#9: Super yachts and swimming pools

Live from Spatex in Coventry, Angela and Michael turn the mic on themselves for a revealing interview. What exactly is the Black Diamant Line? What makes it truly groundbreaking? And what sparked the creation of the new Revolution line? It’s an episode where they challenge each other with questions, share surprising insights, and take listeners behind the scenes of their innovation process. Tune in and find out.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:02

Swimming pool international, the swimming pool podcast.

SPEAKER_05 0:20

A warm welcome to our international swimming pool podcast. In front of me sits Angela. Angela Herrmann, international sales manager at Banker Manufacturing in Germany.

SPEAKER_02 0:31

And in front of me sits Michael Fither, export manager at Fluovo Schmalenberger from Tübingen in Germany as well. Now I was confused where, because we are not in Germany.

SPEAKER_05 0:42

Today we are at Hellebreakers in Nunspete, and we have an interview with Peter Haseleger, project manager Yards at Hellebreaker. Very welcome Peter. Nice to meet you. We haven't met before. You have met Peter before, Angela. Yes. And um well, we are going to talk about swimming pools in uh in in yards or on yachts, I should say. Well, Peter, can you explain us a little bit first about the company Hallebreakers in in general? Yes, of course. Good morning, first of all.

SPEAKER_04 1:18

Good morning. Good morning. Nice to have you here. Yeah, we uh we met at the first time at the exhibition in uh Koelan, I guess it was. And Angelo came to me and he said, uh, did you have some interest to uh to do a podcast? So I said, okay, why not? We like to talk about our job, our company, so that's why we invited you. Um Hallebreakers is um installation company all around. We do a lot of things uh more than only yachts. Also, we do water treatment on swimming pools, public pools, private pools. I guess we have also a big uh department for industrial automatization and also uh a huge network in there, also mechanical engineering, electrical engineering. I think the company has around 300 employees for now, so quite big, I guess. Um I started almost 28 years ago. I was started as a trainee during trainee. I thought it was interesting to do more than that, so I be I became a mechanic at the public pools, not at yachts. There were no yachts 28 years ago, maybe there was, but not in my mind. So I started as a mechanic during that for seven, eight years I came back in the office. It was a little bit necessary because I had some uh physical uh complaints, so I said okay, let me in the office, and then I could do both things outside and inside. After a while, I liked it more at the office and also a little bit outside, do some mechanical things, and I could combine it, so that was a perfect combination. After 10 years, I started as an engineer because the need some people at the office also did some technical drawings, so I started there. Um it was not a kind of my thing, I missed the outside, I missed the the mechanical part, so I asked if there's a possibility to have some job, maybe they could create something for me a little bit outside, a little bit inside. So I did my own engineering and I go outside. I did also the mechanical part, so I did my own job, so I can blame nobody when it was not good. And after that, I grew up a little bit as a project leader, assistant, project leader, senior, and it starts growing the the business in yachts, so they needed a proje manager. I said, okay, let me do that because I'm used to it right now, and now I think the department of the yards is a small twelve, thirteen people now.

SPEAKER_05 4:19

Okay, well that's quite I wouldn't say small. Uh no, but using the company as a 300 employees, it's a small part. Yes, small department. Sorry to interrupt you, but this swimming pool on yards, is that typically something for Dutch companies to do this with all the shipyards here and so on? Because you don't see it in other countries, not so many, at least I don't.

SPEAKER_04 4:41

No, but I guess Germany is also has a lot of yards. Um Holland is because it's quite a small country. It has, I think, six big uh yards which are building over 100 meter yards, so that's yeah, unique.

SPEAKER_02 4:59

I mean, uh, I was so interested, you know, we are our own topic really is dream pools, you know. This is really like let's say the topic of the podcast. And then I thought we put it to a higher level, a dream pool on a yacht. I mean, this is really the absolute high class, let's say. But I would say you just mentioned you said Germany has quite some yachts, but I think when I even go to the boat show in Monaco, I I do see a lot of people. I mean, you're very well presented, I have to say.

SPEAKER_04 5:28

Yeah, no, that's for sure, because I guess at the Monaco Yacht Show, there is uh a complete part only of Dutch uh yard builders uh on one big area, and a few, of course, we know Lursen, it's one of the biggest, and you have also uh how do they call the Builder Cruises?

SPEAKER_02 5:48

The big one Mayerwave is a bit in trouble at the moment, but yes, I know, I know, I know. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 5:53

But I guess we we are in the top three in the world, I guess, and also for the architects, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 5:58

Also, yeah. Ah, okay. Well, and uh, one of the questions uh we spoke about uh before, uh Angela was uh does the uh whole process of getting customers more or less work the same as you have with uh with swimming pools, let's say on the land?

SPEAKER_04 6:15

It depends because um normally what the normal way is to have a project is yard is calling okay, we're gonna build a new build within two years. Could you make a little design? We want to have one pool or two or three or jacuzzi or sauna steam room, doesn't matter. And then we say, Okay, we are not going in detail. It's only okay, one pool, how big it is, how deep it is, do we have a tank to drain it back, or should the water go directly overboard? That are the first few questions we are mentioning. After that, they are getting more in detail, and they said, Okay, the customer bought the ship, they want an approx price, how much around. So we we give a price, and the prices are much higher than the normal prices, and it's not because it's a customer with a lot of money, but it's very uh complicated how it works. And also in the States, we don't have space, we don't have much time, but we said okay, we have three years, but we're always in a hurry at the end. So that's quite an issue for us, also. There's also a way you know the uh owners representative, that's the one of the important guys you need to know because he can bring you in with no problem at all, and he can say, Okay, you need hella breakers for that because uh they are building great projects, uh reliable, good services, because there's also an important thing to have. Afterwards, when they are on sailing and they are at the other side of the world, and they can give us a call, we've been there within two or three days. So that's most of them how we get into new projects and captains also, very important. They talk to each other, okay. We have a pool from Hallibreakers, it's it's really nice, it works fine, no troubles at all, and then they are gonna say it to the owner as a representative, and they said, Okay, you need to go to Hallibreakers, and then they said it to the yard, and the yard comes to us. Ah, okay.

SPEAKER_02 8:35

Um, you just said um it is very specific, no, to do this. And I just have one little story I remember very well because before I was working with jacuzzies, and um the representative of the owner came to see only the jacuzzi, and he had um the yellow stickers and every little thing on the jacuzzi, what I have never seen before, it would have been marked.

SPEAKER_04 8:59

You need hog.

SPEAKER_02 9:01

So I I'm really have a lot of respect on your work because I know how you have to work in detail. Yeah. Could you tell us a little bit more about what is so special in your work?

SPEAKER_04 9:13

I guess um to make something or to create something which is not there. The customer don't want to have anything somebody else have. That's first of all. So the first you get your design, you have your nice pictures, your renderings, uh, so it looks perfect. But if you make a photo of the rendering and you make a photo after two years on board, it's exactly the same. So that's why they need to know okay, uh does they like um to have to only build a product this is jacuzzi, put some water in it and it's finished. They need something specific. They are talking about millimeters, about radio uh radiuses, uh mosaic, what I think by myself why we're talking about one millimeter, but they are talking about one millimeter, and it has to be exactly as the same what the designer designed. We are not always friends of a designer because we are technical guys and we want to make a good solution and uh the solution for years, and they make it quite difficult for us to make an a product which suits both parties.

SPEAKER_05 10:33

So that's it's also nice though to do. So, in that sense, it's much more uh detailed uh design and technically than uh let's say regular high-end stainless steel pools, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a completely different way, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 10:50

But also now we have one project. Uh, for example, there are two jacuzzi um which are going on board. There should be tiles in it, but you don't can say, Oh, here's a jacuzzi. You have to every radius, every rounds at the seat, at the knees, at the back, it should be have exactly 57 centimeters and three millimeters, because otherwise the mosaic don't fit, and they have to end with a half mosaic, and they want only one complete mosaic.

SPEAKER_02 11:22

So that's an uh calculation example.

SPEAKER_04 11:25

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But they also make the design of the jacuzzi and also with the tiles. We send a 3D model to the tiling company, they will put in the tiles and they will fit in like that. They will all not what you normally see. You have the 30-30 centimeters. You can buy them completely, but they're normally they make the mosaic one by one by hand. That's there are three or four guys.

SPEAKER_02 11:50

Oh, they are like already prepared in this. Yeah, I know.

SPEAKER_04 11:52

Yeah, that's not not possible. No, because it's round and that's square. So they have to make all things exactly. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:04

Is is it gonna be a gold gold mosaic?

SPEAKER_04 12:07

It's it's also gold, it's also silver, it's all it's it's it's all kind of things.

SPEAKER_02 12:13

That leads me to the question talking about materials, no, because you have so special requirements, and um you have the sea water, you have the air around, so it makes everything so special. Yeah. What do you really have to uh consider of the materials as well? Because they have to bear a lot.

SPEAKER_04 12:31

The materials and also the condition of the weather, because when they are in Dubay, there's 50 degrees, when they are at the Arctic, it's uh zero. So we also want to know at the beginning: is it an expedition vessel? Is it only a pleasure vessel? Is it uh gonna be for um rental? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So that we make also with the customer. We make a decision, okay. Um you go there, but you got not going to be there, so we can make another material choice for that. Sea water is not good for stainless steel. Everybody says stainless steel is perfect, but it's not that perfect. You need to have an exactly spray it with some some some uh coating. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 13:23

Because you have a very high concentration of the colour.

SPEAKER_04 13:25

When we when we normally made our jacuzzi or pools, it's composite, um, it's gel coat finished, uh, it's a special swim coat finish which can handle the temperatures, the chlorine, uh the pH levels, uh also sunlight. But we have to be honest to say that there is no gel coat which can handle 50 or 60 or 70 degrees. Because when there's water in a black pool, I once stepped in one and I burnt my feet because it's it's over 80 degrees. The water? No, the the the pool itself when it's empty. Because it's only in the sun, and they they when they fill it up, they say, okay, fill it up, they step in because they have to take off some covers. But you you will burn like that.

SPEAKER_02 14:13

Yeah, it's it's it's a big uh cooking pot.

SPEAKER_04 14:16

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And also with a glass mosaic. It's shiny, it's glass, it's it's it's dark, it's it will be hot, very hot.

SPEAKER_02 14:24

So, how do you find all these materials we can which can bear these situations?

SPEAKER_04 14:29

We have some suppliers which are doing also this for over 20 years, so they have all the experience and they have all the guys and the the the knowledge which which you can do. And we also have to say to the customer, okay, you want this, but note that we can be a problem in the future. But they are taking it and they said, Okay, we want it black with with with yellow stripes, they can get black with yellow stripes, but you have to be aware after two years, maybe one year, you have to repaint it again because it's discoloring by the sun and the UV lights and the chlorine.

SPEAKER_05 15:07

Okay, so that's generally accepted as long as you as I explain to the customer up front what he can expect, and then they'll go for it or not. It's not a problem at all, then. And is stainless steel uh not used at all? Not even uh uh seawater resistant stainless steel, higher grades. Higher grades, yeah, that's for sure, and also the the duplex.

SPEAKER_04 15:29

Duplex, yes. Also then also there will always there will be a coating on it, and they will make it with a filler when it's gonna be tiled, because you never have a clear stainless steel pool on board. There's always paint on it or tiles on it.

SPEAKER_05 15:46

So not so it it's it's not like a stainless steel pool that you see in a hotel or private stainless steel pools where it actually is stainless steel shiny. No, no, because there's something on top.

SPEAKER_04 15:58

There's always the base on top because they don't want the same as in hotels, they want something special.

SPEAKER_05 16:04

Ah, okay.

SPEAKER_04 16:05

I have to say all the handrails and that kind of things and the grids, it's all high polished, mirror age, so it's not high polished, it should be one level higher than that. So the surface of the stainless steel is dead, closed up with the polishing, it can grab no dirt and it will not uh be corrosive, so there will be be no rust on it. So higher than mirror, great. You just have to mirror eight, yeah. It's it's it's it's unbelievable.

SPEAKER_02 16:34

How about the weight? Because I think on you on ships generally, or even on yachts, no, it's uh is that an issue?

SPEAKER_04 16:41

If you have like a stainless steel pool which has quite some weight, and then you put tiles on it, or yeah, but first of all, um when they start uh building a yard, they make the calculations, of course. And in that stage, they also call us and say, okay, what are we gonna use? Can we make it in composite? Should we use aluminium? We are not fans of aluminium, it's seawater resistant, but it's not swimming pool resistant, and that's why they make the filler on it, and there is a layer of one or two centimeters of filler and uh primer, and afterwards we're uh paint or something else, what they want to have, and that's then it's aluminium and it's lightweight construction, then but during the filler and everything which is coming on, it's still the same as composite the weight because they use stone or marble or it's also have a little bit of death, so it it doesn't matter at the end.

SPEAKER_05 17:37

And uh in these pools uh uh on on yachts, is there also uh things like water features uh built in, like like waterfalls or even a counter current?

SPEAKER_04 17:49

Yeah, we use the counter currents. We use also uh we had one yacht uh you had a pool on it, it was completely out of glass. They have completely out of glass pools. When you're sitting in the bar, you can look up and see the people swim. Um I don't know if you want to have that, but okay, that's another question. Um, they want to have a waterfall three meter wide, and it should be a mirror, so it's not just falling out, it should be a stream, they want to project a film on it. Yeah. So we're gonna think about that. And we we we we we talked with guys who are in the movie business. How can we make something which you can see and project something on because it should be smooth and it should not be bubbly or something else? So we had one waterfall and we had two pumps of 200 cubic an hour just to spray one flat area of water, which they can project on it.

SPEAKER_02 18:56

Uh, talking about these uh special, very special things. Um, do you have some some story, some things what we in normal life do not really see so much?

SPEAKER_04 19:08

I have one. Um we had a customer, um, the boat was built by FedShip. Um it was in Amsterdam, and the customers said on Wednesday it would be there on Friday. There was no water at all, so they said okay, we need that pool filled with water because the customer wants to swim. They also invited a girl with a mermaid suit just to get in the pool. The pool was also out of glass. It was the first time the customer would see the pool itself and and his yacht. So we ordered 60,000 liters of water at uh a village near here because the water here is that pure and soft. We said, Okay, we could use that, we can also get it on temperature. So they transported 60,000 liters to Amsterdam, filled it up. The guy jumped in. It was he loved it. He said, This is the best water I ever had. They were on transport to Antipe in France, and the guy said, Okay, let's come over 60,000 liters of water to France, because I want the water which I use in Amsterdam. So there were three three trucks full of water to France just to swim in that water because including the mermaid? No, no, I was not the mermaid, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. No, but because they can.

SPEAKER_05 20:35

Yes. So it it it proves that if if you have money you can you can go that way.

SPEAKER_02 20:42

So they're really dream dream dream pools in any sense.

SPEAKER_04 20:48

Yeah, it it it doesn't matter, it doesn't matter at all.

SPEAKER_02 20:50

Anything is possible, let's say.

SPEAKER_04 20:52

We say until it's not possible anymore, because the sky is the limit, yeah. Yeah, because of them. Because they they have an idea already, and they they just throw an idea on the on the table and they say, Okay, I want to have this. And then everybody starts to think and they say, Okay, maybe it's possible, but you have to skip that part because that not is not possible. So at the end, you got almost the ID they want to have.

SPEAKER_02 21:21

So that's I I have been on a couple of yards, and I always felt like I mean there's like super noble hotels. And sometimes I thought, I mean, probably I don't see it because I don't have that eye for it. Then I miss this uh what the owner maybe create himself. I didn't see it, you know, because it looked like a super fancy hotel, but I didn't know what was his really personal approach on it, you know. So, but maybe it's hidden, kind of, you know.

SPEAKER_04 21:50

Yeah, but I think in the details because there's a lot of art also on board. Um the designers create A living area for the guy for the for the owner, and of course, they are sitting with the owner every week, and they are discussing, and also with the owner representative, they discuss okay what does the customer like? We had also one customer said, I have a jacuzzi at my home in Florida. He made the picture of it, and he went exactly the same on his boat, just to feel at home when he's on his yacht.

SPEAKER_05 22:28

And um the um so you do the uh Hellebreakers does the whole process from getting involved in the design and offering and so on up to the installation, up to the installation, yeah. So you have uh like mechanics specialized on yachts are different than the guys who do the pools on land, I would assume.

SPEAKER_04 22:47

Yeah, because um the mechanics which are normally at the public pools on land hate yachts, and it's strange to say, but it's it's small areas, it's always you have to wait for some people. You can come on board and you think okay, I'm gonna install at Yakuzzi right now, but you have to go away because the painter is already started it, so you have to go back to the office again. Okay, I cannot do anything. Of course, we make a call, okay. Can we do something else? When does the painter finish? So, planning is is really really important, uh and also for us because if you go to a job for three times, and three times you have to go home, you don't like it anymore. You say, Okay, this is the third time I've been here and I cannot do anything still. So that's why we have to first when we started, I have to email to call, okay. Can we go? Can we come? Are you sure there's nobody else? And then when we come over there, we can do our job perfectly. And it's the biggest pipe we used is 110 millimeters on boards. In the public pools, it's 500 millimeters, so it's it's it's huge and it's all small and it's all more detailed and it should be look fine and nice, and also the cabling should be straight and not with any curves. So it's it's it's you have also more time to do it, but it it must be perfect. Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_02 24:23

But and I think you also have to be fit physically. Yes, I have been on a boat in where they um refurbished everything, and I thought, oh my god, you really need to be kind of a monkey to climb here. Yeah, it was really like oh you do this big step, no problem. I'm like, well, I thought it was a bit problem, really.

SPEAKER_04 24:43

No, you have to be uh how do you call it physically uh not that big because you have the owner's state room, you have the lounge, the sundeck, it's huge, it's massive, and all the parts where the techniques are is that small. So we always complain, of course. We say, okay, we need some more space, but they don't have any space because they need to put somewhere cushions and also other stuff.

SPEAKER_05 25:08

So the the the water treatment and pumps for your uh your uh water features and so on, it's all in a very small place. Yeah. Space next so next. You have uh good things to consider like the cooling of the pumps and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_04 25:24

Yeah, we have to make an air van can calculation. How much will the blower uh use this on air? How warm will be the pump below there? So we have to say to the yard, okay, give us fresh cooled air, approximately, just to cool the pumps down because it's getting too hot otherwise.

SPEAKER_05 25:46

Yes, yes, I can imagine. It's it's like a science, yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, no, because they say it's just a swimming pool, but it's it's more than much more and you know, regular swimming pool designs uh can be complicated already, but compared to uh yachts, it's a piece of cake. Yeah, you you have the space, the technical space is much bigger, yeah. Exactly. So so you you're right. It's amazing, is it yeah, it is totally.

SPEAKER_02 26:15

I I love this topic to be honest. Is it like um we were wondering if this uh in you know how is the market? Is it growing market or how is it at the moment?

SPEAKER_04 26:26

At the moment we had a crazy three years, it was yeah, coming from everywhere. It doesn't matter from from Turkey to Spain to France to to to Germany, Holland, England, uh the US. And now you see they built, and I just looked it up how much yards were on the construction last year, it were 850. Not only in Holland, of course, but worldwide. So and when we have we have now ten or twelve on the construction, but it's it's really busy for us because we are at the office with three guys. We have, of course, some software engineers, we have some electrical engineers, we have some mechanical guys. So, but they also it's not a complete year for them to work on yachts. So when they are started with a new project, which is not a yacht, and when they call from a yacht, we have I have to go to them directly and say, Stop with that job because we need to go to that yacht, they have a problem, and then you have to fly there because the guys.

SPEAKER_02 27:40

So you fly everywhere where they are, if they're in Asia at the moment, wherever you go and fix the problem.

SPEAKER_04 27:45

Yeah, no, we've been in uh Antigua. Um, it's at the Caribbean, small islands, a customer called. Okay, we got a big problem, and uh the customer is coming. Um, the pool is not working, okay. We are now in that state, we can go on remote so we can see what's happening, but it was not in that time a few years ago. So a guy stepped in a plane, goes to Shoutegault to Paris to Antigua, and he just found out there was one switch off on the cabinet. So he flyed.

SPEAKER_02 28:19

That's actually very good when you have swimming pool controls. I don't know if you're artificially controlled and you can see it.

SPEAKER_04 28:25

No, we are all doing on remote, so we could see it then, but back in the years they didn't have remote. So the guy uh he said, Okay, Peter, I'm here now, but there's only one switch turned off. Yeah, put it on and get back in the plane and fly back. So they will pay for it, they will pay for it. That's of course.

SPEAKER_05 28:46

So I was yeah, I was going to ask that too. Uh, of course, but but outside your uh let's say warranty period, you do all the service and maintenance for the pools you've supplied to the yachts. Yeah, that's part of the contract.

SPEAKER_04 28:58

That's part of the contract. Um, we are now trying to get more because we we do uh as a hella breakers, we have a lot of contracts for the customers. I'd like to have it also for the yacht customers, but it's quite difficult to say, okay, we will keep the installation under guarantee for 10 years, but it costs every year that amount of money. But because they are selling the yacht maybe within one year to get another one, it's it's quite difficult. Right. Because the owner, the owner is every time someone else. But uh last week I got a call from a guy, we built it in 2006, and he said, Okay, Peter, uh, we want to upgrade the PLC because we cannot download any software anymore. Uh, the firmware is outdated, so we need something new. I'd never heard them earlier. I said, How is the installation doing? He said, Perfect. We only did the upgrade on PLC, and now it's running fine again. So that's that's good to hear, also.

SPEAKER_05 30:01

Yes, yes, yes, of course.

SPEAKER_02 30:02

Uh I mean I just see uh because we have heat exchangers also on on yards, and I I just sometimes I notice then I have like at the same day contact me like five suppliers, and they all ask for the same little spare part and like from all parts of the world, you know, because they need it tomorrow.

SPEAKER_04 30:21

Yeah, now that and also you have the spare part companies, and first of all, we have some commitment with the yards. We say, okay, when we were directly contacted by a yacht, and it is within the five years of the new build, we have to contact the yard itself. Okay, that boat is calling, they want to have some extra parts. Please we will quote for the yard, but not directly for the yard itself. That's a commitment we made, and that's always working fine because otherwise we have to. Last week we have to send something to Jeddah. It was quite difficult to get it over there, and sometimes there also was on chemicals that's more difficult then. So I'd rather send it to the yard in Makham or in Vlissingen or in somewhere in Holland because it's more easy for me. Yes.

SPEAKER_05 31:14

Well, in in normal pools, we work exactly the same. We try to avoid the end user and work with partners. Yeah, it's much more efficient, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. For sure, for sure. Yeah, um, okay, so um I and I also guess that if you have to provide service to YARTs, it's always top urgent. Because with this kind of high-end clients, they cannot wait two weeks. No, no, no, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_04 31:41

No, that's not uh don't even think about it now. Because the customer is always coming, and we what we want to do as a halibreak is we say, okay, let's come over in in March, April, before the season starts. Give an upgrade to the system so you will be for sure. You can do your summer period, and afterwards let us come over to finish it, uh preserve everything that is fine for the next season again. But the guys are that busy when we make a quote, uh the engineers like to have it for sure, because it will take some work from them, and they are for sure the system will work fine again. But they are sailing a lot to to keep everything, they have to provide the boat with all the the food, the drinks, and and everything. And then it's difficult to make an appointment somewhere because they are sailing from every uh every part of the world again. So you have to get back to them. This when they are at a yacht in Barcelona, MB ninety two, or at a refit yard, they will call us and say, Okay, come over, just see how the installation looks like, make a plan, make some spar a spare part list for us, and then we can send it to them and they have a season with all the parts on board.

SPEAKER_02 33:05

So So um it's a very you have a lot of pressure, I guess, on your shoulders, no, because of this uh very intense and uh fast work. So, what for you about this job is most what do you like most? Why do you like it so much?

SPEAKER_04 33:21

Um what you already said, you're living in a world where you're normally not intending to be, because you're always on nice places, always sunny places. Um the guys on board know they are you are coming to help them, so uh you're always welcome. You can eat on board, you can drink on board, you can do everything what you like, and also to make something what's not already there, when the guys are yeah, just to see make the impossible almost possible. So that's I think that's the nicest thing. And we have a nice team, the guys are all working for each other and they they know how it works. So when they say okay, we are working 9 to 5, you're not working 9 to 5, you're working from Monday to Monday. And when they call on on Saturday evening, you know there is a problem. They are never calling just to say hi. So that's why you have to always be be there for that.

SPEAKER_02 34:28

Yeah, yeah. But so we could actually learn from you a lot, customer service, be there always, no?

SPEAKER_04 34:35

Yeah, no, but I I guess and service. Yeah, hella breakers is at the service. Um, because we are that big, there's always someone who wants to go to the Caribbean. Yes, yeah, I can imagine. You know, and uh we we we have one or two guys. I know them if I'm calling them directly right now, they will sit in the plane this afternoon to go somewhere because they like their job also. Yeah, so that's that's good to hear also for everybody over here. And they say okay, oh you have to go to the to France or to Spain, and it's not that nice to be on a sundeck when it's 40 degrees just crawling below a jacuzzi. Of course, it's work at the end. It's it's work at the end, and of course, when you're sitting at the beach, then you make the pictures for your colleagues, and not not when you're crawling under a room. No, no, no, no, no, no.

SPEAKER_02 35:31

Technical room.

SPEAKER_04 35:32

No, of course not, no.

SPEAKER_05 35:33

No, it's a really really interesting uh topic. Like you said, when you're not in this world, you haven't got a clue what's going on there. No, no, no, no. And uh it's actually for the same in uh in swimming pool building if you're not from this world, but this is something you know high end, yeah, next level. And uh well, I think uh we've learned a lot uh today about you know uh shipyards, boats, uh boats, uh uh wellness on boats, and what is what is actually possible, or basically nothing is impossible, the sky's the limit, as Peter said. And well, thank you very much uh for your time. Uh is there any argument anything you have to ask? No, not for this moment. Okay, that's let's talk about business later.

SPEAKER_04 36:21

Yeah, we'll talk about business later because I don't know if it suits in here, but okay.

SPEAKER_05 36:26

No, good. Thanks a lot. Uh so we can uh finish it uh off for today. Okay, thank you also. Thank you. You're most welcome. Yeah, so um you can write us with any comments or questions at mail at swimmingpool minus podcast.com. Goodbye. Gracias.

SPEAKER_02 36:47

Merci.