Things We Wish We Knew...

You know those things you only learn after the fact? Yeah… we’re talking about those.

In this episode, we’re sharing some of the biggest lessons we’ve picked up over time—the kind you usually learn through trial and error. From relationships to faith to expectations of ourselves and others, we’re unpacking what’s changed, what surprised us, and what we wish someone would’ve told us earlier.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:01

Welcome to the Somehow Together podcast, where we explore faith, connection, and everything that holds us together. I'm Miranda.

SPEAKER_01 0:08

And I'm Erica.

SPEAKER_02 0:09

You know, life is messy.

SPEAKER_01 0:12

Relationships are messy.

SPEAKER_02 0:13

But we weren't meant to do life alone.

SPEAKER_01 0:15

And God is still at work in the middle of it all. So we're still showing up somehow together.

SPEAKER_02 0:24

Welcome to Somehow Together Podcast, episode three, Things We Wish We Knew Earlier. In this episode, Eric and I are going to dive into things about life, things that we wish we would have known earlier or been exposed to earlier that we just didn't know. And so if you have ever asked yourself, I wish I would have known then what I know now, then this might be the episode for you. So hang in there, hang out with us as we kind of dive into things we wish we knew. Okay, so Erica, as we start, I think this is probably the greatest because, well, we're not going to share our ages, but we're definitely not 20 anymore. Right? Like we're we can we can safely say the 20s are far behind us. And so what is my 30s are behind me, so that's fair. I'm not yet 40. So I'm still looking at my 30s. Barely. Barely. They'll be in their review mirror before I know it. But um, what is something that you believed about life in your early 20s that you do not believe anymore?

SPEAKER_01 1:36

Hmm. Well, um, one of the things I was told at one point was that you'd always have a car payment. So that's why I remember that. Like you'd always have you'll always have a car payment. You gotta build up your credit, um, some of those things. And I I I don't know what I think about the credit statement yet, but um Jason and I paid off our last car 18 years ago, and we've always paid cash since. And so we've never had a car payment. And I feel like that's um freed up a lot of um of financial space for us, you know. It's given us financial capacity to do a lot of uh really cool things over the years, and so I'm glad that um we we believed it at the beginning, kind of bought into that, but then we've definitely changed it and don't believe that anymore.

SPEAKER_02 2:25

That's awesome. What got you to shift your mindset around that idea of just kind of always having debt hanging over your head?

SPEAKER_01 2:34

Um, our last church did uh uh Financial Peace University, and we took that class and yep, and we um decided that we didn't want to be in debt anymore and live in debt, and so yep, definitely shout out to Dave Ramsey. So there was a lot of people. One other thing I believed um early in life was that I could uh convince my husband that my way of doing things was the right way. Yes, and now 20 years in, I'm like, I definitely don't believe that I could do that uh all the time. Sometimes, but not all the time. So sometimes. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:10

How about you? Have I ever told you about the time where I was convinced? Okay, I wasn't convinced. I knew I knew that I knew how to change a diaper because I grew up around like small kids and early childhood education was my thing. And Nate had literally never changed a diaper in his life. And so when we brought Colton home from the hospital, Nate was doing the diaper changes and he's standing over the changing table, and I'm like, that's not how you change a diaper, you need to do it this way. I'm I'm trying to tell him exactly how to change a diaper, and he did not very much appreciate that. And so that was the moment I think that I realized that he would not always do things the way that I wanted them to do. Yes. So, you know, whatever it happens. Um, I think for me, the one of the things that I thought about in my early 20s is that probably, I don't know, 30 seemed so far away, but I thought for sure I was gonna have my life together by by like 30. I would have my kids and my family and my career would be established, and probably we'd be making kudo bucks, living in a big house and kind of living that traditional American life dream. For sure. Because time just flowed different in our 20s. It everything seemed so far away, and older people seemed really old instead of just a little bit older than you. And yeah, I think that was that was an eye-opening moment as just as I've gotten older and am approaching my 40s, is that we are constantly on this journey of life, and things shift and they change so quickly and so fast. And what once felt like forever ago is like a blink of an eye sometimes. And I know you know this because you you're like Olivia, your daughter, she's like gonna graduate college and she barely just started, I feel like, right? And I've got my first graduating senior from high school, and I look around like, how did how did we get here? And guess what? I still don't make kudo bucks, and I am facing a shift in what am I supposed to do with my life yet again. And yeah, we don't have it all together, and we're not even 30 anymore.

SPEAKER_01 5:39

I know. Um, the other thing I think when I was in my early 20s was uh, and maybe it carried through my 30s, I don't know, was that if I worked hard enough and I organized things enough and I planned enough that somehow I was going to be able to avoid uh struggle or pain or you know, conflict, um, you know, all the hard things that come with life. I think I thought that somehow by working really hard, I was gonna be able to control that and minimize that. And maybe I'd minimized some parts of it, but you could definitely cannot outplan and out-organize um life, you know, life struggles. And so no, it's just it doesn't work, and so um ex learning to accept that has has brought a lot of freedom. But it took me a long time, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:29

Because we we want to feel like we're in control of things, and the harder we work for that control, sometimes the more it feels like things are out of control, and then you work harder and harder and harder for that control, and it doesn't ever work out. We do. Yeah. So, okay, so like looking over, I guess, whatever you would consider your younger years, I'm not gonna define those for you. What would you well what was one piece of advice that you got that turned out to be true? So it's easy to talk about all of the things that we thought or hoped for that didn't pan out, but what's a piece of advice that you got when you were younger that did turn out to be true?

SPEAKER_01 7:12

I remember my dad always said that um if it's too good to be true, it probably is. And um, over the years, I know that to be true because I remember buying like diet pills that I saw on a commercial or um this I remember with tag away, like it was this this stuff you're supposed to be able to put on skin tags and it's supposed to make them fall off so you didn't have to get them cut off anyway. And I'm like, oh, that looks magical, that would be great. And you know, it you spend the money on it and they actually don't work. And so I learned that if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is. Probably is. Yes, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:53

How long in trying those things, how long did it take for you to realize that they weren't gonna work? I don't think it took very long.

SPEAKER_01 8:03

I don't know. I don't know how much how long I stuck with the tag away or the diet pills, but um neither were magical, so yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 8:14

That's yeah, that is so enticing though, right?

SPEAKER_01 8:18

Like just take this and all your problems just we want an easy solution, right? We always so much, so yeah, yeah. No, for real though, I remember I was watching another therapist talk to a family, and he talked about the whole fake it to you make it kind of concept. And he talked about it in terms of gratitude, teaching a child gratitude. And you go, you teach a child to say thank you, but it doesn't mean, especially like when there are toddlers, right? You teach them to say thank you, but it doesn't mean they're actually grateful, they don't always know how to have gratitude. But you teach them these things that seem basic, but it teaches them to eventually embrace the the value that you are wanting, you know, wanting them to live out. And so I've thought about that a lot over the years, and I'm like, it's it's kind of true. And I'm like, the fake it till you make it thing is kind of just practice. And so instead of like thinking of it as being false or being fake, I'm like, no, it's like we just do things out of practice. I think of like um putting myself out in in like relationship scenarios and stuff, yeah. You know, like it's not always I don't always feel confident, but I'm gonna fake confidence, I'm gonna practice confidence, you know, and eventually you kind of start to feel more confident in those situations. And so I think it's a something I heard and it's actually worked out. Yeah how about you? Can you think of one? That's great, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 9:50

Um, I don't I don't know. As you were talking, I was like, man, what is one piece of advice that I got when I was younger that's actually turned out to be true? And I think I think for me it I can't remember where I heard it. I probably read it in a book. I joke with Nate all the time that like I learned about love and life and relationships through country music songs. Oh yeah, you know, because growing up, that just wasn't something that adults focused on with us as kids. And you can attest to that. I mean, you're even a little bit older than I am, and it takes intentionality, like you said, with that mindset to raise our kids to embrace something that is hard and challenging and different. And I just don't think that that we were raised in this emotionally aware culture, and so there were things that we were never taught. And so I think for me, part of it was I think I also came out of a different religious background, and yet something that I learned from that that I have carried with me is that kindness really does matter. And so I don't know that it was like an explicit, like always be kind to people. Um, it was probably more like you attract more flies with honey than you do vinegar, whatever. I whatever that be saying. I don't know. I don't actually know what that saying is, but probably similar to that. And so taking it too far can be dangerous, though, too, because if you're overly kind or compassionate, and not compassionate, but but kind maybe in situations where you should be a little bit more assertive or firm or you know, whatever. But but really I think it it helped create in me this heart and desire for people. And so then as I became a Christian and I started seeing people, hopefully through the lens that Jesus sees them, and I try really hard to do that to see them as created beings. That kindness piece has has just really stuck with me. That kindness is so very important to people.

SPEAKER_01 11:51

So it's kind of how you think that's win influence, right? Is I mean, people are going to be more open to listening to what you have to say when you've treated them with care and kindness.

SPEAKER_02 12:00

So yeah, and a smile goes a long way. I know early early on in my work in in my career, I had a I had a boss who trained us on the fact that names matter. And so that became a huge, a huge thing and a huge realization. I was probably in my mid-20s at the time and had never really thought about the power of knowing somebody's name and just smiling at somebody. And so yeah, I think I think kindness, I guess, is something that while not like an actual piece of advice, it was something that I grew up believing in. Yeah, that's great. So yeah, and I I think that over over time, like we just we grow and we hear things that don't feel urgent at the moment, and it's not probably until years later where you're like, oh, that's where I learned that. Yeah, I think it I think it's fun. So the younger selves, right? We're out there, guys. They're out there fighting for us now. Okay, is if that is something that you that actually came true or I guess turned out to be true, that you practice a lot. What is something that you wish somebody would have told you earlier? So through like struggling in life and that those things that that you had to just kind of wrestle with that you're like, oh, if only somebody would have told me this earlier, this would have been so much easier.

SPEAKER_01 13:28

Yeah. Um, I think that one of the things I wish I would have really understood earlier, or that somebody would have told me, is to prioritize personal connections over church programming. And I know um, you know, we both are in the church and have a lot of experience in the church, and um I think it becomes an easy default to expect the church to provide us with connections and social opportunities and um and they do, and it's a great place to start, but I think that um the best discipleship happens in personal connection and relationships. Um the best um friendships are formed when you spend time with people outside of church programming. Um and so I just and I think Jesus did it, he modeled it for us. He like he got personal, he taught, he talked to the crowds, but he also spent time, personal time with smaller crowds, you know, his group, his crew. And I'm just like, yeah, I feel like I spent a lot of time focused on church programming for a lot of years, and I'm and there's nothing wrong with that, it's good and it's necessary.

SPEAKER_02 14:45

So I'm well and the institution breeds it, right? Because they're they talk about like, what's the numbers? What's the numbers? And so you get so focused on the program and getting people there that sometimes the relationship piece falls to the wayside. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:57

Honestly, and out of time and energy to do those things that are actually really important. And so um, I I wish I wish I would have grasped that earlier, I think.

SPEAKER_02 15:07

Do you think that's something that you're still working on and learning? Or do you think that you've really started to embrace that in the season that you're in now?

SPEAKER_01 15:16

Well, it's funny because I remember like God kind of revealing that to me like 12 years ago, maybe when we were still in Missouri, like you should be prioritizing people over programs and and how easy it is to fall back into like spending a lot of effort and energy on helping make the church a great place for everyone else, you know. And and so then over the years, I've kind of slowly been had to learn this process over and over again, usually from like getting tired and burning myself out, or you know, and so I do feel like I fall back, I keep falling back into that trap of programming over people. And so I'm like, I want to keep learning. I'm striving. So I guess I guess I am still learning that learning how to do that.

SPEAKER_02 16:03

Yeah, do you think that do you think looking at I'll just use maybe I shouldn't, but I will anyway. Like our church, like our our congregation, because we are in the same church, in the same congregation. Do you think that's a hard concept for our people to understand and grasp even today? Or do you think that the the culture around relationships and and what the church provides is already shifting that direction?

SPEAKER_01 16:25

I think it's hard for everyone to grasp. I think that our culture does not lend to personal connection. We all stay busy, even outside of the church, right? We stay busy with sports teams and clubs and work and um and we make people make friends and connections with people um that are around us in those places, but don't know how to take it beyond um a programmed-oriented relationship. I think people struggle with it. I think we all do. And so I think that it's also more comfortable. It's it's like you show up to a church function, somebody else has planned the event, somebody else is telling us what to do next. Yeah. Um, here's the question that you're gonna talk about with your table, you know, kind of like situation. Yes, icebreaker. And so it's fair, it's more comfortable. And so those of us that struggle a little bit more with connecting with people or um social worry or anxiety or self-consciousness or whatever it is, have a hard time risking, you know, the risking ourselves, I don't know, our image or whatever. Yeah, it too.

SPEAKER_02 17:40

Like you have to to be in a relationship with people, you have to be vulnerable and willing to expose parts of yourself that we tend to keep hidden from others out of our own insecurities and own fears and own shames.

SPEAKER_01 17:52

And so I think it's a hard concept, yeah, yeah, still to grasp. And so um, like I said, nothing wrong with church programming programming can draw people that struggle socially, and we don't want to just fill our churches up with people that are only struggling, like that that are like have a really hard time with social interaction, if that makes sense. We want churches to be full of healthy people, we want churches to be able to reach all people.

SPEAKER_02 18:20

So, yeah, well, and sometimes when you have an imbalance in health and unhealth, it makes it hard to know who best to serve and in the best ways possible. And so that's why you need a balance of healthy people so that they can help pour into those who may be who may be struggling, whatever that looks like for them. And so um, when you fill it where everybody's always struggling all at the same time, it makes it harder to to have people to journey alongside of them who are a little bit outside of of those struggle points. So yeah, yeah. I think something that I wish somebody would have told me earlier is that in a marriage, your spouse can't be your everything.

SPEAKER_01 19:10

Oh, that's a good one. I've had to learn that.

SPEAKER_02 19:12

Yeah, yeah. I I I don't again, I don't know where I grew up with that idea. Maybe it was the country music and movies. Maybe it was a little bit of the teachings that I had out of my other um religious affiliation, but the the expectation that that my husband or a wife should meet the need, all of the needs of the other spouse is so much pressure and actually sets up the relationship for so many conflicts and hardships and and disappointments and missed expectations. And it took Nate and I a long time of wrestling through some pretty hard things and through counseling with a good marriage counselor before that idea that he was not supposed to be the thing that always filled me and always met those needs. And I could never be that for him, actually truly opened up this dynamic in our relationship that was amazing. And so, yeah, I think I think that is something that I wish somebody would have told told me earlier that it's healthy to have a wide variety of people to pour pouring into your life and not putting that burden or that expectation on your spouse.

SPEAKER_01 20:32

Yeah. We watched those movies like uh was it Jerry McGuire, you know, you complete me. They're like, no, that's the line. And it's like it's so false. Right when we're 20th. Sounds so good. No, it's so romantic, but it's so uh impossible to achieve that. That comp you you will never find that in one person. No, and we should other than Jesus.

SPEAKER_02 21:00

Yeah, yeah, yes, exactly. We can't and and we shouldn't. And I think I don't know that I even would have listened if somebody had told me that earlier. Like, what? That's so weird. That goes against everything a young and in love person believes, right? Yeah, like the the heart goo-goo eyes that like pop out of your head every time they come in the room. And it's like, how are they not supposed to fill all of those, all of those places? All right. I I was thinking back to like when my grandma uh found out that Nate and I were engaged, and we'd been dating for about a year and a half when we got engaged. And my grandma's like, Well, what's the big deal? Like, why are you rushing things? You know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. She's like, Don't you want to travel? Don't you want to do all these things? And, you know, when you're 20 years old, so it's like, well, he's gonna travel with me. And we're gonna do all these things together because it's so much better to do it, you know, together. And so, and not saying that my grandma was wrong or right, it's just when we're in that haze of new love and and excitement about the future, it's hard to listen to the people who who may or may not be speaking wisdom into your life. So it's true.

SPEAKER_01 22:22

Yeah, what was another one for you? One of the other things I thought I think about this regularly is um I wish somebody would have told me that it was okay for me to be a pastor. Oh yes, I um I was a young adult, or I mean, I wasn't even a young adult, it was a young teenager who had this passion for ministry, passion for the church, and I felt like God was calling me to something in my life, but I had never seen females on the stage other than um in worship and um as the pastor's wife. So I assumed because God was calling me to something that it was to be a pastor's wife. And I did just because I thought that's the only thing I could do. Um and so I had a lot of people that were telling me that they thought I was a good leader, that I that God had good things for me, you know, like I had a lot of that kind of encouragement, but um, I didn't even think of it as an option, you know, that I could actually pursue ministry myself. Um yeah. And so I I'm just inspired by um the females that are taking the lead in churches and are are showing up and investing in people and are on the stage and um pastors who are allowing females to be in the those places of leadership so that our next generation of young people will know that it's okay for them to be pastors if if that's what God's calling them to. So that's one of the things that I always look back and I go, I wish somebody would have told me that.

SPEAKER_02 23:58

Yeah, I I think that is I thank you for sharing that. Because I think that's so so true, both for both for the men in the church and the women in the church to hear and to understand. As a female pastor, it it can be hard. It is hard sometimes. And I I think of the things that sometimes I have to fight for, whether that's in our local context, whether that is in the community context, or even larger than that. Uh, some of the pushback I see on even social media and and those types of things, I when I confront those when I feel like I'm supposed to, it's not actually for me. It it is for the young ladies and the young men that are being grown in the church for both of them to understand that there is a place in church ministry, in leadership, as pastors for both both males and females. And so I don't actually fight for those things for myself because I'm not yet 40. I don't actually care for me too much, other than I'm I'm trying to be obedient to what the Lord has called me to. I'm fighting for it for the younger ones coming up behind me who also should know the fullness of God's glory and the fullness of his plan for all of his creation and not just a portion of it. And so I wonder how many other Ericas or not yet 40-year-old Mirandas are out there because nobody ever told us that.

SPEAKER_01 25:30

Well, thanks for fighting. Fighting the good fight. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:33

Yeah, I try. I try. I don't know how well I'm doing, but I I try. So, all right, what is this? Is this something that as I was kind of thinking of questions that we could kind of chat through to give people more of an idea of how some of our conversations go where it's not so topic driven? But just like in general, how have your expectations of people changed over time? And so kind of this idea of like, did you used to expect more or less out of people? How do you like what do you expect from them now? And how do you how do you balance those expectations and still be honoring of who you are in the process?

SPEAKER_01 26:22

I I think that I've always assumed that people have good intentions and that people are and I've I think I've always assumed the best of people, and that's always helped me in my relationships, you know, just assume they're trying their best. But I also think that all humans are um in need of grace and have room for growth, right? And I've had to kind of learn to expect that pain and disappointment is gonna come with almost all relationships and all dynamic, you know, and all environments, um, church, personal connection, home, all of it, you know, people people are human. And um instead of really resisting that and fighting that or expecting that people are perfect or not gonna hurt me, I think I've I've started to embrace that humanity leaves us with this need for Jesus' grace, and so we appreciate his grace more when we can accept this. Um that we all have flaws and that Jesus at is at work in our lives and that we can grow and change because he's involved. Um I don't know if that that's a clear line of thought, but it's like I I assume people are trying their best. Yeah, and that helps, but they're also flawed and they're they're they're going to make mistakes. And so when we can assume that, we can uh assume that Jesus has room to work in their life, and so yeah, I trust those people better.

SPEAKER_02 28:04

Yeah, I well, I I love what you said there because it reminds me that um, at least for me, that healthy relationships really do live somewhere between like grace and boundaries. Like we have to have so much grace with people, and at the same time, we also get to have boundaries with people so that our relationships are as healthy as possible. And I will not get on a boundary soapbox. I promise you that is not what this is about. But that was a huge part of my story, is I I was I am a recovering people pleaser. And so I would let people walk all over me for the longest time and and it and assume or think that those relationships were healthy and good because well, they're asking me for help or they're asking me to do these things, and and I just couldn't say no ever. And so um, and I would get hurt over and over and over and over again, and so I still get hurt, but it's it's a different kind of hurt, if that makes sense, with with boundaries in place. And so I don't know, I just think yeah, that the healthy relationships live kind of between that that grace that exists because we have to with everybody. I mean, I get so I don't like labels of people, I think it dehumanizes them, and so I get super frustrated uh when people label other people. And so, um, but this is a story I share a lot with with others, and Nate knows that, so I'm gonna share it anyway. So he he would like get frustrated. We won't call it road rage because I think that is its own category, but he would get road frustrated when he is driving, and when he'd get cut off or somebody would do something unsafe or whatever, he'd be like, oh, what an idiot. And I would lose my, I mean, I wouldn't lose my mind, but I would always be like, you don't even know what's going on in their life right now. Because it just made me so mad that like that grace piece was missing. Like even on the road, we don't know what people are going through. We don't know what their stories are. Um I would never want my teenage driver to be followed aggressively because he accidentally cut somebody off and he's learning how to drive. I've done it without intention before, and I'm a grown adult, you know? And so, and so that that grace that we give to each other, I think even starts in the the moments where nobody even sees it. Yeah, that's great.

SPEAKER_01 30:34

Yes. And I I definitely want to say that um I agree with what you were saying about like pain and disappointment is okay to expect in the context of a healthy relationship. Yeah. And a healthy dynamic, right? Yep. Um and usually that's healthy because of those boundaries that you were talking about. Yeah. Because you already have those established. Because I would never just go, you should always expect to get hurt. I don't want to ever think people to think that you never boundaries might have to be another topic. Yes. Um, but I do think that um within the context of like healthy dynamics, that people are going to disappoint you sometimes. They're going to to um maybe say something that's insensitive. Um, but when we expect that they never are gonna make mistakes and then demand that, it's it's problematic. It also assumes that that I don't know, you know better than Jesus does, or that you're, you know, you're playing God. And so so I just that's that's what I mean when I'm like, I try to assume the best of people, but also know that they are human and and that they're gonna they're gonna have you know times where they make mistakes or hurt you on accident or disappoint you. And um, and I think that that stepping back and going, this part of humanity is actually beautiful because Jesus' grace can cover it. And he can he can bring restoration to relationships and dynamics that are sometimes problematic. But yes, that all has to happen within the context of a fairly healthy situation.

SPEAKER_02 32:07

Yeah, or at least with people who are tracking to pursue health together, right? Like the dynamic shifts a lot if you have one person who's pursuing a healthy relationship and the other one who refuses to do anything, then that you know, that changes the the framework a little bit for that. But yeah, I love I just love that God's grace is so much bigger than anything we could ever think or imagine, and it covers so much more than we could ever know to ask for. Yeah. And and it helps us to see the beauty even uh in the hard, the hard things that that happen to us and even happen around us. So okay, so this is one that I that I I think is super fun because we all have this idea of what is success. And when we're young, I think we have a very different viewpoint of success than we do as we have lived life and we have some years behind us. So, how has your definition of success changed over the years?

SPEAKER_01 33:08

All right, well, I think that God is still working on refining this in me, but um, I have gone from this vision of success being um influence on a like thinking I have influence from a stage. Like success is like having a microphone, being on a stage in front of a crowd. Like, I don't know, I always had that picture as a young adult. Like, that's what success will be, like when I can be that.

SPEAKER_02 33:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 33:38

And um, and God's really been working in my heart. We took a um, our church does a unique class and where we start to define our life's purpose and we come up with two words of what that looks like, um, your life purpose or your life calling in two words. And mine was safe harbor. And and that has nothing to do with being on a platform that has everything to do with connection with people and and building relationships. And so now when I define success, it's like, am I being a safe harbor to people? So it's like I love that. It's like um when I have my small group in my living room and I've provided the safe space for them to all study God's word and to communicate with each other and like share whatever prayer requests they have. Right now I have a bunch of young adults, young adult guys that are coming over because that's who's showing up for the young adult Bible study. And I get to feed them dinner, you know, after work. And it's like a safe harbor. I get to be that safe harbor for them. Um and I even get to do that in my counseling practice because I get to sit in a room with people and I provide a safe space for them to journey and to talk about whatever is, you know, they're struggling with. And so I've I'm like now success to me is filtered through these two words, right? And like it's not this foreign, this picture of like a program or like being on stage, but now it's like, am I being a safe harbor to people? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:11

Yeah, I love, I love, I love that like image that those two words bring to mind. And I think that, and correct me if I'm wrong, I don't want to speak for you, but some of that shift happened when it went from an external viewpoint of success to an internal viewpoint, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:34

Like what am I the world thinks is cool, and yeah, and this is what I think um the world would define as success versus like now this is what God's laid on my heart, and I view everything now. I try to view everything now through like that vision or that mission that God's given me on a personal level. Yeah, yeah, internal.

SPEAKER_02 35:57

Yeah, yeah, for sure. I think that um for when I when I was younger and I thought of success, I kind of said it earlier. Like you think of like the the income that you have and the house that you're gonna live in and yeah, yeah, you know, the perfect husband, the perfect kids, the 2.5. I don't know, I don't even know how you call it 2.5 means, but the white picket pants and the dog, like the quintessential American dream. And I remember early on when I was working in early childhood education, I was, I was a really good teacher and I loved my classroom, I love my students. I loved pouring into these little hearts and little minds, and I wanted to be a safe because I did not necessarily have that all the time growing up, the safe place when I was young. And so I wanted to be able to provide that for for my students. And it hit me one time as I was journaling and and and the Lord showed me that what I'm doing for 10, if I pour into leaders, I can now multiply and do that for so many more because I could teach other teachers to cultivate safe spaces for kids. And that's really how like that career kind of blew blew out into understanding that influence piece that you were talking about, but not on like this masculine, I was never gonna be this nationally known teacher trainer, you know, whatever. Uh, it was just to impact the school that I was in at the at the time. And so, and even now I think about that when I'm planning ministries and I'm doing work with people, it's it's even if one life is changed or impacted, or even if one person comes to see Jesus differently than they did when they walked out of my office or whatever that looks like, like even if it's just one person, it's it's worth it to me to invest in their lives and to invest in their stories and their histories and to journey together with people to whatever capacity the Lord asks me to. Even if one person is changed by him through that, then for me that is that is worth it. And that does not come with a big paycheck or a giant house or 2.5 kids who are perfect and never make mistakes. It doesn't, but it's that external to internal perspective and and shift when we start defining success outside of material possessions, it opens up this door for freedom to to step into spaces that we probably never would have.

SPEAKER_01 38:31

Yeah, I agree. And that's why we're doing it podcast, right?

SPEAKER_02 38:35

Yes, I know. I was gonna say it's hard because here we are trying to start a podcast. We're like, what's a successful podcast look like? Yeah, right. And and but just like, I mean, honestly, you our listeners will be listening to this a couple a few weeks after we record it, but even this morning, before we recorded it, we talked about what does successful podcast look like? And how did you define that? I can't even say what did I say? You said that a successful podcast for you is that your heart is changed by what we do here, and I I loved that because it was not about the listeners. I mean, I said I hope that other people Yeah, well, that's true, you know, too. Which is fair too, because it's it's hearts and minds that we're wanting to have shifted and changed. But for you, it was it wasn't about anything other than what God would do in you. Yeah, and I I appreciated that and loved it. And and such a different perspective of even a successful podcast where we're like, get a million listeners, now smash those likes. Is that what I don't I don't even know if that's what you like and subscribe? Yeah, like yes, if if you like what you heard today, yeah. Love it. I don't know. All right. I think for one of our last questions before we wrap wrap this episode up is have you ever had to unlearn something about God? Um you know, I think again, we we journey through life learning these things along the way, whether they're implicitly or explicitly told to us, we pick up things from people we look at, we pick up things that we that we watch and we listen to. Um and I think we unintentionally learn things about God that we probably were never meant to take on for ourselves. And so is there something that you've ever had to unlearn about God?

SPEAKER_01 40:33

Yes, and it's um been a journey, but um I remember thinking even as a young, I w I don't know as a teenager probably, um, that as long as I made good choices and I didn't do things that um were across a certain line of sin, you know, like I made pretty good choices. I thought as long as I made those good choices, that then my life would be full of blessing. Yeah. And that good things would happen to me. Like I was equating that God blesses those who make good choices versus um those that I saw, you know, doing things that were not very good or sinning. Yeah. They seem to be struggling. And so in my head, I made this, you know, this equation that life is good and easy as long as I'm doing what God wants. And um then my parents got divorced, you know, and my parents went through a whole lot of hardship. We all had heartbreak in the middle of that. And I realized I didn't really do anything to deserve that kind of pain. And then it so then I had to like work through that with God and wrestle, like, hey God, I I thought I was I was trying to hold up my end at the bargain, you know, like I was trying to be this good person, and yeah, um, yet I'm feeling all of this pain and and um my family's falling apart and and it's confusing. And so I remember having to unlearn that. And um, it's really easy, even through life since then, to it's been really easy to fall into like um patterns of trying to work hard or be good or yes, um act a certain way in hopes that blessing follows, right? Or the good follows. And I it and it kind of does sometimes, you know, you make good choices, God tends to bless you, and they're in like a let there's less chaos when you're making good choices, right? But it doesn't always work out that way. Life is painful, and people in our lives make bad choices and that and we can be following God, and the person that we're closest to could decide to make a choice that impacts your life. You know, it's just there's there's no equation there, and I just had to unlearn that about God. Like He's not He's not necessarily protecting us from all of the hard things in life, but he is walking with us through it. Um, and so it's yeah, so that's that's what I've learned over the years.

SPEAKER_02 43:03

Yeah, what I was gonna say, what other was it just the experience of your parents' divorce where you had to like wrestle with that yourself, or was there something else or somebody else that helped shift that perspective and understanding of who God was?

SPEAKER_01 43:20

I I kind of remember being a solo uh being a solo uh processing um and trying to make sense of what was happening in my life. I I had people that definitely did uh can you know like guide me as I moved through that period of pain. Yeah. But um, I think that was kind of something I was negotiating with God or trying to figure out with God on my own. Um, how about you? Did you ever have to learn unlearn anything about God?

SPEAKER_02 43:54

Oh, so many things.

SPEAKER_01 43:57

That's true. You grew up in a very different faith than. Yeah, what we've got. Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_02 44:01

I'm like, man, which which one do I pick? Yeah. I think, I think actually, probably the weirdest thing for me, and this doesn't actually have anything to do without God specifically, but there are still times, even though I have been a Christian much longer than I was not one. I have to do math. Maybe not much, much longer, but but definitely longer, that there are still sometimes things that pop up where I'm like, oh, wait, is that true? Or is that something that is held over from my old belief system? And I I have to wrestle with that, with God. I have to go back to his word. I have to um like really investigate and ask myself, where where is this coming from? Because there's something about it that I'm not sure is quite right. And so I think that's been the most surprising thing as I have unlearned through my life quite a bit of things about God, is that I'm still having to unlearn things. And also, on the other hand, how great it is that he is so gracious to provide us with so many opportunities to continue to unlearn things. You know, even now we get to do that. And so I think that is the beauty of his revelation through his grace to us, that we can we can read his word regularly and new things pop up. And it challenges old thinking that we might have had and old belief systems that we've held on to. And maybe it was something we weren't ready to tackle 10 years ago, but he's grown us and he's brought us to a place where he's like, okay, now we're gonna tackle, you know, we're gonna tackle this. And so it used to make me super uncomfortable, especially being a leader in ministry, that I wouldn't have already known all of these things. And now I get to the place where I'm like, okay, God, like we're gonna, we're gonna dive in and we're gonna figure, we're gonna figure this out together. And I I trust him in that process so much more now than I did, you know, 10 years ago, where it was uncomfortable and I didn't want to talk about it because people I was, you know, leading Bible studies in small groups, and um people look to me as if I should have the answers. And so, how do I ask for help with some of these things that would pop up without there being an immense amount of embarrassment or shame associated with it? So yeah, I think for me there's there's too many to pick from, but that's probably the most surprising part of unlearning and relearning things about who God is.

SPEAKER_01 46:34

Yeah, and he reveals that through his his word um and through the spirit, but also through community, right? Sometimes we we um hear things from people that make us question if what we believe was true or um, and this is the first year in my small group of I have a women's small group that um it's there's been a lot of wrestling with some different opinions and thoughts, and and I'm like, this is beautiful. And it's it's really uncomfortable, but it's beautiful. And so um I'm I'm thankful for the opportunity and I'm thankful that the Holy Spirit just keeps pursuing us and teaching us, and as long as we're open to growing and listening to the Holy Spirit, um, I hope he continues. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:25

I think I think I don't shy away from tough questions like I used to. Even when I don't know the answers, I'm way more willing now to say, you know what, I'm not actually sure. Let me let me do some reading, let me do some research, let me ask some people. You do yours, I'm gonna do mine, and then we're gonna come back together and we're gonna talk about it. Uh, because I also don't ever want to be the sole person people get their truth from. I think that is very dangerous, especially in in in churches and in religious, if you will, um environments. And so I really do encourage people to go out and read for themselves, to listen to different podcasts that might approach the topic from different perspectives. Like it's not just what Miranda says, but it truly is what is God saying and how is he showing you his truth truly, right? Yeah. Um, and so I think that's that's super important. So, listeners, do your own research. Don't ever just listen to anything you're guys say and be like, well, I heard it on their podcast. We might be wrong.

SPEAKER_01 48:29

We're the experts.

SPEAKER_02 48:32

Well, you might be. No, I'm just kidding. Just kidding. Here's here's a fun one. What's a life hack you wish you knew earlier? Like, I don't know. I see these these reels or these, I don't know, these stupid five-minute craft videos that pop up all the time. And you're like, what? Does that actually work? But there are some that are pretty legit. And so what's one they that you're like, man, I wish somebody would have taught me that earlier.

SPEAKER_01 48:59

Um, I think that I would always encourage someone to have your next friend date on the calendar within the next two to four weeks. I just there's something about like life schedules will get in the way every time of prioritizing friendship. And so um a friendship's so necessary, right? And it's always full, it's very fulfilling when you actually do it, you know. So I'm like, have that date on the calendar. And I I would say the same thing about vacations, right? Always have your next vacation kind of planned, or at least in the dreaming stage where you're always thinking ahead of like what are we gonna do next? You know, what do we want to see next? I just feel like um it just helps you to stay in a positive headspace when you have those things on the horizon.

SPEAKER_02 49:45

Yeah, you're so much better at that than I probably will ever be like for real. And in way more practical. I mean, or I guess relational in yours. Mine was like how to cut a pineapple.

unknown 49:58

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 50:01

Like a stupid life. I don't even eat a lot of pineapple because it burns my tongue. Yeah. But when you're gonna cut one, especially, and it seems like you only eat well, at least us. I feel like I only buy pineapple if somebody's coming over for like a barbecue or something. And cutting that. Oh, and watermelon would be the same. Oh, it's hard. I don't cut watermelon well. I watch those videos, I'm just like, why did nobody teach me how to cut fruit? It seems so silly and so simple.

SPEAKER_01 50:31

And yet it has made fruit so I never want people to watch me cut anything in the like dicing an onion. It's not pretty.

SPEAKER_02 50:40

Oh, heavens no, heavens no. Onions are their own, yeah, their own beast. I can't barely see through the tears pouring down my face to be able to adequately cut the onion. I actually usually make Nate cut onion, but anyway, yeah, fruit, fruit, that's mine. Okay, that's super nice. Super important life is my cat how to cut, how to cut fruit. Like, what do you what do you where do you even go after that? That's funny. Okay, Erica. So as we close out our episode for today, it is time for our somehow together question of the day, where we draw a random question from our prompt jar to close out our time together. So, our somehow together question for today is who brings out your weirdest self?

SPEAKER_01 51:39

Oh, that's a good one. Um actually, a few people come to mind, like um Miranda makes me laugh and be goofy. Um, my sister. My sister is probably the one that we act silly and laugh a lot. We send funny memes to each other and videos all the time. Yeah. So I probably my weirdest self. But also my kids, I will do weird dances and things to like get them to laugh. Or, you know, my son likes to pretend like I'm not cool. Yeah. You know, or you are or like that he I know, or like that um he doesn't need to talk to me or whatever. And so I'll do funny things as I walk into his room to try to get his attention. Yeah. So I'm probably him. How about you?

SPEAKER_02 52:26

I love that. I right now I would have to say a couple. So my sisters are are one of the one of them. Uh there, I have multiple sisters, and each one brings out a different weird or random uh side of me. I think right now, though, one of the things that brings out my most weirdest self is the Savannah banana.

SPEAKER_01 52:46

Oh yes, that's a good one.

SPEAKER_02 52:49

Like, and maybe not weirdest self, but definitely like fun, engaged, fun, hyper, um, probably to my core somewhere in there in my real like my most real self. Yeah. I don't know. I'm a I I like to think I like to have fun, but yeah, definitely, I think definitely the Savannah bananas. So they're they they pull something out of me that not a lot of a lot of places or people can. We're gonna go see them again in June. I'm so excited. Yay! I'm so excited. All right, well, thank you so much for tuning in with us today. We will chat with you guys next time. Bye. Thanks for spending time with us today. If this conversation resonated with you, please share it with someone you want to help feel a little less alone. And as you go into your week, ask yourself where in my life do I need togetherness right now? And until next time, we are somehow together.