Everything Kingdom Podcast

College Ministry explained simply with guest speaker Ryan McSwane

• Lucky Reagan Njumba • Season 2 • Episode 8

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🎙️ Welcome back to the Everything Kingdom Podcast! 

In this exciting episode, your host Lucky sits down with Ryan, Director of Young Life in NYC, to break down what college ministry is really all about—and why it matters now more than ever.

From navigating faith on campus to building meaningful community and helping students discover purpose, Ryan shares powerful stories, practical wisdom, and plenty of real-life moments from the front lines of ministry in New York City. Whether you’re a college student, young adult leader, parent, or someone passionate about the next generation, this conversation is packed with insight, encouragement, and a lot of fun along the way.

🎧 In this episode, we talk about:
• What college ministry actually looks like
• The challenges students are facing today
• Faith, identity, and purpose in college life
• Creating authentic connections on campus
• Real stories and lessons from ministry in NYC

Be sure to like, comment, subscribe, and share this episode with someone who needs encouragement and inspiration today!

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#EverythingKingdomPodcast #CollegeMinistry #YoungLife #ChristianPodcast #FaithAndCulture #CollegeLife #YoungAdults #NYCMinistry #FaithJourney

SPEAKER_04

A lot less control the money. A lot less control. Right now all I can do is just share them with them in the middle, create spaces for them to encounter God, and then see what God does.

SPEAKER_00

Hello there. Welcome back to the Everything Kingdom podcast. It's me, your host Lucky, and I'm so glad to be back in the studio with you. I'm so glad by the time you get to watch this episode, uh, it's gonna be amazing. Today is a beautiful day. I have an amazing guest in the studio. He's not just my friend, but he's also like equipped in areas that I know I was struggling to even find grace for. He's in college ministry, worked with Young Life, and it's just full of joy and wisdom. And uh I can't wait for you guys to get to know Ryan. Hello. Welcome to the studio.

SPEAKER_04

Thank you. It's good to be here. How are you doing? I'm doing well. Doing well. Yeah. Good day so far.

SPEAKER_00

I'm so glad you're here.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, me too. It's it's good to finally be in your in your studio.

SPEAKER_00

I've been asking you for over four months to come on to this place and um finally get an opportunity to have you in here. So glad that you came. So thank you. My pleasure, man. My pleasure. We have uh um a routine. We call it not a ritual, but a culture where we break bread. Every single time we gather together, or we just buy ourselves, we take communion. You know this about me, I won't tell you. But we're gonna do the same for the sake of our listeners that we are not just taking communion for our own selves, we take it on your behalf that the grace of God would meet you whatever that you're watching this from. So we're just gonna go ahead and grab our elements and um we're gonna thank the Lord for making a provision that the forgiveness of our sins lies in his body and his blood, and us having faith in that. So, King Jesus, thank you for your broken body. Thank you that your beatings and your wounds they became healing onto our bodies. Lord, we honor you and we give thanks to you. We thank you for all that you've done. We thank you for all the grace that you've given us.

SPEAKER_01

We take this in remembrance of what you've done. Thank you, God, Lord. In the same measure, we thank you for your blood.

SPEAKER_00

That is the forgiveness of our sins. We thank you that on behalf of those that are watching this episode, that you and your blood, God, would go before them for the forgiveness of their sins, but also for the generations to come.

SPEAKER_01

We honor you, God. Oh, that was just beautiful.

SPEAKER_00

Jesus, thank you. Thank you, thank you. Brian, I'm so glad you came to the studio. What I envision us to talk about today or the topic today is the kingdom for the next generation. You work with young life.

SPEAKER_03

I sure do.

SPEAKER_00

Could you be gracious enough to tell our listeners who you are, your story on how you came to know God and what you do?

SPEAKER_04

Sure. Please. Yes, I can do that. So grew up in a Christian home in Texas. Funnily enough, my parents, both Christians, love the Lord to this day, tried not to tell me about Jesus at first because they wanted me to figure it out when I was a little bit older. But I overheard my mom sharing the gospel on the phone with a friend. Remember thinking, okay, well, if that's what Jesus is like, I want that. So I still remember five-year-old Ryan on this black and white checkered floor, gave my life to Jesus the best I knew how, and told my mom, and she was like, dang it. You know, she was trying to wait. But she she would tell you now there's a different kid after that.

SPEAKER_02

Wow.

SPEAKER_04

But I didn't, and I would say from then on, I had the spirit, I had a strong moral compass. I was kind of the priest of my friends, but didn't really know how to live out my faith and had some like ups and downs. And later in life, I had a brother, my older brother, Patrick, got schizophrenia, and he battled with that for about nine years, ended up taking his own life in August of 2012. So that was really hard. After that, I kind of did whatever I wanted, which was mostly play video games and drink a lot and play dominoes. I had a great time. But I would say I was pretty apathetic to the world, pretty numb is how I felt. And my old young life leader, for those of you who don't know Young Life, we empower a lot of volunteers to build relationships with students where they're at. And the one who did that for me was leading again with a new set of students. And he was like, Ryan, I want you to come and lead young life with me. And I told him, but I was drunk last night. I don't think you want me leading young life. He's like, Well, just come. I'm like, okay, I'll come. Well, we found out that uh a guy got a girl pregnant uh in our group. And Tom's like, Ryan will mentor you. I'm like, I will not. I'm still getting drunk almost every single night. He's like, Don't worry. This guy named John Crady is gonna help you mentor him. So I started meeting with this kid, with a guy named John Cradi to read the Bible.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

The kid found out the girl lied. She wasn't pregnant.

SPEAKER_00

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_04

And so he was like, Well, I don't need y'all anymore. Later, peace out. And then John looks at me, he's like, Well, you wanted to read the Bible just you and I? I'm like, sure. Yeah, I know. It's that easy. As soon as, as soon as he found out, he left us. But after that, it's okay, it's okay. I know. It's very funny. But God uses all things. After that, I read the Bible, this guy named John, every week for the next five years. Yeah. And that's where my faith really took off. And I would say it made my faith my own.

SPEAKER_00

Wow.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Why what what were you doing before the Young Life call? What is your background?

SPEAKER_04

After I graduated college from Texas Tech, I got a civil engineering degree and I was a civil engineer in East Texas for a small company. I was their first hire, and I designed pools and water parks for a living. Sounds pretty cool, right? So that's what I did.

SPEAKER_00

So you chose to move away from a career that you went to school for into young life, or what we call college ministry. Why is that?

SPEAKER_04

There's two main reasons. So I was a civil engineer for five years before I ever made the switch, but about year three, I started to sense that, and I should say, once John and I started reading the Bible together, I really took young life seriously. My faith grew. And so with that, my leadership grew. I started leading my own crew of students, my own Bible studies, all those things. So that was happening at this time. And I remember as I was designing water parks or pools or whatever, that the whole time I'd always be thinking about young life nonstop. And so I thought, well, if I'm thinking about young life all the time, why don't I just do that? Then I thought, if I'm on my deathbed looking back on my life, what would I be proud of? And it was none of the things that I helped build. It was always young life stuff. So with those two epiphanies, that kind of set my trajectory for the next two years to kind of figure out how to start ministry with your life.

SPEAKER_00

I thought you were going to say because of the guy who left and they want to make sure no one lives there.

SPEAKER_04

No. No. Very little effect.

SPEAKER_00

That's that made my day serious. That's hilarious. But that's just an incredible story, too, how you would move for something that you studied you loved to like you start feeling a calling to do something else.

SPEAKER_04

I wouldn't say I love civil engineering. I wasn't bad at it. Like I tried really hard, but I wasn't great at it. Lucky. Like I had I like math and science. That stuff was fun. But my coworkers, they would like read engineering magazines for fun. Wow. I'm not going to do that. As soon as it hit five o'clock.

SPEAKER_00

There's no German blood in you at all. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. Exactly. Zero percent. But as soon as it hit five o'clock, I was thinking about young life stuff. And I was good at that. Like I bore fruit and that stuff. Like people affirmed that. They're like, hey, we see you doing this. I think you should consider staff. So yeah, I I liked my job, but I was not that great at it.

SPEAKER_00

So you're one of the leaders uh for Young Life in New York City. And um you've been that you've been in that sort of ministry for like five years. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And uh you go to college. Tell tell tell our listeners like what do you what does what do you exactly do for Young Life?

SPEAKER_04

Sure. So I work for a faith-based nonprofit called Young Life. We uh empower volunteers to go meet students on their turf where they are, to build relationships. And through that relationship, we hope and pray that Jesus is going to kind of walk through one heart to the other. Very life on life, very low pressure. We have our model of like um events that we do and camp and trips and all these things. But the main way I could summarize it is we're really for the spiritually disinterested. That's the key term. We aren't necessarily for the person who would want to go to a Bible study or want to go to church. We're not necessarily for, although we love these types, the type of student that is really warm to the idea of Jesus, um, although we get those, but we really think about how do we reach the student who would never want to step foot in a church or a Bible study. That's what we think about on our main method is relationships. We exist in high schools, middle schools, teen parents, and students with special needs. And I run college within Young Life. So it's my job as a college director of the greater New York City area to get young life expressions and chapters at different colleges by forming teams, training them, seeing them on the campus, training students that come to know Jesus to reach their friends. That's in essence what I do.

SPEAKER_00

That's just brilliant. And I think that's just beautiful and fun in a way that at the same time is I think it's challenging. The reason I say that is you are a faith-based person, and you're going to form a relationship to someone who has no grid for who God is. And you have a faith to believe that actually in the end, go, I want to connect with this person so well, so much so that in hope that at least they get a chance to hear about who God is.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, they will 100% hear about who God is. It cannot be helped. But whether they're interested or not, we we stick with them. We tell them that on the front end. New Yorkers, they have a good eye for like hidden agendas. New Yorkers, I always say they're not mean, but they are suspicious. And so we genuinely and we mean this, like if they never come to know Jesus, we will still have their back in whatever way we can think of.

SPEAKER_00

So your ministry is relational.

SPEAKER_04

Very relational.

SPEAKER_00

I choose to call it discipleship. Yeah. That's how I want to see it as. But the way you've chosen to go about it is connection best, not with an eutral motive like, I want to convert this person to Christianity. I want to make this person lose. I mean, at the end of the day, what I think I've seen you guys trying to do is I'm going to leave out the hands and feet of Jesus in the person of how I live, and I'll leave the choice to the other person that I'm relating to to see if they'll be able to make that choice on their own without me having to shove Jesus in their throat.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. And it doesn't work when you do, anyways. Like, you can't make someone believe anything. And so if you try to force Jesus down their throat, it's not going to work. Like maybe they can change their outside a little bit to kind of reflect because they like you or want to be accepted, but Jesus is after the heart, right? So it doesn't really work, anyways. But yes, very low pressure, very life-on-life discipleship. Uh, we have our framework of what we use so they get a chance to hear the gospel. But yeah, if they're not interested, then okay. Like I get that. I'm here if you ever want to talk about it. And that has happened. I mean, I had a student who graduated, he's a Muslim. He came to a Bible study one time, and then all he did, the entire Bible study, was write about this girl that he really liked. Like his girlfriend. He was just writing love letters to his girlfriend. Could have cared less. And I did first Corinthians 13, love chapter. Like, this is gonna be perfect for him because I knew that's where he was at. No interest. Oh God. But after he graduated, he called me asking for prayer. He's like, Hey, I can't really talk about what, but I would I would really love some prayer. If you can pray for me, yeah, sure, I'd love to.

SPEAKER_00

Wow. So yeah. The whole time he was there, though he had like, I have an interest.

SPEAKER_04

Oh, couldn't have made it more clear, he he could have cared less. And the only reason he was there and he told me this, I'm only here because of you. Like because I like you and you're my guy.

unknown

Wow.

SPEAKER_04

And that's a lot of it. A lot of times these students, hey, I don't really want to go to that Christian event, but I like you. So I'll I'll go because you're there. Right? The relationship really matters. Wow.

SPEAKER_00

So you're training your volunteers to like, hey, you gotta make sure that you're relational. There have to be no agendas at all. But the goal is this. I think the reason I ask that you said something that's so powerful. And I think this is for anyone listening and whether it's in ministry, for anyone listening, this is what for me I feel like is deliverance to me. Ryan just said right now that you cannot make anyone believe anything. I think that is so powerful. Because sometimes I think we as Christians, we want to think that it is incumbent upon us to lead someone to the board. Yet the way I've seen you guys do it is like, no, my responsibility is to succeed. Mm-hmm and I'll let Jesus be the one to cause growth.

SPEAKER_04

It is a humbling experience. I would say New Yorkers are just more upfront about you can't make me believe anything. Others that I've worked with may try, but New Yorkers are like, no, I don't, no, I'm not buying that. You know, they're just very, very bold with their thoughts. I would say it's not like we don't have an agenda per se. We're just very upfront with it. Like there was one student who asked me once, he's like, What's your plan with me? I'm like, well, honestly, I want you to know Jesus. That's my plan. Like, I'm hoping that happens. But even if you don't, you're still my guy. Uh, so that's kind of how we think about it. And whenever we talk about discipleship, it's this key go to where they are. It's based off John 1, where it says uh that the word became flesh and dwelt among us. Jesus came to our turf where we were, he came out of heaven and dwelt with us. So if you wanted to reach college students, where would you go? Colleges. It's probably where they are. That is their turf. And so we go and we meet them on their turf. But then it's a mutual living life together. I have students who will come grocery shopping with me, or they'll come to church with me if they want to. A lot of them, they're warming up to the idea. Uh, I work on campus a lot of the times because they're around. Um, I invite them to my birthday party. One of my favorite stories, there's this girl who works for us named Angie, who does ministry in New Jersey. And when she had her birthday party, a lot of her New Jersey students showed up to her birthday with all of her other friends. She included them in her life. So that's that's what we're about. Like live, be in their lives and invite them into yours. So there's an unintentionality to it in doing that. Yeah. Treat them as friends. How would you how would you behave around a friend? Would you invite them to hang out? Invite them to hang out.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. There's definitely a sacrificial beginning to where you go to them first, right? So, oh, you like Smash Bros, bet, I'll play Smash Bros. with you. You like tennis? Let's try it. I'm in.

SPEAKER_03

I'm not good, but I'll try it. You know?

SPEAKER_00

So my my question would be there's so many other New Yorkers. There's so many other people all over the world that needs to hear the gospel. Why did you choose college students? Like, why the young people, why the next generation? What caused you to go there? What like what was the uh the thing in your heart that made you feel like there's something that needs to be done with college students? Why that?

SPEAKER_04

Short answer is because I like them. They're they're my preference to hang out with. I was being interviewed for a young life job, which is high school. And I remember in the interview, I was like, you know, I would take this job if I could kind of get rid of freshmen, sophomores, and juniors and only work with seniors. And then I'm like, huh. I think the older they get, the more I enjoy their company. So that's in short, like I love college students. They're my favorite people to hang out with. They are my actual friends. I really enjoy them. And not everyone says that. I remember talking to somebody who does middle schoolers. She feels the same way about them, how I feel about college students. I love the way they think. I love the autonomy that they have, I love the questions they're asking, their humor, the freedom that they do have to kind of experiment and see things in a different way and challenge what they once knew. And then they're confident enough to challenge the status quo. And I like that. They dream big, they have ambition. That's fun to me.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, uh, it is very interesting to uh to see most parents, and I've recognized this as a culture in the US, maybe all over the world. Most parents, when they don't know what to do, uh when it comes to our kids, we just send them to college and we are hoping that college will teach them life. But you actually playing a role of being a dad, a friend, a brother to so many of these kids that you just meet or you just met even as strangers. And you're changing their lives and they're having an experience of not just God through you or through your team or through young life, but it's just I I think I don't know. I in my heart of hearts, the reason as why even I wanted you to come on on this side is just like to highlight the side of a kingdom that is not seen to people that go to school to get degrees, we are being taught to get this, this, and that, only to recognize that maybe the imp uh the important things that we have to learn actually have to be through relationships that we form while at school, while we meet different people in other areas. So for me, I think my question to you would be what is your end goal in investing your resources, your time uh in these kids and in these college students? What do you envision for the next generation as young life? But what what do you want them to see or to have that you feel like there was a need for you to go there in the first place? It's a kind of long question, but in my my humble opinion, I just feel like before you start something, you always have an end goal in mind, at least as far as I know. So, what was yours?

SPEAKER_04

Well, the end goal is to see as many students come to know Jesus as I can, using the methods that I'm good at. So, one of the reasons I did Young Life, there's a lot of great ministries out there that are all God-honoring and good. I am a good fit for young life. I am a good fit for a relational ministry. It is my nature. I have done the door-to-door evangelism, all that's great. And for those who are good at that, continue on. More power to you. I was I was okay at it, but that's really where I felt like I bore the most fruit is through those long-term relationships. So that's that's why I chose Young Life. But the ultimate goal is to see students come to know Jesus, as many as I can. And Young Life is just the tool that I'm using to introduce students to Jesus. So that that is the end goal. As far as why New York City, I mean, that's a whole nother story. This was never the planned city for me to come to, but God brought me here. But I chose, I mean, I chose the colleges we chose by and large, because uh I really like we're at City College and kind of the CUNY system. For those of you who don't know, there's a system of city colleges in New York that cater more to low-income local students who are born and raised here. I like working with those types of students. They're they are also my favorite. And I think I've told you this story before, but when I looked at NYU at the time, this is in COVID, there's like 40-something ministries. I looked at City College and there's three at the time. I'm sure that's changed now. But to me, there's just a lot of space and room in those colleges.

SPEAKER_03

And there are, and there has been. So I just I just like that group.

SPEAKER_00

Have you come to find out at the time you spent with these people that there's a cry in their hearts for them to know God?

SPEAKER_04

Have I? Have I seen that?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. I mean, hey, they're human beings. What human being on earth doesn't want to be known? And yeah, it expresses itself. I mean, some I think two parts. One, the family unit in a lot of these students' lives is not necessarily together in the way God designed it to be. There was one one time I was leading a Bible study with a group of guys, we were talking about forgiveness. And I asked them, who is God calling you to forgive? And every one of them were like, my father, my father, my father, my father. So just imagine what that does to a kid, you know, when the family unit isn't operating the way it was supposed to. So of course they want to be known. Of course they want father figures and mentors. They also have experienced a lot of instability in a lot of different relationships, whether it's um their home life or friends. In New York, it's really easy to. Cut off friends when you're done with them. A lot of people have been cut off for saying something. So there's just not a lot of stability. So I think they long for an older, wise, loving mentor figure that's stable. That's what a lot of them are feeling.

SPEAKER_03

And it takes a while for them to trust you. Other people bail. Why wouldn't you bail? So it takes a little while. But yeah, they want it, of course.

SPEAKER_00

Before we came online, um, you mentioned something, and I think it it it touched my mind of your desire and your idea of wanting someone to experience Jesus as opposed to just know about him.

SPEAKER_04

I love Gen Z. I love like their thought process. There's two things. When I was when I was growing up, my generation, in my opinion, was much more I want evidence that I can like prove God's existence. So show me the information. Let's talk apologetics. Let's kind of argue each other and see if we can get to a conclusion that I not only know God exists, but I know Jesus exists and I can prove that he was who he said he was, all those things. That is that's what like I love the prophecies. That matters to me. But for Gen Z, they have information coming from a thousand different directions, from a thousand different experts that disagree with each other. So who do they believe? You can kind of relate to that, right? Like who who can we trust if everyone's saying different things. And so for them, they kind of have gone away from like this information. They're looking for experience. When they're saying, How do I know if God is real? How do I know if it's true? They're not saying, can you prove it to me with information? Can I experience him? Wow. So that has allowed, I think, for a lot of really cool stories to where I think God will, you know, he'll draw near you in that way. Oh, you need experience? Okay, like I can, I can give you that because I think God's so gracious. And so we've had a lot of students that just have had experiences. And as they've come to know Jesus, it's been confirmed through like a warmth that they felt or a vision that they saw or a feeling, like this overwhelming presence that they had. So I love that about them. They have that, and then they also have a very low tolerance for people who talk about God, but don't live it out. So you can say Jesus is the way. He is the secret to life. But if you don't have life or joy or happiness or whatever, they're like, okay, I I hear you, but what I see is different. So you got you gotta back it up. If you're not kind, then why would they listen to you?

SPEAKER_00

Some study for verses eight says, Test and see that the Lord is good.

SPEAKER_01

Taste and see. Test is experience. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

See is perception. Yep. So that means for you, you're focusing on like, I want someone to experience God, not just intellectually know God. I want them to meet God. I want him to have an experience with God, I want them to have encounters with God, and that's gonna be reflective on how they're going to live their life from their own. And uh you mentioned that even in your life, like you as a kid, like your mom started to see a different kid when you give your life to Jesus. It's it's just mind-blowing, and it's so kingdom that when the kingdom of God, or when the culture of heaven comes, or when the Lord comes and chooses to manifest Himself to a person, their life switches and changes, turns around like it's a 180 or sometimes. Sometimes it's a slow process. Sometimes it's just like a seed sown for them, they will be able to reap, like, you know, a fruit later. But the reason I say that is just like I, when I moved in New York City, I recognized that people here are very intellectual. Any kind of or any idea of God, the uh it's firstly through logic. It's just like more information and more information and more information, less experience. We know how to talk about God that we don't know how to prove one. You know, if we talk about God who does miracles and we live amongst people that don't get healed, that don't know how to relate with their parents, that don't know how to relate with one another or be friends or make friends or all that. Someone's gonna be asking questions as a young person, they're gonna be asking questions of like, but what is the importance of me knowing God if there's no benefit to it? Yeah. Because there's no tangible evidence to it.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah. Yeah. Uh I'm right with you. And I think I think it's easier to go the route of it's an information issue. Like if I give them information, then they would believe. I can control that. You know, it's it's just more comfortable for me. I can research the answers or whatever. It's a little less in my control. Dare say none. Uh if they experience God or not. I can't really I can facilitate environments, or maybe they can come and like open their hearts to connecting with God and pray that God responds in that way, but it's a lot less control in my end. It's a lot less control. Right now, all I can do is just share them with what I know, create spaces for them to encounter God, and then we'll see what God does.

SPEAKER_00

I saw a story this week uh in the New York Times and I think Washington Post as well. That was talking about how the Gen Z and young people are storming the Catholic Church in recent, you know, times. Just going to the masses and they're attending church in Greenwich, in like whatever. And someone was making a comment of how the Holy Spirit is still moving, even in a city like New York City, where people assume that there's no God. That actually still young people, the very young people they are assuming that they don't love God. They're on fire, they're trying to find truth. Uh, what would you say to that? Like, have you heard stories like that where like actually there's like there's such a hunger? Because you mentioned, you talked about this before. There's there's such like they are searching for something, not just to prove something, but they're like, no, I need something that is more than just logic. And I don't know if you heard about that story. For me, it's I think it was fascinating to me to hear that actually I grew up in some measure Catholic. And to see someone like start their faith journey or like, you know, in the Catholic Church or in some sort of ministry whatsoever, is the broader way of how God one of the few things or books that have changed my entire life was written by a brother called Brother Rollins.

SPEAKER_04

Um practicing the presence.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. I think it blew my mind.

SPEAKER_04

As far as I can tell, hey, there's a resurgence in Gen Z in general. Like all the churches are seeing it. There's just a there's a hunger and an openness to God that I mean, I've been doing this for five years, so who knows what more seasoned veterans has experienced, but this is definitely where I would say it feels like the wind is at our back. Like it just things are just going our way more than they used to. I think the Catholic, Anglican style churches are really like attractive. My guess is because of their emphasis on tradition and like sacredness. Like I when I walk into a Catholic church, I I feel it. Like all the mosaics, all the like the statues and the nativities and all this stuff, like it's so beautiful. It's kind of hard not to like not to like connect with that. I was talking to a student that I ran to run into on the street, Muslim guy, no interest in Jesus at all in the three years I've known him. And he and his friends went to a monastery upstate for fun. And he said when he when he sat in the sanctuary that he felt a weight and a presence, like a really powerful presence. And he asked his friends what they thought it was. They said, We think that's sin, like you're feeling the conviction of sin. He had no interest in that stuff, none. But I think in that like a cathedral where it's designed to help you experience like the sacred, that it's really easy for students to connect with God. And it's also helpful. Like if you go to a Catholic church, there's no guesswork on what you need to do. Students here don't love risk. They don't want to make a mistake. And so just having the liturgy and tradition and everything is laid out for you, they don't have to worry about it. Like they don't have to worry about saying a bad prayer or um saying something silly. It's right there. You just walk through it. So I think they're really attracted to that.

SPEAKER_00

To um someone who's out there and they're struggling to uh connect their dots when it comes to denominations or Catholic, Presbyterian, Methodist, Baptist, or whatever, the kingdom of God is so vast and big beyond just a charismatic church, beyond just like your church that you go to. And one of those stories that are familiar reading in the Bible is when a man of God called Elisha died and is buried hundreds of years, and then there's uh an army passing by the area where there was that guy who was buried, the prophet was buried. They kill a guy and they throw him onto the tomb or onto the grave of a prophet who died long time ago. And this guy gets to be resurrected and gets to live because he touched the bones of someone who died hundreds of years ago. That's for me the perfect picture of traditional churches where God moved before powerfully, and people are assuming that, oh no, God no longer lives there because of the introduction of new denominations and all that. That story of Elisha and the dry bones of Elisha touching a man and he gets to live who was once dead, is the idea for me that I see when it comes to traditional churches. Of like, once God is in a place, there are still residues of his presence, irrespective of how the domination stands out to be. And I do believe that. I still go to these mega churches and like, wow, you get to look onto the screens and like, you know, the uh the synagogues and like, wow, the beauty, the wonder, the glory, all of that to say that I'm fascinated for where we're going. But I think I wanted to learn this plan by asking you a question to someone who wants to reach college ministry, reach college students, or maybe not college students, they want to tap into youth ministry at their church or whatever. What advice would you have for them?

SPEAKER_04

If they're wanting to engage with the youth or college students, whatever when you start from scratch.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04

Well, I mean, if they're working for a church, typically the strategy is to mobilize the students that you have and and help them love Jesus a lot and show them how to live that out in their faith. I think the college students, they want to do that. Like they're you don't have to motivate them to want to live out their faith. They really want to. They're very action-oriented, what I appreciate. So that's one way. If you if you don't have a lot of work with, it's it's then I would say, like, okay, if you want to reach college students, go to the colleges. Right?

SPEAKER_00

To the question of experience. Yeah. I agree with you there. To the question, I'm going to ask a challenging question. To the question of experience above logic and information, would you say there's an importance right now more than ever for churches, for any ministry to pursue or to at least explore the past bit of moving in miracles, signs and wonders. Because a generation you're trying to reach, they're not looking for information. They are looking for experience. They are looking for like, show me God, don't tell me about God.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

How important are the miracles, signs and wonders in this day now?

SPEAKER_04

I mean, incredibly important. It's and I don't even know. I mean, who doesn't want to see that stuff? Like, that's awesome. And we should pray for it and pray for it like with a conviction that God is not just able to, but willing to, right? Like is willing to do that stuff. Encouraging them to ask God, like that can feel a little nervous to me of like, oh, you're you're struggling with this illness. Well, let's let's pray about it and see if God heals it. Because then what if he doesn't? Dang it. I shouldn't have done that. Now I've hurt this person's faith and my own. But I think you kind of got to leave that up to God. Like you give a humble prayer, let him respond accordingly. We do this thing that I really love because I think, oh, what I was going to say, I think they love miracles, but I think they they're also very open to just feeling his presence, even if it doesn't come with a miracle. Like we had one student who just came to know Jesus this last week, and he said he saw a vision, but he didn't even tell me what the vision was. But what he did tell me was, and I felt loved for the very first time.

unknown

Wow.

SPEAKER_04

I felt joy and peace for the very first time. For a lot of these New Yorkers, that's what they want. They're just trying to be happy.

SPEAKER_00

Like that's a very like expensive commodity in New York City. Yeah. To feel love or to be loved or to feel peace.

SPEAKER_04

That's how long. So of course they're starving for that stuff. So yes, a miracle would be great, but just feeling his presence and the fruit of the spirit that come with his presence, a lot of them are just looking for that. We felt uh we do this thing in Young Life at camp, we call it the 20 minutes of silence, to where after we we tell them about the death and resurrection of Jesus, they've been learning about Jesus all week. And then we send them outside at night under the stars, which a lot of New Yorkers have never seen stars. It's a fun fact. But under the stars for 20 minutes of silence. Don't say a word, anybody. You sit, try to sit by yourself, and then talk to God about what you've heard. And that's Christian or not Christian, they all think that's one of the most powerful 20 minutes for them, A, because they've been silent. New Yorkers don't get that a lot. B, they're not worried about their problems, they're just connecting with God. And there is one student named Amari, who I remember he said, he came back into like our camp room and he goes, I felt like this overwhelming warmth in my heart when I experienced the presence of God. He wasn't a Christian before. So to my advice to those looking to engage with the youth is facilitate times where they can experience God, let go of control a little bit, because who knows what God will do. He will do as he pleases. But trust that he actually wants them to know him. You know, he wants you to experience him. He's not, he's not so distant that he would just make you read a book and um about like apologetics or something and then reason your way to him. Although that works too.

SPEAKER_00

By talking about the presence of God, you mean someone to feel the nearness of God or the closeness of God or the actual manifestation of the glory of God in some measure. Because God ex God would meet you differently, how he made me. Another person would feel peace, another person will feel love, the other will feel warmth, another will feel the awakeness of God, another person will go burst into miracles, signs and wonders, depending on how God chooses to meet with that person. That's what you mean by say like a presence could mean so many things to different people.

SPEAKER_04

Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Take that how you will, as far as what makes sense to you and your context and ministry and gifting. Yeah. You're right. God will reach a person in a way that um is glorifying to God and is helpful to the person. And yeah, all we can do is just set the environment however that looks. It could look many different ways.

SPEAKER_00

What has been the most challenging thing for you in your ministry?

SPEAKER_04

Scheduling and proximity by far are the most challenging things. New York is a busy place. People have no time for God or close connection or whatever. It is the schools that we do ministry at, students live an hour to an hour and a half in any given direction. They're not there for an experience. They're not there for a the college experience, they're there for a degree. They have their families that they have to help help take care of. They have part-time jobs in addition. They don't have a lot of time and they're stressed out of their minds. So it's just tough to build the relationships that are normally necessary to have meaningful conversations. So we have to make the most that we can with very little time.

SPEAKER_03

Yeah. What are you praying into this season? Wisdom. Always.

SPEAKER_04

Wisdom. Love Solomon in Proverbs. And I think God really empowered him through wisdom. So I pray for that a lot. Wisdom, more leaders, harvest is plentiful, but the workers are few. That is 100% true. I think anyone who's doing ministry feels that. I know students who would be interested in talking about Jesus if they could do it with someone who they trusted. But there's just not enough people to build those relationships. Wow. So need more people. Always need more people. And then I think a continued movement from the Lord. Because what can we do if he doesn't move? So it seems like he's doing that. It's not just me, other college ministers and people working with college students. We're all saying the same thing. It seems like things are just going really well right now. Like I just have a Bible study and more students are showing up than I thought would. So I've, man, it's just a fun time to do ministry. So I I'm just praying God amps it up and continues to do more and more and more of that.

SPEAKER_00

I've had so many people say these questions in so many ways. How can we reach the next generation? How can we tap into college ministry? How can we do youth? How can we uh blah, blah, blah, blah? Like what are the strategies, plans, methods, and all that? And I love those kind of questions or that kind of thinking. This is my faith though. This is my belief system that the same Holy Spirit that came thousands of years ago, the same Holy Spirit that was in the Jesus movement, the same Holy Spirit that was in the Toronto Revival, in the times of Body, in the times of uh Smith Wigglesworth, uh William Seymour, you name Catherine Coleman, you name whoever you want. Uh Billy Graham, you name all of that. It's the same Holy Spirit that is able to reach young people. There's no any other method, there's no any other strategy that is better than the Holy Spirit. And that said, I really want to I really want to think that college ministry is not just college ministry. We love to put names so that you can box things. But for me, I really think that there's a call of God to raise up more people like your prayer is. In other words, the phrase that the harvest is plenty, laborers are few. And we call for that. We want for that not just for college ministry, but in every aspect of life. We need more people to be discipled and we need more leaders that know how to disciple others. Because it's the mandate, go on to all the nations and disciple them, baptize them in the name of the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. It's as simple as, but only a few people say yes. So uh if there's one last thing, Ryan, that you love to say to our viewers, our listeners, what would it be?

SPEAKER_04

The one phrase that keeps coming to my mind probably over this last year, has been stepping into the mess. Um I the world out there is messy. New York City is messy. I think it's really easy to stay in what's most comfortable, clean, quote unquote. But I would encourage anyone listening. I think, I think God will use this first step, is that if there is something in your life, I'm not I'm not necessarily talking about like our own sin or battle with that. I'm talking about kind of on the outside, but there's mess all around us. Like, what would it look like for us to step into the mess in the same way that Jesus came from perfect to here, you know, from heaven to earth and all the messiness. He stepped into our mess and dwelt with us, um, hung out with us, spent time with us. What would it look like for us to do the same? Just to step into somebody else's mess, even if it's a baby step.

SPEAKER_03

Any step is good. So that'd be my encouragement. Ryan, thank you so much for coming to see you and sending up for having me. Yeah, it was fun.

SPEAKER_00

Would you do us the honors and uh close us in prayer?

SPEAKER_04

Sure. Cool. Father, thank you so much um for this time with Lucky and for these conversations about what you're doing in the world of college students and college-age adults in New York City and beyond. We know that you are not um doing nothing, that you are active and you actually want people to know you and to experience you. And Lord, um, I pray that you would honor all of our efforts as we do step into the mess and try our best to honor you the best way we know how. But Lord, it's so refreshing when you move in a really powerful way. So I do pray for more miracles. I pray for more displays of your power. I pray for more encounters in students' lives where they radically forgive people and radically feel loved and joy and peace that radiates to everyone around them. God, we know that you are love. And so I pray, Lord, that people would continue to experience that in powerful ways and that we would get to see it. Your name we pray. Amen. Amen. Thank you so much again for donating.

SPEAKER_00

And God bless you. See you on the next one.