Inclusion, Community Influence & Reframing Imposter Syndrome | Richie Brave

In this episode of Connected Thinking, Lisa Bent, our Group HR Director, sits down with Richie Brave, a journalist, presenter, and host of BBC Radio 1Xtra Talks.

Richie has built a powerful voice that champions Black British Caribbean identity and amplifies underrepresented voices both on and off air.

Together they chat about:

• How brands can move beyond performative inclusion
• How influence bridges the gap between communities
• Reframing imposter syndrome as a response to societal structures

... and much more!

"As people with influence, we have a duty to bridge the gap between culture and audiences to help people make informed decisions."

Stay tuned for more episodes of Connected Thinking, our series of chats with standout voices from the world of marketing, where we unpack what’s trending, what’s shifting, and what’s coming next...

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to Connected Thinking, our series of chats with standout voices from the world of marketing, where we unpack what's trending, what's shifting, and what's coming next. I'm Lisa Bent, your host and group HR director of Synconnects. Today I'm joined by Richie Brave. Richie is an accomplished journalist, presenter and broadcaster, best known as the host of BBC Radio's One Extra Talks. Whether on national radio, television, or in community spaces, he brings a rare combination of empathy and challenge, amplifying underrepresented voices, championing Black British Caribbean identity, integrating power, and sparking conversations that resonate far beyond the studio. Welcome, Richie. Wow, what an intro. So to kick things off, your 17.5 followers on Insta makes you an influencer. What do you think of this term? And what type of influences do you wish there were more of?

SPEAKER_01 1:00

I feel like influencers get a bad rap, you know. I don't feel like I am one. I don't feel like I am. I think I have influence, but I wouldn't say I'm officially an influencer. I mean, if brands want to reach out to me, they can. But um, yeah, I would say, what do I think of the term? I think everywhere has its place. I think we've moved into this really like anti-influencer um space and ideology. People are influencers, they're very rapid. Not all of them are, you know. Some of them do some really great work and um they use their influence and their platforms to promote some really amazing things. What I do think though, and what I do think is important, is we need to be able to identify the difference between influencers, broadcasters, journalists, etc. Some people are all three or all five or whatever those things are, but some people are also one of them as well, and that's perfectly okay. I think sometimes, you know, when we work with when we look at brands or influencer marketing organizations, all of that kind of stuff, or people who, you know, book influencers, the issue that have sometimes is like influencers will be given jobs that journalists should be getting, journalists may be given jobs that influencers are getting, and I think the waters get muddied a little bit. But I think influencers have their place, and I don't feel that one, but maybe I am, and I'm alright with that.

SPEAKER_00 2:09

Is that imposter syndrome?

SPEAKER_01 2:11

I don't think it is. I just think there's a bag that I would get, I'll get in my influencer bag, you know what I mean? But I don't think I'm proper in there yet. I think I've got influence, but I don't know if I'm an influencer. I might I'm an influencer. Yes, you are.

SPEAKER_00 2:22

You've got 17.5,000 followers.

SPEAKER_01 2:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:25

And people listen to you weekly.

SPEAKER_01 2:27

Yeah, it's true. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, you're right. I am an influencer. Maybe it's not. Do you know what it is? I'm not an influencer by job title, maybe.

SPEAKER_00 2:36

I get that. Does that make sense?

SPEAKER_01 2:37

That does make sense. Like I'm a broadcaster by job title, but I do think, um, and I, you know, I said this recently, you are now expected to be all of it. See, if you're a broadcaster, you're also now expected to be a bit of an influencer as well or a journalist. Because social media exists and that is now the currency, you are expected to be able to influence too and do that online. So maybe that is a string to my bow. I'll take it, love. I'll take it, I'm an influencer.

SPEAKER_00 3:05

I think you should. You've built your voice as a broadcaster and presenter to spark important conversations around representation. How do you see your social media shaping those conversations compared to traditional broadcast media?

SPEAKER_01 3:19

I think I'm unapologetic in the things that I do. And I'm very, I would say about myself, I'm quite earnest and honest. Um, I say the things that I feel, and I it's interesting because you're talking about influencer, right? And people are like, oh, you need to get on TikTok and start posting every day. I post things when I have something to say. And I think a lot of people post things as a result of their job, right? Like they have to post every day to keep engagement up. I should be more interested in that. But my engagement is really good because I think I'm known for saying things when I've got something to say and I care. Does that make sense? Although I've done some ads for some things and that, but um, only things that I care about. So I think what is different in terms of that space is I can when I'm working on the BBC, there's an expectation that I orchestrate conversations in a particular way. Of course I have input, but I don't have full creative control. When it comes to my social media space, I use that to promote the things that I want to promote and have the conversations that I want to have that may not always fall within the sphere of a professional organization or a corporate organization or a conglomerate or whatever you want to call it. So yeah, my space is for me and I I build, I've built a community that gets me.

SPEAKER_00 4:28

I love that for you.

SPEAKER_01 4:28

Yeah, I think I love it too.

SPEAKER_00 4:32

As a broadcaster, you're often a bridge between culture and audiences. How do you see influencers playing that role today, especially in giving a platform to underrepresented voices?

SPEAKER_01 4:44

I this is the thing I will say about influencers, as someone who is one, clearly. You need to stay tapped in, you know. And I think influencer culture can make you removed from society. I think as a result of an influencer, you get paid to promote things, you do ads, you get free stuff all the time. Maybe you feel entitled to go to particular events, you're used to getting stuff free, all of that kind of stuff. And sometimes it can remove you from the realities of what it's like navigating through society. So I think it's really important to stay rooted in the communities that you're influencing. So my influencer stuff is always, I mean, like I said, I've done some brands. I did something for like a candy organization. That was my first influencer-influencing job, right? But I did it in a way that was authentic to me. And I wasn't like you should all pick up your money and spend it. Like, I genuinely like the suites, which is why I did the thing that I did, right? So I think, you know, influencers, I hope I'm answering the question because I forgot it, but I think influencers um need to remain rooted in authenticity. Did that answer the question? I've forgotten what you asked me.

SPEAKER_00 5:43

So the question is as a broadcaster, you're often a bridge between culture and audiences. How do you see influencers playing that role today, especially in giving a platform to underrepresented voices?

SPEAKER_01 5:55

So I'll answer that properly, just uh yeah, I think you're challenging me to think about influencing in a different way. I think the words influencer are associated with people who promote products. And actually, you're talking about people who promote culture and want societal change. So in that case, I probably am an influencer. And I think bridging the gap between the two and why influencers are important. I've got something coming up soon around like HIV um awareness. Because I think it's important that I use well, I'm not HIV positive, but I think it's important for me to use my voice and use the platform that I have to inform people, to make informed decisions. So for me, I think you know, bridging the gap between the two is being brave enough to use your platform to have conversations that people usually wouldn't. And I think a black man like myself wouldn't usually go online and be like, hello everyone, let's talk about HIV testing. They wouldn't always do that. But I think as influencers, as people with influence, we have a duty to bridge the gap between the two. And the reason why I say duty, and it's important I identify this the people that are paying your bills are buying into you as a person. You cannot just take from this community and not give back to them. So for me, when it comes to a bridge between the two, I don't just think about representing the communities that are marginalized or underrepresented. I also think about connecting with the communities that are represented so they are able to understand the realities of maybe communities they don't have proximity to. Does that make sense? 100%. So I see myself as not just a bridge, but a connector between multiple different worlds. My following is so like varied. Like you got like guys from South London and middle-aged white women, like black guys from South London and middle-aged white women in middle England. You know what I mean? And the conversations that I have connect the two communities together. So that's the kind of bridge that I see myself as.

SPEAKER_00 7:41

And there's so much beauty in that, yeah, and so much reach as well.

SPEAKER_01 7:44

You know what's interesting? Like my job, so previous to this, I said I worked in like a therapeutic space, like a group therapy space, right? And my closest person at work was a 66-year-old woman called Linda, right? And she was from Ockingdom. We could have been more different, but we were so similar in so many ways. And I see influencing as that, right? You bridge a gap between you never know who's connecting with you. No one, no one ever got our friendship on why we were so close. And I was like 24, 25 at the time, but we just got each other. And I think that's the beauty of influencing. You never know who you're connecting to. I will get like a treatment or I will do something related to influencing. I'm using the word now. And people expect, oh, we want to tap into a black audience. Actually, my audience varies, you know, and I think it's the consideration around that. I think brands need to think about who that person's audience is, not who you think their audience is, if that makes sense.

SPEAKER_00 8:39

Yeah, and also who you resonate with. And that can't always be predicted, which again I think is a nice surprise, actually.

SPEAKER_01 8:45

And it's mainly black, and I love that I'm black. I love being black. But I also like the fact that people from all walks of life can connect with me because I'm quite an open person. I just take people at face value, you know?

SPEAKER_00 8:55

Some of the most powerful cultural moments today come from social media. What does that shift mean for how we tell inclusive stories?

SPEAKER_01 9:03

I think we need to be very clear on what we mean by powerful. And powerful doesn't always mean good. So, you know, we talk about, we can look at the Black Lives Matter movement, right? So 2020. I mean, I went on my first Black Lives Matter March, I think 2013 when Mike Brown was killed by a police officer. But like I'm talking about the 2020 one that happened in London, right? During the pandemic, I think it was. Um, that's a powerful cultural movement, and a lot of people connected through social media. You saw an awakening for many people. Some people didn't even realise they were black, you know, until 2020. They was like, wait, what? What's going on? That's powerful. You're connecting people to their roots and their identity. Powerful is also, you know, a lot of the racism that you see online. That's powerful, you know. It it holds great powers, not a good thing. Um, so I think for me, when we're talking about like powerful cultural moments, it's important to consider what we mean by power, and with power comes great responsibility. Um, so I think I'm not answering your question properly.

SPEAKER_00 9:58

You are.

SPEAKER_01 9:59

Because for me, I'm a c context, it's I'm a neurodivergent, right? So for me, context is so important. I think it's a great question, but let's identify what we mean by power first, right?

SPEAKER_00 10:09

How about we look at it from maybe any recent social campaign perspective, then just to give it some more texture?

SPEAKER_01 10:16

Yeah, there was one um the Give Blood one recently, and it was um Simply Shio, who is an amazing woman.

SPEAKER_00 10:24

Oh yeah, she's incredible. If you can ever sit down with her, she really blew up in um 2020, didn't she?

SPEAKER_01 10:28

I love her. I just absolutely love everything about that woman. Um, and uh, she lost two siblings to sickle cell, and she's promoted people, black people specifically, giving blood. And she has grown that exponentially. That's the word, right? She's grown black donors exponentially in this country. That was a massive campaign. She's funny, she's earnest, she brings humour to it, but she's also able to be very serious. And I think that was such an amazing campaign because they use someone that the community trusts, and that's really important when it comes to power and change when you're using influencers. Having followers doesn't mean they're a trusted voice. There may be a voice that people consider doesn't mean they're trusted. And I think that was such a great campaign to use someone that's so trusted in the community.

SPEAKER_00 11:10

When you scroll through your feed, where do you think the industry is getting inclusion right? And where does it still feel performative?

SPEAKER_01 11:17

Scrolling through my feed is hard because there's so much AI rubbish out there now. And like I'm watching everything, like, is this a real person or isn't it? I think that's where it's all going on.

SPEAKER_00 11:25

Oh yeah, that confuses me as well. I don't. So I'm second guessing myself.

SPEAKER_01 11:28

Yo, I watched something the other day and I kind of felt like it was AI, but I wasn't sure it was. But um, yeah, that's scrambling me at the moment. But I think where the industry are getting it right in terms of inclusion, I think some spaces are unapologetically using faces of colour, right? And I think the issue that I had previously is they would bow to pressure, where it's like they would use black, oh, this is like, why is there so many black people in this campaign? Like, oh my god, there's not even that many black people in the country. And then you'd see like companies rescind some of their campaigns, or the next one you'll see is all white. I think there are some organizations that are like, yo, like the dominant culture here at the moment, when it comes to the music everyone's listening to, the clothes that people wear, is black culture. And some spaces get that. I think they're getting it right. I would say where it goes wrong, and I spoke about this earlier, is a lack of considered representation, right? So you only want to work with black people during Black History Month, or you only want to work with queer people during, I don't know, pride, or you only want to work with Muslim people during Eid. Like actually, I think we need to be integrating communities generally. So I think, you know, if you're doing a celebration of summer, show how Muslim people enjoy summer inside the park. Don't just use them for something that's Eid related or related to their Muslim identity. Their identity is one thing about them, but they maneuver through the world just like you and me. And we build these really like unrealistic perceptions of people based on the way that media positions them. So for me, it's making considered representation rather than just um tokenistic representation. Those are very different.

SPEAKER_00 12:56

Yeah, I hear you on that.

SPEAKER_01 12:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:58

So you've worked in many different spaces. Have you ever had imposter syndrome?

SPEAKER_01 13:05

Yeah, until I realized it was insecurity, right? So, like the thing with imposter syndrome, uh, we're pathologizing an experience that is related to the environment that we're placed in, right? So we are then tasked with you feel like an imposter, you need to manage the feelings that are associated with that. Imposter syndrome is a structural issue, it's not a personal issue, right? So environments and structures make us feel like we don't belong. And in turn, in making us feel like we don't belong, we then feel like impostors. When I realise that imposter syndrome actually isn't my problem, your environment, the environment needs to change, not me. I can manage the feelings associated with it. But there's nothing wrong with me, you know. The fact that I'm even in this room in the first place speaks to the fact that I should be in there. But so many structural and societal elements make me feel like I shouldn't. So I think imposter syndrome, yes, I've experienced it, but I realise it's not a problem that I need to manage within myself. It is a structure that I need to change. So when you look at white supremacy, when you look at misogyny, when you look at transphobia, racism, all of those kind of things, all of those things make us feel lesser than. They send us sometimes conscious, sometimes subconscious messages that we're not enough and we're not good enough and we shouldn't be in a space. Because historically, lots of us haven't been allowed into those spaces, right? So for me, I've noticed that imposter syndrome are insecurities that have been created in me by societal structures. They are not something that exists within me because of my lack of skill. I've got all the skills, babes. You know what I mean? I'm in the rooms, I just need to shed the insecurity, you know.

SPEAKER_00 14:33

Do you know what? I've never thought of it in that way before ever. I always thought it was an insecurity in self, a lack of belief in self. I never put it in the space of institution and systems and environment ever. But where do they come from?

SPEAKER_01 14:47

You see those insecurities. Yeah, right. What are they rooted in? Yeah. So, like, and I use I've used the example of like women who walk into like boardrooms and they put an idea down or they say something that's amazing, and no one listens to them, and the man says exactly the same thing, and everyone pats him on the back. If that keeps happening to you again and again and again and again, what is that going to do for your confidence and sense of self? That is an insecurity that's been created in you by an experience that you've had. And a lot of the insecurities that we have, they're positioned as weaknesses inside ourselves. You need to be more secure. You're an insecure person. Well, actually, let's look at what these insecurities are rooted in and what it took for me to get to the place where I don't feel secure. And I have insecurities, let's be very clear, both professionally and personally. But what I do through therapy and conversations with my friends is attempt to understand where they come from. And I'm not saying I don't have responsibility to challenge them. Yes, I do. But equally, it's so important that we acknowledge and dismantle the very things that are created, just not in ourselves, but in other people. And when I give you an I give an example, right? So the woman being in a boardroom. When I've been in boardrooms and a woman's given an example and a man said the same thing, that I haven't listened to the woman, I've been like, she said that five minutes ago, you know. We have a duty to dismantle those environments that make people feel lesser than.

SPEAKER_00 16:00

And then that becomes allyship. Yes. That's true, allyship.

SPEAKER_01 16:03

Yeah. Or just being a good person.

SPEAKER_00 16:05

And that.

SPEAKER_01 16:06

Do you know what I mean? Because allyship, I think, is so important.

SPEAKER_00 16:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 16:09

But that sometimes that's just being a good person. I think being an ally is very important. I'm not undermining what you're saying. I think it's really important. And sometimes it's being a good person and being brave. And I understand in allyship, you can't always do it and you don't always get it right, you know. And I think that's perfectly fine. We are human beings. We're sometimes in a space where we feel scared, we're not able to speak up. We should have said something in that moment, but we didn't, and we feel rubbish about ourselves. But we're human beings and we're not always going to get it right. It's about what we do with it afterwards. And sometimes I'm not the person to speak up, but I'll speak to someone who is the person to speak up and I'll have a conversation with them because I don't feel like I have the power in the space. Does that make sense? I think 100%. We're all about like, yeah, you be the person to stand up. Maybe I'm not good at articulating myself. And if I do stand up, the point falls to pieces. It's knowing your space in, I guess, the fight against creating environments that make people feel included.

SPEAKER_00 16:58

I love that. Thank you so much. And just on that, it's it I feel like you're probably gonna change faster than maybe your space and environment. Yeah. So as an individual, what can you do with this new insight that you've given us into imposter syndrome? What can we do as an individual to build up our self-belief in spite of the environment?

SPEAKER_01 17:22

I think go into places that pour into you, you know, and write down the things that you're good at and celebrate your wins and take the compliments when they're given to you. I find that quite hard. You know when someone says, Oh, that's really good, and I'll be like, oh, I thought I was shit. You know, like I can be self-deprecating, we all can be, right? And I think accept those wins, accept that love, accept those compliments. When you do a great piece of work, pat yourself on the back, acknowledge it and receive it when someone else pats you on the back. There are so many small micro things that happen that pour into us that we bat away as a result of whatever we're battling or what's going on inside of us. And also, I do think these aren't just individual things that we need to manage ourselves. It's coming back to the point I made before. We also need to be the change that we want to see. So everyone's like, oh, I don't want to compliment that person. I don't want to seem like I'm begging it or like I'm I'm I'm licking ass. Just tell the person they were good, no man. You know what I mean? Just tell the person that you did a really good job. What you did was amazing there. I really like the fact you stood up and spoke up in that meeting because I don't feel comfortable enough to do it. All of those things build confidence inside somebody, but recognise the things that you're good at and know that you are an individual and the things that somebody else is good at and the things that they feel able to do in the space, you're not always going to be able to. And that's part of your journey. It's completely fine.

SPEAKER_00 18:33

Love that. Okay, quickfire.

SPEAKER_01 18:36

Oh I'm in quickfire mode now.

SPEAKER_00 18:40

Favourite book or podcast you'd recommend?

SPEAKER_01 18:43

Our um book would be The Will to Change by Bell Hooks. So it's an exploration of men, sexuality, and masculinity. Amazing.

SPEAKER_00 18:53

Incredible.

SPEAKER_01 18:54

Amazing book. Really.

SPEAKER_00 18:55

But she's incredible.

SPEAKER_01 18:56

She really is. Was I do think was, sorry, was I do think fuck boys use her book so sometimes. They like place it on the table and like they're like, I've done the reading, and they really haven't. Have you noticed that's the thing, right?

SPEAKER_00 19:07

You can do the reading, but have you done the work? Yeah. They're two different things.

SPEAKER_01 19:10

You know, like why I'm no longer talking to white people about race so people would have it on the table. And I'm like, okay, what's in it? Best piece of advice you've ever received. It's a simple one and it's cheesy and it's being yourself. And the reason why I say that, um, not to make it too deep, I spent a very long time trying to be somebody else, you know? And like I made jokes about neurodivergence. I said I'm a neurodivergence. I am, like, and um I'm a I'm a little bit eccentric, I'm quite emotional, um, I'm very soft-natured, and I say that quite often. Um, I'm quite compassionate. I could be sensitive sometimes as well. Like, I can be a little bit geeky and all those. And I think I really tried to hide that and try and be somebody that I was not. Um, and I, you know, I spoke about this, you know, earlier on. Like, my mum and dad have been really like integral in giving me the position permission to be myself. And the reason why I think that's the best advice, Lisa, if I'm reflecting on the question, is I have been provided all the opportunities that I've been given because I've been myself. When I wasn't being myself, I wasn't moving forwards. And I didn't stop being myself consciously through therapy. I was able to rediscover myself because so much had been pulled away from me. So I think, you know, that constant reminder to be yourself, be your authentic self, even if people don't like it, has been the best advice because my life has been thriving ever since. That's probably the best advice.

SPEAKER_00 20:28

And I think that's the best advice to end with. Thank you so much. Richie, you've been great. Thank you so much for joining us on Connected Thinking.

SPEAKER_01 20:35

Thank you for having me.