner Kelly want to come see you. I was so excited, I hadn't seen her in a while, and I said, Okay, that's terrific. And the next day she called me. Now, we hadn't spoken in quite some time uh for a variety of reasons, busy mostly. Uh, and she said, I'm sorry, but you know, we're not gonna come. You're not gonna believe this. But Kelly has breast cancer. So we talked through it, and I said, Oh my god, how did she find it? And um she said, She did a breast self-exam. That's how she found it. And so the reason this is important is because she probably never would have told me we hadn't spoken in such a stretch of time that they would have probably gone on and done their whole thing and I wouldn't have known about it. So she tells me this the next day.

SPEAKER_00 14:48

I'm in the shower and I'm like, maybe I should do a breast self-exam.

SPEAKER_01 14:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:52

I'm like, I think I found a lump.

SPEAKER_02 14:56

And that's how I found it. Did you were were you instantly scared at the time? Or like what was it, what went through your head when you feel that?

SPEAKER_01 15:02

I'll tell you the truth of what I felt was um I don't remember how I felt the when I found the the lump, but my life was so I couldn't figure it out. Like I couldn't figure out how to get it right or do it right. I was trying really hard to do the right things and be a good mom and be, you know, all the things, and I just wasn't. Um and so it felt like a way for me to check out is really like where my mental state was. It was like, okay, I don't even know how to do this life right now, and this would be a good excuse for me to check out of it.

SPEAKER_02 15:40

It probably felt like it was the most certain thing. Like, okay, well, this is it. Yeah, kind of. That that is how it felt. Sometimes certainty is comfortable even when it's traumatic. Exactly.

SPEAKER_01 15:51

And at the time they thought I had stage one breast cancer. Once I had the surgery, it was stage three. And then I was like, Yeah, I don't want to check out. That isn't really what I want. And I heard save your own life, Kim. I heard these words, and it was like that was a turning point for me. So when you say you s you heard these, like audibly, you heard I heard in my head or somewhere around my head save your own life, Kim.

SPEAKER_02 16:20

And where were you when that happened?

SPEAKER_01 16:21

Were you in a hospital or I was in the doctors um when they told me it's stage three. It's not, I mean, I knew it was getting bad because I knew it had already spread to my lymph nodes. Um but it was in that doctor's office when they told me it was stage three, that it was like, yeah, I don't want to check out.

SPEAKER_02 16:39

Yeah. I love that because, you know, if we're if I'm speaking right now to like a let's say a Christian audience, right? It's like God saves us, right? That's kind of the overarching theme, especially of the Bible, right? Jesus died for our sins. But like I think what Christians miss a lot, or anybody who just believes in God is they miss the personal agency we have. And so God was God was like talking to your personal agency, right? Like, of course, God can save you, God can heal, but also we have a we have a say. We are like the practical means sometimes to a supernatural end. And I think that's what he was communicating, right? And I think too many, specifically Christians are like timid in this and like, oh, it's all glory to God. Of course it's all glory to God, but you have a you have a part, you know, you're playing a part. Oh, I just love that you're saying this. I just so it's so what did that mean to you when it when he tells you to save your some w whatever that was coming from?

SPEAKER_01 17:29

Well, I don't know what it meant. It just meant I I had a change of heart, like I didn't want to give up and die, and you know, and then you know, um things just started happening. Doors started opening. I got involved in a cancer wellness program, uh, I started doing yoga and Reiki, and then I just was doors opened, I met people, I was led here and there, and you know, all the places that I was supposed to go. But I had to be willing to do that to your to your point of agency in it. You know, I I had to say yes to things, which meant saying no to other things, yeah, which was important for me at the time to set boundaries. And no, I can't. I often say like it was like, no, I'm not giving you money and no more smoking pot in the house, and no, no, this and no that, and no, you know, I said no to a lot of things because I had to say yes to myself. And that was a a shift in the dynamic of understanding that my own self-care is really the best thing that I can do for everybody else.

SPEAKER_02 18:36

Yeah, it's like uh what do they say when you're going down an airplane, put the mask on yourself first, right? And I think, you know, it's a fine line between like self-righteousness and also being conscientious of the people in the world around you. I think the spectrum is like, okay, we have these these people-pleasing tendencies and we become yes people and we constantly are self-sacrificial, right? And then we have the other end, which is like pride and arrogance and too focused on self. And there is a happy medium, right? So do you do you feel like you went in the total opposite direction? Because it sounded like you were giving everything before this time, right? Yeah. Did you feel a certain way about it? Like, how did you feel? Like, or were you like, yes, you felt confident in in taking care of oh no. No. Did you feel guilty at all? Like, oh, perpetually. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:22

Yeah, perpetually guilty. You know, this is where like the people in my life helped me, you know, and support me and you know, the and in setting those boundaries or saying those no's or um that kind of thing. It wasn't one big fell swoop. It was lots of little steps in a better direction.

SPEAKER_02 19:42

Yeah. And I, you know, this also makes you want to pause to tell people who are listening to check themselves. Um, my mom was a big advocate for that after she, although I don't she didn't feel a lump. I think she went in for a standard mammogram and they found it. Um, but then she became an advocate for obviously the awareness, going in and getting those those uh imaging and whatnot. And then also my dad had text uh testicular cancer that came through, he noticed it through self-examination, and most guys don't check themselves like that enough either. Um, and I think it's important to have a little PSA here to check it. I'm sure people are like, I don't want, I don't want anything to happen, but it's better you find out now than you know, most of the time it is benign, right? But better safe than sorry. Yeah, for sure. Yes. So I want to I want to switch gears to to leadership because you have some experience or a lot of experience in teams. And I know that you mentioned, I think I read on your website that structure with a healthy dose of magic is kind of a key element to the leadership style and and team building. Um people are gonna be curious when they hear that. What is that what does that mean practically?

SPEAKER_01 20:53

No, it's funny. I was thinking about that when I was driving here, and um I was thinking about really you and what you do and really the hypnosis piece. And um, so there's a it's not like magic, but it's kind of like magic, right? So this hypnosis and that you can really reprogram and you know, there's so many whatever elements to that, magical, if you will. But it doesn't work if you're not gonna do it every day. And there's so there's a certain amount of I I found practices, habits, structure, you know, that supports these other endeavors. Um, you know, so um I just I really I believe in that balance of that. I love sacred geometry and the idea that there's an underlying, you know, or underlying um structure um mathematical. You know, what is it? Web, I guess, maybe, of everything. You know, so the peacocks, beautiful, colorful, is there's a structure behind that. So I think for me, it's um creating a culture where we're very um expressive and collaborative, and I do wellness circles and you know, we do all that kind of stuff. And we also have, you know, structured meetings and creative time and you know, and that kind of stuff. So yeah.

SPEAKER_05 22:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:31

And I know you're it was your grandfather who's big on integrity and ethics, right? I look at integrity and synonymous with trust, obviously, uh, as like a spiritual currency, you know. Um, we build up the currency of trust spiritually, you know, and I do believe these things are like substances, like a faith, like faith is a substance. Um, and when you act in integrity with yourself, with your team, with your customers, you're then building up trust that you then have a transfer of with future customers and clients and people. Oh, I love that the way you're explaining that.

SPEAKER_01 23:07

It's like I never thought of it that way.

SPEAKER_02 23:08

It's like in real estate, no one's someone's not gonna list their house with you if they don't trust that you're gonna deliver on being able to sell their house for the highest price, right? And you build that trust through explaining your expertise, through referrals, through um anecdotal uh testimonies from previous clients, but that's actually storing up trust that you then exchange for dollars, you know? Oh so talk to me about integrity. What is that what does that mean? Because I think people have different, and this goes back to like this sometimes it's selfish, sometimes it's like I'm not advocating to to be integral to get something, but I do know that there's an exchange of like reciprocity when you are integral with yourself and the world around you. So what does in what does integrity mean to you? Is it practical? Is it spiritual? Is it a bit of both? I I think a lot of it is um walking the walk.

SPEAKER_01 23:59

A lot of it is that for me. I'm not just espousing things without actually being able to do and make those hard decisions and and do the uncomfortable thing and all of that. So um I think it's a, you know, there's a certain integrity that I feel or know, or something like that, you know, or maybe a character uh asset that how I want to be. And then integrity is the actual doing it, acting with character, acting with integrity when it's, you know, it's easy to do when it's easy to do. It that's doesn't, I don't think that builds the currency that you're speaking of as the the hard times when, you know, you're you know, you're worried about what somebody thinks, or you know, those kind of things that really do um, you know, people operate from that one unknowingly, but to be able to do the thing of integrity when somebody's gonna look at you and think, oh, you know, whatever they're gonna think, you know, those are the times. So I don't know if I'm answering your question.

SPEAKER_02 25:08

Yeah, no, no, certainly. Um, my question that always comes up about integrity is like, where does that integrity come from? Where does this moral compass come from? I mean, for me, I I wholeheartedly believe in God, specifically the God of the Bible and objective morality that points to a creator that would have to create those laws around integrity and trust and and uh and doing good. Um, where does your sense of integrity come from? Is it is it from childhood because you were around people like your grandfather and you witnessed integrity? Is it a divine code, you know, if you will? Where where does like your where does Kim's moral compass come from?

SPEAKER_01 25:44

Probably a little of both. I mean, um my grandfather's, you know, my one in particular because he was an executive and a businessman and you know, um for sure. Um but I think too maybe my own spiritual base or it's God for me, too. Um I try not to look at things so right and wrong. I really try to, I I feel like that's that pendulum, you know, of pleasing everybody, pleasing nobody, you know, like that kind of thing. So um I like rules, but what I found is when my friend Dave would say, getting to Gray, that, you know, there I guess there are some laws, some rules, but integrity to me is being connected enough to myself or my connection to God to know in each circumstance what's right to do. Because sometimes I think things that look wrong are right. I don't know. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:01

Yeah, it's it's it's it's a difficult conversation because you're right, some things that are that look wrong are right, right? And vice versa. There's some things that we do that we think are right that are wrong. Um, I do I do think there's, like I said, I think there's an objective morality, meaning there is objectively things that are evil and things that are objectively good. Now the line is difficult, right? Sometimes if we're not talking about like big T tragedy, trauma type things, you know, um, but there's the day-to-day evil that we lie, we cheat, we steal, and sometimes at a at a micro level, sometimes at a macro level. Yes, yes, yes. You know, um, but I think I think correct me if I'm wrong, one of the things that you're pointing to is it is that connection to God and also your own practical compass that you've learned from the people and world around you that creates this uh code of integrity for yourself. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:53

Yeah, yeah. Because, you know, like one of the things that, you know, speaking of uh, you know, like let's just go to people pleasing, approval seeking, you know, that kind of thing, and setting boundaries, that can seem mean, hard, you know, you're supposed to be selfless and and that does come, but there are times when helping somebody isn't helping them. It's hurting them, it's enabling them, it's you know, so those kind of integrity decisions that really are um are best for someone is to not continue to give.

unknown 28:34

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:35

You're enabling them, right? If you You're enabling them. So understanding that is can be tricky.

SPEAKER_02 28:41

Yeah, we see this a lot in relationships, right? Marriages God knows marriage isn't easy. Um, it's not all rainbows and butterflies after the after the I do's. Um did you have times in your marriage that you felt either boundaries were crossed, you crossed boundaries, and then what was the transition into like sticking up for yourself? And I don't want, I don't want it doesn't have to get too personal where like you paint you or your husband as good or bad. But I mean, like when when did this self-care start playing a role specifically in your relationship? And or have you seen it in other relationships, maybe not with your own? But talk to me about this whole idea of boundary setting, saying no, enabling others, maybe you felt enabled at times. Talk to me about that.

SPEAKER_01 29:29

I think it happened all at the same time with the whole cancer thing, really, and just starting to move in another direction and starting to learn and gain an understanding of um you know, that stopping someone from hurting you is good for them too.

SPEAKER_02 29:46

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 29:47

I didn't get that. Yeah, I didn't understand that. I really didn't. I had things like completely backwards. And so for me, I I I talk about this frequently because this this is my um, you know, journey, and I think many of us, but it's there's the um four stage of stages of competency, unconscious incompetence. Like, I don't even know what the hell I'm doing, I don't know what's what. That's where I was. Then I become consciously incompetent, like, oh, I don't know what I'm doing. Then you become consciously competent. Oh, this is the chunky piece, like, oh, I have to, oh, that's right. This isn't good. I need to set a boundary, you know, and then because it becomes unconsciously competent, where it's just a little more natural. So to answer your question, that's what it was like for me was okay, yeah, this thing that's going on isn't good. I'm scared to say no. I'm afraid that someone's gonna be hurt or be mad or say I'm selfish or, you know, all the things. But it's integrity is teaching me that I need to do this thing. I need to be comfortable with being uncomfortable. And I have support doing it, and then doing it, that you spoke of this in the very beginning. Can I actually do the thing that I'm reading about and learning about? Can I actually say no to somebody who I love? Well, that's a big deal. And spiritual, for me, spiritual experiences I call it like practical magic. Many of my spiritual experiences aren't the big woo-woo stuff. It's the actually saying no to somebody I love because this feels like integrity for me and and what comes of that.

SPEAKER_02 31:36

I I've heard you say the word magic a couple of times. When you say the word magic, does that refer to practical mindset and kind of our brain processing ability? Does it refer to energy? Does it refer to spirituality or something else?

SPEAKER_01 31:54

I think is really what it is. Uh it's, I mean, I guess what I really think it it's it's not really magic. It's the ways, it's the laws of the universe. Okay, the laws of God or the universe or or what gravity is a law in the same way that a spiritual right, but there's a lot of things that feel magical, you know, signs. You know, they they feel like magical, but they're they're kind of not. It's just this, I believe this is how the universe works. Yeah. I mean, honestly, just like me sitting here with you is one of them for me, you know, just there's a lot of connection there. Like, how did that happen? I don't know, because it feels magical, but it just these uh, you know, that those vibrations are drawn to each other, like string theory.

SPEAKER_02 32:43

So when you say magic, it's different. I had I had a guest on the podcast recently, a good friend of mine, Brian, um, in the episode actually should be out already by the time people listen to this one. Um, but he talked about like black magic and white magic, which is like actual kind of alchemy and and and spells and incantations and things like that. That's not really what you're referring to. You're referring to kind of the magic of life.

SPEAKER_01 33:03

Yeah, like the magic of life and like the magic of life and removing, you know, we talk about um removing the blocks to the sunlight of the spirit. So I believe there's all these beautiful magical things happening all the time, but we're blocked to them, we're blind to them, you know. Um, and so removing that to actually witness the beauty, the magic of life is really what I'm talking about.

SPEAKER_02 33:30

I'm a big believer in signs too. Um, I believe wholeheartedly. We see this, you know, I always go back to the Bible because I've I've I've gone through this, this um, this arc of like being involved in manifestation and it got a little woo-woo, got a little occult-y, a little new age-y. And, you know, I was brought up Catholic, but I always say I was Catholic like Olive Garden's Italian, you know, I just like went to Catholic school, didn't really know what it meant to believe in God. As I got like quote unquote social media famous for these topics, and I started achieving quote unquote success in my own life, I realized there was still a big gap. There was still a big hole, right? I realized I could have money without wealth, I could have sex and dates without love, I could have resources without abundance. Um, and so for me, I realized, oh, this is as much a spiritual game as it is a physical game. And where I felt there was a disconnect was that I was teaching things for practical success, even though manifestation and things like that can feel very woo-woo on the surface. To me, it was very like a cause and effect. It's like, okay, you want something, a certain amount of money. Well, what do you believe about money? What do you believe about yourself? What are those programs that are running? Because those are what's affecting your behavior and how you interact with money and how you interact with money is going to dictate how much money you have or don't have. Like very simple cause and effect. But like I said, it blurred the lines. And so over the past few years here, I've been going through this journey of looking into the real spiritual side. And to me, I went back to my roots of Christianity. And when I started looking into the Bible, which I had put off for a long time, because I was like, oh, that's, you know, typical arguments used to control people. There's so much uh there's murder, and God's evil and he does evil things and whatever, like all these arguments that maybe a non-Christian would have. As I looked into it, I realized everything I was talking about spiritually without God was there. And so all the things I was teaching were divorced from God. It was like there was so much man in the manifestation. There was so much self-ish, it was materialism, it was greed, it was all these things. Now that's not what I'm saying you're talking about here, but I'm just kind of bridging the gap. And that's the whole purpose of this Creator and Co-podcast is to bridge the gap from the people who are like reliant on self, reliant on these spiritual technologies outside of God, outside of our creator. So I I'm just qualifying this because I know when listeners specifically for this podcast, when they hear the word magic or even hear that I do hypnosis, they flinch, right? God forbid I tell my like Catholic grandmother, like really what I do, you know? She'd be like, What are you talking about? You know, make me cluck like a chicken, you're talking to spirits. It's not that. So that brings me to my question. Here is the signs that you've experienced. I remember I and I want you to tell me about the the bald eagle because I saw a video about that. Um, the signs that you experience, are there are they something that happened frequently? And then also I want to know like the big signs that you've had in your life, specifically the bald eagle story. So talk to me first, does it happen frequently? Do they happen all the time? And you just have to know where and how to look. And then if so or if not, what was that bald eagle experience?

SPEAKER_01 36:35

Yeah, I think they're there all the time. I think that, you know, that's really what I think when we speak about like Eckhart Tolley talks about the present moment. And to me, that's where it all lies, you know, easier said than done, remaining present. But um when I'm able to do that, the signs come, uh, whether that's, you know, noticing something, you know, it doesn't have to be an exterior, you know, it can be an internal sign or an intuition that comes by ease and being in the present moment. Um, and I love, so I'm just gonna tell you this crazy ass thing. So um I'm I'm I love this Laura Lynn Jackson. I don't know if you know of her. She's a medium, and um, she wrote this book. I think it's called, um, it might be called Guided or Illuminated or something like that. Um, and she talks about how you can ask for signs from whomever, right? So my father passed away a few years ago, and um, so I I just was like, well, let me just try this out. And so I said, Don't pop, I want a white feather. So the other night I'm sitting at the in the kitchen and I'm in my bathrobe, and I feel this point in my pocket of my bathrobe, like this point. It was the end of a feather, and I went like this, and like a goose-down feather uh came out. So, so yes, I do have I do have those. Interesting.

SPEAKER_02 38:09

Yeah, yeah. I'm gonna stay off the topic of of mediums because I have my own, my own, my own stories of my own. Okay. And and I and not and not for any other reason than my my own personal opinion is gonna be different than yours, right? And mine based on my biblical understanding. I've had experiences with media, I've been to mediums before. Um, I'll tell you one quick story about a medium that I went to. My uncle killed himself in 2010. My family was big into mediums and psychics at the time. We go uh to my mom's house. I was in college at the time. I come home at her house, and she says she has a medium on the phone to talk to us. Her name was Georgia. I I don't remember where she was from. She didn't know I was there. She just thought she was talking to my mother and my grand, my my grandmother. It's on speakerphone. Long story short, there's grandparents coming through, yada, yada, yada. Eventually she says she sees this male figure and describes my uncle to a T, tattoos. He was a personal trainer, he was 6'8, like all these different things. And uh all of a sudden he goes, or she goes, he wants to say hi to Tony, right? Now I have an uncle Tony who he was very close with, another uncle. And so my mom was like, Oh, uh, well, my uncle Tony um was very close to him. And she goes, No, how about the one in the room, like referring to me as Anthony? But no one ever called me Tony. And uh obviously I start crying because I'm like, oh, I feel this connection to my uncle, like there's some closure there. You know, as I've gotten um more understanding of specifically scripture, Old Testament, New Testament, some of the spiritual side of things, my mind has flipped on where that source is. And the reason I wanted to tiptoe around this is because I don't want to discredit your experience and I don't want to offend you in any way, especially when you're communicating with your dad, seemingly, and gives you a sign. My understanding, and I want to talk about unseen forces like demons and angels and stuff, which can be a little esoteric to people, is the fact that is it our loved ones that we're seeing or communicating with in heaven, or as I understand it now, there's these spirits around us, right? Good and bad, and some we might call a familiar spirit, who've always been there, who observe our lives, observe our families, and therefore can transmit information that's not necessarily the loved one. This is why I'm cautious with it, because it's hard to validate the source, right? So I guess my question would be to you is when you talk about these spiritual occurrences, do you believe that there's spiritual entities or unseen forces at play moving these things around? Or do you think it's like direct to direct to God or direct to your loved one?

SPEAKER_01 40:46

I know that was a lot. Yeah, that was a lot, but um it's I don't think I really make a big analyzation of it. Yeah. To me, it's uh you know, like what would be called maybe like a God wink, like okay, thanks. You know, just thanks a kind of thing. I don't, I don't know. It's just it's a guidepost, maybe is what it is.

SPEAKER_02 41:12

Yeah, and I think to clarify too, this is a little, I don't know if nerdy is the right word when it comes to like biblical things, but you know, we see um uh characters in the Bible talk to people who have passed, right? But the difference between like mediumship or like necromancy of like communicating with the dead, you're not supposed to use it for like divination or or the the future. You're not supposed to get information from them that's supposed to like dictate your future. So I think that's like we're supposed to go straight to God is kind of the the moral of the story.

SPEAKER_01 41:44

Yeah, and I buy that because honestly, I believe we're creative and I I don't really believe in the whole future, you know, telling thing. I just because I that would take away all my agency, and I don't like that.

SPEAKER_02 41:57

Well, and that that's the thing, agency is I tell people who have I I went to psychics when I was younger, like I'd more than I care to admit. Um, but all it takes is 99% truth and 1% fabrication to like steer you 100% off course. To steer some. Some, right? But that most people, when you go to a psychic or a medium, one, there's usually an emotional deficit that you're going there with because you want that closure, you want that connection. And there's an authority, right? When you go to the psychic or the medium, you're influenced by that. And it can be difficult because if they're not infallible, which they're not, no one's infallible as a human perspective. Oh, they tell you not to get on the airplane, or they tell you, hey, you're gonna date this guy, not that guy. You know, they're they're having a major influence, whether it's divinely orchestrated or not, they're having an influence on your life. And my my antidote for that is you have the agency, you have the ability to go to God and do that yourself. So can you talk to me about that?

SPEAKER_01 42:54

Like where like well, yes, I I I agree with you a hundred percent on all that. And I think any, you know, the the person that I'm speaking of, um, they will say, You don't need me. You don't need me, you know, you don't need me to go to God or or whatever else you want to go to. So Okay. Well, thank you for being open and honest about that.

SPEAKER_02 43:13

I know that's always you know, these are touch, touchy subjects, especially, you know, I keep qualifying this as Christian, but that's who the primary audience is. And it's primarily people, Christian entrepreneurs, who probably have dabbled in the things that we're talking about. And then question is like, is this good? Is this evil? Is this biblical? Is it not? My understanding is that most of the things we're talking about, whatever the label is, it's all kind of spiritual truth that's been perverted or taken away from the the purview of God, right? I think we have a power and authority um under God that we can do these things. I mean, you even see in the Bible a donkey talking to a man, right? There's animal communication, right? There's things that you might even label as astral projection in the Bible. And now I don't want to get a bunch of comments about this, it's open to a can of worms. But my point is, I think there's so much more overlap than we tend to give credit for. Back to the science thing, real quick. I want to hear the the the eagle story, but I'm going to tell you mine first because it we talked about this uh woodlock pines in in the Poconos, which is pretty popular. I I always talk to people, especially in the Northeast here. They all know it, right? Yes. We went there as a family for nearly three decades. I went there from the time I was nine months old and every single summer until the time I was in well into my 20s. My great-grandfather used to pay for everybody back when it was less expensive to do so. My whole family would go, and he would had he had cancer back. I was probably seven or eight years old. And we're driving to Woodlock Pines in the Poconos on Pennsylvania from New York. And my grandmother's in the front seat, and her sister, my great aunt, is in the driver's seat, and I'm in the back seat. And I remember looking up outside, and like the rays of sun are just like it's like supernatural. It's like out of a movie, it was cinematic, you know? And I see something going up, right? I see like what look like an angel or something going up. And my aunt at the time sees the same thing, and she goes, Oh, it looks like someone's coming down from heaven. I go as this little seven-year-old, I say, No, someone's going up. We drive to the resort two days later, we wake up, we're at the dining room table, like the thing. My other aunt comes and takes us into like this back office and tells us that um my great-grandfather had died that night. And I'm like, you can't there, there was no making that up. There, like this is before I knew anything. I'm not, I'm seven years old. Um, and so that was like one of the that was the first sign in my life of something spiritual. Um, so talk to me. What what is like, has there been a sign like that level where like there was no, there had to be a spiritual org uh orchestration, if you will?

SPEAKER_01 45:50

Well, I mean to to speak of the eagle story, you know, that was not not, I I don't feel like in the realm that you're talking about. It's more in what I'm talking about is um I think what I'm speaking about with that is my own interpretation. So one of the one of the things that I love is um where is it? It might be in a course in miracles where they talk about we all have our own curriculum.

SPEAKER_02 46:20

Or a process, it's like you have a revelation, and then there's a process of understanding that revelation and then applying it.

SPEAKER_01 47:03

Yeah, or even that it's you're on the right track, or you know, uh, yeah, keep going, or you know, even as simple as that, maybe as simple as that, you know, those um those serendipitous kind of things that happen.

SPEAKER_02 47:17

I love the word encouragement. It's actually a gift, it's a spiritual gift uh uh in the Bible. And I think people overlook this. It's powerful to be able to encourage somebody, you know? And you have you obviously have that gift. If you're if if you're a leader, if you're someone that helps people and you're coaching people, you obviously have a gift to to encourage. And sometimes it's just that one conversation or that one word that changes the trajectory of somebody's life. And that's the that's the supernatural power of encouragement. And you know, people always say, Oh, I want this type of gift, I want the gift of healing, or I want the gift of miracles. I'm like, the fact that you can encourage someone is a miracle, that can heal somebody, you know. So talk to me about encouragement because you seem like someone who's you seem you seem like a good encouraging leader, you seem charismatic. Does that play a role in how in your style of like in guiding people and coaching and building teams?

SPEAKER_01 48:05

Yeah, absolutely. Um, so when my before my dad died, this is going to be a long, a little bit of a long answer. I'll try to make it short, but um, he was actually struggling with the whole God thing. He uh was raised in Catholic school, and so he was, you know, reconciling. You know, he was he had um pancreatic cancer and it wasn't looking good. And so he said to me um one day, it was just everybody went to church, and I said, I'm gonna do whatever my father does. If he goes to church, I'm going with him. If he stays home, I'm staying with him. And we had this beautiful conversation, um, and he was kind of reconciling. He said, I think I have an expiration date. I hope that I did good. I hope I led a good life. And so we had a very open conversation, uh, much like this conversation about his own relationship, his own interpretation of God and all of that, and that maybe he could look at things a little differently than maybe how he was raised to look at them, you know, the sinning and the, you know, fire and brimstone and all of that. And so a couple days later, I checked in on him and he said, I'm thinking about that new perspective you gave me. It is refreshing, uplifting, and empowering all at once. So that has become my mission statement that I offer unique perspectives to refresh, uplift, and empower the individual spirit. And so I try to bring that no matter what I'm doing, a conversation with you, how I lead the people that I work with. Um, so you use the word encouragement, you know, empowerment, same idea. Um yeah, you've got it in you. You can do this, you know. Uh you'll find the way, you know, all of that. Yes, that's a big part of I think who I want to be.

SPEAKER_02 50:00

It brings up the word permission, right? So many people just need permission, you know. Yes, you know, and so when you have that encouragement, when you can empower someone and then you give them permission, like, hey, you can go do that thing. You can go post that video, you can go knock on that door. It's like it's like this simple but but crazy profound mechanism that occurs that actually motivates the person. And really, it's the self-belief, right? It's the it's when you give someone permission. Yeah, yeah. So, how important to you is self-belief and confidence? Like, you know, I still deal with doubt a lot. I mean, every time I get on, I put the camera on, I doubt. Every time I have a group call or I have uh a presentation, I doubt myself. But what I've found is it's the refractory period of the emotional state that comes because of the thought. I'm able to move past quickly, meaning I can think doubtful thoughts and the emotion no longer um activates as intensely or for as long. So I can have the thought, I can kind of feel some of the angst of the self-doubt, but now I've trained myself to recalibrate back to what the truth is and that, hey, it's I'm capable, I have experience, I've done this a million times, and I'm able to reorientate myself towards that truth. My question for you is where does doubt show up still, if if at all?

SPEAKER_01 51:18

Yeah, it definitely shows up. I don't know that there's anywhere in particular, but yeah, I mean, more than I would like to admit. But to your point, here's just a way of looking at it that I really like. When I'm unconscious about this stuff, then doubt is running me. I'm not even consciously aware of all the moves that I'm making that are doubtful or fearful or you know, all of that stuff. But like just how you articulated it, once you're aware of it, you know it, yeah, like, oh, I'm anxious. I had a little moment of anxiety when I brought up the medium there with you. I was like, I shouldn't have done that. That wasn't good. You know, I got a little bit of a I felt bad. Resistance, yeah, yeah. Yeah, exactly. Okay, so with that, what do I do? All right, God's with me. I didn't intentionally do something, you know, and and it's okay. And uh, and I'm good. So I guess now I feel like I can run it. It is not an unconscious thing that's happening with me. I am aware. Uh, you know, I'm using different words, but I think I'm saying exactly what you said. Yeah, I'm aware. Oh, I felt bad. I got a little anxious, I felt a little, you know, embarrassed or whatever. And yeah, and that's okay. And I can recover from that and I can onward.

SPEAKER_02 52:38

Yeah, you mentioned this word awareness, which is it's it's become a cliche, that word, but I always say cliches are cliche for a reason because they're true, and awareness is paramount. You know, I always give the analogy of a leak in the ceiling. It's like if you don't open up the ceiling and get to the exact point of the leak and fix that pipe, you can patch over the ceiling all you want. It's gonna come back and it's gonna be worse down the road. So, same thing with fear, doubt, anxiety. You ignore it for too long. Now you have sleep issues, you have general anxiety disorder, you get depression, breast cancer, physical ailments. Exactly. Yeah. Do you think that that your health issues were related in any way to emotional, spiritual causes? Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 53:18

A hundred percent.

SPEAKER_02 53:20

Can you talk talk about that?

SPEAKER_01 53:21

It was a gift to me because I think I just would have kept going down the same path without something stopping me in my tracks, something big. And I mean, I think there were probably a million other things that I just whatever. I always say that I'd be dead if I didn't have cancer. It was a gift to me. And that's really a big part of how I look at everything. Whatever is presented to me, there is an opportunity for me with God to what? View it in its best light. A lot of times it's leveling me up, you know, it's that divine discomfort that's asking me to be more than I want to be right now, or that I think I can be. On some level, I think I want it, or it wouldn't have been called in. But yeah, so, you know, I do think those things contributed to that. And it was a great gift in my life that shot me in another direction.

SPEAKER_02 54:19

And this is where, you know, I always now correlate things biblically because the things that you're saying, and like I said, I went through this journey of applause of applying what I found in the Bible to what I had applied in some other spiritual technologies and and education that I had was this idea that he works all things out for our good. Yes. And what's interesting, I want to take a uh pause here because people think good means our happiness or our joy. And I think God is on that side. He wants us to have joy, he wants us to have happiness, but that's not what he means when he says he works all things out for our good. The word good is actually tov. It's Hebrew for for good, which means a divine purpose. And so he's actually working these things out for a divine purpose, not just to make you happy, not just to put a smile on your face. That's kind of secondary to his divine purpose. And so, even the bad things, this is why he says to count all his joy, the trials, the tribulations, because one, it produces character, it teaches you patience, it builds your faith when you can look back retroactively and be like, oh, that's why that had to happen. But that's really difficult because I haven't, I've never been diagnosed with cancer. I don't know what it's like to be in a room with a doctor telling me that I have stage through cancer, I have to get surgery. So my question for you is where was God in those moments for you at that time? Because it had to be really scary, right? Like I know you I know there's some certainty around the diagnosis, and like, oh, well, I guess that's it. But like I imagine there's some nights where you were unable to sleep.

SPEAKER_01 55:43

Yeah, it was scary. Yes, it was. I guess maybe, you know, that Kim Save Your Own Life thing that was I heard that. I don't have a specific answer for you, except that all roads were leading to God, you know.

SPEAKER_02 56:02

Were you ever like crying out to him? That were you like, oh, God save, like, or was it as soon as you heard the save yourself, you really you had a confidence. Like, was there any point where you're like doubting it all?

SPEAKER_01 56:11

Like what was the I think it's it was a prayer for help, you know, just uh help. I don't know what I'm doing, I don't know how this is gonna go. I'm scared. I, you know, I I need help and I uh surrender. That's the word. A surrender of, you know, I'm trying to do it, my will of doing what I think is right and all of that, and I'm failing miserably at all of it. Uh I don't know what I'm doing. I need help.

SPEAKER_02 56:43

That that balance and that juxtaposition sounds like a paradox, right? To someone listening. It's like here God tells you to save yourself, but then there's also surrender. And that is exactly, I think, the message for people. It's like it's the posture of surrender, but also the understanding that you have a say and a play in it, right? You have a power and authority. You know, I I kind of thought of this model recently because I think God calls different people to one have different callings, but we all kind of have a similar purpose. But when he calls you, it's first under this, if we look at the acronym sent, right? Where's if if we're sent, here's here's kind of the the short framework for a Christian to live real life. One, it's surrender, right? It's having that posture of, you know what, God's will, God's bill, you know, it's the cliche. He, you know, if he's gonna bring me to it, he'll bring me through it, knowing that we have a creator who's on our side, but also being expectant, right? This is where faith comes in, E for expectant. It's like I expect miracles to happen. I expect that God is who he says he is, and he's gonna do with me what he said he was gonna do. And that truth to me, once again, going back to the Bible, I sound like a broken record here. I've read those truths so many times that I've programmed my mind with the identity that God has spoken over me. So I can expect that because he is who he says he is, I am who he says I am, and what's gonna happen is how he's said is gonna happen. That builds my faith. Then the end is navigate, right? So this navigation is our behavior, it's our action. We can't just sit back and hope and wish and pray from our cows. Because we've surrendered to his will, because we've expected that what's gonna happen is gonna happen. We then can take aligned action and navigate this scenario, our life. Um, and then ultimately, T is Thanksgiving, is like count it all as joy, be thankful for the cancer, be thankful for the the trial or the tribulation, but especially be thankful for the the blessings that we have. Yeah. So where does faith fall into all this? And what is faith to you?

SPEAKER_01 58:44

I guess just knowing it's all perfect and all is well. I mean, I think that really is what it is for me, because I do know that there's a miracle baked into everything, is the way I like to say it. It could look bad, but I just don't believe that about God and what is sent my way. I've got this business thing going on right now that it's just it's crazy. It's it feels like it's not right, and you know, all the things, but I guess I have faith, but I think I act in trust that, you know, even though this thing looks like it's going sideways, this is for my good. It has to be. There is no other way for me. There is no other way that God works in my life. And, you know, I think it's important, or it's been important for me to make that decision and continue to make that decision and trust. I mean, I have to repeatedly make the decision to trust God. So I have faith, but I think the trust piece is is walking it.

SPEAKER_02 59:52

So, what does that look like practically though? Like, how do you discern whether an opportunity is good or bad? Like, how do you decide what path to go down and practically in business? Like you have a decision of an idea that you want to bring to life or a client that you don't know if you should work with. Like what does that practical process look like of exercising that intuition and then making a decision?

SPEAKER_01 1:00:13

A lot of it is to pause. I need to pause oftentimes and try to discern what is going on with me. You know, is this me? Is it my fear or whatever? Am I being led? But I would say now there's, you know, a lot of it does have to do with a joy and a rightness, a right feeling about things. It's just like a rightness, you know, if I'm hyper anxious or I don't think that's the right thing. Now, there aren't times that I have to override that anxiety to do the right thing and be uncomfortable doing, but there's there's this sense of rightness that I have. I don't know what it what is it? I guess there's an inner calm. There's an inner calm that helps me navigate and see through whatever lies or you know, yeah, or whatever. I don't have like a real good, like a great process for you.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:17

It's a lot of intuition, it's a lot of well that's that's why I asked because that's the hardest part is like even if you're asking me, like, okay, how do you exercise your intuition or your discernment? It's it's very difficult to wrap it in a practical framework, you know, because it's like you know it. There's a knowing, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:01:34

Yeah, and I think remaining in conscious contact with God, yeah, you know, you just it gets easier and better and and feels right, and you know that brings up a good point too, that communication with God.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:47

If someone were to ask me, like, how do you increase your discernment? I look at it as one prayer, two, meditation, three for me reading the Bible, knowing what he's already said, uh, knowing his nature. If you can know his nature, you're gonna know when he communicates with you. Because I've also said previously that you don't often hear God, you discern him. You know, I've actually heard God once in my life audibly. I've not since heard him audibly in my life. It's always been a discernment of his voice, like a frequency, you know.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:17

Okay, yeah. So how the frequency word, that's I like that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:21

Yeah, I know I know you love the word. I heard you use the word frequency a couple times in your videos. So, how does one, let's say, increase their frequency or improve it or match it? Because here's the thing that I've also come to know God's always talking. It's like a radio station. I don't know if you down in Pennsylvania have K-104, but that's a popular radio station here. Okay. It's on right now. It's like in the airwaves, right? It's only when we tune into it through a uh a receiver, right, that we're able to pick up that signal and transmit it into information that we then hear sound. Same thing with God, God's speaking right now. Are we tuned into that frequency, right? Are we tuned into Him? So you mentioned communicating with Him. Where does prayer come in? Where does, if at all, meditation, um, what is that? What is the practical side of the spiritual to increase that communication?

SPEAKER_01 1:03:13

Yeah. So I I mean, I have the this is the um structure and magic piece that I there's a structure to the magic for me. You know, I get out of bed and I get right on my knees and pray. That's the first thing I do in the morning. Basically to be shown the way, to take away anything that of my stuff, my ego that might get in the way of my usefulness to you and my fellows, to take away my difficulties so that I can bear witness that of your victory over things, you know. So that that is my it's it's like a it's rote, but I try not to make it rote. But it's you know, it's a it's a prayer that I say every morning on my knees.

unknown 1:03:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:53

And I I love that you just reiterated on your knees, because there is certainly something supernatural to the posture of surrender. And like actually getting on your knees is moving something spiritually and supernaturally, you know, because you're putting yourself in the posture of you don't get on your knees for anybody, right? Oh, that's true. Yeah, like you get on because God is who he says he is, and that's a form of worship, it's a form of surrender. Um, I think that's really beautiful. Uh, what about uh things like fasting? I'm a big believer in fasting. Do you ever fast or anything for any spiritual reasons?

SPEAKER_01 1:04:24

No, I mean a little intermittent fasting to you know keep my weight at a certain, but no, I I have not done that.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:31

That's something I would encourage you to try because anything that takes us out of the body is going to increase our Wi-Fi signal spiritually. So one of the spiritual technologies that I talk about is fasting. Because when you think about it, if you're constantly eating or whatever, you're consuming things that your body's processing, you're using a lot of energy to do that. Whereas if you can fast for a day or two and only having water, which should be difficult if you've never done it before, and also pray and also meditate, you start seeing things, you start having visions, you start having more vivid dreams. And of course, there's neurological um causes for that when you're taking away sugar and carbohydrates and whatnot, but there is something supernatural that happens when you fast. So I would encourage you and anybody listening to start with a one-day fast, like 24 hours, and also use that time when you're hungry to pray or to read something, you know. But yeah, if you haven't tried it, do you meditate though?

SPEAKER_00 1:05:24

I do.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:25

Yeah. Yeah. What does meditation look for you?

SPEAKER_01 1:05:27

Because I there's I actually do transcendental meditation. Okay. So I meditate for like 23 minutes twice a day. It's a long time. It is a long time. Wow. It's worth it.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:38

It's worth it. I love that. Can I just say something that I love that you just shared? I love the idea of the fasting piece. And I subscribe to that. I haven't done like that kind of fasting, but I think the connection to God and and the communication happens more with what we take away, you know, like that. It's all the stuff that is. Is removed so that that that connection is there. But if I'm eating all the time, you know, I don't drink, I don't do drugs, I don't do, I don't smoke, I don't, you know, though like the that those kind of fasting things. Um make me a more clean, clear, you know, channel, transmitter, whatever you want to call it, to get that frequency of God. So I love the idea of fasting.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:26

Well, it's the thing we're spiritual beings having a human experience, right? Or a spirit that has a soul and has a body, and our soul interfaces between the both, and that's how we kind of interpret that data. So, you know, our soul is picking up on information from our body, our physical senses, but it's also picking up on the spiritual. If you're taking in more physical data, your soul is gonna be busy processing that data. Whereas if you take yourself out of the body through meditation, fasting, prayer, etc., you now have better access spiritually. Does that make sense? Yeah. If I'm being transparent here, you know, part of the reason why I've gotten out of the personal development space as much as I was, is because so much of it was like uh a show. It's like I have to buy the car, bought my dream car, have to make the money, have to have all the nice things go on nice vacations, have to be and here I am. It's like this constant shame and guilt of like, am I am I living the part? You know, which I think is important if you're gonna teach these things. But the problem for me with the personal development and self-help space right now is that it's like, oh, I'm not broken. I I've got it figured out. But like when I get into doing this now, I can show up authentically and be like, you know what, I am broken. We're all broken, and we need, we need a God, we need a savior, right? And one of the and the reason I bring this up is because one of the things that I battle with spiritually the most still is food, right? And no matter how much hypnosis I've done, no matter how much practical um processes or things that I've tried to apply to eating better, it's not until I address it spiritually that it starts to resolve. Um, because I know that that's the one thing that keeps me separated from that connection with God, is if I'm too indulgent with food. You know, I've never been an alcohol guy, I've never been a drug guy. It's always been food. And so I want to encourage people too that if you're if someone's listening and they're struggling with anything, food, a substance, it's not always something neurological that can be uh you take to a therapist or you take to a hypnotist. Sometimes it's spiritual, right? Have you seen things in your life that have only been resolved through a spiritual means? Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:42

I mean, really, I think everything. I I think that is the means. If you know, if I'm to be honest, that that is the means, uh, which isn't doesn't take away my necessity for me to walk the walk or or do certain things too, but I think all of those things happen spiritually. That that is the way.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:04

Yeah, I just I just hesitate because there's a saying it's like, oh, you can be too spiritual for any earthly good, you know. And I think I see this in especially a Christian community where everything has a spiritual origin, but I think that kind of handcuffs people. And I'm not saying you're implying this, I'm saying this is my own, this is how my mindset's been around and have recently adjusted, is that concept of like sometimes you need to address things practically, right? Sometimes you got to go through Al-Anon or AA and have a therapeutic model of change. It's not just about like, you know, people who believe in, I believe in deliverance and spiritual affliction and stuff like that. But very often there's a practical means to recovery or health, right? Finding the cause is is difficult. I always think about the Vatican. You know, I have my Catholic roots. I always used to be into things like exorcism, and I was always fascinated about that. When I did research into the actual practical process of how the Vatican handles exorcisms, they do everything in their power to not do an exorcism, right? They want to rule out every single thing practically, neurologically, emotionally, trauma, before they actually say, hey, this person is possessed by some demonic entity. That's the idea that we have to bring into our own lives for healing and for our health, is that let's address everything practically, but also have an understanding that it could be something spiritually. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 1:10:20

Yeah, I guess you know, the way I see it is, you know.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:24

Like you didn't not get a surgery. You still had a surgery for the breast cancer. Yeah, you didn't pray to pray the tumor away.

SPEAKER_01 1:10:30

No, but I think I was led to the right doctors, you know. Like I and I got a second opinion because I think I was like, I don't know, this doesn't feel right with this guy. I think that's I guess what I mean, that maybe there's that energy that leads me or opens doors for, but I have to walk through them. I like that. I like living life. I like that I get to have these experiences, you know. Um, so I'm all about the practical piece of of all of it.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:05

Yeah. And that reminds me of something I pray routinely is I always say, God, guide my thoughts, guide my feelings, guide my actions, right? Um because it we are the practical means to his supernatural end right. So it is going to a doctor, but having that intuition, I don't really like this guy. I don't know why, but maybe I need to get a second opinion. Maybe I need to go to this hospital rather than this hospital. And sometimes it is a supernatural. I mean, I do believe that God can instantly and supernaturally heal people. And actually, this is a tough thing for Christians because there's a lot of Christians who who pray to be healed and they don't get healed, right? And I heard a pastor say this. He says there's three ways that people are healed. One, they're healed instantly and miraculously, two, they're healed slowly and practically, or three, they're healed when they go to heaven. And the third one can be the hardest to accept. So I guess, I guess my follow-up question for you then is it's hard to articulate this because where is the line of practical healing and spiritual healing? You know what I mean? Like, where how do we how do we even discover the entry point to healing? Or do you is that is that what you're trying to say? Is like we just start spiritually, we just go to God and my intuition is how to do it.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:08

I can think that's what it is. I that's where I start with everything. So I recently, in I guess October, I got sick and um I had strep throat, apparently. And I all of a sudden started to develop this rash on my chest that it's spreading on my arms. I go to the doctor, they give me a steroid because they think I'm I'm allergic to an antibiotic. To make a long story short, it was a rash that developed from the strep virus, and steroids make it worse. I had a rash from my neck to my toes that would curl your toes. Doctors were like jumping back, like, oh my, I'm just like, what is happening? My entire body is just covered in this rash. I I didn't like it. I I I went to doctors, I did the things, but I guess I just I just trusted God in it. You know, I don't know why I have this thing. I it's not right. It's not, you know, I I don't even remember what your question is, so I don't even know what to do.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:16

I was asking where how how do you determine if you go a practical solution or a spiritual solution?

SPEAKER_01 1:13:22

Well, I think I was led to, you know, go to the doctor. Yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:27

What happened with the rash? What happened with the rash? How did it resolve? Did you take medicine for it?

SPEAKER_01 1:13:31

I did take medicine for it. Um, it started to resolve before that. I did struggle a little bit with should I take this medication or not? But it was that bad that I was like, all right, I'm gonna do the I'll pray and I'll give myself this shot too. Well, I think the most important thing I don't think they're mutually exclusive. I think that that it can all be part of the whole thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:52

So what I think it comes down to is where your faith is. If your faith is more in the medicine than God, you have a problem. But if your faith is in God and he uses medicine to heal you, that's a perfect way to say it. Yeah. Yeah. It's and we see this, we threw this see this throughout scripture. It's more the posture than anything. We we and this is the whole story of of the gospel, is like we're broken, we can't be good enough, um, and we need a savior, right? And so it's not up to us, right? Does that mean that we don't live righteously or try to seek righteousness? Of course not. We're supposed to seek righteousness, but there's a posture. We can't be righteous, we can't be perfect, but it's that seeking of that that's important. So, same thing. This was the problem when I had with teaching manifestation, is that it took God out of it, right? It didn't have the faith in God. And something I I have thought about, it's like vision boards and all these practical things that we do. Those things are okay, they're not evil, but a vision board becomes idolatry if you leave God out of it, right? If he hasn't spoken to you or hasn't put something on your heart that you know is from him, and you just have the fancy yacht up there just because you want that, you know, we get into materialism and greed and things like that. So, how do you balance your desires with what you think God desires? Because I know you said before, like you have this, you think or you believe you have the same will as him, like your will is his will.

SPEAKER_01 1:15:11

Yeah, because at the end of the day, why do you want the yacht? Why do we want the yacht? Okay. I mean, I've had to ask myself those questions. Why do I care about that? Why? Okay. And I think at the end of the day, you get down to something real. So, my house, I love my house. It's not that big and extravagant or anything, but it's a beautiful home. I love how people feel when they walk into my home. People are like, wow, something feels really good here. I love the connection, you know. Like, I love that. I love the peace and the the connection and the that's what I really want. That's what I really want.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:47

So it's it's the motivation behind the intent. Because I'll tell you what, yes, I've I've dealt with this. I I bought my dream car, brand new G-Wagon, but I would be lying to you if I tell I told you I bought it because I, you know, didn't like people looking at me at a stoplight, right? Like it was ego, a lot of ego involved, which I'm just being honest, my intention a lot in the past has been ego. Like who's looking at me? What does this mean about me? Does it establish my value?

SPEAKER_01 1:16:09

But why do you want people to look at you?

SPEAKER_02 1:16:11

Well, I think because it establishes uh a value, I guess, right? If they see me as you have all right, right. That's what I'm saying. It's like, where is the focus?

SPEAKER_01 1:16:20

Because if I realize my value God values you, you know, you don't you think it's coming through that thing, but what you want is to be valued, and that's the same thing God wants, because you are valued. We just kind of get a little off track, but I think the motivation is to feel seen and to feel valued. That's a beautiful thing that we all want, right? We just kind of think it's gonna come from this thing. It's like that's you don't need that, and go ahead and get it, really.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:47

And people demonize those motivations, which I think is wrong because God obviously created us as creatures of connection and community. And of course, people want validation. Of course, I want to be loved, right? Like it's a survival mechanism. God created those desires, but if it gets to an unhealthy level where you're buying a car so you can be liked, or you know, that's a different story, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:17:08

I think it's different. Like it's it's where does it come from? So if the car, if you're using this outside thing to give you the the validation, no. But if you're, I don't know, if you're you're doing good things and it's coming from God and and buying the car feels like a great thing, okay. That's okay. It has nothing to do with the car. It has to do with whether you think that car is filling you, or because you're full, maybe you like to have the car. I don't think God really thinks bad if you have the great car. I I I don't I don't believe in any of that uh at all.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:49

Well, it's funny because what you just said, I I was praying about one day months ago, and he kind of revealed to me, he's like, dude, I don't care about the car. It's like inconsequential. It's like inconsequential. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:59

You like it, go ahead. Have it. But don't think that it's me.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:03

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:04

Right. Don't think that it's me, but go have fun in the car. Take your friends in the car.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:10

Speaking of motivation, um, one thing that you and I definitely have in common is uh a posture of generosity. Because I'm I heard something on you were on another podcast talking about your commission. You donate some of your commission. Is that for a cause? Um talk to me about that specifically, but also kind of the the general concept. I also say this is a spiritual technology of of giving, right? The law of reciprocity, givers gain. We see that in B and I if you're familiar with the networking group. But talk to me about generosity.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:37

Yeah, well, I mean, listen, in business, you know, when you're, you know, have success, it's you don't want to give. So this was designed to give in a in a way that honored the clients that we are profiting from. So commissions for a cause is that we donate 1% of our commission to a charity of our clients' choosing. I mean, listen, this is just so good because you really get to know people. Listen, a real estate transaction is a big transaction. You know this from your mom's business and from what you've done. And sometimes it's good, you know, like it's it's good and you're buying a lake house, and you know, we get all of that. Sometimes it's not. But people, you know, we we get to know the people through what they want, where they want that money to go. And it just creates a better relationship with the client. But yeah, and I I I think, you know, what I've learned along the way is about filling my own cup because I didn't, I couldn't give because I had nothing to give. I do believe in that. You know, for me, that was the path to being able to be generous was I can't keep giving you money because I'm not okay. I need to be okay. And once I got to be okay, then I'm able to, right? It doesn't serve me to just to not be okay. You know, that selfless to my own demise. It I don't believe in that.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:08

I don't think that's putting the mask on yourself first, right? Like we said.

SPEAKER_01 1:20:12

Exactly. So, yes, of course. So I'll tell you a little story. My brother is a financial advisor, and um, I was feeling particularly financially insecure one day. I was in Florida and my septic was frozen up at the lake at my office. And you know, we can't flush the toilets, you know, and I'm in Florida and I'm scared, and how much is this gonna cost? So I call my brother, he's my go-to guy, and he's like, You're gonna be fine. He said, Do you have $20 in your wallet? And I was like, Well, yeah, I do. And he said, Go to the store and buy some canned goods and go to this address. And so I did, and it was a, you know, a food bank, you know, and it just was like, uh it just straightened me right out, you know, like I was so scared that I wasn't gonna have enough. I have more than enough and I have enough to give. And so that's always a thing, you know. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:03

Yeah, it reminds me of um uh the idea of money as a currency. You know, if you look at a dollar bill on one side, it says a dollar and it's constrained by that definition, right? It's this specific size of paper, has these words on it that says it's only worth a dot a dollar and it's constrained by that. But if you flip it around, what does it say? And God believes, right? Yeah, yeah. Um, and so that's that's great. That's awesome. The act of generosity is you trusting God, right? Because it's not your money, it's his money, right? And we are stewards of those resources, and so we should freely give because we were freely given. And it's also exercising our faith. It's like, okay, God, I don't have enough money to pay this bill right now. And I'm not saying they should always give your last dollar, but sometimes God will call you to, right? He'll be like, no, I want you to go donate that food or I want you to donate that money, even though you're worried about your paycheck because I'm gonna pick or you're worried about that bill because I'm gonna pick that up for you. And getting to that level, I've realized generosity is a way to strengthen that.

SPEAKER_01 1:21:57

It's energy, you know, money is energy. I I um I love Martha Beck. She talks about when we're being miserly with our resources and not sharing, and you know, that's miserly with our energy, and that never leads to anything good.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:11

It has to be combined with intentionality, right? Money is like a you have a relationship with it just like you'd have a relationship with your spouse. It's like if you're not paying attention to it and you're not being intentional and communicating with effectively, it's just you don't know what's gonna happen. One of the things I've had, because I used to be very flippant with my money, and I always say God kept me broke to keep me close because I I would have six-figure months and then it would go away. Yeah. What is happening? It's because I wasn't intentional with it, you know. And so I actually had a close friend of mine who's very intentional with money. He's uh he's not very spiritual in the practical sense. He's you know, he's this Jewish guy, love him to death. Nothing that's wrong with it. I'm just kind of painting the picture of or different. And he's so intentional. It doesn't matter if he buys a pair of socks, doesn't matter if he's going to a restaurant, he's researching. He's like, oh, is this made out of the right material? What are the resources for this restaurant? And we do that to some capacity, but he's so relentless in it. And who's one of the wealthiest people I know?

SPEAKER_05 1:23:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:23:05

Him, right? Because he's intentional. So he kind of through osmosis taught me this. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. All right, I'm gonna ask you a big question to uh maybe land this plane. We'll see. Maybe we have to cut this out because I don't want you, I don't want you to feel uncomfortable about this at all. But we are on a Christian podcast, and I know in my own journey, for nearly a decade now, I gave my life to Jesus in 2011, even though I was brought up Catholic, I rediscovered my faith in 2011 after my uncle had passed. And then I kind of was in and out of the Christian faith, and I got enamored by some of these spiritual technologies and philosophies that we're talking about, but I always found myself coming back to Jesus because there was always this like this thirst that couldn't be quenched by the world or by success. So, my question for you is who is Jesus to you? What do you believe about him? Talk to me about specifically Jesus as we might say God, or you know, some religions might say just a prophet. Who is Jesus to you?

SPEAKER_01 1:24:03

Yeah, so I was baptized in 2014 and did turn my life over to Jesus. Yeah. Yeah. I was asked at one point, somebody that I was working with in recovery, I was trying to find my higher power. What is my higher power? And I do believe that it's very personal, but I was trying to find my way. And she said, Why don't you ask your higher power to reveal itself to you? And it was Jesus. Yeah, I believe Jesus is the Son of God, and that's you know, Jesus is my man, you know. I think perhaps I have a more expansive way of my relationship with that is um a little more expansive than a strict religious way.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:54

Yeah. I love that because for me, like I said, I've been through all the spiritual philosophies, all I've researched all the religions, I've researched all of the meditations and and processes and things like that. But every time it's like I mess up, right? I I make mistakes, I do things I tell myself not to do. I try to live holy, but then I do the complete opposite of that. And every time I'm I'm in shame or I'm in guilt, it's like I'm drowning in that. And then like Jesus, and this is like supernatural, I can't even articulate. He comes and he like lifts me out. And like I realize then that he's lifting me out of it. I'm like, oh, this is what it means to be in Christ and to have a Lord and Savior, and then to have an identity in Christ. And when I remember that identity of who I am, all of the shame and guilt and condemnation goes away. And so I haven't felt that outside of Jesus. And that's why we're here today doing this type of podcast, is because I want people to have that relationship with Jesus. Also know that it it does have crossroads with these other philosophies that we're talking about, but it's all under the authority of him. I thank you for sharing your perspective on that. I know, and it's it's it can be even for Christians or someone who is brought up Catholic or has a faith in Jesus, it's almost like Jesus becomes a resistance point to talk about. But I think that's because the world has fought back on that that concept for so long, which is probably an episode or a conversation for another time. But any other do anything else to say about it?

SPEAKER_01 1:26:23

And I don't I don't want you to feel pressured to talk about Jesus at all specifically, but I think for me, I don't really like other people's interpretations of it. His words are his words, and they're uh they speak to me, and I have my own curriculum or the way that the Holy Spirit works them out in me. I like the personal relationship with those words. I'm not as interested in uh someone else's that that's yours, and that's good. And if it works for you, I love that. And I love a religion of one's own in that way. Um, so it's very personal to me, but I like those direct words. Yeah. And I'll I'll interpret them how we want to interpret them. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 1:27:15

Yeah, it is a unique journey for everybody. It does people a disservice to for a lot of people to think that there's necessarily right or wrong. I do think there's a right way, you know. Don't get me wrong. I I believe in the biblical way of salvation and believing in Jesus as our Lord and Savior. Um, but we get there by different paths, right? Yes, yeah, yeah. Before we end here, I'm gonna I'm gonna rapid fire some questions at you. They're gonna they're gonna they'll be simple because you have a lot of experience with this, mostly business wisdom related. Um, what's the best leadership lesson you've ever learned? Walk the walk. Walk the walk. Okay. What's one habit that transformed your success? My success? What's one practical habit that you've implemented? Practical time blocking. Uh I oh amen. I I tell everybody that time blocking, oh my God. It's That was the single biggest productivity hack I've ever implemented in my life. Yeah. That's awesome. What's the biggest mistake entrepreneurs make?

SPEAKER_01 1:28:07

I think watching the competition too closely and not not running your own show and running your own race and keeping the focus on yourself and worrying about what everybody else is doing. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:19

What's the most important trait of a great entrepreneur or business leader?

SPEAKER_01 1:28:24

I think integrity.

SPEAKER_02 1:28:25

Yeah, integrity. All right, lastly, what's uh what's one piece of wisdom that you could leave to the entrepreneurs listening? What's like if you only had one message that you could leave with the world, what would it be?

SPEAKER_01 1:28:36

Oh wow. Um This is a guidance system for me. And it it it was a question that I was asked at a personal growth retreat. And it's what do you want people to say about you at your funeral? Begin with the end in mind. That is the way I do everything. People aren't gonna say, oh, she was such a great real estate broker. You know, they're it what you said in the beginning, it is the small encouragement. It is the that's what I want people to say, that's who I want to be, is that you were left with something of value by an interaction with me, not the things or any of that. So I think once you understand what your life was is about or what you want it to be about, that will infiltrate all that you do. And so that is my guidance system. And that that's what it is. What at the end? Because there's gonna be an end to this piece. I believe in the eternal, but this this show, it's gonna be over at some point. What did it mean? Why were you here? Really, why were you here?

SPEAKER_02 1:29:43

And so it sounds like your legacy, right? We were talking about signs and things that have happened in your life that have really spoken to you and maybe given you some guidance. What is this whole eagle thing I'm hearing about?

SPEAKER_01 1:29:52

Yeah, so this was a time in my life when I was struggling, or you know, it was after I was diagnosed with cancer, and you know, still things were a mess, but I'm finding my way and I'm feeling that God peace in me and trying to navigate. And uh, so I was driving down the road, and um, there was an eagle standing in the road, a bald eagle, and they're big, they're really big, they're like a child size. And um, I was excited and startled at the same time, like, you know, it was a it was notable. So this eagle takes flight right in front of my windshield, uh, and the white tail, and it is it feels like it's slow motion for me, like just the the wings, just whoosh, whoosh, and I am just feeling like I'm being willed forward. Like I know this is important. I don't know what it means, but I'm just driving and you know, it is just pulling me. That's how it feels. Like it, it's, you know, wind beneath my wings, you know, like I'm just like being pulled. And the thought that occurs to me with this is I don't know if things are gonna be okay, but I know that I'm gonna be okay. It was a turning point for me because I I realized that how things go is not the determination of how I'm gonna be, because because.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:17

Wow, that's amazing. Yeah, that'd be like majestic. I can't. I'm I'm like picturing myself in the car, like seeing this giant eagle, because they are huge.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:24

Just like kind of in slow motion, and then you probably have a million thoughts running through your head, but like a million and none.

SPEAKER_01 1:31:31

Not yeah. Do you know what I'm what I mean? Have you been in those present moments where like everything exterior just kind of goes away, and I'm just right here? And it was like you're gonna be okay no matter what.

SPEAKER_02 1:31:43

Are eagles uh still symbolic to you? Do you still yeah? Yeah, yeah. I think too, there's something about the symbolism too. We see this uh throughout the Bible, throughout even other spiritual uh traditions. There's something to the symbolism of animals, symbolism of a circumstance. The first thing that comes to mind is when Jesus was baptized, uh a dove came down from heaven, right? Like there's symbolism to it, you know. Let's close with that. What does an ego mean to you in your life?

SPEAKER_01 1:32:11

It's strength, it's perspective. I always think like a higher perspective of things. You know, I we can get so mired in the this and the that and the them and but that 30,000-foot view, to me, it's like getting closer to the way God is looking at things and what is really going on. It's not really all the maybe little things that I'm anxious about. There's a a higher way of looking at this that is closer to the way God looks at things. And I want to try to maintain that perspective, especially in the midst of turmoil.

SPEAKER_02 1:32:47

That's awesome. So, Kim, where where can people uh find you? What are you where how what are you working on where you'd want someone to to work with you? Just talk about that real quick. Where can they find you? And if someone wants to work with you or needs guidance or something.

SPEAKER_01 1:32:59

Uh yeah. So my website, kimgstevens.com.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:02

Awesome.

SPEAKER_01 1:33:03

There's real estate there. I do a weekly blog called Unique Perspectives. I do video blogs and um, you know, hope to do a podcast.

SPEAKER_02 1:33:12

Absolutely. And if anybody listening to this has to go check out your website because I'm not just saying this, like the the level of content creation that you have for free and the value and the information. Yeah, you have like a hundred videos. I don't know how many, maybe less than that, but there is a dozen of videos for free on your website. So kimgstevens.com. That's it. Awesome. Well, thanks, Kim. This is fun. Thank you so much.