Remembering VH1's Family Therapy with Dr. Jenn

Is it therapy? Is it television? Is it both?

Noah and Aidan love watching reality shows you're curious about but may not want to invest actual time in. This week, the duo dives deep into VH1’s *Family Therapy with Dr. Jenn* (2016) which was a chaotic, emotional, and often unhinged experiment in televised healing similar to Couples Therapy or Marriage Boot Camp. From Tiffany “New York” Pollard and Sister Patterson’s mother-daughter warfare to Bam Margera’s post-Jackass unraveling, the show brings together celebrity family units for group therapy sessions that are part breakthrough, part spectacle.

Aidan and Noah unpack the show’s wildest moments, the surprisingly touching sibling arcs, and Dr. Jenn’s signature therapy techniques (including rage rooms, bracelet affirmations, and emotional photo analysis). They also address the shows' lukewarm ratings, its place in VH1’s golden age of reality TV, and whether anyone actually got healed.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:13

Hey note takers, this is Noah Aaron with the Honor Real Note Podcast. And this is Aidan, and I am not a licensed clinician. Oh, neither am I, but I can pretend to be like Dr. Jen. I think she has a license. I think she has her license. Well, we'll see about that. We'll see about that. Oh, okay. I'm gonna have Phaedra Parks look into it. Well, she still has her license. I'm sure people tried to remove hers. Oh, they definitely have. But in case you guys haven't picked up what we will be discussing today, we are talking about it's a little bit of a throwback. I mean, I guess it is a throwback because like this show was literally like as of like spring, like 2016, it was airing, so that was nine years ago. Um, but we're gonna be talking about family therapy with Dr. Jen, which was a VH1 reality show, which showed it was basically a spinoff of couples therapy, and it showed famous families. May I mean I guess I don't know about these weren't A-listers, but you know. They had some reality TV fans. Yeah, reality TV supercast vibes. That's what was giving. And basically showing them in their stars. Yeah, and showing them in their fucked up family dynamics while they received some some interesting, wacky family therapy.

SPEAKER_02 1:29

Pretty much. Also, yeah, pretty much a spinoff of couples therapy. If you've seen Marriage Bootcamp, Marriage Bootcamp Family Edition, any of those shows over on Wii TV. Same vibe, similar vein, people in a house, you get some group therapy, you get some one-on-one, some ridiculous exercises, and you have a show.

SPEAKER_00 1:50

Exactly, exactly. Um, and then so basically we have like and we'll get into the cast in a little bit, but we have the cast moving into the therapy house, and Dr. Jen is our primary, our primary physician. Um, Dr. Jen is like our our main doctor, she's our main uh therapist, but she is joined by a few other therapists, counselors, whatever staff, uh, and and apparently like seven security guards for Dina Lohan. Um and yeah, it's it's pretty. I mean, I feel like it's exactly what you think it is, like Aiden said. Um, each episode we kind of watch, we watch like one-on-one sessions, we watch group therapy sessions, we have various exercises um meant to I mean, just gonna cut I I feel like it's mainly the kind of shit you would probably see in normal therapy with maybe a little bit of woo-woo stuff mixed in as well. Um I'd agree. And so kind of getting into the shows and got into the show itself and the premise, um, like what Aiden, I know, I mean, obviously we were both aware of this show because of the viral clips, but I don't think either of us had actually like sat in and watched the show previously.

SPEAKER_02 3:12

Oh no, I never watched this. Maybe I watched the premiere. I feel like no, because I I was already in college when this happened. But there was an ever when I would just be having VH1 on. You know, whatever came on, I was watching. Like I watched, I don't know if it was VH1 or E, but that famously single show and a bunch of other bullshit, but I definitely have mostly seen it through clips. So some things I was like, oh yeah, I remember when this, you know, this happens. I saw this moment, but I don't think I'm New York centric. And I'm sure there were a lot that were like Bam Rogera-centric because he's such a Jura in himself, you know, to get to the cast, but yeah, that's mainly what I knew because I don't really like these kind of shows. Nothing against them, like the format clearly works. People like seeing these train wrecks. You don't have to build in the drama or do any production really. I mean, you do some production to egg it along, but relationship-wise, the dynamic is already there to, you know, to work with. It's essentially just do you have the coins to get people, you know, the viewers care about to bear all their family drama on TV, essentially. But you know, it's just like I don't know. I just start thinking about what would it be like with my family? And I just can't I can't take it. I don't watch the Badgirl Club.

SPEAKER_01 4:24

Right?

SPEAKER_00 4:25

Right. Well, I feel like part of that is I mean, at least the Bad Girls Club, I feel like knows it's being exploitative and and admits it. I feel like this is I guess my thing with this show, um, and I guess in general, like therapy shows like this, is I feel like any like legitimate therapist that is therapist, counselor, mental health professional that is like holding themselves to even like the lowest bar in terms of just like ethical standards would not engage in something like this. Like I like when I see something like this, and I like I see like a Dr. Jen or a Dr. Phil or like whatever, like I immediately like, okay, they're a quack, you know, like definitely that that's I'm gonna say straight up quack, at least for me. I guess. I guess just when I see like a mental health professional like participating in something like this, like being like an on-camera thing, like just doing some shit like this, right? Some like rip some like exploitative reality TV, I'm immediately like, okay, like you may like actually be like a therapist or a counselor or whatever. Like you may have gone to school, you may have gotten your shit together and your degree and your certification and you know every fucking thing, as um, as Monique and Precious would say. Um but I just feel like if right, I feel like if you're participating in this as like a mental health professional, I'm just like, okay, I'm I'm not really taking you that seriously.

SPEAKER_02 5:50

I definitely see what you mean. I definitely think it takes a certain like risk in your reputation and brand. And there's also a certain desire for fame. It's kind of just like not even on the clinician side, but Bozema St. John, who's on Real Housewives of Beverly Hills now. I know even when she was a professional, it was like does she just want to be famous and brand herself? And well, now she's the real housewife of Beverly Hills, so sometimes it works, but it's definitely an avenue you can take. So I understand and fully like get your perception. And I wouldn't necessarily choose a clinician like this, you know, mental health therapist counselor. Well, yeah, unless I was going to be filmed and be on TV. Because that's maybe some of it. Like some, like your real therapist probably may not want to do this. Like, if you become a reality stuff, they're probably like, well, I I can talk to you about that, but I'm not going on I'm not going to filming with you on housewise. Which may be why like there's like a niche for some of them, but that's how I feel.

SPEAKER_00 6:47

It's like, okay. Well, my thing is I definitely like I would not, I would not in a million in a million years, I would not want a therapist that like wants to be on TV. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, I I wouldn't want that. It's just it's just like I wouldn't want a fucking plastic surgeon that wants to go on TV and talk about it.

SPEAKER_03 7:06

Like, no.

SPEAKER_00 7:07

I don't think so. I don't think so.

SPEAKER_02 7:09

Well with plastic surgeon, I think there's some of like that reverse interest of like what's life like for one of the best plastic surgeons in the world? Because it's like a hard practice to get into. Like there are they are, you know, talented doctors, but there's also some I'm sure some narcissism there off of just the wealth and being a doctor. But with the thing with Dr. Jen is maybe some if you want to be on TV, maybe you want a therapist that wants to be on TV. Maybe they get it. Like, I don't know, do celebrities want famous therapists? I don't know necessarily that, but yeah. Maybe it's like kind of relatable to some. Like a sports psychologist that played your sport. I don't know.

SPEAKER_00 7:50

It's kind of ridiculous. Well that and there you have it, and there you have it. But I uh and I guess my thing with the show, and we'll kind of get into we'll kind of get into this when we talk about the cast in a moment here. But part of my thing with the show and the premise of the show is I feel like to me, this show with its cast felt kind of confused on what it wanted to be because you had a mixture of people who have like legitimately serious issues. I mean, in some cases, even with like the addiction and whatnot, like life and death issues. Like you have some cast members that have like very serious issues that they need to work on and everything, mix with cast members who it's like are very clearly here just to just to have some more TV mo like to have a TV moment and everything and act up for the cameras. So it's it feels very disjointed to me in that regard. Like it feels like the show doesn't really know exactly what it wants to be. Like, does it want to be like a little bit more highbrow and serious, or does it want to just be trash TV?

SPEAKER_02 8:51

I mean, I think they try to kind of be highbrow and serious, but there's only so far you could get with this cast and airing on VH1. Yeah, you know, it's not this is nothing that you know, it's nothing that ABC, NBC, C and BS would pick up. I don't think you know.

SPEAKER_00 9:05

Well, that's what that's what I'm saying, is it feels a little dis disjointed, but with that, do you want to get into our our cast, our patience on this season?

SPEAKER_02 9:14

Well, I just want to touch on a few things. One with this what you said about the mix of the cast. Like I definitely kind of agree with that. Some of them seem more serious, but I do think at a baseline they were all like, oh, like each cast, like I don't want to say member, but e I guess each family on the show. I think each at least one moment on the show is like, oh, I would not want that televised. Which I think is normal for the show, but I didn't I think there was some seriousness. But I do think the approach the show took, like, varied in cartoony and serious. So it was a mess. But I do want to highlight some of the ratings, just to give a sense of how the show performed. But it averaged a 370,000 viewers. Okay. I mean 370. Yeah. Yeah, 370,000 viewers, which is good. Especially for that. I mean, it was solid. I mean, that would be great. But I mean, it was really not great compared to what else, you know, VH1 had going on. Because this is when Love and Hip Hop was kind of maybe not at a Tayday, but still kind of riding the wave in 2016. Black and crew. So those shuttles were doing like a million viewers, for example. So it really wasn't wowing people at VH1. And I think it probably relied a lot on the cast, which I think is what is the bread and butter for these kind of shows. It's just like, oh, you want to see this person? Bear it all.

unknown 10:34

Right.

SPEAKER_02 10:35

So I'd say it had a lot of modest performance, but there's probably a reason you haven't watched it.

SPEAKER_00 10:44

Um no, I I I see that, I see that. And definitely with the show at the time, like I I yeah, like I pretty much my my only exposure to it was I didn't watch it, but it was like those viral clips from the show, mainly of New York and Sister Patterson doing the most.

SPEAKER_02 10:59

Exactly. Should we just start there with the VH1 homegrown talent? Tiffany New York Pollard and Michelle Rocksdown, Sister Patterson.

SPEAKER_00 11:09

Absolutely, we can get right into that. Yeah, we had um something, yeah. We we had um yeah, Sister Patterson, New York Tiffany New York Pollard, and you know, they were kind of it it's a little bit weird because to me, like Tiffany actually in this show came off, and ultimately I really don't know how much of it is real and how much of it is an act, but she came off a lot more, I guess, like real and subdued than she does in most of her reality TV uh performances. Um, this was also this was the same year that she did Celebrity Big Brother on that show too, Celebrity Big Brother. Like she had her Tiffany moments, but overall she also was still even on there, like a little bit more chill than how we had seen her previously.

SPEAKER_02 11:55

I had the same exact note with New York. I was like, wow, you would this is because usually there's a mix of it, you see some real her, but she'll be really a little ridiculous. Because we've covered, I think, pretty much like all her shows except you know, famously single and celebrity big brother at this point. Yeah. Or we've gotten close to it. But like Scared Famous, she'd mix it up between, you know, tender and real and ridiculous. And we got bits and pieces. I mean, House of Villain, she was just a lot. But no, here it's a good one. I don't know if it was just she saw what you know Sister Patterson was doing and thought maybe she should tone it down or what, but yeah, we definitely got a tender open, appreciating the experiment in New York. And maybe it was a bit maybe just preparing for her. I guess being back on TV, because like you said, she did film this when on Celebrity Big Brother, which actually aired first because that's you know live, like you're in the house while it comes on, so which is a lot to process, especially what happens at the result of the show. So you know, we got a very honest and open New York. So I don't know if she's using this as her pathway back to reality TV or just like the seriousness of it all is what got to her. Because her big storyline is that she's pregnant and has you know is dealing with that throughout the show. So trying to deal with a pregnancy and her mom. Yeah. On camera. One in December. One thing back on TV as known as New York.

SPEAKER_00 13:22

Well, one thing, and I think the thing is with Sister Patterson is I mean, we've seen her because I mean the thing is we hadn't seen her since like the celeb reality days, I don't think, and I don't think we've really seen her on anything again since this, as far as I'm aware of.

SPEAKER_02 13:36

Um I mean, not aside from that little I Love New York reunion address in the white wife picture.

SPEAKER_00 13:43

One thing, and I feel like this family therapy show is honestly, at least from what we've seen as Sister Patterson on television, this is like her her most unhinged, I feel. Like this was like, she was doing a lot on this show, like a lot, a lot.

unknown 13:59

Sorry.

SPEAKER_00 13:59

Like she was over the top. Oh, it's okay. She was over the top on like Flavor of Love and I Love New York and everything. Like she was ridiculous. But I mean, this was like next level. This was like crazy shit. You know, watching this, I was like, I don't I don't know if it is that. It's hard to tell, honestly. Like, either either it's like real and she's fucking nuts out of her goddamn mind, or she's a really, really amazing actor. I don't know which it is. I know, it's just and she always always delivers it with such passion, too.

unknown 14:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:31

But there were some moments where she was being, you know, light and tender and you know, complimenting others and you know, the house and like 10% of the time, you know, she was being pleasant. We're just like, okay. Because usually on Flavor of Love, she was going at the other people. So I I I had to really take in those moments of Sister Patterson being kind and agreeable because there aren't a lot of them on the show.

SPEAKER_00 14:58

Being just a normal person. But I mean, her her moments where she was wacky, they were frequent and they were like so bizarre. I mean, oh my gosh. I mean, we we we can um we have a we have a segment later on the episode for like our kind of most memorable or craziest moments, but she she had a lot of them.

SPEAKER_02 15:21

Um pretty much every time she's on screen, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:24

Yeah, and I mean she kind of basically just seemed to be pretty resistant to like anything in regards to the actual therapy of the show until like the very, very end. Even that wasn't really the therapy, that was just like that was just a family visit that kind of got her to like kind of maybe show some level of growth. I don't know. Um, but Tiffany herself, she really did show a much deeper side of her than like what we had seen previously. And honestly, watching though, like the scenes of her talking about being pregnant and everything were really sad to watch, just knowing that she ultimately did have a miscarriage.

SPEAKER_02 16:05

Yeah, I know that was the hardest part, just uh knowing how it all ends up and how Sister Patterson is talking about it.

SPEAKER_00 16:12

Yeah, and how she's treated how she treats on the Steve Harvey show. Um But also And then she had to go right over to Big Brother and deal with them British motherfuckers. Those crazy Brits. And then the next 15, I don't know if that was filmed before or after this, to be honest. They came out the same year. They actually came out the same year.

SPEAKER_02 16:39

What thing, because actually the next 15 came out of three shows at one.

SPEAKER_00 16:43

Oh my god. What thing uh, because the next 15 came out it premiered February, and Family Therapy premiered March. Um, so I don't know which one was filmed first, though, but then yeah, and she also did Celebrity Big Brother.

SPEAKER_02 16:56

I think I would assume the next 15 was filmed first, because I'm not surprised if that took forever to land a network in a home.

SPEAKER_00 17:05

Right, right.

SPEAKER_02 17:07

And there's some things about the cats being like pictured away earlier. So But it could have been close to that show, also New York was barely at film at half the time.

SPEAKER_00 17:18

Right, yeah, she was she was she was not that involved, and she basically just shut up every now and then and turned the fuck up. But 2016 was like a really big comeback year from her after kind of being a little bit more quiet in the reality TV front.

SPEAKER_02 17:32

Yeah, I never realized how close all of these shows were together, are really overlapping. And then the next year she did Scared Famous.

SPEAKER_00 17:41

Yeah, what's funny to me, I feel like, about the 2016 era was like Celebrity Big Brother. I mean, that was just her being on like in the big under the Big Brother microscope. And then Family Therapy seems like she was showing like a more like raw, real version of herself. And the next 15 was just her taking the New York shtick and turning it up to 1200. So it's just like she she was really giving us uh versatility.

SPEAKER_02 18:05

Ooh. But no, she's a versatile reality star. It's also probably indicative of the different productions and what they're looking for and what they're probably prompting you to do. Yeah, yeah. Which I think she was great in all of them. Carlos wanted over the top, she gave that. Dr. Jen wanted emotions and openness, she gave that. And so I think her brothers wanted you to live in the moment. And she gave us David's dead.

SPEAKER_00 18:30

David's dead. Why the fuck is everyone against me now?

SPEAKER_02 18:35

Which I'm sure her appearance on that this also probably just overshadowed family therapy in the next 15 so much.

SPEAKER_00 18:42

Oh yeah, because I feel like I feel like in the year 2016 she threw so much at the wall, and Celebrity Big Brother is the one that ended up, I think, blowing up the most and becoming the most meme-worthy. Exactly. But enough on that. Yeah, I think that overshadowed everything.

SPEAKER_02 18:57

Because I mean who Justin was basically, but um the Jackass fans will appreciate that, but you're your people.

SPEAKER_00 19:09

Your people. You know that it's it's funny. Well, actually, you know what? Since uh on the topic of Jackass, let's just talk about April and B. Um So Jack, it's funny. Did so did you ever watch like any of those shows growing up, Jackass, Viva Labam, any of that?

SPEAKER_02 19:26

Not like by choice or for very long. Like it wouldn't be on MTV and I would glance at it. I'm just like, okay, white boys on the roof of a mo with a motorcycle or something. Like it's something I can watch for like five minutes, but I never got into the lore anything. But like I knew like I knew who Boy Rogera is from like saying the name.

SPEAKER_00 19:45

Yeah, yeah. It's funny because me and my siblings, we we definitely watched a lot of Jackass and Viva Labam when it was on the air. We watched a lot of those shows. Um and uh we even watched his fucking wedding spinoff too. I remember that shit. Um it was like bam.

SPEAKER_02 20:06

Yeah, I knew you were familiar, so I was like, okay, we we got we got the cast cover.

SPEAKER_00 20:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:10

Because I know low team mom.

SPEAKER_00 20:12

Right. Well, and um, and I mean with I mean with that, and that's like what I was kind of talking about when I was saying there was like some people on here that had like much more serious issues, and like because I mean bam, I mean it's it's not like I because I feel like with Tiff I feel like with Tiffany, like all the jokes about drinking and stuff, it's it's exactly that. It's a joke. Like she does, I don't think she actually has like a serious problem, or at least as far as we're aware. Like it's just a joke about like drinking to deal with her mom and whatever. Um, but with like Bam, it's like, no, this man is like actually like a raging alcoholic and is you know No, he is detoxing enough on Kim. And the words of Lisa Renna about Kim Richard, she she may be close to death.

SPEAKER_02 20:52

And you know, when he was like throwing up, I'm like, is this allowed? Can you have somebody detox on reality TV?

SPEAKER_00 20:59

Well, that's the thing is like we never saw him like receiving medical treatment for the because I mean the thing is like most people when they're going through detox, like if they go to like a rehabilitation center or something, like they go through a period of detox and everything where they're like, I don't know, like hooked up to an IV or getting some kind of medication or like whatever, like they're and like being monitored by nurses and shit like that and doctors. Um so I'm wondering like if he received that that kind of medical care and it just wasn't like it was off camera, just wasn't shown. Or like, did they really have him like dry detoxing in this house? Because that's dangerous.

SPEAKER_02 21:37

Right? That's what I was like not sure about. I'm just like, is this the right protocol? Is April wanted? But I mean, April seemed like I mean not fine, like she wasn't chilling, but well, I feel like maybe she wanted she just wanted to be on the show. Well, I don't know if she just wanted to be on the show, but I think maybe she trusted production.

SPEAKER_00 21:56

I think April reminded me a lot. Of people like people that I know and I people that I know that have dealt with like addicts and whatnot. Um where I feel like sometimes when you've like when you've lived with having a family member that's been like deep in addiction and everything for an extended period of time, it's not that you're it's not that you're necessarily like just like used to it or like don't care or whatever. It but I mean I guess you kind of are used to it. Like it's but it's not like you don't care, like you still care, but like you kind of you've kind of like I feel like you've just dealt like you've seen so much crazy shit and dealt with so much of it that you're kind of like okay, like I'm I'm not gonna necessarily give a big reaction to this. I'm gonna just sit here and take it in.

SPEAKER_02 22:45

You know, April, she didn't seem fully fed up, but definitely like approaching it.

SPEAKER_00 22:49

Right. I think I think Which makes sense.

SPEAKER_02 22:51

He must have been like 35 during this.

SPEAKER_00 22:53

I mean, I don't know, but yeah, no, he I think yeah, and I mean from from what I understand, by this point, by the time they filmed this, I mean he had been dealing with He's 45 now, so he's 36. Yeah, like so by the time they filmed this, he had been, I think, you know, abusing alcohol for like a de like bas like probably nearly a decade at this point. Because I mean he um he had his first rehab stint in 2009. So I mean this had been going on for a while.

SPEAKER_02 23:25

Um we were in the sixth grade, right?

SPEAKER_00 23:27

Well, I'll say this has been going on for a while. And from what I heard, um, when his friend Ryan Dunn, who was also a star of Jackass, when when he passed away, um, I believe that was in like 2010 or 11. It was in 2011. When he passed away, that's from my understanding, that's when like it got like when it escalated and got way worse. So, you know, by the time they did family therapy, like Bam had been like drinking and everything for years. Um But yeah, it was it was watching Bam on here was really depressing. Um just in general, I think like human to human, like watching someone who's clearly like just fucked up the who's like it because I mean I'm not gonna sit here and try to diagnose it, but like the way he talks and everything to me like reminds me of people that like have like alcohol-induced like brain damage. Like it's kind of like even when they're even when they're sober, like they they're brain like they they don't have full brain function, you know.

SPEAKER_02 24:28

Yeah. No, it was sad to see, even as someone who may not have like the personal connection, yeah. I was like, damn. And it was like not hard to feel sympathy for him, but it's like you're not getting baby that hard.

SPEAKER_00 24:41

Right, yeah. That that's that's the thing, is I think um I think it's kind of like it's it's kind of like you feel bad, but also you it's also one of those things where it's like a self-induced issue, like it's you know something that they're doing, like it's self-inflicted. Um, but it was also sad as somebody because like like I said, you know, like growing up, I watched him on TV and everything. And it was just so the the difference between seeing him like back in the day on Jackass and his other shows and the spin-offs and everything versus seeing him on this was like insane because it was just not the same person whatsoever. Like on his when he was like on Jackass and everything, he was like so he was like really like witty and smart and very just like lively and with it and everything. Um, even if they were doing like stupid ass shit in that show. Like he like he he seemed like a pretty bright person. So seeing him on this show was like kind of jarring.

SPEAKER_02 25:40

Yeah, no, when you you know list out the juxtaposition like that, it's like oh. But see, yeah, and that that thing we're talking about. It was interesting. No, I was gonna say it was interesting seeing their dynamic bam and April's because the rest of them in their house were just so contentious sometimes. While there's like there was conflict there, but it was like a much different kind of conflict. It wasn't just them yelling. Which they did sometimes, but it wasn't as fiery, so it was like kind of interesting to see how that played off. And it kind of probably resembled some people's families.

SPEAKER_00 26:14

Not not his shade April, but I feel like she's like an embodiment of like a boy moth that like her her her son can do no wrong. Because I remember like like they would do crazy on the show, like they would like they would like put a wrecking ball through her house on Jackass and Viva La Bam, and she and she did a they would put like a wrecking ball through her house. Make it smoothies. Yeah, they they they would like put a wrecking ball through her house or like paint her kitchen blue or something, like everything blue, like the floor, the ceiling, the the refrigerator. Like they would do shit like that, and she'd be like, oh bam.

SPEAKER_02 26:55

Well, because bam buckets.

SPEAKER_00 26:57

I guess yeah, but she just kind of seemed like what I mean.

SPEAKER_02 27:01

When I looked up how he got the name Bam, they said he was always crashing at the walls. They called him Bam Bam. I'm like, Y'all were going to be.

SPEAKER_00 27:10

It seems to be like she's like what she's like one of those boy moms that like lets their son just do the craziest shit.

SPEAKER_02 27:18

I mean, yeah. How was he gonna child on a show?

SPEAKER_00 27:21

Well, they can I and I mean the whole thing, like Jackass like happened as a result, I think, of like him and his friends were like already doing that crazy dangerous shit and like recording it and putting it on like per like fucking late 90s internet. That's one way to build a brand. The original. And it leads it leads to a fucking MTV show. Um VH1. Yeah, Jack has some MTV show. Um we better hope they don't take this shit down. Um we we will not be playing any fucking footage or audio clips. Um but we feel like and that's another thing that's kind of sad too, like just watching it, knowing like where things are now. That that's the thing is watching this show is kind of is kind of a downer. Like, in trying because like I feel like most of these people like didn't necessarily like actually get anywhere as a result of this. Like, it seems like their lives haven't improved because I mean Ban is still, as far as I know, he's still drinking and turning up. I mean, he got fired from the most recent Jackass movie a few years ago because he couldn't stay sober while they were raking in. And that was in 2022, so like that was not long ago. So as far as I know, he's still like he's still getting in trouble with the law, he's still drinking, um, still in the press for bad things. So I don't think he's really had much success with sobriety.

SPEAKER_02 28:57

Yeah, no, I know there's like a little VH1 where they now situation article. And April said that. Oh, he was sober for like four months. Yeah. It was great. And then she said somebody got him a gift as like some alcohol as a gift. No, who the fuck did that?

SPEAKER_00 29:11

That's evil.

SPEAKER_02 29:14

That is fucked up.

SPEAKER_00 29:16

And I know April still likes that because she still has cred she has other credits after this, and she it's it's always just her appearing as herself on some random ass shit. Okay, April.

SPEAKER_02 29:31

Well, Bam's not no reliable reliable anymore. Does she have a I don't think she has a job? She's gonna try to get a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 29:37

I mean she's like she's like she's like 60, she's like almost 70, I think. So I'm sure she I'm sure she gets social security or something.

SPEAKER_02 29:46

But you know, that that that well she has a hundred K followers on Instagram, so she can promote one of those MLM brands. Um like I mean if I had a hearing aid company or something, right? Right, okay.

SPEAKER_00 30:00

See, see this it this this is why you get paid the big bucks. I'm just joking. He he he's done please don't please don't plan a robbery or anything. This ain't Kyle Richards' house. Um but um oh yeah, no, I checked April.

SPEAKER_02 30:18

She I definitely don't got no Teddy's husband's.

SPEAKER_00 30:22

I checked April that just recently turned 69. So I mean she gets social security, but you know, the current administration, they want to get rid of that. So the current administration, they want to get rid of that shit. So she might have to be she might have to be pedaling, God knows what on her Instagram soon enough.

SPEAKER_02 30:38

Oh lord, I hope not. I mean, she was handling the money with I mean she's interesting.

SPEAKER_00 30:47

Okay, yeah, we're gonna have to get into that too. Um yeah, oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:53

Well, let's get into another set of cast members.

SPEAKER_00 30:56

Well, do you want to talk about the the teen mom and the almost teen mom?

SPEAKER_02 31:03

Let's get into it. Brittany. Yeah, so who I actually knew, cuz I'm not the biggest teen mom fan, but yeah, I would dip and dabble. And I'm a big the challenge fan, and I feel like for the longest time, they kind of blocked their programming. You know how sometimes they put the black house on shelves back to back? It was kind of like that with the the challenge and teen mom. So I would always catch glimpses of Teen Mom before or after. So Teen Mom 3 only lasted for one season, but that was one that I would like watch, and Brianna was the only one I remembered. One, I thought she was so pretty. So she was the first name I remembered. Two, cause they have the most interesting storylines. So like I see why they kept Brianna onto Teen Mom 2, why they they picked her off for things like this, because as you can tell on this show, the dynamic is wild. But so Brianna just had a lot of family drama, and on top of that, again, so pretty.

SPEAKER_00 31:57

Where I thought you were going with that when you were watching the challenge, I literally thought you were gonna tell me because I don't know much, I didn't know much about these girls going into this. I literally thought you were gonna tell me that like Britney was on the challenge, like beating people up in challenges or something. I was like, I was like, I have a feeling that'd be a good fit for her.

SPEAKER_02 32:15

They should have called biceps, they should have called by sets. I would love to see her on the challenge, but that is one crossover that didn't happen. I think like the Jersey Shore and Team Mom people, they might have made too much money to be. Right. Well, I just feel like how aggressive Brittany is. Right, right, but I know they have their sisters, their whole thing of parental abandonment, and you know, finding their identities and their families. Um, like Noah alluded to, they were on 16 and pregnant. Well, Brianna, it was Brianna's episode, but Britney also recently had a pregnancy, but she got, you know, had an abortion and moved on from that. But then Brianna was also dealing with it. So it's kind of a very interesting episode as well. So again, see why producers kept continuing that story and following them. And yeah, they didn't have like the cray well, I mean, they had like one big nuclear rocket ship, but aside from that, they're relatively chilled throughout the show, but you could tell that they are like sisters who have two different vibes and personalities, and that's where the clash comes inherently, on top of like a narcissist mother.

SPEAKER_00 33:25

Well, what I think is funny is just like I I love that like when you put these two sisters next to it, because I feel like you have like these two sisters that like to make digs at each other, but the thing is I feel like Brianna is a good example of like the passive aggressive dig, while Brittany is an example of just the aggressive dig. Because like Brianna, like, she like pokes with a well, she takes like a little jab and then Brittany throws the whole fucking the whole fucking kitchen sink at her.

SPEAKER_02 33:54

I will say I always have liked Britney's favorable towards her what's her on team mom. I thought she's so funny. She's pretty funny and witty. And I think she's kind of like redeemed in the teen mom fight teen mom fandom. Because a lot of them, they they hate all the people that want to watch the show. But Brittany actually getting some compliments. Right.

SPEAKER_00 34:12

Well, I feel like Brittany, it's kind of like she's kind of one of those people where she will say the meanest fucking things, like just so mean and nasty, in the words of Nini, so nasty and so rude. Um, she'll say the meanest things, but she will point out, like, hey, she came at me first and I just responded. And I'm kind of like, well, you got a point there, Brittany. So I mean it's kind of like she's she's she said some wild stuff, but she also like she could defend she can defend what she said. And I'm kind of like, well, you know, like you, you you have a point that she she maybe she maybe maybe Brianna did ask for that a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 34:47

Maybe she did co maybe she did I mean Brianna can think they uh threatened to fight people at the mom reunion. So she has a bit of a mouth on her, but Britney tends to fight.

SPEAKER_00 34:58

Right, but I'm like, maybe Brianna did court that smoke a little bit.

SPEAKER_02 35:05

Oh, definitely, definitely. And I feel like their mom definitely probably enabled it. And the big thing with them when which was what their mom revealed, which also I did not know about them at all, was that whoever raised them as was supposed to be both their fathers wasn't actually Brittany's father, and her actual father had passed away, is the story that Roxanne, their mother, told her. Yeah, that is on the show.

SPEAKER_00 35:32

That is not something I would disclose to my children, like with a reality TV camera pointed at me, but that's just me.

SPEAKER_02 35:44

Right like for the first time, I was like, oh my god. And then goes and chases after her. You can't be mad at me. Which that was the craziest part. Doing the whole news is like if that's what you felt you needed to do, if you wanted your check too. Alright. But you're gonna say you can't be mad at him.

SPEAKER_00 36:01

That's ridiculous. That that that's crazy to me, where it's like it's like telling someone something that's a hurtful and b, you should have probably told them a long time ago. But to tell them and then be like, but you can I I'm I'm being honest and telling you the truth, so you can't be mad at me. It's like, yes the fuck I can, bitch. Yes the fuck I can.

SPEAKER_02 36:21

You kept this secret, and then the whole time had like a photo of like Britney and him up in the house. Oh my god. That's insane.

SPEAKER_00 36:28

That's so insane. Um, and yeah, that was definitely like one of the craziest moments. Rob was like, Really? Are you fucking kidding me? Um, but I feel I feel like Britney and Brianna, like you said, I feel like they were kind of more a little more chill throughout the season. And I feel like they um I feel like they were there in good faith, you know. I think so. I think they were I think they were of those there in good faith.

SPEAKER_02 36:56

Yeah, they were trying. You could tell that their mom was a lot of the drivers behind their dynamic. And they were also so much younger than the rest of the cast, because at this time they're maybe like 20 and 22 at the oldest. Yeah. Like when they're filming this. And the rest of the cast is like they're a grown adult to their 30s or 40s. So they're still figuring themselves out and their personal, you know, just coming into the world versus other people who have like, you know, decades-long beef. Which I think is to your point, like some of the casts were so wildly mis like all different stories kind of thrown together. But I do think do think that one bombshot was wild. But at least she dropped it at 21 finally. Like, I get not telling her when she's like three, but I mean maybe.

SPEAKER_00 37:42

It's like you should have told her earlier and you should have told her off camera. But you know, shit happens. Um but as far as people, as far as a as um a duo that I feel like was not here in good faith, uh Lindsay Lohan mommy and Lindsay Lohan daddy. Uh Dina and Michael Lohan. Ooh. I don't realize they had two actors. They had two performers. Those two are fucking toxic. They are so fucking toxic.

SPEAKER_02 38:16

Oh my god. Oh, I can't believe my eyes. And also, how did I not see these clips? Because all the things going viral were like the New York clips. Maybe the Teen Mom fandom appreciated that. I had never seen well, I saw the first thing of the Sister Patterson. Spirit bit me. They're going to shake their sister Patterson jerks away. Her spirit bit me. So I've seen that, but I don't know how I've never seen any of Michael Lohan.

SPEAKER_00 38:43

It was so weird to me, by the way, how Sister Patterson, like, immediately upon meeting them, like just immediately like decided that she hated freaking Dina Lohan's guts and that she was gonna she was gonna like latch on to fucking Michael Lohan as her damn ally or something. Like they were a final two in this game.

SPEAKER_02 38:59

Um and she was gonna Yeah, I'm like, are y'all gonna leave to go?

SPEAKER_00 39:04

She was like gonna she was like ride or die for Michael Lohan, who she didn't even know. To go after Dina Lohan, who she didn't even know. Um ridiculous. Um but yeah, like Mike.

SPEAKER_02 39:18

But yeah, no, Michael Lohan is a crazy coke head and Dina is a little bit of a.

SPEAKER_00 39:25

It's kind of hard it's kind of hard to like the thing is they're both so toxic and insane. And like they were both they were both being so messy, like trying to go around to everyone to turn everyone against. Like they like they were actually they were in the big brother house trying to turn everyone against the other.

SPEAKER_02 39:39

Um the thing with Michael is that all Dina had to do was you know wait a little bit, not say that much, and he would just have essentially like that's the thing with Michael. He never could, like, whenever he would get little Goodwill or you know, big convincing argument, he would just go ballistic and say something crazy.

SPEAKER_00 40:06

But he made it really hard for me, he made it difficult for me to believe him and easy for me to believe Dina. Because like the thing with him is it's like listening to him argue about the abuse, like the how extensive the abuse was and everything was crazy. Because like he wouldn't deny abusing her, but he would like want to argue over the like the smallest details of the abuse.

SPEAKER_02 40:31

Um it happened one time that yeah.

SPEAKER_00 40:36

And then it like it would it reminded me of fucking Taylor Armstrong's husband on Laws of Beverly Hills when he was like getting like when he got all ex apparently he got all excited that they could sue Camille for slander because she said that he broke Taylor's jaw when in reality he just dislocated it. I was like, that's fucking crazy that you're excited, you're excited, like, oh, she said broke instead of dislocated, we can sue the bitch. It's like that's insane. And then like, yeah, that's the thing, is like I feel like the way Dina would even mention abuse, and the Michael would just go fucking off and go on and on and like say a lot of things without actually like he would talk a lot without saying anything and just get so aggressive and everything. It it made me more inclined to believe what Dina was saying. I was like, okay, you you seem like an abuser.

SPEAKER_02 41:25

Exactly. And I do like kind of see what he was saying when saying Dina's not honest, because it did feel like she was holding back throughout the show, and kind of like if I had to say who shared three, it would be Dinah by far. But also Michael just very, very uncertaining man. Watch one another's show.

SPEAKER_00 41:45

But I believe every allegation about her partying and doing drugs with Lindsay, to be honest. I believe every fucking allegation.

SPEAKER_02 41:53

Oh yeah, he was like, we didn't cope together.

SPEAKER_00 41:55

I was like, I guess the thing is, is I believe the worst about both of them. Like I believe that he abused her, and I believe that she's like that she was like a dr a drug addict that did terrible things to Lindsay. I I believe the worst about both of them. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 42:12

Um I mean I do I do think just in general they put you know themselves in the money before Lindsay and Allie because they tried to make Ali a star too.

SPEAKER_00 42:24

And they and they and you know what they both ended up with? They all both ended up broke with a mugshot set.

SPEAKER_02 42:32

Now Lindsay got her Netflix sex on the other.

SPEAKER_00 42:34

I was talking about I was talking about Dina and Michael. Oh, oh, oh. I thought you were talking about Lindsay and Allie.

SPEAKER_02 42:40

I'm like, okay.

SPEAKER_00 42:41

You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_02 42:44

We know Lindsay has mugshots. I don't know if Allie. I hope not. I hope not.

SPEAKER_03 42:58

Okay, good.

SPEAKER_02 43:01

But I did get an in an entertainment weekly article from 2011. Lindsay Lohan has a mugshot. Ali has a mom in here. That's insane.

SPEAKER_00 43:12

You know what, but it's so 2011. It's so 2011. That is ridiculous. Well, you know what? You know what? Lindsay has had a comeback. She got her facelift and she got her Netflix deal. Leave her alone. Um she got some of the best work I haven't seen in my life because she looked like she's like, literally, though, like I think that in the last few years, Lindsay Lohan and Christina Aguilera, whoever their doctors are, like literally turned back the clock 20 years on them. It's insane to me. Because like Lindsay Lohan got that facelift, and Christina Aguilera got an Osempic and did whatever else she did to her face. And like, like literally, she turned back into like early 2000s, like X Tina. I was like, what the fuck just happened? What is this?

SPEAKER_02 43:58

Now you know I love my. Fellow Sag. Well, they're both Sages, Christina and Lindsay. But you know I love Miss Aguilera, but her face. It looks sort of like she got the work done. Lindsay got an actual way.

SPEAKER_00 44:09

But they both look good. I'm starting to believe those crazy ass Republicans that say they're injecting like fetus blood or something. I don't know. They're doing something crazy. I don't know. Whatever the latest conspiracy theory, I don't know. Whatever they think is going down in that pizza parlor. But um Yeah, in my opinion, Dina and Michael, they they were they they weren't here, they weren't here to to to heal.

SPEAKER_02 44:42

Nothing they they're both here to get a paycheck and know each other's stuff.

SPEAKER_00 44:48

Yeah, they both were here to like slander each other and get paid to do it, you know. And if that if that was their prerogative, then then I guess they succeeded at that. Um and in the words of Monique, you didn't come as a friend at all.

SPEAKER_02 45:02

Um and for the most part, you know, Lindsay's name wasn't uttered. So I wonder if that was like a direct one.

SPEAKER_00 45:08

Oh yeah, I'm sure she got I'm sure I'm sure she got to the point where she was like, if y'all keep bringing me the fuck into this, I'm I we're we're going legal. Because I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 45:20

I'm like, does I was wondering the whole time, like, does Lindsay show up on this? I mean, I feel like we would have known if she did, but I was wondering. I'm sure they kind of tried to tease it in the conversions when this was nearby.

SPEAKER_00 45:31

I mean, I don't know. I feel bad for her, because I mean, like, you have like that whole scandal years ago of like her dad Michael like recording her, like talking shit about Dina to like put it out there. Um, and then you also have Michael being like, well, you and Lindsay were doing drugs together, and it's like, why you gotta drag Lindsay into it? Like, why you gotta why you gotta call Lindsay out for like to go after Dina.

SPEAKER_02 45:57

You're right. Wow to drag her in there. But Michael Love talk about how much they both did, how much he did. Wow.

SPEAKER_00 46:06

So I'm sure it was free flowing in that house. Well, and then and then we have the we have the Dash Brothers, which I feel like right? I should have worn some Rockefeller today. But they I feel like with the Dash brothers, compared to like the Lohands, their family issues aren't that bad, right?

SPEAKER_02 46:26

You know, I would say you're not even on par with you know the De He Seusses, but there was definitely some family tension there. Like it wasn't like friendly denly. But most of it's Dame Dash, we know, famous for Rockefeller previously managing Jay-Z. Just being, you know, in the zeitgeist if you're black. I don't know how familiar you were with him though as a youth or even now.

SPEAKER_00 46:48

I mean I I I mean you can you can say it as a cracker. Um no, I do I tell you like that? Nothing. Uh I mean I I I I knew the name Damon Dash, but I couldn't really tell I couldn't tell you much more uh other than I know the name.

SPEAKER_02 47:14

Yeah. But I mean he's another one that, you know, I think he was more you know famous when he still had a relationship with Jay-Z. And then Jay-Z kicked him to the curb and it was kind of like but he still seems to be hanging on to that. So I think a lot of narcissism from being famous and also just being, you know, the famous one of the family. Which I think would throw off any family dynamic. But he comes off particularly bad. Yeah, yeah. Like in relation to his brothers. Like it's almost grating to watch.

SPEAKER_00 47:43

It's like um, I found it interesting.

SPEAKER_02 47:48

I know he's just always constantly berating them over just like career or the choices that they made. But the family aspect of businesses are hard. Like, I went to the number one school in the world for entrepreneurship, and that's like one of the big lessons. Like, you do a little family business module, like it's working with family businesses is it's tough, it's dynamic. Like, watch this show.

SPEAKER_00 48:12

I feel like you'll see what. I feel like whenever you see like these famous like family bit like dynasties and stuff like that, it's it's it's usually doesn't go well. It usually doesn't go well. It has a messy ending.

SPEAKER_02 48:27

I found and I wouldn't want to work for Dame either. He seemed like a rude ass boss probably kind of sending this up. I think kept bringing it up too, you're mad and puts you in a movie. It's like you want to play you wanted to play a criminal, you want to play my car.

SPEAKER_00 48:45

Like talking about you live like because the one brother like lived in an apartment next to their mother and were like, you well, you'd still live with mom. It's like the right no, they live near each other because click on the body. I I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 49:08

Right? Like, why are the superiority complex? You're you're you are the damn dye.

SPEAKER_00 49:12

Like you, you, you know, you have what you accomplished in 99. That's the thing. I don't know why that's it. You're the you're the most famous brother, you're the brother that's had the most success in the industry and everything like that. So I don't yeah, it's like I don't know why you feel the need to so desperately like knock and push your other brothers down to look better. I don't get it. It's like if Kid was acting like Exactly, exactly. That's the thing. It's like I I guess, yeah, that's the thing. It's like it's like you already won, so I don't know why you gotta keep doing this. Um like it's just it's ridiculous. Um I mean it's just maybe and the thing is some people are just fucking assholes, you know what I'm saying? Like some people like it's like okay, he's just an asshole.

SPEAKER_02 49:58

And having some success on the amplifier.

SPEAKER_00 50:00

I found a quote that kind of tickled me from Damon Dash about being diagnosed with type 1 diabetes. Uh this literally has no this like literally has no relation. This is completely off topic and has no relation, but I just wanted to say it. Um so he said, before I was diagnosed, I went about a month or two just going to the bathroom nonstop and losing weight, Dash recalled. Magic Johnson had just been diagnosed with AIDS, so that's what I thought I had. I was scared to even go to the doctor. I thought I was gonna die. Oliver type 1 diabetes. But I I I don't know why Magic Johnson had to catch a stray though.

SPEAKER_02 50:35

So for those that don't know, his um ex-wife was Rachel Roy. Beyonce's man, whoy, allegedly Becky with the good hair. And and who accused him of domestic abuse and filed for a restraining order in April 2015.

SPEAKER_00 50:50

And you know, she she she could have she could have caught hands from Solange too if she'd been in the wrong place at the wrong time. I mean, probably probably when she also she also she also somehow managed to miss the wrath of the bee of the fucking of the baehive because they went after Rachel Ray instead.

SPEAKER_02 51:13

Now they found their way to the city. And that Queen Rachel Rayleigh honey lemonade recipe or whatever.

SPEAKER_00 51:21

That's hilarious to me. You know, Rachel Ray, she's a real one. She's a real one. My grandma used to watch those. My grandma used to watch all her shows, like when she would like when she would have to like eat in New York City on like a really cheap budget, like figure out how to like how to budget that for the day. Yeah, she had like it was like it was like the show. She had like 30-minute meals with Rachel Ray, and she had like the other one, I can't remember what it's called, but it was like literally she'd have like a fucking minuscule budget and she'd have to figure out how to like like how to budget it for the day in New York City. And yeah, those shows were fun. So shout out to Rachel Ray. Um But now that we've kind of gone over the cast, I wanted to kind of talk about what you felt were like the more memorable therapy techniques or exercises that were used throughout the season. Um, I will say in the season trailer when they showed like they when they showed like a coffin or whatever they showed, or like gravestone or where the fuck they showed, I was immediately like rolling my eyes because I'm like, they do this on every fucking ship. Every fucking therapy ship. Right? I was like, oh lord.

SPEAKER_02 52:26

I saw that great.

SPEAKER_00 52:28

I swear to God, every fucking therapy show or every time on a reality show they're do, like, there's a therapist, it's it's always a fucking like funeral exercise. I'm like, what have have we gotten enough of these? Have we gotten enough of these yet?

SPEAKER_02 52:42

No, they're gonna do them every time.

SPEAKER_00 52:43

Somebody there's always somebody's gonna be crying about it. It's just it's just it's a it's always a mess. So I you know what that that one I immediately decided I was like, you know what, I'm not gonna like that exercise on principle alone because I'm sick of it. Um, but what was like a really memorable therapy moment for you this season?

SPEAKER_02 53:04

What I found very interesting was like the photo analysis kind of therapy tasks. So what they did here was kind of have them go into a photo shoot, and they just had one of the um I don't I don't know who what their title was, but they were somebody was just observing them taking notes on how they interacted, how they posed for the photos. And then they also had childhood photos that they looked at and analyzed and kind of saw what the siblings were do were doing then and now. Did this show any subconscious if uh did it show any subconscious dynamics? So I just thought it was an interesting exercise that I hadn't necessarily seen on one of these shows. And it had me wanted to whip out some baby photos. Like, let me see what was going on, let me see what I was given. But it was cute. They saw some things how like Brianna was always in the middle in some of their childhood photos, and then like Brianna always had like a more carefree expression and was doing like the same thing with her hands that she did in one photo, and Brittany was doing like a me mug then and now. So it's like wow, some of them really don't change. And they were like how the um the the day the um the Dash brothers were like mirroring one another and telling how they were in sync, which almost had a little bonding moment for them. I was like, okay, y'all are taking some snaps. See, I like the photo analysis.

SPEAKER_00 54:22

How'd you feel about it? I thought it was interesting because, like you said, that wasn't like an S that wasn't like an an overplayed therapy technique that like I've seen on all these shows and everything. So that was interesting to me, as well as like in a similar vein when they did the writing analysis where they they like looked at their at their writing and they said, you know, we're not necessarily like what's it we're less interested in like the content of what you wrote, but more so like how you wrote it and everything. Which I think was interesting because that's like that's genuinely something that I've never thought of. And I'm like, this could this could totally be some quack technique, but I'm still interested.

SPEAKER_01 54:57

I like the approach there.

SPEAKER_00 54:58

But you you know I'm skeptical of every damn thing, so that that's just me being a bitch.

SPEAKER_02 55:02

Um you know I I Well, I I know I I feel like I'd write crazier in like a writing and a letter. I can really think about it. I can make a thesis, you know, paragraph one, two, three, I conclude, drag your ass.

SPEAKER_00 55:17

Um, but one thing one thing I liked or was memorable was the Smash House because just because I was like, well, I want to do that.

SPEAKER_02 55:25

Same right. I was like, ooh. I might act like Michael Lohan. And then just let But just as you described, like they can go one at a time, smash things and yell, you know, cathartic.

SPEAKER_00 55:38

Those things, yeah. When I scream, really let it out while it's bothering you. When I see a therapy exercise on TV or whatever, when I see like I I those are the ones that like I would want to do the most. The ones where you just get to like go into a room and fucking scream or like break shit or like because that that just sounds cathartic. It does, right?

SPEAKER_02 56:01

Maybe you should go out to the beaches.

SPEAKER_00 56:03

And get a and get jumped by some homeless people that I woke up from their sleep. I I don't think so.

SPEAKER_02 56:09

But uh Well, I don't know if that happens on the beaches of LA.

SPEAKER_00 56:13

That's it. I don't know. That's it. Well, may maybe I'll scream from your roof. Maybe I'll scream from your roof. Ooh.

SPEAKER_02 56:23

No, don't do that. You're gonna wake my dragon up. But I did appreciate the rage room too. I like how they gave New York a little alternative because they didn't want her swinging straight handles around pregnant. So you just had like a picture of Sister Patterson. They were like, do whatever you want to it. You start shoving cake at her.

SPEAKER_00 56:42

You could tell Sister Patterson was bothered. I mean, I think I think literally anything anybody does could bother Sister Patterson. I I don't think she likes to see anything.

SPEAKER_02 56:55

But in that exercise, Dina and Michael pissed me off again because Dina was refusing to engage. And they had one of the headlines up there with like, was it Lindsay and her? I wasn't just Lindsay. Either way, there was a salacious headline, and she ripped that shit down. That is all she destroyed. Y'all gonna try my daughter. I can't. Which pissed Michael off for some reason, and then he just went off, and he was like, 'cause he saw everyone else have a turn, they didn't give him a turn.

SPEAKER_00 57:28

I feel like Dina could like take a like a slightly too deep breath, and Michael would go ballistic and say she's an evil bitch who's ruining his life. Probably. Yeah. No, definitely. I think he's just fucking nuts. But um, yeah, that that was definitely his moment of the season. I mean, he had a lot of moments, but I think that was like his moment was him like go like just going hand.

SPEAKER_02 57:52

Yeah. Yeah, I'm like, if this is, I don't know if he was not. Let's assume that he's sober on the show. But I can I can't imagine what he's like on cocaine.

SPEAKER_00 58:02

Well, I mean, according to this camei, it's a dry facility. According to Miss Cami.

SPEAKER_02 58:06

And he's like 50 now, so imagine him on coconut 20. Right, just going fucking ballistic.

SPEAKER_00 58:11

That that's part that's part of that's part of why I believe Dina when she said he was fucking nuts and going crazy. Um but yeah, man, um an entertaining man though.

SPEAKER_02 58:27

That's I think that's where Lindsay gets the quickness. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 58:30

That that I think yeah, I mean we I feel like definitely, like when we watched um Lindsay's docuseries, as Oprah One Free likes to call it. Um when we watched her docuseries, definitely some of like like watching Lindsay on that, I definitely see a lot of things like mannerisms and stuff that she got from her dad. I I I see a lot of that. Yeah, I you know what I and I think I think I'm I think I'm more respected in this industry than Dr. Janet's.

SPEAKER_02 59:02

But uh and then one last uh technique or like discussion point I wanted to bring up was when they got to the finances and the money, cuz I think that is a big thing with the celebrity relationships of just how that's handled. And I thought they were gonna drag Dina and um Michael. They didn't really I thought they were gonna accuse them of stealing from Lindsay, but we didn't really get that. But I thought it was interesting to see each of the you know groups tackle it, especially Bam and April. I think that's where the the codependency of their dynamic really shine. Because Bam probably was bank rolling everything in, but also could have didn't know where the money was, probably. But for good reason. Because April, that's when April got turned. She was like, it would all be gone if you weren't here. And then Michael tried to jump in too. That also annoyed me. Like you should be the last one talking, you thief.

SPEAKER_00 59:53

Not you thief. I'll edit the I'm cackling at you. I'm just you you criminal. Uh um no, I mean I agree. I think that's definitely with a lot of these child stars, especially. I think that's such a point of contention, is that obviously somebody needs to manage their funds. And because like, I mean, you can't expect a child to be able to know what to do with this kind of money. Um but it's just such a thing because like I feel like it's just such a hit or miss with you have like some child stars whose parents like kind of did right by them financially and did like a and like really did a good job managing the funds and being responsible and doing what was needed. And then you have other ones where like they really screwed their kid over. Like they they had access to that money and they fucked their kid over.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:42

So it's just yeah, we kind of see both sides of the coin. Not that Bam was like a child star, but like teens did they come into fame Jackass? Yeah, they were in their teens.

SPEAKER_00 1:00:51

Yeah, they were in their teens. I think they were minor, I think they might have been minors when they started Jackass. I don't think he was 18. Oh wow.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:59

Yeah, then you know, we'll put them into the child star bundle.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:02

So yeah, we see kind of both sides inspections of it, cuz you know, April doesn't set team me for a woman that would like, you know, take that money and go get her hair done and some procedures, like, yeah, no, I think she was I think she was doing I think she was doing right by him, or at least trying to, you know, because also I know that I know that even somebody who has like the best intentions might not because the thing is like if you if you grew up um if I think I think oftentimes like the the economic class you grow up in determines kind of some of your financial literacy at times. Not obviously there's exceptions, but I just think that like if you didn't grow up around that kind of money, you might not have the financial literacy or skills to know like really know what to do with that kind of money when when you have it.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:50

And I'm assuming that's as far as I as far as I knew, they like they as far as I know, um, Bam grew up like very solidly, just like kind of middle class, maybe like not upper middle class, not lower middle class, but like solidly middle class.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:05

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:06

Yeah, like not not not super well off, but also not like stri necessarily like struggling.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:15

And then the money console also, just in general, it seems like it was a lot behind the relationship with the Dash brothers because they've been trying to employ them, saying that he always helps everyone out, try to hold it against him that he doesn't want to get helped out. I mean that he wants to get helped out sometimes. So it seems like the money and the power situation and how that conflates was a big part of their dynamic as well. And then less so, I feel like with Tiffany and um Brittany and Brianna, but Tiffany didn't mean she was like, well, she has a spending problem, she be buying shit, and sister Patterson was pissed she was like, We did not discuss this part. You're gonna tell my business. And you know what? I believe every side that was an extravagant. I believe that. I believe that. So that was funny. But Tiffany, I mean, she hasn't talked about going broke, so I think she's good with her money, not you know, outrageous with a lot. I mean, she doesn't share a lot as is about her personal life, but I know she's getting some checks to show up on all the side.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:14

Like, I feel like Sister Patterson and her husband and New York's father, I feel like they have money because I feel like from what I've heard, New York grew up grew up like well off. Is what I've heard.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:24

I mean that makes sense because churches can get some coins. And yeah, they don't really seem like poor are struggling. Like it didn't seem like Sister Patterson was spending at the, you know. Uh like that it took anything away from New York. Right. One thing I've Yeah, I never got a sense of what her dad did, but he spoke he had a myself job or something. She definitely grew up in a home.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:47

It seems to me it feels like I feel like if if Bam grew up like middle class, I feel like New York might have grown up like upper middle class, you know?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:57

Mm-hmm. I see that.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:00

Um but yeah, no, I agree. And I think just um, I think for you and I, I feel like just our general nosiness. Like, I feel like we're gonna love a girl. Oh, we're gonna I I feel like for us, it's like, oh we're gonna talk about the money. Okay, let's talk about the money.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:14

Personally, I I don't know, you you would have loved to be the little co-host, absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:19

I love I love, because like I don't want to talk about my finances, obviously, but I I I love to hear about other people's finances. Like that's that's where I get into it, especially with like especially you know when we're talking about like you know, the rich and famous. Um I I love to hear about the finances, especially like when we're talking about people that squandered their money, it's like oh I want to know like how you I want to know how you blew up like millions of dollars. I would like to know.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:44

I think it's interesting.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:47

I don't know the specifics. Right. So what did you buy?

SPEAKER_00 1:04:49

Yeah, like some of these people that made all this money and like ended up broke as hell. I'm like, I want to know like how you did that.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:00

I'm probably trying to buy a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:02

And like I said, just that like not having that financial literacy and not having anyone to help them.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:12

Which is why, you know, that's one thing I'll give Dr. Jen her props for, including that. Because I I mean I've only seen so much Marriage Boot Camp. But like I saw that original season we covered, and I saw bits and pieces from the season that Gabby from Baggles Club was on. But do they talk about fighting as well? I don't think they do though.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:29

And that's I guess that's the thing with this show, is where I want to give it its props as well, is the fact that while they did have some very cliche exercises like like like the fuck like the goddamn graveyards and shit, um, they also like we said they did have some like interesting um ones that maybe we don't see as often. Like you said, like the photo analysts and the and the writing analysts and the and talking about the money and everything. So snap snaps for family therapy. Snaps for family therapy.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:57

Okay, okay, two snaps, two snaps.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:59

And then Getting into not so much like the actual techniques of the therapy itself, but just like the most ridiculous or craziest or memorable cast moments. Like, did you have any in particular that really jumped out for you?

SPEAKER_02 1:06:15

I'm trying to think every moment Michael Low. I mean, I feel like we've we've already kind of tapped into that. The deny everything shirt. He loves a stunt, is what he likes. I know. That was like the second or first night they were there. That was like very early on in the show. Adina was pissed to talk about it. He brought, obviously.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:40

Which I mean he did. Um but that honestly, like, that gives me like I feel like he planned, like, I feel like that stunt was supposed to happen later on, but he got too excited and wanted to just bring it up. Like he couldn't help himself.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:54

Yeah, but he got the channel. You know what?

SPEAKER_02 1:07:01

I heard him talk about how he caught um Dina smoking crack.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:04

I was like, crack. I'd be so mad. Even if I did do that shit, I'd be so mad if somebody exposed me for smoking if somebody brought that up on camera. I'd be like, are you fucking kidding me? Don't don't talk about me smoking crack on camera. Don't talk about me smoking crack on camera.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:22

Are Michelle trying to gaslight Dr. Jen talking about, you know, you're too focused on me. How about you go see your other clients? And trying to get everybody else to be upset around Dr. Jen.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:31

She was trying to rile up the troops against Dr. Jen. I mean I'm your other client. I I did love when uh when um they did the whole like when they were like, raise your hand if you were intimidated by if you've ever been intimidated by Sister Patterson. And and Sister Patterson was pissed. She said they're lying on her. Um she she went to the her room and accused Tiffany of leading a Lich mom against her. Um and then I mean about Tiffany like puts her hands up. Tiffany was like, please, y'all just sit on your palms, just sit on your palms. I loved after that when when Tiffany and her mom were in their in their room, and um Tiffany was just trying to have like pleasantries with her mom, being like, Oh, are you enjoying your candy? And she's like, What's in it? And she's like, Oh, it's intimidation. I just bit into intimidation. There's intimidation in the candy. That's like, I was like, okay, okay. What they're like, okay, Patty Patterson. Okay, Patty Patterson. We see you.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:34

She was not a moment.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:35

I I was genuinely scared for Tiffany when she when she said, I don't get mad, I get even. I was like, oh god.

SPEAKER_02 1:08:44

What has she got planning? Well, just in general, her denying Tiffany throughout the show. It's like this there's no baby. There's no baby. Like they're not sure. Dr. Jen looked like we filmed the ultrasound. Dr.

SPEAKER_00 1:08:58

Jen looked so puzzled during that first um that first session she had with Tiffany and her mom after Tiffany revealed her pregnancy, and Sister Patterson was talking about like A, she's not pregnant because I would feel it if she was. And then B, she's saying if she is pregnant, she is having my baby because I will take her baby. And Dr. Jen looked so perplexed, confused, just appalled. Who is giving very much Dr. Jen was like, I feel like she was thinking, like, okay, I I've never dealt with something like this before.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:30

Like, this is that I I mean, she did go on to say that Sister Patterson was the most aggressive combatant resistant. Yeah, no, I think she's ever served.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:42

Yeah, no. Which I believe. Yeah, they know. I generally believe there's there's not many people like Sister Patterson out there, not to her level and to her extent.

SPEAKER_02 1:09:53

Right? Because she really would commit to the bit. Like others would have given it up by now. They would have wanted some harmony in the house. You know, she wanted a little harmony. She brought disharmony though for the most part.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:10

Unlike unlike Charisy.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:13

I understand now why where Tiffany learned how to cause disharmony from her mother. Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:20

Oh yeah. You know, I think, and especially because I think New York's an only child, I believe.

SPEAKER_03 1:10:25

I've never heard of her mention a sibling.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:27

So I'm like, a mother like Sister Patterson. She does. And we mean I'm the best.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:37

Oh, you know, I actually think on Flavor of Ledge, she made a comment about how she's an only child, so she doesn't understand, she doesn't know how to share.

SPEAKER_02 1:10:45

Oh yeah. You know, you're only child.

SPEAKER_00 1:10:49

But definitely if she had a sibling, they would have appeared on the other side. I would cackle to to watch New York and and maybe if she had like a straight man sister or brother to play off of.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:02

Yeah. I'm cackling. Not some book where I'm a younger sister dies. Like, girl, what is this weird artist? What is this?

SPEAKER_00 1:11:11

I can't.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:14

I thought it was cute how everyone was like, when Tiffany announced her pregnancy to the cast, they were like, oh, you'll be a great grandma, Sister Patterson. They were like, oh, giving her a prop as being nice, and she was just so sad.

SPEAKER_00 1:11:24

She was sitting there just looking evil. She just looked evil. I I I just want to. And I yelling at people, you skip. When Dr. Jen asked her how she feels about Tiffany's announcement, she was like, I don't know. I haven't decided how I feel yet. And don't try to tell me how to feel or how I feel. And Dr. Jen was like, Oh, we we weren't going to. And she's like, well, don't try it. It's like, okay, great. She was like, I'm not dealing with the therapy. I mean, I don't think she did the therapy shit at all this entire season.

SPEAKER_02 1:11:58

You know, she was quite resistant to uh the she was quite resistant to like pretty much everything.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:03

Yeah, which is interesting because she repeatedly said, like, I'm I'm here and I'm open and I and you know I I trust you as the therapist, but then she would proceed to like literally fight every single attempt Dr. Jen made or any of the other staff made. She refused to participate in pretty much anything in any meaningful way.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:24

Right? But Michael Lohan gave her a run for her money those first few episodes. I was like, is Sister Patterson on a show when she's not the wildest cast member? But but my Michael would be up and down, he'd be up and down.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:37

She's consistent. I'll give her that. I'll give her that. She was consistent.

SPEAKER_02 1:12:45

I I did I did. But not consistent enough to get them a million viewers on VH1.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:51

Well, um But before we wrap, did you have any other things that stood out or any final comments or conclusions or takeaways from this experience?

SPEAKER_02 1:13:09

I just want to shout out um April's little stand-up moment. I was cackling at her. And then what the what's your name got up and they were dragging Dame down? Shit, I was cackling the whole time, talking about you're still making payments on those sunglasses. And Dame responded, like, oh y'all all up in my coins up in my money. He said, if I wanted to know about your money, I'd call on your ex-lines. That pissed Dame off. He's like, I'm gonna go on the city.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:35

This was definitely a group of people that knew how to be on camera, that's for sure.

SPEAKER_02 1:13:43

You know, definitely entertaining. I mean the dynamic between them. It was good. I feel like a little a little drama between them, like not just the individual families, but like amongst each other. It could have made for a better show, but I like that they weren't getting along.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:59

One thing I know, I I liked that there was so much interaction amongst like the groups and everything. Like I like I I feel like that made it better than if like they had just kind of stayed in their own lanes. Like if it was just Michael and Dina interacting with each other and just New York and Sister Patterson interacting with each other. Like I'm glad there was so much like cross-interaction and like even them kind of discussing like New York would I can't I keep going back and forth from calling her New York and Tiffany. I don't know. But uh Tiffany, there like she would like she would go to like April a lot for advice or for like kind of like motherly talks and stuff like that. I think a lot of them went to April for that, and like um one thing, and like we saw like Tiffany kind of like in the Michael and Dina thing taking more Dina's side while Sister Patterson was taking Michael's side, which I thought was interesting.

SPEAKER_02 1:14:46

Like, there was just a lot and Michael and Bam had a little connection to the other.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:51

There was just like a lot of like crossover amongst like the families and whatnot, which I which I liked. I think it made it more interesting.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:01

Yeah. Yeah, I definitely enjoy it. I mean, you we we got a little bit of conflict with Sister Patterson trying to bully Dina, but after a while it seemed like she was over that. Dina doesn't seem like I'm gonna talk. Dina seemed like she would just take it and just go be dressed up to the other. Yeah, I thought she didn't want it. Sister Patterson probably got bullied. Yeah, I mean that's the thing with me.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:19

I feel like when you're dealing with someone like Sister Patterson, like really if like the the best way to handle her is to kind of just ignore her and she will get bored and find someone else to fuck with.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:28

Because I think like with Sister Because I was wondering, I would heard Britney gonna get into it. I know Britney liked to yell and put up too, but Britney also seems like she respects wouldn't be like a lot of people.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:43

Like, you know, like you can come off intimidating, or like she like I feel like Britney would say stuff to Sister Patterson, but she like you said, she was very respectful with how she approached it. She wasn't gonna like tussle with her.

SPEAKER_02 1:15:56

Yeah, I think she also saw like some like a similar personality in herself. She was like, Okay, I see it, I see the vibes. I mean, Brianna and Sister Patterson, I mean I got into it, but Brianna, I mean Sister Patterson was doing too much, and Brianna had to be like, bitch, don't don't talk about my mom skills.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:13

She got into her like I like I kind of but Sister Peter in that moment I can understand like what Sister Patterson like meant and what she was trying to say, but at the same time, it was like it was like that, like girl, this is way outside of your ref to be talking to her about. Like, this is just so not your business.

SPEAKER_02 1:16:31

Yeah, she was trying to say don't train your daughter like to say hi to strangers and stuff, but it was it wasn't that they were onset, like it's like introducing your child to your co-workers.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:40

Yeah, no, I I I I get what Sister Patterson was trying to say, and I honestly think in that moment Sister Patterson was not like trying to like do something for TV. I think she was like just say I think she was just genuinely saying her opinion, but it just wasn't her business. I think she was really just saying her her opinion, but she was definitely overstepping the boundaries in that moment.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:03

I think she was trying to be evil with her little smirk. One thing was you said you shouldn't have a boyfriend, which I mean I I think that's fair advice, but then just tacking it on top of what's right, whatever's going on.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:16

Speaking of a smirk, one of my favorite recurring characters this season was Dr. Jen's smirk every time like she would piss off Sister Patterson. Like she would piss off Sister Patterson, and Sister Patterson was like storm and like storm out of the area or the room or whatever. And Dr. Jen would just always get the smirk and like dim. Like she wouldn't directly look at the camera, but she'd get close to looking right at the camera. I was like, okay, okay, Jen. Like she knew Dim well what she was doing when she kept calling her Michelle.

SPEAKER_02 1:17:42

She knew this too. Well, she knows she's not gonna win a screaming though.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:47

She's like, let me just piss this bitch off until she swarms out of the room then. Yeah. But overall, I would say I I kind of going into this, I kind of figured I was gonna enjoy the show. And I I was correct with my assumption, because I did enjoy the show. I enjoyed watching. I had a good time.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:08

You know, I I I liked it too. I was entertained. I didn't love it. I think Got to Get Out was definitely like in terms of I need to watch the next episode. That show was good. It wasn't giving that, but it wasn't a chore either. By the way.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:20

That show was good. And just so you guys know, we covered GotTet Out just a few episodes ago. So if you scrolled it a little bit back, you can listen to us cover that episode, which we had a lot of fun doing. Period.

SPEAKER_02 1:18:31

But what disrupted my viewing experience for this was watching on VH1.com, which has the worst video player imaginable of any website, and has so many fucking ads. And like I work in advertising, I appreciate an ad. I'll I'll look, I'll glance, I'll go to a URL. But it was just so much. Like I just like I I almost like halfway through, I was like, I could just buy it for I can spend$8.99. That's insane, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:18:57

I I had a miserable experience, like just like with the technicalities of trying to watch this show because it's not it's not super easily available. And um basically, like you said, VH1's like little p like video player was terrible, and for whatever reason, they have every episode available except for episode one, the fucking premiere. So then I had to so like what I ended up having to do is I went on Amazon and bought the first episode. Um I'll be damned gonna pay for the whole fucking season. But I bought the first episode, watched it, and then I went to VH1's player to watch the rest of them, and yeah, just had a miserable experience with the ads, with the glitchiness, with the shenanigans. It was just terrible. So I will say, like, while I would recommend this show for you guys to watch because I did have a decent, like, I did enjoy the show itself. I will say, you know, you might have a difficult time watching it just due to the technicality. You know, one thing about Automotive is we cover a show that's difficult to stream, it comes to streaming in a fairly simple and easy way immediately afterwards. So, you know, maybe maybe our fuck it probably will because that's what seems to happen. Every show we cover that's like damn near impossible to find or really difficult to watch, you know, that that's our impact. So you're welcome in advance.

SPEAKER_02 1:20:23

Oh, yeah, because there was an um Real Housewives of DC. One thing.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:29

And both of those shows, like it there wasn't any other reason for those shows to suddenly just become readily available. So I maintained that that was on a real notes, and like there was no fucking reason. And they both and they both became immediately available right after we covered them on this show. So I'm just saying we some some but it happened in reverse with the case. I'm just saying, clearly some some important people are listening to this podcast, and what I have to say to you all is I don't know what Illuminati should I have to do for us to get a talk show, but green light it, bitches. Green light it. If you're gonna talk the show, I'm gonna leave.

SPEAKER_02 1:21:19

You know what? But yeah, I know this season, this show is available for purchase. It is free on VH1 or with a cable provider. I'm sure you can you can get it on demand if you still pay for cable. And if you don't mind letting me single out in the corner, I'm sure you can find this on one of those websites. Oh yeah, I'm sure. But you know, is it worth a full$8.99 to buy a season? Something. I don't know. Maybe wait for the half-off sale. Yeah. I'd say$2.99 at the most. But if you love New York, if you want the full New York.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:56

It's an important piece of media, for sure, for the Tiffany Pollard saga.

unknown 1:22:05

Right.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:06

Resurgence era, and it's definitely a very different thing.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:13

Well exactly, yeah.

unknown 1:22:17

Right.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:17

Probably the most important thing. I think she's retired. I think she's retired. I mean, that woman's like in. I don't know. I think if Zeus offers the right to blue, maybe. I believe that woman's in her 70s. We might we we might see her arguing with blue children. I'm pretty sure that woman's in her 70s, though, so I don't know about Auntie. On the Auntie's group chat show.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:39

Well.

SPEAKER_02 1:22:40

Well, yes. Problem fair. I think she should call my hospital in T3. We should fake it like it's New York.

SPEAKER_00 1:22:47

Well, and it's just a good idea. May the reality TV gods bless us with that. But on that note, on a real note, thank you all so much for listening to another episode of the On a Real Note podcast. If you enjoyed this, please rate us five stars on, you know, whatever, or give us a thumbs up or like whatever platform you're listening to this on. Um, and if you want more of us, or if you even want to give us feedback or give us content suggestions, you can find us all across social media. We are at on a real note pod on pretty much every platform you can think of. We are on Twitter slash X, we are on Instagram, YouTube, TikTok threads. Um we we are not on Rumble. We are not on Rumble, but but oh it's one of those, it's one of those like conservative apps. I don't even know what that is. Not true. I figured that was. We're not on True Social. We're not on True Social, we're not on a parlor, we're on any of those. But but you can find us on like all of the right all of the normal people's social media apps. Although at this point I wouldn't consider uh uh X a normal people's social media app, but whatever. You can find us there. Um did Blue Sky die already?

SPEAKER_02 1:24:02

We are on Blue Sky too. We do have an account on Blue Sky.

SPEAKER_03 1:24:08

I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 1:24:09

We should retweet something. I mean Reese, I don't know the terminology, girl, but we'll we'll we'll figure it out. And if you're curious what happened with this with the cast members of the show and if it worked, um Newsflash, it really didn't. VH1 has a where they now article that's very interesting and informative.

SPEAKER_00 1:24:25

Check that out because we really have a great rest of your day.