Ep. 7 - Talkin' "Who" is God (Part 2)

The Small Group continues their discussion on God, this time focusing on the attributes, nature, and names of God. Each member of the Group discloses their "pet peeves". Taylor highlights "Burning Man", while Benjamin gets on vacation experiences. Sabrina and Lacey keep the discussion focused on the names of God used especially throughout the Old Testament, and history. 

Thank you for joining in Small Group, and please feel free to participate with us by sending your thoughts, questions, or ideas by commenting, messaging, or by email (goat.bear.lobster@gmail.com). You can also reach out, and find out more about us, at our website: SmallGroupPodcast.wordpress.com. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_05 0:44

Please be patient. We're from the 1900s. This is a small group. I'm Benjamin Maxwell.

SPEAKER_02 0:50

I'm Lacey.

SPEAKER_05 0:51

I'm Taylor.

SPEAKER_02 0:53

This is Sabrina.

SPEAKER_05 0:54

And we're finally back together. Taylor and Sabrina guys took a week off on vacation, right? Is what it sounds like. A sweet, cushy, relaxing vacation.

SPEAKER_01 1:07

Yes, a vacation with 23 teens.

SPEAKER_04 1:12

Yeah, we piece of cake. Yeah, we spent this last weekend at a nearby Christian resort, and we were chaperoning some youth. It was a great time. We did a combo trip with another church from Dothan, Alabama, which was great. And it was just fun. We got to know some of the youth better and really enjoyed it.

SPEAKER_01 1:41

Yeah, we're excited to be back though.

SPEAKER_05 1:42

Yeah, we're glad to have you back. We had my actually it worked out perfect. My brother and his family were visiting at the same time, so they filled in and and but we're so glad to have you guys. How are you, my wonderful, beautiful wife?

SPEAKER_02 2:07

I I think I'm good. I think it's it's been a busy full day, which is good. I love a good busy day, but I just haven't stopped long enough to feel it. You know what? It's been a good day. It's been a really good day.

SPEAKER_05 2:20

Yes, I rushing around, especially Wednesdays, trying to get from work to family to church, and everybody by the time I get there, everybody's like, How are you? I don't know. I haven't thought about it or haven't been told. So that seems to be every day now.

SPEAKER_02 2:36

Well, right now we have a happy, healthy toddler. So that is always a good week.

SPEAKER_05 2:43

We'll take that, absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 2:45

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_05 2:46

Well, we are going to let's get let's let's get things rolling gently here with Jingle Bell, jingle yay, jingle good for you. That's gonna be that's now Lace uh Lace's uh intro music.

SPEAKER_02 3:03

So everybody has always told me, like way before I ever got in to parks and rec, everybody was like, you are such a Leslie Nope. And I'm like, I don't I don't know what that means. I can see it. When I watched it, I was like, oh, Leslie Nope is my spirit animal. I love her.

SPEAKER_05 3:23

So sorry, I've already played the music, but I gotta back up just a second because we gotta give a shout out. This has been the biggest phenomenon of the show that I love and I just can't explain it. So we've been watching yeah, where the show is who's listening and like where uh its reach, and we're worldwide now. A lot of unique places we were popping up. It's great. But one thing we couldn't figure out from the very beginning of the show, you know, we have um the markets where we live, where our families live, and in Florida and Alabama, a little bit of Georgia, so those are normal, we expect those. One kept popping up, Ashburn, Virginia, from day one. And so I just thought, well, Sabrina Taylor have family there and uh checked with you guys. No, we don't, it's just a natural phenomenon. And and Ashburn has been loyal from day one. Ashburn, Virginia has a special place in my heart. They uh they have been rock solid who and you know we love you. Uh we got a strong loyal family in Ashburn, Virginia, and we'd love for you guys to reach out to us. We'd like to connect, but I had to throw that out there, and just some of the places we've reached, you know, like I said, all over the world. It's just been so wonderful. You know, what we kind of wanted to do this more of just a discussion and just dig in and hey, let's record it and see what happens. And it's it's it's exploded so fast, and we're we're so happy and happy to have you in from Ashburn, Virginia. So, anyway, sorry about that false start. Let's try that one more time.

SPEAKER_00 5:05

Jingle bell, jingle, yay, jingle good for you.

SPEAKER_02 5:09

All right, so today's icebreaker question is what are your biggest pet peeves?

SPEAKER_05 5:18

People false start on the show.

SPEAKER_01 5:22

Okay, I'll go first. Mine I feel guilty about because it shows my generation, I guess.

SPEAKER_06 5:30

1900s.

SPEAKER_01 5:31

That's right. But it is when the internet is slow. But I think it's because I spend so much time on the computer with work and then also just like scrolling outside of work, and so there's like the sense of lack of control and not knowing what to do.

SPEAKER_05 5:53

The struggle. Well, we'll I'll be praying for you at the moment.

SPEAKER_01 6:02

Just pray that I get over it.

SPEAKER_05 6:04

The fact that you've just come out and admit it, that's that's strong.

SPEAKER_02 6:09

Do you have any other Sabrina? Actually, what are your others? No, I'm here and dig deep. Not because she's so sweet, but I have a list, and so I know Sabrina has a list.

SPEAKER_05 6:21

She's kind and sweet until you turn the internet off.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

I specifically was like, okay, I'm not gonna do anything that points back to Taylor out of love and respect for her.

SPEAKER_05 6:35

Uh-oh. I got pet peeve, and his name is Taylor Bay.

SPEAKER_04 6:39

No.

SPEAKER_05 6:40

May or may not involve the dishwasher. I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 6:43

That's right.

SPEAKER_04 6:45

I try my best.

SPEAKER_05 6:47

Here I was thinking I didn't have a whole lot of pet peeves, but you're listing a bunch that are triggering some uh thoughts.

SPEAKER_06 6:54

I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_05 6:55

No, not not not with you. You say dishwasher. Yeah, that's one. Anyway.

SPEAKER_02 7:01

All right, honey.

SPEAKER_05 7:03

I would probably man. I think my biggest pet peeve is disingenuousness. Interesting. Especially when I feel it from like I I'm very sensitive. I don't want to be disingenuous. I don't want to come across as fake. But when I perceive it in others, I I'm very sensitive about it. And I try not to be like like first impressions if they come if if somebody comes across that way. I try to be grace-giving, but it's like a flag goes up and it's I'm I'm a little more cautious. But I don't know what it is. And I've been very like intentional about why does that drive me crazy? I can't I don't know. I can't stand the fake disingenuousness.

SPEAKER_02 7:46

Well, and you have like this superpower where you can you can tell when somebody's being fake. They can fool everyone else in the room, but they can never fool you. Like you see people, like Avatar. I see you.

SPEAKER_05 8:01

Like I hope it's that. It's either that or I'm a very hard sell, you know. You have to try a little harder to to maybe win me over, which is only fitting because I'm terrible at first impressions. I've had so many of my best friends tell me they did not like me when they first met me.

SPEAKER_06 8:19

So uh yeah, that's so awesome.

SPEAKER_02 8:23

All right, Taylor.

SPEAKER_04 8:26

I thought a I thought for a while about this. I think I have maybe a more daily, kind of practical one, similar to Sabrina's, where I'm a bit of a a Neo-Luddite, you might say. I struggle with technology. I kind of wish that I was born in the wagon era, I don't know, riding a horse or something.

SPEAKER_05 8:53

Dying at the age of 32. Yeah, right.

SPEAKER_04 8:55

Exactly. Dysentery got me. Yellow favor, that was where the no, but but I really struggle also when technology doesn't work the way it's supposed to. Like I get very easily frustrated by computer issues, but I think part of that is like I don't fundamentally have any idea how computers work. I know it's like ones and zeros or whatever, but like I I don't know. I like struggle with that. So technology not working can can like really get under my skin. And a similar one to you, but slightly different. You love fake people? I struggle with things that are genuinely in like a true way arbitrary. And if I'm expected to follow something that is genuinely arbitrary, and someone makes a big deal out of like, you must do this thing, but I know for a fact that there is no justifiable logical reason for doing it one way or the other way, I'm like, why what what are we doing here? Like I I don't know. I've I've I have I can think of multiple examples in my life where I've been put in positions where I've been like actively accosted or like put on like I know I'm I'm the victim of arbitrariness. No, but I've been I've been like actively like you cannot do this thing, and I'm like, but there's no reason that I couldn't, and that gets me.

SPEAKER_05 10:22

Being from the 1900s, you you saw a bug's life, right? Remember that movie? Oh yeah, but it's a rock. But imagine that, but it's a rock.

SPEAKER_04 10:32

But it's just but if it was an acorn or a seed, right? Yeah, no, it's a rock. But it's a rock. It's just a rock.

SPEAKER_05 10:39

And now that you the way that you put it to the technology thing, I think that's probably another one of mine that I just hearing you talk about it made me when you say technology, my mind goes like internet and stuff, and that doesn't maybe bother me so much as like if something in the car is not working. I had issues with my phone not charging lately, and that's driving me crazy. Because it's but my mind, my thoughts are it's like, man, I've paid so much money for this or that, and it's not even working. It's like, why am I killing myself over all this now? Yeah, you know, it's but anyway, to go too too deep there. Yeah, I'm with y'all on that one. Yeah. The technology part. Did you you you said yours, didn't you? No. Oh. Well, let's move on then.

SPEAKER_02 11:25

Buckle up, we gotta list.

SPEAKER_05 11:27

We gotta list.

SPEAKER_02 11:31

Not replacing the toilet paper roll. Hi guys. No, just like if you like at home, at work, at church, at Target, like please, like just this is, I don't know, kind of a personal one. If somebody makes any kind of comments on somebody's weight, oh yeah, and just say like, oh, yes. Yes, like uh you know, oh, she hasn't lost the baby weight yet. Back off Pam, I I will jump you over that. And then the last one, then I'm just gonna say, I got a list again. But the last one is if you ask a question and the person that you're asking says, well, it's obvious. Oh well, obviously it's not if I am asking the question and all you're doing is making me feel dumb. Yeah. And I don't need any help with that. So thanks.

SPEAKER_00 12:40

So that's jingle bell, jingle yay, jingle good, for you.

SPEAKER_05 12:45

I just love that button so much now. Yeah. If you don't know my wife, watch Parks and Rec.

SPEAKER_02 12:52

Leslie Nope is that's right, personality-wise, is is that so I love binders and scrapbooks and all the things I do.

SPEAKER_01 13:03

I feel like the last two Lacey's sums up to like unkind people because both of the those last two things are are unkind for sure. Like weight off limits. Like, well, that's an obvious question. That's unkind, yeah. Well, the toll yeah toll paper could be ignorance, not unkind, intentional. I'm trapped.

SPEAKER_05 13:29

It happened that was a that was a blatant attack on me.

SPEAKER_02 13:33

No, it happened in your office today.

SPEAKER_05 13:35

Oh, that's a that's a long story. Yeah, that's not people being anyway.

SPEAKER_02 13:41

Oh, we'll we'll address that later.

SPEAKER_05 13:44

But I'll talk to you about that later. But anyway, because I I feel like I'm pretty good at it. Anyway.

SPEAKER_02 13:49

Anyways.

SPEAKER_05 13:50

Anybody get that out? Any any more grievances to air? One more, one more.

SPEAKER_06 13:55

I'm just kidding.

SPEAKER_05 13:56

Give it no Sabrina, get him. All right, well. Tonight, we're gonna we're gonna follow up on episode that we all did together a little while back. Like uh we said then, you know, a lot of our topics are gonna have to turn into multiple episodes just because one, me and Taylor will nerd out all night and hog the mics and all that. But not only that, there's just so much to cover, and it and I feel like we all have kind of our unique perspectives that I want to make sure we we all get them. But it so tonight is gonna be a kind of a part two on who is God, what is God, all of that debacle, if you remember that episode. But we're gonna be talking more about God, part two tonight, and mainly this was kind of Lacey's she was very interested in this and hearing everybody's per se take on the names of God. The names of God in the Bible, and you know, and well, I won't get all the way into that just yet, but before we do get into the names, being that as a second parter, we've had time to kind of reflect on our discussions on the first part. Did uh did anybody have any follow-ups or thoughts from that first episode of What is God Who is God that may need like I feel like you need to explain yourself. I I'm talking about myself, but that was in the faith episode. I feel like I need to explain myself a little better on something, but any any follow-ups on that? Anybody hanging in more general terms of who is God?

SPEAKER_04 15:44

Well if we're thinking about the episode also kind of in a more expansive sense being just God questions. Sort of the we touched on the who we kind of briefly discussed the the what idea that your former classmate raised, reframing that a little bit to understand that God is a personal God who is a a personhood, a tripartite in the Holy Trinity, and we talked a little bit about the why being an unanswerable question in a way that you cannot really fully understand or ask the why of God because God precedes all wise, he has no cause or origin, he is the origin of things. But one that I was was kind of interested in maybe touching on a little bit more was the where we talked about God not being there's kind of this like interesting duality to it where God is not contained in space, but that space itself exists because of God and is a uh is a part of the outpouring of his creation, like the the physical space that we inhabit, right? Not not not just like outer space, although certainly that is part of God's creation too, but also this idea of eminence that God is fully present in this way that we in our human little human ant brains, speaking of ants, can't fully understand. So that's interesting to me.

SPEAKER_05 17:38

Yeah, absolutely. To that point, because it's an I'm I'm so glad you brought that up because that was some uh one of the thoughts that I wanted to dig in a little more on to describe you know, like you're talking about a physical object being like you were talking about on that last episode. You know, you can look at Lacey across the table and describe her as a physical object. Right. Well, Lacey brought it up in in that episode of God is love. I love that idea on the face of it of God is love. Love is one of those non-physical in space things that we can perceive. And so it's like not only is that an interesting thought that that perception of love is being equated to God, but it's also it's a because I I feel like we all kind of just came back to this and where we landed on that episode was it's indescrib God is indescribable. We're just we're we're flailing around trying to describe it, whereas you just can't fully describe it. What and and I think that's what the I think that's what John is trying to do in his letter when he says God is love. And that's probably one of the most beautiful, brilliant ways to describe God and and some about it.

SPEAKER_01 18:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 18:56

And and also to that point too, because I you know, I know we spent a lot of I spent a lot of time trying to to uh preface the whole question of who is God, what is God, where is God, and I get some you know sometimes that can rub people the wrong way when you say what is God. But when you think of God as love, do we say who is love? When you say who is love, you know there's only one answer to that. Most people if anybody answers that question, they would say God. But typically you ask that question as what is love? So I think that's where it saying what is God, what is the Holy Spirit, what is Jesus is not if if asked in an appropriate, genuine way, is not a negative thing or something to really lack of a better way of putting it, poop poo-poo, you know, or or scoff at if if done genuinely.

SPEAKER_04 19:52

Yeah, I agree. I mean, I've I had a conversation with a good friend of mine who kind of put me on the spot, just very directly asked me, so what's the deal with this Trinity thing?

SPEAKER_01 20:07

Well, and to backstory, this friend has never been in church before.

SPEAKER_05 20:11

That's that's a great point that I wanted to I wish I could go back and re-emphasize. I'm so glad you brought that up because that's something we all need to be cognizant of, is just because somebody asks what, and even if I ask what, I'm not uh I'm not gonna assume w where your background is. Right. And I'm not so like if somebody asks me what, I'm not gonna get upset because I'm assuming yeah they're you know misclassifying me or whatever.

SPEAKER_04 20:38

Yeah. I mean, and you know, we all come from these different perspectives, different backgrounds, walks of life, and we've discussed this on the on the podcast that we all feel very fortunate in a just a very deep way to come from families that are families of faith, that we were raised and a church upbringing. We've had different journeys with our faith, but I think that that diversity adds a lot to the podcast. But I you know, I I I I think there are a lot of people who rightfully so who've not had a exposure to our faith and the tradition that we hold to who have legitimate questions. I mean and I mean, even for a lifelong believer, you think of people in our church who are our families even who spent a truly spent a lifetime believing, following in the way of Jesus, I mean, there's an essential mystery to a lot of what we're discussing that it is in some way beyond our grasp, and we are kind of fumbling in the dark when it comes to in a way, when it comes to coming up with a clear cut, you know, explanation for God's nature, because it is in a way mysterious. The Bible's clear about that.

SPEAKER_05 21:57

Absolutely. And that's a you bring up an excellent point there. I want to double down on as far as I feel like whether you grew up in the church, you grew up in church, or you're coming to your faith, you know, later in your life, wherever you're whatever walk, I feel like we all kind of go through certain phases. You know, I think we may have can all connect with that phase of being overly eager, and you know, it's up to me to go make fishers of men, or to be a fisher of men and to change everybody. You go through that very eagerness. Uh for me, I was a little over eager and I had to be humbled. I'm still being humbled and and learning to appreciate being humbled. And so, you know, I've I've come to a place of I I'm more reverent, maybe, as far as my approach, is that I don't have all the answers, and I'm not going to assume it's up to me to save everyone. It's up to God to save every to save anyone and everyone. I'm just a vessel for him. And so with that comes a change of pers perspective perspective, perception of I I don't want to be a negative influence. And you can so easily, if you jump the gun or assume knowledge and or assume backgrounds in other people where you not only just miss an opportunity, but you become a negative impact on that person by you how how dare you say what is God? You know, I can't believe you would say that. That that's very offensive. And when that person is being very genuine and very hungry, maybe, you can not only just miss that opportunity to to show them God, show them love, show them grace, but also take it even further to where now they just I don't want to deal with those Christian people, you know. So I I become very me personally, I've become very kind of sensitive and cognizant of you know not just missing an opportunity, but being a negative impact on the kingdom or uh for God. And I definitely don't want to do that. You don't want to relapse to a saw when you become a paw.

SPEAKER_04 24:12

So that's a perfect transition. You're welcome. Thank you. Alle ooping me. I'm the setter, time to spike. So in the book of Acts, chapter 17, there's this really cool Yeah, there's this really cool scene where Paul, who we was just mentioned, is addressing the the Athenians. And you stood there in that place and read that chapter. Oh, really? In Greece? That's so cool.

SPEAKER_05 24:48

I just wanted to throw that out there. It's that's why I love this chapter. I'm gonna nerd out on it, but go ahead.

SPEAKER_04 24:53

So, yeah, so I wrote noted this passage. This is actually a really interesting moment because for a couple reasons. So I noted this passage as a an example of the where answer for where we find God. You just alle ooped me after I pulled it up, and I didn't even think about this until just now, but earlier today, Sabrina and I were having a discussion. This is a total aside. We were having a discussion about Burning Man, the festival. Oh, y'all seem like Burning Man folks. We're not burners. Spoiler alert. But we were discussing this idea where at Burning Man they they're I'm gonna loop it back in, I promise.

SPEAKER_05 25:39

No, I I'm tracking.

SPEAKER_04 25:41

At Burning Man, there's this camp, and they call it the camp of the unknown god.

SPEAKER_05 25:47

Classy.

SPEAKER_04 25:48

And it is basically an a gospel outreach initiative. There's this guy and it and his team who, for the last number of years, I want to think the last nine or ten years, have set up a camp at Burning Man where they evangelize people.

SPEAKER_05 26:04

I totally thought you were going with an irreverent example or some an example of somebody being irreverent, but that's actually it's something where they're being reverent. No, yeah. It's like I it makes me love that even more. I just went from scoffing to very respectful now. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 26:21

So there's this incredible initiative at Burning Man, this guy who was like had it put on his heart that he wanted to reach people who were at this openly pagan, like obviously world worldly, you know, idolatrous, driven by passion and lust and worldliness. This this like fleshly designed. It's it's it's debaucherous, you know, not to don't knock it till you try it. I don't and I don't I really don't mean to be overly judgmental because you know everyone is at a different place in their journey, and these people generally look at look at the people at this festival and they're like, they really need God. And so they've set up this camp where they share the gospel with people in need. A lot of these people who come to them are like you know, hungry, thirsty, so they provide them with food and water, and they spread the gospel to them. So it's the it's the camp to the unknown God. So to tie it back in, we're in Acts 17 here. Uh Paul's talking to the people of Athens, and he says in verse 23, For while I was passing through and examining the objects of your worship, I also found an altar with this inscription to an unknown God. Therefore, what you worship in ignorance, this I proclaim to you the God who made the world and everything that is in it, since he is the Lord of heaven and of earth, does not dwell in temples made by hands. Nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all people life and breath and all things. And he made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined their appointed times and the boundaries of their habitation, that they would seek God if perhaps they might feel around for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us, for in him we live and move and exist, as even some of your own poets have said. For we also are his descendants. And we live and we survive. Sorry. I just thought that was a cool moment to bring it in because we were talking about Bernie Man earlier today in this camp of the unknown god, and then I pulled that up. Interesting, kind of cool.

SPEAKER_05 29:07

Yeah, that's uh that's amazing. Oh, okay. I thought Lacey was gonna stop me for a second. I won't geek out too much on it. But yeah, we got to go. So Lacey, one of the things, one of the places she really wanted to visit at the top of her list, Athens, or Greece, really. So we did a whole tour of the wow, the lower part of the continent where the Corinth canal separates the the top half and the second half. Well I can wow, I'm drawing a blank on. Oh yeah, we did a whole tour of the southern part of the starting in Athens, and so of course we go to the Acropolis, Acropolis is right there. Yeah. You know, when you think Athens, Greece, that's what you think of, and Hercules, you know, the Disney version. And so we go to the Acropolis, we we see all the stuff Lacey's been wanting to see, and Lacey's more of the mythology Greek nerd than I am. And the one thing I wanted to see the whole time I was there is the air Mars Hill, uh Areopagus, where he delivers that, and it's right there. As soon as you come down the steps, or the the mountain, or the little hill, plateau, whatever, or the Acropolis, Mars Hill or the Areopagus Council meeting is right there. And so we got to climb up to the top, and and I had it, I had it with me because I wanted to stand there and read that chapter in that place, and that was just an amazing moment to just kind of you know, it becomes more than a storybook. It becomes real when you're standing there in that place, and and all the history that goes with it. I'm more of a uh Lacey loves the mythology. I I'm more of the philosophy side, like that's where Socrates was tried and everything, and I'm just I'm all over it. And so she snaps a picture of me standing there read as I'm reading, and then when I'm done reading, I turn around and I'll snap a picture of her, and maybe we'll put it up on the website or something so you in the notes so you guys can see it. But right because my back was to the Acropolis when I'm reading, and I turn around and snap a picture of her and the Acropolis. Am I mispronouncing the Acropolis? You look like you're about to jump on me. Okay, good. Uh but there's Lacey posing and just right in your face. The the whole Acropolis is right there, and it's like he's standing right there in the heart of it and delivering this message. Man, it just and it's like that chapter 17 is so brief, and Paul, as we know in his letters, is not a brief type of guy. Yeah. So it's like I can't help but think what was left out of that, you know, account when they went back to make the account. And because it's hard to imagine Paul being that short, but it's it was just I'm sorry, I'm just nerding out now. But uh it was a beautiful thing.

SPEAKER_06 32:02

That's so cool.

SPEAKER_04 32:03

I would love to go someday. We've talked about how everyone has been Lacey is showing us a picture of what Ben is describing.

SPEAKER_01 32:12

It's beautiful.

SPEAKER_05 32:12

Oh, so that's that's actually that's me reading it, but my back is to uh to the crowd. I think I got the picture somewhere. I think it's okay. But anyway, go ahead.

SPEAKER_04 32:21

Oh no, yeah, that's that's a really good picture. That's awesome. Yeah, we've everyone we've ever talked to who's been to Greece really enjoyed it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 32:32

Sabrina and I were talking about the food earlier. Just the food cannot baby awesome. It's amazing. Just so good. Like it was just like everything was fresh, nothing was processed or preserved or anything. Um, we actually we stayed, I don't know why I remember this, but one of the hotels that we stayed at had an olive grove and an apple orchard. Like we like, like they were like, oh yeah, we picked the apples this morning. Here's breakfast. And it was like, I mean, that was the best apple I've ever had in my life.

SPEAKER_05 33:08

Yeah, there was one room where you we walked out, like we had a back door to our room. It was ground level. We walked out of our room and into an olive orchard, olive trees. But wow. So a little bit of a uh you brought up food. This was a point that I was kicking myself for not making last time we were talking about this. Another trip we took, and this isn't gonna be just us showing vacation videos, but on our honeymoon we went to Costa Rica, and we were talking about last episode or the last episode on God was you know trying to describe like if you're asked who is God or what is God, he's God. Like, you know, it's like it's indescribable. When we went to Costa Rica on our honeymoon, we had a driver pick us up at the airport, and he was taking us to where we were staying, and it was a long drive, about halfway through. He was like, You guys hungry, you want to stop? We're in the middle of the jungle. This guy pulls into just some just shack, just run-down shack. And I mean, we just got into the country. This is our first experience, and so he's we're telling him what we want, he's ordering for us or whatever. They they they bring out the food, and to that point it was one of the best thing, probably the best thing I've ever eaten in my life. We later something that topped it, but anyway, they bring out like the chicken and you know, all this different food and and cheese. There's this white cheese on it, and they had the plantains, and it was just it was so good. And I was like, What kind of cheese is this? I need this. And I asked the guy, our the driver, I was like, What what kind of cheese is this? And he goes, It's cheese. So to this day, I don't know what it is, but it's like the best cheese ever I've ever had. So it's like I don't know that it's like that's how I was like describing God. It's cheese, you know. What are you talking about?

SPEAKER_04 35:09

There's different kinds, like do you think it might have been was it similar to Kotiha? Maybe so. I have no idea.

SPEAKER_02 35:15

It was it was cheese, but it was the same everywhere.

SPEAKER_05 35:18

It was you could find and they do the the fried plantain and that little white cheese on it, and it's just don't knock it to you try it, folks. It's it was awesome. But anyway, enough about our travel videos. Well, so let's I I really want to get into for the sake of Lacey, she's been wanting to dive into the names of God. I mean, she's done a lot of research on this, on the the names of God.

SPEAKER_02 35:45

And well, okay, so story time. I was in a Bible study and it came up the different names of God, and I shared that my favorite name for God is Emmanuel, like God is with us, and just that is just the most comforting thing that I've ever heard is that God is right here in the midst of us. Well, the girl sitting next to me said, Well, my favorite name for God is Elroy. Well, I thought she was kidding. And like, you know, and so I was like, Oh, it's like the Jetsons is an Elroy. And like, I thought she was kidding. And so I started laughing, and she was like, No, I'm I'm serious. And so it comes from the story of Hagar. And so if if you're unfamiliar with the story, Abraham and Sarah are unable to get pregnant. And so Sarum gives Hagar, her servant, to Abraham and says, take her as your wife so that she can bear you children. And so Hagar follows orders and becomes pregnant. Well, then Sarah despises her, which is understandable to a certain reason. But yeah, but but she despises Hagar and just makes Hagar's life miserable. So Hagar wants to run away, and she tries, and the angel of the Lord comes and he comforts her and says that I'm gonna multiply your descendants. And he says that the Lord has heard your misery. And Hagar says, He is the God who sees me. And that is just so, so wonderful. How um, you know, how he he not only like he not only sees us like what you know what's happening in our day-to-day lives or whatever, he sees our hearts. He sees he sees what we are going through, he sees our struggles, and he he is a manual and he's right there with us. So those are my two favorites.

SPEAKER_01 37:53

That's beautiful. I love it. I wrote a list of names for God and just some notes on like where it comes from in scripture and how it applies to our lives. And Emmanuel was not on my list. So I love that you brought that up. I I'll I guess I'll go in the same, in that same spirit, what my what one of my favorite names for our Lord is in the Bible, it's Abba. I if every time I read Abba, I get emotional just because it's so Anina, before this Bible study and us talking about the names of God, I didn't know this. I did so reading Abba at that point before doing research, it was purely a spiritual, emotional experience, not even knowing what Abba meant. I would read it and I would feel emotional and vulnerable while reading it. And now that I know what it means, it's so amazing. Like, like I don't know. So I'll I'll read what some of my notes are. Let me pull it up. Okay, so Jesus used Abba when speaking to God, especially in moments of deep emotion. So one section that we talked about in our Romans Bible study, Romans 8:15. So it says, We receive the spirit of adoption as sons and daughters, crying, Abba, Father. Um, the meaning of Abba is personal, it's intimate, it's an affectionate term for father, showing trust and closeness. In Galatians 4, 6, it says, God has sent the spirit of his son into our hearts. And so, my our takeaway or my takeaway for Abba is that God invites us into a personal, loving relationship as our father. Our life application is you can come to God with trust, honesty, and closeness. And thinking about why Abba, that definition is so powerful to me. I think like about God in the Old Testament, He is shown as holy and powerful and sovereign. And that is true, but with Abba's description, that description of God, we see something very deeply personal. And so God is not just over us, he is close to us. He is not just creator, but he is father. He is not just authority, but he is our a relationship with us. So that we see this like very dramatic shift in how people and we understand God. And that's not just to give up the you know, the sovereignty, the reverence that we have for God. He is still like Lord, Father, holy, powerful, just. Um, but it just deepens our understanding about who he is to us.

SPEAKER_05 40:47

Well, it deepens that connection, I think, and makes it even more reverent when you go to Lacey to your point, like he knows our pain, our but he knows what we're feeling better than we do. And that just makes it even more reverent. But I love that description of ABBA, Abba. I always say ABBA. Oh, I could be saying it wrong, I'm not sure. North Alabama, you know, where Jesus is from saying ABBA, Abba. But uh no it's just like a tenderness there, yeah. And and to that point, uh I I've come across looking at Jesus, I've come across a new appreciation for the the the term Christ. You know, you have that joke kind of of Jesus' last name, you know, that you hear banded about Jesus' last name, you know, Christ. And but the more I've dug into like Greek and all that, and I look at that word Christos, and it's a title. It's more of a it's the Messiah. And when you look at if you just reframe that in your mind of Jesus, instead of saying Jesus Christ, Jesus the Messiah. For me anyway, it it hits a little different. There's a Jesus the Redeemer, Jesus the Savior, it connects because when you say, you know, Jesus Christ, it's become, you know, that name has become so synonymous with a first and last name type. Like you can have that perception. What gets lost is that. What does that stand for? What does that mean? And it just carries so much more reverence, like you're talking about what having that deeper connection.

SPEAKER_01 42:26

Yeah. And I think about all of us who have challenging relationships. When I like when I'm thinking about the spirit of adoption that we receive into God's family, that Romans 8 talks about. I think about children I know who are adopted or in foster care. I think about my own like challenging relationships with family members. I think about people who have like, you know, broken marriages or just there's so many examples of broken relationships that we all experience. And so the comfort that we have knowing that God wants us to be a part of his family, that is just so special. And every time I read Abba now, I think about that, and it's wild to me that before I knew all of this and I would read it, it felt so emotional, and I did not know why. So that feels so that feels really special.

SPEAKER_05 43:26

I love all of that. As far as the names of God, I'm more I'm very partial to Jehovah. And mainly for frivolous a frivolous reason. It's not gonna be some deep thing that you're thinking. Okay. The greatest film ever made in the history of mankind, Indiana Jones and The Last Crusade, that was that was the second test to get to the Holy Grail, but the in Latin, just so you everybody knows, in case you come across this. Test Jehovah begins with an I. I don't know, that line's always stuck with me. I haven't shown it. But Jehovah begins with an I. Anyway, there's my contribution to this.

SPEAKER_01 44:13

I wrote notes on Jehovah if you'd like me to. Yeah, because I just was like, you know, let me dig into this. This is small groups, let me do some research off about these names that we use that maybe I don't fully understand. So I can share some of my notes.

SPEAKER_05 44:27

Jehovah's probably the more common one from me. Yeah. In my experience, that's been more common.

SPEAKER_01 44:32

Yeah, well, it comes from at least this is what some resources on the internet say. Another way to say Yahweh. So the tetragrammation. Am I saying that right, Taylor?

unknown 44:42

No.

SPEAKER_04 44:43

You are.

SPEAKER_01 44:44

Okay. So that's the proof.

SPEAKER_04 44:45

I think it's I think it's tetragrammaton, but is that right?

SPEAKER_01 44:49

Yeah, maybe so. I wrote down tetragrammation. So do you want to explain that? You probably can explain that better than me.

SPEAKER_05 44:58

I tried to prepare to explain it, but you go. Because I'm not going to be okay.

SPEAKER_04 45:04

I I I am not by any means any kind of scholar of Hebrew. My understanding is that there. My understanding is that in Hebrew, consonants and vowels operate in different ways in terms of the orthography, the way that the language is written. And so historically, there are no vowels that are associated with the name of God that we have in recorded history, but we have coming from the ancient language we we that Hebrew is derived from, so it would have been Aramaic, but then before then what would have been Phoenician. And so in Old Phoenician, the the letters yad, he, wa, he are basically those are it's like why, you know, y-h w h. Those are the consonants that are associated with the name of God in the Old Testament. And a lot of times, like when the Old Testament is read in Hebrew, oftentimes that the the tet the tetrag tetragrammaton, however it's pronounced, that is pronounced Adonai most often. So like if you in like Psalm 23 in Hebrew, it starts, you know, Adonai Eroi Lol Ishar. It's like Adonai is Yahweh. It's like Yahweh or Adonai is my shepherd. I shall not want. That's like how that's how it's referred to, in my understanding. But yeah.

SPEAKER_05 46:48

And you go you so from what I can tell, just like you, I'm I'm gonna oversimplify, I'm gonna over-generalize this. But you go back even further than that to Elohim. And even further than that, Elohim derives from L. I think L is E L is like the oldest known reference, written reference to, and again, yes, trust but verify, you know, go double check me on this because I I'm I struggle with Hebrew as it is, much less this deep, but but Elohim or L is the probably the oldest reference to God. And so you have L to Elohim to Yahweh to Yehovah, Jehovah, yeah, I hovah.

SPEAKER_01 47:33

Let me get back to no no no, let me finish my thought about Jehovah, and because I feel like I also want to get into Yahweh and Elohim, if I'm saying that right. I don't know. But so it says to Taylor, what Taylor was saying, the name of God in Hebrew Bible is represented by the four letters Y H W H Yahweh, as we say it, known as the Tetragramation, is what I wrote. Maybe I'm I'm missaying that word. This name is considered sacred and was traditionally not pronounced aloud in Jewish practice. So the form. The written form consisted, sorry, I lost my place, consisted only of consonants to aid pronunciation. Jewish scribes known as the Masoretes. Am I saying that right, Taylor?

SPEAKER_04 48:30

Yeah, those are the like after Jesus, the like the Masoretic text. Oh, yeah, that's right. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 48:37

Um, so they added vowel points to the text in the Middle Ages. They used the vowels from the word Adonai, meaning my Lord, when indicating how to read Yahweh, resulting in a hybrid form. So that's where we get Yahweh. So then the Latinization, the form Jehovah emerged in the 12th century as a Latinization of the Hebrew name. The consonants Y H W H were combined with the vowels from Adonai, leading to the pronunciation over of Yahweh. Over time, this evolved into Jehovah as the English language developed. I thought that was interesting because I didn't know that before the small group. Yeah, it's it because it's a sacred word.

SPEAKER_05 49:28

And that keeps coming back to you, like even the first episode into this episode, we cannot escape the consistent rev callbacks to reverence. You talk about reverence. Like even saying just just earlier when I was talking about Christ and saying Jesus Christ, because usually now you only hear that in a derogatory way, I struggle to say it out loud because I I just I try to hold so much reverence to how I see how I how I perceive God or Christ, or especially how it's I I speak about him. I I call his name aloud. I think there's something there that we need to uh uh like they did like you're talking about, you know, the the Jewish the Hebrews their tradition, I guess, lack of a better way of putting it, of um, you know, treating God with so much reverence that you don't it's a serious thing to to call the name.

SPEAKER_01 50:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 50:30

Call call on him.

SPEAKER_01 50:32

And yet he calls us or we refer to him as our father, which is true, and our friend. Yeah. So it's it's both, but it's a balance.

SPEAKER_05 50:40

Absolutely. It's a it's a harder balance, I said, I feel like today with the derogatory nature of of how we'll you know flip it like we can use it.

SPEAKER_02 50:51

So um some other names that I love. I love Jehovah Jirah is the Lord will provide. And y'all apparently I am a huge fan of Abraham and Sarah. So because that that's where the story comes from, or where this comes from, is Abraham tells Isaac that the Lord will provide, and the Lord will provide the lamb, which he did. But I'm going to throw it way back, and Ben is gonna have absolutely no idea what I'm talking about, so he's gonna get a little nervous. Wait, wait. To Amy Grant. Anyone at the table know who's an artist? Yeah, I do know who she is. Okay, so she had a song jelly roll.

SPEAKER_01 51:39

Oh, she's like 90s Christian or yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 51:44

So she she had a song called El Shaddai, which is another another name for God that I love is Lord God Almighty. But in her song, she says, Through your love and through the ram, you save the son of Abraham. Through the power of your hand, turn the sea into dry land. To the outcast on her knees, you are the God who really sees, and by your might you set your children free. El Shaddai. So good.

SPEAKER_04 52:14

She rhymes too. I know that song really well. Sid loves that song. Oh, really? And when I was a kid, it was on all the time. That's awesome. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 52:25

It came out in like in like the 80s or like early 90s kind of thing. Like it's it's a throwback.

SPEAKER_05 52:33

Be patient because we're from the 1900s.

SPEAKER_04 52:37

It's a great one.

SPEAKER_02 52:38

It's a great one.

SPEAKER_05 52:41

More of a Conway Twitty.

unknown 52:44

Conway.

SPEAKER_05 52:45

Um I don't want to cut anybody off. No, go ahead. Go ahead. I may end up changing the subject slightly here.

SPEAKER_01 52:54

I'd like to circle back to Elohim and Yahweh, but you should go.

SPEAKER_05 52:58

No, you you go first. Yeah, I don't want to. I'll I will change the subject, so let's let's stick with that.

SPEAKER_01 53:04

Yeah, I was gonna say Yahweh is such a big name that I don't want to brush over, but I'll start with Elohim. I just had a few notes. I love that you brought that up and you were saying it's the oldest. I don't know about that, but I will I did write down it's the very first name used for God in the Bible, Genesis 1.1, as creator, um, supreme being, which is amazing.

SPEAKER_05 53:26

That might be what I was what I perceived as the oldest. So take take her word for it, not mine.

SPEAKER_01 53:31

No, I don't know. But yeah, any other thoughts on Elohim? I have some thoughts on Yahweh that I want to talk about.

SPEAKER_05 53:38

Those names jump out at me when you hear them, right? The Elohim, Yahweh, Jehovah, because they're not used derogatorily, yeah. Like O and G or Jesus. And so that's what I love, and I think that's something we need to stop and appreciate is why do those names jump out at us when someone invokes Elohim or Jehovah, because it's not, it's very rarely I haven't witnessed it in a flippant manner. It's usually somebody who knows what they're talking about. Yeah, and so it's something I I treasure.

SPEAKER_01 54:11

That's a great point. I've not thought about that, but you're right. I love that.

SPEAKER_05 54:16

Wrong about the age of Elohim, but maybe I got that one right.

SPEAKER_01 54:21

I do have notes on Yahweh. I love I love that that name translated as Lord, meaning the personal covenantal God, the God who is present with his people. So some key verses that I wrote down. Exodus 3 14, of course, I am who I am. Also don't also Exodus 6, 2 through 3 shows God confirming his name to Moses. And that's a gift, like he was giving, he was entrusting his name to the Israelites. So yeah. And then I also wrote down where do we get Yahweh? So again, the tetracremation that I'm sure I'm mispronouncing is derived from the Hebrew root Hy H, meaning to be or to exist, reflecting God's self-existence and eternal nature. Um, it is also interpreted as he who is, he who brings being into being, which I think it's interesting. We don't translate it, we don't literally translate I am who I am, we translate he is who he is, going back to that reverence with God and not saying his name because it's so holy. And yeah, I final thought I wrote down it is considered the most sacred name of God appearing 5,410 times in scriptures, it is traditionally not pronounced aloud by observant Jews who substitute terms like Adonai or Hashem, which is translated to the name.

SPEAKER_05 55:57

So I'm not actually not going to be changing the subject too much here. It's gonna actually gonna flow with that very beautifully. But I locked in on so going back to our question, right? The names of God, something that Lacey and I have found fascinating here recently. In that question, what's overlooked is that the idea of name. And something that comes up, and and I'm gonna bring us to the New Testament, where more my base here, in the name of.

SPEAKER_02 56:25

So I'm sorry, I'm just gonna jump in for a second. So last year I was reading through the book of Acts, and I just what I wrote down, I counted 28 times that it is used in the name of Jesus, and there is power in the name of Jesus. Be baptized in the name of Jesus. This man is healed in the name of Jesus, and that is just it's used over and over. But my favorite or the the one that just jumps out is hang on, hang on. I lost it. Sorry, please wait while processing it's Acts 541. The apostles left the high council rejoicing that God had counted them worthy to suffer disgrace for the name of Jesus. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 57:19

So I'm sorry. No, no, so no, that's that's perfect because I know you're referencing like in the in the name of God bless you. In the name of Jesus. Jesus himself, my reference here was how Jesus treats in the name of God. We all know the Lord's Prayer. Matthew 6, 9. Jesus tells them, Pray then in this way, our Father who is in heaven, hallowed be your name. And then one more verse, and then I got let's see Luke 149 here. And this is a this is Mary's song. Luke 149. I think that she was pregnant with Christ at this point, with Jesus, the Christ. Luke 149. For the mighty one has done great things for me, and holy is his name. And then, like what Lacey referenced, in the name of, that concept of in the name of, I do have the Greek word for that real quick. If anybody's interested at all, uh like me. My cheat sheet here. In the name of, of course, on my cheat sheet I did not put the pronunciation. Anoma. Which in its most general proper definition is name. So, but this whole concept of in the name of, like trying to understand that. Lacy and I've been talking about this. Like, what does that mean in the name of? My little takeaway on it, you know, one thing I I love digging into the translations of the Bible, not just the translations themselves, but that whole process. One thing that you see when you have like you go from King James, New King James to English Standard Version, American Standard Version, you have these groups that come together, these these scholar linguistic scholars who are studying these languages, you know, translating from Latin to this, from Greek to this, and all with all these new discoveries. One thing that I picked up on when studying, you know, that process is one of the you know, there there was an English translation, like England, England, English translation, and then an American version came from that. One of the reasons for these translations, oftentimes, or used to be, was that they were they were concerned that some of those English translations, uh Old English, proper English, whatever, those terms became archaic. Archaic was something that kept getting bandied about when I was studying this. Like you know, fear of those words becoming archaic and they needed to update them to where like now you have like new American standard, which is one that we often refer to. It's just updates with the time. That's one thing that language changes over time. There's just no getting around it. Real quick, one little test I like to do to make this point is like how many words I'm not trying to be vulgar here, but how many words in our culture, in our understanding of our English, how many words for sex do we have? And if you could just and I'm not don't I'm not asking anybody to say them out loud, but just in your mind, like count, how many words can you think of to describe sex? My count is 29. And I feel like that's a low number. I a lot of people have said that they can do better. And so, you know, we have all these words for sex. How many words do we have for love? And then you look at how many words the Greek have for love, you know, and different types of love and all of that. Yeah, so you that just kind of speaks briefly to you know cultural influences on language and all of that. So anyway, get back to my point. In the name of I have a in our you know, in our culture today, in the name of holding reverence, that idea of reverence is is something that I feel like we keep having to come back to because if we feel like that's something that can get that can disappear very quickly if it's not kind of brought back to the forefront. In the name of, I I I wonder, I just wonder, this is a thought that maybe that concept is becoming archaic. Because when I say in the name of God, in our culture today, what does that mean? But you we we have movies and TV shows now where you look back like Middle Ages kind of thing, where like in the name of the king, and then you have all these customs that you know we try to understand today. I just can't help but wonder. I feel like there's something that we're losing in our perception and our modern day perception of in the name of. I hope a smarter linguistic scholar than me can hopefully come up with a better way of describing what is that conveying, a gnoma, what is that conveying in the name of?

SPEAKER_02 1:02:27

Yeah, I can kind of understand it a little bit as far as in the spirit of or in the manner of kind of thing, but anyway, there's not the thing that that fascinates me about it is when the apostles are able to heal in the name of Jesus. Like I I can get Jesus healed people, but the fact that the apostles were able to heal people just by his name. Powerful.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:57

I'm so glad you brought that up because I and that goes to my my last point that I have here in the in the chamber.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:05

The chamber of secrets.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:07

So what you're describing there in the name of this is something I've godliness is another word that I've just taken for granted, never really dug into doing a the divine nature study that I've been doing. Second Peter 1, 4 through 7, where he he talks about to be partakers in a divine nature, this nature of Theos, the divine, Theos, God. He's describing a divine nature, a God nature, and to be partaking in that, he says you he starts with a foundation of faith. Supplement into your faith, virtue, into your virtue, knowledge, into your knowledge, self-control, and into your self-control and long endurance, and into your endurance, godliness, and then into godliness, brotherly love, and then love. So when you have it set up like that, faith, and then you go from faith to virtue, knowledge, self-control, endurance. Those four right there, those are attributes or characteristics that when you think about it, those are things that you feel like you uh you prescribe to. Those are things that I try to I want to attain knowledge, I want to obtain self-control, want to obtain virtue, I want to uh ascribe to those things. Then when he gets to godliness, there's a shift there. And when I dig into godliness, usually uh, when I try to understand what is that concept conveying, go to to me the best example, Peter in Acts, when the I think it's him and John are going into the temple, and there's I can't remember if he's a blind man or lame man. Lame man, okay. They heal the lame man. Uh I can I can find it and put it in my notes. I don't have to talk about it.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:01

He was lame because he got up and he got up and walked in the name of Jesus.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:05

And started telling everyone, and the crowds started gathering.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:08

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:05:08

And and all these crowds are gathering around Peter. Peter just performed a miracle. Hear me out on this. You know, and and if you're looking at it objectively, Peter performed a miracle. This man who has been lame has now stood up and walked and is praising God, and so all these people are gathering around and are like amazed and amazed at Peter. And what is the first thing Peter does? Points to godliness, but not his godliness. He points to God's godliness. So when you think about the that the knowledge, the virtue, the self-control, the endurance, those are things that I want to ascribe to to to obtain and be better and grow in. Godliness is one of those things you obtain it by not ascribing to it. I'm not ascribing to Godliness. I'm ascribing, I'm I'm pointing to God's godliness. This isn't Ben's work, this is God's work.

unknown 1:06:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:06:00

And God is the one that is worthy of praise, not not this vessel here. And so in you going back to to 2 Peter 1 in the divine nature, that that godliness begins a shift in that in that chain of of attributes to a shift away from yourself towards God because what comes next? But you you think about you know what's the greatest command? Love God with all your heart, your mind, your soul, your strength. And the second is love your neighbor as yourself. Well, you supplement into your godliness, mutual affection, Philadelphia, brotherly love, love for one another, and then he ends it, he lands at agape love. God is love. And so I just I find that so fascinating. There's so much in that. There's a few verses that's just begging to be pulled out. So I have two follow-ups on that unless okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:06:59

I had two things that I thought of. Um the first thing you were talking about early on about the power of the name and how we say in like the king's name. I forget what exactly you said. In the name of it's typically how it's yeah, in the name of King X, or in the name, you know. And I I think the difference in my mind, and I've I've heard this I think from Michael Hauser, who you've referenced before.

SPEAKER_04 1:07:28

Michael Heiser.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:29

Mal Michael Heiser, yes. Thank you. He he brought up the same idea and that you just brought up. About archaic no about yes, and how like it's different from how we would say in the name of king.

unknown 1:07:47

Right. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:07:48

Um and he was saying, and so I think that I don't know exactly what he said, but when I heard that it made me think the difference is when we say in the name of the king, that is a temporary thing that we are representing. When we say, Oh, go ahead.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:05

I was just gonna say uh it's like authority. You're calling authority like it's like if someone comes knocking on the door, we have a warrant. Yes. It's like in the name of this warrant, open up. Right. It's author, you're calling who's authority.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:16

That and we're representing the king.

SPEAKER_05 1:08:19

Right.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:19

But it's temporary, is kind of the there's a time limit. The king's not gonna be king forever.

SPEAKER_06 1:08:25

Interesting.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:26

But when we say in the name of the God, there's a covenantal relationship that we have because God has given us that as a gift. And in the same way we're in marriage in a covenantal, well, similar way, not the same way, but in a similar way, we're in a covenantal marriage. We are one. God is when when we receive, God is in us, and so there's this eternal representation that we should be seeing ourselves as. Like we should be representing Christ.

SPEAKER_05 1:09:00

We're gonna fail for sure, but that's that's a great uh tie into marriage because like godliness. I'm not pointing to my godliness, I'm pointing to God, God's godliness and righteousness, not mine. And Taylor will likely agree with me most on this. Marriage is just like that. I'm not pointing to me, I'm pointing to her. This is her. That's the executive branch. Go ask her. She has the authority. So that's a tie-in to marriage is so real, right?

SPEAKER_01 1:09:32

Any other thoughts on that? Because I do have one more follow-up to what you said, but it's a different thing.

SPEAKER_04 1:09:38

I've been thinking about during this this portion of the podcast about Philippians chapter two and why like Philippians chapter two literally gives us this incredible explanation of the reason that every knee will bow to the name of Jesus, which is just in and of itself just an incredible statement that it's the name of the Lord Jesus Christ. We pointed out you were pointing out Christ earlier, which is just the Greek translation of the of Messiah with the Messiah, which just means the one who's anointed. Anointed one, Christos being the one who's anointed. But in Philippians chapter 2 here, it explains why every knee will bow. It's it it says in verse 3 do nothing from selfishness or empty conceit, but with humility, consider one another as more important than yourselves. Do not merely look out for your own personal interests, but also for the interest of others. Have this attitude in yourselves, which was also in Christ Jesus, who, as he already existed in the form of God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but emptied himself by taking the form of a bond servant and being born in the likeness of men, and being found in appearance as a man, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, death on a cross. For this reason also God highly exalted him, and bestowed on him the name which is above every name, so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, and those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord to the glory of God the Father. Amen. Amen. Good call on that one. So to me, that's just like it I mean, it sets up this perfect I mean, Paul, my man. He goes from Peter. He goes from describing how we should act towards one another in like this this humble way, putting another person's interests above our own, whether that's our wives' bin or or something. Oh no, there's no weather. It's our wives. Right. It is our wives. Or even a stranger. Just that we should treat other people more highly than we treat ourselves. And that goes into the second command to love others like we love ourselves. But then he he has this like brilliant explanation here where he moves into how it's it's the emptying of Christ. And that that word, I believe, in Greek is echenosin or canosis, as we would call it in the in the nominal form in English, it's the emptying of self, becoming that empty vessel that you are describing for God's will, where you're you're simply you're seeking to do the will of Christ in all circumstances. You are focused on the mind of Christ, you're embodying the characteristics of that are described in Galatians, the fruit of the Holy Spirit, which he bestows on us when we walk closely with him, that we seek godliness in the way that Peter describes, and that in that process we are transformed into the likeness of Christ, that process of sanctification, theosis, whatever word you're ascribing to it, that we are experiencing this ongoing transformation, but that that moment where he's like, for this reason, for this reason, the reason of his emptying of himself, not not assuming that his equality with God was something that he would grasp, but just that he was totally obedient to the will of the Father, that in that that is the power, that is the source of the power of his name that God bestows upon Jesus, which his name, as Matthew says, just means God saves. He is the savior. And so it's he it's because of his emptying of self and his full obedience to his father that he has this quality of being the savior of of mankind. It's just amazing.

SPEAKER_05 1:14:17

And and we are to be Christ-like in doing that as well, and and like going back to the godliness. But I find it so fascinating that Sabrina brought that up. The time element, the that authority in the name of is temporary. We're and I'm gonna I'm gonna make I'm probably gonna mix up some verses here, references, because I I I don't have them right forefront in my mind, but it just calls to this idea of you know this this whole emptying myself, pointing to God. I'm doing that in in this vessel, this body, this life that He has given me as a gift. I'm doing that now. That is a temporary thing because soon but because you know soon I will be joined with him. I will be teleos complete and whole and and and made perfect. That's not an overreach. Glorified, glorified with him, sanctified with him. Uh, thank you for saving me on that. And so that I just love that whole time element, ties it back together again. It's you know, this is temporary, there is an end goal, there's a promise. Promise is another word that keeps coming up a lot in my study of you know, just keep pointing to that. Peter, Paul, they keep pointing back to that promise. Don't forget that promise. That all of this is is I think we we took we hit it on our episode of faith that you know that hall of fame of faith in Hebrews 11 of all these people that didn't receive their their promise was not fulfilled, they didn't see it here, but they received something even greater and and better.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:58

They knew Jesus without they knew Jesus, they knew the risen Messiah, right?

SPEAKER_05 1:16:04

They do now. Right. Was it Moses that appears with Jesus in what whose vision and Elijah, the transfiguration? Not transfiguration. There was I know there was transfiguration, but wasn't there another one where Moses was maybe I am thinking transfiguration.

SPEAKER_04 1:16:22

I know for sure the dangerous when I try to go off the club here. Peter, Peter, James, and John see Elijah and Moses alongside. That's that's probably what I'm thinking of. Maybe that's what you're thinking about. Yeah, that's yeah, that's gonna be it.

SPEAKER_05 1:16:35

So Brina, did you have one more mic drop?

unknown 1:16:38

No.

SPEAKER_01 1:16:39

Well, I can't remember how this tied into what you're saying, but I did have this in my mind to bring up after you shared Ben. So I think it ties in in some way. But oh uh you're talking about some of the Hebrew words or names for God, and how we you don't often hear them blasphemed in the same way you hear God or Jesus. And I it made me think I heard this from the Bible project. We just brought that up for the book.

SPEAKER_05 1:17:12

Settle down, Robbie. If you're listening, settle down.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:15

It's a good podcast. But anyway, so they were were talking about the commandment to not thou shalt not take God's name in vain. And I just heard this and I just realized this for the first time. But you know, the host of that podcast, and we should fact-check them and myself, because I'm saying it right now. I haven't fact-checked this myself, but they're saying that take is actually not the best translation, and it's actually carry. So thou shalt not carry the Lord's name in vain, and the connotation of that just changes when you think about it. Yeah, and yeah, and so it's not just like about our words cursing, it's more about our actions and habits not representing the Lord in the way that he wants us to represent him. It's an when it we're careless or insincere or disrupt in a disrespectful manner that doesn't represent God in the way that he calls us to represent him.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:21

It goes back to you know, uh the opportunity. It's one thing to miss an opportunity. I I could have stepped in and represented God there. It's another thing to step in and misrepresent God. And it comes back to reverence.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:37

We're gonna start dropping a you know money in a jar by the time we bring up reverence.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:41

That's the Bible for you. It all ties in together.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:45

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:46

So that's all I had for you got me fired up. Yeah, I'm ready to go.

SPEAKER_05 1:18:54

If we were at y'all's house, I'd run through a wall right now.

SPEAKER_01 1:18:59

Taylor, did you have more notes?

SPEAKER_05 1:19:02

I thought he's debating with himself.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:04

Yeah, I I I'm just on the logos. Oh no. Uh oh. And I'm looking at the Hebrew. This is Do you have the logos app? Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_01 1:19:14

Is it just called the Logos app? Yes. Okay. I'll download it.

SPEAKER_04 1:19:18

I will say I kind of the full the full thing. I kind of don't love the interface, but I so I don't use it as much as I wish that I did, but I do get on it when I need to like do what we're doing right now. But it is Exodus 27, chapter 20, verse 7, to be clear. And the word in Hebrew is yisa, which can be translated in different ways, but it means like what you're just getting what you're describing, to misuse, to lift up, to carry, to bring, to take, as we said. But when you yeah, when you look up this word, you saw the most common use of it seems to be misuse. So uh like appropriating or utilizing repres in a representational way God's name in an inappropriate manner, which I think is interesting.

SPEAKER_05 1:20:20

At the risk of of broaching a probably a off the broadcast subject. Oh. Is the logos app the same as the logos software? Is that the same people?

SPEAKER_04 1:20:29

It's the logos Bible app. I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_05 1:20:32

Is that like a paid thing?

SPEAKER_04 1:20:34

It's like this.

SPEAKER_05 1:20:34

Is that a free app?

SPEAKER_04 1:20:35

It's free.

SPEAKER_05 1:20:36

I don't I don't know. Because there's a logos software out there. Okay, but it's very expensive, and so I have to do my research the old-fashioned way of bouncing around from translinear to versions. No, I was about to say if you have access to low, we're about to be best, best friends. Because I'll be knocking on our on your door to get some information.

SPEAKER_04 1:20:59

But yeah, no, I I I don't think I paid anything for the top. But it it's good. I mean, it'll give you, I mean, you can I'll show it to you.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:10

Oh, I'll check that one out.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:11

It'll it'll literally show you like where things appear, the most common uses.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:16

I spent a year and a half studying the divine nature and all the Greek where I probably could have got done in a week. Oh man, I have been wasting so much time.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:25

Well, this is gonna be a game changer for you. The Logos Bible op.

SPEAKER_05 1:21:28

Doing it the old-fashioned way, I have learned a lot. Like the fact that I can I'm not a good memorizer, but I can I have dug through so much Greek that I can recall certain words from memory at this point. And not because I sat there and tried to memorize it, but but just because I've looked at them so much that uh they're right there. So I I do love that if if if my study goes nowhere and does nothing for anybody else, it's done a lot for me personally. So anyway.

SPEAKER_04 1:21:56

This one's cool. Like you can click any verse in the Bible, Old Testament or New, and get word-for-word breakdown of the Greek or the Hebrew. Um it'll tell you, it'll give you an exegetical guide of like here's like I was showing you, like, here's where this word appears, here are inflections or like variations of this word, here's translations.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:19

Sounds like a common I I usually bounce between like four different sources primarily.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:25

And uh it looks like it's all in one.

SPEAKER_04 1:22:27

But I've it's gonna save a lot, but I'll warn you, I think the interface is a little unintuitive. Not I I'll I'll not too. I'm grateful for the for that. Yeah, there's some people who really did a good job.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:42

Since we keep speaking up technology in this episode, I just I think I've mentioned before, I'll say it again, uh, just how fortunate we are to have at our fingertips so much like different translations. The gre like I don't I can't speak Greek fluently, I can't speak English fluently, but I can access Greek and I can see so many different descriptions and and and and studies and and uh and I can just grow in knowledge and and understanding of of things because uh it's become such so accessible, and I can't not help but just thank God for that. Because my faith and the way that I think and approach things, like if I didn't have that, my faith would be very empty. And or not faith, but my understanding and and uh maybe appreciation for for God and scripture would be very lacking if it weren't for all those blessings. But well, this was episode this was part two of our of study on God. So did we get it all out? I think we did we did we I think so.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:54

This was a really interesting discussion.

unknown 1:23:56

Yeah, I liked it.

SPEAKER_05 1:23:57

So there should be no more questions for anybody listening. Who who is God? What is God? But we we answered it all.

SPEAKER_04 1:24:06

And I mean, I think too, like just going back to this and we mentioned this in the last episode too, but you know, God is not a puzzle. Yeah, you know, he just wants a relationship with you, and so he like I think I would say uh it is good to have these conversations.

SPEAKER_01 1:24:23

We're wrestling with who God is, that helps us to draw closer to him, but for anyone who feels overwhelmed by it all, I think that's a fair good point, Taylor. Like he's not a puzzle, he just wants to be with us, to have a relationship with us.

SPEAKER_05 1:24:38

You don't have to be a scholar to have a relationship, yeah. Right, and that's the most important thing. And I have to remind myself, even as I'm digging down these rabbit holes, trying to just better understand that I can get I can get distracted and lose track of why am I doing this? Is it just to boost my own knowledge or is it to grow closer to God and and know him better? Right. And and I have to remind myself a lot sometimes on that.

unknown 1:25:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:07

And it's a balance to realize too that like there is, I mean, I I loved what Lacey brought up about the story of Hagar, how oftentimes these names that we have of God, Eldoi, or like the God who sees me, like these different names, you know, in the Burning Bush story in Exodus, there, that Sabrina mentioned, that the names of God are received by people in their experience of God. And that he he condescends to us as humans in order that we might have a name by which we can worship him and that we can relate to him. And that's just such a beautiful aspect of it. It's not just like, you know, open your dictionary, hear a list of, you know, just abstract adverbs and nouns. Right. Like my name, Taylor, doesn't it's just some random amalgamation of consonants and vowels. I guess it has some kind of meaning. Tate. Tate. But yeah, I think it's really interesting that God's names appear so often in these in this in this way of like relating to him. Emmanuel, right? He's with us.

SPEAKER_05 1:26:19

That was the whole reason I brought up divine nature and I did I missed my main point was going back to the old testament, it's the those names like you were talking about, those names are describing the attributes of God. And that's what I find so fascinating about the divine nature is it's the it's the attributes, the nature of God, divinity. But we gotta we gotta wrap it up sometime. So we'll have to wrap it up there. We can always come back to it. I was being facetious about answering everything about God, you know, the undescribable. We hit it in two episodes, so we can always come back to it. But thank you guys so much. Thank you. That was great stuff. So, yeah, and thanks for bearing with me on my tangent there. Anyway, thank you so much for joining us. Ashburn, Virginia, we love you. Can't wait to come visit and uh taste that good cooking. Everybody else, we're so happy to have you with us too. Thanks for being part of our small group. Please just reach out to us. If you got nothing better to say, say hi. Uh, because we just love to hear from you and uh get to know you. And um, but if you have questions, topics, uh anything like that, please send them our way. You can find all of our information in the description on our podcast. Uh, and as always, thank you so much for being part of it.