Crave To Connect | Building Better Relationships

Parenting With Boundaries And Connection | Crave To Connect | Ep15

• Karina and Michael • Season 1 • Episode 15

Share episode

Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.

0:00 | 55:45

Crave To Connect is a candid, honest, and sometimes hilarious conversation about the messy realities of relationships.Hosted by Karina Paxton, a certified clinical EFT practitioner, and a trauma informed coach, and...

Michael Calderon, a licensed clinical social worker (LSCW) and a licensed clinical alcohol and drug counselor (LCADC) specializing in mental health, addiction, and relationship dynamics

The goal is simple: Real conversations about real life and real real relationships.

With their unique backgrounds in trauma recovery, therapy, and emotional healing, Karina and Michael bring two different perspectives to topics like toxic relationships, healing, personal growth, and understanding human behavior. 

Expect relaxed conversations, unexpected insights, and the occasional awkward moment, because that’s what real conversations look like.

Pull up a chair, get comfortable, and join the conversation.


To get in touch:

Instagram: 

https://www.instagram.com/liveyourlife.coach?igsh=dHJpcm1zZmQ3c3Ex&utm_source=qr

Website:

https://linktr.ee/liveyourlife.coach

Book a Call:

https://calendly.com/liveyourlife-coach/30-minute-discovery-call-helena-guest

Michael Calderon:
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/therapists/michael-calderon-hackettstown-nj/1044394


SPEAKER_00

Welcome to Crave to Connect with your host Karina, the recovering men hater, and Mike, the former emotionally unavailable therapist. Sit back, get comfortable, and relax. Our whole vibe with this podcast is to casually dive into all the messy, hilarious, and sometimes confusing parts of relationships. Whether it's with yourself, other humans, no pressure, just good chats, and maybe some awkward moments.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Um inspired by my mom's recent birthday, uh, she passed away three years ago. Um, and you know, we did a little remembrance for her, and Karina asked me to tell them stories about my mom, and we thought it would make a nice podcast to kind of my mom was a great mom. She uh she had really great boundaries, understood psychology. Um she, you know, as me and my sister, she understood how to parent each child fairly but differently. Um, because you have to give, you know, with fair is giving everyone what they need, not necessarily equal and even.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And my mom really understood how to do that. So we thought we'd talk about uh parenting with boundaries and in honor of my mom. Her name was Linda.

SPEAKER_00

And I I loved that so much. And unfortunately, I never got to meet your mom.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

So when you told me it was her birthday, I asked you, I said, Do you want to do something to remember her and celebrate her, celebrate her life? So you found this like beautiful poster, right? That you said the was it the funeral home that put it together.

SPEAKER_02

Yep.

SPEAKER_00

And that was just that was just so fun for me and my daughter to see because we got to see pictures of you when you were younger, when you were a teenager, pictures of your mom, your sister, when you were yeah, and you were a baby too. And then all the stories you told, it was just so beautiful. And it's was it's very clear to me that you were raised by a very strong, incredible woman, right? That really installed boundaries in you, but also taught you to be a gentleman, also taught you to be caring and empathic and considerate, which you definitely are. And I really think that that starts from home.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, when mom raised me, right? She did a good job.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, she did. And I'm sure, right, our parents' generation was very different than this generation, and you and I have talked a lot about that. Is there was definitely a lot more rules, right, in our households when we were growing up.

SPEAKER_01

Right.

SPEAKER_00

Um, and I think in that era it was sort of like, well, you were born and now you are just going to be part of our lives. And what we talked about, my generation, you know, having children, it's I think it was the opposite. It was like, you're in my life, and now my life evolves around you. Right? And uh and how we talked about how that can really cause a lot of issues in life and also in your marriage or your relationship when your life completely stops. And it takes, and and let's face it, having a child definitely changes everything. Your life is upside down forever, it's never going to be the same. But the extreme of how we were raised by our parents and how my generation, our generation, raises kids now is just so opposite, right?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, very different. Um, and I think um I think uh, you know, my generation, our generation, we kind of our parents started moving more towards the middle, away from fear-based parenting, towards, you know, um, caring about their feelings and about the person recognizing that, you know, about some of the developmental things, but not a lot. And then our generation kind of leapfrogged over to the other side, and we're on the other side of the middle. It would be nice if we could start to shift it back again because um there is middle ground there to be had. And um I think, yeah, I think if the boundaries are important, that's what we're gonna focus on today, mainly um having strong boundaries and following those boundaries is most important to be consistent, fair, firm, and consistent with those boundaries.

SPEAKER_00

And at the same time, stay connected to your child.

SPEAKER_01

Right.

SPEAKER_00

And I think for gosh, for me too, that is one of the hardest things is how do you have boundaries? How do you have roles in your house, especially as the kids get older, but at the same time stay connected, right? Because you know, you're talking about how your mom, it sounds like your mom was interested in your feelings in the household I grew up. There was really none of that. It was like this is just the way things are, and no, I don't remember anyone ever asking me how I felt, what I wanted, why I was sad. And no love. We never said I love you in my household. I never have I never ever heard my mom say I love you.

SPEAKER_01

And my mom, uh, there were times where sh it was, you know, we weren't it was gonna be the way it was, and you know, there was no consideration sometimes that today that might seem very cold and uncaring at times, which it wasn't. Um, you know, but also in my house, you know, especially as I got older, she got as she got older, my mom would end every conversation with I love you. And and I said, you know, mom, you know, you know I love you. I'm not gonna say it every time because it just feels like words after a while. It doesn't feel like there's meaning. So one day she said to me, Do you know why I say I love you after after every time I talk to you? I said, Well, I mean, I know you love me, but I don't know what other purpose it would be. She goes, Because God forbid something ever happened to either of us. I want the last word you ever hear come out of my mouth be, I love you. And so that made sense to me. And now I say it more than I used to.

SPEAKER_00

You say it all the time to me.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, you did. And I I feel the same way. That's the last thing I say to my daughter, too, when I drop her for school and the night before she goes to bed, right? So I'm just so glad that you had a mom that showed that side to you, right? Of of having that connection and that love.

SPEAKER_01

And um so But also having that firmness, like you knew where to stop.

SPEAKER_00

You had respect for her, right?

SPEAKER_01

Oh, absolutely. You respected her, you know, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00

And as a as a boy, they're turned into a man, right? I don't have a boy and I never will have a boy. I can only imagine because I saw my mom struggling with that. Um, the how do you, you know, how do you stay a parent and then be firm and have rules as these boys, my mom is a is a very tiny woman, as my brothers would just skyrocket over her, right? And they would start to get bigger and stronger and louder. And she absolutely struggled because that was a whole different beast. And more aggressive. That was a whole different beast to raise boys versus me. That was just this hormonal, emotional, angry teen, right? It's like two completely different worlds. And and also our parents' generation did not have all this. We didn't have they didn't have books, they didn't have internet, they didn't have therapists, they didn't have people they could go to and say, Well, what do I do? How do I understand how to raise children and and development and like they had no they had no idea, right?

SPEAKER_01

No, and if you had parents that didn't exhibit good parents, strong parenting, then you really had no role model.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Unless you maybe spent time, a lot of time at a friend's house with their family and saw something different. Um, you know, so uh and my you know, my mom had some role modeling, but I could honestly say that my mom was definitely a much better parent than her parents. Um, you know, my grandmother, my mother loved her dearly. Uh, the problem was that since my mom was age seven or eight, she had been an alcoholic. She started drinking and and kept drinking the rest of her life. And when she wasn't drinking, she was a great mom. When she was drinking, she was not. And my mom was able to maintain that consistency throughout. My grandfather was always kind of hands-off.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

He was, you know, he let it was sort of an old school Italian setup in a way, although my grandmother was kind of the authoritarian, which is unusual, but he let my grandmother set the standards, the rules, and then enforced them. And he would step in only when necessary. And but he it was interesting, never hit, you know, because a lot of people got hit back then. My grandmother hit them. My grandfather was not a hitter. My grandfather was a uh I don't think he raised his voice a lot, you know, but when he spoke, they listened. So but he didn't speak a lot. He was a very quiet guy.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So what I have been interested in ever since I became a trauma-informed coach, and especially, you know, a certified EFT practitioner, is in a child healing and understanding that trauma goes back seven generations, right? And I I saw this this reel that got me all choked up. It was it was four different generations and three three different generations. And the grandmother was holding this big rock in front of her, it was so heavy for her to lift, and she turned around and she passed that huge rock down to her daughter. And her daughter took it, and her little daughter was behind her, she was maybe five or six, and the mother was about to turn around, and instead of passing it on to her daughter, she put it on the ground, yeah. Right? So she's like, I am not passing this burden of trauma that was not even mine that was passed down to me. Like, I am ending that right here. So she put that big rock down and instead just turned around and hugged her little daughter, and I got all emotional. And like, this is this is what it's like to break that trauma cycle, right? To break that trauma bond. And and isn't it crazy to think it can go past, it go back seven generations. So things that we do, things that are ingrained into our brain that we are born with in ourselves, we have no idea why we're doing it. The patterns that we that we have carried on through our family lineage, we have no idea. Money issues, right? Parent issues, how to um express emotions, how to communicate, all of that stuff, right? It we literally gets stuck. It really is. It's learned behavior that gets pre-programmed into our neuropathways and our brain, right?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I mean, I was learning terrible behavior, you know, when my dad was younger, his behavior was not good. Um, and I realized at a fairly young age, age 13, that I was starting to behave like him.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And it was an incident that occurred that I and I stopped myself and I was like, I'm not, I don't want to be like this. And I decided I want to be the opposite of it. So I did everything in my power to try and do different, even at that young age.

SPEAKER_00

And that's incredible that you realized that and you caught yourself in it, right?

SPEAKER_01

No, I wasn't thinking about stopping generational patterns. I just didn't want to be that because I hated his behavior and I sure as I didn't want to do it myself.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And so I think I did a pretty good job. I mean, you know, even today, I'm sure I behave in ways that my dad does. I mean, he was my role model for a male growing up, and you know, the guy is today. Um I there's still some things I wouldn't want to emulate, but he's a pretty good decent guy now. So pretty good guy. So uh, but as a young man, he had a lot to work through.

SPEAKER_00

And subconsciously, right, that is what we can pass on to our children. Even if we and I remember, you know, when I was when I was trying to get pregnant, and and that's a whole nother podcast, but um I had a really hard time getting pregnant. My daughter's an IVF baby, it took me five and a half years to have her. So just there was a long period period in the beginning where I thought, I don't think I'm gonna have children. Because what if I passed on to my child what I had experienced? Like I was, it took me a lot of therapy to work through that and and understand that I did have a choice, I could do things differently. So, so once I understood that, I made it my mission to understand how can I do things the opposite way? Right, in the complete opposite way that my mother raised me, because I was never ever going to do that to my to my child if I ever had a child. But then I also understood that unconsciously I could be right passing on these patterns, behaviors, feelings, emotions onto her without even knowing. So thank the Lord that we have incredible therapists, that we have the internet, which is an incredible lot of research, and the knowledge and the understanding that this is what all of us do because we are all humans, right? We all have trauma, we all have healing to do. So this is what we can do, and this is what we can do to try to help that and stop that.

SPEAKER_01

Right. And I think for a lot of for some people, it's wanting to do opposite. But you know, I think about it, for many of us, it's doing it much better. You know, wanting to, you know, for me it was I want to be the opposite of my dad when I was younger. And I would say um probably with some of it was true, but other parts it was do it better. Do it better, just be better, right? Be better, don't allow my emotions to become deregulated the way he would, and don't you know have more control over myself, um, not only from the people around me, but from for myself.

SPEAKER_00

For yourself.

SPEAKER_01

Because when we're deregulated like that, when we lose control, how many parents yell and then they hit their kids, and you never ever. I'm not an advocate of using physical discipline with children, but if if anyone does, it should never be done out of anger. It should be done as a teaching method. You know, when my dad hit me as a kid, it was out of anger. There was no teaching involved. He was hitting me out of anger, and so do it better, right? Better could be if you're gonna use physical discipline, it's not out of anger, or better could be don't hit your kids, find a better way to ex to teach them differently. And especially now, when my dad was raising me, there was no, there was very little research in this area.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, there was there was none. It was just what was done to him, right? And and so many studies have been shown that using physical violence to children are never ever a good idea. It is never ever something we should do because the marks that it leaves on these kids, they don't learn anything from it. It's just they learn violence, it's just yeah, violence and this fear of someone raised their hand at me. So we don't do that in this.

SPEAKER_01

And that doesn't teach respect, and that's what parents used to think. It teaches fear because kids who are beat by their parents don't respect their parents.

SPEAKER_00

Absolutely not.

SPEAKER_01

They don't have positive things to say. They, you know, some do later in life, not in a moment, but they don't learn respect.

SPEAKER_00

Absolutely not.

SPEAKER_01

No, they learn fear, they learn fear.

SPEAKER_00

So this leads me into what I understood early on was that children will trigger the heck out of you, right? Your own children would trigger the heck out of you because they are going to shine a spotlight on all of your own unhealed wounds. So I think being a parent, I think one of the hardest things to learn is to regulate yourself. So when your child, and they will, from the minute they're babies until they're grown, they will trigger you. But it's really not them, right? They are either, and I remember, I remember having a newborn. She's a newborn, right? My daughter has needs, she needs to be fed a certain amount of times a day, she needs to be changed, she needs to do all that. And and that's normal. That's what we need to do as parents. But when we are not regulated, we get it's it's it's a lot. And especially when you do it all on your own. Like I always say, I'm a one-woman village, I don't have family nearby. I have a couple of close girlfriends, and we definitely help each other out. But I really did this on my own, even when I was in my marriage. And I remember multiple times getting just to this breaking point. You're not sleeping, right? Your kid, it's just this constant, your kid is all over you when they're little. There's no personal space, there's no breathing room. And life as you know it is over, it's changed, right? It is going to be very different from that moment on. And and of course, I think you try you you seem to understand that when you have a you're like, yeah, of course, it's going to be different. But until you're really living it, you have no idea. You have no idea. And there's no manuals for how do you raise children? And all children are different. What works for one kid does not work for the other, right? So it's I remember just that it was like all these puzzle pieces trying to put that together. So what I realized I needed to do for me, and it's different for everybody, is I'm like, I am by myself. I did not have a good role model for how to parent. So I did so much research. Thank God that was available in 2014 too. On I was trying to find, you know, children, parenting experts, psychologists, anybody that I sort of related to because that's another thing, too. There is so much information out there, right? There are so many different ways. This is what you should do.

SPEAKER_01

Well, from none to it. Exactly.

SPEAKER_00

Too much. This is how you should do. Don't say that, but you should say that it's right. Do you sleep trained? Do you not? It's it's it's a lot. So, but what I found was I found someone named Dr. Becky Kennedy, and she goes by the name Dr. Becky, and she is a clinical psychologist and a parenting expert, and she has written multiple books. She has a podcast. I follow her on all her social media platforms, and she, I just I like her so much.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And she has two children. They are now 14 and 11. So my daughter is 11. So it's just been really helpful to follow her because what she does is she's really good at sharing real life examples. And she is really good at saying, she's like, even though I'm a parenting expert in quotation, she's like, I get triggered. I absolutely do. I get triggered, and this is what I did, and this is what I probably should have done anyway, instead, right? So for me, having someone like that just to Google certain things or reading her books or whatever just helped me tremendously. And what she has said from day one is as a parent, you have to learn to regulate yourself. You must learn when you start to get triggered and upset, do not take that anger out on your child. You have to regulate yourself so you can be in your body in the moment and not because what happens is if you get dysregulated, when your child is dysregulated, it's just gonna blow up even more, right? You have to be the parent.

SPEAKER_01

And then the child is in harm's way at that point. And you know, we're all gonna be triggered, it's what you do after being triggered.

SPEAKER_00

Exactly.

SPEAKER_01

How do you handle that?

SPEAKER_00

Exactly. Right screaming and yelling, and she's like, I certainly have done that, and and me too, absolutely. But she's like, that doesn't help. So her philosophy philosophy is how do you parent with boundaries and respect, but also connection?

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, it's interesting with the screaming and yelling, and I'm not great at this, but I've shared it with clients. It's like, especially if someone's a yeller, what I always say to them is whisper instead.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Right? And it's like I need you to stop doing that. And then they're like, what? And they're leaning in. I need you to stop doing that.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Why are you whispering? Because I want you to hear me. Well then why are you so quiet? Yeah. So you listen. Yeah. And what happens is it also drops it drops the um the tension in the atmosphere.

SPEAKER_00

A hundred percent.

SPEAKER_01

Right? All of a sudden, because you broke it by whispering, and then they're like, What? Because they're not ready for that. Even if they can hear you, they're not processing because they're waiting for you to yell at them.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And now all of a sudden they're like, wait, what? This is different. It throws everything off, and both of you can kind of reset.

SPEAKER_00

That's that's a really good tip. And and it's like the opposite of what you want to do in the moment, because you I've heard so many parents. I had a friend that used to say, So when my son is like, why are you yelling? I'm like, because you're not hearing me. That's why I keep yelling, which of course didn't didn't help at all.

SPEAKER_01

You become Charlie Brown's teacher.

SPEAKER_00

You're just gonna keep yelling, and and then they just become immune, immune to the yelling, right?

SPEAKER_01

Right.

SPEAKER_00

Um, so what Dr. Becky likes to say is boundaries are not about punishment. It's really about just creating safety in their life for kids so they can grow and they can thrive. Because kids like they like boundaries, they like routines, they like rules, so they know what they need to do.

SPEAKER_01

We all do.

SPEAKER_00

We all do.

SPEAKER_01

We all do. I mean, you know, structure, you know, like I talk about structure, that's boundaries too. We all want to know when we're left to run roughshot, it causes a lot of chaos and it causes a lot of deregulation, even in the person that's setting those boundaries or the person in charge. You know, I live alone. If I'm not structured, if I'm or if I don't have boundaries with others, it it it causes deregulation and anxiety for me.

SPEAKER_00

100%.

SPEAKER_01

And so it's it's important for all of us, but kids in particular, structure and boundaries are interesting.

SPEAKER_00

Because they do not know, they come into this world as little, like helpless little creatures, right? They are formed and shaped by their environment, by their caregivers.

SPEAKER_01

And most importantly, it's love to them.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

No matter how much they fight them.

SPEAKER_00

Right.

SPEAKER_01

Kids who don't have boundaries feel unloved on the whole. Kids who have boundaries feel much more loved.

SPEAKER_00

And it feels scary to them, it feels confusing because they don't know what's next, right? They don't know what you need to do. And so Dr. Beggie likes to say that effective boundaries are rooted in love and respect. It's not control. They help children learn how to manage their emotions and their actions, right? Like, what is it that's expected of me? That's what children need to know at all ages. What is expected of me and how can I do that, right? And she also says the key to raising resilient children is consistent boundaries combined with open, honest communication. Because those boundaries can be so tricky, right? It's like if you don't get off this iPad, you are never ever going to watch the iPad for like another month. I've had that happen, I've heard that from so many parents before. And then what happens? A week passes or a day passes, not even a week, a day passes, and the kid is driving you crazy, and you're like, oh my God, here's your iPad. Please take your iPad so I can get a break.

SPEAKER_01

She just killed herself so I can get a break.

SPEAKER_00

So what you just said was you're not going to watch the iPad per week, but because you're driving me crazy after day one, I'm gonna do it.

SPEAKER_01

I reward your bad behavior, which means I'll get more of it.

SPEAKER_00

And then the kid is like, Well, what does that mean, right?

SPEAKER_01

So it's like consistently, it's like Well, you're teaching them to misbehave to get what they want. That's unfortunate. And that's anybody again, it's not just kids. Nope. You know, think about okay, if if your spouse is doing something you don't like, how are you contributing? Because if you're rewarding the bad behavior, if every time they get angry you give them what they want, well, there you go. That's why they're getting angry so much to get what they want.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, a hundred percent. And it could be the hardest thing, right? Because in the heat of the moment, we might say something, and then after we say it, we're like, shit, why did I say that? Why am I gonna why would I take the iPad away? That's gonna hurt me. Or why did I say that you don't get to do that? Because now I know this kid is going to be bugging me about it forever, right?

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_00

And so what she also talks about a lot is is to repair and to go back in and to say, look, I know I got really mad about that at this moment, and I know that I raised my voice, and this is something I'm working on, right? So it's it's repairing that what happened to, but to let them know I am working on it, I am human, I am not perfect, right? But what I expect from you is A, B, and Z. So the kid knows, right? It's just so important to have those clear boundaries of what's expected.

SPEAKER_01

Clear with your language, like if you tell your kid to go clean their room, yeah. Well, clean their room to them and clean their room to you might be different, right?

unknown

Yes.

SPEAKER_01

I told you to clean your room. Why are your clothes in the corner?

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_01

Well, they're not all over my room, they're in the corner now. Yeah, I want them hung up. Well, you you didn't say that. So you need to tell them I want you to clean your room, which means all of your clothes are off the floor and put away. I want your room vacuuming and I want all your furniture dusted. Now we have a clear picture of what that looks like.

SPEAKER_00

Details.

SPEAKER_01

Right.

SPEAKER_00

And that happens to me too. I am actually guilty of that too. When I say, you know, can you go clean your bathroom or clean your room? And she's like, Yeah, I did. And then I come in and I'm like, there's still stuff in the corners, and there's and she's like, I did the best I could, but when I'm really clear about can you can you pick up the towels from the floor and like hang them back up again so they're not they don't dry all moldy? Can you put that in there? And what I like to say too is can you do me a favor and do that, right? When I sort of use that kind of language, I have found that my daughter responds so much better than that. She's like, Oh yeah, yeah, I'll do that. Sure, I'll do that. So I'm not barking orders, I'm not like, I expect this to be done within whatever time, right? So often I'll say, you know what, before we leave today, yes, could you just get your room done, get your homework done. This way it's done, it's out of the way, and then we can enjoy the day, right? So again, it's me setting boundaries and like what I expect from.

SPEAKER_01

It's okay to remind them if they're not having done it. Don't forget, you promised you would do this before we left.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Right? If it's a few hours in and they haven't done it yet.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. Yeah, so they know, right? So what Dr. Becky says, and I really like this a lot. This is a scenario, and I think that's so helpful when we have little scenarios. You have a child that refuses to do the homework or chores, that happens, right? They get home from school, they're exhausted. I don't want to do this. They want to be on the iPad or they want to be on their phone or whatever, right? So, what she's saying is like, you got to set clear boundaries around this is your responsibility, you know. So she says something like, I know you're upset about doing chores, but they're part of our family rules, and they'll just find a way to make it easier.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_00

Like, how can we do this together? So, again, you're not yelling, you're not screaming at them, you're not making them feel a certain way. It's like this is part of our family rules, and this and this needs to be done.

SPEAKER_01

We can compromise, right?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

I want I want you to get started on your homework as soon as they get in. But mom, whatever, you know, I I want to snag, and okay, I'll tell you what. You know, I haven't whatever. I I've been working all day, I'll tell you what. It's whatever time, three o'clock now. I want you to get started on your homework at 3 30. So you have a half hour to have your snack, do whatever you want, and then I want you to get started on your homework. And then you might even say, depending how much homework, right? And then, you know, if you need to, we could take a break at 4 30.

SPEAKER_00

And that's choices too. And Dr. Becky talks about that a lot too. Like, giving kids choices really empower independence, right? And so they get so they don't feel like they're forced to do everything, right?

SPEAKER_01

It can be like them being compliant too, because now they feel empowered.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, they feel like they get to make the decision, right? So a question could be like, would you like to do your homework now or after a short break? It's like the homework has to be done, but do you want to do it now or do you want to eat a snack first? Right? Because, and this this was my generation, my mother's generation for sure. It was just barking orders constantly, right? It was like, you need to do your homework now, right? And you really felt like you couldn't breathe. You felt like you were in this prison, right? Kids like to be given choices, but again, the the outcome is that you get to do you have to do your homework.

SPEAKER_01

And that was somewhere, that's where my mom, you know, my mom fell a little short, but don't forget, no one, there was nothing to reference. But my mom's rule is as soon as you get home, you gotta do your homework. I'm like the most ADHD kid there is. That's like the worst thing for me.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Like I've been I've been having to do this all day. And they don't give you breaks except for gym or lunch, and then you know, and the more the less structure it was, the more I'd get in trouble a lot of times when I was little because you know, I also had trouble regulating myself. And then I had to come home and then I had to start doing my homework immediately. Because then it wouldn't be something she had a fight with us at about a bed. But if she would have just given me the option of a little, I'll tell you what, why don't you know, you have a half hour, but then you have to start.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Right? And when I tell you, you know, I'll I'll remind you of five minutes, and then and that's the other thing. When you have kids, it's good for any kid, but especially ADHD kids. If you tell them dinner is in a half hour, don't just then tell them dinner's ready.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_01

A good idea would be like, okay, dinner's in a half hour. That means at five o'clock, dinner will be on the table.

unknown

Right.

SPEAKER_01

Right. So if they're playing or whatever, they're doing homework, you tell them, hey, in my case, Michael, it's it's a quarter to five. That means in 15 minutes, dinner will be on the table.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And then honestly, I would recommend with ADHD kids in particular, but any kid, give them a five minute every five minutes, give them a warning because if they're working, they can come to a to a place that can start to wind down to it. Or even if they're playing, because that was one of the big things with me, right? When I was little, I'd be playing and I had this this whole thing I want that I was playing out, right? And then my mom would be like, okay, dinner, and I would want to finish what I was doing because I didn't know if I have all these warnings, I can get there faster. Yeah, and then I could feel satisfied with whatever pretending I was doing, yeah, and come to dinner without a fight.

SPEAKER_00

That's beautiful that your mom knew that, right?

SPEAKER_01

No, she didn't do that. I'm saying that's the best thing.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, she did not do that.

SPEAKER_01

That's the one thing my mom didn't do. Okay.

SPEAKER_00

No, but it's what she could have done.

SPEAKER_01

But we've learned that as we go, right? And that's what you know, when we're talking about ADHD, I've done a lot of studies studying on ADHD and research. That's the most effective. But anything, you know, when we're dealing with something with somebody with special needs, it's good for any anything you do for somebody with special needs is good for everyone.

SPEAKER_02

For anybody, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Right? Even your husband, especially if your husband's ADHD like me. Michael, dinner's gonna be ready and and at five o'clock. Michael, it's 4 45. We're gonna be on the table, right? If we're having dinner, that wouldn't be the bad thing to do if you want to make sure I'm there on time.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's a really good point because we lose track of time. Adults do for sure, and and especially children too, right? Yeah, and even timers, like we do that a lot in this house with Alexis, and now we have we have the countdown clock that you were introduced to us. That's been really helpful. But when my daughter she does that all on her own, she will say, Alexis, set a timer for whatever. Right, and that helps her a lot because then when the timer goes off, she knows that oh, so now I have to get ready to do whatever, right? So it's like so just these little steps just helps eliminate right the stress, the anger, the I can't believe I have to keep reminding you. Well, you do because these are children, and the rest of us too, we're just humans, right?

SPEAKER_02

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00

There, there's nothing wrong with that. But again, we can get as parents so activated activated inside ourselves that we can explode because this is probably, let's say, five, it's five or six. We're making dinner, right? Five or six the end of the day, we are exhausted, we've been through a whole day, they've been to school, everyone's like nervous system is shot, like it's not gonna take much before any of us are going to explode, right? So it's like, how can we do this together in a way that that eliminates that insane chaos?

SPEAKER_01

And a time timer is something like we've talked about during our ADHD episode, but it for those of you not aware, that would be a great thing, especially if you're afraid you might forget to give a warning.

SPEAKER_02

A hundred percent.

SPEAKER_01

It's a clock that's an hour and you spin it, and then when you turn it to the hour or however long, half hour, whatever you turn it to becomes all red. Yeah, and so as it times down, the red gets smaller and smaller, and it gives kids a visual. And for instance, I know your daughter really loves using this.

SPEAKER_00

She does, it helps her a lot. And then you can even set an alarm on the back.

SPEAKER_01

Yep.

SPEAKER_00

That goes off, which actually happened in one of our episodes.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

But none of us know what it was at first, so both we just stopped talking, and then afterwards I realized it was the clock. I thought it was something else. So you can also set a timer so that can help you too, right? So it's just just help yourself, right? So you don't get frustrated and they don't get frustrated.

SPEAKER_01

So here's another kind of to take the boundary thing that we're talking about. So obviously the consistency of structure, the boundaries, giving kids choices, but you know, the other thing that parents seem to really juggle and struggle with, this is something that my mom was so good at, and so are you, which is how do you balance between parenting, being the authority figure, that they respect you, um, right? They show you respect, they're they're compliant with the things you ask most of the time. And then kind of having them, I'd say being a friend, but you can't be their friend. Too many parents want to be friends. You're not their friend, you're their parent. But how do you then balance um having them trust you like a friend? Right? How do they know that they can come to you with anything even though you're their parent? Yeah. Now, no kids are gonna come with everything to their to their parents, but you want to know, like I went to my mom with most stuff. My mom was unbelievable with that line. And honestly, my friends went to my mom with stuff. You know, my friends adored my mom. She was like the I don't know if they say what they called her, the cool mom, but she was she was just the mom, she was everybody's mom. They called her mom. Yeah, you know, my close friends would call her mom. Um, you have the cool mom, which could be a good thing or maybe not, especially if you're trying to be cool.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

But how did, you know, so how do you do it? Because my mom was so good at it, and it really is a skill, and I actually believe in instinct. So 100%.

SPEAKER_00

Well, thank you for saying that. And um, I just I mean, again, I didn't know what I was doing. So I just, you know, with the help of Dr. Becky and and other resources out there, I think I understood really early on when she was born is that connection is just so important and respect. Like I always wanted her to respect me, and still to this day, she's 11. If my tone changes and I get stern, I could tell there's something on her that's sort of like I do not, I do not need to yell. I don't do she gets very upset if I yell, and I hate doing that, and it uh definitely happens at times without getting a lot better at it. But when my voice turns a little bit to being stern, her body sort of stops and she like listens, right? But I understood early on that that connection, so I don't even think it has to be like, oh, I want to I want to be cool, I want her to be my friend. No, of course. It's just like the connection of I am the parent, right? And I'm in charge. You are part of this family, right? You are you are not the entire you're not the only one in this family, you are part of this family. So we are team. I say that to her all the time. Like you and I are team.

SPEAKER_01

She gets to make decisions, right?

SPEAKER_00

So when you are a team, you are teammates, so you have to work together, right? So if we help each other do X, Y, and C, we are going to get to whatever it is we want to get to so much faster, right? So if I do my part and you do your part and we do our parts together, and kids like that because they want to feel like that they're contributing, they want to feel like that they're important, they want to feel like that they're hurt and they're seen. And and I think another thing I really did was, and I saw this in an Oprah podcast, um, they were talking about how children feel loved and how they feel seen and heard and appreciated. And they had somebody on there, I don't remember who, but some sort of expert that says every time your child walks into a room, look them in the eye. That eye contact. So they know I see you.

SPEAKER_02

I don't feel invisible.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, every time, and especially if you've been apart for the day or whatever, first thing I do when she gets into my car, she takes the bus, and I pick up the bus stop. I always look her right in the eye and I say, How is your day? So good to see you. I gave her a hug, give her a kiss. But I still do that. The morning she wakes up and night before she goes to bed, that eye contact is just so important, right? So that line between how does she know that she has to do certain things, and at the same time, her and I can have fun, right? It's it is a tricky line, but I feel like we have really gotten to a point.

SPEAKER_01

But she can talk to you about things she's struggling with.

SPEAKER_00

Oh, she does. She comes to me.

SPEAKER_01

She talked to you about an incident with one of her friends, well, two of her friends, where they were kind of at war with each other, sort of. And I I remember when you told me about that, that she did that. I I thought that was pretty that reminded me of my mom.

SPEAKER_00

And something else I have learned is kids don't need you to solve their problems, right? They will tell you if they need help. Like when my daughter came home with that scenario, is they want you to listen, they just want to know that you hear them, right? So that's something else that I learned from from the NAWEP, is when they talk, right? We don't sit there and go, Well, what about doing this or doing this? What I have gotten, I think, really good at is just to go, really? Wow, then what happened? Oh, wow. Uh-huh. Well, that sounds that's that sounds like you had a hard day, right? They they want to be heard, they want to know they can come to you. Yeah, and they'll ask me. And then I'll also say to her, I said, Do you want me to listen or do you want advice? Like, I'll I'll give that, I'll give that option too, so she can decide that. And often she'll be like, No, I just want to talk. I'm like, that's great. And often she'll say too, she'll be like, Can we just can we talk, mom? Can we just like talk? No, I don't want to do that. Can we just like talk? Like if we are having dinner and I'm like, Do you want to play a game? She's like, I just want to talk. Like she really likes that, right? And that's again because I I'm listening to her, and I'm not telling her, that's weird that you feel that way, or I would do this instead, or no. Like this is her expressing and getting everything out of her body. And then if I feel like it's appropriate, I might say to her, if I'm confused about what does she need, I might just ask her, right? Do you want me just to keep listening or do you want some advice?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And I have found that that just that maintains that beautiful connection that she knows she can come to me. I'm not gonna reprimand her, I'm not gonna say that was a bad idea. I'm just here to listen, and this is a safe space.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah, I think so many times when how many times do we want to solve problem? I know as a guy I'm I want to fix, right? We do, and so we it's almost in some ways, it's gonna sound weird, but it's selfish in some ways, right? It's empowering for us, but oftentimes people just want to be heard, and sometimes just having the conversation, expressing feelings can help somebody come to their own resolution.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, yeah, a hundred percent, a hundred percent. So since my daughter is uh is a preteen, she's 11, so far, so good, knock on wood.

SPEAKER_01

It reminds me of what teenagers were when I was a teenager, though. She's advanced, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

She's she has she's advanced a lot, and all of this social media, right, is is certainly not helping. No kids are just growing up like way too quick, right? So, and I see that with so many of her friends from school, and I hear it from from my mom friends to struggle, and I know it's coming. And this is also part of of what they're supposed to do, right? They're supposed to push boundaries, they're supposed to to become independent, they're supposed to detach themselves from you. We want that, but we don't want them to do that, showing disrespect, right? Or calling you names or treating you a certain way.

SPEAKER_01

When you say detach, we're tired, it's gradual. Yeah, I mean, when you think about it, of all the species on earth are our young stay with us longer than any other species on earth. Yes, as far as I know. Yeah, because maybe there's a species I'm unaware about, but yeah, you know, 18 years typically minimum. That's a long time to leave the nest. And it's because we're so intricate and there's so much to learn. And so we want them to detach appropriately.

SPEAKER_00

And we want them to do that too, so they can learn on their own, right? And they can learn from their mistakes. We want them to fall so they can give themselves up and they can keep walking. We want them to know that I'm here, like I'm here. But you have to do this thing called life. You have to walk your own path.

SPEAKER_01

That's that's the basis of being a parent.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Right? If I if if someone said to tell me in one sentence, the purpose of parenting, it's to get your life ready for your, I'm sorry, to get your children ready for life without you.

SPEAKER_02

100%.

SPEAKER_01

And it takes 18 or more years to do it.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And that's what we're here to do.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

We're here to love them and enjoy them, but the basis, the bottom line job we have is to prepare them for life without us.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And absolutely, and teach them, right? How to be kind, how to be respectful, how to be resourceful, how to be resilient, how to know what to do, right, when they're in a situation, to know to trust their gut instinct. I I say that a billion times, and you've heard me say that a billion times. What do you feel in your body with certain situations, right? So when my daughter talks to me about things in school, how did that feel? I always say, how did that feel in your body? And she can then explain it because I want her, right, to be at a party. If she's going to be at a party at some day when she's very, very old, right? And someone at the party is offering her something to drink or to smoke or whatever they do at that time when she gets that old. I want her to feel in her body. No, that doesn't feel good. Oh no, I'm not gonna get into a car with all these teenagers because I know that I'm not supposed to do that, right? I want her to know deep inside herself, this feels uncomfortable. I would never want her to do something just because now I'm not gonna look cool. Now I'm gonna be made fun of, and it's important to me what other people feel about me. That's not what it's like. And my favorite saying to her is you never want to disappoint yourself. You disappoint everyone else, including me, including your mother, before you disappoint yourself. If this doesn't feel right to you and you don't want to do it, you say that out loud. You always say what you feel on the inside, you say that out loud.

SPEAKER_01

Right. And then it becomes to get back to where you were with the social media, then teacher. This is what I do for a living, there is no social media addiction. The only behavioral addiction we have is gambling. I think when they write the new DSM, there will be other things. Video games, in my opinion, are very addictive. Yeah, pornography is very addictive, and social media is also very addictive. There are elements in it that just draw you in and keep you coming back and coming back. And whether it's doing plain like roadblocks like the kids do, or the other one, Minecraft, or if they're on YouTube, or TikTok, TikTok. I mean, I sometimes find myself kind of in it's like I could lose time in TikTok watching these short videos.

SPEAKER_00

So what Dr. Becky says. Is, you know, you have a teen, a preteen, and they are just so focused on their phone and screen time, right? What she advised to do is you want to establish clear, consistent boundaries about around that device for them to use because they're going to use it once they start. It is very, very hard to pull that back and say you can't use it, right? So what she likes to say is you can say something like or understand it's so hard to step away from your phone. It is so hard for me to, and it is as parents, right? But we need to set limits to help you stay balanced, right? And another idea that she has is you involve them in creating the roles so they can have a say, so they can have autonomy, right? Well, what do you think? Right? What do you think will help you? How would it help you so you can actually step away from the phone and do other things at the same time? Because what we see so much, and I hear that from my clients too, is that they say, That's it, took a phone away. I, you know, no screen time for like whatever. And and then what do the kids want? The kids just want that more and more. And then they start really hating you because what's so important to remember is it's addictive to the brain. It's a dopamine hit that they get, that we get as adults too, when we're watching, we're scrolling. And there's nothing else, unfortunately, that gives your brain that same dopamine hit. So it's important to remember, right? And I wish I was very good at it when my daughter was younger. I was very good at Friday, Friday after school or after whatever, even when she was not in school. And I I really I was I did a good job starting her much later. I think she was like four or five before she even knew what an iPad was, compared to what parents do now.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_00

But it was only Friday and it was only for a couple hours. And then what happened as she got older, she would say, Can I watch a little? And she would. And then it just the time in between became longer and longer and longer, right? And once you allow that to happen, their brain wants that more and more and more. So now I find myself several times during the day, I'll have to say, Can you put that away? Can you put your phone away? Can you be pressing with me? Can you do that? And it's it's like I have, I have, I have no clear advice to how this works, but it is just getting them to understand that, and I explained that to her two a million times. This is what it does to your brain. It is so addictive.

SPEAKER_01

And I think having, especially with kids, even teenagers, it's hard much harder when they're in high school. But having pretty strict boundaries about time on the phone or on the video games, whatever, um is one way of doing it. Um, you know, I think that that that's really important. I think um teaching them good decision making because of what they may run into, right? Yeah, is also important. Um, but also like having um, you know, technology free nights if possible, which could or may not include a TV, right? Like we could sit and we do that, we sit and play board games, yeah, or a card game, or you could sit and talk, or um, you know, could take a walk in nature or sit outside. You know, we just bought this baby pool that we're gonna lounge out in, yeah uh outside the house because we have a community pool, but you know, it's something nice that we can cool off in and just relax in.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

Nice big baby pool that all three of us will fit in with the bench. Cup holders.

SPEAKER_02

I mean, it's really that.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. Um, you know, I think if if those things are taught, obviously there still can become a problem. You know, one of the things too, with the kids on so much, I just I it sort of it's not really related to boundaries, but as a health issue that I'm seeing so much is I am watching so many people and so many kids, and they constantly have their neck crane downward into these phones.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And the damage that I'm afraid that this generation is going to do to their necks and their backs with what they're doing because it's so long every day.

SPEAKER_02

100%.

SPEAKER_01

You know, we would maybe crane our necks before when we were growing up reading a book. Um, but you know, even watching TV, you were leaning back watching against the couch, right? And so I think it's something to monitor for parents, is also how they're doing it, right? Um, because they have their heads down and craned, and that I know from somebody who has issues with this my neck, that is absolutely terrible posture to have.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And they're doing it. I I mean, I everywhere I go, I see even adults.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, head down. It's so true. You don't even think about it, right? It's you have your head down.

SPEAKER_01

And so it's something to point out because I would hate to see this generation struggle with back pain that we've never seen before. Because of that.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, because of that.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And I think what before we wrap up here, I think what all that comes down to is just connection, right? So the the the ideas that you mentioned, right? Like playing board games together, sitting outside at night talking, going for a walk together. Because what we all want, and especially kids, is we want to feel a connection with our parents, right? We want to feel like we are seen, we are heard, we are together, we're doing something together.

SPEAKER_01

But then balancing it with giving them their own space, right? Like your girl daughter will go up to her room, yeah, and she'll be up there for hours in her room doing whatever she's doing, right? And I remember doing that as a kid as well.

SPEAKER_00

Yes, teaching them to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_01

Right, that was my space, right? So we want to balance it out, but we want to make sure that there is that balance and that communication, right? I think if it's possible, if there's dinner, don't let them take their food up to their room, have dinner together, yeah, and leave the devices in the living room, not in the kitchen. I mean, it's the studies have shown that families who have dinner together um four to five nights a week, which isn't always possible with sports and everything in people's work schedules, but four to five nights a week, the chance for their children to end up um with a substance use addiction, whether drugs or alcohol, drastically decreases by just having dinner and communicating with one another. And that's the key, communicating. Again, if you're all on your devices, it's it's better, but it's still not that good. It's it's a time to catch up with each other, check in, find out who has a crush on who, and you know, and what friend is you know mad at the other friend and everything else going on in their lives.

SPEAKER_00

And that takes asking questions because every parent out there knows if you say to your child, how was school? They go fine, good, that's it. You're never gonna get anything. So what I've learned was I gotta ask specific questions, right? Oh, what happened to recess today? How is this and this person doing? How was history? Like you ask them specific questions to get them to talk, and then you might get a little bit more than good or fine or whatever.

SPEAKER_01

Right. And you want to ask open-ended questions if you can. Yes, I mean not always, but but an open-ended, you want a more of an answer in yes or no.

SPEAKER_00

So you're curious, right? So you were just a little like, I am so interested in what's happening. And and please know out there, I get it. Like parents, I don't think we've ever been more overwhelmed in this era than we are than we are now. What all the things we're juggling and work and kids, and it it is a lot. So trying to remember every day, oh my god, I gotta connect with my child, I gotta do this again. It does not have to be all day, right? It is it is really quality and not quantity. Because for a lot of parents, they work a million hours a day, the kids are in school, their activities after school, you have five minutes in the morning and five minutes at night. But what do you do in that time, right? Right. How do you show up for your kids and how do you show up for yourself?

SPEAKER_01

And it's interacting, right? Even if you're if you're watching TV and you say nothing and you're on the opposite of the couch, it's not really quality time, whether it's your spouse or partner or your kids. Yeah, but you know, even if you're doing that, one thing to connect with our kids is hey, you guys are watching Stranger Things, right? Yes, is and you guys were connecting throughout, but let's say you weren't, you could say, so hey Cora, how did how do you think so-and-so felt when this happened?

SPEAKER_00

Oh yeah, talk about it.

SPEAKER_01

Talk about, but ask them qu like deep questions, right? Or how did that make you feel? What if how would you have felt if you were in this character's position? What would you have done? Would you have done something different? Yeah, and now all of a sudden just sitting on the couch and not interacting turns into this rich bonding type of communication.

SPEAKER_00

Always, we always do that, and it's so important. So again, it's just being open and being curious, always curious, always curious and just asking questions. And and it's just it's never too late to start that, right? If you're one of the parents out there, none of us are perfect, please know that. We just nobody has any idea what we're doing. We're trying to do our best. It's never too late to start one little thing. What could that be? Well, maybe tonight, maybe on a Sunday, we are just going to have family dinner. Maybe that's the only day you do it. You do it on Sunday, you're like devices, let's put that on the table. We're gonna spend time, we're gonna go around the room, around the table, we're gonna talk about what we did this week and what we didn't do. So you just start establishing just very little things. You're in the car together. I say that to my daughter too. I'm like, I'm like, I want to tell me about your day, tell me what happened, and I'll ask her specific questions. So she's not on her phone as we're driving, right? So you can just do little bits throughout the day in order to sort of form that connection.

SPEAKER_01

And you know, you can also start if you don't give a lot of choices. Hey, if you want to start out, let's say on a Friday, and Friday a lot of people order pizza. You can give one of your children or if you're one child the choice. Hey, we always order pizza, would you like to order out somewhere else? Or you get to choose the type of pizza we order, right? Right? Yeah, let's say whatever toppings or you know, mom, I really want to never get Sicilian. Okay, we'll get Sicilian.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, give them choices.

SPEAKER_01

Right, you give them a little choice, you could start with something like that, or you know what, we always get pizza every Friday, and they might you might say, Do you want to go somewhere? Would you like to order something else? And oh, you know, mom, I would love Chinese food. Okay. Or they might say, No, we do pizza every Friday. Okay, do you want to decide what's on it?

SPEAKER_00

I like that. That's really good. I like that. And really, for everyone out there as a parent, as hard as it is, you must find time to fill your own cup up.

SPEAKER_02

Yes.

SPEAKER_00

And I know for so many of us out there, it is just impossible. But whatever that means for you, if you close the door to your bedroom, if you crawl into bed with a book, if you leave the house and go out with a friend or for yourself, you go for a walk, you cannot be beside, you cannot pour from an empty cup. And I feel like that is what we do. And then, you know, divorce mothers, like we are just we are constantly little, we we're constantly going, we're constantly moving, we're constantly doing things, and we forget to take care of ourselves.

SPEAKER_01

And to use the previous, you know, kind of metaphor, fill your bank account, you got to make deposits to your own account.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_01

We talk about that in romantic relationships, but it doesn't matter what, you always have to deposit in your own account. And if you're a single mother, it is so important to deposit in your own account and so hard to do so.

SPEAKER_00

So hard to do so.

SPEAKER_01

But it's so important to find a way to do it.

SPEAKER_00

Because if you're not good, your children are not going to be good anymore. So take care of yourself and keep talking.

SPEAKER_01

Keep talking.

SPEAKER_00

Thank you everyone for listening. And if you like this episode, please give us a five-star rating and a review. And so you don't miss an episode, click the follow button on the upper right hand corner. There's three little dots. Click follow, and you'll be notified every Monday morning at 7 a.m. Eastern. Six, thank you. 6 a.m. Eastern.

SPEAKER_01

Just in time for the commute.

SPEAKER_00

Right a new episode drops. Thank you, everybody.

SPEAKER_01

Thank you.