Idaho AG Raúl Labrador - Did Meta Put Profits Ahead of Kids?

Idaho Attorney General Raúl Labrador joins Lars to discuss the multibillion-dollar settlement with Meta over allegations its platforms were intentionally designed to addict young users. Should tech companies be held responsible when their products harm kids’ mental health?

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SPEAKER_00 0:11

Welcome back to the Lars Lives and Show. It's a pleasure to be with you. I'm glad to get to your phone calls and emails in just a moment. Meta, the company a lot of us knew is Facebook for the longest time, is going to pay over $17 billion in claims that it intentionally designed Instagram to addict children. And Idaho's Attorney General, Raoul Labrador, joins me now. AG Labrador, welcome back to the program. Hey, great, great to be with you. Thanks for having me on your show. So tell me this. And what was the what was the claim that was made in that lawsuit that caused Meta eventually to agree to a settlement of $17 billion?

SPEAKER_01 0:57

So beginning in 2021, attorneys general across the United States, we started investigating whether the social media industry was designing and promoting platforms to children and teens despite known harms. That they knew children were being harmed. They knew that they were being abused, that they were being uh used by these companies. The companies design Instagram with intentionally addictive features. They expose young users to serious mental harms. And they misled the public about the safety. And that's why this is a consumer protection claim, because it's about misleading the public about uh the potential harms that they're that their platforms had.

SPEAKER_00 1:41

Okay. And it was determined, I mean, at at that point, the company said, we'll go ahead and we'll do a settlement and pay the money rather than admit any wrongdoing, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:51

Correct. So they had a uh a settlement or or a verdict in New Mexico where the cup where new the state of New Mexico has sort of led uh was one of the first ones to take it to trial. And we were in the middle of a of another lawsuit in California where Idaho and many other states had joined um in that lawsuit. And we were actually in the middle of trial, and Meta decided to settle before going to verdict.

SPEAKER_00 2:21

Kind of in does that in is that indicative to you that they figured what if they went to verdict, they'd end up losing?

SPEAKER_01 2:28

I think they knew that they they they had a high risk of losing. And then it's not just in in that suit, but seeing what happened in New Mexico, seeing how things were going in California, and knowing that they had a lot of pending lawsuits in many other states, they realized that they they better settle. And and we actually, you know, obviously everybody's talking about the amount of money that they're gonna be handing out, but really it's it's the injunctive relief. It's is the the changes that they're making to their platform that are gonna be so beneficial to families and to children and to parents who are trying to protect their kids at the same time that they're exposed to all these different uh platforms.

SPEAKER_00 3:14

I'm talking to Idaho's attorney general, that's Rao Labrador. So let me ask you about those limits, the changes. They're gonna enforce default daily usage limits, they're gonna block out sometimes during school hours and in nighttime, and they're gonna implement age verification measures for Meta. Is that gonna be enough?

SPEAKER_01 3:34

Well, it it's pages and pages of settlement. In fact, what was strong about this settlement is that even in New Mexico, what the jury found that they were asking Meta to do is not even as strong as what we were able to get them to do in the settlement agreement. So is it enough? I I hope it is, and we're gonna continue to monitor it. There's gonna be a monitoring mechanism where there's like an ombudman who's making sure that they're keeping up with their commitments. You know, the states are gonna have to just keep a close eye on the things that they're doing, but they're making a commitment to parents and and states that they're not gonna be uh uh uh abusing the the platforms that they have. I feel, you know, Lars, I I say this to every parent. Um I I have five kids, they're all grown adults now. If I had to do it all over again, you know what the best solution is? Don't give them phones. If I had to do it all over again, I would not give any of my children. And I was actually pretty strict. I I didn't let my kids have these phones that access the internet till they were 15 or 16. So I didn't give it to them when they were young. But if I if I was doing it all over again, I would just say, you know, wait till they're 18, 19, 20 before you give um these phones to your kids. I think these are very harmful products, and and they're really affecting uh this whole generation of children. So it's something you still have to be vigilant. You know, the state can't do the work for you, the attorney general of your state can't do the work for you. You have to make sure that as a parent, you're being very careful and uh in what you're allowing your kids to access on the internet.

SPEAKER_00 5:26

I'm talking to A.G. Labrador from the state of Idaho. So let me ask you this. You said Meta's design was to create a lifetime user regardless of the psychological damage. Now, as you said, the best advice is don't give your kids a phone to begin with. Has Meta agreed to unengineer the addictive part of what they do? Or is there a way to do that?

SPEAKER_01 5:47

So one of the things that you you you see, you know, is that doom scrolling that we all do, right? Yep. Even us as adults. And and it's gonna limit that for kids. It's gonna limit the the amount of views and the amount, you know, how it goes from one screen to the other, you know, one video to the other. It's gonna limit the amount of hours that that that children can uh can be online. It's gonna allow parents to enable additional optional protective features such as autoplay restrictions. It's gonna allow parents to provide information on teens' time spend, social connections. You know, parents are gonna be provided this information so so they can keep track of their kids. But but don't be mistaken, these companies are trying to make money, and that's why the number one guardian and protector of your children is yourself. I mean, that that was the thing I wondered. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 6:46

Well, uh AG Labrador, that's the thing I wondered about. I mean, if you determined, say, that there was a product like nicotine that was the addictive, that had the addictive qualities, you might say, well, then your product has to have less of that in it. Or if it was alcohol, there'd have to be less of that. Or if, you know, or a drug that's addictive, you'd have to have less of that. And yet in this case, I don't know if there's a way to unwind that clock. Is there?

SPEAKER_01 7:10

Well, I I think there is. I think there's been some studies that that you you can you know get yourself on clock in in some sense. But but the reality is that we we we live in a whole different world. When you and I were children, we didn't have these, you know, we we were worried about maybe drugs and access to some things. But what what these kids are faced with every single day, the the things that are happening online, the people that are reaching out to them, we just have to protect our kids at all costs. And as the Attorney General of Idaho, I think it's my biggest responsibility to ensure that we're not exposing young users to these serious mental harms that can come from addictive technology. And we're doing the best we can to go after these companies.

SPEAKER_00 8:00

Well, uh so it sounds like 18, 17 or 18 billion from Meta. California is going to scoop up about two billion of that, about 10% of it. And Attorney General Raoul Labrador, the Idaho State Attorney General, Idaho will probably get between ninety and a hundred and twenty-eight million dollars. Back in a moment, you're listening to the Large Large of the Show.