A Messy Amen
A Messy Amen welcomes you into the conversations you might not be having on Sundays. Do you ever feel like you want to get to know people more but you get the weird sense that no one can relate to your struggle? You show up to church, sing, listen to the sermon, and go home feeling forgotten, isolated, and frustrated? Here we will be sharing stories that help women of faith feel less alone. We will be honest in ways that may normally feel foreign and share how we hold on to faith and trust God in the ups and downs.
A Messy Amen
God as Father - Healing the Wounds We Don't Talk About
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This conversation is honest, a little messy, and full of hope.
We’re talking about what it looks like to meet God in your brokenness, not once you’ve cleaned it all up. From wrestling with abandonment and feeling unlovable, to slowly learning how to trust God as a good Father… this episode is about letting truth speak louder than the lies.
We also get into Bible journaling, not for perfection or aesthetics, but as a way to slow down, stay present, and actually connect with God.
If you’ve ever felt like God’s promises are for everyone else but you… this is your reminder: He hasn’t left, and He’s not going anywhere.
You don’t have to have it all together.
You just have to come honest.
Scriptures mentioned:
- Romans 8:28
- James 1:2
- James 4:8
- Psalms 73:26
If this episode came to mind for someone, send it to them. And if you want to go deeper, the companion devotional will be waiting for you over on Substack. Check there tonight or tomorrow!
Find me everywhere at https://linktr.ee/Amessyamenpod
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Life isn't always Sunday best. Sometimes your faith is put to the test. If you feel unseen and all alone, it's time for stories you've never known. Hello and welcome back to a messy amen. This is the podcast where we talk about the good, the bad, and the holy parts of real life. Thank you so much for joining us. We are just um f finishing up a Bible study in Romans chapter eight, and it is so good. I am happy to be able to see and hang out with my friend Kiera. This is um so fun because I love Bible journaling and highlighters and taking notes and all the fun stuff.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, um. Do you have a highlighter that I could use?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, sure. Look, you got some a pink one, or maybe a purple or green. Oh, really? Um, I got what some of these, some of those, anything. Also, some I really like plans and highlighters that go with it. Or maybe just a color underline. You know, okay. You know, I I had to um let you guys know that a funny thing is with all the things and all of the pens, highlighters, and all that good stuff, the point is to bring us closer to God and that way when we're taking notes that we can we're just enjoying God's presence and his goodness and w worshiping can look different for different people. Not only do you write some notes here and there, but you also draw really well. So can you show me maybe a couple of little doodle or I like doodling it feels like it was an insult. So show us show us a little bit what you got there.
SPEAKER_01So you open it up, you just got a whole bunch of stuff. So in here, I do the joker, and it says don't have a hardened heart like the joker. Oh my god. Yep, so I just have some stuff like that. I have one of my favorite verses that we might touch on a little later on. Um I had a little girl at shirt, she sat next to me in the pew and she drew me this, so I put it in my Bible because she was she saw all my doodles. I have some like washi tape art in here. Um flip that one around. Yep, so we have this one. That's so good. Yep, it's Jesus looking down. You have the little thorn cro um crown up there.
SPEAKER_00Flip back to where you were. You had some. Oh wow. Or you flip out. My goodness, great.
SPEAKER_01Um, got an eyeball, and then I'll go backwards.
SPEAKER_00So did you tape those into the spine?
SPEAKER_01Yep, so they're just taped right in there. So this was the Joker one.
SPEAKER_00So wild. Yes. So like, and then so this process um like not only um can be fun, but also, you know, spiritual and that giving us that mo those moments of um just spending time with God. That's so good. These are going to be um a prop for the rest of the show. But as I um was looking for, shout out to Wright Tech Morph pens. I might these will be in the show notes because they are some my new favorite. Um they're nice and pocket-sized until you need it, and you're not gonna accidentally um write on anything. That's the best part. So that work of art didn't happen overnight. You have spent time in there. Yeah, probably hours and not if not, you know, clock clock in the times. So tell me a little bit about your you know spiritual background and how that journey came to be.
SPEAKER_01Yep, so my spiritual background, um, I was not born um in a family of believers, I wasn't raised in a church. So I started believing in God when I turned 16. I had a friend named Katie. She invited me to um a youth group. And the night that we went to the youth group, um, there was a worship night in the big sanctuary. So the first night that I had gone with her, she came and picked me up, and we were at school. She asked me, she said, Hey, do you want to come? And I'm like, I'm not sure. But I came, I did come, and I knew nothing about church. I came in a belly shirt, I was my hair was bright red, I had a whole bunch of piercings. So I had gone, and that was, you know, it was a pretty low point in my life. But I had gone and I had gone and I sat down, and you know, I'm sure we'll get more into that a little bit later, but that's where things really started to, you know, blossom. And I had saw that she had uh like a very artistic Bible, and I was like, okay, that's pretty cool. And I was a pretty artsy girl, I had been my whole life, so I searched up journaling bible on Amazon, and that was actually a gift that I ended up getting from Christmas from my mom. And so I've had this Bible since I was 16, and I think that a journaling Bible does help me a lot because it helps me to remember what I'm reading, and it also helps make it a little more enjoyable to where I look forward to reading it, you know.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I um got this is my oldest right here, I've had since like 2023. Um and then I've dabbled in a couple before I ever got serious about the idea of, you know, for me taking notes is a big thing. But so if you're said that back then was a low point when you were sixteen you just came to church for the first time, like m mind blowing for me just because I was, you know, my dad was a pastor and I've grew up in church my whole life. Yeah, vi um visiting um different churches, and then um after my parents were divorced, my mom took a while took some time to um find where her and my stepdad ended up uh going and they sometimes it was different places and then they had seasons of a few a couple different denominations and stuff like that. So to hear a story like yours, I'm you know so excited. But when you were said you were struggling, what did what was it like for you, you know, because it you're 16, you're in the middle of high school. That's you know, not anything I'd recommend for a teenage girl.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so um a lot of it did stem. I did grow up, and my father willingly wasn't in my life, you know. Um he didn't try so hard, and I'm not born into a rich family, so I had to watch my mom go through a lot of that. I had to watch her really, you know, do what she had to do to make sure me and my brother was okay. And I do have a grandpa that fills in that spot pretty well. He does provide for us and take care of us a lot too, but it was hard, you know. And um, you know, growing up you see friends in school have their fathers around, and that was a big part of my life because the only time that my father would call, he would be, you know, under the influence, or he would just say really harsh things and it would hurt my feelings and it would stick with me. I always had the heart where it would stick with me, but I think I just held a lot of anger of him not being there. Yeah, so um it kind of brought a big struggle of not trusting anybody, not letting anybody in. Like I was very, very unwavering in the fact that nobody would stick around. That was my thought process with that. So I just always assumed I'm not gonna get close to people, you know. If I just avoid this, then that's fine. Yeah, just arms pushable way. Yeah, and so yeah, I'd say that was that was a big struggle. So I would be super angry, I'd be super avoidant, I would push people away and just very isolated. But you know, we're not we're not meant for isolation.
SPEAKER_00I'd say we might have some um community that God calls us into too um and then when we have those bad habits that we can um practice just talking to each other and then letting each other know, hey, you don't have to feel like that, you know, that might that even if that's something that oh being defensive or um anxious and all you know, overthinking that's it can be a big one. So when you're going through those seasons that that's uh you know unimagin imaginable, but uh what would be like a lie that um you were probably believing so many lies. First of all, not knowing the Lord and then getting to know him. There was points where you're trying to battle your in your mind and to find get close to God.
SPEAKER_01Mm-hmm. Yeah, so a lot of the lies that I would kind of really face and deal with is that I was unlovable, that I was easy to push away, easy to cut off, and like I said, that would really make it easy for me to push people away to avoid feeling hurt or feeling like you know, unimportant or feeling like a burden because those are things that would really go through my mind. Um it was things that I just tried to not even have to deal with. But I just feel like those were lies that were hard to break out of. It didn't take a week or a couple days, it took a couple years.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. That's because when those seeds and those lies get planted, it could be people being harsh, but it can also be um the you know, the enemy working overtime to take root and those so if it doesn't happen overnight, we're just talking about addiction um in our previous episode. But so when if addiction doesn't start um overnight, you can't recover from it overnight. And same thing with believing things about our identity. So when we find where where do we need to find our identity, you know, in Christ. And but ton um today we're talking about um God as our heavenly father and really growing up with that struggle of you know, f feel that those feelings that when you're battling, well, why wouldn't he want to be in my life? Right? That's why why would what it did I do something wrong? Or like you mm-hmm I don't you know, there's because I c I used to feel that way about um another family member of you know, seeing people oh well look at them that you know, you get the idea well, everybody else's dad um dad must be nice, or like for something you you might have been like, Well, so and so's got a nice dad or so-and-so, and you know, then you're live going these day-to-day um feelings of abandonment or whatever.
SPEAKER_01And I will say, um, just to kind of piggyback off of what you said growing up and feeling like the abandonment and the feelings and stuff, I will say that was something that was also a struggle for me. Is because I was so scared of abandonment that I would project that onto God at first because I didn't understand. You know, I would read about his love for me, I would read that he would never leave nor forsake us, and it's I believed it, but it was almost like I struggled to believe that for me because the constant lie of because he that's goes for everybody else, but I um I'm not he didn't mean it for me or whatever.
SPEAKER_00So then how did you experience God's love and first start to trust him then?
SPEAKER_01It took so much prayer, it took it took being desperate. It really did. It it like it's like you almost have to wrestle with God, and I feel like that's something that's so important that you know should be known. Sometimes you have to wrestle with God because sometimes it's your own stubbornness and your own pride, and you don't even realize it. Like there's a lot of there was a lot of for me a lot of whys, but I had to look at my surrender. Was I really giving it to him? Was I really laying it all down, or was I just giving him what I wanted to give him and keeping the rest for myself? I think it took a lot of brokenness. Yeah. And there's something so beautiful about being broken and running to God. Yep. And so when we are talking about our um lies, where like what have you found in scripture to help um to just speak over yourself and that has helped you um growing in those um growing in the truth, like so what I actually did, um kind of going back to this, you could see like I added in my own marks, so I have like stand firm, no grudge. Um, there's like forgive, there's pouring out his spirit. I made these to where like if I need strength, I can flip op like open to strength, and then I'll have like a verse. So right here it says, My flesh and heart may fail, but God is my strength, my heart and my portion forever. And that's Psalm 73, verse 26. So that's something that really helps me is if I know that I'm lacking in something that God's not lacking, that the word can't be void. So that's what I do. I'll flip to it and I'll read it, and I'll just believe it and I'll pray on it. And sometimes it's hard. Sometimes I definitely I read it and I'm like, but God, I need it now. But I think there's just something so beautiful about the moments where you just can't see or can't understand. And then when you step out of that season, you see that God never left you once, even if it didn't feel good.
SPEAKER_00Did you so like in those early years, 16, 17, 18, what would you say um stuck out the most? The book How'd you find you know, how'd you start to find those verses? Because I that doesn't, you know, like we said earlier, it doesn't happen overnight. But then God gave you those um that idea to I would call that, you know, sometimes online you see them called like a prayer Bible.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Well I would just I just read and read and read. One time I heard a pastor say, you know, you can't know God until you learn God by studying him. And um I also heard a pastor say in the same sermon that if we need an answer, that this is where we seek for it. And I was looking for the answer, like I was just looking for it, so I just kept reading. Um, you had asked what had stuck out to me. Um, that would have been the book of James, it where it was talking about all the trials because again, so once I did start to surrender those things to God, also there's a weight in being one of the generational curse breakers of your family. There's a weight in that when you're the only one in the house praying and you have to, you know, deal with responses, you have to learn how to respond, you have to learn how to trust God, believe in God, you have to trust Him when you're not getting the answers to your questions. There's there's something special about that, and a lot of times that would result to me going to my room and reading the Bible.
SPEAKER_00So that's so I um you know you're talking about trials, but there's another thing that another verse in James that's popping in my mind. What would I what would be another one that can you tell me off the top of your head before I tell you what I was thinking as draw near to God and ho draw near to you? Yeah, that's what we're going for. So and like we're we don't want to make it too much about like look at our Bibles. Um, but um this is a very good episode to um watch. But um we can also just you know look up look at open your own Bible and then there's always going to be so many good um James is so good because if you ever need a book of the Bible to tell you what to do and what to not do, that's James, you know. And so we've talked about um in episode one about James one and um chapter one, two two through uh sorry, verses two through eight, you know, and but then we got talking about we don't play favor favorites, you know, tame your tongue. Um faith without works is dead. You know, so that is it's just packed full of um so there's we could talk about different Bibles. Um the blue one up there is um I have uh interleaved edition of New King James. So every other page is blank and I um that's what I used to study um James a couple years ago. But so that's what helped you um in the beginning and then because we trials, you know, we we all face them. So in your prayer and quiet time with the Lord, what does this look like for you? Because I always say, you know, I'll fight my own comparison battles and in like the stupid lies from the enemy of, oh well if only my Bible could look like Kieras, you know, I'm just like I have so much um I could show you know show you a few other um, you know, Bibles I've written and stuff, but I love it, but I know that it's a process and so what does your quiet time look like for you?
SPEAKER_01My quiet time looks like some days a lot of tears, some days a lot of gratitude, but I'd say other than Bible studying on the days where it's super hard, on the days where I feel like it's even hard to speak, um, I have a little keyboard that I have, so sometimes all I know on it is four chords. I do not know how to play it at all. I just play the same four chords, and sometimes I'll just sing my prayers, and sometimes it's the same thing over and over and over, but I'll just sing whatever's on my heart, and I think that's where I really do feel the presence of God. I love worship music.
SPEAKER_00So, in this time of you digging deeper and praying and not always having the words to say, I will tell you that you had the words to say because you were singing it, girl. And you're you wrote a song on the fly. I don't even know how long it took you. So in your prayer and quiet time and you're s you know singing sometimes those prayers, uh four chords sounds plenty because um the Lord gave you words and um you were uh you're on fire for the for him. And you when you sang a song the other day, might have been a few weeks or months ago, on TikTok, it really touched my heart and the lyrics were so amazing. We're gonna include your username in the show notes because it was just amazing. But also this chat, I really w we're highlighting God as our heavenly father. So we're you know, we've let God heal us over the years. So there's a movie called He Calls Me Daughter, and it is able to stream now on Angel Studios, but also it was in the theaters uh here in Saginaw, it was just one day, and then our small group went to um see it and it was talking about um a father wound. So when God i uh uh finds us in our um brokenness and uh in our hurts, he can transform that and give us that feeling of family and those um and give us scriptures that we need. You know, the Psalms are full of prayers and um petitions for him. So in your quiet time with the Lord, what has been impacting you recently?
SPEAKER_01Mm-hmm. So lately I've been taking it back to Genesis. I've been starting um a lot of in the beginning, you know, um, and as niche and as niche as it might sound, um what I've actually been learning through it is I've been really overanalyzing the intention in the story where God created the sun, the moon, the stars, and the birds, you know, the wind, the earth, the light, the day, but he also created us. Yeah, and sometimes I find myself asking, Well, God, why did you make us? Because we see a lot of things these days, you know. We see we see this crazy world, we see all the crazy stuff going on. So my wonder is just God, what do you need from me? What do you want to do with me? There's there's intention in such little things, like he knows the number of hairs on our heads. If you look at the bees, they they go and pollinate the flowers. I think that is so intentional, the way that the waves crash on the shore. So, what would God do with us? Yeah, like there's a verse, it literally says, If he dresses the lilies, you know, how much more could he love you? So, what will he do with us? That is what I'm studying right now in Genesis, and I'm just looking at the purpose. Yeah, because if there was such purpose for all of these things, then there is such purpose for us.
SPEAKER_00It makes me think of like the time. God, God's time is different than ours, like a day for us. You know, some days we are like, Oh, I can't make it through the rest of this day. Like, I got two little kids, and sometimes I'm like, Lord help me, can I just make it until my husband gets home from work? But like at the and then a year goes by and we're like, What you know, what in the world? Yeah. And so or a month, or or my baby's turn nine months old, it's gonna turn one in July, and it's just like, What um, how does this happen? But then even that's like a blink. We're you know, we're saying, Oh, cherish the moments with your children, the time goes by. But it's like so if we're we're looking at our children and thinking the oh wow, this is insane. God is thinking of us as his children, right? Yeah, yeah. So like when we're going through you know, going through these moments, we have to remember who God is and what he says about us. Yeah. Because it he's the w you know, it's ri rich um scriptures are rich. So what's another Bible verse that has meant a lot to you over the last several years um that you go back and back to over and over?
SPEAKER_01Yes, over the last several years, I'd definitely say Romans 828. I know it's a common verse, it's one of the first ones that we all learn about, that we all hear, that we all read, and it says, and we all know that for those who love God, all things work together for good for those who are called according to his purpose. And that means so much to me because that's something you repeat to yourself, especially if you're in high school, if you're just now starting to. Walk with Jesus if you're just now starting to go through the trials, you lose people, you lose friends, you might lose some family members, um, things will happen, things might seem to all be going wrong, you'll deal with spiritual warfare. But as long as you keep that whisper in the back of your head, all things work together for the for God's good. Yeah, then it might not feel good to us.
SPEAKER_00And then we can say if it doesn't feel good, then God's not done.
SPEAKER_01Yes, and if when you trust God, no matter who you lose, no matter what people might think about you, no matter what they say, you know that God loves you. That it'll all work together for those good. You never know. Those that same group of friends that are hating on you, bullying you, being rude to you, might be the same group that get you in trouble. That might be the same group that pull you away from your true purpose. Um in all things just rejoice, thank God, like it tells you in James.
SPEAKER_00And then you can look back at Romans and say, Well, all things work together just and if God gives us purpose, it's not just well, I guess we can trust God because he says that it might work out, but that he's saying that we love him and he calls us. So we're we're chosen, we're his people and we're his children. So like we can come back to, you know, years of healing, um, you know, praying and um asking God to um help us with a father wound or um those feelings and those lies that we've believed, but to n and to know that um that he's always loved us from the beginning, right? And so as we um as we finish up here, can we can you just hold up your Bible again? For those on YouTube, if you are not on YouTube, um finish up on um your platform and check out the video to go along because I'm obsessed. So, you know, we you can't um you know I have um a little bit here um here in mine and then I've had a couple fun things, but at the you know, it's not the that's not the point of that's not really the point of getting into the word. Yeah. But it's so fun and can add so much um richness and excitement and then something to look forward to. But to um as we highlight, what would be one thing that you want, you know, you've said a a lot of good um aha moments, but what would be one more thing that you'd want people to take away from this conversation?
SPEAKER_01You're not alone. You're not the only person that feels that way. I know sometimes it can be hard to think, well, um, these people might not understand. It might be hard to confide in people, but in reality, it's a gift to be surrounded by people. Stay connected, um, find people who are kingdom-minded. We're called to be in unity, we're called to not judge one another, we're called to love. And for others on the other perspective, if somebody's giving you a hard time, just love them anyway. You never know what somebody's going through.
SPEAKER_00I know personally, I Wait, you you wouldn't give somebody a hard time, would you?
SPEAKER_01I have. I definitely have. I definitely have.
SPEAKER_00And I meet you and you're getting into what would you you know, three years ago. So you were 16, you were like 17-ish. Yeah, 16. I think you were about to turn 18. Um because you're about to turn 21 in July.
SPEAKER_01June, June 3rd, and so you forgot my birthday.
SPEAKER_00Well, I knew it was in the summertime, so that that counts. So I'm just I had to interrupt because the funny thing is that God can um can work on our hearts and He can grow us and mature us at any point, right? Yep. I would even say, so in the time that I've since I met you, I would say I've grown and matured a little bit too, and that I've kind of come up with ideas and things that help me to know to stay, you know, rooted in Christ, and that I don't have to be, you know, overly, even if I'm overly excited or so I oh, oh well, I want you know, I want to be friends and you know, blah blah blah blah blah and I would just be like then I learned, Michelle, take a breath. You know, people the right people that will come along that will like you, God will give you the right friends, and God will give you people to surround you um to spur you on to grow closer to him. But at you know, as you're saying, you know, that is so um so good to give grace to those. Um when we're working through things that our prayer would be that somebody can still love us and that that we can, you know, God will bring those people, uh the right people alongside us that can give us the grace and to work with us even when we're not always the most lovable, but that we would know that that's not the point. That if God loves us and God forgives us, that we can extend that same grace for everyone else. But you know, that I think that is so important for every single person listening that to remember that our Heavenly Father is always there for us. No matter what we've gone through, no matter and then no matter when we've come to know him, that you know, whether it's been six years or twenty-six or fifty-six, you know one day you'll be able to you're not even gonna remember not knowing God. So we can um and then we can but we can always trust that in those trials and in the things that we wouldn't choose ourselves at, God can um have our back, right? So all that to say you don't have to have it all together. They'll just come honest because that's got God meets us no matter where we're at, right? And if you want to stay connected, you can find us on socials at a messy amen pod. That's on TikTok and Instagram. And then if you want to dig a little bit deeper, there will be a companion devotional to go along with this episode over on Substack. And thank you again for um listening and tuning in. If somebody came up in your mind um that might need to hear this, please send this along and share it with them that uh we can just spread the good news that Jesus loves us and that God's always got our backs.
SPEAKER_01We'll see you next time.