Ep15 - Doctor Strange 1 Retrospective with Titanic Review

The Goodell Bros sling over to reviewing Doctor Strange 1 right after they break down the latest news, rumors and have a special guest to review the EPIC BLOCKBUSTER Titanic!

Transcript

SPEAKER_06 0:00

On every timeline in every universe, there's one thing that we always talk about.

SPEAKER_04 0:08

Marvel.

SPEAKER_06 0:09

Hello, everybody. Welcome to the Goodell Multiverse. I'm Isaiah Goodell. I'm Sam Goodell. And we are going on our episode 15 today, Sammy. We got a good one today, guys. Our retrospective of Doctor Strange today at the end of our episode. Of course, you know, just like any other episode, guys, we're going to start out with our multiverse minute. We've got some great stuff to talk about, new X-Men trailer. We actually have the X the Spider-Man trailer to talk about, plus the ticket sales. You know, and that's going to be fun to speculate on that. And I guess a whole big new swing on X-Men coming forward. I mean, that could be good or bad news, y'all. According to the Spider-Man trailer, it might be bad news. But we'll see how we go. We got some awesome rumors, guys. Multiple dooms finally blade. I mean, would they get out his wheelchair? What's going on here? And uh then we have a nice uh special branch point breakdown to you for you today with our special guest, our mom again. And we're gonna be talking about Titanic today, which is a big one. I got a couple fun hot takes and fun things to talk about there. So we'll have fun with that. And uh, what do you got to add, Sammy?

SPEAKER_03 1:13

Anything? Uh nothing. I'm just excited for this episode. I'm excited to get into Doctor Strange. I've rewatched it now about four or five times. You've watched it that many times? Yeah, I just every night for the past week, I've just been putting it on and I get through uh surprisingly, I get through the movie each time. So I didn't fall asleep like I normally would. Yeah, but anyway, so I'm I'm excited to at least talk about it and a new flavor of the MCU.

SPEAKER_06 1:40

Yeah, for sure. It'll be an interesting talk. I got some interesting thoughts on this one. It's not all bad, and it's not all it's not all good either. It's an interesting movie.

SPEAKER_03 1:48

Yeah, I think we're gonna have a similar vibe for this. So I'm excited for that conversation.

SPEAKER_06 1:51

So, guys, join us for our multi multiverse minute coming up in a few seconds.

SPEAKER_03 2:04

All right, guys, thanks for staying with us on the Goodell Multiverse podcast. We are in our multiverse minute, even though it's 45 minutes, news of the week. And so I'll kick off the first topic that we're gonna talk about. X-Men 97 season two has released a brand new character trailer ahead of its official release on July 1st of this year. So, in anticipation of season two coming out on July 1st, the first four episodes of X-Men 97 season two have also premiered um in certain uh areas. I think they had like a festival or something going on, and they did like a kind of like the red carpet thing. They did this, they do this with everything really. Um, and apparently it left jaws dropped by their attendees. Wow. It is so far 100% on Rotten Tomatoes, which I know it's early. This show's not even officially out yet, so who knows what that's gonna be. But that's pretty big that every critic that went and saw it loved it. Four episodes. So, uh Ike, you saw the trailer, um, and you heard some of these numbers already. What are your thoughts on this so far?

SPEAKER_06 3:15

Yeah, so um, I'm I take it easy on cartoons. You know, it's like I'm not expecting these to blow my mind, anyways. That's why with even with some of the issues that we we could talk about when it comes down to the first season of the new X-Men, I was I was pretty much okay with a lot of stuff because I still enjoy it. Um those, I mean, they're really not that good. Those old ones aren't. They are like special to us and we like them. But when you rewatch them, you you're like, oh yeah, this is a little camping corny, you know. And and these follow suit in that way, you know, and they're and they're playing on that. Um, I will tell you the trailer looks great. I love a good montage of characters to look forward to. I'm sure there's gonna be some characters they didn't put on there that will be a surprise. But um, but these will be like your main ones, depending on how much time they get. That's good to see Emma Frost is one of them.

SPEAKER_03 4:04

Because like I told you before, I want her my shirt, Emma Scott Jeans. Yeah, you sent them up. Yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_06 4:11

And then it's and it's like I want her to get her due, you know. And it's you know, you hear Magneto talk, yeah. Alex Xavier there, and it's got you know, green cyclops is awesome. You know, I like the costumes in this. It looks like they're a little more every time Storm talks, like this is the MCU Storm we need. Yes, like this this they got Storm down 100%. And and Apocalypse looks great. I mean, he's yeah, he's that campy, old school looking still apocalypse, but his voice is different this time, sounds a little more menacing, looks like he's scary. And to go go on like this audience reaction, I mean, sure, unless it's real bad, I mean, everyone clearly thinks it's gonna be good. They all think it looks good. The people the people that saw these first four episodes, there must be a fun little arc they do in the beginning of this season that kind of gets you prepared for the rest. Because it to have four, just I mean, four episodes is a lot for like an opening, but then to have four, and you'd be like, holy cow, I can't believe this. It's like an intentional, like, here's the first four, here's your first big plot twist by episode four. Yeah, you know, so I think that's gonna be fun to see. I mean, yeah, I can't wait to see it. I'll watch it. You know, it's like I said, it's a cartoon, funny tunes like yeah, nothing wrong with that, but it looks great, makes me love X-Men more. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_01 5:23

It's kind of where I'm standing at it.

SPEAKER_03 5:25

I I agree. Not surprised. I if from my understanding, as we're recording this guys, they just announced all the episode titles, and when they're dropping and little descriptions, of course, it's nothing that's too revealing, so there's no spoilers in them. I just briefly look through them, and it does sound like every episode is gonna have some one of your favorite characters somewhere uh in the mix of it, which is kind of cool. So I'm it sounds like to me, based on the first trailer and this character trailer, and then the brief descriptions that we got, that they're taking on the full adaptation of the Age of Apocalypse comic book, which is kind of an offshoot of the main storyline, um, which I'm kind of excited for. I think that'll be really cool. I'm curious, like you, on how they're doing Apocalypse, because he does seem to be that campy. He's like a mix of campy and serious, because we only got glimpses of him in this trailer, and he looks menacing, he looks scary, but he also looks like he could be a little type thing, like he used to do. Yeah, yeah. Like he was in the original ones. So um I this will be a good indication of um how they do apocalypse and animation because it'll give us a glimpse of what they may do in live action for the MCU version. Um, it may not. Also, if if he's poorly received of the whole season, then we know what they're not gonna do because Marvel's pretty good at picking up pieces when they hear what's good and bad. And I think that's actually a plus for the cartoons and X-Men in particular, is that if it's if it's not jiving well at all, they won't put that into live action because they already know what the general response is gonna be. So this is a nice way of saying it's a cartoon, we could get away with craziness, and maybe some are good, maybe some are not good. And then when we put them in the live action, we'll know okay, what worked for the cartoon will complement it for the live action. So that could be a good little tease.

SPEAKER_06 7:21

You have a lot more optimism for the way fans are. I I like it for fans because you know what's gonna happen is they're gonna hate this apocalypse, they're gonna do an apocalypse in the show in the movies, and I say, Why wasn't it like the cartoon? You know what? You know, because you know I'm right. But I feel I'm glad you're thinking positive. I'm positive. Don't be Star Wars fans, don't be Star Wars fans. Oh my gosh. Yeah, I like the way he looks, though. I think he looks scary. I he needs to kill a couple people and make you go, oh no.

SPEAKER_03 7:53

You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_06 7:54

That's what we need. Have fun, have and go with it.

SPEAKER_03 7:56

Yeah, make him their biggest villain, like they already say he is, you know. Like I get it. Um, I'm excited. The first three episodes drop on July 1st, and then it's weekly episodes after that. So it's the first three, okay. Yeah, but the first four were the first four at the premiere, though. Okay, yeah. So anyone who went to this premiere and got invited to it, they got to see the the first three that you see in July 1st, then the following week's episode. Meanwhile, there are some uh people out there on the YouTube that are um critics or moviegoers and all that, like Grace Randolph from Behind Beyond the Trailer, she's seen the whole thing now, so she got an early screening of everything. Oh wow, yeah. So she was able to give a um, I didn't watch it because I'm trying to brace myself for this myself just because of an X-Men fan and all that stuff, but uh she does have like a spoiler-free review out there already on it, and then I'm sure as each episode drops, she'll be able to get into like a breakdown, which I love watching all our YouTube people out there giving breakdowns of each episode just to catch all those little pieces that we don't really catch, you know. Yeah, yeah. I'm excited for this. I like the new trailer. Um, and um, I hope it is better than the first season. I can't say, like I said before, guys, I don't hate the first season, but there are just some parts of it I was a little creeped out by is probably the best way to say, and a little let down by. So I'm hoping it sounds like everyone loves this, so maybe it's better, or maybe they love the first one so much that this is a continuation of the first, and they feel the same way. We'll find out. Yeah. All right, but do you have any thoughts before we move on?

SPEAKER_06 9:31

No, I agree with you. I mean, it's I I I enjoyed the first season, it wasn't perfect. There's definitely things nitpick about it, but once again, I do take kind of a little leniency on cartoons, and yeah, I expect only certain things from them really. So, but this actually looks like it's a lot of fun. I mean, I like the montage, all the characters look great, the new costumes and stuff.

SPEAKER_01 9:51

The Cyclops is balling. He's looks real good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He is a highlight in the first season, so I'm excited to see what he's gonna do in the next one. Oh, don't kill him. Let's all learn from those mistakes.

SPEAKER_03 10:04

All right, guys, question is for you. Are you excited for X-Men 97 season two to be premiered? What do you think of the reviews so far? Do you think that rotten to mail score is gonna change as the each episode drops? Let us know in the comments below.

SPEAKER_06 10:17

All right, I take it away.

SPEAKER_03 10:18

All right, guys.

SPEAKER_06 10:19

So we got some more Spider-Man news. So as tickets go on sale, Sony has officially released the second Spider-Man brand new day trailer. Ticket sales were sold out in minutes, and reports indicate that the film could gross 200 million opening weekend in North America alone. So let's talk about the ticket sales and money. Okay. Yeah, no duh. Like, what Spider-Man movie hasn't made a ton of money. So this I think the 200 million opening weekend in America alone is a little reaching. I think they're just I think they're exaggerating it to maybe overhype us. But I still think this is gonna be a $1.5 billion movie before it's done. At the least.

SPEAKER_03 11:04

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 11:04

And I'm saying that's at the least. Like I still think it's gonna be closer to two before it's over, but it's definitely gonna be a big money maker, mostly because all of his Spider-Man movies had been. So, and this one's gonna be it's got a Hulk in it, everyone's all excited. You know, it's a first one back, it's uh after the a great trilogy, you know, despite what some other YouTubers say. It's Tom looking towards being done soon, maybe. You know, there's unique things going on in this that we're curious about. Um, yeah, I I see that numbers reachable. I don't know so much here in North America alone, but it doesn't surprise me that the tickets went out and on sale and they're pretty much sold out, too. I mean, that's you know it that's yeah, this movie's gonna be a hard one to watch right away. You know, we we have our plans to go see it when we see it, and we'll see it in a couple different ways, probably, you know. And I'd like to see it uh at the drive-in, but I also like to see it in the theaters, you know. So this there might be one for the second time I see it because it's gonna be packed, you know what I mean? So yeah, but yeah. Oh, yeah. What do you think about the money wise? Then we'll talk about the trailer for a second.

SPEAKER_03 12:10

So I don't know what the mark the movie market is like in Canada and Mexico. So I don't I can't speak on their populations and if it's released there, which of course it's gonna be released there. I've never heard them not being released there, how much of a moneymaker they are in those two countries. I know our country is pretty significant when it comes to how much money we're gonna make and all that. And these, by the way, the the tickets might have just been gone on sale, but a lot of the times it's the special seats that go on sale first, and then your general audience ones as more popularity of a film comes out, they make more screens for it, screen time because it's guaranteed money for these theaters. So I will not be surprised if worldwide it over makes two it makes over 200 million dollars. Yeah. Um, North America, if that happens in North America, that's a pretty big deal. Um, I know that the trailer for this blew all the records. We covered that on the podcast that it was the most watched trailer in the first 24 hours of being dropped for the first trailer. So if that's any indication of if each one of those people got one ticket, you're probably gonna see a $250 million opening on the first weekend. And if it's as good as the hype is, just like no way home, it's gonna keep going up with uh attendance every week once good good news comes out from it, you know. Yeah. Um, I do think the second trailer, I know we're about to get into it, so I'll just um is there anything else that I should touch upon for the money part?

SPEAKER_06 13:44

The money part of it too is the thing, it's Spider-Man. Yeah. And it's one of like we've talked about this, it's kind of a built-in when you say superhero, I would say he's on when I wouldn't say a Mount Rushmore of the best, but if you were to make a Mount Rushmore of most known, Spider-Man's on there. Everybody knows Spider-Man. I got kids on my bus that are that are pre-K school kids, and they know who Spider-Man is. You know what I mean? So those are the people that are gonna go watch this multiple times taking because you can go for us, the nerds are gonna go, the parents are gonna go, and the parents are gonna take their kids over and over again. Yeah, uh, you want to go see it for your birthday? Okay, and then those kids are gonna talk to their parents and they're gonna be like well, I want to see it too, so I'm gonna go with my kid, take it, we'll go see it again. Yeah, these kids will watch this movie again. It's like the Spider-Man's got a money-making ability already set in it. So because even though people say that uh No Way Home, not No Way Home, but Far From Home wasn't as good as they thought. But look at the money it made. Made over a billion dollars. It's it's yeah, it's like it's it's gonna make the money because they're gonna go watch it multiple times. Yeah, you know, it's just how it's gonna be. It's gonna be especially in the summertime. We live next next to a drive-in theater. There's people are gonna go back to hang out, have pizza, and watch Spider-Man again.

SPEAKER_03 15:01

Oh, yes, that's gonna be on every screening, usually it's gonna be it's gonna be.

SPEAKER_06 15:12

Which I'm not complaining, I'm not saying it in a bad way. No, it's that's what he's got going for. Is Spider-Man is like I said, I don't know if I put him up there as the best superhero on Mount Rushmore, but uh for well most known though, for sure. You sell people named top five, you know, superheroes that you just know of, not your favorites that you just know of. He's the quickest one almost you go to, right? So and and and then good for good reason, he is cool, you know.

SPEAKER_03 15:37

Yeah, so well, two two things that jump off to me when you said all that, and two key factors for the money making for this. Yeah, uh, one is we just found out recently that Toy Story 5 that just came out this weekend had the biggest opening of the weekend. And yeah, it's probably a great movie, but Toy Story is geared for kids, yeah. So there's two tickets sold right there for your two kids and your family, plus each mom and each dad, and each aunt and uncle and grandparent that's taking their kids to see it because it's Toy Story. So that family factor is big. So if this was like a a Deadpool in Wolverine where you might not want to take the young kids give given the crude language that's in it, you might have less of a chance of seeing a family ensemble. But for something like this, it's easy. A four-person household, it's not just the two adults who are gonna go see it, it's the four. So that adds up after that.

SPEAKER_06 16:30

I was wondering what was going on. I went by the charcoal corral on the way over here today, and there's cars going into the drive-in and right in, and they're all lined up all the way up to the road, coming down the road. I'm like, man, what movie came out this weekend?

SPEAKER_03 16:42

Toy Story Five. So, yeah, it's just it's making its money. And I hear it's better than the fourth. I hear it's really good. I'm actually excited. I kind of want to go see it now. Our twin driving is full tonight for it right now. Like there they are in line. So yeah, and yeah, so then the second piece of this that I think it's gonna make a lot of money too, is it's the only Marvel movie before Doomsday. It's a big deal. It's been by the time this movie comes out, it has been a full year since we had an MCU film that was Fantastic Four at the same time as this. So yeah, you want to and Supergirls already, it's not like the it's not like last year what had going against Fantastic Four was Superman two weeks prior to it coming out. Supergirl's a whole month prior to this. So if you get done watching Supergirl, and she's not, no offense, as well known as Superman for the the draw appeal. So it's perfect, this is ripe for a billion plus dollar movie. I'll be shocked if it doesn't. In the middle of the summer, family friendly. Guaranteed money.

SPEAKER_06 17:41

Oh, yes. Could suck, it's still gonna make a lot of money. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's it. So about it sucking, let's talk about the trailer.

SPEAKER_03 17:50

Oh boy, so yeah. Do you do you want to start it? Do you want me to the what jumped out at me? You know.

SPEAKER_06 18:02

So I like that he's struggling with becoming a new kind of spider in a way, where it's like the the meta or the you know, the the uh lifespan of a spider changes and how it reacts to things, and it gets sometimes it gets more a little more aggressive. I kind of like that aspect of this trailer where it's like you see his eyes are kind of getting dark and he seems to be a little roughhousing when it comes down to Scorpion, but he's throwing him around, you know what I mean? And I'm kinda like, okay, this is cool, because it's gonna be almost like can you control it, right? And I think that's gonna be kind of what this movie talks about. Um, I'm worried about who our villain is, you know? And I d I now understand why the Hulk's in this movie and how he's gonna be used. So that kind of it it makes me sad. And it does, it makes me sad. Uh seeing more Frank Castle is cool, but it makes me a little sad. You know? Um, I really why I say that is because I geared myself to this, I married this idea of just be Spider-Man. You know, let's just do it. And it's not gonna be. And I need to understand it. I don't I think this version of Spider-Man in the MCU are not gonna get just a Spider-Man. Yeah, unfortunately. And you know, that's okay. That doesn't mean the movie's gonna be bad though. It just means I myself have to accept it. The only part of it I'm really worried about is who the villain might be. And it's clear it's gonna be Gene Gray. I mean, they just did another, there's another news article come out not too long ago about one more insider that knows even more is saying, Yeah, God, it's Gene Gray. You know, and then like in the when the person walks by on the street in the trailer and says, Maybe I'll go see how MJ's doing. Who would know that unless they're reading his mind, right? And it's like, and that's how the Hulk's gonna be used. He's gonna be a weapon, it's not going to be him turning into Hulk to help Spider-Man. It's not gonna be the Hulk turning bad, it's gonna be someone going into his head that we've already seen before and him Hulking out and Spider-Man having to fight him. And frankly, uh why are we doing this? We already seen the whole Hulk gets his head messed with and goes if that's how we're gonna get Rage Hulk back, then you people out there that are that are clamoring for Rage Hulk should be pissed. Because that's not how it should be done, you know. But that's exactly what's gonna happen here. We're gonna see Spider-Man take out low-level villains, have a really cool fight, maybe even accidentally kill Scorpion to really put him in this accidental crisis he's gonna go in about becoming a spider, see him take out the hand in a really cool way, they might be a big deal, but your ultimate villain is gonna be someone that starts out as a villain, but by the end of the movie is just a misunderstood villain because it's Gene Gray because she can't go fully bad, but she does have to still be Gene Gray later, and it's gonna be Gene Gray, misunderstood, but doing bad things for why? Yeah, what are we watching here? Yeah, and I maybe I'm wrong, but that's my instinct is telling me gear up because this is what you're getting. And if there's anyone that's gonna make MJ remember who Peter Parker is, it's gonna be Gene Gray putting thoughts back into her head, unlocking things that have happened. See, they aren't see if you think about it, it is set up for it to happen now. That's why she's in the movie so much. Uh MJ. MJ, yeah. Because by the end, Gene Gray's gonna unlock her mind, you know, and she's gonna remember Spider-Man or him as M. Without it having to undo all what they did. And yeah, I'm just hey guys, you heard it here first. That's all I know. It's just from the trailer. I'm telling you right now. That's just what this movie's gonna be. It's gonna end with him having to decide how harsh she's gonna be as a Spider Man and what what to do with her and how to beat her. And and of course, you know, he can only sense her, no one can see what she's doing because it's all mental mind stuff, but he can sense it because he can sense your. You know, anything that's bad about to happen, plus his things are heightening anyway, so we don't know what that means. There could be more of a sensitivity to that, right? So yeah, I just I just don't know how I feel about that though. You know, it's like, is there one more big bag gonna show up at the end, like these movies do, where you're gonna have the bad guy turn out to be a good guy that they have to team up to fight the other bad guy? Like whose doomsday gonna be, right? Like when I think when I think of uh Batman versus Superman, right? So yeah, I don't know, guys. That's that's the feel I get from it. And it still might be great, it's just not what I was really clamoring for, to be honest. But that's just my thoughts. So go ahead, Sammy. I don't want to rant too much about it because I really do feel like with all that said, they still haven't said this is Gene Gray. They still haven't said, but I mean at this point, you know, if the if it looks like it's gonna rain, it might rain. You know? So Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 22:57

Well So I'll start off with the positives that I saw in this film. Or this trailer, I should say. I just get all that out. So they fixed the color grading compared to the first trailer. The first trailer looked a little bleak, a little doom and gloom-like. Maybe there was a reason why they wanted it to look that way, or it was just unfinished enough where now it looks more colorful, it looks a little more like a Spider-Man, uh almost like the Sam Raimi Spider-Man look, which actually wouldn't make sense given how the posters have look like Sam Raimi Spider-Man, and this is supposed to be about Peter becoming an adult now. Yeah. Um, and that brings to my second part. I like that Spider-Man says he has to stretch at the end of the trailer. I like that he's dealing with some of those emotional baggage with losing his aunt and how to pick up the pieces, and now he's going through this inner turmoil crisis literally on his own, which is why I think he's seeking out Dr. Banner. So that gives me hope for the Dr. Banner aspect, the Bruce aspect, is that I I like you, well, I can't say I was married to the fact that I want him to just be a Spider-Man. I already understood based on the current MCU contract that they have with Sony that we are never gonna get a Tom Holland solo Spider-Man without a character from the MCU, at least one character. And if there's a way they could add in more, they're definitely gonna do it because Sony's not gonna say no to more star power.

SPEAKER_06 24:29

I was just hoping they'd be daring enough to put Bruce Banner in it and actually not have the Hulk. That's all because I'm with you. I agree with you. I think I always knew there was gonna be someone too, but like why couldn't it just been Bruce? And and we all are clamoring for the Hulk to come, but then like this isn't the movie for it. To me, that has shown a restraint I actually would have respected a lot for storytelling-wise. But that yeah, sorry, I didn't mean interrupting.

SPEAKER_05 24:52

No, I agree. Because I'm with you if there's I know that's how they get it.

SPEAKER_03 24:55

If there was a place to put the Hulk recently, would have been Brave New World with and Captain America, because it really was a Hulk movie, it just didn't have the Hulk. We're gonna get to that when we get to that, guys, because we got some thoughts on that. But for this movie, um I completely agree with you that I see the story that they're setting up. There are still some question marks in my head, like, well, how is the hand involved in this? And why are they there? Like, what's you know, there are some unanswered things that I'm I definitely can't wait to see the movie to see what they're gonna do. So I am okay with the Hulk being in the movie if it's tastefully done. Just like I'm okay with the other characters that were in all the other movies. Doctor Strange was in it, you saw them three or four times, but it was still a Spider-Man movie at the end of the day. And I know we see a lot of Punisher, but it also goes to the fact that what we complain about with the TV shows and with other movies is you're in New York City, why aren't these other characters showing up? Well, the Sony is gonna be like, they're the only time we're gonna see a movie that you can't say that because they're gonna show the Punisher, they're gonna show some of these other characters. So I get it. My w I wonder how much they're gonna be used, though, is the difference. Is this a Spider-Man movie? Or does he have a great story, but it's also being told around other people's stories, and that's the part that I worry about. Don't do a disservice to your main person by throwing in all these other things. And uh when I'm trying to stay as positive as possible because I'm trying to think of all the good things that were in this this trailer, because it was really a cool trailer, to be honest. It was a nice trailer. I mean, it it looks funny, it yes, the action looks awesome, right? It looks intriguing. Yeah, my worry goes back to what you said to the villain. Yep. Again, full disclosure, I know it's like a worst-kept insider secret that it's Gene Gray, but they have not officially come out and say that yet. So there is still at least a 5% of me that's thinking I'm gonna go into this movie, they're gonna surprise us all, and it's a different character that's actually a Spider-Man villain that either they mentioned a long time ago and no one remembered or whatever, which would have been kind of meta that no one would remember it, but yet this movie is all about remembering stuff. I think that's kind of fun. Anyways, who knows? That could that could be part of this whole ploy, too. Anyways, that's true, you're right. Not saying that these insiders are lying, but insiders are not the actual uh studio, they're not the actual directors and um characters that are confirming who they are, they're just hearing what they hear behind the scenes, and for all we know, behind the scenes, they could be telling them five different stories and they're gonna report it because they're inside scoopers and need content for us to talk about. But is it right? Is it not right? Kind of like how when they filmed Avengers Endgame, they gave Tom Holland a completely different script than everybody else to make sure that when he does talk about it, if he does slip up, whether it's publicity or an a real accident, no one really knew that was real or not. Everyone thought that that was a wedding that was happening in Endgame, not a funeral for Tony. Yeah, remember. So it's all like and I'm not saying that that means Gene Gray's not in this movie. In all honesty, she probably is. I feel like after this trailer, I'm 95% sure that she is in this movie. And it it's good for us to know right now and kind of bite the bullet as we're going in for the Gene Gray fans. And if anyone is listening to this and watching this and thinking you guys are overly dramatic about Gene Gray, you do not understand the big deal it is to introduce one of the main core mutants, main core X-Men, and introduce them in this way in someone else's movie. There is there is that fine line difference.

SPEAKER_06 28:54

Well, put it this way: if you're one of the people out there that think we're over dramatic about it, I want you to think of your absolute most favorite MCU character that you hold dearly, and then them messing around with it. That's how we feel about it sometimes. I wouldn't say she's I don't know if she's the most dear to me, but she's up there. Top five, top ten, definitely maybe top five of one of my favorite characters in at least in the X-Men, let alone all the MCU stuff. You know, it's like I'm honestly more nervous about Magneto. You know, I see they had a cast rumor, not to bring up a whole different room, but they say Patrick Wilson might be playing uh Professor Xavier. I guess they're in talks with him. And we didn't put it on here. I I meant to send that to you the other day, but maybe we'll talk about it next week more in depth, which I think is a which I think is actually a great casting, to be honest with you. Um but yeah, i you take your favorite character, guys, and like and then they and you don't want it messed with. Like I said, it's not about ownership, we get it, you know. And I I don't want to be I don't want to be Star Wars fans. You know, everyone that's a Star Wars fan out there hates Last Jedi because of what they did to Luke. When I actually think it made sense with what they did to Luke. So it is subjective, anyways, but we what we're gonna tell you is we are very particular about our X-Men stuff.

SPEAKER_03 30:20

Yep. And I I I think this situation is very unique. And I'm gonna I'm gonna say this, and maybe you're gonna agree with me, Ike, maybe not. I would be more comfortable if Charles Xavier showed up in this movie and not Gene Gray. And the reason is he is one of those big figures that is he's part of the introduction of the team, yes, but he's not a core member of the team like this. But would you be comfortable if he was a bad guy? No, right, yeah, yeah. See that that's not a caveat, that's a problem. And I wouldn't have mind if Storm showed up in Wakanda forever.

SPEAKER_06 30:56

I actually don't mind Gene Gray being in this movie. I mind her I can get over her showing up in this movie. I don't know why you'd want to, but her showing up as a bad guy is always where my were the biggest problem I have.

SPEAKER_03 31:10

Well, and also this brings up a lot more questions when it comes to how they're introducing the mutants into the MCU. Yeah. Because the easiest solution, the Marvel has already set this up, is we're getting rid of the Fox ones through Doomsday and Secret Wars, and when we start new and the first X-Men, probably the first film after Secret Wars, it is now you're welcoming in mutants, so you're gonna meet the main mutants you're gonna go with. So why complicate it? Why are you adding her into this dying universe that's gonna be destroyed within the next two movies and rebuilt when they haven't even fleshed out mutants in general in the MCU? That the this doesn't make any sense, which makes me, you know. Another thing I'll say, which might be a really stupid or really how do I say this properly, might be a dumb observation, but I watched uh someone who lives in New York City do a trailer reaction to the Spider-Man trailer, and that person said that street the Spider-Man's swinging on is not anywhere New York. And obviously it's a set piece, we get it, guys, but you know, they try to make things look as similar, and they said, even down to how the cabs look, they do not look like New York City cabs. And so it got me thinking, and it's probably just my own rumor in my head, what if Spider-Man's not even in this universe for some of this movie, and that's how we get Gene Gray? It's a stretch, and there's I'm not saying that they've even talked about any multiversal stuff in it, but what if that's a possibility? Is that through an incursion in this movie that we don't even know of, Gene Gray is there, and she's been apprehended from the Department of Damage Control, and she is freaking out, and like Gene Gray does in most of the comics and iterations we see when even in X2, when she has a headache, things go crazy. What if it's something as simple as that? A scared little girl that's from a different universe is being drawn into ours, which leads into Avengers Doomsday.

SPEAKER_06 33:14

So if they can do it right, it could work. It just you're just still getting further away from a Spider-Man movie the more you talk about it. You're just starting to feel like Doctor Strange too. And he's and Spider-Man is just our usher through a story. And I don't want that either.

SPEAKER_03 33:32

I feel like even if it's not happening, that's yeah, good thing.

SPEAKER_06 33:35

It could be a mix. That's a great take. That'd be a great hey, you guys heard her here first from Sam. If that's a boy, if that's the big secret, that that'd be the only way I'd be okay with her being in it. Because it would still be a good one. You know, because at least it would at least it would like it accomplisment the idea that she's from somewhere else and that's coming eventually, right?

SPEAKER_03 33:54

And that whole prison scene is Spider-Man fighting the hand because he's breaking her out of the DOC, DO, whatever. I almost said doge. Department of Damage Control. A doge. Yeah, you know, I mean, it's just a thought, uh, just throwing it out there. It could be fun. Thinking of that makes me feel a little better about what they may or may not be. It does, but uh I don't know. Maybe we're getting it it might be if it's tastefully done. I'm okay with something like that. I'm maybe that's why it's gotta be before doomsday. That would probably be, yeah, that that's probably why they decide not to to change all that. Because at first this was gonna be after doomsday, and now it's before doomsday with all the doomsday movies changing and secret wars changing, but maybe it's because it coincides so much with what's going on in Doomsday, they're like, we don't need to change this to make Doomsday fit. Yeah, and it'll explain why his absence isn't a Avengers Doomsday, he's needed in New York City, figuring helping usher in the X-Men into our new multiverse. That could be the post-cred scene of Doomsday. Is here's Gene and here's all her family, and that's how we get the new X-Men. I don't know. I'm just spitballing here and stuff that could sound cool, make sense, and definitely blow people's mind. But I mean, it is a long movie, and it's possible.

SPEAKER_06 35:14

Uh I still don't know where the hand comes into play, but we're gonna figure that out. Well, as far as we know, the hand could be part of the montage of people he's beaten up. They might not even have a be have a big part at all. You know what I mean? I think a mistake. It but well well, there it could be though. There's some yeah, I think there's gonna be a lot of random villains in this throughout the movie that he takes on and beats. You know, and it might not even be montage style like Fantastic Four, it might be off and on all of a sudden this one, and then he does it, and it's him dealing with his new powers.

SPEAKER_03 35:44

But think about in this aspect then. Say in the Fantastic Four promo art, they showed three or four of those villains that they talked about, and then you get to the movie and they're either off-screen or just a montage, you would be kind of disappointed that you thought you'd be setting that up. So with the hand being in all this promo art, it makes me think that at least trickled throughout the movie, they're gonna be there.

SPEAKER_06 36:05

I I agree with you. I think they're gonna be a bigger part than than the others because it is there's a lot of the if it wasn't on the posters and stuff, it'd be one thing. Yeah, yeah, because like we didn't get a lot of indication of the other uh people in Fantastic Four, other than like some of the clips showed a couple things. Then you go, wait a minute, what is that? You know what I mean? And but I I didn't expect to get that much Mole Man though, either in the movie than we got.

SPEAKER_00 36:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 36:29

In fact, someone mentioned there's a rumor that Molman's in it, and you and I are like, There's no way they're gonna do a whole movie about Molman. He has to be in the movie way more than I thought he'd be. Yeah, you know what I mean? Actually, a big part because that's where everyone goes to hide. Yeah, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_05 36:41

So it's like very integral to it.

SPEAKER_06 36:42

Yeah, yeah. So, like, so sometimes you never know. You know what I mean? Like, I don't know. It's yeah, I don't know, Sammy. It's it's just it this this feels packed, but I I trust them with the packed stuff because they've done well with it before.

SPEAKER_03 36:54

And I trust Dustin Daniel Creton has he did a phenomenal job with Shang-Chi. He obviously did a great enough job of Wonder Man that gave him a season two, and he is so gung-ho about this movie and the stuff he said that he's come up with with Tom Holland to do this. There are some good things like that that make me have faith it's gonna be good. Yeah, it it's still depending on the territory they're touching in, that's what's making me.

SPEAKER_06 37:19

The other part of this that makes me have some hope to end this on a light note, yeah, is this now though during the time that the massaging of the Roosevelt brothers is there too. Oh, yes. Where in during production of this, they have already been talked to, whether we knew about it or not, or whatever. They are in going, make sure this, this, and this, and we're gonna make sure so they if it's really out there and weird, they'd correct it, I think, knowing what they're going forward in. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? So and so I just I'm just we just you and I just might have to surrender to the idea of this is how they're gonna do X-Men, and we're just gonna have to deal with it. It's tough. Guys, you understand? It's so it's tough. And taking your favorite IP and just it and just turning it upside down.

SPEAKER_03 38:05

Well, speaking of favorite IP, I do not think Sony wants a bad Spider-Man movie. So if they I feel like whether it's Russo Brothers, whether it's Destin Daniel Creton or Sony executives themselves, if they feel like something is overshadowing their main character enough where it could be a hit or a miss, and they want a guaranteed hit because of how much money they're making off this thing. They don't want people to not go to a Spider-Man movie because this is poorly received in any way, shape, or form. I have enough faith to say, okay, there's a little bit more of checks and balances here to guarantee this is a Spider-Man movie. It's just what are they doing with these side characters? Yeah, that's their biggest thing.

SPEAKER_06 38:43

Yeah, the Russos and Feige are the icing on the cake for me. Yeah. Because like those, because Sony doesn't want a bad Spider-Man movie, but they made awful Spider-Man movies, you know. So, and not Spider-Man, but those movies that we got were not good. And this guy, Shang Chi's good, but it's not I mean, it's not brilliant. You know what I'm saying? So I'm not saying not to be mean, you know what I mean? Like, it's not it's not like oh you could do anything because you did go to the Chang Chi. I don't feel that way about that. Um, that you do, but because Sam Raimi's a great director and Doctor Strange is awful. So it's or not just Doctor Strange, but the movie versus you know, it just wasn't a good coherent movie, but Sam Raimi's made excellent movies, you know. So like it's uh um, yeah, but the fact that the Russos and Feige are kind of they've committed to a doomsday story now and they want it to fit is what is that's the one thing that gives me, okay, let's just see what this movie's gonna be and give it a shot. Yeah, you know. I do have some you know trepidation going into it though. Yeah, yeah, they're gonna mess with Jean Gray a little too much, I think. And you and I are just gonna have to see if we go along with or not. You know, really.

SPEAKER_03 39:57

All right, guys. Let us know in the comments below what you think of the second trailer. What do you think about the box office projections for this? And while you're at it, what do you think the Rotten Tomoeo scores are gonna be once those start rolling out over the next month? Um, let us know. Uh, do you feel the same way about X-Men and Gene Gray that we do? Or do you feel like, uh, whatever, I'm still gonna go see it. Comment below and let us know. Yeah, I can't wait to hear early reactions on this movie. That that's gonna be a big kicker. People that don't have that much skin in the game, like what we have now, that are gonna be the real make it or break it. You know. All right. I guess I'll I'll tell you, I'll introduce the last part of our segment here. Um, X-Men Reboot is getting, quote, a big swing in the MCU. Uh, upcoming MCU X-Men writer Lee Sungjin in an interview with Deadline says Kevin Feige wants to take a big swing and start anew. Not to be beholden to any of the movies that came before. So um, I'll just tell you my two cents on this because I don't have too much to say about it, because it's just a writer commenting on his upcoming projects. He had like three or four things he was talking about at the same time. But saying that he's not being beholden to any of the movies that came before, that makes me a little nervous and a little excited. A little nervous because some of those Fox X-Men movies we hold very dear to our hearts, and they got some of the core elements of that movie completely right, those movies. And then there are some of them that didn't do so well, and so part of me is wondering, is this their bold new take on it, or is there is there gonna be complementary to the X-Men ones? Uh Fox ones, I should say. What are your thoughts on this?

SPEAKER_06 41:32

Like, I want to hope I'm not reading too much into it. Um, I don't want them to remake what we got from before. Um, so I'm okay with them saying it's it's gonna be different and they're not beholden to what's happened before. I'm cool with that. Um, because there is things like do cyclops better, do storm better. You know, not that I don't love them in the other ones, but there's definitely another way to do them to make them a lot better. Um, keep things at work, you know, in that in a sense of like, you know, don't make Wolverine way weird and different. He's not gonna be in for a while, but he will be eventually. Um I think what they're talking about here though, and this is what makes me nervous, the nervous side of me is, is they're talking more about their history and why they're who they are, is what I worry about. I don't mind the big swings and having fun with the characters and doing different stuff and and and really diving deep into different things. I'm cool with that. There's a lot of different sides of these characters from different comic books and different source material that we didn't get in the old stuff that we could jump more into. We could see more of a love story between Gene and Scott than we got. We just always assumed they were together. We never really did get a good love story with them. It was always the almost or they were together, right? We could see a storm that is more of a motherly figure. You know, we can get all get into those little nitty-gritty parts of it, right? Um, I think what they're talking about though is the biggest glaring issue is all these X-Men are gonna be coming in from different multiverses and all that thing's clashing, colliding, and however they're gonna do it in the end here. But ultimately, what's that thing that drives them to be who they are, right? What drives Magneto to be Magneto? What drives Xavier to be Xavier? What makes the family part of them important? Because that's very clear to us in the other stuff and in in in all the content. But with the MCU, it's very convoluted. We don't know what they're gonna do. You know, they're not gonna use the Holocaust, obviously. You know, there's certain things they're not gonna do when it comes down to Magneto. So what are we gonna use? What is it gonna be? Is it gonna make sense? Or is it gonna be woke? Is it gonna be too woke? Is it can it be a little? Sure. Is it gonna be too much? Yeah, you don't want to cut everybody in half just because you have an agenda. The X Men is the one that for me could be potentially scarily the way. That Disney gets more political in their movies. And I don't want them to do that because it's something that we haven't had to do in the MCU. As political as some of these MCU movies get, it's always stayed in-house, in the story of what's going on. And even though it's not nothing reflected on us, you know, or what's going on outside of here. You know, until we got, until we did get, well, when we talk about this, when we get to Captain America, Brave New World, right?

SPEAKER_10 44:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 44:29

That's obviously there was more of a political agenda there shoved out. And whether you like who they're picking on in it or not, it doesn't matter. And we're not here to debate that. I don't want to talk about that when I watch my superhero movies. You know, and some of the reason why that kind of fell flat is because it's it's cheap. It's just cheap. There's so much good world building and content. Don't bring the real world into it, guys. Bring concepts from the real world into it so we can talk about these bigger ideas. But I don't want to go into it thinking, oh, we just got done talking about this the other day at work or sitting in a car every time I turn the news on. Why am I watching it in my X-Men movie? You know, we don't need to. We can talk about the big ideas and how X-Men talks about those, but ultimately it still comes down to the things in the universe that's happening, right? So that's what I worry about. And that's what I'm wondering if that's what they're alluding to. They're gonna take a big swing and see what people think. I think, I mean, because it's with the multiversal stuff, how much big of a swing do you have to take? Just make the character how you want it to be and put them in there and it's gonna fit and just make it work. The big swing they'd have to take, though, is there is a fundamental foundation about the uh actions and why these characters do the things that they do. And and X-Ben is a very important one. Yeah. You know?

SPEAKER_05 45:49

So I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 45:50

We'll see. And guys, this is really early on, too. They have no idea what's they haven't even started officially writing, they've just been throwing out concepts, and the this is an off-handed comment of when they were asking Kevin Feige what he wants to see, and he says, quote, a big swing. Take a big swing. It's it's because he wants to start the new phase off of a bang. I just hope he means just make it a darn good movie, right?

SPEAKER_05 46:14

Just make it an unforgettable movie that we don't need organized, you know.

SPEAKER_06 46:18

Let's just get right into something big, you know.

SPEAKER_03 46:19

Yeah, for all we know, kind of fantastic for the thing, right? Like, yeah, for all we know, this is probably their way of saying, hey, we're giving you a good leg up with Secret Wars and Doomsday. Don't F this up, make it huge, make it big, make it memorable.

SPEAKER_06 46:32

My opinions will have more weight once we get to Secret Wars. Because after Secret Wars is done, that's when we can look at each other and say, okay, so we have somewhat of an idea of what direction they're facing. Yeah. And then we'll then we'll kind of know where to speculate from there. Yeah. We might be surprised and be like, hey, this could work. Or we might get there and be like, oh no. You know what I mean? Like, yeah. So let's I think that that's you know, they're smart, they're Secret Wars's uh post credit scene would be active in.

SPEAKER_05 47:05

Yeah. And they probably would be, to be honest. Who knows? I hope so. So truthfully, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 47:10

Or at least the introduction to a couple of them, like boom, yeah, new ones, you know. So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 47:16

All right. Well, question is for you guys. What do you think about these comments made by um the X-Men writer Li Sung Jin on Deadline that Kevin Feige wants them to take a big swing? Do you think this is good? This is bad, does it give you pause? What are your thoughts? All right, guys, we are gonna now portal our way over to the rumor mill rundown.

SPEAKER_06 47:44

All right, everybody. Welcome to the rumor mill rundown. We got some fun stuff to go through today, Sam. I'm gonna start us right off with this top one here, right off the top. Right off the top. All right. Reports are servicing that there will be a will be doom variants in Avengers Doom Day, in one of which is a female variant. These were very early rumors that are now making their rounds again on the internet. How valid do you think they are? So female Doctor Doom.

SPEAKER_01 48:14

Yeah, Mrs. Doom, Mrs.

SPEAKER_03 48:17

Doom, Ms. Doom, yeah. Eh. Do we care? Like, I don't know if we care. This is my point of view on Doom variants. If the oh, I've I'm sorry, I forgot his name on the top of my head. Who played Doctor Doom in the Fantastic Four ones that recently passed away of cancer? Oh, I should know his name on the top of my head because I was just thinking about him the other day. Oh, shucks. But anyways, I see his face. Right? Yeah. Yeah. You're gonna say his name or be like, oh yeah, dumb. Yeah, right. But um there have been a couple of live action iterations of the Fantastic Four.

SPEAKER_07 48:59

Um you're gonna talk about the best one, right? And the the newer Fantastic Four. His name was Let me guess. Julian Guess? Julian McMahone. Oh, I wouldn't ever guess the last second part.

SPEAKER_03 49:17

No, but yes. I got Julian right, right? Julian McMahon, right. Yes. This this amazing actor passed away recently. Yeah. Like July 2nd of last year. Has even almost a full year now, guys. Um, so I say that to say that we've had like in the old 90s, uh, the Fantastic Four film that never really went to theaters and all that stuff. And they pay homage to them in Fantastic Four first steps with having the actors come in. That the gentleman who played Doctor Doom, then he's still alive. This version of Doctor Doom was one of my favorite versions of Doctor Doom. So RDJ, you got some big shoes to fill. You're gonna try to beat what he could do in this one. Anyways, we'll get there sometime, folks. And then we have uh Toby, I forgot his last name. He was in the recent Fantastic Four one that Fox did before it got reboot in the best Doom, right? No, no, no, yeah. That's this is the one where I don't know what what he was doing. Um I don't know what they were doing in making it. He's a good actor. Uh Toby. Oh my gosh. I am blanking on names tonight, guys. I am sorry. Toby Cabell. Let's see his face.

SPEAKER_09 50:28

That was the best dude. He's the best one. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 50:35

That that silence right there is me like going, what the heck are you talking about? I'm kidding. Whoa. Okay. I had a feeling you were kidding. Part of me is like, what am I gonna do? Yeah, no, anyway.

SPEAKER_05 50:52

So I always thought to move on from that. I always cats.

SPEAKER_03 50:57

Um, I always thought it would have been cool if RDJ is playing a Doom variant and we're not gonna get RDJ Doom for the rest of MCU to do a variance of Doom, and he's like the god emperor doomed everyone's talking about. That would have been kind of cool. However, the my favorite Doom passed away, so now I don't want that to happen. This is the main thing about this rumor. I don't think it's true. And I'm gonna tell you why I don't think it's true. They're not gonna take the spotlight off of the Doctor Doom RDJ to another Doctor Doom variant. It'd be one thing that these are like Kang variants and they're all behind him, and it's probably RDJ playing a whole bunch of different types of Dooms, or there's there's a female version like Lady Deadpool that was there that was just like didn't overtake anything. It was still Deadpool's film type thing. That's one thing if it's a lady Lady Doom in the crowd of Dooms, but they're not gonna have a Doom variant like this. I think Doom is a safe bet. He's a selfish guy, he's not gonna want a whole bunch of variants of himself when he can just take it over himself, like one guy. You know what I mean? You're gonna see variants of like Spider-Man, you're gonna see Toby McGuire, Andrew Garfield, all that in Secret Wards, but you're not gonna see in Doomsday or Secret Wars a female Doom variant. That's my two cents on it.

SPEAKER_06 52:22

Yeah, I'm with you. I think it's I just think there's it's unnecessary. They just don't have the money after RDJ. Well, just kidding. Yeah, yeah. That's probably partially true. Um I also think it's unnecessary. Yeah, you know, it's like why? You don't need to. Like it's yeah. I think you got a lot to tell. There's already enough going on. So yeah, just yeah. Not that you can't handle a big load of stuff, but yeah, but why? I mean, w would it I don't think it would help the story at all, but we don't know what the story is, so who knows, you know. Yeah, I'm more interested in in who Dr. Doom could have been than I am who he is and whether we're getting him. I've you had to fan cast Doom right now. Do you have a top one? Do you have a top actor?

SPEAKER_03 53:03

I got one. Well, on the top of my head. I have there are two on the top of my head, honestly. I and I forgot the one guy's name. And one of them we're gonna be talking about tonight in the Doctor Strange movie, to be honest. Yeah. He would have been Mad's Nicholson. He would have been my top pick. He would have been my top pick. Vigo Mortensen for me. Edward Gordon. Oh, yes. Oh, he would have been my third pick. Actually, he should be my second pick. My third pick would have been the guy that played Scarecrow in Batman Begins. Uh Kelly Murphy?

SPEAKER_05 53:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 53:33

Not bad.

SPEAKER_05 53:35

Yeah. Not bad. I could see that. He's a little bit younger than the other two, so he could do it a little bit easier. He's looking older now. Yeah, but he could pull it off. Yeah. I I do think I do think Vigo Mortensen would play. Oh, he'd be looking awesome.

SPEAKER_07 53:47

Amazing. It's like it's just me. I completely agree.

SPEAKER_06 53:51

But to me, that's more to talk about than that that exists. And I'm glad we're talking about though, because it has come up, but it's like, yeah, I don't, it just doesn't, you know, and the only Why?

SPEAKER_03 54:01

Like the there is a rumor out there that's similar to this, but it's around um Dr. Doom having like a council of people around him. We're gonna get into more of that on next week's rumor mill rundown, because there's one character that's been rumored out there to be part of this that we'll definitely talk about. Um, but I'll be more interested in that and see what the heck that is if that's true.

SPEAKER_06 54:21

Yeah, and I think that council thing probably refers more to Secret Wars than it's gonna be Doom's years, do you think?

SPEAKER_03 54:26

I I feel like that has more to do with just Doom's overall plot. Yeah. And if they're a big surprise character like a Scarlet Witch behind the scenes or a Doctor Strange behind the scenes, like the rumors are, that's just cool for us, even better for them because they don't have to tell their stories. It's just part of this story, you know what I mean? I gotcha. Anyway, so uh, what do you guys think of a female Doom variant? Do you think this is valid? Do you think this is actually gonna happen? Do you think it's overload, or do you think, oh, this better happen? Who knows? Metal boobs. We're already getting blue boobs, might not have metal boobs too. So comment below and let us know. Alright, so I'll I'll lead off in the second story here. Four score and seven years ago, the forefather of Marvel Studios decided to announce Blade with Mahersha Ali. What's it called again? Blade.

SPEAKER_09 55:18

Never mind.

SPEAKER_03 55:18

I know, right? Not not spoon, not knife, not screwdriver, blade. So he has yet to make his first physical appearance into the MCU. The post-credit scene in Eternals, we're not gonna talk about Eternals too much because it doesn't sound like Marvel's trying to adapt any of that that we know of, but that's all that we've ever had of him in the MCU. And to be honest, if you didn't even know it was his voice, you wouldn't have even known. I didn't know until afterwards, and they're like, oh, it was him. You're like, oh, it wasn't distinguishable enough for me. Anyways, insider uh Daniel RPK is reported a while back that Blade will make his MCU appearance in Avengers Secret Wars, and now more insider reports indicates that indeed Mahersha Ali, his full MCU debut, will be in Avenger Secret Wars. His role is expected to be significant and will carry on into the next phase of the MCU. So how much do we trust this and do we like this idea or not?

SPEAKER_09 56:25

So I mean I'll probably throw you for a curveball on this on my thoughts. Maybe.

SPEAKER_07 56:34

I don't know.

SPEAKER_06 56:36

I don't trust anything that Marvel says about Blade until I'm sitting in the seat watching the movie. Yeah. I think Marshall Ali is gonna be too old at this point to continue the character on. Why do it? Like but the other part of this that makes me kind of go, what? is him having a crucial role in Secret Wars. And it's just a strange character to put that kind of responsibility on. Especially one that you're having a hard time bringing into this universe, anyways. And especially one that is so unique is Blade. Makes me wonder what Secret Wars is and what Doomsday is gonna be. Like, I'll be honest with you, none of these things that we talk about that like this kind of news comes up or rumor gets me curious in Doomsday and Secret Wars in a positive way. Almost all of it is in a really it's not a really you know what I mean? It's not like a oh that's interesting, it's a really and and I don't know, I don't care for that feeling. I'm getting to a certain point with all this where I'm kind of like, what kind of bullshit are you guys trying to sell us here? Because I don't know, you know, like I don't know how I feel about this. Do I want bleed? Yes. Should it be Mahersha Ali? I mean, I guess. How long do you want to keep the guy? You know, he's br near Wesley Snipes age now, you know, might as well just bring Wesley Snipes in. You know, it's like if and if he's a crucial part of Secret Wars, I don't like hearing new characters being a bigger part of something that's ending old characters. It makes me kind of feel um it just it just makes me feel like this is all all of it is just to kind of make you get this reaction that we're doing right now. Thankfully, we're in a rumor mill thing. This could be bullshit. This could be nothing, you know? So that this is so as far as I'm concerned right now, I'm not too worried about it. The minute it becomes news is when I'm gonna that's what I'm gonna be like, really? Right now, I see this as just a rumor and a possibility, and frankly, I probably wouldn't do it if it was me. I'd be like, nope, you know, this blade's gonna show up when blade shows up in the right way, and we're not just gonna shoe him and horn him in. We're not gonna do it just because, and and I probably wouldn't waste a lot of time on newer characters in Secret Wars more than ending old and maybe ushering in some new. And maybe if Blade's got something to do with that, that's cool, but I don't know why what's Blade gonna have to do with this. It's gonna make a lot of sense, and we don't know what these movies are yet, too. So I just I feel like this is kind of jumping the gun. You know, I I it's it's very hard to speculate on secret wars when doomsday is still very much a cloud of mystery, really, for me.

SPEAKER_09 59:45

So okay.

SPEAKER_06 59:47

So that's where I'm gonna leave it. I think it's a I think it's a bit anything to do with blade though, until I see it. I gotta, it's gotta be even when I see it, I'm gonna be like, am I dreaming? I don't trust the Marvel with blade thing. They just because they don't know how to do it. So what why all of a sudden do you know how to do?

SPEAKER_03 1:00:05

All of a sudden, you know what I mean? So I don't know, it's just so I guess I would have a little bit I'm gonna take a little bit more of an opt- optimistic tour on this. All right, and there's two reasons why, two things I'm gonna point out. Russo Brothers, as we saw in Captain America's Civil War, have a great f I wouldn't say formula, but a great way of being able to introduce to your audience a new character that you don't need to give too much of a backstory, but it's just enough to put them into the MCU and then see if the right creative team behind them can go and make them flourish. They we they just did that like we just said in uh Captain America Civil War with Peter Parker, Spider-Man, and Black Panther. And thankfully those two went on to become successful franchises within the MCU. Uh, I think one of the problems that they've been having with Blade um is they haven't been able to figure out how do we introduce vampires into the MCU. And if that's any indication of what they've done with magic, and we're gonna be talking about that in our moot uh retrospective today with Doctor Strange, they drop the ball on magic, at least for your general audience to understand what the MCU means about magic. To anyone who says they get it and they did a great job with it, no, and all honesty, and we're like I said, we're gonna talk about on our first Doctor Strange retrospective, but even what we know of the Doctor Strange sequel and some of the other uh witchcraft magic type stuff later on, it's very wishy-washy. And who can do magic, when they could do magic, who can hone spells, who can't. It's it it contradicts common lore of what magic users can do. And it's okay if Marvel's gonna do it a little bit differently than what you're because it's all fictitious, y'all, but at least set some ground rules, and they haven't been able to do that in the MCU. So I can't say they could do the same thing with with vampires the same way. I think they're having a struggle with how to bring him in. I think there are a number of reasons why Blade didn't get off its feet after he announced it. One probably also, other than them not figuring out how to introduce him and the whole idea of vampirism, but also the the quantity versus quality type thing. I think Kevin Feige has purposely kept some of these projects like Blade on the back burner during that horrible time where he was told he had to do so many movies and so many shows, and they were just using existing IP that was already successful to see if they can make that work instead of introducing some brand new IP that could be a hit or a miss depending on if they do it right, you know, especially with someone like Blade. So that I think that really does have a big part of it, is that they're like, we're not gonna throw him in here while we're in the midst of this roller coaster and figure out what the heck are we gonna do with him and potentially ruin the character for the MCU moving forward. Is that not what they're doing here, if this is true?

SPEAKER_06 1:03:10

No.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:11

In the midst of all this going on, we're just gonna toss him in and to go back to what I said about civil war. I don't if they he says on here a significant role. Yeah, that's the difference, right? I don't know if significant role, see, this is this is how I'm picturing Secret Wars in my head at the moment, and I'm basing this a little bit off of the comics because that's how they're trying to pull it from us from the comics. I think we are gonna get a core team of five to six characters, similar to what we had in Endgame, to be honest, um, that we are gonna follow that's gonna help wake everybody up to what Doom has actually done and have an epic battle. That's similar, a little bit similar, not exactly, but a little bit similar to what they did in the Secret Wars comic, where it was basically in the Secret Wars comic, there's like one character, I believe it was either Wolverine or Doctor Strange, someone who knew of what happened before, and then slowly they started waking everybody up. I would not be surprised if because wherever Blade is in the MCU, because we haven't been introduced to vampirism, this could be a way of bringing forth vampirism, at least the dimension of vampires or however they're gonna describe it, Mephistle's realm, whatever, wherever Blades come from. Um, or half of them has come from, to be honest. Um, this would be a way to bring that to light, and that he is not connected with everybody else, so he could be part of a team that will go and help bring people to light on that. That way you don't have to tell a full backstory of him and make him be like in every frame, but just like Peter Parker and Black Panther, you sprinkle him in enough, give him some cool action scenes, already got a great actor to do it, and there you go. You've now brought him into the MCU, and what you do with him moving forward is up to whatever the Rooster Brothers are gonna give their hands to and be like, all right, guys, we set him up for you, just like Black Panther and Spider-Man. Now go ahead and figure out what you're gonna do. You got him now. And even if it never amounts to anything because of his age, or it just amounts to a midnight sun movie that we've talked about before, at least you've already broken the ice of introducing him to the the audience, and now the audience will say they like him, don't like him, and then move forward from there. Right. But that's that's my two cents on it. I do think it'll be ambitious to do it in the Secret Wars film, but I I actually can see something like this being done because I have a feeling in Secret Wars, not only are gonna they throw everybody in there, but we're gonna be introduced to some characters that were in different dimensions that we've never seen before, and we know in our comic brains, oh, they there is a possibility they could be there. We just haven't seen them yet, and this could be a good time for a niche character like Blade. How do we fit him in? Here, this is A weird story already to throw them in, just throw them in and see what happens. That's my thought.

SPEAKER_09 1:06:05

All right.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:06

I hope you're right. Yeah. Like your optimism. I'm I'm sticking to some optimism a little bit until we find out. Because if I stuck with the other way, for especially for Sadie Sink's part right now, I'd be like, be a little depressing. Anyways. Yeah, I mean, as of right now, it's just a rumor.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:22

Yeah. So as far as I'm concerned, they don't know what the hell to do with this character still.

SPEAKER_03 1:06:25

I'm just letting my imagination run wild. And Russo Brothers, if you like what you heard, please take it. I don't care. Don't give me the credit.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:32

I don't know how I would even bring Blade into it right now at this point, either. So like it's hard to even have a have a path of my own with them. So I get it. I get it. If they got some idea, then maybe it's something's better than nothing, I guess, right?

SPEAKER_03 1:06:47

But well, the cool thing about Secret Wars is you don't need to flush out too much of backstory characters because you're literally just throwing these all these characters into this weird battle world scenario. Yeah. They have to survive and figure out a way to get out. So you the Russo brothers are great with writing character development in regards to their skill set, how they're going to interact with other people, their smarts, things like that. So just do what they do best for a character like Blade to establish those key core things of Blade. And the story itself that they're having a hard time figuring out to do. Worry about that later once you've established your character. Then it'll be easier to throw in the the the whole movie for him. Because you don't have to reintroduce him. You know what I mean? Right. So, anyways, that's my thought. What do you guys think? Jump down the comment section below. Let us know what what you thought of my thoughts. Do you think Blade should be in Secret Wars? Do you think they should just wait? Or do you think at this point they kind of need to recast because they've kind of kicked the can down the road a little too long? Let us know in the comments below. Sounds good.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:51

All right, Ike. Alright, guys, our next rumor. This one I'm actually kind of excited for because this is coming from a real good source. Jeff Snyder's been known to have some real good stuff out there. He knows his thing. A new rumor report online from Jeff Snyder suggests that Sebastian Stans, Mr. Character in the Batman Part 2, is not Harvey Dent, but instead Victor. Yep. Okay. But don't count out Harvey Dent from being in the movie as his actual portrayal will be from Brian Tyree Henry. Do we like this? I love this. I think this is brilliant. I hope this is 100% true. I think, Jeff, if you get you get a lot of your stuff right, I'm hoping this is one of them. I'm great with uh Brian Tyree Henry playing um Harvey Dent. I have no problem with that. I think Harvey Dent, that'll be a great character for him to play. I think it'd be different for that actor to play. It'd be cool to see him do something different. But I'm more excited to see Sebastian Stan take on a bad guy role because you could make this guy real messed up. And he is real messed up. This to surprise, like Joker kind of scary if he does it right. And this, and I think this fits this really cool serial killer-esque kind of feel that this new Batman iteration has kind of welcomed itself to feeling. You know, I like this idea, I want this to be true. I hope this is true. I think Sebastian's Dana's Harvey Dents too on the nose, too simple, too Hollywood casting. I think him playing this bad guy character, especially this one, is the kind I want to see in the next Robert Panson movie of Batman for sure. I'm down. This better be true. If it's not, I'll be sad.

SPEAKER_03 1:09:39

I hope it's true because I think this is a great idea. Well, what I will say about this great actor, Sebastian Stan. We love him in the MCU, but even outside of the MCU, he's a fantastic method actor. Great character we have not seen in live action. And let me tell you about this guy. I don't know too much about him, although Batman's my favorite DC character, um, or superhero. Uh he is creepy. He actually has cut marks on all his victims that he's done, and it's all over his body. So just to picture Sebastian Stan looking that way and acting acting that serial killer way and doing this crazy mind stuff that the the first Batman movie was really great at really portraying with the Riddler. I would love to see this. This if they announce this as true and confirmed. Um Well, that's how excited I am. If they announce this as true and confirmed, I will be more I will buy uh same night it comes out theater tickets. Oh, yeah. I would want to see this. Yeah. Like hands down, this is not, I'm gonna wait until Saturday. This is Thursday night, midnight showing. Because I would want, especially the trailers alone will look crazy. This he it just I want to see this. There's no other way to say it. I wanted to see this. I want this to be true. I want this out of Rumamo rundown and into our multiverse minute next time we talk about this.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:09

Yes, because that is that is oh what a great casting that would be. That is just uh to see who didn't think of this before. I hope this is true.

SPEAKER_06 1:11:18

Maybe it was a plan all along, right? Maybe to see I would love to see Sebastian Stan and Robert Badson toe-to-toe acting wise, and these characters in particular. This could be a fun movie, man. I this could be a fun movie.

SPEAKER_03 1:11:35

I'm I'll be doing a lot more research on Victor Saz to make sure I'm prepared for it. Yeah, but from what I know of the Arkham games and just from general stuff, he's crazy. He is crazy. And to see Batman combat that, especially the mind games they could play with each other. Oh, all right.

SPEAKER_06 1:11:53

Yeah, and I I think I I loved I like this new iteration of Batman too. I love Batman's Batman. Like I the Batman I thought was a great movie, you know, and like I I can't I can't think of if you were to say what villain would you do for this if it was for me to pick. I gotta be honest with you, uh, it's hard to pick. And then when I hear these words, I'm like, oh yeah. This is this is a no-brainer. No brainer. Like just dude, yeah, let's do this character. And then to say Sebastian Stan. Oh Hallelujah. Yes, and let's see this, man. I want to see this tomorrow. I want to see this tomorrow. Yeah, I hope this guy gives him such a hard time that the penguin has to help Batman find him, and that's why Penguin's gonna be in it. And I I have a hot take about how I feel about the penguin. I think the penguin's gonna be in this new iteration of Batman. I think he's gonna be Batman's biggest adversary, not the Joker.

SPEAKER_03 1:12:52

Well, that's I think they're slowly building that up to that. It's a good point you bring up on that because I they did introduce a Joker at the post-credit scene of this of the first one, but I don't think he is gonna be the villain for the second one. No, I think Joker is gonna be one of those slow burn buildups.

SPEAKER_06 1:13:09

Yeah, but but I also think the penguin's gonna be the highlight one. You always got Joker's always the highlight of Batman's villains. I think in the end of this trilogy, it's gonna be Batman and Penguin facing off, and that's why we're getting a lot of penguin too. So then when we get to that, it's gonna be we know a lot about both these characters. Because Colin Farrell, as that cat character, is amazing, and the the show is amazing. So yeah, I don't know. I kind of I could hot take, you could just not do Joker again for a while, that'd be alright with it.

SPEAKER_03 1:13:44

Well, I don't think we need it. I would well my hot take for this would be if they did something similar to the Arkham games for their third movie and make it where it's all these villains against Batman. Yeah. Where each one has their highlight moment, but maybe Penguin's the head guy, or you know, there's something that's bigger behind the scenes where you could be able to some of these throwaway villains that may not be able to stand alone for him or be a little crazy, a little bit out there. Um, they could be included in it type thing.

SPEAKER_06 1:14:15

I guess anything supernatural you can throw out the window though. This guy's not gonna go there.

SPEAKER_03 1:14:19

I know, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:14:20

Even more so than Nolan didn't, because Nolan didn't either, but he still teetered that line. This guy's going as far from it as he can find it. Yeah.

unknown 1:14:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:14:32

I even be prepared. When Harvey Dent does become two-faced, it's not gonna be like what you think it's gonna be. It's not gonna be half of his face gonna be messed up. He's just gonna turn into a bad guy. So if that's gonna disappoint you, be prepared. Because I don't think he's gonna go the direction of ruining of doing that again. I think it's gonna be a two-faced as an amount of things. Maybe it'll gouge his eye out at the most. Like maybe at the very little they'll hurt him and give him a scar, but it's not gonna be like what we've been, what we've seen before. Yeah, it's gonna be more grounded, more real. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:15:07

All right. Well, what do you guys think of this news or this not news? I'm sorry, this rumor that's spreading around out there. Yeah. Do you want to see Sebastian Sam play Victor Saz like Ike and I do? Or do you think that he is gonna be Harvey Dents? What do you guys think about the characters in general? Comment below and let us know. All right, so where are we uh teleporting ourselves to now?

SPEAKER_06 1:15:32

So next we're gonna sling ring ourselves right into uh nice good old retrospective of Titanic. And we have a special guest today. It's gonna be our it's a retrospective branch point breakdown. It's it's kind of what's taking place of when we don't have a show to talk about. Um, but we're gonna do Titanic with our mother. We're gonna have a good time talking about that. I had a lot of fun getting ready to do this movie. Um, it's been nice to re-watch it. It'll be fun to sit and talk about it and see how it goes and see what mom thinks. I got a couple real fun hot takes, so we'll have a good time.

SPEAKER_03 1:16:03

Yeah. Yeah. All right, guys. So stick with us. Here we go. Thank you for staying with us on the Goodell Multiverse Podcast. We are on our branch point breakdown, and we have another special for you today, guys. Our mother has joined us back in studio, and we're gonna be reviewing the amazing film Titanic that came out in 1997. So as always, I'm gonna get started with a little bit of a history behind the film, guys, and then um my mom's gonna jump in there, our mom is, and she's gonna tell you the official synopsis of the film, and then Ike is gonna wrap it up, the intro part with telling you basically what the movie is. So we'll get right into it. So uh Titanic was released on December 19th, 1997. The main cast includes Leonardo DiCaprio, Kate Winslett, Billy Zane, Kathy Bates, Frances Fisher, Gloria Stewart, Bill Paxton, and Bernard Hill, just to name a few. History behind the film. Titanic is an epic romantic disaster film written, directed, and produced by James Cameron. Set abroad the real RMS Titanic during its ill-fated maiden voyage in 1912. The film follows the fictional love story of Jack Dawson, a poor artist played by Leonardo DiCaprio, and Rose DeWitt Buchter. Bucter? Bucater. Bucater. Yep. An upper class young woman played by Kate Winslett. Blending historical events with a sweeping love story, Cameron created a film that appeared to appeal to both fans of romance and large-scale spectacle. At the time of its production, Titanic was considered one of the biggest gambles in Hollywood history. Its budget ballooned to approximately $200 million, making it the most expensive film ever produced at the time. Industry insiders widely predicted it would become a financial disaster. Instead, the film became a global phenomenon, earning over $2.2 billion worldwide through its original release and subsequent re-releases. It became the first movie ever to surpass $1 billion of the Global Box Office and remained the highest-grossing film of all time until James Cameron's own Avatar overtook it in 2010. Critically, Titanic was highly praised for its groundbreaking visual effects, production design, cinematography, score, and emotional storytelling. The film currently holds an 88% critic score on Rotten Tomatoes and a 69% audience score. It was nominated for 14 Academy Awards and won 11 Oscars, including Best Picture and Best Director, tying the record set by Ben Hur for the most Oscar wins at the time. The film's sweeping musical score by James Horner and the theme song My Heart Will Go On, performed by Celine Dion, became cultural landmarks in their own right. The production of Titanic was nearly as ambitious as the story it told. Cameron constructed enormous ship sets in Baja, California, Mexico, including a near full-scale recreation of the Titanic's exterior. The director also conducted multiple expeditions to the actual Titanic wreck site, and footage from those dives was incorporated into the film. Kate Winslet performed many of her own water scenes and reportedly suffered pneumonia during filming due to the demanding conditions. One famous behind-the-scenes fact is that the nude portrait of Rose seen in the movie was actually drawn by James Cameron himself, and the hands seen sketching on screen belonged to him. Another iconic moment, Jack shouted, I'm the king of the world from The Bow of the Ship, was improvised during production and became one of the most recognizable movie quotes ever. The legacy of Titanic is difficult to overstate. Beyond its financial success, it demonstrated that audiences would embrace a three-hour film that they were emotionally invested in the story. It helped establish Leonardo DiCaprio and Kate Winslet as international superstars and inspired renewed public interest in the real Titanic disaster, maritime archaeology and historical preservation. The film also raised the bar for visual effects and large-scale filmmaking, influencing countless blockbusters that followed. Nearly 30 years later, Titanic remains one of the most successful, influential, and beloved films ever made, frequently appearing on lists of the greatest epic romances and disaster films in cinema history.

SPEAKER_06 1:21:03

Quite a history on that movie. There sure is. Which is real crazy if you think about it. It's kind of cool. But he he actually um visited the Titanic himself 33 times with his thing. Cameron has he had spent most of better part of 30 years chasing the story of the Titanic. And it ended up becoming one he ended up becoming one of the world's most experienced deep sea explorers just because of it. And there's a lot of and that the camera technology and stuff has actually become part of what they use now when they look for shipwrecks of the stuff that they designed in order to get filming done and do the stuff that they did for this movie. Which is actually really wild if you think about it. Wow. You know, there's there's other and there's one more behind the scenes story that did you guys know about? Um someone spiked the clam chowder during the filming The Titanic. Yep. I wrote it down right here. Someone spoke someone spiked the clam chowder. Someone put PCP into a pot of the clam chowder that was served to the cast and crew. Dozens of people were taken to the hospital, and to this day they still have no idea who did it.

SPEAKER_09 1:22:52

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_06 1:22:53

But including your lead two stars, they've even said it in some interviews. Yeah, someone played a real bad prank and drugged everybody on the set of this movie. Oh, isn't that wild? That's one of the most wild facts about like movies like that out there like on set. Isn't that crazy to think? Oh my goodness. It sounds scary. Oh, yeah. To not know what was wrong. It's wild.

SPEAKER_09 1:23:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:23:15

Yeah. All right. Well, mom, would you do us the honor of reading the official synopsis of the film?

SPEAKER_08 1:23:23

Yeah. Uh uh. A young aristocrat falls in love with a poor artist aboard a luxurious, ill-fated RMS Titanic.

SPEAKER_06 1:23:34

Yeah. Yeah. So, guys, I'm going to give you a quick little story outline real fast just so it's so we can jump into our favorite stuff and kind of just reminisce about this movie. In 1996, treasure hunter Brock Lovett searches for the wreck of the RMS Titanic for the priceless heart of the ocean diamond. After discovering a drawing of a young woman wearing the necklace, he is contacted by a 101-year-old Rose Calvert. Calvert? Yep. Who reveals it is Calvert, yeah. Who reveals that she is a woman in the sketch and begins recounting her experiences aboard the Titanic in 1912 as a young first-class passenger, Rose DeWitt Bukotter, Bicotter. Her last name, guys, it's so hard to. I think we had it the first time, right? But anyways, feels trapped by her engagement to wealthy Cal Hockley and the financial pressures of her family. Her life changes when she meets Jack Dawson, a free-spirited third-class artist who saves her from a suicide attempts. Despite the social barriers between them, Jack and Rose fall deeply in love during the ship's maiden voyage. The romance is cut short when the Titanic strikes an iceberg and begins to sink. Cal frames Jack for theft, but Rose frees him as chaos spreads across the ship. Together they struggle to survive while lifeboats depart and the ship breaks apart in the freezing Atlantic. Jack sacrifices his own life to keep Rose alive, urging her to live a full life and never give up. Rescued by the RMS Carpacea, Rose adopts Jack's surname and starts a new life inspired by his by his spirit. In the present day, she reveals that she had possessed the heart, the whole of the ocean all along, and quietly drops it into the ocean above the Titanic's wreck, bringing her story and her connection to Jack to a peaceful close. That is pretty much the gist of the film. Yeah, it's just when this movie first came out, how many times did we try to go see it, Mom? Because I specifically remember walking up to the doors in Geneseo and you and Dad seeing it, it would say right on the doors, they put a sticker up on it said sold out.

SPEAKER_09 1:25:49

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:25:50

And it it wasn't, was it where where was the first time we ended up seeing it? Wasn't it at the drive-in? Or was it in Warsaw?

SPEAKER_09 1:25:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:25:57

Okay. All right. I thought so. Yeah. And then how many times of the drive-in did we go see it? At least three, I guess.

SPEAKER_08 1:26:04

I think I've seen it in a theater twelve times.

SPEAKER_06 1:26:07

Wow.

SPEAKER_08 1:26:09

In the first two years.

SPEAKER_06 1:26:10

Yeah. Wherever it played, I went. Yeah, because it played for almost two years, that movie.

SPEAKER_08 1:26:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:26:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:26:15

I took all different kinds of people. Good friends, church friends, neighbor. Somebody say, I'd like to go see it. I'll say, I go with you.

SPEAKER_06 1:26:24

Yeah, when a movie strikes you like that.

SPEAKER_08 1:26:26

Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:26:27

Yeah. Do you remember the first time you saw it, Sammy? Because I know you were this was a long time ago for you.

SPEAKER_03 1:26:32

So well, I I didn't see it in the theater at all. Um, I saw at home here. Um, I'm trying to remember when the first time was. I have to have been in middle school, I want to say. Um, when I actually s remember seeing it. Um, I'm sure you've played it before that, because I I remember periodically throughout my childhood, this film was always one that was just we had them on VHS. And anyone who remembers VHS, those big black, long things that go inside a VHS player, just for your youngins that don't know what even a DVD is anymore. Um, and it was that big of a movie. There was a two-pack VHS, big fat box there, and I remember that always being played. I know we have it somewhere in this house still because that's one of those we just we just kept when we got rid of everything. So um, yeah, I just I remember you playing it off and on periodically throughout my childhood, and so I always knew of the story. It was in seventh or eighth grade. I actually our my whole class in school was supposed to do a take a piece of the Titanic and do like a project of it. So some kids would get the exterior, some would get exactly what happened, some would get the the boiler room and all that. And I I think I got one one piece of like the interior or like the dining hall or something I had to lay out. And I remember watching this movie two or three times just to get a Good picture of it at that point. And yeah. So that's my earliest memories of watching this film.

SPEAKER_06 1:28:05

Yeah. I don't know what my fascination with it is. Um when I when I talk West, I mean with Titanic in general, I have I am a fanatic about the Titanic and it's sinking for some reason. To this day, I've I've prescribed or subscribe, subprescribed to I guess medicine. I subscribe to at least three different podcasts that are as purely talks about Titanic history. I've probably listened to hours and hours of like right now there's a podcast on. I can't remember their name for the life of me, or I'd tell you right now. We'll put in the comments below. Um that it's literally they're taking like all the passengers that they have the names of, and they're the podcast is just each episode during the background in each passenger. And and and where they were on the boat, and some of them they didn't know, some they did know. There was some they have a lot about, so some they don't have a they have very little about. In fact, one of the things I found funny, I found out from that, not funny, but one of the really creepy, strange facts about the Titanic is the hundreds of people died there, but there's still some that are unidentified. That like some of the graves that they have in Nova Scotia are actually, they just say unknown passenger or unknown child. You know, like when they found the Titanic on the ocean floor in the 90s, like when they actually discovered it, they expected to see like skeletons of people that had floated down, but they saw none of that. All they saw were shoes of where these bodies had laid. And the guy he described it as like a graveyard of shoes. And so, how do you identify people, especially if you're third class and you got on that boat and it was just a signature you probably couldn't read that you probably took with you while you were on the boat? I mean, that it's it's quite amazing. Little stuff like that I found and you don't think about, you know, and I've always thought, you know, it's and it's not like the worst disaster that's happened in the world, but it is one of those that it just for some reason captures your imagination of what it could have been like. Because it's there was no telephones, there's barely, there's no photos, you know. I mean, there's so many things that are like so unknown that makes it so interesting that I think that's why. And then when you really look into how scary that night was, you know, the movie doesn't do that part of it justice. If I had to say anything wrong with this movie, is you because you see everything and it's it's it's a big spectacle and it's cool and it and it it's awesome that way. And and it's the drama and the scariness of it happening is still there, but in reality, it was like double the scary because when the lights go out on that ship when it's hanging up in the air and the power finally goes out, you know. In the movie, we we can't just not see it, right? You have to be able to watch and see what's gonna happen. In reality, though, it was so dark in the Atlantic Ocean. There was no moon that night. It was a new moon that when you and the lights went out in that thing, it's you don't see anything. So if you put yourself in a position of these people sitting in these lifeboats watching this boat turn off, all you hear is metal and it breaking. I mean, that's why the the accounts of it breaking in half are real hard to know exactly how it broke in half because nobody could see it doing it. Like the people there are people that they could see the shape of it, they were close enough to understand that's what was happening, or maybe the silhouette they could see. But when the lights went out and that thing, it will you were it's like closing your eyes, and all you hear is a ship sinking and people screaming. It's that's how dark it was. And it did that's actually if you think about it, that's the movie can't do the j they can't do that for the film. It's a terrible movie, right? You know what I mean? But but when you start thinking of real life, you really put yourself there. Yeah, that's terrifying. I just I mean, not I'm not gonna go on and on, but I just found out that there was a whole lifeboat of 30 people that the lifeboat had capsized over. So the bottom of it was up and the air underneath was keeping it floating. But they 30 people were standing on top of this lifeboat and they stood there for five hours. As they died, they would fall off, and people that were holding on to the sides would climb up and take their place, and they'd all every time a wave come, they'd say, Okay, move, and they'd all move with the shit with the boat so it wouldn't flip back over so they could stay out of the water for five hours. Like there's so many little stories of yeah, the movie almost can't do it justice, right? Yeah, like it's so much, you know. Not that the movie fails at that, it's it's because it doesn't fail because of it. But what a hard movie to make over something that there's countless amounts of things that you could talk about with what went on in this thing, you know? But that's why I'm so fascinated. I don't know what it is. I don't know if this movie got me fascinated. I can't remember the first time Titanic came into my little young mind where I was just so interested in what happened out there, you know. And I don't know. Do you do you remember when it really struck you, or is it was it the movie that was that the thing that catalyzed that was like the catalyst of it? But I don't know what it was for me. It's not like we were growing up with stories about it or anything, you know.

SPEAKER_08 1:33:05

I just Yeah, I I think for me, uh I had heard stories about it. I had read the book, The Night to Remember.

SPEAKER_09 1:33:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:33:13

Um, in high school. But when the movie came out, it made it all real. All the things you had read or had heard about, all of a sudden you're seeing it happen in front of you. The mammoth size of the Titanic, I think, is what struck me by. I knew it was big and it talks about it being huge, but that movie, the the way they c capture side glimpses of it, and as it moves through the water and boats beside it, and yeah, I just I'm just yeah, I was overwhelmed by I you're just mesmerized by it. And there's a love story involved for us women, the love love stories. Uh and um, yeah, it was just it was an incredible reality, real reality of of something I'd known about.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:56

So that this this movie, this that's one thing that when I do any traveling again and I go back down, I went to Tennessee only one time in my life, but that I'd like to go to the Titanic Museum that's in Tennessee, where they have, I believe they have some pieces of the ship they're able to recover. They haven't been able to fully recover most of most of the Titanic itself, just because of where it is.

SPEAKER_06 1:34:21

Well, and a lot of it is the people that own it won't let them because the maritime law is if you were the owner of it, you have the right to say leave the wreckage or not. And they've been they've always they get permission every time, like if anything they have brought up has gone through several court cases in order for that to happen. And not that they sue for it to happen, but it's about permission and this and that. Yeah. Then they finally get it, or or we would see a lot more of the shit brought up. It's it's unfortunate too. There's things of it I wish they would bring up. I wish they would have saved the propellers at the time. That'd be neat to see in a museum. You know, it'd be unique to see some of the stuff that now is it's just slowly disintegrating away down there, pretty much. You know? It's pretty wild if you think about it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:35:04

I'm surprised with the DNA testing that they can't take soil samples.

SPEAKER_06 1:35:09

Oh, yeah. Who knows? It's probably I think we we I think we need someone with scientific knowledge to tell us what at that kind of depth with that kind of cold, what there would be of left, you know. And you gotta think of all the critters and things and but that would be interesting to know to see what they could do. You know, but they can't they can they can't bring nothing up.

SPEAKER_08 1:35:31

They gotta have a match anyway.

SPEAKER_06 1:35:32

So I mean Yeah, there's gotta be a match. Yeah, so yeah, it's pretty wild.

SPEAKER_08 1:35:37

It is. It is.

SPEAKER_06 1:35:38

I've always wanted to go to the graveyard, Nova Scotia, and I've always wanted to take that little cruise they have where you can go out and they do like a ceremony over the I think it would be surreal to be on a boat in the spot where it sank. I could only imagine. Mm-hmm. Like they do it right at night and everything to give you that, you know, understand the feel where it's nice and cold. And of course now it's a little different. So now there's no icebergs there now, you know, and but it'd be still be very surreal to be.

SPEAKER_03 1:36:04

It's still pretty cold, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:36:06

Yeah, or just just to know this happened right here. Sure. You know, like that'd be wild. There's something about being in a place when it's happened, you know. You can feel it almost. And they say to this day, there's people that say they hear strange in that area. They've heard like SOS signals that just are they show up and they're gone like that. And they they always think it's like a weird fan. There's a ghost story, there's tons of ghost stories about Titanic. I'm sure it's all just crazy stuff, but but that's how that's how big of a whoops, that's how big of a deal it is, though. Even to maritime guys, when today they even talk about the possibility of that stuff being weird, you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:36:42

Yeah. Oh my. Well, I I don't even know where to begin when we start talking about this mammoth of a movie of uh historical thing, but we usually at this point we'll just jump into what we thought about the cast that they selected and uh their performances. Are there any that stand out to us? Some that are surprising, some that you thought that could have been done better. I mean, when we get to these type of movies, guys, like we do with Shaw Shank Redemption, we're reviewing these amazing movies that have stood the test of time at this point now on how great they are. So we might not get into too many of weakest cast performances, to be honest. But um, mom, why don't you start us off? Is there any performance you would either describe as the best performance or the one that stuck out to you the most? Of any of the characters, or um what did you think of the two main people that we had?

SPEAKER_08 1:37:38

Oh, they're I thought they were great. Uh Kathy Bates is still one of my favorite actor actresses, so um, she's kind of my well, she's a little older than I am, but I I thought her role was great. Um I liked the captain of the ship. I I thought he did I loved every time he came around, you know, he was involved. I liked I liked him. Um actually the husband to be, the the rich gentleman that was had Rose under his thumb, he did a good job. He really did a good job in that role. I like you know, you have to that's quite a role to have to play. And I thought he did a great job that he had an air about him through the whole movie that made you realize that he thought he was pretty, pretty good stuff. You know, he was top notch and he was gonna let everybody know. So yeah. Um those are those are probably my favorites.

SPEAKER_06 1:38:37

It's it's funny you bring up the captain too, because he's interesting. I like his character in this, and the actor's great. Uh it the real life captain, they the for the movie they had him go into the room and he closed, which is one of the most amazing scenes in the movie.

SPEAKER_09 1:38:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:38:52

It's kind of surreal if you think about it.

SPEAKER_08 1:38:54

It is.

SPEAKER_06 1:38:54

In real life, though, they they really don't know what he did. They don't know where he was.

SPEAKER_08 1:38:58

But they have pictures of him and they look very similar.

SPEAKER_06 1:39:00

Yeah, he it looks like they pulled him right out of the phone. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like the the man, the actor just plays him well. Yeah, it's he does.

SPEAKER_08 1:39:07

He does.

SPEAKER_06 1:39:07

For a small part, you really get who this guy is right away. Yep. You know?

SPEAKER_09 1:39:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:39:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:39:14

Yeah. I mean, it's uh when I was doing my research for the movie after watching it and things like that recently, um, and come to see all the different actors and actresses that they were tapping to to play Jack and Rose. It's hard for me to imagine after watching this movie anyone else but these two actors playing it. Their chemistry together was amazing. Their performances were really good. It really launched Leonardo DiCaprio to superstar them, this this movie in particular. Um, and he already was a rising star, and Kate Winslow was too. But there are some people like Gweneth Paltrow was apparently in the runnings to play Kate, um, Brad Pitt, Tom Cruise, they were in the runnings to play Jack. It's just some some of these people that we know of them now, of course, and they're huge names, but I can't picture these guys after seeing what Leonardo and uh Kate brought to the table for this. You know, and these from my understanding, the the love story is a fictional part of the whole thing, right? It's the um Jack Dawson wasn't a real character person in life, and um Rose wasn't real either, but they used they used this fictional love story to tell the story of the Titanic and their the life on the Titanic. Like, even though they weren't real people that did that stuff, there were people really that did that stuff there with the um some of the best scenes, like the everyone in the the the bottom of the ship doing the the Irish jigs and all that stuff, and then you had the upper class people that are hoity-toides or like four different types of fork, and no one knows what to do. Like it's it really they became like our audience view into the Titanic, and then they just told in doing that, really well written, good job, James Cameron, really well-written love story of these two characters, um, meeting and every bit of it is so good, so good.

SPEAKER_06 1:41:20

Yeah, my my best performance is gonna go to Billy Zane as the Kale, as the bad as is her husband to be. I over the years of watching this movie, um I always the first when I think back to the first time you watch it, he's just your typical bad guy. And you almost kind of roll your eyes at him, like, really, this guy with his crap. But I've come to really understand, not understand him, but because he's an awful human being, but like what a role that he played in that. Because what comes off is like your typical, you know, pretentious, kind of rich idiot, you know, that just is thinks he's full of himself. He really, I feel like he puts a lot of dimension to the character because he's not really evil, he's just a product of his own environment that he's from. And uh there's moments in this movie where where the pr the pretentious is given that okay, he's always gonna be like this, but he is sincere when he's sincere, and I think that that's unique to play that role when you watching him, like when he's talking to her, when he gives her the necklace, that specific scene, he's being sincere with her. There's nothing for him to gain by having Rose other than she's pretty and he's got her and he owns her. But it's not like he needs her to be who he's gonna be. As you go through this movie, you find out that it's it's the other way around. They need him because, like the mom said, you know, we're we're done. Your father ruined us. If not for you marrying this guy, we'd go back. You want me to go back to being poor?

SPEAKER_09 1:43:03

You want me to live that way?

SPEAKER_06 1:43:05

Yeah, and it's like so it's not it's not him that's you know owning this woman and taking her inheritance, it's the other way around. And he, I do think he loves her in his own weird ownership way, you know, and when he gets mad and he throws the table, like he has moments of this is a real person with real feelings and what's really happening. He's just a pretentious prick, you know what I mean? Like, but he plays that of the that's the the environment that he's grown up in, that's who he is to his core. And Billy, I think, just plays it like so well where it's not over the top, but it's just enough where you see it, you know, and you can feel that that's that it feels authentically real. He could easily be that pretentious, you know, twirling his mustache villain, but he's not like he he pulls back a little bit on it, you know. And I and that that scene when he's standing at the boat and the guy comes up to him and says, Yeah, she's with him right now on the other side of the boat. And he's and the guy says, Don't we have an arrangement? And he can't leave knowing that that that you know that he can't have her. Like it he literally walks away from a a seat on a boat to get off the sinking ship. Like it's there's there's moments of the actual, you know, there's a person there. And I yeah, and and I think he gets I don't I think it's Oscar worthy, I think it's that good. I think it was he was the best of the year. You know, I thought I think he kills it. There's other movies that I've seen him in that you don't see this side of him. Even other movies when he plays a bad guy. I introduced you to one of his not too long ago. We were watching over at grandma's house. Do you remember the name of that? I can't remember where he took over that woman's boat, right? And some crazy, awesome 90s thriller movie. But he's great in that as a real bad guy. But in the you see now, and when you see them there and you see him in this, you're like, Well, this guy's got depth to him that he brings to this role. That I really do think it's overshadowed a lot. That people they they think about everything else too much and they pass over this as oh, this is a pretentious bad guy. You know, he's not even not really some people say it's annoying. And I I don't know, I just disagree. I I don't think this movie has that emotional punch when it comes down to their relationship without him being that other part of it personally, but that's you know, with that said, to me, the weakest performance of the movie, which is still good performance, but the one that just kind of is like there is his is his bodyguard guy. This what's his name? Is they called him his spincer lovej or whatever. It's a weird name, you know. It's like a and this guy is just kind of what is he? An ex-cop that's just like a thug, like that works for him. You must pay him good because this guy acts like he owes him his life. Yeah, you know, like I would have been on that boat. You want to go get her? Fine. See, I'm gonna sit down. You know what I mean? He follows him like in and to his death, basically. And it's like that's that guy is who is that guy? I don't know if there's any character that falls short for me, it's him because I could he's and he's fun and he serves it right, and he's a great, it's a great guy when they're running away from him in the boat, which is one of my favorite scenes in the movie, which I'll get to later. But him himself, though, there's really not much there. You know, I don't really understand that guy, what he's all about. That could have been just some guy. It didn't need to be this guy that was some mysterious used to be a cop, now he's a thug. You know what I mean? It's like it kind of adds to that bad guy part of it that makes you go, that's maybe not feel necessary, but it's it doesn't hurt the movie at all.

SPEAKER_03 1:46:35

But I I agree with you, Billy Zane, he's he's a he's a good actor. I don't I think I've seen him in something else other than this, but I don't recall. Uh I um I had the privilege of meeting him at a comic convention two years ago. Yeah. And it was it's funny. I I I went there, and you know, when when we prepare to go to these comic conventions, we have like five people we want to actually see, get autographs, do the whole 90 yards thing, and all that. And he was just sitting, I think his wife was next to him, so I believe she's an actress too, right? I'm I'm not sure who he's married to, but I'm not sure. I I thought that was his wife next to him, but anyways, um he's just sitting at this table and there's a big Titanic sign or the the poster right there, and then it has his name. And I'm thinking, who is that again? And I see him, I'm like, he looks just like he did in the movie. There's a little silver in his hair, still looks handsome, still just sitting there, and he is so sweet to talk to. All I did was just say hi because I'm not like a super, super fan, but you know, I appreciate his work, and I just said hi. And he he would be someone that would be really cool to meet for you. Oh, I would have loved, I would have told him right now.

SPEAKER_06 1:47:40

I would have been like, sir, you should have got an Oscar for that role. I would have made sure he understood that I I see how good you did there. Like, yeah. Because I think I think he is proud of it, but no one, you know. Mm-hmm. And no one really knows him in other than this. He doesn't do a lot of stuff, truthfully. He hasn't been in a ton of things, you know. So his other best role is in Tombstone with Kurt Russell. And he plays an actor in there that gets murdered by one of the cowboy clan guys. And he's just he's just really good at it. Like he's the guy's a great, a great actor. So yeah, and he casting, like to me, it kind of brings me to like we kind of talked, like mom had already said, some of the casting wins, you know, the ones that really stand out to me is I like the guy who they cast as not only the captain, but I like the the first officer and the second officer. Yeah. I think those guys were casted real well, very believable. And same with the um Ismay there, the guy who was the white star line, their their like uh advertisement guy. Um and the guy who built the ship. Yeah, yeah. I like that guy. Yeah, we even gave him his Irish accent because it was built in Ireland, so he would be an Irish guy that was running the whole thing. And yeah, yeah, I like I think those all casted real well.

SPEAKER_03 1:48:49

Yeah. Yeah, he was so good. And to go back to what you were talking about, mom. I know you'll you'll elaborate a little bit more on this, but uh, Kathy Bates, she she is a steam sealer, like she was so good at this. It's it's hard for me to picture, and she would have done a fantastic job had it all worked out in her favor. But Reba McIntyre was up for that role. And then she had to turn it down because of a scheduling conflict with her band and going on tour, which ultimately that was a rough year for her, anyways, Reba McIntyre.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:20

Her band was killed in that plane crash. That probably wouldn't have happened if she'd been on that movie set. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:49:29

Yeah, yeah. But ri regardless of what happens I didn't know that. Well to poor Reba there. Uh Kathy Bates, what an actress.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:41

And everything she does.

SPEAKER_03 1:49:42

I can't picture anyone else doing that.

SPEAKER_06 1:49:43

Me either.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:44

No, no, the unsinkable Molly Brown.

SPEAKER_06 1:49:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:47

Yeah. No, she's she's and I wonder if that was a real that was a real person.

SPEAKER_06 1:49:51

It was.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:52

Yeah. So yeah. I bet she was quite the hoot.

SPEAKER_06 1:49:54

That was her second ship she was on that sank.

SPEAKER_08 1:49:56

That she's oh, man.

SPEAKER_06 1:49:58

Yeah, the other one had a lot. More help that you know wasn't as dire as the Titanic. That's how she got that nickname. Oh wow.

SPEAKER_08 1:50:06

Well, I wonder if she ever went out again. I bet she did.

SPEAKER_06 1:50:09

I don't, I probably not. I think I would not. I wouldn't get the pond.

SPEAKER_09 1:50:14

No.

SPEAKER_06 1:50:15

Don't even give me a rowboat.

SPEAKER_09 1:50:18

No.

SPEAKER_06 1:50:18

It's all with water. Yeah, and that actually is another unique fact about the Titanic. You know, it was never, it was the movie does do this and it's not correct, but it was never advertised as unsinkable. All the times they talked about it in the movie would say, Oh, it's unsinkable, it'll never sink and it's in the paper and all that. It's not that's actually not true. It was never advertised that way.

SPEAKER_03 1:50:37

So answer me this then. If it wasn't advertised that way, was the saying even God couldn't sink the ship, was that purely in the movie? That's made me have a really big change of thought there. Wow, because problem is like don't mess with God, y'all. But anyways.

SPEAKER_06 1:50:54

I mean, they there was the consensus was I mean, look at this thing, it's not gonna sing. But it was never, it wasn't like the deal they made it sound. That's that's very just dram dramatized for the film. Yeah. But that but she's I couldn't imagine her playing anyone else playing that. But the fact that she gives Jack the clothes from her son, like to wear it, that it's perfect. Yeah, and she gets him because she comes from nothing first, yeah, and then earned her money.

SPEAKER_08 1:51:21

She's new money, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:51:22

That's right. She's new money.

SPEAKER_08 1:51:24

That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:51:26

She's different, she's new money.

SPEAKER_03 1:51:27

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, all the ladies are like, let's stand up and leave because she's coming. She'll be like, Oh, I need the gossip, we'll go outside and talk then. Can't get rid of her. Who wanna get rid of Kathy Bates? Oh my gosh. Yeah. I'm like, what? Those ladies are crazy. Um, any casting wins of all of them or any misses that you feel like with?

SPEAKER_06 1:51:50

No, I think that I can't think of one person in this movie that was miscast.

SPEAKER_08 1:51:55

No, me either.

SPEAKER_06 1:51:56

You know, I write down to the guys playing the music to the old people that are.

SPEAKER_08 1:52:01

I love the orchestra people. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:52:04

Yeah, it's like it I think everybody had their role and they knew what what to do. Um, I've not I have never been a big Leo Nardo DiCaprio fan until recent. So, like to me, this I I say this and I don't mean it. Like, I've always been kind of like, yeah, anyone could have played Jack, but I don't think that's true. I think he needed to play that role, and I think it's a good role for him. Um, I just didn't become a Leo fan until his later movies. There's a mid part of his time there. I'm just like, yeah, I don't really care about what you do, buddy. But his as he's gotten older, he's made better choices about his films. And to me, they're he's a much better actor. Um, so it's so to me, and same with her. I don't really know her that well, honestly, at the time, you know, and but obviously now seeing it like this, it's like their their their chemistry together is fantastic, you know, and they've kept a relationship, like a friendship, you know, this whole time. So but I can't think of any I can't think of anyone that was Miss Cass.

SPEAKER_03 1:53:07

Yeah. No, I I this is this is that good of a movie, guys. Uh if for some crazy reason, if you're listening to this or watching us on YouTube and you haven't seen this movie, you can't be you better go and watch it. It's on Paramount Plus right now as we speak. So um And any naysayers are, oh, it's just a lot get over yourself.

SPEAKER_04 1:53:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:53:30

It's just it's more than that, you know. And then and it's if it is the love story, really. If you're gonna come down on it like that, then hey, I mean, there's nothing wrong with that. Even casting down to the guy at the end, the one who was it, the third officer or whatever, who was the you calling out for anybody alive out there, it's Mr. Fantastic itself. It's like it's the guy comes out of nowhere, right? Like it's yeah. I'm like, holy smokes, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:53:53

Reed Richards is here. I'm just kidding.

SPEAKER_06 1:53:55

I'm glad Reba didn't play their role. You know, she needed to. I like during Tremors. That's where she that's her, that's more her style, not this. I like there with a gun shooting worms underground, giant dinosaur worms. She don't need to be on a boat that's sinking.

SPEAKER_02 1:54:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:54:14

Well, we'll review that movie sometime, yeah. Because that was that's a good movie. But yeah, yeah, I it you know it's funny. I don't think for me, I'm a Reba fan, anyways, myself. I love her music and things like that. And we've been to one of her concerts before, you and I, mom. Um, I I wouldn't have been like upset if she was in it, but Kathy Bates, I'm glad that that was who they got. Yeah, that was so good.

SPEAKER_08 1:54:36

Yeah, you listed all these people they were looking at, but all in all, they chose the best.

SPEAKER_03 1:54:41

Yeah, they did. It yeah, it worked out for them. Yeah, yeah. All right, so um, before we move on to the directing style, is there anything, and Ike you might have a little bit more in tune to this, knowing a little bit more of the history of the Titanic itself, but is there any missed opportunities or waste of potential you feel like they could have done in this movie differently?

SPEAKER_06 1:55:00

No, you know what? I don't have anything for this. And I'm and why I say that is because even though there's a there's a few other little tidbits that they did wrong or got wrong, but I don't feel like they needed to get them right either. You know? Um it it's I I don't have anything because it's hard to find any time there's any moment in this film that I might sit back and say, you know, that could do without that. I go, yeah, but then it wouldn't be this, you know, and that's the problem with this movie. You know, it's not the problem, but like is that it all the moments are worth it in the long run. When you get to the end, you don't feel like you wasted any time, you know. And yeah, I would say if there was 10 minutes more stuff, it may have been too long. I think this movie hits that mark like almost dead on.

SPEAKER_04 1:55:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:55:47

When some movies you could go 10 more minutes. Like I could have went 10 more minutes with Shawshank. You could have given me 10 more minutes, I would have been fine with that. With this, though, it's like, no, that's perfect right there, you know. But it also has that kind of ending though.

SPEAKER_09 1:56:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:56:00

Where it ends in a moment of like this, that's an ending. And that's something I love about this movie is I like snappy endings, I like endings that there's like a bow tied on it, you know. And sometimes they end quick, or just when she comes, it comes around the corner and you see them all there, and Jack's there, and the camera spirals up to the light, and then boom, it just ends. Like, yes, that's how this movie needs to end right there. You know what I mean? And I think that that's that's yeah, I there's nothing I can think of. I mean, yeah, even though there's a like I said, there's a couple things I'll mention as we go through that they did they did wrong with something or what they shouldn't have done, but like it's not necessarily changes the movie at all, though. Like it makes it worth it, you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:56:40

Yeah, exactly. Because I think overall this movie did a great job of portraying the Titanic and showing off what happened to it enough where if there's one or two little details on how exactly it broke down or how it was supposed to look on this part versus another, that's very overshadowed and kind of insignificant compared to the movie at large of what you saw. Yeah, there wasn't like such a drastic change to the boat of the Titanic where people would have been a little upset over. No, no, no, no, no. Yeah, yeah. Um, all right, so let's move on to the direction of the production of this film. Um, mom, what did you think of James Cameron's direction style and his vision for this film?

SPEAKER_08 1:57:21

Oh, I thought it was great. He mixed the historical size, the beauty of the boat with a love story he made up to go along with her. Someone made up to go along with it. I thought it was a good mix. It kept it gave you historically gave you that feel of seeing that ship personally. And then you fall in love with the movie, the the what's going on in on the boat, you know. It's kind of cool, cool. Church scene, you know, their dinner scenes, the music, all the wood. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:57:55

Pays attention to detail is astounding.

SPEAKER_08 1:58:00

Yeah. When that boat is sinking or making its plunging and all the dishes and stuff come tumbling down. You're getting to see patterns and you know how beautiful that boat was. And they said it was that beautiful. So I thought it did a great job. I mean, I don't think there's anything about the movie that I would change. I can watch it right now again, like I did the first time. And I love the soundtrack.

SPEAKER_03 1:58:29

Oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:58:30

It's got beautiful music to it.

SPEAKER_03 1:58:32

Oh, yeah. Well, that's that's one of our next next coming up uh spots. Uh Ike, what did you think of James Cameron's direction?

SPEAKER_06 1:58:39

Yeah, I I I echo everything mom just said. I mean, Utah, this is one of the best filmmakers of all time. I mean, Terminator, Terminator 2, you know, the abyss. You know, this guy's made great stuff. I just wish he'd stop making these avatar movies. Like, I mean, I I'm not I just I get people love him. I understand it. I know I I just I want I want I want James Cameron to do something that's not blue aliens, you know, like come back and do something new and inventive. And like I know he's doing that with those movies too, but they're just oh man. I don't know. I just you're wasting your time, sir. Like you make some amazing movies. Like, don't make your last 10 years of your life be 10 Avatar movies. Like, give us another Titanic of some sorts, you know. Like I want to see him do some space shuttle, like uh disaster, or or just or just something. I don't know. Like this guy's went from killer robots to aliens underwater to you know to Titanic to now 10 movies of Avatar, which is the same thing over and over again. It's it's Ferngully and Pocahontas. I mean all over and over again. You know, it's like I I get it. I I'm not a lover of those movies, obviously. But like I just wish he'd come back and really do something blow our minds. Like, with all the stuff we I'd love to see him do a movie about the events of 9-11. Could you imagine a James Cameron movie about I mean, why not? Like I just enough footage. Oh gosh, he yeah, there's so much you could use accuracy, you know. Yeah, and or just just the in the the things that happened during that, you know. That yeah, I think that would be I mean, yeah, that's how I'd feel about it. Yeah, this movie, this movie makes me feel sad. I feel like we've lost a director to a genre, you know, unfortunately.

SPEAKER_03 2:00:26

So yeah, well, the cinematography and the visuals of this movie, so good. Yeah. I mean, I didn't even realize that until we did that history breakdown, the beginning of this, that not only did he visit the wreckage of the ship in production of this movie to get as much accuracy, but he used any footage they were able to get from underwater and incorporated it into the movie. So for the whole world, that was the first time they were seeing some people, yeah, the actual Titanic itself, you know, and then it's so great for the accuracy of it. He used what he saw there and repurposed it into this is how would have I would have imagined it looked like, you know, the wasn't underwater and it was upright, and you know, back in 1912 and everything. It was something, and then I didn't know he could draw so well, I didn't know that was him drawing that stuff. That is this guy he's a talented fella. Holy smokes! Like I have a whole other uh level of respect for you, sir. That is amazing. Yeah, just get away from Avatar.

SPEAKER_06 2:01:36

You imagine a Marvel movie by him?

SPEAKER_09 2:01:38

Oh boy, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:01:40

Anyways. Um, so yeah, the um the action and the editing quality, very good. I think that I I feel like I could speak for all of us to say that held up really well for the time, right?

SPEAKER_06 2:01:56

Yeah, oh no, absolutely. Um the the when you talk about the visual cinematography action and CG, I'm gonna bunch it all into one. It he brought the boat to life. Like, I don't know about you guys, but I feel like the boat's a character when you're watching it, right? It almost feels like there's times where you're in love with the boat, and then there's times where the boat kind of feels like a killer that's about to kill them all. You know what I mean? Like the boat gets scary at some point, obviously because it's sinking and all that, but you realize how you know it it does become that thing that's like a you know, like a slasher kind of movie kind of feel to it, you know. Like I don't know how to explain that, but he does a great job at making that boat feel like this story's taking place on this thing, but you almost think you're living on you're on something living. Like the boat is almost like a character of its own just because they're there. All these big shots of it going through the water and the gliding stuff, and all that and all the shots of while it's sinking, it's you are you're invested in that character of the vessel itself. Yeah, you know, and it and and it turns on you like it does the people, you know, like in that way. You know, it's it's kind of like its own, it's kind of the real villain of the movie, to be honest, you know.

SPEAKER_09 2:03:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:03:11

And the CGI for whatever CGI they did use of this movie, which obviously there is some, it's dated a little, but it's but it it works.

SPEAKER_05 2:03:20

Yeah, it's fine. It's not dated to the point where you're like, that's awful.

SPEAKER_03 2:03:23

Yeah, it's not unwatchable. It's still because you know what's happening, and you're just in the heat of the moment there for whenever they do use the CGI for the people, the falling, the debris, things like that.

SPEAKER_09 2:03:33

Right, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:03:35

I'd say the CGI at night still holds up way better, though. Like the daytime shots of the CGI, you can be like, eh, it looks a little Lord of the Rings kind of it holds up, but it is you can tell it's a little dated. But all the night stuff, I think it looks like it's it's almost like they made it late, like today.

SPEAKER_09 2:03:52

Huh.

SPEAKER_06 2:03:52

You know, to me, I feel like the CGI at night holds up real well.

SPEAKER_03 2:03:57

Yeah. All right, so mom, why don't you talk to us a little bit about you mentioned it before, the score and the music of the movie?

SPEAKER_08 2:04:04

I'm having I'm so sleepy, guys. I'm sorry. It's been a long day. So I'm yawning. What like I said, just it's this beautiful, beautiful orchestra. You know, I don't know who wrote the the music for it, but they did a great job.

SPEAKER_06 2:04:19

Yeah, James Horner is the same who did uh like Braveheart.

SPEAKER_08 2:04:23

Oh yeah, and when the ship is sinking, that music that they're playing, who you I mean you can feel your heart race. You feel like you're in getting wet, you know, from the yeah, so yeah. And I love the uh when you talk about music, I love the the players and they kept playing. To me, those are some of the best scenes.

SPEAKER_03 2:04:44

So yeah, yep, yep. Yeah, yeah. No, and I I agree with you. I echo that the the theme song that uh in in its own has become like career defining for Celine Dion, and that she did that whole song in one take when she got into the studio. She just did it one time and they said, That's it, we don't need any more takes. That was perfect. It was just and just the instrumental, even uh of course, beautiful words, all that stuff, and she did a great job, but that instrumental playing throughout the whole film. Oh, it there's just some emotions there and feelings in you. You listen to that, it's like I could that could be a soundtrack of our life. It's so good.

SPEAKER_06 2:05:24

Well, it feels meant to be. Yes, like when you think Titanic, it's like, oh, that's that's what it sounded like, right? Like it's almost like it was like playing all the time, right? Like, yeah, yeah, it yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_03 2:05:35

Oh, yeah. All right, so we're gonna go on to some hot takes of the film, and I'll let Ike start off with his, then we'll work our way over to me.

SPEAKER_06 2:05:44

Yeah, I got a couple I want to get your guys' opinion on. So uh is it just me, or do you guys think Rose dies at the end? What do you how do you interpret this?

SPEAKER_08 2:05:55

Oh, I don't think she dies.

SPEAKER_06 2:05:56

You always like you as a big thing.

SPEAKER_08 2:05:57

Well, she's 101, so she's not gonna be around much longer, anyways. But I never thought when she fell asleep that too she was dying.

SPEAKER_06 2:06:05

I always thought it was her dying.

SPEAKER_08 2:06:06

Yeah, that's funny.

SPEAKER_06 2:06:07

I've heard other people say that, but I I did never I I take it as like they pan across the thing. You see, she did all these things that he told her, yeah, promised me you did how they talked about riding the horse. You see all these things they talked about, have kids, meet somebody. She did all that stuff, and you know, she kind of closes her eyes in the bed. I feel like that her dreaming about going there, when you if you notice when she's there, everyone she sees is people that's dead that died when they were there. Like they all look like they did when they were on the Titanic when they died. They're all and there he is at the top of the stairs, young.

SPEAKER_08 2:06:43

I never saw that.

SPEAKER_06 2:06:44

And I and it's like she reaches her hand out, and here she is, young like him, almost like when she died, she went back to the happiest part of her life, and that's like where she went to be. Like she's meant to be with him in that sense, in that in that era area, that's where she's chosen to be in a way. I've always interpreted it as that's her passing away on that boat.

SPEAKER_08 2:07:02

That's funny.

SPEAKER_03 2:07:03

I never thought about it that way, but I can easily see that that makes sense why she's in the wedding dress because she wanted to marry him. That's right. And yeah, they look exactly like they did. It's all back to her right where how they looked when they passed away when they died on that boat. It also could be just a dream that she's always had to. So I could see that part, but I I can agree with you there. I think that's a that's a pretty good hot take or a pretty good opinion on that.

SPEAKER_06 2:07:26

Probably my biggest hot take though is I don't think I think Jack had to die. Oh not just historically, because it doesn't matter. I don't care if they change little things here and there, but Jack had to die. Um, I don't think their relationship would have worked. I I I think this movie isn't as much about her falling in love with the wrong person or being with the right or wrong person as it is about her her having to be her own person. Yes. And she wasn't gonna be happy with Kale, because Cal's Cal, right? She'd been fine with him, he'd have taken care of her his whole life. I mean, she'd have never gone without. But the first weekend that her and Jack sleep under a bridge because he has no money is a different story. It's romantic now, but it's not later. I don't think that that lasts the way she thinks it lasts in her head. I think that they could find- He was an escape 100%. And and it it I'm not saying they would have hated each other, I'm not saying they weren't good for each other. There wouldn't have been some real heavy, hot romance there for sure, but her life would not have been the same.

SPEAKER_08 2:08:33

No.

SPEAKER_06 2:08:34

And you can't take her that young age going from living rich her whole life to now living with a guy who's literally, like he said, I was sleeping on a park bench the other day. Like, what's there for her, you know? Not that I understand love has no boundaries. Okay, I get it. But guys, let's all be realistic here. You know, the the first night that they're sleeping in some cold park bench, you know, and they and after they survived the Titanic, she's gonna be, when are you gonna get your shit together, Jack? Like get a job. You know, and he's not gonna be like that. Do you think he's gonna change his life as a as a guy who's a nomad that he loves this? You know, she'd have to fall in love with his lifestyle, not just him. Yeah. And she fell in love with him for sure. But his lifestyle is not what she's ready for. She he had to be.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:19

No, and at the end, when she he's looking for her, when Cal's looking for her on the boat and and they said not to come here, this is where steerage is. Um that would have been her opportunity to have turned and said, uh, I made it.

SPEAKER_06 2:09:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:34

She knew then.

SPEAKER_06 2:09:36

She couldn't be with either of them.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:38

No, she knew then she had to be her.

SPEAKER_06 2:09:40

That's right.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:40

For the first time. Yep. Not even with mom. Yep. And she didn't want to be the responsibility, yep, have the responsibility of making her mom's life better even.

SPEAKER_09 2:09:48

That's right. Yep.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:49

So uh she she that once she lets go of him and knows he's dead, I think she knew that.

SPEAKER_06 2:09:56

Yeah, this movie's more about her independence than it is the actual.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:59

Breaking free of the chains of that whole relationship. Yep. Because she could have, if she just wanted life to be comfortable.

SPEAKER_06 2:10:06

She was fine with Kale. Sheep, she could have. She would have been fine with him. But she hid. Because she had a side of her too that was just as pretentious. Yeah. You heard her. She had all these paintings she's buying. She she had a part of her that was like, you don't just walk away from that easily just because you feel you it's romantic at first. Yeah, but then reality hits and you still want a little bit of the way you want to live, which is what she got in the long run. Met a nice man, had a bunch of kids, lived her life happier. She learned not to be pretentious, but she also learned that you need to be somebody and not, you know, not Jack either. You know what I mean? Like in yeah, that's that's a very good hot take, actually.

SPEAKER_03 2:10:42

I I really agree with that. It's sad that he dies, but he needed it. Yeah, and I know the biggest internet hot take is oh, there was room for him on that that uh what was it, that door yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:10:54

You know what's funny? They actually did a documentary, not too long. Cameron himself did the documentary where they recreated the whole thing like they did on set. And could have Jack actually have been on the door. They actually did a whole it's a whole hour-long special on HBO. And and they and he still would have died. On actually, she would have had she may have died as well. Like they you had the same thing that she had a life vest on, he didn't, you know. If he was on the door, she would have a percentage of her body would have been in the water, and the fact that she lived is because she was out of the water, which I mean that's that's what kept her alive. Yep. So he he was right by not getting on the door with her. Like in the size of the door and the way they they even use the same prop and everything, the weights and everything. You have to say that two people that were almost identical to their size. You should watch it, you'd be fast. James Cameron does all because he's like, let's give an answer to this once and for all. Yeah, the truth is he still would have died, and she probably would have died too. But she definitely lives if he's not on the door. So, no, guys, Jack can't fit on the door. That's the final answer right there. I know when they Ask Leo, he says, no, no comment.

SPEAKER_01 2:12:01

They ask K2.

SPEAKER_03 2:12:02

They're like, you could have scooched over, right? And she doesn't, she's like, How do I answer this?

SPEAKER_06 2:12:09

No, there is a science to it. Believe it or not, out of all the people that went into that water, only three survived out of the hundreds that went in. And the three that survived were mostly out of the water. That's just the truth, right there. Like, yeah, crazy as that is. So that is that is. Do you have a hot take, Mom?

SPEAKER_08 2:12:28

No, not really. No. Everything you say said, you know.

SPEAKER_03 2:12:31

Yep.

SPEAKER_08 2:12:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:12:32

Yeah. I don't really have one either. I my my hot take actually was gonna be about the the comments of it being unsinkable and all that, but since that's been disproven throughout this this segment, I really don't have a leg to stand on on that. The only thing I'll say hot take about the movie for people who think that is real, and when they make the the the claim that even God himself couldn't sink this ship, I warn you not to challenge God that way. Just it doesn't usually end well for you. Whether you believe or not, he has a way of letting you know. That boat was so doomed. Like it's just yeah, be like, oh no, I wouldn't have gone on if that was a slow boat, be like, nope, sorry, you are you've cursed this boat now.

SPEAKER_06 2:13:14

Yeah, what's even more amazing is if they'd just hit the iceberg head on, they would have survived. And there were they figured about 30 or fifty fifty to eighty people would have died because it would have been the the people that work on the boat would have been sleeping in the front parts and that would have crushed in. So you probably would have lost the there would have been loss of life, but it the boat would have just it just it was made to do that. Yep. And come to find out, it was like five compartments of Titanic could fill of water and it would still stay afloat, but that sixth one is what did it, and the two holes the size of a piece of paper is what doomed that ship in three hours.

SPEAKER_03 2:13:52

Yep. Isn't that amazing? During my research, I read that to mamas. I'm like, did you know that if it had just not turned, it probably would have been okay? Like, yeah, people would have died because you're hitting an iceberg, but like it wouldn't have broken, sunk all those thousands upon thousands of people that are on that ship, like they'll have been rescued, yeah. Yeah, they've just been sitting there until a boat came forward to be able to take them away, you know?

SPEAKER_06 2:14:17

Like it's with that said, uh they say it's still pretty amazing how fast they did turn. So if you think about it, they were they were literally feet away from so that's a good possibly nothing happening, you know.

SPEAKER_03 2:14:29

Was that true too in the movie in real life that they fired up that last boiler when they didn't need to to try to make time? No. That was all in the movie. Yeah. Okay.

SPEAKER_06 2:14:42

I'll bring it up as I got it as my least best the least best scene.

SPEAKER_03 2:14:45

Okay. All right, all right.

SPEAKER_06 2:14:46

Yeah, I'll I'll save that then until there was no there was no pressure on being early. It was all okay it's it's a lot of that's dramatic too, but unfortunately.

SPEAKER_09 2:14:56

Okay.

SPEAKER_06 2:14:56

Made for good in the movie. I wouldn't change it because the movie's good with it, but real life, it was this just they were just moving along. Well, what is true though is they did ignore some iceberg warnings, but that wasn't uncommon though, either. Like a lot of them see, yeah, well, we don't see it. And and that's just it. They they relied you gotta think back then there was no radar, you know. Right. There's this is people just telling you, hey, look, we went by a bunch of icebergs, watch out. Yeah, that's really all it was. You got typed out in Morse code, yeah. And and then it was two guys up in a little tower nest in the middle of the cold, look looking, you know, and they didn't have binoculars. They left port with them still locked in the locker in the case in in uh onshore. So if they had binoculars, they may have been able to see it. But what's interesting about that night is it was a new moon and it was calm and it was ice cold. And yeah, I if you've ever been driving down a road, it's the best way to explain to everybody when it's really hot out and you come up over a hill and you you can see far away, you ever see that shimmer of the heat coming up off the road? Yeah, and it's almost like it looks like water. Yeah. So that that same mirage happens with water and when it's really cold. So when they you gotta think when these guys are sitting up in this nest looking out into the Pacific or into the Atlantic Ocean, looking for icebergs, at a certain distance away, the water and the sky and what they're looking at is a mirage, and they don't see anything when it's right there. So this iceberg comes out of nowhere because they come out of like if you're just going down the road and you see that little mirage and all of a sudden there's something behind it. That's exactly what happened to them. Or they would have seen it earlier and still had turned because they still could have seen that thing, even you know, the icebergs do show up in pitch dark. They there's a there's like a darker silhouette, there's a light that comes off of them. The icebergs are weird, you know. They they are you can see them kind of well, but not that night. That night was so oddly calm that you you'd hear the water. There's a lot of different things that went into why it looked that looked that way. When you look out and you you can't tell what you're looking at, or they didn't realize that what they were looking at. You know, it's and it's the same thing that happened with the the not the Carpathia, but there's another boat. I can't remember the exact name of it. I think I wrote it down, but there was a boat that was in eyesight of the Titanic after it hit the iceberg, which means they could have got there and gotten everybody off onto their boat, but they couldn't see it. All they saw were the lights of the white lights that they're shooting off as fireworks. And they said, Oh, that must be a luxury liner that's having a party. So then they look in their binoculars and they don't see it on the horizon. So they don't see it sinking on the horizon because of that mirage effect that's going on. Wow. Yeah, they were doomed. That was there was just something was faded for that to just not work out. Like as crazy as that sounds. Oh man. I go deep, guys. I was doing so many podcasts on tight end.

SPEAKER_03 2:18:00

All right. So this this next part, guys, we're gonna list some of our favorite scenes. If you want to list the other two, that's fine. But uh, mom, do you have one that sticks out to you? We probably have a lot of the same ones.

SPEAKER_08 2:18:12

Yeah, yeah. I mean, there was yo from him winning the ticket. I just thought that was a good, that poker game thing. I thought that was a cool. Um just the image of the boat with the music if as they scanned through it, those every time they did that, I would you the dolphins when the they're out there. The ones people love where they're think they're you know flying. I never was that impressed with that. But yeah, it's a little overrated.

SPEAKER_07 2:18:39

Some of the um the like the one of them um having a jiggle.

SPEAKER_08 2:18:47

Yeah, the dance, the dance, the dance scene.

SPEAKER_03 2:18:49

That was one of Dan's favorite scenes.

SPEAKER_08 2:18:51

It was the favorite, his favorite. He loved that was his favorite part, yeah, because he loved that kind of stuff anyways. The music and Irish dance and um more primitive and native to you know, particular heritage. He he thought that he would he liked that part. I loved um when one of my I chuckle every time I see it when um uh Rose lands in that helicopter and they unload all that luggage and they hand the fish tank and the fishbowl. Oh yeah. I just I mean she brought her whole life, she brought her whole life with her and she was the the dog, the little Pomeranian and the fish tank, the the bull with the fish and the you know. I love that I love that the set scene I loved, you know. It's like wow, that's pretty cool.

SPEAKER_07 2:19:40

Yeah, that yeah, that is.

SPEAKER_08 2:19:41

Um and I I have you can't uh you can't overlook and this whole movie, the costuming is excellent.

SPEAKER_09 2:19:49

Oh man.

SPEAKER_08 2:19:50

Rose's dresses, the women's dresses, the men's tailored suits, the hats. It's all I mean, just right up there. Even the steerage people in the way their little their bonnets and stuff. I mean, the research that was done, I I yeah, it's just so cool.

SPEAKER_03 2:20:09

I I thought was oh, it's above and beyond the detail of all that is insanely good. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Uh I know you're gonna go in more in depth on these, I but I'll just just throw out there my three favorite scenes that came to my mind when I'm writing this down. When Jack meets Rose, I thought that was a really good scene of she she's okay, she's about to jump, and he he just talks to her and tells her basically how stupid you're acting.

SPEAKER_08 2:20:35

And it's funny when we I watched that for like the hundredth time, I fast forward through that.

SPEAKER_06 2:20:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:20:41

I feel the same way.

SPEAKER_06 2:20:43

It's good, it's just it's just whatever. Yeah, it is the weirdest thing.

SPEAKER_08 2:20:46

Yeah, yeah. I'm like, okay, she didn't jump.

SPEAKER_03 2:20:50

Yeah, we are not gonna. My my next one would be when Rose comes to him and she changes her mind and chooses him. Um I know you think that's an overrated scene, that that the one that's on the poster and all that stuff, but I just always interpret that as this is me just enjoying freedom and I'm making my choice to choose what I want, knowing that there's this guy that's gonna be going after her for it. Like, um, I I did like that. And then I'm I shouldn't say it's my favorite scene, but of of scene-wise, um, the ship collapsing when it breaks in two. Oh, it's that one so good. It's it's so tenseful, it's so um sad. It's yeah, it's sad, yeah, terrifying. It's it's the suspense of hearing it and then seeing it, and you're like, oh my gosh, oh my gosh. Like it's um that it's just really well done.

SPEAKER_08 2:21:41

Every time I watch it, that and you get trapped in that.

SPEAKER_03 2:21:45

Yeah, yeah, it's mesmerizing.

SPEAKER_08 2:21:47

Yeah, that sickening feeling it. This this chip. Um, your dad used to joke, we're watching Titanic again tonight. I wonder if the bull won't sing.

SPEAKER_06 2:21:56

I still say that same joke all the time. Yeah, yeah. But this is that moment in that movie where this the chip is like uh it's a killer. Yeah, like it's a slasher movie all of a sudden. You're the thing you've been sleeping on is trying to kill you now. Like, yeah, yeah, yeah. It just makes it scary. Yeah, it's just hang on a couple more hours, you know.

SPEAKER_08 2:22:15

Yeah, how ironic they want a trip to death.

SPEAKER_06 2:22:18

Yeah, literally, yeah. Yeah, yeah. All right, so what are yours? Like I'm gonna go and order for mine. I love the dinner scene when they when they bring Jack to dinner. Oh, that's why just him talking, discuss just you see the difference of the worlds of the people there in a hurry. And this is where once again Billy Zane is so good at he's almost entertained, but yet he still even does see, like, oh, I kind of see what this kid's talking about. Like as pretentious and as much of a bad guy as he is, he, you know, he understands he's not he's not that kind of bad guy, you know. And um, but I just love the dynamic of the how the mother tries to, well, it's a weird weird way to live. And and he just puts it real elegant on how fun life is like that. But there's somewhere in the middle is the best part, right? And that's kind of interesting.

SPEAKER_08 2:23:06

Well, we don't talk much about the mother, but she played a great role.

SPEAKER_06 2:23:10

So good. Yeah, yeah, so good.

SPEAKER_08 2:23:11

Yeah, she was intense and she she made she made it really in a lot of ways. She made the movie, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:23:18

Yeah, well, that's definitely Rose for Rose's motivation of you know, uh definitely part of her journey. Yeah, yeah, for sure. I love whenever we're talking about stuff like this. We have the movie on the side. Oh, yeah, there it is, guys. Yeah, it's exactly there. That's her reminding her. Did you want me to live with him? Yeah, I gotta do things. It's like okay. Acting so good. Yeah, so good for them. Yeah. Um, and the the whole chase scene, when they chase, when he chases them throughout the ship, this was the best time in the probably the only, I'm sure he sat down trying to figure out how to do this, where Cameron was able to really I we need to show the audience that's watching this movie parts of this ship that you normally wouldn't see. Yeah. And this is the best way to do it. So we get to see what the engine room looks like. We get to see where the coal is, where the storage is, where you know, all the first class stuff, all the all the lower class things, because they're running through them and we kind of get to visit it through their eyes, you know. And I I like that is such a great way to put you in those places. Because why else would you be down there and there where they're shoveling coal? You know, you're not gonna be. But if you're running from skim guy and you went to the wrong door, it's you get to see that, oh, that was what's going on in the belly of this shit. Yeah, and then then that opens up the whole other world of what those people went through when that ship started to sink. Yeah, when those doors, those sliding doors come down, you know how many people sat in those things while waiting for the water to fill up while they're in there. Well, some of them burned to death, yeah, or but boiled to death, yeah, scalded to death from the water hitting the fires. Yeah, there's some awful ways that people died in that ship during what all it's all calm up top and it's just slowly going down and the violins are going down, and down below is just hell. You know what I mean? Like it's it's it's when you think about stuff like that, you realize, well, the perspective of where you are and the people up there, oh, what's really going on? They're drinking stuff while the boat's slowly sinking. There's someone burning to death, boiling to death below them. You know, it's it's it's amazing to think about when you're really it's shocking, you know. Like not that they did anything wrong, but you don't think of that when you're watching the movie because the movie does feel so romantic. It's but when you start realizing the reality of it, you're kind of like, oi, this is rough. Like that's rough. Yeah. My other favorite scene is the whole time when from when they see the iceberg to when they hit it. That all that intensity of just the mu that that it's almost like a clock, the music is, and then it's silent when they hit the iceberg and the chunks of it fall on the deck, and you're just and then after they hit it, everyone's like kind of like, what's going on? It's okay, right? And they're like, and you feel that little shudder, you know. Oh yeah. I love that when a captain feels that little shudder and it's like, oh, what's going on?

SPEAKER_08 2:25:55

He knows.

SPEAKER_06 2:25:56

Yep. And then when that guy says, Oh no, it's gonna sink, and he says, So how long, you know, it's like he's like, Oh, two hours. He's like, Two hours. Yeah, you know, it's I think some people are like, Yeah, two hours is a long time. No, it's not. Oh, I'm like, no, it is not. Oh my god. Now when that last half hour comes, you realize two hours is went by real quick. You think about two hours, man. That's you and I do a podcast, it's not two hours long. Yeah, no, well, you know what I mean? Like, this we we talked longer than the Titanic state afloat. Well, yikes. The other ones that stick out to me are mostly shots. Like, I love the shot of when he turns. I kind of brought it up earlier when Cal turns and goes to go after her, you know, and he's upset that she's with Jack. And he walks across the deck and they're shooting the thing off at the same time. Yeah, it's a great sweeping shot where action they called action behind the camera. So when the camera gets there, they're all in motion already. Those are that's the genius of that kind of directing, right? And uh also I love I've all and then that same scene when the guy there, this is male or whatever his name is, when he gets on the boat and he kind of turns, and the the other guy the he puts his hands out, like he looks at him and realizes he's got on and he's just supposed to be women and children, but he just like lets him go. It's just as he starts to do the hand thing, the music kind of hits. Yeah, what a great scene that is, you know, because the guy's terrified, right? He's terrified. I don't I don't I anyone that does something like that, you could all be like, oh a coward. It's like, yeah, I don't know, man. Put yourself in his shoe. It's like that's I'd be scared to death, too. Uh yeah, that would that would really scare the hell out of me. And I always liked that scene of when they're climbing the boat after it, like when they're before it breaks, and they're kind of climbing up the boat that where that pastor he's holding on to the thing, and they're all like holding on to each other and he's praying with them. You just think that you know, only three people survived out of the water. You know, all these people probably died. You know what I mean? Like how terrifying last moments of your life. Yeah. And then to be on, let alone being out in the boats when the lights go out. Imagine being on the thing when the lights go out. Whew. Yeah. How scary. Like it just I just those are my favorite scenes, though. I love those, you know. Yeah. Yeah. And I'll I'll start off with the least best one because I know there's not many probably for you guys, right? None for me. I'm gonna say the least best scene only because it's just false straight up not true, is when the Ismail's sitting with the captain having dinner, telling him, wouldn't it be nice if we got there early in the headlines and is it? None of that's true. That's all false. There's that the way that guy was portrayed or doing that isn't isn't accurate. And he Cameron's actually even gone on to go to the family later and apologize to them for making him look that way. But at the time, they thought that's all they knew, that that people thought that that's why that maybe that was part of it. But that's just not none of that's true.

SPEAKER_03 2:28:54

Because they make it sound like in the film that that was the um one of the catalysts of why they weren't able to to turn the boat in time.

SPEAKER_06 2:29:04

Because they're going too fast. Because they're going too fast. They they were going fast. That is, it's true, but it's not true that it was too fast. There's a lot of things that went in there. And they weren't pressured to go too fast. That's why that's where I you bring that up again. Yeah. So there was no, don't you want to go out with a bang? You know, it's like, no, there wasn't none of that. There was none of the egging. They were just making good time. They ignored the iceberg warnings. If if they did anything wrong, that's what they did wrong. But then, like I said, like I explained to you, they that was an impossible night. They just shouldn't have been, God, they should have gone a little more south, you know. They they should have they should have took the iceberg warning seriously and dropped south and come in lower. And they just didn't. You know, they went more north, thinking it was a more direct pass with the way the current was going in the ocean and how everything was all set. It would have been, but that the time of night and the time of day and all that stuff, and being as cold as it was, it just was against them. It just was against them.

SPEAKER_03 2:30:00

All right. So um, I don't know if you have any of this mom. We're we're almost done, guys. We got it just like only two more questions. Yeah. Um, so best villain moment. Anything that the bad guy did that you were like, oh, he either portrayed that scene real well, or that was a really bad thing he did, but it stuck out to you. I could tell you my wrath the bat is when uh Cal uh lied to Jack about the being a boat for him. I was just gonna say not even that because the uh Jack thought Jack's like there's not really an arrangement, is there? And he's like, Oh yeah, there is, just not for you.

SPEAKER_08 2:30:37

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:30:37

And that that's like okay. And that whole thing, like you just said um a couple minutes ago, Ike, about he had his chance to get off the boat, and just knowing that Rose was gonna be with Jack was enough. He he didn't take his own chance. He he'd rather have spend the last minutes that he thought he had going over there to ruin that other man than to let them get away with it.

SPEAKER_07 2:31:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:31:03

Hmm. That's my best villain. And then he still lives. It's it's what he says to him too. He he says, I always win. Yeah. You know, and it's like, and and just the way they both played that with each other. There was no fight, there was no, you know, it was just he just told him straight up that this is that you're gonna lose this battle. That I also love though when he realizes that he left a diamond in the coat. Mm-hmm. And he's like, put the coat on her. Like it's like it's like, oh, you screwed up. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, it's yeah, but that's but it's also, yeah, no, I that's to me, that's his that's the big moment. Because when he says that the jack. That's where the line is crossed.

SPEAKER_08 2:31:41

All of them. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:31:44

Because up until then, you think he's he's just capable of being an ass. But right then, he's capable of letting someone die for his for his own, you know. So he's definitely capable of some bad stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Oh yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:31:57

All right. Here's a fun question. Most punchable face in the movie. Other than other than Kale. No, I'm kidding. If there's anyone in the movie that you were like, oh, he should have like just get a slap or get something, be like, what do you do? Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:32:16

This was tough.

unknown 2:32:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:32:18

There's not a lot of people in this I don't like.

SPEAKER_03 2:32:20

Like you know, or like someone that comes off as annoying. What's nice is some of the people in here that do come off as annoying, they end up getting hit by some of them. Like I I wrote down that the ship crewman towards the end of the film who refused to listen to Rose when she was trying to get help.

SPEAKER_07 2:32:40

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_03 2:32:41

That's a good one. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:32:44

Yeah. Like listen.

SPEAKER_08 2:32:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:32:48

I always thought the guard, the guy, what's his face, Lovejoy. I always thought he needed a good punch to the face in this movie. You know, that and there's that other mustache guy that's at them with the party. He's like, oh, should we retire with our cigars and stuff? Anyone that talks like that too much needs to get away.

SPEAKER_08 2:33:09

He's a big flip opera star.

SPEAKER_06 2:33:10

He is, yeah. Yeah. But he he could have been punched in the face. That'd have been nice. Because sometimes when he talked, it was like, shut your mouth. You know, it's like you just need just the way you guys talk is just, oh my God. And honestly, the mom could use a good punch into the face. You know, she was nasty with her. Just yeah, she's a good old backhander, like Sean Connery style. Like, yeah. Yeah, I'm not saying he needs a punch to the face, but we haven't talked about him yet. Bill Paxson is awesome in this movie.

SPEAKER_02 2:33:42

Yeah, he is. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:33:44

The late great Bill Paxson. It's hard to believe still that he's gone, you know. You twister and all this stuff. I mean, I know it's way off topic, but I just want to I want to make sure we say it. I love Bill Paxon and I think he adds a lot to this being the guy in the beginning, and or the the dude that's looking. For this diamond this whole time. He just adds a credibility to this whole thing that's very believable. You know, and I just I just love him. I just love him a lot. Like, once again, another excellent casting that's just ridiculously random, you know. But yeah, that's that's the best. You're you got the best punchful fan. I say the mom needs a slap. I think Lovejoy could use a punch, but yeah, your guy he didn't get punched. Yeah. Because the other guys that they all do. Everyone that needs it really gets their due. So it's hard to give a punch to someone that, you know. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:34:33

Yeah. Um, all right. One prop you would take home.

SPEAKER_09 2:34:38

Hmm.

SPEAKER_04 2:34:40

I picked a couple.

SPEAKER_03 2:34:41

I I picked two of them as well. So why don't you do one Ike then see what so the obvious one's the diamond, right?

SPEAKER_06 2:34:49

Like everyone would want to bring a be cool. It's a nice diamond. There it is. But I think Jack's sketchbook would be cool.

SPEAKER_03 2:34:56

Oh, okay. All right. One of mine I put was Jack's black pen that he used for sketching. Yeah, yeah. So I didn't pick the actual book, but uh, do you have one on top of your head?

SPEAKER_08 2:35:08

Yeah, Rose's um um thing at furry.

SPEAKER_03 2:35:13

Oh, the butterfly.

SPEAKER_06 2:35:14

Oh, oh, that's such a good one.

SPEAKER_03 2:35:16

I didn't even think of that. Yeah, that that black pen though.

SPEAKER_06 2:35:19

I love that one too. Yeah, yeah. I always thought it'd be cool to have one of the life vests that has the white star line. Well, and the wall.

SPEAKER_03 2:35:29

That'd be cool. Yeah. I I also wrote down the Titanic tick and the ticket, the jack one. Oh, that'd be cool. It's just on that piece of paper, just framed uh the ticket. That'd be cool.

SPEAKER_06 2:35:38

That's cool. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Or a frame picture of the blueprints of the Titanic from when he rolls them out. That'd be cool.

SPEAKER_08 2:35:44

Yeah, that would be. I bet you could get those. I bet you could.

SPEAKER_03 2:35:47

Yeah, I'm sure you could, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:35:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:35:49

Yeah. Oh, right. All right. Um, so the most underrated moment you would say in the movie.

SPEAKER_06 2:35:55

I you know, I don't think I I think everything gets its fair due. I there's nothing that's underrated.

unknown 2:36:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:36:01

I don't think something happens as the people. Um if I had to say anything, uh it would be I think they people don't talk enough about Billy Zane's role. I really am an advocate of how awesome he is in this movie, even though he's that pretentious bad guy. It he really it's captivating sometimes. And uh I and I never felt this way though all the time, but as I've re-watched it over and over again over the years, I've been more, man, this guy's so good. Like it just hits you, so believable, but there's a realness there, there's an understanding there that you get that doesn't make it feel like it's cartoony or over the top, which it easily could be, and it's just not. So I'm always gonna say his role I think is very underrated. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:36:45

Yeah. I didn't really have one. No. How about an overrated one?

SPEAKER_08 2:36:52

Yeah, that at the and bow of the ship. Yep. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:36:56

Where they're it's not that cute.

SPEAKER_08 2:37:00

No.

SPEAKER_06 2:37:01

It's it's a little it's kind of it's kind of cringy.

SPEAKER_07 2:37:05

Oh boy.

SPEAKER_08 2:37:05

I like it better when he and the Italian boy are there.

SPEAKER_06 2:37:08

Or just hanging out. Yeah. And they're like, yeah, they're like, oh, this is awesome.

SPEAKER_08 2:37:12

Yeah, yeah. And they're going to America and we're free. Yeah. I think that's just a little bit over. I mean, we've we've made it that way. It fits well in the movie. It's perfect in the movie. But that got to be a real focal point.

SPEAKER_06 2:37:27

It's one of my favorite transitions from past to present, is when that happens, when she's kissing her and the the camera comes around and shit goes old. Yeah. And you see that the the they kind of almost like they turn into skeletons. It's awesome. But the what comes before that, I'm like, okay, this is cringy.

SPEAKER_08 2:37:45

Every time that happens, because it happens several times in the movie where you see it come to life and go back to death.

SPEAKER_06 2:37:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:37:53

I think that's underrated.

SPEAKER_06 2:37:55

I think that needs to be that just died at the end, though, because there's all anyway.

SPEAKER_08 2:37:59

Well, that could be it's like the reverse of it.

SPEAKER_06 2:38:01

Yeah, I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 2:38:02

Anyways, I'm just going back. That's underrated. That is that it really is.

SPEAKER_08 2:38:07

But that that whole way of doing that was perfect. Because that's actual pictures, and they've it made it fade it in and faded out. So yeah. Genius.

SPEAKER_03 2:38:16

Yep, genius. It is genius, yeah. All right, funniest moment that you would say in spinning.

SPEAKER_06 2:38:22

That is good. Yep, that is good.

SPEAKER_08 2:38:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:38:25

My funniest moment is I love when he's handcuffed to the thing and he's like, okay, do a practice swing. Yeah. He's okay, now do it again. And she misses completely. He's just like, all right, it doesn't matter. It's like we're just ready. It's like I just love that the whole, the whole like she's not good at this. Like it's like there's nothing. They don't have a choice. It's like they're gonna do what they have to do. Yeah. I that to me it is one of the funnier moments in the movie. Yeah. There's not a lot of humor in this movie, but there's enough to chuckle at here and there. Sure. Yeah, and the stuff with Molly, there's moments with her that's funny too.

SPEAKER_08 2:38:56

I like it in when um she's uh describing um they ask, can you tell your story? And she said, Well, it was a long time ago, and the one guy, the the guy there, the he he makes the comment um about if you need more time, she says, Do you really want do you want me to continue telling the story? Yeah, oh yeah. That scene.

SPEAKER_06 2:39:19

The old lady, her little comebacks here and she was good. Yeah, she was good.

SPEAKER_03 2:39:23

Very good. Yeah. All right, most emotional moment.

SPEAKER_06 2:39:27

Oh, geez. I I I know what it is right here. I'm gonna tell you exactly why. The entire montage when they're playing that last song on the boat, when the violins are playing that.

SPEAKER_09 2:39:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:39:40

Why to me is because throughout this whole movie, you're getting through the love story perspective, but when you get to that point, there's not any moment in that when they're playing that music. Do they show Jack and them? They're showing you other people on the boat.

SPEAKER_08 2:39:56

The fate of the people.

SPEAKER_06 2:39:57

Yep. They're showing the the two kids she's put in the bed, the two old people laying in the bed. Yep. You're seeing other people, the people they're dying, the people are falling, everyone's surrounding you that's their reminder of by the way, this fake story we're telling you, this is something that's real. Right down to them guys playing to that moment and that song and everything. Is they want your question?

SPEAKER_08 2:40:20

What's most emotional?

SPEAKER_06 2:40:21

Yeah. It to me that is that that's where Morgan cries every time. She can't handle it. She said when the two old people are holding hands, she blubbers. And then to me, it's like it is. It's just like it is the reminder of look, there's a true story behind this romance that I told you. And they take that moment to show those people in it. Yeah. You know, right right down to like those were real passengers too. Like these were real people that had gone and died. And I mean these kids are laying in bed, she's reading a story to them as the water's rushing in under the door.

SPEAKER_09 2:40:53

Yeah, those are the things.

SPEAKER_06 2:40:54

That's a reality for some of those people, you know. And yeah, or those old people, we can't get off, we're just gonna die here together. Yeah, it's like can you imagine? Like, it's it's in the play with that song during that moment with those guys who don't survive either. Yeah, you know, it's like it's pretty wild if you think about it.

SPEAKER_03 2:41:12

It's pretty wild. I completely agree with you. The only other one I wanted to add to that, because I always was wondering when I was when I was doing my rewatch of this yesterday, I kept thinking, what actually happens to this one character? The one his friend that has the thick accent that's younger.

SPEAKER_06 2:41:29

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:41:30

When the the one of the silos or whatever is when it breaks and falls on him, yeah. That I thought, wow, I I don't know why I've never seen that before.

SPEAKER_06 2:41:41

You know, it's funny, that's a specific detail for this movie, too. That's true. Um that smokestack particular, why that was so weak, is because it's fake. Because Titanic only needed three smokestacks to actually run. But in order for it to look like its sister ship, we needed the four, they put the the other one on there for decoration. So that third one in the back worked, and the two in the front worked, but that middle one before the back one was fake. So it was built differently. So once it started hitting the water and it did break, that's why it broke so easy. So it actually works for the movie, and he put it, that's how they put it in the movie.

SPEAKER_03 2:42:19

Oh, isn't that wild? Yeah. Well, that was just I felt so bad for him because he just lost his friend being a gunshot and all that. I'm like, oh, he might actually survive. No, no, no, no. Yeah, no. It's like a final destination moment right there. I was like, whoa, if the water's not gonna kill you, that's gonna kill you.

SPEAKER_06 2:42:37

The only other glaring thing that's not true in this movie that didn't really happen is the locks on the gates of the lower class to the upper class. Oh that's all made up for the for the movie, too. There were gates and they would close them at night to stop people from wandering around too much, but none of them had locks. They weren't allowed to for that reason. Oh, oh. For the reason they put in the movie. But the movie made it more dramatic because he needs a key and he had so there's a lot, there's a few things they went there that didn't they didn't need to do that, but yeah, they Hollywood Hollywood. Yeah, they gave a little bit of the Hollywood taste, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:43:12

All right, guys, so we're at the final scores of this film. Um, so mom, out of two, what would you rate the story?

SPEAKER_08 2:43:21

Uh one out of two?

SPEAKER_03 2:43:22

Yeah, uh, yeah, out of two, like one or two or one.

SPEAKER_08 2:43:26

Oh, like five. Yeah, I mean it's gotta be one of my top twenty movies that I've watched my whole life. You know? All right, uh maybe uh the maybe it's the in the bottom six. I mean, that's how much I like.

SPEAKER_06 2:43:42

Yeah, it's in my top ten of the best movies ever made.

SPEAKER_03 2:43:45

Yeah, all right, Ike. So out of out of two, you put two? Yeah, I put two. All right, mom, the characters out of two.

SPEAKER_08 2:43:52

Oh, two.

SPEAKER_03 2:43:53

Yeah. Ike? Yeah, two. Yep. Okay. I'm the same by the way for both of those guys. Emotion and stakes, mom. Two. Two all right, I put two as well. Rewatchability and industry impact.

SPEAKER_08 2:44:04

Oh, a hundred times.

SPEAKER_06 2:44:05

Oh, there's no doubt I've seen this movie. I not as many times as I've seen Jaws, but I've seen this movie a lot.

SPEAKER_04 2:44:12

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:44:12

And its impact is bigger than just the movie itself. It's not only is it a story that should be told about the boat itself, but also the stuff invented just to make this movie. Like the feats that they did just to get it done. How do you not give it a two? Like it's impossible to not give it a two. I gave it a one.

SPEAKER_03 2:44:32

In this industry impact is the one. Rewatchability. You struggle rewatching it? Yes. Yeah. It's it's not this because it's long, I could watch a long movie. Avengers end game is three hours long, so I could, but I could watch that over and over again. This there's only so much when I get to that end scene, I'm like, I'm tired of seeing them die like this. So I'm like, I know it happens, but I don't need to relive it every single time. So once is enough for me a year. But that's the reason. No, I hear you. Um, all right. So final scores, uh, mom, out of 10, what would you rate this?

SPEAKER_08 2:45:08

Oh, a 10. Okay. Definitely.

SPEAKER_06 2:45:11

I yeah, this is in my top 10. Maybe if I had to sit down and write a top 10, it might be in a top 15 because there's a lot of good movies, but it's definitely top 15, best movies ever made. I give it a 10 out of 10. All right. I am giving it a 10 out of 10 as well, guys. Yeah. So, which you're gonna hear a lot with these guys because we're we just want to talk about movies we love, anyways. And some movies that we really love, like I'd like to talk these guys into doing Dead Poet Society next. Yeah. And because Sammy has yet to see it. No, he might not like it like we do, which would be good. Actually, I kind of hope he likes it, but I do hope that he has a different work of it. But but yeah, I'd like to hear his take, especially his age and you know how many times we've seen it, because it's a particular kind of movie, right? But but you're gonna hear a lot of tens, guys. So there's no like, what are they gonna say? Like we're only gonna spend time on these breakpoints on with movies on the ones we love, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 2:46:04

Well, and even then, you have to give an objective view on these movies too. And even if like my personal taste, I gave it a one out of two for the rewatchability factor. That doesn't mean it's culturally, it did not impact the movie or movie industry at all. It was big. This is a big deal. This is I mean, I know James Cameron has already had successes with Tomb Raider. Um, sorry, not Tomb Raider. Ha ha terminator and stuff like that. He would, yeah. But this uh, you got a hand to him. This is probably one he's gonna he could hang his hat on, like for for Oh, he still has. I mean, the mind probably still makes all of his movies of ridiculous. All right, so the official Goodell Multiverse score for this film, guys, is 10 out of 10. One final verdict, mom. What would you say is like a uh like a a closing line for for the segment for you? Uh something you want the audience to don't go on a cruise.

SPEAKER_08 2:47:02

Just kidding. Uh life can be shorter than you think. Obviously, those people had no they they thought they were going to America, land of all the opportunity, and they ended up not getting anywhere. So we're all ended up dying in the you just never know what life what you know.

SPEAKER_06 2:47:22

Didn't matter how rich they were, you know.

SPEAKER_08 2:47:23

Money had nothing to do with it. And we've learned that all of you who are watching or listening to this, know you can't buy health and you can't buy l longevity. Uh some of it is just gonna be what it's gonna be. Don't make it making it count. Uh as Jack said it. Yeah. Um every moment make it count.

SPEAKER_09 2:47:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:47:45

That's Jack's. I think that's the best line in the whole thing.

SPEAKER_06 2:47:48

So that's what you said at the dinner table, yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:47:50

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 2:47:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:47:51

All right. What would you say, Ike is your final?

SPEAKER_06 2:47:54

I would say that if you guys haven't seen this movie, I don't know where the hell you've been. So if you're watching our channel talking about movies and you've not seen Titanic, then you need to go do something else.

SPEAKER_08 2:48:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:48:04

You need to go watch this movie. Go watch this movie.

SPEAKER_08 2:48:06

Go, go watch this movie. You're missing out on some really good movies. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:48:10

That's my final line, too, guys, is go and at least give this a one time in your life, watch and let us know in the comments below what you think about this movie, too. And with that said, that concludes the branch point breakdown special that we had with our mother here.

SPEAKER_08 2:48:25

And so So make it count, guys. Make it count.

SPEAKER_06 2:48:28

Make it count. I want to touch on the very end real quick. Okay. Not not when I think she died, because I do think she died. But do you do you guys, do you guys are aware of the deleted scene or the an alternate ending?

SPEAKER_08 2:48:40

Well, I heard it. She jumps.

SPEAKER_06 2:48:42

No, well, she where they they kind of uh corner, they find her before she drops the thing. And there's like this showdown about what to do with it. Okay. Yeah, I don't like that. I'm glad they didn't do that. I like what they did. I like what they did, but I gotta be honest with you, I almost think I would have almost made it where she gave him the thing. That or if I would have changed it, I would have done one of two things. If I would have changed the ending with when it comes down to the actual heart of the ocean thing, I would have had him go back to his office and it's in a wrap thing sitting on his desk. You know, Bill Paxton. And and then, you know, the then end with him smiling while he's holding it and then shows the pictures of her and then she dies. You know what I mean? I'm gonna keep saying it. But or reveal somehow that she sold it and that's how she started her new life. Because her drop it in the water, I get what this whole thing is, this whole the heart of the ocean throwing it in, but I always saw that thing as the as the the uh tie to the thing she was trying to get away from. You know, I didn't see it as the heart of her heart in the ocean, like they kind of made it, like in the movie. I that to me, that was the last gift Cal gave her. That why not use that last gift to actually build your life? Well, she still went and built a life without selling it, but I would have been more impressed if it was just in on someone's you know, dusty shelf somewhere because she got money from it.

SPEAKER_08 2:50:12

You know, you could think deeper than that.

SPEAKER_06 2:50:14

You're right, you're right. There's a deeper part of that.

SPEAKER_08 2:50:16

That that resembled financial wealth.

SPEAKER_09 2:50:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:50:22

This whole movie is based on there was a life without it.

SPEAKER_06 2:50:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:50:27

Well lived with it.

SPEAKER_06 2:50:29

And it is a thing that was in the middle of this whole situation.

SPEAKER_08 2:50:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:50:32

You know, out of everything that was in her pocket, it ended up being there. So I get it, but I I almost would have liked it if she'd given it to him. Yeah. You know.

SPEAKER_08 2:50:40

I remember the first time I watched it, she dropped it. I was in a in a theater and I heard everybody go, no. They all reacted the same way I was thinking. You dropped it. And yes, like, uh, yeah. I think her it resembles a lot of things, but one of them is her true love was in the bottom of that water. And she learned to love who she was without using that, and she gave it back. She learnt a lesson by not using it. So, yeah. It was sad though.

SPEAKER_06 2:51:12

It looked like a beautiful that's always why I still thought.

SPEAKER_08 2:51:16

And that's not true either, right?

SPEAKER_06 2:51:17

There was no there's no that is based off of a real diamond, okay, but it was never on the Titanic. Okay. So, and it wasn't the shape of a heart. Okay. It was just a real big thing.

SPEAKER_08 2:51:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:51:27

But it was supposed to be on the Titanic and it wasn't.

SPEAKER_08 2:51:30

Okay.

SPEAKER_06 2:51:30

So it actually was owned by the Hershey's family from Pennsylvania who were supposed to be on the Titanic.

SPEAKER_09 2:51:36

Ah.

SPEAKER_06 2:51:37

And they never were. Wow. And it didn't because he was sick. And they stayed longer. And they're actually upset about it because they wanted to be on the maiden voyage of the best, best ship in the world. Or we wouldn't have Hershey's.

SPEAKER_08 2:51:50

No, we would not. What?

SPEAKER_06 2:51:51

In the wild.

unknown 2:51:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:51:53

There's a lot of crazy things. Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:51:55

Oh my. So go go check it out. Guys, find out more of those things. We just took the scab off it. There's a whole wound there too.

SPEAKER_06 2:52:04

It was an iceberg, you would say. Yeah. That was just a tip. That was just a tip of the iceberg. But see, that's to me. Like even with her throwing it in the water, it was still they always gave validation to me of why I thought that's why I thought she died. Because it was like it was the the end of it was like this whole culmination of her. The last place she's gonna be is gonna be there, right?

SPEAKER_08 2:52:25

Like I No, every time I watch that, that's what I'm gonna think about. It's gonna go through your head a little bit. Never ever have I thought that.

SPEAKER_06 2:52:30

No?

SPEAKER_08 2:52:31

Never.

SPEAKER_06 2:52:32

The first time I saw as a kid, I thought she died. Isn't that weird?

SPEAKER_08 2:52:35

Oh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:52:36

But I also think Forrest Gump's son at the end of Forrest Gump isn't really his kid, so I think Jenny just doesn't know what to do with her kid because she's dying. And she's gonna she's gonna I mean look what she does to him. She goes she dresses him up like him, puts him in front of the TV and says, Oh, yeah, I even named him Forrest after you.

SPEAKER_09 2:52:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:52:56

It's like so you won't tell this guy he's had a kid for how many six years?

SPEAKER_09 2:52:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:53:00

Like the you want to know the worst, it's not Darth Vader, folks. It's Jenny from Forrest Gump. She's a villain. Look what she does to that man throughout that whole movie. She has a kid with him and doesn't tell him about him for six years. That's because it's not his kid. She's just dying of AIDS, and now Forrest is relevant because he can take care of her problems and he's rich.

SPEAKER_09 2:53:23

Anyways, wait till we get there. We do digress. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 2:53:27

No, but I do get anyway. Yeah, I always thought she died, but yeah, this even as a kid, I was like, wow, I to me it always felt like that.

SPEAKER_08 2:53:38

That's now I'm that's what's gonna be in my mind every time I see it. How funny.

SPEAKER_03 2:53:43

All right. Well, guys, thank you for tuning into this segment of the Godell Multiverse podcast. Why don't you stay tuned? Because we are almost done here. What do we have next, Ike?

SPEAKER_06 2:53:52

Oh, next we're gonna have the retrospective of this guy right here, Doctor Strange, which was probably gonna be a quick one tonight, folks. Only because we're all tired. Yeah, you have that, but it's this movie is just it's you know strange.

SPEAKER_07 2:54:06

It's just one of the great.

SPEAKER_06 2:54:08

You know what? That might be the best way to say it. This movie is strange.

SPEAKER_08 2:54:12

Yeah. So yeah. I watched it. I thought it was strange.

SPEAKER_03 2:54:16

Well, thank you, Mom, for staying. And everyone, stay tuned. Here we go.

SPEAKER_08 2:54:20

Bye-bye.

SPEAKER_03 2:54:30

All right, everybody. Thanks for staying with us. We are on to our main event of the Goodell Multiverse podcast. The reason you guys are here. That's right. We are reviewing Doctor Strange 1. So, this is gonna be fun. It's gonna be exciting. I'm gonna jump right on in, guys, with a history behind the film. Then my brother Ike here is gonna give the official synopsis, and we're gonna get into the juicy details of what this whole magic thing is in the MCU. Let's see if we can figure it out. All right. So, uh Doctor Strange came out on October 13th, 2016. Some of the main casts include Benedict Cumberbatch, Benedict Wong, Rachel McAdams, Chu Chi Chiwetta, E. Joefor. That was pretty good.

SPEAKER_06 2:55:16

That's pretty close. Chewedle J4. Cheweedle. Bro, you need a nickname. You're not trying to be mean. Yeah. Yeah. No. You're Chip. Chip. I mean, I it's it's no offense to your ethnicity or whatever's going on, but that is yeah, dude. Anyway, go ahead. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 2:55:39

Great actor, but yeah. One of them, yeah, he's fantastic. So Chewetal. Tildoswind.

SPEAKER_04 2:55:43

That's right right there.

SPEAKER_03 2:55:45

I'm just I'm not gonna say your last name, just Chiwetel. All right. Tilda Swinton and Mads Mc Oh my gosh. McKelson. McKelson. Mads McKelson, right? Is it McKelson or Mickelson?

SPEAKER_05 2:55:58

Mickelson sounds better. I think. Nickel, Mickle, Nickel I'm I'll try to remember that.

SPEAKER_06 2:56:02

Or Mads. Yeah. Or there's another one where what's up with this name? What's up with this? There's way too many Ks.

SPEAKER_03 2:56:11

All right. So uh the history behind the film, guys. Marvel Studios' journey to bring Doctor Strange to the screen was years in the making and represented one of the studio's biggest creative risks since Guardians of the Galaxy. By the time filming began in late 2015, the MCU had firmly established itself as Hollywood's premier franchise through films like Avengers, Guardians of the Galaxy, and Captain America's Civil War. But Marvel had yet fully explored the supernatural and myth mystical side of its universe. The studio saw Doctor Strange as the gateway to an entirely new corner of the MCU and wanted the film to feel visually unlike anything audiences had seen before. After considering several directors, Marvel hired Scott Derrickson, known for horror films such as Sinister, because of his passion for the character and his desire to blend superhero storytelling with psychological, spiritual, and horror-inspired elements. Derrigson pushed Marvel to embrace the bizarre, mind-bending visuals from the comics, leading to the film's famous reality-warping sequences inspired by artists like Steve Dickko, MC Esther, and films such as Inception. At the center of the project was Benedict Cumberbatch, who was coming off career-defining performances in Sherlock, the imitation game, and several major studio productions. Marvel had pursued him aggressively despite scheduling conflicts, believing he embodied both Steven Strange's arrogance and intelligence. I'm panicking right now. Mr. Strongbones. Yeah. The decision to use him as the primary villain rather than Strange's more famous comic foes such as Dormammu or Nightmare was intentional. Marvel viewed him as a more grounded human antagonist whose motivations could introduce audiences to the mystical world without overwhelming them. The film gradually built towards Dormammu as a larger cosmic threat, while using him, uh calculus, as a bridge between the real world and the mystical realm. Mads later revealed he was attracted to the role because Calcium had understandable motivations rather than being purely evil. One of the film's most controversial behind-the-scenes decisions involved the casting of Tilda Swinton as the Ancient One. In Marvel Comics, the Ancient One was traditionally depicted as an elderly um Tibetan man, a portrayal many critics viewed as outdated Asian stereotypes ruled in the 1960s comic book tropes. Marvel chose to reinvent the character as a Celtic woman, effectively both gender swapping and race swapping the role. Marvel executives argued they wanted to avoid um perpetuating stereotypes, but also face criticisms and also face criticisms from the from Tibet in a major film that they would need access to for the Chinese box office. The decision generated significant criticism and accusations of whitewashing, becoming one of MCU's largest casting controversies. Years later, both Derrickson and Marvel leadership acknowledged that there was no perfect solution and that the decision remains heavily debated among fans and critics. Filming took place across England, Nepal, Hong Kong, and New York, with Marvel playing unusual emphasis on practical locations and in-camera effects whenever possible. Cumberbatch reportedly spent months learning hand movements and mystical gestures used for spellcasting, while the visual effects team developed entirely new techniques to create the film's kaleidoscope dimensional folding effects. Fun production facts include many of the mirror-dimension sequences being created from real-world architectural photography before being digitally manipulated, and the famous astral projection scenes requiring actors to perform multiple versions of the same scene simultaneously. Another interesting detail is that Marvel deliberately designed the magical system to resemble a blend of martial arts, traditional fans, scientific theory, and spirituality, so it feels distinct from both as guardian technology and traditional fantasy magic. The filmmakers also worked hard to make Steven Strange's character art feel similar to Tony Stark's in some respect. Both are brilliant, arrogant men, forced to confront their own limitations, but with a more spiritual and philosophical journey. When Doctor Strange was released in 2016, it was praised for its visual ambition, performances, and successful introduction of the MCU's mythical side. The film earned approximately 89% of Rotten Tomatoes from critics and 86% from audiences. Financially, it was a major success, grossing roughly $677 million worldwide against a production budget estimated between $165 and $236 million. More importantly, the film expanded the MCU scope beyond science fiction and superheroes, introducing concepts such as the Mystic Arts, The Mirror Dimension, and the Timestone, all of which will become critical elements in Thor Ragnarok, Avengers Infinity War, Avengers Endgame, and the broader multiverse saga. What began as a risky attempt to bring Marvel Strangest characters to the screen ultimately become one of the franchise's most visually distinctive and influential films. Woo! Woo, yeah, that was a lot. Yeah. Yeah. All right, Ike, what is the official synopsis?

SPEAKER_06 3:02:26

So officially, while on a journey of physical and spiritual healing, a brilliant neurosurgeon is drawn into the world of the mystic arts.

SPEAKER_03 3:02:38

All right. So before we get into our breakdown, I want to make one quick note. And I did look this up to confirm, but I've been trying to pay attention to this in all of our retrospectives. This is the first film where we get that iconic MCU opening with the montage.

SPEAKER_04 3:02:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 3:02:55

All the rest, we've heard the music. The music's been there, but this is the one where we saw the concept art and then the image, the um clips, like popular clips of all the MCU stuff going on, mixed in with the Marvel Studios logo.

SPEAKER_06 3:03:09

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 3:03:10

Wow.

SPEAKER_06 3:03:10

I didn't really notice. I just kind of let it fly by.

SPEAKER_03 3:03:13

I've been I've been waiting for it and I thought Guardians of the Galaxy was it, and I'm like, okay, I see, I see I notice the music more. I like they're they're making that more important. And this one, it and I did look it up to confirm I didn't miss anything. This is the first film to feature it. And it's interesting. It's been that way actually up until last year, 2025. Yeah. Then they stopped doing that. All right.

SPEAKER_09 3:03:37

So, all right.

SPEAKER_06 3:03:38

Um Act one. I mean, I'll get through this here. You go right ahead. And here we go. World-renowned neurosurgeon Dr. Steven Strange is arrogant, brilliant, and obsessed with control. After a devastating car accident destroys his hands, he loses the ability to operate and exhausts all scientific options trying to heal himself. Despite or desperate, he travels to what's that say?

SPEAKER_07 3:04:08

Cath Mandu?

SPEAKER_06 3:04:09

Cath Mandu. Yes, can't math, I do. Cathman do and finds the ancient one. Uh, who introduces him to the mystic art strange, begins training under her, and and car Carl is it Carl? Yeah. His first name is really Carl. Why did I not catch this for some reason? So I'm sorry. So it's just like Mordo, but it's like, hey Carl. Uh he's Carl now. So her her and Carl, reluctantly learning about magic, astral projection, and multiple dimensions. Meanwhile, a rogue former student, calculus, steams or steals forbidden knowledge from the Dark Dimensions ruler. Threatening re cell.

SPEAKER_09 3:05:01

Dormammu.

SPEAKER_06 3:05:04

There's a lot of M's in that. Yeah. Yeah, Dormammu. Way too many M's. So that's Act One.

SPEAKER_03 3:05:14

We can't pronounce some of these names, but to be honest.

SPEAKER_06 3:05:17

Honestly, I'm better with them, but I'm just like I'm stumbling on them for some reason tonight. But yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:05:21

It's no, it's okay. Well, unless you hear it in this movie, if you're just reading it on paper, guys, good luck.

SPEAKER_06 3:05:28

I'm not gonna get Calcium's name right at all the whole time. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:05:31

Calcidious. It's calcidious.

SPEAKER_06 3:05:35

But there's but it doesn't look like that. No, Calcidious sounds like the cousin of Darth Maul that isn't quite bright. You know what I'm saying? The one that counts leaves. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 3:05:48

Yeah, but I I now it's starting to hit me. It's it's it's supposed to be calcidious. Yeah, I like calculus, though. I know calcilius. Calcillius. All right. Anyways, it's silly. So what worked for you in the beginning?

SPEAKER_06 3:06:05

So I like, you know, uh cumbersome here. I think cumbersome's real good in this cumberbatch. Cumberbatch.

SPEAKER_09 3:06:12

Cumbersome. But it's cumbersome.

SPEAKER_06 3:06:24

That's how good. I know how I feel about this actor. I don't he's very cumbersome.

SPEAKER_09 3:06:30

He's an adjective and a name. So I don't know if I like this guy. The actor or just the character?

SPEAKER_06 3:06:42

Both. Okay. I know the character is supposed to be what he is, so I'm cool with that. He's he's a jerk, you know, he's pretentious, you know, he's Lolly Kale from Titanic, right? He's he is kind of a jerk, you know, and but and I'm cool with that. I don't get Tony Stark vibes from him at all, though. Uh this he's definitely not as warm as Tony. Oh, no, not as nearly close to as funny. Not as charismatic. No, not as charismatic as the word. And he is a jerk to her. How long has she been with this dickhead? You know what I mean? Like, she's been putting up with a lot. I'd have been like, I don't care if you can make circles out of fire and all this crap you're doing. You're a jerk, you know. And she kind of does kind of give that to him like that in a way, so I get it. Um, I like I think Rachel McDadams is a great pick for the the girlfriend in this, though. I think the other fellow doctor, I can't remember his name as an actor, but he's a really good actor too. And this was earlier on in his like exposure to us, but he's really good. Um, he went on to do some real actual, real good dramatic work. But I I I'm not gonna lie to you guys, like I like uh, you know, Benedict Cumberbatch, you know, that guy, right? Benedict Cumbersome. I like him. Um I just I don't know how much I like him. And I think that's where I realized when I watch this movie, I'm like, oh no. Is this one of the first times I've actually noticed that there's a big actor in a big role? And I'm kind of like, uh-oh. I don't know if he's a good actor. Or I don't know if he's a believable actor to me, you know? Because I know a good actor could mean because he's great in Sherlock. Have you seen any of the Sherlock that he did? No, but I haven't paid attention to the Sherlock stuff. It's really good. He's really good in it, too. And he's awesome as con in Star Trek. After that, I mean, I don't know if I believe him in this, Sam. I think I'm struggling with it. So does it work? What works? Amy Adams works. I like the doctor stuff. I like that we're going that direction. Rachel McAdams. Yes, Rachel McAdams. Do you not get those two confused sometimes? No, I do all the time. They don't look alike. One's way better of an actress. Rachel McAdams is way better than Amy. Sorry, Amy. I know. Good Lois Lane?

unknown 3:09:14

Oh.

SPEAKER_06 3:09:14

Yeah. Anyways. Moving on. Who? No. No, no, Rachel McAdams, I think, is is a better actress. Anyways, yeah, uh, I'm sorry about that. But I think she's a great work. I think she fits well. I think that works real well. Um, the doctor stuff works real well. I I do enjoy um seeing him being as arrogant as he is and and struggling to figure out how to fix his hands. Um he definitely sells the arrogance of his of him being a douche. You know, he definitely sells it to the point where it's almost like, I almost don't like you that much. You know what I mean? Like, so I don't know, you know, in this introduction to uh well, I'll stop there because I'll I want I want to stop rap until we actually meet the the um you know the other magicians or no until we meet the other sorcerers. What do you feel about what works for you in this first part? Like, and you can go right into like the sorcerers and I'll I'll follow you into there, but like I just I don't want to I didn't want to go too far after this this initial you know meeting him because uh to be honest with you it kind of goes right into what didn't work for me. I'm gonna give you a little bit of a sneak peek. I I just feel like the transition from him being this guy to going and meeting the sorcerer is just really felt real forced and quick. You know, it works and it's okay, but it is kind of like uh, oh, and we're there and we're just there, you know? So I don't know. How do you feel about that?

SPEAKER_03 3:10:48

So I I honestly, and I'm just double checking my notes to make sure I'm getting it right. Um, this first act, I'm gonna give you a little spoiler, is my favorite of the three. Hmm. Um I might agree with you on this, too, to be honest with you. Yeah. Because I'm I'm very happy that Marvel decided to do the origin of Doctor Strange, and I'm very happy with how they portrayed him because he really is like this. I get when uh the history part did touch upon how their Marvel was looking for someone who could kind of be like a Tony Stark esque type thing with the arrogance type thing, and they nailed it, but they do make a distinction on his character versus Tony Stark, and you already pointed it out where he's not as charismatic, he tries to be funny, but it's this is more of like a colleague humor. This isn't like love interest humor. And Rachel McAdams lets him know right away this is not gonna fly. I love you, but I can't be with you. You know what I mean? Yeah, because of how self jerk he is, really.

SPEAKER_06 3:11:57

Well, he's nasty to her in the scene that's on here right now.

SPEAKER_03 3:12:00

Yes, he's nasty to her, like there's not a lot of redemption in this guy. No, there's not. Um, I do like the casting of Benedict Cumberbatch. Um, I I I can't and I'm not saying this with any disrespect because the the world has so many actors and actresses and all that stuff. I I don't think he's bad at acting. He's not one of my favorite actors, but I think for the if I had to do a picture comparison, he looks just like Doctor Strange. And he definitely can act, so I'm not gonna complain about that. I will even go so far to say I like him I I can't say the most in this movie, but for the solo stuff, the better in this one. There are big problems in the sequel when we get there that's almost character assassination level for him. But we'll get there when we get there. For this movie in particular, what works for me, I I like how do I say this properly? Because I know later you might be like, what do you mean by this? I'll I'll get there because I have my notes right in front of me, y'all. Um I like that the opening introduced you to the bad guy being really bad. Like they wanted to it's funny. I I uh I he's not my favorite bad guy, and we'll get we'll get to that. But how do I say this properly? Because you're gonna laugh at me. With how much I like Ronan and Guardians of the Galaxy, oh no, this guy starts off the same way as Ronan, but I don't like him. Interesting. So they actually have similar similarities, those two. Not fully, of course, but pretty similar. A little similar. Like the first time you meet Ronan, he kills someone and the blood goes. And for me, I was there for it. I was like, this is awesome. But it's also because I knew the card of the not cartoon, the comic book character. This guy, he almost starts off similar, decapitates a librarian's head. And I'm that's probably the most badass scene he does in the whole movie. Yeah, the only thing he doesn't do is pout.

SPEAKER_06 3:14:15

He doesn't, but other than that, he doesn't just stand around. No, he doesn't, but he's I I I I don't I see what your comparison is. I s I feel similar. I just think this guy's done better.

SPEAKER_03 3:14:29

But I okay, I can concede to that a little bit, but I it's just I always would put Ronan above him. But anyways, that's just for personal taste, though. But yeah, to move on from that. So the opening scene, I like that they decap the head of that guy because I thought that was that really it's it's supposed to set the tone, and it does. That take this guy seriously. It's gonna get to another gripe I have later on. But um, I thought that was really interesting to introduce the mirror dimension that way and to do some of those cool things. Um you could definitely tell that the CGI was new when it comes to some of that stuff. It was good. I'm not not dissing it, but there is there were some moments where I'm like, okay, I could tell this was their first time really trying it. Later on, I think, especially when you get to Spider-Man No Way Home, they really hone in on those much better, much crispier. Crisper. Anyways. Yeah, Cocoa Crispier. Um, and also I'm gonna say what also worked for me here is everything that they do in the medical world was perfect. Yeah, I like that stuff too. The writing for it, even their banter back and forth and um just the him wanting to know all the stuff about music and all that stuff. This is really cool. I actually think that if if this was like just a medical movie, it would have been really, really cool. If this wasn't superhero and Scott Derrickson and his writers are just writing a medical movie, they can do that easily. It was so entertaining for me. The all the medical stuff. Um, so I did like that a lot. What I also liked is that they use his origin. I liked the um him not paying attention in the car because that really literally is what his origin was in the car crash, broke his hands, and he does all these different types of things to fix him and he can't, so he surrenders to go to something like this. Um, just trying to reclaim his crown of being one of the top neurosurgeons in the world type thing. So I loved every aspect of that. I I even thought the CGI from that was even better in that than it was in the opening scene, the mirror dimension thing. I agree. It was it was really well done. You really felt it, and I can't say I felt sorry for him, you felt sympathy for him, but the way he treats Christine is like okay, you come on. Yeah, he's a jerk. Yeah, he's a jerk. Yes, that yes. So but I like that for his character because it really will help later on, and that's one of the things I will say really positive about the whole film and and and total for this, is I do like his transformation later on. I agree with you that felt a little forced when it came to the mystic mystic stuff, but I think it was, if this makes sense, a natural force because it gave us a really cool sequence of what the ancient one did to him. And it was it's one of those, I don't want to say this in a bad way, like a come to Jesus moment where I like it clicked inside his head. It's like, teach me more. Now I want to know, now I've seen it.

SPEAKER_06 3:17:39

So almost like a see and believe type thing. Yeah, I like the initial push him out of his body thing. But then when it gets into just the kaleidoscope stuff, I'm kind of I struggle with this movie because sometimes I feel like there's not there's more. Or there's a I'm trying to collect the words for what I'm trying. I tried to write it down, I just couldn't even figure it out. But I feel like there's a lot on the plate, but but it's not a lot of substance. You know, I'll ex- I'll explain as we go because it's more so towards the second act, anyways. Cause this is all just the beginning stuff, and you're kind of learning these people. But there's a lot of like we're looking at something cool, but there's really not a lot happening. And I and I tend to like these sequences that are supposed to like be the what blows your mind kind of started getting boring and too much. So uh but we'll get into that more as we go. So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:18:48

Let me see if there's anything else I wrote down and what what this first act entails to make sure I'm right. Okay, so they do meet the ancient one in this yeah, and it basically just let's see. Um okay, this uh this is uh for my notes at least. I stopped it after meeting the ancient one, and it's the next act where they suck into the practicing and all that. So ancient one introduction. I thought that was kind of cool.

SPEAKER_06 3:19:17

Yeah. Um yeah, it's does that whole bait and switch thing where you think it's that guy, but it's really that that lady. Yep. Um I I don't understand the controversy of it being her. No, I I don't I get where people are coming from, but I also think it's people making a big deal about something just because you know, I don't I'm I'm glad it's her. She does a great job. I don't think she's standout in this though, but we'll just we'll go from there.

SPEAKER_03 3:19:41

So I agree. You know, I I will say for the the hiring part and the casting thing, Tilda Swinton, she can almost play anything. She is you don't you don't think so?

SPEAKER_05 3:19:51

No.

SPEAKER_03 3:19:52

I I look at her similar to how I look at Glenn Close, where they're just almost legacy actors that um and I found it. You think she only can play weird? Because like when she played in Lightning Witch and the Wardrobe, I thought that was perfect casting for this weird two. But um Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 3:20:12

I'm with you. I'm not saying she's awful. I don't know who I'd put in her spot.

unknown 3:20:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 3:20:18

I think she does the role justice. Doesn't ruin the movie. It's just not a big deal to me. Which I know to a lot of people it is, but for me, I'm kind of like, huh. But I don't think she's as talented as other people think she is, though, truthfully.

SPEAKER_03 3:20:32

I I do like her. I think she's talented for that like that. But um, I will say that switching it up like this, I remember when this first was announced, and I was a little put off only because I just from what I knew of Doctor Strange and his origin. And I I'll be honest, guys, I know that the some people might say those are 1960s character tropes of cartoons of what an Asian man looks like. They don't mind that, and I say that with all due respect because it gets their name out there on the map to a degree, you know. There's some it's okay if it's an old Asian kung fu fighter or martial artist that's teaching him that's fine, that's normal, that's not bad that they like to make it sound like so how do I say this without getting cancelled? Maybe I shouldn't say it then.

SPEAKER_06 3:21:29

I was gonna say I'm gonna say it. This is a free speech platform, right?

SPEAKER_09 3:21:33

Um all stereotypes have a small truth. All of them.

SPEAKER_06 3:21:41

You know, some are harsher and take it out of context, but there are tons of examples of why those that was portrayed that way back then. Because there were people that you know that did that stuff, that they looked like this and they did these things. So like it's not out of it's it's just not tasteful. Okay, I th I think that's what I'm trying to say, is I get it. Like you just don't, oh, don't portray them, but you know, there's still some truth to a some of this, like so what's the big deal? But see, it doesn't matter, Sam, because it's not about doing the right thing, because they got rid of the stereotype and they're still mad about it. Because it's now we're whitewashing. So, you know, it's you're not gonna make anyone anyone happy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:22:28

That that's a perfect uh explanation.

SPEAKER_06 3:22:31

Yes, a lot of it is is just what can we complain about, you know, and it's like I don't know. Get over it. Like they they the Chinese people don't give a crap. You know, I saw a thing online the other day where this guy puts a a big old sombrero on and a fake mustache and a poncho, and he walks around a college campus and he asks black, white, Chinese, all sorts of people, do you think this outfit is racist? And they're like, Are you Mexican? And he says, No. Or actually they said, Are you Latino? Because they can't even say Mexican. And and he says no. And they said, Well then that's racist. Your you know, cultural appropriation. You know what I mean? All of them. About 20 people he went through. And then he went to a place where it's just a bunch of Latinos hanging out, you know, in their neighborhood, in whatever, wherever it was, it was like some sort of parade thing going on. He walked up and he'd asked random Latinos, and they loved his outfit. Like, I'm not saying that the guy, it can't come off as disrespectful, because it can. But what I am saying is maybe it's just because you think it should, you know? And that's as far as I'm wanting to talk about that because it's getting a little on the political side of it. I agree. But I it's just a social thing that don't do this to these movies, guys. You know, it's like it's like what are we gonna start saying? You know, you know what, that that that Tyree guy can't play Harvey Dent. Harvey Dent's not black. How do you know? There's nothing about Harvey Dent's character that says he can't be black. The only thing I ask, and I think John Campia has said this before, is as long as it serves the character, then that's what it should be. If the if you have a character that them being Chinese is important to what serves that character, then yeah, don't cast the Chinese character as a white guy. But if it doesn't matter what it is, then it doesn't matter who you cast them as. And that that's kind of the point I'm trying to make. This ancient one, technically, that's look where they're from. That's where they're from. So, like if we so if we do it as where they're from, you're mad because we're doing 1960 stereotype. Okay, fine. So we're gonna fix it, we're gonna give you till the swim. Oh, now it's just some white chick. Okay, well, which do you want? Okay, now we will do away with the character. Oh, that's you did that to the Mandarin, though. It's like, okay, so what do we do now? It's like, it's like you're not gonna, I don't know. I just don't like her because I don't like the actress. It's got nothing to do with who they cast her as. I the controversy of this almost helps, doesn't help this movie. You think it would, but it doesn't. And it's unfortunate that that's because there's more to discuss about this film than that bullshit count controversy. But I'm gonna digress from that because it's it's getting me going and I don't want this podcast to turn into that.

SPEAKER_03 3:25:20

I'm just gonna back you up on one other thing that came to mind too, that's not even in the realm of politics for it, but it's similar. When uh Scarlett Johansson was cast in a role called Ghosts in the Shell, I believe it was, which is based off of famous anime from Japan. A lot of people over in America were saying that you're whitewashing it by casting Scarlett Johansson, who because isn't this is an anime, but one anime, they all look the same with how they they're they're supposed to look. That's just part of what makes anime anime. And then two, they interviewed a whole bunch of regular Japanese folk over in Tokyo, I believe, and they loved that Scarlett Johansson was portraying them because they're like, oh, Scarlett Johansson, sign me up. So it's almost like take yourself out of this own this weird race ownership and a culture ownership that's not even yours, but you just want to be a voice for someone, let them speak for themselves. If the if the Japanese people do not like Scarlett Johansson playing an iconic anime character, they will let her know. And the same it goes around for all over the place. So to put that to rest, I I did like Tilda Swinson. I do like her as an actress. I don't think that her cast in this changed the character too much. I I don't think that and they see that's another thing too, guys. Stop looking at everything so superficial because even if they did cast, even if they did cast an elderly Asian man to play the ancient one that is comic accurate, that doesn't mean that it's a stereotype. It means you develop a really good character with him and we don't look at his race. Isn't that the whole point? We don't see color. Anyways, so um I do have problems actually with the ancient one in this film when we get to the those certain scenes. Yeah, but the casting is not the problem. Gotcha. Okay. Uh I did like the introduction. I thought that was pretty um pretty cool. Like the bait and switch thing, because it actually worked for this film because he's looking at the the elder Asian guy sitting down there thinking that's the ancient one, because that's what you put two and two together and it's it's the woman giving you tea, and be like, okay. And things like that. So um, and I I did like that little montage of her widening his brain with just flooding him with images of other dimensions and making him kind of go through it. Yeah, I thought that was interesting, especially at the time when they did it and in the retrospective. Uh if they continued doing it like that, I would have said that's annoying. But for an intro for him, that's cool. This is one of the only times we actually get to touch the multiverse, to be honest. Yeah, that's true. And we didn't even think of the multiverse as a concept at this point in the MCU. Right. So that's all the stuff in the first act I think that worked for me. What didn't work for you?

SPEAKER_04 3:28:14

I already talked about it. Okay, all right.

SPEAKER_03 3:28:16

So all right, I'll tell you what didn't work for me. Um is this one okay. There's there's two things, and I this is within the first act right before it gets to the next one. Um actually, this the one point I'm gonna make is more so in the next one. So I'm gonna skip it and come back to it. That's right. But I I will say the thing I don't like about in the first one is the watch. This is it's a weird one. Be like, really? The engraving is stupid. I'll be very honest. It literally says, time will tell how much I love you. What a stupid statement to put on a watch for someone. That is weird, right? I get the metaphors they're trying to make. It's a watch, time will tell. No, yeah, just a simple I love you from Christine will be enough. Yeah. Time will tell how much I love you on a watch. Their relationship's weird. It it no, that's really weird. Yikes. That's and by the way, that's not in the comics. He does not have a watch in the comics with her giving it to him. There's no significance of a watch other than this is what they threw in the movie. And I'm like, yikes. It shouldn't mean that much to him. He said some awful things to her. Oh, I get he's under distract. It means to me, it means for him more of regrets when he's seeing it. And maybe that's a friendly nod that I could love you, but only time would tell what you do. Right. But it's still a stupid thing to put on a watch. Like a note, an email that says that, that's one thing because you're saying it in the moment. You're engraving this onto a watch you're supposed to be wearing all the time. Yeah, yeah. I'm sorry. It's all so it's stupid. It's dumb. Anyways. Um, and I I even wrote on my notes, I will put this saying, time will tell how much I love you, in the same category as what Storm said in X1. Oh, it's that bad to me. It's that bad to you? When I read it, I'm like, oh my gosh. Who came up with this?

SPEAKER_06 3:30:32

It's up there.

SPEAKER_03 3:30:33

It's a little more creative than the Storm one, but it's yeah, it's still the same level of stupidity. So pretty cringy. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 3:30:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:30:39

So there you go, guys. That's what my what I don't like about the first act. Other than that, it was a pretty solid first act, to be honest.

SPEAKER_04 3:30:46

Yeah. True.

SPEAKER_06 3:30:47

So is there a standout moment for you? I I do like the first initial astral projection, that meeting them, that first conversation. I like all that. And I'm and I'm in for like that first adventure that he goes on psychedelically, right? Um, it although it is the first time I didn't notice, I'm like, hmm, how often is it always just like this? So that you get away with it this first time, but later there's no more excuses. So um that to me is a good stand up because we hadn't seen none like that yet in the MCU. I agree. Yeah. And it's quite a thing to tackle, so I was I was impressed with that.

SPEAKER_03 3:31:21

So I I agree. I wrote that down, and I also wrote, I was impressed that they decapitated somebody in the beginning. Yeah, they went there.

SPEAKER_06 3:31:29

It's good.

SPEAKER_03 3:31:29

Um I remember when in the they did an Avengers Endgame and they decapitated Thanos, and I was shocked Disney went that far. But then now watching this as a retrospective, I'm like, oh, they've done this before. Yeah, we just never really noticed it, or it wasn't that memorable. Yeah, well now it's Thor doing it, it's a big deal. Yeah, yeah, that's true. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_07 3:31:48

Bad guy doing it is one thing.

SPEAKER_03 3:31:50

Purple booger.

SPEAKER_07 3:31:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:31:52

So it's okay. So how would you score the first act? Five out of ten. Oh. Oh, that's slow. Wow, okay. I put eight out of ten. Okay. Here we go, guys. Okay. I'm gonna read act two. Yeeha. Strange. Strange progresses rapidly. Weird horse. I'm sorry. My horse has got the blanger for me.

SPEAKER_06 3:32:24

All right. That's what horses did. Get out of here, horse.

SPEAKER_03 3:32:29

All right. Um act two. Uh strange progresses rapidly, mastering the eye of Agamodo and its ability to manipulate time. As calculus attacks multiple sanctums worldwide, Strange is forced into combat before fully understanding his powers. The ancient one is mortally wounded and reveals she has secretly drawn power from the dark dimension herself. Strange and Mordo begin to diverge philosophically. Mordo believes magic must not break natural laws, while Strange believes becomes more flexible and pragmatic. Calcium succeeds in opening a portal for Domamu's dimension to merge with Earth, setting the stage for a catastrophe.

SPEAKER_09 3:33:17

Okay, so um, I have three things that worked for me.

SPEAKER_03 3:33:26

Give them. What do you got? So I like I I always like training montages. So I think that was kind of cool showing him learning how to open up a portal and with all his other peers, so to speak, there and things like that. Like he's really trying and struggling, and then it's she she teaches him. I love the words that she says. Um, I'm trying to remember the specific words, but you can't beat a river into submission, you must surrender to it and use it as its own power. And it it's kind of it's a little very philosophical in in that sense, but I think it I like how they did all that. So I'm fine with all that part. Okay. Um that's the first thing worked for me. This the um second thing is the astral fight in the medical thing. Um, when uh Christine is tending to his own. Yes, that that was really cool. Yep. And that actually, in my retrospective review watching it, made me excited for what they could do with the X-Men in the astral plane, because this is the astral dimension that they refer to in there, where in X-Men they call it the astral plane, but astral, it's the same thing. So it makes me excited for what they could do. As soon as you said it, all I thought was was apocalypse. Oh, that's um I'm sorry, that is probably one of the most standout moments of the whole movie of Apocalypse. It's so thank you for letting me in. Oh right. I can't wait to get to that retrospective, guys, because I tell you what, that movie makes me cry. Anyways, in a good way, I love it. Naysayers, go away. Um, or come back and watch that, I will prove you wrong. Anyways, um, so that I thought that was really cool. And again, the anything to do with the medical stuff, I thought they they write that really well in there.

SPEAKER_06 3:35:24

Yeah, we're we're kind of getting away from the medical stuff here. Yeah, but you're right. I do like the training stuff. I'm with you there. I will have to say, um, it's not as good as other training stuff, you know, because it is stuff we're learning, is we're still trying to understand what the hell they're even doing. Um, but it is nice to see a good old training montage and stuff like that going down. It's pretty basic, to be honest.

SPEAKER_03 3:35:46

But it's not it didn't it wasn't bad.

SPEAKER_06 3:35:50

Yeah, and it's and it's a lot of trying to get us on board with what's going on too, right? Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_09 3:35:56

And what what worked for you, and then we'll get into what didn't.

SPEAKER_06 3:36:05

I love this astro plane fighting thing too. I thought that was that might be one of the best scenes in the movie as well. But I've got it in as my standout moment, so I'll tell you that, and that that it also is what worked for me. Um what works for me is I believe the sorcerer grew up. Like I I really I understand the the motivation of the bad guy, and I like that he comes off as someone that gets shit done. But kind of to echo like what you said, there's times where I'm kind of like, you're just filler here. You're just a guy that's just here doing things, you know. And but I do like he's dangerous. I like that he's dangerous. I think uh what doesn't work for me is mortar or Carl comes off as kind of whiny. And there's times where it's like if you're wondering why you're not in the position you want to be in, it's because you don't shut your mouth and stop complaining. You know, like I have a problem with the character. I like the actor, I think he's good, I think it's unique. I just don't care for the way it just I don't feel like that's getting earned this turn he's gonna have. Doesn't feel that earned yet. I will say by the end of the movie I'm a little more on board with it because it gets more interesting, but it's it's not quite earned. What doesn't work for me as well is I don't really care for this. I'm just gonna read a whole bunch of books and be on and now I'm up on everything. I get it, you know, but like it's what are we talking about here? What is he? Is he super smart or is he just a really good surgeon? Or is he just great with his hands? It's like pick the specialty and go with it, right? I I don't mind it. I I wouldn't have minded it if this movie actually gave it more time. Who's to say this couldn't be? He goes there, shows up, talks to them, and then you get into well, what's the best way to do this? And Wong, who works for me in this, the introduction of Wong is awesome. I love him. And I like every moment of him in it. He's some of the funniest parts. He's you know, he's definitely I can see why he's a lot of comic relief, anyways. So I like Wong, I'm glad he stays. Um, but I don't like the Sorcerer Supreme, but I'm glad he stays.

SPEAKER_03 3:38:26

Um, he becomes that later on. Yeah, at least right now the ancient one is. Oh, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 3:38:35

No, yeah, yeah. But yeah, I don't like that later on. Yeah, he should have given it back to strange when you come back. Yep. Um, but what was I gonna say? Where was I? Yeah. Yeah, I just don't feel like it's earned some of it. You know, some of the turn isn't earned, but that's not till the third act either, though. So well, I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 3:38:56

It's we are in that spot where he does open up the portal, they fail about, you know, that I I will say, in regards to that, the first couple times I watched this, I've watched, I'll be honest, and I think I said this in the beginning of our podcast episode. I've watched this movie five times in the past week. You watch way more than I did, so you were a little saturated. And I and I will admit this was one of those movies where I always say this.

SPEAKER_06 3:39:21

Do you feel like he is for me? It's his acting. Like I'm sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you. I just Oh, who, Benedict? Yeah. I just don't believe him.

SPEAKER_03 3:39:33

I often I believe him. I don't I'm not put off by his acting. I actually don't have any problems myself with Doctor Strange in particular and Ben the Cumberbadge's perpetrator of him in here. It's all the other characters around him that I have more of a problem with myself.

SPEAKER_06 3:39:49

Maybe that's the problem I have too, and I'm just struggling pinpointing. I'm gonna watch this again and give you another answer on that. Like, you know, just for the hell of it. Because I only did give. I only got to watch this really a total of once and then had to go back and and pick apart a couple of scenes. So I just didn't have a lot of time this last week.

SPEAKER_03 3:40:07

Well, if you're anything like me, the struggle has started to get really started to get hard for me the fourth or fifth time I watched it. And the reason why I say it like like that is I watch it one time just to remember it. I watched it a second time to start writing my review form and make sure I'm critiquing it, seeing things right, heard things right, all that stuff. But uh um Mortal's character grew on me enough where I I understood him a lot more. I actually think he has just like Doctor Strange, he just so this is this is how I view Mortal in this movie. Yeah. Strange has a character arc in this, where he starts off as this arrogant prick neurosurgeon and he gets humbled into submission to a degree and just takes on Doctor Strange as this is what my life is gonna be like now. So he does have a character arc in this movie. Mordal, he's like the next level down where I think he has a character arc, but he doesn't show the emotion enough that convinces me. Like he the the logical pieces are there, but him portraying them to me is it falls flat. Just comes off as a bunch of complaining, right? Complaining, yeah, rage, he has good emotion for rage, but the but the the thing that should break him to do what he does at the end, that's not there. That emotional moment of maybe even shedding a tear or something, being like my teacher is actually this and I'm strict, and you understand him a little bit more why he feels the way he does when you find out about the ancient one in this act, that would have made me believe him more. But I do see the pieces there, I just don't see it being um displayed well to me. But it's I I don't know if it's the acting or well, honestly, it probably is the acting because I do see the pieces there, I just don't see it being like I just said, portrayed them well. I gotcha, yeah. Um so that uh were you in the middle of saying something else before I jumped in there? All right, what else what didn't work for me too is the ancient one. This woman is very questionable. Yeah. There are things about the character that make me concern in the MCU, she was the sorcerer supreme. Yeah. And it's not, and it's not actually it's not the drawing on the dark dimension thing to live forever. That actually is understandable. I understand I understand that that she she's gonna hang on to power and she is trying to do the right thing, so to speak. But knowing that calculus is out there and what he did to her librarian, she's very nonchalant this whole time. Yeah, it's there is very urgent. Yeah, exactly. There's no, yeah, there's no sense of urgency in this movie of her saying we need to go and find him, or we think he's here, so we're gonna send some of our sorcerers there. That stuff would have been cool in the movie to really show, okay, she knows what pages he took out of the book, she knows what he's planning to do with it. Why aren't you taking this seriously enough? Because obviously it's working what he's doing, so it's like, oh my gosh, what did you do that for? It made me not like her because she seems arrogant, and yet she has the nerve to look at Doctor Strange and call him arrogant. And the thing is, he doesn't point that out to her, too, in this whole movie. He lets he let her say that to him, and he just relies on, oh, but you're not who you say you are. You draw power from the dark dimension. That's not the point here that should be made. The point should be you're more arrogant because this guy's out there, and look what he just did to me. And what are you doing this whole time?

SPEAKER_06 3:44:06

This is something Marvel She's a little underwhelming. This is something that Marvel has trouble with sometimes. And they seem to never have this problem when the Russo Brothers are helmeting a movie, but they do have it with everybody else. And this problem is nobody really sits down and discusses what does this really mean. If it's not the ancient one, it's Thor's hammer. You know, if it's not Thor's, it's it's the throne or it's whatever. It's something specific that you're like, so what does this really mean? Right? And let's come up with a meaning for it. Like if she's sorcerer supreme, then the bar is set low for him. Because this is someone that should be urgent, you know, real urgent about it. And Doctor Strange is more urgent about Loki showing up on New York City streets during Thor Ragnarok than she is about a guy trying to end the world. You know what I'm saying? So it's like Yeah, that's the thing.

SPEAKER_05 3:45:02

He takes this this job seriously, more seriously, right as Sorcerer Supreme, where she's like She's like, well, something will happen.

SPEAKER_06 3:45:10

Let's jokes. I'm source. I'm weird. Look at me. That that's Tilda Swenton, too. And that's that's some of the problem. Is like it's just a weird character. It's not to, it's not meant to have there's no meat there. They just are going, she's weird, she could play this part cool. We're not gonna be stereotypical, and people are gonna love it because we're woke, and she's gonna play it weird and have fun with it. And it just and it it's exactly what happens, and it falls short.

SPEAKER_03 3:45:43

Yes, she's very contradictory for herself.

SPEAKER_07 3:45:47

It's because they don't know how to do it, Sammy.

SPEAKER_03 3:45:49

It's funny because I when I'm watching this movie, then I think about when the Rooster brothers added her an endgame to make a point to Bruce about explaining that taking away a stone. She sounds competent in that one. She's actually doing stuff in that one, fighting the aliens. She's saying something that makes sense, too. Yes, and she's being a sorcerer supreme, what they would do. This movie, you don't get that.

SPEAKER_06 3:46:11

She's throwing things from her rooftop at like birds.

SPEAKER_03 3:46:14

So she even then she's not really no, but at least it's something. And I get it. They couldn't make her do something bigger because Avengers, you can't intermingle what the what's actually going on there.

SPEAKER_06 3:46:25

Well, it would have been a great way to get rid of that nuke. Just a sling ring. But you know, she's too busy being weird. Um, we don't have to get to act three yet, and we can start discussing this now. Because I'm gonna ask you right now, what is magic in the MCU at this point? What have you learned about it? Does it make sense to you yet? Because by now, we should be able to say, okay, let's get to this end act and see things go down, because I got a grasp of what this means. And I'm still like, yeah, I don't get it. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 3:47:03

Let me see where I wrote this because I don't want to say it now and then kick myself later. Because if we're gonna if you're gonna discuss it more a little later, we can move on.

SPEAKER_06 3:47:13

But it to me at this point, if I don't quite have a grasp on the concept of your movie of what you're trying to do, then we got a problem.

SPEAKER_03 3:47:22

Yeah, this is this is what I wrote down for later.

unknown 3:47:25

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 3:47:26

So I'm not gonna get into too much detail at uh will, but not not the moment.

SPEAKER_06 3:47:30

Okay, so let me just let me just answer then on some of this here. Uh yeah. Real quick. The pacing was okay. I think the movie does well there. Um the best character moment in this section. Um, I don't know. I struggled with this one, to be honest with you.

SPEAKER_03 3:47:48

Actually, I I can tell you about this one for me that might surprise you after all the stuff I just said. Um, it actually, for me, it is the ancient one revealing how complex of a character she is to him, why she draws out the dark dimension. That's her final good.

SPEAKER_06 3:48:05

You know, I thought I was gonna go with that as well, although I still don't like her. But I do like that That's what I think about her. Right, because like what makes her what makes her um worthy of being the you know the sorcerer supreme, and then yet it's interesting at least that there's a complexity, right? So it's so contradictory because we don't you think that you shouldn't be that, you should have this problem. Yeah, yeah, I'm with you. That's tough. So that's tough.

SPEAKER_03 3:48:40

Well, I put is the ancient one revealing how complex of a character she is. I appreciate this type of a personality character development for us learning a little bit. Part of me wants to know more about her origin herself to understand her more in this movie. Yeah, I got you. I got you. And I think that that ending to me was a good like tease of I wish we had a beginning now instead of just an ending.

SPEAKER_06 3:49:05

My my best character moment, though, I will have to do, I do like the the Carl and Steven fighting and the getting to learn him more. I agree with you, it's not earned later, but right now I'm still in for him, like still trying to figure him out. And I'm enjoying that stuff, so that's where I have for that.

SPEAKER_03 3:49:23

No, that's a good that's a good pick too.

SPEAKER_06 3:49:24

Later is the problem, but right now I'm still on board in at this point in the movie. So yeah.

SPEAKER_05 3:49:30

Alright, so um, I guess then what score would you give act two?

SPEAKER_07 3:49:34

Five out of ten. I gave it a six.

SPEAKER_03 3:49:40

All right, so uh act three, the final act. Why don't you read for us the what happens?

SPEAKER_06 3:49:46

Um Strange confronts Dormamu directly in the dark dimension, using the eye of Agamoto to trap both of them in a time loop. No matter how many times Dormammu kills him, Strange resets the moment, refusing to break. Eventually, Dormamu agrees to leave Earth and take Calculus and his zealots with him to escape the loop. Earth is saved, not by brute force, but by Strange's clever manipulation of time and persistence. Strange fully accepts his role as Earth's protector and becomes a new sorcerer supreme. And I'll tell you right now, the ending does land for me. I love this thing with Dormammu and the time loop thing. I think it's very smart. I think it's a lot of fun. I think visually it made for the end scene really unique looking. And it was different than the kaleidoscope bullcrap we've been getting the whole time. It was something new and interesting to look at. Um yeah, I'll start with that and then let you go from there. Because I do enjoy this. I I like this thing with Dormammu. I like all this stuff. I think it's very smart. I think it's very smart.

SPEAKER_07 3:51:04

I think uh if I look at our thing here. You call that as the the ending or is that the climax?

SPEAKER_03 3:51:13

I would say the climax is earned. Yes, the climax is earned. Is that that the is that the Dormammu thing? Yeah. The climax thing. And the the ending, what I interpret that as is like the overall arc throughout the movie of But for Steven himself, it works for me as well. Yep.

SPEAKER_06 3:51:31

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 3:51:32

I agree. I I I am full agreement. For me, yes, the ending ending landed well. I put Doctor Strange accepting he no longer will be the doctor and leaving his past in the past and becoming a sorcerer. Perfect.

SPEAKER_06 3:51:44

I there is a softer side of him shown in this, yep, which actually bugs me because we don't ever see it again.

SPEAKER_03 3:51:50

Yes, I agree. But at least it's here, and I like it in this movie. This is great character growth for him in this movie. And I actually like I actually like that he's oh I wouldn't say he's okay, but he accepts the fact that he's not gonna be your Christine. Yep. I like that. I think that's really good for something like that.

SPEAKER_06 3:52:10

I think the next time we see him where he's somewhat softer and like this again, that makes sense, is maybe a little in Infinity War, like little moments, but like I wish I kind of wish he was even softer than that at all, you know.

SPEAKER_03 3:52:27

And maybe this is a hot take. I don't know if this will be a hot take for this movie, but definitely will be for future for the next movie, and maybe I'll remember remember and say that that time as my hot take. He does better besides this movie, he does better in other people's movies. Yep, agreed. Ensemble movies. That's gonna be part of my hot take as well.

SPEAKER_06 3:52:48

So we'll get there.

SPEAKER_03 3:52:49

Okay. Um, all right, so yeah, ending landed for me, climax. I liked it. How they defeated Dormammu, like exactly what you said to a T. I thought that was clever, that was cool. I I I do enjoy that. Yep. Uh, what would be your best moment then for Act Three?

SPEAKER_06 3:53:06

It it is that honestly, I I could watch that scene of him repeating that over and over again. I love that when he's with Dormammu. I think that's real cool stuff. Dormamu looks real freaky, you know, like he's big like he is, and I just I really enjoy this. He will literally keep doing this for as long as it takes. And it really told me, I'm like, cool, this character's gone somewhere. And it really made me like him at this point. You know what I mean? Yeah. Because it took a while, and uh, but I like him as this point. So yeah. Yeah, I agree.

SPEAKER_03 3:53:38

I I put that too. I've just this Dormamu thing really saved the this movie's ass, to be honest with you. I did the the the time loop trick was cool to to use and make Domamu retreat. That's part of my best moment. I also like visually them fighting while everything else is rewinding. Yes, that is a very fun fight to watch. I agree. Yep.

SPEAKER_09 3:54:03

Uh what didn't work for me is how many sorcerers are there?

SPEAKER_03 3:54:12

Mm-hmm. So we get one moment of Wong rich recruiting. Why Wong? He's a librarian. That's what that's one of the things I always had a problem with. Wong real job, right? Yeah, I like him in this movie. Don't get me wrong. I love the character, yeah. But a librarian doesn't do this type of stuff. You know what I mean? He doesn't recruit other fighters to go fight unless this is a latch stitch effort and all your A-listers are gone. They're not gone. That's strange is there, um, Mordo is there, all that stuff. So, but whatever. So he does. He recruits the sorceress. There's six of them. There's not many.

SPEAKER_09 3:54:53

No.

SPEAKER_03 3:54:53

This is supposed to be the world-ending thing where uh one dimension is being bled and consuming our earth, and you only have six.

SPEAKER_06 3:55:04

Do you remember how many there were when we got to Doctor Strange 2 and they're trying to fight off Wanda?

SPEAKER_03 3:55:08

That's you know, I read Doctor Strange 2 made it seem like there's quite a few sorcerers, but here you visually saw none in the final act except for that little recruitment, and that's it. Like, either these guys are pretty weak to die the way they did, because I mean, I'm not saying the calculus here isn't like he's a formidable guy, he's formidable, he's a dangerous bad guy. But if it's just one of him or him and his two other people versus 20 of the sorcerers, he easily could have been defeated. So maybe that's why they didn't bring them in. But then that leaves a big hole in your story of how dangerous is this, then so that that's that's one of my biggest problems with it.

SPEAKER_06 3:55:55

Um actually, that really is one of my main big problems with that. That's been that was my that was honestly the same thing I was thinking. It's like this doesn't seem the urgency is not there. No, from her and from well, we got a couple guys.

SPEAKER_07 3:56:09

The rest of them.

SPEAKER_06 3:56:10

Okay, these other people you even trained with, where are these people?

SPEAKER_03 3:56:14

You all showing up, like strange is the only one who cares, and he's the one who says, I don't want to be part of this, right?

SPEAKER_09 3:56:20

Right.

SPEAKER_03 3:56:21

But yeah, he's still the only one who cares. It's like, what the heck? I love when he says, Can you explain what we are? Because I don't I think that he wouldn't have had to ask that if they all were like taking this seriously. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_09 3:56:37

What are we?

SPEAKER_03 3:56:39

Anyways, so yeah. Um so I guess what's your score for this act?

SPEAKER_09 3:56:46

Five out of ten. I put a seven. Good.

SPEAKER_03 3:56:52

If it wasn't for that visual thing and a unique way of defeating Dormammu, because obviously I didn't know that does help it. I think that was the best way for him to defeat Dormammu because he can't fight that. He's a new sorcerer, and yeah, he might be book smart and read everything, but that doesn't mean practice he's had. Right, right. So yeah. Oh boy. Okay. So post post-credit scene. Um, what happens is Doctor Strange, in the in the mid-credit scene, I should say, Doctor Strange meets Thor in New York. Thor is searching for his father, Odin, and Strange agrees to help him. Strange is concerned of Loki. Um, the post-credit scene is Mordo confronts Jonathan Pangborn, a former sorcerer, and strips him of his magical energy, declaring that there are too many sorcerers and that the world is out of balance. So the purpose of these is to set up Thor Ragnarok and reveal Mordo's turning to an antagonist, so to speak. How important is this to the MCU for you?

SPEAKER_06 3:58:02

Um, I don't think it's too important, to be honest with you, for two reasons. The Thor Ragnarok thing only comes up later as a scene in Ragnarok that you almost didn't need this and you still would understand what's going on. And that and the other thing, the the Carl thing, doesn't go anywhere. That's it. You know, the best we ever see of that again is in Doctor Strange 2, and it's literally just them having an argument and fighting.

SPEAKER_03 3:58:29

And it's another dimension of him. It's not even the main timeline. Still just as whiny. So like yeah. Um I I put on here not really for importance, and I gave a hype level of 50% because I do like that it showed that he's gonna be taking doing business at least with the other Avengers, so that made me excited for the thing. I agree with you.

SPEAKER_06 3:58:53

I think 50%'s a great way to put it there.

SPEAKER_03 3:58:55

Yeah, yeah, but the the um Mordo thing is definitely one that I'm like, really. It's a great setup and it has no follow-through. None. That's why in the retrospective, that's it's not really that hype. So I gave a five out of ten. I split it right in half.

SPEAKER_06 3:59:10

Five out of ten, perfect, yep.

SPEAKER_03 3:59:13

Okay, all right. So we we did get through this a little quick.

SPEAKER_06 3:59:17

Yeah, it's well it's okay because it's so mid. It is, it's very mid. I think it's the best way to describe it. We'll have a couple things to talk about here towards in some of this here.

SPEAKER_03 3:59:26

So all right, so casting and performances. What is your best performance, you would say? Oh god.

SPEAKER_06 3:59:37

Oh, Rachel McAdams.

SPEAKER_09 3:59:39

Ooh, okay, okay.

SPEAKER_06 3:59:42

She's the only one in this that sold it where I didn't have to work at being a part of what they're doing. Yeah.

SPEAKER_07 3:59:49

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 3:59:50

So I I do like Rachel McAdams. I think that was a great choice. I put Benedict Cumberbatch because I I liked his casting for it, and I think he had a complete arc in it, and I think he was believable for me personally. Mr. Cumbersome, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, all right, so most surprising performance.

SPEAKER_06 4:00:10

I'm gonna give that one to I gotta give it to somebody, don't I? So I don't know, Sam. Like there's I was not impressed with anybody in this, to be honest with you. Nobody really stood out more than she did at this moment. I might also give that to her. Because I don't expect that much of a side character, especially when it comes down to the like the love interests of these people, whether it's male or female or not, usually don't end up being that important to me. But I think it is in this for this story, in this one at least. So and unfortunately, I'm just some of my issues with everybody else. I guess if I had to pick one different than her, I'm gonna say Wong is a surprising performance because he's funny, he's there, and I want to see more of him, and and they they come through with spades when it comes down to getting more Wong, so which is one of the smarter things the MCU's done.

unknown 4:01:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:01:21

So I'll give it to Wong just to just to be different.

SPEAKER_03 4:01:25

Okay. I I did have it as a tie between Wong and Rachel McAdams. I I I like them both. I I how do I say this? I think Christina is an important character for Steven's development and growth, but I actually don't see her as important moving forward after this origin.

SPEAKER_06 4:01:45

I find her way more important than Natalie Portman. And door. I relate with her more, I like her more, I think she has more charisma, I think she's a better actress in in this style. Mm-hmm. Yeah. I I hear what you're saying, the moving forward, sure. But if you're gonna have someone in in his storyline that is another person that you know that love interests, I think she's played this real well. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:02:10

And I'll I'll I'll clarify that I won't say no to putting her in future installments. You just don't see it's unnecessary. Yeah. Yes. Yeah, I gotcha. It's not like a pepper to Tony.

SPEAKER_06 4:02:20

I would almost say that's probably what they sh you know. I I would almost say the lack of her in the future is problematic for him in how much I like this character or not. So but I guess we'll just yeah. Yeah. Let's get to the hot take for that.

SPEAKER_03 4:02:40

Alright, weakest performance.

SPEAKER_07 4:02:42

I kind of had a a tie, but um weakest performance is Tilda Swinton.

SPEAKER_06 4:02:50

She's just weird. She's just weird. Just be weird. We're good, just be weird. Say these lines in this cool philosophical weird way, and you're good. You got it. Weird, weird, weird. That's it. That's all I get from her. That's all I get from her in almost anything she does. I do not share your enthusiasm for her.

SPEAKER_03 4:03:07

Oh, really? That's fine. That's fine. So I have the my two weakest performances are Mads and um Chewedle. Mads is a great actor. He was just underwritten. So that's a good reason. That's the only reason I will give it to him. Other than that, he did the part that he was supposed to play. Yep. Where Chewetel was I see the pieces there, I don't see the performance there. All right. So it's kind of like a they're both on par with me, just in two different ways. And I see it the opposite.

SPEAKER_06 4:03:47

I see underwritten, and he tried the best he could with what he had, which is interesting. But it's funny. I mean it works out. It's the same, still works out the same way, but I definitely see it the opposite way. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:03:58

Yeah. Well, I don't think the Mads's performance exactly is the weakest. I just think that he was underwritten, so therefore it was under Moto. Moto. Mordo. Mordo. Whatever. Yeah. Him.

SPEAKER_06 4:04:11

No, Mads, I agree with you 100% on that. Yeah. He's with he the only difference between him and Powdy Face is Powdy Face. And that he's actually doing something in this. At least he's in the mix.

SPEAKER_09 4:04:24

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_06 4:04:25

Powdy face wasn't. Or it wasn't always. And like it just didn't care. At least this guy, I was like, well, at least this guy's got his hands dirty. He feels he feels a little more of a I get shit done kind of guy than Pouty Face did. You know, for me. So that's a big difference there.

SPEAKER_03 4:04:44

Alright. Uh casting wins or misses for you. I have three casting wins.

SPEAKER_06 4:04:53

I have to tell you, this might be one of the only MC mov MCU movies where I think ultimately it worked out for casting.

SPEAKER_09 4:05:08

But I don't know if I would have cast everybody that they cast.

SPEAKER_06 4:05:12

So I think Doctor Strangers missed cast. I don't care that it looks like them. And it's never been important to me. You know, and it shouldn't either to anyone. I get you want them to look a certain way, but I I do think that the problem is it's it's I I am gonna be honest with you. Doctor Strange is the one of my least favorite MCU characters, and a lot of it is because of the portrayal of him in the movies. But I don't also know a lot about him in the comics either. So, but what I've gotten to know in the movies, I'm not a big fan of him. And sometimes I don't like that he's involved in stuff, but I'm able to accept it and it's okay and it works for the most part. But I do feel like it's miscast. And I feel bad because I think cumbersome there's not a bad guy, and I think he's made some good stuff. I just don't know if this was one of them that I would have given to him.

SPEAKER_09 4:06:17

You know? Okay.

SPEAKER_06 4:06:20

I'll tell you who I would have cast for Doctor Strange in the hot take. Or actually, I'll tell you now, because the hot take is different. I think that we missed out on what Joaquin Phoenix could have done. I heard that he was in the running of it. I but I do think he's too pretentious of an actor to get involved in these kinds of movies, and it's too bad because I think we would have had a better performance. I think we'd have had a different kind of movie, we'd have had a different kind of Doctor Strange, we'd have seen a fuller fleshed-out character, something that was definitely more earned and more interesting to see in the future. I do personally feel that way about that. And it's kind of a hot take, but I think it's also a missed opportunity and a miscast.

SPEAKER_09 4:07:00

So okay.

SPEAKER_03 4:07:04

So I put for my casting wins is Menda Cumberbatch, Rachel McAdams, and just to throw it out there, Tilda Swinton. I don't mind her, but I really threw that out there as a casting win just for any naysayers to be like, oh, she was bad, whitewash, be like, shut up. She's fine. She didn't that that didn't that didn't factor into my deciding. And it didn't factor into mine either. Yeah. But I still think she wasn't good.

SPEAKER_06 4:07:29

But it had nothing to do with that part of it at all. I think that's why I tried to make that clear earlier, because I don't want people to think I'm jumping on that same wagon. Because that's not what's wrong to me. What's wrong to me is she was given the Johnny Depp treatment, which is like, just come be what you always be in these parameters and work. That's a good point. You know? Because John is Johnny Depp a great actor. Yes. If you just sit six people down on the couch and say, What movies do you think Johnny Depp acts in the best? Almost all six of them are gonna pick all characters that he came up with on his own on the spot. When I have three off the top of my head where they actually told him how you needed to be, and he was able to do it and he did good. I think he's a great actor. I do. I think she can be a great actress, but I think they're just giving away too much room when they have this whatever works thing works. And do I think Johnny Depp's best work is you know, the the the normal, you know what I mean? Like the all the normal, the usual suspect kind of lineup that he has? No. You know, his best work is public enemies, secret window, uh freaking what's the one, black mass, you know, like the things where you need to play a real person with real things, real stuff, real emotions, real stakes. You're not just putting on makeup and pretending you're drunk and jumping around. Because that's 99% of what the others all are, and that's Telva Swinton. 99% of her roles are what's weird and do it. And that's what she does. And she does good at it, but I see through it because it's not, I don't think it's authentic. That's how I feel. That's why I feel that way about it.

SPEAKER_03 4:09:06

So how about Johnny Depp and the Tourist with Angeline Jones? Yeah, no.

SPEAKER_06 4:09:15

So that's what I don't think I don't think they realized they were even making a movie half the time that made that movie. The movie's so bad. You gotta admit, that's not one of her better, like obviously, right? Like I know you like her, but that can't be one of your favorites of hers.

SPEAKER_03 4:09:29

No, there's others that's a bad movie. I won't say I won't say it's a bad movie. Oh, I'd be cursed. But it's Angel Jolie. But um it's not my favorite of her.

SPEAKER_06 4:09:42

It's not good to me. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:09:44

It's not my favorite of hers. No.

SPEAKER_06 4:09:46

Yuck.

SPEAKER_03 4:09:48

I'm trying to think of what of hers do I like. See, that came out the same year as Salt did, and I love Salt. Yeah. Ooh. That's that that's that is her.

SPEAKER_06 4:10:01

She made pepper with Queen Leticia. Um Kifa or whatever her name is. Uh I don't.

SPEAKER_09 4:10:11

Angeline Jolie. What do I like her in? I'll get back to you on that. Okay. Eternals. I'm just gonna.

SPEAKER_03 4:10:19

I mean, maybe. Tomb Raider. I mean, that's Yeah, that's yeah. Because she literally is the embodied of the colour. She really likes Laura Croft.

SPEAKER_06 4:10:29

So this problem if I had to pick anything that she really accomplished for me personally, it'd be that. There you go. I don't know what else I'd like her in, though. You know, it's it's a problem I have with her. Yeah. I get why you like her. I do, but she's not the only one. There's there's several actresses you like that. I'm not a fan of. But she's definitely top of the list. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:10:51

All right. So um, let's see. Missed opportunities or waste of potential. Do you have anything for the cast characters of the stories?

SPEAKER_06 4:10:59

No, I think I kind of it's kind of part of what I just got done talking about. I think waste of potential could have would have been, I would have loved to see what Joaquin would have done with that role, you know?

SPEAKER_03 4:11:09

Yeah. So I I wrote down uh two things in particular. One, Dormammu. I wish we saw more of the dark dimension. Because we see it, we see a glimpse of it when she's giving him that like open your eyes type thing and open your mind. Yeah. And then we see um it's good. Then we see the it's bleeding through into our dimension and things like that. And then he goes to him, but it really just looks like outer space and neon lights. It it's a weird-looking place, right? And I I kind of, especially now after the post-credit scene with Doctor Strange, I want to know what does this dark dimension actually look like if you went there and lived there because you know, because Clea looked pretty normal, but we'll get there when we get there for that movie.

SPEAKER_06 4:12:00

It's like a bunch of random little planets that you can jump to.

unknown 4:12:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:12:06

And they're just there and yeah. What's drama? What's what's he doing all that? It's funny, is just floating around all these planets all day, just being rah, I'm a bad guy, bad things. It reminds me. Is he watching TV? What's he doing? You know what I mean? I want to see his chair, I want to see his lounging area. He's watching out of Lucy. Like, is he just relaxing? Like he's just in the bad game of smoke.

SPEAKER_07 4:12:24

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:12:24

You know what I mean? Like, or what's or is he just always mingling around these floating planets, being mean? Yeah. Like it's like, what's going on? Like, at least Thanos looks like he kicks back and watches home improvement every once in a while. You know what I mean? Like, like some of these bad guys look like they actually do something with their life other than being bad.

SPEAKER_03 4:12:41

But so I'll I'll say this now because I think I might remember it when we watch this other movie, but it's not going to be my hot take for that movie. Um, the Dark Dimension, it rem I feel like they took that, they got rid of the darkness and added lights, and that became the quantum realm. That's how it does look so similar. It looks too similar to each other. One's just a little lighter than the other. And maybe a little more of a pastel-y color type thing than this neon light, dark place. Interesting. Yeah. It's I don't know. I I I don't know. That that's just the feeling I get when I when I looked at it and I see how Doctor Strange is walking on it, and I'm like, you're walking on kind of like how Janet and Hank and um Hope were walking on that. And like, it's kind of like the same place, just different. I don't know. That's just me. It it yikes.

SPEAKER_06 4:13:40

You want to know what looks silly in this, like really silly in this, that I have a hard time with is whenever they're running, a lot of the running stuff looks goofy. And but when they're running and trying to use the sling ring at the same time looks really goofy. Like it this this and they're running at the same time. I'm like, yeah, it looks real silly. You know what I mean? Like there's some silliness to this that I wonder, I wish they would have actually played into a little more, but yeah, anyways.

SPEAKER_03 4:14:12

Yeah. Yeah. All right. So I put I put Dormamu in the Dark Dimension thing, but I also I put um Cayselius there. The I think that's the only time I'm gonna pronounce his name right. Um Mr. Calculus. I would like to know a little more of his story to make me like him.

SPEAKER_06 4:14:30

Yeah, it would be nice to know why Kelsium's the way he is.

SPEAKER_03 4:14:36

If we had like just one scene of him like training and then he stumbles upon the book and is tempted by it type thing. Or he he gets the same vision that Doctor Strange had type thing, but he's he's intrigued by it more instead of feared by it. That would make me at least understand him more or like him more. Um, so yeah, those are the two out of the things. I can go with that. I like that. Yeah, yeah. All right, so direction and production, directing style for you.

SPEAKER_06 4:15:06

Yeah, I'm gonna give you just an overall here. Music obviously is is still good. I like the music in this movie. The CGI is good, unfortunately, it's just uh repetitive and it's this kaleidoscope thing, I think was a great gimmick in thought, but then now that we've seen it, it's almost annoying. Um, the action in this I do like. I think some of the moves are silly. I think there is some over exaggeration. I think when they do certain things, there's too much of like one move and too much going on around them. Like I said, sometimes I feel like we're seeing a lot, but there's no substance. You know what I'm saying? So we're seeing a lot happening when there's really not anything happening. Um, I do love the portals, though. I think they're really cool. Um, and then CGI, I think it holds up, it looks good. I mean, it does look good. It's just I just don't know how much I care for it, is all um the cinematography, it's not very creative outside of those scenes, though. I'll say that. Um, and the director, I mean, I can't remember who directed this. Scott Derrickson. Yeah, I mean, cool. Good job. You you made you did you did you you you made a movie that doesn't suck. You know, so congratulations. But Scott needs to write us a letter and explain to us how Magic works, because I still don't get it.

SPEAKER_09 4:16:27

Do you?

SPEAKER_03 4:16:29

So everything on here I'm gonna say is got kind of similar to you. It's everything I just listed. Good, good, good. CGI quality, I put as okay. It's good. It's got weird moments, right? It does. The first standout moment I noticed of the CGI that made me question it was in the very beginning opening. After um the ancient one is doing her thing, as she's jumping down and everything's going back to normal. I immediately thought that looks like a PS2 game. Yeah, that looks weird, right? Yeah, yeah. That's the only time that really stuck out to me. And then the I could tell they put a lot more of their focus on like their astral projections and some of the kaleidoscope stuff. And it's good. I'm glad they did because they don't want to make those look too corny. But that was the one that really stuck out to me as like, ooh, they could have landed that a little bit better.

SPEAKER_06 4:17:20

Yeah, their astral projection stuff reminds me of Casper the Friendly Ghost for some reason. Um, not that it's a bad thing, but it's definitely like it's the first thing I think of for some reason. But yeah, it's how they move. You remember that old movie, the one that had Bill Pullman in it? It's just it just felt that way for some reason.

SPEAKER_03 4:17:36

Yeah. Music-wise, I put very good. Yeah, they're actually I noticed this in my second watch through. If you listen to that last end battle when they're fighting or everything's rewinding, you hear this harmonizing in the background of like the all these female voices underneath the music, and I think it really like has a nice touch to it. Yeah, there's some good choices in the music.

SPEAKER_06 4:18:02

So I I thought that was noteworthy. Well, Mark, they've definitely learnt that we music counts. Let's not be sloppy. Yeah. So it might not be the best. It might not be like, I'm not gonna download the soundtrack to this. Yeah. But it's at least it fits the film real well, you know.

SPEAKER_07 4:18:16

Yeah, yeah, I agree. All right, so why don't you get to your hot take? So here's my hot take.

SPEAKER_06 4:18:24

This movie is the actual 100% pure definition of mid. And it works now because you need this character in order to get what we got coming later, right? My hottest take of this though is this should have been Marvel's one and done only. In fact, I actually think you could have done better with Doctor Strange if he was introduced in someone else's movie. Although where they fail for me in this movie is you need one movie, like an actual movie to itself, where would they explain magic? And they still don't explain magic. I don't think that this character after this movie serves to have any other sequels. I don't think it should. And when we get to the one, we'll see why. I think that I think that supports this reason. But I also think that this movie should have focused more on not the character arc of Doctor Strange and how weird this one is here, the other one. Like maybe dial some of that back and really be clear to us what this magic stuff is. Because I get kind of what they're doing in this movie, but beyond this movie, now it's like how they use it and where it's implemented is where the question comes, right? And we still don't understand it. We're still at a loss. You know what I mean? And that's I blame that on Fige and them for not, you know, the not being, I don't know if it's not being prepared, or they just think we're just gonna go along with it. Because I worry it's always gonna be that magical thing that they can use out of nowhere that just solves the problem. And I kind of don't want that to be that way, you know. And this movie it I it's just a perfect example of this is as mid as you can get in the middle of how good things are. And I blame the Russos because you're talking at this point now, we've got at least two MCU movies that are downright amazing. You know? And what's the movie before this one?

SPEAKER_09 4:20:46

Civil War. Wow. Good luck.

SPEAKER_06 4:20:50

Right? And you feel it. I feel that. I feel that carry over. And then the next movie overshadowed this movie for sure. Unfortunately. Yeah. Perfect mid. It's better than I think it's better than Thor of the Dark Roll. I think it's on par with Captain America for the first Avenger. I think it's better than some of I think it's way better than The Hulk. I think it's better than Iron Man 2.

SPEAKER_09 4:21:21

Really?

SPEAKER_06 4:21:23

Um But it doesn't serve for a sequel. And truthfully, his character, I don't think, deserves its own movie, except it should have been more focused on magic. Because it magic needs a whole movie. And they just didn't utilize that that well. That's my hot take. This should have we should have never got Doctor Strange to. That should have been Wanda in the Multiverse of Madness, not Doctor Strange and the Multiverse of Madness. He could have still been in the movie and done what he did in the movie. It still would have been a bad movie at that point, but like it shouldn't have been his movie, you know. I think that his story is good enough to end here and then he'd be just be where what he's best at, which is showing up in other people's movies, you know.

SPEAKER_03 4:22:10

I um I noticed the pattern of when these type of movies come out, just like how we talked about with Ant-Man, what kind of saved it was in between an Avengers and a Civil War movie. What saved this movie is between Civil War and Thor Ragnarok, which that was a swing to. I'm sorry, not Thor Ragnarok. What's after this? Uh Guardians of the Galaxy, which that was already guaranteed, like because of how great.

SPEAKER_06 4:22:38

Which I know a lot of people don't care for, but you're gonna find out next week what I think of it. So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:22:45

Um I agree with your hot take. So this is why I wrote for my hot take.

SPEAKER_05 4:22:50

I just think he has I just think Ant-Man has more potential for a sequel than Doctor Strange does.

SPEAKER_03 4:22:56

I think this has potential to be its own trilogy. I just don't think they executed it well. They drop the ball on magic still. That's that see that's that where you're at with it too?

SPEAKER_01 4:23:08

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 4:23:09

Okay. Because I like Doctor Strange as a character, and like I said in this movie already, he has a complete character arc, and I want to see that progress forward in the sequel. I think that would have been cool. The problem is, and it's gonna lead me to my hot take here. Okay, go for it. The Doctor Strange films, or this film, or all of them really, there's only two, are one of the most free-for-all and thus frustrating aspects of the MCU. Continuity is vague. That's a quite way to put it, and explanations of magic concepts differ and at times contradict each other. Yeah. And it starts with this movie. You should, as like you said, establish a firm foundation of all right, the ancient one explained to us already how they do what magic is. It's pulling energy from other dimensions that they channel and use. And that creates magic. I get it. We got that concept down. Now we know what magic is. Now I want to see that whole training montage, him doing actual spells and how does that look in the MCU? What can he read versus what he can't read? Doing the difference between the we are, she is the sorcerer supreme, but we are all sorcerers, which means we do this, this, and this. Oh, that's different than the warlock. Oh, that's different than the witch. No, we are sorcerers. That's the stuff they did not know how to differentiate. And for some reason, they expected us to just know that when we got to WandaVision and then Doctor Strange 2. We don't know. Therefore, when we're watching this, we don't know what to follow. And that makes it so that's why I put on here most free-for-all, and thus it's the most frustrating of the MCU because we are very logical people. And when just in general, people in general, not just you and I, but in general, when you watch a movie, we figure it out. Exactly. We want to understand what's going on. And you don't have to spoon feed it to us like we're babies, but you just all you have to do is one or two lines and introducing concepts or doing one. This is a perfect movie to do a montage to explain this is how he learns these magic abilities. And then we don't have to watch that again to know when he does a magic thing. Oh, we know how he learned how to do that. And the most that we got was him doing that apple with the timestone, and even that wasn't explained how he did it, he just picked it up and just started doing it after he looked at a book for a moment. That's not enough. That doesn't that doesn't help us as the audience know this is actually something that we need to pay attention to, right? Or understand at least, so we can enjoy the movie a little bit better. Yep. So um I put on here the book about time spells, which also just um what did I write here? Oh, was also dictates how to use the timestone somehow allows ripples between dimensions and mentions it um a part in particular the dark dimension. Why didn't um calculus there steal the eye of Agamardo in the beginning if he stole those same pages that he used? Right. That that doesn't make any sense. There's a little hole right there in your whole your whole plot. He knows of the timestone because of that book and those pages. That's how he knew about it. And then how did the use of the timestone, the way they did it, and how they showed it for both him and his enemies to break free of that rewind, not create branches and paradoxes? Yeah, if it was supposed to happen this way, and then you do that weird thing, and all of a sudden you're now fighting, is that supposed to be what was supposed to happen, or did you that's the whole weird thing about this the the time thing and and it might just be me. And guys, please comment down below if you're watching us on YouTube or you're listening to us on the audio, go on to the YouTube thing and comment on below to explain to me how do they use magic in the MCU and why did that not this whole fight?

SPEAKER_06 4:27:17

I think I do. All right, it's the magic I have trouble with.

SPEAKER_03 4:27:21

Explain to me the time thing just so I understand it.

SPEAKER_06 4:27:24

I might be wrong. This is just how I've been taking it, okay? So I think that you use the time thing on something specific. It's not everything. Does that make sense? Why I say that is because I think everything that you see the timestone used in has always been a specific thing. Like when he did it to the apple, he's not doing it to everything, it's just the apple. Right. When Thanos does it to Vision and the time in the head in the mindstone, it's just everybody else doesn't get back up and where they were. It's just that, right? So when he's doing it to this event, it's just this event that he's doing it to. It's not the rest of the world. So I think the branches only change when it you incorporate everything. Does that make sense? Because he's only changing that one thing that this it's like it's like you know, me doing this and then going like this and setting that back up like it didn't happen. Doesn't change anything that's happened in this timeline. It just changed the hammer itself.

SPEAKER_03 4:28:35

In other words, from my understanding, because I'm trying to think about it when it came to the Loki thing and all that. He was Loki was supposed to be captured and go to Asgard, but because he is out there free.

SPEAKER_09 4:28:53

Um see if I explain this. But this is this isn't that's not the timestone problem though. No, it's not because that's just an MCU continuity thing.

SPEAKER_03 4:29:00

Yeah. Right. Yeah, because he I just had it a moment ago in my head. And that's see, that's why this gets a little confusing, guys. It gets tough, right? Yeah, so I get it for this, for this the this end of the state. The timestone itself makes sense to me. Yeah, you can't just use it for everything on something. Yep. Right. Yes, that's right, because they didn't use the timestone when they did the Loki thing. They just went back in time to all to grab something and in doing something. They accidentally altered yeah, they they went back to grab the stone, but in in the chaos of what happened, it altered what the plan was supposed to be. So that created. Which has nothing to do with the time zone at the time. No, it doesn't.

SPEAKER_06 4:29:43

It's them time traveling altered things, everything.

SPEAKER_03 4:29:46

If they did exactly what Bruce explained to the ancient one in Endgame, where they return back to that same moment and just hand it back to them. It there's no time branches that ever gets created. That's what they're explaining on the rooftop there. Okay, so that makes more sense to me now. That this this wouldn't create that. So my apologies on that.

SPEAKER_06 4:30:04

It gets a No, I get it, because I used to always have the same trouble with it. But then I've realized, okay, the timestone works on things, on moments, not as a whole, which is kind of which I'm glad because it would be just a if it did just work, like, oh, that didn't work, so just reverse everything. Yeah, like to me that would be a cop out. Yeah, like with this, is you actually have to be strategic on how you use it. You know, or you could use it wrong, you know, or it wouldn't help you, right? So yeah, that's that's at least how I feel about the time. Like right now, he's using it specifically on this moment, on him and Dormammu. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_03 4:30:39

Like, yeah. Well, one little side note, I appreciate that Dormammu is not just a flying head, because it looks like he is, but then when you see him hit him, he is an actual, he has a body.

SPEAKER_06 4:30:52

You don't really see much of it, but he looks like a big speaker. It's always actually like if you watch this with no sound on, you just like wait, wait, wait, wait until he comes back on. Okay, they're reversing, and then here he is again. And blah blah blah blah. Oh, this is awesome. I love all this.

SPEAKER_03 4:31:12

That place looks really cool.

SPEAKER_06 4:31:13

I'd like to hang out there. It does look like the quantum realm you.

SPEAKER_05 4:31:17

Yeah, just if you lighten it up a little bit and put the sun in there.

SPEAKER_06 4:31:20

Oh, I see the body now. Yeah, look at it. His face is like it's just like he's just a speaker, like someone driving by with a radio on too loud.

SPEAKER_03 4:31:31

And funny enough, it's it's um it's Benedict Cumberbatch divorces Dormammu.

SPEAKER_06 4:31:37

Oh, that's cool. Yeah, Benedict does it.

SPEAKER_03 4:31:38

Which makes sense because he did smog and stuff, and he could do that voice. So I totally get it. Anyways, um, to move move on from there, um, all right. Uh best scene in the movie for you.

SPEAKER_09 4:31:55

The astrophite.

SPEAKER_07 4:31:56

Yep. I like this here, but I like the astrophythy more.

SPEAKER_09 4:32:00

Yep.

SPEAKER_07 4:32:01

Okay.

SPEAKER_09 4:32:02

Least best scene, I agree with you. Least best scene.

SPEAKER_06 4:32:05

Um probably it was hard for me to pick just a bad thing. There's nothing that's awful, right? Yeah. There's nothing awful that goes on. But I guess the least best scene is I don't care for th his interaction with um the ancient one when they're outside Astro Project as she's dying. Not a fan of that scene. No, I I like that there's things that's happening there that I don't know, I like there's complexity to her. I just it just didn't it was it tried to have the feels and it failed for me. It just didn't it just didn't have it. I don't know.

SPEAKER_03 4:32:53

I get you. I get you. Um I can't for at least best scene for me, I I had a hard time really picking one there because it was just I don't know. There was nothing that stuck out to me that said, this is horrible. Why do we have this?

SPEAKER_06 4:33:10

You know Yeah, I was just trying to if I had to pick something. Yeah. I try to make myself pick one even when there isn't a many. Like we just did Titanic, and it how do you pick one in Titanic? So it's like I think that you have to I think you need to force yourself to find if you had to pick out of all the good, which one would be the least. That's why I said that one, I guess. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:33:35

Okay. I'll I'll think about that a little harder for future ones, but I don't have anyone at the top of my my head.

SPEAKER_07 4:33:41

Um best villain moment for you. Yeah, this the beginning, his his introduction. Yep, mine too, that the the app and all that. Yeah. That's exactly what I wrote down. Most punchable face.

SPEAKER_06 4:33:53

So I wanted to punch Carl at least three different times in his movie. He just is really whiny.

SPEAKER_09 4:34:02

He just bugs me. So I'm gonna give it to Carl. Okay.

SPEAKER_03 4:34:08

Um I had a hard time with that one too. Part of me wanted I I agree with you in the Carl thing. Part of me wanted to. Um until the end of the movie, I was you're thinking about it. I was thinking about it. Yeah, for being that that typical strict librarian thing. I'm like, oh come on, we had enough of you. Um I I wrote down the doctors that enabled him. Yeah. Every one of them don't enable him. Yeah, that that's a good point. Yeah. I think this will work as uh costly and experimental, but it may work. He's like, that's all I need. Be like, no. Yeah, stop. Don't just tell him no. Tell him no, tell him the go deal with it. Anyways, um, one prop you take home.

SPEAKER_06 4:35:02

Oh, I mean, the sling ring is cool, you know, but I kind of like the eye of Agamoto.

SPEAKER_03 4:35:09

I think that'd be sick. That's cool, that's good. I picked the piece of paper that had his signatures on it. Oh, nice. Okay, I like that. Yeah, I thought that's something that's unique for the first movie and he's learning and all that stuff. Because I almost wrote the watch and I thought, I hate that watch. I don't want that watch. Yeah, no, I hate that watch too.

SPEAKER_06 4:35:29

It's an awful watch. Yikes. Yeah. Is that your favorite thing, Sammy? I'm like, yeah, I don't like the watch either.

SPEAKER_03 4:35:36

So no, I'm not a fan of the watch. All right. Um, oh, what's next here? Okay. Most underrated moment. I don't have one. My underrated and overrated are the same thing. Which I that's kind of controversial. Yeah, it's weird, isn't it? Yeah, what is it? Yeah. All right. I might agree with you because I struggle with both of these. It's the ancient one revealing that she draws power from the dark dimension. Gotcha. I know where you're going with this. Yep. All right. So it's underrated because that is that was kind of like a surprise in the movie a little bit, that why she's living that long. She's the same thing she's warning them about, the how bad the dark dimension is. She's actually drawing power from it. So it's kind of underrated in that regard. That that is it shows what very powerful magic can do if you utilize it correctly. Gotcha. It's also overrated because who the heck cares? Gotcha. I know that Mortal, like he's whining about what if it overtook her? She's been living for how long and it hasn't overtaken her yet.

SPEAKER_06 4:36:42

Like that's one of the times I want to just punch him in the face. Yeah. Yeah. You need to calm down. You know, it's like you gotta clearly she's okay. Yeah. It's like she doesn't, you know, it's not like she's Gollum. You know, it's not like she's like, then I'd be like, yeah, there's a problem. I mean, I guess the first question would be, does she always look like she looks like we're right now? He'd be like, yes, but she's fine.

SPEAKER_00 4:37:02

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:37:03

Because if you're telling me a couple years ago she had a bunch of hair, then maybe she's cheating.

SPEAKER_07 4:37:08

Exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:37:10

No, so that's I that's why I put us both overrated and underrated. Yeah. I dig. I like it. I would I would subscribe to that. I feel like it fits her as a character being so complex that we Yeah. Yeah. So you give her a hell a lot more credit than I do. I do, I really do. All right. Well, so what's yours over and underrated?

SPEAKER_06 4:37:30

I'm gonna I'm gonna stick with yours because I didn't fill those out yet. I didn't in my head, I it's been tough because like I said, I don't feel like there's anything in this movie that makes me want to turn it off. And I don't think there's any in this movie that gets me too excited either. Yeah. So it's tough, you know. So but that point you make, I think, is a very good. I'm I can go with that. Okay.

unknown 4:37:50

All right.

SPEAKER_03 4:37:50

Uh, funniest moment for you.

SPEAKER_06 4:37:52

Um, I do like when he hands him the piece of paper and he says, What is this, my mantra? And he goes, 'Nope, this is a Wi-Fi password.' We're not savage.

SPEAKER_03 4:37:58

I thought about that. That's a good one. That's funny. I did laugh out loud. I'm like, that's a funny joke. I like that one. I I had two. Um, one of them was the Beyonce references. I thought that was cool. Well, you want one name like Cher or Beyoncé. You've heard a Beyoncé, right? And then he's soliciting the single ladies. Yeah. That's pretty funny. Um, the second thing is, and this was kind of an impromptu in the filming. It wasn't part of the script, but happened and how she reacted was perfect when the mop fell. Oh, okay. So that wasn't supposed to happen, but they were filming her, and then she like did this weird when the mop hit the ground because she was scared. I love all those jump scares that featured her in it. It was it was believable and they're funny. Yeah, I agree.

unknown 4:38:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:38:42

All right. Most most emotional moment for you. So, yeah, I'm gonna go the opposite. Usually it's sad. This is a little sad, but usually super sad moments. But I I like the moment when he's sitting in his apartment and it's raining outside and him and her and he's real nasty to her. I mean, I don't like it that he's nasty to her, but it's the best acting from him in it. And it's it's why I gave her best act acting in it, because the reaction back is the sadder part, but I think there's that scene has the most emotion in it to me that I could connect with, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_03 4:39:16

I can see that. I I should have put that as my most emotional moment.

SPEAKER_06 4:39:20

Um, we usually don't do something that early. Yeah it's usually not something that's more of an anger thing than anything else, but it really it it I wish the rest of the movie had that kind of heaviness. I may have taken it a little differently, you know.

SPEAKER_03 4:39:35

Yeah. No, I get it. I like that scene. That's that's actually a really good pick, honestly, um, compared to mine. I put mine as the ancient one and strange in the astral projection as she's dying. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:39:47

I know they tried for me and it just didn't it's because of her. Because I just don't feel like about her like you do. Yeah. I get it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:39:53

I I liked the her end sentence where I'm this is this are a thousand moments I'm trying to capture just so I could see that bolt of lightning. And I thought, no, that's really sweet for this. Is the view she wants to have when she's dying. Yeah. So because she likes to be weird. Like, yeah, like she couldn't see lightning at any other time. You could have done this anytime. And her thousands and thousands of years she's been alive, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:40:17

This is okay. It's out of nowhere, is what you're thinking of right now. It's like, no. Still not worried about the world ending, by the way. Yes. Yeah. Just about that bowl of lightning that she's seen a thousand million times already, and you know it.

SPEAKER_03 4:40:32

Anyway. All right. Final scores, y'all. So, out of two, what's the story for you? I give it a one. Okay, I did the same thing. Uh characters. I give it a one. Yep, I gave it a one. Action and visuals? I give it a one. Okay. I gave that a two at least. Yep. Uh emotions and sakes. I give it a one. I gave it a one as well. Rewatchability and MCU Impact. I give it a one. I give it a one. We're the same thing except for that one I went up a little bit more.

SPEAKER_06 4:41:02

You see a trend with me during all these scores.

SPEAKER_09 4:41:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:41:06

This one at least. Your final score, sir. So I'm gonna say if you throw the poster up, there we are. It's Doctor Strange, blah, blah, blah. Just so you know, this is middle ground as you get, I think this movie lands and a perfect five on the chart. Okay. Because it's not bad, but it certainly isn't that good either. But it's it's just right dead smack in the middle, right where it belongs, and I think they earned that middle part.

SPEAKER_03 4:41:34

Okay. On both ends. I had given it a six, which to me and some of my scoring, it's a little low for me, but it's not the lowest. So the official Goodell Multiverse score will be a 5.5 out of 10. I see it. I see it on the poster. I think it works.

SPEAKER_05 4:41:52

Yep.

SPEAKER_06 4:41:52

All right, your one sentence final review. Um, if you like Doctor Strange, this is your movie. You should watch it. You'll like him as Doctor Strange, I get it. If you like Doctor Strange, that's what's it. And just to add to that, somebody put in the comments, explain magic to me, please. Please. These guys did a whole movie of it. I'm still kind of like, oh, I understand the timestone more than I do magic yet, and it's kind of weird, right?

SPEAKER_03 4:42:22

So yeah, that's all I got. Yeah. I put um if you don't re-watch this movie multiple times in a row, you can enjoy it for what it is. Because I found That's a great play, it's a great way to say it. It might just be me because maybe I overwatch this to be honest, five times. Usually I watch a lot, usually I watch them three times at least before review, but I just kept putting it on every night because I'm like, why not? Um and I got more confused as each rewatch started. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 4:42:53

And I'm like, that's not good. I'll be honest with you, even movies. There's a very small list of movies I could watch five times in a week. You know? I don't I don't know if you did yourself a service by watching it that many times. Yeah, it's it's tough because like we want to find this balance of we want to give you guys the best retrospective we can. So watching it once isn't fair. And maybe you could say that about me with this one this time, because this week was a wild week. I had to run, I had to go to DC. And I gotta tell you, I only got I only had the chance to watch this once. Um, but that was also because I had Titanic in there to throw in, and guys, Titanics are no easy feat to get through. Oh, yeah. Especially when you got a hot-pack schedule. But like, so I wish I had watched this more than once and not just once and in pieces. Um so technically I did see it twice, but the second time was in three different settings. Um, but to sit and watch it five times might be too much. You know, I'm thinking I'm two to three, I think is fair to our retrospective audience. I'd say two for sure. Um, three is if you really need to. Because it's a lot of time. That's a lot, this is a lot of time to watch these movies. Yeah. Um, but there's not many that I could watch five times in a week. It's a very small list of movies that I could tolerate. So I give you a lot of credit for being able to. By the time you got through the fifth one, you had to be kind of like, I don't know if I like this damn movie. Because like I I don't know if I would like it that much. I I could go the rest of my life and not see this movie again.

SPEAKER_03 4:44:31

Oh, right now I could go over two years at least and not need to watch this movie. I could not see it again. I but I will say I was it was better watching this five times than watching the incredible Hulk three times. That that's and that's crazy, right? That's wild. Yikes. Yeah, it says a lot about and I like Hulk a little bit more than Doctor Strange, but that movie, man.

SPEAKER_06 4:44:54

That's tough.

SPEAKER_03 4:44:56

All right. Well, thank you guys for staying with us with the Goodell Multiverse podcast, and you've been able to listen through all of our stuff. Thank you for being avid listeners if you are. So we really do greatly appreciate you. Um, every download you do, like you do, comment that you do, and share that you do really makes us very happy because it's what we do for fun. So thank you for staying with us. Or if you're new to the podcast, please like, please subscribe, follow us on um Facebook, Instagram, TikTok, and uh stream us wherever you stream your podcasts, and we're on YouTube and things like that. So, Ike, what is coming up next?

SPEAKER_06 4:45:32

So, guys, keep an eye out for the release of our X-Men One special retrospective, which I'm excited for y'all to watch. We've been watching tastes of it and getting glimpses, and Sammy's been working real hard on it. And boy, does it look good! And this is our meat and potatoes, guys. So, if there's anything that you're gonna come into and plug into and share with your friends, it's this X-Men thing. Get on it, because this is why we started the podcast in the first place. And then we're also gonna go into a retrospective of Guardians of the Galaxy. Volume two. Volume two. And now do we have any branch points for next week?

SPEAKER_03 4:46:06

No. So next week we're doing uh one more trivia takedown segment. I believe we're doing hot takes. Yeah, we're gonna do hot takes, right? Yep. Yep. And then after that, we're gonna be putting the trivia takedown on pause for a little bit because we got a couple of branch points that we're gonna be doing. And and guys, once we get into phase four onward, we've decided to do our our um the the Disney Plus shows as our branch point breakdown so we stay in line with our March to Doomsday so we could be able to get er everyone all caught up right until the week before Avengers Doomsday actually comes out if we stick to our schedule. So yeah, so that's exciting.

SPEAKER_06 4:46:45

Yeah, so keep an eye out for all this stuff, guys. Uh, I will be doing another Dark Dimension episode that'll be coming out real soon. I know I've been I've had put it off now for almost three weeks. I apologize to anyone out there that's looking for one. Um trust me, I'll give you a little more content this time and we'll have fun talking. But it's just it has just been a wild couple weeks. My old my youngest daughter just graduated on top of it. So then this week I had a uh bus run to to DC. I drive school bus for everybody out there that needs to know. I'm not gonna tell you what's cool. But it, you know, I had to go down to Washington, D.C. and stay the night, and it's just been a it's been a wild couple weeks. So, you know, we had a lot of stuff going on, family things going on last week on top of it. So I will I will get back into doing that, guys. I have some real good plans. Sam and I we have great plans. We we want to watch one on a projector outside next to the pool and then talk about it. I maybe we can tell them it's gonna be tremors, guys. So hold on for that. Um, but yeah, and we have some plans for other ones too. And other than that, if you guys have any other questions too, definitely hit us up at our Gmail. It's Godell Multiverse at uh gmail.com. You know what I mean? You can send us any kind of questions there. We'll talk to them about it there. Hit us up on all your fun features, all the fun, you know, Instagrams and face tags and snapbooks and all that stuff. You know what I'm saying? Let's have a good time with that. And uh and and you know, watch us on YouTube. I love watching ours. I often watch ours actually when I'm reviewing ours a lot. I found that there's some podcasts I've had to kind of catch up on that I listen to because I've been listening to ours more just to critique us and how we talk and trying to get better at this. But as we do this, I get more natural. I really don't feel like there's a the right or wrong way to do this. Yeah, no, we're it's the best part is we're just talking, having a good time.

SPEAKER_05 4:48:31

But yeah, this is just us two. Yeah. So we don't put on the show, we just talk.

SPEAKER_01 4:48:36

I cannot wait to get into our retrospective next week of Guardians of Galaxy Volume 2. Oh, that I can't wait.

SPEAKER_03 4:48:42

I'm gonna limit myself to three times watching it, not like this one, but I am I am looking forward to this one.

SPEAKER_06 4:48:48

Yeah, you guys are gonna find out. I'm I'm in a small minority of people that really like this movie, and I have will have a lot to say. So hopefully Sammy brings a little bit so we can kind of have a good debate, but at the same time, you know, I I have a lot to say about the movie. I think it's I think it's pretty good. I think it's good. Although, you know, it has been a while since I've seen it, so maybe with my critical eye, and I'm trying to be a little harder on them because I'm trying to make it, you know. Once again, guys, we're talking about the cream of the crop when it comes down to Marvel or to comic book movies. So on our scale of one to ten, you know, we're still doing a scale of one to ten on movies that we never thought we'd ever get to see. And truthfully, they're all pretty good. As much as I complain about the Incredible Hulk, it's not the worst. No, you know, there's awful movies out there, guys. So, like, so when our numbers are low, and you know, I can't believe you give it a two. How can you guys say you're fans if if you give things twos and threes and fives? You're talking to out of a scale from the best to the best. So, like, it's you know, so yeah.

SPEAKER_03 4:49:51

Well, even then, if we are fans like how hardcore fans we are, we give it a two, you need to pay attention to that. It's critical. There's a reason why we're giving it that, right? Yes, yeah, we're not giving it just to be mean, we're giving it because someone really dropped the ball somewhere. We don't want it to happen again. That's right. That's so. Anyways, thank you guys for tuning in to us. Please like, subscribe, share of a friend, share of a family member, share of an enemy. Get us out there, guys. And until next time, we'll see you at the movies. Dormamo